The LoHud Yankees Blog

A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Marcus Thames getting closer

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Jun 30, 2010 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

ph_407801It might not have made a difference, but last night would have been a good time for the Yankees to have Marcus Thames. With a left-hander on the mound, Thames could have started at designated hitter and beefed up the lineup a little bit. Instead, he was in Pawtucket.

Assuming he came through running drills with no problems on Tuesday, Thames is scheduled to begin a rehab assignment tonight. That puts him a few games from rejoining the big league roster.

Thames season numbers started to drop when he was forced into everyday duty, but he’s still hitting left-handers to the tune of a .302/.412/.442 slash line. A lineup with Jorge Posada at catcher and Thames at DH would look pretty good against left-handed starters, and the Yankees remaining games before the all-star break are against Seattle, Toronto and Oakland, teams that have at least two lefties in the rotation.

As it stands, the Yankees have to play with at least one of Francisco Cervelli, Kevin Russo, Ramiro Pena, Chad Huffman and Colin Curtis in the lineup. No doubt those five have stepped up to help the team, but it’s an inexperienced group with two of the five primarily known for defense, and adding a platoon bat like Thames will bring some much needed pop. 

Speaking of Scranton/Wilkes-Barre…

I went over there late Monday night to see some of my old friends, but before I met up with them, I stopped by PNC Field where Dustin Moseley had been pulled from his start with no reason given. Manager Dave Miley could only say Moseley is healthy. It seems that the Yankees are trying to make a decision on what to do with him before the out in his contract kicks in on Thursday. Moseley went through his usual pregame routine before finding out he wasn’t pitching, so the decision skip him wasn’t planned for very long before it happened.

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527 Responses to “Marcus Thames getting closer”

  1. Shame Spencer June 30th, 2010 at 9:20 am

    What would be better news: Thames coming back or Nick Johnson shaving his mustache?

  2. John in Ohio June 30th, 2010 at 9:22 am

    How about that face Cervelli is making in the NY Times photo? Funny stuff.

  3. Giuseppe Franco June 30th, 2010 at 9:24 am

    With that mustache, Nick Johnson looks like Ron Jeremy with a buzzcut.

  4. vinny-b June 30th, 2010 at 9:27 am

    “In case you hadn’t noticed the Yanks really don’t have a spot for Nunez”
    ————————————————————

    they will.

    Rivera will have a longer career then Jeter. Mark it down

  5. ron June 30th, 2010 at 9:28 am

    Johnson shaving his mustache.

  6. Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 9:28 am

    He had a bad game. It was bound to happen sooner or later.

    Boston, the Mets, and the Astros and now the Mariners. It?s not like the ?sooner or later? really applies here.

    He?s a command pitcher, and when he takes time off, he?s going to lose some command, and it showed. I don?t know why we are all acting surprised. In fact, there were three days last week exclusively when we all talked about how this would affect him as a pitcher.

    He doesn?t throw a fastball he can live on (hello, AJ), so when he?s not mixing it up, and hitting his spots, he?s going to get hit. That is exclusively the reason that this year will be Buchholz? first full year in the majors ? he had command issues and Boston kept sending him down to work that out. It happens. When Buchholz was 23, he was only given 17 or so starts, and most of those were fill-ins. Last year was his first where he actually had a spot.

    It happens, and will continue to happen. It takes time. Not everyone is Strausburg (sp).

  7. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 9:29 am

    Eduardo Nunez will replace Pena as the Yanks utility player next season, if not sooner and will take Jeter’s position when the time comes. His bat and speed is that good, and his defense has been better than any other ss in the league. Pena will become expendable. They can trade Luis Numez is the need a ss better than Pena.

  8. ac1 June 30th, 2010 at 9:31 am

    If the 9 days off is the reason for this bad start, what is the excuse last time he was hit hard?

  9. ron June 30th, 2010 at 9:31 am

    Going to be interesting to see how brackman does in his 2nd start.

    He has to be on the team in 2012 or clear waivers to be kept in the minors if i understand it correctly because of his contract he is burning through his option years.

  10. ac1 June 30th, 2010 at 9:33 am

    Boston, the Mets, and the Astros and now the Mariners. It?s not like the ?sooner or later? really applies here.

    He?s a command pitcher, and when he takes time off, he?s going to lose some command, and it showed. I don?t know why we are all acting surprised. In fact, there were three days last week exclusively when we all talked about how this would affect him as a pitcher

    ___

    I dont get the point you are trying to make here… You pointed out the last 4 times he didnt have great stuff, and then blamed the 9 days off for this one. He didnt have 9 days off between the other starts.

  11. Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 9:36 am

    No, I wasn’t blaming it, ac1. I was simply stating that things like “off time” don’t help. He got knocked around becuse he wasn’t good, which could be a factor of several things, bud.

    I should have been more clear, and can see your point, but I think the time off is just a factor in a much more complicated equation.

  12. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 9:36 am

    Pitchers are going to have off periods.

    Did any of you really expect him to go 19-4 this year?

    I mean really, try to be a little realistic on Hughes.

    He’s in his first full season starting in the majors.

    How ’bout you temper the expectations a bit and not go into panic mode if he hits a rough stretch.

    Especially since it happens to EVERY pitcher in the game.

  13. ron June 30th, 2010 at 9:38 am

    Fastballs & Cutters

    Photo Credit: Seth Wenig, AP
    I’m not going to get on Phil Hughes too much because this was his first start in ten days, but good grief, again with the 85% fastballs and cutters. It’s been 15 starts now, and it’s pretty obvious the league is catching on. When Rob Johnson, Rob frickin’ Johnson and his .274 wOBA whacks a pair of doubles off you, you don’t tip your cap to him. You say “what the hell did I do wrong?” and stop doing it. The guy saw 11 pitches in three at-bats against Hughes, and ten of them were fastballs. I mean, what more do you need? Was the Kevin Cash homer a few weeks ago not enough?

    Yes, it was good to see Hughes get two swings-and-misses on changeups (both to Russell Branyan in separate at-bats), but so what. Until he starts mixing that pitch, or at least his curveball in more, he’ll keep getting hit around. Major league hitters will hit a fastball when they know it’s coming, and 85% of the time Hughes is giving it to them.

    From rab.

  14. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 9:39 am

    Aaron

    Did you say you live near Portland? If so what town?

  15. Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 9:45 am

    How about not telling everyone how they should react to what has clearly been a rough month of baseball for Hughes, where he has been knocked around pretty bad by some very below average baseball teams.

  16. raymagnetic June 30th, 2010 at 9:48 am

    Repost:

    Phil Hughes pitched 7 innings and gave up 3 runs against the Mets. Not good enough?

    In Hughes last five starts he’s had 2 bad ones, 1 good one, 1 very good one and 1 great one.

    The expectations for Hughes have grown way out of proportion I think.

    Hughes throws his curveball 13.5% of the time this year. Not good enough?

    He throws his fastball around 61.7% of the time. Too much?

    CC throws his fastball 67% of the time BTW.

  17. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 9:51 am

    Who cares what “RAB” writes or thinks. They’re made up of a bunch of pompous jerks and hand wringers. Like too many people on this board, they/you seem to think because the pitcher is a good ome and some of the hitters are inferior that the inferior hitters shouldn’t hit the pitcher and if they do, it’s because of stupidity on the part of the pitcher. Hell, Bob Uecker hit a home run off of Koufax, but, it’s doubtful that anybody considered Koufax stupid. Doug Decinces was a decent player but he killed Ron Guidry. There’s nothing that says a bad hitter isn’t going to hit a good pitcher. Strange, unexplainable things happen in baseball

  18. ac1 June 30th, 2010 at 9:51 am

    Take a positive from last night. Cliff Lee put on a show for the fans who will be cheering him in 2011.

  19. ron June 30th, 2010 at 9:52 am

    I understand going through rough stretches but 85 % fb,cutters seems like way too much.

    Is there a difference in speed between the two & maybe the two pitches are just not good enough too live exclusively off of.
    From what it looks like the league is sitting on fasball with hughes & it is working for now.

    I believe hughes is smart enough to realize that in some way shape or form he has to use at least a cu or curve a larger percentage of times.

    I think it is easy too see that hughes will never be a great pitcher throwing primarilly fb/cutter & the good games he does have is when his location is great,the bad games he has is when his location isn’t but has nothing else to go too.

  20. Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 9:52 am

    Maine Yankee,

    I live in Gorham.

  21. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 9:54 am

    Aaron

    Ok. I’m in South Paris.

  22. raymagnetic June 30th, 2010 at 9:55 am

    CC throws 84% fastballs and sliders.

  23. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 9:56 am

    GB7

    Morning.

    Good to see you’re in a good mood this am. :lol:

  24. Ron June 30th, 2010 at 9:57 am

    ugh, “getting closer” to what ? we don’t need him. And, Cliff Lee likes pitching in NY. I bet he likes money too…cuz he’s gonna get some

  25. Rich in NJ June 30th, 2010 at 9:57 am

    Nothing against Thames, but I kind of like watching Curtis and Huffman and not having a DH that can’t field, but is asked to field anyway.

  26. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 9:57 am

    Maine-

    I didn’t know that.

    South Paris huh.

    Then you must get out to see the Eiffel Tower, and art museums a lot. :)

    Lucky you Man.

  27. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 9:59 am

    MTU

    I just have to look out my window to see it. :lol:

  28. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 10:00 am

    How about you do some research and see what’s happening with Hughes is NORMAL for young pitchers developing at the major league level.

    Regardless of the quality of team OR player, at the major league level, if you miss your spots you get hurt.

  29. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 10:01 am

    Maine-

    Are you near Acadia ?

    Also, does “Bullwinkle” ever come by to visit ?

  30. ron June 30th, 2010 at 10:02 am

    Fine,hughes is pitching great,needs too make no adjustments & a 5 era or higher over his last 7/8 games is ok.

    Over his last 8 games 49.1 innings-56 hits-29 runs & his era climbed from 1.69-3.58.

    I get it that he is young & learning but all is not great regardless.

  31. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 10:02 am

    Most top pitchers throw their two best pitches 82-85% of the time.

    The spread is nothing unusual re: Hughes.

  32. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 10:03 am

    MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 9:56 am
    GB7

    Morning.

    Good to see you’re in a good mood this am.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    Yeah, great mood. It’s not about the game, though. actually I was surprised that NYY hit Lee as well as they did.

    I’m in the mood to put some of the whiners out of their (and our) misery, though. Time to warm up the Howitzer and get ready for a road trip.

  33. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 10:05 am

    MTU

    No, I’m in SW part of the state.

    I’ve had Mr & Mrs Bullwinkle walk across my lawn. :lol:

    I had a turkey and a coyote come through last week.

  34. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 10:06 am

    Nobody is saying he doesn’t have to make adjustments.

    What he DOESN’T have to do is panic like a fan, scrap things that have worked, and start pitching backwards.

    Did CC do that when he struggled earlier this year? Nope.

    You REFINE what you have, make a few better pitches in favorable counts, and continue to learn and grow. Which, given how he has pitched this year, he seems to be doing.

  35. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 10:07 am

    ron June 30th, 2010 at 10:02 am
    Fine,hughes is pitching great,needs too make no adjustments & a 5 era or higher over his last 7/8 games is ok.

    Over his last 8 games 49.1 innings-56 hits-29 runs & his era climbed from 1.69-3.58.

    I get it that he is young & learning but all is not great regardless.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    Is Hughes pitching and the Yankee games embarras sing you?

  36. Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 10:08 am

    Most top pitchers throw their two best pitches 82-85% of the time.

    Most top pitchers also know when the other 15-18% of the time should take place. Though, I imagine some of that can be blamed on the catcher as well.

  37. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 10:08 am

    Maine-

    You probably have been there many times though ?

    I would have loved to see it (in the off season though).

    I’m very familiar will Wil-e and the Roadrunner. See them plenty.

    Have seen and drunk Wild turkey. Both a treat. :)

  38. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 10:09 am

    MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 10:05 am
    MTU

    No, I’m in SW part of the state.

    I’ve had Mr & Mrs Bullwinkle walk across my lawn.

