Stark: Yankees increasing offer to Jeter
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Dec 02, 2010 
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Jayson Stark is reporting that the Yankees are raising their offer to Derek Jeter. According to Startk’s sources, the Yankees contacted Casey Close today to let him know the offer would be improving. It’s unclear whether the new offer has actually been put on the table.
This is more or less as expected after Tuesday’s meeting between the two sides.
In other minor Yankees news: The Yankees have signed reliever Buddy Carlyle to a minor league deal. Carlyle was in the big leagues with the Braves for a while and spent last year pitching in Japan.
UPDATE, 4:37 p.m.: The Associated Press echoes the Stark report…
NEW YORK (AP) — The New York Yankees have increased their contract offer to Derek Jeter.
The team informed Jeter’s side of the new offer during a telephone conversation early Thursday, a person familiar with the negotiations said. The person spoke on condition of anonymity because no announcement was made.
New York opened with a $45 million, three-year offer last month, then awaited a formal proposal from its captain. It was not known whether the new offer improved the value, contract length or both.
Get it done, Cash.
Second tour in Yankee system for Buddy “Kitty” Carlyle.
Fro argument’s sake, no way Crawford *doesn’t* hit 20-25 at NYS. He is gaining 8 less feet down the RF line vs. the Trop.
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Maybe if he changed his hitting approach? But he isn’t a pull hitter, he hits to all fields, its no guarantee that he just hits 25 because he goes to NYS. It’d require a Damon-esque transition into a pull hitter which may remove some of his other abilities.
He goes opposite field and up the middle alot. Look at his chart from last year, none of his fly outs were near the wall at Tropicana or down the line, and it looks like maybe 1 double would have ended up over the fence in NYS.
jerkface-
Take a look at this scatter plot of Crawford HRs for 2010. I’d say when it comes to HRs he is in fact a pull hitter:
http://www.hittrackeronline.co.....ype=hitter
Jerkface -
On Gwynn and Hairston vs. Curtis – I would give the two FA’s the edge simply because they can play multiple positions.
If nothing else I would bring one in for Spring Training to compete for the job.
Hopefully this saga is coming to its conclusion.
GreenBeret7 December 2nd, 2010 at 3:54 pm
Second tour in Yankee system for Buddy “Kitty” Carlyle.
———————-
Yeah, when you can’t crack the bullpen in Japan the odds are you’re not going to get a sniff of anything better than a role as a Scranton or Trenton mop up guy.
GB,
Admit it, you have had a long long crush on Kitty Carlisle. So elegant and yet so clever in knowing the truthteller.
Take a look at this scatter plot of Crawford HRs for 2010. I’d say when it comes to HRs he is in fact a pull hitter:
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Sure, but he hit those. You say he is going to hit MORE just because he is in a new stadium? Most hitters with little power pull their HRs. I’m saying look at his spray chart and check the hits or outs that you are expecting to turn into HRs from the move.
He doesn’t light up the RF wall with doubles for example.
If this is a couple of million taking it to fifty for three years or so – that doesn’t advance the sticks much. Maybe that’s all Jeter needs to save face and throw in the towel.
Yankees are probably willing to add a million or so per year to keep him the highest paid SS over Tulo but in seeing what Tulo got they believe Close and Jeter are now aware of how on point the Yankee offer was.
GreenBeret7 December 2nd, 2010 at 3:54 pm
Second tour in Yankee system for Buddy ?Kitty? Carlyle.
*************************
Sounds like a comedian.
I must say, Buddy Carlyle is an awesome name.
Erin,
Won’t that be nice. There has to be another more interesting topic of conversation. This one has been beaten to death.
SI_JonHeyman #yankees increaded their offer to jeter today, and jeter’s side lowered their request. #moving closer
GB,
Good day. Buddy should be as good as “Kitty” Kaat
“How I Bid Against Myself, And Won!” by Brian Cashman
Heyman says Yanks raised their offer and Jeter lowered his and they are moving closer…..twitter.
By the way – between Salty and a 39-year old Tek I really hope Boston has a Plan C for their catching position…well actually I don’t; but if I was a Boston fan I would.
austinmac December 2nd, 2010 at 4:00 pm
GB,
Admit it, you have had a long long crush on Kitty Carlisle. So elegant and yet so clever in knowing the truthteller
———————————————————————————————————————-
Kitty was a warmy in her day.
http://rangersblog.dallasnews......towar.html
not looking good for Yanks here….
Blake –
So they’re negotiating….;-)
I think the Tulo contract really helped the Yankees. Derek and Close aren’t idiots, they looked at a prime young stud getting $15.7 mil per and realized that asking for something in the 20′s was nutty.
If they settle on $16/$17 mil per for 3 years the Yankees will be fine with that. The extra 6 mil is still a savings over what they paid him last year and what’s more important they hold the 3 years.
jeter will probably end up around 3/51 or so, with a 4th year option/buy out something agreed to on both ends.
