Votto wins NL MVP
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Nov 22, 2010 
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A first baseman not named Albert Pujols has won the National League MVP award.
Today, Joey Votto was named the Most Valuable Player in the National League. No real surprise that Votto, Pujol and Carlos Gonzalez finished first, second and third.
One name that jumps out in the top 10 is Aubrey Huff, who finished seventh despite the fact he had to wait until January to settle on a small $3-million contract with the Giants. Last winter’s best signing? Could be.
JM -
Me, too – a vote for Swish was a vote for Votto.
LGY -
I got crushed on this board for suggesting that the Yankees sign Downs and Lee meaning Downs would cost the pinstripers a 2nd round pick. I don’t know that a team is going to give up a 1st rounder for a 35-year old relief pitcher.
The team that signs him would have to have some Type A’s of their own that they’re parting with – that’s why I think Boston would be a good fit. They’ll a first round pick for Beltre regardless of who they sign.
I would also say Tampa is a fit but if they want a closer they’ll just sign Soriano back.
Leyritz piece coming up on OTL right now.
Two guys had Carlos Ruiz in the Top 6?
I bet they find a way to diss A-Rod in the OTL segment.
Chip,
That makes sense. Downs costs a 2nd round pick in that scenario. Worth it for a setup guy. I suspect the Yankees would be interested in Downs because he was one of their first inquiries at this year’s trade deadline.
The risk is his age.
However, since Joba is such a huge question mark and there are no clear, reliable, viable candidates for the setup role, that’s a risk the Yankees might have to take.
congrats to Votto! all but one of the first place votes!
Hope they are announcing Cano’s name tomorrow at this time.
Giving up a top fifty to fifty-five pick is not worth a 35 year old set-up guy that will be asking for $5.5-$6.5 mil a year for 3 years.
Only one more day ’til :crossesfingers: Cano is named AL MVP.
I really don’t see any trade targets at this time.
blake November 22nd, 2010 at 2:59 pm
Hope they are announcing Cano?s name tomorrow at this time.
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blake, you beat me to it, but I like the way you think.
I took a Kennedy’s class at Umass Amherst, by a Professor Stephen B. Oates (look him up). This was by far my favorite class in college and was so popular that only 2nd semester seniors could take it unless you were a history major. The only thing I disagree with, in terms of what was already said in the last post is the notion that Bobby would have been better a president. In my mind JFK is vastly under appreciated as a president (look at the what he accomplished in such a short amount of time, plus he laid the ground work for all of LBJ’s work, like him or not there is no denying that LBJ did more than almost any president in the last 50 years in terms public programs that improved middle class). If he would have served out 2 full terms this would have been a majority opinion. His charisma/leadership were vastly superior to that of Bobby/Teddy. Supposedly big brother Joe even topped Jack in that regard.
Chip,
One of the main reasons you got crushed is because the Yankees already have Mo. If Mo were to retire, I would say basically everyone on here would be fine giving up draft picks to to replace him.
Also, not every GM subscribes to the theory or subscribes to it as strictly as the Yankees seem to now that relievers are not worth giving up draft picks.
bERtIN, if Cano wins, I’m buying myself my own lucky Bert and Ernie stuffed dolls.
I just pray that they don’t scare the twins or “Killer”.
Interesting
“The Yankees were going to select Votto with their first pick (71st overall) in the 2002 draft, but the Reds beat them to it. The Yanks surrendered their first round pick to the A’s that year when they signed Jason Giambi. Congrats to Votto, this might not be his last MVP.”
http://riveraveblues.com/2010/...../#comments
GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2010 at 3:05 pm
bERtIN, if Cano wins, I?m buying myself my own lucky Bert and Ernie stuffed dolls.
I just pray that they don?t scare the twins or ?Killer?.
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All right, GB!!
Don’t worry-I’m sure the twins and Killer will love them.
I hope Cano gets the award but I believe Josh Hamilton will win it.
Mike Boston-that sounds like a fascinating class.