    I had a turkey and a coyote come through last week.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    You need to send for an ACME bomb making kit and get rid of Wylie Coyote.

  39. nick blasioli June 30th, 2010 at 10:10 am

    im sorry,,i just cant get excited that thames is going to come back soon…we need a bat period……..

  40. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 10:12 am

    Do you really expect Phil Hughes to have that advanced a pitching IQ after less than 20 starts in his first full year starting at the big league level?

    That’s why it’s called “development”.

    He’s still learning and is far from a finished product.

    A little patience isn’t a sin to possess.

    Especially when it comes to young pitchers.

  41. kr June 30th, 2010 at 10:13 am

    well, not really.

    I just randomly checked pitch types thrown by lincecum, halladay, lester, jimenez, lee and greinke. Lee has the highest 2 pitch combo with a fb/ct % of 78. The other 4 all range between 68 and 74% for their top 2 pitches. Josh Johnson actually throws 90% fb/sl. so phil hughes’ 85% fb/ct is somewhat high, i’d think especially so considering the similar speed of the pitches.

  42. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 10:14 am

    MTU

    I’ve never been to Acadia.

    My wife and children have been. My wife tells me I need to go sometime.

    Like you it would need to be in the offseason. To many from “away” this time of year.

  43. Ron June 30th, 2010 at 10:15 am

    I am now convinced we should trade for Cliff Lee. Cashman usually will not pay twice, but he has made scky moves by letting both damon and matsui go, signing nick Disabled List Johnson, so he needs to do the opposite of what he usually does, ala george costanzo, and send some prospects and cash for Sabathia’s buddy cliff lee and then sign cliffy long term. Its easy. We have the prospects and money. We will find another great prospect like Montero in the future because this is what our international scouts are paid handsomely to do.

  44. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 10:15 am

    GB-

    True fact. Out here they still pay a bounty for eliminating Coyotes.

    The ranchers consider them a pest.

    I wish they didn’t. I kind of dig ‘em but then again there not killing my stock.

    Good thing they are willy in real life too or they would have gone the way of the DoDo bird long ago.

  45. blake June 30th, 2010 at 10:15 am

    How’d Greinke, Buchholtz, Felix Hernandez, Halladay, Price, Ubaldo, etc etc do in their first full seasons starting in the big leagues?

  46. ron June 30th, 2010 at 10:16 am

    SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 10:06 am
    Nobody is saying he doesn’t have to make adjustments.

    What he DOESN’T have to do is panic like a fan, scrap things that have worked, and start pitching backwards.

    Did CC do that when he struggled earlier this year? Nope.

    You REFINE what you have, make a few better pitches in favorable counts, and continue to learn and grow. Which, given how he has pitched this year, he seems to be doing
    ——————————————————————————————————————-

    Fair enough.

    It is more me wanting hughes too get on track than panicking or thinking i know what the solution is.

  47. Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 10:16 am

    Yeah, Kr. You’ll learn fast to take the numbers thrown out by SJ with a grain of salt.

  48. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 10:16 am

    “a long time ago”. Sorry. another brain fart.

  49. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 10:19 am

    I don’t understand why people think the Yankees need Lee. Their strength is their SP.

    So they are going to trade prospects for a player they don’t need? Not sure I see the logic.

  50. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 10:19 am

    Lee threw mostly fastballs last night.

    Halladay has become a fastball-cutter pitcher at this point in his career.

    You also pitch to the scouting report.

    Do you really want Hughes to throw breaking balls to the likes of Rob Johnson and Michael Saunders and get in bad counts?

    The pitch selection wasn’t the problem. It was the location of the pitches.

    If he locates his fastball in those AB’s, he gets outs.

    He doesn’t need to trick bad hitters. He needs to locate better.

  51. JCPD..... June 30th, 2010 at 10:20 am

    MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 10:08 am
    Maine-

    You probably have been there many times though ?

    I would have loved to see it (in the off season though).

    MTU, make it a point to get there. My brother is a chief of police up in that area. When I go visit, I make it a point to get to Acadia!!

  52. Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 10:21 am

    Maine – there is no logic, and you’re exactly right. Lee is just another all-star name, with a little glitz and glimmer from a couple years of pitching well, and most Yankee fans want to add the name. What’s another 120M for something you don’t need?

  53. vinny-b June 30th, 2010 at 10:22 am

    “I am now convinced we should trade for Cliff Lee”
    ———————————————————–

    re-convince yourself.

  54. tampayank June 30th, 2010 at 10:22 am

    cowherd trying to rile people up to get ratings, rips New York in his opening segment(in reference to Lebron)

  55. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 10:23 am

    JCPD-

    I will try. Can you your brother get me a police escort so I can bypass all the tourists ?

    How are you ?

    Thanks for the photos and clips. They were great. :)

  56. ron June 30th, 2010 at 10:23 am

    I’d actually like hughes to throw breaking balls & get in good counts.

    At the very least to go with his fb/cutter i would like hughes to develope a good changeup & not be affraid to use it.

  57. mama where's my baba June 30th, 2010 at 10:23 am

    Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 10:16 am
    Yeah, Kr. You’ll learn fast to take the numbers thrown out by SJ with a grain of salt.
    _____________________________

    Yeah sj44 also wanted to trade phil hughes for shin soo choo last year, the genius actually said that hughes wasn’t enough to get choo

    and just yesterday he wanted to trade Granderson for BJ upton

    and he’s calling us children and fantasy baseball gm’s?!?!

  58. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 10:24 am

    Aaron

    I’m talking now. If they go after him as a FA thats another story depending on who comes back next year.

  59. Ron June 30th, 2010 at 10:24 am

    do it ! Just do it Cashman! when you’re surrounded by annoying sox fans in new england, you want the Yankees to go undefeated ! every year !

  60. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 10:24 am

    Actually Aaron, look beyond the numbers.

    Go deeper than just a cursory review of numbers.

    When do pitchers use their secondary pitches? To which hitters?

    Do you think AL pitchers throw their secondary pitches to #8 and #9 hitters in the order?

    How about when they get ahead 0-2 and 1-2 and they see guys aren’t catching up with their two best pitches? Do they speed up their bats by going to their secondary pitches or do they try to finish them with what works?

    There is more to it than just having him throw more curveballs and changeups.

    Especially since he has evolved into becoming successful as a fastball-cutter pitcher.

  61. Andrew June 30th, 2010 at 10:25 am

    Ripping his approach is kind of laughable now since it got him to 10-1; because he’s hit a rough patch based seemingly entirely on issues with his location with his pitches, he now needs to go back to the drawing board and revisit his entire approach to getting guys out? Seems like an overreaction. Just because a site that presents nothing but stat after stat without even really considering anything outside the stats says it, doesn’t make it indisputable fact.

  62. JCPD..... June 30th, 2010 at 10:26 am

    MTU, I’ll give him a call and see what I can do. I’m OK, other than a crash and burn on a rainy day hike two weeks ago. My back and the immovable tree weren’t a good match for me. I knew you’d like that baseball video.

  63. Joe from Long Island June 30th, 2010 at 10:27 am

    GB – you have to express your inner feelings, don’t hold them back.

    I took the family on vacation to Maine and Nova Scotia a couple of years ago. I was so excited, as I planned it myself. It rained the whole 10 days, stopping only when we were leaving. And we all got sick.

  64. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 10:28 am

    Unless one of the starters gets hurt between now and the deadline, they don’t need to trade for Cliff Lee. They will just sign him as a FA in the off-season and not give up any prospects.

    They need a RH bat and bullpen help. That’s more of a priority than Cliff Lee.

    The worst kept secret in baseball is where Lee will pitch next year.

    There is mo logical reason for the Yankees to pay twice for him, absent any injuries.

  65. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 10:29 am

    JCPD-

    Don’t feel bad sometimes I crash and burn just sitting in my chair.

    At least you have an excuse.

    It good to know you’re lurking. :)

  66. Bronx Jeers June 30th, 2010 at 10:29 am

    There’s been some coyote “attacks” outside of NYC recently. Bizarre.

    http://www.google.com/hostedne.....AD9GLJG9G3

  67. Rich in NJ June 30th, 2010 at 10:30 am

    Sorry if this has been posted:

    http://deadspin.com/5576040/ya.....h-his-face

  68. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 10:30 am

    Joe-

    We’ll get you a “do over”. :)

  69. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 10:31 am

    Bronx-

    I had heard about the “Cougars” but coyotes too. :)

  70. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 10:32 am

    Joe from Long Island

    So that’s why it rained so much then. I should have known it was someone from “away” that caused it.

    Where in Maine did you go?

  71. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 10:36 am

    Maine-

    Those damn Interlopers. Time for an Electric fence. Out here we have the vast expanses of desert to take care of the problem. :)

  72. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 10:36 am

    MTU

    It’s hard to bypass the tourists on the coast this time of year. It’s like walking through a mine field. :lol:

    I live inland so it isn’t quite so bad as the coast. Enough coming to the lakes but still not as bad as the coast.

  73. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 10:38 am

    MTU

    I can see it would be easy to help someone get lost out there. :lol:

    I’ve never seen so many miles of nothing as out there.

  74. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 10:39 am

    Maine-

    It’s easy for us. We just tell them how beautiful the desert can be. Point them in a direction and tell them there is plenty of water out there, and not to worry. And then just send them on their merry way :)

  75. LGY June 30th, 2010 at 10:40 am

    Even if Romine is not the catcher of the future on this team, barring injury to the rotation, IMO trading him for a few month rental would not be the best use of him as a prospect.

    After seeing the Granderson trade fans need to realize that just because you can get someone for a prospect, doesn’t mean you should. The reason they were able to get Granderson was holding onto Kennedy and Jackson until the right trade came along.

    Prospects are assets. You want to maximize their value. That means either having them on the big club or trading them for the most valuable piece possible. I don’t think 3-4 months of Lee does that with this rotation.

    I posted this last night. It is not the perfect evaluation of prospects, but it is interesting.

    Romine just missed Keith Law’s cut for top 25 prospects in all of baseball. Before this year he wasn’t even in Law’s top 100.

    Romine is clearly making noise down there in Trenton and if he continues to play this well, he is going to be a blue chip prospect at the end of 2010.

  76. St Louis Yankee June 30th, 2010 at 10:41 am

    Hope Thames doesn’t come back, and used as trade bait in a nice bundle suite, for a real help in the field or pen!

  77. St Louis Yankee June 30th, 2010 at 10:42 am

    Hope Thames doesn’t come back, and used as trade bait in a nice bundle suite, for real help in the field or pen!

  78. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 10:43 am

    Joe from Long Island June 30th, 2010 at 10:27 am
    GB – you have to express your inner feelings, don’t hold them back.

    I took the family on vacation to Maine and Nova Scotia a couple of years ago. I was so excited, as I planned it myself. It rained the whole 10 days, stopping only when we were leaving. And we all got sick.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    LMAO. That’s some funny stuff. Does your wife allow you to cross the street alone? My ex-wife never allowed me to plan anything. With good reason, I might add. She never saw the fascination in anything baseball or visiting alligator farms. That was my first and only chance to plan a vacation.

  79. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 10:46 am

    GB-

    Military planning skills and vacation planning skills are not one in the same. :)

  80. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 10:50 am

    Joe-

    I can top your faux pas.

    How would like to fly all the way to Hawaii and then come to realize it was the “rainy” season ?

    Spent the whole time drenched. What a bummer.

  81. Ron June 30th, 2010 at 10:53 am

    The Yankees don’t hoard prospects. They can spend a few to get an ace like cliff lee and he will most likely sign a long term deal to pitch with his buddy CC for the big bucks in NY. I’m not saying empty the cupboard, but put some on the table and get in the mix for Lee with the other teams who will, at the deadline. I don’t see it as if it will hurt the organization. Its not a relief pitcher Larry Anderson for Jeff Bagwell situation.

  82. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 10:56 am

    Not really that many decent/good right handed bats out there that will be on the market, and that a team is willing to trade to NYYs, which pretty much eliminates Wigginton. At least, not at this time. A lot of teams hanging around the top of their divisions. Perhaps Corey hart is a possibility at the right price.

