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Jeter: “I don’t necessarily change things based on results.”

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Jul 22, 2010 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

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By his standards, Derek Jeter is not having a very good season. That’s no secret. It’s also no secret that Jeter is a wildly popular player in and out of the Yankees clubhouse, and the people around him seem to pull for him. When Jeter had three hits on Wednesday — after two hits on Sunday – there was hope from Joe Girardi that it was a sign of things to come.

“Sometimes you have to make minor adjustments,” Girardi said. “Sometimes you can watch video for hours until you find exactly what you’re looking for. He’s made some minor adjustments, and he’s swinging the bat better, and that’s a great sign.”

Of course, when Jeter was asked to elaborate on the adjustments, he turned it into a joke.

“Trying to bloop it over the pitcher’s head and into center field,” he said.

Jeter is always one to downplay this sort of thing. It’s part of what’s made him a good player, and if he’s concerned about his .272 average, he isn’t showing it in the clubhouse. In fact, when he finally went into detail about the adjustments he’s made at the plate, he said they were no bigger than repositioning his foot. They’ve been minor tweaks, the kind of changes he makes all the time in the course of a season.

“Not only when you think you’re going bad,” he said. “I don’t necessarily change things based on results.”

Associated Press photo

 
 

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200 Responses to “Jeter: “I don’t necessarily change things based on results.””

  1. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:03 am

    Derek. You have the smile and the bat of a winner. :)

  2. illi3 July 22nd, 2010 at 9:05 am

    there comes a time when you need to start thinking about changing things based on the results

  3. Erin July 22nd, 2010 at 9:06 am

    Love the picture :)

  4. Rich in NJ July 22nd, 2010 at 9:08 am

    Jeter could be totally altering his swing and his approach at the plate (I’m not saying that he actually is), and he would tell the media that he was doing everything the same. Few players say less to the media than Jeter.

  5. 86w183 July 22nd, 2010 at 9:10 am

    147 hits to go!

    The countdown to 3,000 is going to be the best milestone countdown in Yanks history

  6. 86w183 July 22nd, 2010 at 9:11 am

    Jeter could also be in the clubhouse with his leg in a cast and tell reporters he’s fine and playing tomorrow

  7. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:14 am

    My mother is 85 years old.

    And I think she is very savy.

    Derek Jeter is her favorite player. :)

  8. JM July 22nd, 2010 at 9:17 am

    MTU,

    Your mother is a smart lady. :)

  9. Rich in NJ July 22nd, 2010 at 9:18 am

    SJ44

    You never know whether or not a kid can hit ML pitching until he is promoted. But that’s the point, test it. I have read numerous scouting reports that Montero could have hit ML pitching last season; that the only reason he needed to remain in the mL was to determine if he could remain at C.

    Again, if we agree that he will be a September call up, then the issue reduces to two or three weeks. As such, I don’t really see the big deal.

    The Yankees have been far better at developing players than making trades. Afterall, Cash was ready to trade Montero to Seattle for a pitcher that he could sign after the season. TBH, I think that would have been idiotic.

    So I would rather err on the side of seeing what a talented near (at least) ML ready prospect can contribute. To me, that’s the prudent thing to do.

  10. RJ July 22nd, 2010 at 9:19 am

    LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 8:36 am
    The most amazing part of Austin Jackson’s season is that he is still at a .426 BABip.

    For some context on how high that number is, this is a list I pulled off another blog of the highest BABip in baseball history:

    Babe Ruth, 1923, .423
    George Sisler, 1922, .422
    Rogers Hornsby, .422
    Ty Cobb, 1922, .416
    Ty Cobb, 1913, .415
    Harry Heilmann, 1923, .414
    Rogers Hornsby, 1921, .409
    Rod Carew, 1977, .408
    Jose Hernandez, 2002, .404

    ========================

    The relevant comparison to AJax on this list is Jose Hernandez. He had 188 K’s that year. AJax on pace for 165 K’s this year. Pair that with only 1 HR so far, and what do you have? A flawed player, just like Hernandez. Is there potential? Yes, just like there’s potential that Long can get Grandy straightened out.
    This is far from the disaster that some make the trade out to be.

  11. SJ44 July 22nd, 2010 at 9:24 am

    He would be a part-time player here Rich. They aren’t going to play him everyday.

    The kid has been an everyday player his entire career.

    Even if he was called up on Sept. 1, it would be more as a viewer than a player.

    To take a kid that is now just starting to get it going playing everyday in Scranton and have him come here to play part-time to see if he can contribute makes no sense.

    If anything, it puts too much pressure on him to perform because he’s going to want to show something in his limited opportunities.

    With the long stretch of games coming up, the DH spot is going to be reserved for the most part to give guys like ARod, Jeter and Posada half days.

    That’s more important right now than seeing if Jesus Montero can hit major league pitching at this time of the season.

  12. Yankee Trader July 22nd, 2010 at 9:24 am

    GB7-
    They are playing .634 now with this brutal “buulpen.”
    —————————————————
    I like your choice of brutal bullpen which has been brutal bull#/*@

    Now that Mitre is in the starting rotation, we have the likes of batting practice pitchers Gaudin, Moseley, Park pitching multiple innings and giving up too many homers and runs.

    Still think a trade will be made for an arm. Albeit, it was a small sample, Albaladejo didn’t impress me with either velocity, movement or location.

    My biggest surprise this year is that, in terms of least team errors, the Yankees are fighting the Twins for that distinction.

    Congratulations to new Uncle Bret the Hitman!

  13. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:25 am

    JM-

    She is really a riot. Even at that age whenever she shes Jeter she just swoons.

    She calls him her “boyfriend”. :)

  14. GreenBeret7 July 22nd, 2010 at 9:25 am

    I put this on the last board, but, as bad as people think things are going for the Yankees, they are playing 2 percentage ponts below the level that they finished at last year….(.636 to .634). They were at 56-37 after 97 games last year.

    xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

    How bad have things gone for the Yankees this year? They have to go 41-28 to finish with 100 wins. That’s a .594 winning percentage. They are playing .634 now with this brutal buulpen, no bench and everyone having below par seasons except for Cano and swisher. Have they been going to Wal-Mart’s and buying wins at a discount?

  15. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:27 am

    “Congratulations to new Uncle Bret the Hitman!”

    seconded. :)

  16. MaineYankee July 22nd, 2010 at 9:27 am

    To try to put Jackson in that group based on his numbers so far is where I have a problem basing things just on numbers.

    Based on what he’s done so far this season in no way puts him in the same class as those other players and to try to do that is where some have a problem with the numbers.

  17. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:28 am

    “sees Jeter”. sorry. case of the GB’s. :)

  18. Apple byte July 22nd, 2010 at 9:30 am

    R.I.P , Ralph Houk (No.35)

    It’s too bad that Yogi had his accident which prevented him from being at Old Timers Day and Ralph Houk couldn’t attend because of health reasons.
    Yogi’s No. 1 backup (Charlie Silvera, No. 29) was there and it would have been great to see all three of the 50′s catchers together one more time.

  19. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:30 am

    YT-

    I too am hoping that Yanks will still bust a move. :)

  20. Erin July 22nd, 2010 at 9:30 am

    BryanHoch That’s a roadway over where the old Yankee Stadium infield used to be:
    http://twitpic.com/27kgbt

  21. blake July 22nd, 2010 at 9:31 am

    Hasn’t Montero has struggled a bit initially when moving up in levels.

    DJ will be around .300 by the end of the year like he is every year….don’t think 2008 numbers are out of the question. (he was “done” to a lot of folks after that season as well.)

  22. blake July 22nd, 2010 at 9:31 am

    Hasn’t Montero has struggled a bit initially when moving up in levels.

    DJ will be around .300 by the end of the year like he is every year….don’t think 2008 numbers are out of the question. (he was “done” to a lot of folks after that season as well.)

  23. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:31 am

    Maine-

    I thought you were supposed be off on a deserted island with your beloved ? :)

  24. GreenBeret7 July 22nd, 2010 at 9:31 am

    MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:28 am
    “sees Jeter”. sorry. case of the GB’s.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    Or maybe a “Freudian Slip”?

  25. CountryClub July 22nd, 2010 at 9:31 am

    illi3 July 22nd, 2010 at 9:05 am
    there comes a time when you need to start thinking about changing things based on the results

    —————————-

    His point is that he tinkers all the time, whether he’s going good or bad.

