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Berkman expected in Tampa tonight

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Jul 31, 2010 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Just talked to a Yankees official who said Lance Berkman “should be” in Tampa in time for tonight’s game against the Rays. Joe Girardi indicated last night that Austin Kearns will be here as well.

Still waiting on word of who’s being taken off the roster to make room. I believe the Yankees will have to open a 40-man spot as well. Trading Mark Melancon opened a spot for Berkman, but they need a spot for Kearns.

Unless Marcus Thames is DFAd, I’d have to guess Wilkin De La Rosa, Greg Golson and Reegie Corona are the top candidates.

As for the guys the Yankees traded for Berkman…

Mark Melancon
I’ve always been a Melancon believer, and I still am. It’s hard not to be after seeing him pitch so well in 2008 and 2009. Some guys get to the big leagues and it’s clear their stuff won’t play at this level. With Melancon, it wasn’t his stuff that was the problem. He looked just like a different pitcher, not nearly as aggressive as he was in Triple-A. Could be that he just needs to get used to facing big league hitters. They hit only .217 against him last year, but he walked 10 guys in 16.1 innings. That’s not the Melancon I saw in Scranton/Wilkes-Barre.

Jimmy Paredes
In spring training, when most of the Triple-A roster is still in big league camp, the Yankees will bring some of the lowest-level guys to play for the Triple-A team. Those spring games have been my only first-hand experience with Paredes. I only remember that he had a big arm. He’s an interesting guy to have in the system — he’s shown he can hit and run a little bit, and that arm will play — but he was certainly not someone the Yankees were counting on.

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286 Responses to “Berkman expected in Tampa tonight”

  1. Bret The Hitman July 31st, 2010 at 2:08 pm

    The NL could be a blessing for Melancon.

    Hopefully he can earn enough as a middle reliever to enjoy a great living with his family.

  2. Crawdaddy July 31st, 2010 at 2:08 pm

    How about moving Aceves to the 60 day DL to open up a spot on the 40 man roster?

  3. CB July 31st, 2010 at 2:09 pm

    repost:

    I really don’t understand the Cardinals trading Ludwick for Jake Westbrook. That’s a bad deal. Ludwick is a really solid player who isn’t expensive. To only get Westbrook back is a poor deal. I know the Cards need pitching but they also aren’t scoring much in the way of runs.

    Tony Larussa’s use of Colby Rasmus is also strange. Not even Torre would have used him like this. Just let him play.

  4. tampayank July 31st, 2010 at 2:09 pm

    “will Berkman make it Tampa by tonight’s game?”

    thanks for answering my question 1 second later :)

  5. SJ44 July 31st, 2010 at 2:10 pm

    Melancon’s makeup and work ethic is off the charts.

    His arm action is a nightmare and it leads to his inconsistency within the strikezone at the big league level.

    The difference between AAA and the big leagues is that in AAA, you can get away with guys chasing pitches out of the zone. Much tougher to do at the big league level.

    He’s got great stuff when he’s on. The issue is, will his mechanics allow him to be on enough to be a productive big league pitcher.

    I hope so because he’s a great kid.

    At 25 though, its probably best he has a change of scenery.

    I wish him the best.

  6. blake July 31st, 2010 at 2:10 pm

    CB,

    I thought is was a strange deal as well….we were speculating earlier if that might mean the Cards were in on Dunn but that doesn’t appear to be the case…Who knows.

  7. Rich in NJ July 31st, 2010 at 2:11 pm

    Given Dave Duncan’s track record, the Cards may think they can coach up Westbrook.

  8. Chip July 31st, 2010 at 2:12 pm

    Blast….Theriot goes to the Dodgers (along with Ted Lilly) I was hoping he might wind up here as a Ramiro Pena upgrade

  9. Bret The Hitman July 31st, 2010 at 2:12 pm

    Tweet dead zone…

  10. Rich in NJ July 31st, 2010 at 2:12 pm

    Maybe the Yankees failed Melancon. We’ll see.

  11. Bret The Hitman July 31st, 2010 at 2:12 pm

    eery…

  12. MTU July 31st, 2010 at 2:13 pm

    Bret-

    At this point I think all we might still get is a Pena upgrade, and maybe not even that.

    We tried to change the balance of power in a big way with Lee and to a lesser extent Haren.

    I like the 2 trades Cash has made.

    I doubt very much he has any rabitts left in his hat.

    Always willing to be surprised though. :)

  13. GreenBeret7 July 31st, 2010 at 2:14 pm

    Unless the Yanks feel keeping Thames in Ny is redundent, Golson may be the guy, though with Mark Newman watching DeLaRosa’s performance last night, he may have gotten sick. I can’t figure out what happened to DeLaRosa. He’s just never recovered from the injuries.

  14. CB July 31st, 2010 at 2:14 pm

    “What may be hurting Raines was playing for the Expos.”

    maine-

    Very true. That’s a big part of it as well.

    It’s just so strange. With other guys like say Lou Whitaker, you can understand perhaps how they’d get overlooked. But Raines was spectacular. Watching him play, there was no question that you were watching a hall of fame player. None at all. His impact on games offensively, defensively and on the bases was enormous. He influenced games in so many ways.

    Just a shame. Real embarrassment to the game that Jim Rice is in the Hall because he had a handful of very vocal, influential reporters constantly talking him up with nonsense like “most feared” hitter of his generation (Mike Schmidt and George Brett say hello) and Raines seems to have almost no shot to get in based on his prior vote tallies.

  15. GreenBeret7 July 31st, 2010 at 2:16 pm

    St. Louis also received some level of prospect from San Diego for Ludwick.

  16. CB July 31st, 2010 at 2:17 pm

    “His arm action is a nightmare and it leads to his inconsistency within the strikezone at the big league level.”

    Melancon’s arm action was truly terrible. That’s the fundamental issue with him and it’s a big one. I hope he does very well and a move to the NL is the best thing possible for him.

    But he was one of those guys that comes up from the minors and the way he plays just doesn’t match with the numbers he put up and those guys are always a concern. Tough to generalize their stats from the minors to the majors.

