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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Berkman batting eighth for Boston opener

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Lineup on Oct 01, 2010 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Right now, the consensus seems to be that the rain will hold off enough to play tonight’s game. At least, that’s the chatter around the ballpark. The sky does not look promising and radar doesn’t look great, but it sounds like there’s at least a chance things could work out.

Derek Jeter SS
Curtis Granderson CF
Mark Teixeira 1B
Alex Rodriguez 3B
Robinson Cano 2B
Nick Swisher RF
Jorge Posada C
Lance Berkman DH
Brett Gardner LF

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493 Responses to “Berkman batting eighth for Boston opener”

  1. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 3:50 pm

    Are we actually talking about trading for Braden? if so, why would the A trade him unless you gave them a superior package to Dallas’ true worth.

  2. Erica in NY October 1st, 2010 at 3:50 pm

    Another Girardi line up reshuffle

  3. indy42 October 1st, 2010 at 3:53 pm

    I don’t quite understand this. Girardi rests his guys before they clinch, now that they’ve clinched, they all play? LOLWTF?

  4. Erin October 1st, 2010 at 3:53 pm

    Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 3:50 pm
    Are we actually talking about trading for Braden?

    **************************
    I sincerely hope not. LOL

  5. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 3:53 pm

    A lineup…I just hope no one gets hurt under these yucky conditions, especially a guy like Pettitte.

  6. MG October 1st, 2010 at 3:53 pm

    redfish
    October 1, 2010 2:32 PM
    Fish breaks another story. Minaya and Manuel gone.

    West Coast Yankee Fan October 1st, 2010 at 2:34 pm
    Minaya and Manuel gone.
    —————————————-
    this is the joker who denies he is the same person on the two blogs, give me a break. He’s already ruined the Daily News blog, in time he’ll try to do the same here…

  7. Carl October 1st, 2010 at 3:54 pm

    They all had a day off yesterday.

  8. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 3:55 pm

    :) I taken you don’t like him Erin? :P

  9. MG October 1st, 2010 at 3:55 pm

    I like Grandy in the 2 hole and Swish batting 6th, I hope to see this in the playoffs…

  10. Erin October 1st, 2010 at 3:57 pm

    Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 3:55 pm
    I taken you don?t like him Erin?

    **************************

    You are correct, sir. :)

  11. Bad Scooter October 1st, 2010 at 3:58 pm

    “indy42 October 1st, 2010 at 3:53 pm
    I don’t quite understand this. Girardi rests his guys before they clinch, now that they’ve clinched, they all play? LOLWTF?”

    Are you serious? They’ll have off on Monday and Tuesday before their first game. Is that not enough rest? These guys don’t want to go without playing 3 or 4 days out of 5. Even Jeter himself said the same thing after they clinched. They have to play to stay sharp.

    People just complain for the sack of complaining. Anything to bash Girardi.

  12. CountryClub October 1st, 2010 at 3:58 pm

    They should pitch Andy tomorrow. He needs to get a full game in; plus a dry field wouldn’t hurt. Just move AJ to Sunday and let Nova pitch tonight.

  13. West Coast Yankee Fan October 1st, 2010 at 3:59 pm

    Another inexplicable schizophrenic lineup by Girardi. He is trying to win the division, he’s not trying to win the division, he’s resting players, he’s not resting players.

  14. Bad Scooter October 1st, 2010 at 3:59 pm

    Good point Carl, I forgot about that. So they have 3 built in off days in less than a week. Does that answe your question indy42? LOLWTF?

  15. MG October 1st, 2010 at 3:59 pm

    I’m not making up any trade proposals but if the Yankees were to go after a left handed starter I’d like to see them get Brett Cecil, I’m really impressed with him. I just have no clue what they would have to give up in order to make that kind of trade.

  16. indy42 October 1st, 2010 at 4:00 pm

    “Are you serious? They’ll have off on Monday and Tuesday before their first game. Is that not enough rest? These guys don’t want to go without playing 3 or 4 days out of 5. Even Jeter himself said the same thing after they clinched. They have to play to stay sharp.

    People just complain for the sack of complaining. Anything to bash Girardi.”

    ========

    I just don’t understand why Girardi was so liberal about resting people before and now he seems happily playing everybody.

    I perfectly support his decision to play everybody now. I just don’t understand why he wasn’t doing that before.

  17. Wave Your Hat October 1st, 2010 at 4:01 pm

    I hate to see Swisher in what’s bound to be a wet outfield, his knee is troubling him enough as it is.

  18. Patrick October 1st, 2010 at 4:03 pm

    If the Yankees go after a left handed starter I want them to go after Cliff Lee…

  19. West Coast Yankee Fan October 1st, 2010 at 4:04 pm

    Indy is right on point. For months he rested players during key games with the suggestion that was more important than HFA which he only gave lip service to. It’s also the inconsistency, flip-flopping and air of uncertainty as opposed to a steady guiding hand that is cool in the face of adversity. Like letting Javy stay out there until we were down 7-0.

  20. 4time October 1st, 2010 at 4:06 pm

    If they’re looking for a RH starter this winter, Pavano would be their best option.

    3.83 ERA, 200 innings, 1.19 WHIP, 8 complete games

  21. blake October 1st, 2010 at 4:07 pm

    Looks like they are going with the A lineup tonight.

    MG, agree on Cecil..I like him too.

  22. Patrick October 1st, 2010 at 4:07 pm

    If they’re looking for a RH starter this winter, Pavano would be their best option.

    3.83 ERA, 200 innings, 1.19 WHIP, 8 complete games

    This is one of those times where you have to ignore the stats. Pavano will never be a Yankee again, for obvious reasons.

  23. Giuseppe Franco October 1st, 2010 at 4:09 pm

    Yeah, let’s just keep whining about Girardi. That hasn’t gotten old or anything.

  24. Chambliss October 1st, 2010 at 4:10 pm

    Pavano? No thanks. Been down that road and done that. After stealing $40 million from the Yankees, he can come back if he is willing to work for nothing.

  25. Wave Your Hat October 1st, 2010 at 4:10 pm

    Pavano could be matched up against AJ…

  26. ConcernedCitizen October 1st, 2010 at 4:10 pm

    “If they’re looking for a RH starter this winter, Pavano would be their best option.”

    No one in the New York media would mind if we brought him back on, right? :P

  27. El Duque October 1st, 2010 at 4:10 pm

    I would love this lineup for game one! And please stop talking about pavano! He´s dead!

  28. Cashman needs to go October 1st, 2010 at 4:10 pm

    CR9 –

    what did you think of Jeter tipping his hat to that criminal Cito Gaston, he of the torrid love affair with anything boston and his immense hatred for anything new york yankee related – so much so that he actually threathens his players with suspenion and fines if they play hard against the redsox and reminds them that if they don’t give 250% when playing the yankees he will force them to listen to canadian celine dion for 24 hours straight…

    huh…any opinions? What the heck was jeter thinking?!?!

  29. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 4:11 pm

    What is wrong with this lineup? They had yesterday off. They will have two days off. The players themselves want to play. They have a definite shot at division/HFA. What is the problem?

    For some of you Girardi showing up at the ballpark is a reason to complain.

    He rested people before so he didn’t have to rest them now. He rested people who were HURT. He didn’t rest people who weren’t hurt. His priority was getting everyone as close to full strength as he could so they were not hobbling for the post-season games. He hoped they would win in spite of resting guys – and guess what? But for a couple of blown saves and a couple of missed opportunities with bases loaded and none or one out in a couple of games they just might have.

    But I really feel like this horse has been beaten so far down you can’t even see it anymore!

  30. ac1 October 1st, 2010 at 4:13 pm

    i think now that girardi sees the division as a real option, he is trying to get it.

    that being said, it is pouring here in boston so i feel like pettitte should probably be pitching tomorrow when there isnt a chance of a rain delay.

    Swish: i agree in theory he can get more hurt, but what can you really do? he can get hurt when it isnt raining too.

  31. Erin October 1st, 2010 at 4:13 pm

    Girardi just can’t win it seems. If he had played the kids the response would have been “how are we supposed to win the division with this lineup?”. He goes with the regulars and the response is “these guys shouldn’t be playing with possible bad weather”. It’s almost funny.

  32. upstate kate October 1st, 2010 at 4:13 pm

    the Yankees are still playing for the AL east and HFA…why wouldn’t Girardi put out the A line up?

  33. MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:14 pm

    Doreen, you make valid points but my issues with Girardi are the way he’s handled the pitching staff. As an example, there was no excuse to leave Vazquez in the game past the 2nd inning on Wednesday when he has nothing to get even a little leaguer out and a win could have put the Yankees in the driver’s seat for the division and HFA. I’m all for playing the regulars until they are out of it this weekend, they have 2 days off coming up and were off yesterday.

