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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Jeter conversations continue

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Nov 16, 2010 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Hal Steinbrenner just got to Orlando and said there’s “nothing out of the ordinary” going on with the Yankees.

The only minor news out of his quick walk to the elevator was that the Yankees have talked to Derek Jeter’s agent “a couple of times” since last week’s meeting in Tampa.

Otherwise, Steinbrenner said it’s business as usual.

“Things are going well right now,” he said.

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221 Responses to “Jeter conversations continue”

  1. ac1 November 16th, 2010 at 4:17 pm

    just make sure rivera isn’t lost in all of this.

  2. Laura - I Bleed Blue November 16th, 2010 at 4:17 pm

    The longer the Yankees drag out this Jeter thing, the more annoyed I get. Just offer the guy arbitration and be done with it.

  3. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 4:17 pm

    Justin Upton is one of the five most talented players in the game.

    So was BJ Upton.

  4. Bret The Hitman November 16th, 2010 at 4:17 pm

    CB November 16th, 2010 at 4:12 pm

    A trade for Upton would require Hughes, Montero, Banuelos and one other player.

    ********

    .799 OPS, 152 K’s, related to BJ Upton who turned bust, owed 14.25 million in 2014 and 14.5 million in 2015.

    So yeah.

  5. Wave Your Hat November 16th, 2010 at 4:19 pm

    CB-

    I think you could do it for a trade of Hughes and either Granderson or Swisher, especially if the Yanks paid part of the salary of Grandy or Nick. Also, Upton had a bit of a bump this year, sometimes that can disenchant a team a little.

  6. Erin November 16th, 2010 at 4:20 pm

    Things are going well right now,? he said

    ***************************
    This is good. I just things were moving a little faster. :)

  7. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 4:21 pm

    Erin November 16th, 2010 at 4:09 pm
    edit: It’s really *good*

    I’ve been hanging around GB too much again.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    That just shows that you can learn style and class from anyone, Dolly.

  8. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 4:21 pm

    Take it easy, Bret. You just suggested the Snakes trade Upton for Brackman, Joba and Braden. CB’s suggestion, while a little steep in my eyes, is a lot closer to right than you are.

  9. Erin November 16th, 2010 at 4:22 pm

    GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 4:21 pm

    That just shows that you can learn style and class from anyone, Dolly.

    *****************************

    :)

  10. Bret The Hitman November 16th, 2010 at 4:23 pm

    I think Braden + Brackman + Joba is fair. It’s 3 potential starting pitchers and that’s what AZ needs.

  11. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 4:23 pm

    Erin November 16th, 2010 at 4:20 pm
    Things are going well right now,? he said

    ***************************
    This is good. I just things were moving a little faster.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    If it means anything, at least your thinking is moving faster than your fingers on the keyboard.

    I just ***????***things were moving a little faster

  12. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 4:24 pm

    Fort Worth Star Telegram via MLBTR says the Rangers contingent had their Little Rock sit down with the Lee family and agent yesterday.

  13. MorningPerson November 16th, 2010 at 4:25 pm

    Could be it’s taking a little longer because the want to structure the deal a certain way?

  14. ZMAN November 16th, 2010 at 4:25 pm

    # CB November 16th, 2010 at 4:12 pm

    Justin Upton is one of the five most talented players in the game.

    On the very remote chance AZ actually moves him start your trade proposals from there. Top 5 talent in the entire game.

    His past seasons statistics are largely irrelevant. That’s not how he’s going to be evaluated within the game. Everyone knows what kind of talent is involved with Upton as long as his shoulder is ok (which is a larger concern than his 2010 OPS).

    Upton’s contract is a plus – not a burden – regarding his value.

    A trade for Upton would require Hughes, Montero, Banuelos and one other player.

    And that’s in no way an overestimate of what it would take.

    Arizona will only trade him if they feel like it will transform the franchise with young, inexpensive players, particularly players who will be cheap for 6 years.

    There will be no bargain hunting on Upton. He is an immense talent, talent close to the level of ARod and Josh Hamilton.

    ———————-

    Good analysis

  15. Bret The Hitman November 16th, 2010 at 4:25 pm

    SI_JonHeyman

    hal steinbrenner in lobby cameo, regarding jeter: “who knows?” but he adds, “things are going well.” hearing #yanks to bid 3 yrs, at least.
    8 minutes ago via web

  16. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 4:26 pm

    Sorry, Erin. It’s just so seldom that I get to ding somebody elses typing/spelling that i have to get my thrills somewhere.

  17. Erin November 16th, 2010 at 4:26 pm

    GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 4:23 pm

    If it means anything, at least your thinking is moving faster than your fingers on the keyboard.

    I just ***????***things were moving a little faster

    **********************
    LOL I didn’t even catch that!!

    Should be I *wish* things were moving a little faster

  18. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 4:28 pm

    “I think Braden + Brackman + Joba is fair. It’s 3 potential starting pitchers and that’s what AZ needs”

    It’s a laughable offer.

  19. MorningPerson November 16th, 2010 at 4:28 pm

    CB -

    But if you’re the Yankees, do you do that deal?

    Even if they sign Lee, it leaves a big hole in the rotation on an immediate level, but also takes away one of the most promising arms for the relatively near future. Plus you lose a young catcher who’s bat should replace Posada’s and you suddenly find a need for a catcher, because I don’t think Romine is quite there. Buck is going to be unavailable if the rumors are correct

    So while Upton may be that kind of a talent, I’m not sure it’s the right move right now.

  20. MTU November 16th, 2010 at 4:29 pm

    I’m beginning to have my suspicions the Hal is a different animal than his Father in regards to spending, or is that already obvious and confirmed ?

    He seems much more #’s oriented.

  21. Shame Spencer November 16th, 2010 at 4:30 pm

    I don’t understand how anyone can evaluate talent that hasn’t performed yet.

    …but it won’t stop the LoHud faithful from trying I suppose.

  22. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 4:31 pm

    I don’t understand how anyone can evaluate talent that hasn’t performed yet.

    Minor league numbers? Isn’t this what people are doing suggesting that Upton is going to require a hall? Since his latest effort was markedly worse.

  23. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 4:31 pm

    haul not hall

  24. MorningPerson November 16th, 2010 at 4:32 pm

    Erin,

    I thought it might be a quick read. I started reading it as soon as I opened the box it came in, but I had to put it down to make supper.

    I could read it in the evening now, because there’s no Yankees game to compete with my attention. But I also bought some yarn – inspired the other day to crochet some scarves. I went from having nothing to do to putting too much on my plate. I tend to do that too much!

  25. blake November 16th, 2010 at 4:32 pm

    I think if that were the price for Upton (Hughes, Montero, Baneulos)…then its counter productive from the Yankees POV.

  26. MTU November 16th, 2010 at 4:33 pm

    Blake-

    Without a doubt. That’s way too high a price IMO.

  27. Bret The Hitman November 16th, 2010 at 4:33 pm

    Blake, good thing that’s not the price of a career .824 OPS guy who just K’d 152 times.

  28. Wave Your Hat November 16th, 2010 at 4:33 pm

    Granderson, especially if the Yanks paid part of his salary, would be more valuable to the D-Backs in the near future than Montero, especially since AZ has catching talent.

  29. Shame Spencer November 16th, 2010 at 4:34 pm

    Hall might be the correct word since the kid is apparently already being inducted into the Hall of Fame. I mean, maybe I’m just a little touchy about comparing players that haven’t been in the game that long to players that have consistently produced results for 10-15 years (since I think I just saw an Upton/Arod comparison on here).

  30. Erin November 16th, 2010 at 4:34 pm

    SI_JonHeyman baseball GMs favor adding a wild-card playoff round. their debate is whether they want 1 or 3 games

  31. MTU November 16th, 2010 at 4:35 pm

    WYH-

    Keeping Phil out of it. What’s your proposal for Upton ?