Ryan Howard got a second place vote, a third place vote, a fourth, two fifths, two sixths and a seventh.
SMH
Don’t worry-I’m sure the twins and Killer will love them.
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Only homemade chocolate chip cookies would calm them down. Scientific fact.
“Ubaldo Jimenez got a fourth place vote, but no other votes. No man is an island. Except, that is, for the man who voted Jimenez fourth.
Dan Uggla got five votes. I can now officially taunt Marlins fans by saying that the Braves traded Omar Infante and Mike Dunn for an MVP candidate. Wait, that’s silly. There aren’t any Marlins fans.”
http://hardballtalk.nbcsports......-happened/
GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2010 at 3:10 pm
Only homemade chocolate chip cookies would calm them down. Scientific fact.
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Hmmm…I could always send you some through the computer again. Or have Cookie Monster make a special delivery.
sounds good, bERtIN. I’d buy some Chips Ahoy, but I can’t open a bag with burning them.
LGY:
The 2nd round that year produced a few big names. In addition to Votto at #44, Jon Lester went at #56, Jonathan Broxton at #60, and Brian McCann at #64. Lot of good 1st rounders that year too. Greinke, BJ Upton, Swisher, Hamels, Fielder, Kazmir, Span, Loney. A’s used the Yankees pick to select Joe Blanton that year.
I think Hamilton is a shoo-in for AL MVP. Cano will be probably be 2nd, maybe 3rd.
I wouldn’t go for Downs. We have enough good young bullpen arms to make it work. We can always pick up someone up at the deadline if need be. Not worth the draft pick plus the inflexibility that the length and amount of his contract would cause.
Mike_Boston, that’s cool you got to study with Oates. I remember reading his Civil War “oral” history where he wrote semi-fictional imagined perspectives from the major participants. One thought though: I actually think JFK is a bit overrated. He consistently scores higher with the general public than he does with historians. I think the flash of the Kennedy years and his tragic end overwhelm people’s memories as opposed to his actual accomplishments. JFK’s legislative program was basically a list on a piece of paper that was never going to happen until LBJ pushed much of it through in 64 and 65. I do think that JFK may have altered the course of Vietnam, not because he was a dove (he was as hawkish as anyone) but because he wouldn’t have been as intimidated by his elite advisors as LBJ was. Your thoughts?
“Only the Reds and the Yanks were on Votto…Yankees scout D. (edited by me for the filter) Groch, who signed Derek Jeter, was in Etobicoke, set to pounce, if the Yanks got Votto.”
http://www.torontosun.com/spor.....6-sun.html
Mike boston, that is interesting, unfortunately I am told we can’t discuss politics on this blog..
People should read “one minute to midnight” by Michael Dobbs outlining day by day even minute by minute the happenings of the cuban missile crisis. Holy Cow it is a scary read. Kennedy, through rational decision making and holding his own against nut jobs like Curtis Lemay , saved us (of the few who would have survided a nuclear war) from experiencing Cormac McCarthy’s The Road. His handling of the cuban missile crisis and holding off war makes him not only a great president but one of the saviors of mankind.
Patrick do what you want – that was just my opinion.
“People should read “one minute to midnight” by Michael Dobbs outlining day by day even minute by minute the happenings of the cuban missile crisis.”
I was in elementary school back then.
For tornado drills we’d open the windows, go into the hall, sit down and put our coats over our heads.
For nuclear missile drills, we’d close the windows, go into the hall, sit down and put our coats over our heads.
What a world…
“Bombs Away” Lemay is still an interesting character to read about, though. I met him years ago when stationed in Texas. WOW!! Every morning he’d get up at 5:00 AM, turn on his TV and sing the National Anthem with the TV. He was in his 70s. What a character.
We’d all have been radioactive glass.
