The LoHud Yankees Blog

A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


One shortstop comes off the board

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Nov 29, 2010 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Juan Uribe has signed a three-year deal with the Dodgers, taking one viable shortstop candidate off the free agent market at a price far lower than the Yankees offer to Derek Jeter.

Uribe reportedly agreed to a three-year deal worth $21 million.

Granted, Uribe is far from a perfect comparison to Jeter — he’s 31 years old and has never made an all-star team, much less flirted with an MVP award — but he does help establish the market value for middle infielders.

The Yankees basically offered Jeter twice what Uribe will be making. A little more, actually.

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188 Responses to “One shortstop comes off the board”

  1. Mike in Harrisburg November 29th, 2010 at 3:00 pm

    Jeter only has three more World Series rings than Uribe.

  2. Bret The Hitman November 29th, 2010 at 3:01 pm

    It’s an absurd comparison.

  3. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 3:04 pm

    Far more than absurd.

  4. Mell November 29th, 2010 at 3:07 pm

    “It’s an absurd comparison.”

    “Far more than absurd.”
    ______________________________________________

    Yeah, that’s probably what Chad meant when he indicated, and I quote, “Uribe is far from a perfect comparison to Jeter”

    Lighten up fellas.

  5. blake November 29th, 2010 at 3:07 pm

    Chip,

    After Arod joined the Yankees and moved to 3rd base, Jeter was the best SS in baseball for a period of time…..you could argue he was the best SS in baseball in 2009.

  6. Erin November 29th, 2010 at 3:07 pm

    Bret The Hitman November 29th, 2010 at 3:01 pm
    It?s an absurd comparison.

    *************************
    Did you miss the part where Chad said “it’s far from a perfect comparison”?

  7. Erin November 29th, 2010 at 3:08 pm

    Mell-you beat me to it. :)

  8. Tom in N.J. November 29th, 2010 at 3:08 pm

    Last 3 seasons:

    Jeter: .301/BA .369OBP/ .414SLG/ .783OPS

    Uribe: .261BA .312/OBP .443 SLG/ .755OPS

  9. ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 3:09 pm

    After Arod joined the Yankees and moved to 3rd base, Jeter was the best SS in baseball for a period of time…..you could argue he was the best SS in baseball in 2009.

    __

    That’s true, and he also was paid something like $22M in 2009 for that season.

  10. Prete Funk Era November 29th, 2010 at 3:09 pm

    What’s the over/under for a Jeter signing? I think this is going to go on and on and on until Christmas.

  11. ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 3:10 pm

    It’s funny that athletes want MORE MONEY for good seasons, but would never ever give back money and are insulted by the notion they should be paid less for bad ones.

  12. ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 3:11 pm

    Last 3 seasons:

    Jeter: .301/BA .369OBP/ .414SLG/ .783OPS

    Uribe: .261BA .312/OBP .443 SLG/ .755OPS

    __

    Tom this is true, but you can find many people making much less than Jeter, who did better than that over the last 3 seasons. No?

  13. ML November 29th, 2010 at 3:11 pm

    They should raise the AAV to about $20 million while holding firm at 3 years. So I’d offer something like 3/60. A significant raise from their current reported offer of 3/45, but holding firm that a 36 yo SS coming off a very down year is too big a risk to give 4 years.

    This will get done eventually. In the end, I expect that Jeter will get a 4th year. I just hope it doesn’t come back to bite the Yanks if it happens.

  14. LGY November 29th, 2010 at 3:12 pm

    The absurd part is that Jeter was offered 2x as much as Uribe and people still think it is not enough.

  15. ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 3:12 pm

    Maybe we should just give jeter a $30M/year salary and take 500K back for each DP he hits into.

  16. Chip November 29th, 2010 at 3:14 pm

    ac1 -

    I was thinking give Derek a 1 year $25 mil contract and unlimited player options with 5% raises going forward – so as long as Derek wants to play he can….

  17. LGY November 29th, 2010 at 3:15 pm

    randy,

    Are you hinting in the last thread that the Yankees did not make the playoffs in 2008 because they let go of Torre and Bernie?

  18. Wave Your Hat November 29th, 2010 at 3:17 pm

    “Are you hinting in the last thread that the Yankees did not make the playoffs in 2008 because they let go of Torre and Bernie?”

    LOL, if only the Yanks would continue to play Randy’s favorites forever the Yanks would never lose. :)

  19. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 3:20 pm

    “Among the clubs interested in veteran utility player Bill Hall is the New York Yankees, according to a report fromFoxSports.com, and Tim Brown of Yahoo! Sports tweets that Hall has eight clubs interested.

    The Yankees could use the former all-star at second base, third base, the outfield and even at shortstop in limited stints, spelling some of the aging veterans on the Yankees roster, including Alex Rodriguez who has battled some injuries the past few seasons.

    Hall, 31 in December, hit 18 homers for the Red Sox in 2010 while playing several positions. He could also be a fit for the Philadelphia Phillies whose three infielders — Chase Utley, Jimmy Rollins and Placido Polanco — each missed time with injuries last season and are on the wrong side of 30″.

    - Jason A. Churchill
    ESPN

  20. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 3:21 pm

    No one was knocking Chad – lighten up is right. It’s an absurd comparison on the merits.

  21. ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 3:21 pm

    I was thinking give Derek a 1 year $25 mil contract and unlimited player options with 5% raises going forward – so as long as Derek wants to play he can….

    ___

    Been a long day. Is this a serious suggestion? 25 and the option to go UP each year?

    I would say 20, with 5% decrease as long as he wants makes more sense.

  22. LGY November 29th, 2010 at 3:22 pm

    “No one was knocking Chad – lighten up is right. It’s an absurd comparison on the merits.”

    —————————

    Ok, I’ll take the bait.

    Why is it absurd on the merits?

  23. MorningPerson November 29th, 2010 at 3:24 pm

    I think the Yankees will give the 4th year, and I think it will “come back to bite them,” but I think that’s the compromise if Jeter is looking for 5-6 (which is not a viable option, without the salary being frontloaded and other concessions made). Sometimes it’s worth the year you shouldn’t have given -whether it’s for the great performance received in years 1, 2 and/or 3; sometimes it’s to keep a relationship that’s been mutually beneficially from being harmed.

    But it will be an overly generous contract. Right now, it’s a generous offer, but not overly so.

  24. randy l. November 29th, 2010 at 3:25 pm

    “Are you hinting in the last thread that the Yankees did not make the playoffs in 2008 because they let go of Torre and Bernie?”

    i’m saying straight out that cashman was too full of himself and relying too much on his sabergeek side and putting in place lots of stuff that was total baseball BS.

    you might remember marty miller.

    cashman was a disaster with his generation trey in 2008 and his first base platoon.

    cashman had it all wrong and saved himself by spending more than anyone else in the history of baseball to still have a job in 2009.

    personally i’m sick of the guy.

  25. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 3:25 pm

    LGY – Oh, I don’t know. Like maybe Uribe and Jeter being uttered in the same breath or sentence?

  26. jacksquat November 29th, 2010 at 3:26 pm

    NEW YORK — Negotiations between the Yankees and Derek Jeter are at a standstill until Jeter and his agent, Casey Close, “drink the reality potion,” according to a source close to the negotiations.

    ha ha

    somehow I think these negotiations won’t be over soon.

  27. ML November 29th, 2010 at 3:26 pm

    WCYF,

    Why is it absurd? This mystical notion that Jeter is some sort of baseball god, and not a mere mortal baseball player like the rest of them, is what’s absurd.

    I love Jeter, and I hope and expect that this will be resolved and he will retire as a Yankee. But why is it absurd to compare his salary and production to other players at his position? Did Chad or anyone else say Jeter should be paid the same as Uribe? No! That’s why the Yanks have offered him MORE THAN DOUBLE the average annual salary that Uribe is about to get.

    What do you think Jeter should get? 5x Uribe? 10x??

  28. blake November 29th, 2010 at 3:26 pm

    Will Pat Reily take his talents to the Miami Heat bench before the All Star break?

  29. Chip November 29th, 2010 at 3:27 pm

    ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 3:21 pm
    I was thinking give Derek a 1 year $25 mil contract and unlimited player options with 5% raises going forward – so as long as Derek wants to play he can….

    ___

    Been a long day. Is this a serious suggestion?
    —————–

    no it wasn’t.