  34. Wave Your Hat October 1st, 2010 at 4:15 pm

    The Red Sox sure aren’t putting out their “A” lineup. Big win opportunity here.

  35. blake October 1st, 2010 at 4:16 pm

    I like this lineup…they are coming off an off day and also have Monday and Tuesday off as well…that’s sufficient rest in itself. Now of course you be smart with guys but as long as there is still a chance at the division and home field then you push IMO.

  36. West Coast Yankee Fan October 1st, 2010 at 4:16 pm

    I don’t care as much about today’s game as I do the post-season – but hitting Granderson second and Swisher sixth is a huge mistake and I hope Girardi does not do this.

    1. It is accepted baseball strategy, for a reason, that you put your better hitters at the top of the lineup as they get more at bats. Swisher is a better hitter.

    2. It’s important to have the higher OBP guy batting second in this lineup ahead of Tex, A-Rod and Cano, for obvious reasons.

    3. Having a switch hitter batting second is a plus especially later in the game when the bullpen comes into play.

    Swisher – .289 BA – .360 OBP – 88 RBI’s

    Granderson – .249 – .345 OBP – 65 RBI’s

  37. ac1 October 1st, 2010 at 4:17 pm

    MG the problem with javy is where do you go from there/

    gaudin, mitre? i mean no one thinks these are better options and i can see it now, everyone complaining about bringing them in. sometimes, there is just no good answer.

    besides resting the players, he needs to be sure the pen is ready too, especially if burnett is going to get to pitch at some point.

  38. m October 1st, 2010 at 4:19 pm

    Doreen,

    Nice post.

    lol @ the redfish reference. Thats’s the only poster I remember from reading the comments section. Quite a colorful poster, lots of conflict.

  39. Wave Your Hat October 1st, 2010 at 4:19 pm

    WCYF-

    Season numbers, sure. But lately Granderson has been the better hitter. I can’t see the issue here.

  40. MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:20 pm

    ac1, you don’t leave a pitcher on the mound who is defenseless-the Yankees pen only gave up one run the rest of the game and they mostly had a day off on Tuesday and another day off yesterday.

  41. Cashman needs to go October 1st, 2010 at 4:20 pm

    stars falling into place maybe???…
    ***************************
    Beltre leaves team to join his wife
    Permalink|Comments (0) Posted by Peter Abraham, Globe Staff October 1, 2010 04:16 PM
    Has Boston seen the last of Adrian Beltre in a Red Sox uniform?

    The third baseman, with the blessing of the Red Sox, left the team today to join his wife in California for the impending birth of their third child.

    Beltre will not be back for any of the games this weekend.

  42. m October 1st, 2010 at 4:22 pm

    That’s great news.

    I thought Beltre would be unable to father children. And he won’t hurt the Yankees this weekend. Win/win!

  43. Joe from Long Island October 1st, 2010 at 4:22 pm

    MG – Hi. I don’t know what the reason was for leaving Vaz out there to get clobbered; by his own admission, he had nothing. I just hope Girardi found out what he needed/demonstrated what he needed to in order to leave Vaz off the post season roster. I’m no pitching coach, not be a long shot, but Vaz looks washed up.

  44. Cashman needs to go October 1st, 2010 at 4:22 pm

    boston lineup…

    RED SOX (87-72)
    McDonald CF
    Drew RF
    Ortiz DH
    Lowell 1B
    Lowrie SS
    Varitek C
    Hall LF
    Lopez 2B
    Navarro 3B

  45. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 4:23 pm

    I thought Beltre would be unable to father children.

    literally?

  46. MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:23 pm

    Grandy has 96 ABs this year in the 2 hole and is batting .295 with 6 HRs and 16 RBIs and has scored 20 runs, that’s exceptional production in my view. For the sabremetricians out there, his OPS is 1.056 as well.

    I like him there because of the combination of speed and power, I had to look at the stats to realize he’s been very good in that spot.

  47. GreenBeret7 October 1st, 2010 at 4:24 pm

    The lineup today is pretty much Girardi’s typical lineup against right handers, except for Berkman hitting lower. Granderson is the hotter hitter between him and Swisher, which could turn into early and instant runs….speed in front of Teixeira, Rodriguez and Cano. He’s also walking more than Swisher lately.

    Other than that, continue whining and pissing your pants over nothing.

  48. I Like Inge October 1st, 2010 at 4:24 pm

    MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:23 pm
    Grandy has 96 ABs this year in the 2 hole and is batting .295 with 6 HRs and 16 RBIs and has scored 20 runs, that’s exceptional production in my view. For the sabremetricians out there, his OPS is 1.056 as well.

    I like him there because of the combination of speed and power, I had to look at the stats to realize he’s been very good in that spot.
    __________________________________

    Good stats. That’s what happens when you hit in front of Big Tex. Fastballs all day.

  49. MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:25 pm

    Joe from Long Island October 1st, 2010 at 4:22 pm
    MG – Hi. I don’t know what the reason was for leaving Vaz out there to get clobbered; by his own admission, he had nothing. I just hope Girardi found out what he needed/demonstrated what he needed to in order to leave Vaz off the post season roster. I’m no pitching coach, not be a long shot, but Vaz looks washed up.
    ————————-
    Joe, I agree and have no clue why is was so obvious to casual fans and not to a guy who caught in the bigs for 15 years. He gave away the chance to win a big game and didn’t need any reason to leave Vazquez off the post season roster.

  50. Joe from Long Island October 1st, 2010 at 4:25 pm

    I think someone is making a subtle reference to Beltre’s remarkable numbers in his walk years, and the possibility of certain PEDs being used. Or, maybe I’m just too cynical….

  51. Cashman needs to go October 1st, 2010 at 4:26 pm

    more words of wisdom from our favorite chubbsy wubbsy up north..

    Here’s another weird one. Marco Scutaro has a .721 OPS and will have to fight off Jed Lowrie in spring training. Derek Jeter has a .707 OPS and he’ll probably get a $60 million contract or whatever.

  52. West Coast Yankee Fan October 1st, 2010 at 4:26 pm

    Wave Your Hat
    October 1st, 2010 at 4:19 pm

    WCYF-Season numbers, sure. But lately Granderson has been the better hitter. I can’t see the issue here.

    *******

    You are absolutely right Wave Swisher had a less than stellar September, I think due to being banged up. Reportedly he is better now after the cortisone shot. I just think that a .240 hitter which Granderson has been all year with a low OBP is not an optimum number two hitter in this lineup. Just an opinion, based on my observations of both players all year as well as statistics.

  53. Giuseppe Franco October 1st, 2010 at 4:26 pm

    Swisher – .289 BA – .360 OBP – 88 RBI’s

    Granderson – .249 – .345 OBP – 65 RBI’s

    ———–

    Too bad you’re leaving out extremely relevant information such as Granderson being a different hitter the last month and a half and Swisher hasn’t been the same hitter the last month (due to his nagging knee problem and other aches).

    For someone who claims to be a “knowledgeable baseball fan” you aren’t offering any evidence that suggests you have any idea what you’re talking about.

  54. Patrick October 1st, 2010 at 4:27 pm

    I think someone is making a subtle reference to Beltre’s remarkable numbers in his walk years, and the possibility of certain PEDs being used. Or, maybe I’m just too cynical….

    I thought it was a reference to him getting nailed in the junk last season. He literally had a tear in his testicle.

  55. Cashman needs to go October 1st, 2010 at 4:27 pm

    Joe from Long Island October 1st, 2010 at 4:25 pm
    I think someone is making a subtle reference to Beltre’s remarkable numbers in his walk years, and the possibility of certain PEDs being used. Or, maybe I’m just too cynical….

    ***********

    or maybe because he took a groundball to the jewels last year when he wasn’t wearing a cup…

  56. blake October 1st, 2010 at 4:28 pm

    It was a curious move to stick with Javy in that game…we could all see what was coming and that was an important one for the Yanks…

    But still….the outcome is the same as it would have been if both the Yanks and Rays would have won that night….tied with 3 to go.

  57. MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:28 pm

    Giuseppe Franco October 1st, 2010 at 4:26 pm
    Swisher – .289 BA – .360 OBP – 88 RBI’s

    Granderson – .249 – .345 OBP – 65 RBI’s

    ———–

    Too bad you’re leaving out extremely relevant information such as Granderson being a different hitter the last month and a half and Swisher hasn’t been the same hitter the last month (due to his nagging knee problem and other aches).