  17. JobaTipsHisCap July 31st, 2010 at 2:17 pm

    Apparently we need more pitching.

  18. Chip July 31st, 2010 at 2:19 pm

    Guys like Melancon are easy to replace.

  19. blake July 31st, 2010 at 2:19 pm

    I know this is a bit of a funny question, but what will the Yankees do with Nick Johnson (remember him) now when/if he comes back?

  20. Betsy July 31st, 2010 at 2:19 pm

    I loved Tim Raines as a Yankee; I don’t rember him in his prime as an Expo, but he was just a wonderful guy to have on the team. He was part of that rotating LF spot – ridiculous, but oddly it worked.

    I haven’t read one tweet on the Yanks all day; I’m sure Cash is working the phones for a UTIL INF – I hope he gets one.

    I mentioned before, but Richard Justice from the Houston Chronicle raved about Berkman as a person. He also thinks he’s got something left and will thrive being on a contender.

    As to Kearns, there’s an article on NESN.com about how the Sox missed out on him.

  21. GreenBeret7 July 31st, 2010 at 2:19 pm

    Never bought off on the “Most Feared Hitter” label, either. Dave winfield was a rather scary proposition as far as hitters went.

  22. Betsy July 31st, 2010 at 2:20 pm

    Oh and I’m glad Lilly went to the Dodgers.

  23. pat July 31st, 2010 at 2:20 pm

    “Unless Marcus Thames is DFAd, I?d have to guess Wilkin De La Rosa, Greg Golson and Reegie Corona are the top candidates.”

    Corona was carted off the field with a shoulder injury last night after colliding with Bruntlett. Anyone hear how serious it was?

  24. Perlo July 31st, 2010 at 2:21 pm

    CB,
    I think what hurt Raines’ HOF chances is the same thing that hurt Mattingly. The first half of both player’s careers were much better than the latter half, but our lasting memory of a player is what occurred most recently.
    For half a decade, Raines was arguably the best position player in the NL along with Mike Schmidt and Dale Murphy.

  25. MTU July 31st, 2010 at 2:21 pm

    Our lineup tonite against the Devil Goat(Garza).

    Jeter
    Swish
    Tex
    A-Rod
    Cano
    Posada
    Berkman
    Grandy
    GGBG

    That is one tough lineup. OBP out the ying-yang. Whew ! :)

  26. Apple byte July 31st, 2010 at 2:21 pm

    The Red Sox continue to wait for the Red Cross to take them out of their doldrum. John Henry continues to make money for an inferior product. Theo Epstein just shruggs his shoulders and keep his hands in his pockets jiggling loose change around.

  27. Chip July 31st, 2010 at 2:22 pm

    Blake,

    He’ll be a pinch hitter. Likely he’s not coming back until rosters expand

  28. Betsy July 31st, 2010 at 2:22 pm

    ed_price

    Quote:
    Source: #Rays and #Orioles in talks. Could involved Luke Scott, or a reliever (Ohman?).

  29. Andrew July 31st, 2010 at 2:22 pm

    I think at this point, if Cashman can’t find the right utility guy or a cheap bullpen arm before 4, he will be content to wait it out and keep scouring the list of guys who clear waivers in August. Those are the 2 types of roster spots that teams will definitely be able to fill during the waiver period, as a semi-expensive bench player and a similar bullpen arm could get through waivers and still make an impact down the stretch.

  30. Andrew July 31st, 2010 at 2:24 pm

    So funny that Angelos won’t approve a deal to the Yankees but I’m sure he will practically hand Tampa Luke Scott if they are serious enough about him. That guy is an ultimate scumbag, I pity Orioles fans who have to endure his ownership.

  31. blake July 31st, 2010 at 2:24 pm

    Chip,

    I didn’t know the timetable on him. Thats probably it though.

  32. Betsy July 31st, 2010 at 2:25 pm

    PeteAbe

    Quote:
    Red Sox are trying to move their spare parts (Ramirez, Okajima, Lowell) at deadline to open room on roster for Bowden, others.
    *********

    Andrew, agreed. Cash certainly isn’t going to make bad trades just to get someone now and, if I recall, didn’t they get Hairston and Hinske post-deadline? Maybe I’m wrong – it was Gaudin, for sure, and he helped them.

  33. CB July 31st, 2010 at 2:25 pm

    blake-

    The non-Pujols at bats for the Cards are pretty painful to watch already. Ludwick was a solid bat and he was also a good glove. Very nice pick up by Hoyer for SD. He’s going to help the Pads a great deal.

    The cards are an odd-duck franchise. They simply haven’t committed very much to developing their minor league system and it hurts them every year. That prevents them from surrounding pujols with talent at prices which make sense for them given their resources.

    Even now with the way they’re using Rasmus – you can just see how little patience LaRussa has for young players at this point in his managerial career.

  34. Perlo July 31st, 2010 at 2:26 pm

    I really hope that “Fat Elvis” resonates more than “Big Puma” does for the Berkman’s 2 months in NY. I’m a Memphian at heart.

  35. Chip July 31st, 2010 at 2:26 pm

    Peter Angelos won’t deal with the “rival” Yankees, but the Rays are ok. No wonder that organization is such a mess…fish stink from the head.

  36. Betsy July 31st, 2010 at 2:26 pm

    Angelos had a personal feud with George and that makes all the difference in the world; you can’t overestimate how much he despises the Yankees and he’s probably very glad to help the Rays.

  37. Bret The Hitman July 31st, 2010 at 2:27 pm

    Olney: Dunn moving still possibilty

  38. Doreen July 31st, 2010 at 2:28 pm

    So the Orioles have no qualms about dealing with the Rays, who are in their division, but won’t deal with the Yankees or Red Sox. So it’s not about not helping division rivals/competition; it’s about being plain nasty to the Yankees and Red Sox.

  39. GreenBeret7 July 31st, 2010 at 2:28 pm

    If NYYs can’t make a decent deal for a utility player to replace Pena, they can always bring up Eric Bruntlett up from Scranton. He plays everywhere. Not perfect, but, he has experience with Philadelphia and others.

