Swept away in Texas
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Sep 12, 2010 
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Swept in a three-game series for the first time this season, the Yankees lost 4-1 to the Rangers this afternoon, keeping their division lead at just a half game heading into tomorrow’s showdown with second-place Tampa Bay. Derek Jeter, the Yankees embattled shortstop, drove in their only run as Cliff Lee was once again dominant. Yankees starter Dustin Moseley allowed one run through six innings, but he and Jonathan Albaladejo combined for a three-run seventh that made the difference. The blame rested on the offense which was without Alex Rodriguez, Nick Swisher and Brett Gardner and managed just two hits, both in the sixth inning.
Associated Press photo of Derek Jeter and Vladimir Guerrero
Pathetic…..
Joe is running an extended spring training….
Chad,
You will never become the bestest beat writer if you keep pressing “Submit” the second they lose.
It’s really going to be tough warming up to Lee next season. He’s so arrogant.
At least TB lost.
Isn’t it funny how Terry Francona gets lauded every year for conceding the WC in order to rest his guys down the stretch, while Girardi gets killed.
When Francona does it, it is “foresight” and “smart” not to go pedal to the medal when the WC team doesn’t have a big disadvantage anyway and it is a good idea to rest his aging players and keep everyone fresh.
When Girardi does the same thing, he gets killed for “giving up” and “forfeiting” and “choking down the stretch” and “managing scared”.
People kill the media for genuflecting about the Sox and not giving the Yankees the benefit of the doubt, yet people in here are doing the exact same thing. Sox play for the WC? Smart. Yankees play for the WC? Fire the manager.
What if the Yankees lose CC’s first game at home? Then they have to go on the road to try and win games…
anyone can think of doomsday scenarios. If the yankees can win their 3 out of 5 in the ALDS( which as the best home team and 2nd best road team they should be able to accomplish with their 3 best pitchers pitching 100% of the games), then oh man they only need to split on the road to take a decided advantage.
Because even if they have HFA in the ALCS you’re expecting them to lose all 3 road games right? So they go into Game 6 and 7 HAVING to win to stay alive??
Or is it better to lose on the road, sweep at home, and go into Game 6 and 7 with 2 chances to go to the WS???
Good lord, the home field advantage!!
How about this??
The Yankee offense is apparently so bad on the road according to many on here that the having their 2 best pitchers go on the road actually gives them the best chance to win the series!!
With Burnett pitching on the road and this offense the Yankees almost have no chance
Rationalizing blows, no two ways about it, this is not good.
anybody want to join me on the edge of the cliff?
I like Joe Girardi. But right now he’s managing like a blindfolded giraffe.
Pathetic is right. Today’s game just sucked on all levels. Two hits. Why would you have Granderson in there, mr. “I-can’t-hit-lefties”, versus Nick Swisher or Brett Gardner?! Why would you pinch hit for one of your hottest hitters, Marcus Thames, in the top of the 9th, for the unreliable Lance Berkman?!
It’s not that he’s trying to conserve and keep players rested. Its that he makes dumb decisions every single game. I’m getting tired of it.
And after our tailspin, we still head the division by .5 a game.
We will have the opportunity to get the division by beating Tampa head-to-head. Would have been nice to have a lead, but they still control their own destiny.
Want the division? Win the games head-to-head. That is the beauty of playing them 7 of the final 19 games.
If we don’t, not a big deal. People are agitating too much about a team going to the playoffs.
The Rangers aren’t a good team. If they were in a real division they wouldn’t be coming in as a WC, let alone a division winner. To be swept by them is a disgrace.
Last year the Yankees played 3 home games and 3 road games in the WS.
The Phillies “stole” home field advantage and somehow still lost the WS.
CC Sabathia is not pitching again until a Game 5 at home in an ALCS if he starts Game 1 this year with the way the schedule works out.
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Not true.
This is what the Rangers sat out Cliffie for.
To go for a complete game against us
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Who cares what the one year wonder Rangers do. The better he pitches against the Yanks the worse it is for them this off season. Everyone knows they can’t afford him and whatever the Rangers offer him the Yanks will offer him more. I hope the Rangers enjoy him this year because they will be back to being a 3rd place team with no pitching next year.
“managed just two hits, both in the sixth inning.”
++++++++++++++++
nuff said, disgusting
Nick was scratched and Gardner needs an MRI. Pick something else to rant about.
Tank no one is talking about Terry Francona – your premise is without merit and has nothing to do with the Brooklyn Bridge. Girardi is a very average manager, and, if he is “conceding anything” as you say he should be fired.
If we’re on the road, I’d prefer Hughes in game 2. Target Field is a spacious ballpark, so thats good for him.
Sets up Andy in Game 3 at home against their lefties.
“# raymagnetic September 12th, 2010 at 5:57 pm
Last year the Yankees played 3 home games and 3 road games in the WS.
The Phillies “stole” home field advantage and somehow still lost the WS.”
+++++++++++++++
What about the series before that, you jumped right to the World Series, but ignored that they played 2 series to get to the World Series
Better to do that with Home Field than without it, once you get to the World Series its game on
Its not impossible they could win without Home Field, but watching this team I would rather they have it than not based on their performance level this season on offense at home vs the road
If we’re on the road, I’d prefer Hughes in game 2. Target Field is a spacious ballpark, so thats good for him.
Sets up Andy in Game 3 at home against their lefties.
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That sets Hughes up for a potential game 5.
this team is not fun to watch…..can’t wait for the playoffs..
Jeter’s at bats were pretty damn good today. Tampa Bay lost. Cliff Lee will be in pinstripes by Christmas. Yankees leave Texas in first place. Get all of the angst out of your system and be prepared for an exciting series.
So, Swisher was scratched and Joe decided, after his moronic decision not to start Alex, to put him in the lineup. Brilliant Joe. The lineup he put out today was awful.
