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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Gardner still on track for spring training

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Dec 20, 2010 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

ALCS Yankees Rangers BaseballBrett Gardner was a telephone guest on the Yankees Hot Stove tonight on the YES Network. He’s still recovering from offseason wrist surgery, but said he had his first rehab appointment today.

“I definitely think by the time spring training rolls around I’ll be 100 percent,” he said.

Actually, Gardner guessed he’ll be back to 100 percent by early to mid January, which more or less puts him on track for a normal offseason. I know from past conversations that he usually doesn’t start hitting until after Christmas anyway, so he seems to be only a week or two off his usual schedule.

He can’t start any upper-body work just yet, but he’s keeping himself in shape.

“Just trying to take it easy and doing a little bit of running and keeping my legs in shape,” he said.

• No surprise that the Andy Pettitte is still leaning toward retirement. I have a feeling it will be that way until we hear something official about his retirement or his return. Today, Marc Carig heard an estimate that there’s only a 30 percent chance Pettitte will return.

• Heading into the 2004 season, the Yankees No. 4 prospect, according to Baseball America, was infielder Joaquin Arias. Now Arias has been designated for assignment by the Royals. Tip of the hat to MLBTradeRumors.

• By the way, in the 2004 Yankees prospect ranking, the guy listed two spots behind Arias as the No. 6 Yankees prospect was Robinson Cano.

The Astros made their Bill Hall signing official.

• Even with Zack Greinke out of town, the Royals have no plans of trading Joakim Soria.

Associated Press photo

 
 

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203 Responses to “Gardner still on track for spring training”

  1. Vineyard Yankee December 20th, 2010 at 9:50 pm

    The question still remains will someone with the knowledge and experience please give him an extended course in how to bunt correctly and often. If he leads off this year and can get on base he should easily be able to score 120+ runs.

  2. Rich in NJ December 20th, 2010 at 9:52 pm

    Bat Gardner leadoff v. RHP.

  3. Phranchise December 20th, 2010 at 10:00 pm

    Gardner should lead off against anyone. Let’s be real. Jeter doesn’t have the legs and doesn’t get on base enough anymore. This year they need to make the change.

  4. Phranchise December 20th, 2010 at 10:01 pm

    Well maybe that’s overdoing it, but the Yankees certainly need to work out getting guys on base this year for Tex and Arod. That’s where Damon was really missed.

  5. Rich in NJ December 20th, 2010 at 10:01 pm

    .321 .391 .481 .872

    Jeter was still very good v. LHP in 2010.

  6. ac1 December 20th, 2010 at 10:02 pm

    maybe they can use damon as the extra OF.

  7. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 10:03 pm

    Bret should leadoff.

  8. blake December 20th, 2010 at 10:05 pm

    CB,

    Fair enough…the draft pick would go to tampa too which isn’t great either. It could possibly lighten the load on Rivera though…just a thought. I do think they need to address and strengthen their bullpen somewhat if they aren’t going to be able to add to the rotation.

  9. Rich in NJ December 20th, 2010 at 10:08 pm

    I think the decision on whether or not to pursue Soriano could turn on:

    1) how much his asking price comes down
    2) how fragile they think Rivera is

    But losing the 1st rounder would be tough to swallow. OTOH, trading for Soria would likely cost more in terms of value.

  10. ac1 December 20th, 2010 at 10:10 pm

    royals arent trading soria, so might as well put some of the money lee and pettitte arent taking up into soriano and a strong bench,

  11. Rich in NJ December 20th, 2010 at 10:10 pm

    I wouldn’t give KC what they want for Soria anyway.

  12. ZMAN December 20th, 2010 at 10:13 pm

    “I do think they need to address and strengthen their bullpen somewhat if they aren’t going to be able to add to the rotation.”

    I agree… has to be one or the other. People forget how inconsistent our pen was before Wood arrived. Joba/DRob were given chances in the 8th inning and were erratic.

    If they decide to go with a shaky rotation, it behooves them to strengthen the pen. Not to mention, right now, the pen has 2 guys in Feliciano and Logan that are useless against RH. Even if you take the leap of faith that D-Rob is the EIG, what’s behind him?