The Yankees are increasing their offer, even though Jeter has had no offers, or real indications of interest from any other team?
This just shows you that anyone can make money owning the Yankees, even idiots like the Steinbrenners.
elijahandstephensdad December 2nd, 2010 at 4:06 pm
http://rangersblog.dallasnews&.....towar.html
not looking good for Yanks here….
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I don’t know about you but I for one am shocked that Ian Kinsler would look at the situation with Texas colored glasses.
The line ends “…but it’s all about the money” actually makes it sound quite good for the Yankees because if that’s all that it’s about for Lee then he’ll be wearing Pinstripes by New Year’s.
SAS December 2nd, 2010 at 4:02 pm
Erin,
Won?t that be nice. There has to be another more interesting topic of conversation. This one has been beaten to death.
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SAS-no kidding!
E&S’s Dad
I am sure Cliffy’s old buddy CC is lobbying just as hard for him to come to NY
I am so ready for the Jeter saga to be settled
Chip,
I agree.
BloggingBombers Source says Yankees have indeed made a new offer to Jeter. Unknown how much they’ve increased it.
SAS December 2nd, 2010 at 4:03 pm
GB,
Good day. Buddy should be as good as “Kitty” Kaat
———————————————————————————————————————-
afternoon, SAS. Hope all is well in your world. “Kitty” Kaat was one of baseball’s top pitchers in the ’60s through the mid-70s. The phrase “stylish southpaw” was made for him, Tommy John and Whitey Ford. I still think he and Tommy John more than earned a place in the HOF.
“Sure, but he hit those. You say he is going to hit MORE just because he is in a new stadium?”
No, yankeefeminista was saying that. I simply posted a chart to show that when Crawford hit HRs, he pulled them.
I think all this Crawford speculation is a complete waste of time anyway.
Derek Jeter will do one thing for the Yanks that few other players will do willingly: completely sacrifice his body for the good of the team.
That “dive into the stands” play against Boston was a prime example. When he left his feet for that ball, he knew that he was throwing himself into the Great Unknown.
Yankee Stadium was an unforgiving place. If the fans in the seats parted like the Red Sea, he was going to eat concrete.
Unfortunately, that’s exactly what they did. He took a beating on that play, and the outcome could have been far, far worse.
It’s hard to put a definable value on that sort of dedication. I can’t say that I blame him for wanting it to be recognized.
The Sawx are simply “stuck” with Salty and Varitek bc there just aren’t quality catchers available.
Tek is cheaper, knows the staff, and can show Salty the ropes vs taking a chance on someone like Olivo.
The Yanks knew what they were doing filling their system with pitching and catching.
You can more easily fill holes in the OF, corner IF, and even middle IF than you can with P and C via free agency.
RiverAveBlues Yanks spring training tickets are going on sale tomorrow at 10 a.m.
hardwired7 December 2nd, 2010 at 4:11 pm
Derek Jeter will do one thing for the Yanks that few other players will do willingly: completely sacrifice his body for the good of the team.
???????????????????????????????????????-
So did Butch Hobson.
Buddy Carlyle is a lounge singer here in Vegas….. I think he played the Casbah Lounge at the Riviera Hotel back in the day. He opened for Louis Prima & Keely Smith.
hardwired,
You mean Jeter plays like every player should play?
In all seriousness, I would dive into the stands in a pickup game. I’m always amazed that Jeter gets so much credit for that… but it’s because not everybody does.
Do people really believe DJ goes into the stands more often than other regular shortstops? I mean, he doesn’t do it very often – in fact he does it extremely rarely.
Nobody actually keeps count, do they?
Tweet from Bronx Baseball Daily which is usually full of crap.
Cliff Lee’s agent: “We’re not looking for Sabathia’s contract”
No one was going to give him Sabathia’s contract anyway.
No, yankeefeminista was saying that. I simply posted a chart to show that when Crawford hit HRs, he pulled them.
I think all this Crawford speculation is a complete waste of time anyway.
–
Ok? But your point didn’t really disprove anything I said. Of course his HRs were pulled, he doesn’t have power. I bet you Brett Gardner’s HRs are all pulled.
The argument is that he will hit MORE Hrs. I don’t think moving to NYS stadium would cause that. His HRs would already be a HR in NYS, and his outs weren’t close enough to the wall to matter. Meanwhile all of his outs, hits, etc are sprayed to all fields. He’d have to fundamentally change his approach.
WYH
isn’t there some sabre type stat on that???
I think he went into the stands on that play for one reason: if he didn’t make that play, the ball lands fair and Boston takes a lead in extra innings.
I think the reason that play gets so much hype is bc he came out all bruised and bloody and it was a little scary. And it was an intense game.
Lee will end up with a 6 year $140 mil contract from the Yankees.
I just don’t see how Texas matches that.
NYY626 – Andy in 2011 December 2nd, 2010 at 4:21 pm
I think the reason that play gets so much hype is bc he came out all bruised and bloody and it was a little scary. And it was an intense game.
