A bench option emerges
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Dec 06, 2010 
Print This Post
| 
Email This Post
Among the Yankees secondary concerns this winter is their lack of depth in the outfield. The roster has a few young players who filled holes last season, but the Yankees need a fourth outfielder who they can count on for occasional starts in the corners, especially against left-handed pitching.
That’s where Matt Diaz comes into the picture.
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution reports that the Yankees have shown some interest in the former Braves outfielder. He’s a free agent, and he seems to fit all the necessary criteria.
1. He hits lefties. With a switch hitter and two lefties in the starting lineup, the Yankees could use someone from the right side. They don’t necessarily need to setup a platoon, but adding a righty makes much more sense than adding a lefty and basically just as much sense as adding a switch hitter. Diaz is a right-handed hitter who’s hit lefties to the tune of a .335/.373/.533 slash line in his career. Even last season, in down year, Diaz had a .512 slugging percentage against lefties.
2. He’s not a bad everyday option. If someone gets hurt and the Yankees need a bench player to make regular starts, they could do worse than Diaz. He’s actually been at his best when’s seen regular playing time. He’s had more than 300 plate appearances in a season three times. Those have been his best years, hitting better than .300 with a .360-plus on-base percentage and a slugging percentage of .475 or better. As recently as 2009 he hit .313/.390/.488. Is he a sure thing? Of course not, but sure things don’t settle for bench roles.
3. He’s readily available. No need to get tricky here. Diaz is a free agent, having been non-tendered by the Braves after making $2.55 million last season. I don’t want to venture a guess at how much he might cost, but he wouldn’t cost anything in terms of prospects or young players. He’s not the only guy who fits the Yankees needs — and the Yankees surely aren’t the only team interested – but he at least seems like an option worth considering.
Interesting option
I’d prefer someone younger with more upside and better defensively.
Isn’t Scott Hairston out there?
Pat M.
I don’t like how this Jets game is beginning at all
_____________________
Groan
G. Love,
I present the Boston trade because I’m impressed by the quality of baseball discussion on this website.
It’s hot stove time and it is a trade that has merit.
Also because I’d like Boston management to man-up and take action that forces them to stop making excuses for about their just little old boston without Yankees resources…
They don’t have Yankee resources because they are afraid to go all in and reinvest 110% back into the the franchise the way George Steinbrenner did with the Yankees.
I want the Yanks to sock it to the Sox after they put on their bigboy underpants and go all in!
Too bad the Yanks can’t get a guy like Marcus Thames.
correct typo…
Also because I’d like Boston management to man-up and take action that forces them to stop making excuses like they are just little old boston without resources of big bad Yankees…
Those guys are few and far between Rich.
At least on the FA market, that is.
Travis Buck? Lastings Milledge?
Why would Werth sign with Washington? Unless he likes touring the Mall I don’t think the difference in money would have been that different from real contendors.
So one down and Crawford still out there. Rangers are making alot of noise that Lee may stay there. If Andy retires and Lee goes somewhere else, it’s going to be another questionable winter for the Yanks.
Diaz seems like a good option for the bench. No excuse for the Yanks not to load up the bench this season.
I’m sure there are other pieces out there, and the Yanks should sign a few of them.
GB mentioned Fred Lewis, who I also like, but he may have much more interest.
Still, Lewis would be a good fit for sure.
I still say Crawford to the Angels, maybe for 7/$133
Say what you want about Boras, but the guy gets his clients PAID.
he was smart to get Werth that deal and get it signed quickly.
“Why would Werth sign with Washington? Unless he likes touring the Mall I don’t think the difference in money would have been that different from real contendors.”
He probably got about 2 years and 35 million more dollars than anyone else would have given him. The Red Sox offered him 4 years.
Like Diaz’s right-handed triple slash. Now we’re talking, no Randy Winn here.
yankeefeminista December 6th, 2010 at 9:29 pm
Pat M.
I don’t like how this Jets game is beginning at all
____________________________________________________
I had a bad feeling also, 17-0 now and the Pats are firing on all cyclinders. Scared the heck out of me playing Jets D against Pats in FF so that much at least was a wise move not doing it.
BD,
I agree…I think Crawford will probably beat Werth’s deal, but not by nearly as much as is being speculated. Teams should just ignore the Werth deal, it really has nothing to do with the rest of the market. 7/130-140 is about as good as I can see him doing and it probably will be from the Angels (or maybe the Rangers if they miss on both Lee and Greinke)
My n-i-e-c-e saw Aroldis Chapman working out at The U gym with Alex today.
She texted her father, “Should I know who Chapman is?” He responded “Pitcher who throws 100. Be nice so he doesn’t throw anything at you.”
The amazing thing about Boras’ handling of the Werth deal is that he didn’t even have to make a public smoke screen about a mystery team that was bidding big dough…
Never lasted that long…
Actually, the mystery is why Nat’s put that offer on the table so quickly.
I just can’t see Moreno going home empty handed; I think Crawford and Soriano both are good fits with the Angels as many are predicting. I also think Greinke has definitely pitched his last game for Kansas City. Toronto or Texas, but maybe Minnesota is a dark horse.
WCYF,
I think the Angels get at least 2 of Crawford, Beltre, and Soriano and maybe all three.
wcyf….Angels will be big spenders this Christmas season…….Jets need a turnover right now…..
Tom Brady is good….how does Rex not challenge that?
Pat M. – the Jets are turning over my stomach right now….
referees
missed intentional grounding by Brady
missed hit to the head on Sanchez
missed clothesline on Keller going out to run a route
missed false start when Brady moved back before the ball was snapped
missed spot on Jets first drive on Keller catch to make 3rd and 1 instead of 3rd and inches
bailout pass interference on Eric Smith for 40 yards down to Jets 1. Also, it was incidental contact as Smith tripped.
miscalled the TD by Tate
rex
should never have had Folk take kick – that was the coward’s way out. gave them better field position
Sanchez couldnt execute a sneak
Eric Smith is a white loser that didnt bother to turn his head around on pass interference and try to make a play
Ryan used the challenge on the sneak play on 3rd and 1 by Sanchez, but chose not to challenge 7 points, the TD by Tate
Rex kissed Belichick’s rings. Too buys worrying about his next meal than coaching this game.
