Other teams are actually doing stuff
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Dec 13, 2010 
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Believe it or not, as we approach the end of Day 4 of the Cliff Lee Watch, other teams are actually making small moves here and there. Don’t they know nothing else is supposed to be happening right now?
• Hideki Matsui is on the verge of a one-year deal with the Athletics. That lineup needs some sort of pop, and Matsui looks like their everyday designated hitter.
• Dustin Moseley has finalized his $900,000 deal with the Padres. Great signing for him, and probably a good one for San Diego. Despite what the linked AP story says, Moseley did not spend, “the previous four seasons in the Los Angeles Angels.” That’s wrong on many levels.
• Apparently my friend Marc Carig didn’t get the memo about Yankees reporters asking nothing but Cliff Lee questions until Lee signs. Marc reports that the Yankees have checked on Jerry Hairston Jr.
• Buried in this story from Ken Rosenthal is a note that the Dodgers might consider Bill Hall for their everyday left field job. I’ve never really bought Hall as a legitimate option for the Yankees, and an everyday opportunity in Los Angeles would make Hall even less likely for the Yankees.
• Baseball America has updated its minor league transactions, including a few familiar names: David Winfree signed with the Diamondbacks, Brian Bruney signed with the White Sox, Omir Santos signed with the Tigers, and Wilkin de la Rosa signed with the Dodgers.
• Speaking of the Bruney signing, who was the winner of last winter’s Bruney trade? I’d say the Dodgers, because they lost Jamie Hoffmann a team that was never going to keep him. The Yankees finished somewhere in the middle, if only because they didn’t have to pay Bruney. Washington lost. Definitely.
Closer to closure?
BobKlap
Highly unlikely #Yankees increase offer to Lee. Execs starting to think if Lee wanted to be in NY he would’ve accepted today.
6 minutes ago via TweetDeck
Really need to get a lefty or even two in the pen.
Cliff has done one thing during his favrian dramasession…..annoyed an awful lot of yankee fans.
don’t know if already posted but the rumored offer to Lee from Philly is 4 years $25 mil per
Ledger_Yankees
Cliff Lee wait has Yankees on hold http://bit.ly/eFHnAc
5 minutes ago via twitterfeed
Bret,
For all that money and all those $$$$, the Yankees will manage one way or the other.
Here’s a thought….Maybe Lee is actually trying to get the Yanks to drop out of their own accord so he doesn’t have to face the wrath of the players union when he accepts one of the lesser deals.
Probably not though. I still believe that Braunecker is just trying to milk the Yanks for more $.
I still believe that the people who talk don’t know and the people who know aren’t talking.
Phillies rotation would be REALLY good.
This is horrible ? I live 20 miles from Philly.
The fans are already insufferable.
Better call a realtor ? I may have to move!
Bret,
meant to say: for all those years and all those $$$$, etc.
BobKlap
Highly unlikely #Yankees increase offer to Lee. Execs starting to think if Lee wanted to be in NY he would’ve accepted today.
6 minutes ago via TweetDeck
I agree with this. Yanks will be looking at Plan B this time tomorrow.
“I still believe that the people who talk don’t know and the people who know aren’t talking”
There it is.
He’s not going to Philly. It’ll be Texas or NY same as it has been.
I hate to say it but the yankees might have to increase their offer. Only because last week they were adamant about not going to seven years and they did.
It’s seeming more and more like Lee is not coming to the Yanks. If it was all about the money or the winning tradition, and the Yanks were in other ways an acceptable alternative to him, I think he would have signed with us already. Most likely he is working with the Rangers and/or Phils to get the best deal he can from one of them.
If he doesn’t sign with us it’s clearly not Cash’s fault. He has used everything at his disposal to try to get Lee under Yankees fans’ Christmas tree. As much as we love the Yanks, not everyone loves them as much as we do.
Bret,
I think these leaks are just the Yankees’ way of responding to all this mystery team, love of Texas, love of Philly, etc. Basically saying, our offer is what it is, we’re not raising it so if you want to be somewhere else–go for it. It all seems like gamesmanship to me. If he truly wanted to be in Philadelphia, that development would have came about long before now. The narrative about Texas and it’s location & culture ran it’s course without the Yankees further increasing their offer. That meant the Lee camp needed to try another tactic if they weren’t content with the offers on the table. The leaks we’ve seen today are that final tactic. Another 24 hours or so and this should all be over with.
Yankees aren’t increasing their offer more than 7/161 they apparently already have. that is already way more then they should be giving up. at some point, you have to say enough is enough.
no way Benny.
they have the best offer and it’s probably too much as it is.
if the best offer isn’t enough, so be it.
favrian dramasession
HE IS flirting with that territory. lol.
We still don’t know the exact Yankee offer yet. Its been reported to be 7 years at around 160 million but it actually may not be quite there yet. All this may just be to get it there….who knows really.
Execs starting to think if Lee wanted to be in NY he would’ve accepted today
******
I thought they said that on Friday. Oh wait Saturday too. Don’t forget Sunday as well.
It’s just a hunch, but for some reason I do not envision Lee fitting Pinstripes this offseason. It would have happened already if he was going to…
the yanks have presented the best offer. if lee decides to take lesser money, it means he never really wanted to play in ny in the first place.
BD,
You got me, I tried…lol. I’m still holding out though!!!
RSM – as I wrote on previous thread to you: just think how much fun you’ll have when SF bounces Philly again? I also suggested you wander around with the 2009 WS cap
i just think yankee support is going away from lee.
“# Benny Blanco December 13th, 2010 at 9:06 pm
I hate to say it but the yankees might have to increase their offer. Only because last week they were adamant about not going to seven years and they did.
”
it’s the top offer, if he doesn’t want that you can’t force him to play in NY…already offering to overpay him to a risky deal
I’m starting to be more open to the possibility that Cliff Lee and his wife never wanted to play in New York and never had the intention of coming here. It could be that Cashman has been used all along to get Texas and Philly to offer as much money as possible.
Lee may be from the school that rich is rich and that there is no substantive difference between $140 million and $160 million when it’s all said and done. You’re never going to spend all that money and you and your kids are set for life and then some.
i think we wouldn’t be so hooked into this, if some of the other needs were being taken care of. So far, only Russell Martin is even close.
Worried – if Phillies sign Cliff Lee – Phittin Philly will return – concerned
” I also suggested you wander around with the 2009 WS cap”
I already do that!
Phillies are in the NL… Don’t care about them until the world series.
RSM December 13th, 2010 at 9:16 pm
” I also suggested you wander around with the 2009 WS cap”
I already do that!
HEE HEE. I’m on the central/south jersey border, so we get a mix here. I do it too. Such fun.
“All this may just be to get it there….who knows really.”
Very true blake. My guess would be that they’re looking to get his AAV to $24M or $25M. The exact number is secondary though. The central issue is that they are likely trying to scare someone, specifically the Yankees, into increasing their bid. I imagine the Yankees also believe that to be the case and likely feel that should Lee choose another team it certainly wouldn’t be because of money. However it turns out, this flurry of leaks should at least signal that this contrived episode has almost reached its conclusion.
It just is so astounding that we are in this position. Not too many years ago we had Kennedy, Joba and Hughes in the pipeline, we went out and signed Sabathia and Burnett, etc. Yet here we are. Perilously close to being in a whole lot of trouble with a three pitcher rotation, one of whom is a train wreck, going up against a retooled and powerful Boston lineup. What a game.
After this dog and pony show, cliff will have zero margin for error if he ever pitches for the yankees.
Yeah, I would rather he sign with Philly than Texas if it’s not going to be us. Texas was the only team better than us in the AL playlets and now would be losing their top starter. Not worried about Biston who traded power for speed and still have two suspect starters of their own.
*playoffs*
“After this dog and pony show, cliff will have zero margin for error if he ever pitches for the yankees.”
Nah, it would be forgotten in a NY nanosecond.
It just is so astounding that we are in this position. Not too many years ago we had Kennedy, Joba and Hughes in the pipeline, we went out and signed Sabathia and Burnett, etc. Yet here we are. Perilously close to being in a whole lot of trouble with a three pitcher rotation, one of whom is a train wreck, going up against a retooled and powerful Boston lineup. What a game.
__
Wang was the killer though…
WCYF what’s boston doing for a real rotation?Crawford & AGon are great acquisitions but neither can pitch for them.
I think this will all be known soon. I don’t see the drama going on much longer.
I think the Phillies might have been one of the two mystery teams out there from the beginning. The Nats were the other team. The Nats were eliminated earlier, but the rumors about another mystery team remained, though pretty quiet.
Bruanecker and Cashman talked earlier today. Then tonight it leaks out that the Phillies, a team Lee loves, supposedly, is that mystery team.
Cashman has been asked if he will increase his offer. He said no.
This just seems to me that it is about making sure Lee isn’t leaving anything on the table.
For the Phillies to have been this mystery team and lurking out there for this long, and now they are talking about moving a player or players to make room in their payroll just seems a bit much.
Once the Phillies got Halliday it seemed as though they couldn’t drop Lee fast enough.
I think we will hear the decision tomorrow. Its been milked as much as possible, and unless the Phillies move their offer up due to getting some trade worked out, nothing is going to change.
is Wang healthy and still under Nationals control?
What position does Cliff Lee’s wife play?
I don’t think the Yankees are out of it yet, but I think Lee has made it abundantly clear that NY is definitely not his first, or second, choice. Looks to me like the Yankees are being used to drive up the price of one of his “preferred” destinations. We have had the biggest offer on the table for a week now and he hasn’t accepted it.
Last week I gave us an 80% chance of signing Lee. This weekend I thought it was more like 60%. This AM 50/50. Now…30%.
The current offer (assuming it really is in the 7/160 range) is already too much. If that isn’t enough, it’s time to cut our losses.
Wonder if Cashman really has a plan B?
I believe Wang was non tendered by the Nats.
# Rich in NJ December 13th, 2010 at 9:22 pm
“After this dog and pony show, cliff will have zero margin for error if he ever pitches for the yankees.”
Nah, it would be forgotten in a NY nanosecond.
____________
I agree. A lot of fans will listen in on some of this, but many don’t tune in to the baseball stuff till the season starts.
If Lee signs with the Yankees, a lot of fans will be celebrating.
This blog probably represents about about .0000001% of all Yankee fans.
I think the vast majority of fans will find out about Lee by either hearing it on the evening news, seeing it in the paper, word of mouth etc.
No one is going to remember how many days it took him to accept a contract. Most simply don’t care.
forget wang… if harden is healthy, get him. he pitched well with the cubs and we have the cubs pitching coach now.
Has Lee even said anything this off season? I don’t remember a single quote.
carmelo just told everyone not to trade for him because it will eventually be signing with the knicks.
Still maintain Lee is about the money – to quote All the President’s Men – follow the money – follow the money. . . .
“Has Lee even said anything this off season? I don’t remember a single quote”
The dead deer picture he texted spoke 1000 words, but that’s about all anyone’s heard from him.
carmelo needs to learn to play defense
Thing is, even though this feels like its been a very long time, it really isn’t all that long. CC had the Yankees offer for a long time. Lee hasn’t had their offer a week yet.
This just feels like forever because as soon as the season ended everyone knew the Yankees would be in on him. That is when the clock starting ticking for many people.
There is also the chance that Lee just wants to make sure he’s making the right decision and is giving it some time. There has been so much misinformation and conflicting reports around this whole thing that we likely won’t know the real story until its over.
How many times has a deal gone down where everyone thought one thing then come to find out something different after the fact.
I will be among those fans celebrating, but it is undeniable at this point that I am thoroughly frustrated.
Mrs Lee’s inner thoughts…
NY (saliva) vs. Philly (urine), hmmm?
this Giants-Vikings is such a sloppy game
“carmelo needs to learn to play defense”
Not to play on the Knicks, he doesn’t.
He ain’t all that anyway…There has to be a better way to spend $160
phillies are also really thinking with their heart instead of head. put whatever money is left into lee. still need some righthanded pop in their lineup or they arent going anywhere. werth was it and now he is gone. his replacement is lefty too. Opponents will load up on lefties against them.
RSN….wasn’t Philly where the drunk guy purposely vomited on another person in the stands?
Good point ac – Wang’s loss was huge.
RSN….wasn’t Philly where the drunk guy purposely vomited on another person in the stands?
__
Vomited on a kid no less. Class…
When CC was a free agent the yankees offered him a 6 year 140 million dollar deal that he sat on “no pun intended” for three weeks. When he signed it was for 7 years 160. The same exact thing is happening with lee. Thats why I think the yankees will budge.
“RSN?.wasn?t Philly where the drunk guy purposely vomited on another person in the stands?”
YES! How did I forget that, LOL!
Hi all –
I think I know what Lee’s first choice is. It’s to get the most money possible. My guess is that by dragging this out, he thinks he can get someone to up their offer, and he doesn’t particularly care how long it takes, as long as it’s settled by the time he needs to make his own personal plans for ST.
When he feels that he’s gotten all the money he can get out of the FA process, he’ll then sign and profess all sorts of love for wherever it is.
I know this is a very cynical point of view, but, when dealing with pro athletes, it all too frequently works out.
And didn’t they pelt Santa with snowballs in Philly?
J. Alfred Prufrock December 13th, 2010 at 9:23 pm
WCYF what’s boston doing for a real rotation?Crawford & AGon are great acquisitions but neither can pitch for them.
************
J. Alfred – I am not as down on Boston’s pitching as some are. Lester is a legitimate ace and Buchholz is a solid number one on most teams. I think Beckett if healthy, and they say he is, is a pretty good number three and Lackey will be better his second year in the AL East. He’s a bulldog. As to DiceK – well he is what he is.
Benny, they aren’t moving past CC’s contract. What’s the point? Philly is offering MUCH less 61 M less from all reports. If he is considering that, then an extra couple mil wont matter and 3 extra years apparently won’t either.