*************************
I still remember Alex’s quote the day after that game- about how it looked like Jeter had been in a fight with Mike Tyson. LOL
Johnny Damon ran into a wall or 2 in Yankee Stadium duing his tenure, Tex has made some pretty hairy plays into the stands or camera well, Cervelli has taken a dive or 2 into the dugout, Alex came back from hip surgery in record time and Mo pitched with strained ribs in the 2009 postseason.
Players give up their bodies in different ways for the team all the time.
Erin – he did look like he got into a fight! His mother’s reaction in the stands kills me. Like she wants to go run and check on her baby boy but realizes hes a 30 yr old professional baseball player…. lol
jerkface-
It wasn’t an attack on you. I thought the plot was interesting. Perhaps it indicates that when Crawford is trying to hit a HR, he pulls the ball. If he played in Yankee Stadium, maybe he’d try to do it more often.
Perhaps it just means when he hits the ball hard, he pulls it. Perhaps it is just a misleading random result. But he did pull all his HRs.
Your speculation on Gardner was right, though:
http://www.hittrackeronline.co.....ype=hitter
It appears as though ranger fans believe that after they sign lee, they will trade for greinke…LMAO!
Boston Dave,
Every player should be as motivated as Jeter, but obviously they are not.
pat December 2nd, 2010 at 4:25 pm
Johnny Damon ran into a wall or 2 in Yankee Stadium duing his tenure, Tex has made some pretty hairy plays into the stands or camera well, Cervelli has taken a dive or 2 into the dugout, Alex came back from hip surgery in record time and Mo pitched with strained ribs in the 2009 postseason.
Players give up their bodies in different ways for the team all the time
_______________________________________________________________
I was at the game this year when cervelli fell into the dugout. I laughed so hard.
I remember the Yanks having a different Buddy – Buddy Groom. As I recall, he had slicked back hair, and really looked like a Vegas lounge singer. Or, am I getting my Buddies confused?
Regardless of optimistic rumor generated in Texas, I still think that Lee has made it pretty clear over the years that he’s going about this FA thing in a very un-sentimental, let’s see what’s out there in my one and only shot, show me the $$$$$$ way. And if he wants to see the $$$$$$….well, then, that means hello Tampa in the spring time.
f this is a couple of million taking it to fifty for three years or so
=============================
It’s the “or so” part that’s important. That 4th year, be it a 10m buyout, that could bring the deal to 4/60.
Lot’s of chatter about the White Sox and Dunn getting close on a deal.
It wasn’t an attack on you. I thought the plot was interesting.
–
But the insinuation of replying to my post with that information is that you disagreed with my assertion, as if I was not aware that his HRs were pulled. It may be that he would try do that more if he were at NYS though, but I wonder if it would affect his overall numbers negatively.
Joe, you’d be correct about Groom. Carlyle was an emergency spot start a few years ago for the Braves. The Yanks signed him in the winter of ’03 but he split time between Trenton in AA and Columbus in AAA during ’04.
4/$60 for Dunn per Heyman
jerkface-
Going back and re-reading your original comment at 3:55pm, I think it is a fair reading to conclude that you were not aware most of Crawford’s HRs were pulled. But certainly you could have been aware of the fact and written a similar comment.
However, I’m sure many LoHudders were not aware it, and some may have found the chart interesting, as I did, which is why I posted it.
JackCurryYES Eventhough Jeter and Yankees are making progress, one person said the discussions aren’t “in the zone” yet. Still more work to be done.
JackCurryYES Jeter and the Yankees are inching forward. One person said Yankees slightly boosted 3-year, $45 mill offer after Jeter lowered his demands.
JackCurryYES Eventhough Jeter and Yankees are making progress, one person said the discussions aren’t “in the zone” yet. Still more work to be done.
pgammo Dunn is 4/$56 with White Sox
As much as I want Jeter to sign back with us, I will be very disappointed if the deal includes a GUARANTEED 4th year.
Jerkface,
It was a chart that I actually understood.
Going back and re-reading your original comment at 3:55pm, I think it is a fair reading to conclude that you were not aware most of Crawford’s HRs were pulled. But certainly you could have been aware of the fact and written a similar comment.
–
I disagree, I was not arguing what he had already hit for HRs, the argument is if he would hit more. Why would I look at the HRs he already hit? We’re looking at how he hits the ball in general, which is to say he is a spray hitter whose power zone is pull.
Jerkface December 2nd, 2010 at 4:19 pm
No, yankeefeminista was saying that. I simply posted a chart to show that when Crawford hit HRs, he pulled them.
I think all this Crawford speculation is a complete waste of time anyway.
–
Ok? But your point didn’t really disprove anything I said. Of course his HRs were pulled, he doesn’t have power. I bet you Brett Gardner’s HRs are all pulled.