  26. 86w183 July 22nd, 2010 at 9:34 am

    We are a greedy, hard to please lot aren’t we?!?

    I agree with SJ on this Montero thing. Even if you consider him an upgrade over Thames as a part time DH it’s not enough of an upgrade to take away 10-15 starts behind the plate. Let him finish the season in Scranton and then give him his cup of coffee in September.

    If they get enough of a lead maybe they can even let him catch a few games before the season is over.

    Yes the bench could be better and so could the pen. But everyone in baseball would trade position with the Yanks right now.

  27. MaineYankee July 22nd, 2010 at 9:34 am

    MTU

    Not yet.

    If it works out we are going tommorow afternoon.

  28. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:34 am

    GB-

    She is a very sweet lady it’s truly sad she produced a monster like me. :)

  29. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:38 am

    Maine-

    Take some photos, of the scenery that is. I would like to see that area. :)

  30. jesusmonterofordh July 22nd, 2010 at 9:38 am

    you let the jesus be the everyday dh, you can catch once a week. give posada a day off.

    is add fleability. you still can catch cervilli and dh jesus, give posada more rest.

    yea arod and derek will need a blow here and there.

    jesus bat is to potent to keep at the minor league level.

    bat him 8th.

    the way jeter hitting you can afford to give him the entire day off and lead gardner off

  31. GreenBeret7 July 22nd, 2010 at 9:39 am

    MaineYankee July 22nd, 2010 at 9:34 am
    MTU

    Not yet.

    If it works out we are going tommorow afternoon.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    How can you be a “true Yankee fan” and desert the team during it’s most important “must win” series of the year? Don’t you even care what happens?

  32. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 9:41 am

    If the Yankees were to theoretically call up Montero, why would he be a part-time player?

    The idea to call up Montero is because the Yankees do not have a DH. The idea being floated around by Rich, MTU, etc. is to make Montero the full-time DH.

    Nothing in his minor league career suggests that Montero is some sort of platoon player. Actually his career OPS is 54 points higher vs. RHP.

    Thames would then be relegated to pinch hitting duties on the team like say for Granderson against a lefty late in the game.

  33. GreenBeret7 July 22nd, 2010 at 9:41 am

    Maine looks just like Arizona and Utah, MTU.

    Except that it’s green instead of brown and has water.

  34. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 9:41 am

    And Miranda would become expendable as Montero is a better hitter than him.

  35. MaineYankee July 22nd, 2010 at 9:42 am

    MTU

    I’m not that savy to put pics on here.

    I’ll try to paint you a good pic. but I’m no artist. :lol:

    So I guess you may need a good imagination.

  36. Tar July 22nd, 2010 at 9:42 am

    Who’s spot wll Montero take if he comes up before the rosters expand? Also as GB has said they have a lot of players that “have” to be protected or the Yankees may lose them. I just don’t see it.

  37. MaineYankee July 22nd, 2010 at 9:43 am

    GB7

    That about sums it up.

    The same but differant. :lol:

  38. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 9:44 am

    I posted this last night, but these are the players that are eligible for the Rule 5 Draft.

    “Zach McAllister, Dellin Betances, Ryan Pope, Bradley Suttle, Austin Krum, Justin Snyder, and Brandon Laird.”

  39. MaineYankee July 22nd, 2010 at 9:45 am

    GB7

    How can you be a ?true Yankee fan? and desert the team during it?s most important ?must win? series of the year? Don?t you even care what happens?

    —————————————————————–

    As much as I like the Yankees I think I better put my wife ahead of them on our anniversary if I know what’s good for me. :lol:

  40. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:45 am

    GB-

    “Except that it’s green instead of brown and has water.”

    I am relieved to hear that. It is good some place has water.

    Out here people have been known to kill for it.

    P.S. You must not have been viewing many of the photos I have posted recently. You haven’t been paying attention. ;)

  41. pat July 22nd, 2010 at 9:46 am

    Joel Sherman’s column today raises a good question.

    If you take emotion out of the equation and were able to insure players had zero ego about where they would hit or play, what is the Yankees best line-up using the current 25 man roster?

  42. Tar July 22nd, 2010 at 9:47 am

    LGY

    When must they be on the 40 man to be protected?

  43. jesusmonterofordh July 22nd, 2010 at 9:47 am

    there plenty of guys you can let go on the 40 man roster

    gaudin,park,miranda,johnson,mosley,thames won’t be on the 40 man next season.

    they be plenty of room for jesus and believe he has to go on the 40 man anyway

  44. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 9:48 am

    These 3 as well

    George Kontos, Lance Pendleton, and Josh Schmidt

    This is an article on RAB discussing next year’s Rule 5 Draft:

    http://riveraveblues.com/2010/.....ash-31488/

  45. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:50 am

    Maine-

    “I’m not that savy to put pics on here.”

    Time for an old dog to learn some new tricks ?

    In some ways it’s good to go modern. :)

  46. GreenBeret7 July 22nd, 2010 at 9:50 am

    Pope and Snyder may get picked off of that list, but, I’d think they are not big priorities. Snyder has never known what to do with a glove at any position and has forgotten how to hit since he left Charleston. Pope only has value because of where he’s from. He just stopped developing and he’s almost 25 in AA.

  47. mick July 22nd, 2010 at 9:50 am

    # BIG AL July 22nd, 2010 at 9:32 am

    GreenBeret7 July 22nd, 2010 at 8:33 am
    I think that by the end of the season, Granderson can pretty easily get his average up in the .260s. With a season total of 17-18 homers and 60-65+ RBI, he’ll be just fine. He provides outstanding speed and power to go with near stellar defense.

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    You seem to enjoy ripping anyone that does not conform to you’re was of thinking. Rather than an exchange of ideas on the blog, you seem to have an attitude of “My way or nothing”. I commented on Mick’s post, simply stating I agreed that many fans take it to heart when the Yankees lose, and do not take a ho hum attitude of not caring one way or the other. No where did I “rant or rave, live or die, as you state, neither did Mick. I don’t know Mick, nor do I know you, other than what you post. I do however believe you are delusional if you keep thinking Granderson will become a productive hitter for the Yankees. And as for his stellar defense, what Granderson have you been watching? He keeps going back on balls that wind up falling in front of him. gardner is a far superior defender. Just as you and others like to point out what Austin Jackson has done so far as his “season”, you then say you can’t judge Granderson on half a season. Jackson could not be batting at such a low BA since May 1st, as stated by SJ44, and still be at .309 as of today.
    # mick July 22nd, 2010 at 9:48 am

    That entire post is a load of horse dung. He may “live and die” and “rant and rave”, you may, but, not everyone does. It’s a sport….a game. I may not like what happening in the game, but, I still love baseball and the Yankees. If you and Mick feel that makes you more of a Yankee fan than some supposed adult who holds their breath and stomps their feet, all I can say is that you two have major issues beyond how the Yankees are playing.
    ======================================
    As Big Al states above, quite eloquently, it’s ALWAYS, your way or the highway. Once again you take the extreme position , just to be a contrarian, IMO. And who said you don’t love baseball, not implied either, why so defensive? Some people are so drunk by the end of a game that they aren’t awake to see it or are too numb and dumb to appreciate it, the good or the bad.

  48. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:51 am

    LGY-

    Thanks again for providing the info. on the 40 man. :)

  49. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 9:53 am

    I accidently skipped over Kontos, Pendleton, and Schmidt last night when I posted the list last night.

  50. GreenBeret7 July 22nd, 2010 at 9:53 am

    MaineYankee July 22nd, 2010 at 9:45 am
    GB7

    How can you be a ?true Yankee fan? and desert the team during it?s most important ?must win? series of the year? Don?t you even care what happens?

    —————————————————————–

    As much as I like the Yankees I think I better put my wife ahead of them on our anniversary if I know what’s good for me.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    Well, if she’s going to be selfish about it, I just won’t talk to her anymore. And “Killer” can’t come back and help her dig up her flowers.

  51. MaineYankee July 22nd, 2010 at 9:53 am

    MTU

    My wife informs me that she knows how so we’ll see.

    I knew she would come in handy some day. :lol:

    Don’t tell her I said that or she may push me off the nearest cliff this weekend.