  32. Chip November 16th, 2010 at 4:35 pm

    LGY November 16th, 2010 at 4:11 pm
    Chip,

    Red Sox: No
    Blue Jays: Yes (Who do you have hitting 3-4-5 that is better than Swisher other than Bautista?) I would go Wells, Bautista, Snider/Lind. Snider and Lind are much more valuable to the long term future of the club than Swisher would be

    Phillies: No (But with Werth on his way out, it won’t be that way next year) right but this is based on last year

    Rangers: Maybe (He was better than Vlad last year)

    Marlins: Yes (Who do you have hitting 3-4-5) HanRam, Uggla, Stanton

    Rays: Yes (Longoria is the only better hitter in that lineup)Zobrist, Longoria, Pena

    Twins: Maybe. (Depends where you slot Thome. Mauer and Morneau are better, but Young is not)

    Mets: Yes (Beltran was injured basically all season and Bay sucked) Based on a healthy lineup their 3-5 would be Beltran, Wright, Bay

  33. CB November 16th, 2010 at 4:35 pm

    Wave-

    I don’t think AZ would want either Swisher or Granderson at the money they will be making. 10M is going to be around 15% of their projected payroll and after 2-3 years those guys will be free agents. The NL West is horrible but the D’Backs aren’t close to competing.

    Getting a match on this kind of deal when Upton is signed to that long term deal will be very difficult and I doubt Towers is going to just jump into making a deal of that proportion this quickly after taking the job.

    I think Arizona will want one established major league player with considerable talent and then all high level players with 1 year or less service time.

  34. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 4:35 pm

    “I think if that were the price for Upton (Hughes, Montero, Baneulos)…then its counter productive from the Yankees POV”

    Definitely can’t see Hughes being in such a deal.

  35. Shame Spencer November 16th, 2010 at 4:35 pm

    BTW – I’m not trying to suggest Upton isn’t or won’t be a great player.. but calling him ‘top 5′ is a stretch to me. IMO you don’t get the ‘top 5′ label until you’ve done something and done it for at least a few seasons (preferably in a row).

  36. MTU November 16th, 2010 at 4:36 pm

    Erin-

    They’ve got to be kidding. let’s just play into dec. Ridiculous.

  37. Wave Your Hat November 16th, 2010 at 4:36 pm

    CB-

    Note I said the Yanks would have to pay part of CG’s/Swisher’s salary.

  38. Chip November 16th, 2010 at 4:37 pm

    Bret The Hitman November 16th, 2010 at 4:17 pm
    CB November 16th, 2010 at 4:12 pm

    A trade for Upton would require Hughes, Montero, Banuelos and one other player.

    ********

    .799 OPS, 152 K’s, related to BJ Upton who turned bust, owed 14.25 million in 2014 and 14.5 million in 2015.

    So yeah.

    —————————

    What does his brother have to do with anything?

    Mike Muddux and Billy Ripken proved just because you’re related to a player doesn’t mean you’re going to be anything like him.

  39. Wave Your Hat November 16th, 2010 at 4:37 pm

    CB-

    I’d also do it for Hughes, Gardner + prospects, but I don’t think it would work from a Yankee payroll point of view.

  40. blake November 16th, 2010 at 4:37 pm

    MTU,

    As I said earlier, my limit would be something like Swisher, Betances, Nova…..if that’s not getting it done (and it probably wouldn’t) then im not going any higher because the need doesn’t justify it.

  41. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 4:38 pm

    MTU,

    Not so sure that Hal Steinbrenner is so different than The Old Man in spending money, just not quite as reckless on who he spends it on. He’s not as enamoured with the biggest names of the day…Dave Collins, Steve Kemp, Steve Karsay, etc.

  42. pat November 16th, 2010 at 4:39 pm

    “SI_JonHeyman baseball GMs favor adding a wild-card playoff round. their debate is whether they want 1 or 3 games”

    Owners always want more games not less. $$$$$ That will likely be a short debate.

  43. Wave Your Hat November 16th, 2010 at 4:39 pm

    I’d also be on the phone talking to the Cardinals about Cody Rasmus. And it would be worth the cost of a phone call to talk to the Marlins about Mike Stanton.

  44. Erin November 16th, 2010 at 4:40 pm

    MP-I figured I’d read a little before I went to bed Sunday night, and before I knew it I was halfway through the book. LOL I should (hopefully) finish it up sometime this week.

  45. MTU November 16th, 2010 at 4:40 pm

    GB-

    What made me wonder is the idea that he might only be willing to go 3 years on Jeter. It’s probably just a rumor but I can’t imagine GS ever saying a thing like that with respect to Jeter.

  46. CB November 16th, 2010 at 4:41 pm

    Morning Person-

    No I would not make the deal required to land Upton. I would trade one of those players but the problem is the aggregation of talent it’s going to take.

    I think it would be too costly and would require absorbing too much risk to do as you’re putting all of your eggs in that one basket. And as talented as Upton is – he hasn’t performed consistently yet.

    But his inconsistent performance is going to have minimal impact in how he’s valued in the trade market due to how young he still is, how quickly he moved through the minors and his immense talent. People frequently compare Justin Upton to his brother but that’s just a lazy comparison. Justin Upton is at an entirely different level of player because he has so much more raw power.

  47. MTU November 16th, 2010 at 4:41 pm

    Blake-

    since we continue to share one brain we are again in agreement.

  48. Dylan November 16th, 2010 at 4:41 pm

    I’m a little surprised that so many people would be willing to give up Hughes in a trade for Upton. I understand that Upton is a great player, but pitching is our biggest weakness right now. I don’t understand how giving up our #2 starter, a solid outfielder, and a good prospect for a relatively small upgrade in the outfield makes us a better team.

  49. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 4:42 pm

    “I’m beginning to have my suspicions the Hal is a different animal than his Father in regards to spending, or is that already obvious and confirmed ?

    He seems much more #’s oriented.”

    I agree, but he’s same dude who let Cashman go the extra mile for Teixeira during his $455,000,000 spending spree of ’08. Hard to argue Cashman isn’t being provided with the resources necessary to win.

  50. Chip November 16th, 2010 at 4:42 pm

    I think a lot of people need to learn the difference between “listening to offers for a player” and “shopping a player” and “must deal a player”

    If you are, as Kevin Towers is, either actively shopping or simply listening to offers for a young player like Justin Upton – that doesn’t mean you think he’s a bad player, nor does it mean he’s in a rush to deal him. If you want Upton you’re going to have to overpay for him.

  51. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 4:42 pm

    Blue Jays: Yes (Who do you have hitting 3-4-5 that is better than Swisher other than Bautista?) I would go Wells, Bautista, Snider/Lind. Snider and Lind are much more valuable to the long term future of the club than Swisher would be

    Marlins: Yes (Who do you have hitting 3-4-5) HanRam, Uggla, Stanton

    Rays: Yes (Longoria is the only better hitter in that lineup)Zobrist, Longoria, Pena

    Mets: Yes (Beltran was injured basically all season and Bay sucked) Based on a healthy lineup their 3-5 would be Beltran, Wright, Bay

    What does long term value have to do with production?? Snider and Lind OPS’d under. 800, Lind hit under .230. Snider hit 9th most of the year. Stanton was a 20 year old and still didn’t out OPS Swisher struck out more often didn’t get on base as much and batted 5th for only 15 At Bats last year.

    If the Rays had a hitter better than Pena or Zobrist they’d have hit them in the middle of the lineup, they didn’t. You think Maddon wouldn’t replace Pena in a heart beat? Or Zobrist who had a down year? Why do you think Carl Crawford ended up hitting 3rd? He isn’t going to hit 3rd on the yankees, he is a role player.

    Ok so now its based on health, but with the phillies its based on last years actual results?? No, Swisher would hit 3-5 on the Mets based on last year and probably going forward.

  52. MTU November 16th, 2010 at 4:44 pm

    Blake-

    Have you decided on a place for it yet ?

    And please don’t say your circular file.