He vomited on a Police Captains daughter.
Needless to say, he “resisted arrest”.
Remember the black eye he had in the picture that hit the papers.
What a dumba$$.
When push comes to shove, how many people pass up an extra buck or two,let alone millions?
Lackey’s numbers have always been bad at Fenway. Beckett is NEVER healthy, and even when he was, he stunk against the Yankees. Yes Boston is always a concern, but lets see what our team looks like in March before really worrying.
“Lee moved closer to a decision tonight, according to ESPN.com’s Jerry Crasnick. The Phillies entered the bidding for Lee after the winter meetings and have presented the lefty with “a spirited late bid,” Crasnick writes.”
If the Phillies really are involved then that’s another reason he’s took so long. 3 teams to consider instead of 2….still don’t think he’s going there. Like the Yanks chances.
I’m hoping that this deal falls through. We’ll be better off for it in the long run. For the short run, I trust Cashman to fill the holes that need to be filled.
West Coast Yankee Fan December 13th, 2010 at 9:13 pm
I’m starting to be more open to the possibility that Cliff Lee and his wife never wanted to play in New York and never had the intention of coming here. It could be that Cashman has been used all along to get Texas
——————————————————————————–
did I say this
ust read the ESPN update. Suddenly he’s wanting to go back to Philadelphia, where he loves the city and his teammates there? After loving Texas and his teammates there?
He’s loving one thing, folks: his favorite teammate, the Benjamin.
Yankees offer is likely $160 x 7. Texas is likely $120-140 x 6, and the Phillies can’t offer him a lot more than Halliday with a straight face.
Yankees will not be outbid. They are offering a serious premium.
Well played by Braunecker and Lee to make this a three-way, so there is less hard feelings in Texas when he goes for the money and years.
I’m not sure joeman. It’s just one of the many thoughts going through my head on this interminable Lee deal. Could be though.
Bronx Jeers says:
December 13, 2010 at 9:27 pm
This blog probably represents about about .0000001% of all Yankee fans.
I think the vast majority of fans will find out about Lee by either hearing it on the evening news, seeing it in the paper, word of mouth etc.
No one is going to remember how many days it took him to accept a contract. Most simply don’t care.
—-
I definitely agree with you there. My Grandfather is a huge Yankees fan(though he doesn’t mind the Rays anymore since they’re the only thing on TV down here) and we talked the sunday before the jeter press conference, he said he bet I was happy that morning reading about jeters new contract. He couldn’t believe I knew it had gone down that thursday or friday. He says he just looks forward to seeing the team in spring and doesn’t care who they get as long as they’re good.
It really doesn’t look like the guy wants to be here. We are offering a higher package than anybody else is even capable of offering. I think the fact that the Phils (can’t even compete with Rangers offer) are still a part of the negotiation shows he needs more leverage outside of the Yanks.
It’s pretty obvious the Yankees aren’t going to bid against themselves. Both Lee and his agent know this.
He wants more money from the Rangers and using the Phils can get him just that.
joeman
Explain two things:
Why was Lee so jacked in July to play for the Yankees, and was shocked at the last minute when Seattle changed the destination?
Why did CC say Lee “doesn’t need a lot of convincing” to come to NY?
“phillies are also really thinking with their heart instead of head. put whatever money is left into lee. still need some righthanded pop in their lineup or they arent going anywhere. werth was it and now he is gone”
If Phillies get Lee they will have a monster rotation-
Halladay
Lee
Hamels
Oswalt
They won’t have to worry too much about a righty bat.
If the Phillies win out, whatever….
I don’t get how Lee is ok with how they unloaded him and refused to negotiate an extension when they already had him.
To each their own, just get this over with already, because im as sick of hearing about Lee as i was with Favre and Lebron.
No joeman, what you said was “lee will announce he is returning to texas on sunday night.”
Bringing the Phillies in isn’t going to affect the Rangers. They are likely already maxed out and they are already outbid….bringing the Phillies in isn’t to get the Rangers to raise their offer, if anything its to get the Yankees to raise theirs. If he chooses the Rangers then it will already be for less money.
Beckett was supposed to be healthy last year as well.
The Red Sox are going to be a good team. They usually are, and would have been tougher last season without the injuries that hit them big.
Benny but CC was also younger than Lee
Curry reporting Lee is looking like he is heading to Phils.
From one on the more reliable sources through this mess:
JackCurryYES Jack Curry
Wonder what has taken Cliff Lee so long? There is a belief he is heading to the Phillies
It made sense for Braunecker to leak to Heyman that there was a “mystery team” involved today to see if he can get either team to up their offers one last time. I mean why not looked what happened after Crawford signed. The Yanks immediately offered another year and $20m more. So if your his agent why not try one last time? I expect/hope the drama is over tomorrow.
“# PittsburghYankeeFan December 13th, 2010 at 9:44 pm
joeman
Explain two things:
Why was Lee so jacked in July to play for the Yankees, and was shocked at the last minute when Seattle changed the destination?
Why did CC say Lee “doesn’t need a lot of convincing” to come to NY?
”
that was before going on a playoff chase w/ Texas and getting to know Nolan Ryan who is well respected by any pitcher in this game
# West Coast Yankee Fan December 13th, 2010 at 9:44 pm
I’m not sure joeman. It’s just one of the many thoughts going through my head on this interminable Lee deal. Could be though.
——————————————————————–
well where I stand on this is just gut….Do I want to be happy or do I want to be right..I truly believe that his wife wants no part of NY but how do you turn down that $ and years…I also believe he’s trying to get the Tex & NY money as close as he can so he can stay in Tex
I’m certain that a few years ago the blueprints for the Yankee rotation would have read, Sabathia, Wang, Hughes, Chamberlain and maybe Kennedy or to left open for a freshman type arm like Nova……
Crasnick says he doesn’t think the Yankees are at 160 yet……says could be more like 150.
JackCurryYES
Wonder what has taken Cliff Lee so long? There is a belief he is heading to the Phillies
JoeyA December 13th, 2010 at 9:48 pm
Curry reporting Lee is looking like he is heading to Phils.
Where did he say that? I see:
JackCurryYES Jack Curry
If Lee goes to the Phillies, it will be for a lot less money than the Yankees offered.
JackCurryYES Jack Curry
Wonder what has taken Cliff Lee so long? There is a belief he is heading to the Phillies
Where in the world does that say he believes he’s going t the Phillies?
Blake, the Phillies were played as a mystery team for a reason. They weren’t really in the same range bidding as the Rangers and the Yankees. The leak about it being a team Lee really loves was meant to shake the Yankees down to see if more pocket change falls out.
I think we will hear either way soon.
Funny, when I read that Lee was moving closer to a decision, what popped in my head was an image of Lee sitting there with three contracts in front of him, doing “enni, meani, minni, moe”, and one team’s bid was gone. lol.
Regardless of who Lee is going to sign with, delay can’t hurt him and might help. He could go to the Yanks or Texas and say I will sign right now if you increase your offer by some specified small amount. The team might go for that. And, a “small amount” in this context could be several million dollars.
Really, Lee can afford to delay until the Yanks and/or Texas threaten to withdraw their offer as of some deadline date or until spring training starts.
Of course, the delay stinks for the Yanks and Texas. They’re stuck waiting to implement Plan B, but that’s not Lee’s problem.
Lee is going to the highest bidder.
Will the Yankees cave and say OK, we offered $160 x 7, here is $168 x 7 now enough already?
Lifestyle? Come on. These guys get paid astronomical amounts of cash to play a kids game. They don’t usually go to college, and spend half of the year on the road, away from home, from age 17 to 27. The wives and spouses marry them knowing this is the life they chose.
It’s a multibillion dollar business. The owners know it, the players know it, the media know it (but cynically pretend they don’t). Players are meat until they hit free agency (or at least arb in some cases). We fans need to remember it as well.
# tampayank December 13th, 2010 at 9:50 pm
“# PittsburghYankeeFan December 13th, 2010 at 9:44 pm
joeman
Explain two things:
Why was Lee so jacked in July to play for the Yankees, and was shocked at the last minute when Seattle changed the destination?
Why did CC say Lee “doesn’t need a lot of convincing” to come to NY?
”
that was before going on a playoff chase w/ Texas and getting to know Nolan Ryan who is well respected by any pitcher in this game
——————————————————————
I believe his time in Tex changed his thoughts
Yogi,
I think if what Crasnick says is true and the Yankees aren’t at the Sabathia deal yet, then they could be trying to get the Yankees to go there. The Phillies have a team policy of not going over 3 years for starting pitchers….hard to imagine them stretching that far enough to get close to the Yankees or Rangers offer….especially after they just went 3 and an option with Halladay.
# Carlo December 13th, 2010 at 9:46 pm
No joeman, what you said was “lee will announce he is returning to texas on sunday night.”
———————————————————————
the 3rd team changed all that
I don’t get it. Why would you want to play for a team that traded you away. I guess he forgot about that. Frankly, as I have said a million times, I don’t really care.
Now we can go after some pitchers with all the $$$ we have and our trade chips. Hopefully, Andy can be talked into returning for another go round.
Halladay, Lee, Oswalt, Hamels…
hmm
I still think that Lee will be the rotation with Sabathia in April.
SI_JonHeyman
the #phillies look like a very strong candidate to win lee’s services.
WCYF – C’mon now – Buccholz a “No. 1″ on “most” teams?i can see only the most infatuated red sox fan making such a blind leap.he’s basically had one decent year in the majors after being sent for retool in the minors.you can call him a very talented pitcher, but a No. 1 on most teams is just excessive,sorry.let him do it for more than one season and see if he can improve his K/BB rates and walks less batters.there are very few “aces” that can get away with such low K rates.
Beckett is erratic at best, in decline at worst.only managed about 127 IP in 2010. lackey is also trending down. Dice K can’t get out of the fifth inning.Lester is terrific.not exactly a sound staff.& their bullpen is a mess.
LEEve US alone already, YES? I’d love to have Cliff as part of the family, but we’ll just have to move on. He did want to be here last year….I guess it because Philadelphia is SO MUCH closer to the hometown ARK
RadioKey
Is your foot uncomfortable in your mouth?
coney1 December 13th, 2010 at 9:59 pm
SI_JonHeyman
the #phillies look like a very strong candidate to win lee’s services.
==========================
That statement scares the hell out of me..
Uh oh. Curry and Heyman both reporting Philly looks like the team.
“# BD (Boston Dave) December 13th, 2010 at 9:58 pm
Halladay, Lee, Oswalt, Hamels…
hmm
”
would be scary
Cashman needs to buy a better net.
tampayank
So he leaves $20 million on the table after knowing Nolan Ryan for all of three months, and winning all of the two playoff series wins in Texas’ history?
Is that what you are saying?
J. Alfred. That’s my take on it. We’ll see when they play the games.
would be scary
__
for the national league.
JackCurryYES
If Lee goes to the Phillies, it will be for a lot less money than the Yankees offered. 18 minutes ago via Mobile Web
I don’t see it…its a scare tactic.
Halladay, and Lee. Wow.
This thing is over. Anyone trying to convince themselves otherwise if wasting his/her time. Everyone wondered why this was taking so long and now we know…..he wanted to return to philly where world series appearances are nearly guaranteed now.
And in the interest of not kidding urselves as it relates to the future…..this yankee team has a lot of problems, no matter what Cashmans non existant plan B is.
if the Philly talk is revving up, it is possible that is where he is headed.
I think we can move on and we will…
Maybe even beat Lee once or twice moving forward.
# joeman December 13th, 2010 at 9:56 pm
# Carlo December 13th, 2010 at 9:46 pm
No joeman, what you said was “lee will announce he is returning to texas on sunday night.”
———————————————————————
the 3rd team changed all that
As someone that can read english and think independently, nope. Curry reported people think Philly will get Lee. Who are these people? I think there are probably a few people that think Lee will go to Texas and New York as well. I also think that’s not saying “I sense that Lee is going to Philly.”
Heyman also isn’t the shining example of hard journalism either. I’m not sure how these people decide what to and not to publish. I think over the course of the past 24 hours the top baseball writers reported every possibility as likelihood. I mean, eventually they will be right, but does that mean much?
So Philly is going to bid $160-170 x 7 to beat the Yankees? While paying a likely better pitcher (Roy Halliday) $20 x 3 with an option? If that happens, I know I’m not on earth anymore.
They are ratcheting it up as they make the final push to squeeze every penny out of NY.
If true shows how wrong everyone was, me included, about proximity to home and money being the end all.
YES just announced Philly too.
I’m sick of this whole thing. Hey Cliff, just sign with Philly, win the next 5 WS, and be done with it. Enough.
If Braunecker calls Cash tomorrow and says 7/$168 and you have a deal Cash should say yes. If a little more money seals the deal fine but not if he is going to shop the deal again. I can’t see the Phillies coming up with the money to match the Yanks offer and can’t see Lee leaving $30m on the table to go the Phillies or Texas. No one knows if the Phillies are just sniffing their noses in this like Boston did or they are really involved as in offering 6-7 years and $150m plus..I highly doubt it’s the 2nd one.
Have to concur with Carlo – thought it was about the money – have to see the whole story once it comes out. I concede. . . Lee will not be a Yankee.
wzup, everyone. Haven’t posted in a minute.
for the record, have been opposed to NYY signing Cliff Lee dating back to the 2010 season/playoffs.
*any* team willing to offer a 7 year contract to a 33 year old pitcher who has been sidelined with back issues, deserves what they will get. Lack of foresight. Prediction: Kevin Brown part II (who was also a dammm good post-season pitcher before signing his record LAD contract)
secondly, i didn’t like Cliff Lee during the 2010 season. Not changing my mind now. I prefer to take a liking to players on the Yankee roster. In particular when a 7 year/161 million contract is on the books. Cliff Lee strikes me as cold. He looks like a serial killer.