  40. Bill D July 31st, 2010 at 2:28 pm

    Andrew:

    Yankees will have a tough time with the bullpen arm after the deadline. Only ones they stand a legit chance of getting are overpriced, under performing types (Wood, maybe Farnsworth) who other teams will pass on. So many teams need help that if a reasonably priced reliever having a good year is put on waivers, there’s no way that guy gets anywhere close to the Yankees in the process. Anybody worth having is going to get claimed.

  41. Andrew July 31st, 2010 at 2:28 pm

    Betsy I think Hairston was right on the 31st, Hinske was pre-deadline, and Gaudin was definitely in August. But an arm will probably be out there, especially since teams will fall further out of it a few more weeks into August and will be looking to cut ties with some guys. Patience is a virtue, and since the team is still really good right this second, it will pay off to not overpay for either a bench or bullpen guy.

  42. blake July 31st, 2010 at 2:29 pm

    “They simply haven’t committed very much to developing their minor league system and it hurts them every year. ”

    And they essentially “paid twice” for Holliday last year by sending prospects to Oakland. Pitching is St. Louis’s strength to me, especially in a playoff series with Wainwright and Carpenter…

  43. LGY July 31st, 2010 at 2:29 pm

    I thought the reason the Astros were so reluctant to deal Myers is because they had a club option on him.

    Apparently it is a mutual option.

    I don’t see how Myers takes only 1 year and $8 million after having such a good season.

    It seems strange that they are so reluctant to move him when he may actually be their best trade chip at his price point.

  44. MTU July 31st, 2010 at 2:29 pm

    Who gives a rats rear what Angelos thinks, or does. After all, he owns the USS Going Nowhere.

    If he doesn’t want to improve it by trading with the Yankees that’s his loss.

    He’s a bit player anyway. Who cares.

  45. SJ44 July 31st, 2010 at 2:30 pm

    Or maybe the Yankees didn’t fail him at all. Maybe, he is just is what he is and it hasn’t nothing to do with the Yankees failing him in any way.

    Not every prospect makes it. In fact, 95% of them don’t.

    I know folks get infatuated with every prospect and believe they are the next, “fill in the blank”.

    Fact is, when you saw the Yankees not make him the closer in Scranton this year, you knew he was in play on the trade market.

    Most of the guys in the organization are going to be trade assets. Mainly because, if you view this roster objectively, there aren’t a lot of open spots over the next year or so.

    Melancon is a guy that can be easily replaced because arms like Nova, Brackman and Phelps could be used in the bullpen to help the Yankees in the next year if need be.

    When you have that kind of surplus, it speaks to the great job the Yankees have done to beef up the system again.

  46. Laura - I Bleed Blue July 31st, 2010 at 2:31 pm

    “So the Orioles have no qualms about dealing with the Rays, who are in their division, but won’t deal with the Yankees or Red Sox. So it’s not about not helping division rivals/competition; it’s about being plain nasty to the Yankees and Red Sox.”

    And for that, BAL will be in last place for decades to come.

  47. MTU July 31st, 2010 at 2:31 pm

    Gb-

    Too bad Tracy can’t play short. :(

  48. CB July 31st, 2010 at 2:31 pm

    Perlo-

    That’s a good point. The thing with Raines is that he had such a long, productive career that he did play for a long past his prime. And the reason why he was able to do that was because even in his decline phase he was a valuable piece, especially on good teams.

    But that may have dimmed the memories of what he was in his prime.

    I agree with you – for a significant period of time there was a real argument for Raines being the single best player in the entire NL. He was clearly in the small handful of elite players.

    Hard to believe Dawson is in and Raines isn’t. Dawson wasn’t close to as good as Raines, especially once Dawson’s knees went bad so early.

  49. pat July 31st, 2010 at 2:31 pm

    MLB Network showing Berkman is in the Trop

  50. Betsy July 31st, 2010 at 2:32 pm

    Doreen, I have no idea if he’d deal with the Sox, but he detests the Yankees – it’s personal. If he doesn’t like the Sox, it’s simply a matter of the fact that they are in the same division. That said, didn’t the O’s trade some minor player to the Yankees last year?

  51. blake July 31st, 2010 at 2:32 pm

    Need to get Lance a Yankee bag.

  52. MTU July 31st, 2010 at 2:34 pm

    Too bad Lance couldn’t make his debut in the “Home” uni’s. He’s gonna look good in the stripes. :)

  53. LGY July 31st, 2010 at 2:34 pm

    lol. Lance looked a little lost.

    He needs his buddy Andy to show him the ropes in these AL stadiums.

  54. MystiqueAura July 31st, 2010 at 2:36 pm

    MLB Radio: Red Sox and Braves talking Ellsbury

  55. Bret The Hitman July 31st, 2010 at 2:36 pm

    90 minutes to go.

    The only thing we know is this.

    Cashman is working.

  56. Rich in NJ July 31st, 2010 at 2:36 pm

    “Or maybe the Yankees didn’t fail him at all. Maybe, he is just is what he is and it hasn’t nothing to do with the Yankees failing him in any way.”

    That’s right, we don’t know. The Astros’ ability to develop him will provide some insight.

    It’s not like the Yankees have a stellar development record.

  57. SJ44 July 31st, 2010 at 2:37 pm

    The best “punishment” the Yankees give the Orioles each year for Angelos is the 8-9 games a year Yankee fans take over Camden Yards and the Yankees pound them.

    Petty grudges like that is why Angelos has run a great franchise into the ground.

  58. Captain Clutch July 31st, 2010 at 2:37 pm

    I am very upset that the Yanks traded Melancon…..Now who is going to throw at Youkilis? lol

  59. Chip July 31st, 2010 at 2:37 pm

    GB – Yankees aren’t clearing someone off the 40 for Eric Bruntlett (or Chad Tracy)

  60. blake July 31st, 2010 at 2:38 pm

    “MLB Radio: Red Sox and Braves talking Ellsbury”

    I heard this mentioned earlier today but then heard nothing else about it. Braves need a CFer and/or a bat.