ML,
I do think that if Dallas never happened we never would have had Vietnam to the scale that we wound up getting with LBJ. Like you said JFK was more hawkish and I highly doubt he would have been bullied into war by his advisers along with the infamous industrial military complex. Oates’s theory was that this was a CIA ordered hit carried out by the mob (both certainly had their reasons). LBJ was thrust into this presidency and was not prepared to lead in all facets of the position and that was clearly displayed in his handling of Vietnam. My guess would be that the Gulf of Tunkin would have been seen for what it really was and thus would have been dealt with appropriately. It’s very sad to think of how many lives were really lost with JFK when you look at the big picture.
Oates told us that one day after one of his lectures he was approached by two large men in three piece suits and was asked to stop using that theory if he knew what was good for him (I’m paraphrasing).
Patrick,
I don’t consider this topic political, since we’re not harping on left/right or anything current. It’s simply a fascinating topic that changed our lives forever. If you don’t want to read about it then skip it. It’s not like this offensive material.
Patrick,
The point is don’t instigate a fight where none exists. We’re discussing history, not politics, and doing it without yelling, screaming, or name calling. Your posts, including this last one, are clearly designed to start a political food fight.
Tim Dierkes’ list of player that he thinks will be offered arbitration and not.
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/.....tions.html
Mike_Boston November 22nd, 2010 at 3:38 pm
Oates told us that one day after one of his lectures he was approached by two large men in three piece suits and was asked to stop using that theory if he knew what was good for him (I?m paraphrasing).
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OMG!! I take it he didn’t stop. LOL
Mike_Boston,
Yeah, after he was stung by the CIA at Bay of Pigs, he probably would not have been fooled or bullied into accepting the military’s story on the Gulf of Tonkin incident.
OTOH, we may not have won civil rights and Medicare if LBJ had not become President. Impossible to know but fascinating to discuss.
I’ll bet those two big guys were LoHud policemen.
I’m not instigating any fights. Mike, I wasn’t being sarcastic when I said that your class sounded interesting, I enjoy history.
I have nothing but respect for JFK, he was a great leader. Whether or not he was a good president is up for debate and you all opened that door. I won’t even go into it. But when some people start going on about how they love Ted Kennedy I feel it’s my right to state my opinion on the guy. Today is about honoring JFK and his achievements, not his brother’s. However, if someone is going to start down that path I’m going to throw my 2 cents in.
GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2010 at 3:48 pm
I?ll bet those two big guys were LoHud policemen.
***************************
If Koji Uehara is not offered arbitration and becomes a FA, this would be one of the first relievers that I’d go for with Kerry Wood a close 2nd…after re-signing Rivera.
I totally forgot that today was the 22nd and what this date meant, so that’s why all this talk started!
ML, good question about the civil rights passage. My feeling is that JFK would have seen it through but of course that is open for debate.
One of the things I still struggle with is if Oswald was alone. Discovery channel did a special on this a few years ago that showed a single sniper could have made those shots, with watermelons, which totally took my by surprise. I had always just assumed it was triangular fire, especially after seeing the location in person the first time.
If anyone out there was curious about the show Madmen (to me it’s the best dram series I’ve ever seen) they handled this day very well. I was born much later so seeing it played out in a realistic setting was really cool and from what I hear from relatives alive in ’63 they were spot on with it.
i think wood was lighting in a bottle. he struggled in cleveland. it’d be hard to bring him back at closer’s money, which he’ll get from someone.
What about this guy as a trade target for setup guy and future closer?
http://espn.go.com/mlb/players.....erId=28486
138 K’s in 77 innings.
Probably cheaper than Joakim Soria as well…and makes less.
JFK lives, no Nam…LBJ was able to push through all of JFK’s programs as The Hill passed them out of respect for JFK….Nuclear Test Ban, Earth Day, Civil Rights, Medi-Care, War on Poverty, etc…..The thawing of the Cold War cost Nikita Kruschev his job as well as the Old Liners in The Kremlin didn’t care much for the direction that he was taking Mother Russia……55,000 American lives would have been shared had those shots never rang out 47 years ago……Oddly enough my BA Degree in American History is only used when topics such as this arise…..Time to hit some 7 irons….
Mike_Boston -
I agree – MadMen handled this topic very, very well.