Albaledejo is still the same mediocre pitcher he’s always been, but no way I’m getting on Moseley’s case.
All that said, the hyperbole associated with our recent play is ridiculous. Now the team is doomed for the future unless we sign Lee? We’ll never win another division title again?
The Rays have been playing pretty mediocre ball as well, so I don’t want to hear how awful we are or how we should give up o the division or how that the WC is inevitable. Tomorrow is a new game – too bad we’ll have the same manager.
I would like HFA, but this team can win on the road – just look at the road record. Ok, so we’re better at home – most teams are. I want to win the division because it’s an honor to win; being 2nd best is like kissing your sister. Joe has no business ever scolding his team for complacency when he’s treating these games like ST
In the space of a week, this team has gone from the unbeatables to the unbearables. Of course there is time to turn things around. After all, we still have seven games to come against the Rays. But just as a winning streak accentuates the strength of a team, a losing streak exposes the weaknesses: namely the Yanks’ inability to score with RISP and the fallibility of their starting pitchers.
Very concerned about this team. Yankees are playing so poorly right now. 3 runs on walks and bunts, seriously!!.. Sick to my stomach seeing how bad this team is right now. From the players right up to the manager. They are not a WS team right now and if you say “a new season starts in Oct.”.. you should seriously know that momentum is everything and losing the HF advantage would put a serious dent cause the Yanks tank games on the road.
Tank no one is talking about Terry Francona – your premise is without merit and has nothing to do with the Brooklyn Bridge. Girardi is a very average manager, and, if he is “conceding anything” as you say he should be fired.
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Actually, the premise is exactly the same if Girardi gets criticized for not going all out to win, while other managers get praised for the same thing.
People are way overstating HFA and thats evident by the fact that NO manager goes all out to get it and never has. Girardi resting A-Rod means nothing in the grand scope of things. These games are meaningless aside from potential HFA.
What are you talking about? Yankees get swept on the road? Where in the world did I say that?
The advantage of HFA is the fact that the Yankees are a WAY better team at home than on the road. They are better than last year’s team offensively at home and their ace has an ERA and WHIP that are way lower at home than on the road.
Jumping out to a 2-0 series lead puts a ton of pressure on a team. It didn’t matter how well the Twins played at home because they were down 2-0 before they even came back to the Metrodome. They were do or die before they even had one game at home.
Look at 2007 for example. The Yankees gave away a close game on the road and came back home immediately down 2-0. Even though they made a bit of a charge at home it was too late to salvage the series.
The Angels took 2/3 from the Yankees at home last postseason but because the Yankees immediately jumped out to a 2-0 lead, they were going back to NY down 3-2 with them having 2 chances at home to finish them off.
HFA doesn’t always matter, but when you have a team that is as good as the Yankees are at home, it definitely can allow you to jump out and take control of a series from the start. CC and the offense are both much more dominant at home, and you could end up with a big lead immediately and make it very tough on the other team.
Who is the last manager to go all out to win his division when he was guaranteed a playoff birth?
they got schooled this weekend. zero clutch hitting. they had the lead in all 3 games and maybe held the lead for a short while in total.
mosely stinks, miracle he only gave up 4 runs.
to bad gaudan was not available today girardi’s favorite.
series means almost nothing……..wow wee have a parade jeter got a hit with a RISP. throw him a parade. Maybe his obp will pass cervelli’s soon…………..
major league umpiring is horrific….
Put a APB out for the robot tex at first. he is missing in action……..guy has not gotten a rbi with a hit in about 10 days…………………..
Resting Alex was an asinine decision. No one is asking Joe to drive his players into the ground, but he’s healthy – and if he’s not, he shouldn’t be playing at all. Forget HFA – the idea is still to win the division, not to accept finishing in 2nd place. If I were Alex, I’d be furious with Joe……
I really don’t see how Cash and Hal can look at Joe and be happy with how he’s treating these games
HFA is nice but it’s not like they’ve won every series that they’ve had it in. If they play like this they’re not winning anything regardless of where they play.
If they pitch and defend well and hit like the back of their baseball cards they should win.
Gotta win a game at the the Trop.
There have been many, many Yankee fans worried about this team all year. Pick your poison, Winn, Vasquez, Burnett, an aging Jeter and Posada, Teixeira’s lousy start, Granderson, Joba, and Girardi’s absurd penchant for resting pro-athletes and giving games away by doing so.
The Yankee offense this season gets on base at relatively high rates and hits for good (thought not great) power.
But one of the major differences between this season and last is that the offense generates base hits a a significantly lower rate than the did last season.
That may very well put them at risk when they are facing pitchers with plus control, like Lee. In context, they aren’t going to be able to generate as many base runners by walks. And if they don’t get mistakes to hit for power they can struggle because they are less likely to be able to string together multiple hits compared to what they could do last season.
abeledajo may be avg but gaudin is way below avg. and is a mop up man at best…………………..
this offense stinks on the road….BA with RISP is pathetic bordering on criminal……
Times HFA advantage did not matter: 96, 98, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, etc.
Nothing but AL East teams for the rest of the schedule. Baltimore, Boston, and Toronto will do their best to play spoiler knowing they’re going home after the last pitch of October 3rd. No secret what the Rays wish to do.
The Yankees get to find out what they’re made of for the next 19 games. The wakeup call has been delivered.
Yesterday was a terrible, terrible loss but today was expected. Moseley against Lee and Girardi sits his best player. Tex and Cano have been lost for the last week. Lee pitches better against the Yanks than he does against any other team. The offense is absolutely dreadful. They better wake up for Price and Garza otherwise they will get swept by Tampa also.
“The Rangers aren’t a good team. If they were in a real division they wouldn’t be coming in as a WC, let alone a division winner. To be swept by them is a disgrace.”
We were swept by the Nationals last year. At the Stadium. They were in last place when it happened.