Wonder if this Fielder, Broxton/Loney thing is going to happen.
Hold on to the ball, Bray
Joe from Long Island…….I just lost my desire to finish my dinner……Oh the curse of Joe Willie Namath….You know Doc, I sat and froze my 16 year old butt that freezing December Day at Shea back in 68 and watched Namath bring the Jets back to punch out The Raiders and then 2 weeks later shock the world in The old Orange Bowl……Little did I know that it would be over 40 years of heartbreak over and over…..Rex is getting schooled tonight, as is Mark and his teammates……..Time for a big turnover
rex didn’t care to challenge 7 points. didnt care to go for 4th and 1 at the 50 yard line to give the ball back to a defense that hasnt stopped the pats all game long. biggest game of the year, punting on 4th and 1.
Pat M. December 6th, 2010 at 9:54 pm
Joe from Long Island…….I just lost my desire to finish my dinner……Oh the curse of Joe Willie Namath….You know Doc, I sat and froze my 16 year old butt that freezing December Day at Shea back in 68 and watched Namath bring the Jets back to punch out The Raiders and then 2 weeks later shock the world in The old Orange Bowl……Little did I know that it would be over 40 years of heartbreak over and over…..Rex is getting schooled tonight, as is Mark and his teammates……..Time for a big turnover
______
We need 7 to have any chance. At least Schotty will have to throw the ball now. Maybe even on 2nd down. Imagine that.
Per Pete Abe:
“Epstein did not rule out Adrian Beltre, saying anything was possible. But he said Kevin Youkilis is the third baseman and there are no plans to play him in left field.”
So Beltre is still in play… If Boston re-signs him… what does that say about Youkilis’s future in beantown?
whats wrong with the jet punter?
i doubt that the sox can sign beltre.
it’s going to be a big spend. they would need to move a beckett or a lackey to afford that type of a player.
i think the angels sign him
Maybe Ryan has resigned himself to the act that Lee is headed to NY. He’s checking out other left handed starter options like Jeff Francis.
act = fact
Boston has the resources but they’d rather make big money than break-even and win a championship.
GMAN,
what odds do you want that Youkilis isn’t getting traded?
there is no chance.
give it up already!
1. Pat M. – To be a Jets’ fan is to know disappointment, over and over and over again. The season’s far from over for Gang Green, but, tonight is definitely an education.
2. Youkilis is not going to LF. He’s either the 3B, or he’s gone. From Boston’s track record, I would not rule out them trading him. They seem to regard all players as temps.
There’s a better chance that Beltre ends up in Anaheim than Boston.
Pat M
Have you seen The Big Shamrock play this year?
He has looked good so far.
BD (Boston Dave) December 6th, 2010 at 10:07 pm
GMAN,
what odds do you want that Youkilis isn’t getting traded?
there is no chance.
give it up already!
*************
BD,
i agree. Boston would be crazy to get rid of him<especially as beloved as he seems to be with the fans
beltre would fit well out in anaheim
Ken_Rosenthal
Cliff Lee market headed toward seven years – if it’s not there already. http://tinyurl.com/2el6ee4 #Yankees #Rangers #Nationals #MLB 5 minutes ago via web
MaineYankee…..You must be referring to the Diesel , my man Shaq !!!! He’s doing well for The Celtics and if used smartly and I think Doc Rivers will , he could be a factor come May and early June when they square off vs. The Lakers for the NBA Championship…..
“Lee will receive a seven-year offer, according to Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports. At least one club has suggested they’re willing to offer a seven-year deal. ”
http://www.mlbtraderumor.com
the only 7 year offer may come from the Nats or something like that.
Rangers 4-5
Yankees maybe 6.
That’s all that matters.
Werth may not care but Lee seems like he wants the big stage.
Yankees haven’t come this far with Lee to drop it because of one year,
Pats making the Jets look like chumps. Wonder what big mouth Rex is thinking.
I’ll believe a team is offering 7 years when Lee signs the contract.
It sounds like an intentionally planted leak to the media and par for the course during the winter meetings.
GB….I agree with you, the Yankees are a great need of the pinpoint tossing lefty, or it’s going to be a dicey few years without him….By then, A-rod, Jeter, Rivera will be toast…..A dark Satdium in October translates into many millions of dollars…..Many million of dollars
I have a feeling Lee signs with Yankees tonight……
Ken_Rosenthal Source: #Yankees do not plan to offer Lee seven years. #Rangers #MLB
Ken_Rosenthal Source: #Yankees do not plan to offer Lee seven years. #Rangers #MLB
__
Yankees not going 7 and Rangers apparently not even going to 5-6.
If Lee really wants 7, he will have to play for a team like the Nats.
DocTodd,
I kinda hope you’re wrong.
If he actually did sign tonight (I don’t think he will), it’s because the Yankees made a ridiculously high offer that Lee simply couldn’t turn down or even shop to other teams.
I wouldn’t lose sleep over it, because Lee in pinstripes is a good thing, but I don’t see it happening quite yet.
BD,
Ok but when it happens… It won’t be a surprise!
Now onto the main event…
Getting Cliff Lee in pinstripes with a cap sporting the interlocking NY…
Toeing the mound situated in the very epicenter of the baseball universe…
That beautiful ball orchard in the Bronx, U.S.A.
Yankee Stadium !!!!!
So far in December:
Rosenthal has had around 125 tweets and maybe 3 of them had merit.
it’s just gibberish to me
yankees will offer 5 and go to 6 and it will be done. Call Mrs. Sabathia and find your home in NJ.
Rosenthal was way off with the Gonzalez talk yesterday…..
At the time I knew going for the 50 yarder even with the wind could prove to be costly…..However the Patriots came in with a dogmeat defense and the Jets with the best ( give or take ) the best defense…..Time to say goodbye to several benji’s…….
