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Postgame notes: Falling behind and staying behind

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Notes, Podcast on Sep 25, 2010 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Red Sox Yankees Baseball

This afternoon, Jon Lester threw seven shutout innings and got his sixth straight win. Since September 3, the Yankees have had a starting pitcher do that — throw seven innings of any kind and get the win — exactly once. It was CC Sabathia last Saturday.

At some point around the seventh or eighth inning, my friend Marc Carig and I realized we had seen this game before. It was then that Marc pointed out the fact the Yankees have had the lead only once during this four-game losing streak. Sabathia gave up that lead in the sixth inning on Thursday, and the Yankees haven’t been in front since.

“Part of it is we haven’t gotten a whole lot of distance out of our starters,” Joe Girardi said. “One was due to a rain delay and there’s not a whole lot you can do about that. We’ve gotten behind in games, which always changes the complexion of a game.”

As we’ve noted many times, the win statistic isn’t a good way to measure the whole of a pitcher, but the fact the Yankees rotation has won just two games in the past three weeks does begin to tell the story. Tonight, Ivan Nova was no match for Lester. That was the long and short of this one.

“It’s hard to play with an edge when you’re down by five or six runs,” Alex Rodriguez said. “…I think the bottom line is it starts with our starting pitching, and we have to have someone come out and step up and go six or seven innings, and the offense has to do our job.”

Here’s Girardi’s postgame.

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Red Sox Yankees Baseball• A fair point from Girardi about the frequency of ups and downs: “You can’t make too much of four games, because you take the previous five games and we were feeling pretty good about ourselves. You go through those ups and downs and you don’t evaluate your club on a short-term period.”

• Rob Thomson on getting Austin Kearns thrown out at home in the sixth: “Sometimes you factor in the fact you’re not scoring a lot of runs or you’re not getting a lot of hits with runners in scoring position, but that wasn’t the case because we scored a bunch last night. I thought he was going to score so I sent him. It was a mistake.”

• Nova had kind of a typical start. He was very good when he was good, but when things started to fall apart, he unraveled. “He nipped Kalish, just nipped his jersey, and then he lost the strike zone,” Girardi said. “It was the first time he was in the stretch and he walked the next guy.”

• In that three-run third, Girardi had Dave Robertson getting loose, but a double play seemed to buy Nova some more time. “It looked like he was in trouble and it’s a situation where if I need Robby to close out the inning,” Girardi said. “He gets up and get loose quicker than a lot of the other guys. That’s why I was going to go to him.”

• The weird Joba Chamberlain pickoff throw: Home plate umpire Chris Guccione called for time, and it caught Chamberlain off guard. Obviously not thinking about the fact the runner was at second, Chamberlain turned to throw to first and sent the ball into the ground when he saw no one there. “I just kind of panicked, I guess,” he said.

Red Sox Yankees Baseball• Speaking of balls in the dirt: Andrew Brackman was up and throwing in the bullpen in the ninth but didn’t actually get in the game. “My first pitch was 40 feet into the ground,” he said. “After that, everything was perfect.”

• Brackman said if people were shouting at him, he couldn’t hear them.

• Jonathan Albaladejo and Romulo Sanchez combined for 1.2 scoreless innings. Every other Yankees pitcher was, in some way, responsible for a run.

• Derek Jeter extended his season-high hitting streak to 14 games.

• Rodriguez has three home runs in his past five at-bats. He’s hit 48 career homers against Boston, the most among active players.

• Curtis Granderson has nine home runs in his past 22 games, and 13 home runs in his past 40 games. That’s after hitting 10 homers in his first 90 games this season.

• The Yankees have lost the home series against Boston for the third time in the past five years. They are 3-5 against the Red Sox at Yankee Stadium this year.

• Mark Teixeira was not hurt when he came out of the game. Just a double switch that left Lance Berkman in the lineup.

• A minor move that could come into play tomorrow and next weekend: The Red Sox have signed infielder Felix Lopez.

Associated Press photos of Nova, Rodriguez and Francisco Cervelli being helped out of the Red Sox dugout by Victor Martinez.

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94 Responses to “Postgame notes: Falling behind and staying behind”

  1. UnKnown September 25th, 2010 at 9:52 pm

    repost from prior thread:

    Well was losing to one of the best pitchers in the big leagues today something really that awful. Tomorrow as well if Clay goes. That is some dominant pitching. Better than anything Minnesota is going to throw at us.

  2. West Coast Yankee Fan September 25th, 2010 at 9:55 pm

    Yes it was that awful. Giving up 34 runs in 4 games qualifies as awful, as does losing 6 of your last 13 games.

  3. EA September 25th, 2010 at 9:59 pm

    “as does losing 6 of your last 13 games.”

    Actually, it’s worse – they are 6-13 in their last 19.

  4. Red Lobster September 25th, 2010 at 10:01 pm

    They have lost 13 of 19, not 6 of 13.

    I wish it was only 6 of 13, that would be 6-7 rather than our current 6-13

  5. West Coast Yankee Fan September 25th, 2010 at 10:04 pm

    Thanks for the correction – sorry, typo on my part

  6. Purenyyankee September 25th, 2010 at 10:05 pm

    There is absolutely NO focus on this team. What is that idiot Rob Thompson doing sending Kearns DOWN 4-0? What is Fatso Chamberlain doing throwing to 1st base after giving up two doubles? Here’s Stump’s quote: “You can’t make too much of four games, because you take the previous five games and we were feeling pretty good about ourselves.” Does he have any idea that they are 6-13 in the past 19 games? He then said “He likes the position they are in.” Really??