    For someone who claims to be a “knowledgeable baseball fan” you aren’t offering any evidence that suggests you have any idea what you’re talking about.
    ————————————————-
    GF, that’s a great take on those fishy comments…

  58. upstate kate October 1st, 2010 at 4:28 pm

    hmmm… taking pot shots at Jeter…that is a new low for PA

  59. Giuseppe Franco October 1st, 2010 at 4:29 pm

    # GreenBeret7 October 1st, 2010 at 4:24 pm

    The lineup today is pretty much Girardi’s typical lineup against right handers, except for Berkman hitting lower. Granderson is the hotter hitter between him and Swisher, which could turn into early and instant runs….speed in front of Teixeira, Rodriguez and Cano. He’s also walking more than Swisher lately.

    Other than that, continue whining and pissing your pants over nothing.

    ———-

    Congrats. You made my point better than I did.

  60. Joe from Long Island October 1st, 2010 at 4:29 pm

    Cashman – yeah, that could do it….ouch.

  61. Patrick October 1st, 2010 at 4:29 pm

    I have no problem whatsoever with Granderson hitting 2nd, he’s been great for awhile now.

  62. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 4:30 pm

    or maybe because he took a groundball to the jewels last year when he wasn’t wearing a cup…
    ————————–
    Oh , i forgot about that …. X factor here, he is from D.R. , land of grande cojones, plenty rooms to spare.

  63. Joe from Long Island October 1st, 2010 at 4:30 pm

    Well, leaving the office to head on home. Thank goodness, at least the deluge stopped.

  64. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 4:31 pm

    MG -

    I agree about the pitching staff to a certain degree. Only because I don’t know from night to night who he has available and why or why not. Certainly the other night, I have no idea why Javy had to start the 5th inning, and once he did, why he didn’t come out as soon as someone was on base. He has extra pitchers out there now.

    I don’t understand why Gaudin became a favorite. Gaudin had some good outings, but more often he’s been mediocre at best and certainly not 100% dependable. I don’t understand where Mitre disappeared to for awhile and can only guess at a mystery malady or something.

    But even with all that, even if you go with Girardi being unfathomable in his decisions, they could have won at least 4 games in the last 2 weeks in spite of those decisions.

  65. MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:31 pm

    that’s a pretty impressive combination-a groundball to the jewels towards the end of last season, a new baby due this weekend. Hat’s off to Mr. Beltre, he definitely has cajones lol

  66. pat October 1st, 2010 at 4:31 pm

    “I think someone is making a subtle reference to Beltre?s remarkable numbers in his walk years, and the possibility of certain PEDs being used. Or, maybe I?m just too cynical?.

    I believe the Beltre/children reference is due to his preference to not wear a cup.

  67. ac1 October 1st, 2010 at 4:32 pm

    Swisher – .289 BA – .360 OBP – 88 RBI’s

    Granderson – .249 – .345 OBP – 65 RBI’s

    __

    in defense of this, Granderson has been hitting much better lately.

  68. West Coast Yankee Fan October 1st, 2010 at 4:33 pm

    # I Like Inge October 1st, 2010 at 4:24 pm

    MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:23 pm
    Grandy has 96 ABs this year in the 2 hole and is batting .295 with 6 HRs and 16 RBIs and has scored 20 runs, that’s exceptional production in my view. For the sabremetricians out there, his OPS is 1.056 as well.

    I like him there because of the combination of speed and power, I had to look at the stats to realize he’s been very good in that spot.
    __________________________________

    Good stats. That’s what happens when you hit in front of Big Tex. Fastballs all day.

    ***********************************

    And Swisher was better in the two hole. 17 home runs and 47 RBI’s with 48 runs scored and a larger sample size.

  69. Cashman needs to go October 1st, 2010 at 4:34 pm

    MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:31 pm
    that’s a pretty impressive combination-a groundball to the jewels towards the end of last season, a new baby due this weekend. Hat’s off to Mr. Beltre, he definitely has cajones lol

    *****************

    tahst why God gave us 2 of ‘em…

  70. GreenBeret7 October 1st, 2010 at 4:34 pm

    One other thing that could work well with this line-up is that the 6, 7 and 8 hitters are switch hitters. having Berkman in the #8 spot means a lot less disruption if they decide to put Kearns in as a pinch hitter. All of the spped is together and all of the power is together.

  71. MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:34 pm

    Doreen, you’re right that they could have won 4 games more but, at the same time, some of the moves by Girardi that made no sense might have been another 4 games and a very comfortable lead.

    One thing none of us in mentioning is that the Rays are playing really bad baseball, I wonder if they can get out of the 1st round whether they play the Rangers or the Twinkies. I still think the Yankees, with their ‘A’ lineup and the rotation pitching to expectation, are head and shoulders above everyone else in the AL-the Phillies could be very tough in the WS because it would be CC vs. Doc 3X and you just can’t tell who would win those.

  72. West Coast Yankee Fan October 1st, 2010 at 4:37 pm

    That’s fine – you are entitled to your opinion as I am entitled to mine and Girardi’s is all that matters in the end. I would bat Swisher second, I think he’s a better hitter. If he is injured and the same performance can’t be expected as he produced all year – that’s a different story. Despite Granderson being more productive he is still a .249 hitter with a .345 OBP.

  73. pat October 1st, 2010 at 4:37 pm

    benshpigel

    Scuttlebutt in #yankees clubhouse is that the game’ll start around 830, mas o menos

  74. MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:37 pm

    West Coast Yankee Fan October 1st, 2010 at 4:33 pm
    # I Like Inge October 1st, 2010 at 4:24 pm

    MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:23 pm
    Grandy has 96 ABs this year in the 2 hole and is batting .295 with 6 HRs and 16 RBIs and has scored 20 runs, that’s exceptional production in my view. For the sabremetricians out there, his OPS is 1.056 as well.

    I like him there because of the combination of speed and power, I had to look at the stats to realize he’s been very good in that spot.
    __________________________________

    Good stats. That’s what happens when you hit in front of Big Tex. Fastballs all day.

    ***********************************

    And Swisher was better in the two hole. 17 home runs and 47 RBI’s with 48 runs scored and a larger sample size.
    ——————————-
    Welcome, LoHud, to the WCYF’s fishy use of statistics. I love Swish as a player but he’s been up 377 times in the 2 hole, Grandy has been up 96. Multiply Grandy’s stats by 4 to make them equal and he would have 24 HRs, 64 RBI’s, and 80 runs scored. Swish has only scored 48 times from the 2 hole, that’s because Grandy has far better speed. Swish is perfect hitting behind Arod and Robbie and in front of Jorge, that’s a very, very dangerous lineup to face…

  75. The Phenom October 1st, 2010 at 4:38 pm

    No SJ? No CB? No good.

  76. Cashman needs to go October 1st, 2010 at 4:39 pm

    In a way i kind of feel sorry for petey abe….

    so far today he has posted 7 threads that are chock full of information – total number of comments for all 7 threads = 67….

  77. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 4:41 pm

    Brennan Boesch stats has really fell off the table post all star break, he is posting a triple slash line of 167/244/229 , he has been a worst offensive player than Ramiro Pena!

  78. PacoDooley October 1st, 2010 at 4:41 pm

    lineup doesn’t make any sense to me. If they want to try out some new alignment, try Gardner 1 and maybe Granderson 6th. Obviously Jeter should probably be lower, but he could shoot for second if they don’t have the stomach to drop him lower.

  79. ac1 October 1st, 2010 at 4:43 pm

    new alignment? the only thing really different here is berkman 8th. granderson and swisher have been 2 and 6 often this year.

  80. MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:43 pm

    Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 4:41 pm
    Brennan Boesch stats has really fell off the table post all star break, he is posting a triple slash line of 167/244/229 , he has been a worst offensive player than Ramiro Pena!
    ————————————————-
    the second time through the league can be brutal, can’t it? Reminiscent of Roger Repoz, a Yankee rookie who tore through the league for about a month until they figured out he couldn’t hit a breaking ball with a tennis racket. Kevin Maas lasted slightly longer…

  81. pat October 1st, 2010 at 4:43 pm

    m

    Your Flyin Hawaiian and his wife had a new Cryin Hawaiian.

  82. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 4:43 pm

    MG -

    We could point to a bunch of games, decisions, etc., along the way. It’s senseless because what’s done is done.

    The important thing is that through all that, they are still in first place, still with the best record, (albeit tied) still with a chance for the division/HFA.

