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Report: Girardi’s deal done

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Oct 28, 2010 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Mark Feinsand is reporting that Joe Girardi’s deal is a done, a $9-million contract that will keep Girardi in New York for another three years.

This has pretty much been the speculation for the past few days, that Girardi would get another three-year deal worth $9- or $10-million. Feinsand says it could announced later today.

 
 

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256 Responses to “Report: Girardi’s deal done”

  1. Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 12:00 pm

    The reason he had limited plate appearances over that period of time is because he didn’t excel. The Yankees developmental and major league staff are capable of evaluating players he never rose to the next level. Four years is plenty of time to evaluate someone.
    ———————————-
    Westcoast, Miranda posted three season of OPS of 833 or above in the AAA last three year. I think the reason he never got ‘ample’ opportunity in NY was because a team like the Yankees had guys like Tex and Matsui in front of him which renders his presence redundant. Is he a regular 1b on the ML level? we will probably never find out unless some lesser team gives him a chance or never.

  2. TheStraw October 28th, 2010 at 12:03 pm

    Well let’s just hope Joe has learned from some of the mistakes he made this season. I happen to think that the new pitching coach, if competent, will go a long way to fixing some of the errors/misplayed hunches.

  3. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 12:04 pm

    Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 12:00 pm
    The reason he had limited plate appearances over that period of time is because he didn’t excel. The Yankees developmental and major league staff are capable of evaluating players he never rose to the next level. Four years is plenty of time to evaluate someone.
    ———————————-
    Westcoast, Miranda posted three season of OPS of 833 or above in the AAA last three year. I think the reason he never got ‘ample’ opportunity in NY was because a team like the Yankees had guys like Tex and Matsui in front of him which renders his presence redundant. Is he a regular 1b on the ML level? we will probably never find out unless some lesser team gives him a chance or never.
    —————————–

    You’re right – Miranda was too limited to have a role on the big club. Last year the Yankees opened with essentially 3 first base options on the ML roster (Tex, Swisher, NJ) and picked up another one midseason in Berkman.

    What’s more – Miranda showed what a lot of young players show – which is that he wasn’t suited to riding the pine for long stretches and then being productive.

    I posted on an earlier thread that I think it would be a smart developmental move to bench Eduardo Nunez and Brandon Laird at AAA early next season to see if they’re capable of coming in cold as pinch hitters or spot starting and being productive since that’s what they’re going to need to do at the ML level to start their pro careers.

  4. Erin October 28th, 2010 at 12:05 pm

    Good news. :)

  5. Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 12:07 pm

    Agree Chip, I was more or less responding to WCYF’s narrative on how Miranda had gotten ample opportunities on a major league level with the Yanks which is just untrue and for stated reasons above.

  6. Tom in N.J. October 28th, 2010 at 12:08 pm

    Didn’t some fool tweet a week or so ago that ‘sources’ told him that Girardi was going to leave the Yankees?

  7. Doreen October 28th, 2010 at 12:08 pm

    Manager now in place – ready to move onward!

    :)

  8. jacksquat October 28th, 2010 at 12:08 pm

    West Coast Yankee FanOctober 28th, 2010 at 11:47 amMontero won’t start the year in the Bronx, he will probably be called up after Memorial day so he wouldn’t be eligible for arbitration until 2014

    The Yankees are not a small market team that needs to do that. If Montero can be on the opening day roster then the Yankees don’t need to find another catcher that can hit to share time with Posada, or play Cervelli in that spot again, in essence saving money.

    The only way Montero is not on the opening day roster is if they feel he does not meet even the minimum necessary defensively.

  9. Dylan October 28th, 2010 at 12:09 pm

    Eh… I don’t think Girardi is a very good coach and I’m definitely not thrilled about this, but we all knew that it was bound to happen, so I’m not gonna waste my time complaining.

  10. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 12:09 pm

    I would love to see the Yankees find a way to add Butch Wynager to the ML coaching staff.

    He’s done a lot of work with Jesus Montero both at the plate and behind it and at his age I think consistency is important.

    Problem for Butch is that he’s a hitting coach and the Yankees already have a pretty good one in K-Long.

  11. JCPD October 28th, 2010 at 12:10 pm

    Dylan, you just did ;-)

  12. blake October 28th, 2010 at 12:12 pm

    That was a horrible deal for the braves from the last thread….all that for a rental of Mark Teixera when they knew they couldn’t sign him and they weren’t good enough to win the WS anyway…..

    Glad the Girardi deal is done…now if only the other 3 in house deals would go that smoothly.

  13. Dylan October 28th, 2010 at 12:12 pm

    # JCPD October 28th, 2010 at 12:10 pm

    Dylan, you just did ;-)
    ___________________________________________________________________

    lol well it was a short subtle complaint, instead of a long, drawn out, whiny one!

  14. Erin October 28th, 2010 at 12:12 pm

    Tom in N.J. October 28th, 2010 at 12:08 pm
    Didn?t some fool tweet a week or so ago that ?sources? told him that Girardi was going to leave the Yankees?

    *********************************
    yeah-wasn’t it incarcerated bob? :lol:

  15. Brian44 October 28th, 2010 at 12:13 pm

    There’s always 2014…

  16. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 12:13 pm

    With all due respect it’s not untrue. He had four years in the minors, a few spring trainings and was called up repeatedly in September and just never showed that he was good enough to DH or to be a significant trade piece.

    One of the jobs of a major and minor league staff as well as scouts and talent evaluators throughout baseball is to evaluate and rank talent and he was never that highly thought of, especially as his contract clock ticked down. Anyone can make a judgment on a player when they have had 500 mlb at bats, but that is not practical or feasible.

  17. Ruby Tuesday October 28th, 2010 at 12:13 pm

    I love Girardi………………………………….and his binder.

  18. Dylan October 28th, 2010 at 12:14 pm

    lol incarcerated bob is a fool that makes up stories based off rumors. Its incredible that so many people actually follow him on twitter and believe what he says.

  19. Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 12:14 pm

    I think Joe is a good manager. One of his strength has been keeping a healthy and effective BP through the grind of 162 games. But as MG aptly pointed out the other day, some of the Joe strategic moves can be questioned at times. But so are lot managers in this league. He is young and relatively new to managing, I see room for growth and improvements. But overall, he is the right man for the job IMO.

  20. raymagnetic October 28th, 2010 at 12:14 pm

    I’m not going to waste my time making a comment about this contract renewal.

  21. Bob October 28th, 2010 at 12:15 pm

    theee best italian manager in baseball !

  22. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 12:15 pm

    blake October 28th, 2010 at 12:12 pm
    That was a horrible deal for the braves from the last thread….all that for a rental of Mark Teixera when they knew they couldn’t sign him and they weren’t good enough to win the WS anyway…..

    Glad the Girardi deal is done…now if only the other 3 in house deals would go that smoothly.
    ——————–

    What makes the Tex deal even worse is that a year later Braves were forced to trade him and could only get back Casey Kotchman and a non-prospect.

    I think that trade and the deal that sent Carlos Santana to the Indians for Casey Blake could be among the worst we’ve seen in a while.

  23. Ruby Tuesday October 28th, 2010 at 12:16 pm

    Does Girardi use his binder to raise his kids too ?

  24. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 12:16 pm

    No surprise on Girardi, I am not a huge fan at all but I think he may learn from past mistakes and become a better manager. I can only hope so. IMO the Yankee management like him because he is a corporate guy and doesn’t make waves. Cashman can dominate him, he does what he’s told, etc. He’s not the worst manager in baseball and not the best.

  25. JCPD October 28th, 2010 at 12:17 pm

    Dylan, that’s what I like…. short and to the point. I don’t think any fan is happy with every move the team makes. I like the voice one’s displeasure and move on method rather than the days, weeks, months on end whining about the same move. Heck, people are still whining about the Matsui, Damon non-signings a year later.

  26. raymagnetic October 28th, 2010 at 12:18 pm

    Incarcerated Bob still believes Lebron is going to sign with NY.

  27. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 12:18 pm

    Speaking of Casey Blake –

    He would be an interesting option for the Yankees. He had a bad offensive season last year but has been a consistent performer for the last few years.

    He would be a RH bench option that could fill in at 3b, 1b and RF – pop a few out of the park and be another solid veteran on the bench. Getting pretty old so I’m not sure what he’s got left in the tank but I also don’t think it would take much to bring him over from the Dodgers.

  28. JCPD October 28th, 2010 at 12:18 pm

    Erin October 28th, 2010 at 12:12 pm
    Tom in N.J. October 28th, 2010 at 12:08 pm
    Didn?t some fool tweet a week or so ago that ?sources? told him that Girardi was going to leave the Yankees?

    *********************************
    yeah-wasn’t it incarcerated bob?

    ——————————————————————–

    He probably should be. ;-)

  29. murphydog October 28th, 2010 at 12:19 pm

    I don’t see them carrying three catchers the whole season in 2011. Maybe start out with Cervelli and Po, but call up Montero at the All Star Break and deal Cervelli or send him to AAA as insurance. It’s not a money thing, it’s a final preparation thing for Montero.

    I agree that the bench could have been more versatile in 2010. But it wasn’t a bench failure or a lineup failure, it was a complete failure, including the rotation.

    It’s convenient to suppose that a weak bench led to overuse of A-Rod and Jeter and Po, and that their overuse and fatigue led to the collapse. But I’m not sure that conclusion is borne out by the facts. Jeter was in a slump most of the year, not just the dog days, and in fact he showed signs of life late in the season. A-Rod was injured and was coming off an off season in which he apparently did not adhere to his usual regimen because of his hip. Teix was hurt, not tired. Po’s concussion scare has to be evaluated, but Girardi overused (and exposed) Cervelli in order to rest Po. IMO, Po wasn’t tired; Cervelli was.

    Burnett’s implosion, Vazquez’s ineffectiveness and Pettitte’s late season injury was just as likely the real cause of the August/September collapse, especially if you consider the timing of the demise. The importance of starting pitching cannot be overstated.

    For 2011, a super sub, a Chone Figgins circa 2009 kind of guy, is the dream scenario. But there just aren’t many Chone Figgins 2009 clones out there and the real thing may be in steep decline. Or maybe not. Cash should kick his tires. Figgins is 32 and may still have some baseball in him; maybe he’s due for a rebound. He’s signed in Seattle through 2013 with an option on 2014. He’s too expensive, but in a trade Seattle can absorb some of the salary. They are probably looking to unload him now after a bad 2010. But after the Cliff Lee thing maybe Cash won’t do business with Seattle. Not a big deal wither way.

  30. blake October 28th, 2010 at 12:19 pm

    Chip, both were just horrible…the braves probably were ok dealing andrus because they had escobar but have since shipped him out as well because of his attitude. They had a pretty big net loss from the teixera deal in the end.