To me the only disgrace is that there is a lack of understanding about just how many problems this team has had this year with a struggling/injured rotation and a whole host of player and relief pitcher injuries. When your rotation struggles guess who takes the hits trying to pick up the slack? You got it. Your offense and your relief pitching. And guess when it start to show up? You got it again! At the end of the season.
Look for the good in this game. Moseley was terrific. Jeter finally got a hit.
And again, the Yankees could have had two of the games. It isn’t like the Rangers annihilated the Yankees. The Yankees basically annihilated themselves.
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ONWARD AND UPWARD!
The playoffs are going to be a struggle this year, but then I guess they’re going to be for most teams. The problem is that for all the runs they’ve scored, this team is lousy at fundamentals. Therefore, they are ill-equipped to play low-scoring, close games -unlike, say, the Twins.
Moseley did a fine job- better than any of our other starters have done recently.
# Betsy September 12th, 2010 at 6:06 pm
Resting Alex was an asinine decision. No one is asking Joe to drive his players into the ground, but he’s healthy – and if he’s not, he shouldn’t be playing at all. Forget HFA – the idea is still to win the division, not to accept finishing in 2nd place. If I were Alex, I’d be furious with Joe……
I really don’t see how Cash and Hal can look at Joe and be happy with how he’s treating these games
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I would disagree. The lineup still had more than enough pop to deliver today, but they didn’t do it. There are 2 off days left to the season. Get A-Rod a day game off into tomorrow’s night game (and it’s a travel day). I’d rather have Alex in the lineup for 3 against the divison rival.
As for Cash and Hal, I don’t imagine they’re too unhappy considering the team won the WS in Girardi’s second year. It’s on Girardi to determine if he’s coming back, which I expect him to do.
What?
1996- How many teams go down 2-0 and win 3 straight on the road? Not many.
1998- Once in a generation, and the Yankees went up 2-0 in the world series and had SD on the defensive before even a single home game
2000- Yankees went up 2-0 at home in the world series and had the Mets on the defensive before even a single home game
2001- No team won a single road game in the series
2002- Yankees faced an Angels team that won the World Series, and HFA saved them because they won both of the last 2 games at home to do it.
2003- HFA mattered a lot when the Yankees had a game 7 at home that they came back and won, no?
2004- Were up 2-0 on Boston immediately and 3-0 as well. HFA would have allowed the Yankees to pretty much lock up that series right away if not for the total collapse.
So in pretty much every year you mentioned, HFA made a difference in a series, and when it didn’t, it was a fluky thing that you can’t bank on happening. If this Yankees team fell behind 2-0 at home do you think they win 3 straight on the road to salvage the series?
Wow people really do need to chill. It is NOT idiotic to rest Alex. People complaining about Swish and Gardner not playing need to actually pay attention to the team. Have you not been watching any recent games Swisher can barely WALK to first place forget about actually running anywhere. Gardner was PULLED from last night’s game with a WRIST issue.
This team has basically a 8 game blanket to make the playoffs. This was not a MUST WIN or you go home game. We are going onto 3 games against Tampa on the turf which traditionally has not been kind to Alex or some of the other layers with issues.
A little perspective really does go a long way.
Therefore, they are ill-equipped to play low-scoring, close games -unlike, say, the Twins.
–
Whats more likely to happen in a close, low scoring game? A confluence of 10 different events required to manufacture a run? Or a HR?
I seem to recall the Yankees defeating the Twins and Angels last year with timely power.
The difference between the Twins fundamentals and the Yankees fundamentals are less than 2 plays per 100.
“The Yankees get to find out what they’re made of for the next 19 games. The wakeup call has been delivered.”
The tale of the tape will unfold in the next three weeks.
I love Moseley’s attitude. I’m wondering what role he and Nova will have in the postseason.
“Wow people really do need to chill. It is NOT idiotic to rest Alex. ”
THANK YOU! The lack of perspective here is staggering. And contagious.
Well the Yankees this year don’t have as much power as last year’s team, so they’re going to have to find other ways to score runs, which for much of this season they haven’t been able to do.
Last year’s team had a slugging percentage that was nearly 60 points higher than what this year’s has hit on the road, and 20 points higher than what this team has put up at home. If you can’t hit sac flies, you aren’t going to get as many home runs to make up for it and you may lose some close games.
Offensively it reminds you a lot of the 2008 club in approach even if not in numbers. That team could not score without the home run and because of injuries, did not have as much power up and down the lineup that could allow them to do it. The result was a lack of base hits and a lack of clutch hitting. This year’s team has been much of the same. When they don’t hit HR, they often have trouble scoring consistently.
I can’t remember the last time I heard a Yankee team described as fundamentally sound.
Every year though the Twins and Angels are.
Yet, last year those 2 teams were the ones dropping pop outs, getting thrown out on the bases, and playing sloppy baseball in the playoffs.
“I really don’t see how Cash and Hal can look at Joe and be happy with how he’s treating these games”
Because he doesn’t look at series like emotional fans and feel they have to win every game. They are in the playoffs again and that is where the team will be judged. They have nothing left to prove in the regular season. They obviously are more confident in the team on the road than most fans are.
With 3 days on turf coming up, he wanted to give him a day-off on a hot day. What is wrong in looking out for his aging players in, essentially, meaningless games? (Unless you feel HFA is important and think these games mean something, but again, that is opinion)
I doubt Cashman minds how Joe manages a weekend set against the Rangers. He is judged by the bottom line, not individual series. In the playoffs, he isin’t going to be resting A-Rod, using Joba/Gaudin with 1-run leads, etc. He is merely taking advantage of his place in the standings.
Terrible series. This has probably been the worst stretch of baseball the team has played this season.
Positives:
The Yankees are still in first place somehow and still control their own fates. Down the stretch.
Mosely pitched very well through 6 innings. 2 lead off walks cost him and he was tiring in the 7th but the pen was shot and Girardi stuck with him a little too long. He pitched well though.