    Thing is, I remember way back in April, when the Yankees got off to one of their best starts in years, how incredibly unfortunate it was that the Rays were off to an even better start! Over the last few days, different people have posted the Yankees’ record since this date or that date, to point out how horribly they’ve played since this or that date. Well, the Rays must have played just as poorly or worse, because they started out BETTER and ended up tied with the Yankees. And I remember thinking back then that this year was going to go down to the wire. I hoped it wouldn’t, and when the Yankees finally overtook the Rays, I thought they’d take off. I think if Andy didn’t go down, they might have.

    The Rays’ pitchers were supposed to be unbeatable. The Yankees staff was always said to be good, but with some questions. The Yankees offense was supposed to be unstoppable. Neither team accomplished what people thought they were going to do initially. As different as these two teams are, they are equally matched.

  83. upstate kate October 1st, 2010 at 4:44 pm

    Pat
    very clever

  84. JD October 1st, 2010 at 4:45 pm

    No game no good. I live south of Boston and it is pouring right now.

  85. GreenBeret7 October 1st, 2010 at 4:45 pm

    Next year, I’d like to see Granderson in the #2 hole, providing he can repeat the success of the last 2 months while retaining the new approach. Install Cano in the #3 spot and group his 3 switch hitters together….with Montero/Posada being interchangable out of the #7 spot and Gardner hitting #9.

  86. West Coast Yankee Fan October 1st, 2010 at 4:46 pm

    It’s a shame MG is so consumed with winning that he ignores the salient facts. Such as there being a good reason that Swisher hit second 377 times this year and Granderson 96. He’s a better hitter, with a higher batting average and a higher OBP. Those are much more important criteria for batting second in this lineup than speed. That’s why Nick Johnson was slated to hit second, atrocious speed, a high OBP.

    I Swisher is deemed to be playing hurt. That might be a reasonable reason to switch things up.

  87. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 4:47 pm

    MG, when you look at his minor league stats , you have to acct for some regression back to his norm. But I did not expect that ! That is a precipitous drop ! from a layman’s eyes he had a long but a smooth swing , i did not think he would fare so terribly.

    You right, it’s baseball. In the grueling long haul of 162 , It invariably spitsout the posers from the real Mccoys.

  88. MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:47 pm

    Doreen, as always, you make sensible, excellent points. I never complain about players and managers but Girardi has been so inconsistent the past month it’s just been really strange to watch and try to understand.

  89. RMS October 1st, 2010 at 4:48 pm

    Yankees need solid starting pitching in the playoffs. If they don’t get it, it won’t matter where Grandy and Swisher hit in the line-up.

  90. Wave Your Hat October 1st, 2010 at 4:48 pm

    “providing he can repeat the success of the last 2 months”

    That’s the big question, isn’t it? Lots of players have had a hot 6 weeks.

    “Gardner hitting #9″

    If the Yanks don’t trade him, he has to be moved to the top of the lineup next year.

  91. MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:49 pm

    Cashmoney, Boesch looked like the real deal to me earlier this year, it’s hard to believe how bad he’s been the second half…

  92. m October 1st, 2010 at 4:50 pm

    No, not literally. But there was a big deal made of the possibility at the time.

    pat,

    Ouch!

  93. Giuseppe Franco October 1st, 2010 at 4:51 pm

    Girardi was riding the hot hand between Swisher and Granderson when he kept Swisher in the #2 slot for the majority of the season. Until the last 50 games or so, Swisher was compiling the better numbers between the two.

    Now, it’s Granderson who is the hot hand and Girardi is riding him in the #2 slot at this point (against right-handers, anyway).

    This isn’t brain surgery. It’s obvious what Girardi is doing. Any other manager worth a pile of dirt would be doing the same damn thing.

  94. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 4:51 pm

    Right now at this point in time, Granderson is the better hitter. But Girardi also looks at matchups. And Grandy has had success in the #2, and Swisher has had success down lower in the lineup.

    Talking about Nick Johnson at this point is just – I don’t know – immaterial? The whole reason either Grandy or Swish gets a shot in the #2 spot is because Johnson isn’t around. Hasn’t been around.

    And you really feel a need to complain about something every single day. And yet, here they are, still muddling through the season. Gonna get to play games after the regular season is done. Isn’t that the goal? Get to the post-season and work toward winning the WS?

    GB7 –

    Pat M likes Grandy in the #2 spot as well. It would be nice if they give it a go in spring training and see from there.

  95. YankFanCA October 1st, 2010 at 4:52 pm

    I just hope the field is playable tonight. The last thing they need is a weather-related injury right now.

  96. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 4:54 pm

    GB7 -

    Where will Jeter hit next year???? :lol:

  97. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 4:55 pm

    I am not in boston , so I don’t know the field conditions. But , I have to think to trot Pettitte out under these less than ideal circumstances is a concern.

    If he starts tomorrow, would he be ready to start game 2 in the post season?

  98. CR9 October 1st, 2010 at 4:55 pm

    Cashman – Actually, I was in favor of Jeter and the Yankees showing Cito Gaston respect.

    Why? Because it’s one thing to talk trash about a bunch of dirtpiles anonymously online.

    And it’s another to treat people with disrespect in person. As I often treat dirtpile Bostonians with respect in person.

    Furthermore, IMO, the only way to fight dirtpiles and scummy scummertons is with class. For one day, if you show enough class, maybe you can teach them the right way! The Yankee way!

  99. m October 1st, 2010 at 4:55 pm

    What a great day! Yankees are headed to the post season to defend their championship. What more could you ask for?

  100. Giuseppe Franco October 1st, 2010 at 4:56 pm

    Count me as another one who had hoped all season that Granderson would play well enough to earn the #2 slot in the lineup.

    It took awhile, but he finally got there.

  101. YankeeRay October 1st, 2010 at 4:56 pm

    GreenBeret7 October 1st, 2010 at 4:45 pm
    Next year, I’d like to see Granderson in the #2 hole, providing he can repeat the success of the last 2 months while retaining the new approach. Install Cano in the #3 spot and group his 3 switch hitters together….with Montero/Posada being interchangable out of the #7 spot and Gardner hitting #9.

    ——–

    GB, next year Crawford hits in the 2 hole. Next years line up:

    Jeter SS
    Crawford LF
    Tex 1B
    Arod 3B
    Cano 2B
    Swisher RF
    Montero / Posada C
    Montero / Posada DH
    Granderson CF

  102. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 4:57 pm

    m -

    No rain? :lol:

  103. Wave Your Hat October 1st, 2010 at 4:58 pm

    This year Girardi is welcome to play Granderson where Girardi wants to as far as I’m concerned.

    Long term Granderson is not a #2 hitter. The speed fools you into thinking he is, but he is a classic #5 or #6 hitter.

    His career triple slash line is .269/.341/.482. That’s #5, #6 or #7, not #2.

  104. Giuseppe Franco October 1st, 2010 at 4:59 pm

    GB, next year Crawford hits in the 2 hole.

    ————

    I think you forgot the part about the Yanks not being interested in spending $100M+ on Crawford.

  105. MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:59 pm

    the only reason WCYFF wants Swish in the 2 hole tonight is because Girardi is batting him 6th, it has nothing to do with performance…

  106. m October 1st, 2010 at 4:59 pm

    Nope. But it was chilly this morning. Maybe high 70′s?

  107. upstate kate October 1st, 2010 at 4:59 pm

    M
    a dry field so we don’t have to worry about Andy

  108. West Coast Yankee Fan October 1st, 2010 at 4:59 pm

    Girardi on with Francesa in 3 minutes.

  109. MG October 1st, 2010 at 5:01 pm

    WYH, that’s a good point but Grandy gets lots of fastballs hitting in front of Teix and Arod and that has to help him. Didn’t Arod bat 2nd for most of the 2nd half of 2006 or 2007 when Torre adjusted the batting order to shake things up?

  110. West Coast Yankee Fan October 1st, 2010 at 5:01 pm

    MG October 1st, 2010 at 4:59 pm

    the only reason WCYFF wants Swish in the 2 hole tonight is because Girardi is batting him 6th, it has nothing to do with performance.

    ***************

    It has everything to do with performance as I conclusively proved.

  111. m October 1st, 2010 at 5:02 pm

    I like Swisher in the 2 spot. He’s pretty patient, but has enough pop to clear the table himself. He’s turned out to be a good player for us. Great pickup.

  112. GreenBeret7 October 1st, 2010 at 5:03 pm

    Doreen, unless Jeter goes to Girardi and tells him that it’s better to drop him lower, I can’t see any change next year. I fully expect to see both Jeter and Rodriguez back in the .300 range in average and closer to their career on base %. Gardner is better off in the #9 spot until he fixes his flaws. He has to get better with the bunting and his tendencies to be timid on the bases. That speed doesn’t help in the #1 spot if he doesn’t use it. Batting just infront of Jeter (as the #1 or #9 hitter), he has to run on the first two pitches or you’re wasting him because Jeter, no matter how well he’s hitting, still hits ground balls.