  31. Dylan October 28th, 2010 at 12:21 pm

    # JCPD October 28th, 2010 at 12:17 pm

    Dylan, that’s what I like…. short and to the point. I don’t think any fan is happy with every move the team makes. I like the voice one’s displeasure and move on method rather than the days, weeks, months on end whining about the same move. Heck, people are still whining about the Matsui, Damon non-signings a year later.
    __________________________________________________________________

    Yeah, its definitely not worth spending time complaining about. I don’t think he is a horrible manager, I just don’t like a lot of the decisions that he makes. He is still relatively inexperienced, so hopefully he will learn to fix his mistakes and can grow as a manager. He is definitely capable of winning a WS (as we saw last year) if he has enough talent on the roster. Now the Yankees can turn their attention to negotiation with the big 3.

  32. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 12:21 pm

    West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 12:16 pm
    No surprise on Girardi, I am not a huge fan at all but I think he may learn from past mistakes and become a better manager. I can only hope so. IMO the Yankee management like him because he is a corporate guy and doesn’t make waves. Cashman can dominate him, he does what he’s told, etc. He’s not the worst manager in baseball and not the best.
    ——————-

    It’s the trend in baseball – General Managers want managers who will execute an organizational philosophy that looks at long term goals vs short term ones.

    For example, Joe Torre would blow out a guy like Scott Proctor if he thought it would get the Yankees wins in one year. If the kid got hurt, well they can replace him next year. Joe Girardi will be more sensative to ensuring that David Robertson is around for several years to come.

  33. 108 stitches October 28th, 2010 at 12:21 pm

    Next on the agenda is to get the pitching coach in place along with the rest of the coaching staff.

    Can’t do anthing about the contracts of Derek and Mariano until 5 days after the WS is finished.

  34. Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 12:22 pm

    Pardon the language… but WTF is incarcerated bob? Is he a relative of cool heist Fletcher?

  35. pat October 28th, 2010 at 12:23 pm

    “No surprise on Girardi, I am not a huge fan at all ”

    What was the last thing the Yankees did that you were a fan of?

  36. Vineyard Yankee October 28th, 2010 at 12:24 pm

    Not even anyone else considered, sad. The brass must love Girardi and all his quirky BS that comes with him.

  37. blake October 28th, 2010 at 12:24 pm

    I think Casey is more of a trade deadline move than an offseason one for the yanks…I really think they will go with their young guys for the bench roles to start out the year to both save money and to see what they can do.

  38. JM October 28th, 2010 at 12:24 pm

    Hard to get good, reliable info in prison.

  39. Dylan October 28th, 2010 at 12:25 pm

    # Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 12:22 pm

    Pardon the language… but WTF is incarcerated bob? Is he a relative of cool heist Fletcher?
    _____________________________________________________________________

    Haha some guy who “breaks stories” (or actually makes them up) about sports on twitter and seems to have a cult following.

  40. Erin October 28th, 2010 at 12:25 pm

    SI_JonHeyman girardi’s salary and postseason bonuses were bumped up. i guess he isnt as offended as joe torre by incentives.

  41. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 12:26 pm

    When Girardi was sitting players all year he incessantly made reference to them needing rest and keeping them healthy. Yet, in an interview post-game with Yes recently, I think it was after the Minnesota series, Girardi said that he sat players who were banged up, injured, but never just to rest them. That notwithstanding, it didn’t seem to work did it whatever you want to call it? The team looked really tired at the end of the year, Sabathia and Pettitte were hurt, A-Rod, Swisher, Tex, Posada, all banged up with various ailments.

    Next year, we can expect more of the same, with an older Jeter, A-Rod and Posada still on the team. It makes our bench needs all the more important. Last year Cashman and Girardi looked at is as an afterthought. I hope they realize that in 2011 it shouldn’t be. You can’t have hitting zeros like Peña be your first call to replace A-Rod. But, granted it is hard as not many players who are good hitters want to come here to sit on the Yankees bench.

  42. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 12:27 pm

    With all due respect it’s not untrue. He had four years in the minors, a few spring trainings and was called up repeatedly in September and just never showed that he was good enough to DH or to be a significant trade piece.

    Not true. He OPS’d 1.000 and hit over .300 in both of his september callups prior to 2010 with great power. Slugged .500 and .667 in limited ABs. It is patently untrue to suggest he did not show anything. He had very good minor league seasons, he was asked to improve against LHP in 2010 and he did. He was never given a fair shake at the majors, but thats ok because his only spot would be a backup for Tex or DH. They need to trade him.

  43. Erin October 28th, 2010 at 12:27 pm

    Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 12:22 pm
    Pardon the language? but WTF is incarcerated bob? Is he a relative of cool heist Fletcher?

    ************************
    Cashmoney-just some idiot with a twitter account who always has breaking news (but is very seldom correct)

  44. pat October 28th, 2010 at 12:28 pm

    David Price winner of Players Choice AL Outstanding Pitcher award says he voted for CC. :smile:

  45. sunny615 October 28th, 2010 at 12:30 pm

    I’m “meh” on Girardi. Personally, I would have preferred someone else but we’ll see.

    I really hope Harkey does not become pitching coach. I’m not thrilled with him either. Dave Duncan signed a 2 yr extension with the Cards (smart move by the Cards) and honestly, I don’t know who else would be a great fit. Works well with vets and young arms…?

  46. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 12:32 pm

    pat October 28th, 2010 at 12:23 pm

    “No surprise on Girardi, I am not a huge fan at all ”

    What was the last thing the Yankees did that you were a fan of?

    ************
    Lots of things. I loved the acquisitions of Teixeira and Sabathia. I love Swisher and think he’s a big asset. I think Cashman was right on the Thames move. Cashman did a good job bringing in Wood and Berkman. I applaud them for not trading Cano and Montero and for the internal development and promotion of Phil Hughes. I like the way they don’t burn out bullpen guys. I like lots of things.

  47. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 12:34 pm

    Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 12:27 pm

    Not true. He OPS’d 1.000 and hit over .300 in both of his september callups prior to 2010 with great power. Slugged .500 and .667 in limited ABs. It is patently untrue to suggest he did not show anything. He had very good minor league seasons, he was asked to improve against LHP in 2010 and he did. He was never given a fair shake at the majors, but thats ok because his only spot would be a backup for Tex or DH. They need to trade him.

    ****************

    If that were the case, why did Cashman feel the need to bring in Berkman, a left-handed hitting DH?

  48. NDYankee October 28th, 2010 at 12:36 pm

    Let’s get Leo Mazzone as our pitching coach.

  49. RSM October 28th, 2010 at 12:37 pm

    They do NOT have to wait until 5 days after the WS to negotiate with Mo and Jeter. A team can negotiate with their own free agents anytime.

  50. Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 12:38 pm

    If that were the case, why did Cashman feel the need to bring in Berkman, a left-handed hitting DH?
    ———
    WC, I am not jerk. But the answer is obvious, Berkman gives more a certainty over a relative rookie like Miranda down the stretch in a pennat race who in fact hasn’t been given ample opportunities on the ML level. That’s the way Yankees operates.

  51. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 12:38 pm

    If that were the case, why did Cashman feel the need to bring in Berkman, a left-handed hitting DH?

    Well it is the case, there is no IF. You can’t take back his good 08 and 09 call ups or his strong minor league numbers. The problem in 2010 is that when he was given intermittent play time he did not play well, and the Yankees always favor veterans over rookies. If the Yankees had a big cushion all year, its possible Miranda might have been given more consistent play time. As it stands, the yankees were fighting an uphill battle and went with a known vs an unknown.

  52. Shame Spencer October 28th, 2010 at 12:38 pm

    raymagnetic October 28th, 2010 at 12:14 pm

    I’m not going to waste my time making a comment about this contract renewal.

    ———————-

    Irony?

  53. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 12:39 pm

    The Yankees just won a World Series last year – you can’t seriously expect them to walk away from the manager who got them there a year later.

  54. NDYankee October 28th, 2010 at 12:39 pm

    Just saw this: http://hardballtalk.nbcsports......ing-coach/

    Make it happen Cash!

  55. YankFanCA October 28th, 2010 at 12:41 pm

    Vineyard — I agree. Why not put a few candidates through some interviews? Girardi was always going to be there. His very poor work in September and October should have at least sent up a yellow (if not red) flag.

  56. Erin October 28th, 2010 at 12:41 pm

    RiverAveBlues The answer to our trivia question ( http://bit.ly/bXxPbm ) is Joe Girardi. His 287 wins are tops in the majors since 2008.

  57. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 12:44 pm

    Mazzone doesn’t fit the organization’s philosophy.

    The Yankees preach inning limits and pitch counts while Leo promotes lots of work. You can’t have one philosophy throughout the minors and then a completely different one in the bigs.

  58. blake October 28th, 2010 at 12:45 pm

    Mazzone was really good writing down the names Maddux, Smoltz, and Glavine. Im just not sure he’s the answer.

  59. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 12:45 pm

    I respect your opinions we just see Miranda differently. I think at 27 years of age the Yankees management have had ample information gathering opportunities. And other clubs have never seemed to value him much either, I can’t recall having heard his name mentioned in the trade rumor mill. Thanks for the discussion. I hope for his sake he gets to go elsewhere and have a great career.

  60. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 12:45 pm

    YankFanCA October 28th, 2010 at 12:41 pm
    Vineyard — I agree. Why not put a few candidates through some interviews? Girardi was always going to be there. His very poor work in September and October should have at least sent up a yellow (if not red) flag.
    ————————-

    Because it’s a waste of time.

    The Yankees are happy with Girardi.

  61. joeman October 28th, 2010 at 12:45 pm

    possible they will sign Werth and trade Swish in a package for a SP

  62. pat October 28th, 2010 at 12:45 pm

    WCYF

    Thanks. It’s easier for me to take negative comments more seriously from people who scatter in positives too.

  63. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 12:45 pm

    Miranda’s a free agent – he certainly will not be coming back.

  64. Tarheel In NYC October 28th, 2010 at 12:46 pm

    Shame Spencer October 28th, 2010 at 12:38 pm

    raymagnetic October 28th, 2010 at 12:14 pm

    I’m not going to waste my time making a comment about this contract renewal.

    ———————-

    Irony?
    _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

    :-D My thought exactly.

  65. Giuseppe Franco October 28th, 2010 at 12:47 pm

    Swisher is going nowhere. Neither is Gardner nor Granderson.

    Focus on the pitching staff if you want to make wholesale changes.

  66. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 12:49 pm

    The only way Swish or Gardner get moved is if the Yankees strike out on Lee and need to include one of them to get a front-line starter.

  67. Doreen October 28th, 2010 at 12:51 pm

    Erin -

    AH!! I should have typed my guess. I was right. :)

  68. joeman October 28th, 2010 at 12:52 pm

    # Giuseppe Franco October 28th, 2010 at 12:47 pm

    Swisher is going nowhere. Neither is Gardner nor Granderson.

    Focus on the pitching staff if you want to make wholesale changes.
    —————————————-
    I just did….joe

  69. JCPD October 28th, 2010 at 12:52 pm

    blake October 28th, 2010 at 12:45 pm
    Mazzone was really good writing down the names Maddux, Smoltz, and Glavine. Im just not sure he’s the answer.