The argument is that he will hit MORE Hrs. I don’t think moving to NYS stadium would cause that. His HRs would already be a HR in NYS, and his outs weren’t close enough to the wall to matter. Meanwhile all of his outs, hits, etc are sprayed to all fields. He’d have to fundamentally change his approach.
__________________________________________________
Um, Crawford pulled all of his HR’s in a park that was 322. He would know he had less of a fence to shoot for. He would be able to pull and hit more HR’s in his homepark (NYS), knowing the wall is 8 feet closer. & he wouldn’t have to fundamentally change his approach to do so.
Matt Diaz non-tendered. Bad year last season but overall a monster against LHP…bench option?
Here’s a random thought:
Nationals get Greinke
Royals get Wilson Ramos, Justin Maxwell, Ross Detwiler, and another prospect.
He would be able to pull and hit more HR’s in his homepark (NYS), knowing the wall is 8 feet closer. & he wouldn’t have to fundamentally change his approach to do so.
–
To pull more and hit more HRs would require him to change his approach. He doesn’t do that right now.
in other news, the red sox have decided to re-sign varitek.
which means now that martinez have left for detroit, the red sox will more than likely have a platoon situation behind the dish.
varitek and saltamacchia
WTP
How do you platoon switch hitters?
“in other news, the red sox have decided to re-sign varitek.”
Desperation move. This guy has been done since he stopped juicing.
Very sad to hear the Yankees increased their offer by any amount of money.
Derek Jeter surely has a shamrock up his you know what. The team offers to over pay him, he spits at it and then they offer to overpay him more.
I hope to God he lives up to whatever contract he signs. I don’t think the fan patience is going to be high for him after he hits 3000 if he’s grounding the ball into the dirt for outs all the time.
The Yankees should not cave into any demands above their generous offer. Sad to see them start to do it.
His contract dollars will affect what this team does now and in the future.
Bank on it.
Laura – I Bleed Blue December 2nd, 2010 at 5:00 pm
“in other news, the red sox have decided to re-sign varitek.”
Desperation move. This guy has been done since he stopped juicing.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The weakest catching duo in the AL East.
Dunn to the White Sox.
The sides agreed to a four-year, $56MM deal, according to Bob Nightengale of USA Today (on Twitter).
G. Love December 2nd, 2010 at 5:02 pm
His contract dollars will affect what this team does now and in the future.
__________________________________________________________
lol. It is the rhetoric, but I actually doubt it. I can think of quite a few other contracts that will have much more of an impact.
Jerkface December 2nd, 2010 at 4:57 pm
He would be able to pull and hit more HR’s in his homepark (NYS), knowing the wall is 8 feet closer. & he wouldn’t have to fundamentally change his approach to do so.
–
To pull more and hit more HRs would require him to change his approach. He doesn’t do that right now.
_____________________
The original discussion on here was incredulity that Crawford could hit 20-25 in NYS. He hit 19. I think he can quite easily hit 20, and 25 wouldn’t in no way be a reach. And the wall helps him–8 feet and a lefty who has more power than you think.
*would in no way*
Vineyard Yankee December 2nd, 2010 at 5:04 pm
Dunn to the White Sox.
The sides agreed to a four-year, $56MM deal, according to Bob Nightengale of USA Today (on Twitter).
__________________
I can think of worse places he could have gone.
No one knows what limit the Yankees put on their negotiations with Jeter. They may not have hit their upper limit. Though it may seem to us they’ll be outbidding themselves, that won’t be true if they don’t go over whatever limit they set for themselves.
G. Love.
The amount they raised their offer wont affect anything….now.or in the future. Regardless of what they pay Jeter, they have made a statement that they aren’t giving away money needlessly anymore…..even if they are in this case, that wont be the perception. The perception is that they have negociated hard with Jeter so the will with anybody else as well.
G. Love – Agree. But is it a surprise? Yanks love to bid against themselves.
If the reports from yesterday are correct (about Hank not wanting to raise the Jeter offer, but Hal willing to), perhaps Hal had more input to the A-Rod contract than we initially thought.
Disappointing. If they had stayed patient, Jeter would have eventually come crawling back to them and signed the 3/$45 and they would have looked great for holding firm and sent a message to future FAs.
They have 0 reason to increase their offer.
I have overlayed NYS on his tropicana spray chart, 2 more HRs?
http://i54.tinypic.com/687ts8.jpg
Its a crappy photoshop job, but whatever. I think its a far cry from Chip’s 30 HR at NYS hopes.
Just because Crawford hit 19 last year doesn’t mean that would be the baseline he would be working with next season or beyond.
His 162 game average in his career is 14 HR.
As a 28-29 year old in a walk year last year it is possible he topped out his power at 19 HR. We could easily look back on the day he retires and see 2010 was his career high for HR whether he played for the Yankees or any other team.
He is going to be 30 next August.