  30. LGY November 29th, 2010 at 3:27 pm

    “LGY – Oh, I don’t know. Like maybe Uribe and Jeter being uttered in the same breath or sentence?”

    ——————————-

    Ok, let me try again.

    Why shouldn’t Uribe and Jeter being uttered in the same breath or sentence in this context?

  31. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 3:29 pm

    MLBTR – Mike Axisa of River Avnue. Blues estimates Phil Hughes’ first-year arbitration reward in the $3.2-3.5MM range.

  32. randy l. November 29th, 2010 at 3:30 pm

    “LOL, if only the Yanks would continue to play Randy’s favorites forever the Yanks would never lose.”

    so who are my favorites?

    you mean someone like cano who i stuck with while people like you wanted to trade him.

    or am i mistaken?

    did you want to keep cano after his 2008?

    enlighten us about your favorites.

  33. YsGuy November 29th, 2010 at 3:30 pm

    apparently chip comes from the hank steinbrenner school of negoitiating…take whatever ridiculous offer the agent asks for and add a couple mil. but chip has added a new twist, add 5% forever, so as long as jeter doesnt retire, he gets more. in 2050 the yankeees will be paying the 77 y/o shortstop (he wouldnt agree to move either…) somewhere around 62M per year…

  34. joeman November 29th, 2010 at 3:30 pm

    West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 3:20 pm

    “Among the clubs interested in veteran utility player Bill Hall is the New York Yankees, according to a report fromFoxSports.com, and Tim Brown of Yahoo! Sports tweets that Hall has eight clubs interested.

    The Yankees could use the former all-star at second base, third base, the outfield and even at shortstop in limited stints, spelling some of the aging veterans on the Yankees roster, including Alex Rodriguez who has battled some injuries the past few seasons.

    Hall, 31 in December, hit 18 homers for the Red Sox in 2010 while playing several positions. He could also be a fit for the Philadelphia Phillies whose three infielders — Chase Utley, Jimmy Rollins and Placido Polanco — each missed time with injuries last season and are on the wrong side of 30?.
    —————————————————————————————————–

    I mention his name two weeks ago and GB jumped all over me..

  35. blake November 29th, 2010 at 3:30 pm

    Good value for Phil Hughes and the 15-20 wins he’s gonna put up in 2011.

  36. YsGuy November 29th, 2010 at 3:31 pm

    randy doesnt have a favorite, just a favorite to hate. he’s currentlly investigating cashman possible involvment in 9/11

  37. LGY November 29th, 2010 at 3:32 pm

    randy,

    There was no first base platoon in 2008.

    Are you sure you want to get into why the Yankees did not make the playoffs in 2008 and how many times in the years prior Cashman was overruled by George which led to it?

  38. pat November 29th, 2010 at 3:33 pm

    From ESPN, in the last 20 years, there have been 2 players age 36+ signed to contracts longer than 3 years. Jorge and Barry Bonds.

  39. comet November 29th, 2010 at 3:34 pm

    Kate no snow here! Was over to Buffalo last night to pick up friends at the airport. Buffalo has had a smattering of snow. Grass is still green here. How about you?

    Erin any snow there?

    GB you live to far south for snow you lucky guy!

    No moreDJ talk from me. I don’t like to around in circles. What will be, will be!

    C

  40. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 3:35 pm

    LGY oh, I don’t know. Maybe as Chad mentioned above he has never been an All-Star or come close to an MVP award? Or maybe Uribe’s .248 BA and .310 OBP in 2010 and his .256 BA and .300 OBP lifetime?

  41. joeman November 29th, 2010 at 3:35 pm

    wonder what Reyes will be looking for next year at the age of 28 & making $23 mil now

  42. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 3:36 pm

    Same here Joeman.

  43. randy l. November 29th, 2010 at 3:36 pm

    “There was no first base platoon in 2008.”

    how about 2007?

    they win anything that year ?

  44. Wave Your Hat November 29th, 2010 at 3:37 pm

    Randy-

    “you mean someone like cano who i stuck with while people like you wanted to trade him.”

    I don’t remember advocating a Cano trade. I might have entertained the thought once or twice but when I go to the bother of actually advocating something it usually leaves an impression.

    “enlighten us about your favorites.”

    Sure. Paul O’Neill is my favorite favorite. Second is Bernie. Third is a tie between Jorge and Andy. Mo is next.

    Guess what? I’ve had to let them go or resign myself to the thought it will be over soon.

    But I was only teasing you, randy, I don’t like arguing with you because I respect where you are coming from. I meant, as long as the Yanks continue to play your favorites, in your heart the Yanks will never lose.

  45. LGY November 29th, 2010 at 3:37 pm

    randy,

    Are you hinting that in 2007 the Yankees did not win the WS because of a platoon at 1B as opposed to retaining Bernie?

  46. Erin November 29th, 2010 at 3:38 pm

    comet November 29th, 2010 at 3:34 pm

    Erin any snow there?

    *************************
    Not yet, although we’re supposed to get some light snow on Wednesday. As long as it stays light, I don’t have any problem with it. ;)

  47. ML November 29th, 2010 at 3:39 pm

    WCYF,

    Which is why everyone is saying that Jeter should be better paid than Uribe. But you have yet to prove that it’s absurd to discuss him. Nor did you take up my offer to give your opinion on how much more than Uribe would not be “absurd” to pay Jeter. 2x Uribe isn’t enough? What is? 5x?

    Jeter’s great, but he had a very bad year. And at his age, 2010 might be the new norm.

  48. randy l. November 29th, 2010 at 3:39 pm

    “andy doesnt have a favorite, just a favorite to hate. he’s currentlly investigating cashman possible involvment in 9/11″

    i don’t make jokes about 9/11.

    interesting to know that you do though.

  49. LGY November 29th, 2010 at 3:39 pm

    “LGY oh, I don’t know. Maybe as Chad mentioned above he has never been an All-Star or come close to an MVP award? Or maybe Uribe’s .248 BA and .310 OBP in 2010 and his .256 BA and .300 OBP lifetime?”

    ————————————-

    What does Jeter’s past performance have to do with his next contract?

  50. joeman November 29th, 2010 at 3:40 pm

    my thinking is that Jeter will be somewhere in the middle of 09 & 10

  51. Wave Your Hat November 29th, 2010 at 3:40 pm

    “I mention his name two weeks ago and GB jumped all over me..”

    I mentioned his name back in January and have been geezered about it ever since.

  52. randy l. November 29th, 2010 at 3:42 pm

    “Are you hinting that in 2007 the Yankees did not win the WS because of a platoon at 1B as opposed to retaining Bernie?”

    lgy-

    the thinking in cashman’s head was so screwed up in 2007 and 2008 that the yankees were a mess until cashman reversed field and bought a world series.

    he’s going to try the same thing again by signing lee.

    his baseball ideas do not work any better than yours.

    is that clear enough?

  53. Chip November 29th, 2010 at 3:43 pm

    pat November 29th, 2010 at 3:33 pm
    From ESPN, in the last 20 years, there have been 2 players age 36+ signed to contracts longer than 3 years. Jorge and Barry Bonds.

    —————

    And we all know how well that contract Brian gave to Posada worked out for the Yankees.

    3 years of decline behind the plate, almost as much time on the DL as in the lineup, and an immovable contract to go with it.

  54. joeman November 29th, 2010 at 3:43 pm

    # Wave Your Hat November 29th, 2010 at 3:40 pm

    “I mention his name two weeks ago and GB jumped all over me..”

    I mentioned his name back in January and have been geezered about it ever since.
    ——————————————–
    GB had a name for him but can’t remember what is was, something to do with him not being able to catch the ball

  55. blake November 29th, 2010 at 3:43 pm

    I like Bill Hall for the yanks….I just think he will cost more than the Yanks will pay and that he could probably get a better role elsewhere…..they are already going to be pushing the assumed budget with the big items they have to address.

  56. LGY November 29th, 2010 at 3:44 pm

    “the thinking in cashman’s head was so screwed up in 2007 and 2008 that the yankees were a mess until cashman reversed field and bought a world series.”

    ———————————–

    What did Cashman do in 2007 and 2008 that had a significant detrimental impact on 2007 and 2008 and what should he have done differently?

  57. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 3:44 pm

    Who said anything about a contract? I said it was absurd to compare the two in any way shape or form.