    :)

  53. ZMAN November 16th, 2010 at 4:45 pm

    Who is “Braden”? We have a prospect named Braden?

  54. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 4:45 pm

    MTU,

    Although Hal Steinbrenner is relatively new to the baseball side of business, I believe that even he knows that Jeter’s true salary on the baseball side is his ability to play shortstop. He also realizes what Jeter’s value is to the Yankee family. He knows that Jeter playing shortstop more than 3 years down the road is fanciful thinking. Jeter also happens to be a family favorite with The Old Man and his mother.

  55. Chip November 16th, 2010 at 4:46 pm

    Blake -

    That’s a fair stance to have on it and I think it’s the one Cashman would have. He’s often said that if a deal comes along that he’s comfortable with he’ll make it but he’s not going to go overboard.

    Now, the only way that Cash could justify to himself including Hughes with Swisher and a prospect is by saying:

    “Well we can lock down our OF with young, talented players for the next 5 to 10 years; we’re going to sign Lee so that gives us two top guys at the front of the rotation and we have a crop of highly talented young pitchers coming up to fill out the back end of the rotation…”

  56. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 4:46 pm

    “What made me wonder is the idea that he might only be willing to go 3 years on Jeter. It’s probably just a rumor but I can’t imagine GS ever saying a thing like that with respect to Jeter.”

    The way I read that is that the Yankees are willing to start at 3 years, which is anything but disrespectful.

  57. MTU November 16th, 2010 at 4:47 pm

    Mell-

    I was implying that he wasn’t. It’s just the jeter thing. I don’t see his father quibbling witha guy like jeter.

    maybe I’m wrong, and maybe the rumors are BS.

  58. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 4:47 pm

    Chip,

    Blue Jays- Swisher was and is a better hitter than Wells. What does long term future have to do with it? Swisher was demonstrably better than Lind last season and Snider only played half a season. Swisher would be hitting 3rd or 4th on that club easily.

    Marlins- Stanton doesn’t even hit 5th for them NOW with Swisher not on the team.

    Rays: Zobrist and Pena were both terrible last season.

    Mets: That is speculative. Both Bay and Beltran were much worse than Swisher when they played. Based on merit Swisher would be hitting 4th or 5th for that team.

  59. Chip November 16th, 2010 at 4:49 pm

    Jerkface -

    You’re right, I’m wrong. Nick Swisher is the best RF in the game today. Heck, he might be the best RF that baseball has seen in the last twenty years.

    I’ll start consulting with the folks at Yankee Stadium to make sure that his monument is good to go the day he retires – which will be 10 years from now because the Yankees will sign him to a 10 year $700 million deal and be thankful for getting him at such a bargain.

    Just one question – should his Hall of Fame bust say Swisher or Swish-alicious?

  60. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 4:49 pm

    Hmmm….quite a problem to have…

    Do you “Put all of your eggs in one basket” or “All of your baskets on one egg”. You still end up with a lot of scrambled eggs.

  61. Chip November 16th, 2010 at 4:49 pm

    LGY November 16th, 2010 at 4:47 pm
    Chip,

    Blue Jays- Swisher was and is a better hitter than Wells. What does long term future have to do with it? Swisher was demonstrably better than Lind last season and Snider only played half a season. Swisher would be hitting 3rd or 4th on that club easily.

    Marlins- Stanton doesn’t even hit 5th for them NOW with Swisher not on the team.

    Rays: Zobrist and Pena were both terrible last season.

    Mets: That is speculative. Both Bay and Beltran were much worse than Swisher when they played. Based on merit Swisher would be hitting 4th or 5th for that team.

    ——————————

    This entire excercise is speculative.

  62. CB November 16th, 2010 at 4:50 pm

    Wave-

    Saw your point on picking up salary after my own post. That makes sense.

    I still think they are going to want players they can control for as long as possible.

    If they trade this player they are going to need talent back that will set them up for the next half decade.

    If the yankees pick up salary on Granderson (or Swisher) he would have much more value to a team that has a chance to contend like the Cards or the Dodgers. The D’Backs are just so far out and the economy in Arizona is just so bad and non-diversified.

  63. blake November 16th, 2010 at 4:50 pm

    MTU,

    Probably at the office….I need some pics there to soothe the terrified.

  64. Bret The Hitman November 16th, 2010 at 4:50 pm

    Arizona would likely want three players for Upton — a backend reliever, a starter and a bat. But it’s not clear if there is a good match on players between the clubs.

    Sox interested in Upton from Foxsports:

    Given their historical bullpen woes in 2010, the Diamondbacks would likely request ascendant reliever Daniel Bard; the Red Sox would probably rather move closer Jonathan Papelbon, who is more expensive than Bard and just one year from free agency.

    Jacoby Ellsbury could fit Arizona’s need for a hitter. He would represent an upgrade over the incumbent Gerardo Parra. The Red Sox, though, might not have a major-league-ready starter that would appeal to the Diamondbacks. Lefty Felix Doubront might not be attractive enough, and righty Casey Kelly likely is off-limits.

    Compare this to:

    Hughes + Montero + Banuelos + another prospect

    Horse manure.

  65. MorningPerson November 16th, 2010 at 4:51 pm

    CB -

    If he’s truly available, it’s kind of a shame he doesn’t fit the Yankees’ needs right now.

    Sometimes, that’s just the way things are.

  66. pat November 16th, 2010 at 4:51 pm

    Hal doesn’t appear to be as hands on as George was- not that I think that’s a bad thing.

    George played owner and GM

    Hal seems to let Cash put together the team and only steps in when over and above money is the issue.

  67. West Coast Yankee Fan November 16th, 2010 at 4:52 pm

    MTU November 16th, 2010 at 4:29 pm

    I’m beginning to have my suspicions the Hal is a different animal than his Father in regards to spending, or is that already obvious and confirmed ?

    He seems much more #’s oriented.

    ****************************

    I have been saying that for a year now and I believe it to be true. We’ll see.

  68. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 4:52 pm

    “This entire excercise is speculative.”

    ———————————-

    Well we are at least trying to keep it as realistic as possible. Saying things like if they were healthy, makes this thing much more speculative.

    Based on production Swisher would be 3-5 for the Mets.

  69. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 4:52 pm

    You’re right, I’m wrong. Nick Swisher is the best RF in the game today. Heck, he might be the best RF that baseball has seen in the last twenty years.

    You’re a sore loser when you get destroyed on a point.

  70. Bret The Hitman November 16th, 2010 at 4:53 pm

    Sox interested in Upton from Foxsports:

    “Arizona would likely want three players for Upton — a backend reliever, a starter and a bat. But it’s not clear if there is a good match on players between the clubs.

    Given their historical bullpen woes in 2010, the Diamondbacks would likely request ascendant reliever Daniel Bard; the Red Sox would probably rather move closer Jonathan Papelbon, who is more expensive than Bard and just one year from free agency.

    Jacoby Ellsbury could fit Arizona’s need for a hitter. He would represent an upgrade over the incumbent Gerardo Parra. The Red Sox, though, might not have a major-league-ready starter that would appeal to the Diamondbacks. Lefty Felix Doubront might not be attractive enough, and righty Casey Kelly likely is off-limits.”

    http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/s.....ton-111610

    Compare this to:

    Hughes + Montero + Banuelos + another prospect

    Horse manure.

  71. MTU November 16th, 2010 at 4:53 pm

    Blake-

    I thought that might be a possibility. Glad to hear it. About the pic not the terrfied of course.

    :)

  72. pat November 16th, 2010 at 4:53 pm

    RE: Upton

    Kevin Towers just spent a year focusing on every player in the Yankees system.

    There will be no bargains in an Upton trade.

  73. ZMAN November 16th, 2010 at 4:54 pm

    NickCafardo
    Yankees also talked to DBacks about Justin Upton.

  74. Giuseppe Franco November 16th, 2010 at 4:54 pm

    # blake November 16th, 2010 at 4:32 pm

    I think if that were the price for Upton (Hughes, Montero, Baneulos)…then its counter productive from the Yankees POV.