    Hard to figure what their strategy is.

  13. Rich in NJ December 20th, 2010 at 10:18 pm

    “Hard to figure what their strategy is.”

    I think it’s pretty transparent. There are no major upgrades available at a reasonable cost, so they are looking for bargains while saving their bullets in case some attractive targets become available later on.

  14. ac1 December 20th, 2010 at 10:19 pm

    more concerning than not going for the big guns is that there seem to be so many holes left that need to be filled.

    I wasnt on board wirh Soriano at 10M/year until now.

    I would then get Damon for additional OF and late hitting for Gardner and any back ups that are in…..

  15. ac1 December 20th, 2010 at 10:22 pm

    I don’t know that this will be doable, but here I go.

    Soriano: 3/31, wouldn’t go 4 unless I had to.
    Damon: 1/5.5, again if he would accept that.

    Let Nova be #4, and let Noesi/Phelps and a couple others battle for 5th.

  16. Vineyard Yankee December 20th, 2010 at 10:22 pm

    Repost:

    WCYF:

    Rauch yes. Ah………Cashman is waiting for ? ? …………..Oh, thats right we have nobody and Plan B is patience.

    ==============

    The fact remains no Pettitte, Wood left, Felicano is a LOOGY, Burnett is a head case, Mitre and Nova are unproven as ML SP’s and Joba and DRob have been inconsistent. Is Cashman going to be proactive before ST ?

  17. Rich in NJ December 20th, 2010 at 10:25 pm

    They aren’t going to make any big moves until they know what Pettitte is going to do.

  18. AldotheApache December 20th, 2010 at 10:27 pm

    Let’s see …

    Joba can’t pitch … Brett can’t bunt … Robertson can’t be a setup guy … Cashman sucks as a GM … Girardi is a terrible manager …

    Just another wonderful Yankees winter dialogue. It’s a wonder what some of you get out of this.

    Yeah, yeah, I know. “Rose-colored glasses blah blah …”

  19. ac1 December 20th, 2010 at 10:30 pm

    AldotheApache December 20th, 2010 at 10:27 pm
    Let’s see …

    Joba can’t pitch … Brett can’t bunt … Robertson can’t be a setup guy … Cashman sucks as a GM … Girardi is a terrible manager …

    Just another wonderful Yankees winter dialogue. It’s a wonder what some of you get out of this.

    Yeah, yeah, I know. “Rose-colored glasses blah blah …”

    ___

    Lost cause pal. People just want to complain and think the worst, and act like there is no gray area at all.

  20. Hopdevil December 20th, 2010 at 10:32 pm

    I love Damon…the guy’s a real gamer – a good guy that’s just fun to cheer for. That said, I don’t see what hole he would fill on this team.

    He would be another aging player in the lineup – if we end up needing outfield insurance I think it would be better to deal for a younger, Swisher-like (pre-Yankee) player with upside.

  21. ac1 December 20th, 2010 at 10:36 pm

    Damon can sub in LF when Gardner sits or when Gardner plays CF for Granderson. the bench players dont need to be 20 years old.

    Damon woud also be late inning batting insurance for gardner if he struggles to hit.

    age isnt always the concern.

  22. Drive 4-6 December 20th, 2010 at 10:36 pm

    Yanks 1st round draft picks ’98 – ’08:

    ’98 Andrew Brown,’99 David Walling, ’00 David Parish, ’01 John Ford Griffin, ’02 none, ’03 Eric Duncan, ’04 Phil Hughes, ’05 Carl Heny, ’06 Ian Kennedy , ’07 Andrew Brackman, ’08 Gerrit Cole (failed to sign).

    Granted the Yankees always draft late. But other than Phil Hughes and possibly Brackman, that is one sorry lot. I wouldn’t hesitate to give Tampa Bay any of them other than Hughes for Soriano.

  23. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 10:37 pm

    Just gotta wait and see how it unfolds. It makes my head want to explode lol

  24. ac1 December 20th, 2010 at 10:37 pm

    Why would we give Tampa anything? Soriano is a free agent.