  58. Wave Your Hat November 29th, 2010 at 3:44 pm

    “Are you hinting that in 2007 the Yankees did not win the WS because of a platoon at 1B as opposed to retaining Bernie?”\

    I thought it was the midges.

  59. LGY November 29th, 2010 at 3:45 pm

    “Who said anything about a contract? I said it was absurd to compare the two in any way shape or form.”

    —————————-

    The contract is exactly what we are talking about and THE reason they are being compared.

    You are supposed to tell us why it is absurd to compare them when talking about each contract they have or should receive.

  60. Chip November 29th, 2010 at 3:46 pm

    Randy

    You’re getting harder to follow than the movie Inception….

    so the Yankees are trying to force out Jeter because Cashman doesn’t like him but are going to bring back Rivera and sign Lee so that fans will forgive him for forcing out Derek?

    And the Yankees squeezed out Bernie and Torre because of Cashman’s ego?

    And even though the Yankees offered Jeter (and Torre) more money than anyone else – they did so hoping that the offers would be rejected because — again — Cashman’s ego?

  61. randy l. November 29th, 2010 at 3:47 pm

    wave your hat-

    ok, got ya. no problem.

    this jeter thing is not good for the team.

    if we’re getting heated up this much on this site, it’s a sign the rest of the yankee universe is too.

    i’m going to take a little break here because quite frankly most of the so called yankee fans on this site are too annoying to interact with anymore on this subject.

  62. ML November 29th, 2010 at 3:48 pm

    WCYF,

    That doesn’t make sense. We’re talking about Jeter’d contract; that’s the context. Uribe is a FA SS about to sign, so it’s interesting to compare his deal to what Jeter might get. It WOULD be absurd to say that Uribe is anywhere close to as good as Jeter. But it’s NOT absurd to say “Jeter is much better than Uribe, but in the future he might be only twice as good, not four times as good as Uribe.”

    What part of that is absurd?

  63. Bronx Jeers November 29th, 2010 at 3:49 pm

    Oft-injured Met prospect Fernando Martinez is injured after playing 1 game in the Dominican winter league.

  64. jacksquat November 29th, 2010 at 3:49 pm

    Tom in N.J. November 29th, 2010 at 3:08 pm
    Last 3 seasons:

    Jeter: .301/BA .369OBP/ .414SLG/ .783OPS

    Uribe: .261BA .312/OBP .443 SLG/ .755OPS

    And last season:

    Uribe: .749 OPS, UZR/150: +3.3

    Jeter: .710 OPS, UZR/150: -5.4

    Not saying Uribe should get more than Jeter, or that Jeter should be paid even close to Uribe, but let’s take it easy on the “absurd” comments.

  65. YsGuy November 29th, 2010 at 3:49 pm

    thats a break, i was just about to take a little break here because quite franky randy is too annoying to interact with anymore on this subject…

  66. Erin November 29th, 2010 at 3:50 pm

    Chip November 29th, 2010 at 3:46 pm
    Randy

    You?re getting harder to follow than the movie Inception?.

    **********************************

    :lol:

  67. LGY November 29th, 2010 at 3:53 pm

    randy,

    We are just having fun here! It is all in good nature.

  68. LGY November 29th, 2010 at 3:54 pm

    Who am I going to poke fun at now randy?

    GB is too sensitive.

  69. MorningPerson November 29th, 2010 at 3:56 pm

    Chip -

    The Posada contract at the time wasn’t a bad one. He had spent no time on the DL and he was as sturdy a catcher as you were going to find. I fervently believe Posada would have gone to the Mets – it was a serious offer from them, and they were a relevant team at the time. There were no other catching options on the market and none in the system.

    Every contract is a gamble because you’re contracting for services yet to be rendered and as far as I know, no one can read the future.

    I’m sure the Yankees wish they could have gotten it done for 3 years, but they had someone else bidding for Jorge’s services. They did not bid against themselves.

    ****

    “Generation Trey” or whatever you want to call it was a result of not trading Hughes and CMW, or Hughes and Joba or Hughes or whatever iteration of that potential trade you want to talk about. It may not have had the results he’d hoped for (and the offense didn’t help early that season, if you’ll recall), but would you rather have had Johan Santana who has had quite his share of injuries the past couple of years?

    Things don’t always work exactly to plan and sometimes even the contingencies fall apart. But I don’t think Cashman messed that up.

    I wish he’d handled Bernie more delicately, but I suspect there were not a lot of ways that could have been smoothly handled. I don’t have any issue with how Torre was dealt with. Many teams would have fired him cold after 2004, 2005 or 2006. The only thing I didn’t like was the waiting game – the week or two when Torre had media camped out by his home.

    Every team that wins a WS does so with a combination of talent they have and talent they acquire. And if it was so easy to buy a WS, they’d have won one every year.

  70. YsGuy November 29th, 2010 at 3:56 pm

    its crazy, a guy as knowlegable and observent as randy cant get past his cash hatred. ive been coming here for over 3 years and it never stops, every post is tinged with it and slanted toward blaming cash for something.

  71. Erin November 29th, 2010 at 3:56 pm

    For people a) who have YES year-round and b) are not bored to tears by the Jeter saga:

    JackCurryYES The Hot Stove is burning. Join @BobLorenz and me on YES at 6:30 tonight. Yes, we will talk about Derek Jeter.

    Sadly, neither a or b applies to me. :(

  72. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 4:00 pm

    The absurd part of that is mentioning Uribe and Jeter in any context in the same breath. What you used to do for me, what you do for me now and what you can do for me later.

    - Then throw in All-Star, Gold Glove awards, World Championships and stats past and present.

    - Then you can get to their value to their respective teams, from both a financial and image standpoint.

    - Then you can talk about who will be a unanimous, first ballot hall of famer.

    - Then you can talk about who will have their number retired and get a monument dedicated to them next to Ruth, Gerhig, Dimaggio and Mantle.

  73. LGY November 29th, 2010 at 4:10 pm

    WCYF,

    What does most have that stuff have to do with Derek Jeter’s free agency.

    How many times have you said that Jeter’s last contract paid for his on the field performance? He was already paid for all that stuff.

    All that matter is what Jeter produces going forward.

    So then how do you address that Juan Uribe is 5 or 6 years younger (depending on what website you go to :lol: ) and just had a better season than Derek Jeter?

    Or should we just completely ignored what happened in 2010 when talking about Jeter’s next contract?

  74. Erin November 29th, 2010 at 4:11 pm

    RiverAveBlues Now that the Yanks have told Casey Close to ?drink the reality potion,? I hope he tells them to stop drinking the ?crazy juice.? #metaphors

    :lol:

  75. Tom in N.J. November 29th, 2010 at 4:12 pm

    Does Jeter share his Ford or Gillette money with the Yankees?

  76. ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 4:12 pm

    i am glad the yankees seemingly leaked what jeter is asking. I definitely want to know that the yankees are making reasonable offers and i am glad we know why this isnt done yet.

  77. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 4:16 pm

    LGY – I’ve said all I can say on Jeter, you know I have written quite a few long and detailed posts detailing why I support him. I think he is right and management is wrong. I’m in the minority here, I know that. The Uribe horse is beaten as well. Peace.

  78. GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 4:17 pm

    ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 3:10 pm
    It’s funny that athletes want MORE MONEY for good seasons, but would never ever give back money and are insulted by the notion they should be paid less for bad ones.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    Not true. In 1978, Lyman Bostock tried to return his check to the Angels because he had a bad first month after signing a big FA contract. The Union wouldn’t allow it and Gene Autry refused it. Bostock signed the check over to charity. That was 4 months before he was murdered in Gary, Indiana.

  79. Crawdaddy November 29th, 2010 at 4:18 pm

    Bostock was the exception not the rule.

  80. GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 4:22 pm

    Whether exception or rule it was falsely stated.

  81. vrsce November 29th, 2010 at 4:23 pm

    Not true. In 1978, Lyman Bostock tried to return his check to the Angels because he had a bad first month after signing a big FA contract. The Union wouldn’t allow it and Gene Autry refused it. Bostock signed the check over to charity. That was 4 months before he was murdered in Gary, Indiana.
    ===================================================================Lyman Bostock. there is a blast from the past. A great guy.

  82. BD (Boston Dave) November 29th, 2010 at 4:23 pm

    Why does “anonymous source” so easily get changes to “The Yankees” ?

    The Yankees didn’t tell Derek to drink the “reality juice.”

    A media outlet, desperate for readership and viewership, quoted an “anonymous source” who may or may not have any clue.