Jeter had the best collective AB’s over a full game he’s had in weeks. Stayed back much better today and let the ball travel deeper. Hopefully he’s starting to find something…
Nobody else got hurt….
That’s about it….have to forget about it now. Big series starts tomorrow.
“Isn’t it funny how Terry Francona gets lauded every year for conceding the WC in order to rest his guys down the stretch, while Girardi gets killed”
Don’t know whether Girardi is conceding anything. I do know Francona never resigned himself to a Wild Card fate while ahead in the standings.
Home field would be a significant advantage, but it’s not a requirement for this team to win in the AL pennant.
And it’s impossible for them to have home field advantage in the Series and the goal of this team isn’t to win the AL pennant – it’s to win the series. So if they are that subject to having home field they aren’t particularly likely to win the world series as is.
The Yankees chances to win in the playoffs are going to be much more dependent on how Andy bounces back from his injury and time off, which AJ Burnett shows up to pitch and whether or not Mark Teixeira happens to be on a hot streak when the playoffs commence.
Those are three major variables that are very difficult to pin down before hand. We’re only going to know how those go when the post season roles around. There’s too a great deal of uncertainty around them (especially AJ) to prognosticate how this yankee team will perform in the post season.
I will be at the game tomorrow night and hopefully see CC’s 20th win…should be a great matchup. I’m beginning to think the Yanks would rather play the Twins in the 1st round then the Rangers. Having to face Cliff Lee twice in a short series is not something I want to see. Yanks own the Twins. I’d rather see the Rays and Rangers kill themselves for 5 games and have a easier time of it with the Twins. Girardi said it on his show on YES a couple weeks ago…that it will be nice if they win the division but they just want to make sure they make the playoffs and have everyone healthy first. The way he’s been managing the last week you can see he is sticking to that plan. Lets face it too the Rangers have a much better offense then the Twins too and a better offense then the Rays. Its just their pitching outside of Lee that is the question…they didn’t face any of the Yanks top starters in this series either and Yanks shoulda won the first two games.
Cashman/Hal don’t judge managers based off one series. They judge them by what they do in October.
CB is correct.
You look at this everyday lineup, even the regulars, and the batting averages are not good.
We don’t have a .300 hitter in the OF.
Our 1b who should be close to a .300 hitter is a .260 hitter.
Our SS who is a perrennial .300 hitter is a .260
Our 3b isn’t hitting anywhere close to .300
Forget about catcher.
Our DH position is not hitting .300
This team can walk and see pitches, but can’t put the ball in play enough to get on base or do positive things with the at bats like sacrifice/move runners, etc.
The only saving grace is the Rays are also scuffling, but you can be sure Maddon will have them amped up to play this week while Girardi will be resting everyone he can because that tough hard turf will hurt their feet.
Cashman and Hal have to be on board with what Girardi is doing since it’s apparent he’s not playing to win, just playing out the string hoping to rest everyone into a productive post season.
Only problem with that is our hitters haven’t hit for high averages all year.
Cano is the only guy on the roster who has hit for a high average.
I don’t know what everyone expects will happen with rest, but I don’t see this group suddenly hitting .290 as a team because Girardi keeps resting guys with 3 freaking weeks to go and a division on the line.
This team should be better than this. There’s no question in my mind they should be better.
Something is wrong with them and it’s been wrong most of the season.
That said, they’ve held onto 1st by a hair so we should all take our happy pills, right?
If TB plays with the energy Texas just did this weekend, we’re going to get run off the field this week.
LGY, that’s true…………but this team is not as good offensively as last year, so they aren’t going to score as much. They need to take advantage of opportunities they get……but they don’t know what a sac fly is. I’m not predicting they are going to go out early, just that it will be a struggle for them.
# Captain Clutch September 12th, 2010 at 6:11 pm
Yesterday was a terrible, terrible loss but today was expected. Moseley against Lee and Girardi sits his best player. Tex and Cano have been lost for the last week. Lee pitches better against the Yanks than he does against any other team. The offense is absolutely dreadful. They better wake up for Price and Garza otherwise they will get swept by Tampa also.
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Moseley did his job for 6 innings and should have been pulled. We’ve seen that Tex can get hot just as he goes cold. I’d like to see Cano get some tweaking from Long. He’s not reacting well this month so far.
Lee has a 5-4 record and a 4.81 ERA v. the Yankees in his career. Not exactly lights out. But he had good stuff today. Pounded the zone, didn’t give hitters a chance to get into deep counts.
Remainder of the schedule will be telling. I look forward to the effort.
1996- How many teams go down 2-0 and win 3 straight on the road? Not many.
1998- Once in a generation, and the Yankees went up 2-0 in the world series and had SD on the defensive before even a single home game
2000- Yankees went up 2-0 at home in the world series and had the Mets on the defensive before even a single home game
2001- No team won a single road game in the series
2002- Yankees faced an Angels team that won the World Series, and HFA saved them because they won both of the last 2 games at home to do it.
2003- HFA mattered a lot when the Yankees had a game 7 at home that they came back and won, no?
2004- Were up 2-0 on Boston immediately and 3-0 as well. HFA would have allowed the Yankees to pretty much lock up that series right away if not for the total collapse.
—
96 – Swept the road IN EVERY SERIES.
98 – Won road games
2000 – Split home and road vs Oakland. Won the 3 and 3 vs Seattle.
2001 – Went down 0-2 at home vs Oakland. Won on the road vs Seattle.
2002 – Lost with HFA
2003 – Lost with HFA in the WS, split at home with the Twins finished on the road. Won an equal amount of road/home games with Boston!
2004 – Split at home , lost with HFA
CB – you are right.
Fans are spending too much time whining about the manager, rather then the real fundamental aspects of our success or failure in the playoffs (offense, Burnett, bullpen, etc.).