# Carlo December 13th, 2010 at 10:04 pm
This thing is over. Anyone trying to convince themselves otherwise if wasting his/her time. Everyone wondered why this was taking so long and now we know…..he wanted to return to philly where world series appearances are nearly guaranteed now.
And in the interest of not kidding urselves as it relates to the future…..this yankee team has a lot of problems, no matter what Cashmans non existant plan B is.
——————————————————–
I kind of think Crawford would have been plan B…..I think they are up to plan C
This thing is over. Anyone trying to convince themselves otherwise if wasting his/her time. Everyone wondered why this was taking so long and now we know…..he wanted to return to philly where world series appearances are nearly guaranteed now.
___
Near Guarantee?
2 years in a row is a guarantee? Giants beat them like the Rangers beat us this year. I hardly see Philly as a guarantee to make the World Series.
Cliff Lee to Phillies…..
AND CASHMAN GETS THE JOB DONE AGAIN………………NOT.
The only player he even focused on the entire offseason he couldnt even get with all the money he has in the world. Cashman really blows. Not only did he screw us on Lee, but any other big free agents out there.
Our best bet is to trade Romine/Montero, Gardner, High prospect for Greinke and then maybe sign Magglio for left field? (Being that MLBNetwork is reporting the Yankees are close to signing Russell Martin, we can probably trade one of our catchers for Greinke.) IF it was my decision, i would put in 2 more really good prospects and go all out and get Felix Hernendez.
But…I say sign Magglio and trade Gardner.
Jeter
Swish
Tex
Arod
Cano
Posada
Magglio
Russell Martin
Granderson
Rotation of: CC, Greinke, Hughes, AJ, Pettite/Nova isnt horrible
We can recover. But cashman still sucks.
# Joelsherman1
At thsi moment, #Yankees have become extremely negative about landing Lee and believing that he is edging toward #Phillies less than 10 seconds ago via web
* Reply
* Retweet
# Tyler Kepner TylerKepner
Hard to know exactly what’s going on w/o knowing Phillies’ offer. But Yanks sound pessimistic now about getting Lee.
It’s over folks
Screw Lee. Let that dude go wherever he wants. Sick of hearing about his lanky a s s. Here’s hoping he never wears pinstripes. The Yankees are the Yankees. They will live without Lee. I hope he stays in the AL, if he doesn’t sign with the Yankees, so we get a chance to beat him.
And yes this rotation has problems – heck the setup crew has problems without Wood – sorry – Yankees with their 200 million dollar payroll are not going Nova and journeyman Mitre/Harden type in the rotation waiting on the likes of Phelps and Nosei – also question marks – in AAA. Not sure what plan B is – but it cannot be as good as Cliff Lee b/c we would have pursued Plan B already – i.e. Plan B would be Plan A – UGHHH
He is going to take 25mil for 4 years? Is that the Phillies offer?
“I kind of think Crawford would have been plan B….”
At $142m? Doubtful. He can’t pitch and any pitcher they trade for will cost money.
Joelsherman1 At thsi moment, #Yankees have become extremely negative about landing Lee and believing that he is edging toward #Phillies
TylerKepner Hard to know exactly what’s going on w/o knowing Phillies’ offer. But Yanks sound pessimistic now about getting Lee.
jcrasnick The question is, how close can the Phils get to the other two offers? Lee can only leave so many years and dollars on the table
SI_JonHeyman the #phillies look like a very strong candidate to win lee’s services. #mysteryteam
LOL. In mere minutes Cliff Lee has gone from most beloved to most hated.
I’m no Cashman fan, but the elf only has one task that he must accomplish this offseason. If he fails to get Lee, it’s time to send his little a$$ back to the North Pole.
—————————————————–
I am a Cashman fan. And that was pretty funny
The only satisfaction i get from Lee possibly returning to the Phillies is the ridiculous weeks of talking about :
1. Being close to Arkansas
2. Unruly fans
3. Taxes
If this indeed to proves to be true then The Phils are going to be a very tough ballclub….Johnson and Schilling all over again only with a better 3 & 4 …..Yikes, can’t beleive that this has happened…
“# PittsburghYankeeFan December 13th, 2010 at 10:02 pm
tampayank
So he leaves $20 million on the table after knowing Nolan Ryan for all of three months, and winning all of the two playoff series wins in Texas’ history?
Is that what you are saying?
”
no I’m saying he at least is seriously considering them after spending time w/ that team that has a younger core than the Yankees
but it might not matter now w/ these Philly rumors
LOL. Mets fans are more unhappy if true than we are.
Wow.
The guy is leaving a lot of money on the table if this is true. The Phillies? After all of the talk of loving Texas?
Was it the thing that happened to AJ Burnett that turned him off, if this is true?
Devastating tonight for Yanks, Rangers, Mets, Braves, well the NL
Fantastic night for the Phils, Red Sox, the Lees, Lees’ agent, and Yankees haters in the media
Double ughh
Oh well – back to the drawing board – let the pain set in and then move on tomorrow
Nah West Coast. People tired hearing about Lee. After a while, you just don’t give a damn. The Yankees will field an excellent team in 2011 with or without him.
I can’t believe we wasted all this time on this clown. Congrats Cliffy, now both NY and Texas hate you.
What a freakin’ joke.
But as far as the Phillies rotation? Didn’t get them to the WS last year, and didn’t win them the WS the year before.
Crapshoot.
Plus – I believe, at least a little, in karma.
If Lee chooses the Phillies, the Yankees AND the Rangers will have been strung along.
You hear what “they” want you to hear.
/bobcat’d
LOL. In mere minutes Cliff Lee has gone from most beloved to most hated.
———————————-
in my case, i never wanted him
.I won’t believe he’s signing with the Phillies until he actually does.
Now everyone is just hedging their guesses to save face. If he doesn’t sign to Philly, it’s just another twist in the tale, if he does sign, they were right all along.
Yeah, sure..
What happened to AJ Burnett, aside from having a bad second year?
Lee is gonna leave $70M on the table. Im sure the players union will love that
I say sign Magglio and trade Gardner.
ORDONEZ has become an awful fielder.pass.
SI_JonHeyman
lee may leave up to $70 mil on table to sign with philly. if he gets it done with them, he will truly be able to say it wasnt about the $ 1 minute ago via web
Anybody really see that happening?
You do hear what they want you to hear.
Logically, the Phillies cannot beat Halliday’s contract. He’ll go for that?
The players union will go nuts.
At least he will be in the NL – and not in the AL on the Rangers – can live with him going to the Phils – Rangers we would just have to face him so much more
Hope Cashman has a plan – b/c the Killer Bs are definitely not ready – and the Yanks are not going to hand the keys to the staff to unproven youngsters again like in 2008. Only Cashman knows what is out there.
No way this happens…
SI_JonHeyman lee may leave up to $70 mil on table to sign with philly. if he gets it done with them, he will truly be able to say it wasnt about the $
“# ac1 December 13th, 2010 at 10:03 pm
would be scary
__
for the national league.
”
did you forget what Halladay did to the AL East all those years?
Let it play out
I feel so used.
I feel the same.
What happened to AJ Burnett, aside from having a bad second year?
What happened to him??
This thing turned out terribly.
I don’t blame Cashman for lack of effort, but it’s VERY troubling how badly we were played throughout this whole thing.
Lee had to have basically lied to Cash & Co.’s faces if he chooses the Phils. It wasn’t about money OR proximity to home/taxes/etc.
*I only feel this way if all of this is true.
Doreen
Could be the black eye – not sure
Ac1 – “near guarantee to make the world series” – that’s what I said.
Name another team with a rotation even close to that good.
Name another NL team with an offense that’s on par with philly even after werths departure
Name another team who is so far and away better than anyone else in their division
Once they win the division, their ds opponent has to beat oswalt, hamels, and either lee or halladay once
In the NLCS, their opponent has to beat oswalt, hamels, and lee or halladay twice.
U name for me a team that has a better chance of making the WS for each of the next 5 years?
Nothing official official on lee, is there?
did you forget what Halladay did to the AL East all those years?
__
You forget that the phillies are in the national league and we see them 3 games a year? i won’t worry about the phillies and their monster rotation.
Who needs Lee when you’ve got Robert Fish and Daniel Turpen?
Serenity now.
Lee and Braunecker are probably rolling on the floor about now reading these tweets.
So Lee becomes Maddux 1992 offseason v. 2.0
Now we have to go out and get our Jimmy Key 1992 offseason v. 2.0
We will figure it out and be there in the end – somehow – someway – keep the faith good Yankees fans
This is Lee’s 1st and only time being a free agent I really doubt he or anyone would leave that much money on the table. Hopefully this is his agent still trying to push the Yanks otherwise we are screwed. I hope Cash is on the phone with his agent right now.,.
SI_JonHeyman
being told cliff lee decision unlikely to come tonite but may be as early as tomorrow. #phillies, #mysteryteam
___
Tomorrow or never.
Still thinK it’s a leverage play…..SI now reporting no decision tonight “could happen tomorrow”. I say Cash pull the offer. F- cliff and the high horse he rode in on.
“Buccholz a “No. 1? on “most” teams?”
—————
I hate to say it but it’s not completely far-fetched. Buchholz needs to follow up last season in order to make that statement true, but saying Buchholz could end up being a #1 starter is not crazy.
I was talking to someone in the Red Sox org and he had said that Buchholz was their most consistent pitcher last season.
Again, one season doesn’t make anyone a superstar, so we’ll have to wait and see how he does in 2011.
SI_JonHeyman
lee may leave up to $70 mil on table to sign with philly. if he gets it done with them, he will truly be able to say it wasnt about the $
I cant believe this fell apart… WTF!!!
U name for me a team that has a better chance of making the WS for each of the next 5 years?
__
Well…. Halladay only has 3 more year on his contract and Oswalt is a FA after 2011.
Philly offense is a beast, but also had some pretty bad months in the summer.
Also, they are extremely lefty dominant and haven’t replaced Werth.
Yes on paper they should be the best team in the NL, but that was the case in 2010 too.
Honestly, who cares about fielding??? We need offense. Jeter is questionable with the year he had last year. Granderson might go back to the first half he had last year and Arod’s power is diminishing.
Magglio would bring a #5 hitter to the 7th slot in the lineup. He would easily hit .290, 30 Hr, 100 RBIs in that lineup and stadium. He’s a double’s machine and goes the opposite way so well in a stadium with a short left field porch. Put him in right field, switch Swish to left field and then you dont have a problem with fielding bc right field isnt too difficult. ALSO, it allows us to trade Gardner for Greinke which is a MUST now.
GREINKE IS A MUST. If they Yankees go into next year with this rotation, we will be lucky if we get 3rd place.
Lee isn’t going to the Phillies. Nobody throws away 70 mil. Nobody.
It’s amzing how no one knows what the Rangers or Phillies offers are but everyone knows every single detail of the Yankees offer. Of course that would happen because his agent is leaking only the info that he wants out in the media. The Rangers offer is probably so low that people would laugh.
Cliff Lee needs more time… after all he is awaiting the entry of a 2nd mystery team somewhere in the west, a place he says he also “loves.”
No way Cliff Lee leaves 70million on the table. Any believing he will, is a fool
Memo To Phillies Ballplayers:
Good News: Rotation of Halladay, Lee, Oswalt and Hamels.
Bad News: The team will be traveling by bus and you wash your own uniforms.
pat -
“used” about would sum it up.
Stoneburner -
But no one knows how that black eye happened or why. And that happened before the almost-trade to NY, and Lee was happy to think he was NY-bound.
GREINKE IS A MUST. If they Yankees go into next year with this rotation, we will be lucky if we get 3rd place.
__
Yeah that is extremely wrong.
They don’t need Greinke and they will be 1 or 2 no matter what.
They can, however, build a rotation of some people for less money with potential, and beef up the pen.
I hate how people on here blame Cashman. He gave Lee the best offer hands down. So, please stop blaming Cashman for this.
The Yankees can always turn to Igawa or Pavano.
Hurry someone wake up Hal and Cashman!!!
I just saw Cliff Lee at starbucks on 75th st
Here’s hoping C.C.’s knee heals fine, Phil Hughes is working on his change, and A.J. is . . .well working on whatever he needs to stay consistent with his mechanics – if that is at all possible. As for the other two dudes in the rotation – looking forward to finding out who you will be . . . .
http://twitter.com/Ledger_Yank.....7430639617
^^^^ THIS is what Cashman is working on?! JERRY HAIRSTON JR?? We have Eduardo Nunez to do that crap work. Seriously. Someone please send Cashman back home to Connecticut and tell him to stay there and not come back.
If George was still alive this wouldn’t be happening….RIP Boss
“I hate how people on here blame Cashman. He gave Lee the best offer hands down. So, please stop blaming Cashman for this.”
QFT
Hurry someone wake up Hal and Cashman!!!
__
Why? they aren’t offering MORE money when the Phillies offer is already 60M less.
If Lee signs a 4 year deal, barring injury, he will be a free agent again. Let’s see how interested NY or anyone is in dealing with this kind of mess again. Lee would be wise to take the years from NY or even Texas.
Philly isn’t close to home. Money will be less.
I wonder what teammates on Philly Cliff Lee loves so much? Sorry Sabathia.
Its Arods fault
Lets start talking about other options.
Doreen
AJ black eye incident occurred in September – around the Baltimore Orioles series – Lee was already in Texas
If anyone is searching for a silver lining and optimism, here it is:
Yanks “very pessimistic about chances of landing lee”…..could be cashmans way of saying to brauneker “it is what it is, we don’t like our chances, and that’s that, our offer does not change”
The problem is, phillies offer appears to be so much lower, it wouldn’t even make sense for us to offer a couple million extra
blaming cashman is ridiculous. twice, he game the best offer for Lee.