    Replacing “anonymous source” with “The Yankees” is irresponsible and ignorant.

  83. Crawdaddy November 29th, 2010 at 4:25 pm

    “Whether exception or rule it was falsely stated.”

    It was mostly true too.

  84. blake November 29th, 2010 at 4:27 pm

    BD,

    That’s just how it rolls these days….”.source close to the negociations” becomes whoever the writer wants the reader to believe it is.

  85. Crawdaddy November 29th, 2010 at 4:29 pm

    “personally i’m sick of the guy.”

    Shocking!

  86. LGY November 29th, 2010 at 4:29 pm

    WCYF,

    Uribe really doesn’t have anything to do with Yankee mgmt. I just don’t understand why it is absurd to talk about Uribe. But peace out, I guess? ;)

  87. LGY November 29th, 2010 at 4:29 pm

    talk about Uribe *now that he signed*

  88. ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 4:34 pm

    Tom in N.J. November 29th, 2010 at 4:12 pm
    Does Jeter share his Ford or Gillette money with the Yankees?

    __

    Interesting take.

  89. Erin November 29th, 2010 at 4:34 pm

    BD (Boston Dave) November 29th, 2010 at 4:23 pm
    Why does ?anonymous source? so easily get changes to ?The Yankees? ?

    The Yankees didn?t tell Derek to drink the ?reality juice.?

    ************************
    You’re right. However, I would pay money to see Cashman say “reality juice” and to see the look on Jeter’s face. ;)

  90. YsGuy November 29th, 2010 at 4:37 pm

    wcyf says uribe’s contract doesn’t affect jeter’s because he has been trying to make his point that jeter deserves somewhere over $20M per year and uribe’s making 1/3 of that shows how outlandish jeter’s demand is.

  91. Prete Funk Era November 29th, 2010 at 4:42 pm

    Source: Rivera, Yanks not far apart

    http://sports.espn.go.com/new-.....id=5862998

  92. austinmac November 29th, 2010 at 4:43 pm

    Is there anything else not happening besides no Jeter negotiations that can be discussed?

  93. hardwired7 November 29th, 2010 at 4:45 pm

    almost time to drink some reality potion (I like mine 80 proof)

  94. bruceb November 29th, 2010 at 4:46 pm

    Do I sense that the court of public opinion is turning against Derek Jeter in favor of the owners and Cashman? When I first accused him of being unrealistic and greedy, I was told I couldn’t possibly be a Yankees fan. Now it seems more and more people are saying he needs to get a reality check.

  95. ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 4:47 pm

    I think giving Rivera two years shouldn’t be something the Yankees really need to stress about. They want 15, he wants 18, just meet in the middle and give him the two years. 2/33.

    Bring on Lee.

    Jeter can continue to pull his head out of his butt while the Yankees bring on the FAs.

  96. ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 4:49 pm

    When I first accused him of being unrealistic and greedy
    __

    I don’t know about greedy, as FAs always go for the max, but definitely unrealistic.

  97. MichiganYankee November 29th, 2010 at 4:51 pm

    2010 WARP1:
    Uribe – 2.4 (RAP1 6, FRAA1 -3)
    Jeter – 2.3 (RAP1 2, FRAA1 -4)

    2010 WARP2 (which accounts for league difficulty):
    Jeter – 3.1 (RAP2 8, FRAA2 -3)
    Uribe – 2.8 (RAP2 9, FRAA2 -2)

    Granted, Uribe’s numbers from previous years were significantly worse, and a statistical spike at age 31 is often a fluke. But a statistical dip at age 36 is often not.

    To any team other than the Yankees, Jeter’s worth at this stage in his career would not be that much different than Uribe’s.

  98. Dill Pickler November 29th, 2010 at 4:51 pm

    Comparing Juan Uribe to Jeter is ridiculous and a comparison not worth making.
    And talking about this situation in terms of “athletes think they deserve raises after good seasons but not pay slashes after bad ones” doesn’t really have much to do with the reality of the situation either.
    What Jeter’s agent is looking at is: A) what Jeter has meant to the organization his entire career; B) what kind of contracts to other players the team has given out recently, for instance to ARod and AJ Burnett.
    If you’re Jeter, and you have been arguably the face of the franchise during one of its most glorious runs, it probably feels like the Yanks are trying to squeeze you now after they spent wildly on guys like A.J. Burnett and ARod. Not the first time the Yanks have decided to draw a hard financial line with their own longtime mainstays, while opening up the checkbook for outside free agents.
    I’m not saying Jeter deserves $25 million or $20 million, because based on last year’s performance alone of course he doesn’t. But it’s a lot more complicated than that.
    As a Yankee fan I just want this to get done. It’s hard enough seeing Don Mattingly in a Dodger uniform, I don’t want to have to see Jeter in anything but pinstripes. He is one of the all-time great Yankees. This just needs to get done.

  99. 108 stitches November 29th, 2010 at 4:51 pm

    Depending on how much longer the Jeter negotiations go on, there could be a little less enthusiasm for him during the rolls calls from the Bleacher Creatures.
    A prolonged slump could see signs asking if he’s “baffled”. That of course comes from his agent who is not a household face like his client is.

  100. tyanksfan36 November 29th, 2010 at 4:53 pm

    Spring Training tickets go on sale friday and I’m a little disappointed at the options of teams they are playing. I’m glad they are playing the Twins on a sunday or else I’d probably not make it to any of the games.

  101. ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 4:54 pm

    If you’re Jeter, and you have been arguably the face of the franchise during one of its most glorious runs, it probably feels like the Yanks are trying to squeeze you now after they spent wildly on guys like A.J. Burnett and ARod. Not the first time the Yanks have decided to draw a hard financial line with their own longtime mainstays, while opening up the checkbook for outside free agents.
    __

    Difference is those free agent contracts came at times when they were on what seemed like highs and when they really needed those guys. Hence Rivera and Posada’s last contracts, Burnett, CC, Tex.

    They take care of their stars too. Jeter has not suffered because he is a homegrown Yankee, same with Pettitte, Rivera, Posada and others.

    They give when the player has the leverage, and take when they have it. Nothing wrong with it.

    Jeter is no victim and the more people act like he is the hurt party, the more people turn on him.

  102. RayVT November 29th, 2010 at 4:55 pm

    Well, the Yankees decided what Jeter’s worth was 10 years ago. $189M for 10 yrs escallating to a salary of $22.6M last year. Now they want to de-escalate Jeter’s salary to $15M.

    The Yanks are asking Jeter to take a 34% pay cut from last year! That is a lot!

    If Jeter were offered arbitration, he most likely would won with a # around $20M – $25M.

    What would be interesting is to offer Jeter a 4 year deal like this:

    2011 – $20M
    2012 – $18M
    2013 – $14M
    2014 – $10M
    2015 – Team Option $9M / $1M Buyout

  103. ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 4:55 pm

    And just in case there is question from my comments, i still want Jeter on this team until he retires. But I want the team to spend money more wisely then they have in the past.

  104. ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 4:57 pm

    Ray, i think it’s more about the years than the money.

    If they could end this with 3/60, i bet they would be considering it.

  105. Prete Funk Era November 29th, 2010 at 4:57 pm

    Depending on how much longer the Jeter negotiations go on, there could be a little less enthusiasm for him during the rolls calls from the Bleacher Creatures.
    A prolonged slump could see signs asking if he’s “baffled”. That of course comes from his agent who is not a household face like his client is.
    ——————————————–

    This Jeter situation will be over as soon as he signs. We’re just bored right now. It keeps us occupied and sells newspapers. Anything else is just gasoline on the fire.

  106. MDD2 November 29th, 2010 at 4:58 pm

    I’m happy to see that players like Curtis Granderson are paying attention and tweeting about the Jeter negotiations. Like what your bosses are doing, @cgrand14? Classy, huh.

    Let me see if I have this right:

    1) Thinking you’re worth more than an offer on the table is the height of arrogance. Even negotiating at all is greedy and selfish.

    2) Should you dare do it anyway, it’s no big deal if your boss and others close to the negotiation blab off the record about your alleged demands in the most unflattering of terms. It’s just business. If you’re surprised, you need a reality potion.

    3) Have no fear, though. Your boss says he wants you to be his employee. You’ve done everything right since starting sixteen years ago and he knows it. Sure, he publicly questioned your level of competence and told you to field other offers, but you’ll be able to forgive and forget. Where the heck else would you go anyway? You’re lucky to have a job at all.

