Workout wraps up with some extra hitting
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Oct 08, 2010 
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The Yankees off-day workout is over, but Kevin Long is still on the field throwing extra batting practice to Nick Swisher, Robinson Cano, Ramiro Pena and Francisco Cervelli. It’s that net drill that Long likes so much, the one with the screen on the opposite side of the plate to keep his hitters short and quick to the ball.
When the group finished taking hacks from the right side, the screen was moved for left-handed swings. During the change, Cano seemed to be going over mechanics with Cervelli. I’m not close enough to know what Cano was saying, but he was definitely demonstrating a right-handed swing while talking to the Yankees backup catcher.
My guess: Cano could rake from that side too if he wanted.
When it came time for Cano to take his hacks from the left-handed batters box, he did what he always does during this drill. He crushed balls to right, over and over again, one loud thwack after another.
would love to see a couple of those hacks in the next few games..
Good to see the players getting after it. That’s why they’re the best. (yes, they ARE the best)
1 Day, 3 Hours and 33 Minutes until Game 3 of the ALDS
Kevin Long for President.
Wave Your Hat October 8th, 2010 at 4:50 pm
I’d start with Gardner and Nova, and go from there to see what’s available. IF the Yanks plan to bat Gardner 9th next year.
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I don’t get this logic.
If Gardner bats lead-off, Jeter bats 2nd. If Gardner bats 9th, Jeter bats lead-off.
The difference is a first inning at-bat.
Gardner is the speediest guy we have and a plus defender. He adds another dimension to our line-up that Yankee fans have craved for years.
In a line-up packed with sluggers, what does it matter if he bats 1st or 9th?
Continuing the Gardner discussion,
I want to make sure everyone understands I like Gardner. I’ve liked him from the beginning. I think he’s good enough, or will be good enough, to lead off on a pretty darn good team.
However, if the Yanks think he’s a #9 hitter, you have to consider moving him. There are better young outfielders, or young outfielders with an upside projected to be higher than Gardner’s. At the same time, the Yanks have a surplus of young pitching talent.
It only makes sense to see if you can package Gardner and some of that young surplus pitching talent to get a young outfielder with a higher upside than Gardner’s.
Wave Your Hat October 8th, 2010 at 5:02 pm
However, if the Yanks think he’s a #9 hitter, you have to consider moving him. There are better young outfielders, or young outfielders with an upside projected to be higher than Gardner’s. At the same time, the Yanks have a surplus of young pitching talent.
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The #9 hitter in the Yankees line-up is much different than your average #9 hitter.
You think Berkman or Granderson are #8 hitters in other line-ups?
Gardner would bat lead-off on tons of teams. He bats lead-off on days for the Yankees when certain players are not in the line-up.
The fact that Gardner is batting ninth in our line-up when it’s fully loaded is a good thing. It makes the line-up cyclical.
I wish I could watch this BP.
WYH,
Good post. Like I said, I can see the logic, but not the practicality.
If the Yankees choose to sign Crawford, then I can see Gardner being traded now that Granderson is putting up numbers.
Or, the Yankees can let Crawford go, use Gardner for the next 2-3 years and sign a more traditional corner OF.
Gardner is also CF insurance in case of (heaven forbid) an injury to Granderson.
BJK-
Where Gardner actually bats is not the point, since in my hypothetical the Yanks would be getting back a better hitter, so the lineup remains cyclical.
My point was based on the Yanks’ perception of how good Gardner is, as revealed by their decision on where to bat him.
WYH
I think with the Yankees, it’s more complicated than their decision on where to bat him reflecting their perception of how good they think he is.
There’s the whole Jeter thing, really.
And except for the first time through the lineup, it doesn’t much matter. I don’t think it does, anyway.
Plus the Yankees aim for a a circular lineup – one with no holes. When the A-team plays, there are no holes, no weak spots, and it is a tough lineup for any pitcher to navigate through. I mean, Berkman batting eighth is not a reflection of his talent, but of the talent of the entire lineup. 8th in the Yankee order has the potential to be a second clean-up hitter. Gardner has the opportunity to re-set the table at the #9 spot.