  83. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 10:57 am

    Its not a question of hoarding prospects.

    Starting pitching is not a problem with this team.

    Why take 1 or 2 A List prospects to fill a need that isn’t a need?

    There is no reason to pay twice for Cliff Lee if you don’t have to.

    They didn’t for CC Sabathia, and they needed CC more in 2008 than they do Lee in 2010.

    As LGY correctly states, its a poor use of propsect assets to trade for a guy that you can sign as a FA in the off-season.

    Especially when starting pitching is not a weakness on this team.

  84. CompassRosy June 30th, 2010 at 10:57 am

    The worst kept secret in baseball is where Lee will pitch next year.

    Sadly, it’s true.

    Although….
    I seem to remember many having similar thoughts regarding Felix.

    Just sayin’ ;)

  85. upstate kate June 30th, 2010 at 10:57 am

    speaking of vacation planning…I am making my husband take a few days off from triathlon training to take me down to Cooperstown…anyone have any suggestions for parts of the HOF not to miss?

  86. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 10:57 am

    Ron

    Who do they replace and what do they do with the one they replace?

    It’s fine to trade prospects for a need but not for a strength.

  87. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 10:58 am

    MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 10:46 am
    GB-

    Military planning skills and vacation planning skills are not one in the same.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    Yeah, she said pretty much the same thing….just not quite that eloquently.

  88. Bret the Hitman June 30th, 2010 at 11:00 am

    I am 100% against trading Austin Romine (aka August Romain) for Cliff Lee

  89. upstate kate June 30th, 2010 at 11:00 am

    CompassRosy
    nice to see you back…I had such high expectations for your team this year, actually I thought they would win the W

  90. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 11:01 am

    GB7

    I can see why she might not want to go to an alligator farm.

    She was probably afraid she wouldn’t come home. :lol:

  91. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 11:02 am

    GB-

    Personally, I see nothing wrong with visiting an Alligator farm on a vacation. Can’t understand her objection.

    It’s more interesting than a lot of things people do.

    Nothing like watching a whole dead chicken disappear in a nanosecond. :)

  92. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 11:03 am

    MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 11:01 am
    GB7

    I can see why she might not want to go to an alligator farm.

    She was probably afraid she wouldn’t come home

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    Given her state of mind when we drove up to it, it was me that should have been afraid of not making it home.

  93. RayVT June 30th, 2010 at 11:04 am

    Hello GB & SJ!

    I see your voices are trying to call the fears of those concerned after a Yankee Loss again. Losses happen! LOL!

    The only way I see the Yanks getting involved in Lee this year is if Boston or Tampa really goes hard after him. I don’t want to see Montero or Romine heading to Seattle.

  94. RayVT June 30th, 2010 at 11:05 am

    CALL = CALM

  95. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 11:07 am

    GB7

    Of course I’m sure you didn’t give her any reason to feel that way.

    You seem like such a mild mannered guy. :lol:

  96. Joe from Long Island June 30th, 2010 at 11:10 am

    We went to Acadia, and Bangor, as I recall (this was a few years ago). The wife still hasn’t forgiven me. She swears she will never let me plan another vacation trip again.

    So, we went down to Tampa for ST for a few days this March. She gets the idea that she wants to go to the Everglades. Being the city boy that I am, I look up the Everglades online, and see that it’s full (at least by my definition) of alligators and snakes, not to mention flying bugs the size of aircraft carriers.

    After I told her that it was OK for HER to go, as I had just paid up the life insurance policy, she lost interest.

  97. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 11:13 am

    Joe-

    That was going to be her revenge for the Maine trip.

    Good thing you realized it before it was too late. ;)

  98. champ809 June 30th, 2010 at 11:14 am

    if the Yanks were willing to take on salary then a trade for Carlos Lee to DH would make them a mortal lock!

    Jeter
    Swish
    Tex
    ARod
    Cano
    Lee
    Posada
    Grandy
    Gardy

    would be a true murderers row…He’s a true rbi guy who would I think make them impossible to pitch to and in a pinch could play some LF although I wouldn’t want him to…I know he doesn’t want to leave Houston because of it’s proximity to Panama but for a year and a half to play in NY and win a couple of rings I think he’d wake up….

    Don’t think that Ca$h would want to take on the $23mil in salary commmitments though…

    Lee’s a Yank next year for sure…I just hope they keep it @ 5yrs/$100-110mil…

  99. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 11:15 am

    Joe

    Tell her you’re a trip planner not a weather forcaster. :lol:

  100. raymagnetic June 30th, 2010 at 11:16 am

    Champ,

    Carlos Lee? Not this iteration of Lee. He’s not good anymore at all.

  101. tampayank June 30th, 2010 at 11:19 am

    “# champ809 June 30th, 2010 at 11:14 am

    if the Yanks were willing to take on salary then a trade for Carlos Lee to DH would make them a mortal lock!

    Jeter
    Swish
    Tex
    ARod
    Cano
    Lee
    Posada
    Grandy
    Gardy

    would be a true murderers row…He’s a true rbi guy who would I think make them impossible to pitch to and in a pinch could play some LF although I wouldn’t want him to…I know he doesn’t want to leave Houston because of it’s proximity to Panama but for a year and a half to play in NY and win a couple of rings I think he’d wake up….

    Don’t think that Ca$h would want to take on the $23mil in salary commmitments though…

    Lee’s a Yank next year for sure…I just hope they keep it @ 5yrs/$100-110mil…

    2 Panamanians on the Yanks :) ?

    And Carlos Lee……there are direct flights from Newark to Panama City

  102. Phil Hughes June 30th, 2010 at 11:20 am

    Lee has a full no trade clause, 37 million left on his contract-18.5 mil per year-and a .680 OPS. No thanks.

  103. MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 11:20 am

    The one concern I have with Lee is I heard this isn’t the first time he’s had an ab strain.

  104. tampayank June 30th, 2010 at 11:21 am

    I don’t like players w/ the frame of Nick Johnson, Carlos Lee, etc …those types seem to break down way too wasy

  105. Tom in N.J. June 30th, 2010 at 11:22 am

    Carlos Lee?

  106. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 11:25 am

    Hank Blalock was just DFA’ed by the Rays.

  107. raymagnetic June 30th, 2010 at 11:28 am

    Hank Blalock?

  108. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 11:30 am

    Bret the Hitman June 30th, 2010 at 11:00 am
    I am 100% against trading Austin Romine (aka August Romain) for Cliff Lee

    —–

    Why Brett? I don’t profess to know who will be the better of our 3 catching prospects but if trading the 2B Adams and a catcher gets us Lee then how do you not do that?
    The Post says trade Montero which we all don’t want because we think he will be great.
    Only the Yankees know who they like best and only Seattle knows what they like best.
    Based on what little I know I would trade Romine for Lee in a heartbeat but what do I know?

  109. Giuseppe Franco June 30th, 2010 at 11:34 am

    Why Brett? I don’t profess to know who will be the better of our 3 catching prospects but if trading the 2B Adams and a catcher gets us Lee then how do you not do that?

    ————

    Because it doesn’t make sense to trade one of their best chips to get a guy they’ll probably end up signing in the offseason anyways.

    Cashman doesn’t roll that way and he’s demonstrated that time and time again. Especially for a spot in the rotation that the team doesn’t need right now.

  110. Wakka Wakka June 30th, 2010 at 11:38 am

    I would trade my self esteem and dignity to get Cliff Lee, but I think that’s way too low to get him.

  111. Joe from Long Island June 30th, 2010 at 11:41 am

    Hank Blalock? After only 63 ABs, and 69 PAs? Talk about impatience.

    It was only a few years ago he was an All Star. Hit a HR in that game, too.

  112. Everyone sucks except SJ and CB and Doreen June 30th, 2010 at 11:42 am

    Who comes out of the rotation if you acquire Lee, morons?

    One of the guys who has ten wins?
    The guy who started poorly but is now pretty reliable?
    The guy who is struggling right now but is also owed a ton of money?

    Who comes out so you can fit Lee in?

    Seriously, there is no need, barring injury, for Lee this year. Hold on to the prospects and buy him in the offseason.

  113. raymagnetic June 30th, 2010 at 11:43 am

    Wasn’t Cashman willing to pay twice last year for Doc Halladay?

    Wasn’t he also willing to pay twice for Santana?

    Those trades didn’t happen but Cashman made offers on both of those guys. I somehow don’t see him sitting on the sidelines this time around if the price is right.

  114. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 11:44 am

    Giuseppe Franco June 30th, 2010 at 11:34 am
    Why Brett? I don’t profess to know who will be the better of our 3 catching prospects but if trading the 2B Adams and a catcher gets us Lee then how do you not do that?

    ????

    Because it doesn?t make sense to trade one of their best chips to get a guy they?ll probably end up signing in the offseason anyways.

    Cashman doesn?t roll that way and he?s demonstrated that time and time again. Especially for a spot in the rotation that the team doesn?t need right now.

    ———

    Guisepp, I hate that response. if we could get him for 3 Months THIS year to help us win THIS year then to me it’s worth it.
    What would we use that chip for later? Will he get us a front line starter as good as Lee?
    We need him now as I don’t want Javy pitching in the playoffs instead of Lee do you?
    I know it’s out of the recent norm for Cash but this is an exception IMO that you can’t pass on.
    We are not giving up a Hughes or Joba which is why we passed on Santana.
    If we wait and sign Lee next year we still give up 2 draft picks which may or may not turn out to be as good as Romine.
    Also there is no 100% guarantee that we will sign Lee in the off season.

  115. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 11:44 am

    Afteernoon, Ray. It’s like [iszing in the wind. Definately a losing battle. Oh, well. I guess I’ll just continue trying to tilt the windbags….errr….windmills.

    How are things your way? Still hot and muggy?

  116. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 11:45 am

    Joe-

    He’s 29.

    He’s cheap.

    Hits righties fairly well.

    Has some pop.

    Does not K a ton.

    Represents an upgrade for the LH portion at DH.

    Can play first, or maybe third in a pinch.

    Worth a try ?

  117. Joe from Long Island June 30th, 2010 at 11:45 am

    I somehow don?t see him sitting on the sidelines this time around if the price is right.

    Ah, there’s the rub….

  118. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 11:46 am

    MaineYankee June 30th, 2010 at 11:07 am
    GB7

    Of course I’m sure you didn’t give her any reason to feel that way.

    You seem like such a mild mannered guy.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    I just don’t understand it. I get along with everybody.

    I think she objected to my dragging her into culture and refinement that alligator farms can offer.

  119. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 11:47 am

    Everyone sucks except SJ and CB and Doreen June 30th, 2010 at 11:42 am
    Who comes out of the rotation if you acquire Lee, morons?

    One of the guys who has ten wins?
    The guy who started poorly but is now pretty reliable?
    The guy who is struggling right now but is also owed a ton of money?

    Who comes out so you can fit Lee in?

    Seriously, there is no need, barring injury, for Lee this year. Hold on to the prospects and buy him in the offseason.

    ——-

    The answer is simple Moron. You trade the guy who started slow who is coming on but that no one trusts in the post season who if implodes in the post season everyone will say how did you bring him back Cash.
    He potentially leaves next year anyway and if you can move him and get Lee now then who is the moron?

  120. Joe from Long Island June 30th, 2010 at 11:48 am

    MTU – this guy definitely gets your attention. I’d bet Billy Eppler and the pro scouting dept. has a file on him. I wonder what their take on him is. If it’s a mechanical thing, and they think KLong might be able to fix it (maybe show him some video of Blalock), it might be worth a shot.

  121. NYYROC June 30th, 2010 at 11:48 am

    I am in the group that thinks that Cashman won’t pay 2x for Lee. Sure is tempting though. On a team like the NYY Lee would be virtually a guarnteed win every time out. He would put the NYY pitching so far over the top they would be the closest thing to a guaranteed #28 in 2010 as you could get. And that is what this team is about winning, not coming close but winning. How will Cashman feel if Lee goes somewhere else and knocks the NYY out of the playoffs knowing he could have had him for (guessing) Romine, Nunez and 1 or 2 others.
    Kruk was on Kay’s show yesterday and he said many Phills FO people and Manuel still can’t understand why they traded Lee for guys to “restock the farm system” as Kruk put it. He said those guys aren’t even playing well in the mL. At $9MM the Phils could’ve kept Lee one more year and gotten Doc, according to Kruk. The guys the NYY would trade may turn out good but you never know and Lee is a great pitcher. Don’t think it will happen, but tempting.