    ——————————————————————————

    That’s true blake, but you do have to give him some credit. Smoltz and Glavine were not HOFers when they came up and pitchers like Neagle and Ortiz had their best season with him if I recall correctly. That being said, I’d rather not have him on board.

  70. blake October 28th, 2010 at 12:52 pm

    Gardner maybe because he’s cheap….anybody willing to trade a good pitcher does so because they can’t afford them. Swisher is nearing 30 and is in his free agency years….he doesn’t help teams that want to get younger and cheaper.

  71. blake October 28th, 2010 at 12:54 pm

    JCPD,

    That’s all true but im just not sure he’s a great fit due to age and some of the reasons chip already mentioned.

  72. pat October 28th, 2010 at 12:54 pm

    Mazzone’s rocking would annoy me.

  73. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 12:56 pm

    blake October 28th, 2010 at 12:52 pm
    Gardner maybe because he’s cheap….anybody willing to trade a good pitcher does so because they can’t afford them. Swisher is nearing 30 and is in his free agency years….he doesn’t help teams that want to get younger and cheaper.
    ——————

    Depends – if a team has a pitcher under a long term contract (for example Fausto Carmona) they would consider Swisher’s 1 year 9.5 mil a bargain. not advocating for or against Carmona, just using his situation as an example

  74. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 12:57 pm

    The Yankees will have control of Miranda for two more seasons, he has only been in the minor league system for 4 years. The Yankees have had good opportunity to assess Miranda, but they have had no room on the roster for him for the past 3 seasons.

    He has OPS’d over .800 at every level, and you have no idea how another club might value him.

  75. Erin October 28th, 2010 at 12:57 pm

    Doreen October 28th, 2010 at 12:51 pm
    Erin -

    AH!! I should have typed my guess. I was right

    ****************************
    Doreen- maybe he’s not quite as bad a manager as some would have you believe. ;)

  76. Giuseppe Franco October 28th, 2010 at 12:57 pm

    # joeman October 28th, 2010 at 12:52 pm

    I just did….joe

    ———–

    Perhaps you’re new to baseball so I guess I need to explain that you can’t include one of the core members of the team in a trade they have no intention of dealing.

  77. blake October 28th, 2010 at 12:59 pm

    Chip,

    That’s true but in general teams like the Indians are rebuilding and 1 year of Swisher at a good price really doesn’t help them.a whole lot. Young cost controlled players that they can control.for several years and build on are usually what they are after.

  78. Doreen October 28th, 2010 at 12:59 pm

    Of course Mazzone would like a job with the Mets or Yankees. Who wouldn’t? :)
    ***

    I kinda have to agree with WCYF about Miranda. He was given a number of opportunities over the last couple of years. But he never really took the bull by the horns. He had a couple of nice plate appearances, but I think overall disappointed.

    When you’re in the position he’s in you have to make the most of your opportunities and he didn’t It could be simply because it’s difficult to be productive when you’re a better player playing every day, but that’s not going to happen here with most of these young guys.

  79. Doreen October 28th, 2010 at 1:00 pm

    Erin -

    :)

  80. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:01 pm

    Jerkface -

    The Yankees signed Miranda to a 4yr 2.07 mil contract in 2007. The last year of that contract was 2010.

    (per Cot’s Baseball Contracts)

  81. JCPD October 28th, 2010 at 1:01 pm

    Agreed blake, I don’t think he’d be a good fit. I’d also prefer going with someone younger and “fresher”

  82. MG October 28th, 2010 at 1:02 pm

    I haven’t watched any of the World Series (nor do I intend to) but all you have to do is look at the Giants to realize that the entire postseason is a complete crapshoot. The World Series winner is whichever team in the playoffs can sustain a hot streak through three consecutive series (or whichever team faces a team about to go into a cold streak).

    You can sit here all day and come up with ways to make the Yankees better, it really doesn’t matter much. The 2010 team was as capable of reaching (and winning) the World Series as any of the others, there is no way they are inferior to the Giants. It’s just a matter of who is healthy, who is hot, and who comes up big at the right time (something there is no way of knowing). The 2011 Yankees will be capable of winning the World Series no matter how they are configured, it’s just a matter of getting to the playoffs and being on a roll at the right time.

  83. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:04 pm

    He was given a number of opportunities over the last couple of years. But he never really took the bull by the horns

    This is just untrue!!

    08: .400 .500 .500 1.000
    09: .333 .333 .667 1.000 , including a walk off

    What more do you want????

    It is inaccurate to say he got a number of opportunities or somehow failed to impress. What is true is that in 2010 he failed to impress in what amounted to, 3 separate call ups. Once in may, once in july, and then in september. Often times he was only called on to pinch hit.

    You guys are acting like he was the starting DH for this team and failed. You can’t judge a player on 15 games. Jeter hit .250 .294 .375 .669 in 15 games to start his career, how did that work out?

  84. MG October 28th, 2010 at 1:05 pm

    I don’t think Miranda is a potential star but most likely could play regularly for a bunch of MLB teams, just not the Yankees because he plays the wrong position and gives no flexibility defensively.

    It has nothing to do with whether he is capable or not as the blog troll keeps trying to point out.

  85. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 1:05 pm

    GF, this year is all about fine tuning the pitching staff. That’s what’s needed. Move out the Gaudins, Mitres and Moseleys and bring in the best of the young starters from scranton to fill those roles and learn about pitching from Rivera, sabathia, Pettitte and Lee (if they’re on the team).

    As far as the ones complaining about not picking up the likes of Jeremy Hermeda, are you kidding? He can’t field, he can’t hit and he can’t run the bases and he’s been dumped by 3 teams in one year. As fair as picking up these waiver claims on AL, these same wizards seem to forget that NYYs were the last team in the league to be allowed to make the claims. Texas picked before the Yankees and since most of them came from the NL, they were not going to get to NYYs anyway.

    The Yankees aren’t going to entice starting players to sign with them just to ride the bench and accept the “honor” of being yankees and not play. It’s about as stupid as expecting a guy like Soriano to go from top closer to 8th inning guy because it’s the Yankees.

    The same with those that have decided that Laird, Montero, Nunez can’t play in NY next year. These guys are going to get more playing time than most young players usually get. NYYs aren’t sticking $12-15 mil into bench players.

    I’m seriously thinking about talking about baseball with my twins. They make more sense than these “experts”.

  86. RayVT October 28th, 2010 at 1:07 pm

    Erin October 28th, 2010 at 12:25 pm
    SI_JonHeyman girardi?s salary and postseason bonuses were bumped up. i guess he isnt as offended as joe torre by incentives.

    Hello Erin! Joe Torre wasn’t offended by bonuses, he was offended after 10 yrs of playoffs that his salary was cut significantly and bonuses were tied to try & justify the cuts for a 1 yr salary. It was a slap in the face & an easy way to get rid of him as a lame duck manager.

  87. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:07 pm

    Chip: Contracts and service time and club control are all different things. Miranda’s first team in MLB is the Yankees. They signed him to a contract and he was placed in the minors. The only thing which might necessitate Miranda’s leave from the team is running out of minor league options (due to his contract possibly being a major league one)

    His contract expiring does not mean he would be a free agent, because the yankees retain control of him for 6 years at the major league and minor league level.

  88. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 1:07 pm

    I think one thing that is lost in all the speculation regarding what the Yankees might do or not do – is the unanticipated and impossible to predict perspective of other ball clubs.

    As an example, one can reasonably speculate that the Yankees due to budget and personnel considerations won’t be moving a Granderson Gardner or Swisher, etc. But. what if a general manager contacts Cashman and asks about one of them, or wants to dump salary for a good player, or is interested in some of our minor league pitching and catching talent. This could precipitate a deal that was not necessarily predicated on the Yankees internal evaluation of what their “needs” are. Depends on the deal right?

    For instance, never happen, but as an example, what if Seattle called and decided to start over and wanted to talk Cano for King Felix as the baseline for a deal? Or St. Louis who keeps falling short was interested in Gardner, Montero and others and were willing to talk Carpenter or Wainwright?

    You never know what another club might instigate.

  89. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:08 pm

    blake October 28th, 2010 at 12:59 pm
    Chip,

    That’s true but in general teams like the Indians are rebuilding and 1 year of Swisher at a good price really doesn’t help them.a whole lot. Young cost controlled players that they can control.for several years and build on are usually what they are after.
    ——————–

    Well right – but an organization’s impressions of a player can change from the time they signed him.

    Sticking with the example, the Indians could internally question whether Carmona will live up to the 33 mil he has coming to him over the next 3 years and whether that money could be better spent elsewhere. Or they may decide that they have a greater need at 1b or in the OF where Swisher could fill and then at the trade deadline try to turn Swisher into good prospects from a team making a playoff push.

    Another way to view Swisher’s value is that you could have a team with very deep pitching options that doesn’t have great position players.

    It would never happen but just to use as an example – Tampa. They’re very deep in their rotation with more young starters waiting in the wings. But they’re about to lose possibly both their LF and 1b, both of whom represent significant offensive production. The Yankees could offer them Swisher for one of their arbitration eligible pitchers like Matt Garza or James Sheilds.

    The Rays fill in the gap left by the departing Garza with Towsend and the pick-up of Swisher prevents them from having to give a long term contract to a Carlos Pena.

  90. Robin October 28th, 2010 at 1:09 pm

    Me first! Me first!

    FIRE GIRARDI!

  91. ac1 October 28th, 2010 at 1:10 pm

    cano is not going anywhere, no matter what pitcher he can bring back

  92. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:10 pm

    Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:07 pm
    Chip: Contracts and service time and club control are all different things. Miranda’s first team in MLB is the Yankees. They signed him to a contract and he was placed in the minors. The only thing which might necessitate Miranda’s leave from the team is running out of minor league options (due to his contract possibly being a major league one)

    His contract expiring does not mean he would be a free agent, because the yankees retain control of him for 6 years at the major league and minor league level.
    —————

    That’s not the case when you’re talking about signing a player to a major league contract – which is what they did.

    Miranda’s contract is no different than the contracts given to Matsui or Igawa. He’s not subject to the same service time protocols as a Jesus Montero.

  93. YankFanCA October 28th, 2010 at 1:11 pm

    There was no need for urgency to re-up with Girardi. But, hey, if they think he’s the best out there, then so be it. Sensible people can disagree on this.

  94. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:11 pm

    Yes he is, Chip. Brackman has a major league deal. All that happens is that he has to be on the 40-man and subsequently burns his minor league options.

  95. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:13 pm

    YankFanCA October 28th, 2010 at 1:11 pm
    There was no need for urgency to re-up with Girardi. But, hey, if they think he’s the best out there, then so be it. Sensible people can disagree on this.
    ——————

    Sure there was. The Yankees have a lot of things that they need to take care of. Why waste time messing around with interviewing other managers if Ownership and the General Manager were happy with the manager they have in house?

    Now that his contract is done Cashman is freed up to deal with the agents for Jeter and Mo, get a pitching coach in place and then move on with the business of shaping the 2011 roster.