  113. m October 1st, 2010 at 5:04 pm

    Oops Doreen misread that. :)

    I’d take wet weather over wet attitudes any day. :)

  114. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 5:04 pm

    m -

    I was answering your question: What more could you ask for?

    :)

    Answer: No rain?

    But nice weather you’re having there. :)

  115. Wave Your Hat October 1st, 2010 at 5:06 pm

    “Didn’t Arod bat 2nd for most of the 2nd half of 2006 or 2007 when Torre adjusted the batting order to shake things up?”

    No. He had 7 PAs batting 2nd in 2006, none in 2007.

    You may be thinking of 2004 and 2005. ARod had a little over 100 PAs in the 2 hole each year.

  116. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 5:07 pm

    GB7 -

    I sure hope Jeter has even a slightly better year. I liked what I saw from Gardner the last couple of games, bunt-wise.

    For a guy who really is gritty and who does work hard, I don’t understand his trepidation on the bases. Just go!! ;)

  117. MG October 1st, 2010 at 5:07 pm

    Wave Your Hat October 1st, 2010 at 5:06 pm
    “Didn’t Arod bat 2nd for most of the 2nd half of 2006 or 2007 when Torre adjusted the batting order to shake things up?”

    No. He had 7 PAs batting 2nd in 2006, none in 2007.

    You may be thinking of 2004 and 2005. ARod had a little over 100 PAs in the 2 hole each year.
    —————-
    WYH, it’s tough getting old sometimes, the years just fly by :)

  118. Cashman needs to go October 1st, 2010 at 5:08 pm

    Giuseppe Franco October 1st, 2010 at 4:59 pm
    GB, next year Crawford hits in the 2 hole.

    ————

    I think you forgot the part about the Yanks not being interested in spending $100M+ on Crawford.
    **************

    I agree that the yankees probably aren’t interested in crawford – but alot of what they do in the offseason, historically, hinges on what specific yankee players do in the postseason and how opponents perform against the yankees (burnett & giambi are examples of the latter and tino martinez and bernie williams the former – among others)

    would you be surprised if gardner (or granderson) stink it up in the postseason this year that either will be shipped out to make room for crawford? i know i won’t bet against it…

  119. Jerkface October 1st, 2010 at 5:08 pm

    He has to get better with the bunting and his tendencies to be timid on the bases.

    He has 40+ steals which last I checked is 25 more than jeter, and a better on base percentage. Maybe Jeter should work on his timidity? Its one thing to say Gardner can improve on the bases, which he can, but to suggest he should wallow in the 9 hole DUE to his timidity when even as a timid base runner he is by far our best base stealer is not well thought out.

    Thats like saying A-rod is hitting 35 HR so he should be out of the 4 spot until he ‘learns how to be more aggressive and hit 50 HRs’. 35 HRs is already good just like 40 SB is already good.

  120. MG October 1st, 2010 at 5:08 pm

    Ruby Tuesday October 1st, 2010 at 7:42 pm

    Dice K is pitching a no hitter.

  121. Jerkface October 1st, 2010 at 5:08 pm

    Gardner’s greatest strengths are batting ahead of everyone else, because he isn’t going to drive in a lot of people. Leaving him in the 9 spot puts him in too many RISP situations because of the good hitters before him.

  122. Wave Your Hat October 1st, 2010 at 5:10 pm

    I can’t see Jeter getting back to .300 next year. I hope he does, but I wouldn’t count on it.

    The Yanks need to decide if Gardner can lead off. He ought to work on his bunting, and they should certainly bring in someone like Rickey to work on his SB skills, but if he can’t lead off then they ought to trade him.

    If they keep him, Gardner needs to lead off. At this point in their respective careers he is a better leadoff hitter than the Captain.

  123. m October 1st, 2010 at 5:11 pm

    Doreen,

    The book on Gardner was that when he got on, he’s going to go because he was that fast. So whenever he got on throw over.

    I’m not saying he can’t improve, lord know he can. But I can definitely see how the pitchers are throwing HIM off, too. It’s not as simple or easy as LoHud players make it out to be.

  124. CR9 October 1st, 2010 at 5:11 pm

    Id be more concerned about a Red Sox-intentionally caused injury than a weather-related injury.

    Thank God no Beckett in this series, he’d be headhunting for sure!

  125. Wave Your Hat October 1st, 2010 at 5:11 pm

    MG-

    Don’t I know it. Sigh…

  126. GreenBeret7 October 1st, 2010 at 5:14 pm

    Doreen, the bunting and controlled aggression on the bases are the only thing that is stopping Gardner from becoming the yankees leadoff hitter for the next 7-8 years (after Jeter). Until then, the#9 slot fits him best. NYY needs to hire a quality Gardner-like former player to school him, though Tyson could be of help there, but, a Brett Butler/Willie Wilson sort would be perfect. Ricky Henderson was never much of a bunter. I also thought that Frank Catalanotto would be good instructor for him.

  127. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 5:15 pm

    m -

    Fear of the dreaded pick-off.

    I can see that.

  128. Jerkface October 1st, 2010 at 5:16 pm

    Gardner is 4th in the league in Stolen Bases with the 2nd least amount of PA’s of anyone in the Top 4 (7 due to a 3 way tie). Only Rajai Davis has less PA, everyone lese has as 50-100+ more plate appearances.

    But he is too timid, whatever.

  129. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 5:17 pm

    GB7 -

    Well, we sure know he can’t take matter into his own hands again. He tried that last off-season. He had such a good year this year, it would be a shame if they don’t work with him in these two key areas. And it’s not like he’s awful – he’s good and just needs to build on it.

  130. MG October 1st, 2010 at 5:17 pm

    GB7, they should just put Gardner in a room with video of the Scooter laying down those great bunts and not let him out until he yells, ‘Holy Cow’ and ‘Happy Birthday to Emma Santorini, she’s 90 years old today and eats those cannoli from Satriale’s bakery in Pasaic’ :)

  131. Giuseppe Franco October 1st, 2010 at 5:18 pm

    # Cashman needs to go October 1st, 2010 at 5:08 pm

    I agree that the yankees probably aren’t interested in crawford – but alot of what they do in the offseason, historically, hinges on what specific yankee players do in the postseason and how opponents perform against the yankees (burnett & giambi are examples of the latter and tino martinez and bernie williams the former – among others)

    would you be surprised if gardner (or granderson) stink it up in the postseason this year that either will be shipped out to make room for crawford? i know i won’t bet against it…

    ———-

    I would certainly bet against it.

    The Yanks couldn’t justify adding another $100M to their payroll (plus the luxury tax) simply because either Gardner or Granderson had a handful of bad games in October.

    They are certainly going after Cliff Lee and he’s going to cost $100M+ as it is.

    Don’t see any justification to add another one when they’ve already got their starting outfield set for the next couple of years.

  132. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 5:19 pm

    jerkface -

    But he had many opportunities that looked ready-made for a stolen base and not just gratuitous, but in meaningful situations. Now, as m said, the other side to that is the responsibility of not getting picked off, and I can understand that as a deterrent.

    He could have had even more and not just for the sake of having more. They would have helped.

  133. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 5:22 pm

    Opinions wanted:

    Would the Yankees ever pay Lee more in AAV than CC gets even if it were for a shorter duration ?

  134. MG October 1st, 2010 at 5:22 pm

    Doreen, just being fast doesn’t automatically make you a great base stealer, there is lots of instinct involved. Gardner doesn’t seem to be a natural baseball player to me-he makes lots of mistakes involving baseball smarts but has clearly improved enormously in the past year in all aspects of his game. I’m content to have him steal 40+ bases this year, maybe he’ll be at 50+ next year and eventually be in the 60-70 range before he starts slowing down, that’s good enough for me if he can hit .275 and work the count the way he does.

  135. m October 1st, 2010 at 5:22 pm

    Any weather reports or delayed start time?

  136. GreenBeret7 October 1st, 2010 at 5:23 pm

    Gardner has yet to steal a base as a leadoff hitter in an inning this year. 39 hits, 17 walks, 3 HBP and 2 times safe on an error. He has 11 extra base hits, so subtract those times. That’s timidity.

  137. Niblick October 1st, 2010 at 5:25 pm

    That’s not timidity; that’s Genius Joe’s ultraconservatism.

  138. Wave Your Hat October 1st, 2010 at 5:25 pm

    “Would the Yankees ever pay Lee more in AAV than CC gets even if it were for a shorter duration ?”