  122. Joe from Long Island June 30th, 2010 at 11:52 am

    Plugging Cliff Lee into the rotation is not so simple as just working out a trade for him with Seattle. You need to lose a starter. So, you would have to work out a simultaneous deal to unload the unwanted starter – maybe Vazquez, but who just so happens to have at least a partial no-trade, according to what I’ve read.

    So, it gets a bit complicated. Not impossible, it’s just that this deal would have a few more moving pieces than your average acquisition.

  123. mama where's my baba June 30th, 2010 at 11:53 am

    Cashman doesn’t roll that way and he’s demonstrated that time and time again. Especially for a spot in the rotation that the team doesn’t need right now.

    ***********************************
    I don’t think its very wise to say that he will never trade prospects just because he doesn’t like to pay twice. I would think he’s smarter than to stick with a rule that makes sense most of the time but not always (then again he DID sign Nick Johnson thinking he’d stay healthy so his intelligence took a big hit there). Like everything else you have to look at the situtaion and decide if its a smart move.

    No matter how you slice it Romine and Adams may not have a future in pinstripes. Cano isn’t going anywhere which makes adams expendable, and you won’t be able to platoon montero, sanchez and romine at catcher in 3 or 4 years which makes one of those 3 expendable. If romine and adams is all you need to give up to get lee then why not do it? You then can makes deadline trades with other teams for one of your starting picthers (probably vazquez) and the Yankees are dealing from the position of strength and can ask for whatever they want in return for one of their starters. Cliff Lee in the playoffs is better than anyone the yankees have right now, including sabathia.

    CC, Lee and Pettite with either basketcase or hughes as the 4th starter is so much better than cc, pettite and pick your poison as the #3 and #4. Again you will be dealing from a position of strength if you get lee for expendale pieces and then having the luxury of trading vazquez to whomever is desparate on july 31st and robbing them of 2 or 3 good prospects – like outfielders and a future closer whom the yankees have little of in the minors.

    oh and how cashman rolls is that he rarely offers his players arbitration so he’d probably lose vazquez to F/A next year without getting any draft picks for him.

  124. ron June 30th, 2010 at 11:55 am

    If burnett & vaz don’t get straightened out there will be pressure to sign lee.

    Hughes is a concern also.

    Although i think we will be fine we have 1 pitcher(burnett) who is a disaster,vaz not sure about,hughes still growing.

    If vaz has a few bad outings i can see him going to the pen being he has only a half year left with us.I agree cc,hughes,pettitte,burnett are not going to the pen but we can trade for lee & put vaz in the pen killing 2 birds with one stone if you will.

    It all depends on if lee is willing to wait for us & sign with us in fa,maybe he want’s to hit fa regardless to maximize his contract also.

    Things will look a lot different if both burnett & vaz get bombed in their next outing with hughes still struggling.

  125. Bret the Hitman June 30th, 2010 at 11:58 am

    If Seattle can’t get a top catching prospect from another team for Lee then why should we forfeit one of ours?

    If I’m going to pay twice for Lee, I’d trade away talent valued slightly above the equivalent of the first round draft pick it would cost to sign him as a free agent.

    I’d see if they’re interested in guys like Eduardo Nunez, Brandon Laird, David Adams. They’re not as valuable as Romine or Montero but they’re all worth more more than the 32nd pick in the draft because they’re more projectable.

    We have plenty of other talent to piece together an above-market trade offer.

  126. Joe from Long Island June 30th, 2010 at 11:59 am

    I wonder if Vazquez would waive his no-trade clause for “financial considerations”?

    I keep coming back to a three-way deal.

  127. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 12:02 pm

    “oh and how cashman rolls is that he rarely offers his players arbitration so he?d probably lose vazquez to F/A next year without getting any draft picks for him.”

    ——

    Agree 100% on this point Mama and on your entire response.

    To me this is a no brainer. The one point I may disagree with is on the return in trading Javy. I’m not sure we will get much back in return but getting anything back is a plus since you are just making room for Lee.
    I’m sure Joe would want him back in LA lol.

  128. ron June 30th, 2010 at 12:02 pm

    I think cash will take a look at lee at the deadline.
    He won’t get robbed but their are packages that he is willing to trade lee for i guarantee you that.

    Now he might not be willing to part with what seattle want’s but he will trade for lee if the need is there & the package acceptable.All depends on what our pitching is like at the deadline.

    Imo if vaz is pitching ok it makes it very difficult to trade for lee because vaz is the only pitcher that i think cash is willing to put in the pen.

  129. pat June 30th, 2010 at 12:03 pm

    Blalock for Yankees?

    Probably need a right handed bat more than a left handed bat so I’d prefer Michael Young if the Yankees are trying to rebuild the 2003 Texas Rangers infield one piece at a time but Blalock is going to get some interest if the price is right.

    I could see the Sox giving it a thought with the injuries to Martinez and Lowell.

  130. Steve June 30th, 2010 at 12:04 pm

    The Yankees have 5 catchers down in the system ! . Send one with another prospect and land an “Insurance Arm” , Burnett is starting to worry me . .and I just can’t count on Vasquez. We are pretty much one injury in the roation away from being in deep trouble .

  131. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 12:05 pm

    Joe-

    Vasquez’s NTC is not that restrictive. It only includes the AL and NL west I believe.

    He is from PR and it seems like he just wants to stay on the East coast.

  132. Mike RI June 30th, 2010 at 12:06 pm

    where would Blalock play ?? he doesn’t offer much value for us .

  133. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 12:07 pm

    Joe from Long Island June 30th, 2010 at 11:59 am
    I wonder if Vazquez would waive his no-trade clause for ?financial considerations??

    I keep coming back to a three-way deal.

    —–

    Thats what I have been saying all along. Get something back that you can throw in to the M’s. I disagree with Brett that we can offer lower end value to get Lee.
    I am trying to be fair and not rape Seattle which I don’t think they will allow.
    If Romine, Adams and whatever we get back for Javy will work then do it.
    Cash worked the 3 way deal in the Grandy trade so hopefully he is working on something to get Lee because we need him.
    Javy, Burnett, Hughes all question marks as we stand today.
    Pettitte you never know with the elbow knock on wood and until his last 2 starts CC wasn’t looking so ace like.
    Lee will take us over the top and isn’t that how we roll?

  134. Joe from Long Island June 30th, 2010 at 12:10 pm

    Thanks, MTU.

    I don’t think any deal is going to happen until after the All Star Break, 2nd half of July. As Seattle falls more out of it (don’t get their trading for Branyan), and the market heats up more. Starting pitching will be sought, and there will be a market for Vazquez, esp. if he keeps pitching well.

    Another kicker could be Cliff Lee himself. If he truly wants to test FA market, and won’t consider an extension mid-season, he becomes a bit less attractive for Cash. Again, depends on what it’s going to cost now.

  135. mama where's my baba June 30th, 2010 at 12:11 pm

    YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 12:02 pm
    “oh and how cashman rolls is that he rarely offers his players arbitration so he?d probably lose vazquez to F/A next year without getting any draft picks for him.”

    ——

    Agree 100% on this point Mama and on your entire response.

    To me this is a no brainer. The one point I may disagree with is on the return in trading Javy. I’m not sure we will get much back in return but getting anything back is a plus since you are just making room for Lee.
    I’m sure Joe would want him back in LA lol.

    *************************

    YankeeRay desperation makes teams do many stupid things – if the Cardinals for example think that they are 1 decent starter away from making the playoffs and vazquez is the only one available then you can pretty much start cherry picking what you want from them…I mean look at what they gave Matt Holliday when they were the only team that waas bidding for his services.

    Theo Epstein is not very smart but the one smart thing he’s said is the goal is to make the playoffs and then anyone in them can go on a roll and win it. If vazquez is the missing piece for that one team (or so they think) then the yankees can ask for whomever they want and say no to the deal if they don’t reciprocate.

    and even if you get back 2 average players its still more than you’d get if you don’t offer javy arbitration and he signs elsewhere.

  136. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 12:14 pm

    ron June 30th, 2010 at 12:02 pm
    I think cash will take a look at lee at the deadline.
    He won?t get robbed but their are packages that he is willing to trade lee for i guarantee you that.

    Now he might not be willing to part with what seattle want?s but he will trade for lee if the need is there & the package acceptable.All depends on what our pitching is like at the deadline.

    Imo if vaz is pitching ok it makes it very difficult to trade for lee because vaz is the only pitcher that i think cash is willing to put in the pen.

    ——–

    We can’t wait for the deadline. Getting him for 3 Months is better than 2 months. If something happens to one of our pitchers between then and now then they will have more leverage. If something happens to someone elses pitchers then they will offer more.
    The time to strike is now IMO. Don’t let him leave the Bronx, would love to see him in pinstripes before last game of series :)

  137. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 12:14 pm

    Joe-

    Just for argument’s sake.

    Let’s say that the Mets want Lee but know they don’t want to give away what it would take to get him.

    But they still want a pitching and would consider Vasquez.

    What would they be willing to give up for a half season rental of Vasquez ?

  138. Joe from Long Island June 30th, 2010 at 12:15 pm

    YankeeRay – I think any pitching staff has potential landmines for injuries and question marks, but overrall I agree with you. You can’t expect Seattle to get nothing in return, and getting Lee in our rotation makes the postseason a better bet, with all those extra revenue dollars. That makes it very worthwhile for the Yankees.

    Again, it comes down how much each party wants – Seattle, third-team, and Lee (to forego FA and sign an extention now). I’d bet Cash is busy trying to find the answers to those very questions.

  139. I Like Inge June 30th, 2010 at 12:16 pm

    All these trade suggestions. How about the Yankees go out there and take 2 out of 3 from teams like they have been doing most of the year, winning series consistently. The talent is already on this team. Lee is not an immediate need.

  140. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 12:16 pm

    MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 12:14 pm
    Joe-

    Just for argument?s sake.

    Let?s say that the Mets want Lee but know they don?t want to give away what it would take to get him.

    But they still want a pitching and would consider Vasquez.

    What would they be willing to give up for a half season rental of Vasquez ?

    —–

    I’ll take Beltran as we should have signed him first time through :)

  141. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 12:17 pm

    For Trenton, Grant Duff has been placed on the 7 Day DL and JB Cox has been recalled from Tampa to replace him.

  142. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 12:19 pm

    YRay-

    I was thinking more along the lines of propects that we could then either keep or flip for a potential 3-way for Lee.

    Just speculating that’s all.

  143. Bret the Hitman June 30th, 2010 at 12:19 pm

    I’m not trying to rape Seattle. I just don’t think the Mariners will be able to snag a top catching prospect for a rental. They’re trying to rape US in that respect. I don’t think any team would forfeit a top catching prospect for a rental.

    I’m saying we have plenty of prospects outside of Romine and Montero to put together a competitive, above-market offer.

    I’d offer one of Banuelos/Ramirez + 2 of Eduardo Nunez/Brandon Laird/David Adams

  144. Joe from Long Island June 30th, 2010 at 12:19 pm

    MTU – well, Pagan and Mejia have current injury concerns, so that eliminates them for the time being. IN AAA, a young catcher named Thole, and Fernando Martinez, OF. Beyond that, their better prospects are lower in the chain. And then, it would depend what Seattle thinks of them.

    Cards might be a player for Vaz, esp. after signing Holliday to big money, and wanting to keep Pujols content. Supposedly, several NL teams were calling Cash on him last month, when he had his struggles.

  145. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 12:21 pm

    Bret-

    Personally, I don’t think it would be a good idea to give up Nunez.

  146. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 12:21 pm

    Whatever Seattle gets for Lee, you can bet the demand will be more than a first round and a sandwich pick.