  61. GreenBeret7 July 31st, 2010 at 2:39 pm

    MTU July 31st, 2010 at 2:31 pm
    Gb-

    Too bad Tracy can’t play short.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    Yeah, right now, he’s the inhouse insurance for Rodriguez.

  62. Doreen July 31st, 2010 at 2:40 pm

    Betsy -

    I don’t know. And I may be getting the Orioles and Blue Jays confused, but I think they operate on the same basic premise regarding the Yankees and Red Sox. I’m not complaining. I’m just mildly amused they’d do a deal with the Rays, because the Rays are no longer stuck on the bottom with them. :)

  63. Bret The Hitman July 31st, 2010 at 2:40 pm

    Rosenthal – Rays in on League.

  64. Rich in NJ July 31st, 2010 at 2:40 pm

    “Most of the guys in the organization are going to be trade assets. Mainly because, if you view this roster objectively, there aren’t a lot of open spots over the next year or so.”

    OTOH, Jeter, Alex, Posada, Pettitte, and Mo are reaching the point in their careers at which they are vulnerable to a decline.

    So now is the time to accumulate prospects, both for purposes of in-house development and/or trades to provide replacements for these players.

    Right now, the only position that the Yankees have covered is at C.

    That’s why I would be reticent to trade prospects to fill marginal needs.

  65. SJ44 July 31st, 2010 at 2:41 pm

    The Yankees development record is actually pretty good.

    They have more homegrown guys on their roster than the Rays.

    Guys like Coke and Jackson have gone to other teams and played well. That’s a testimony to the Yankees developing players.

    Not every player makes it and if that happens its not always the teams fault.

    When I look at the current Yankee roster and see guys like Jeter, Cano, Gardner, Pettitte, Robertson, Hughes, Posada, and Cervelli contributing, I’d say they are doing a pretty good job in that department.

    That’s 40% of the roster with guys contributing to the team that has the best record in baseball.

    I’m not even counting Joba, who is far from a lost cause.

    When you factor in the talent that’s currently in the system, I’d say the Yankees are in the upper half of teams in the game right now developing young talent. That’s a far cry from where they were just a few short years ago.

  66. CB July 31st, 2010 at 2:41 pm

    Hard to understand the O’s. They are historically awful and won’t trade off pieces like Scott, Wiggington or Ohman. Those are all guys who are going to have more value at the trade deadline than they will in the winter.

    Perhaps they’re worried about breaking the Mets record for losses. Hard to explain who Angelos thinks.

    Andy McPhail has done a very strong job there and they have some promising young talent. But it’s hard not to think that the well is somehow poisoned down there.

  67. Bret The Hitman July 31st, 2010 at 2:42 pm

    Heyman: ChiSox still working on EJax Dunn swap but Nats want more.

  68. Melkmanisinhotlanta July 31st, 2010 at 2:42 pm

    I pray that NJ doesn’t take offense at the Puma taking his place lololololo

  69. Chip July 31st, 2010 at 2:42 pm

    I think if they don’t get a utility infielder it’s more likely they promote Nunez over Bruntlett.

  70. Perlo July 31st, 2010 at 2:42 pm

    CB,
    I think what really raised Dawson’s profile was his signing with the Cubs in 1987. Growing up in the Midwest, we always viewed Dawson as an excellent player (although Raines was better in his prime), but when he came to Chicago ignoring the wall of collusion by signing a blank contract and simply dazzling with 49 HR in his first season, his popularity went off the charts (Thank you WGN.)
    On the other hand, Raines was forced to re-sign with the Expos in 1987 when no one would offer him a contract and then went on to sign with the Chisox the next year and he was never quite the same player.
    I do wonder what effect the cocaine usage had on his career. Certainly, it affected some players more than others (like Strawberry another certain HOF before age 30). Have you ever heard the story of why Raines always slid headfirst?

  71. Rich in NJ July 31st, 2010 at 2:43 pm

    “The Yankees development record is actually pretty good.

    They have more homegrown guys on their roster than the Rays.”

    You mean when you include Jeter, Posada, Mo, and Pettitte who were developed under different personnel?

    They’ re getting old! They need to develop a new homegrown core.

  72. SJ44 July 31st, 2010 at 2:44 pm

    You don’t have to accumulate prospects to replace those four guys.

    Cliff Lee could end up replacing Pettitte. That’s more of an upgrade than having any propsect in the game at that position.

    The future SS is at least 2-3 years away. That means, the chances are more likely they replace Jeter from outside the organization.

    They haven’t even touched any of their Top 10 prospects in the organization with these trades.

    Seems to me the organization has done a very good job of balancing prospects, trades and FA signings the past few years.

    They have a lot of young talent in the pipeline. That’s why they have many more options to work with than they did a few years ago.

  73. Chip July 31st, 2010 at 2:44 pm

    Would like to get league or aardsma but can’t see Yanks dealing with Seattle

  74. Crawdaddy July 31st, 2010 at 2:46 pm

    Rich,

    Let’s be fair, the Yankees have come a long way in player development in the last five years compared to the previous ten years.

  75. Crawdaddy July 31st, 2010 at 2:47 pm

    Let’s remember that the Yankees can always get a stopgap SS after Jeter until a long-term solution from the system makes it to the big club.

  76. Rich in NJ July 31st, 2010 at 2:49 pm

    “You don’t have to accumulate prospects to replace those four guys.”

    You have no idea where the next SS is coming from or when one will be needed. That’s why you need the ability to get a replacement when then need arises. You do that, in part, by accumulating prospects.

    Similarly, you don’t know when you will need a 3Bman or a closer.

    The Yankees are extremely vulnerable.

    “Seems to me the organization has done a very good job of balancing prospects, trades and FA signings the past few years.”

    It seems to me that the Yankees have done a good job of accumulating catching prospects. That’s about it right now. They haven’t developed many high end prospects in the recent past except Hughes.

  77. MystiqueAura July 31st, 2010 at 2:49 pm

    Have to agree, the Yankees player development has moved ahead leaps and bounds. Good to see.