Girardi is not resting Alex Rodriguez in a playoff game. This is much ado about nothing.
CB, that’s fair……………I assume you think, like I do, that AJ is getting a start in the post-season. That would mean that Cash’s comments were meant for pitchers other than AJ or they were wasted words.
Tex didn’t do well in the playoffs last year at all except for that huge HR against the Twins, so we’ll see if he’s more like the Angels version or last year’s version.
“Positives:
The Yankees are still in first place somehow and still control their own fates. Down the stretch.”
A huge positive in this series was the way Alex was swinging the bat. He had great at bats and his swing looked very good. Amongst the best it has this season. He was very fast and direct to the ball.
Let’s hope he’s poised to make a run that can carry this team like he did at this time last year.
Well I’m hardly about to say the Yankees are going to get run off the field……………and I thought BA wasn’t everything, so now all of a sudden BA is the be all and end all?
yankees are middle of the pack at scoring a runner from 3rd with less than 2 outs.
How do you know Cashman isin’t on board with Girardi resting his guys?
Like others have said, Cashman and Hal like Girardi because of his overall body of work and how he handles his players/clubhouse, not what he does in mid-September series against the Rangers.
Negative: Joe neglected to take advantage of how hot Alex was.
I agree…and also think the Yanks wouldn’t be too upset if they faced the Twins as the wildcard team either.
Leadoff walks, CF throwing to the wrong base, no hitting, a LF that appears to not be able to see the ball, and a manager that’s doing his best to keep the team from winning.
Other than that, this team is ready for the post season – bring it on!
There are 2 weeks left in the season and we don’t have an 8 game lead. If my GM is happy with the manager resting his players left and right because he doesn’t care that much about winning the division, then I have to question my GM
“I really don’t see how Cash and Hal can look at Joe and be happy with how he’s treating these games”
Because he doesn’t look at series like emotional fans and feel they have to win every game. They are in the playoffs again and that is where the team will be judged. They have nothing left to prove in the regular season. They obviously are more confident in the team on the road than most fans are.
With 3 days on turf coming up, he wanted to give him a day-off on a hot day. What is wrong in looking out for his aging players in, essentially, meaningless games? (Unless you feel HFA is important and think these games mean something, but again, that is opinion)
I doubt Cashman minds how Joe manages a weekend set against the Rangers. He is judged by the bottom line, not individual series. In the playoffs, he isin’t going to be resting A-Rod, using Joba/Gaudin with 1-run leads, etc. He is merely taking advantage of his place in the standings.
Absolutely excellent post and spot on Melk Man. It’s what Gayle was saying about perspective. For those with the ability to look beyond the game being played, it is very easy to understand and support the moves that Girardi makes. The sad thing is that the same people who are screaming for Arod now would forget they had said that and demand Girardi’s head if Girardi overplayed Arod and he was unable to be effective in the postseason because of it.
Something to try to remember. The Yankees WILL be in the postseason. It’s important for Girardi to be thinking about that and getting his players ready, not worrying about the fans’ demands for instant gratification.
CB,
That is one factor that the Yankees have. Alex can almost win games by himself offensively when he’s locked in. I think that may be why Girardi is so insistent on resting him and having him totally healthy come October….it paid off last season and he’s hoping it will again this year.
Yankees offense is dreadful at points.
Once in awhile 1 player will get hot for a week, but never the whole team.
When the team slumps, it’s usually the whole 1-9 that goes into a funk.
It’s contagious and if this continues, they will be looking 2.5 games back by Wed.
What 3-days on turf? Since when does third base have turf surrounding it? Or the batters box? Or the base paths.please.
If my GM doesn’t care how his manager handles pennant drives (no matter who we are playing), then I’d have to question my GM. Most years, you are not going to have an 8 game lead………..most years, it’s going to be fairly close. You have to let these guys play.
Past performance, positive or negative, is not an indicator of future success or failure.
Alex was terrible in the post season until he wasn’t. Mo was unbeatable until he was. No team came back from down 0-3 until a team did.
I’m not resigned to the idea of HFA being that much of a difference or players that didn’t perform last year won’t perform this year.
This team will be in the post-season. All trends and past indicators go out the window.
“Girardi is not resting Alex Rodriguez in a playoff game. This is much ado about nothing.”
Again, yes. Talk about fan myopia, it is rampant here. Mama mia!
Blake, but he did that last year because of the hip. Is Joe going to do that every year? We need Alex now…………
Tex needs to help out here, you know?
“There are 2 weeks left in the season and we don’t have an 8 game lead.”
not in the division, but for a playoff spot they do.
“If my GM doesn’t care how his manager handles pennant drives (no matter who we are playing), then I’d have to question my GM. Most years, you are not going to have an 8 game lead………..most years, it’s going to be fairly close. You have to let these guys play.”
If we were fighting for our playoff lives, you would see much different managing. Shouldn’t Girardi be allowed to take advantage of being 8 games up in a playoff spot?
Is it only a “pennant drive” if you want HFA. We’re in the playoffs.
“Cashman and Hal have to be on board with what Girardi is doing since it’s apparent he’s not playing to win, just playing out the string hoping to rest everyone into a productive post season. ”
I think last season may have had a major impact on Girardi’s thinking and management style.
Last year he gave significant rest to players across the roster, especially the pitchers, down the stretch. For an older team that rest seemed to pay real dividends in the post season.
Now last year they could afford to do that and still win the division comfortably. This season they can’t do that – and that has less to do with this team not being as good as last year’s and much more to do with the Rays this season being far, far better than anyone in the AL East was last season.
Regardless of cause however, Girardi may feel rest now is critical for post-season success. Not sure if that’s the case or how true that proposition may be but that might be the wager Girardi is making (though that makes his use of Mo for two innings the other night even more perplexing).