    ———

    That’s exactly how Cashman would view it, especially when the outfield is already reasonably cost effective and very productive.

    And they haven’t addressed the rotation or found Posada’s successor yet (internally or externally) – two areas of the highest priority this offseason.

  75. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 4:55 pm

    According to Nick Cafardo, the Yankees talked to the DBacks about Upton.

    But, as Pete Abe said in reference to the Red Sox “talk” with them it is almost definitely just due diligence than actual trade talk.

    That FoxSports article is just made up speculation and pretty laughable speculation given the talent they have the Sox “giving up”

  76. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 4:55 pm

    pat November 16th, 2010 at 4:51 pm
    Hal doesn’t appear to be as hands on as George was- not that I think that’s a bad thing.

    George played owner and GM

    Hal seems to let Cash put together the team and only steps in when over and above money is the issue.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    GMS certainly had his faults, but, disinterest wasn’t one of them.

    A team that allows the GM to run the entire sow unimpeded is called “The Mets”.

  77. MTU November 16th, 2010 at 4:55 pm

    WCYF-

    How they handle the Jeter negotiations will tell me a lot in that regard.

  78. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 4:56 pm

    A team that allows the GM to run the entire sow unimpeded is called “The Mets”.

    Incorrect, the Mets are notorious for their owners meddling in everything. All decisions go through them.

  79. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 4:56 pm

    MTU,

    Jeter is going to be 37 years old.

    If George would have just given him 4+ years, then we are much better off with Hal.

  80. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 4:57 pm

    entire sow unimpeded

    “And the entire ***show***, too.

  81. MorningPerson November 16th, 2010 at 4:57 pm

    pat -

    Kevin Tower must just be the last person the Yankees should do deal with right now! :)

  82. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 4:57 pm

    Bret:

    That’s probably why Justin Upton will quite likely be standing in the D’Back outfield come early April, 2011.

  83. pat November 16th, 2010 at 4:58 pm

    “A team that allows the GM to run the entire sow unimpeded is called ?The Mets?.”

    Wilpon Jr. seems to have his fingerprints on many things. Very GMS-ish.

  84. Chip November 16th, 2010 at 4:58 pm

    Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 4:52 pm
    You’re right, I’m wrong. Nick Swisher is the best RF in the game today. Heck, he might be the best RF that baseball has seen in the last twenty years.

    You’re a sore loser when you get destroyed on a point.

    —————————-

    I’m not a sore loser at all.

    That said, my folks always stressed to me that if you spend too much time arguing with a fool you invariably fall to their level.

    Much like your comment yesterday about guys like Torre, Cox, LaRussa and Lou not being effective managers because they have “forgotten so much about baseball” I find your stance on Swisher silly but not baffling given your general tenor.

    And with that – night all.

  85. Bret The Hitman November 16th, 2010 at 4:59 pm

    If Foxsports doesn’t mind, I’d like to edit their article for them.

    “Arizona would likely want three players for Upton — a backend reliever, a starter and a bat. But it’s not clear if there is a good match on players between the clubs.

    Given their historical bullpen woes in 2010, the Diamondbacks would likely request ascendant reliever Joba Chamberlain; the Yankees would probably rather move Damaso Marte, who is more expensive than Chamberlain and just one year from free agency.

    Brett Gardner could fit Arizona’s need for a hitter. He would represent an upgrade over the incumbent Gerardo Parra. The Yankees, though, might not have a major-league-ready starter that would appeal to the Diamondbacks. Right Ivan Nova might not be attractive enough, and righty Dellin Betances, Manny Banuelos and Andrew Brackman are likely off-limits.”

  86. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 4:59 pm

    Unless they have some background in baseball, owners that allow their GM and the team that GM has assembled to run the entire show are very smart owners.

    The Steinbrenners need to stay out of baseball decisions as much as possible and it would be ideal if they stayed out of it completely.

  87. pat November 16th, 2010 at 5:00 pm

    Morning Person

    Yup. Tower knows where the bodies are buried now.

  88. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:00 pm

    Incorrect, the Mets are notorious for their owners meddling in everything. All decisions go through them.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    Yeah, they certainly corralled Minaya and Bernazard, didn’t they? It only took them 5 years to meddle.

  89. CB November 16th, 2010 at 5:00 pm

    Why would anyone think that FoxSports actually has any valid information over what the D’Backs would want in a trade? They are consistently wrong and simply speculating.

    According to FoxSports Jacoby Ellsbury can be included in any trade for any player in all of baseball. Never mind the fact that Ellsbury fired his prior agent after a brief run of notoriety after the 2007 world series and hired Scott Boras. I’m sure the D’Backs will be very interested in a Boras player who is now arbitration eligible.

    Yes, foxsports has the inside track on this.

    Horse manure, indeed.

  90. MTU November 16th, 2010 at 5:00 pm

    LGY-

    I’m just noting the difference if there turns out to be one.

    Jury still out.

    As you know I personally do not like the pure #’s approach to assigning value to players.

    Some things go beyond numbers in my mind.

    But hey, that’s just me. I’d probably be terrible at running a team
    because of it. And go bankrupt.

    :)

  91. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 5:02 pm

    Yeah, they certainly corralled Minaya and Bernazard, didn’t they? It only took them 5 years to meddle.

    They made the choice of their player development men and GM, and many of the mets moves were ordered by the Wilpons. They are one of the least ‘GM controlled’ teams in the league.

  92. CB November 16th, 2010 at 5:02 pm

    “If he’s truly available, it’s kind of a shame he doesn’t fit the Yankees’ needs right now.”

    Oh – he fits a need. He’s a player who creates his own need. It’s just that it’s going to be cost prohibitive in terms of the talent needed to get him.

    And as Pat astutely points out Towers is going to know the Yankees system upside down. They aren’t just going to sneak one by him.

  93. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 5:02 pm

    Or did you think that just because the owners meddle it makes it impossible for their employees to also be screw ups?

  94. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:02 pm

    Not sure how much Jr. is involved, pat, but, they allowed Minaya to run that team into the ground. My response was more about Sr. I haven’t kept up with that train wreck much, lately.

  95. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 5:03 pm

    Why else would the Mets promise more GM autonomy as a way to lure in candidates to interview?

  96. Bret The Hitman November 16th, 2010 at 5:05 pm

    Ken_Rosenthal

    Sources: #Marlins and #Braves talking about Uggla for IF Infante and LHP Dunn. Story soon on FOXSports.com. #MLB
    2 minutes ago via Twitter for BlackBerry®
    Reply Retweet

    Ken_Rosenthal
    Buck deal with #Marlins will be $18M for 3 yrs. #RedSox #MLB
    13 minutes ago via Twitter for BlackBerry®

  97. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 5:06 pm

    One of the main reasons the Wilpons allowed Minaya to stick around for so long is because Minaya was basically a puppet for them. He did what they wanted, took the fall and public PR backlash for all the bad stuff, and didn’t demand autonomy like Cash did.

    One of the main stories surrounding the Mets new hirings has been if the Wilpons can stay out of it and let those guys run the show and if good baseball people would even want the job with their constant meddling.

  98. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:06 pm

    Nobody cares about the Mets. They’re the Pittsburgh Pirates with money.

  99. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 5:07 pm

    Nobody cares about the Mets. They’re the Pittsburgh Pirates with money.

    Ok great, no one cares about the mets, so don’t make up a situation on the mets as a way to prove some point about the steinbrenners

  100. MTU November 16th, 2010 at 5:07 pm

    GB-

    “Nobody cares about the Mets.”

    Now that I definitely agree with.

    :)

  101. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:08 pm

    If Minaya was “a puppet”, then he was a gutless, no talent that couldn’t draw a paycheck from a decent team and deserved to tale the fall.

  102. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:08 pm

    ***take***

  103. Wave Your Hat November 16th, 2010 at 5:09 pm

    The Yanks have a somewhat unique window of opportunity here.