  78. CB July 31st, 2010 at 2:49 pm

    Perlo-

    Agreed that Dawson’s 49 HR and MVP for the Cubbies really elevated his national stature, especially given how, as you pointed out, he signed with Chicago. The irony is that he was a better player when he was on the expos and could still play CF.

    Never heard why Raines slid head first. I was just assuming he did it for the standard reasons – small target, etc.

  79. SJ44 July 31st, 2010 at 2:50 pm

    Rich,

    What do you call Gardner, Hughes, Robertson, Chamberlain, Cano and Montero?

    Is that not a “Homegrown Core”?

    They is NEVER going to be another Core Four. Its only happened once in the history of professional sports that four guys have played this long with the same team.

    You have guys like Tex, Granderson, CC and Swisher who are all 30 and under. Again, three more guys in the heart of their careers as Yankees.

    They are developing younger players. Some are on the roster, some are coming, and others are going to be dealt.

    Its never going to be an all homegrown team.

    Right now though, the balance of the club has been better than its been in years.

  80. blake July 31st, 2010 at 2:50 pm

    “The Braves are working on potential deals for hitters and relievers, tweets David O’Brien of the Atlanta Journal-Consitution, and there’s a “reasonable chance” something gets done by the deadline.”

  81. LGY July 31st, 2010 at 2:51 pm

    “They’ re getting old! They need to develop a new homegrown core.”

    ——————————–

    I wouldn’t say the Yankees need a new homegrown core. Having Jeter-Pettitte-Bernie-Posada-Mo all home grown is a rarity. Having all those young players come up around the same time and all be All Stars is not something I would hold as the standard for future Yankee teams.

    This team now is much more talented on the veteran end than they were in the 90s.

    They just need to continue to build around the key veterans like Alex, develop a few young players to balance the budget, and sign the right FA’s/make the right trades.

    They are doing all that right now.

    Cano, Hughes, Gardner are all in the mix, they used the farm to get Swisher and Granderson, and are making very smart FA agent decisions like Teixiera, CC, and hopefully next Lee.

    They seem to have a very good balance going on right now serving present and future needs of how this team is constructed.

    Like many have said we need to move on from 2009, I think we need to move on from the late 90s as well, because the scenarios are just not very similar.

  82. mick July 31st, 2010 at 2:51 pm

    Will Berkman platoon at Dh with Kearns/Thames?

  83. pat July 31st, 2010 at 2:51 pm

    Doreen

    Enjoy your vacation.

    I just got back from a quick trip to SoCal on Thursday and they were anticipating nice weather this week.

  84. Apple byte July 31st, 2010 at 2:51 pm

    Even more puzzling with the Orioles situation is why Buck Showalter accepted the managerial job knowing that Peter Angeles is lurking in the shadows. There’s a few good situations that will open up after the season for Buck if he waited.

  85. Jason22 July 31st, 2010 at 2:52 pm

    I saw the name Chad Tracy mentioned as a possible backup for Alex, you can cross him off your list, he left Scranton today, as he had an op out and he took it.

  86. Perlo July 31st, 2010 at 2:52 pm

    The Yankees farm system is in far better shape than what it was from 2000-2005, but if this team is going to get more financially efficient and therefore flexible (especially at the trade deadline when other teams literally give away bad contracts–see Abreu), then they are going to have to produce at least 1-2 regulars and a starter in the next season or two. Role players like Cervelli and Pena may be useful, but there is little difference in the cost of a FA IF reserve and one that is produced from within. As it is, we have produced only one bonafide starting position player in 5 years (Gardner) and one starter in the last 15 (Hughes).

  87. Rich in NJ July 31st, 2010 at 2:52 pm

    Craw

    They have. I am coming to the conclusion that Oppenheimer has done a better job (under Cash’s auspices) than I originally thought. My concern is that they aren’t doing a great job of developing the talent that he is putting into the pipeline.

    They can get a stopgap for Jeter as long as they are getting top production at 3B and C. If not, would a stopgap be enough?

    Again, my point is that they need to be careful trading (and developing) prospects because they have several points of vulnerability due to advancing baseball age.

  88. Bret The Hitman July 31st, 2010 at 2:52 pm

    Stark: Hears Rays are done for today.

    Does anyone believe that?

  89. CountryClub July 31st, 2010 at 2:52 pm

    Gardner, Cano & hughes are a nice ‘core’ for the future. 6 of 10 players in starting lineup last nt were home grown.

  90. SJ44 July 31st, 2010 at 2:53 pm

    The Yankees aren’t vulnerable at all. When you have their assets, and the baseball side of the business is being run as well as it is, how are they vulnerable?

    They don’t have to identify their future 3B or SS right now.

    Suppose four years from now, Cito Culver is that guy?

    Or, suppose they have the assets to trade for a SS two years from now.

    They don’t have to have in house replacements lined up for anybody right now.

  91. CB July 31st, 2010 at 2:53 pm

    The Yankees are in a dog fight to win the AL East given that the second best team in baseball is chasing them.

    And this season winning the AL East has enormous value because it lets you avoid Cliff Lee going twice in a 5 game opening series.

    As such, the value of a marginal win added for the yankees is enormous right now in this season. A marginal win added this season will likely be much higher than it is next season as the Rays will be regrouping again.

    If there’s ever a season to trade prospects at the deadline this on is it.

    The Yanks understand that and it’s likely part of why they decided to include Montero for Lee in season.

  92. mick July 31st, 2010 at 2:54 pm

    If Gardy moves to CF and Kearns to LF vs a lefty, wouldn’t Thames be the DH?

  93. Betsy July 31st, 2010 at 2:54 pm

    SJ, I agree with you………

    What exactly is wrong with Robertson? Gardner? Cano? Hughes? High end prospects? How do they get those high end prospects unless they stink it up every year? They are at a disadvantage in the draft and so what Cash has done is pretty remarkable.

    Extremely vulnerable? I share your concerns about the age of the team, but that’s extreme.

  94. Perlo July 31st, 2010 at 2:54 pm

    CB,

    By his own admission, Raines claimed that he carried a glass vial of cocaine in his back pocket while playing and was afraid that he would crush it if he slid on his butt.