  25. Rich in NJ December 20th, 2010 at 10:39 pm

    Hughes
    IPK
    Brackman
    Cole

    are all smart picks, and each have a chance to be very good players.

    What they did before Oppenheimer ran the draft is irrelevant at this point.

  26. ac1 December 20th, 2010 at 10:39 pm

    nevermind, you mean the first round draft pick we would surrender to Tampa.

  27. Drive 4-6 December 20th, 2010 at 10:39 pm

    ac1

    As a Type A free agent, the Rays get the 1st round draft pick from whoever signs Soriano.

  28. AldotheApache December 20th, 2010 at 10:40 pm

    Damon is a merc. He’s goin to whoever gives him starter money, even if it’s the Pittsburgh Pirates.

  29. ac1 December 20th, 2010 at 10:40 pm

    Drive i figured out what you means after i sent my message.

  30. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 10:41 pm

    I don’t see much of a need for Damon. I don’t see why the Yankees won’t bring back Thames? Did he not do the job last year? I know he isn’t a good outfielder but his bat is dangerous.

  31. ac1 December 20th, 2010 at 10:41 pm

    I’d be interested to see if ANYONE is willing to give Damon starter money anymore. like i said, Yankees have money to spend. 1/5 and see if that works.

  32. JWeav December 20th, 2010 at 10:41 pm

    I don’t care who runs out there. I can’t wait for Yankee baseball.

  33. West Coast Yankee Fan December 20th, 2010 at 10:42 pm

    Drive 4-6. No prospect is a sure thing, including Montero, Banuelos, Betances etc. That’s a pretty sad list but keep in mind we weren’t drafting very high during that time period.

  34. Tom in N.J. December 20th, 2010 at 10:43 pm

    Wasn’t David Parish the pick the Boss ordered after hearing from someone that the Yankees lacked catching depth in the system?

  35. Drive 4-6 December 20th, 2010 at 10:45 pm

    Rich in NJ,

    Those wasted picks arent irrelevant now that the Yanks are left to their own devices. But given where the Yanks have drafted, they may not represent a wasted opportunity as much as they do a lack of opportunity to draft better players.

  36. Sayanora Sal December 20th, 2010 at 10:46 pm

    Pettitte’s retiring only the Yanks have asked him to keep it hush-hush as to not send the message of desperation to any potential trade partner. Not sure anybody’s buying it based on KC’s demands for Grienke.

  37. JoeyA December 20th, 2010 at 10:46 pm

    They aren’t going to make any big moves until they know what Pettitte is going to do.
    —————————————————

    Isn’t that what got us in this situation in the first place?….waiting on one players decision and ignoring other options.

  38. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 10:48 pm

    There is something to come.. I just feel it.

  39. Pat M. December 20th, 2010 at 10:49 pm

    Gerrit Cole….Ouch !!!! I was just spared from going to a Christmas recital tonight…….Now my wife tells me, I could have been in Vegas with SJ….

  40. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 10:50 pm

    Eric Duncan. That leaves me feeling ill.

  41. GreenBeret7 December 20th, 2010 at 10:51 pm

    A’s signed yankee minor league FA, closer Jonathon Ortiz.

    “The A’s signed right-hander Jonathan Ortiz, who combined a sinker and an above-average changeup to post 11.8 K/9 in the Yankees system this year, according to Matt Eddy of Baseball America (links go to Twitter).”

  42. West Coast Yankee Fan December 20th, 2010 at 10:52 pm

    Not only waiting on one player, waiting on Lee and Pettitte. Although Cashman has been floating that nonsense about proceeding as if Pettitte was retiring for a while now. If that was the case — what has he done to secure a starter?

    Last year Cashman admitted 2009-10 off-season was not his best. Looks like he’s headed for two in a row.

    But, to be fair, the off-season is not over yet. Cashman still has time to turn this around although I find it hard to see the appealing options out there.

  43. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 10:52 pm

    Nothing to be done about Lee sadly.

  44. MTU December 20th, 2010 at 10:52 pm

    Pat M.-

    You’re lucky you didn’t go to Vegas. It’s getting flooded right now.