  96. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:14 pm

    Cuban free agents are no different than Dominican free agents are no different than venezuelan free agents.

  97. Doreen October 28th, 2010 at 1:14 pm

    jerkface -

    No. I’m not acting like that at all. And I said, it may just be a function of not playing quite enough, but apparently he did not impress enough to get more time to play. Maybe it’s simply that they weren’t comfortable with him in the outfield and Tex played just about every day. I don’t know.

    The numbers you post – I can never decipher them, because I don’t remember what they mean – they look like good numbers. But they don’t reflect the overall impression I had.

    All I’m saying is that in the opportunities Miranda had he didn’t really make enough of a difference to get more of a chance.

    Maybe you’re right – maybe he didn’t have enough opportunities. But my point is when you’re a guy like Miranda you have to really be outstanding and he didn’t leave me with that impression. Maybe I was expecting too much based on what everyone here said about his being born to play at Yankee Stadium with the short porch and his perfect swing to reach it. Maybe people here actually built him up too much so that when he didn’t hit all those HRs to the short porch that we were waiting for, we were disappointed. Maybe expectations were set too high.

  98. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:14 pm

    Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:11 pm
    Yes he is, Chip. Brackman has a major league deal. All that happens is that he has to be on the 40-man and subsequently burns his minor league options.
    —————

    And to keep Brackman the Yankees had to pick up his option earlier this week.

  99. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:17 pm

    Thats not how it works, Chip. Brackman has options built into his deal so that the yankees don’t have to tangle with arbitration. Look at Josh Beckett. He got a 4 year major league deal, and then was ARBITRATION ELIGIBLE for the Marlins.

  100. blake October 28th, 2010 at 1:17 pm

    Chip, fair enough. I just don’t see them dealing Swisher but you never know I guess.

  101. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:17 pm

    Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:14 pm
    Cuban free agents are no different than Dominican free agents are no different than venezuelan free agents.
    —————

    The deals they sign often are though given their age.

    Let me put it to you this way – the Yankees paid Miranda 2.07 mil over the last four years – that concludes the terms of the contract so what does Miranda get paid in 2011?

  102. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:18 pm

    Signing baseball deals does not automatically exempt you from the service time requirements of the MLB. If that were true, do you think Evan Longoria signs a minor league deal with the Rays? Or does he sign a 1 year major league deal?

  103. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:18 pm

    He gets tendered a contract, just like Josh Beckett.

  104. BIG AL October 28th, 2010 at 1:19 pm

    Gil Patterson for pitching coach, he’d make a difference with this staff.

  105. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:19 pm

    Chip, please review Josh Becketts contract history so that you can put this issue to bed.

  106. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:20 pm

    Jerkface…

    When Hideki Matsui left Japan he signed with the Yankees for 3 years $21 mil. After 3 years the Yankees needed to sign him to a new contract. But he had only accumulated 3 years of major league service time so why did the Yankees need to re-sign him?

  107. raymagnetic October 28th, 2010 at 1:21 pm

    Shame, Tarheel

    Read the post 3/4 posts before mine from the poster who said he wouldn’t complain but complained anyway.

  108. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:21 pm

    Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:18 pm
    He gets tendered a contract, just like Josh Beckett.
    —————-

    You can’t compare drafted players with international free agents.

  109. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:22 pm

    contract included clause requiring Yankees to sign Matsui to an extension by Nov. 11, 2005, or release him (effectively granting Matsui free agency after 3 years)

  110. RayVT October 28th, 2010 at 1:22 pm

    GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 1:05 pm

    AMEN! LOL! I agree that Laird, Montero, & Nunez will be in NY in 2011 & I think they start the season there!

  111. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:23 pm

    I can when the drafted player is granted a major league deal. All a major league deal does is force a player to be put on the 40 man and start accruing service time and burning options.

  112. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:23 pm

    Ichiro: re-signed by Seattle 12/03 (avoided arbitration)

  113. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:24 pm

    Please Chip, just stop, you’re wrong on this one. The only thing that will be stopping the Yankees from keeping Miranda is their lack of room for him on the roster if he is out of options.

  114. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:25 pm

    Jerkface –

    To put an end to this argument let me put it this way:

    If I’m right – and Miranda’s a free agent – the Yankees won’t re-sign him and he’s a free agent

    If you’re right – and Miranda needs to be tendered a contract – the Yankees will non-tender him to get him off the 40 man roster and he’s a free agent

    Either way, we have spent more time discussing the contract status of Juan Miranda than Juan Miranda will spend with the Yankees in 2011.

  115. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:26 pm

    Well you’re not right. Lets agree on that regardless of Miranda’s future yankee status.

  116. Giuseppe Franco October 28th, 2010 at 1:27 pm

    # GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 1:05 pm

    GF, this year is all about fine tuning the pitching staff. That’s what’s needed. Move out the Gaudins, Mitres and Moseleys and bring in the best of the young starters from scranton to fill those roles and learn about pitching from Rivera, sabathia, Pettitte and Lee (if they’re on the team).

    As far as the ones complaining about not picking up the likes of Jeremy Hermeda, are you kidding? He can’t field, he can’t hit and he can’t run the bases and he’s been dumped by 3 teams in one year. As fair as picking up these waiver claims on AL, these same wizards seem to forget that NYYs were the last team in the league to be allowed to make the claims. Texas picked before the Yankees and since most of them came from the NL, they were not going to get to NYYs anyway.

    The Yankees aren’t going to entice starting players to sign with them just to ride the bench and accept the “honor” of being yankees and not play. It’s about as stupid as expecting a guy like Soriano to go from top closer to 8th inning guy because it’s the Yankees.

    The same with those that have decided that Laird, Montero, Nunez can’t play in NY next year. These guys are going to get more playing time than most young players usually get. NYYs aren’t sticking $12-15 mil into bench players.

    I’m seriously thinking about talking about baseball with my twins. They make more sense than these “experts”.

    ————-

    GB,

    That’s not a bad thought. I have 4 yr old triplet nieces and I may just ask them what they think of potential Yankee offseason moves.

    There’s no question we’re going to see an influx of youngsters getting opportunities with the big club next season. It was a banner year for the Yankee farm system so seeing what these guys can do next season against major leaguers is inevitable.

    Although I think it’s a long shot, I would like to see them try to retain Wood. He’ll probably get a closer’s job somewhere else but perhaps he liked playing on the big stage and pitching in the postseason enough that he’ll want to play for a perennial winner at this stage in his career.

    They’ll solve quite a few of their rotation issues if they do manage to nab Lee and Pettitte decides to return.

    I’m with you, I could do without the Gaudins, Moseleys, and Ponsons of the world pitching crucial games for this team next season.

  117. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:28 pm

    RayVT October 28th, 2010 at 1:22 pm
    GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 1:05 pm

    AMEN! LOL! I agree that Laird, Montero, & Nunez will be in NY in 2011 & I think they start the season there!
    —————

    Montero and Nunez I agree with since their are natural fits – Montero at catcher and Nunez replacing Pena – but Laird would need to have a really amazing spring to force his way onto the 25.

    I think right now – without taking into account free agents – he would come into spring training needing to substantially beat out Kevin Russo since Russo can play all the same spots Laird can and is more advanced than Laird right now.

  118. Doreen October 28th, 2010 at 1:30 pm

    GB & Giuseppe -

    I’m okay with Moseley. But I think I’m over Mitre.

  119. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:31 pm

    Miranda is out of options, even receiving a 4th option year due to having less than 5 years of pro experience. He will be non-tendered, or tendered and given a backup role on the team. The first is more likely.

  120. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:33 pm

    You can’t just promote “the best young arms” from the minors and roll with that as your bullpen.

    There is a lot to be said for having veterans in a bullpen who aren’t going to get rattled, who know the league and who have been through pressure situations before.

    I would bring in Randy Choate and Scott Downs – give the pen three left handed relievers (along with Logan) who have experience and success dealing with the hitters in the AL East.

    I keep Mosley – he’s a decent long reliever and a viable spot starter.

    I go with a pen of:
    RHP – Mariano, Joba, Robertson, Mosley
    LHP – Logan, Choate, Downs

    Downs can also serve as the primary set-up man to Rivera if Joba and Robertson again falter in that role.

  121. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:34 pm

    Scott Downs is a type A free agent, not worth losing a 1st round pick over.

  122. MConti October 28th, 2010 at 1:34 pm

    Why are some so ready to get rid of Swisher? I don’t get it. Obviously he underperformed in the playoffs, but does anyone realize that it was probably due to the issues he was having in his knee?

    It is extremely easy to fall into bad habits when one body part isn’t working in concert with the rest of it.

    Let’s face it, the Yankees got beat by a team that was in better health and playing better in a 6 game series of the LCS. It wasn’t like they collapsed and fell apart at the end of the season, missing the playoffs.

    I think some people on this board need to go root for the Mets for a while to realize what a treat it is to root for a team that goes to every extent to bring a winner to the fan base.

    I’d much rather see what Nova, Laird, Montero and Nunez can do with extended at-bats then trading away Swisher for the young pitcher de jour. Cashman and Oppenheimer have put the effort into the system to bring into the top 10. Do you realize what an accomplishment that is when it is combined with the Yankees ability to outspend everyone else because of their revenue streams?

    The playoffs will still be a crapshoot, but the Yankees significant advantage is going to start appearing if any of these players in the minors being to pan out and take roles (albeit marginal at the start) with the big league club.

  123. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:35 pm

    I’d rather go after Benoit, Fuentes, or a guy like Wil Ohman.

  124. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 1:35 pm

    Ray, not sure if all three start in NY, but, 2 of them will. Laird is playing at his 3rd level this year now and overall, hitting close to .290. He’s probably the least likely to start the season in NY, but, Nunez did everything he needed to do after his call-up and far outshined Pena in every area.

    Montero, right now is head and shoulders over Cervelli and at worse could equal Posada’s 2009 numbers with the bat. Those that constantly yammer about him not being any good on defense haven’t even seen him, and he certainly can’t be any worse than Cervelli was. He’s a little rough on defense, but, he’s not brutal. at worse he gives them the 2009 version of Posada at bat and behind the plate. He also gets the undivided attention of Tony Pena this spring.

    Laird, if he plays well in the outfield this fall, he’ll have a crack at the Yankees in 2011 when they go north. There’s room for both him and Golson on the team. Being able to play four spots is huge. The only issue is that it’s an entirely right handed hitting bench unless Laird is replacing one of the regs, which would put one of the switch hitters or left handed batters on the bench that day.

  125. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 1:36 pm

    Why would the Yankees bring Montero north in April and lose 2014 as an arbitration kickoff date? They are too patient and business oriented to do so, all they have to do is wait until the end of May I think.

  126. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:37 pm

    Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:34 pm
    Scott Downs is a type A free agent, not worth losing a 1st round pick over.
    ——————

    If you sign Cliff Lee then it doesn’t cost you a first round pick. Costs you a second round pick. Yankees are already going to get compensation picks for Javy Vazquez and Kerry Wood – so that offsets the pick they would lose for Downs.