    They are overloaded in marketable AAA and AA pitching, they have three very marketable outfielders, especially if they give some salary relief on Granderson and Swisher, and marketable major league pitching, headlined by Phil Hughes.

    At the same time, by all accounts the Yanks want to sign Cliff Lee and re-sign Andy Pettitte.

    There is no room for the AAA/AA pitchers, and if there is no room for them their value to the Yanks is significantly reduced.

    Therefore the Yanks can significantly overpay for the right player and still come out ahead.

    Whether that is Upton, Rasmus or someone else is not that important. What’s important is that they do try to make a deal lot that, and not be content to just sit on their assets, so to speak.

  104. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 5:10 pm

    “If Minaya was “a puppet”, then he was a gutless, no talent that couldn’t draw a paycheck from a decent team and deserved to tale the fall.”

    ———————————–

    What does that have to do with this discussion at all?

    I thought we were talking about how you said the Wilpons didn’t meddle??

  105. G. Love November 16th, 2010 at 5:10 pm

    CB,

    You must be having an off day. Usually you’re much more astute.

    You know you can trade Ellsbury for every all star in this league at the drop of a hat.

    Boston is still currently deciding whether to trade him straight up to the Padres for Agon, Heath Bell, Latos and Steve Garvey’s elastic wasitband.

    You can also trade Ellsbury for the Tampa Bay Rays if you throw in Dan Nava.

    The Marlins are offering Hanley, Stanton and Josh Johnson just for an autographed 8×10 of Ellsbury and a pinch of Curt Young’s pixie dust.

  106. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 5:11 pm

    Alderson is going to make the Mets into a beast. He is in the Cashman/Theo skein of GMs

  107. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:13 pm

    LGY November 16th, 2010 at 5:10 pm
    “If Minaya was “a puppet”, then he was a gutless, no talent that couldn’t draw a paycheck from a decent team and deserved to tale the fall.”

    ———————————–

    What does that have to do with this discussion at all?

    I thought we were talking about how you said the Wilpons didn’t meddle??

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    They allowed him to destroy a team, didn’t they? Nobody goes about toredoing their own company on purpose unless it’s CBS and looking for a fast buck with the Yankees, or for insurance.

  108. West Coast Yankee Fan November 16th, 2010 at 5:13 pm

    MTU November 16th, 2010 at 4:55 pm

    WCYF-How they handle the Jeter negotiations will tell me a lot in that regard.

    *************

    Indeed it will.

  109. MTU November 16th, 2010 at 5:13 pm

    Jerkface-

    It’s about time they had somebody competent running that team.

    I’ll check back in about 5 years after they have rebuilt their gutted farm system.

  110. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 5:14 pm

    Wave,

    I really hope things go south with Rasmus in St Louis.

    If that happened I think he would be more easily attainable than Upton. I also may be in the minority here, but I like Rasmus more than Upton.

    Rasmus could be the next great Yankee CF IMO.

  111. JoeyA November 16th, 2010 at 5:14 pm

    Blog opinion on the matter:

    Any thoughts on the notion that teams request higher packages in terms of talent from Yanks due to our revenue advantages?

    I’d say while its not a widespread blown out of proportion mindset for the competition, I would imagine certain teams, especially ones we contend with and others with sour grape owners (jeff loria) force the Yanks to a higher price, talent wise.

  112. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 5:14 pm

    I’ll check back in about 5 years after they have rebuilt their gutted farm system.

    Alderson already announced they’re going to go overslot on the draft and dig deep into IFA. It might take them 5 years, but as long as the Wilpons stay out of it they will be back on top.

  113. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:14 pm

    Nobody goes about ***torpedoing***

  114. jacksquat November 16th, 2010 at 5:15 pm

    http://espn.go.com/mlb/players…..erId=28841

    I don’t trade Hughes for that. Looks at the games played. Look at the OPS other than 2009. Look at the strikeouts… Hughes is young and has a lot of potential also. At least a #3, probably a #2, and maybe a #1. I don’t trade young pitching talent like that for young corner outfield talent the likes of which Upton has shown thus far.

    He’s been very overhyped thus far.

  115. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 5:16 pm

    They allowed him to destroy a team, didn’t they?

    They were the ones destroying the team. The Wilpons assessment of the 2008-2010 mets is that ‘we were unlucky’.

    One of the Wilpons wanted Allan Baird for GM, while the other wanted Alderson (though some say Selig pushed for Alderson). Baird was the notorious puppet GM of Glass for the Royals who traded away all their good players for nothing.

  116. Bret The Hitman November 16th, 2010 at 5:16 pm

    Jacksquat,

    You don’t have to worry.

    Phil Hughes is worth more than Justin Upton.

  117. Bret The Hitman November 16th, 2010 at 5:17 pm

    Jacksquat,

    BTW, your Justin Upton espn profile link doesn’t work.

  118. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 5:17 pm

    “They allowed him to destroy a team, didn’t they? Nobody goes about toredoing their own company on purpose unless it’s CBS and looking for a fast buck with the Yankees, or for insurance.”

    —————————————

    They are just as responsible as Minaya for destroying the team.

    That is what happens when you have a couple of owners who have no clue how to assemble a baseball team start making baseball decisions and demanding their GM to make certain moves.

    They didn’t “let” Minaya do anything. They were the ones steering the ship.

    Its why unlike what their father did, the Steinbrenner sons need to stay out of baseball decisions.

  119. jonathan p November 16th, 2010 at 5:19 pm

    yanks in on upton?
    interesting tweet

    http://twitter.com/nickcafardo.....8509428737

  120. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 5:19 pm

    “Any thoughts on the notion that teams request higher packages in terms of talent from Yanks due to our revenue advantages?”

    Nothing in any of the trades the Yankees have been involved with over the last year would suggest it. Granderson, Vazquez, Wood, Berkman. All fair deals.

    So far as the M’s and Lee go, I think that was more about Jack Z liking Smoak over Montero moreso than anything else. Don’t think he made the right choice myself, but I think he made the right choice in his mind.

  121. Bret The Hitman November 16th, 2010 at 5:20 pm

    Tweets mentioning @NYYrumors

    Smokey_14
    Why hasn’t this idiot been thrown outta town yet? ———> @NYYrumors
    31 minutes ago via twidroid

    Smokey_14
    Ugh! You Again?! RT @NYYrumors Cliff Lee willing to take huge pay cut to be a Yankee. Likes the spa, other clubhouse amenities
    about 6 hours ago via twidroid

  122. CB November 16th, 2010 at 5:20 pm

    “What’s important is that they do try to make a deal lot that, and not be content to just sit on their assets, so to speak.”

    They are likely going to. Whether or not the deal can be reasonably made is a another issue. This is about the most difficult kind of trade there is to make.

    Your trying to get another team to trade you their potential franchise player who is not yet free agent eligible (or even that close to free agent eligibility).

    There are only a select few reasons why a team would consider that kind of deal. The player may be deemed to be a problem that the team wants to move. Or the team may be so bad they need to try to achieve a multiplier effect through a trade.

    The Yankees know what their objective is. And it’s not to accumulate a wealth of arms in the minors just to have a wealth of arms in the minors.

    But the likelihood of a deal being feasible to make is small, even if the yankees are willing to overpay some.

  123. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:20 pm

    all of what good players? You mean all of the ones the team refused to pay?

  124. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 5:21 pm

    Sounds like Uggla to the Braves could be close.

  125. RayVT November 16th, 2010 at 5:22 pm

    Uggla for Infante & Dunn? Are the Marlins serious???? Certainly they can get more than that for Uggla! That is really cheap!

  126. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:23 pm

    Enough about the Mets. Hell, I don’t care if they’re found belly up in the East River.

  127. MTU November 16th, 2010 at 5:23 pm

    I gotta run. It’s been an interesting first day to the HS season.

    Catch you all later.

  128. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:24 pm

    Ray, afternoon. For that cost, the Yankees can get Uggla to be a bench player.