He very well may feel that rest now increases their probability to win the World Series. If they win the series no one will care they did so as the wild card team.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the Yanks came out and played great in Tampa. One series has nothing to do with the other. Then again, it comes down to pitching. Was last out just an abberration for CC? Phil is coming off long rest — will he fare any differently than his other starts after long rest? Nova against the Rays; what can we expect?
they are really swept.
I am not surprised a bit.
next, lose the TB series.
Prediction: lose in ALDS
“If my GM doesn’t care how his manager handles pennant drives (no matter who we are playing), then I’d have to question my GM. Most years, you are not going to have an 8 game lead………..most years, it’s going to be fairly close. You have to let these guys play.”
Betsy I’m guessing that your GM is much more concerned about how the guaranteed postseason Yankees perform in the postseason than what happens in the last three weeks of the season. So therefore I think your GM is ecstatic that Girardi is being very careful with the health of his top players by not wringing the life out of them in the last three weeks of the season.
JMO
# Betsy September 12th, 2010 at 6:30 pm
Blake, but he did that last year because of the hip. Is Joe going to do that every year? We need Alex now…………
Tex needs to help out here, you know?
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Alex is also one year older than last year.
Tex has capable players around him. They just need to hit. Losing Swish as a late scratch didn’t help, but the team is more than capable of managing 2 hits. Unfortunately, they didn’t do it today.
Blake, I feel that it is important to win the division. Is this what the WC has wrought? So that it’s no longer that important to strive to be the best? I don’t suggest Joe should run the team into the ground, but winning the division is an honor, no matter what happens in the post-season.
Joe shouldn’t have scolded the team in KC if he was planning on playing for 2nd best.
When a team gets on a roll, and firing on al cyclinders, at this time in the season, that’s getting ready for the playoffs.
This team is getting use to losing, and not playing well, that too is contagious.
All of a sudden, this board seems ready to accept the Wild Card. News flash, they keep playing like this, there may not be a post season, or a very brief one.
“We need Alex now…………”
for what? For a chance at homefield?
When you consider the schedule disparity between us and Tampa in the final 10 games, even if we play well, the division is going to come down to the wire and require us to win games in our final week anyway. So if you want Joe to play pedal to the medal for homefield, he will likely need to play hard till the final day of the season. Even then, Tampa still will be favored to win it because of how easy their final 10 games are. We can play hard and still lose to Toronto and Boston.
“Was last out just an abberration for CC”
I’m thinking that CC could have been hit with a little of the same kind of jitters that Clemens had when he was going for 300. CC has never had a 20-win season and he’s going for his 20th win. It might have had some effect in his first outing out to get #20. He adjusted as the game went on. I’m thinking that he’s past it now and what will take over is the desire to beat the Rays and keep the Yanks in first.
“Now last year they could afford to do that and still win the division comfortably. This season they can’t do that – and that has less to do with this team not being as good as last year’s and much more to do with the Rays this season being far, far better than anyone in the AL East was last season.”
Exactly. Girardi didn’t have to make these decisions last season because they had such a big lead. He knows he’ll be facing younger teams in the playoffs…specifically the Rays, and he needs his team’s legs to be fresh for that.
As I said this morning…..I think they are going to try very hard to win the division, just not at the expense of the goal they have placed the highest priority on (having the team rested and healthy as possible for the playoffs).
# Betsy September 12th, 2010 at 6:33 pm
Blake, I feel that it is important to win the division. Is this what the WC has wrought? So that it’s no longer that important to strive to be the best? I don’t suggest Joe should run the team into the ground, but winning the division is an honor, no matter what happens in the post-season.
Joe shouldn’t have scolded the team in KC if he was planning on playing for 2nd best.
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I don’t believe it to be a situation of not trying to win the division. But whether we like the WC or not, the goal is to make the playoffs as healthy as possible. Weather as a division champ or WC is less important. With the large lead in the WC, travel to TB and the importance of the next 3 games, I don’t have an issue with resting Alex with an eye on keeping him just that much fresher for the final 3 weeks.
CB, that’s probably how he’s viewing things, but I think it’s the wrong message to send to your team.
If the Yanks lose early, I truly don’t think it would be because they lacked HFA; I think it would be because they aren’t much, if at all, better than any of the other teams. Frankly, they’re all sort of on the same level; nothing would shock me this post-season. I can see the Yanks losing very early or possibly winning the WS if they get their pitching in order (that includes Robertson).
But this team is above one player – even if A-Rod sits, it doesn’t excuse the other 8 all-stars for not hitting.
Do we concede games when Jorge rests a day game after a night game?
Good teams win, even if a starter takes a day off. It’s not like we had a minor league lineup in there. We had 7 regulars.
Betsy,
The Yankees don’t consider winning the division that much of an honor. Winning the WS is their only goal…..whether its as the division champ or the WC doesn’t matter at the ring ceremony.
CB I agree with all of the points in your last post. The thing about Mo, though, is that Mo has not pitched a lot this season, where the other players have put in a lot of playing time. So it isn’t like Mo has used up a lot of his bullets and Girardi still pressed him.
Phil, not sure what you mean, but Tex needs to pull his weight – he’s the #3 hitter. Alex is an all-timer, but he shouldn’t be expected to do it all himself. I don’t think Tex should be expected to do it by himself, but he needs to come up big.
I’m worried about Swish’s knee……..
# trisha – true pinstriped blue September 12th, 2010 at 6:35 pm
“Was last out just an abberration for CC”
I’m thinking that CC could have been hit with a little of the same kind of jitters that Clemens had when he was going for 300. CC has never had a 20-win season and he’s going for his 20th win. It might have had some effect in his first outing out to get #20. He adjusted as the game went on. I’m thinking that he’s past it now and what will take over is the desire to beat the Rays and keep the Yanks in first.
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I agree. Also, sometimes, pitchers just don’t have their best stuff. It happens. I expect CC to come with his best stuff next start.