  147. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 12:21 pm

    MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 12:19 pm
    YRay-

    I was thinking more along the lines of propects that we could then either keep or flip for a potential 3-way for Lee.

    Just speculating that?s all.

    I know just kidding on Beltran although I was hot for him when we opted for Randy Johnson instead.

  148. Joe from Long Island June 30th, 2010 at 12:21 pm

    I’m still concerned about Beltran’s knee. Plus, he’s been away so long, without facing ML pitching. I wouldn’t take him on the Yanks. Another team might bite. I think the Mets would love to unload him and his contract, and play Pagan in CF.

  149. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 12:22 pm

    Joe-

    I don’t think any of this is likely to happen but it doesn’t hurt to keep an open mind. :)

  150. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 12:23 pm

    Bret the Hitman June 30th, 2010 at 12:19 pm
    I?m not trying to rape Seattle. I just don?t think the Mariners will be able to snag a top catching prospect for a rental. They?re trying to rape US in that respect. I don?t think any team would forfeit a top catching prospect for a rental.

    —–

    Brett, we have 3 and can afford to give up 1. Why do you consider Lee a rental?
    If we include the Catcher then of course we should ask for a window to sign him long term.

  151. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 12:23 pm

    Joe-

    I don’t think the Mets would part with F-Mart for Vas would they ?

  152. Yankee Trader June 30th, 2010 at 12:24 pm

    Rumors are the Mets are hot for Lee, without requesting an extension, which puts him in NY close to his buddy CC. This would not be a bad scenario, since it gets him back to the NL. If there was a possibility for the Yankees to get Lee now, without giving up prospects like Montero, Nunez, they would somehow have to get a 3rd [eastern] team interested in taking Vazquez, as AJ is virtually untradeable.

    If Royals are truly willing to eat most of Jose Guillen’s contract, then he’d be a better option than Thames as a right handed bat, for the remainder of this season. Blalock is a lefty, who has nothing left. Russell Branyan was out there if the Yankees had wanted another lefty with power, as he was eventually traded to the Mariners.

    Just my two cents.

  153. pat June 30th, 2010 at 12:25 pm

    NY Times feature about Mo that will be in the Magazine section this Sunday.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07.....72-rmgM61B CJTmJBEfpLmPjg

  154. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 12:28 pm

    Yankee Trader June 30th, 2010 at 12:24 pm
    Rumors are the Mets are hot for Lee, without requesting an extension, which puts him in NY close to his buddy CC

    —–

    Lee sounded like he loved pitching in NYS. I would think that he would prefer to go to a place that he will stay long term as all this bouncing around has got to be tough on him and his family. If he wants to be close to his buddy CC then no place better than in NYS.

  155. Bret the Hitman June 30th, 2010 at 12:29 pm

    Brett, we have 3 and can afford to give up 1.
    ************

    Just because we can afford to give up 1 catching prospect it doesn’t mean we should especially when no other team would be willing to forfeit a top catching prospect for a rental.

    My offer is Manny Banuelos + Eduardo Nunez + Brandon Laird.

    We’d still have Romine + Montero + Brackman + Betances.

    Nunez and Laird are blocked by Jeter and Arod.

    Adams is blocked by Cano.

    Why not try to deal from a surplus of positions other than catcher?

    This is a rental we’re talking about here and the rest of baseball will be unwilling to let go of a top caching prospect for a rental even if they have a surplus.

  156. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 12:31 pm

    other than pitching in the spolight and in the white hot heat of the AL east who wouldn’t love NYS.

    It’s state of the art and very plush.

    If you can stand the heat who wouldn’t want to live in baseball luxury.

  157. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 12:31 pm

    “spotlight”. sorry.

  158. ac1 June 30th, 2010 at 12:32 pm

    Cashman doesnt do mid-year extensions, so why would he trade for Lee now, with the off chance he does not sign with the Yankees in 2011?

  159. Pat M. June 30th, 2010 at 12:34 pm

    Last week two Seattle scouts were sent to follow the Yanks minor league players…..So if something sensiable can be arranged Lee could be in pinstripes…….Javy would be the odd man out I would guess…….Phil’s lack of consistent command was his undoing last night, bottom line……

  160. Yankee Trader June 30th, 2010 at 12:35 pm

    Yankee Ray-

    Would like Lee in pinstripes also, but don’t see it happening in the next few weeks, unless a three way trade is made which involves Javier Vazquez.

  161. ac1 June 30th, 2010 at 12:35 pm

    I wouldnt give up Laird or Nunez. Nunez can come in and replace Pena, and Laird looks like a hitting machine. In a couple years, who knows what happens with Alex and Jeter’s fielding ability. Laird may have a chance to be an everyday player between 3B and maybe the OF (if they start letting him play some in LF/RF now.

    No way we give up players with his kind of bat.

  162. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 12:38 pm

    No score in Trenton game thru 2 innings. Brackman,” 2 innings, 0 hits, 0 runs, 1 walk, 2 strikeouts. 0 ground outs, 2 flyouts. FB is 93-94 MPH, hard breaking slider at 87-88 MPH and sharp curve.

  163. Everyone sucks except SJ and CB and Doreen June 30th, 2010 at 12:38 pm

    thank god none of you run this team

  164. rj June 30th, 2010 at 12:38 pm

    SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 10:24 am
    Actually Aaron, look beyond the numbers.

    ======================================

    That’s all these people have is numbers. Last I checked this game was played on grass, not on microchips, but they’d have you think otherwise.

  165. LGY June 30th, 2010 at 12:40 pm

    “Brett, we have 3 and can afford to give up 1.”

    ————————————–

    This is terrible logic and an extremely poor way to use a farm system.

  166. blake June 30th, 2010 at 12:40 pm

    Does “everyone who sucks” include yourself?

  167. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 12:41 pm

    The guess around Trenton is that Laird would be moved to a corner outfield but still fill in at the two corner infield spots. That was the word on the radio broadcasts a couple of nights ago.

  168. rj June 30th, 2010 at 12:41 pm

    Rich in NJ June 30th, 2010 at 10:30 am
    Sorry if this has been posted:

    http://deadspin.com/5576040/ya…..h-his-face

    ======================================================

    This is awesome.

  169. LGY June 30th, 2010 at 12:41 pm

    Cashman was willing to trade for Halladay in the winter because we would have had him for a full season.

    Also, it became well known that Halladay wanted to be traded to a place where he could sign an extension and was even willing to take less than market to do so.

    Very different than the Cliff Lee case right now.

  170. Patrick from CT June 30th, 2010 at 12:42 pm

    Thames has stunk other than in April. I see him getting replaced if he does not come back killing the ball.
    Is Gardner coming back tonight?
    Who’s going to DH tonight?
    GTLU

  171. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 12:44 pm

    In the 3rd inning, Austin Krum singled and scored from 1st base on Romine’s double to right field. Laird is 0-2.

  172. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 12:48 pm

    Do some of you really think the Yankees are going to trade for Cliff Lee AND do an in season extension with him?

    Something they aren’t doing with Jeter and Rivera?

    Not happening.

  173. austinmac June 30th, 2010 at 12:48 pm

    If Lee can be obtained this year for Romine and a secondary prospect, I am for it. There is no assurance he will be a free agent if and when he is traded. Everyone argued that the Yankees shouldn’t trade for Halladay when they could just wait until his free agency. Teams that make such trades will do everything in their power to sign the player.

    Clearly, the Yankees minor league strength is catching. They can best afford to lose a catching prospect unless they don’t think Montero will be able to catch. Even then, they have Cervelli helping now and Sanchez hopefully on his way in a few years.

  174. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 12:48 pm

    For Tampa rookies, Culver with a walk and run scored, Sanchez is 0-1 with a strikeout and big 1st baseman Reymond Nunez with an RBI single

  175. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 12:48 pm

    If the Yankees want Lee they can get him at any time.

    They can get him now, or they can get him later.

    They have the wherewithal to do it either way.

    If Jack Z wants to demand a King’s ransom from the Yanks then we just wait till Lee hits FA.

    If not and Mr. Z is prepared to be reasonable maybe we get him now.

    Judging by the recent history of trade demands for top players from the Yanks and Cash’s own proclivities one would have to guess that we don’t get Lee now.

    But you never know.

    I’m keeping an open mind. :)

  176. Patrick from CT June 30th, 2010 at 12:49 pm

    Still talking about Chiff Lee?
    He will not be a Yankee this season unless one of the starters goes down for the year with the next 3 weeks.
    For next year he makes sence, and if Andy retires, you can count on him being a Yankee.

    Now who are the Yankees going to get to replace Thames/Russo/Huffman?

  177. LGY June 30th, 2010 at 12:52 pm

    People on here are severely underestimating Romine as a player and prospect.

  178. Giuseppe Franco June 30th, 2010 at 12:53 pm

    YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 11:44 am

    Guisepp, I hate that response. if we could get him for 3 Months THIS year to help us win THIS year then to me it’s worth it.
    What would we use that chip for later? Will he get us a front line starter as good as Lee?
    We need him now as I don’t want Javy pitching in the playoffs instead of Lee do you?
    I know it’s out of the recent norm for Cash but this is an exception IMO that you can’t pass on.
    We are not giving up a Hughes or Joba which is why we passed on Santana.
    If we wait and sign Lee next year we still give up 2 draft picks which may or may not turn out to be as good as Romine.
    Also there is no 100% guarantee that we will sign Lee in the off season.

    —————

    You may hate that response, but all indications seem to show that is the mind frame of the Yankee front office.

    They LOVE Cliff Lee. But they’d rather sign him in the offseason for just money instead of trading at least one if not two of their top prospects to get him for 2-3 months.

    No matter how you cut it, Lee is a rental. All signs point to him exercising his right to free agency and he’s earned that right.

    No team is going to outbid the Yankees in the offseason if they want him. And I’m sure he wants to win, so he’ll get the best of both worlds with the biggest contractual offer combined with the chance to win a WS every every year.

    No, nothing is guaranteed in baseball. But that scenario is much more likely to happen than Cashman trading two of his best chips for a position that they don’t really need.

    They need a bat off the bench and at least another bullpen arm. They don’t need another starting pitcher unless disaster strikes.

    The offseason is a different story. They could have as many as two open slots in the rotation if Pettitte retires and Vazquez leaves via free agency. Then, acquiring another starter becomes a necessity.

  179. raymagnetic June 30th, 2010 at 12:57 pm

    No one is underestimating Romine. If you have to trade him to get a player of Lee’s caliber then people are willing to do it.

    You aren’t getting Lee by trading trash to Seattle.

  180. gayle June 30th, 2010 at 12:57 pm

    Not sure anyone here posted this but this breakdown of Mo is pure genius

    http://www.nytimes.com/interac.....l?src=tptw

  181. austinmac June 30th, 2010 at 12:58 pm

    SJ–I don’t think you can compare extending Lee to extending current players. The current players would understand the need for an extension following a trade. That being said, I don’t see it happening. Certainly, not unless he would agree to an extension. I would think he would want to discuss it since he knows the Yankees would pay fair market value.

  182. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 1:00 pm

    Brackman thru 3 innings: 1 hit, 0 runs, 1 walk, 3 strikeouts, 1 Hit batter. It was a bloop single and hit the batter on a full count curve. Throwing a lot of pitches, mostly because of foul balls.

    Cashman is in attendance at the Trenton game.

  183. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 1:02 pm

    gb-

    “Cashman is in attendance at the Trenton game.”

    Thanks for the updates and for the interesting news on Cash.

    Checking in on a prized posession ? :)

  184. CompassRosy June 30th, 2010 at 1:03 pm

    CompassRosy
    nice to see you back?I had such high expectations for your team this year, actually I thought they would win the W

    Thanks, Kate.
    Your expectations for my team were much higher than mine, though I was hoping they would have improved enough to at least be competitive. I knew the offense would struggle in the power department, but was hoping they would be able to play small ball enough to stay in most games with that stellar pitching – so far, it hasn’t worked too well, with many players posting career-worst seasons. For instance, after going 35-20 in one-run games last season, they are currently only 11-15 so far this season.