You forget that the phillies are in the national league and we see them 3 games a year? i won’t worry about the phillies and their monster rotation.
NEITHER DID SF. THEY ALSO DIDN’T WORRY ABOUT LEE. INSTEAD, THEY BEAT THEM. BOTH. LOL.
This is all a ploy to see if the Yankees will up their offer.
Hold your head Cashman. Don’t lose it Cashman.
Chill folks – it hasn’t been announced yet. Tomorrow they say. And no one has a clue how much Philly is offering money wise. That has all been total speculation.
http://www.overthemonster.com/.....se-to-sign
Red Sox closing to signing Teixeira. Anybody remember this headline?
Wow. Landing Lee would EASILY lock in at least 2 or 3 WS appearances and most likely wins for the damn Phils. Easy league and easy division…with Doc and Lee anchoring rotation Phils would coast through weak competition while Sox/Yanks beat the hell out of each other to get there.
I’d much rather Lee go to Texas than Philly. Only thing worse would’ve been Lee to Boston.
“# Carlo December 13th, 2010 at 10:15 pm
Ac1 – “near guarantee to make the world series” – that’s what I said.
Name another team with a rotation even close to that good.
Name another NL team with an offense that’s on par with philly even after werths departure
Name another team who is so far and away better than anyone else in their division
Once they win the division, their ds opponent has to beat oswalt, hamels, and either lee or halladay once
In the NLCS, their opponent has to beat oswalt, hamels, and lee or halladay twice.
U name for me a team that has a better chance of making the WS for each of the next 5 years?
”
I agree and the kid taking Werth’s place is no slouch
# Doris from Rego Park December 13th, 2010 at 10:21 pm
I just saw Cliff Lee at starbucks on 75th st
———————————–
yeah. The same way you said the Yankees had traded for Grienke 2 years ago. Whatever you say..
For all the talk of Lee being a competitor, perhaps he prefers the relatively easier workload of an NL pitcher?
Red Sox closing to signing Teixeira. Anybody remember this headline?
__
yeah, then the yankees snuck in at the last minute, much like philly has now.
Still think the Yanks get him.
Everything so far in these negotiations has been about $$MONEY$$
the strategies of Branecker has been to get big offers from teams.
That doesn’t mean it’s impossible that Lee will sign with the Phillies, but it doesn’t add up.
Call me crazy, but unless Lee had zero intention of ever playing for the Yankees, I still see him coming to NY for the top offer.
Lee or no Lee – I have maintained since day one of the offseason – would rather have Lee v. 2.0 – John Danks – he is of course not available – yet – but there are circumstances that could lead to this being a possibility.
I think this is hysterical.
I’ll take SF’s young buck staff over the Phils’ over-30 control artists any day.i remember the argument on here for Halladay in exchange for Montero was all “Halladay will age perfectly…yada yada.” Halladay,it turns out,injured himself PRECISELY at the wrong time; NLCS and got beat by the Giants,whose young homegrowns thrived. Then,SF made Cliff Lee look like a LH Jon Lieber in the WS.
I’d much rather Lee go to Texas than Philly. Only thing worse would’ve been Lee to Boston.
__
How exactly would him in texas be better than not seeing him more than once a year?
Jon Heyman
being told cliff lee decision unlikely to come tonite but may be as early as tomorrow. #phillies, #mysteryteam
11 minutes ago from web
————————–
What an absolute load of crap. I can’t tell if that tweet is tongue in cheek or not. Just keep on guessing Heyman.
I can’t wait to hear what Cashman (and maybe Hank) have to say about this.
blake
Apart from Jeter, I think we agree on most things.
You can’t “lock in ” WS appearance, much less wins, no matter what the rotation is, in December, for crying out loud. I wouldn’t do it for the Yankees, much less any other team. You can talk about having a good chance, but locked in???
Can Jerry Hairston, Jr. pitch left-handed?
Dominic Brown is a very nice prospect – but he is just that – he will take time as well – heck a lefty swing – but will take time – Phils need to either platoon that position or sign someone else – not a finished product yet
And it is so funny to hear people proclaim a team to win the next two or three world series months before the first season. Bet the Phillies looked like a sure thing until SF came in and crushed them…
If this goes through, the Phils better win in the next year or two because all three of those guys are approaching 35….they could go south in a hurry. Isn’t that what everyone was saying about the Yanks the last two weeks?
NYBD
RT @incarceratedbob **BREAKING NEWS 3 sources have confirmed Texas will hold a Press Conference in next 24 Hours to announce he’s Re-Signed
LOL
The Phillies will have Rollins going to FA after 2011. Ibanez also.
Rich,
probably, I’m a Jeter homer so to speak so I’m a bit biased in that area I’ll admit. I don’t see Lee leaving 2-3 years and 50+ million on the table. I think its a ploy to get the Yankees to go to Sabathia’s contract if they aren’t there yet.
Just over-thinking, what better way to stick it to the Phillies in the final hours of this thing than getting their hopes up and then signing with Yanks or Rangers
Yogi Mantle December 13th, 2010 at 10:26 pm
I think this is hysterical.
IT ACTUALLy is.i’ve worked up quite an appetite in fact. In fact,if you asked me right now if I would be willing to forgo the alacarte sushi i ordered that’s due on my doorstep any minute, in exchange for us signing lee, i would have no hesitation to go with the sushi. my stomach is more important than the fickle mr. lee.
ac1 December 13th, 2010 at 10:20 pm
GREINKE IS A MUST. If they Yankees go into next year with this rotation, we will be lucky if we get 3rd place.
__
Yeah that is extremely wrong.
They don’t need Greinke and they will be 1 or 2 no matter what.
They can, however, build a rotation of some people for less money with potential, and beef up the pen
———————————————————
It’s minds like yours the ruins chances of a baseball team, dynasties, and wastes money.
Have you EVER seen lower quality players get the job done?
How’s Pavano looking right now? Nick Johnson last year instead of resigning Matsui or Damon? OH! Keeping Ian Kennedy and/or Joba Chamberlain out of a trade for Roy Halladay.
Ya, those guys work. And there’s not enough bullpen help on the entire market that would make up for the 2 bad starters we’re going to have in 4 and 5 (without Greinke) or compare to Cliff Lee’s production. You’re just so wrong.
Burnett will probably go like 13-10 with a 4.30 ERA and a guy like Harden or Nova will probably not even finish the season in the rotation but would have a similar 4.50 ERA if they did.
Trading for Greinke or (fantastical i know) Felix Hernendez is a must.
Braunecker is feeding Heyman everything except the Rangers and Phillies low offers…ofcourse
RSM December 13th, 2010 at 10:28 pm
Can Jerry Hairston, Jr. pitch left-handed?
_______
Swish can.
Boned.
Funny how the Yanks and Rangers have been waiting on this idiot for over a week since the Winter Meetings began, only to maybe lose out in a few hours to the Phils….
based on all info, it is apparent Braunecker is using these negotiations as a vehicle to make himself the ‘next’ Scott Boras.
“How exactly would him in texas be better than not seeing him more than once a year?”
Seeing him and Doc in the WS? I’d rather see him twice a month than face him and Doc the one time of year that it matters. Can they be beat? Sure. But I’d rather not have to face that tandem in WS.
Obviously normal caveats apply…barring injuries blah blah…but both he and Doc have pretty good injury histories and no reason to think that changes now.
CC, Pettitte, Hughes, AJ, Swisher?
JackCurryYES The Yanks took “mystery team” for Lee seriously. Now we see why. The Phils trying to swoop in and sign him for less $
I think Curry’s tweets are to give Lee’s camp the impression Yankees are giving up and put scare in them and also send the message Yanks are prepared to move on.
i still dont get all the greinke love. How exactly did he do last season?
Why are no Philly writers on this?
Think logically for a minute.
Roy Halliday, a likely better pitcher than Cliff Lee, makes $20 million x 3 with a vesting option for year 4. The current offers for Cliff Lee are 7 years, averaging anywhere from $20-24 million per year. You cannot go that much over Halliday as the Phillies.
This still remains about shaking out the Yankees. The Yankee “sources” are likely the usual suspects Randy Levine and Lon Trost, who are full of themselves in general and fed up with the process. I am sure this is a reaction to Braunecker’s mention of the Phillies tonight to Cashman and the rest…
When will the owners and their lackeys just let the GMs do the dealing and just keep quiet?
The facts remain that Cliff Lee will be just fine in NY, and the presumed 7 year offer is nothing to sneeze at.
We are at the endgame.
You hear what they want you to hear folks. I’m more sure than ever now that Lee is coming to the Bronx.
Everything that’s going on right now is a ploy to get the Yankees to up their offer.
Heyman – Texas willing to go six years
Cash – We’re not upping the offer
Heyman – Mystery team may be in the mix
Cash – We’re not upping the offer
Heyman – Phillies strong possibility
I’m willing to bet Cashman will release a statement shortly saying that the Yankees will not increase their offer.
So this is Lee’s agent to his client… Soooooo buddy after you make me go through all this now you want to go to the phillies and cut my commission check in half…… Whateva
You Heyman bashers are hysterical, there are numerous guys all over this Philly thing and number one is Jack Curry.
The Phillies probably do have legit interest but I’m not buying that Lee is seriously considering giving them that big of a discount after what they did to him…I’m just not.
Lee’s agent has released the information he wants out and it’s created the frenzy that he intended it to…..this is about getting somebody to raise their offer, whether it be the Yankees or Rangers….my guess is its the Yankees.
RT @incarceratedbob **BREAKING NEWS 3 sources have confirmed Texas will hold a Press Conference in next 24 Hours to announce he’s Re-Signed
————————————————————————————————
From Evan Grant…
Private jet theory: on Cliff Lee. Plane took off from Love Field this afternoon bound for Little Rock and returned to Love this evening.
about 2 hours ago via web
But he follows with…
Sources telling me that if Cliff Lee is in North Texas tonight, it is news to them.
about 2 hours ago via web
I’m not sure why people love Greinke. Do people bother to look at his numbers before declaring him a savior? I seriously encourage you. Go to baseball reference: http://www.baseball-reference......za01.shtml
Now look at the “GS” “Games Started” number. After 2006 he only had 3 full years starting. One was a good season, one was a great season, and one was an ok season.
Now add his anxiety issues. Now look at the asking price. Now ask yourself, is this kid a sure thing and is he worth selling the farm for?
My answer is “No.” Think about it, what’s your answer?
Where is my t-shirt, Doris??????
Ray, I hope you are right.
“i still dont get all the greinke love. How exactly did he do last season?”
————————————————
he is an excellent pitcher. Unfortunately, not for new york.
I am familiar with SAD. While Grienke would likely fit in well with the team/clubhouse. The NY media would eat him alive
“Why are no Philly writers on this?”
exactly…don’t think its a coincidence that this stuff is being leaked to Sherman and Curry etc….
Well, as Rich in NJ pointed out earlier, at least we still have Jesus Montero…..I’m still stunned by this rumor, wasn’t Lee less than happy when he was shipped out of Philly ???? But he did say that he would have signed on with them had he stayed…
RadioKev, i said the same thing.
What is the point of getting yourselves worked up over a bunch of rumors that may or may not be true?
Good grief, let the friggin thing play out.
West Coast Yankee Fan December 13th, 2010 at 10:34 pm
You Heyman bashers are hysterical, there are numerous guys all over this Philly thing and number one is Jack Curry.
——
That’s fair, but Curry didn’t say that the decision is unlikely to come tonight and may come as soon as tomorrow. How noncommittal is that? Why bother publishing something like that to hundreds of thousands of people directly, only to spread to millions of people indirectly?
Doreen
I was (sort of) kidding with the “used” comment. If Philly pulls off a last minute coup, sometimes you just have to tip your cap…
Randy Levine and Lon Trost, who are full of themselves in general
LOL. Loathsome both.
SI_JonHeyman source: phillies rotation, in order, would be: halladay, lee, oswalt and hamels. greatest in baseball history? #mysteryteam
__
This is why people rag on Heyman. He needed a source to tell him this?
Sorry guys, the $ thing simply doesn’t make sense. U can’t put out info that the phillies are involved, they are the frontrunner, and oh, by the way, are offering $60 mm less and expect the yankees to up their offer. That’s simply not logical.
All I can say is if lee chooses the phillies for less money, please, please, please let history repeat itself
You are all behaving like children.
The nonsense on this board has reached an all-time high.
wannabe’d/
Sherman owns the Philly beat.
If Lee left upwards of $70 million on the table, I can only imagine what Braunecker’s reaction would be.
Man would that put a dent in his commission.
Anyone know what deal Phillies offered Lee before the trade?
Well, as Rich in NJ pointed out earlier, at least we still have Jesus Montero…..I’m still stunned by this rumor, wasn’t Lee less than happy when he was shipped out of Philly ???? But he did say that he would have signed on with them had he stayed…
————————————–
I don’t buy it. Negotiation ploy to get Yankees to raise their offer.
don’t do it Cashman.
Screw Cliff Lee. I’m tired of all the game playing. Go get Greinke and save all that money. Groom Nova for the 5th starter. Get Andy to return. Bring back Kerry Wood. Let him go back to that miserable pit of America, Philthadelphia.
Pat M – Montero is good as gone now……and for a lesser pitcher than cliff lee, if in fact he goes to philly.
We can only hope montero becomes felix or johnson and not greinke.
ac1 December 13th, 2010 at 10:38 pm
SI_JonHeyman source: phillies rotation, in order, would be: halladay, lee, oswalt and hamels. greatest in baseball history? #mysteryteam
This is why people rag on Heyman. He needed a source to tell him this?
**************
ac – source means someone else said that to him and he’s not taking credit for saying it. Come on. He is being honest.