  7. UnKnown September 25th, 2010 at 10:05 pm

    Cool Yankees suck. Season’s over. Can’t wait till the Winter Meetings…..

    Anyways. Really liked that last question to Girardi from the link of the post game interview above. Girardi is such a liar, saying that he hasn’t been managing the last few weeks different from the course of the rest of the year. I think it was the RealKevin in a post on a couple threads ago saying how he can’t believe Girardi can keep telling these bold face lies. Got him in trouble 2 years ago with the media and now that he is on his way out doesn’t much matter I guess. Girardi let up on the gas way too soon this season. Now he and the Yankees are paying for it every which way. Once again with Gaudin today. UNBELIVABLE!

  8. West Coast Yankee Fan September 25th, 2010 at 10:06 pm

    I guess one could be stoic and chalk it up to inflation. $210 million dollars just doesn’t buy what it used to.

  9. West Coast Yankee Fan September 25th, 2010 at 10:07 pm

    Ever notice that Chad Gaudin has a rubber arm?

  10. Barry September 25th, 2010 at 10:10 pm

    I could not disagree more with your comment relative to the win statistic. Winning is the only element that matters. 300 wins. 20 wins. In some cases, you can modify the evaluation of a great pitcher performing on a mediocre team. But guys who win consistently, are the guys you want on your team.

    Barry

  11. Bill D September 25th, 2010 at 10:10 pm

    “He then said “He likes the position they are in.” Really??”

    Everything is relative. I know for sure of 22 organizations who’d like to be in the position the Yankees are in.

  12. UnKnown September 25th, 2010 at 10:11 pm

    I guess my point on the previous thread was I don’t think its thinking too far out of the box to say that the Yankees lost today because Lester is a really good pitcher and good pitching shuts down good hitting. Now that doesn’t excuse the other losses the past few weeks and all those numbers that were thrown out. But for today I think Lester shut us down and however the timing of the game is horrible. Thats what happened.

  13. Purenyyankee September 25th, 2010 at 10:12 pm

    Does Chad Gaudin have pictures of Stump & Cashman? Why is this guy on this team?

  14. Yanks78 September 25th, 2010 at 10:13 pm

    What do you want Girardi to say?

    I’ll never understand why people put so much stock in postgame quotes… it’s like people want to see Girardi panic or rip his team,

    The team is in freefall mode… everybody on the team knows it. Talking about it outwardly won’t make them play better, especially when they are starting Mosely tomorrow.

  15. Purenyyankee September 25th, 2010 at 10:13 pm

    Bill D:
    22 other organizations are not the defending World Champions. 22 other organizations don’t have a $200M+ payroll. 22 other organizations are not expected to win. This is NOT the 2000 Yankees. They cannot just flip the switch.

  16. UnKnown September 25th, 2010 at 10:14 pm

    I want Girardi do manage differently. Then maybe he wouldn’t have to say idiotic things in the post game presser.

  17. Bill D September 25th, 2010 at 10:20 pm

    Pure:

    Only way to secure an opportunity to win is to get into the playoffs. The Yankees will do that. What happens from there is anyone’s guess. All they can do for now is secure the opportunity. They’ll do that.

  18. Carl September 25th, 2010 at 10:31 pm

    Why don’t the writers ask, why do you keep going to Gaudin?

    That is the only question that needs to be asked.

  19. tyanksfan36 September 25th, 2010 at 10:47 pm

    I don’t see why Girardi keeps saying he likes where they are and they’ve been playing good baseball etc. Tell the truth and say that they’ve been sucking from starting pitching to offense. Its not like we haven’t seen how bad they’ve been.

  20. West Coast Yankee Fan September 25th, 2010 at 10:51 pm

    Cut To Interior Yankees Clubhouse After Loss:

    Girardi: (Theatrically unscrewing top of water bottle) Marky?

    Mark Feinsand: (meekly) Well, um, uh, what did you think of Nova’s performance?

    Girardi: I liked Novey’s effort. You don’t understand how hard it is to pitch from the stretch. Ever try it? Try tweeting from the stretch. Kim?

    Kim Jones: (stuttering) Joe. Some are sa-sa-sa-saying you are using Gaudin too-too-too much. Not me-me-me of course, you know, Pete Abraham probably.

    Girardi: (Theatrically unscrewing top of water bottle) Get her the hell outa’ here!

    Ben Shpigel: (whispering nervously) Joe you lose weight? You look good. Uh, I’m not suggesting it was uh a mistake, but, what about Thompson sending Kearns.

    Girardi: I liked the play, Kearnsey tried his best. It was a hell-of-a throw. Ever try to throw a ball to home plate from the outfield? Carig?

    Mark Carig: (hiding behind Jason Zillo) Uh, Joe, Sweeny Murti asked me to ask this, sorry. It’s not me asking. I think it’s a dumb question. Are you concerned with this loss? And losing 13 of 19?

    Girardi: (Theatrically unscrewing top of water bottle) Are you kidding? I like how this team is playing, we’re all giving our best effort, we feel good about ourselves, it’s a long season, I believe in these guys, we could very easily have won, sometimes you get the big hit and sometimes you don’t, I thought we played fairly well. Pete?

    Pete Caldera: (voice quivering) Joe, have you given any thought to your rotation for the playoffs?