  127. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:37 pm

    The Yankees don’t nickel and dime their minor leaguers on arbitration dates. They bring the best squads north.

  128. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:38 pm

    West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 1:36 pm
    Why would the Yankees bring Montero north in April and lose 2014 as an arbitration kickoff date? They are too patient and business oriented to do so, all they have to do is wait until the end of May I think.
    ——————————-

    When have the Yankees ever worried about arbitration dates? If a kid is ready to go north and can help the team then he goes north.

  129. Doreen October 28th, 2010 at 1:40 pm

    If Montero doesn’t come north with the team, it’s because they’ll think he should get some regular work in to start the season, not because of money/contract/arbitration issues.

    I can’t recall an instance where the Yankees worked that way.

  130. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 1:40 pm

    Doreen, Moseley did quite well replacing Pettitte in the rotation, but, by the time he saw teams the 2nd time, he was no mystery. I suppose, though, if NYYs keep one of them, he’s the one. I’d rather see the Yanks break in the young pitchers in the bullpen the first year as opposed to the rotation, though.

  131. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:40 pm

    If you sign Cliff Lee then it doesn’t cost you a first round pick. Costs you a second round pick. Yankees are already going to get compensation picks for Javy Vazquez and Kerry Wood – so that offsets the pick they would lose for Downs.

    They’re not offering arbitration to Javy. And Scott Downs isn’t worth a 2nd round pick either. They will probably offer arb to Kerry Wood. I don’t think relievers are worth losing picks over.

  132. blake October 28th, 2010 at 1:41 pm

    Well one reason is because the experience he receives in April and May could help him adjust quicker and pay off in the 2nd half….

  133. CB October 28th, 2010 at 1:41 pm

    If the Yankees chose to Juan Miranda would still be under team control for two more seasons. The major league deal he signed has no impact on the 6 years of service time he has to put in before becoming a free agent.

    Because he didn’t play in a recognized professional league his major league contract is functionally no different than the major league contract amateur players often sign when they are drafted.

    Miranda is however out of minor league options. As such either the yankees put him on the major league roster out of spring training next season or they lose him.

    He’ll likely be traded this winter. He just doesn’t have a place on the roster next season.

    Next year’s draft is setting up to potentially be one of the best in recent history. Any team that signs a guy like Scott Downs who is a type A free agent would be foolish to do so because he would not only cost money but a first or second round draft pick in next year’s draft. Cliff Lee – you don’t think twice about the pick. Scott Downs – not a good move just given the draft pick compensation (never mind how problematic signing those kinds of relievers are on the free agent market.)

  134. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:42 pm

    Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:35 pm
    I’d rather go after Benoit, Fuentes, or a guy like Wil Ohman.
    —————–

    Pass on Benoit – I’m not buying his Tampa season. Certainly not at the price he’s going to be selling it for.

    Fuentes is going to look for a closer’s job

    Wil Ohman is fine – I picked Choate over him because Choate has had success in the AL East and Ohman has not.

  135. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:43 pm

    Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:40 pm
    If you sign Cliff Lee then it doesn’t cost you a first round pick. Costs you a second round pick. Yankees are already going to get compensation picks for Javy Vazquez and Kerry Wood – so that offsets the pick they would lose for Downs.

    They’re not offering arbitration to Javy. And Scott Downs isn’t worth a 2nd round pick either. They will probably offer arb to Kerry Wood. I don’t think relievers are worth losing picks over.
    —–

    You are certainly entitled to that opinion.

  136. Betsy October 28th, 2010 at 1:43 pm

    Eh, I would rather Joe not have returned……..

  137. Giuseppe Franco October 28th, 2010 at 1:43 pm

    How would the Yanks get compensation picks for Vazquez and Wood if they aren’t going to offer either arbitration?

    They lost Abreu, Matsui, and Damon without getting any compensation picks in return.

  138. Tarheel In NYC October 28th, 2010 at 1:44 pm

    Raymagnetic,

    All in good fun :) I’ve seen enough of your posts to know what you meant. It just made me chuckle a little bit while sitting here and eating lunch at my desk.

    And you are correct…what’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

  139. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:45 pm

    You want to pay Downs more than 4 mil a year and lose a pick? I just don’t think thats good business. Benoit is going to get less than Downs.

  140. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 1:45 pm

    How many days until Spring Training? lol

  141. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:45 pm

    Giuseppe Franco October 28th, 2010 at 1:43 pm
    How would the Yanks get compensation picks for Vazquez and Wood if they aren’t going to offer either arbitration?

    They lost Abreu, Matsui, and Damon without getting any compensation picks in return.
    —————

    Part of the reason the Yankees traded for Javy was that they were hoping they would get picks for him if they went after a big time player this winter – now him stinking up the joint may have changed that plan.

    The Yankees could still, in theory, offer Javy arbitration and then trade him much the way Atlanta did with Soriano last winter.

  142. Tyler October 28th, 2010 at 1:45 pm

    Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:37 pm
    Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:34 pm
    Scott Downs is a type A free agent, not worth losing a 1st round pick over.
    ——————

    If you sign Cliff Lee then it doesn’t cost you a first round pick. Costs you a second round pick. Yankees are already going to get compensation picks for Javy Vazquez and Kerry Wood – so that offsets the pick they would lose for Downs.
    ————————

    They aren’t going to get compensation for Wood or Vazquez as they either won’t offer arbitration or pick up their contracts. The Yanks very rarely get supplemental draft picks because of the risk of these guys accepting contract offers. if they are really that good the Yanks just keep them. If not then they just let them walk.

  143. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 1:46 pm

    Over the years, the only player that NYY has offered arbitration to was Pettitte in 2003. That’s how they got Hughes.

  144. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:46 pm

    How would the Yanks get compensation picks for Vazquez and Wood if they aren’t going to offer either arbitration?

    I think they will offer Wood arbitration. There won’t be a fear that he will accept because he is only a Type-B, which means other teams will bid for his services as a closer.

    Worst case scenario he accepts and they have Kerry Wood next year as a setup man.

  145. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:47 pm

    They didn’t offer Arb to Matsui, Damon, or Abreu both all 3 would have won raises / high salary in Arbitration.

  146. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:47 pm

    Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:45 pm
    You want to pay Downs more than 4 mil a year and lose a pick? I just don’t think thats good business. Benoit is going to get less than Downs.
    ——————-

    1. I didn’t say I wanted to pay Downs 4 mil a year
    2. Benoit is going to get less than Downs because Downs is a better pitcher than Benoit.

    The Yankees could also spend less and try to sign Braden Looper instead of Cliff Lee – I wouldn’t advocate going that route either.

  147. Tyler October 28th, 2010 at 1:47 pm

    I’ve never been in love with Scott Downs. I just feel like spending big money on bullpen guys (unless its Mo) is pretty dumb. It’s an absolute toss up year to year on most of these guys. Marte was one of the best leftys in the game in the pen and know he can’t even stay on the field. I like bringing up bullpen guys from the system. Converting these guys who probably won’t make it as starters in the big leagues to relievers is a good strategy (like they did with Phil Coke). I’d like to see them do it with DJ Mitchell and maybe look at Brackman as the closer of the future.

  148. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:48 pm

    Downs is going to get more than 4 million per year. Do you still sign him?

  149. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 1:48 pm

    The only thing Vazquez is going to get is a handshake and the door being opened for him.

  150. CB October 28th, 2010 at 1:49 pm

    The Giants came very close to not qualifying for the playoffs this year because they foolishly kept Buster Posey in the minors far longer than was necessary from a development stand point because they were trying to set back his service time.

    The yankees are unlikely to make that kind of mistake with Montero. If he doesn’t go North out of spring training it’s because they feel he needs more minor league games or want him to get off to a strong start against minor pitching. He just turned 21 and as a catcher has a lot of defensive responsibilities and issues to worry about. Letting him get off to a strong start in the minors seems like a prudent strategy so that he doesn’t have to worry as much about hitting while he’s trying to work on his defensive game.

  151. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:49 pm

    Ok, let’s say for the sake of argument that the Yankees don’t offer Javy or Wood arbitration and do sign Lee and Downs.

    They replace those lost draft picks the way the Yankees always do:

    1. They get aggressive in the later rounds offering above slot deals to high ceiling kids
    2. They sign international free agents

  152. Betsy October 28th, 2010 at 1:49 pm

    Not exactly thrilled with a bench including Nunez and Cervelli……..

    I don’t think Granderson is going anywhere; that makes no sense. I love Swish, but if the Yankees want to fix their lineup a bit to make it less prone to deep freezes, he’s about the only one you can trade. Gardner, too, I guess – but then you’d need to sign Crawford and he’s really a plan C (if a plan at all). If Lee doesn’t sign, then Plan B is a pitcher – and CC isn’t going to wait for the Yankees to get their house in order.

  153. MG October 28th, 2010 at 1:50 pm

    West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 1:36 pm
    Why would the Yankees bring Montero north in April and lose 2014 as an arbitration kickoff date? They are too patient and business oriented to do so, all they have to do is wait until the end of May I think.
    ——————————-
    why not mention this point that no one else on this blog cares about another 20 times?

    Are you that starved for attention in your pathetic life?

  154. Giuseppe Franco October 28th, 2010 at 1:51 pm

    # Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:45 pm

    Giuseppe Franco October 28th, 2010 at 1:43 pm
    How would the Yanks get compensation picks for Vazquez and Wood if they aren’t going to offer either arbitration?

    They lost Abreu, Matsui, and Damon without getting any compensation picks in return.
    —————

    Part of the reason the Yankees traded for Javy was that they were hoping they would get picks for him if they went after a big time player this winter – now him stinking up the joint may have changed that plan.

    The Yankees could still, in theory, offer Javy arbitration and then trade him much the way Atlanta did with Soriano last winter.

    ——–

    That theory is way out there. There’s probably a better chance Vazquez wins the Cy Young next season.

  155. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:52 pm

    Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:48 pm
    Downs is going to get more than 4 million per year. Do you still sign him?
    ——————

    If I can get Downs for the same contract that Cash gave Marte – yes I sign him. Take a look at Downs’s stats – he hasn’t just been a good pitcher, he has been a dominant lefty reliever.

  156. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 1:53 pm

    Nunez as a utility player is a much better option than Pena is. There is no difference in defense and Nunez is a better base runner and hitter, along with more extra base power.

  157. Betsy October 28th, 2010 at 1:53 pm

    MG, that’s true, but the Giants’ pitching is pretty unbelievable; the Yankees had much less room for error because of how shaky their pitching was. Sabean does get grief as someone mentioned, but he shouldn’t -he’s put together a hell of a staff that’s the envy of baseball : lots of top end, homegrown youn pitchers.

  158. Giuseppe Franco October 28th, 2010 at 1:54 pm

    # Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:46 pm

    How would the Yanks get compensation picks for Vazquez and Wood if they aren’t going to offer either arbitration?