  129. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 5:25 pm

    Has there been any talk about St Louis moving Rasmus since that initial incident?

    Can he, LaRussa, and Pujols really coexist?

  130. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 5:25 pm

    “Uggla for Infante & Dunn? Are the Marlins serious???? Certainly they can get more than that for Uggla! That is really cheap!”

    That’s National League All Star Omar Infante to you, pal. ;)

  131. CB November 16th, 2010 at 5:26 pm

    “You know you can trade Ellsbury for every all star in this league at the drop of a hat. ”

    G. Love-

    The other ridiculous part of that trade speculation was the Dan Bard part.

    Towers has built his reputation in part due to his bull pen construction in San Diego. He really was the guy to pioneer the strategy of finding cheap, short terms parts to stock the pen with rather than expending significant value (either monetary or talent) on a relief pitcher.

    And all of a sudden, Dan Bard is going to be a huge piece for Upton? Out of the blue Towers is going to put huge value on a closer rather than sticking with his strategy of trying to find a Heath Bell off the scrap heap?

    That foxsports report was just the usual speculative nonsense on how the Sox can acquire any player for Ellsbury (who is coming off a horrible season, one in which much of boston is fed up with him), Bard, and Player X.

    Using that nonsense to try to construe an argument for what the D’Backs would actually want for Upton is absurd.

  132. MorningPerson November 16th, 2010 at 5:26 pm

    CB -

    But in filling one need, he creates others.

    And I agree, pat’s very good at getting to the nitty gritty and I don’t think right now the Yankees can make an “advantageous” deal with Kevin Towers.

  133. blake November 16th, 2010 at 5:27 pm

    Ellsbury plus a pair of Casey Kelly’s used cleats should be plenty enough for Upton..

    Get Uggla Braves.

  134. D-Man November 16th, 2010 at 5:27 pm

    Rasmus should be the target, not Upton who will cost the moon.

    Ramus will be a great Yankee

  135. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 5:29 pm

    Casey Kelly gets made fun of a lot on here, but what kind of prospect is he really?

    Beyond the insane hype, how much value in the real world does he have?

    Buster Olney said this yesterday:

    “The Brewers priority right now is to get any kind of high end pitching because that’s what they lack so much, and I’m sure that if you called Doug Melvin and offered, you know, prospects like a Casey Kelly, like a Stephen Strasburg, like a Madison Bumgarner, you’re going to get their attention.”

    Kelly in the same sentence as Strasburg and Bumgarner!!! Is there some sort of systematic attempt by baseball writers across America to hype this kid up beyond belief?

  136. Bret The Hitman November 16th, 2010 at 5:29 pm

    Why does it have to be an advantageous deal with Kevin Towers. Can’t it benefit both teams like the Granderson trade?

  137. G. Love November 16th, 2010 at 5:30 pm

    CB,

    I felt like the first report linking the Red Sox was to bring the Yankees to Towers doorstep and the 2nd report from Cafardo was to bring the Red Sox to the doorstep.

    Towers is smart enough to know that if he can get those 2 behemoths frothing over a franchise talent, he could walk away with 5 major league players.

    I can’t even imagine what it would take to get that player talent wise.

    The Yankees have a simple plan they can follow which is sign Lee, resign Jeter, Mo and Andy and add a bench bat and a LH reliever.

    That said, if players like Upton are really on the market, the Yankees have an awful lot of chips on their side of the table to play.

    Should be interesting if the rumor of his possibly being in play is true.

  138. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:30 pm

    In the AFL, all three of Banuelos, Kontos and Pope were very good today.

    Romine and Laird didn’t hit a thing, but, Laird had his 7th assist of the season (23 games in the outfield). He threw out a runner at home.

    http://mlb.mlb.com/milb/stats/.....n_pddwin_1

  139. CB November 16th, 2010 at 5:30 pm

    Uggla to the braves makes a ton of sense. Their lack of power really hurt them.

    If that’s the deal that gets executed you once again see the impact that finances and free agency have on a player’s value.

    Uggla’s trade value went down when he rejected that last contract offer from the Marlins.

    Every team wants one thing – cost controlled young players. Even the yankees want them. That’s why so few of them are traded now.

  140. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 5:30 pm

    Infante only has one year left on his contract at $2.5 million.

  141. Yanks78 November 16th, 2010 at 5:31 pm

    Death…. Texas…. and speculative November hot-stove reports about the Sox acquiring another team’s superstar for overvalued players that are of minimal interest to the other team.

    Like clockwork….

  142. MorningPerson November 16th, 2010 at 5:31 pm

    Wave Your Hat -

    I feel almost as if the Yankees are paralyzed until Cliff Lee makes his decision. And there’s the rub. If you KNOW you have Cliff Lee on board (and/or Pettitte) it definitely impacts what you’re wiling/able to do in other areas.

    Meanwhile, Mr. Lee is going to be courting suitors….

    :)

  143. RadioKev November 16th, 2010 at 5:31 pm

    It’s just talk, nothing more. I don’t see this working out at all as we’ve got a stacked outfield all ready. Why trade away arms for an upgrade over Gardener? Gardener is much better than average, cost efficient, and we hold onto our talent.

    It’s just silly.

  144. MorningPerson November 16th, 2010 at 5:33 pm

    Bret the Hitman -

    I was just about to type, without having seen your post, that one can still make a fair deal with Towers.

  145. blake November 16th, 2010 at 5:33 pm

    LGY,.

    I’ve never see Kelly pitch but he had a 5 + era in AA and Baneulos appeared to adjust better to that level while being nearly two years younger.

  146. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 5:34 pm

    It will be interesting to see if the Braves can afford Uggla an all their pitchers with Jurrjens arbitration case.

    Uggla is going to get $10+ million and Jurrjens is Arb1.

  147. RayVT November 16th, 2010 at 5:36 pm

    Mell November 16th, 2010 at 5:25 pm

    But Uggla had 4 yrs of 30+ HRs and an OPS of almost 900. The Braves are offering almost nothing for him!

  148. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:36 pm

    What i do know is that Trenton cuffed Kelly around a couple of times. From radio reports on the games, he’s a normal 90-91 MPH decent curve, good change-up. Control was ok.

  149. Bret The Hitman November 16th, 2010 at 5:37 pm

    My thinking is…if Uggla nets Infante and Dunn, that pretty much caps the trade value of Nick Swisher. Uggla and Swish are both 30, both will earn 7-10 million, both had .870 OPS.

  150. Wave Your Hat November 16th, 2010 at 5:38 pm

    I don’t understand signing Buck at 3 years/%18MM, then turning around and trading Uggla for Infante and Dunn.

  151. Wave Your Hat November 16th, 2010 at 5:40 pm

    Morning Person-

    I believe you are correct.

  152. D-Man November 16th, 2010 at 5:40 pm

    All Uggla could fetch was a super-utility player and an erratic lefty reliever?

  153. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 5:42 pm

    “I don’t understand signing Buck at 3 years/%18MM, then turning around and trading Uggla for Infante and Dunn”

    They offered him 4/$48M and he turned it down. Not an unfair offer. Not the greatest reutrn either, but they were only selling one year of his services.

  154. Wave Your Hat November 16th, 2010 at 5:43 pm

    Mell–

    But you don’t sign Buck at that price unless you are trying to win in 2011, no?

  155. CB November 16th, 2010 at 5:44 pm

    The Marlins have really made some awful moves recently. It’s just clear that they have little concern or interest in actually trying to win.

    You’d want to hope that they would try to start winning given that they’re moving into that tax payer financed stadium the season after next.

    But it wouldn’t be surprising at all if they just pocketed the additional revenue from that new stadium to increase their margins.

    The exchange of talent in that Uggla deal is just awful.

  156. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 5:44 pm

    “My thinking is…if Uggla nets Infante and Dunn, that pretty much caps the trade value of Nick Swisher. Uggla and Swish are both 30, both will earn 7-10 million, both had .870 OPS.”