    Here’s to competitive games for the remainder of this series as well as the upcoming one in Seattle (of which, I will be at all three!)

  185. Pat M. June 30th, 2010 at 1:04 pm

    SJ, when Cashman was looking at CC ( 08 ) and looking even closer at Doc ( 09 ) wasn’t he looking to resign them once they would have been acquired……Just asking as I think Cashman is probing the possibilities

  186. LGY June 30th, 2010 at 1:05 pm

    “No one is underestimating Romine. If you have to trade him to get a player of Lee’s caliber then people are willing to do it.”

    ——————-

    You aren’t getting a player of Lee’s caliber. You are getting a player of Lee’s caliber for 3 months.

    Trading a guy who is becoming one of the best prospects in baseball for that is just not good business

  187. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 1:07 pm

    MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 1:02 pm
    gb-

    “Cashman is in attendance at the Trenton game.”

    Thanks for the updates and for the interesting news on Cash.

    Checking in on a prized posession ?

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    Yeah, I’m guessing that he’s getting a look at some tall kid….can’t remember his name.

    That would make a great picture…6’10″ Brackman facing Chris Cates, a 5’3″ shortstop.

  188. Jerkface June 30th, 2010 at 1:08 pm

    I would not trade any of the yankees top prospects for Lee. Look at what the mariners traded for Lee and that was for a full year. Guess what, the prospects weren’t that great.

  189. MTU (aka GBURL) June 30th, 2010 at 1:09 pm

    GB-

    David and Goliath. Our Goliath.

    Just hope it doesn’t end the same way as the Original version. :)

  190. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 1:12 pm

    Brackman thru 4 innings: 1 hit, 0 runs, 1 walk, 3 strikeouts, 1 Hit batter, 4 ground outs, 3 fly outs. Real quick 4th inning.

  191. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 1:13 pm

    I don’t think Mo or Jeter would understand. Nor should they. They both realize they don’t need another starting pitcher. Especially one that could take money off their table right now. That isn’t flyin’ with either guy.

    Basically, there would have to be a “wink wink” deal in place with Lee to obtain him via trade.

    In other words, no in season extension but, a deal that would be agreed upon in free agency.

    Sort of how Warren Buffet helped Arod and the Yankees bridge their 30 million dollar gap by floating a deal that saves face for both sides.

    Plus, while all of you are eager to deal Romine, what if Seattle doesn’t want Romine?

    What if they want Montero because he’s closer to being ready than Romine?

    Would you still make the deal?

    Seattle is holding the cards. They are looking to get maximum value for Lee. If they can’t, they will just keep him and take the draft picks.

    I don’t think “maximum value” for Seattle is getting a guy two years away from the majors.

    Its getting a guy, or two, they know will be in their lineup Opening Day 2011.

  192. G. Love June 30th, 2010 at 1:13 pm

    I’ve figured out how to make this all work.

    The Yankees trade whatever it takes to get Cliff Lee.

    Then the Yankees trade Javy Vazquez and Curtis Granderson and cash to the Dodgers for Matt Kemp.

    Then the blog spontaneously combusts!

  193. Patrick from CT June 30th, 2010 at 1:13 pm

    Cash did not trade for Santana in 07, CC in 08, or Doc in 09. He is not trading for Cliff Lee this year; 0% chance…

    The Yankees don’t need a starting pitcher at this point in time. All the starters are healthy so move one people…

    Now let’s hear some suggestions for RH bat replacing Thames/Russo??

  194. LGY June 30th, 2010 at 1:15 pm

    And the biggest reason why the Yankees aren’t trading top prospects for Lee is because they have one of the best if not the best rotations in baseball.

    They have the best rotation in the AL East.

    Where is dire need to trade top prospects for Lee?

  195. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 1:16 pm

    So far in his 9 innings with Trenton, only the home run has been a hard hit. The other 8 hits have been pretty soft. Impressive is his season totals of 69 innings, 11 walks and 64 strikeouts. 6 homers allowed and 6 hit batters needs to be worked on, though.

  196. Jerkface June 30th, 2010 at 1:18 pm

    Very impressed with Brak. Glad he isn’t succumbing to the pressure of Cash watching his start. I believe in that article about Aceves, Ace bombed when cash came to watch him at trenton.

    Brak is a fast mover and a friend to all.

  197. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 1:18 pm

    Bret the Hitman June 30th, 2010 at 12:29 pm
    Brett, we have 3 and can afford to give up 1.
    ************

    Just because we can afford to give up 1 catching prospect it doesn?t mean we should especially when no other team would be willing to forfeit a top catching prospect for a rental.

    My offer is Manny Banuelos + Eduardo Nunez + Brandon Laird.

    We?d still have Romine + Montero + Brackman + Betances.

    Nunez and Laird are blocked by Jeter and Arod.

    Adams is blocked by Cano.

    Why not try to deal from a surplus of positions other than catcher?

    This is a rental we?re talking about here and the rest of baseball will be unwilling to let go of a top caching prospect for a rental even if they have a surplus.

    —–

    I n’t disagree with your thinking but Seattle has said that they must get a catcher in return.
    I also like SJ’s in season extension response but I have to think that trading for a player is a little different since you are giving up top talent to get him but an interesting point SJ.

  198. Jerkface June 30th, 2010 at 1:20 pm

    I would trade cervelli to get Lee.

  199. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 1:21 pm

    Ray,

    Seattle spits on the offer of Baneulos, Nunez and Laird for Lee. They can do better from the Twins.

    That’s not going to get the guy.

    Look at it from Seattle’s POV and not the Yankees.

    They have a major chip. They aren’t trading him to a team for players they don’t see as more impactful than what they can get on their own through their own scouting or from other teams.

    That means, Montero or Romine have to go in that deal. Especially since Seattle doesn’t have an elite catching propsect. Its a real weakness in their system at the present time.

  200. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 1:23 pm

    SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 1:13 pm
    I don?t think Mo or Jeter would understand. Nor should they. They both realize they don?t need another starting pitcher. Especially one that could take money off their table right now. That isn?t flyin? with either guy.

    Basically, there would have to be a ?wink wink? deal in place with Lee to obtain him via trade.

    In other words, no in season extension but, a deal that would be agreed upon in free agency.

    Sort of how Warren Buffet helped Arod and the Yankees bridge their 30 million dollar gap by floating a deal that saves face for both sides.

    Plus, while all of you are eager to deal Romine, what if Seattle doesn?t want Romine?

    What if they want Montero because he?s closer to being ready than Romine?

    Would you still make the deal?

    Seattle is holding the cards. They are looking to get maximum value for Lee. If they can?t, they will just keep him and take the draft picks.

    I don?t think ?maximum value? for Seattle is getting a guy two years away from the majors.

    Its getting a guy, or two, they know will be in their lineup Opening Day 2011.

    —-

    SJ, great points but why wouldn’t they understand. If presented in the manner of we are trying to help you win now and later and the only way to get him is to trade top talent and the only way to guarantee keeping him is to sign him now to an extension, that is completely different than their situation IMO.
    I also read where Seattle is looking for someone who will be MLB ready in 20111/2012. There is no guarantee that Montero wil be either so it obviously comes down to who they like more.
    I agree with the wink wink deal, whatever it takes.

  201. G. Love June 30th, 2010 at 1:24 pm

    The thing all you guys advocating dealing from a surplus (like Catcher, ss, 2b, etc.) are missing is we should not deal our surplus for a player we don’t need right now.

    Why waste surplus for a starting pitcher?

    I’m more interested in using surplus to get an OF’er or maybe even our future SS or 3b should Arod and Jeter need to play less in the field.

    Most of the guys we’re talking about dealing aren’t even in AAA yet which means they’ll still be in the system next year.

    When we start to trade some of the young catching it should be to fill a hole on the team.

    Starting pitcher, as it stands, is not a hole on this team.

    What if you actually could get, for sake of argument, Matt Kemp from the Dodgers for some of our surplus?

    Wouldn’t you rather use it on that type of player than a 1/2 season rental with no spot in the rotation who we can sign long term in a few months?

    I’m all for prospect trading. But use them wisely.

    Cliff Lee is a brilliant acquisition, but we can win the world series without him.

    We already have.

  202. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 1:25 pm

    SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 1:21 pm
    Ray,

    Seattle spits on the offer of Baneulos, Nunez and Laird for Lee. They can do better from the Twins.

    That?s not going to get the guy.

    —–
    That was Bretts offer not mine. I have been saying it will take a catcher.

  203. Jerkface June 30th, 2010 at 1:27 pm

    I really like the idea of Javy+Granderson for Kemp. Shoot I’d pay the rest of Javy’s salary.

  204. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 1:28 pm

    For the Yankees to trade for Cliff Lee, three things have to fall into place:

    1. They have to be willing to give up Jesus Montero. Austin Romine isn’t going to do it, IMO. No Montero=No Lee.

    2. They have to get a “wink wink” deal in place for Lee because if they extend him in season, you have some VERY ticked off guys in a solid clubhouse. When two of those “ticked off” guys are Derek Jeter and Mariano Rivera, its an unwanted distraction.

    3. They have to trade Vazquez and get a bat in return because they need a bat more than another starting pitcher right now.

    Three reasons why its a problem:

    1. They may not want to give up Jesus Montero for a guy they will probably sign as a FA.

    2. There is no reason to tick off Jeter and Rivera right now. Plus, they do have the best record in baseball so, its not exactly like the team is hurting.

    3. Javy has a no trade clause that pretty much keeps him in and around the east coast. Who knows if there is a team willing to take on 5 million bucks for the second half of the season AND give up a bat for a guy who is gone at the end of the year.

    Too many obstacles to get a guy you don’t need right now, IMO.

    Between now and the deadline, if a starter gets hurt? Perhaps you re-visit it.

    Now? Not a likely thing to happen.

  205. Jerkface June 30th, 2010 at 1:29 pm

    Javy’s no trade would probably cancel that deal, as I think he wants to stay east coast tho :(

    And no gaurantee the Dodgers are stupid enough to give us Kemp for Grandy.

  206. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 1:29 pm

    G. Love June 30th, 2010 at 1:24 pm
    The thing all you guys advocating dealing from a surplus (like Catcher, ss, 2b, etc.) are missing is we should not deal our surplus for a player we don?t need right now.

    ——-

    GLove, explain why we don’t need him right now? He is our #1 or #2 starter and replaces Javy in the post season. Allows Burnett to be our 4th and Hughes to the pen in playoffs unless AJ continues to blow up which is all the more reason to get Lee now. What if innings becomes a factor? What if Pettitte experiences more elbow pain? It was only 2 years ago when he wore down in the second half and now he is two years older. Hedge your bet and get Lee.
    What are we going to trade our surplus catcher for a RP or 4th OF that won’t be around next year?

  207. Roger(The Dutch Yankees Fan)Final 8!! June 30th, 2010 at 1:30 pm

    Sj,

    With Burnett struggling and Hughes inn limit…

    Would you offer someone like Romine(and B prospects) to get Lee…?

  208. UnKnown June 30th, 2010 at 1:30 pm

    Jerkface I think that is a terrible deal. Kemp is riding pine for Torre right now which tells ya how hot he is going. And if Javy goes who fills that starter role.

  209. G. Love June 30th, 2010 at 1:31 pm

    Jerkface,

    It would actually be a great trade for the Dodgers for this season, but don’t forget Javy isn’t one of “Torre’s Guys”. Well, he was for the 1st half of 2004 when he was pitching like an All Star, but when he struggled due to injury, Torre was not at all understanding.

  210. Jerkface June 30th, 2010 at 1:31 pm

    What are we going to trade our surplus catcher for a RP or 4th OF that won?t be around next year?

    Who ever suggested this? Things I’d trade our surplus for:

    - Good SS (Tulo, Hanley, etc)
    - Good 3B
    - Good OF (Choo)

  211. Betsy June 30th, 2010 at 1:32 pm

    GF, I agree with you about Phil’s need to throw his secondary pitches. He’s totally fallen out of love with his curve. I mean, come on – when he was so excited about the change in ST, he actually said it was better than his curve. What does that tell you about what he thinks about his curve?