I was five and a half when JFK was killed. Kindergarten. No one made an announcement to us, and the only thing I remember was coming home from school what must have been a few days later, and the funeral was on our television. My mom was just staring at it. I can see it as clearly as if it happened this morning.
RFK (and MLK), I was 10 and more aware.
Just an awful, awful decade.
Wood was great for the Yanks, but he won’t be a Yank next year. It doesn’t bother me, walking 6.2 per 9 innings is playing with fire IMO.
walks can be controlled, his 11 k/9 is more than worth it.
ID-
How can walks be “controlled”?
I was in 4th grade, and it was my birthday. I had a mean teacher, but she always did something for the birthdays at the end of the day…not this time however. The teachers told us and they were all crying…it was very upsetting. I remember how Kennedy felt like our president, he was young and glamorous w/ a beautiful wife and cute children.
WYH – with the new pitching coach, who’s MO is… lower pitchers walk rate?
How can walks be “controlled”?
—
By throwing fewer balls
jimbaumbach Sounds like Larry Bowa is a strong possibility to be Terry Collins’ bench coach. #mets
“WYH – with the new pitching coach, who’s MO is… lower pitchers walk rate?”
Oh, I see. I wonder why nobody ever told Wood not to walk people? Sheer perverseness, I guess.
I don’t care about the walks – the health is why I wouldn’t invest a full year in Wood. The Yankees were very fortunate to see him stay healthy from August through the playoffs – I wouldn’t roll those dice again on that one though.
ID,
Rothschild’s MO is to increase strikeouts, not reduce walks…. Just look at where the Cubs rank every year in BB/9
pat November 22nd, 2010 at 4:37 pm
jimbaumbach Sounds like Larry Bowa is a strong possibility to be Terry Collins’ bench coach. #mets
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With the hopes that he does for Jose Reyes what he did for Robbie Cano
Happy Birthday, upstate kate.
Hope you’re enjoying your day.
Patrick-
I should have thought of that. I now view walks as a thing of the past, now that the secret of preventing them has been revealed.
kate-happy birthday!!!
patrick- the cubs walk rate is irrelevant. he preaches more k’s less walks, their pitchers were terrible and still walked people.
We don’t need Wood. Robertson’s main problem with being a set up man is he walks too many people.
Now that Roths is here, problem solved!!
wood’s career k/9 is (IIRC) one of the best in the history of the game.
LGY and WYH, you can be as snarky as stupid as you like, it doesn’t change anything.
“he preaches more k’s less walks”
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If only it were so easy.
ID,
It’s not irrelevant at all. All pitching coaches say they want fewer walks, the proof is in how their teams perform. If allowing fewer walks is the #1 priority the Cubs would have a lower BB/9 at the cost of maybe a higher ERA.
Rothschild is obviously all about the strikeouts, his teams almost always have a high k/9
Eiland preached more walks, less Ks.
True story.
“LGY and WYH, you can be as snarky as stupid as you like, it doesn’t change anything.”
You are right, it doesn’t. And if you want to believe in magic, be my guest.
No thoughts on Carlos Marmol?
Any information you can possibly find about Rothschild (since I know none of you have actually looked) says the same thing over and over: Higher strikeout rates, lower walk rates, lower home run rates.
Results may vary. The performance of headcase zambrano and tons of failed rookies shouldn’t dissuade that.
the longer wood stays healthy, the better his control will get as well.
Patrick November 22nd, 2010 at 4:38 pm
ID,
Rothschild’s MO is to increase strikeouts, not reduce walks…. Just look at where the Cubs rank every year in BB/9
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I think that’s more a reflection of the pitchers than the pitching coach. I’m sure Rothschild isn’t out there saying “throw more balls…”
If he can get AJ to throw his change more and get Hughes to incorporate his secondary stuff instead of just throwing fastballs and cutters – I’ll be a happy man.
On Joba, I don’t think there’s much Larry can do for him – he just needs to throw with confidence.
ID,
What pitching coach doesn’t preach “more strikeouts, fewer walks, fewer HR”? He can say it all he wants, the proof is in what his team has actually done.