    I’m beyond disgusted with the Yankee organization. Yes, 3/45 is a lot of money but it’s not about the numbers anymore. It’s about a team willing to damage the relationship it has with one of its most storied players for a few million dollars and short-term PR. The PR campaign is working now, but this is a bad mistake long term.

  107. DaSaint007 November 29th, 2010 at 4:58 pm

    I just received a call from a friend of mine, who’s close to a key figure who works intimately in the Yankee organization, who prefers not to be named, due to his not being authorized to speak on behalf of the organization. He stated that this key figure has a source, who is another executive with another organziation, but who is privy to some of the particulars of the Jeter negotiation, has told him that the Yankees continue to negotiate with Derek Jeter’s representatives.

  108. GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 4:59 pm

    yanks61 November 29th, 2010 at 2:57 pm
    * Chip November 29th, 2010 at 2:20 pm *

    Terrific post, Chip, as were those by LGY and Austicmac earlier.

    I really don’t see how the Yanks offer is anything but generous and incredibly respectful of his “status.” Jeter/Close should also bear in mind:

    - Babe Ruth (BABE RUTH!) was traded after a better year than Derek just had. Turns out the Yank’s mgmt. at that time got it right, too.

    - Joe Mc Carthy, one of the most successful managers ever, resigned – in effect was forced out by conflict with mgmt. (He went to the Bosox – don’t see Jeter doing that.)

    - The Yanks and Bosox had a handshake deal to trade Joe D and Teddy Ballgame – their 2 great Icons – before the owners had second thoughts.

    - Ty Cobb was traded at the end of his career

    - Willie Mays was traded at the end of his career.

    - Hank Aaron was traded at the end of his career.

    I’m sure we can find other examples, but it seems to me to prove, once again, that NOBODY is bigger than their team and that teams have been making these kind of decisions since the beginning of the game. Heck, Connie Mack basically traded away the bulk of two different championship teams. It’s business, always has been.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    OK, let’s take this one at a time, because those aren’t the facts.

    Ruth was sold by Frazee because he was broke after producing a string of bad plays on Broadway. He needed the money and Ruth was his best asset, because he was also able to get a $300,000 loan on the pink slip for Fenway. The money went to produce another play. No, it wasn’t “Np, No, Nanette”. That was 4 years later.

    Cobb wasn’t traded by the Tigers. He was released because of a betting scandal and accusation of throwing games. It involved him and Tris Speaker. They were given that year and the next to get out of baseball or get thrown out.

    McCarthy left the Yankees because he hated Larry McPhail.
    Topping and Yawkey got drunk one night and decide to trade Williams for DiMaggio. When they sobered up the next morning, they mutually cancelled the trade. It was never close to being official.

    Mack was always selling players because was always broke and it was the only way to make payroll and pay bills. Baseball was his only business.

    Aaron and Mays were near the end of their careers and asked to be traded back to their original cities to say goodbye to their fans.

  109. ac1 November 29th, 2010 at 5:01 pm

    I’m beyond disgusted with the Yankee organization. Yes, 3/45 is a lot of money but it’s not about the numbers anymore. It’s about a team willing to damage the relationship it has with one of its most storied players for a few million dollars and short-term PR. The PR campaign is working now, but this is a bad mistake long term.

    ___

    Really? A few million dollars? So out of fear of damaging a relationship, the Yankees should just bend over? That would not be very good business. And you have no idea what exactly is going on and who is releasing what. Just because a ‘source’ is quoted, doesn’t mean it is coming from Hal and Cashman.

    And if you are fed up with the Yankee Organization, there is always a second franchise in NYC that would love your support.

  110. Erin November 29th, 2010 at 5:01 pm

    DaSaint- :lol:

  111. Don November 29th, 2010 at 5:06 pm

    There is a blog on the Internet called “Respect Jeter’s Gangster”….interesting!

  112. YsGuy November 29th, 2010 at 5:06 pm

    jeter took a nosedive off his pedistal in this negotiation.

    what determines how much a player can get is leverage. jeter can talk all he wants about legacy or whatever but at the end of the day, nobody is going to come anywhere near what the yankees offered him. he has zero leverage.

    you would think he’s smart enough to know that.

    in the end this will matter very little when he begins closing in on 3000 hits and espn starts pumping up the ‘chase for 3000′ jeter will be the golden boy again.

  113. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 5:07 pm

    MDD2 – Great post and you are right.

  114. GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 5:10 pm

    Ted Williams wasn’t the last superstar left fielder that Yawkey almost traded to the Yankees. In the winter of 1965, he offered Yazstremski to the Yanks straight up for Tommy Tresh. The worst trade that the Yankees never made.

  115. Dill Pickler November 29th, 2010 at 5:12 pm

    AC 1: “Difference is those free agent contracts came at times when they were on what seemed like highs and when they really needed those guys. Hence Rivera and Posada’s last contracts, Burnett, CC, Tex. They take care of their stars too. Jeter has not suffered because he is a homegrown Yankee, same with Pettitte, Rivera, Posada and others. They give when the player has the leverage, and take when they have it. Nothing wrong with it. Jeter is no victim and the more people act like he is the hurt party, the more people turn on him”

    First, I’m not saying Jeter is a victim. Yes, the Yankees have leverage now. But Jeter still has some leverage too. Jeter has a lot of value to the franchise, his agent recognizes that and his agent is attempting to negotiate the best deal possible for his client, just as the Yankees are trying to use their leverage.
    Just because I understand that concept and can understand Jeter’s point of view — as well as the team’s — doesn’t mean I’m making him out to be a “victim.”

  116. GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 5:14 pm

    YsGuy November 29th, 2010 at 5:06 pm
    jeter took a nosedive off his pedistal in this negotiation.

    what determines how much a player can get is leverage. jeter can talk all he wants about legacy or whatever but at the end of the day, nobody is going to come anywhere near what the yankees offered him. he has zero leverage.

    you would think he’s smart enough to know that.

    in the end this will matter very little when he begins closing in on 3000 hits and espn starts pumping up the ‘chase for 3000? jeter will be the golden boy again

    ———————————————————————————————————————-Only an idiot would believe that. But then, you are the one that tried making a joke out of 9-11, aren’t you?

  117. DaSaint007 November 29th, 2010 at 5:19 pm

    GB, I’m so done with this Jeter convo. Let me know when it’s done. I’m much more interested in the rotation and bullpen, and totally looking forward to some more kids in ST trying their darndest to make the team: Nunez, Russo, Laird, Romine, Montero plus others.

  118. Southern Yankee Lawyer November 29th, 2010 at 5:20 pm

    Why should the Yankees increase their offer for Jeter or anyone else when there is not another team willing to pay that amount of money? The only way Jeter will get more money out of the Yankees is get another team into the bidding war (a la Jorge) otherwise, he must “settle” for only 15 million a year. I don’t see the fact that he is a Yankee great, first ballot HOF, etc. increasing what you pay someone when no one else is willing to even pay him the $15 million the Yankees are offering. If the shoe was on the other foot and the Yankees had money issues, do you think Jeter or any other Yankee great would give the Yankees a home town discount and take less money? I doubt it.

  119. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 5:22 pm

    Well what do you know. Looks like this year’s Hall of Fame ballot includes two first-timers, Rafael Palmeiro and Juan Gonzalez. What a joke.

  120. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 5:23 pm

    Here’s the complete ballot:

    Roberto Alomar, Carlos Baerga, Jeff Bagwell, Harold Baines, Bert Blyleven, Bret Boone, Kevin Brown, John Franco, Juan Gonzalez, Marquis Grissom, Lenny Harris, Bobby Higginson, Charles Johnson, Barry Larkin, Al Leiter, Edgar Martinez, Tino Martinez, Don Mattingly, Fred McGriff, Mark McGwire, Raul Mondesi, Jack Morris, Dale Murphy, John Olerud, Rafael Palmeiro, Dave Parker, Tim Raines, Kirk Rueter, Benito Santiago, Lee Smith, B.J. Surhoff, Alan Trammell, Larry Walker.

  121. GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 5:25 pm

    Simon, I am tired of the talk, on here, in the media and from both sides. Just get it done or let it go. Neither side looks very clean in this deal.

    Right now, I’d settle for Winter league baseball in spanish, which I understand only a little.