  95. Bret The Hitman July 31st, 2010 at 2:56 pm

    Stark: Fun final hour coming. One exec says the number of calls is insane.

    Cashman swamped?

  96. CountryClub July 31st, 2010 at 2:56 pm

    The Yankees are not an old team anymore. Tex and grandy and swish along with Gardner and Cano solved that problem. Posada is at the end of the line, but the farm is ready to fill that need. Jeter and Arod are aging, but they’re not going anywhere. Yanks could have Longoria in their system, he wouldnt replace arod at 3rd (mostly because they could never move his contract). Jeter and Arod getting old is just a fact that Yankees fans are going to have to live with.

  97. trisha - true pinstriped blue July 31st, 2010 at 2:56 pm

    My name is trisha, and I approve these trades!

    :)

  98. GreenBeret7 July 31st, 2010 at 2:57 pm

    CB July 31st, 2010 at 2:49 pm
    Perlo-

    Agreed that Dawson’s 49 HR and MVP for the Cubbies really elevated his national stature, especially given how, as you pointed out, he signed with Chicago. The irony is that he was a better player when he was on the expos and could still play CF.

    Never heard why Raines slid head first. I was just assuming he did it for the standard reasons – small target, etc.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    Raines said in an interview once that he started sliding head first so he wouldn’t break the vial of coke that he kept in his back pocket. He said it with a straight face, but, not sure how much truth there was in that. He also said that he didn’t get his legs beat up so much.

  99. Rich in NJ July 31st, 2010 at 2:57 pm

    “I wouldn’t say the Yankees need a new homegrown core. Having Jeter-Pettitte-Bernie-Posada-Mo all home grown is a rarity. Having all those young players come up around the same time and all be All Stars is not something I would hold as the standard for future Yankee teams.”

    What’s rare is keeping them together for so long. It’s not as rare to develop a homegrown core that changes over time.

    “This team now is much more talented on the veteran end than they were in the 90s. ”

    The competition is far better due to the parity engendered by the revenue sharing provisions of subsequent CBAs.

    “They just need to continue to build around the key veterans like Alex, develop a few young players to balance the budget, and sign the right FA’s/make the right trades.”

    Alex is 35. Is this merely an off year? Does he need more hip surgery? We don’t know, i.e., vulnerability.

    “Cano, Hughes, Gardner are all in the mix, they used the farm to get Swisher and Granderson, and are making very smart FA agent decisions like Teixiera, CC, and hopefully next Lee. ”

    That’s fine, and I applaud them (although I’m not sure what Granderson is and we don’t know if the new Swish is enduring), but the team still relies on big production from the aging core.

    “Like many have said we need to move on from 2009, I think we need to move on from the late 90s as well, because the scenarios are just not very similar.”

    I think that maintaining a homegrown core is a model that needs to be retained.

  100. pat July 31st, 2010 at 2:57 pm

    BloggingBombers Lance Berkman will wear No. 17 for the Yankees. Austin Kearns will wear No. 26.

  101. Bret The Hitman July 31st, 2010 at 2:57 pm

    The teams are devoting few resources to media communications and are all in on the dealings which seem to be intense.

    Media blockout right now.

  102. CB July 31st, 2010 at 2:57 pm

    Perlo-

    I do remember hearing that story. I didn’t think it was Raines who said it. Always assumed it was apocryphal.

  103. LGY July 31st, 2010 at 2:58 pm

    Concerns about the offense in the future with aging players like Jeter and Alex have to be balanced with the reality that the Yankees are putting a better and better starting rotation on the field every year.

    You don’t necessarily have to directly address the offense to balance any concerns about it.

    Cliff Lee sounds like a great solution for any drop off in the offense in the next few years.

    And of course the development and influx in the system of guys like Brackman, Bentances, Banuelos, Ramirez, etc.

  104. mick July 31st, 2010 at 2:59 pm

    Will Berkman be at DH tonight vs Garza?

  105. SJ44 July 31st, 2010 at 3:01 pm

    They are maintaining a homegrown core.

    What they aren’t going to do is pass on a guy like Cliff Lee in the off-season because they want to develop a “homegrown guy”.

    Its a balance and the fact is, the Yankees have done a great job with this balance.

    They won a WS last year, got younger in the off-season, added Granderson, and now have the best record in the league, with younger players helping them perform.

    Its been a great year in the system with guys like Phelps, Brackman, Betances and Nunez making strides.

    Its all about balance. They aren’t going to lean one way or the other.

    You never cover every base. Its impossible.

    However, when you look at this team this year and next year, they are loaded.

    Hard to see what the problem is because this is the most balanced they have been as an organization in over 10 years and they didn’t need George to get kicked out of baseball again to achieve it.

  106. pat July 31st, 2010 at 3:02 pm

    MLB Network is saying Berkman is batting clean up?

  107. Anthony Murillo July 31st, 2010 at 3:02 pm

    Berkman batting clean up according to MLB Network.

    Why????

  108. jrazz12 July 31st, 2010 at 3:02 pm

    Rumor is the yanks are still looking for a backup 3B/SS to take over Pena’s role. Has anyone heard any names being floated for who that would be?

  109. trisha - true pinstriped blue July 31st, 2010 at 3:02 pm

    “Concerns about the offense in the future with aging players like Jeter and Alex have to be balanced with the reality that the Yankees are putting a better and better starting rotation on the field every year.”

    Yes indeed. And though I didn’t have any sources predicting these trades, I did say at the beginning of the season that the Sux would fold like a house of cards and end up in 3rd place. Actually I said 3rd place or worse.

    :D

  110. mick July 31st, 2010 at 3:02 pm

    Cano 7th, Berkman 5th…is Reynolds crazy?

  111. Perlo July 31st, 2010 at 3:03 pm

    CB,

    The story could certainly be nothing more than bloviating but there is no question that he was a user at the time along with a significant number of the league (and society as a whole).
    I’m curious, what is the minimum body of work do you allow for HOF consideration? I’m wondering in terms of duration (# of years) and amplitude (quality of play).