Can further @Ken_Rosenthal report, #Yankees have internally said 7 yrs is dealbreaker with Lee, would go to 6, perhaps, to finish off a deal 6 minutes ago via TweetDeck Retweeted by 13 people
Joelsherman1
Joel Sherman
Joelsherman1 Can further @Ken_Rosenthal report, #Yankees have internally said 7 yrs is dealbreaker with Lee, would go to 6, perhaps, to finish off a deal
Pat M. December 6th, 2010 at 10:40 pm
GB….I agree with you, the Yankees are a great need of the pinpoint tossing lefty, or it’s going to be a dicey few years without him….By then, A-rod, Jeter, Rivera will be toast…..A dark Satdium in October translates into many millions of dollars…..Many million of dollars
———————————————————————————————————————-
After Lee, there’s nothing else on the FA market and I can’t see them wasting young talent on junk. If they get Lee, NYYs could deal with a rookie in the #5 spot if Pettitte doesn’t return. If that’s the case, I can see them going all out for Crawford and possibly Upton. With Lee and Pettitte, they could bury Arizona in young pitching. One good young arm that everyone seems to disregard in the yankee system is DJ Mitchell.
Forget Lee if he’s going to get 7 years – that’s ridiculous and it should be a deal breaker. I said yesterday the Nats would go there…………….and if Lee is so willing to wait a few years to win and he takes an offer, then good luck to him.
Why are people thinking Lee will sign with the Yankees if they are unwilling to go seven years and the Nats are? Haven’t we all agreed he would follow the most money? If this information is true, plan B awaits.
Everyone is negotiating through the media. Ignore it.
Everyone is negotiating through the media. Ignore it.
we said most money from a contender.
Joelsherman1
No formal sitdown between #Yankees and Braunecker tonight, just a chat between Cashman and Lee’s agt 4 minutes ago via ÜberTwitter
What’s the difference….what are they talking about their golf games tonight…..
An extra year in Lee’s case will probably mean an extra 20+ mil.
I don’t think anyone leaves that kind of money on the table.
Don Meredith would be singing early tonight- RIP
Rich,
Everyone is negotiating through the media.
What should we do?
Is this the same Rosenthal that wore a bow tie throught the WS that we are talking about. Guy seems a little out of touch for me to pay attention to.
I’m confused.
Who said the Nationals are offering 7 years???
The Nats are focused on American Idle
no one said that, but we assume if there is a 7 year, it isnt coming from the Yankees or Rangers.
“What should we do?”
You know that Bret, but based on some of these posts, not everyone seems to realize that.
“Forget Lee if he’s going to get 7 years – that’s ridiculous and it should be a deal breaker.”
What top pitcher will the Yankees get if they don’t get Lee?
Yankees will figure it out.
The Yankees have no choice but to match or better the high offer. I have yet to hear a plan B. If there is one, it would have to include losing many of our young, cost controlled, minor league prospects in a trade and even then, there is no sure thing deal out there for a quality pitcher. Which is worse? Spending another $23 million or dealing with that.
i dont believe any of what the media puts out there, but if GB says that one year wont be a dealbreaker for the Yankees, then it must be true ; )
If I was a betting man and I believed a word Rosenthal was saying, I would put my money on the Orioles as the club he is referring to.
But I don’t buy any team is going 7. I wouldn’t be surprised by a 6 year offer from the O’s though.
Rich,
The Yankees say they won’t go 7 years…but they’re just negotiating through the media, forcing other teams to stop at 7. Then they’ll surprise and slide in that 7th year at the last minute.
What’s the difference between a diminished Lee at 38 and a diminished Lee at 39?
Not much.
Kind of a bummer for Pujols…
He’s coming up on free agency and no big market teams will be in mix to bid for his services.
RMS, probably none, but you have to draw the line somewhere. I barely want to give him 6; 7 is unacceptable.
Betsy,
7 is gonna happen.
Just load up a six year contract…….
THis is obviously just talk on this blog, no one knows the veracity of the information. But it’s worth considering as Yankee fans. What if another team gives Lee 7 years and we say no? What is plan B.
Question.
What would you rather have, Lee at 7 years
OR
Trade for Greinke
Cashman has a plan B, whether he tells the world what it is or not.
6/140
“What’s the difference between a diminished Lee at 38 and a diminished Lee at 39?”
Bret
Depending on the rest of the payroll, the terms of the CBA at the time, their ability to produce in house talent, an so on, it may be that their ability to replace him, if necessary, could be limited at some point.
If you don’t think that their financial flexibility will ever be an issue, why not sign him until 40 or 41?
At some point, you have to draw lines.
Teams other than the Rangers or Nationals who could offer seven years to Lee and pay him:
(1) Orioles – had the money and resources to go eight years to Teixeira two seasons ago – is this the big splash to counter the Nationals big signing in their Maryland/D.C. rivalry
(2) Detroit – plenty of money coming off the books and not adverse to giving primetime talent seven years (Cabrera received an eight year deal)
(3) Angels – again plenty of money to spend – but are they looking more at Crawford, Beltre, and Soriano – and wasn’t Dan Haren their big acquisition
(4) Sox – a sleeping giant – and they can afford him and given the Gonzales trade – not totally adverse to seven years – gave Lackey five years – acquiring Lee would essentially lock up the AL East for them for at least the next three seasons . . . and drive a stake through the hearts of our beloved Yankees
(5) people keep saying the Phillies – but do they have the resources – I guess – but seven years???
keep adding as you see fit – Cubs are one of the wealthiest teams – but the financial situation with them is fuzzy. Mets are already out even though they possess deep pockets.
I think Detroit is going to get Crawford. Book it.
What would you rather have, Lee at 7 years
OR
Trade for Greinke
–
Lee.
Exactly…that’s why the Yankees will give Lee 7 years.
Plan B is a bigger risk.
Greinke would have a meltdown in NY. Too much pressure.
Definitely Lee
At some point in the process, Lee has to show that he wants to be a Yankee, that the chance to win the WS every year matters, and that their could be more ancillary income in NY as well.