And you can’t overstate the importance of value. For what he’s paid, Gardner is extremely valuable to the Yankees. Keeping Gardner at his salary will give them more flexibility in other areas – trying to retain Wood, for example, or upping their offer to Lee in case Texas goes nuts with their offer. (I believe Mo and Jeter have been planned for, financially speaking, for a long time.)
Wave Your Hat October 8th, 2010 at 5:10 pm
BJK-
Where Gardner actually bats is not the point, since in my hypothetical the Yanks would be getting back a better hitter, so the lineup remains cyclical.
My point was based on the Yanks’ perception of how good Gardner is, as revealed by their decision on where to bat him.
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I hear what you’re saying. My counter-point is that Gardner batting 9th doesn’t reflect what the Yankees see in him. It reflects more of how they feel about Derek Jeter.
Gardner is obviously not an RBI guy. He’s a table-setter. If the lead-off spot in the line-up isn’t available because a future Hall of Famer currently resides there, the next best spot for him is #9.
Let’s say they bring a better player. Either that player, the DH, or Granderson is hitting 9th. Because I can’t see anyone in the middle of the order batting lower than 7th.
And how many times have we seen Gardner create runs all by himself this year?
He forces errors in the infield because of his speed.
He makes pitchers nervous on the mound.
He goes first to third when most others wouldn’t consider it.
Last night, batting in front of Jeter, he got on base, went to second on a grounder, stole third and was set up to score with less than 2 outs.
Not many players on the Yankees can offer that dimension. He’s a special player that’s still developing.
My point is really, use the surplus pitching to improve the hitting. I admit the hitting is good already, but there’s nothing wrong with getting better. There are some very attractive young outfielders out there who can play defense and hit, and adding a high average hitter would help out the RISP problems.
It’s a minority view but I’d be willing to substitute Swisher or Granderson for Gardner, I just think those two are better than Gardner although more expensive.
I hate to see all that surplus pitching just sit in AAA, I think it is a waste of good assets.
Anyone have a link for the press conferences today? Thanks!
WYH,
In theory it’s good. But do we really have a surplus of pitching in AAA? I haven’t seen or heard about it. The big names are in lower levels, still.
Nova’s not even polished yet. And we had to turn to a journeyman to fill in for Andy.
As for Swisher and Granderson are still relatively cheap for the power they are providing. But wasn’t Gardner 2nd in WAR for the Yankees (assuming position players)? For less than a half-million.
I do have to say, that I am supremely impressed with the strides that both Granderson and Swisher have made. Those are made players, but they tweaked and worked and got even better.
Erica in NY October 8th, 2010 at 1:18 pm
LGY October 8th, 2010 at 1:17 pm
?However, I have had 15 people RSVP yes?
???????????????-
Yankee Snoopy?s know how to RSVP?
***************
They weren’t invited either.
In fact, after the game last night I removed them from their viewing position on the couch and put them in a closet. I hope they aren’t mad at me!!!!
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So!!! Are you saying that Snoopy is finally coming out of the closet tomorrow?
Gardner, like Granderson does not have a plus arm. They have good arms, but, it’s accurate and they get the throws off quickly.
Gardner out if the Yanx get Crawford? I think I’d rather keep Gardner. He may not be as accomplished as Crawford, but he’s still getting better. Why not keep both of them? I know there are only 3 OF positions but we often think of OFs with 4 players rotated in these days … versatility, injuries, depth, guys stay rested, DH … at that stuff together means a 4th OF guy really comes into play. Gardner, Crawford, Swisher and Granderson in the OF would be nice. If you need a killer arm in RF … consider Golson too.
Why exactly would we want to get rid of Swisher or Granderson? I’m not married to Gardner, but I don’t quite see a reason to get rid of him either.
m -
Precisely.
The pitching “surplus” is a year or two away.
If they need anything, it’s to address the exact nature of what the catching situation will be next year.