  112. Eroc July 31st, 2010 at 3:03 pm

    Now get one of Greinke, DeJesus, Soria, Marmol and call it a deadline

    Maybe Downs or League as well

  113. Andrew July 31st, 2010 at 3:03 pm

    Rich how are the Yankees “extremely vulnerable” when they have elite talents (Teixeira, Sabathia, Cano) under control for years to come combined with a number of cost-controlled guys that are producing as useful pieces at the ML level? You choose to overly focus on aging veteran players in spite of the fact that those guys are still productive right now plus only A-Rod is tied to the Yankees for an extremely long time. Seems like an overly pessimistic and hyperbolic take on your part to say they are extremely vulnerable and that they haven’t developed any talent.

  114. Bret The Hitman July 31st, 2010 at 3:03 pm

    SHOCKING REVELATION BY BUSTER OLNEY

    Buster_ESPN

    Heard this: The Yankees are still open for business and looking for help.#trades
    less than 20 seconds ago via web

    :lol:

  115. Doreen July 31st, 2010 at 3:03 pm

    Thanks, pat.

    :)

  116. Captain Clutch July 31st, 2010 at 3:04 pm

    You would think Arod is getting the day off. I hope he is not hurt…

  117. CB July 31st, 2010 at 3:04 pm

    “What’s rare is keeping them together for so long. It’s not as rare to develop a homegrown core that changes over time.”

    Not true. This is said all the time and it’s just an argument to dismiss what the yankees did in terms of developing that core in the first place as a function of money.

    Jeter, Mo, Posada, Andy and Bernie – those are 5 guys each of whom either is a hall of famer or has a legitimate argument to be in the hall of fame.

    It is extraordinarily rare for any team in the history of the game to have a crop of home grown players come up together in the minors/ majors as a cohort, especially in the post-rule 4 draft era.

    It’s true that their financial resources made it possible for them to keep them together. But it’s extraordinarily rare to have assembled that much talent together internally. It just doesn’t happen.

  118. m1kew July 31st, 2010 at 3:04 pm

    MLB TV just said Berkman will bat cleanup! ???

  119. Rich in NJ July 31st, 2010 at 3:04 pm

    “The Yankees aren’t vulnerable at all. When you have their assets, and the baseball side of the business is being run as well as it is, how are they vulnerable?”

    With all due respect, that’s absurd.

    When Jeter, A-Rod, Posada, Mo, and Pettitte are all 35 or older, you are vulnerable. Any baseball actuarial table would reveal that. It’s highly unlikely that all will continue to be aging outliers for much longer.

    “They don’t have to identify their future 3B or SS right now.

    Suppose four years from now, Cito Culver is that guy?”

    It’s not about identifying a replacement now, it’s about having viable options if Jeter or A-Rod need to be replaced years before Culver is ready.

    “Or, suppose they have the assets to trade for a SS two years from now”

    That is the point I have been making. They need to keep Montero, etc. precisely because they don’t know when that replacement will be needed, and they need to keep sufficient top tier assets go get that player. But they also need in house solutions as well because as long as they want to keep the payroll at or near $200m, they don’t have unlimited payroll flexibility.

  120. trisha - true pinstriped blue July 31st, 2010 at 3:05 pm

    “Berkman batting clean up according to MLB Network.

    Why????”

    They are hoping to improve their ratings by putting out apparently provocative information?

    They got it wrong?

    Alex has the night off and they want him to bat cleanup?

    Probably best to wait and hear it on the pregame show. If it’s true, you’ll hear the reason then. Good waiters get good tips…

    ;)

  121. sevrox July 31st, 2010 at 3:05 pm

    You actually believe the MLBN?

    Ha!!!!!!!!!!

  122. Disco July 31st, 2010 at 3:05 pm

    Funny seeing Berkman in TB with his Astros equipment bag around his neck.

    Get him some Yankees Adidas sponsored gear!

  123. blake July 31st, 2010 at 3:05 pm

    surely they aren’t resting Tex or Alex today?

  124. Apple byte July 31st, 2010 at 3:05 pm

    Rays owner Stuary Sternberg is fooling nobody but himself. Floating all the rumors about adding players is a clear indication that he has no intention of signing Carl Crawford after this year.

  125. Betsy July 31st, 2010 at 3:05 pm

    The AL East is going to be brutal for awhile, so there’s no way you can go with all kids – even the Rays can’t do it. In the last couple of years, we’ve had Joba, Phil, Robertson and Cervelli help us – that’s pretty good. Now will all of them stick? Doubtful……….Phil probably; Robertson ….we’ll have to see. Joba? A complete unknown. Cervelli? Eh -maybe. However, they have all helped us in some degree or another. It hasn’t all been sunshine and roses – Melancon was a disappointment – but it’s still pretty good. Our position players are behind the pitchers, so we’re going to have to wait, but Heathcott looks very good and so do Montero and Romine. We also appear to have had a pretty decent draft this year……..

  126. Eroc July 31st, 2010 at 3:05 pm

    “They need to keep Montero, etc. precisely because they don’t know when that replacement will be needed,”

    We need a replacement at DH?

  127. Rich in NJ July 31st, 2010 at 3:06 pm

    “Not true. This is said all the time and it’s just an argument to dismiss what the yankees did in terms of developing that core in the first place as a function of money”

    Huh? Dismiss what they did? It applauds what they did.

    “It is extraordinarily rare for any team in the history of the game to have a crop of home grown players come up together in the minors/ majors as a cohort, especially in the post-rule 4 draft era. ”

    That’s my point.

  128. mick July 31st, 2010 at 3:06 pm

    he has no intention of signing Carl Crawford after this year.
    =============
    Or Pena

  129. trisha - true pinstriped blue July 31st, 2010 at 3:06 pm

    “Cano 7th, Berkman 5th…is Reynolds crazy?”

    Hmmm from cleaup to fifth?

    I think I’d just wait and not presume anything to be the case. But that’s just me.

  130. LGY July 31st, 2010 at 3:07 pm

    trisha,

    I’m glad you can celebrate the Berkman trade now that it was made official :D

  131. Bret The Hitman July 31st, 2010 at 3:07 pm

    Rich in NJ,

    Perhaps the Yankees are keeping Eduardo Nunez and Brandon Laird as insurance for Jeter and Arod. Add in Romine/Montero and you have Posada covered as well.