Pettitte is going to be 39 years old this year. I don’t hear anyone complaining about his age. So what if Lee is 39 at the end? If you get a good 5-6 years from him, it’s worth it.
Neither.
Lee will go to the highest bidder – that much I can be certain of at this juncture.
Pettitte is going to be 39 years old this year. I don’t hear anyone complaining about his age. So what if Lee is 39 at the end? If you get a good 5-6 years from him, it’s worth it.
______
Pettitte isnt making 25 Million per year.
Rich, agreed.
“Pettitte is going to be 39 years old this year. I don’t hear anyone complaining about his age.”
Well yeah, he produced at a high level at 38. How many pitchers in MLB history have done that?
“Question.
What would you rather have, Lee at 7 years
OR
Trade for Greinke”
——————
Lee, and it’s not even close.
Lee has been a dominant, Cy Young winning pitcher for a while now… including shutdown playoff performances.
Greinke would cost considerable prospects and has several BIG question marks. He was not good this season and there’s concern of his ability to handle pitching in NY.
It’s not even close for me.
If you had to choose one of those 2, it’s Lee.
Agree with West Coast – you go to seven years on Lee – lefties age well – Pettitte pitched well this past year at a similar age to when Lee’s contract would be ending – and Lee is a better pitcher than Pettitte in comparable ages of 32 – no reason not to believe Lee would age well. If it is just a matter of years – take it – just as we have with C.C. and A.J. and others before them – that is that tax of swimming with the big primetime FAs – have to do it. Only costs you money, not prospects or talent.
“Pettitte is going to be 39 years old this year. I don’t hear anyone complaining about his age. So what if Lee is 39 at the end? If you get a good 5-6 years from him, it’s worth it.”
————————–
Getting 5 to 6 good years is an extremely questionable proposition as it is.
Pat M. December 6th, 2010 at 11:13 pm
Just load up a six year contract…….
———————————————————————————————————————-
$23 mil per @6 years with GG and Cy Young incentives along with an opt out after 4 years?
it’s different to pay a guy 10 Mil at 39 years old than 25 Mil.
6 years + option which vests if Lee wins 2 Cy Youngs or places in Top 5 4 times.
Chad wrote: He’s actually been at his best when’s seen regular playing time.
Maybe it’s the other way round. That is, maybe he’s been given regular playing time during those seasons when he’s been at this best.
from end of reg season I stated Lee wasn’t coming here and Andy was going to retire…….this happens it will put them in a big hole……..
no more opt outs please.
Betsy December 6th, 2010 at 11:18 pm
Neither.
*******
How is “neither” an option?
Ah the mystical mystery team with the 7 yr offer…
Always in the shadows whispering to baseball reporters…
every yr at this time.
Mystery Team…mystery team… reveal thyself !
I made it an option, Brett.
LOL, Jets. nuff said
I may be missing someone, so correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe RA Di ck ey was the only pitcher above 35 to throw enough innings to qualify last season.
I think I give Lee what he wants. If 7 years gets the deal done then I do it.
I don’t think Cliff Lee wants to sign a contract past his expiration date. Does he really want to be collecting 20+ million as a long man in his later years?
I think the guy plans on pitching effectively into his late 30′s. With the kind of control and movement he can put on the ball I don’t doubt he could last that long.
Andy was a fantastic pitcher last year. The Yankees would happily take him back if he wanted to return.
If the pitcher knows how to pitch and isn’t just a power thrower they can have longevity in the league.
I think 6 will get it done though. I don’t see many teams willing to pony up that kind of guarantee at the kind of dollars it will take to sign Lee.
If the 7th year is a sticking point you offer him the option year for year 7 where he gets money if we choose not to keep him. If that doesn’t work, you guarantee the year and be done with it.
This guy is a fantastic pitcher. The opportunities to acquire someone like him are going to be few and far between. He’s not a pure power thrower so his stuff may slow down a lick but he’ll still be effective.
I don’t think Lee wants to stay in Texas at all. I think he wants the best deal for the longest term. We should give it to him. No one is going to make a trade with us like SD just made with Boston. We’re not getting gifted anything.
Our money is our only advantage. We need to use it since no other team is out there trying to help us in any way, shape or form.
GB….That could be the ticket, especially with the escape clause…..Cliff Lee does want to pitch for the Yanks …..Yanks need to stay in the ballpark and he’ll come to the Bronx…..The other alternative of not having Lee is not so good….
Betsy December 6th, 2010 at 11:27 pm
I made it an option, Brett.
********
Lee’s agent would have you cornered.
Lee’s agent HAS you cornered…if your only option is no option.
If you get a good Lee for 4 of 6 years I take it (under the assumption that 4 good years of Lee = 3 World Championships
) and don’t mind eating the money in the last two years. 7 years? That might be pushing it but I wonder what the dollar/year ratio would be. I think the Yanks offer more money in less years if that’s what it takes.
Yankees starters if Andy retires
CC
Hughes
AJ
?
?
Yankees will sign Lee
# RMS December 6th, 2010 at 11:33 pm
Yankees starters if Andy retires
CC
Hughes
AJ
?
?
Yankees will sign Lee
**************
This is based on normal AJ will appear. I am troubled.
People keep pushing the goalposts in terms of “if you get a good X number of years for Lee then it is worth it”
A year ago it was 3 or 4, so you go 5.
Then it became 4 or 5, so you go 6.
Now it is 5 or 6, so you go 7.
Lee is not Benjamin Button. He hasn’t gotten any younger in the past year.
ac1 I am talking about a pitcher being effective at the age of 38-39.
Sabathia Hughes and Burnett and ???
I’m just asking. What do you do if you let Lee walk.
7 years.
I’m SURE I’m alone on this, but iff Pavano would sign for one year, I’d take him.
WCYF…..???? = A Dark Yankee Stadium come October….That means a very large loss of money…..I wish CB and SJ were available to assist in the financial loss when the Stadium is empty come the postseason……It’s more than that 7 th year we’re bickering about I’d say
With your willingness to add that pivotal 7th year you push concessions with it – deferments in the early years that satisfy the roster’s salary schedule. You push for slightly lower AAV than the one in your 6 tear offer. You use this wiggle room to squeeze in Crawford.