    IMO the bidding for Lee is going to start at CC’s $23MM AAV and go from there. I think Lee ends up north of $23MM, but on fewer years than CC because Lee is older.

    Then, after the end of the 2011 season, CC will pull an ARod and opt out, and the Yanks will then match his AAV to Lee AND give him an extension.

  139. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 5:25 pm

    I agree with Jerk’s take Gardner vs Jeter, I honestly think Gardner should be in lead off spot due his skill sets of superior speed, stolen base , pitches see PA, and high OBP.

    The problem is obviously where do you bat jeter , 8 or 9 against RH? And obviously, his iconic statute as a catalyst for the yanks.

  140. SAS October 1st, 2010 at 5:26 pm

    Carl Crawford has supposedly been courted by the Angels through Torii Hunter. They need him badly. Boston is also supposed to be interested. I think he goes to another good weather town and therefore the Angels.

    The Yankees want Lee and will pay to get him. I don’t see them paying for a second all star. I could be mistaken of course.

    If Pettitte returns (I hope) they have 5 starters. They have to resign Jeter and Mo. Money doesn’t grow on trees even for the Yankees. They will get a good bullpen guy or 2 and maybe a catcher.

  141. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 5:26 pm

    MG -

    I agree with what you said about Gardner’s instincts.

    It may not be the exact number, but you know when you’re watching a game it’s just the right time to steal or try to and he doesn’t. He has enough speed to just go. He might get caught more, too, but that’s part of it. Maybe this year’s plan was to lull pitcher’s into thinking he’s too afraid to go and next year he’ll fool ‘em all.

  142. CR9 October 1st, 2010 at 5:26 pm

    Joe aint running the basepaths, Gardner is. Joe has already said he gives his baserunners the go ahead to do as they choose.

  143. Jerkface October 1st, 2010 at 5:27 pm

    Thats because you can’t steal a base when leading off an inning. You’re not on base yet.

    Juan Pierre has 66 stolen bases, none when leading off an inning and none when the first batter of a game. I’m inclined to think that steals arent tracked in that situation.

    if they are, then is Pierre too timid?

  144. GreenBeret7 October 1st, 2010 at 5:27 pm

    MG October 1st, 2010 at 5:17 pm
    GB7, they should just put Gardner in a room with video of the Scooter laying down those great bunts and not let him out until he yells, ‘Holy Cow’ and ‘Happy Birthday to Emma Santorini, she’s 90 years old today and eats those cannoli from Satriale’s bakery in Pasaic’

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    yeah, and then they can name a cannoli after him. Right now, the best he gets is an Olive Garden salad named after him. “try our new Gardner fresh salad today.”

  145. Jerkface October 1st, 2010 at 5:27 pm

    Carl Crawford has 0 steals leading off an inning, I think they aren’t tracked.

  146. Niblick October 1st, 2010 at 5:27 pm

    Of course, Joe is going to honestly disclose his strategy and tactics to the public. Right. By the way, I’ve got a bridge to sell …

  147. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 5:28 pm

    Do the Yankees let the Rangers make the first offer and top it? Or do they go the CC route – a number and conditions so friendly that no one else has a chance?

  148. Jerkface October 1st, 2010 at 5:28 pm

    Gardner bats .500 leading off the game and .339 .437 .487 .924 leading off an inning. bat him 1st

  149. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 5:29 pm

    WYH-

    That’s a unique take. Even though Lee might turn out to be as good as CC I think he might want the security of a longer contract @ a lower AAV due to his age.

    The Yankees would prefer to pay more year to year and shorten the overall length.

    Maybe they split the difference with an option year, or do some sort of creative financing sort of thing.

    Not sure what CC is gonna do on the opt out thing.

  150. BTX October 1st, 2010 at 5:29 pm

    CC has said he is not opting out and loves it here

  151. Wave Your Hat October 1st, 2010 at 5:29 pm

    “Gardner has yet to steal a base as a leadoff hitter in an inning this year. 39 hits, 17 walks, 3 HBP and 2 times safe on an error. He has 11 extra base hits, so subtract those times. That’s timidity.”

    Let’s be fair. Here’s Gardner’s triple slash line leading off innings this year: .339/.437/.487. If he achieves those numbers as a leadoff hitter I don’t care if he ever steals a base.

    But Gardner’s basestealing skills will improve. He needs to lead off in 2011.

  152. Niblick October 1st, 2010 at 5:30 pm

    #Jerk – thanks for the stat warning.

  153. GreenBeret7 October 1st, 2010 at 5:30 pm

    Girardi has a green light on his runners. At no time has he told runners not to go. That’s why he’s had to have more than one talk with Gardner for standing on 1st base after being sent in as a pinch runner in obvious running spots.

  154. CR9 October 1st, 2010 at 5:31 pm

    True Niblick. But it cant be Girardi’s fault every time. You have to attribute some blame to Gardner

  155. Wave Your Hat October 1st, 2010 at 5:31 pm

    Well, players often say they won’t opt out until they do.

  156. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 5:31 pm

    Doreen , I personally prefer the prior than the former . But, I think Cashman is going with the shock and awe strategy on Lee.

    He has indicated in the past that’s the org’s philosophy when it concerns with sure talents.

  157. m October 1st, 2010 at 5:32 pm

    Doreen,

    I prefer the “give me the last call” method. :)

  158. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 5:32 pm

    prior than the latter , oops

  159. MG October 1st, 2010 at 5:32 pm

    Doreen, that’s an interesting question. I don’t know how baseball negotiations progress but I would think there would be some fact finding involved as to what Cliff wants (though his agent, of course) and where that would fit for the Yankees. Lee’s agent is Darek Braunecker, who represents AJ Burnett so has been through this with the Yankees in the recent past. I also don’t know the details of the Burnett negotiations but both sides will have a good understanding of each other going in.

  160. Yankee Trader October 1st, 2010 at 5:32 pm

    The money IMO will be spent on pitching-preferably another lefty starter-Lee, maybe another catcher-John Buck?, and the bench, as well as resigning Mo, Jeter, Thames and possibly Pettitte. There are also raises due many players, which in all likelihood will need the Steinbrenners to raise the payroll to near $220 Million.

    I also think the Yankees will need to sweep the Red Sox this weekend to win the division title, as the Rays face KC and Chen, Davies and O’Sullivan

  161. BTX October 1st, 2010 at 5:33 pm

    “Do the Yankees let the Rangers make the first offer and top it? Or do they go the CC route – a number and conditions so friendly that no one else has a chance?”

    With CC, they were so desperate to get him, and there were all the rumors that he wasn’t that interested about coming here and wanted to go West… they had no choice but to overwhelm him with the first offer. They wanted to scare away the WC teams from bidding on him and get his attention.

    With Lee… we know he wants to come here. We don’t need to impress him or scare anyone away… all we need to do is write the largest check. Rumors are that he isin’t in love with Texas anyway. We can afford to let the market play out and give him the extra dollar when it is signing time.

  162. JM October 1st, 2010 at 5:33 pm

    I believe CC when he says he’s not opting out. Maybe I’m just naive, though. :)

  163. JoeyA October 1st, 2010 at 5:34 pm

    No Beltre tonight. Wife is having a kid.

    I don’t know if it was mentioned or not, but I loved hearing it.

  164. Niblick October 1st, 2010 at 5:35 pm

    Juan Pierre doesn’t have any SB when leading off an inning, either, according to Baseball Reference. You believe that?

    GB, stop lobbing ridiculous grenades; this time, you’ve blown yourself up.

  165. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 5:35 pm

    I have to confess.

    Never thought GGBG would turn in the type of season he has.

    Sure glad he did though.

    Will he get even better ?

    Love to see him become a really good drag bunter.

    Most pitchers wouldn’t stand a chance. :)

  166. MG October 1st, 2010 at 5:35 pm

    CC has said he’s staying, it would be a complete 180 degree turn for him personally to make that statement and then opt out. I just can’t see that happening, he’s a family guy who seems like he would never back off a commitment.

  167. CR9 October 1st, 2010 at 5:37 pm

    “GB, stop lobbing ridiculous grenades; this time, you’ve blown yourself up.”

    LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HAHA!!!!!!!!!

    CC aint opting out!

  168. JD October 1st, 2010 at 5:37 pm

    no game either

  169. GreenBeret7 October 1st, 2010 at 5:37 pm

    I would assume that Lee’s agent will get a call after the season, asking how much it will take to sign Lee. Cashman will hash it over with the Steinbrenners and make a counter offer. above all else, unless Lee wants to pitch for the Yankees, it’s not going to be a quick sign,….not before Christmas, I’d think.