Tank, I never said HFA, so tell me where I said that. I don’t like the idea of just thinking it’s ok to get the WC. I already said that I don’t advocate Joe pulling a Torre, but IMO, he has to let these guys play.
“That is one factor that the Yankees have. Alex can almost win games by himself offensively when he’s locked in. ”
It’s interesting, there are very few players who have this quality at any one time in the game. Alex is one of them when healthy.
But a number of the other players of this caliber will be missing the playoffs this season. Tampa Bay doesn’t have an offensive player of that caliber (Longoria is terrific but he’s not at that level unless he’s in one of those super hot streaks). Mauer would be but he’s been so banged up and his power stroke hasn’t been great this season. Texas has Hamilton and he’s been fantastic this season.
It’s just extremely difficult to predict how this yankee team will do in the playoffs. There are a number of factors which have very wide ranges of potential performance associated with them.
It’s very tough to know. They looked awful for that past 6 weeks but could look like a completely different team in the post season and look like the team they were on that 8 game win streak.
I generally support the idea that having this team well rested for October will payoff given the age and injuries the team as suffered.
However 3 points really bother me.
1. There is only so much you can rest Alex until that is actually going to backfire from rust. He has had trouble getting his timing down with his swing and leg kick for most of the season. Now he actually looks locked in and Girardi keeps taking him out of the lineup.
2. Other than Alex, the Yankee postseason rests largely on CC Sabathia. Him being well rested, because of the 3 day starts he could and will make is probably more important than anyone else on the team. Yet, Girardi has not taken the pedal off on CC at all this late in the season.
3. He is resting some of his players at the expense of others, particularly Cano. He has given Alex and Jeter so much time off that it is basically imperative he pencils Cano into the lineup every single day. Cano has been their best offensive player this year and he looks tired right now from playing so often. If you are going to rest your guys, you can’t hurt other key players at the same time.
Blake, maybe so, but there’s no guarantee they are winning the WS as the wild card. I don’t get why it’s wrong to want to win the division……..and yes, I still hate the WC.
This team needs HFA. They r much better at home
LGY, agreed – though Jeter needs the time off.
# Betsy September 12th, 2010 at 6:38 pm
Phil, not sure what you mean, but Tex needs to pull his weight – he’s the #3 hitter. Alex is an all-timer, but he shouldn’t be expected to do it all himself. I don’t think Tex should be expected to do it by himself, but he needs to come up big.
I’m worried about Swish’s knee……..
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You stated that Tex needed help out there. I was contending that he has the help he needs, they just need to pull their weight. Alex can’t do it all, and neither can Tex. Cano needs to hit like Cano of August. Posada needs to get the timely hits he used to. Granderson needs to continue the improvement he made after tweaking the swing.
Unfortunately they didn’t get it done today. Lee had good stuff. Yesterday was an aberration, given the implosion of Mo. I don’t expect that will happen again this year.
On to TB to plant the Yankees flag on the division.
One thing that gives me reason to be optimistic is that this team never has peaked this season. They never have had all or even most of their players playing well at the same time. Either Teixera was struggling, or Jeter was struggling, or Arod was hurt etc etc.
You keep hoping that time is coming and will come in about a month.
“I don’t believe it to be a situation of not trying to win the division. But whether we like the WC or not, the goal is to make the playoffs as healthy as possible.”
Yes and if you don’t mind me yelling to make your point -
JOE GIRARDI KNOWS THAT THE YANKEES STILL LEAD THE DIVISION AND HAVE 7 GAMES LEFT WITH TAMPA BAY, THE LAST 4 AT THE STADIUM. THOSE ARE THE GAMES THAT WILL TELL THE TALE OF THE DIVISION AND HE NEEDS ALEX RODRIGUEZ AS HEALTHY AS HE CAN BE IF THE YANKEES ARE TO WIN THOSE IMPORTANT GAMES. HE IS STILL PLAYING FOR THE DIVISION.
And on the manager’s show Girardi was just asked how badly he wanted home field advantage. His answer: You want it badly but you can’t risk injuring players just to get home field advantage.
Now either you get it or you don’t. Cripes it’s like hitting a mule with a freakin stick!
Phil, no I didn’t; I said Tex needs to help out………he needs to help carry this team.
LGY,
very fair and good points. Its a balancing act and we may not fully know if the right buttons have been pushed until we get to the postseason and find out.
Blake, it seems like ages ago, but this team looked like a super team at the beginning of the season…………..
# Betsy September 12th, 2010 at 6:45 pm
Phil, no I didn’t; I said Tex needs to help out………he needs to help carry this team.
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I stand corrected. I completely misread that.
Disregard please…
trisha -
You get a team ready for the post season by getting on a win streak. Pro players need to keep a routine to stay sharp. A day off once in a while is OK, but, Joe has Alex off Thursday, play Friday and Saturday, and then off again today. That’s too much down time from him to get, and keep sharp. If this team does not learn how to win again, they will be at home watching the WS. Should they lose the division, and exit early in the playoffs, Joe should be let go. Let me say, I’m a big Girardi fan, but, the way he’s mishandled this team since the ASB, I have deep concerns about the direction he’s taking the team.
The 7 games with Tampa Bay are not likely to create any separation between the 2 teams and decide the division.
Because of how talented these 2 clubs are and how well they matchup with each other, it is probably just going to end up with a 4-3 outcome in either direction.
The Rays have the advantage right now because of how much easier their schedule is at the end.
If you want the division that badly, you are going have to play hard the rest of the way. Look at Tampa’s schedule in the final week.
Unless we smoke them head-to-head, we’re not going to have any kind of comfortable lead on them and for us to win it, it will require us playing hard throughout. Even then, it is no guarantee. Toronto/Boston are not just going to roll over for us, whereas Seattle/KC probably will for Tampa.