    I think they will offer Wood arbitration. There won’t be a fear that he will accept because he is only a Type-B, which means other teams will bid for his services as a closer.

    Worst case scenario he accepts and they have Kerry Wood next year as a setup man.

    ————

    That sounds like a logical scenario. Certainly more logical than offering Vazquez arbitration. No way that’s going to happen. Too big of a gamble.

  159. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 1:54 pm

    Who is going to take Vazquez and a $10 mil contract in a trade?

  160. Tyler October 28th, 2010 at 1:55 pm

    GB7-

    Do you think the Yanks will use Nunez as a big league utility player or keep him playing everyday in AAA at the start of the season? They seem to think that he has a shot at replacing Jeter eventually at SS so you think they will see everyday playing time at AAA as the best option for his development or more time spent in the big leagues?

  161. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:55 pm

    Downs is real good Chip, if the Yankees signed him I’m sure I’d get over the loss of a draft pick real fast, but I don’t think they should sign him.

    He has been much better the last 4 years than Marte was in the 4 years before he signed his deal with the yankees.

    I think he gets 6-8 mil a year. Maybe as an elite setup man or a closer for a smaller team.

  162. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 1:56 pm

    Sabean has quite a pitching staff because his teams spent most of the decade with some of the worst teams in baseball. Should he get credit for that, too?

  163. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:56 pm

    Vazquez was supposed to have a good deal and then get offered Arb and accept a multiyear deal with another t eam in the offseason. Losing 5 mph off his fastball and subsequently finding it on his ERA was a real blow to that plan.

    Cash’s idea was sound in theory, but injury conspired to thwart him.

  164. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 1:57 pm

    MG October 28th, 2010 at 1:50 pm

    **************

    Don’t like my opinions? Tough.

  165. JM October 28th, 2010 at 1:57 pm

    Would hate to lose Swish. Don’t think he gets traded unless the Yankees don’t sign Lee. Then all bets are off as they will likely have to seek a starter in the trade market.

  166. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 1:58 pm

    Tyler, Nunez has nothing left to learn in the minors. If they keep him, Pena is better off being included in a trade as filler.

  167. Tyler October 28th, 2010 at 1:58 pm

    The Giants have gotten scorching hot at the right time. I think it’s as simple as that. They have always had good starting pitching but that lineup is really not championship caliber on average but all of those guys are just hot right now. Juan Uribe has turned into Hanley Ramirez, Aubrey Huff is turning it on… Really the only real solid hitter in that lineup consistently is Posey (and maybe Sandoval but not this year). They are just hot as a unit at the right time which is one of the names of the game in the playoffs.

  168. Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 1:58 pm

    There is no difference in defense and Nunez is a better base runner and hitter, along with more extra base power.
    —————
    From what I seen in short sample GB, Nunez has little problems in fielding the ball but has some problems in throwing the ball. If I am correct, majority of Nunez’s errors stems from throwing in the minor this year.

    But I assuming you are right. Then what reason is to left Nunez off the PS roster in favor of Pena if all things are equal and he is a superior hitter?

  169. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 2:00 pm

    Pena was with the team longer and is more comfortable at a bigger variety of defensive positions, Cashmoney.

    Thats why he is on the PS roster, because he isn’t going to play anyways but if he did play it might be at a position that Nunez can.t

  170. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:00 pm

    Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 1:55 pm
    Downs is real good Chip, if the Yankees signed him I’m sure I’d get over the loss of a draft pick real fast, but I don’t think they should sign him.

    He has been much better the last 4 years than Marte was in the 4 years before he signed his deal with the yankees.

    I think he gets 6-8 mil a year. Maybe as an elite setup man or a closer for a smaller team.
    —————

    Yankees gave Marte 2 years for 12 mil before the market for relief pitchers tanked.

    I think the Yankees could get Downs for similar.

    I’m not saying Cash should back up the truck for him and give him whatever he wants, but I wouldn’t let a second (or possibly third depending on what moves the Yankees make) round pick stand in the way of getting him.

  171. Patrick October 28th, 2010 at 2:01 pm

    You can’t just promote “the best young arms” from the minors and roll with that as your bullpen.

    Yes you can. The Yankees have done this and will continue to. Look at the last several years, the only veterans were Marte and Rivera. Marte hardly even counts, he’s been injured the entire time.

    There is zero chance that the Yankees sign any reliever but Rivera to a >1 year deal. Unless Rivera retires.

  172. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 2:02 pm

    We all saw how the Rangers came back against a devastating loss to the Yankees in game one. Cain is a tough hill to climb, arguably as good as Lincecum this year if not better, but if they can get this one and go back to Texas tied, game on.

  173. Patrick October 28th, 2010 at 2:02 pm

    Scott Downs vs a 2nd round pick? I’m keeping the pick no question

  174. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:03 pm

    Pena had the experience. It really made little difference since Pena hasn’t played in any post season games in two years, either.

  175. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:03 pm

    Ramiro Pena is a tremendous fielder – don’t sell him short on that.

    While Nunez is a step down from that level, he’s still quite good. The difference is that he has a bat that can be productive at the ML level.

    Part of the reason that Girardi couldn’t rest Alex and Derek more than he did was because doing so meant inserting a virtual automatic out into his lineup. Nunez would free Girardi up to give more time off to his veteran SS and 3b.

  176. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:05 pm

    Patrick October 28th, 2010 at 2:02 pm
    Scott Downs vs a 2nd round pick? I’m keeping the pick no question
    ——————

    Patrick –

    I’ll take Downs over the prospect who is at best 3 or 4 years away assuming he makes it to the majors at all.

    There are what – 20 rounds in the ML draft – whatever I lose in the 2nd round I can find lower down by going above slot.

  177. Patrick October 28th, 2010 at 2:06 pm

    Chip,

    50 rounds actually.

    The point is, while Downs is good how much does he give you over an inhouse guy? Is that amount really worth a 2nd rond pick and millions of dollars? I highly doubt it

  178. Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 2:07 pm

    I think NY could use a veteran backup til Montero proves that he is ready defensively. I am not adverse of carrying 3 catchers if Posada indeed will be our part time DH and when Montero plays and vice versa. It’s somewhat uncomfortable to have a two sub par defensive catchers on a roster where the opposing team can greatly exploit their weaknesses as it was illustrated by Texas this post season.

  179. kd October 28th, 2010 at 2:09 pm

    i think at this point you have to let montero figure it out on the ml level. bat hit 9th and tell him that no matter what he hits he’s on the team. let him become a ml catcher with posada, girardi, and pena mentoring him. he’s a big leaguer. he’ll hit

  180. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:09 pm

    Patrick October 28th, 2010 at 2:06 pm
    Chip,

    50 rounds actually.

    The point is, while Downs is good how much does he give you over an inhouse guy? Is that amount really worth a 2nd rond pick and millions of dollars? I highly doubt it
    ———————-

    Patrick -

    I don’t see any in house candidates who can give the Yankees what Downs can.

    The Yankees currently have no healthy LH relievers other than Boone Logan who are in any place to contribute.

    Downs has experience setting up as well, so he’s insurance if Joba or Robertson falter – which they did this year, prompting the Wood trade.

  181. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:09 pm

    Pena made 6 errors this year in NY. Not exactly dazzling. He makes too many careless mistakes. Nunez is an exceptional fielding shortstop. This past season, they finally fixed his footwork and he cut his errors by 2/3rds from 33 to 10. He’s still learning to play 2nd and 3rd, but he’s no worse there than Pena.

  182. Doreen October 28th, 2010 at 2:10 pm

    GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 1:40 pm
    Doreen, Moseley did quite well replacing Pettitte in the rotation, but, by the time he saw teams the 2nd time, he was no mystery. I suppose, though, if NYYs keep one of them, he’s the one. I’d rather see the Yanks break in the young pitchers in the bullpen the first year as opposed to the rotation, though.

    GB7 -

    That’s all I’m sayin’ :)

  183. Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 2:11 pm

    Jerk, I think Pena is better defensively than Nunez , even if it is just by little. I was thinking along the line that Nunez is the arguably the best stolen base threat off the bench. Which was the most plausible scenario in which under either of them would have been use. Hence,I would have gone with Nunez. Nunez is also probably a better hitter which can’t hurt.

  184. Don October 28th, 2010 at 2:11 pm

    What is Montero like on defense? He couldn’t be much worse than Cervelli and Posada were this past season.

  185. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 2:14 pm

    Ok, I was just telling you why the Yankees had Pena on the roster. He was a marginal player in the postseason that would see very few if any at bats and was really only there for pinch running / defense.

    In which case you take Pena. If you want someone who is a better bet with the bat and plays SS, you take Nunez.

    Pena could play 3B, SS, 2B, and a little OF. He covered more bases.

  186. Yank1 October 28th, 2010 at 2:14 pm

    The Giants’ 11-7 Game 1 win over the Rangers drew a 10.4 overnight rating on FOX Wednesday night, down 25% from Game 1 last year (PHI/NYY: 13.8), but up a tick from Game 1 two years ago (PHI/TB: 10.3).

    The 10.4 overnight is the third-lowest for Game 1 of the World Series since at least 1998 (Game 1 overnights prior to 1999 were not immediately available). Only the aforementioned Phillies/Rays Game 1 in 2008 and Cardinals/Tigers Game 1 in 2006 (8.6) drew lower numbers.

    Though low historically, Wednesday’s Game 1 drew the same overnight as Game 1 of the Lakers/Celtics NBA Finals in June (10.4).

    http://www.sportsmediawatch.ne.....ame-1.html

  187. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:17 pm

    banuelos is starting for Phoeniz today in the AFL in about an hour and 15 minutes. Nothing else on the line-ups, yet.

  188. Patrick October 28th, 2010 at 2:18 pm

    Chip,

    I’m not going to knock Downs because he’s a very good pitcher but I don’t think he’s necessary. Logan is a fine lefty and you don’t really need more than one. And the Yanks have plenty of in-house options to act as setup men. Joba, Robertson, maybe Nova, Sanchez, maybe Noesi. I just don’t see the need to spend a lot of money on a setup pitcher. It’s a waste

  189. Patrick October 28th, 2010 at 2:19 pm

    I don’t really care if the Yankees use Nunez or Pena next year. They both kind of suck tbqh

  190. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 2:20 pm

    Expensive relievers are a waste of space for the Yankees. They have little trade value to the team if they have down years, and they really need to pitch well to make up for their high salary vs the limited amount of innings they throw.

  191. Chambliss October 28th, 2010 at 2:20 pm

    Good for Joe G. Hopefully a three year deal helps the guy relax. As others have pointed out, he got nervous down the stretch and in the postseason and that nervousness worked its way down to the players.

    I am still scratching my head at Cliff Lee’s performance last night. He went from having perfect command to AJ-like command in the matter of a few days. I wonder if his back flared up the way that it did in September.

  192. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 2:21 pm

    I’d use Nunez because we already know Pena sucks. Nunez might turn into something.