    As far as Texas having all of this new TV money, they still have a lot of debt to cover and much of it to Alex Rodriguez.

  170. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 5:38 pm

    m -

    The “Teixeira.” :)

    Cashmoney -

    The former makes sense in that you know what the market is and wouldn’t overpay. My guess is that the Yankees don’t care about overpaying pitchers like CC and Lee. And Lee knows the Yankees want him – heck he thought he was on the team a couple months ago, and was excited about it.

    And there’s no doubt about it. In the year they got CC, AJ and Tex, Tex was an add-on, really. The primary goal was pitching. It always will be. So, I think Lee gets the CC treatment or close to it.

    If they think they want Crawford, he will get the “Teixeira.”

    I think the philosophy is “all in” on star pitchers, and for position players, more let’s see.

  171. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 5:39 pm

    WYH-

    I agree with you on CC. Call me a skeptic. I hope he doesn’t opt out though. Keeps things simpler.

  172. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 5:41 pm

    Adrian Beltre was one of the best pick up in the off season. One would imaging his RH bat would play well @ Fenway. But the surprising part to me is He has outperformed on the road in nearly every offensive categories.

    He has been remarkably consistent offensive player this year.

  173. CR9 October 1st, 2010 at 5:41 pm

    Cashmoney – It’s magic. The magic of umpires. Really shows how pathetic Lackey was!

  174. Doreen October 1st, 2010 at 5:43 pm

    Another suspense-filled off-season to look forward to. Later, though.

  175. Yankee Trader October 1st, 2010 at 5:43 pm

    Other than not maintaining a .300 average and not bunting enough, what more can you ask of Gardner in his 1st fulltime role? Leads all leftfielders in assists. Still disruptive on the basepaths. Other than some power, what more does FA lefty Crawford offer? Another righty like Werth would be a better option, if they’re planning to spend big bucks.

  176. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 5:44 pm

    GB-

    Do you have any concern over Lee’s health going forward, or do you think he’ll hold up without issue ?

    He has been a horse thus far but the guy’s 32. You never know.

    I would like the Yanks to up the AAV, and have at least one option year rather than a 6 year guaranteed deal.

    That’s what I think Lee is going to want- 6 guaranteed.

  177. SAS October 1st, 2010 at 5:44 pm

    Why would CC opt out, and just where would he go that gives him the opportunities the Yankees do. He’s an Ace and is paid like one. He gets commercials and all kinds of other goodies in NY. With his buddy Lee on the team, he should be happy as a pig in …..

  178. Betsy October 1st, 2010 at 5:44 pm

    I really would prefer Andy not pitch. I don’t get Cash – I heard a brief part of his interview on Kay’s show. Sure they wanted to pitch him tonight, but if he goes tomorrow, he’d still pitch game 2 (if they wanted) on normal rest). Why even take a chance? Dumb.

    I also dislike the decision to not throw CC even a couple of innings here, just to keep him sharp.

  179. Betsy October 1st, 2010 at 5:45 pm

    Gardner really was a first half player – that’s my concern with him.

    CC? I’d be shocked if he opted out

  180. SAS October 1st, 2010 at 5:45 pm

    MTU,

    Look at Pavano. You’re right, you never know

  181. CR9 October 1st, 2010 at 5:46 pm

    There’s as much chance of CC opting out as there is of me becoming normal :)

  182. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 5:46 pm

    SAS-

    “Look at Pavano.” I’d rather not especially after eating. :)

  183. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 5:47 pm

    Doreen, I think the circumstances this time around is a little dif. The Yanks aren’t as desperate to have Lee, but desperate enough i suppose. I believe their strategy with premium talents especially when consider demand far exceeds supply in starting pitching market, is to go all out!

    I fully expect the Yanks to give him the best deal , maybe not as overwhelming as the deal CC had received, but close enough.

    In closing , yet another example , why we need to develop home grown pitching stars. Hopefully, we got 1 or 2 amongst our touted minor pitching crops.

  184. Betsy October 1st, 2010 at 5:50 pm

    Wave, thanks for the explanation of the sabre stats

    I actually think that a pitcher can control BABIP to larger degree than maybe most think. I really think a pitcher can control whether a hitter has a weak swing against him or not. It just seems unfair to chalk good this (or other stats) up to mere good fortune. I mean, if all pitchers with good stats are lucky, then how do you determine who’s really good?

    The Shields’ example that Neyer used showed that Sheids was apparently unlucky this year, but unless you watch the games, how do you know that he really wasn’t just hit hard as opposed to lots of bloops falling in?

    RAB’s example of Phil’s #s (which were almost even with his ERA) also confuse me. I asked them about it in their chat and they said that it means that Phil was neither lucky or unlucky and that because of that it was easy to evaluate how he pitched (they also said, when I asked, that this was rather unusual).

  185. Yankee Trader October 1st, 2010 at 5:50 pm

    CC is like David Wells-rubber arm and durable.

    A long 5-6 year contract for Lee might be asking for trouble, unless it comes wirh a guarantee of 2-3 more WS titles!! :)

  186. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 5:52 pm

    YT-

    Does this equation compute for you ?

    Cliff Lee = Andy Pettitte’s replacement.

  187. Yogi Mantle October 1st, 2010 at 5:52 pm

    I can see Lee getting a deal a bit less than CC did. Lee has had some injury problems. His abdominal and back problems could have him out for portions each year.

    The other possibility is incentives, but they could have a player trying to play through injuries.

    Its going to be an interesting off season. A number of teams will have to make some moves. Rays will have big decisions to make, RS need a number of holes filled in, Angels are going to have to do something after this year’s performance, the Rangers are trying to make a go of it, the Mariners are a mess and need to do something to get offense.

  188. GreenBeret7 October 1st, 2010 at 5:53 pm

    MTU October 1st, 2010 at 5:44 pm
    GB-

    Do you have any concern over Lee’s health going forward, or do you think he’ll hold up without issue ?

    He has been a horse thus far but the guy’s 32. You never know.

    I would like the Yanks to up the AAV, and have at least one option year rather than a 6 year guaranteed deal.

    That’s what I think Lee is going to want- 6 guaranteed.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    No, not really. No more concerns than I would have about signing any other pitcher. He could blow out his arm on any pitch, but, he just seems so mechanically sound that it reduces the possibilities of him getting hurt. No concerns about the back. I’d put any concerns about him on the same level as there was about Mussina’s first signing. Nothing he throws is overly “impressive”, but, it’s where he throws it. all of his pitches are above average, much like Mussina was. The pitches just seem to move off of the center of the bat at the last second. Ever see a movie called, “It Happens Every Spring” with Ray Milland? about a college professor who discovers a formula that repels wood? He rubs it on the ball and it hops over the bat, and then signs as a pitcher for the Cardinals. That’s who Lee reminds me of.

  189. Betsy October 1st, 2010 at 5:54 pm

    I think it’s a very dangerous assumption to think Lee is practically ours. I can see the Rangers outbidding the Yankees – if not in $$ outright, then in years. Do the Yankees want to hand out another 5 year deal (hopefully the last one) to a veteran? He’s already had back issues…………. Rangers, with all that $$, may give him more years. The Yankees need Lee very much, but I don’t think they should give more than they think he’s worth because the Rangers are in it.

  190. Bronx Jeers October 1st, 2010 at 5:55 pm

    Ahoy from Fenway !

    I was just over by the Monster watching Joba play catch with Phil & D-Rob.

    It’s raining pretty steady though.

  191. Betsy October 1st, 2010 at 5:55 pm

    CClub, I agree, but for some reason they don’t appear to be doing that with Andy and I think it’s the height of foolishness.

  192. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 5:55 pm

    Yogi-

    Reminds me of what Berkman said in an interview. I’ll change it just a little.

    The Yankees will do fine if there is a Doberman nipping at their heels.

    In our case, there are several.

    Can stand still. Got to keep running fast to stay ahead. ;)

  193. Betsy October 1st, 2010 at 5:57 pm

    Why would the Yankees go after Cecil? He’s a good pitcher, but they need another top gun behind CC…………..I still have reservations about the 2011 rotation even with Lee and Andy. Also, why are we developing these kids if not to use any of them? Lastly, Toronto will not deal with the Yankees…….period.

  194. Yankee Trader October 1st, 2010 at 5:57 pm

    MTU

    Cliff Lee is like Greg Maddux with 3-4 more mph on his fastball. Halladay got a reasonable 60 million 3 year extension. Pettitte made ?12M this year. I really think another lefty starter would be the best route to take, but I’d rather wait and see how well Lee does in the playoffs, before entertaining a 5-6 year contract.