Fantasy GM doesn’t even stop during the playoffs I see.
There’s a better probability that the Yankees will move/try Brandon Laird in the corner outfield spots than going after some big name outfielder with a big contract. Why trade a good young outfielder along with good minor league pitching for something that they aren’t in a dying need of?
I don’t think Crawford is on the table. He’ll end up in Anaheim. Maybe Boston. More likely Anaheim.
Yankees are going to give a blank check to Lee. Then they still need tons of $$$ to resign Jeter, Mo, and hopefully Pettitte.
If the Yankees are in on Crawford for any reason other than to drive up the price for Anaheim or Boston, that means they whiffed on Lee.
And if they whiffed on Lee, the rotation will need to be addressed big time.
At AA and AAA, just counting starters, there are Nova, Noesi, Betances, Banuelos and Brackman. Those could all be “top 100″ type minor leaguers, all near ready for the majors. They’d be attractive to a lot of teams.
Next year the Yanks will probably sign Lee and Pettitte, and have CC, Hughes and AJ. That’s 4 long term starters, plus Andy.
There’s no room for all of the kids, so there is a surplus.
Not enough props can to given to the hard work done by Kevin Long on a daily basis. He’s fully responsible for tweaking and adjusting the swings of Swisher and Granderson and can spot batting flaws of others a mile away. We as fans may not hear about how many others have turned to their hitting coach for advice and not seen in the hitting cages inside the Stadium.
GB7-
I think down the road the Yanks are in need of good young hitters, so might as well start now.
But I wouldn’t trade Gardner (or Granderson for that matter) for just anyone, it would have to be a cream of the crop deal.
If that’s not available I have no problems with the Yanks just sitting tight offensively.
A young and in his prime Kerry Wood………….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3cphBCyGkg
Wave Your Hat October 8th, 2010 at 5:41 pm
At AA and AAA, just counting starters, there are Nova, Noesi, Betances, Banuelos and Brackman. Those could all be “top 100? type minor leaguers, all near ready for the majors. They’d be attractive to a lot of teams.
Next year the Yanks will probably sign Lee and Pettitte, and have CC, Hughes and AJ. That’s 4 long term starters, plus Andy.
There’s no room for all of the kids, so there is a surplus.
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What happens if AJ doesn’t rebound? Or if Pettitte re-signs, but misses a third of the season? Or even worse, CC or Hughes gets hurt?
Nova was the only one of those 5 ready to step in when Andy went down this year, and just barely. The rotation needs to be deeper than 5 to get through the year.
I don’t look at them as a surplus. Some will stick, some will not. Make sure the ones that stick are there if we need them.
Those young pitchers are better served to be used in the bullpen in NY to replace the likes of Gaudin, Mitre and Moseley. It preps them for the rotation in the following year. Brackman and Mitchell/Betances in 2011 and the others a year later. Nova is the most likely to be traded in the off season. Then, they are not surplus.
I really like the idea of the Yankees paying whatever it takes to get Cliff Lee and let the rest of the team essentially stay the same. Use the farm system to fill the bench for the 1st half of 2011 and, like they did this year, pick up a couple of veteran bats at the trade deadline.
I also want to see them do everything possible to keep Kerry Wood, I think his presence extends Mo’s career by at least 1 year.
The guys on TBS just said the pitch to Berkman was right down the middle.
They are blatantly lying. Either that or they actually believe what they are saying. Either way, it’s absurd.
By the way, did anyone see that absolutely gorgeous brunette female Twins fan arguing the call in the crowd after the pitch? They keep showing her in the replays over and over again.
Last night, when she was on the screen, I started cursing her out – as if she could hear me
– telling her to sit her … down! 
NYY have some good hitting prospects coming pretty fast. Montero, Laird, Romine, Brewer, Mesa, possibly Brad Suttle, though he’s not much of a defensive 3rd baseman/1st baseman. The problem is that they are almost all right handed. The left handed hitters are further back.