They increased their offer to get things moving and get a deal done. It hasn’t been reported yet how much it was increased by but I doubt it was much…..probably to around 50 million as has been reported for days. If 50 gets things moving and gets this over with then thats better for both sides than to continue this stalemate which is helping neither.
the catching situation over in boston is rather weak.
tek is no longer an everyday catcher.
salt is a career .248 hitter with only 25 hr’s.
nothing to be scared about there.
Then they will give Cliff Lee a 32 year old pitcher with occasional back problems a six year deal for $23 million a year.
YS while it could help Crawford’s HR could lower his 2B and 3B totals.
Finally Adam Dunn gets paid big money. He deserves it! Smart of him to move to the AL too, he is a huge negative in the field.
WCYF,
Yup they will and that’s what it’ll take to sign him. If they win 2 titles in those 6 years then it will have been worth it.
Does this mean the ChiSox are moving on from Konerko. Dunn in.addition to Konerko is a big upgrade for them…..Dunn in replacement of Konerko isn’t nearly as much.
“The perception is that they have negociated hard with Jeter so the will with anybody else as well.”
It is easy to do this with Jeter considering he has no leverage at all. They can talk tough with him and all that because he has nowhere to go. They wouldn’t pull this with, say, Mariano.
and premier FAs like Lee or CC in 08 have all the leverage against the Yankees anyway, so the Yanks are in no position to negotiate like this with someone they badly want on the market.
I don’t think this changes the perception of the Yankees negotiating strategy. They are still going to get taken to the cleaners by guys who they want badly. They just might be more firm with the guys with limited leverage (Damon, Jeter, etc.).
blake-i have to agree with you there.
if that money earns the team 2 titles over the length of the contract, i think the entire organization would accept that.
anybody around here who thinks differently obviously is not very intelligent and is asking for
the impossible.
Why can’t they still get Konerko to play 1B? The White Sox had a gigantic hole at DH this year, Dunn can fill it nicely
I would guess the Yankees went 3/50 and are going to hold firm on that number.
Especially in light of Tulo’s new contract.
.273 .361 .504 .865 120 HR
.252 .378 .524 .902 196 HRs
Dunn replacing Konerko is a huge upgrade. 76 more HRs? Tasty!
Warning Track Power,
The Yankees don’t have the remotest idea what they will get from their catchers.
Blake – I think most Yankee fans would take 2 for 6.
“I would guess the Yankees went 3/50 and are going to hold firm on that number.”
I hope you’re right. My limit was 3/60, but if they can do better than that, so be it.
TD213,
It does tell other teams and agents that they wont be going over market value anymore without a fight. They will Overpay Jeter but not nearly by as much as they may have in the past and that is the statement they are trying to make…
“Then they will give Cliff Lee a 32 year old pitcher with occasional back problems a six year deal for $23 million a year.”
They always negotiate differently with guys who they feel they need. You won’t be seeing firm Cashman/Levine quotes when Lee starts taking offers lol
SJ44,
What are your thoughts on an 4th option year?
LGY December 2nd, 2010 at 5:16 pm
Just because Crawford hit 19 last year doesn’t mean that would be the baseline he would be working with next season or beyond.
His 162 game average in his career is 14 HR.
As a 28-29 year old in a walk year last year it is possible he topped out his power at 19 HR. We could easily look back on the day he retires and see 2010 was his career high for HR whether he played for the Yankees or any other team.
He is going to be 30 next August.
______________________________
I doubt 14 is his mean. He is in his prime and improving.
Cliff Lee is a better player, at the most desired position in the game (top of the rotation starting pitcher), than Derek Jeter at this point in their respective careers.
Players are paid by comps in MLB.
Look at the comps of top of the rotation starting pitchers v. SS. There is a big difference.
Cliff Lee also has other suitors bidding top dollar for his services. Derek Jeter does not.
The two situations aren’t comparable at all.
Nice move for the Chi Sox.
Dunn did say he wants no part of DHing though.
when you consider that Dunn can’t field a lick then its not as much of an upgrade over Konerko as it may seem…..re-signing Konerko to play 1b and DHing Dunn is what they should do.
I doubt 14 is his mean. He is in his prime and improving.
–
Exitting his prime. At age 24 he hit 18 HR then hit 11, 8, and 15 in his actual prime.
when you consider that Dunn can’t field a lick then its not as much of an upgrade over Konerko as it may seem…..re-signing Konerko to play 1b and DHing Dunn is what they should do.
–
Yea I agree there, but I don’t think any amount of first base fielding overwrites 72 HRs. Thats massive. 72+ runs for free! Dunn isn’t going to give those back in the field.
Patrick,
Not in favor of it.
The offer is already the highest AND longest ever offered a 36 year old SS.
I see no reason to add a 4th year.
Sas-
Is that really true? I think with Posada more than likely getting some starts behind the plate, that right there is an upgrade over the red sox platoon.
I think Dunn will replace Kotsay, which will be a big power boost for the Pale Hose.
I am sure that the Yankees revised negotiating posture will be duly noted by agents. Might not be real pretty should Hal et al crave a Close client in the future.