  52. mick July 22nd, 2010 at 9:55 am

    jesusmonterofordh July 22nd, 2010 at 9:38 am

    you let the jesus be the everyday dh, you can catch once a week. give posada a day off.

    is add fleability
    ========================================
    Great post! Let the Jesus DH! He has flea-bility. Might have come in handy in the midge game.

  53. GreenBeret7 July 22nd, 2010 at 9:56 am

    MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:50 am
    Maine-

    “I’m not that savy to put pics on here.”

    Time for an old dog to learn some new tricks ?

    In some ways it’s good to go modern.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    He prefers taking pix with a stone tablet and chisel.

  54. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:56 am

    Maine-

    I promise I won’t as long as you take some photos.

    And by the way, at GB’s age he is probably already colorblind so he wouldn’t know green from brown anyway.

  55. jesusmonterofordh July 22nd, 2010 at 9:59 am

    HA, i fail at life

  56. Erica in NY July 22nd, 2010 at 9:59 am

    So this morning didn’t start any better than yesterday-

    There was an overturned oil truck in my neighborhood which caused a gas leak and the closure of the most main road.

    It took me an hour to get out of my neighborhood. An hour!!!! To go basically a mile away from my apartment. And the streets were so crazy I couldn’t even turn my car around and go home. I was just stuck

    So I just got to work…. ARGH!

    I feel like a refugee

  57. MaineYankee July 22nd, 2010 at 10:00 am

    mick

    I know I’m not GB7(thank goodness) but I want to add my input.

    From reading some here during the game and how upset they get about the team I wonder why they follow baseball.

    It doesn’t seem like they get much enjoyment out of it.

    I’m not saying you need to cheer everything but when some comment it’s only negative.

    If I disliked something that much I’d find something else to follow. Or maybe some just like to be unhappy rather than to enjoy something as good as the game of baseball.

  58. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 10:00 am

    This is from RAB:

    “So how many 40-man roster spots are opening up after the season? I count nine: Chad Gaudin, Sergio Mitre, Chan Ho Park, Andy Pettitte, Mariano Rivera, Javy Vazquez, Derek Jeter, Marcus Thames, and Nick Johnson. Both Juan Miranda and Jon Albaladejo will be out of options next season, so they could be gone as well. Wilkin DeLaRosa and Dustin Moseley are imminently DFA’able, so I would count on them being gone as well. Mo and Jeter are obviously coming back, so let’s call it 11 total spots opening up after the season.”

    The rest of the article is his opinion on how the 40 man will be filled out and who he thinks will be protected.

  59. RickD July 22nd, 2010 at 10:01 am

    Has Girardi’s name came up for the Cubs job?

  60. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 10:01 am

    Erica-

    I thought we discussed this yesterday ?

    Vegas awaits after you find some new more flexible friends. :)

  61. MaineYankee July 22nd, 2010 at 10:03 am

    Erica

    Did you ever stop and think maybe you should just stay home?

    Maybe you need to get pat m to check and see if nick is poking needles in a doll. :lol:

  62. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 10:05 am

    Time to walk the perritos. :)

  63. mick July 22nd, 2010 at 10:05 am

    # MaineYankee July 22nd, 2010 at 10:00 am

    mick

    I know I’m not GB7(thank goodness) but I want to add my input.

    From reading some here during the game and how upset they get about the team I wonder why they follow baseball.

    It doesn’t seem like they get much enjoyment out of it.

    I’m not saying you need to cheer everything but when some comment it’s only negative.

    If I disliked something that much I’d find something else to follow. Or maybe some just like to be unhappy rather than to enjoy something as good as the game of baseball.
    ==================================================
    Good points. Most of the whiners are either children or constant complainers. It’s not that big of a deal. Just a bunch of Yankee fans expressing their feelings, that’s all. And don’t let them fool you, a lot of them are frustrated Met and RS fans , jealous of our success. :)

  64. Erica in NY July 22nd, 2010 at 10:06 am

    MaineYankee July 22nd, 2010 at 10:03 am
    Erica

    Did you ever stop and think maybe you should just stay home?

    Maybe you need to get pat m to check and see if nick is poking needles in a doll.

    *************

    MaineYankee-

    If there is one thing I know for sure, its that I was meant for a life of leisure :-)

    I swear, it was so bad that if I could have found a place to park my car I would have left it and just walked back home.

    At one point, everyone turned off their cars and started talking to each other

  65. MaineYankee July 22nd, 2010 at 10:06 am

    GB7

    I haven’t figured out how to get the stone tablet to show up here.

    When I do you may need to watch your toes when you open it up. :lol:

  66. Erica in NY July 22nd, 2010 at 10:06 am

    MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 10:01 am
    Erica-

    I thought we discussed this yesterday ?

    Vegas awaits after you find some new more flexible friends.
    **************

    I would get on the plane right now, except that I am pretty sure I wouldn’t be able to get home to pack.

  67. Erin July 22nd, 2010 at 10:07 am

    RickD July 22nd, 2010 at 10:01 am
    Has Girardi?s name came up for the Cubs job?

    ************************
    Oh, yes. Yesterday, the sports section of the Chicago Tribune had all of the “candidates” and Girardi was right there.

  68. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 10:08 am

    they put every manager without a contract next year in “contention” for the cubs job.

  69. JM July 22nd, 2010 at 10:09 am

    # MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 9:25 am

    JM-

    She is really a riot. Even at that age whenever she shes Jeter she just swoons.

    She calls him her “boyfriend”. :)
    __________________________

    Minka better watch out! :)

  70. Erin July 22nd, 2010 at 10:10 am

    Erica-sounds like Super Grover would have been useful this morning. ;)

  71. SJ44 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:10 am

    LGY,

    Montero would be a PT player here because Girardi intends to sometimes use the DH spot for this long stretch of games to give Arod, Jeter and other vets half days.

    That renders him a PT player in NY since he’s not going to catch here this season.

    He’s better off playing everyday in Scranton than getting sporadic work in NY.

  72. Richie Rich July 22nd, 2010 at 10:10 am

    Hey everybody! Long time lurker here – thought I would sign up and start posting away.

  73. Richie Rich July 22nd, 2010 at 10:12 am

    Montero should see some time this September – I would expect him to start for the Yankees next year if he keeps up his hot hitting in Scranton. It would be ideal to have him as our third catcher and DH for us most of the times.

  74. GreenBeret7 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:13 am

    Erin July 22nd, 2010 at 10:07 am
    RickD July 22nd, 2010 at 10:01 am
    Has Girardi?s name came up for the Cubs job?

    ************************
    Oh, yes. Yesterday, the sports section of the Chicago Tribune had all of the “candidates” and Girardi was right there.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    He’ll have to fight Joe Torre for the job. Maybe the Steinbrenners can sell SRO under the O”Neill sign or next to GMS’ statue.

  75. BIG AL July 22nd, 2010 at 10:13 am

    As information, as of 05/01/10 Jackson was batting .356 and as of 07/21/10 he’s at .309, a drop of 47 points.

    As of 05/01/10 Cano was batting .382 and as of 07/21/10 he’s at .333, a drop of 49 points.

    So according to some, like SJ44, Cano sucks worse than Jackson.

    Everyone knows early season averages that are quite high, rarely hold up, but, to say Austin Jackson is not hitting well is wrong.

    Granderson missed 23 games and still has 58K’s to Jackson’s 95K’s. Jackson’s #’s are 16 SB, .361 OBP & .415 SLG, compared to Granderson’s .305 OBP & .393 SLG and 7 SB

    Granderson K’s 23.77% and Jackson 27.94%. Jackson is still learning to be a MLB player, Granderson is not. The Yankees always knew AJAX did not have HR power, yet, but he does have 23 doubles and 5 triples, compared to Granderson’s 9 doubles and 4 triples.

  76. Erica in NY July 22nd, 2010 at 10:15 am

    Erin July 22nd, 2010 at 10:10 am
    Erica-sounds like Super Grover would have been useful this morning.

    ************

    I keep a Super Grover in my car. He protects me

  77. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 10:18 am

    “Montero would be a PT player here because Girardi intends to sometimes use the DH spot for this long stretch of games to give Arod, Jeter and other vets half days.”

    SJ,

    I think the group calling for Montero is suggesting he be called up toward the end of August when that stretch of games is winding down.