It does not maximize your assets to take a young starter and use him in relief. That lowers his overall utility and value. Much better to get his equivalent value as a starter by trading him for offense.
And, with the pitchers we have, I repeat all those minor league starters are surplus. Saving them all for “insurance” is nuts.
So I saw this discussion on another board:
If you had a time machine, would you go back and do anything to re-sign Andy, knowing it meant we wouldn’t have Phil?
I can’t understand this trade talk. The PS is just getting started, and people want to trade the guys that got us here.
Perhaps you won’t appreciate what you have, until it’s no longer here.
If you were talking about going after Josh Hamilton, I know not going to happen, then I’d listen. But to spend 15X the money for an OF to replace Gardner makes no sense. Gardner is getting better, and if not in the future plans, see what AAA has to offer as a stop gap.
I know people railed at this team all year long, but it really is a good one. Very few holes to exploit for an opposing pitcher. Can you imagine working throw the landmine of the switch hitting duo of Posada and Swisher…only to face Lance Berkman? Batting 8th?! With OBP, Jr. right behind him?
I would love to re-sign Kerry Wood, but he’ll probably get offers to close – granted, from mediocre teams. I’m hoping he’ll remember how great it was to be in a pennant race/the playoffs and take a fair offer from the Yankees.
MG October 8th, 2010 at 5:47 pm
I really like the idea of the Yankees paying whatever it takes to get Cliff Lee and let the rest of the team essentially stay the same. Use the farm system to fill the bench for the 1st half of 2011 and, like they did this year, pick up a couple of veteran bats at the trade deadline.
I also want to see them do everything possible to keep Kerry Wood, I think his presence extends Mo’s career by at least 1 year.
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I can’t see another team that will pay Wood closer money. Wood walks to many to be a full time closer. I’m guessing that NYYs offer a 3 year $6 mil a year deal to try keeping him.
Laird is playing the OF in the AFL this Fall.
If he adjusts well to it, it’s not inconceivable to me that both Montero and Laird are on the big league roster next year.
No such thing as a pitching surplus.
Stuff, good and bad, always happens with pitchers.
Sit tight unless a deal comes along that is too good to be true.
“I can’t understand this trade talk. The PS is just getting started, and people want to trade the guys that got us here.”
Big Al, we’re just killing time. No reason to get excited.
Only two of those “excess” pitchers have any AAA experience. They aren’t exactly well tested in the minors.
m – Did you see my heartfelt apology to you earlier?
___
As SJ44 once said and I agree, it is likely that Kerry will receive a closer $$$$ contract offer from a subpar team. However, I hope that playing for a perennial contender will keep him with the Yankees. After a career of failure, I have to imagine that playing a full year with the Yankees would do more for him than an extra $4-5 million.
Wave Your Hat October 8th, 2010 at 5:51 pm
It does not maximize your assets to take a young starter and use him in relief. That lowers his overall utility and value. Much better to get his equivalent value as a starter by trading him for offense.
And, with the pitchers we have, I repeat all those minor league starters are surplus. Saving them all for “insurance” is nuts.
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Not all of them will make it. It’s becoming more and more common to break them in as relievers first. Price, Hughes, Joba, etc.
The cream will rise to the top by how they perform in the majors. The Hughes and Prices will find their way into the rotation. The Jobas will be relegated to the bullpen.
And yes, some will be traded a la Arodys Vizcaino in the right deal (or the “went horribly wrong but had the right idea” deal.)
You never have enough pitching.
I like the idea of signing Kerry Wood. Of course he’s a health risk, but who isn’t?
He’s insurance for anything happening to Rivera. Robertson, Wood, and Rivera as it is in the last two innings is already a tough draw.
The Yankees didn’t try and break in Phil as a reliever. In fact they didn’t – he came up (still think he was rushed) as a starter. He ended up in the pen due to cirumstance…..
SJ44-
If the Yanks sign Lee and Pettitte, yes there is such a thing as a pitching surplus.