Bret, I would go the 7, but only because I have absolutely NO interest in trading top prospects for a pitcher who is somewhat overrated IMO and who has issues………..
However, as I’ve said, I’d rather struggle than give Lee 7 years.
I agree, that’s clear. The Yankees reap enormous financial gains when they are in the post season. Additional home games at premium ticket prices, inflated costs for YES commercials, merchandise sales, concessions, etc.
Lee isn’t measured on how many good seasons he gives you – he’s measured on how many championships we can win with him as opposed to without him. CC, Lee, Hughes, AJ, Andy (yes, I think he comes back)… thats not a guarantee but it makes your playoff rotation look mighty scary if you get there.
If he wants the Yankees so much, he won’t force them to go to 7 years. I think he’d prefer TX, but I admit I’m not sure. In any case, I don’t think he cares where he pitches…….
Who is overrated?
Jesus. MLB needs to get that giggling idiot Millar off the air.
“I think he’d prefer TX”
I don’t, and if I believed that, I wouldn’t want him for free.
Betsy December 6th, 2010 at 11:42 pm
Bret, I would go the 7, but only because I have absolutely NO interest in trading top prospects for a pitcher who is somewhat overrated IMO and who has issues………..
*******
Of course! Lee’s agent knows that. He knows Greinke is your plan B. He knows the questions about Greinke’s makeup. He knows about the meltdown factor. He knows the cost in prospects it will take to get him and he knows how having those prospects for other trades (like Upton) changes the whole dynamic of the team on the field and its ability to win championships. He knows Werth got 7 years and Werth is not even top dog.
7 years.
You may miss the playoffs more often or get bounced early in the playoffs over the next 7 years by having Lee than not having Lee.
I have a feeling Lee is a Nat by Wednesday morning
Greinke is not a plan B. I dont’ know what the plan B would “b”, but you still can’t sell your soul for him. I would not do that.
How do you figure that LGY?
Betsy, why so pragmatic ??? I understand the Devil’s Advocate role, but why always so dark ????
Plan B usually sucks.
Let’s stick with plan A. Cashman’s good at plan A.
Betsy December 6th, 2010 at 11:49 pm
Greinke is not a plan B. I dont’ know what the plan B would “b”, but you still can’t sell your soul for him. I would not do that.
********
Maybe not, but all the other Plan B’s are WORSE or RISKIER!!!
Lee’s agent knows this. That’s the market. Worse options and WORST options.
Lee wants 7 years…why do you think his agent’s first move was to pull out the Jamie Moyer comp?
Plan A is be the high bidder for Cliff Lee. Period.
Good grief. Betsy is ALWAYS dark and negative.
She’d probably find something negative about saving a child from being hit by a car.
Six years was always going to happen for Lee. There was no way around it.
Braunecker’s job in these negotiation is to get that 7nth year and to get it from the yankees.
These now constant leaks from Lee’s side coupled with his refusal to hear offers are their attempt to set the “ground rules” so to speak for the negotiations to come.
This emergence of a team willing to offer a 7nth year after all of these leaks about Lee wanting to go back to Texas if he gets a 6th year is trying to up the ante before the negotiations start.
It’s interesting to see the yankees immediately leak in response that they won’t go to seven years. I don’t think they are taking this report of a team willing to go seven years as substantiated as of yet. They wouldn’t just dismiss it out of hand if they thought it was serious.
They’re just trying to send a message to Lee and his camp regarding the kind of parameters they’re willing to go to.
The Yankees offer 5 initially. Lee says he wants 7. Lee will need a tangible offer in hand to get that 7nth year.
Greinke is not coming to New York. The Yankees do not want him. He will be traded to Toronto or Texas probably but not here.
“How do you figure that LGY?”
————————
You have a number of contracts 3+ years from now dedicated to declining or ineffective players.
It is a decent possibility that 4 or 5 years from now that the Yankees have $46+ million committed to 2 injured or ineffective pitchers in CC and Lee.
There is a point at which the Yankee resources can’t overcome a number of bad contracts.
Wasn’t it just least week that Braunecker said that they weren’t looking for Sabathia’s contract?
Pat M, how am I dark? In any case, being a pessimist or realist does not make one a worse fan than someone who is optimistic. My opinion is just that, an opinion – those who say he will sign here have their opinions as well, but who’s to say they are right?
CB,
You seem to have some inside knowledge. How do you think this plays out? Do the Nats offer Lee 7 years out of nowhere?
If Cashman says no to 7 years if that’s what it takes, it will be very interesting to see what he does next. I have no clue.
LGY joining Betsy on the dark side of the moon.
Who knew?
LGY, and the thing is, Cash was trying to get away from bad contracts. Now we have several of them………with maybe one more on the way.
LGY – Possible, no question about that.
They are not bad contracts yet, not one of them. That is all speculative.
WCYF,
Don’t you get it…they will BE bad contracts…and then Earth…God save our planet…will BLOW UP
The Yankees have two potentially bad contracts: A-Rod and Jeter.
One, Cash was out of the loop, and two, they had little choice given a small but vociferous segment of the fanbase, and they lmiited their exposure the best they could, at least from their perspective.
Frankly, I’m not that concerned about 4-5 years from now…..This club is about winning now and for the next 3 years while the big contracts ( Alex, Jeter , Rivera, Posada even Texeria ) can still pull their weight…….Good to see you here CB….Any clue as to how much money the Yankee generate when they play in October ???? I thought I read that not playing in 2008 cost the club somewhere in the area of 25 million ….Can that be right ???/
I’m in the market for a pop tent trailer or a small camper trailer to go camping. I looked into these teardrop trailers http://www.golittleguy.com/teardrops/.
Ever seen them?
Yeah well they’re 10k. 10 GRAND!!! You can’t even stand up in the thing. No fridge. No AC, no Heating unit, no bathroom.