    Girardi: (snapping) Why, what’s it to you? Yes I am starting to. I’m a bit concerned about all the innings Sabbathia has pitched this year so I’m thinking about skipping his first start against Minnesota. I have to think long term. I need him to be ready for the Mariners next April.

    (Applause and in unison) “Thanks Joe”!

    (Cut to WB Mason commercial)

  21. UnKnown September 25th, 2010 at 11:01 pm

    West Coast, well done. Applauso. Great Post. Haha

  22. Sigmund September 25th, 2010 at 11:09 pm

    Hilarious post, West Coast.

    Lame couple of weeks, unquestionably.

    However, these are the FACTS:

    1) The Yankees will very, very likely make the playoffs. (Greater than 99% chance, according to ESPN.)

    2) Once there, not a single person on Planet Earth knows how well or how poorly the team will do.

  23. JobaTipsHisCap September 25th, 2010 at 11:10 pm

    They will make playoff.
    but if somehow they miss, I think it should be worse than 78 Sux.

  24. JobaTipsHisCap September 25th, 2010 at 11:11 pm

    Yankee manager: “We are in good spot!”

  25. JobaTipsHisCap September 25th, 2010 at 11:11 pm

    LOL, west coast, good one!

  26. West Coast Yankee Fan September 25th, 2010 at 11:13 pm

    Thanks guys. Blatantly pandering to our host by excluding him, I’m sure he was putting fresh batteries in the tape recorder.

  27. Bill D September 25th, 2010 at 11:17 pm

    “but if somehow they miss, I think it should be worse than 78 Sux.”

    Way worse. ’78 Sox aren’t even the best example of blowing leads anymore. This would be worse than the Mets team that lost a 7 game lead in 17 games and the Phillies team that lost a six game lead in 12 games.

    Fortunately, it’s not going to happen.

  28. joeman September 26th, 2010 at 12:05 am

    right now this team is lucky they are running out of games…10 more games this team wouldn’t make the playoffs

  29. BIG AL September 26th, 2010 at 12:13 am

    The real losers are the “Fans” on this blog.

    Every other team in MLB is better than the Yankees, go pick one of them to root for.

    You are just a bunch of fair weather fans, can’t back the team when they lose, or are having a very bad stretch.

    I’ll bet you one thing, if they win #28, you’ll be back here saying you knew they could do it.

    Good night “Fans”.

  30. joeman September 26th, 2010 at 12:18 am

    # BIG AL September 26th, 2010 at 12:13 am

    The real losers are the “Fans” on this blog.

    Every other team in MLB is better than the Yankees, go pick one of them to root for.

    You are just a bunch of fair weather fans, can’t back the team when they lose, or are having a very bad stretch.

    I’ll bet you one thing, if they win #28, you’ll be back here saying you knew they could do it.

    Good night “Fans”.
    —————————————————————————————–
    you have to admit this team is falling apart…

  31. CR9 September 26th, 2010 at 12:34 am

    joeman – The team may be appearing to fall apart, but that doesn’t make it the case.

    So they are struggling. Best they struggle now than in the postseason. This team will pick itself back up, achieve what it is capable of achieving, and will be 28 time World Champions by the end of October.

  32. CR9 September 26th, 2010 at 12:38 am

    Rise, Fall Down, RISE AGAIN

    What dont kill ya, make ya stronger

    2010 World Series Champion New York Yankees

  33. Red Lobster September 26th, 2010 at 12:41 am

    Ozzie Guillen is one of the few managers who has integrity against the Sox, as evident by sweeping them in the 2005 ALDS

    He will have his team ready to play and they will take a couple from the Chi Sox and we’ll win at least one from Tor and be WC champs before we go to Fenway

  34. Red Lobster September 26th, 2010 at 12:45 am

    Though it would be nice to celebrate on Fenway Field :lol:

  35. Wang IS Taiwan September 26th, 2010 at 1:33 am

    He likes the position they’re in? Is he freakin’ nuts? OK, granted, you don’t need to sound desperate to the media/public, but come on — who is he talking to? Does he think we’re all imbeciles? That particular statement did NOT have to be uttered.

    And Chad, he does not, in fact, “make a fair point” at all. Girardi was in a position to help his team win several times in the past several weeks when they actually had a chance (Lester isa tough one to crack, I’ll admit that), and yet he put in garbage to pitch (e.g., Gaudin, Albie) again and again, running up the opponents’ scores and making it nigh impossible to mount a comeback. He kept saying he was resting his players, that they had plenty of time…

    Now the pressure is mounting just for them to take the WC. That’s asisine management at its finest.

    Girardi should have won the winnable ones, clinched long ago and then rested his players.

    This “tomorrow is another day” is so old on this board. Tomorrow is already in the rear view mirror.

  36. Jerkface September 26th, 2010 at 2:18 am

    The Phillies, without Short Rest, will be able to pitch their first 3 pitchers 17 out of 19 times in the playoffs.

    Where is Mike Scoscia to complain about this injustice?

  37. Vineyard Yankee September 26th, 2010 at 2:49 am

    Who is this West Coast Yankee Fan ? Some type of screen writer or Ghost impersonater ? Sign him up to start doing the between inning funnies on the YES Broadcasts.

  38. igotid88 September 26th, 2010 at 2:54 am

    really wish Hughes was pitching today. We basically only have 3 good chances of winning a game this week. Which is enough to get in.

  39. Betsy September 26th, 2010 at 3:09 am

    Blake, you and I are on the same page and I said that about Phil before the first game. He didn’t need to be skipped, they should have taken care of his skipping weeks ago and no – having his last start be against a team that has killed him is not smart. I know what Cashman said, but the fact is, this team is in a drive to make the playoffs and they do need a 24 year old to help them out.