    —————————-

    Swisher is under contract for 2 more seasons vs Uggla’s 1 and didn’t just turn down an extension harming his trade value.

  157. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 5:45 pm

    Mell,

    They are basically just trading Dan Uggla for Mike Dunn and a worse team in 2011.

    Infante is only under contract for 1 more season.

    So they are downgrading the team in 2011 by swapping Uggla for Infante just to get Mike freakin Dunn.

  158. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 5:45 pm

    Ray:

    I was only kidding about the all star thing. Like I said earlier, the Marlins are selling one year of Uggla’s services with the prospective buyer understanding that 4/$48M isn’t going to be good enough to keep him beyond that one year. That’s not going to net you great return.

  159. Betsy November 16th, 2010 at 5:46 pm

    The Yankees won’t trade Phil now………….they’ve invested a lot in him. If he doesn’t do that well next year, I can see it, but then you wouldn’t get an Upton back for him. They need pitching……there is no guarantee they get Lee (who I don’t think is jonesing for NY – or any place else in particular) and/or Andy. Even with Lee and no Andy, they are still a pitcher short.

    As to Swisher, I like him, but I do not think he’s an elite, middle of the order hitter. I don’t go out of my way to trade him, but I sure listen.

  160. RayVT November 16th, 2010 at 5:47 pm

    CB November 16th, 2010 at 5:44 pm

    What do you think it would take the Yanks to get Uggla?

  161. MorningPerson November 16th, 2010 at 5:47 pm

    The Marlins kind of have a history of this type of stuff don’t they?

    I mean, every time it looks like they might have something, they start trading pieces away.

    I remember after they won both WS, they took apart the team.

    And the year they signed on Girardi as manager, he thought he had one team, and then they started breaking that team up so the team Girardi ended up managing was not the team he thought he was getting when he took the job.

    Unless I’m completely misremembering everything. :)

  162. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:48 pm

    How much better does Hughes need to be for somebody to realize just how good he was in 2010?

  163. Dylan November 16th, 2010 at 5:48 pm

    # RayVT November 16th, 2010 at 5:47 pm

    CB November 16th, 2010 at 5:44 pm

    What do you think it would take the Yanks to get Uggla?
    ____________________________________________________________

    A time machine, because apparently its a done deal.

  164. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 5:49 pm

    “But you don’t sign Buck at that price unless you are trying to win in 2011, no?”

    If I’m trying to win, that last thing I do is sign Buck at that or any other price.

    It’s a pretty bad trade, and I’m not sure why they were so quick to make it. However, it is for only one year of Uggla, unless the Braves are prepared to go 5 and $60M at a minimum.

  165. RayVT November 16th, 2010 at 5:49 pm

    Mell November 16th, 2010 at 5:45 pm

    I thought you were, but I’m still in shock that a talent like Uggla could cost so little. If I were Red Sox, I’d trade for him in a heartbeat at that price!

  166. CB November 16th, 2010 at 5:49 pm

    RayVT-

    I believe the Uggla deal is final. He’s on the Braves now.

    As it is, Uggla had no spot on the yankees. Not the right fit given the money he’ll make next season.

  167. Betsy November 16th, 2010 at 5:49 pm

    That said, no way do I do that deal……….we don’t need Upton to win and a trade like that just wrecks your farm system. Romine (if you trade Montero) is hardly a given and he’s not that close (2 years away at least)… You could give up Phil if there were other pitchers who were at least somewhat established in the majors, there aren’t

  168. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 5:50 pm

    Uggla plays terrible defense as well.

  169. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:51 pm

    Ray, what do the Braves need? Cashman will have to deal with them, now. They made the deal.

  170. CB November 16th, 2010 at 5:52 pm

    “If I were Red Sox, I’d trade for him in a heartbeat at that price!”

    That would have been an interesting deal for them. They could have traded for Uggla, moved him to third and let Beltre go and saved the long term deal.

    People have long thought Uggla has to be moved off of second as he’s a horrible fielder and that he’d wind up on 3b or LF.

  171. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 5:53 pm

    If the Yankees traded one of their OF for a pitcher, I was planning on advocating the Yankees try to make a move for Uggla and stick him in one of the corners in the OF.

    Oh well.

  172. Betsy November 16th, 2010 at 5:54 pm

    Marlins should be contracted.

  173. Dylan November 16th, 2010 at 5:54 pm

    What a steal for the Braves. They basically traded a glorified utility player and low level prospect, for one of the best offensive infielders in baseball.

  174. CB November 16th, 2010 at 5:55 pm

    “How much better does Hughes need to be for somebody to realize just how good he was in 2010?”

    It is really amazing.

    Many Yankee fans have no idea what it means for a young player to develop. No patience at all and no sense of how players get better with experience. Everyone has to be Derek Jeter or Wang or Pettitte and come up close to fully formed otherwise they are substandard.

  175. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:55 pm

    CB, I always thought that Uggla was an AL right fielder, given the many smaller right fields in the league, moreso than a left fielder. decent to strong arm….just not very mobile on grounders or very sure handed.

  176. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 5:58 pm

    CB, I still remember the hue and cry to unload Pettitte after the 1998 season because “he was just lucky to be on a high scoring team”. Pettitte rimnds me a lot of Jack Morris and David Wells as far as pitching to score boards. “Score me runs and I’ll get through the game. Score a couple and I’ll shut ‘em down.”

  177. RayVT November 16th, 2010 at 5:59 pm

    What a steal for the Braves. He could play 3B or LF for them. A great bat!

  178. LGY November 16th, 2010 at 6:00 pm

    Just a year ago John Buck was non tendered by the Kansas City Royals.

    One fairly good season later and he scores a 3 year $18 million deal.

    Timing is everything.

  179. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 6:00 pm

    Pettitte ***reminds*** me

  180. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 6:03 pm

    The braves just traded for a player they won’t be able to sign for 4-48, which Swisher is not even worth and Uggla is arguably worse.

    Good pickup for a season I guess.

  181. RayVT November 16th, 2010 at 6:04 pm

    LGY November 16th, 2010 at 6:00 pm

    Very true! A Catcher that can hit above his weight is valuable anytime though!

  182. pat November 16th, 2010 at 6:04 pm

    Uggla can be Uggla in Atlanta and still look better than Conrad at 2B. :wink:

  183. West Coast Yankee Fan November 16th, 2010 at 6:05 pm

    Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 6:03 pm

    The braves just traded for a player they won’t be able to sign for 4-48, which Swisher is not even worth and Uggla is arguably worse.

    Good pickup for a season I guess.

    **************************

    I’m sure the Braves will try to sign Uggla to a long-term deal.

  184. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 6:06 pm

    “Very true! A Catcher that can hit above his weight is valuable anytime though”

    I think last year was the 1st where Buck hit above his weight.

  185. Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 6:07 pm

    I’m sure the Braves will try to sign Uggla to a long-term deal.

    Ok, but its either going to be for 5+ years for a guy who can’t defend at second, or for more than 12 million a year which he isn’t worth (according to Chip)

    Uggla turned down 4-48

  186. pat November 16th, 2010 at 6:08 pm

    PeterBotte
    Halladay on Felix vs CC, etc.: “Obviously, Felix’s numbers are very impressive, but ultimately you look at how guys are able to win games.”

    Halladay with a vote for CC?

  187. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 6:10 pm

    I thought 4/$48M for Uggla was pretty fair.

  188. West Coast Yankee Fan November 16th, 2010 at 6:10 pm

    Jerkface November 16th, 2010 at 6:07 pm

    I’m sure the Braves will try to sign Uggla to a long-term deal.

    Ok, but its either going to be for 5+ years for a guy who can’t defend at second, or for more than 12 million a year which he isn’t worth (according to Chip). Uggla turned down 4-48.

    ****************

    I think Uggla was nuts to turn that down. Maybe the Braves will offer him 4/50 and he takes it. Or he tries this again next year.