  78. mick July 22nd, 2010 at 10:18 am

    Big Al
    Do you really think Ajax had a shot with the Yanks? Really, where would he fit in? Most likely they are going for Crawford and will move Gardy to center. Granderson was a good gamble and he can be dealt. They usually don’t let rookies audition for jobs up here unless they are can’t miss.

  79. Richie Rich July 22nd, 2010 at 10:19 am

    I was one of those people who wished we didn’t trade Jackson and Coke for Granderson. I understand the need to have an established starter but Jackson is a mold of Grandy – he’s still relatively young. As for Coke, he would be a huge part of our bullpen. I haven’t checked up with Coke but I think he’s doing good in Detriot.

  80. Mike_Boston July 22nd, 2010 at 10:19 am

    Once the minor league season is over and players can get called up with rosters expanding, do they have to be on the 40 man roster or no? I agree that you keep Montero in AAA until the season is over, he needs the AB’s and games behind the dish while he still can get ‘em.

  81. Wave Your Hat July 22nd, 2010 at 10:20 am

    I think if there were an obvious full time DH – as NJ was supposed to be – then Girardi would not use the DH spot as a way to rest ARod and Jeter. If the Yanks were to trade for Adam Dunn, say, then Girardi would play Dunn most of the time at DH and rest people less often.

    Montero, though, makes no sense in that role yet. First, though the odds seem against his becoming a full time major league catcher, the Yanks owe it to themselves and to Montero to give him every chance to succeed as a catcher. That means giving him at least a full AAA season at catcher to see how he progresses at the art of catching.

    Second, Montero is no lock to be an immediate major league hitting sensation. It’s quite possible his rookie numbers would be equal to or less than Thames or a Thames/whoever platoon.

    The best solution is of course to find someone who can platoon with Granderson and DH against righties, and I’m sure Brian Cashman is looking for that someone now.

    Once Granderson starts platooning everyone will love him again.

  82. Mike Ri July 22nd, 2010 at 10:21 am

    I can’t see the Yankees landing Crawford. Gardner erased that theory. The Yanks will save that money on Lee and Jeters new Contract

  83. Richie Rich July 22nd, 2010 at 10:22 am

    Yes Montero would have to be moved to the 40 man roster.

  84. mick July 22nd, 2010 at 10:24 am

    Once Granderson starts platooning everyone will love him again.
    =========================================
    That will be his ticket out the door.
    Hello Crawford in LF, Gardy in CF.
    We could fetch a lot for Grandy in the off season.
    Maybe enough for some to forget Ajax.

  85. NYY626 - Andy in 2011 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:24 am

    pat July 22nd, 2010 at 9:46 am
    Joel Sherman’s column today raises a good question.

    If you take emotion out of the equation and were able to insure players had zero ego about where they would hit or play, what is the Yankees best line-up using the current 25 man roster
    _____________________________________________________________________-
    Interesting question. But IMO, if you take emotions out of the equation, baseball wouldn’t be very fun to watch.

  86. Wave Your Hat July 22nd, 2010 at 10:24 am

    Over the last 28 games Austin Jackson is hitting .329/.396/.439. That’s not bad.

    I don’t blame Cashman for doing the deal though.

  87. Bronx Jeers July 22nd, 2010 at 10:24 am

    With the 2013 buyout, Granderson is set to make about 20 mil over the next two years. I don’t see too many teams falling over themselves to get their hands on that.

  88. champ809 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:25 am

    I really can’t believe that “fans” want the Yanks to make the same mistake with Montero that they made with Joba where they place the short term “needs” of the team ahead of his proper development.

    The most important thing for Jesus is his development as a defensive catcher, period. He should be behind the plate catching as often as possible. There are enough bats around if the Yanks really need a bat for the stretch run. Besides as I’ve been saying for 2 yrs now if Miranda is given an opportunity to get regular at bats and get his legs under him he’s plenty enough hitter to get the job done.

    As Ca$h is fond of saying,”the solutions are there in the clubhouse…”

  89. Wave Your Hat July 22nd, 2010 at 10:26 am

    mick-

    I can’t see The Yanks giving Mo and Derek big contracts, signing Cliff Lee and then adding Carl Crawford too.

    I think Cashman gave a big sigh of relief when Gardner showed he has game.

  90. champ809 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:26 am

    So the imminent demise and exposure of AJax has been greatly exaggerated…….hmmmm!

  91. vblade July 22nd, 2010 at 10:27 am

    No use wasting resources on Crawford. The Yankees didn’t spend prospects on Granderson just to flip him after one year.

    Just use the money for Cliff Lee and be done with it.

  92. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 10:27 am

    From what I gather there seems to be a group that wants Montero called up now, a group that wants Montero called up towards the end of August, and a group that wants him called up when the rosters expand (and of course some like GB7 who does not think he should be called up this year because of 40 man roster issues)

  93. mick July 22nd, 2010 at 10:28 am

    Doesn’t the AAA season end early Sept?
    How would it stunt his development at catcher if he came up at that point?
    He could continue to catch here, someone has to spell Posada and we will have runaway with it by then anyway :)

  94. Giuseppe Franco July 22nd, 2010 at 10:28 am

    I’d still take Granderson over Jackson despite his off year.

    He’s got a lot more tools to work with and he’s been successful at this level. An offseason with Kevin Long working on his swing could be what Granderson needs to take his game to the next level.

    It certainly worked for Gardner and Swisher. Nobody expected those guys to put up those numbers this season. It can work for Granderson, too.

    I’d like to see Phil Coke’s home ERA from last season and compare it to this season.

    He was certainly useful but he gave up a TON of long balls to left handed hitters, which was his primary job.

    There was a stretch where he was very good for awhile and then he was hammered for a long stretch as well.

    Pitching in the AL East w/ half your games at the Stadium is a lot different than pitching in the AL Central w/ half your games in the Grand Canyon.

  95. vblade July 22nd, 2010 at 10:29 am

    # champ809 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:26 am

    So the imminent demise and exposure of AJax has been greatly exaggerated…….hmmmm!

    ———————–

    I’m not a big fan of BABIP (ID knows this from yesterday lol), but….

    Jackson has a .466 BABIP over the last 28 games.

    Just sayin’.

  96. BIG AL July 22nd, 2010 at 10:29 am

    Mick -

    I agree with Bronx Jeers, Granderson’s contract vs. his play will be hard to move, unless the Yankees pay part of it.

  97. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 10:29 am

    “So the imminent demise and exposure of AJax has been greatly exaggerated…….hmmmm!”

    ———————————————–

    If his BABip remains where it is he will top Babe Ruth for the highest BABip recorded since 1913

  98. champ809 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:30 am

    I would hope that Ca$h is open to the idea of trading Granderson….He’s a good person and that’s fine but the Yanks would be a much BETTER team signing Crawford to play LF and moving Gardner to CF…..

    Crawford
    Jeet
    Tex
    ARod
    Cano
    Jorge
    Jesus
    Swish
    Gardner

    would be murder

  99. vblade July 22nd, 2010 at 10:31 am

    # LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 10:29 am

    “So the imminent demise and exposure of AJax has been greatly exaggerated…….hmmmm!”

    ———————————————–

    If his BABip remains where it is he will top Babe Ruth for the highest BABip recorded since 1913

    ————————————-

    In other words, there’s nowhere to go but down.

  100. mick July 22nd, 2010 at 10:31 am

    what is this bapip you speak of?
    can you show me the bapips?

  101. Mike_Boston July 22nd, 2010 at 10:31 am

    Someone already pointed out that there are a few stiffs on the 40, like Gaudin, that won’t be here next year anyways. I don’t see why they wouldn’t bring Montero up in September to get his feet wet, seems like a total no-brainer to me. This would set him up for a mid season call up next year. It seems like he’s figured out AAA pitching. Just a reminder, he’s the youngest position player in AAA, what else would he have to prove there assuming he keeps this pace up the next month?

  102. Crawdaddy July 22nd, 2010 at 10:33 am

    The Yankees aren’t paying Crawford 15-16M next year even if they could trade Granderson.

  103. 86w183 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:34 am

    No argument that 100 games into the season the Granderson trade does not look good, but I like to see at least a full season (and post-season) before passing judgment.

    Case in point, to some the Nady/Marte trade turned out to be a mistake, but I completely disagree. Anytime a trade adds a key component to a World Series win it’s worth whatever the price.