    But, yeah, right now, I want to see the kids playing soon.

  122. GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 5:33 pm

    So, the Ramgers are now signing the top players. They just signed Torrealba for 2 years.

  123. Prete Funk Era November 29th, 2010 at 5:33 pm

    They should follow the minor leaguers around “reality TV” like, during the season. so during the off season we have something to watch and root for later.

    Also it could give the kids a taste of Broadway

  124. Betsy November 29th, 2010 at 5:34 pm

    MP, I don’t think they will give the 4th year -and if they do, I will be upset. They are in the right on this – they’ve offered Jeter MORE than a fair deal. If he wants to move on, then I’m afraid I have to say “let him”. At most I would consider a team option for a 4th year, but I see no reason for the Yankees to budge now. Derek’s demands are not in the realm of being realistic.

  125. Betsy November 29th, 2010 at 5:35 pm

    I really don’t see how it’s Cashman’s fault that Phil broke a rib…..unless Phil ticked him off and he punched him in the gut. Joba was basically fine in 2008. IPK was a mess, but that’s on him.

  126. Dill Pickler November 29th, 2010 at 5:36 pm

    Southern Yankee Lawyer — Yes, I do think if the shoe were on the other foot and the Yankees had money issues (hard to imagine) that Jeter would offer to restructure a contract or take less to help the team. It certainly wouldn’t be the first time we’ve seen a player do that in sports. It’s happened numerous times.

    I agree with GB7. This just needs to get done. sure the Yankees can stick to their figure knowing that no one else will top it and let Jeter dangle until he capitulates, but in the end I think it is better for everyone — the fans and the organization — for them to give a little, let Jeter “save face”, maybe meet somewhere near the middle and just get this done.

  127. hardwired7 November 29th, 2010 at 5:36 pm

    GB7, there’s a new ESPN app on the XBOX 360 where you can watch some of the Dominican League games.

    muy beuno!

  128. murphydog November 29th, 2010 at 5:37 pm

    Prete Funk Era November 29th, 2010 at 5:33 pm
    “They should follow the minor leaguers around “reality TV” like, during the season. so during the off season we have something to watch and root for later.

    Also it could give the kids a taste of Broadway”

    It was either Dykstra or Backman who was trying to get a development deal on exactly that proposition a year or two ago, but “no go.” I read about it somewhere… can’t find it right now.

  129. Betsy November 29th, 2010 at 5:38 pm

    The folks at RAB might want to learn to read; that ESPN article did not say the “reality juice” quote came from the Yankees FO

  130. Wave Your Hat November 29th, 2010 at 5:38 pm

    hardwired-

    GB7 probably thinks XBOX is a newfangled sabermetric fielding stat…

  131. Dill Pickler November 29th, 2010 at 5:41 pm

    Betsy, headline from ESPN.com: “Source says Yanks want Jeter to take ‘reality juice’ “

  132. hardwired7 November 29th, 2010 at 5:42 pm

    nice one, WYH.

  133. GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 5:42 pm

    hardwired7 November 29th, 2010 at 5:36 pm
    GB7, there’s a new ESPN app on the XBOX 360 where you can watch some of the Dominican League games.

    muy beuno!

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    H-Wired, appreciate the information. Thanks.

  134. Tom in N.J. November 29th, 2010 at 5:43 pm

    GB:

    http://espn.go.com/espn3/index/_/sport/baseball

  135. SAS November 29th, 2010 at 5:44 pm

    Betsy,

    I keep saying to myself that I wouldn’t comment on Jeter again, but I have disagreed with you each and every time you have said 3/45 is the final offer or what the final offer should be. I am almost certain Jeter will 4 yrs. as an option, or a 4th year. I also think the Yankees are willing to sweeten their offer. I don’t know by how much, but those are my feelings.

  136. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 5:45 pm

    Of course that quote came from the Yankees front office! lol Who else would it come from?

  137. Betsy November 29th, 2010 at 5:46 pm

    http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/s.....eal-112910

    And guess what, the Yankees are right — absolutely and unconditionally. The Yankees’ current offer is more than fair and in line for a singles hitter who turns 37 this season.

    Of course, Jeter doesn’t see it that way, which is why the gulf between him and the Yankees remains so wide. He considers himself a generational superstar, the Michael Jordan of baseball, a first-round Hall of Famer (which he is), an integral part of five championship seasons, as clean as Tiger Woods is sleazy.

    To which the Yankees say, all true — which is precisely why Jeter has been paid $205 million in the past decade. He’s the highest-earning shortstop in baseball history, so it’s hard to feel sorry for him now. The onus is on Jeter, not the Yankees, to calculate his true market value in 2011, to calibrate exactly where he is in his career.

    ************

    Klapisch hit it right on the spot (and I’m really sorry it’s had to come to this. I hate thinking of him in such a negative light as a singles hitter – even in this situation, I’ve never gone that far because I still love the guy and don’t think he’s done). The media is actually on the Yankees’ side for once.

  138. SAS November 29th, 2010 at 5:46 pm

    WYH,

    I have heard of an XBOX, but I am not certain what it is. You know when these things are not part of your life you don’t know what they are.

  139. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 5:48 pm

    I think it is better for everyone — the fans and the organization — for them to give a little, let Jeter “save face”, maybe meet somewhere near the middle and just get this done.

    ****************

    Common sense from Dill Pickler, kudos. Fans need to realize that meeting in the middle or near and allowing Jeter to retain his dignity and save face is paramount.

    The organization does itself no favor by embarrassing Derek Jeter.

  140. GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 5:49 pm

    Thanks, Tom. Between my language skills and my handy dandy little English/Spanish dictionary. I’ll be able to follow right along and get 3 out of every 10 words. .300 average will put me in the HOF.

  141. ML November 29th, 2010 at 5:49 pm

    WCYF,

    Your Jeter love is blinding you to the realities of the situation here. Jeter is not being paid for his past performance. He has already been paid well, in fact probably overpaid, for that. This is about paying him a fair amount for his future performance. And by that standard, the Yanks offer is more than fair. In fact, Jeter will almost definitely be overpaid. Even taking into account his financial and intangible value.

    Jeter will in the end sign for something close to $20 million a year, and he may even get a fourth year. Which is absurd for a 36 yo SS who had a very mediocre year.

  142. DaSaint007 November 29th, 2010 at 5:49 pm

    Seems like Detroit, Angels and Rangers look to make the biggest splashes. Dodgers have also.

    Still waiting for the 1st Met move….just out of curiosity.

  143. Betsy November 29th, 2010 at 5:51 pm

    I think what Jeter’s camp forgot is that no player is bigger than the team…….not Jeter, not Mo, not even Ruth or Gehrig. I say that because the team comes first; the FO has to figure out a way to stay competitive and, not just competitive, but WS-type competitive. So, it’s necessary to disengage emotionally from the love and respect the franchise has for one of it’s icons in order to make the business decisions needed to keep this team a WS-caliber team.

  144. murphydog November 29th, 2010 at 5:52 pm

    Ahem:

    http://www.prorumors.com/2010/.....ters-agent

    Would the former NY Baseball Giants sign Jeter to finish his career in the City by the Bay? Then they could play “I Left my Heart in San Francisco” after Yankee home game losses in 2011. It’s not like they need great offensive punch with that pitching staff. He’d bring a lot of, um, intangibles and a cool veteran presence with lots of WS experience. The Giants are a 2011 WS contending team for sure, more so in my mind than the Yankees right now. Hmmm….

    It could happen. Just saying.

  145. Betsy November 29th, 2010 at 5:52 pm

    Dill, so what? I could be the source for all that headline says. It doesn’t say Yankees FO……..

  146. GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 5:53 pm

    Really, the only “big” name that has signed would be Martinez. The lessers would be Uribe and Benoit. Only Benoit would have been of interest to the Yanks, I’d think.

  147. Betsy November 29th, 2010 at 5:54 pm

    Murphy, if it happens it’s because Jeter wants it to happen

  148. murphydog November 29th, 2010 at 5:54 pm

    GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 5:49 pm “Thanks, Tom. Between my language skills and my handy dandy little English/Spanish dictionary. I’ll be able to follow right along and get 3 out of every 10 words. .300 average will put me in the HOF.”