  193. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 2:21 pm

    With A-Rod, Jeter and Posada getting significant days off in 2011 either at DH or on the bench, not to mention Swisher and Teixeira if/when banged up, who can sub and hit? The log jam at DH and all these aging players with long contracts is quite an impediment to progress.

  194. hardwired7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:21 pm

    way o/t here: what Mikhail Prokhorov paid for the Nets was less than he paid the Russian gov’t. in taxes last yr.

    that’s one wealthy dude.

  195. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:22 pm

    Pena has all of 4 innings in 2 games in the outfield with 1 catch, plus 7 games in the minors. Not enough to declare him an up and coming outfielder.

  196. munson15 October 28th, 2010 at 2:25 pm

    murphydog, your post at 12:19 was spot on.

  197. Tyler October 28th, 2010 at 2:26 pm

    hardwired-

    I am surprised he didn’t buy a team in a non-salary cap sport. He would be a real force in baseball or soccer with his money. I know he absolutely loves basketball but IMO it’s not the sport he could have the most success in though the Nets do look better.

  198. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 2:27 pm

    No one declared Pena an up and coming OFer.

  199. Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 2:28 pm

    I think the Yankees will have a lot of minor league pitching depth in covering some BP roles in the coming years. However, there is no understating how Wood took hold of the EIG role and offer further depth and stabilized the BP in general. While I don’t think it’s necessity to resign Wood or go out looking for the lights of Down, Putz and Benoit. I think it certainly helps to have them on the team. The question will be cost and years as always along with compensation picks in lieu of deep draft next year.

    My favorite is Benoit. If I can sign him for 2 for 10 I would do it.

  200. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:30 pm

    Patrick,

    In the American League – where contending teams have:
    David Ortiz
    Justin Morneau
    Joe Mauer
    Josh Hamilton
    Bobby Abreu
    JD Drew
    Carlos Pena
    Carl Crawford (even if he’s not with Tampa he’ll be with someone the Yankees have to deal with in a touch situation)

    you can never have enough good left handed pitchers.

    As for Nova and Noesi – wouldn’t you prefer to have someone who has had success as a set-up man in the AL East over putting your eggs in the basket of a kid who doesn’t?

    I’m not saying that there’s no room for prospects on the Yankees – heck I’m advocating handing the starting catcher job to Jesus Montero – but I think that if you rely too heavily on too many prospects in key spots you get the 2008 Yankees who went into the season with Phil Hughes and Ian Kennedy in the rotation.

    Plus, it’s not like Downs is ineffective against RH bats

  201. Patrick October 28th, 2010 at 2:33 pm

    Lefties aren’t the only pitchers that can get left-handed pitchers out.

    And, no, I wouldn’t prefer to have a veteran set-up man over a kid if the price is tons of money and a high draft pick.

    Comparing using a bullpen of young guys to using young guys in the rotation is completely wrong. Look at the bullpens of the last few years, almost all of the relievers have been young guys from the farm system. Bullpens are volatile and beyond those handful of ace relievers like Mo, relievers just aren’t that valuable to a team.

    You put Downs on the Yankees this past year how many more games do they end up winning? 1? none?

  202. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:34 pm

    Only a fool or an idiot would give up a first round draft pick for a 7th inning bullpen pitcher that will cost 5-6 mil a year for 3 plus years.

  203. Patrick October 28th, 2010 at 2:35 pm

    err.. “Lefties aren’t the only pitchers that can get left-handed batters out”

  204. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:38 pm

    Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 2:28 pm
    I think the Yankees will have a lot of minor league pitching depth in covering some BP roles in the coming years. However, there is no understating how Wood took hold of the EIG role and offer further depth and stabilized the BP in general. While I don’t think it’s necessity to resign Wood or go out looking for the lights of Down, Putz and Benoit. I think it certainly helps to have them on the team. The question will be cost and years as always along with compensation picks in lieu of deep draft next year.

    My favorite is Benoit. If I can sign him for 2 for 10 I would do it.
    ——————————

    Why why why would you want Benoit?

    He’s a 9 year veteran who had a career season last year but the odds on him repeating it are astronomical.

    His ERA last year: 1.34
    Lowest previous: 2.85
    Career ERA: 4.47

    strikeouts/9 IP last year: 11.2
    Best ratio previously: 9.6
    Career average: 8.5

    Hits/9 IP last year: 4.5
    Best ratio previously: 7.1
    Career Average: 8

    BB/9 IP Last year: 1.6
    Best ratio previously: 2.7
    Career BB/9IP ratio: 4

  205. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:38 pm

    GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:34 pm
    Only a fool or an idiot would give up a first round draft pick for a 7th inning bullpen pitcher that will cost 5-6 mil a year for 3 plus years.
    ———————

    Technically I’m giving up a first round pick to sign Cliff Lee.

    I’m giving up at most a second round pick to sign Scott Downs.

  206. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:40 pm

    And Scott Downs is a 9 year veteran having his best season at the age of 34. What’s the difference? At least be consistant.

  207. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:40 pm

    If the Yankees don’t sign any other free agents – then no, I would not sign Scott Downs and give up a first round pick for him

    If the Yankees have signed Cliff Lee or Werth (or both) then yeah, I have no problem giving up a 2nd or 3rd rounder for him.

  208. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:41 pm

    Downs still isn’t worth a 2nd round pick.

  209. Cashman needs to go October 28th, 2010 at 2:42 pm

    Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:30 pm
    Patrick,

    In the American League – where contending teams have:
    David Ortiz
    Justin Morneau
    Joe Mauer
    Josh Hamilton
    Bobby Abreu
    JD Drew
    Carlos Pena
    Carl Crawford (even if he’s not with Tampa he’ll be with someone the Yankees have to deal with in a touch situation)

    you can never have enough good left handed pitchers.

    **********************************

    Thats why its not a bad idea to go after Dallas Braden of the A’s….he had a very good year in 2010, throws lefthanded and is a bull dog (doesn’t back down when adversity hits him like burnett and vazquez)…oh and he also had a perfect game…

    he’s the A’s #4 or 5 starter so i don’t think he’ll cost much – i’d look to see if they would want to also package kurt suzuki……give them romine (or cervelli..or both), nunez, and 2 of the better minor league arms ..

    suzuki is your everyday catcher for next year (about 100 games) and becomes the backup the year after that (or you can trade him after 2011 if montero emerges as the #1 catcher) , montero can catch 30 -40 games and throw posada a bone once a week and have him catch a game…..

    regardles of how many games posada will dh – i think the yankees also need to get a bonafide DH as well…its pretty obvious posada will almost assuredly get injured in one way or another and you don’t want another scenario where you have to play pena at third or SS alot because you are forced to play arod and jeter at DH a great deal…

  210. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 2:43 pm

    Matt Thornton exploded in his 30s. Relievers are different/can be effective at the drop of a hat. This is why its not wise to pay guys long contracts or a lot of money as a reliever.

  211. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:43 pm

    The only place you’re going to make some of these trade ideas and signings is in FantasyLand.

  212. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:46 pm

    GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:40 pm
    And Scott Downs is a 9 year veteran having his best season at the age of 34. What’s the difference? At least be consistant.
    ———–

    Downs:

    ERA: 2.64
    Best previous: 1.78
    Career ERA: 3.79 (but since being moved to the pen full time he has not posted an ERA higher than 3.07)

    Hits/IP: 6.9
    Best Previous: also 6.9
    Career: 8.9

    Walks/IP: 2.1
    Best Previous: 2.5
    Career: 3.3 (which has been dropping each year)

    K/IP: 7.0
    Previous best: 8
    Career: 7

    So no – Scott Downs didn’t have a career year last year and the difference between his best numbers and his career numbers aren’t close to the differential that you see with Benoit.

    Next time GB – check the facts first.

  213. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:46 pm

    How can anybody think that Braden is a good idea. There can be no meetings on the mound because he doesn’t allow anybody on his mound. Beware of wanting pitchers from Oakland. Most pitchers look good in that park. he’s one of them.

  214. Vincent October 28th, 2010 at 2:46 pm

    Posted this in the previous thread about the Braves but just in case.

    Actually, at the time, the Atlanta Tex trade was thought to be the one piece the Braves needed to make a serious run. Hindsight tells us it didn’t work out, but at the time you had to respect the Braves for going for it. I actually live in Atlanta and this move was VERY popular at the time amongst fans. Remember, Tex went to Georgia Tech. He also played very well as soon as he got there.

  215. pat October 28th, 2010 at 2:47 pm

    “With A-Rod, Jeter and Posada getting significant days off in 2011 either at DH or on the bench, not to mention Swisher and Teixeira if/when banged up, who can sub and hit? The log jam at DH and all these aging players with long contracts is quite an impediment to progress.”

    Define significant. 5 games? 10? 20? 30? 50?

    Number is probably alot less significant than you make think.

  216. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:48 pm

    GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:43 pm
    The only place you’re going to make some of these trade ideas and signings is in FantasyLand.
    ————————-

    And the only place you’re going to see a Yankee team fill its bench and pen with kids from the minor leagues is in FantasyLand.

  217. RayVT October 28th, 2010 at 2:49 pm

    Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:28 pm

    I understand! I think Russo is okay, but Laird has more potential and more thunder in his bat. A lot will happen between now and ST and opening day! It is fun to speculate! LOL!

  218. Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 2:49 pm

    Why why why would you want Benoit?
    ————————-
    Because he had good stuff and was prone to poor control when Texas switched to BP in 2006. He had very good year in 2007 with TX with 2.85 era and 80 innings pitched. in 08, he had a poor year that follow by surgery which effectively cost him a year. If you look at his stats he has been a guy who gave up less hits per innings since TX converted him to a reliever. I am making the assumption that benoit is fully healthy and had finally gained master in command and control his pitchers. Base on one year, that’s a big assumption. But I think it’s a reasonable risk to take JIMO.

  219. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:49 pm

    Forget it. Next you’ll be advocating getting Nava and Uribe to replace Gardner and Jeter because they once had a hit.

  220. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:51 pm

    GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:49 pm
    Forget it. Next you’ll be advocating getting Nava and Uribe to replace Gardner and Jeter because they once had a hit.
    ——————-

    Yeah, that’s right. Because 4 years of sustained success in the AL East is meaningles.

  221. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:52 pm

    Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 2:49 pm
    Why why why would you want Benoit?
    ————————-
    Because he had good stuff and was prone to poor control when Texas switched to BP in 2006. He had very good year in 2007 with TX with 2.85 era and 80 innings pitched. in 08, he had a poor year that follow by surgery which effectively cost him a year. If you look at his stats he has been a guy who gave up less hits per innings since TX converted him to a reliever. I am making the assumption that benoit is fully healthy and had finally gained master in command and control his pitchers. Base on one year, that’s a big assumption. But I think it’s a reasonable risk to take JIMO.
    ——————–

    Cash –

    I just think that he’s got Kyle Farnsworth written all over him.

  222. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:53 pm

    Cashman is not going to have a $10 mil bench next year. Not happening. He’ll make mid year deals that make sense. He’s not going to have a $25-30 mil bullpen. The payroll is at the limits of what makes sense. They may add to it later, but, they aren’t going to start the season at $220-225 mil.