  40. Betsy September 26th, 2010 at 3:26 am

    http://sports.espn.go.com/new-.....id=5615863

    “It’s hard to play with an edge when you are down five or six runs,” said Rodriguez, refreshingly honest, if impolitic.

    *********

    Alex shouldn’t have said anything; the offense had better look in the mirror as well.

  41. Wang IS Taiwan September 26th, 2010 at 4:07 am

    “It’s hard to play with an edge when you are down five or six runs,” said Rodriguez, refreshingly honest, if impolitic.

    *********

    Alex shouldn’t have said anything; the offense had better look in the mirror as well.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    I agree, Betsy, but it could have also been a dig at Girardi for his pitching choices in tight games that have blown up.

  42. PacoDooley September 26th, 2010 at 4:26 am

    Granderson’s current homerun pace equates to a full season of 52 – not that he would ever stay this hot for an entire season, but it is possible that he could match my original projection for this season of 40 homers next year. That would be amazing – but he has to stay consistent. That would make everyone feel better about losing Austin Jackson, especially when his batting average drops next year and he only hits a handful of homers.

  43. West Coast Yankee Fan September 26th, 2010 at 4:45 am

    The offense? We have scored 53 runs in the last 10 games while our pitching staff has allowed 57 runs. We hit 6 home runs in just one game; yesterday.

    You want to know what the problem is? Here is the problem.

    Chad Gaudin – 5.68 ERA
    Javy Vazquez – 5.07 ERA
    A.J. Burnet – 5.05 ERA
    Dustin Moseley – 4.94 ERA
    Ivan Nova – 4.54 ERA
    Joba Chamberlain – 4.50 ERA

  44. West Coast Yankee Fan September 26th, 2010 at 4:53 am

    Maybe this will illustrate just how poor the Yankees pitching has been comparatively:

    Last Four Games:

    Yankees – 34 runs allowed

    Tampa – 9 runs allowed

  45. Wang IS Taiwan September 26th, 2010 at 7:12 am

    I thought Sherman’s analysis of just a few of Girardi’s recent decisions perfectly summed up what many of us on this site have seen the last couple of weeks: “a schizophrenic managing style” where he is unable to decide which road to travel: 1) win now and clinch early or 2) rest the team and hopefully back into a spot fully ready for the playoffs.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Girardi can’t manage to send right message
    By JOEL SHERMAN

    Joe Girardi must make a decision — and we are not talking Cubs vs. Yankees.

    Girardi must decide to go all-out to win games until a playoff spot is secured. Because the hybrid he is deploying between saying the games matter — but often not managing that way — has left his team confused. Actually that decision might have been made for Girardi now since the Red Sox, with a 7-3 triumph yesterday, closed within five games in the loss column for the wild card.

    That should be huge with eight games to play. But this weekend has the feel of a reverse Boston Massacre, or as if the ghosts of the 2004 ALCS Yankee choke job are being revived. That four games remain between the teams means the Red Sox have re-opened a door that seemed closed.

    And Girardi’s schizophrenic managing style has helped open that door. He has alternately pushed hard and pulled back so often over the last few weeks that his team has been left as tight as its high-strung skipper.

    Girardi said he is managing the same now as always. But that is just disingenuous. He has been more cautious with injured guys, older guys and tired guys than ever, acting as if his team has a playoff spot locked up, but no real fervor for the AL East title or the best record in the league. Yet by prioritizing that caution, Girardi has shut off his team’s switch. The Yanks currently feel like an NBA team that pulled its starters up 23 in the third quarter, and now can’t get going again with the lead down to seven in the fourth.

    Girardi says the bad look of late reflects poor starting pitching. Yet at a moment when the Yanks want to douse the idea of a Red Sox miracle, they will start Dustin Moseley tonight for just the second time in 27 days because of the organizational mandate to restrain Phil Hughes’ innings.

    And even before a pitch was delivered yesterday, Girardi had allowed the wrong message to be delivered to his clubhouse. Tony Dungy was brought in as a motivational speaker. Yes, he is a Super Bowl winner. He also is infamous for shutting down his teams late in seasons. But at least those Colts knew they were in the playoffs.

    Girardi’s 2010 version is not yet assured of that, but are more confused about their style of play.

    With the bases loaded, none out and Boston ahead 1-0 in the third against Ivan Nova, Girardi warmed David Robertson. He might as well have yelled “PANIC.” Girardi said he picked Robertson because the righty can warm quickly and provide length. Robertson has had those traits all year, yet the only time he was used before the fifth inning was July 18 — in relief of the injured Andy Pettitte. That was in the rubber game against the Rays, when what was at stake was whether the Yanks would be three games up in the AL East or one.

    Yet on Wednesday night, with a chance to win a third straight against Tampa and go 31?2 games up, Girardi summoned not one of his best relievers, but Chad Gaudin to open the seventh after the Yanks closed to 3-2 in the sixth. Gaudin promptly pitched the Yanks out of the game and they have not won since.

    Girardi never brought in Robertson yesterday. But his bizarre decision-making persisted. In the fifth, with the Yanks trailing 3-0 and two on and two out, Girardi lifted Nova for a lefty to face David Ortiz. But not his best lefty, Boone Logan. Why warm Robertson in the third at bases loaded, down 1-0 to try to keep the game close, but go to your second-best lefty in the fifth for the same job description?