    All the same, GB, I’d let somebody else order the food. A .300 average against the menu is a recipe for disaster ;)

  149. Prete Funk Era November 29th, 2010 at 5:54 pm

    murphydog

    It was either Dykstra or Backman who was trying to get a development deal on exactly that proposition a year or two ago, but “no go.” I read about it somewhere… can’t find it right now.
    ————————-

    The Yanks have one of the best regional sports networks around. I think there’s a lot more they can do, especially during the down time.

  150. SJ44 November 29th, 2010 at 5:54 pm

    Stop with the sanctimonious crap.

    The Yankees don’t owe Jeter ANYTHING.

    They certainly don’t owe him anything to save face.

    That’s not their job.

    Geez Louise, at some point, get a clue about this.

    The Yankees negotiate THEIR position.

    They can’t also negotiate Jeter’s position.

    You know what saves “face” for Jeter? Lowering his asking price.

    If he doesn’t, there isn’t anything the Yankees can do.

  151. murphydog November 29th, 2010 at 5:55 pm

    Betsy November 29th, 2010 at 5:54 pm: Murphy, if it happens it’s because Jeter wants it to happen

    Absolutely true. Maybe a change of scenery is just what he needs.

  152. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 5:55 pm

    ML November 29th, 2010 at 5:49 pm

    WCYF,

    Your Jeter love is blinding you to the realities of the situation here. Jeter is not being paid for his past performance. He has already been paid well, in fact probably overpaid, for that. This is about paying him a fair amount for his future performance. And by that standard, the Yanks offer is more than fair. In fact, Jeter will almost definitely be overpaid. Even taking into account his financial and intangible value.

    Jeter will in the end sign for something close to $20 million a year, and he may even get a fourth year. Which is absurd for a 36 yo SS who had a very mediocre year.

    ***********

    ML – just FYI I am not in love with Derek Jeter. I was appropriately critical of his performance last year and I certainly don’t idolize him.

    I happen to agree with his position as regards his contract negotiation and I believe that Yankee management has acted in a disgraceful manner.

  153. MorningPerson November 29th, 2010 at 5:56 pm

    Betsy -

    I actually agree that they are “in the right.”

    But sometimes, you give in just because.

    I’m hoping they don’t have to go to 4, but if they do, I’ll understand it.

  154. GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 5:57 pm

    murphydog November 29th, 2010 at 5:52 pm
    Ahem:

    http://www.prorumors.com/2010/…..ters-agent

    Would the former NY Baseball Giants sign Jeter to finish his career in the City by the Bay? Then they could play “I Left my Heart in San Francisco” after Yankee home game losses in 2011. It’s not like they need great offensive punch with that pitching staff. He’d bring a lot of, um, intangibles and a cool veteran presence with lots of WS experience. The Giants are a 2011 WS contending team for sure, more so in my mind than the Yankees right now. Hmmm….

    It could happen. Just saying.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    They must have just awakened from their naps, Murph. That took 3 hours for someone to come up with that,

  155. YsGuy November 29th, 2010 at 6:00 pm

    being a capital district resident i’d like to point out that before the giants were from san francisco and new york, they were from troy!
    but nobody looks good in those orange-hued unis of there’s especially not jeter

  156. ML November 29th, 2010 at 6:00 pm

    WCYF,

    Youre not critical of him if you think a 36 yo SS off a bad year deserves whatever he asks for.

    You still have yet to say what you think the Yanks should offer, of what Jeter should be expected to accept. Until you get down to specifics, it’s all rhetoric.

    What do you think is a fair deal?

  157. Bronx Jeers November 29th, 2010 at 6:00 pm

    I do love that some are “disappointed” in either the Yanks or in Jeter as if this negotiation flies in the face of all things Yankee.

    That’s a joke.

    People use words like pride,tradition.legacy etc. and how they’re being tarnished but in reality those words don’t really exist except in terms of marketing and promotion.

  158. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 6:01 pm

    SJ44. It is their job to be concerned about the public image of their most valuable asset. That’s just plain old good business. The additional $25 million it would take the Yankees to get this deal done is pocket change for them and would not affect their ability to compete in the least.

  159. YsGuy November 29th, 2010 at 6:03 pm

    the only way that a $15M contract offer hurts the public image of their team captain is when that captain turns it down and demands another $100M.

    any damage to his image is self-inflicted

  160. ML November 29th, 2010 at 6:03 pm

    murphydog,

    It’s a fair point, but ultimately I don’t think SF can do it. They have to pay Posey, Lincecum, Cain, and Bumgarner long-term. And they need more power in their lineup as they won’t win again with the offense they have now.

    BTW, if SF was willing to give Jeter more money or a 4th year, then the Yanks would almost certainly exceed that offer to keep him. But why should they offer that now if no one else will?

  161. Betsy November 29th, 2010 at 6:04 pm

    MP, the Yankees paid Jeter what he was worth when he was worth it and now he should be paid comensurate to his expected performance. They are actually (and I know you agree) paying him more than would be expected. I don’t think you give in just to give in………it sets a bad precedent.

  162. yankeefeminista November 29th, 2010 at 6:06 pm

    To collapse Jeter trying to negotiate a contract with thinking he is being greedy or bigger than the team is laughable. This is a contract negotiation. It just goes to show how emotionally overwrought people are when their “heros” prove just to be “just baseball players.”

  163. Betsy November 29th, 2010 at 6:07 pm

    Murphy, if he goes, Jeter is not going to have the backing of whatever fan base. That is, he won’t have the currency (as Francesca puts it all the time) that he has with Yankee fans (and rightly so). If he struggles, he’ll be booed……..big time. He’s nothing to Giants fans (as an example), the same way Manny probably is nothing to Dodgers or White Sox fans (I’m sure I could come up with other HOFers). Other teams will be more ruthless with Jeter in terms of playing time than the Yankees would; they’ve got no loyalty to him

  164. SJ44 November 29th, 2010 at 6:09 pm

    Derek Jeter is not their most valuable asset.

    Nor are they giving him another 25 million absent a reason, ie: a competing offer, to do so.

    They also haven’t acted “disgracefully” in this.

    Just because you believe it, doesn’t make it so.

  165. yankeefeminista November 29th, 2010 at 6:10 pm

    Betsy, Yankee fans already booed Jeter vociferously when he had his batting slump in 2004, just as they booed Mo. What would be so new about that?

  166. MorningPerson November 29th, 2010 at 6:10 pm

    What exactly IS Jeter’s position in these contract negotiations? Somewhere along the line, that’s gotten somewhat “confused,” to say the least.

    Is it to be the highest paid player ever? Is it to stay with the Yankees as long as Alex Rodriguez? Is it to get “his take” of Yankee profits that he feels entitled to? I’m not really sure anymore. Frankly, aside from hearing that Close said Jeter should get his asking price “because he’s Derek Jeter,” I don’t recall anything near a statement about Jeter’s position in these negotiations.

    I am a Derek Jeter fan. But I am also an open-minded individual who will actually process what both sides want. Seems to me though that the Yankees have a lot more to think about than Derek Jeter, while Derek Jeter ONLY has to consider Derek Jeter. And the Yankees have tried to balance what the “real” market value of Jeter is and what he is worth to them, and against all that, trying to maintain a budget that allows them NOT to pay excessive LUXURY TAX which enables the rest of the teams in the league to compete against them.

    Plus, the more I thought about things, the more I realized that Jeter has been paid for 10 years above and beyond his “true market value” – his salary has ALWAYS included his “Derek-Jeter-ness” and to pretend otherwise is quite ingenuous.

    Ideally, I would like it if the Yankees did 3/$60 million. But I figure they’ll go a 4th year because he’s Derek Jeter and the PR fallout won’t be worth it in the long run.

    I’ve changed my stance a little since before the negotiations. One thing someone said struck me, and I don’t remember who it was, but basically it said that there are other players in the league who have maintained as clean a record as Jeter has, who are exemplary players as well. Also, Jeter did not win 5 rings all by himself. He has benefitted from being surrounded by a team that every year he’s played has been playoff quality. Every player on the Yankees for the last 16 years has benefitted in the same way. The Yankees front office has spared no expense to ensure that there is a playoff quality team every year. Does that count for nothing????

  167. RayVT November 29th, 2010 at 6:10 pm

    It is funny that the multi-billionare is thought to be frugal at holding Jeter to $15M/yr & millionare Jeter is thought to be greedy for wanting a slight pay increase.

  168. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 6:11 pm

    ML November 29th, 2010 at 6:00 pm

    WCYF, You still have yet to say what you think the Yanks should offer, of what Jeter should be expected to accept. Until you get down to specifics, it’s all rhetoric. What do you think is a fair deal?