So I figure I’ll just buy a camper shell to fit on the bed of my pickup truck.
I checked today and they carpet the interior of the shell and it has windows and acts like a camper.
$1,400 bux to turn my pickup into a camper.
To clarify, I still do not doubt Lee will be a Yankee.
Lee will be wearing pinstripes, but it won’t be for the next 7 years.
I agree with LGY.
The AAV will be high though.
“That means a very large loss of money…..I wish CB and SJ were available to assist in the financial loss when the Stadium is empty come the postseason……It’s more than that 7 th year we’re bickering about I’d say”
Pat M.-
I know that in the old stadium each home playoff game for the Yankees generated 2M in additional revenue for the club. But that was the old stadium. It’s only been 2 years in the new stadium so it’s a small sample so it’s still tough to gauge how much more playoff revenue each game generates but we can guesstimate.
When the yankees moved in to the new stadium they raised ticket prices around 75% compared to the old stadium. Then there’s the additional money in parking and concessions in the new park.
I’d estimate every home playoff game for the yankees generates at least 4M in stadium related revenues.
The TV money is more complicated and I’m not exactly sure how that filters back to the team.
And of course the playoff (and regular season) stadium related revenue from 2009 was likely biased downward due to the economy.
While the overall economy is still struggling terribly Wall Street is once again absolutely flush with cash and huge bonuses being paid out again I’m sure the 2010 revenues, especially for the playoff games was higher than in 2009.
The Yankees should probably raise their ticket prices again next season for the premium seats from a business standpoint. They may not do so for political reasons but there’s more than enough money in NY to sell those seats as they originally envisioned.
“The Yankees have two potentially bad contracts: A-Rod and Jeter.”
When did AJ Burnett become a good contract? He’s going to make more than Jeter. This fixation on Jeter is just strange.
My bad, AJ too.
I must have repressed it.
If it’s 6, but $140M or more
is that much better than say, 7/$152M?
If it really comes down to a 7th year, fine, but the AAV goes down by about a mil.
Or defer some $ and get creative.
I still say the Yanks sign Lee for 6/$141
“This fixation on Jeter is just strange.”
I missed this part.
Your projection is stranger.
If AJ Burnett tanks next year, then it will be a bad contract. Its on the fence for now. He could salvage it.
There is a difference between a bad contract and a bad year or two on a contract.
For example, I doubt we look back at the end of CC’s contract and say it was a bad contract. But in the last couple of years of the contract it is possible there is a bad year or two in there.
The problem will arise not necessarily from too many “bad contracts,” but too many bad years whether because of injury or ineffectiveness overlapping.
LGY……Much like the 2010 campaign ???
coney1-
I have absolutely no insider information. I just follow the game an have a general sense of the business side in terms of revenue.
It’s really hard to believe how much money baseball generates. And those revenue streams are likely going to increase in the future. I’d guess baseball will gross more than 7 billions next season. 7 billion split amongst roughly 30 teams.
Every team is flush with cash. The nationals draw 10K people per game and they have a lousy TV deal thanks to Angelos but even they can offer Werth 7yrs/ 126M.
It’s possible that a team will offer Lee 7 years in an conscious “overpay” to try to attract a player of his caliber to a non-competitive team.
The O’s could absolutely do it. The Nats could as well. The mariners probably could.
It’s really a matter of whether they will because that’s a significant amount of risk to carry.
It’s hard to know how it will play out. My sense right now is that this leak on 7 years is just trying to set up teams to bid against a “mystery” team when Brauneker is finally “ready” to start hearing offers.
The only problem with giving Lee seven years is that Sabathia will almost assuredly opt out and what’s he gonna want? 9 or 10 years?
One more thing to consider is the addition of another playoff team.
It will be easier to make the playoffs when that goes into effect.
Additionally, unless you win the division make long playoff runs thus more revenue will be more difficult if you qualify as a wildcard.
“If AJ Burnett tanks next year, then it will be a bad contract. Its on the fence for now. He could salvage it”
It was bad the day he signed it. It’s been loss mitigation since. He’s been a little less than OK in that regard.
*making*
“The only problem with giving Lee seven years is that Sabathia will almost assuredly opt out and what’s he gonna want? 9 or 10 years?”
Same 6-7 Lee gets, I’d imagine. Hard to imagine him not opting out at this point. Also hard to imagine the Yankees won’t be prepared for it.
Speaking only for myself, the reason I think A-Rod’s contract has the potential to be be bad is the number of years given the age he will be in the later stages of the contract.
With Jeter, I think the reason the contract has the potential to bad is his production in two of the last three years and his position. IOW, where else can he play if his OPS doesn’t approach .800 in light of the age he will be?
Obviously, Jeter just signed his, so most reasonable people should be able to understand that it’s topical.
To call it a fixation is amusing though.
It was bad the day he signed it. It’s been loss mitigation since. He’s been a little less than OK in that regard.
–
Yea but if he just performs well it goes from inevitable bad contract to ok signing! We won the WS and his contract falls in the 5 year rule for complaining.
I think if he can manage 3 good seasons, 1 mediocre season, and 1 awful season he should be able to save it! Only 2 more good seasons and 1 mediocre season to go!
Whether or not CC opts out is really going to depend on the overall package Lee gets. Whether he gets it from the Yankees or another team is secondary. It’s the market conditions that will set the context.
And Lee is looking to redefine the market given his age.
It will be interesting to see how the addition of another playoff team will impact team construction, if it has any impact at all.
But I suspect it will to some level.
Mell, I would be shocked if CC opted out; I really don’t think he will
JF:
I think he owes us 3 good seasons.
Thought ’09, when he led the league in walks, wild pitches, and allowed 13 baserunners per 9, or in his case 9 baserunners per 5 2/3, was decidedly mediocre.
I don’t think CC will formally opt out. I wouldn’t be surprised, however, if he and the Yankees announce that a year or two has been added to the contract.