    Girardi said he didn’t want to burn Logan in a one-batter spot. But if he felt the game were important enough to have Robertson up in the third, shouldn’t it have been important enough to shut Boston down there, especially with Jon Lester dealing?

    Also, the righty warming next to Logan was not Robertson, but Gaudin. Again, why? Was this important or not?

    It was more mixed messages on another day late this season when the Yanks played tight and without an edge. Girardi needs to change that message. Fast.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Harper’s column also worth a read.

    http://www.nydailynews.com/spo....._fall.html

    BTW, I’m giving Francona manager of the year award. He’s someone who actually knows how to motivate and encourage his players toward success.

    For those on this site who hate all analysis except their own expert take, please just jump on past and post your own thoughts.

  46. sunny615 September 26th, 2010 at 7:18 am

    Yankees are a pitiful wildcard team now.

  47. sunny615 September 26th, 2010 at 7:19 am

    They’re sucktastic.

  48. Wang IS Taiwan September 26th, 2010 at 7:21 am

    Sunny,

    Are you on the East Coast?

  49. Doreen September 26th, 2010 at 7:24 am

    Betsy -

    Alex did also say that the offense had to do it’s job too. If I recall correctly he mentioned not getting important hits. He did say it’s hard when you start off down by 5, 10 (!) runs, but he did include the offense in the equation.

    The quotes in the papers are clipped – and always it seems precisely at the point where they know it will open the doors to controversy. Not everyone watches/listens to the post-games; not everyone chooses to access blogs like this where the interviews are included (and even when they do, not everyone opts to click on the link and listen). Most people get that kind of information from the newspapers or whatever sound byte is included in sports wrap-up programs. They really are able to mold opinion in that way.

    Alex was refreshingly direct in his post-game. I rarely put much stock in the post-game stuff, because most of the time it’s predictable and boilerplate. But you notice when someone goes “off-script,” and Alex did last night. Based on what he said and how he said it, I believe there have been clubhouse discussions, contrary to what many here believe. But, as I chastised people for talking about what they have no idea about clubhouse-wise, I’ll admit I have no idea if they did or did not.

    Go Dustin Moseley! Go Yankees!

  50. Doreen September 26th, 2010 at 7:45 am

    Wang IS Taiwan -

    It’s very difficult to argue with Sherman’s post. Especially the last few nights.

    But when this spiral downward began on that road trip, the Yankees had opportunities to win several of those one-run games. They came up short with the bases load what seemed to be a zillion times. Mariano Rivera, of all people, blew TWO saves. That’s two “sure wins” right there. Bringing in Gaudin in close games is most assuredly questionable; but this is a veteran team and no managerial move excuses not being able to move a runner over, hit a sac fly or get a lousy little single with the bases loaded and 0 or 1 outs.

    They may or may not be playing “tight” now, but I don’t think they were at the beginning of this mess. At the beginning of the mess, they just weren’t hitting.

    And I don’t put much stock into the “motivational speaker” angle. Chad wrote here, I believe, that Dungy was supposed to be a spring training speaker but this was the first time their schedules meshed. They should have probably just skipped it. At any rate Dungy said he spoke for just a couple of minutes. I don’t think he had any impact at all on this team.

    I think Girardi says he isn’t managing differently because he has always rested guys, even going back to last season. And so in that regard, he is the same. I suppose the difference could be seen in his choices of who to bring into games in relief and when. Prior to September, the bullpen was lights out and it seemed Girardi was pushing all the right buttons. Hard to know what went wrong – the button pushing, or did the pen just get overused because AJ, Javy, starter #5 and even Phil Hughes could not get past the 5th inning much of the time. Hard to stay strong when you’re taxed 4 nights out of 5.

    I think it’s fair to question some of Girardi’s decisions, but I will continue to point to “bases loaded, no one out, and not even a sac fly” to at least 3 or 4 games on that road trip that could have/should have been won. (They were getting men on base just fine – even with non-regular lineups.)

    I would also point to games during the course of the season where this team could not hit pitchers they hadn’t seen before who threw absolute junk. It’s easy to look at the last 2 weeks and say it’s Girardi’s fault. But there were team failures throughout the season that led up to this point.

    BUT even with that, the team managed or was managed to remain atop the AL East with the best record through to this past week. And you can’t ignore the injuries that had to be worked around and the fact that Jeter and Tex were not hitting well at all for much of the last stretch (at least Jeter’s picked it up lately).

    I am just as unhappy as any Yankee fan that this is all going on, and that they haven’t yet clinched a spot. And I’ll be more than disappointed if they don’t. But there are no guarantees in baseball. And I do believe that they can win three games this week. I believe the Red Sox can lose 1 or 2.

    I do think what this shows is you can’t make the season do what you want it to do. I think perhaps a mistake that was made was looking at the schedule, seeing who was pitching and figuring out which games would be in the win column (all of CC’s starts, Pettitte’s second start, etc.). I think the Yankees were shocked they lost CCs start and were definitely counting on Pettitte to be better in his Friday night start. They were counting on Nova for 5 good innings yesterday. What can you do?

  51. CR9 September 26th, 2010 at 7:50 am

    “The Phillies, without Short Rest, will be able to pitch their first 3 pitchers 17 out of 19 times in the playoffs.

    Where is Mike Scoscia to complain about this injustice?”

    Scioscia dont care about any other team/organization receiving an advantage aside from the Yankees.