  189. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 6:10 pm

    If NYYs had been in a real need for a solid utility player, you can’t get much better than Infante and he hits, fields and runs well enough to start at a lot of positions for a lot of teams.

  190. RayVT November 16th, 2010 at 6:11 pm

    Mell November 16th, 2010 at 6:06 pm

    I understand! LOL! Strange isn’t it!

  191. Mell November 16th, 2010 at 6:13 pm

    Ray:

    Speaks to the power of one good year, and having that year at the right time.

  192. West Coast Yankee Fan November 16th, 2010 at 6:14 pm

    Mell November 16th, 2010 at 6:13 pm

    Ray:

    Speaks to the power of one good year, and having that year at the right time.

    **********

    Beltre is the master.

  193. RayVT November 16th, 2010 at 6:14 pm

    GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 6:10 pm

    Hello GB! I thought a guy like Uggla on the Yanks could serve an amazing amount of use. Play some 3B, LF, RF, DH & even spell Robby at 2B. Easily get 500 ABs in a season and more if a major injury took out a key cogg. (ARod/Tex/Cano/Swish/Gardner/Granderson).

  194. RayVT November 16th, 2010 at 6:16 pm

    West Coast Yankee Fan November 16th, 2010 at 6:14 pm
    Mell November 16th, 2010 at 6:13 pm

    So right! Timing is everything! Truly is!

  195. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 6:20 pm

    For those that love talks about hitting, Costas on Friday night has Rod Carew and Tony oliva for an hour. That’s going to be some kind of show. I feel sad that more people didn’t get to see just how good Carew and especially Oliva really were.

  196. West Coast Yankee Fan November 16th, 2010 at 6:20 pm

    Jake Westbrook back to the Cards.

  197. D-Man November 16th, 2010 at 6:22 pm

    “Jake Westbrook back to the Cards.”

    2 of the better short-term guys, Westbrook and Kuroda, off the board.

  198. 108 stitches November 16th, 2010 at 6:22 pm

    Few GM’s in the game are in more of a quagmire than Theo INepstein is.
    John Henry has no interest in exceeding the luxury tax threshold. The farm system is middle of the road at best with no trading chips that can get the attention of many teams.
    They will need a full year of good health from their 1 – 5 starters – - – a tall order.
    If by chance they’re still a contender by the 7/31 trading deadline, Papelbon will be the only chip to offer in order to get any player considered quality.
    Daniel Bard can be dangled but that’s as far as it gets. He’s cost conrtolled for a few years and the next closer after Papelbon is gone which will be no later than the next crop of free agents.
    Their catching is a giant hole and Victor Martinez has better be signed or it’s clearly the worst catching in the AL East.
    Their outfield doesn’t match up better than ANY other team in the AL East. Their infield is coming back from injuries.
    Thanks – but no thanks.

  199. pat November 16th, 2010 at 6:23 pm

    Ledger_Yankees
    A person with knowledge confirms a @NickCafardo report that the Yanks have checked with D-Backs about Upton though it’s more due diligence.

  200. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 6:23 pm

    RayVT November 16th, 2010 at 6:14 pm
    GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 6:10 pm

    Hello GB! I thought a guy like Uggla on the Yanks could serve an amazing amount of use. Play some 3B, LF, RF, DH & even spell Robby at 2B. Easily get 500 ABs in a season and more if a major injury took out a key cogg. (ARod/Tex/Cano/Swish/Gardner/Granderson).

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    Yeah, Ray, he could have offered that offense and emergency spots at other spots probably, though his best position is batter. Had NYYs needed a full time DH, he’d probably made more sense.

    Hope all is going well with you and Mrs VT and the little VTs up there in the “sticks” there in Virginia.

  201. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 6:31 pm

    Ripken is smoking peyote. He’s got Boston signing Werth and trading Ellsbury for Adrian Gonzales. Gonna take a Hell of a lot more than that. Not sure if San Diego wants to take Boston’s complete farm system, but, that’s what it’s going to take. San Diego is as close or closer to the NL West than Boston is to the AL East. Not happening.

  202. austinmac November 16th, 2010 at 6:34 pm

    GB,

    I grew up in the Orlando area and saw a lot of Oliva and Carew. Amazing hitters. My wife’s cousin is a good friend of Carew. I hear he is a terrific guy. Always glad to hear that. I saw Carew in A ball. He could hit even then. Oliva could hit with power to all fields. Too bad a leg injury shortened his career.

    No way the Yankees trade Hughes. He is too valuable-a capable young pitcher. I could see any of the current OFs, Romine and one of the Bs being offered.

  203. Tom in N.J. November 16th, 2010 at 6:34 pm

    There’s a nation wide peyote shortage:

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....eheadlines

  204. MorningPerson November 16th, 2010 at 6:35 pm

    GB7 -

    Which Ripken? Not that it matters, really….

    It sure sounds like Ellsbury is not long for the Red Sox, though, doesn’t it?

    I realize that it’s good business to listen on everything – mega due diligence and all – but it sure confuses the heck out of me as to what exactly the Yankees are doing! :)

    The problem lies in the statement from Lee’s agent though, doesn’t it, that they aren’t even entertaining actual offers yet, right? Just listening to the perty words first?

    Sheesh.

  205. Tom in N.J. November 16th, 2010 at 6:39 pm

    Congress is honoring the late Yankee Stadium public-address announcer Bob Sheppard.

    New York congresswoman Carolyn McCarthy introduced the resolution on Tuesday in tribute to his lifetime achievement. It was passed by the House of Representatives.

    http://sports.espn.go.com/new-.....id=5814268

  206. Rich in NJ November 16th, 2010 at 6:41 pm

    “There’s a nation wide peyote shortage:”

    Don’t blame me.

  207. BIG AL November 16th, 2010 at 6:41 pm

    Is upton a good player – Yes
    Does he possess the potential to be a great player – Yes
    Is he worth what so many on this blog think he is – NO

    If any player is being overrated in this discussion, it’s Upton.

    Montero has great potential as well, but until he has 5-7 years of solid numbers posted, Upton still only has great potential, and has yet to put up the numbers required to give uo the talent being thrown around on this blog, IMO.

  208. BIG AL November 16th, 2010 at 6:41 pm

    Dinner bell – Ca

  209. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 6:42 pm

    austinmac November 16th, 2010 at 6:34 pm
    GB,

    I grew up in the Orlando area and saw a lot of Oliva and Carew. Amazing hitters. My wife’s cousin is a good friend of Carew. I hear he is a terrific guy. Always glad to hear that. I saw Carew in A ball. He could hit even then. Oliva could hit with power to all fields. Too bad a leg injury shortened his career.

    No way the Yankees trade Hughes. He is too valuable-a capable young pitcher. I could see any of the current OFs, Romine and one of the Bs being offered.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    Make, when Oliva came up, he was the 2010 Robinson Cano with speed. His knees were almost Mantle bad. Like Mattingly, only injuries have kept him out of the HOF. Not only could he hit, but, he was an very good right fielder with a rifle arm. Not sure how the Yankees missed on Rod Carew. He grew up about 3 blocks from Yankee Stadium. Damned, thos two could rip a baseball, though.

  210. Rich in NJ November 16th, 2010 at 6:42 pm

    Westbrook is very well-suited to be coached up by Duncan.

  211. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 6:43 pm

    Tom, I hadn’t seen that, but, Ripken’s dreams sure would account for that report.

  212. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 6:45 pm

    MP, the Red sox need to offer a lot more than Ellsbury. He’s gone, but, he’s fast becoming more of a piece than a headliner in any deal.

  213. GreenBeret7 November 16th, 2010 at 6:47 pm

    ***Make***, when Oliva came up, he was the 2010 Robinson Cano

    I must have gotten Ripken’s shipment. Mac. sorry about that.

  214. blake November 16th, 2010 at 6:51 pm

    I doubt the Sox can get Gonzalez without including Buchholtz….I just don’t see who else they could put in there. Ellsbury isn’t headlining that deal.

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