Betsy:
I think it would be bad business for him not to. He’ll be younger than Lee is now and capitalizing on an opportunity to turn his 4 remaining years into 6 or 7. He’d be crazy not to, especially if Lee gets 6-7 years this offseason.
Rich:
If not for the Yankees history of doing nothing like that, I’d agree with you.
Yankees playing October has a direct relationship to it’s overall worth in the eyes of Forbes for instance….The October payoffs go beyond what the ticket sales generate…Of course it’s just numbers on a spreadsheet, but the NY Yankees market value leaped after winning the World Series in 2009, regardless of how much their mortgage payments are……..October baseball starring the NY Yankees is a bonanza and not only for the Yanks , The Bronx, The City of NYC……Bottom line, much like it was 2 years ago, Cliff Lee is a vital commodity for the Bombers……It’s an expensive money machine that requires expensive tune-ups……Rebuilding and winning at the same time is a most difficult task……
Mell…..welcome to the LoHud ???
Mell
Do you think they would prefer if CC opted out?
That could be another lesson that they learned from the A-Rod opt-out fiasco.
It’s an expensive money machine that requires expensive tune-ups
————
Nice line Pat
Rich:
I don’t. Just like I don’t think they wanted to go 4 years on Posada, when they had they had the opportunity to extend him a couple years while still under contract. Historically, they’ve let their players hit free agency. I agree it would make sense to offer him a couple extra years, but it hasn’t been their style.
“Rebuilding and winning at the same time is a most difficult task……”
I think the single hardest part is to show young players patience. Of course, falling to do so almost ensures an overall team decline at some point.
Thought ‘09, when he led the league in walks, wild pitches, and allowed 13 baserunners per 9, or in his case 9 baserunners per 5 2/3, was decidedly mediocre.
–
Pitched the biggest game of the WS and won though! Good season!
(Ignore the 6 ER in the other one)
Jerkface……Two years ago I was very pro AJ joining the Yanks….I thought he had turned the corner in addition I viewed his presence in the Rotation as being vital for the club to succeed in 09…..I must admit I’ve always been dazzled and blinded by his arm….I still maintain that at some point he’s going to turn in an eye popping season before he leaves the Bronx…….He came out of camp just on fire and then he lost a wheel or two……Still say he was the better choice over Lowe…..There’s a payoff that awaits us with AJ Burnett…
I don’t think CC opts out. The purpose of the clause is to provide an escape for CC in case he didn’t like New York. He does.
Of course, there’s always a chance that CC breaks his Gentleman’s Agreement with Cashman to get more money. If he does, I think Cashman lets him go just like he wanted to do with A-Rod.
And if CC does go, no harm no foul. We got 4 years of his prime.
Mell
Two years agao, Cash convinced Hal that they should learn from the mistake they made in 2004 when they didn’t sign Beltran because Bernie had a year left on his contract, and that led to accelerating the expiration of future contracts to find the money to sign Teixeira.
They may learn from their past mistakes yet again.
Pat M. every Yankee fan everywhere hopes that is true. But. You knew a but was coming right?
IT’S AJ FREAKIN’ BURNETT!
“New York Yankees’ fans can rejoice, their star left-handed pitcher C.C. Sabathia has no intention on leaving the Bronx. According to Mark Hale, Sabathia told the New York Post that he won’t “even consider” becoming a free agent after 2011, even though his contract allows him to opt-out.
“I’m here,” Sabathia said. “Hundred percent.”
“I think you know I’ve built a house here, right?” he said. “My kids go to school here. We live here year round. So I’m not going anywhere.”
What WCYF said.
WCYF…..Fenway Park May 2009, the mother of all meltdowns
If somehow Rosenthal’s report is true, keep in mind he did not specify the $ in addition to the years.
For example, this mystery team may be willing to offer 7/140 ($20 million a year).
A 6/140 offer is more attractive than that.
So if by some chance a 7 year offer does exist, it does not necessarily mean it is more lucrative than a Yankee 6 year offer.
I’m still standing by my prediction.
Lee to Yankees for 6/140.
RSM….I think that could be the number….Blake threw out that earlier as well….Just load up on a 6 year deal just may get it done…..Hopefully this will be the last time they need to spend so much for frontline pitching……..Shame Joba didn’t work out
I’m not writing Joba off just yet. I hope the Yankees don’t either.
Write him off?
At this point Joba might be lucky if the Yankees don’t bump him off.
Two key quotes from Cashman:
“My whole day has been on a number of different players,” he said. “Some you probably wouldn’t think would be on our radar. We covered a lot of ground today to try to assess expected value and see if it matches up with something we’re trying to do.”
“I have to control our costs”
Let me say this. First, Lee is not getting 7 years. I firmly believe he’ll be offered a 5 year/$110MM deal initially. 6 years at the same AAV is an option, but Cashman will pack up and walk out at 7. I really believe that. Further, I believe that if Lee is given a dime over CC’s AAV, plus matching years, CC will opt out. I know I would, even if just to renegotiate.
Second, I’d think that Cashman was exploring every option, except maybe Pavano, which is why his comment that “some you probably wouldn’t think were on our radar” struck me as interesting. That’s Pavano. He’s the only one I wouldn’t think would be on their radar. Could we be in for a return as an option for Pettitte if he does retire? My head spins with the mere thought.
Third, Greinke isn’t coming to NYC. We’ve been down that road with those without the ‘temperment’ for New York: Kevin Brown and Randy Johnson, both talented individuals in their own right, couldn’t hack it here. Not happening.
Last, there is a Plan B. And Cashman will probably rappel down another building bringing with him someone we never thought was a realistic possibility. But based on his history: Swisher, Marte, Nady, Berkman and Wood, it’s going to happen. None of us thought that any of those names would be in pinstripes, and yet they were.
Nothing surprises me with Cashman/Elf anymore.
I wouldn’t put mid-season salary dump/rentals like Berkman and Wood in quite the same category as surprise trades like Swisher and Granderson.
And the ‘radar’ remark could refer to trades as well as free agents. As in, not Pavano.
Please, not Pavano.
Fair point Nick.
And I agree, Please, not Pavano!