    That’s why the Yanks were willing to include Montero to get Cliff Lee. Had Lee helped pitch the Yanks to a repeat, to me it’s worth it. Now if they win without Lee those opposed to the deal will have won that debate.

    The Yanks have won seven World Series in the last 48 years. That’s about one every seven seasons. Having been a fan all of that time it makes me appreciate winning it all that much more. Thus, any personnel deal that results in a W.S. Championship is a good deal.

  104. mick July 22nd, 2010 at 10:34 am

    Aside from bringing up Montero, his future probably doesn’t lie as a catcher. Romine is supposedly far ahead as a defensive catcher and can hit a little too.. There is not enough room for the both of them to catch.

  105. RayVT July 22nd, 2010 at 10:34 am

    Montero is intriguing! As a fan we want him in Yankee Stadium now! LOL! As a team, it is a process. Why would the Yanks want to damage his development or worth long term with a short term goal? That is why Cash gets paid the big bucks to make those kinds of decisions.

    Personally, I like the idea of Montero getting his feet wet in September, perhaps even the very last day of August. The question is whether Montero is destined for NYY in 2011 or not. If he needs another year in AAA, then perhaps the Yanks don’t bring him up at all in Sept 2010.

    What is not being specifically stated is whether Montero plays into the 2010 Yankee playoffs. If he does, as a 3rd Catcher/DH/PH, then Aug 31 is the day he comes up & if not, perhaps it would be as late as Spring Training.

  106. BIG AL July 22nd, 2010 at 10:35 am

    Giuseppe Franco July 22nd, 2010 at 10:28 am
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Coke has a season .252 ERA and an ERA of 0.56 in his last 15 appearances. You can’t attribute all of that to playing in Detroit. He’s now their EIG, and doing well. Cashman gave up on him early. AJAX will become a better ball player than granderson. Granderson has been on a steady decline, not just this season, that’s why Detroit moved him, they could read the signs.

  107. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 10:35 am

    Scranton went to the International League Championship last year.

    The last game they played was on September 17th.

    They are in first place again this year.

    So if they make a deep playoff run like last year, you could potentially shave off about a month of “catching time” for Montero if he is called up in last August.

    If they really want Montero to have a full a season as possible catching they won’t call him up until the playoffs are over.

    And it is unlikely they would add Montero to the 40 man for just 2 weeks to get the proverbial “cup of coffee”

    There is a good chance as GB7 has said we don’t see Montero at all this year.

  108. champ809 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:37 am

    AJax is playing the best defensive Cf in the AL, hitting over .300 on base close to .400 on pace to score 100+ runs and steal 30 bases…..@ 22 yrs old for a team in the pennant race….

    what’s wrong with that?

    I believe the power will come and he’ll eventually hit 20 HRs to add to the glove and the speed…

  109. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 10:39 am

    vblade – it is common for fast players to have a higher babip because of beating out infield singles and the like. he seems to have averaged about .340-.350 in the minors. he only has 13 infield hits though, tough to gauge.

    clearly correction is still due (and has been going on with his avg dropping to .309, I would expect him to finish the season in the .275-.285 range.

  110. ron July 22nd, 2010 at 10:39 am

    If nick johnson was healthy,batting .280,.400 obp would he be a pt player because arod,po,etc… need to dh?

  111. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 10:41 am

    champ – the best defensive centerfielder in baseball? whoa buddy… i think a few players would like to have a word with you.

  112. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 10:41 am

    Montero can be added to the playoff roster if the Yankees wanted regardless of when he is called up.

    If Nick Johnson is indeed done for the year, they can use his spot to add basically anyone in the organization to the playoff roster.

  113. Giuseppe Franco July 22nd, 2010 at 10:42 am

    Couldn’t disagree more, Big AL.

    I don’t think Coke’s numbers would be quite this good if he were still wearing pinstripes. He had stretches where he pitched well and then had long stretches where he got hammered pretty hard.

    He finished 2009 w/ a 4.50 ERA. That’s not exactly stellar.

    And I don’t think there’s any question that Granderson is a better player than Jackson. Sure, he’s having a tough year but he’ll turn it around.

    Cashman isn’t going to give up on him this soon.

  114. vblade July 22nd, 2010 at 10:42 am

    # champ809 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:37 am

    AJax is playing the best defensive Cf in the AL, hitting over .300 on base close to .400 on pace to score 100+ runs and steal 30 bases…..@ 22 yrs old for a team in the pennant race….

    what’s wrong with that?

    I believe the power will come and he’ll eventually hit 20 HRs to add to the glove and the speed…

    ————————–

    His OBP is .361. Not that close to .400.

    He’s only walked 25 times in 369 PA, so if he wants to keep that OBP even remotely near .350 he’ll have to bat over .300 all season.

    But, for that to happen, he’d have to have a BABIP higher than Babe Ruth’s. AKA make better contact with the ball than the Sultan of Swat himself did over the course of a full season.

    Don’t see it happening.

  115. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 10:43 am

    he has the lowest fielding percentage (going with easy numbers for you here) of any qualified CF in the AL.

    the only defensive metric he’s even close to leading in is out of zone plays in the UZR measurement. and he’s second to rios.

  116. mick July 22nd, 2010 at 10:43 am

    If nick johnson was healthy,batting .280,.400 obp would he be a pt player because arod,po,etc… need to dh?
    ================
    No. NJ was asked by mgmnt. to cut himself shaving off that hideous mustache and to go on the DL so that Po could DH a little :)

    No, really, they would limit NJ at DH, esp vs lefties, to give Po his AB’s.

  117. vblade July 22nd, 2010 at 10:44 am

    # Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 10:39 am

    vblade – it is common for fast players to have a higher babip because of beating out infield singles and the like. he seems to have averaged about .340-.350 in the minors. he only has 13 infield hits though, tough to gauge.

    clearly correction is still due (and has been going on with his avg dropping to .309, I would expect him to finish the season in the .275-.285 range.

    ——————–

    According to the metric, I only see him holding his current level of value if he makes better contact than 1913 Babe Ruth.

    Which isn’t happening.

  118. champ809 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:44 am

    The Yanks could very easily pay Crawford next season and sign Lee as well if they choose to…

    If we somehow fail to seal the deal and repeat as champs this season then I think the drive to do that would lead them to do that.

    Grandy I think jumps up to almost 9mil next season so it’s a difference of about 6mil which would be Nick Johnson’s salary coming off the books….

    Lee’s $ would be Pettite and Javy’s salaries with a savings of about 3mil assuming $20mil for him….

    The Yanks could go with Nova or Joba as the 5th starter and be at the same payroll they have this year with a better team on the field.

  119. RayVT July 22nd, 2010 at 10:44 am

    mick July 22nd, 2010 at 10:34 am

    There is room for both of them to catch. LOL! Every team has at least two catchers, and some have 3. I think next year the Yanks will have 3. Posada, Cervelli & Montero. Romine will move to AAA. If Posada signs an extension, he will be phased into a #2 backup catcher with Montero moving to #1. Cervelli will slide to 3rd C or be traded if Romine is ready. It is easy to have 3 catchers if they all can hit! (Posada, Montero, Romine) Also, Romine could play a Johnny Blanchard type role & play a corner OF spot or a corner INF spot as a backup.

    With Sanchez moving fast at C too, the Yanks may be able to get a key piece from someone for one of these potentially great Catchers via trade.

  120. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 10:45 am

    the more i am lookin at the numbers, austin jackson could be way closer to the worst defensive centerfielder in baseball than the best.

  121. vblade July 22nd, 2010 at 10:46 am

    # Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 10:45 am

    the more i am lookin at the numbers, austin jackson could be way closer to the worst defensive centerfielder in baseball than the best.

    ——————

    Reminds me of how overrated Jacoby Ellsbury used to be. Everyone tried to make him out as this awesome CF for Boston, but his “spectacular” catches were usually the result of bad jumps and poor routes on fly balls.

    Just cause you’re fast in the OF doesn’t mean you’re a good defender.

  122. raymagnetic July 22nd, 2010 at 10:47 am

    “Pitching in the AL East w/ half your games at the Stadium is a lot different than pitching in the AL Central w/ half your games in the Grand Canyon.”

    For Coke’s career his OPS against in Yankee stadium is .303.