Why would you even WANT Crawford to hit more HR? That’s not his game… I don’t want him swinging for the fences, trying to pull balls out to RF. I want him hitting it to all fields, driving the ball in the gaps, stealing bases, etc
The Yankees need to stop negotiating against themselves.
To put $23M/yr in perspective for Cliff Lee, he has made just over $23M to this point in his entire career.
It s/b a pretty Merry Christmas in the Lee household.
My crystal ball insists that there will be some sort of fourth year option/buyout in the Jeter contract. The crystal ball says it will be a team option, not a player option though.
“I want him hitting it to all fields, driving the ball in the gaps, stealing bases, etc”
I don’t, since he almost certainly will be playing against the Yanks.
The White Sox, if they make Dunn their DH, are rightfully shifting away from the rotating DH that doomed their offense in 2010.
Jerkface December 2nd, 2010 at 5:29 pm
I doubt 14 is his mean. He is in his prime and improving.
–
Exitting his prime. At age 24 he hit 18 HR then hit 11, 8, and 15 in his actual prime.
_________________________
Exiting his prime? I think not.
SJ44
I have to agree with you. If for some reason a 4th year is added, that 4th year could be a “club option”.
Not sure if Jeter wants to sign a contract under those terms, but that could be very possible.
No matter what, Jeter is being paid a lot of money for a 36 yr old SS.
“The crystal ball says it will be a team option, not a player option though”
A player option, given Jeter’s age and the probable trajectory of his career, would be tantamount to a guarantee. IOW, it shouldn’t happen under any circumstances.
Exiting his prime? I think not.
–
When is the prime of a baseball player?
“I doubt 14 is his mean. He is in his prime and improving.”
——————————-
I’m sure a lot of people thought the same thing in 2006 when he hit 18 HR with an .830 OPS.
Crawford is not really on an improvement path. He got worse after 2006, until 2010 in his walk year he had a career year and finally topped his 2006 season.
The white Sox will re-sign Konerko and put Dunn in one of the corner outfield spots. Since there’s no difference in the defense if Quentin and Dunn, since they’re both brutal, Quenton will DH and maybe stay healthy.
Rich in NJ-
I’m pretty sure that’s why my crystal ball is only showing a team option…
Warning Track,
Last season Posada’s defense was poor. Grant you he was injured, but if he catches much, he will get injured again. Montero has never played an inning in the majors…not one.
LGY December 2nd, 2010 at 5:35 pm
“I doubt 14 is his mean. He is in his prime and improving.”
——————————-
I’m sure a lot of people thought the same thing in 2006 when he hit 18 HR with an .830 OPS.
Crawford is not really on an improvement path. He got worse after 2006, until 2010 in his walk year he had a career year and finally topped his 2006 season.
______________
He topped in 2006? OK… Do you ever actually watch him play? Did you see him this year. Add his 2010 numbers and mix.
Position players see their best years in their age 26-29 seasons, the ‘prime’ really being 27,28ish. For pitchers the prime can often be 29-32. For players who enter the league at a young age, the prime is shifted forwards, 24-27.
This is what I understand, from various articles and research into player performance. Crawford has been in the league since he was 20.
Crawford
HR/OPS
2006: 18/.830
2007: 11/.820
2008: 8/.718
2009: 15/.816
2010: 19/.851
GB7-
You think? They owe Pierre $8.5M and I can’t see them sitting down Quentin.
Warning Track,
I don’t like Cervelli either. Hopefully, Montero will be good, and be the next Posada, but it is a crap shot.
The prime age of a baseball player, although not an exact science is said to be in the 27-31 range.
WYH
Try to get your crystal ball tdo have more of a spine (
) : no option at all, because the same people who now think Jeter should get more money even though no other team would pay him anything close to what the Yankees are reportedly offering will be screaming for the Yankees to pick up that option no matter how bad he may be at that time.
“He topped in 2006? OK… Do you ever actually watch him play? Did you see him this year. Add his 2010 numbers and mix.”
—————————–
You didn’t read what I said right.
I said in 2010, he finally topped 2006. 2006 was his previous best year and it took him 4 years to improve on it.
There won’t be any fallout with future Close clients and the Yankees because these are not acrimonious negotiations.
Any agent keeping clients away from the team that pays more money to players than any team in the sport would be a moron.
Casey Close is not a moron.
When all is said and done, Derek Jeter will have been paid over 250 million dollars by the Yankees over the course of his career.
Counting endorsements, Casey’s commissions on Derek Jeter’s deals alone top 13 million dollars.
Everybody will survive just fine, with no hard feelings, when this deal is done in the next week-10 days.
It depends how this ends. There are often hard feelings based on what is said across the table in private. I agree that this might not go that way, but we will never know.
Pierre in left, Dunn in right, Konerko at 1B, Quentin at DH. They have no other full time outfielders.
SAS-
What you fail to realize is, the sox are down in the dumps.
As a Yankee fan, I have no choice but to pile on and kick them a few times while they are down, LOL!!