“Think logically for a minute.
Roy Halliday, a likely better pitcher than Cliff Lee, makes $20 million x 3 with a vesting option for year 4. The current offers for Cliff Lee are 7 years, averaging anywhere from $20-24 million per year. You cannot go that much over Halliday as the Phillies.”
That’s an excellent point. Unless Lee is truly willing to take (to use Heyman’s number) $70M less – which would be unprecedented in sports and would have the Union committing mass suicide. I would think either the Phils come close to Yanks/Rangers offer (which would seem to be unlikely given the Halladay situation) or there’s no way he would go to Phils.
Phew. Talking myself off the ledge…really don’t want him going to Philly…
I would be more upset if he signs with Texas then Philly. It makes sense for him to want to pitch there. Hope he decides soon so we can all move on.
pat -
I’d tip my cap if he got a better deal from them; not so much if he was just getting the Yankees adn Rangers all hot and bothered, all the while hoping for attention from elsewhere.
I’m curious though. I wonder if the Phillies approached Lee (Hey, you haven’t made a decision yet, would you be interested in talking t us?) or the other way around (Hey, Phillies, we got these great offers, but my client still isn’t over you?)?
West Coast Yankee Fan December 13th, 2010 at 10:34 pm
You Heyman bashers are hysterical, there are numerous guys all over this Philly thing and number one is Jack Curry.
YOU DO seem awfully invested on how John Heyman is viewed. Not tryin to tweak you, but i’ve no idea why this is so important for you?asking in earnest.
JackCurryYES
Nugget about Phillies’ pursuit of Lee: One member of their org told me he wasn’t in class of Halladay or Sabathia and was riskier signing
less than a minute ago via Mobile Web
I hope that you’re right when you say it’s all a ploy possibly to get the Yanks to raise their offer. It is awfully coincidental that Curry was leaked the info first about the yankees being negative and philly the front runner now.
I’m HOPING that’s the case. “All I want for Christmas is my Lee Lee Lee” hahaha, otherwise, we’re screwed.
@jackcurry – what the f does that mean?
Carlo December 13th, 2010 at 10:41 pm
Pat M – Montero is good as gone now……and for a lesser pitcher than cliff lee, if in fact he goes to philly.
We can only hope montero becomes felix or johnson and not greinke.
THAT WOULD BE incredibly stupid.it also would justify every piece of criticism aimed in cashman’s direction on this board. It would be the yankee version of Hanley for Beckett,& that would be as much of a disaster for us as it has been for them.
JackCurryYES
Nugget about Phillies’ pursuit of Lee: One member of their org told me he wasn’t in class of Halladay or Sabathia and was riskier signing
4 minutes ago via
_________
ac – source means someone else said that to him and he’s not taking credit for saying it. Come on. He is being honest.
__
point is this isn’t news.
I might be the only one enjoying this news about the phillies…. This is how bad I don’t want Lee, I’d rather concede next year to the sucks and save all that extra cash and make better use of that for the next 7 years… Also. Don’t fool yourself into thinking cashman is not looking at other options
don’t be surprised if Cash does the 8th year…not out of the question
This blog is about to blow up lol
Hanley for beckett has been a disaster for boston? I did not know that. They did win a world series post that trade so not sure its been a total disaster.
# joeman December 4th, 2010 at 10:45 am
Lee isn’t a given in fact I’ll go out on a limb and say he stays in TEX…mark it down
——————————————————————————
until the 3rd team got into it…..
Chad, where are you to make some sense of this for us?
Also, I am soooooo sick of this guy.
“I might be the only one enjoying this news about the phillies…. This is how bad I don’t want Lee, I’d rather concede next year to the sucks and save all that extra cash and make better use of that for the next 7 years”
————————————————
you’re not the only one. It has been my view the past 3 months
joeman December 13th, 2010 at 10:49 pm
don’t be surprised if Cash does the 8th year…not out of the question
__________
No way he goes 8. Never never.
“Todd Zolecki of MLB.com confirms that the Phillies are a legitimate suitor for Cliff Lee and was told by a source that the club is shopping Joe Blanton, Raul Ibanez and Kyle Kendrick in order to clear salary.”
I don’t think anyone is thrilled about 7 years.
# yankeefeminista December 13th, 2010 at 10:51 pm
joeman December 13th, 2010 at 10:49 pm
don’t be surprised if Cash does the 8th year…not out of the question
__________
No way he goes 8. Never never.
—————————————–
OK
cash won’t do 8. may raise the 7 but will never go above 7 for a pitcher.
“don’t be surprised if Cash does the 8th year…not out of the question”
——————————-
it wouldn’t suprise me. The Yankees ‘word’ is never good. They always cave
Right the extra day of waiting is Lee letting the Phillies dump off more salary.
“don’t be surprised if Cash does the 8th year…not out of the question”
I’ll take the under. As to the final AAV, that’s a separate issue.
But my guess is that the Yankees feel that if it’s about money, they are already offering the most, so why bother raising the offer.
Take it easy:
No decision has been made. The stalling has not been tactics, Lee camp was waiting on legitimate additional offers. All offers are in, and it’s quite possible they were waiting for Phils to up there offer. Dunno if they did or not..
Before crucifying the guy, and pushing him out of NY before he makes his decision, restrain yourself and let the process come to conclusion.
Either way it’s a win win for us.. 1) we get Lee 2) we don’t tie up a ton of $$ on a 32 year old SP.
If 2) we have some plans in the works.. Crawford was one of them yes, but there’s more.
Relax..
Squeakz you are not alone. If Lee goes elsewhere, c’est la vie. He is not worth mortgaging the farm for.
As much as I want Cliff Lee to come to the Yankees, this whole thing has been interesting to watch.
In an era of Twitter, blogs, and the internet, both the owners and the players/agents are using these media in their negotiations to create as much uncertainty as possible. Uncertainty is a classic negotiating tactic, especially when one side is perceived to have the advantage.
The Yankee beat writers are being spun like tops. Not Texas, not Philly.
Again, think logically. If Philly (or Texas) has the better offer, then the Yankees will beat it. They will not be outbid, since they have money in spades, are willing to use it, and don’t yet want to give up their prospects.
What I see, looking beyond the spin, it that the Yankees have the best offer, Rangers a distant second, and Phils an even more distant third. Phils want to hurt the Yankees by making them bid more.
So far, good work by Cash holding steady.
“cash won’t do 8. may raise the 7 but will never go above 7 for a pitcher”
—————————————————
there is no difference between 7 and 8 years, for a 33 year old pitcher. If a team is dumb enough to go 7 years, they will also go 8
Tonight Cashman said that they have made their final offer, IMO, tomorrow he makes a statement about a time limit on the offer if Lee is still playing around.
All u folks who talk about saving money to spend down the road……let me run a few points out there for u:
1- starting pitching is the hardest thing to come by and even mediocre guys get big checks
2- stars get locked up and extended now a days for this reason (josh johnson most recently)
3- the yankees couldn’t pitch from 2004-2008 because they couldn’t sign star pitchers in their prime until CC came along….now its Lee
There aren’t more Lee’s coming to spend our saved money on next year or the year after….so what exactly are we saving it for?
if i were a national league team, knowing why the phillies are dumping blanton, i would absolutely refuse to play that game until after lee is signed. why would the national league teams want to help the phillies get even stronger?
“Hanley for beckett has been a disaster for boston?”
—————
not by a longshot.
We’re talking about a pitcher who was a very big part, if not instrumental, of winning just their 2nd title in over 90 years.
Most teams trade top prospects for just a hope that they can win a title because of it.
Hindsight is 20/20, and I bet the Sox still give away Hanley for a World Series win every time.
“don?t be surprised if Cash does the 8th year?not out of the question”
Why? So he can leave 3 years and $80M on the table instead of 2 years and $60M.
If he goes to Philly, it won;t be about money, years or proximity to Little Rock.
How are you supposed to negotiate with someone like that!
Lost:
please tell your connections, we don’t want Cliff Lee.
Rumor has it that Phillie may just be in the lead right now. I think this is a hell of a leverage play by Lee, and I honestly expect to wind up in TEX. What about you guys?
Crawford was plan B…….
J. Alfred Prufrock December 13th, 2010 at 10:43 pm
West Coast Yankee Fan December 13th, 2010 at 10:34 pm
You Heyman bashers are hysterical, there are numerous guys all over this Philly thing and number one is Jack Curry.
YOU DO seem awfully invested on how John Heyman is viewed. Not tryin to tweak you, but i’ve no idea why this is so important for you?asking in earnest.
****************
I understand Alfred it’s a very fair question. It’s because I hate gratuitous piling on that I feel is unwarranted. And there is a double standard. No one is blasting Jack Curry. And one of my best friend from childhood is a very, very high level editor with a major news organization and he has convinced me over the years that 99% of all journalists have high standards they adhere to religiously. I understand sports journalism is different in some respects. Also Heyman said clearly that tweets are not the same as reporting in SI and that recipients should take them with a grain of salt.
One member of the Phillies organization has said to Jack Curry of the YES Network that Lee isn’t in the same class as C.C. Sabathia and Roy Halladay and would be a riskier signing
Phillies signed Blanton to 3/$24M
it’s not exactly going to be easy to dump the 2/$16M left
they’ll have to eat some $$ most likely
Ibanez won’t be easy either. He’ll make $11.5M this season.
Braunecker is a slut (someone had to say it).
Blanton put up an 84 ERA+ in 2010 and will make $8.5m in each of the next two seasons.
No one is taking that.
“Braunecker is a slut (someone had to say it).”
NTTAWWT
Lost
You really think Philly can come close given their current contract with Halliday? I just don’t see it.
funny all this got out right around the time everyone was expecting Lee to make a decision.
Lost-
Do any of the plan ‘B’s involve trading Montero.
correction:
Joe Blanton has 2 years and $17M left on his deal
so they need to eat around $7M on that deal to trade him and probably more than $5-6M on Ibanez deal.
Kyle Kendrick would be a throw in as he makes next to nothing.
I would be stunned if Lee left any money on the table let alone some enormous amount.
A team that might take Blanton off the Phillies’ hands is the Boston Padres…errrr….I mean the San Diego Padres.
Only 2 reasons Phils are in running, knowing how much less they can offer:
1. Lee needs more leverage against Texas other than a “higher bidder” because, as Cliff Lee and his agent know, he doesn’t want to come here.
2. He actually will take less and go to Philly.
I hope Cashman watched the WS.If so,he saw the Giants win with a homegrown staff of pitchers one of whom was being Joba Chamberlain’ed as an irrevocable mess by the fanbody and media.
Boston dave – that’s what I said about beckett trade – u just didn’t read that part
Carlo December 13th, 2010 at 10:54 pm
All u folks who talk about saving money to spend down the road……let me run a few points out there for u:
1- starting pitching is the hardest thing to come by and even mediocre guys get big checks
2- stars get locked up and extended now a days for this reason (josh johnson most recently)
3- the yankees couldn’t pitch from 2004-2008 because they couldn’t sign star pitchers in their prime until CC came along….now its Lee
There aren’t more Lee’s coming to spend our saved money on next year or the year after….so what exactly are we saving it for?
_____________
Teams are locking up younger pitchers not 32 year old ones. Josh Johnson is 26 y.o. What 32 year old pitcher has gotten a 7 year deal?
The whole point is not to be beholden to free agent pitchers b/c good ones are the hardest ones to come by, and it is going to get worse. In 2 years if our pitching prospects develop and Cash plays it right, we will no longer have to pluck down the big bucks for FA’s every couple of years. That is the wave of the future for us w/a judicious free agent pitcher signing here and there.
Cash needs to up his offer to the $175-$180 range. One last shot in the dark
# Tom in N.J. December 13th, 2010 at 10:59 pm
Lost-
Do any of the plan ‘B’s involve trading Montero.
———————————————–
I hope they don’t trade him ..
God help us if they can move Blanton.
Is Lost someone with legitimate insights? I don’t know him, but seems to be the case. Let me know. Thanks
no way should we go to 180, when they are already the highest bidder.
Carlo,
sorry – I was agreeing with you but I guess I didn’t make that clear. I did see what you wrote and I think you’re right.
“God help the team they move Blanton to.”
Yes.
How do we know that Crawford was plan B? Cash may have wanted Boston to *think* that as a way to drive up the price/years.
“How do we know that Crawford was plan B? ”
Because he has a great slider.
I think Lee signs with the yanks for 7 years and somewhere between 160-168 million…..then Pettite follows a couple weeks later.
No way Cash should or will up his offer or years.
Yankeefem – if our prospects develope, we will likely have one capable starter from the 3 B’s. Like we have one from “generation trey”.
Also Heyman said clearly that tweets are not the same as reporting in SI and that recipients should take them with a grain of salt.
OK thanks.FWIW,I don’t think the writers take seriously what fans say.it’s fun for fans to insult the writers,try reading the comments section after an article is posted, usually it’s people going off.they also probably don’t mind the buzz,even if its negative.speak of the devil,ur boy heyman is on mlb right now.
I agree that Cashman puts a time limit on the Yankees’ offer to Lee sometime tomorrow, if he hasn’t announced his decision.
If the Phillies are waiting to clear salary by trading players, then Cashman needs to move on, no? That could take a while, no?
“Teams are locking up younger pitchers not 32 year old ones. Josh Johnson is 26 y.o. What 32 year old pitcher has gotten a 7 year deal?”
——————-
yes, but how many 26yr old aces are on the free agent market??
your point is a good one, but unless your pitching is coming from the farm system, you’re going to be looking at 30yr old pitchers in free agency.
CC Sabathia was rare, IMO. You don’t see 28yr old pitchers who are among the top few in the game available like that very often.
“God help us if they can move Blanton.”
The Red Sox taking on the contract would show they are all in this year just to keep Lee away from NY.