    “If his BABip remains where it is he will top Babe Ruth for the highest BABip recorded since 1913

    ————————————-

    In other words, there’s nowhere to go but down.”

    Well, no. Just because he’s been “lucky” thus far doesn’t mean he’s going to be “unlucky” in the future.

  123. Patrick from CT July 22nd, 2010 at 10:47 am

    Granderson is a proven major league CF having a down year. He got hurt early on and that has not help is numbers. Let the season play out before we go trying to replace him. Luck for him the team is winning and the NY pressure is off.
    He’s lucky is not playing for the Mets like Jayson Bay…

  124. mick July 22nd, 2010 at 10:47 am

    Why trade any of the young catchers esp if they all hit?
    Didn’t Yogi, Ellie and Blanchard all play on championship teams?

  125. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 10:48 am

    he has great range, shown by the 66 plays “out of zone” that he has made (ie. pays he wasn’t supposed to make), but leads the league with 5 fielding errors, in CF that’s atrocious.

  126. jpb173 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:48 am

    Aside from bringing up Montero, his future probably doesn’t lie as a catcher. Romine is supposedly far ahead as a defensive catcher and can hit a little too.. There is not enough room for the both of them to catch.

    —————————————————————————————————

    Down the road a bit ( 2 years) and after Posada is retired I can envision a scenario where Romine catches 5 days out of 7 (and rests the other 2 days) while Montero catches the 2 games per week that Romine doesn’t and DH’s the remaining games.

    In that scenario the Yankees would probably trade off Francisco Cervelli and keep a marginal third catcher in case either Romine or Montero needs to be pinch run for.

  127. 86w183 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:48 am

    I bet the Yanks add Montero to the 40-man on August 31st so they would have the option of activating him for the post-season while letting him finish the season in Scranton.

    There’s plenty of dead wood on the 40-man anyway, so moving someone out makes sense. Plus, there is not a third catcher on the 40-man and that’s kinda risky. I say put Montero on the 40-man and move Aceves to the 60-man since he almost certainly will need back surgery after having another setback two weeks ago.

  128. BIG AL July 22nd, 2010 at 10:48 am

    AJAX’s BA has been .308 – .309 for over 6 weeks, I believe it has leveled off to about where he’ll finish the season. Just as Cano’s BA went from .388 to .333, he’ll most likely finish within that same range.

  129. mick July 22nd, 2010 at 10:49 am

    The first catcher to go will be Cervelli.

  130. raymagnetic July 22nd, 2010 at 10:50 am

    “he has great range, shown by the 66 plays “out of zone” that he has made (ie. pays he wasn’t supposed to make), but leads the league with 5 fielding errors, in CF that’s atrocious.”

    He’s a rookie and he’s still learning these ballparks that he’s never played in before. I think that could have something to do with his errors.

    He’s always been known as playing a great CF.

  131. champ809 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:50 am

    take a pole of players and scouts who watch the Al games and see what they tell you about his D….

    He plays in the biggest CF in the sport so his fielding percentage #’s will be skewed because of that.

    How often and consistently is he on top plays on MLB and baseball tonight?

    every now and again take a peek away from your computer and actually WATCh the GAMES on the field…it’s informative.

    just a suggestion…

  132. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 10:50 am

    raymagnetic – he doesn’t have to be “unlucky” in the future to regress, he can be league average and still regress. he HAS to be lucky to sustain what he has been doing.

  133. raymagnetic July 22nd, 2010 at 10:52 am

    My bad on the Coke numbers. Those numbers were from the old Yankee stadium. In the new stadium his OPS against was .647 and he gave up 7 hrs there.

  134. raymagnetic July 22nd, 2010 at 10:52 am

    Meant his OPS against was .614

  135. Bill D July 22nd, 2010 at 10:52 am

    “I would hope that Ca$h is open to the idea of trading Granderson….He’s a good person and that’s fine but the Yanks would be a much BETTER team signing Crawford to play LF and moving Gardner to CF”

    So you’d like to see Cashman sell exceedingly low on Granderson? What do you believe you’d be getting back? As you consider that answer, also consider the last time the Yankees were involved in a deal where an outfielder was sold short. Yankees were on the right end of that deal, but remember what the wrong end looked like. That could be your return on the 2010 model of Curtis Granderson.

  136. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 10:52 am

    The problem with Austin Jackson’s performance to date is that he is hitting .300 while being backed up by the highest ever BABip in modern baseball history.

    If he has the ability to direct the baseball as Paul O’Neill always like to point out you cannot that is a different story.

    He can of course mantain a high BABip like ID points out, but .426 is well historic and record breaking.

    Let’s say you are generous and Austin Jackson’s “true talent level” is a .360 BABip.

    If he were to have that .360 BABip as opposed to .426, he would actually be hitting .262 on the season and his OBP would be .317.

  137. jpb173 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:53 am

    Someone already pointed out that there are a few stiffs on the 40, like Gaudin, that won’t be here next year anyways. I don’t see why they wouldn’t bring Montero up in September to get his feet wet, seems like a total no-brainer to me…

    ——————————————————————————————————–

    Mike,
    On the surface it sounds easy, but the reality is that Jesus Montero is not on the 40 man roster. I don’t think the Yankees want to add him to the 40 man roster to bring him up because those spost are precious. As someone mentioned in a post here, the Yankees have a large number of players who must be protected ( by putting them on the 40 man roster) from the Rule 5 draft this December. Montero doesn’t need to be protected at this time so I don’t think the Yankees are going to let him consume one of those precious spots until next year.

  138. raymagnetic July 22nd, 2010 at 10:54 am

    “raymagnetic – he doesn’t have to be “unlucky” in the future to regress, he can be league average and still regress. he HAS to be lucky to sustain what he has been doing.”

    There’s nothing to suggest he won’t be lucky in the future however. Which was my point.

  139. FanSince1948 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:54 am

    Does anyone think that Montero might best be served by being up with the Yankees, mentored by Tony Pena – at the least beginng with the Sept. call up?

  140. Bill D July 22nd, 2010 at 10:55 am

    “With Sanchez moving fast at C too”

    Sanchez is moving fast as a hitter. His catching has been disasterous.

  141. Doreen July 22nd, 2010 at 10:56 am

    pat -

    On the surface, an interesting question posed by Sherman. Under the surface? Definitely stirring up controversy.

    GTLU Alert!

    I have to take my daughter to a doctor’s appointment that was relatively unexpected. I’ll be gone from 11 to about 4 or 5 o’oclock.

    I will start GTLU now and catch up with it when I get home. Today’s results will be announced late.

    Today’s Guess The Line Up is Now Open for Business.

    Lineups can be submitted and will be accepted until an official lineup is posted.

    Good luck!

    :)

  142. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 10:56 am

    champ – your “watch the games” argument is completely pointless. UZR is literally calculated by people “watching the games”.

    austin jackson may have the tools to be the best centerfielder, but he has PERFORMED like the worst one.

    fielding percentage is not skewed by a large outfield, if he is running full speed for a ball he doesn’t get an error. he has 5 fielding errors (ie balls he SHOULD have made plays on).

    top plays on MLB tonight is meaningless if he is getting bad jumps to get to routine plays and make them look spectacular… like pedroia does all the time.

    every now and then, don’t assume that the people that understand the advanced metrics don’t watch the game, it’s rude and insulting.

    just a suggestion.

  143. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 10:58 am

    86w183,

    They don’t need to add Montero on August 31st to be available for the postseason roster, because of Nick Johnson.

  144. Giuseppe Franco July 22nd, 2010 at 10:59 am

    If the Yanks need to add a 3rd catcher to the 40-man roster this season, it will be Chad Moeller – not Montero.

    That’s why Moeller is still in the system.

    At this point, Montero is not a major league catcher. At least not yet. They wouldn’t promote him to catch if either Posada or Cervelli goes down.

  145. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 11:00 am

    raymagnetic – there’s nothing to suggest that he will be lucky either. moot point. he only has the statistical average of 20,000 baseball players before him working against him.

    ballpark adjustments do not mean anything for a centerfielder. the only way a CF is getting errors are ground balls/line drives in front of him, or dropping fly balls. either way, where the fence is won’t effect those plays. any play where the park is causing him to misplay the ball, he’s not getting an error anyway.