  45. AldotheApache December 20th, 2010 at 10:53 pm

    I wouldn’t be unhappy if Thames returns, but how would he fit in, with Posada as ft DH? Watching Thames wandering under a flyball last season was about as painful as it was watching Damon trying to throw out runners at home.

  46. Carlo December 20th, 2010 at 10:53 pm

    Sorry fellas, but we saw what happened in 2008 when we went with youth at the back end of the rotation and those guys had talent to be life long major leaguers. The projected back end this year is flat out bad and there is no way anyone can try and rationally defend it. Its a problem and passing on deals and free agents while waiting for pettitte doesn’t solve it so the entire “waiting for pettitte before making big moves” theory doesn’t hold water.

  47. GreenBeret7 December 20th, 2010 at 10:54 pm

    Duncan’s trouble wasn’t lack of talent. It was a bad back.

  48. Vineyard Yankee December 20th, 2010 at 10:55 pm

    ‘They aren’t going to make any big moves until they know what Pettitte is going to do’

    ================

    Joey exactly.

    At this point it hardly matters as there is next to nothing left FA wise. If I were Cashman I wouldn’t waste any more time wondering about Pettitte, he knows how to pickup the phone. The longer he waits the less I would give him. If they wait till midseason to make a move for a SP or a RP, it will most likely be too late. I doubt the Sux will be waiting around.

  49. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 10:55 pm

    Carlo what deals are there? Yankees could have given up a kings ransom for Greinke if they wanted to.. But is that smart? The fa season is not very strong. I would like to see more pen arms though.

  50. ac1 December 20th, 2010 at 10:55 pm

    So far they passed on 1 deal. They passed on Greinke. They did everything they could to get Lee.

    We cannot keep giving up 4 players to make a trade when others get to deal for less.

  51. West Coast Yankee Fan December 20th, 2010 at 10:57 pm

    Vineyard – ringy – ringy

  52. AldotheApache December 20th, 2010 at 10:58 pm

    Aside from here, who has said the Yankees were waiting on Pettitte before making any moves or decisions?

  53. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 10:59 pm

    Nobody knows that. It does kinda seem like that though. Pettitte is waiting for what? I think he already knows.

  54. Vineyard Yankee December 20th, 2010 at 10:59 pm

    ‘Last year Cashman admitted 2009-10 off-season was not his best. Looks like he’s headed for two in a row’.

    ===========

    Not his best last year. Non existent this year.

  55. West Coast Yankee Fan December 20th, 2010 at 11:00 pm

    Hey dummy answer your phone!

  56. GreenBeret7 December 20th, 2010 at 11:00 pm

    Name FA pitchers besides Lee that were worth the money they signed for. De La Rosa is no $10-11 mil a year pitcher for the next 4 years.

  57. UnKnown December 20th, 2010 at 11:00 pm

    Well said ac1. Nice perspective of things. Absolutely agree.

  58. blake December 20th, 2010 at 11:02 pm

    Lee wanted to go to Philly, the Red Sox overpaid for Crawford, the Nationals overpaid for Werth, and the Royals asking price for Greinke was ridiculous. Can’t really say there was much different the Yankees could have done this offseason so far.

  59. jacksquat December 20th, 2010 at 11:02 pm

    Nova just appeared to lose some of his stuff as he got into the middle of the game.

    http://www.baseball-reference......;t=p#pitco

  60. Carlo December 20th, 2010 at 11:02 pm

    Sweet swing – I am sorry, but u don’t go from knowing u have a starting pitching issue and trying to fix it with $150 mm on cliff lee to losing another starter to suddenly saying, heck, we’re spending $190 mm this year so let’s go with nova and noesi at the back end of the rotation. they simply will not do that. Its imperative that they protect the investment. They will not sit here and wait 3 more weeks for favre to make up his mind and then say, “oh, is shawn chacon available”? There are guys out there who can help this team. Freddy Garcia is one of them. Fausto Carmona is another. Carlos Zambrano is another. These are not empty the farm type guys and Garcia is simply a one year free agent deal. They won’t, nor should they, sit around like a bunch of dumb mopes waiting for pettitte to decide.