Definitely should *not* increase the offer. It’s already too much. I didn’t want 7 years, I didn’t even like 6. 5 should be the max for a pitcher his age, I don’t care how good he is right now. I said it before, there is going to be too much money being paid to old players.
BTW:
Yankees saying, “we believe Lee is leaning towards Phils..” you have to read between the lines.. what they are saying is, “we are counting ourselves out and moving on”.. in other words, the offer is the offer and take it or leave it.
Settle down, this is negotiations and either way the end is near.. but before you rip Lee apart, let him decide, reporters are guessing and have nothing concrete. Just maybe this was designed to force Lee to make up his mind.. just maybe..
this is surreal.
TINY HARMONICA SOLO!
“no way should we go to 180, when they are already the highest bidder.”
——————————-
wouldn’t suprise me if the Yankees did offer 180 years
Rich in NJ December 13th, 2010 at 11:05 pm
“How do we know that Crawford was plan B? ”
Because he has a great slider.
________
& all along I thought it was his FB that we coveted, considering our newly acquired love of power arms.
“If the Phillies are waiting to clear salary by trading players, then Cashman needs to move on, no? That could take a while, no?”
No. He has done all that he could. If that’s not enough, so be it.
If Lee spurns the Yankees and goes to the Phillies then I think Pettitte definitely comes back b/c he does not want to leave the Yankees and his “core 4 buddies” in a tight spot with a weak starting rotation after Sabathia and Hughes…hopefully Burnett can rebound to a better year and Hughes improves even more…..with 25 million to spend Cashman needs to act quick and get Soriano to be the 8th inning guy, Feliciano the 2nd lefty, Damon the lefty DH, very part tiem outfielder and bench player, Hairston JR the back-up infielder, Russell Martin the catcher and then sign a 4th or 5th starter type guy for competition with Nova, …..let’s see how it all shakes out come July and go from there…at least we will have a strong bullpen and bench and hopefully Montero will be really good……I wanted Lee but he did get hit pretty good by the SF Giants in the WS…could be a blessing if the money is spent wisely to add the right players…..
Carlo December 13th, 2010 at 11:05 pm
Yankeefem – if our prospects develope, we will likely have one capable starter from the 3 B’s. Like we have one from “generation trey”.
WE’LL HAVE TWO, unless one of those kids gets hurt.seen ‘em both and they both have stuff & can command it.the guy to get the least play of the two on this board,Betances,has a world of talent not to mention he’s an ox on the mound,and the lefty is smooth and now the gun is popping.i’m rooting for good health,only bad will deter them.
Waiting for the announcement – Joe Blanton to San Diego for Casey Kelly and cash. Theo is probably setting it up right now
pompomflipflop BREAKING NEWS: Cliff Lee spotted at Pottery Barn, shopping for table to leave money on.
I’d rather have a trade for Garza than Lee….he wouldn’t cost Montero….and made 20 mill less than Lee is asking
“Settle down, this is negotiations and either way the end is near.. but before you rip Lee apart, let him decide, reporters are guessing and have nothing concrete. Just maybe this was designed to force Lee to make up his mind.. just maybe..”
agreed.
Having his main client sign for tens of millions under market value will not help Brauneker’s career. That would be the most amazing free agent signing I can recall.
Carlo…take over for me and remember…Lee isn’t coming here & Andy is going to retire…Cash will have to roll up his sleeves and get to work…
Lost December 13th, 2010 at 11:06 pm
BTW:
Yankees saying, “we believe Lee is leaning towards Phils..” you have to read between the lines.. what they are saying is, “we are counting ourselves out and moving on”.. in other words, the offer is the offer and take it or leave it.
Settle down, this is negotiations and either way the end is near.. but before you rip Lee apart, let him decide, reporters are guessing and have nothing concrete. Just maybe this was designed to force Lee to make up his mind.. just maybe..
*********
EXACTLY. The Yankees would not be peddling the notion of internal panic if it were real because that hurts them.
They’re merely communicating that they’re willing to let Lee go because they’ve already done all they can do and it’s out of there control now.
Cliff Lee signs with the Yankees tomorrow.
Lost:
thanks. But 7 years for a pitcher who will turn 33 in August, is too much.
I hope the Yankees don’t sign Cliff Lee. And i hope the Yankees don’t trade Montero
Lost – can u clarify for me ur relation to the team/baseball, etc? I need to get some sleep and need to know if I can count on ur telling me to be chill.
“God help us if they can move Blanton”
Wouldn’t shock me to see the Cardinals get a little interested, provided Philly eat about half the salary.
Rich in NJ -
I think you misunderstood me. I’m not saying Cashman should increase his offer, I’m saying if Phillies are legit, and are trying to clear payroll, then he should move onto other things. Forget Lee. I mean, how much longer do you wait for a guy? I say, not much.
Hahaha – joeman, u my friend, are a total jabroni
# JoeyA December 13th, 2010 at 10:59 pm
Only 2 reasons Phils are in running, knowing how much less they can offer:
1. Lee needs more leverage against Texas other than a “higher bidder” because, as Cliff Lee and his agent know, he doesn’t want to come here.
2. He actually will take less and go to Philly.
_______________
You left off the 3rd, the agent thinks this could be enough to get the Yankees to up their offer again.
If the Yankees don’t get Lee, they don’t. Nothing can be done about that if Lee takes either a higher offer (which I doubt) from either Texas or Philly, or gives a discount.
This just seems like big gamesmanship.
Cashman has said no higher. The mystery team suddenly moves into the lead with a report that Lee loves this team. The Rangers are at their limit, the Yankees are probably the only team that could up their offer. Who do you think this is meant to push?
If the Phillies move some of the players, they are probably going to have eat some salary, especially for Blanton. One thing I saw was a couple of teams were contacted about Blanton being traded and the response was the Phillies would have to eat about 11 million. That isn’t going to free up much salary.
Ibanez is only under contract next season. Not a great trade piece, but still doable, but who takes his place?
Looking at the reactions here, it seems the tactic is working for Braunecker. While it may be legit, I’m thinking something smells in Phillie, other than their fans.
“Tom in N.J. December 13th, 2010 at 10:59 pm
Lost-
Do any of the plan ‘B’s involve trading Montero.”
Crawford was plan B, Cash even hinted at it saying that it wouldn’t before the first time he switched from starting pitching to an offensive impact. Redsox played their cards very well.. of course he is going to play it as he never had interest, what’s he going to do say to Sox, “You got me?”.
Yanks have other options.. nothing set in stone but some comforting ideas and conversations.. Montero has been subject of discussions as well as more unannounced of yet..
let’s not shake anything up anymore until we see what happens with Lee.
Ken_RosenthaI It’s (almost) official: Lee has reached a tentative agreement with the #Phillies, he is waiting to see if the #Rangers will offer 8yrs. #MLB
__
so the phillies are offering 7?
Doreen
As I think I posted here or somewhere else, if Plan B is time-limited, the Yankees will move on. If not, waiting costs them nothing.
Carlo December 13th, 2010 at 11:05 pm
Yankeefem – if our prospects develope, we will likely have one capable starter from the 3 B’s. Like we have one from “generation trey”.
__________
If one were a front of rotation starter I would gladly take that, but we have many more pitching prospects in line at all levels now. We had nothing like we have now in the system. Therefore, we have many more possible success stories in waves vs. Hughes, Joba, IPK, and then the big gap because everyone else worth a damn was in A ball. This time around we are backed up pitching-wise going from the top to the bottom of our minor league system.
Ken_RosenthaI
It’s (almost) official: Lee has reached a tentative agreement with the #Phillies, he is waiting to see if the #Rangers will offer 8yrs.
Sucks for Nolan Ryan. He seemed resigned if Lee went to the Yanks. That the Phillies dove in at the eleventh hour must really fry him.
The Phillies and Rangers are both at 7??????????????????
I don’t buy this at all.
It’s absolutely possible that the Phils are trying to make some kind of undermarket bid to see if they can get Lee.
But it’s extremely unlikely that Lee is just going to leave tens of millions of dollars on the table.
Look at the coincidence. Texas makes its final offer and there’s a deluge of leaks about how much Lee “loves” Texas and how much it means to him to be in a “4.5 hour” drive of home. It means the world.
And in turn the Yankees refuse to up their offer.
And now, magically, rather than a mid-market team being the big threat to the yankees, a large market team suddenly appears as the “front runner” even though it is bidding less than the yankees AND the Rangers.
And of course why is Lee considering this? Because he “loves” the Phillies.
Who knew Lee was so sentimental? How quickly attached the player who has been on 4 teams the past two seasons were.
I have little doubt that tomorrow we’re going to hear how the Mariners were in the mix and that Lee is willing to play for league minimum because pitching in the same rotation with Felix meant so much to him.
It’s entirely possible that Lee wants to see how hard he can push the Phils.
But so many of these leaks are absurd.
And the leaks the yankees are sending out in return about being pessimistic may very well be the team sending out clear signals to Braunecker that their offer stands and is not going up.
Lee is entitled to take the time he needs to make the best decision possible for himself. But he can’t have it both ways. His camp is leaking like a sieve with new leaks every day just to try to create a circus.
# joeman December 13th, 2010 at 10:55 pm
Crawford was plan B…….
Fake Rosenthal account
Rich in NJ -
Been out and about a lot and didn’t see that post of yours. Makes sense, but I’d almost rather at this point Cashman tell Lee to forget it than the other way around. (Break up first, you know?)
Lost – can u tell me if their is any credence to montero in a package for josh johnson….some friends at mlb saying they picked up on it in orlando last week
vinny-b:
You have 2 choices really..
Take the risk and pay huge money/years for a top of rotation starter.. or trade away top prospects.. because no matter which way you look at it.. we need SP badly.
I prefer to pay the $$ instead of the prospects.. but that remains to be seen.
Ken_Rosenthal
It’s (almost) official: Lee has reached a tentative agreement with the #Phillies, he is waiting to see if the #Rangers will offer 8yrs.
——————————————-
hopefully, this is legit
mlbtraderumors That was from a fake Ken Rosenthal account. We’ll keep you posted if and when there is actual news on the Cliff Lee front.
__
getting ridiculous with this Lee situation and the fake twitters.
That was a phony Rosenthal tweet.
nowhere did rosenthal say that
but truthfully, if not us, i hope the phillies get him.
I’m not seeing anything new on Rosenthal’s twitter.
You guys are getting trolled by a fake Ken Rosenthal.
Carlo December 13th, 2010 at 10:50 pm
Hanley for beckett has been a disaster for boston? I did not know that. They did win a world series post that trade so not sure its been a total disaster.
HOW MANY TITLES do you think they could have won with a middle of the order shortstop with a career OPS+ of 135? Which went DOWN after a down year? Hanley is a monster, and not a COF but a SS. Hanley is a kind of miracle anomaly. Beckett helped his team win one title and has been a homer-prone slob since.
Kim Jones of YES retweeted the fake Rosenthal
I’m not buying that Crawford at that price was Plan B. That contract is just too stupid.
BloggingBombers The Rosenthal tweet about a deal with the Phillies is fake. The account uses a captial I at the end, not an L.
Hilarious. Well played Mr. Fake Rosenthal
mlbtraderumors That was from a fake Ken Rosenthal account. We’ll keep you posted if and when there is actual news on the Cliff Lee front.
I for one don’t think they(Yankees) ever had a shot at Lee..he was just trying to draw Tex $$$ closer to Yankee $$$$$….
It was so transparently fake…
WHY WOULD YOU WANT GREINKE??? YOU WANT TO ADD ANOTHER HEADCASE ALONG WITH BURNETT?????
BD (Boston Dave) December 13th, 2010 at 11:06 pm
“Teams are locking up younger pitchers not 32 year old ones. Josh Johnson is 26 y.o. What 32 year old pitcher has gotten a 7 year deal?”
——————-
yes, but how many 26yr old aces are on the free agent market??
your point is a good one, but unless your pitching is coming from the farm system, you’re going to be looking at 30yr old pitchers in free agency.
CC Sabathia was rare, IMO. You don’t see 28yr old pitchers who are among the top few in the game available like that very often.
________
That is the point. Teams are now locking up their aces. Therefore, few or none will be available in FA in their prime years. The goal should be to develop from within. I understand the desire to sign Lee, but going forward, we cannot live and die by this model. Cash realizes this, but the farm will just start to sustain itself in the next couple of years. To continue to *need* to sign FA ace pitchers will be suicide going forward.
Can’t wait to see the documentation of these negotiations on Wikileaks
“I don’t buy this at all. ”
nor do I.
LOST,
If Lee signs here, are the Yankees done or are some of those “contingency” moves still in play?
Its one thing to be shunned by cliff lee and left with a putrid pitching staff.
But to be hazed by a fake ken rosenthal, now that’s just intollerable.
greinke had one good year.
It would be interesting to know how much (if any) all the activity on twitter/espn/etc is actually simply a public relations war versus a legitimate method of “talking” to the other side.
I have no intimate knowledge of how GM’s and agents interact but I would think if I was GM I’d actually be speaking to other GMs, agents, executives and would only talk or leak to media outlets in order to attempt to alter public perception.
In other words – I wonder if all the leaks are really meant for the players/agents or are they just meant for the fans?
If Cliff Lee does indeed choose the Phillies, at least he is out of the AL.
I still wonder if he is trying to drive the Yankees price up. I hope that Cashman doesn’t budge.
By the way, I didn’t realize that Philadelphia was so near to Arkansas.
“I’d rather have a trade for Garza than Lee…”
that is pure comedy. like the Rays would EVER trade with the Yankees.
“HOW MANY TITLES do you think they could have won with a middle of the order shortstop with a career OPS+ of 135?”
—————
I honestly don’t believe the Sox would have seen the WS without Beckett in 2007.