Seriously, I know Cervelli is not an everyday catcher and Montero is very unproven.
Posada is very much a weak catcher behind the plate, but his bat is still very strong.
As long as Montero performs in ST, he will break camp with the team and “share” catching duties with Posada.
I will be fine with that scenario to begin the season.
Rich in NJ-
I hear you, and I have tried to reason with it, but my crystal ball only shows what it shows.
It doesn’t mean that anyone would be kept away, but personal feelings do enter into negotiations that can translate into an intransigence that might not ordinarily be there. No matter how professional the participants. That’s just human nature.
I really hope the Yanks don’t give Jeter a “4th year option”. That is basically giving him a 4 year deal since I would love to see Hal and Cash telling the fans they are declining the option on the captain. Agents will never take the Yanks seriously since they always bid against themselves and their offers are never final offers. $15-$17m a year is more than fair and he is basically getting an extra $5m a year in your the captain and we respect you bonuses. The extra year is not necessary but they will probably agree to 3/$60 with a 4th year option.
Hey Team LGY/Jerkface,
Don’t get so screwed into your numbers that you can’t see what is in front of your face. Also keep in mind, once again, you have as usual diverted from the original discussion: It was number of HR’s Crawford can hit in NYS were he to play for the Yankees.
And if you don’t think Crawford is in his prime. I really don’t know what to tell you.
As for pointing out CC’s HR/OPS, not exactly the optimum way to view a speed player and who wouldn’t take those # of HR’s and OPS with the SB ability.
Crawford was great in the first half of last year: .321/.380/.521 .901 OPS and 31 SB.
He fell off that pace a lot in the 2nd half: .289/.326/.463 .789 OPS and 16 SB.
Did yankeefeminista watch him in the 2nd half?
0% chance.
But, if you believe otherwise, so be it.
The entire Red Sox organization HATE Scott Boras.
REAL hatred. Nothing manufactured about it.
Pure, unadulterated hatred.
Guess what? The Sox are deep in negotiations with two Boras clients, Beltre and Werth.
There is nothing resembling those feelings between Close and the Yankees.
Especially since these negotiations are a picnic compared to when they did the 10 year deal.
Those were tough negotiations.
This is nothing.
They sure showed him. Now that Jeter has tested the market and found that no one will pay him so much as $10 million per year, it only makes sense to increase an already generous offer.
It’s all bluster and false bravado with the Yankees . . . always. They will cave each and every time . . . like clockwork.
2013 should be fun when the Yankees starters are older than the Old Timers they bring back each year.
I think a lot of people forget that contract negotiations with Jeter have never been all that easy. This isn’t the first time where both sides have disagreed on what he’s worth…
“It doesn’t mean that anyone would be kept away, but personal feelings do enter into negotiations that can translate into an intransigence that might not ordinarily be there. No matter how professional the participants. That’s just human nature.”
I think Jerkface was right.
regarding all this talk about carl crawford:
i would rather have Gardner is LF with Cliff Lee on the mound vs having
crawford in LF and Cliff Lee pitching for some other team.
“Pierre in left, Dunn in right, Konerko at 1B, Quentin at DH. They have no other full time outfielders.”
Man that’s a bad outfield. You get to choose between Quentin and Dunn, both guys are just terrible fielders…
YankFanCA
2013 should be fun when the Yankees starters are older than the Old Timers they bring back each year.
If that means 1 more WS title, that is fine by me.
Isn’t the game played to win.
Regardless of age or how old certain players are, if these same “old” players take home another WS title, then Yankee fans will be very, very happy.
SJ,
What are the chances the Yanks sign Lee at this point? Seems the Rangers are pressing pretty hard.
LGY December 2nd, 2010 at 5:39 pm
“He topped in 2006? OK… Do you ever actually watch him play? Did you see him this year. Add his 2010 numbers and mix.”
—————————–
You didn’t read what I said right.
I said in 2010, he finally topped 2006. 2006 was his previous best year and it took him 4 years to improve on it.
__________________________
I likely was responding to Jerkface, sometimes hard to figure out where one begins and the other ends.
Define best year. His numbers aside from the injured 2008 were pretty good, and you failed to include his 58 and 50 SB’s in 2006 and 2007 and 60 SB’s with a .364 OBP and 15 HR’s in 2009. Therefore, I really can’t buy into your manipulation of the numbers.
Warning Track — What’s Jeter going to do if the Yankees offer $15M x 3 years? Sit out? Give me a break. We all know he’s not worth more than $10M per year, so this whole negotiation thing is a joke.
Yankees management tries to look like tough guys, but even when they’re doing the right thing, they inevitably capitulate.
And bringing Jeter back doesn’t put them any closer to a WS championship. This team is incorrectly named. They should be called the Mariners, because they’re ancient.
Quentin was th RF last year, so they are used to bad outfield play. Another year of Alex Rios having to patrol the entire outfield….except for the outfield foul lines.