  61. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 11:04 pm

    They could very well be in on some of those deals right now. Nobody knows what is going on behind closed doors.

  62. Yank1 December 20th, 2010 at 11:09 pm

    “We cannot keep giving up 4 players to make a trade when others get to deal for less.”

    I agree… but that’s not going to change at the deadline either. Seattle asked for Austin Jackson for Washburn. Cleveland asked for Montero/Hughes for Lee, yet got much less from PHI.

    Teams trying to rape us are nothing new. Yet people keep suggesting that we “save our bullets” for a deadline deal. Well, we’re going to have to overpay then too, so Cashman has to get used to it if he wants someone in demand.

    Which is why he should be after guys like Soriano who will only cost $$. If he wants an elite reliever at the deadline, he will have to pay through his nose.

  63. Carlo December 20th, 2010 at 11:10 pm

    That’s what I’m saying. The thought that they are waiting on Pettitte before acting on any rotation improving deals is way off base in my opinion.

  64. lounge lizard December 20th, 2010 at 11:12 pm

    If Pettite doesn’t come back, have to get a vet to absorb some punishment. Can’t have a plan of sending your not-ready prospects out to the mound to get shelled in front of 50,00 people. Yes, I know about Tyler Clippard and Matt DeSalvo, but that was emergency, not a plan. Eventually you sign the Sidney Ponson to absorb the beatings in an “ethical” way.

  65. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 11:12 pm

    Soriano really worth a draft pick? I would love for him to join the team but wow.

  66. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 11:13 pm

    Garcia would be that vet.

  67. SAS December 20th, 2010 at 11:14 pm

    MTU,

    You said yesterday that you were about to build an ark. Has the rain calmed down today. By the way, not a drop of liquid all the way.

    It may rain here tomorrow or Wednesday.

  68. Carlo December 20th, 2010 at 11:14 pm

    This falacy of every team being out to rob us in trades has to stop. We do not have the #1 farm system in baseball. We have depth at catcher and we have pitchers. If teams aren’t looking to fill those spots, we don’t match up. Its that simple. And just because everyone on here is excited about banuelos, betances, and gary sanchez, none of the 3 would logically be in the majors until 2013 at the earliest. Both banuelos and betances need 2 more years of innings accumulation before they can even sniff where hughes was this year.

    We had the 15th ranked farm system this past year….and cashman won’t part with montero…..so what do u guys expect?

  69. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 11:16 pm

    Keeping Montero isn’t a bad thing. Not when Jeter, Posada, Arod, all over the age of 35.

  70. SAS December 20th, 2010 at 11:16 pm

    Why wouldn’t Soriano be worth a draft pick? Every team gets lots of them, and few of them work out.

  71. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 11:16 pm

    The Brewers did not give up anything near his talent. That is why it frustrates me.

  72. Vineyard Yankee December 20th, 2010 at 11:17 pm

    Garcia, Carmona and Zambrano. There you have it ladies and gents your 2011 WS Champs, The Boston Red Sux !

    Cashman needs to rebuild the pen while he still can and have the toughest 6 thru 9 inning guys in MLB.

  73. Pat M. December 20th, 2010 at 11:18 pm

    MTU….It’s flooded here in Southern California….I haven’t seen the sun in 4 days….

  74. ET December 20th, 2010 at 11:18 pm

    Damn… we went from having a potential super-rotation, plus a pen with Wood-MO…. to this?

    Can’t imagine the vets on their last legs (Jeter, MO, Andy, Jorge, even ARod) are happy about this. They want to waste their final year(s) with some combination of Burnett, Garcia, Mitre, Phelps, Nova, etc. taking up 3 rotation spots and no one in the pen?

  75. Carlo December 20th, 2010 at 11:19 pm

    Soriano isn’t worth a draft pick? Seriously? Did I miss the memo about the goal for the next 5 years was to win no fewer than 8 MILB titles?

  76. jacksquat December 20th, 2010 at 11:20 pm

    If the Yankees are going to go short on starters, it might be a good idea to lengthen and strengthen the bullpen. I know Soirano would be expensive, but if any team can afford to pay a lot of money to relievers, it’s the Yankees.