In 2008, who knows…
2009 = Yankees all the way
2010 = not the Sox
so, they’d probably have ZERO World Series with Hanley instead of Beckett
it’s all moot, so why discuss it?
it turned out very well for Boston. if you’re suggesting they should have won 2 WS over the past 4 years, then you are out of your mind.
what in the hell is going on in this world where we have fake tweeters??? LOLOLOL
JackCurryYES The Yanks have had internal discussions about Greinke, but don’t think he matches up well with NY. If they don’t get Lee, he won’t be Plan B
Hopdevil, probably a bit of both.
This is reaching comical proportions now. I didn’t think anything could be more surreal than the public nature of the Jeter negotiations, but this has it topped.
# Fran the original December 13th, 2010 at 11:23 pm
If Cliff Lee does indeed choose the Phillies, at least he is out of the AL.
I still wonder if he is trying to drive the Yankees price up. I hope that Cashman doesn’t budge.
By the way, I didn’t realize that Philadelphia was so near to Arkansas.
————————————————
they will go 8 years and more $$$$$$$….offer he can’t refuse
The amount of salary they eat can never match what Blanton has himself already eaten.
boston got beckett AND lowell. both were very valuble to the sox success at the time.
Joelsherman1
1. to make him turn down superior $ from #Rangers and, esp, #Yankees. Might have to be able to trade Blanton or Ibanez to do so (cont) 2 minutes ago via TweetDeck
2. Ok, where do I think things stand: Clearly Lee wants to give #Phillies chance to put best offer on table. Can thet get close enough (cont) 3 minutes ago via TweetDeck
CoreyMac December 13th, 2010 at 11:09 pm
I’d rather have a trade for Garza than Lee….he wouldn’t cost Montero….and made 20 mill less than Lee is asking.
_____
Rays would never trade Garza to us.
Plan B should be Felix plain and simple. He can’t be happy signing that huge contract extension with the promise of them trying to compete and they sucked hard last year and their big signings so far this offseason are Cust and Olivo.
again i say, why would anyone help the phillies get lee by taking blanton ? especially the NL teams ?
GhettoBlaster December 13th, 2010 at 11:20 pm
WHY WOULD YOU WANT GREINKE??? YOU WANT TO ADD ANOTHER HEADCASE ALONG WITH BURNETT?????
AJ’s high maintenance and had an awful year.but the fact is he headcased his way to what stands as the biggest win in the 2009 WS.that is a fact.
Plan B should be Felix plain and simple. He can’t be happy signing that huge contract extension with the promise of them trying to compete and they sucked hard last year and their big signings so far this offseason are Cust and Olivo.
__
so? felix doesnt get to decide if he can be traded.
Wonder if cliff knows its philadelphia, PA and not philadelphia, MS? Maybe he thinks he is going to play in the home of marcus dupree.
yankeefeminista,
I agree.
But the fact is they do need somebody who they can count in over the next 2 years or so. Lee gives them that.
Does that warrant 7/160? No.
If the Yankees sign Lee and end up with too much pitching because their farm system is so loaded, I don’t think they’ll be too upset about that.
If they don’t sign Lee and the farm system doesn’t bear enough fruit, they’ll be spending money on a weaker starting pitcher than Lee in 2 years and still be stuck on 27.
The best part about Lee, aside from him being dominant, is that he only costs a 1st rd pick and money.
They can keep all their pitching prospects and hopefully they won’t need another big name free agent pitcher for a long time.
The Greinke talk is absurd! The Yankees have don’t want him.
they will go 8 years and more $$$$$$$….offer he can’t refuse
***********************
I find it hard to believe that Philadelphia will go so high for a pitcher they traded away and that they would give him that much more that Halliday.
And if you mean the Yankees, I don’t think they will go any higher since Cashman will be bidding against himself.
YESKimJones
Time to leave twitter for tonight after getting duped by a fake. Again, sorry ’bout that. The real @Ken_Rosenthal rocks!
less than 10 seconds ago via web
The fake tweets are too funny. lol.
ac1 December 13th, 2010 at 11:25 pm
boston got beckett AND lowell. both were very valuble to the sox success at the time.
THAT’S NICE, real nice but Hanley Ramirez is a highly unusual talent playing SS.it was not a good long-term trade, in fact it gets worse every year.
Rays would never trade Garza to us
————————————–
maybe they meant via 3-team trade
Joelsherman1
1. I don’t think delay is about drama or extortion because not asking #Rangers or #Yankees for more — yet. think it is about #Phillies (cont) 1 minute ago via TweetDeck
2. Lee has known what #Yankees, #Rangers willing to do for days. Checked in with Yanks to make sure this was best offer and was told yes (cont) 3 minutes ago via TweetDeck
3. All things being equal think Lee wants #Phillies. But all things won’t be equal. #Yankees will have superior offer. So tough decision (cont) 4 minutes ago via TweetDeck
I thought all things equal he wanted Texas…..this is funny.
ac1,
I know he doesn’t decide but he’s the only guy I’d want to deal prospects for. Doubtful we could even get that done after they decided Montero wasn’t good enough for Lee last year though.
Don’t get so worked up about this. It’s more comical than serious the way these feverish tweets are coming out.
And don’t buy the yankees “pessimism.” They are basically just telling Lee and Braunecker that’s it. The tap is dry now. We’re not increasing the offer. You decide.
That’s all that’s happened.
The whole Cliff loves Texas strategy got the Yankees to 7 years. But Lee wants more money. And now they’ve cooked up this whole Phillies situation.
The man who was all about money is going to leave 70M on the table?
If I told anyone that back in november they would have laughed hysterically.
Lee’s camp is trying to generate additional leverage to force a team into doing something rash with one final raise.
Wonder if cliff knows its philadelphia, PA and not philadelphia, MS? Maybe he thinks he is going to play in the home of marcus dupree
————————————————-
lol
and that was a good documentary.
I also have to add i’m pretty blown away at the casual regard here for Hanley Ramirez.we’re talking top 5 player.Beckett is not even near elite and even a suspect No.3 with his problems providing innings.lowell is retired.we are talking about Hanley Ramirez. your position is unreal.the trade stinks.
BD (Boston Dave) December 13th, 2010 at 11:27 pm
yankeefeminista,
I agree.
But the fact is they do need somebody who they can count in over the next 2 years or so. Lee gives them that.
Does that warrant 7/160? No.
If the Yankees sign Lee and end up with too much pitching because their farm system is so loaded, I don’t think they’ll be too upset about that.
If they don’t sign Lee and the farm system doesn’t bear enough fruit, they’ll be spending money on a weaker starting pitcher than Lee in 2 years and still be stuck on 27.
The best part about Lee, aside from him being dominant, is that he only costs a 1st rd pick and money.
They can keep all their pitching prospects and hopefully they won’t need another big name free agent pitcher for a long time.
______
I agree Lee is the stopgap until we no longer have to follow this model. However, in the years that there are no Lee’s and Sabathia’s, if we don’t change the model, we are screwed. 2008 was the most recent, perfect example of that.
“Bret The Hitman December 13th, 2010 at 11:22 pm
LOST,
If Lee signs here, are the Yankees done or are some of those “contingency” moves still in play?”
——
Are you assuming the Yankees are going to stop trying to get better?
Frankly, I am more concerned over Andy retiring, if we don’t get Lee.
Just a reminder: it’s 12/13 we are still months away from ST a lot can still be done.
I know he doesn’t decide but he’s the only guy I’d want to deal prospects for. Doubtful we could even get that done after they decided Montero wasn’t good enough for Lee last year though.
__
Trust me, i would love to have Felix before his 5 years in Seattle is up and Boston goes after him. He would definitely be worth 4-5 prospects. But i don’t ever see Jack Z allowing Cashman to do that.
Cliff Lee is the ULTIMATE mercenary.
If he tanks in NY, he’ll have to fear for his life.
CB:
“And don’t buy the yankees “pessimism.” They are basically just telling Lee and Braunecker that’s it. The tap is dry now. We’re not increasing the offer. You decide.
That’s all that’s happened.”
———
If you read my post earlier, you would see that again we are on the same page.
We also need to keep in mind….the media is a very competitive biz…nobody likes to be out in the cold so guys force tweets and stuff just to be in the flow.
That said, shermans tweet sounded good for us….but if true, cliff has some explaining to do if he wanted the phillies to get close.
Lost,
I take that as a YES!!!
I expect LEE plus much much more!!!
I know he doesn’t decide but he’s the only guy I’d want to deal prospects for. Doubtful we could even get that done after they decided Montero wasn’t good enough for Lee last year though.
__
i dont know about top 5 player and Boston did what they needed to do at the time and it worked for them. In a couple years, they will be able to go sign Hanley anyway.
my take:
the latest reports are bad news for the Texas Rangers. (i.e. now he wants to play in philly??)
I predict Cliff Lee signs with NYY
Trust me, i would love to have Felix before his 5 years in Seattle is up and Boston goes after him. He would definitely be worth 4-5 prospects. But i don’t ever see Jack Z allowing Cashman to do that.
————————-
Probably not but we can always dream. Pretty sure after last years deal falling through Seattle has something against us. Smoak can’t be that good.
CB,
I’m think the Yankee offer is not actually the CC deal and that is where Braunecker wants it to get to.
“All things being equal think Lee wants #Phillies. But all things won’t be equal. #Yankees will have superior offer. So tough decision (cont) 4 minutes ago via TweetDeck ”
Literally a few days ago, all thing being “unequal” Cliff was willing to play for less because staying in Texas meant so much to him.
Now all things being equal he wants the phillies. Ok.
Well things aren’t equal at all. The Phils are going to be hard pressed to offer Lee a huge deal after they signed Doc for an undermarket deal.
So is Lee going to take a 3 -4 yr deal at 60-80M?
Unless the Phils get to 6-7 years their offer is an afterthought.
This is just so blatantly obvious is sort of embarrassing.
If the Yankees are under CC money then Lee really wants to make as much as CC or beat his deal.
I really don’t understand why Lee would even want to go back to Philly after they traded him to Seattle in favor of Lee…especially not for a discount. That just doesn’t add up to me…..I’d make them pay extra.
Lost,
I’m on the same page with you as of my 11:10 post.
* in favor of Halladay*
re: Hanley Ramirez.
That trade worked well for Boston, they won the 2007 world series. It does seem though the only time Boston ever had to give up a TON for something in return.
I don’t think Theo worked that deal. He was off being a Social Worker at the time.
Hanley is SICK.
Not sure the Red Sox win the 2007 world series without Beckett.
LGY,
Crasnick thought that the Yankees weren’t actually to 160 yet….
Right, Prufrock. That one WS is nice, but Boston has been bereft of a SS for far too many years. Since Garciaparra really. Hanley is a stud and Beckett after 2007 has been brutal in the playoffs. & Hanley’s WAR’s blow Beckett away.
BD (Boston Dave) December 13th, 2010 at 10:54 pm
“Hanley for beckett has been a disaster for boston?”
—————
not by a longshot.
We’re talking about a pitcher who was a very big part, if not instrumental, of winning just their 2nd title in over 90 years.
Most teams trade top prospects for just a hope that they can win a title because of it.
Hindsight is 20/20, and I bet the Sox still give away Hanley for a World Series win every time.
///And you would be certifiable.this ‘pitching beats hitting’ thing is a fairly reliable truism.it does not apply in a case like Hanley Ramirez.who is a freak of nature as a slugging SS. He’s an otherworldy talent,and as I said,this trade gets WORSE every year.Beckett’s one WS contribution does not compensate for losing a once in a lifetime megastar who is a short stop?? That’s just an obscene alignment of position and power..that is not worth a lone championship and what is now a mediocre starter and a retired 3B. if you think so, i don’t know WHAT to tell you.
Also agree with LGY and CB about the reason for the holdup.
Cliff Lee wants CC money and the Yankees haven’t matched that contract.
Braunecker thinks they will.
He’s wrong.
Lee signs tomorrow.
Does anyone know if the yankee brass talks during times like this?
Is there a conf call where they discuss and someone says ok “go to such and such and give him this quote ‘we are not encouraged, we don’t think he is coming here’ and leave it at that”.
Do these things happen?
CB December 13th, 2010 at 11:35 pm
“All things being equal think Lee wants #Phillies. But all things won’t be equal. #Yankees will have superior offer. So tough decision (cont) 4 minutes ago via TweetDeck ”
Literally a few days ago, all thing being “unequal” Cliff was willing to play for less because staying in Texas meant so much to him.
Now all things being equal he wants the phillies. Ok.
Well things aren’t equal at all. The Phils are going to be hard pressed to offer Lee a huge deal after they signed Doc for an undermarket deal.
So is Lee going to take a 3 -4 yr deal at 60-80M?
Unless the Phils get to 6-7 years their offer is an afterthought
————————————————————–
yup. To me this adds up to Cliff Lee signing in NYY. If he actually wanted to “play near his home in Texas” he would’ve already signed.
this is positive news for Yankee fans who want Cliff Lee. As it is between Philadelphia and NY, and everyone knows Cliff Lee isn’t leaving 20+ million on the table.
Cashman has to call Hal if he wants to go over a previously agreed upon budget figure.
Question. How does anyone know what Philly is offering Lee in terms of years and AAV?
Lost-
I agree. This is all window dressing.
I do however think these constant leaks are just ridiculous.
He can take all of the time he needs to decide.
But his issue doesn’t seem to be indecision. His issue is that he seems to want more despite the serious bidders saying this is it. So he (or at least Braunecker) are just dragging this on and on introducing mystery teams and now new teams he’s willing to play for for 70M less because he “loves” that team.
Again, he absolutely should take his time to make the best decision and wait for final bids.
But he’s not just innocently doing that. He’s functionally taking final offers and shopping them in the search of leverage which will get teams to bid against themselves.