    I don’t think we’re very vulnerable.

    For Mo, you have Joba or Soria.

  132. Bret The Hitman July 31st, 2010 at 3:08 pm

    and for Pettitte you have Lee.

  133. Perlo July 31st, 2010 at 3:08 pm

    Getting Granderson did make the Yankees slightly younger but it did nothing to make them cheaper. In fact, his escalating salary was the only reason Detroit traded him. The point is, the team does need to flip a few of their everyday positions (ie–high earning positions) from within in order to remain cost-effective. It looks as though they have some possible candidates, but that can change quickly if they dump them for expensive veterans.

  134. pat July 31st, 2010 at 3:08 pm

    “Get him some Yankees Adidas sponsored gear!”

    Yankee Nike sponsored gear

  135. Bret The Hitman July 31st, 2010 at 3:09 pm

    New post.

  136. Rich in NJ July 31st, 2010 at 3:09 pm

    “We need a replacement at DH?”

    Two points:

    1) They need bats that project to put a .950 or better OPS no matter where they play. See how many DHs you can find that will do that for 15 years. Anyway, I still think he can catch 50 games a year, and failing that, he will be 27 when Teix’s contract expires.

    2) Reread what I typed. I suggested that another reason that need to keep an asset like Montero is to trade him to replace the holes that could develop at SS/3B.

  137. Rich in NJ July 31st, 2010 at 3:10 pm

    Bret

    We got Soria?

    Laird and Nunez have a lot to prove to be at that level.

  138. Perlo July 31st, 2010 at 3:10 pm

    It’s true that their financial resources made it possible for them to keep them together. But it’s extraordinarily rare to have assembled that much talent together internally. It just doesn’t happen.
    ————————————–
    CB,
    Generally true but I can’t think of anybody who outproduced the Braves and even the Expos of the 1990′s.

  139. trisha - true pinstriped blue July 31st, 2010 at 3:10 pm

    “You actually believe the MLBN?

    Ha!!!!!!!!!!”

    Hello voice of reason! Hope things are going well for you. I’d love to see a picture of Wills and his sister. I’m sure she’s gorgeous. My email address changed but when I emailed you I got a bounceback, so so has yours since we last emailed. If you’re still on Yuku, post some there! If not and you don’t mind doing it, email Chad and ask him to pass on my email address to you. I no longer post it anywhere. If you don’t know the reason I’ll explain it when I hear from you.

    :)

    XOX

    In the meantime, keep the troops calm regarding where Berkman will bat in the lineup. As for me, I have some shopping to do.

  140. SJ44 July 31st, 2010 at 3:13 pm

    Its not absurd at all.

    Have you looked at how this team has changed in the last four years?

    They have three OF’s now all under 30 years old and all are making less than what the
    Red Sox are paying Cameron and JD Drew this year.

    They have a 24 year old kid in their rotation they are developing to be a top end starting pitcher. He made the AS team in his first full year as a starter. They have to be doing something right.

    Tex, Cano, and CC are cornerstone guys for the next five years. Name me another team that has three guys of that pedigree and talent locked up for the next 4-5 years.

    We aren’t even talking about Arod and Jeter and neither one of those guys are done.

    You seem fixated by the belief the only way the Yankees can stay competitive is to develop a homegrown core.

    I’m saying the way they stay competitive is balance. Use free agency intelligently. Accumulate enough minor league assets to trade AND bring to NY, achieves that balance.

    The last thing they should do is try and become the Rays. That’s a foolish allocation of resources because the fail rate with young players is much, much larger than the fail rate with free agents (especially if you sign the right one’s) and trading for younger talent.

  141. mick July 31st, 2010 at 3:15 pm

    NEW POST=========>>>>

  142. DaSaint007 July 31st, 2010 at 3:15 pm

    Yankees have done a fine job with their young talent. Better than in the past. Some folks here always seem to see the sky falling. Either today or in 2-4 years. I guess we need a replacement for Cano in 8 years too. Better start looking. And oh yeah, A-Rod is having an off year – only 85+ RBIs thus far. Big dropoff. Please.

    Anyway, infield and bullpen haven’t been addressed yet, if they in fact are going to be. Sad to see Melancon go, but that’s life. Can’t hold on to everyone, and you have to give to get.

  143. CB July 31st, 2010 at 3:16 pm

    It’s often argued that what made the “core 4 + Bernie” special wasn’t that they yankees developed those players but that they could keep them together. The implication being that other teams like the Indians, Padres, etc. haven’t had a “core” like that due to financial limitations. That’s a very commonly made argument. That’s may not be what’s being argued in this thread. But that’s frequently said.

    That’s a specious argument because teams it’s not true that keeping the core together was the big trick. Developing the core in the first place was the hardest part. Since the rule 4 draft was started teams rarely if ever have 5 hall of fame caliber players developed internally. It doesn’t happen so the issue of money keeping them together is secondary. That was the only point I was trying to make there. That may not have been the argument in this thread, however.

    Conversely, if it is so historically uncommon to have a core of internally developed players of that caliber, it argues that trying to repeat that pathway actually isn’t a good strategy because you are trying to recreate a black swan of sorts. It’s turning a historical aberration into a model but it’s not a model that is necessarily reproducible.

    Pragmatically blending internally developed talent with outside talent is likely the best pathway forward and I think that’s the one they are taking. The key part of this strategy is of course talent evaluation as knowing which young players to keep and which to get trade is fundamental to success.

  144. MystiqueAura July 31st, 2010 at 3:17 pm

    Dustin Richardson is also on the way up to Boston, in addition to Ryan Kalish, trade coming, or Cameron to DL?

  145. Mike353511 July 31st, 2010 at 3:38 pm

    I don’t think Melancon was given a fair shot. When we called him up we didn’t use him for like a week and then when we did use him, he was rusty.

  146. Mike353511 July 31st, 2010 at 3:43 pm

    Melancon wasn’t given a fair shot, the way we used him was pretty bad.

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