    I thought that would be quite obvious by now. Im not even sure that Scioscia knows the names of the other 27 teams in baseball – sans Angels, Yankees, Red Sox.

    Of course, he only knows the Red Sox from his timeless desire to lose to them.

  52. pat September 26th, 2010 at 7:57 am

    The Daily News printed Alex’s whole quote and he didn’t single out pitching.

    “Starting pitching sets the tone for us, always has,” added Alex Rodriguez, who homered leading off the ninth to cut into Boston’s lead. “We play good defense and then we grind out some at-bats and get some timely hitting.

    “We haven’t done any of them.”

    Rodriguez said he didn’t sense any tension among his teammates, but he noted, “It’s hard to play with an edge when you’re down five or six runs. We need to get a lead early and defend that lead and go from there.

    “There’s nothing profound you’re going to hear today,” he added. “The bottom line is, we have to have somebody come out and shut the door and that means six or seven innings and giving our offense a chance and the offense has to do its job.”

  53. Doreen September 26th, 2010 at 8:02 am

    West Coast Yankee Fan -

    Those numbers are not pretty. And for AJ and Javy particularly, not expected.

  54. Doreen September 26th, 2010 at 8:04 am

    pat -

    Thanks. I know Alex put it very well after yesterday’s game.

  55. Rich in NJ September 26th, 2010 at 8:08 am

    Girardi has been a trainwreck with his mixed managerial messages in September, but baseball managers don’t have much impact on wins and losses (which is why it’s stupid to overpay them), so the players are primarily responsible for the quasi-collapse.

    Nonetheless, you can’t say that tonight is an important game and start Moseley. He could pitch well, but that would be an accident.

    I still think the Yankees will win the WS. They need to forget who is managing the team and step the hell up.

  56. Doreen September 26th, 2010 at 8:11 am

    Rich in NJ -

    They are hell-bent on resting Hughes here. So, who is an option besides Moseley? Not saying I agree or disagree with resting Hughes in this situation. But once they made that decision, Hughes can’t start. And if they had one even one of the last 2 or 3 games, it would be a moot point.

    The guys on the field have to do their jobs, that’s the bottom line, so I agree with you there.

  57. Rich in NJ September 26th, 2010 at 8:12 am

    Uh oh, I just read the Sherman column and he used the same phrase I did…

  58. Rich in NJ September 26th, 2010 at 8:13 am

    Doreen

    Why is it that the innings cap is inoperable in the playoffs but not the week before?

  59. pat September 26th, 2010 at 8:14 am

    Doreen

    Sad that the media uses sound bites and clipped quotes to promote agendas rather than just reporting facts.

    One of the best things Pete did here was posting the audio clips so you could hear what was said rather than how it was interpretted.

  60. Rich in NJ September 26th, 2010 at 8:18 am

    I think they do it as much for commercial reasons as it is to promote agendas.

  61. Rich in NJ September 26th, 2010 at 8:25 am

    Also, as I said, I think Mitre is better than Moseley or the pathetic Gaudin, but Girardi has buried him so he’s not stretched out enough to start.

  62. Ken Phelps September 26th, 2010 at 8:30 am

    Rich in NJ September 26th, 2010 at 8:13 am
    Doreen

    Why is it that the innings cap is inoperable in the playoffs but not the week before?
    ——-

    It is silly just plain silly…and can there be any innings limit on Chad gaudin?

  63. MTU September 26th, 2010 at 8:30 am

    Good Morning.

    I’m not into all the Psychoanalysis of the team, or all the finger-pointing. If that’s your bag knock yourself out.

    All they have to do is win a couple of games, and then start to play better in the playoffs.

    I’ve got my ‘clinch’ tribute ready and waiting and I hope I get to use it soon.;)

    I’m going out hiking again today to get ready for Hughes # 18.

    I hope Moseley puts up a good game and the Yankee bats show up.

    See you all later.

  64. Wang IS Taiwan September 26th, 2010 at 8:34 am

    Doreen,

    Was out walking (it’s night here). I appreciate your analysis. You’re always very thoughtful. I think for me the problem has not been those games Mo didn’t come through (it happens, though it’s always surprising), but the games where Girardi failed to remove someone before the damage became too great to overcome OR he brought in a suspect reliever when there was still a deficit that we could still overcome, but then the lead became too daunting even for our bombers.

    I do think Sherman hit the nail on the head when he said he’s actually managing to rest/win simultaneously within a single game which is confusing to the team in general.

    Hopefully, Matsucky will be having one of his many off days and Dustin is spot on.

    Everyone have a great day posting. It’s hard to be hopeful at this point that we’ll experience last year’s euphoria, but I’m trying…

  65. Rich in NJ September 26th, 2010 at 8:34 am

    “I’m not into all the Psychoanalysis of the team, or all the finger-pointing. If that’s your bag knock yourself out.”

    Pointing that the impact of Girardi’s inconsistent managing is hardly analytical, psycho or otherwise, it’s merely stating the obvious.

  66. Rich in NJ September 26th, 2010 at 8:36 am

    Per Wang IS Taiwan’s Rivera reference, I just noticed that he hasn’t pitched since 9/20. It has gotten to the point where he has to pitch irrespective of the score, assuming he’s healthy.

  67. Ruby Tuesday September 26th, 2010 at 8:42 am

    Another unfortunate sweep.

    But I guess we can’t say it’s a surprise anymore, considering this is the 2010 Yankees after all.

  68. Crawdaddy September 26th, 2010 at 8:43 am

    Looks like Girardi has lost more than the Yankee clubhouse with his little support from the Yankee fanbase. It’s time to get back to Chicago then.