    He’s not a 4 pitch pitcher, he’s a 2 pitch pitcher right now because he hardly uses his curve (and it’s not that good anymore – he needs to work on that) and the change is a rarity for him. I don’t know why his command has left him for such a long period of time, but it has. Yes ,he has to get that back in order to pitch better, but he’s not going to be a dominant starter in this game without more than 2 good pitches.

    I don’t think there is any way the Yankees trade for Lee, but then I don’t think their rotation is THAT great. CC is great and he appears to be on a roll now. Andy should be fine, even if he’s not as good as he was in the first half. AJ? I have no idea; he’ll get on a roll and then do the opposite again. Javy is probably ok…..and I do not know how Phil will do in the 2nd half. It’s a good rotation, but beyond that…..? We’ll see.

  212. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 1:32 pm

    bottom of the 5th inning, after a lead off full count walk Brackman gave up a double and the two runs scored on a wild throw from 2nd baseman Justin Snyder to 3rd base.

    Brackman’s starting to lose command, now. 3rd walk, 2nd this inning.

    1st out on a strikeout

    ground out

    double scores another run.

    Fly out deep to the wall in left center.

    Brackman: 5 innings, 3 hits, 3 runs (earned) 3 walks, 4 strikeouts.

  213. Betsy June 30th, 2010 at 1:34 pm

    GB, I think RAB is pompous, but I agree with them about Phil………This is nothing new for me; I said it in ST and I said it when he was dominating. Phil is not going to dominate like he did earlier this season with 2 pitches. First, he was throwing harder (I believe), and second, teams hadn’t adjusted to him.

  214. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 1:34 pm

    Jerkface June 30th, 2010 at 1:31 pm
    What are we going to trade our surplus catcher for a RP or 4th OF that won?t be around next year?

    ?

    Who ever suggested this? Things I?d trade our surplus for:

    - Good SS (Tulo, Hanley, etc)
    - Good 3B
    - Good OF (Choo)

    ——

    Talk about insulting Jeter, we are not trading for a SS or getting one like that for our surplus catcher.
    We have a good 3B, Choo? And who goes now in our OF? A surplus catcher needs to bring back a big bat or a SP not a RP. Who better to bring back than Lee?

  215. Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 1:35 pm

    They have the best rotation in the AL East.

    In April they had the best rotation in the AL East. Since then, they’re a close third.

  216. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 1:35 pm

    Javy can veto a trade to the west coast.

    Ray,

    They won’t understand they because are lifelong Yankees who have represented the franchise well and have been told no in season extensions.

    They would have to watch Lee get one (under your example) in season and have to deal with the Yankees saying, which they will (after all, it is a business), “we just tied up 90+ million on Lee, sit tight”.

    That’s not going to wash.

    Also, the NY media would have a FIELD DAY going to Derek and Mo every day for their reaction to it.

    All this for a guy they don’t need right now? A guy they know they will sign for nothing but money in the off-season? It creates a huge, unnecessary distraction.

    Can’t see it happening.

    By holding onto assets, perhaps you can get a Matt Kemp, BJ Upton, Hunter Pence, etc in the off-season.

    A younger OF who needs a change of scenary because you have such valuable assets (all of these catchers) in the system.

    As others have said, just because you have assets doesn’t mean you have to use them right now.

  217. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 1:36 pm

    Not a good day for Laird so far 0-3 with 2 strikeouts. Romine is 1-2 with a walk and an RBI.

  218. Shame Spencer June 30th, 2010 at 1:37 pm

    “Cliff Lee is a brilliant acquisition, but we can win the world series without him. We already have.”

    Great work G.Love.

  219. G. Love June 30th, 2010 at 1:38 pm

    Yankee Ray,

    You’re making your points based on a lot of what if’s.

    Here’s my counter;

    I don’t want Hughes put back into the pen. I believe that the Yankees are screwing up their pitching prospects with innings limits and shuttling them back and forth to the pen.

    Phil Hughes should be our #3 starter in the playoffs this off season.

    Regardless of what happened last night, he holds more value to this team in the rotation and the team cannot keep flipping him back and forth like that. It has to stop and he has to remain a starting pitcher.

    Our 4th best starter right now is Javy and he’s pitching quite well for someone being called a 4th starter. Why do we need to replace him? Why do we need to give up players to replace a guy pitching well.

    Which leads me to AJ, our current whipping boy and 5th starter. AJ will not pitch this way all season. He just won’t. In fact, maybe now that Eiland is back he will revert to his better self and go on a run.

    As far as Andy’s injury or any injury, no one in our rotation is injured today.

    We don’t need to trade for a Cy Young award winner to give us a 6th starter for the rotation.

    If one of our starters go down, then by all means get Lee.

    If not, the only way you trade for him is if you trade someone out of the rotation, namely Javy Vasquez since he’s the easiest to part with and NL teams would love to add him to their rotation.

    That said, if you’re going to trade Javy, you better receive players worth more than the draft picks we get for him by offering arb and letting him go in the off season. Otherwise, it’s a dumb trade.

    The Yankees are not banishing AJ to the pen because he’s in a slump.

    They also should not be sitting there planning on putting their 3rd best starter back in the bullpen later this season and continue to yo yo him as a player. Phil Hughes needs to stay a starter.

  220. Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 1:38 pm

    In May, the Sox and the Yanks were tied, in June the Sox pulled ahead, and in April the Yanks were far and away better, so the end number is alternately affected for all three teams.
    FWIW, Tampa was nearly the worst rotation in baseball. If not for Price, they’re with Baltimore.

  221. Betsy June 30th, 2010 at 1:38 pm

    SJ, over the last 7 or 8 starts, he’s giving up a lot of hits, more HRs and getting fewer strikeouts. You mentioned he was pitching to contact – I doubt that’s on purpose. Why would he change what was working? Hitters are squaring him up and that’s why he’s pitching to contact – he doesn’t have his swing and miss stuff just now. He’s also not making good pitches in favorable counts…….and CB has mentioned previously that he does not do a good job with 2 outs and RISP. I’m sure that won’t be a career problem ,but where’s the improvement?

  222. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 1:40 pm

    Betsy, Hughes has more than 2 pitches. The other two just aren’t as developed as the fastball and curvew, yet. Seriously, gotta quit worrying about Hughes because of a couple of games. It’s the same thing that every young pitcher goes through.

  223. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 1:44 pm

    Third best rotation in the AL East? Behind whom?

    Right now, Pettitte and Hughes are all starts. CC is 9-3. Javy has pitched very well since May 1 and AJ is struggling.

    Tampa: Price has been great. Shields has been awful for over a month. Garza is their AJ. Niemann has been solid and Wade Davis has fallen off a cliff. Not as good a rotation as the Yankees.

    Boston? Lackey gets a ton of run support. Other than that, he’s been so so. Lester is outstanding. Buchholz has pitched very well. Wakefield and Dice-K are nothing to write home about. Not as good a rotation as the Yankees.

    If all of these teams are so much better than the Yankees, how come they haven’t overtaken them?

    Some of you continue to overrate the opposition and underrate your own team.

    Hughes was throwing 91-94 last night. The same velocity he has had all year.

    There is nothing wrong with his velocity. His location was off last night.

    Next start, he will be fine.

    Its the ups and downs of pitching. If folks can’t be patient with it, find another hobby.

  224. Bronx Jeers June 30th, 2010 at 1:44 pm

    gayle June 30th, 2010 at 12:57 pm

    Not sure anyone here posted this but this breakdown of Mo is pure genius

    ——————————————————————————————-

    Thanks Gayle.

    It looks like Mo’s gonna be featured in this Sunday’s NY Times magazine. Very cool.

  225. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 1:45 pm

    Hughes is light years ahead of where Zach Greinke was at the age of 23 and Greinke had a lot more experience than Hughes.

  226. Hey Kelvin says June 30th, 2010 at 1:46 pm

    Yanks are not trading Granderson, don’t be delusional.

  227. Betsy June 30th, 2010 at 1:48 pm

    Gammons was on WFAN yesterday and he really talked up Romine in comparison to this Ramos prospect the Twins have…..who knows what the Ms would want? I wouldn’t give up either Romine or Montero for Lee…….

  228. raymagnetic June 30th, 2010 at 1:49 pm

    “You aren’t getting a player of Lee’s caliber. You are getting a player of Lee’s caliber for 3 months. ”

    This statement makes no sense.

  229. Jerkface June 30th, 2010 at 1:51 pm

    If Jeter’s batting line continues as it is, I see the Yankees trying to go year to year on him. Nunez could probably put up jeters current line.

    It doesn’t bode well for the future, especially with his increased ground ball rate.

    The yankees need him in uni next season to collect 3,000 hits but after that? Jeter should look to start bowing out.

  230. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 1:51 pm

    Betsy,

    He’s going to do that because he wasn’t going to pitch to a 1.35 ERA all year. So, statmongering with Hughes is a waste of energy.

    What more do you want from the guy? He’s barely spent a HALF SEASON as a starting pitcher!

    You are so fixated on Phil Hughes, you lose all perspective.

    He has more than 2 pitches. He’s not going to USE ALL OF HIS PITCHES IN EVERY START.

    No pitcher does that.

    Last night, Cliff Lee threw almost all fastballs throughout 9 innings. Probably 85-90% fastballs and cutters. Threw some curveballs to some hitters in the middle innings.

    For the most part though, all fastballs and cutters. How did he do last night?

    Phil got hurt with LOCATION last night. Not with pitch selection.

    He gave up a HR to Gutierrez on a pitch that missed its target by a foot. Hit Jorge’s glove, he’s out of the inning. Same for Johnson and Saunders’ doubles.

    Where is the improvement? What do you want Betsy, a 24 win season?

    The guy is 10-2 with a mid-3′s ERA at the halfway point of the season.

    If that’s not good enough for you, nothing will be.

    Every pitcher, even great, veteran pitchers, get roughed up. It happens.

    You have to stop losing your mind after every Hughes outing.

    He is going to struggle. EVERYBODY STRUGGLES IN THIS GAME.

    He’s not immune to it.

    In the end, he has too much talent not to succeed if he stays healthy.

    Its worry for nothing.

  231. Betsy June 30th, 2010 at 1:54 pm

    SJ, I love how I’m fixated on Phil….the guy just pitched last night. Do I have your permission to ever talk about him again?

  232. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 1:55 pm

    I don’t think there is any way the Yankees go year to year with Derek Jeter. I don’t even think that offer would be put on the table.

    They will probably offer 3 years and Jeter will want 4.

    I dont even think the money will be an issue. It will be working out the years in some fashion.

    Mo? He’s opened the door to go year to year and that could be a possibility at this point.

    I’m sure the Yankees liked hearing Mo be open to an Andy type of deal.

  233. Betsy June 30th, 2010 at 1:56 pm

    You have to stop telling me I’m losing my mind because I don’t agree with you that he can get by with 2 pitches like Halladay and Lee. Let’s just agree to disagree because the discussion is now devolving into an argument and we’ve been there and done that before.

  234. Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 1:56 pm

    Betsy, big league hitters will adjust to pitchers. The onus is now on Phil to adjust again for them, which he didn’t do last night, or recently.
    He’s a big boy, regardless of how much they wanna baby him and regardless of how people think the fact that he’s 23 is a pass for him. He’ll figure it out. Stop worrying.
    It’s several issues:
    The number nine hitter is hitting .323 on him this year.
    After throwing 61 pitches, he’s allowing a batting average of .368, so he’s not adjusting the third time through to what he did the first two.
    With runners in scoring pos, and two out, the league is hitting nearly .500 on him.
    In 25 full counts to batters, he’s walked 17 of them, and given up 7 hits.
    His ER, ERA, WHIP, HR, Hits, walks, and K have all gotten worse every month this season, which also suggests that he’s just not making the adjustments that he should be making.
    In the 18AB he’s gone 1-0, he has come back with a fastball 93% of the time, and the league is hitting .588 off of him during those situations, which means he’s scared to trust his stuff and gives in with a fastball. The problem is, more times than not, his fastball is 92 or 93, and not painted, which in MLB, ends up being hit.