    ***********

    You just missed it, I have posted this before.

    1. Give Jeter a 3% premium on the $1 billion dollar increase in the value of the Yankees franchise during his tenure.

    That’s a conservative estimate of what his contribution was. Call it a gold watch/retirement bonus. That’s $30 million dollars. Add that to the 3 year – $45 million, give him $66 million for three years, shake hands and move on.

  169. MorningPerson November 29th, 2010 at 6:12 pm

    Betsy -

    I believe with Jeter the Yankees don’t really have to be afraid of setting a precedent. If the argument is there is only one Derek Jeter, then in the future they can cite the “one of a kind” thing.

  170. GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 6:15 pm

    murphydog November 29th, 2010 at 5:54 pm
    GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 5:49 pm “Thanks, Tom. Between my language skills and my handy dandy little English/Spanish dictionary. I’ll be able to follow right along and get 3 out of every 10 words. .300 average will put me in the HOF.”

    All the same, GB, I’d let somebody else order the food. A .300 average against the menu is a recipe for disaster

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    I figured that “mucho beer and mucho pizza is safe and universal.” Certainly won’t ask for hot dogs. Difficult to say how they may interpret that one.

  171. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 6:15 pm

    SJ44 November 29th, 2010 at 6:09 pm

    Derek Jeter is not their most valuable asset. Nor are they giving him another 25 million absent a reason, ie: a competing offer, to do so. They also haven’t acted “disgracefully” in this. Just because you believe it, doesn’t make it so.

    ************

    SJ44 – I couldn’t agree with you more when you say that, “because you believe it, doesn’t make it so”.

    You are absolutely right. That is my opinion and that is all I have ever said it is. Nothing more. Just as your comments are your opinion, and nothing more. Two passionate bloggers and Yankee fans that disagree about an issue.

    It’s all good.

  172. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 6:16 pm

    Typo – $75 million

  173. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 6:19 pm

    Or negotiate it downwards, $65 million for three years. Whatever the case may be, negotiate and compromise.

  174. SJ44 November 29th, 2010 at 6:22 pm

    You have ZERO proof of how much Jeter raised the value of the franchise.

    It’s a TEAM. It’s not an individual contribution.

    Nor can you differentiate how much of the 205 million dollars they have already paid him could be viewed as paying him for that contribution.

    You act as if Derek Jeter is the sole reason the franchise rose in value. Nothing can be further from the truth.

    If his overall value was as significant as you believe it to be, he would be flooded with offers. franchise values.

    The fact he isnt getting those offers should tell you something.

    Especially since, owners love increasing their

  175. GreenBeret7 November 29th, 2010 at 6:22 pm

    I don’t care what Jeter gets paid. Makes no difference to me, but, although I’ve enjoyed what he has done for 15 years and will be unhappy the day he leaves the game, he is not the Yankees mist valuable asset. Most recognizable asset, along with the logo and Yogi Berra, maybe.

  176. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 6:27 pm

    SJ44 – his value and labor was for the Yankees not other teams. I also never said that Jeter was the sole reason for the increase in the Yankee franchises valuation over the years. As a matter of fact, if you read my previous opinions, I said just that. And hence the 3% bonus figure.

  177. murphydog November 29th, 2010 at 6:30 pm

    Betsy November 29th, 2010 at 6:07 pm: Murphy, if he goes, Jeter is not going to have the backing of whatever fan base. That is, he won’t have the currency (as Francesca puts it all the time) that he has with Yankee fans…. He’s nothing to Giants fans (as an example), the same way Manny probably is nothing to Dodgers or White Sox fans”

    He’s not Manny Ramirez. He’s pretty much the anti-Manny. Sure, SF might play him less, but the Yankees would be playing him less over the next three years too. His skills have certainly not declined to the point, IMO, that he’d be Willie Mays when Say Hey came to the Mets. That was just sad. Jeter could be an important guy on SF, teaching, leading by example, grafting Yankee tradition onto the modern era Giants.

  178. Betsy November 29th, 2010 at 6:30 pm

    MP, ok, but I still think giving in just to give in is a bad idea

  179. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 6:38 pm

    Another solution would be to offer Jeter a three year deal at $17 million a year, totaling $51 million.

    With, an agreement that at the end of the three years he would receive a retirement/severance lump sum payment of $15 million dollars for an effective package total of $66 million.

  180. YsGuy November 29th, 2010 at 6:38 pm

    wcyf you forgot to subtract from your 3% figure the quarter billion dollars he’s already been paid. now he gets a bonus over that?

  181. West Coast Yankee Fan November 29th, 2010 at 6:39 pm

    YsGuy. That was for his on-the-field performance like any player. Different.

  182. yankeefeminista November 29th, 2010 at 6:43 pm

    RayVT November 29th, 2010 at 6:10 pm
    It is funny that the multi-billionare is thought to be frugal at holding Jeter to $15M/yr & millionare Jeter is thought to be greedy for wanting a slight pay increase.
    __________
    Funny but predictable. Fans always side with management. Even in market value contracts, fans always get twisted up in a knot over the money players make. I guess fans expect players to play for free. :)

  183. YsGuy November 29th, 2010 at 6:51 pm

    wcyf, i guess well just have to agree to disagree.

    but in the end, the market says that he’s not worth more than the yankees have offered because nobody has (nor will anybody) come close to the yankees offer.

    in the end the capn will be back in tampa in february.

  184. Dill Pickler November 29th, 2010 at 7:33 pm

    SJ44 — why is it “sanctimonious crap” to say that the Yankees should negotiate with Jeter and allow him to “save face”? Because you disagree with it?

    A negotiation — any negotiation — has to take into account both parties’ perspectives. The Yankees playing hardball with Jeter, leaking information to the press about his agent’s initial asking price, etc., is meant to tilt public opinion towards the organization and away from Jeter in the negotiation process. I am merely stating my opinion that I think this does a disservice to both sides in the long run, and I think the organization is better served by giving a little, not trying to make Jeter look bad just to save some money.

    Geez Louise, at some point get a clue about this yourself…

  185. Dill Pickler November 29th, 2010 at 7:38 pm

    Betsy, the ESPN headline may not have said the Yankees were the source, but they did imply that the Yankees said it. “Source: Yanks Want Jeter to Take Reality Potion.”

    ESPN is reporting that the Yanks said it. I’m not saying that it’s accurate, I’m just saying that’s what ESPN is reporting, thru their source.

    And no, I don’t trust ESPN’s reporting (or anyone’s on this, right now. There’s a lot of bull flying around on this, imo)

  186. SAS November 29th, 2010 at 7:45 pm

    MP.

    You and I thin a lot alike.

  187. Pops November 29th, 2010 at 8:24 pm

    Hey all – I’m a life-long Yankee fan and have been a regular reader for many years. This is my first post. Mostly because I’ve found a lot of the talk around Jeter’s contract negotiations to be pretty mind boggling.

    I really think the number crunchers should put the calculators away and forget about what Jeter could get on the open market or debate whether Juan Uribe is a fair free-agent comparison. This is Derek Jeter we’re talking about. He is the face of the Yankees, maybe the face of baseball, and a model for how every player in the league should carry themselves both on and off the field. He plays hard every night and always handles himself with a grace, dignity and humility not often found in star athletes today. As I watch my grandkids grow up as Yankee fans, I feel better knowing that they are rooting for someone who genuinely deserves their respect and admiration.

    Of course the Yanks are more fun to watch when they win. And staying within a budget of some kind enables them to go out and get the best players when they become available. But hypothetically speaking, I would rather root for a team of 9 Derek Jeters than one that wins the World Series every year with a hired gun at every position. If not, what are we rooting for?

    So does that mean the Yankees should pay Derek for being a good guy? No. That they should give a 36 year-old shortstop a 6 year contract worth 150 million dollars? No. But they absolutely should do better by him than they are now. After overpaying time and time again for players who have earned it far less, the organization’s hard-line approach with Jeter is frankly disgusting. $15M/yr for 3 years is a lot of money, but it is not the kind of contract the Yankees are known to give. They made that bed a long time ago and Derek Jeter’s final contract is not the time to start implementing spending controls. They need to find a way to get this done and to keep it out of the media. I, for one, do not want to watch Jeter collect his 3000th hit in a Dodger uniform.

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