  69. MTU September 26th, 2010 at 8:43 am

    Rich-

    I was not one who was in favor of backing off the throttle prematurely.

    Wanted HFA too.

    Some of the moves are the product of a bi-furcated strategy when the only real strategy IMO should have been to secure a playoff spot ASAP.

    What done is done. Now the object is to do the same as quickly as possible with the max. arsenal.

    I don’t care for the Moseley move but I hope he steps up.

    Once they are in they better up their game.

  70. Nutball Gazette September 26th, 2010 at 8:44 am

    You know what they are saying in other countries about the Yankees

    Greece—????????? ?? 1964 Philidelphia Phillies

    Korea–1964? Philidelphia? Phillies ??????

    France and parts of Canada–Rappelez-vous le Philidelphia 1964 Phillies

  71. trisha - true pinstriped blue September 26th, 2010 at 8:45 am

    Doreen, absolutely EXCELLENT response in your 7:45 a.m. post. Win Mo’s two games, Yankees have one to go. Win just one of those games where the Yankees were unable to bring in runs despite putting inumerable men on base, Yankees have clinched already.

    That’s baseball.

    “Doreen

    Sad that the media uses sound bites and clipped quotes to promote agendas rather than just reporting facts.

    One of the best things Pete did here was posting the audio clips so you could hear what was said rather than how it was interpretted.””

    Absoluely agree. Though at this point Pat I think that those who probably need to medicate anytime they even think of the G word (I’d say Betsy leads the pack at this point, though she certainly has company) probably would hear the entire clip and automatically cut to the soundbytes anyway.

    Alex did a really nice job of succinctly putting the whole thing in perspective.

    If there were two wins people were probably counting on this week they were from CC and Andy. Those were pretty realistic expectations. I don’t fault either for not winning. I just point out that if those games were won, the Yankees would have already clinched.

    That’s baseball. And all you can do is move onward and upward and expect/hope for the best.

  72. Rich in NJ September 26th, 2010 at 8:46 am

    MTU

    Your post is spot on, and any sentient Yankee fan should agree with it, as should the manager.

  73. joeman September 26th, 2010 at 8:46 am

    # CR9 September 26th, 2010 at 12:34 am

    joeman – The team may be appearing to fall apart, but that doesn’t make it the case.

    So they are struggling. Best they struggle now than in the postseason. This team will pick itself back up, achieve what it is capable of achieving, and will be 28 time World Champions by the end of October.
    —————————————————————————————————

    6 & 13 after their 8 game streak in late Aug & early Sept…this isn’t a way to go into the playoffs …..the SP is what it is & in the playoffs thats where games are W & L….

  74. pat September 26th, 2010 at 8:49 am

    “I think they do it as much for commercial reasons as it is to promote agendas.”

    The Daily News put accuracy ahead of commerce? Never let it be said. :wink:

    ****************************************************************

    I’m not so sure innings limit are the sole reason they pushed Hughes back.

    I get the feeling overthinking is involved in that decision more than innings.
    Wanting to pitch him away from Yankee Stadium? Some master plan involving postseason use?

  75. MTU September 26th, 2010 at 8:50 am

    Rich-

    IF they can somehow manage to win today things are gonna look a lot brighter. :)

    I hope Moseley pitches above his pay grade and the offense stakes him to a large early lead, and then keeps pouring it on.

  76. trisha - true pinstriped blue September 26th, 2010 at 8:51 am

    “Looks like Girardi has lost more than the Yankee clubhouse with his little support from the Yankee fanbase. It’s time to get back to Chicago then.”

    I’m wondering if a 2010 World Series win would change any of that. If not, then I’m happy that Girardi has a place to go to if the choice is given to him.

  77. Doreen September 26th, 2010 at 8:56 am

    pat -

    I’d agree with that – setting up a post-season rotation probably had as much to do with the decision has capping the innings – because really, as Rich in NJ pointed out, what is the difference if there is no cap in the post-season as if those innings don’t also register on his arm.

    I would suggest, though, that at all times the Yankees have had this secret number in mind, and it may in fact take into account the post-season innings. So the “real” limit may be much higher than 175.

  78. Crawdaddy September 26th, 2010 at 8:56 am

    Trisha,

    Even it they win the 2010 WS, I don’t think Yankee fans particularly like Girardi. It could be his managing style, but his lack of personality doesn’t help in that regard.

  79. Cashman needs to go September 26th, 2010 at 9:04 am

    West Coast Yankee Fan September 26th, 2010 at 4:45 am
    The offense? We have scored 53 runs in the last 10 games while our pitching staff has allowed 57 runs. We hit 6 home runs in just one game; yesterday.

    You want to know what the problem is? Here is the problem.

    Chad Gaudin ? 5.68 ERA
    Javy Vazquez ? 5.07 ERA
    A.J. Burnet ? 5.05 ERA
    Dustin Moseley ? 4.94 ERA
    Ivan Nova ? 4.54 ERA
    Joba Chamberlain ? 4.50 ERA

    *****************

    Well to be fair then you’ll have to add the great mariano rivera’s 2 blown saves as well..i know he’s 75 years old and needs his rest but if you can’t be relied upon 3 days in a row without pitching like crap then you should be put on that list as well….you can’t “keep giving him a pass” for things he’s done 10 years ago – or even 10 days ago….what happened to play today win today – it doesn’t relate to rivera?