  195. Betsy October 1st, 2010 at 5:58 pm

    I also think it’s dumb to play Swish on a bad field

  196. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 5:59 pm

    GB-

    Thanks. I just wondered what you thought. Yeah. Saw that flick. Very funny. Always liked Ray Milland. Old school type actor. Very good one.

    Maybe the Yanks are willing to eat a year or two for some more rings in any case. If we’re lucky he’ll stay sound the whole way that’s if we can get him.

  197. Yankee Trader October 1st, 2010 at 6:00 pm

    GB7- I would hope that Lee would be a better signing than Mussina, who never won a title and was relegated to the bullpen for many of the playoff games.

  198. G-C October 1st, 2010 at 6:00 pm

    Sabathia
    Lee
    Hughes
    Burnett
    Chamberlain/Nova

    I think that’s ultimately what we see next year.

  199. JCPD October 1st, 2010 at 6:00 pm

    MTU, you should have mail soon

  200. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 6:01 pm

    Trader-

    Lee seems to be plenty battle-tested. That’s another reason I think the Yankees love him.

  201. GreenBeret7 October 1st, 2010 at 6:02 pm

    MTU October 1st, 2010 at 5:59 pm
    GB-

    Thanks. I just wondered what you thought. Yeah. Saw that flick. Very funny. Always liked Ray Milland. Old school type actor. Very good one.

    Maybe the Yanks are willing to eat a year or two for some more rings in any case. If we’re lucky he’ll stay sound the whole way that’s if we can get him.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    I can see the Yanks offering a 5 year with a 6th year option and perhaps front loading the contract with a big signing bonus.

  202. SAS October 1st, 2010 at 6:02 pm

    Hey Jeers,

    Have a good night. Bring home a win. The game may start late so it may be a long day for you.

  203. G-C October 1st, 2010 at 6:02 pm

    “GB7- I would hope that Lee would be a better signing than Mussina, who never won a title and was relegated to the bullpen for many of the playoff games.”

    __________________________________________

    Mussina was one of, if not the best ever, long-term free agent starting pitcher signing in baseball history.

    I’d be shocked if Lee held up as well as Mussina did over the length of that deal.

    How was Mussina relegated to the bullpen for many playoff games BTW? The only season in which he wasn’t in the rotation for the playoffs was 2007, when he posted a 5.15 ERA. Otherwise he was quite often lined up as the Yankees # 1 starter in the postseason…

  204. Jerkface October 1st, 2010 at 6:03 pm

    Gardner just recently had a 20 game stretch of hitting .300 between august and september. He battled some injury in the second half.

  205. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 6:03 pm

    Betsy, what’s your cutoff point on Lee in terms of years and AVV?

  206. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 6:03 pm

    JCPD-

    Thanks. Glad you made it back alive. :)

  207. Betsy October 1st, 2010 at 6:03 pm

    I hope not, GC

  208. Wave Your Hat October 1st, 2010 at 6:03 pm

    Just remember, there’s a reason that the opt out provision is in CC’s contract. It isn’t in there just to make the contract longer.

    On Lee, I think a number of teams will try for him, and the Rangers are going to be tough competition. But, the Yanks desperately need to sign him. If they don’t get him, they have to try to deal for Greinke (who probably wouldn’t want to play here) or bid on Darvish.

    Greinke will cost Montero plus more, and Darvish…

    The Yanks will sign Lee because they need to, and Lee will be a very rich man.

  209. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 6:05 pm

    GB-

    That’s what I would like to see. That, and a whole bunch kick a*s games at just the right times. ;)

  210. Betsy October 1st, 2010 at 6:05 pm

    Cash, oh boy – I don’t know. IMO, we desperately need Lee……..but I hate to make a bad move just to make a move. I’m not all that comfortable with 5 years, but I recognize we’ll at least need to do that. I think that’s my cutoff – if he can get 6 from the Rangers, then they can have him. If he’s so enamored of pitching for the Yankees (in a park he’d be good in), in NY, with his friends, he’ll take our $$. If he just wants more $$, let him stay in Texas. I don’t have a figure in mind – that’s the Yankees thing. I’m way more concerned about the years.

  211. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 6:05 pm

    If Darvish does come to the states, I would be curious what kind of dollar figures he will get.
    Some thinks he is the real deal .

  212. Betsy October 1st, 2010 at 6:07 pm

    I have zero interest in Darvish and I’m not interested in trading a boatload of prospects for Greinke. If we miss out on Lee, then we’ll have to adjust our plans. No way am I putting Darvish, a complete unknown, in the 2nd slot behind CC……..and that’s the kind of pitcher we need

  213. SAS October 1st, 2010 at 6:07 pm

    G-C,

    I want Pettitte back.

  214. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 6:08 pm

    SAS-

    I want Pettitte AND Lee. :)

  215. GreenBeret7 October 1st, 2010 at 6:09 pm

    Trader, I never had any problems with Mussina pitching for NYYs. His numbers were pretty consistant with those that Pettitte put up….even in the post season. He only relieved in two games. The W-L record wasn’t great, but all of his ERAs were in line with his career numbers. I’d take a yankee career like that from Lee any time.

  216. Don Vito A. Bellamo October 1st, 2010 at 6:10 pm

    Darvish, Lee and Andy to go with CC and UGH AJ…..SWEET !

  217. SAS October 1st, 2010 at 6:10 pm

    MTU,

    Agree 1000 percent

  218. SAS October 1st, 2010 at 6:11 pm

    Sorry to be stupid, who is Darvish????

  219. JCPD October 1st, 2010 at 6:11 pm

    MTU October 1st, 2010 at 6:08 pm
    SAS-

    I want Pettitte AND Lee.

    —————————

    I want Koufax and Spahn ;-)

  220. Yankee Trader October 1st, 2010 at 6:12 pm

    G-C

    Mussina won 5 and lost 7 games in the playoffs as a Yankee and had an ERA in the mid 4′s from the 2004 ALCS thru 2007. He wasn’t a #1. He was a good signing but IMO Lee is a better pitcher.

    Attached are his stats:

    http://www.baseball-reference......mi01.shtml

  221. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 6:12 pm

    SAS… there you go.
    http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs.....real-deal/

  222. SAS October 1st, 2010 at 6:12 pm

    Don Vito,

    Where is Hughes in your plans?

  223. Cashmoney October 1st, 2010 at 6:14 pm

    I think Yu will have a pretty big market here… I can think a few teams in needing a potential ace go after him hard. Rangers , for example , if they lose Lee.

  224. Yankee Trader October 1st, 2010 at 6:14 pm

    I want Pettitte AND Lee.

    —————————

    I want Koufax and Spahn

    JCPD- still freezing from your wonderful mountain pics!

    I want Koufax and Gibson. Nolan Ryan from the right side would do also!

  225. SAS October 1st, 2010 at 6:16 pm

    I like our chances with Hughes. Darvish should go to the National lLeague, far from the Yankees.

  226. JCPD October 1st, 2010 at 6:18 pm

    Yankee Trader, sorry to freeze you out. ;-) After the next one, you’re going to need to “dry” out what with the deluge of rain we had yesterday. Went out today to get the pictures of it.

  227. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 6:19 pm

    Can I get Carlton too. Pretty please. :)

  228. Chuck58 October 1st, 2010 at 6:20 pm

    :arrow:

  229. MTU October 1st, 2010 at 6:21 pm

    JCPD-

    Looked like a miniature version of the Amazon. Thanks for sharing. :)

  230. JCPD October 1st, 2010 at 6:22 pm

    MTU October 1st, 2010 at 6:19 pm
    Can I get Carlton too. Pretty please.

    Nope!!!! Don’t think his personality would fit into today’s Yankee clubhouse

  231. Yankee Trader October 1st, 2010 at 6:23 pm

    New post—–>

    For an all lefty lineup of starters I’d take Koufax, Spahn, Carlton and Guidry in their prime years.

  232. Vineyard Yankee October 1st, 2010 at 6:30 pm

    MG
    October 1st, 2010 at 3:59 pm

    I’m not making up any trade proposals but if the Yankees were to go after a left handed starter I’d like to see them get Brett Cecil, I’m really impressed with him. I just have no clue what they would have to give up in order to make that kind of trade

    ===============

    There you have it. Sign Lee as a FA, Pettitte returns for another year and then trade for Cecil. That might be a first, 4 LHSP in the same rotation. LMAO !

  233. Don Vito A. Bellamo October 1st, 2010 at 7:07 pm

    # SAS October 1st, 2010 at 6:12 pm

    Don Vito,

    Where is Hughes in your plans?

    .
    he is right there when one of my pitchers is not a reality ;-)

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