Pavano? Not a chance. That’d be like bringing Javier Vazquez ba… Oh.
I wonder what KC would want from Cashman for Grenkie, and then send The KC Royal pitcher off to Arizona for Upton….Certainly they’re would be some moving parts to make this happy……arozona suddenly has a very nice rotation, Saunders, Kennedy and Grenkie……Similar to the Granderson / Jackson / Coke deal ladt winter,,,,,
In was mentioned last night that Kevin Towers was going after pitching,,,,Well he loaded up in the bullpen, so maybe it’s time he looks at stsrters……It could be a start to obtaing Upton……
“I don’t think CC will formally opt out. I wouldn’t be surprised, however, if he and the Yankees announce that a year or two has been added to the contract.”
That would go against their current practice of not negotiating until the contract has expired.
incarceratedbob
**BREAKING NEWS** Yankees go 7Years & Cliff Lee is on verge of becoming #2 starter in the Bronx -Seems like Lee wants 2 give Texas last call
Could this be true??
incarceratedbob
**BREAKING NEWS** NY YANKEES are on the verge of signing Cliff Lee to a 7 Year Contract for approx 160 Million – Deal is almost done
No No No No No
It’s incarceratedbob
No no no no.
Why is bob incarcerated?
Heyman says: Yanks plannig to.offer 6, don’t want to go 7 because CC was 4 years younger when his deal was done.
Says Pujols wants Arod money.
Good morning…or as good a morning as it can be when you have to shovel out your driveway to leave for work 6 AM
7 is too long IMO, and no one else will give him that long of a contract
Pujols deserves Arod $$$
# upstate kate December 7th, 2010 at 8:07 am
Good morning…or as good a morning as it can be when you have to shovel out your driveway to leave for work 6 AM
7 is too long IMO, and no one else will give him that long of a contract
Pujols deserves Arod $$$
No one deserves an A-Rod contract. Including A-Rod.
MystiqueAura December 7th, 2010 at 5:56 am
Could this be true??
incarceratedbob
**BREAKING NEWS** NY YANKEES are on the verge of signing Cliff Lee to a 7 Year Contract for approx 160 Million – Deal is almost done
“““““““““““““““`
Funny but’s it’s doubtful that Cashman stayed up all night to hammer out a deal. Wait ’til he has breakfast and starts business for the day.
incarceratedbob is the jack-ass who had Girardi going to the Cubs and Lebron to the Knicks.
The Cards may have to reach a compromise and give pujols arod money for a shorter term……like 5/150 or 6/180. I don’t know but as great a player as he is, there is a point where the contract would hurt the Cards more than he helps them on the field.
**BREAKING NEWS** NY YANKEES are on the verge of signing Cliff Lee to a 7 Year Contract for approx 160 Million – Deal is almost done
is this true at all or did i get my hopes up for no reason?
Remember Pete’s primer on trade rumors?
We could use that again.
upstate kate December 7th, 2010 at 8:07 am
Good morning…or as good a morning as it can be when you have to shovel out your driveway to leave for work 6 AM
******************
Brrrrrrrrrrrrr! i am just north of albany, but all we had were flurries last night.
Sherman says the Yanks will max out at 6/144-150. 6/150 would be tough for any team to match even if they added a 7th year……that’s an AAV of 25 million.
“guys that you WOULDN’T think would be on our radar”.
Hmmm ?
I am not happy if takes 7 to get Lee. Hope it doesn’t.
Matt Diaz for the bench, etc. Excellent idea.
Incarcereated Bob is at it again??
I feel your pain Kate. It’s been snowing here in Syracuse since Saturday.
Calling Andy Pettitte. Calling Andy Pettitte.
It would be good if you return. Your presence is requested.
JCPD-
Maybe you should trade your vehicle in for an Arctic Cat ?
Which would be worse from a Yankee stand point……6/150 or 7/154, and is the difference between those two a deal breaker. Of course a 7th year could mean 7/161 as well but the question is, how much more would the Yankees have to pay against the luxury tax with the higher AAV and would a 7 year year deal at a lower AAV actually be cheaper in the long run?
Swish, Joba, Banuelos, Betances, and Romine for Upton.
Who hangs up first ? Towers or Cash ?
MTU, that might not be a bad idea. No smart a** remarks, but my new toy should be here today!!
JEKIKASO/JCPD
we probably have about 6-8 inches of light fluffy stuff…not even enough to close schools, but too much not to shovel.
I am guessing ‘Cuse has more
Blake-
I believe the Yankees might go to the mat for Lee but 4 for 7 is not
quite as attractive in my mind as a max. of 4 for 6.
Just my take.
Joelsherman1 If Werth can get 7-yr deal thru age-38 season why wouldn’t Lee ask at least 7 yrs thru age-39 season #Yankees, #Nationals #Rangers
JCPD-
Did you have it fitted with the special “snow” lens (sorry couldn’t resist) ?
Mine should be here any day now too.
Kate, yeah light and fluffy here too, but not much more than you have. The snow machine coming off the lake hasn’t been turned on to full force yet.
“Any clue as to how much money the Yankee generate when they play in October ???? I thought I read that not playing in 2008 cost the club somewhere in the area of 25 million ?.Can that be right ???/”
Pat M
Yankees had revenues of $72 million dollars from just ticket sales in the 2009 postseason.
MTU December 7th, 2010 at 8:31 am
Swish, Joba, Banuelos, Betances, and Romine for Upton.
Who hangs up first ? Towers or Cash ?
—
Hopefully Cashman…
jacksquat……….. only one of the B’s and I think I’d do it.
MTU —
Cashman would not only hang up first, but he would have his old friend committed for making such an insane proposal. Despite a world of talent, Upton has done nothing on the field that would indicate he’s worth that kind of package.
OK people.
It was only a hypothetical.
I’m retiring as a GM anyway.
New Post: Day 2 begins in Orlando
MTU —–
You should never retire as a make believe GM…..
What do you do in retirement? Lay around on make believe beaches drinking make believe pina coladas while watching make believe girls go by?