  80. joeman September 26th, 2010 at 9:04 am

    this might be the biggest game of the year for them thus far, I don’t think they want to go into their final 6 with a 4 game lead and those games against TB and Bos on the road

  81. Fran the original September 26th, 2010 at 9:05 am

    I think that right now there is plenty of blame to go around for the Yankees skid. Starting pitching has not been good, inability to hit with RISP, poor relief pitching and some of Girardi’s decisions.

    But if the Yankees win tonight, the magic number is 1 and all is well in the Yankee universe again.

    If the Yankees loose tonight, and with 3 more coming up vs. Boston, I will probably be as tightly wound as Joe is right now.

  82. trisha - true pinstriped blue September 26th, 2010 at 9:05 am

    Craw, what would you think of Bobby Valentine managing the Yankees? You think his day is well in the past?

    Realistically, it would be Girardi’s decision were the Yankees to win the world series because I doubt the organization would show him the door under those circumstances, especially because some of the overall moves that were made certainly were done either with the blessing of the organization or at the behest of the organization. If I were Girardi I would run for the hills, though I would respect him inordinately if he stayed and basically told everyone to kiss his ass. I think he would definitely find more peace going to Chicago. He would be away from the unforgiving New York media, the unforgiving New York fans, and not unimportantly, he would be both home and closer to his dad.

  83. Crawdaddy September 26th, 2010 at 9:06 am

    Bobby Valentine has no chance to be Yankee manager. He’s too much of a loose cannon for Cashman and probably Hal.

  84. joeman September 26th, 2010 at 9:08 am

    just tossing this out there….if JG leaves any chance Lou gets hired

  85. Crawdaddy September 26th, 2010 at 9:11 am

    I don’t think so unless, unfortunately his mother passes.

  86. trisha - true pinstriped blue September 26th, 2010 at 9:14 am

    Lou left the Cubs saying he needed to spend time with his sick mom. Unless his mom passes, certainly nothing I’m hoping for, I don’t think it’s a possibility. Don’t know what his thoughts would be on returning to the game in any event, though for Lou there probably wouldn’t be a sweeter opportunity than to go back to his beloved Yankees.

  87. SJ44 September 26th, 2010 at 9:18 am

    Oh please, ask Lou Piniella about the Chicago media and Cub fans.

    There are no “soft landings” in big markets.

    Even Joe Torre is getting killed in LA and that’s supposed to be a “soft big market”.

    If Joe Girardi can’t take the heat, he’s in the wrong business.

    His moves this month ARE worthy of scrutiny because they do go against what he has done the last two years.

    Only the blind and the hopelessly ignorant see otherwise.

    The fact is, he took his foot off the gas too early and his inconsistent way of resting people have produced the likes of Chad Gaudin, Sergio Mitre, Ivan Nova and Dustin Moseley pitching FAR too many meaningful innings in September.

    Now? As I posted yesterday, all of that is done now.

    It’s now up to the players to find a way to get in the playoffs and take it out of the managers hands.

    If they do that, everybody, Girardi included, starts with a fresh slate for the post-season.

  88. SJ44 September 26th, 2010 at 9:21 am

    Lou is done managing.

    In addition to his mom dying, he has the same problem Torre has……..he can no longer relate to the players and he, like Torre, knows it.

    Lou would love to consult for a front office.

    The day to day grind of managing? I think he’s done with that.

  89. trisha - true pinstriped blue September 26th, 2010 at 9:34 am

    “Only the blind and the hopelessly ignorant see otherwise.”

    It’s a shame you can’t learn to leave lines like that out of your posts. It makes posts that are otherwise so well thought out almost seem juvenile. Please try to cut the nasty boy act in your posts. They truly detract from some very good stuff.

  90. Crawdaddy September 26th, 2010 at 9:37 am

    SJ,

    Like Trisha said, you make some great points, but you need to lighten up with the nasty comments about other posters. It’s really not needed.

  91. SJ44 September 26th, 2010 at 9:42 am

    Trisha,

    And it’s a shame that you still try to tell people how to post here.

    Here’s a tip. I’m not changing how I post here.

    If you don’t like the posts, simply skip over them or ignore them.

  92. trisha - true pinstriped blue September 26th, 2010 at 9:46 am

    Craw thanks.

    Talk to you later.

  93. trisha - true pinstriped blue September 26th, 2010 at 10:09 am

    SJ, by the way, there are some posters here, one in particular, whose opinions are greatly respected and admired, and who don’t necessarily see things entirely the way you do, especially with respect to the last two months. I certainly am not referring to myself. By saying things like people are “blind and hopelessly ignorant” if they don’t see things the way you do, you automaticaly set up a barrier to your arguments.

    Just saying that you have greater readability and credibility if you just put forward ideas and let them sit there than by calling people who disagree “blind and hopelessly ignorant.”

    Not necessary. Not nice.

  94. sandy g September 26th, 2010 at 11:33 am

    the yankees of 2010 do not have 4 reliable starters for the playoffs.i have been a yankee fan for 53 years and have followed baseball very careful and i know what iam talking about when i talk about the yankees. they must contact kansas city and see what it would take to get zack greinke and joakim soria and contact cleveland to get shin-soo choo to play rf. i love nick swisher but he has no arm for rf. an outfield next year of swisher/granderson/choo would be just fine.sign david dejesus to be our 4th outfielder.how about this trade,greinke,soria,aviles for gardner,chamberlain,nunez,nova,murphy,warren.a cleveland trade for shinsoo choo for phil hughes and brandon laird.

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