I do get a kick out of the notion that the Yankees don’t need a veteran set-up guy because someone from the combo pack of young pitchers that the Yankees have will step up and take the job.
Wasn’t that the same plan last year that resulted in the Yankees going out and trading for Kerry Wood?
Einstein defined insanity as doing the same thing over and over again while hoping for different results.
I think that’s more a reflection of the pitchers than the pitching coach. I’m sure Rothschild isn’t out there saying “throw more balls…”
—
No but he’s probably saying “strike more batters out and try to keep those walks down. but priority #1 – strikeouts”
Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2010 at 4:46 pm
the longer wood stays healthy, the better his control will get as well.
—————————
Why do you think Kerry Wood can stay healthy?
Strikeouts are fascist – throw more groundballs, they’re more democratic
Most everything I’ve read about Rothschild says he’s one of the best in the business and that it was a great hire for the Yanks…..im going to give him the.benefit of the doubt until I see otherwise.
I’d rather my pitching coach urge his pitchers to get strikeouts rather than pitch to contact
Chip,
True. I’m fairly certain the Yankees will make a move to bring in a setup guy. It’s in their best interests or else they’re right back where they started from when they traded for Wood. They totally lucked out on that deal. If Wood lived up to his injury history, the bullpen issues could’ve cost the Yankees big time.
What do you think about Carlos Marmol?
He has 2 years remaining on his contract with the Cubs. He’s 28. They’re nowhere near competing so maybe he’s an unnecessary luxury.
When AJ realized Eiland’s preaching of more walks, less Ks ruined AJ’s career, he took a swing at him.
Unfortunately, AJ’s control is so bad that he swung and missed and actually hit himself in the eye.*
This is the story behind AJ’s black eye.
marmol would be insanely expensive.
LGY-
LGY,
I like that theory.
LGY – so is that why eiland was let go?
for ducking? lol
“Any information you can possibly find about Rothschild (since I know none of you have actually looked) says the same thing over and over: Higher strikeout rates, lower walk rates, lower home run rates.”
A study has actually been done. Everyone interested can check it out:
http://www.anothercubsblog.net.....walks.html
The walk improvement is marginal in the extreme.
Certainly not inconsistent with it being random. And certainly doesn’t show Rothschild would improve Wood’s control to any significant degree, or in fact at all.
Argue something else.
LGY-sounds like a conspiracy theory to me
thanks MP and Erin
ID,
How much would Marmol cost?
More or less than Joakim Soria?
Does anyone have any idea why Eiland left or if his extended absence during the season was any reasoning for letting him go?
New Post: Arbitration decisions looming for Yankees
Walk improvement is minimal, while increasing strikeouts.
So the pitchers are being finer with their control, striking out more guys while not inducing more walks. Pitching away from contact and trying to strike guys out will naturally increase your walk rate, the fact that their walk rate did not increase shows he is in fact “lowering” their walks.
So, he does what he says he does… as advertised.
I’m not arguing, you aren’t listening.
Bret -
Can’t see why the Cubs would move Marmol, at least not at a price the Yankees would be willing to pay.
How about this though:
Yankees get: Matt Lindstrom & Jeff Keppinger
Astros get: Joba Chamberlain
I’m pretty sure that’s not enough return for Joba – but I’ll be honest – I have no clue what his trade value is at this point.
” the fact that their walk rate did not increase shows he is in fact “lowering” their walks.
So, he does what he says he does… as advertised.
I’m not arguing, you aren’t listening.”
Baloney.
So you’re all saying that you believe in the single/magic-thrown fist theory?
But what about the bruised ear? It’s just hard to believe that a single fist could do all that damage. There has to have been a second fist thrower.
bret – That’s a tough call, very similar players… marmol could be cheaper just because the Royals wouldn’t want to send us their closer.
They are both FA in 2013… they both make squat… I’ve not heard of the cubs entertaining any offers for marmol though. They have no heir apparent if he gets traded away.