There is an opportunity cost to every move you don’t make. Saving 5 top 100 type minor league starters for insurance in case CC or Lee gets hurt, at the cost of a top young outfielder if that’s what it is, hurts the Yanks every single day.
Other than Montero, there isn’t any Yankee minor leaguer in AA or AAA of the hitting potential I am talking about.
SJ, I can’t see any reason that Laird can’t be a Swisher type hitter and outfielder. He’s not quite as patient, but, not many minor league hitters are. He’s no burner out there, but, neither is swisher. Really strong arm and tracks pop ups well.
What a dominating, filthy performance by Wood last night. He sat down Hardy with pure filth and then blew away an overmatched Hudson! Just what I needed, an easy 8th inning
m -
Are the Yankees willing to pay $12 mil for an EWIG, I don’t think so. Wood cost nothing to rent this season. Most likely he wants to close for some team.
CR9,
Yes, I saw it. Just wanted to make sure you said it in a lucid moment.
Thanks for that. It’s all good.
And btw, I don’t hate Alex. I just don’t love him as much as you do.
Seriously, he’s changed a lot.
And your post was very magnanimous. Thank you.
EIG not EWIG ………..
Hughes ended up in the pen because Joba leapfrogged him. That was when he was slim enough to leapfrog another player.
Now Joba is the toad.
I don’t believe there is any such thing as pitching surplus. We have no idea which, if any, of these kids will turn out.
EWIG is how they use to score errors on Pepitone..
GB7 -
Did you see that Laird was going to play OF in the AFL?
“We have no idea which, if any, of these kids will turn out.”
The Yanks should make their best guess, which ought to be pretty good.
Many young pitchers have gone to the bullpen at the beginning of their major league careers for the past 100 years, it’s not a new process. Adam Wainwright, Johan Santana and Phil Hughes are recent examples to name a few.
It’s a good place for a kid to learn how to pitch in the majors without a ton of pressure and, at the same time, learn how to hold runners on, pitch out of the stretch, deal with the travel schedule, etc, etc, etc. If that’s where the Yankees young guys fit it’s a strength, not a weakness for the team in the coming years.
Tom -
Good one!
M, not quite. Phil was starting in AAA………….he would have been sent down had he not been pitching well enough to stay. The point is, the Yankees did not try to break him in as a reliever.
That said, 2007 and 2008 were hard if you were Phil fans.
I like the idea of having high upside pitchers in the system. Joba, Hughes, and Robertson have done a great job contributing. Either, in the bullpen, rotation, or sometimes, both.
MG-
I never said moving starters to the bullpen was a weakness. I said it isn’t maximizing an asset, which is a different thing.
If you had a time machine, would you go back and do anything to re-sign Andy, knowing it meant we wouldn’t have Phil?
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I would 100% let Andy walk for a few yrs and draft YMH.
Also, I’d use the time machine to go back to last Wednesday and not eat that shady roast beef sandwich.
m – It’s very rare that I am lucid, as I am so filled with hatred. I appreciate you accepting my apologies
___
It meant so much to me last night to see everyone complaining about the umpires and the broadcasters and the subsequent whining by the media over the Berkman pitch. It was just an excellent excellent feeling!
1-0 REDS!!! WoooooHoooooo! That was an absolute no-doubter!
Attention Mommy’s! Dave Eiland has spoken so stop your babying!
Ledger_Yankees Eiland on Hughes: “He’s a big boy now. The kid gloves are off now.”
I do think that Brackman and Montero leave camp w/ the Yankees next spring.
Argh. I so want Cincy to win. I had it on, but someone switched it. Grrr. It’s a battle for the remote. That ends 30+ shutout innings in Philly for the Reds.
Wave Your Hat October 8th, 2010 at 6:07 pm
MG-
I never said moving starters to the bullpen was a weakness. I said it isn’t maximizing an asset, which is a different thing.