  146. vblade July 22nd, 2010 at 11:00 am

    Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 10:56 am

    top plays on MLB tonight is meaningless if he is getting bad jumps to get to routine plays and make them look spectacular… like pedroia does all the time.

    ——————

    To be fair, Pedroia’s stature makes it difficult to have great range. He pretty much has to “look spectacular” all the time just to get to hard hit ground balls a few feet to his left or right.

  147. RayVT July 22nd, 2010 at 11:00 am

    mick July 22nd, 2010 at 10:47 am

    Yes Mick they did! Posada, Cervelli, Montero, Romine & Shanchez all have value though especially if Posada can still hit. On those old Yankee teams of Blanchard, Yogi & Howard, Blanchard palyed some C, OF & 1B, while Yogi also played C & OF. That was my point actually. LOL! But 4 or 5 or 6 catchers may require a trade for something of value!

  148. Jeters Edge In Blazin Copper July 22nd, 2010 at 11:01 am

    Test

  149. vblade July 22nd, 2010 at 11:01 am

    Like I said, not the biggest fan of the FIP/BABIP stats, but when you’re in a Babe Ruth stratosphere of BABIP, that’s a different story entirely.

  150. Jeters Edge In Blazin Copper July 22nd, 2010 at 11:01 am

    Woohoo, i can finally post again!!!!

  151. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 11:02 am

    vblade – oh certainly. there are plenty of outfielders that take bad routes and make easy plays look hard… i just didn’t feel like speculating one and then having someone trump out some stat i didn’t memorize.

    pedrioa was a safe answer :p

  152. RayVT July 22nd, 2010 at 11:02 am

    jpb173 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:48 am

    Actually both Romine & Montero can run, especially Romine.

  153. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 11:03 am

    vblade – and its statistical outliers like this one that are the best examples of the way those stats work.

  154. Andrew July 22nd, 2010 at 11:03 am

    I guess the concept of waiting more than a partial season to pass final judgment on a trade is never going to be comprehended by some, since this back and forth over Jackson and Granderson and Coke has been happening since April. Regardless of how Jackson finishes this season he still will have exactly 1 year of proven ML performance under his belt. Granderson has a track record of hitting for power, playing a good CF and contributing positively at a high level, with obvious flaws in his game that have been beaten to death here and elsewhere.

    Yet because he’s struggled so far this year, after a down year last year as well, he’s in decline at age 29? Of course hindsight by critics here is 20/20, yet a lot of story is left to be written for the principals in this trade.

  155. Wave Your Hat July 22nd, 2010 at 11:05 am

    Babe Ruth’s career BABiP was good but not spectacular. Remember, you subtract HR’s when calculating BABiP. Add back in those dingers and Ruth’s numbers get a lot better.

  156. vblade July 22nd, 2010 at 11:05 am

    # Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 11:03 am

    vblade – and its statistical outliers like this one that are the best examples of the way those stats work.

    ———————–

    I’m still not convinced Joba’s .390 BABIP for 2010 is enough of an outlier to say that he’ll turn it around.

    But for curiosity’s sake, what’s the expected stats if his BABIP became league-average?

  157. Mike in Chicago July 22nd, 2010 at 11:05 am

    Irreverent Discourse, great points re: Austin Jackson making what should be a routine play look spectacular because of bad jumps, etc.

    Reminds me of a player the Yanks had back in the late 70′s or early 80′s named Elliott Maddox who was very much the same way, making routine plays look tough.

  158. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 11:06 am

    andrew – it will almost be impossible to determine the true end result and value of the trade until austin jacksons career is over.

    but today is today, and today we speculate about what we have to work with. :)

  159. Erica in NY July 22nd, 2010 at 11:07 am

    Jeter SS
    Swisher RF
    Tex 1B
    A-Rod 3B
    Cano 2B
    Posada C
    Granderson CF
    Miranda DH
    GGBG LF

    Thanks Doreen. Hope everything is okay!

  160. RayVT July 22nd, 2010 at 11:07 am

    Bill D July 22nd, 2010 at 10:55 am

    True, but he is really young & has the skillset. He needs coaching defensively! But a Catcher that hits is worth his weight in Gold! You only have to look to Boston to see that. V-Mart!

  161. Giuseppe Franco July 22nd, 2010 at 11:07 am

    A fine post, Andrew.

    But most fans don’t have that kind of patience. It’s a shame.

  162. mick July 22nd, 2010 at 11:07 am

    Yet because he’s struggled so far this year, after a down year last year as well, he’s in decline at age 29? Of course hindsight by critics here is 20/20, yet a lot of story is left to be written for the principals in this trade.
    ===========================================
    What if Grandy has a big post-season?
    This will quiet the naysayers.
    Post-season is big on a Yankee resume.
    Didn’t he have a good one against us?

  163. 86w183 July 22nd, 2010 at 11:07 am

    LGY — You have to be on the 40-man on Sept 1 to be eligible for the post-season. Nick Johnson has nothing to do with Montero.

    Giuseppe — If they need a catcher between now and the end of Scranton’s season I agree it’ll be Moeller or some other useless re-tread. But if they wanted a third guy on the post-season roster I don’t think Montero is out of the question. Depends on a lot of factors, obviously including how healthy Jorge and Cisco are and how well Thames is swinging the bat.

    I don’t expect it to happen, but I’d put him on the 40-man to have that option.

  164. raymagnetic July 22nd, 2010 at 11:08 am

    ID,

    “raymagnetic – there’s nothing to suggest that he will be lucky either. moot point.”

    I never said anything about ballpark adjustments. However he doesn’t know the stadiums he’s playing in.

    Watching Yankee games I see a lot of visiting players have trouble finding balls in the sun when they visit the stadium.

    I have no idea how or why Jackson is making errors but he doesn’t know the intricacies of the stadiums he’s playing in and that could certainly have something to do with it.

  165. Erin July 22nd, 2010 at 11:09 am

    Doreen-hope everything is OK with your daughter.

    GTLU:

    SS Jeter
    RF Swisher
    1B Teixeira
    3B Rodriguez
    2B Cano
    C Posada
    DH Thames
    CF Granderson
    LF Gardner

    Thanks!

  166. BIG AL July 22nd, 2010 at 11:09 am

    To all the Granderson lovers and believers, Good luck! I can’t wait to read your comments at the end of the season. They’ll most likely go; Wait until next year, after KLong has a chance to work with him. What you’re all forgetting is KLong did work extensively with Granderson all throughout spring training, and what you see is what you get. Some of you that still believe in Granderson, and think he’s just going to turn around a career that has been on a steady decline are kidding yourselves, IMO. The majority of AB’s he looks lost! You keep knocking AJAX, and praying for the re-birth of Granderson. Hope you all live long enough to see it.

  167. Dassit July 22nd, 2010 at 11:10 am

    If someone is on the DL, you can replace them with anyone right? Last year, Freddy Guzman wasn’t even a Yankee before Sept 1 and he played in the ALCS.

  168. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 11:11 am

    86w183,

    Not if there is an injury.

    They did it with Guzman last year, because of Nady’s injury.

  169. SJ44 July 22nd, 2010 at 11:11 am

    Actually, if you “watch the games”, Gutierrez is the best defensive CF in the AL and its not even close.

    Not every young player is going to be the next superstar in the game. In fact, most of the extreme prospect huggers on this blog overrate just about every player in the Yankee syste, Montero included. I say that because the odds that kid could be recalled right now and hit to a .900 OPS at the big league level is extremely remote.

    As far as Jackson’s “power” is concerned, it has never developed.

    Hard to sell to those of us who watch these games he’s now going to add power playing everyday in one of the biggest ballparks in the AL.

    Right now, he’s not even the best rookie on his own team. Boesch is the kid who should be the ROY in the AL this year.

    Jackson is a good young player. You still make that Granderson trade 100 times out of 100 times though, regardless of the hindsight now being practiced by some.

    Especially for a kid who would be the everyday CF in Scranton right if he stayed with the Yankees organization.

  170. BIG AL July 22nd, 2010 at 11:11 am

    Later – Off to cut the grass.

  171. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 11:11 am

    My take on Grandy is talk to me about the middle of next season after he has had a full year under his belt as a Yankee ; had a chance to work with K. Long in the off season ; and he continues to fall short after six months of the 2011 season.

    Patience is required, and I am still hoping he turns it around. :)

  172. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 11:11 am

    Dassit,

    Correct.