“Blake, it seems like ages ago, but this team looked like a super team at the beginning of the season……”
that was mainly as a result of how great their starting pitching was early in the season. The offense never has come close to being as good as it could be if several of its players played to their career norms. What I meant was that the Yankees have essentially underachieved this season and still are 1/2 game up for the best record in baseball….
“If you are going to rest your guys, you can’t hurt other key players at the same time.”
I agree that if Girardi is prioritizing rest then he’s not doing it as systematically or in an as organized fashion as he probably should be given the apparent value he’d be placing on rest.
He seems to be prioritizing rest for the older veterans rather than rest for the squad. For most players that’s ok, but if that’s you’re over arching strategy for success in the post season, it’s tough to keep pushing CC hard. And Cano does look like he’s dragging. There’ been a great deal of pressure for him to play and carry the team given the problems Posada, Alex and Jeter and now Swisher have had. But it may be having an impact.
If you believe rest is this critical to post season success then it probably needs to be done in a systematic fashion, accounting for age and injury but not only reduced to those factors.
Right now it seems like they’re trying to play it half way on whether to do everything to win the division or not.
There’s probably no good way to strike that balance but right now it’s not systematic.
“I’m thinking that CC could have been hit with a little of the same kind of jitters that Clemens had when he was going for 300.”
Steroid Clemens probably had a lot of jitters, among other things.
CC does not, thankfully, have jitters going for his 20th. He seems to be very cool, calm and collected.
JMO
Big Al – Texas was just swept by Minny and turned it around and swept the Yanks. Three weeks is plenty of time to get on a roll. Again I harken back to the 2000 season when the Yankees absolutely tanked in the last three weeks and still won the world series.
I believe Girardi knows a lot more about how to deal with the team to get them ready for the postseason than do the screaming malcontents on this forum (not tagging you here) who are indignant no matter what Girardi does if it doesn’t comport with their idea of what should be happening in a game. Absolutely unbelievable.
“CC does not, thankfully, have jitters going for his 20th. He seems to be very cool, calm and collected.”
He appeared to have them at the beginning of his last outing, which was an unusually rocky one for him. He did get it together as the game went on. I think he’s gotten past it though and his next outing out takes on a whole different import. I think he will do well in Tampa.
Blake, when we beat the Sox, Angels and Rangers, I recall the offense being pretty good. However, I agree with your overall point………..though I think expecting things to just change because of the time of year is probably asking too much.
What we really need is much better SP. CC is a stud and I think Andy can be reasonably counted on (if he’s healthy) to pitch well. After that, my expectations for the remaining starters are pretty low.
New Post
CB -
I agree, Cano looks as if he’s just going through the motions, something you see when a player is dog tired.
Swish with the bum knee was playing hard dispite the fact it appeared he should be on the bench.
By all accounts A-Rod is healthy, just had 15 days off, and should not be in need of a rest.
Why have September call-ups, if you’re not going to use them.
Give Cano a couple days off during the O’s series, he needs it.
Again, I love Girardi, but, at times I think he simply over manages, and causes the team to lose.
All these panic stricken posts are a total pain. Yankee fans. Pull the pitcher in the third inning because he gave up a BB, Girardi is a moron eleventeen times. Play everybody every day because the team will self destruct if they come in second, etc etc. Grown men having nervous breakdowns on a blog. Does anyone think that this is way over the top. This is entertainment. These were good tough games. So the Yankees lost, it’s called, chit happens. A bright intelligent man going ballistic with every pitch and trading insults with some HS kid is really not pleasant. What happened to baseball discussions, fun, ribbing the opposition, yelling at the ump? A little rational discourse would be so enjoyable.
For example, I think Girardi is doing a hell of a job. He’s got one starting pitcher and a kid, a overworked BP. Stars getting old on him rapidly, he’s scratching out lineups daily because they’re hurt or slumping. What, you can depend on Teixeira to have a quality at bat three times a game? That with a man in scoring position the hitter will stroke a single? How did Teix do in the seventh? This is your number three hitter, he should at least have a quality at bat. No, let’s yell about how Girardi is a moron. Yappity squawk.
What will make NO SENSE to me is if Girardi plays all the regulars in Tampa on turf, yet needed to rest them on grass this weekend.
He set up a practice this weekend that it’s about resting the regulars and banged up guys and that is more important than an individual win.
What does it say if he plays the starters the next 3 straight?
And the oldest most important player on the team doesn’t benefit from this rest mandate in Mo.
Does any of this make sense to you?
Something is wrong here.
I think Girardi has too many conflicting ideas in his head and his focus is not uniform.
I’ll go back to what I said during pregame.
I believe he is resting Alex in an effort to make Jeter think it’s not just him who needed a break.
I think that because he lumps Jeter and Arod into the alternating days of rest category as if you can rest one but not the other and they are intrinsically tied together when it comes to this issue.
The only reason I see he needed to rest Arod today was because he swore to the press yesterday that Jeter’s day off was planned and not driven by performance and that Alex was next.
Maybe I’m wrong for thinking this, but I can’t shake why Jeter and Arod are tied together with this “rest” issue every time Girardi brings it up publicly.
Actually, I do mind your yelling, trisha, as it’s rude, aggressive, arrogant, unnecessary and hard to read.
“If you want the division that badly, you are going have to play hard the rest of the way. Look at Tampa’s schedule in the final week.”
ZMAN, there’s going to have to be a delicate balance there. It will take the wisdom of Solomon and some balls dropping in for us.
We do have a pretty formidible schedule. I don’t want to throw the baby out with the bath water. What good do we do ourselves if we go full bore to win the division and have a team that is too beat up to rally for the post?
“LGY:
3. He is resting some of his players at the expense of others, particularly Cano. He has given Alex and Jeter so much time off that it is basically imperative he pencils Cano into the lineup every single day. Cano has been their best offensive player this year and he looks tired right now from playing so often. If you are going to rest your guys, you can’t hurt other key players at the same time.”
Girardi has abused Cano whose average has dropped every month I believe!