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I can see your point on that, it’s just tough to know which pitcher(s) would be the right one to move without seeing them in the bigs first. They’ve seen enough of Nova to know if they consider him a potential starter in the rotation, they were able to make the same decision about Kennedy from his experience. I just don’t think they want to add a high priced position player right now, if they can get a good young, cost controlled outfielder for one major leaguer and prospects that would be something to consider.
Doreen October 8th, 2010 at 6:04 pm
GB7 -
Did you see that Laird was going to play OF in the AFL
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Yes I did, Doreen, and, I’m happy to see it. I’ve always thought that they should think about making these kids more versatile. If he can play a competent outfield, with his bat and ability to play 3rd and 1st, he’s great insurance. I still want them to give Romine some outfield and corner infield time, too. Two players to watch is Brewer in AAA and Mesa in AA. Mesa is a lot like Granderson….great outfielder (with a rocket arm) big time power and blazing speed as well as a smart base runner. Still not quite convinced about suttle, but, as a switch hitter, he could make the jump, too.
Hey, Did you guys get rookie hazing photos yet?
That 2-1 pitch to Votto was nowhere near a strike. And then the 2-2 pitch was a strike right down the middle, but called a ball. How do you call a pitch 2 feet outside a strike, but one right down the middle a ball?
Hardwired, lol………..
Pat, lol – us mommies will never stop worrying. However, the kid looked nice and relaxed at his presser:
http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play......d=12775613
“if they can get a good young, cost controlled outfielder for one major leaguer and prospects that would be something to consider.”
That’s what I’m talking about.
Meetings all day.. Did I miss anything?
ConcernedCitizen,
Nothing to concern yourself with. Just a few
brushfirescivilized discussions.I don’t think the Yanks have a pitching surplus but I do think the Yanks may want to cash in on a couple of their youngsters who have overachieved this season and trade high on them.
Nova being a prime example.
The Dodgers aren’t trading Kemp unless they can rape a team. Kemp has a ton of talent, but, the question is whether he turns into Carlos Beltran or Ruben Rivera.
Melky is batting 5th for the Braves tonight?
GF, Nova and DJ Mitchell are possibly the two most logical trade commodities for minor league pitchers. Both have talent, and Mitchell would hurt, but, NYY really doesn’t need outfield help this next year. I’m for waiting to see if Gardner makes that next big step up and if Granderson carries his last 45 games over to next year. Even with bringing Pettitte back and bringing Lee in, I don’t want to see another year of scrambling to patch the emergency #5 spot with Mitre/Mosely/Nova again.
pat October 8th, 2010 at 6:25 pm
Melky is batting 5th for the Braves tonight?
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I always thought that he could be the equivalent of Robinson Cano. Tonight just confirms the similarities.
For those of you that did not see the picture of the runner being called safe in last nights Giants/Braves game, who was out by a mile, here it is.
My question, how much did this ump have on the game?
http://sijoeposnanski.files.wo...../steal.jpg
I have never visited Deadspin until today. Funny stuff. One contestant on the tailgate cooking show (hosted by the lovely Erin Andrews) was invited to taste her own food. She gagged and puked it out. Another was a lady who was shocked to find out that her White Sox “Sox” tattoo on the back of her leg was actually tattoed on backwards. Also had a thing on the ump’s errant zone. Though they bought into the idea that the Twins were victims.
Utley with the yips again!
nomaas’s prospect grades/rankings:
http://nomaas.org/2010/10/end-.....prospects/
Tom in N.J. October 8th, 2010 at 6:10 pm
I do think that Brackman and Montero leave camp w/ the Yankees next spring.
……………………………………………..
It wouldn’t be a surprise if Brandon Laird made a strong impression in spring training and left camp also. He was impressive last spring but was ticketed for AA to start the year regardless. He’s going to the AFL to work on his fielding skills.
Don’t expect Austin Kearns back which could open the door for Laird.
GB7 -
You are joking – right?
Melky is batting .255, OBP is .317 and SLG% is .354
On top of that, he has 8 errors in the OF.
The only thing he and Cano have in commom is batting 5th.
You must be kidding, no one would make that comparison with a straight face.