  173. 86w183 July 22nd, 2010 at 11:11 am

    oops —

    I did a quick check, which I should have (and usually do) before I posted. You have to be on the 25-man roster, disabled list or bereavement list on August 31 to be eligible for post-season. You have to be on the 40-man to be eligible to replace an injured player. Still warrants having Montero on it in my view. Aceves is wasting a spot since he should be on th e60-day DL which doesn’t count against the 40.

  174. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 11:11 am

    vblade – i have no idea how to figure that out. babip doesn’t really translate directly into the pitching metrics, something like FIP specifically eliminates anything that isn’t a strikeout, walk or a homerun.

    taking out almost 1/4 of his baserunners on balls in play(from .391 to .301, .090 is 23%), however, would obviously significantly lower his other basic stats like era/whip and such because he will be getting out of innings quicker. i don’t know if theres any way of figuring out an exact number though.

  175. Wave Your Hat July 22nd, 2010 at 11:11 am

    You’d be making an error regressing any hitters BABIP to league average. For pitchers you’d be basically right to do it, but for hitters BABIP doesn’t vary randomly. That said, it seems more likely than not that Jackson’s current .426 BABiP will decline.

  176. BIG AL July 22nd, 2010 at 11:13 am

    “Right now, he’s not even the best rookie on his own team. Boesch is the kid who should be the ROY in the AL this year.”
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Boesh’s numbers are falling faster than the stock market!

  177. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 11:14 am

    WYH,

    When people are referring to Babe Ruth, they aren’t talking about his career BABip, but just 1913.

    I posted this morning the highest BABip since 1913, because I found the list on another blog, and he topped it.

  178. 86w183 July 22nd, 2010 at 11:15 am

    LGY — The Yanks acquired Guzman on August 31st

  179. Bill D July 22nd, 2010 at 11:16 am

    RayVT:

    I think he’s more a hitter that catches right now (12 passed balls and 6 errors in 13 games?). I do understand he’s only 17, just getting started as a pro, and will be on the receiving end of some coaching. Just saying that where his bat may only 3 years away, his catching is considerably further. For all the talk of Montero’s ability to be an MLB catcher, it would appear based on the numbers that he was well ahead of where Sanchez was at the same age and league. Of course, it also appears 17 year old Sanchez is quite a bit further along than 17 year old Montero with the bat.

  180. jpb173 July 22nd, 2010 at 11:16 am

    jpb173 July 22nd, 2010 at 10:48 am

    Actually both Romine & Montero can run, especially Romine.

    ——————————————————————————————-

    Ray, Late in a game…when you really need a stolen base, you simply aren’t going to ask either Romine or Montero to steal the base…you will pinch run for them. And, they may have some speed right now but after a year or two more of catching regularly, they will only get slower.

  181. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 11:16 am

    Guzman wasn’t added to the 40 man until mid September.

  182. esmee July 22nd, 2010 at 11:18 am

    I just signed up. I’m so excited!!

    Don’t mind me. First-time, long-time. I just had to sign up, not only to become a part of your Yankee family, but also to have a chance to win one of those great prizes …hopefully Jeter or Cano =)

    And now back to your scheduled programming …

  183. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 11:18 am

    Guzman was added to the 40 man on September 14th.

  184. BIG AL July 22nd, 2010 at 11:18 am

    Boesh was hitting .354 on 5/20, he’s now at .316 and dropping every day, wheras AJAX #’s are holding steady at .309

  185. esmee July 22nd, 2010 at 11:19 am

    And woww, Derek’s smile is just …wow!

  186. Wave Your Hat July 22nd, 2010 at 11:19 am

    LGY-

    1913? Are we talking about THE Babe Ruth or a different guy by that name?

  187. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 11:21 am

    Wave,

    :oops:

    1923

    The list goes back to 1913.

  188. SJ44 July 22nd, 2010 at 11:21 am

    Holding “steady”. Are you serious? He went from a high of .380 to his current .309. If that’s “holding steady”, you and I have a different interpretation of the expression.

    He has no power and doesn’t drive in runs. Two things Boesch has done since he got called up after the start of the season.

    I know you are convinced Austin Jackson is the second coming. Take a closer look at the two and Boesch is having a much better season. Especially impressive since he didn’t start the year with the Tigers.

  189. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 11:21 am

    WYH – i think any stat can and should be regressed to the league average. not necessarily to say “he should only be doing this” but more “he shouldn’t be exceeding this by so much”.

    there was some misinformation earlier. babe ruths career BABIP was .340 calculated correctly, and isn’t actually the record highest… tom mccreery has a .391 (highest i can find anywhere) and ty cobb had .378… here’s the link
    http://www.fangraphs.com/caree.....8;min=3000

    there are clearly players that have managed to sustain a high BABIP over their careers. most of the ones over .360 seem to be early era (1880-1930ish) players. something in the game has changed (most likely better defense in the outfield and smaller parks). jeter and ichiro seem to be the 2 highest modern era players at ~.357

    we can either believe that austin jackson is one of the greatest players ever already (highly unlikely), or that he should be falling more in line with the league average. being league average is not bad, by standard deviations 66% of the league is going to be “average”. it’s not like we are regressing to a below average number.

  190. MTU July 22nd, 2010 at 11:21 am

    LGY-

    You gave a very nice summary earlier of the various positions regarding bringing up Jesus both pro and con.

    The only mistake that I saw was that you forgot to include SJ along with GB. :)

  191. Wave Your Hat July 22nd, 2010 at 11:23 am

    LGY-

    Ah.

    Babe had 41 HRs that year, so the .426 BABiP is somewhat misleading. But I get your point of course.

  192. champ809 July 22nd, 2010 at 11:23 am

    there is Literally NOONE who has actually seen Austin Jackson play that would be of the opinion that he’s been the worst CF in AL….

    In fact all I’ve read and heard is that he’s been one of the best if not the best defensive CF in the AL next to Guti…

    And 2 of his errors came on one play last week….a bobble and a throw…

    And again he’s not getting bad jumps or reads on plays actually on the contrary he gets excellent reads and jumps on balls allowing him to make all those plays that technically he’s not supposed to make! make sense nerdboy.

  193. LGY July 22nd, 2010 at 11:24 am

    ID,

    The BABip was highest for a single season, not career.

    MTU,

    I believe SJ sees Montero getting called up in September?

  194. Irreverent Discourse July 22nd, 2010 at 11:24 am

    champ – this year, he is the worst. you can’t even argue that. he has 0 throwing errors for the season, so you don’t even know what you are talking about.

  195. Andrew July 22nd, 2010 at 11:24 am

    Big AL did you love Nick Swisher last year? He and C-Grand could end up having very similar paths in NY. Swisher had an extremely streaky 2009, if your memory can stretch back that far, and at times looked like a player completely over his head & lost at the dish that fans spent countless internet hours ripping and burying as a useful Yankee.

    But he contributed to a team that won it all, then knowing that his season was extremely uneven rededicated himself to improving his game, worked tirelessly with KLong and is in the midst of arguably his best season ever, offensively and defensively. No way to know for sure the same thing will happen with Curtis, however to say that it’s just blind faith at this point would not be totally accurate.

    I know this has been said before, but the idea that it’s impossible for recent history to repeat itself with Granderson, who has just as many physical skills as Swisher, is giving up hope way too soon.

  196. Wave Your Hat July 22nd, 2010 at 11:24 am

    “WYH – i think any stat can and should be regressed to the league average. not necessarily to say “he should only be doing this” but more “he shouldn’t be exceeding this by so much”.

    OK, but that wasn’t what I was talking about. I was focusing on the “he should only be doing this” part.

  197. Erin July 22nd, 2010 at 11:27 am

    New Post: Pitching matchups vs. Kansas City

    :arrow:

  198. champ809 July 22nd, 2010 at 11:27 am

    You literally are a dunce if you think he’s the worst defensive CF in the AL….

    He’s been twice the defender that Granderson has been.

  199. Tom in N.J. July 22nd, 2010 at 11:28 am

    To be eligible for the PS roster as an injury replacement the player must be in the organization on Aug. 31. That’s why Guzman was allowed to be on the PS roster for the ALDS even though he wasn’t on the 40 or 25 man rosters.

  200. mick July 22nd, 2010 at 3:30 pm

    just wanted to be the 200th comment…


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