  223. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 2:54 pm

    Benoit found 2 mph on his fastball this year returning from injury.

  224. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:55 pm

    RayVT October 28th, 2010 at 2:49 pm
    Chip October 28th, 2010 at 1:28 pm

    I understand! I think Russo is okay, but Laird has more potential and more thunder in his bat. A lot will happen between now and ST and opening day! It is fun to speculate! LOL!
    ————–

    Very true – always fun to speculate.

    And I’ve seen where Cash views both Laird and Nunez as potential Ben Zobrist type of guys – I just don’t think Laird’s there yet.

    Maybe a strong spring training and good start to the season in AAA earns him a call up, but more likely than not I think the Yankees look for a veteran to fill that role on the bench.

  225. Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 2:58 pm

    Cashman is not going to have a $10 mil bench next year
    ———————-
    why do they need 10 mil bench ? A guy like Bill hall couple with the lights of Renteria, felipe lopez and many others would only cost you slightly over 4 at max.

  226. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 2:58 pm

    GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 2:53 pm
    Cashman is not going to have a $10 mil bench next year. Not happening. He’ll make mid year deals that make sense. He’s not going to have a $25-30 mil bullpen. The payroll is at the limits of what makes sense. They may add to it later, but, they aren’t going to start the season at $220-225 mil.
    ——————-

    Agreed – he’s not going to have a 10 mil bench next year…but there’s a big difference between 10 mil and all rookies.

    His bench this year to open the season: Winn, Thames, Cervelli, Pena
    His bench to close the season: Kearns, Thames, Cervelli, Pena

    I expect Cervelli and Thames back, Pena replaces Nunez and a veteran bat will replace Kearns.

  227. Wave Your Hat October 28th, 2010 at 2:58 pm

    I don’t see the point of arguing for any starters other than Lee and Pettitte. If the Yanks don’t get one of those two guys, then start worrying about it.

  228. Doreen October 28th, 2010 at 3:00 pm

    If I recall correctly, Renteria hasn’t done well in the AL in the past. Or am I thinking of someone else?

  229. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 3:01 pm

    pat
    October 28th, 2010 at 2:47 pm

    “With A-Rod, Jeter and Posada getting significant days off in 2011 either at DH or on the bench, not to mention Swisher and Teixeira if/when banged up, who can sub and hit? The log jam at DH and all these aging players with long contracts is quite an impediment to progress.”

    Define significant. 5 games? 10? 20? 30? 50?

    Number is probably alot less significant than you make think.

    ******************

    The regulars named had 243 plate appearances at DH in 2019. That’s about 60 games give or take and doesn’t count games they sat on the bench or missed due to injuries.

  230. Mell October 28th, 2010 at 3:02 pm

    “Cash –

    I just think that he’s got Kyle Farnsworth written all over him”

    Farnsworth ever post a .70 WHIP and a 75 to 11 K/BB ratio? Benoit was the best EIG in the AL in 2010, and that includes Kerry Wood.

    He’s definitely a guy worth looking at.

  231. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 3:02 pm

    You shouldn’t have a $10 million dollar bench but $2.9 million is absurd.

  232. Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 3:03 pm

    Doreen, you might be thinking his year with boston where he batted 276 and with OPS of 720 as a regular SS in 2005. If I remember correctly, he had more defensive troubles than anything else.

  233. Wave Your Hat October 28th, 2010 at 3:04 pm

    “You shouldn’t have a $10 million dollar bench but $2.9 million is absurd.”

    Every dollar saved on Jeter’s contract can go toward the bench and pen. How’s that?

  234. hardwired7 October 28th, 2010 at 3:04 pm

    Tyler,

    Prokhorov has always had a sort of fascination w/the NBA. in a sense, it’s the perfect environment to take a team that’s dead-in-the-water and quickly turn it into a champion (which fits this guy’s M.O.). smaller rosters mean a well-managed team has a quicker turnaround time.

    the Times has pretty fascinating article that shows how buying the Nets now really fits his pattern:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10.....=1&hp

  235. Mell October 28th, 2010 at 3:06 pm

    “If I recall correctly, Renteria hasn’t done well in the AL in the past. Or am I thinking of someone else?”

    Only played one year in the AL. Disasterous defensively. Offensively? About the same year Jeter had for the Yankees this year.

  236. RayVT October 28th, 2010 at 3:07 pm

    Next year the Yanks start the season with 2 lefties in the BP. Logan & Marte. I don’t think a 3rd lefty is needed yet until the Yanks explore other options.

  237. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 3:08 pm

    Mell October 28th, 2010 at 3:02 pm
    “Cash –

    I just think that he’s got Kyle Farnsworth written all over him”

    Farnsworth ever post a .70 WHIP and a 75 to 11 K/BB ratio? Benoit was the best EIG in the AL in 2010, and that includes Kerry Wood.

    He’s definitely a guy worth looking at

    —————————–

    The year before the Yankees signed Farnsworth (when he was 29):

    K/9 IP: 11.2
    BB/9 IP: 3.5
    ERA: 2.19
    WHIP: 1.07

    and he was throwing 100 mph

    so yeah – Benoit scares the heck out of me.

  238. Wave Your Hat October 28th, 2010 at 3:09 pm

    RayVT-

    I think Marte is down for the count.

  239. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 3:09 pm

    RayVT October 28th, 2010 at 3:07 pm
    Next year the Yanks start the season with 2 lefties in the BP. Logan & Marte. I don’t think a 3rd lefty is needed yet until the Yanks explore other options.
    —————–

    Marte just had shoulder surgery – he’s not around until at least the all star break.

  240. Doreen October 28th, 2010 at 3:10 pm

    Cashmoney -

    Yeah, I just looked him up over at Baseball Reference. One year with Boston – looked okay offensive, but I do remember he was a disaster in the field for them.

    But he also has a single year in Detroit, and didn’t stick. After he was an All-Star in Atlanta in between.

    Odd. :?

  241. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 3:13 pm

    You aren’t going to get Bill Hall, who has no business owning a glove and hasn’t hit in 6 years. They don’t need a strikeout artist sitting on the bench. Hall is going to a team that will give him a chance to play. I’d rather see them sign Giambi and play him in the outfield….and, no, I don’t want to see Giambi. Once was enough.

  242. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 3:13 pm

    I had some people over to watch the game last night, one of them is gay, he happened to play small school college football in North Dakota. Anyway, he asked if any major league players had come out, I couldn’t remember any. It’s pretty hard to imagine in 2010 this barrier would not have been broken. I guess don’t ask don’t tell is the operative rule.

  243. West Coast Yankee Fan October 28th, 2010 at 3:15 pm

    Billy Bean I just remembered.

  244. Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 3:16 pm

    Chip, the big difference is in Benoit’s control and the fact he did in the heat of pennant race in AL east.There are always concerns and risks involved in dealing with short relievers. I am just in the opinion that Benoit at 2-10 (which he prolly will get more) is a good risk. Will the brass see it the way I do, prolly not. But that’s why we are here on a forum talking about baseball in the middle of afternoon on a Thursday :)

  245. GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 3:17 pm

    Renteria was a defensive disaster in both Boston and Detroit and is probably the oldest 34 year old in baseball.

  246. Chip October 28th, 2010 at 3:17 pm

    GreenBeret7 October 28th, 2010 at 3:13 pm
    You aren’t going to get Bill Hall, who has no business owning a glove and hasn’t hit in 6 years. They don’t need a strikeout artist sitting on the bench. Hall is going to a team that will give him a chance to play. I’d rather see them sign Giambi and play him in the outfield….and, no, I don’t want to see Giambi. Once was enough.
    —————-

    Cashman is not going to fill out the bench with guys from Scranton. He is not going to simply “take the best young pitchers from the minors” and bring them north to fill out the pen.

    He has never operated that way.

  247. Tom in N.J. October 28th, 2010 at 3:17 pm

    Glenn Burke

  248. RayVT October 28th, 2010 at 3:19 pm

    Thanks Chip & Wave!

    I was thinking he’d be ready soon after AS Break. Memory! LOL!

  249. Jerkface October 28th, 2010 at 3:19 pm

    Jeter and Arod had 17 games combined at DH

  250. Yank1 October 28th, 2010 at 3:20 pm

    Blue Jays pick up the option on Molina for 2011

  251. Erin October 28th, 2010 at 3:21 pm

    New Post: Worked and didn’t work for Joe Girardi

    :arrow:

  252. RayVT October 28th, 2010 at 3:25 pm

    Not sure Joe G keeping Pena over Nunez is the Gold Standard for saying what is the best thing to do. IMO, Nunez would have been my 1st choice as a BU infielder over Pena.

  253. Cashman needs to go October 28th, 2010 at 3:27 pm

    How can anybody think that Braden is a good idea. There can be no meetings on the mound because he doesn’t allow anybody on his mound. Beware of wanting pitchers from Oakland. Most pitchers look good in that park. he’s one of them

    *********************

    Although I would usually agree with A’s pitchers looking good in the coliseum – he actually had a better ERA away from oakland (3.43 vs 3.56) and his whip was almost similar (1.18 away vs 1.14 home) and BAA was slightly higher away (.256 vs .243) – he also had great numbers vs the yankees, baltimore and toronto and decent numbers vs tampa (including the perfect game) and had the worst #’s vs. boston (those numbers were skewed because his first game back off a 1 month DL stint was against the redsox where he gave up 10 hits and 4 runs – 1 earned – in 4.2 innings)

    he also had 5 complete games….all in all not bad numbers for someone you are looking to be your #4 or 5 in the rotation – much better than burnett and he costs only 400K

    as for his mound issues – i guess arod will have to ask him to meet near 3rd base in order to go over assignments…

  254. Bob October 28th, 2010 at 3:29 pm

    Lets pry away Hanley ramirez and johnson from Florida ! Move Jete to LF ! What a dream

  255. Cashmoney October 28th, 2010 at 3:35 pm

    You aren’t going to get Bill Hall, who has no business owning a glove and hasn’t hit in 6 years. They don’t need a strikeout artist sitting on the bench. Hall is going to a team that will give him a chance to play.
    —————–
    GB7 I don’t understand you logic here. So IYO, he can’t field (which is somewhat true on the infield and less so in the of) and he hasn’t hit for 6 six years, but by some miracle he is going to a team that will give him a chance to play?

    In reality, Bill hall is a poor average hitter who has decent patience and good P/PA. He is a guy who OPS’d 772 in 2010 while playing various of and if positions due to many injuries that had occurred on the RS. Aside from his inability to play SS , Hall is your prototypical super U player at this point of his career. So why not on the Yankees where he can effectively usurp the roles of Kearns and spell Arod and regular OFers when needed and possibly accrue no less 200 PA next year?

  256. BIG AL October 28th, 2010 at 3:38 pm

    It’s already been stated Marte can’t even start throwing until after the AS break, so at best you’re looking at a guy ready by September. I wouldn’t count on Marte ever pitching for the Yankees again.


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