So part of this time is the time he needs to make a rational decision. But much of this time is indirect offer shopping.
Kim Jones blocked me on Twitter.
I just have a hard time believing that he loved Philly so much (especially after what they did to him) that he would take a significant discount to go back there…..I could buy that argument somewhat with Texas but they are reportedly in the ballpark of the Yankees offer.
“.that is not worth a lone championship”
————–
you are out of your mind.
“a lone championship”
because they are so easy to come by, right?
let’s agree to disagree.
yankeefeminista December 13th, 2010 at 11:39 pm
Right, Prufrock. That one WS is nice, but Boston has been bereft of a SS for far too many years. Since Garciaparra really. Hanley is a stud and Beckett after 2007 has been brutal in the playoffs. & Hanley’s WAR’s blow Beckett away.
///it’s getting caught up in the glitter of the one championship.i could see the argument if Hanley played rightfield.Hanley would have knocked that Monster down.I can’t even debate this any more,it’s too silly.the life of the trade is conveniently dismissed and 2007,to which Beckett mightily contributed,is harped on. But Boston loses this trade. Big time.
Well it’s time for plan Z, it was fun while it lasted. I hope Cash has some tricks up his sleeve.
The only reason I would want the Yanks to get Lee at this point is because it makes it more likely that Andy will come back. It kinda seems like a package deal in a way, although I honestly believe Andy will end up coming back either way. I just don’t see him hanging it up when he’ll know his team needs him.
blake,
Oh yeah? I didn’t see that.
I think he is right. I think that Braunecker believes that the Yankees are willing to top out at the CC deal.
If the Yankees were already at 7/161 I would guess Braunecker would be much more convinced the Yankees wouldn’t go any higher.
The phillies didn’t really do anything bad to him. They traded him. They traded him largely because they knew he wanted to be a free agent and would likely not have signed an extenstion…..which by the way should tell us all what we need to know about how much he loved it there
450 posts on a Monday night late! Get a life, Que sera, sera—— Whatever will be will be…………Let’s move on. It’s gonna happen……
LGY,
That very well could be the case. We never have received anything concrete on any of the offers….this whole thing could be to get the Yankees to match Sabathia’s deal if they aren’t there yet.
Dear Cliff,
“O, swear not by the moon, the fickle moon, the inconstant moon, that monthly changes in her circle orb, Lest that thy love prove likewise variable”
All best,
William Shakespeare
Lee will be a Yankee tomorrow.
I’m out. GN.
BD (Boston Dave) December 13th, 2010 at 11:44 pm
“.that is not worth a lone championship”
————–
you are out of your mind.
“a lone championship”
because they are so easy to come by, right?
let’s agree to disagree.
///
because shortstops with career OPS+’s of 135 are so easy to come by, right?agree to emphatically to disagree. but i’m walking away not entirely certain you’re familiar with hanley ramirez. NM.
CB:
“But he’s not just innocently doing that. He’s functionally taking final offers and shopping them in the search of leverage which will get teams to bid against themselves.”
Not sure that is exactly what is going on here. You can surely speculate that to be the case, but I think it’s more of a final hurrah. Braunecker has been planning how he was going to play this for quite sometime. Boras-like tactics.
Carlo,
It wasn’t necessarily bad but they did ship him out in favor of Halladay….and shipped him to a team he didn’t want to go to, in turn made him move twice when he wanted to stay there. I certainly wouldn’t be excited about giving a team a discount that had done that if it were me….
If not getting Lee means trading Montero, then get Lee by all means.
Otherwise, I don’t care.
This is classic negotiation in the final push.
Getting three teams worked up, and possibly getting one of them to go stupid, its why there was no announcement.
1. Cashman upped the offer to 7 years, giving (we assume) a couple of different scenarios for Lee to choose from. More years, less money for each year.
2. All kinds of talk about how much Lee loves Texas.
3. All kinds of talk how the tax issue will be a big difference in what Lee could take home.
4. Cashman asked if he would raise the bid. No.
5. Mystery team talk starts surfacing.
6. Mystery team is not only in the running, but is a team that Lee loves.
7. Cashman asked if he would raise the bid. No.
8. Phillies outed as mystery team. Lee leaning toward the Phillies, Phillies working it to free payroll.
Just think. If the Yankees had offered a couple million more per year, that was showing that they had money to give that amount for those 5 years. If they have that amount for 5 years, why not for all 7 years?
Add some pressure about the other clubs and see if that shakes the higher rate out for all the years of the longer deal.
If it doesn’t, nothing is lost. If it does its a gain for Lee and his agent.
I just don’t see Lee leaving money on the table in the amounts that seem to be talked about.
I will be shocked if Lee leaves millions to play elsewhere.
This is to see if one of these teams goes all in and offers more. The matching of the Yankee dollars and term would only be fine if it were Texas doing it. The Phillies will have to go higher.
One other thing about the Phils -
They made their decision last season. They traded Lee rather than committing a 9 figure deal to him.
And that was before the monster Howard deal and the huge money they are paying Oswalt.
They made their decision to go with Doc rather than Lee because he represented less money and less risk.
Curry’s source from the Phils reflected what they’ve done materially in action. They don’t see Lee as Doc or CC.
So how does a deal possibly work for Lee under those conditions.
Oh yeah, Lee is all hear and no head. He’s a true romantic at heart and just keeps falling in “love.” In fact, he was once a disciple of Byron and Shelley’s.
Going to bed.
If he’s a yankee tomorrow, great. I think he will be.
If he’s not, no good….I won’t be one of the cheerleaders sugarcoating how this was a good miss though that much I can say right now.
“The Phillies already have over $145 million tied up in contracts for next season, so somebody would have to go if they add Cliff Lee.
Blanton is owed $17 million over the next two seasons while Ibanez makes $11.5 million in 2011 before hitting free agency.
Kendrick, meanwhile, is arbitration-eligible for the first time this winter.
They’d likely have to eat most of the salary for Blanton or Ibanez in order to move them.
It’s possible that the Phillies could heavily backload Lee’s contract, though that could be crippling for the franchise in the long-run.”
- MLBlogs.com
Anyhow, all this is designed to flush him out and get this over with.. look at the sources who is realeasing Phils connections it’s all Yankees affiliates and associates.
i just realized this entire blog is a fake page.
Welcome to the “lohud” bizarro world. just kidding !!!
But the fake tweeting has got to stop. I cant believe one pitcher is causing this much hysteria..LMAO!!
The Phillies are not even that similar to when Lee was there.
Doc and Oswalt were not on the team yet. Hamels was in like a state of depression hoping the season would just be over. Werth is gone. And now they are trying to move both Ibanez and Blanton.
Chase Utley is a huge animal rights/animal rescue advocate. Don’t think him and Mr. I send pictures of deer I shot to my friends are bestest buds.
Who does that really leave? The Flyin Hawaiian, Howard, and JRoll?
Call me crazy, but those 3 don’t strike me as the Arkansas deer hunter type. Ryan Howard would stick out like a sore thumb in the woods.
Right, I was saying this earlier. There are no Philly leaks.
yankeefeminista December 13th, 2010 at 11:48 pm
Dear Cliff,
“O, swear not by the moon, the fickle moon, the inconstant moon, that monthly changes in her circle orb, Lest that thy love prove likewise variable”
All best,
William Shakespeare
///
Nice.
.
How about “To the Mooooooon!!!”
jackie gleason’d/
I’m out….Lee joins the pinstripes tomorrow.
Lee is definitely a mercenary. I will root for him and I’m extremely happy we’re getting him but i don’t think I’ll ever like Cliff Lee.
My dear fellow Cliffy, whither thou goest, thy gait is the slowest!
/Prufrock’d
Joelsherman1 #Yankees are out on Lee. Told going in another direction by agent
Yanks out on Lee per Heyman and Sherman.
Bye Bye Cliff Lee
F him f-ing Loser going to Philly
Filthy home of the 2nd worst fans in all of sports
LGY, Rollins will be a FA after 2011 as well.
If the Phillies were to do something like backload the contract that means that Lee actually gets less. Dollars up front are worth more than dollars years later.
MLB Trade Rumors:
Cliff Lee is signing with the Phillies
wow
It’s strangely comforting to know that no one knows.
Bret The Hitman December 13th, 2010 at 11:55 pm
Lee is definitely a mercenary. I will root for him and I’m extremely happy we’re getting him but i don’t think I’ll ever like Cliff Lee.
NOT A LIKEABLE guy.sort of a smirky shallow type you see in an abercrombie catalogue.or a stupid smart guy who wears nice suits or a second-rate bourgeois writer who shovels out bad “bestseller” fiction to all the dopes who eat out of his hand.but if we land him,he’ll be the man every 5th day as far as i’m concerned
http://trsullivan.mlblogs.com/.....ladel.html
Phillies sign Lee.
Kicked in the nuts
“Not sure that is exactly what is going on here. You can surely speculate that to be the case, but I think it’s more of a final hurrah. Braunecker has been planning how he was going to play this for quite sometime. Boras-like tactics.”
Lost-
I think you said it well, “Boras-like tactics.” And the key to Boras’ tactics is to get a team to bid against itself.
Boras was the master of the mystery team. Braunecker has brought that tactic back to the fore.
But what I don’t see how that’s much different than what I described. Push a team to its “final offer” and then figure out a way to shop that offer even if it requires concocting fictions to get that team to bid against itself.
That’s fine. That’s their right if they want to go that direction. But that doesn’t change the fact that it’s silly and it’s absolutely the search the couch cushions for every nickel strategy.
Which is fine.
He just doesn’t get to use that strategy and get the complete benefit of the doubt. It’s just too obvious.
A few days ago the “4.5 hour drive” home meant everything to him despite the fact he’s never going to drive and will be flying private.
Now he loves cheese steaks and is willing to leave 70M on the table.
And remember – these leaks are coming from his camp. From his representatives. He owns this.
And the Yanks aren’t buying it.
Tomorrow it’s going to be how much he loved Cleveland. He’s going back to the Tribe!
He loved it there!
Ed December 13th, 2010 at 11:56 pm
Joelsherman1 #Yankees are out on Lee. Told going in another direction by agent
_____
Fake Joel or the real one?
Fake Cash or the real one?
Calling their bluff?
I am also on the same page.
(with Lee coming to the NYY and Blanton staying pudgy and lovable)
MLBTradeRumors says MLB.com has Cliff Lee signing with Phillies. done deal.
obviously we need to wait for confirmation
The wait is over. Cliff Lee has agreed to sign with the Phillies, according to MLB.com’s T.R. Sullivan. Evan Grant of the Dallas Morning News hears it’s a five-year deal (Twitter link).
Lee, Roy Halladay, Roy Oswalt and Cole Hamels should give the Phillies a historically good rotation and the Yankees and Rangers will have to look elsewhere for an ace.
It appears that Lee has made up his mind. Time for plan B
Its over – Philly. 5 years
“The Yankees’ final offer was for $150MM over seven years, according to Jon Heyman of SI.com”
Phillies Agree To Sign Cliff Lee
By Ben Nicholson-Smith [December 13 at 10:54pm CST]
The wait is over. Cliff Lee has agreed to sign with the Phillies, according to MLB.com’s T.R. Sullivan. Evan Grant of the Dallas Morning News hears it’s a five-year deal (Twitter link).
Lee, Roy Halladay, Roy Oswalt and Cole Hamels should give the Phillies a historically good rotation and the Yankees and Rangers will have to look elsewhere for an ace.
Seems real enough. Lee, public enemy #1 in NY?
Hope we tread carefully from here, putting plan B into action.
It sucks not getting him but him going to the Philly I can live with.
ON ESPN. Breaking: the yankees are OUT of the ruNNING for CLIFF LEE….
thank god its over.
Dude left $50M and 2 years on the table. Proof he didn’t want to be a Yankee, the f’n hick
Cliff Lee signs with Phillies. Check.
memo to Brian Cashman: don’t panic. And don’t force any short-sighed trades. If need be, wait for the trade deadline and then make a move
Sounds like there may have been a 2nd “angry” Jeter last week or a photographer looking for a payday.
http://www.wtsp.com/news/local.....yid=162323
I love all the “insider” experts. lol
Have we then officially transitioned from Lee Vigil to Montero Worry?
As Tina Turner says: “What’s love got to do with it?”
This remains about the Benjamins.
If they have to get Philly involved, then Texas can’t/won’t up their offer. Sorry, incarcerated Bob, go back to solitary confinement. Jon Daniels prevails in Texas–let us hope. It’s also best for them long term. A young and rising club taking on a 6 year committment to a 32 year old. Yes, Nolan, we know how long you pitched, but enough already.
I can’t see Philly gutting their payroll for Cliff Lee. They are strong without him, in the weaker league. Why? Oh, rest of MLB? Take our salary dumps so we can beat you down even further? Just think carefully about that one. “Ruben, it’s Omar. I’ll take Raul Ibanez for a bag of balls so you can dominate me for the next 5 years. Sure!”
For better or for worse, the Yankees are the team dumb enough, and with enough resources to cover their mistake. Why do they want him? One reason only–he looks like the Mariano of starters, a postseason dominator. They are willing to act dumb because of it.
Cliff–take the cash. Enough already. The team and the park are built for your kind of stuff. Philly? Please.
if theres one positive to take from this it was that incarcerated bob was very wrong
Oh well. There went that post. Unbeleiveable.
Lee, Roy Halladay, Roy Oswalt and Cole Hamels should give the Phillies a historically good rotation and the Yankees and Rangers will have to look elsewhere for an ace.
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Historically good? Perhaps he needs to go check out the 1971 Orioles rotation with FOUR 20 game winners with Palmer, Mcnally, Cuellar and Dobson.
I feel bad for Montero. I hope he’s not traded.
it’s done. Wow. this is almost unheard of.
Confirmed.