Patrick,
Exactly.
Folks forget that Jeter and the Yankees once went to arbitration.
The negotiations for the 10 year deal was like the Pacquaio-Marquez fight.
Those were rough negotiations.
This has been a walk in the park compared to those negotiations.
Folks keep looking for a doomsday scenario in these talks and that just isn’t the case.
Quentin was th RF last year, so they are used to bad outfield play. Another year of Alex Rios having to patrol the entire outfield….except for the outfield foul lines.
—
And before that Jermaine Dye… jeez you’re right I guess the white sox don’t really care about defense
Its too bad the yanks caved in. Jeter never had an ounce of leverage. Highest paid shortstop in baseball wasn’t enough for him? I’d say, take it or leave it. No player is bigger than the Yankees. They shouldn’t have increased their offer a dime. He would have had no choice, and even if he were disappointed he has too high of personal standards to not play his hardest next season and beyond.
Warning Track,
Just to let you know, I couldn’t agree more about Lee vs. Crawford.
“Define best year. His numbers aside from the injured 2008 were pretty good, and you failed to include his 58 and 50 SB’s in 2006 and 2007 and 60 SB’s with a .364 OBP and 15 HR’s in 2009. Therefore, I really can’t buy into your manipulation of the numbers.”
————————–
We aren’t talking about whether he was good those years. He was.
You said he is improving. I said a lot of people probably thought that after 2006.
Yet, after 2006 he didn’t improve. He was stable and slightly worse in most areas until 2010.
Try to keep up
Ryan Zimmerman is complaining about the Nats not re-signing Dunn.
Contract breakdown:
$8M for hitting .250 – .270 for the next three years
$7M for Jeter’s greed
$2-4M for Jeter’s ego
Yeh, that’s good business.
theREALkevin speaks theREALtruth
LGY December 2nd, 2010 at 6:03 pm
“Define best year. His numbers aside from the injured 2008 were pretty good, and you failed to include his 58 and 50 SB’s in 2006 and 2007 and 60 SB’s with a .364 OBP and 15 HR’s in 2009. Therefore, I really can’t buy into your manipulation of the numbers.”
————————–
We aren’t talking about whether he was good those years. He was.
You said he is improving. I said a lot of people probably thought that after 2006.
Yet, after 2006 he didn’t improve. He was stable and slightly worse in most areas until 2010.
Try to keep up
_____________
How was he slightly worse? In 2009 his OBP, HRs and SB’s were superior, and his WAR was 5.7 vs. 4.6 in 2006. Try to keep up with me. His last 2 years are the stellar. And as usual you have subverted the original discussion, which was CC’s ability to hit 20+ HR’s in NYS. I think this is about played out, fun as it has been.
$15 mill is a minimum $5 mill per year overpay…i love the fans that spouts since the yanks overpaid 8 other guys why set a precedent now????
fayboy was the guy in charge with the srod and jorge joke contracts. leave it up to cashman and the smart steinny and those gift contracts will go away.
the yanks will have to pay jeter $2 mill more overpay joke so the egocentric fool does not look like a groveling old man.
way to go derek, way to have a sense of humility and reality. these guys(athletes) are clueless fools.
poor poor derek……….
subtract “the” from last post.
List of tendered and non-tendered players and those that there has been no decision made yet.
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/nontenders2011
I want Ryan Zimmerman playing third for us so bad.
I hate to be a greedy Yankee fan. He’s the one guy from any other team I want though.
Zimmerman, Cano, and Tex would be amazing.
Ironic that there’s a discussion on this thread about Crawford’s “prime” years as the team is about to raise its already outrageous offer to a 36 year old SS.
YankFanCA December 2nd, 2010 at 5:56 pm
Warning Track — What’s Jeter going to do if the Yankees offer $15M x 3 years? Sit out? Give me a break. We all know he’s not worth more than $10M per year, so this whole negotiation thing is a joke.
Yankees management tries to look like tough guys, but even when they’re doing the right thing, they inevitably capitulate.
And bringing Jeter back doesn’t put them any closer to a WS championship. This team is incorrectly named. They should be called the Mariners, because they’re ancient.
I see you have a strong opinion. Mine differs greatly, but so be it.
To say Jeter is not worth $10 million is laughable. To the Yankees, Jeter’s value can not be put into numbers.
Then you claim the Yankees should be called the mariners, based on age?
Again, you have really reached an all-time low.
Carl December 2nd, 2010 at 6:16 pm
I want Ryan Zimmerman playing third for us so bad.
I hate to be a greedy Yankee fan. He’s the one guy from any other team I want though.
Zimmerman, Cano, and Tex would be amazing.
____________
Only signed through 2013 too. (sigh)
Mention of Kitty Carlisle reminds me of her husband Moss Hart, who died in 1961. His book Act One was a huge best seller. I’m sure it would still be wonderful reading.
yankeefemanista – if his OBP and HR were up, but his SLG was not… he wasn’t better.