    He needs to make adjustments in these areas, and he’ll be fine. And if not, hey, he’s 23, sooner or later, he’ll do what he has to do, or he’ll fade away into mediocrity like so many guys with equal talent and hype before him.

  235. Pat M. June 30th, 2010 at 1:57 pm

    Betsy, what did I say about Phil’s numbers for this season ( 13-7 with a 3.75 ERA ) & many thought I was a candidate for Bellevue……..The lad is in uncharted waters right now, he’ll be fine…..

  236. G. Love June 30th, 2010 at 2:00 pm

    I’m less worried about giving a few years to Jeter right now than I am about keeping Arod at 3b long term.

    He is not moving well at all at 3b. I think it’s in the Yankees best interest to work on finding a 3b that can also DH and keep Arod off the field as much as possible.

    How far away is the Laird kid in the minors? Or this Adams kid people are hyping up…can he play 3b?

    Seriously, Arod does not even have a first step to get a ball to his left right now.

    He is all about defensive positioning and hoping the ball is hit to him.

    Out of Jeter, Jorge and Arod, Arod (at this moment) is looking most like a DH candidate to me.

    I really hope the hip heals up and gets better. Hopefully the fact that his power returned means his mobility will come back as well.

  237. GreenBeret7 June 30th, 2010 at 2:01 pm

    SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 1:55 pm
    I don’t think there is any way the Yankees go year to year with Derek Jeter. I don’t even think that offer would be put on the table.

    They will probably offer 3 years and Jeter will want 4.

    I dont even think the money will be an issue. It will be working out the years in some fashion.

    Mo? He’s opened the door to go year to year and that could be a possibility at this point.

    I’m sure the Yankees liked hearing Mo be open to an Andy type of deal.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    I can see a 3 year with a 4th year option and a 10 year to life time service contract.

  238. Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 2:02 pm

    Boston? Lackey gets a ton of run support. Other than that, he?s been so so. Lester is outstanding. Buchholz has pitched very well. Wakefield and Dice-K are nothing to write home about. Not as good a rotation as the Yankees.

    Again, I was just looking at the numbers. AJ has been garbage the last month, as has Hughes. Javy killed them in April and May. It’s all cyclical. Anything you want to say about Boston or Tampa can also be said about NY. They’ve all had their issues.
    I’m looking at more than just wins here, all knowing prince of the board. I’m looking at the stats of players.
    Pettite and CC have pitched well, which has been matched by Lester and Buchholz. and Price has been better than any of them.
    Why take the stats so personally. Guess what else isn’t anything to write home about – AJ Burnett and lately, Hughes. Every team has it’s moments. I’m just pointing out that it’s not as white and black as you’d think. The numbers point to different answers than you’re suggesting. I’m sorry you can’t accept that.

  239. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 2:03 pm

    Betsy,

    You read posts on a zillion blogs, panic and convince yourself Hughes is going to fail. You then try to come up with all of the reasons why he “won’t be an ace”.

    Sense a pattern?

    Why not look big picture?

    In March, if I said to you on June 30, Phil Hughes would be 10-2 with a 3.58 ERA and the Yankees would be in first place, would you take that? Yes or No?

    Instead, you are fixated on changeups, curveballs, he’s “losing it” etc.

    No he isn’t. He’s going thru the ups and downs every pitcher goes through over the course of a season.

    Last year at the ASB, Andy Pettitte was “done”. Finished. Nothing left.

    Just blew a 5 run lead to the Angels and the Yankees got swept in Anaheim.

    He was “done”, Cash needed to “go find pitching NOW”, from panicked fans, and the Yankees were in “deep trouble”.

    How has it gone since then?

    Pettitte has been one of the best pitchers in BASEBALL since that time. Instead of being happy about that, now folks think he’s all of a sudden going to “lose it”.

    Pitchers are going to have bad stretches. They can’t be avoided.

    You can’t go into panic mode when it happens.

    He doesn’t have to scrap what he’s doing. He has to locate better and perhaps throw a few more off speed pitches per game. Not as many as you think because I don’t care if you know its coming, there is nothing harder to hit than a well placed fastball.

    That’s his bread and butter. That’s what he has to stick to in order to be successful.

  240. Hey Kelvin says June 30th, 2010 at 2:04 pm

    Pat, i still think the record will be better then 13 for Hughes. I believe Yanks will certainly provide the appropriate run support for more then 3 W’s in the upcoming months from what, now till september.

    16-7 sounds more ideal to me, The Era is pretty accurate though.

    Also betsy, SJ didn’t mean it like that. It’s just you do worry tons and it does get annoying for others, but hey this is public so no complaining on my behalf.

    I think today we can get to King Felix and get a “W”. Let’s go Yankees, should be a great day at the stadium.

  241. YankeeRay June 30th, 2010 at 2:04 pm

    SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 1:35 pm
    Javy can veto a trade to the west coast.

    Ray,

    They won?t understand they because are lifelong Yankees who have represented the franchise well and have been told no in season extensions.

    They would have to watch Lee get one (under your example) in season and have to deal with the Yankees saying, which they will (after all, it is a business), ?we just tied up 90+ million on Lee, sit tight?.

    That?s not going to wash.

    Also, the NY media would have a FIELD DAY going to Derek and Mo every day for their reaction to it.

    —-

    SJ I don’t buy the argument. We already told them to sit tight and Levine just said yesterday that they wil be Yankees next year.
    What if we traded for a player that has a few years left on his contract? That would be tying up money as well.
    If we are going to sign Lee in the off season we are still tying up the same money.
    If the Yankee hard line is no in season extensions to players under contract, could that mean in spring training to existing players?
    When making a trade then I think all bets are off. They will get their money no matter what we do or when we do it but to get a player like Lee while giving up talent you do what you have to do IMO.
    Unless of course you do a hand shake deal with Lee.
    But based on your view we shouldn’t even be in the media discussions on Lee because we won’t extend him due to our rules taking us out of play. And we won’t rent him and then sign him because we don’t pay twice.

  242. Betsy June 30th, 2010 at 2:05 pm

    Aaron, those are dreadful numbers…….but hopefully numbers he will improve on next year and the year after that. I don’t think he doesn’t trust his stuff; he’s just too enamored of his FB, esp. when he doesn’t have his command, which he hasn’t had. I can’t figure out why his #s in those situation are so bad – those are #s that mediocre pitchers put up.

  243. Pat M. June 30th, 2010 at 2:06 pm

    Any pitcher will tell you that the art of pitching is so much a touch & feel thing….Like any aspect in life there’s good days and bad days……..It’s the nature of being a human being

  244. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 2:07 pm

    Looking at a month of pitching stats is what’s called a “small sample size”.

    Perhaps you have heard of it.

    People who look at small sample sizes aren’t not accurately reflecting the overall picture.

    Its more stat parsing than anything else.

    Which, folks who have no idea how to use statistics properly tend to do.

  245. Pat M. June 30th, 2010 at 2:09 pm

    SJ, it’s time to put the wind to our backs…….I’m getting wet

  246. Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 2:10 pm

    I also have to look at the fact that CC nearly thirty percent of every inning he’s thrown this year has been to the Baltimore Orioles. Or are we just talking wins again?

  247. Betsy June 30th, 2010 at 2:11 pm

    Kelvin, if people want to think I’m worrying, let them. I honestly believe everything I posted – I’m not panicking at all.

    Pat, we’ll just have to ride it out and see where he ends up at the end of the year. I can’t vouch for ERA, but I’m sure he’ll have more than 13 wins.

    SJ, that’s true – and I’m sure I’ve been spoiled by his dominant start. I realize that pitchers struggle, but I’m looking big picture, not just this year. Had Phil still had his command and FB, you think he’d still be dominating like he was earlier this year? Has the league adjusted to him or is he struggling because he hasn’t had any command lately? I’m not the first one to throw out numbers like Aaron just mentioned. CB has mentioned previously that Phil has difficulties with #9 hitters, putting away hitters with 2 strikes, etc…and I remember him as being puzzled about that given his stuff. Aaron is right – Phil’s ERA before last night in his 3rd time through the lineup was over 6. He’s got some things to work on, that’s all – I’m aware of that.

  248. just wow! June 30th, 2010 at 2:13 pm

    Halladay ends the 6th inning with 79 pitches, Harang ended with 103, just phenomenal !!

  249. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 2:13 pm

    Hughes has been “garbage for a month”.

    Really?

    Care to look deeper into his numbers?

    He had solid starts against the Orioles on June 2 and June 8. Especially important since it was the first time he had faced a team back to back as a starter in his career. Always an adjustment for a pitcher.

    He had ONE bad inning against the Astros on June 13. Other than that, he was very good.

    He pitched a very solid game against the Mets on June 19.

    Last night, he got belted around pitching for the first time in 10 days. Frankly, not unexpected.

    The fact is, if you look deeper into his numbers, which if you are going to use numbers you need to do, you will find out he hasn’t pitched like “garbage” for a month.

    He just wasn’t going to keep pitching to a 1.35 ERA all season. Nobody is for that matter.

  250. Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 2:14 pm

    Actually, looking a month of stats, in relation to the overall year of stats is very telling. Especially when the trend line continues to go in one direction.
    When you individualize a month, and concentrate solely on said month, and refuse to acknowledge anything that happened after or before is “small sample size”. When using that month as a function of the whole, it’s absolutely not SSS. Trend lines and graphs are more telling than anything. It’s called statistics. Maybe you’ve heard of it?

  251. SJ44 June 30th, 2010 at 2:16 pm

    You can only play the teams that are on the schedule Aaron. That’s the way it works in baseball.

    If you watch the games, you can see CC beginning to find it.

    If you look back to last year, he was the same way coming into this time of year. Then, he went on a roll.

    Its not just about looking at raw numbers. Its looking deeper.

    When you do, things aren’t as dire as you may believe they are.

  252. Pat M. June 30th, 2010 at 2:17 pm

    So Aaron, what’s your point ??????

  253. Pat M. June 30th, 2010 at 2:17 pm

    Let’s continue this on the next thread, as most everyone has left us ……

  254. Aaron June 30th, 2010 at 2:18 pm

    So with a few really bad exceptions, he’s been great!

    Without that inning here, or that inning there, it’s all good!

    I looked at, and depicted the numbers as they stand now. I’m sorry if you don’t agree. At the end of the month, his trend line on nearly every statistical category has continued to fall.

    Again, you’re making me sound like I’m down on him, which I’m not, I’m just saying it’s not as meaningless as you think because he had another bad start. He has trended that way.
    In June, he was worse than May, and in April was better than both of them.
    Same with AJ.

  255. vblade June 30th, 2010 at 2:19 pm

    Wait, so Hughes had a single bad start last night and suddenly he’s trending badly? He hasn’t had a terrible start AT ALL before last night.

    There’s no point worrying about Hughes. Him, CC and Pettitte are rocks and Javy has been decent since a brutal start.

    Getting Lee in-season is just terrible resource allocation, considering the cost-benefit. Pay him in the offseason, and enjoy his services next year at the cost of only money.

  256. Pat M. June 30th, 2010 at 2:22 pm

    vblade, what do you think Cashman can get for Javy ???? Then maybe spin some of those parts to Seattle ???? I think that is the option being currently explored by Cashman

  257. Chuck June 30th, 2010 at 2:33 pm

    Thames was gone? I hadn’t even noticed. Don’t care either.

  258. just wow! June 30th, 2010 at 2:50 pm

    Charlie Manuel let Halladay stay in for the 8th and the Reds now have 4 runs off Halladay. Manuel did the same with Pedro in the WS, who was allowed to stay in an extra inning too long!

  259. just wow! June 30th, 2010 at 3:03 pm

    Reds beat Halladay, stupid move by Manuel, becauee they scoed on Halladay the 6-8th, after being held scoreless the first 5 innings. stoopid!

  260. just wow! June 30th, 2010 at 3:06 pm

    Halladay is just 2 games above .500, he’s 9-7. I bet he thought he would be further along than 9 wins ha ha!

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  262. Chuck July 1st, 2010 at 10:59 am

    I am not trying to be you Chuck58. I always post under the name “Chuck” as far as I know.

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