  77. disco stu December 20th, 2010 at 11:22 pm

    Assuming Pettitte does, in fact, retire, I am guessing that Cashman will bring in at least 1 low level veteran to help add depth to the rotation. I just cant imagine that the Yankees can honestly hope to contend (or at least hold the fort until July when the deadline deals start up again) with a combo of Nova and Mitre as their 4/5 starters when the season starts.

    Looking at the remaining FA, pickings are defiintely slim – unless you think that someone like Kevin Millwood or Jeff Suppan can come in recapture some of their old magic from days gone by.

    But I did notice one pitcher who is definitely at the crossroads and is a FA after 2011 and I wondered if the Yankees would inquire about him – Scott Kazmir.

    I know his numbers were terrible for the Angels last year, but he is still only 28 and left handed. Perhaps a change of scenery and a pitching guru like Larry Rothschild could help him get back on track. Besides, like the Vasquez trade last year, he is in his walk year so there is no long term commitment for the Yankees.

    I dont think it is a stretch to think that the Angels are disappointed with what he has given them since the ’09 trade with Tampa. With a year left on his contract, maybe they feel it is time to see what they can get in return for him instead of holding their breath that he might regain his old form.

    If so, then the Yankees could either ask the Angels to eat some of his money in 2011 and give them a decent package of prospects or they could pay his entire 2011 contract and the Angels can view it as a salary dump and request even less in return from the Yankees.

  78. Carlo December 20th, 2010 at 11:22 pm

    Jacksquat – its to the point now where adding a soriano type arm to the pen is practically imperative. Then we can hope Joba has a 1H2011 like his 2H2010 and we can use him in a trade in July.

  79. blake December 20th, 2010 at 11:23 pm

    Soriano is really good…he’s worth the draft pick if that’s all it was. The problem is the 4/40 or maybe more that it might take to sign him, plus the 1st round pick, and plus the fact that its a good draft and that Tampa would get the pick. All that combined might make the cost too much for the Yanks….there’s no question that he would make their bullpen really good though at the back end.

  80. Rich in NJ December 20th, 2010 at 11:25 pm

    “Isn’t that what got us in this situation in the first place?….waiting on one players decision and ignoring other options.”

    There are’t any big moves to make.

    If, for example, Felix becomes available, they’ll strike.

    But the chances of any big pitcher (or even fairly big) being on the market for a reasonable price are extremely remote for the time being.

  81. ET December 20th, 2010 at 11:26 pm

    “We had the 15th ranked farm system this past year….and cashman won’t part with montero…..so what do u guys expect?”

    Whether it is Cashman being stingy and overvaluing his guys or other teams asking more from the Yanks than other teams…. the fact is that the trade route is obviously not a viable solution to our problems currently.

    IMO, the “teams were asking more from us” is a cop out that the FO throws out there to the media when they don’t get someone they wanted.

  82. Carlo December 20th, 2010 at 11:27 pm

    4/40 doesn’t sound bad at all. They saved $110 by lee not coming so basically they are paying 2 and $20 for a setup man for two years and 2 and $20 for a closer for two more.

    The draft pick is meaningless to me. our work in the international draft has far eclipsed our work in the first round of this draft anyway.

  83. blake December 20th, 2010 at 11:30 pm

    Carlo,

    I just threw that number out there…it may cost more considering that they’ll probably have to overpay to get him to accept a set up role. Hard to know whether they should pursue him without knowing what it would cost. He very well could be the best option left to improve the club though at this point…

  84. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 11:32 pm

    4/40 would be a hefty price. But damn he would make our pen good.

  85. Carlo December 20th, 2010 at 11:32 pm

    Blake – right, I was saying at that level I would certainly do it. The reason I think he is attainable for around that number is because I don’t see who the other bidders are at the boras asking levels. The big spending teams simply don’t need closers.

  86. Carlo December 20th, 2010 at 11:35 pm

    Gotta get to bed fellas. Talk to you all tomorrow.

  87. Sweet Swinging Cano December 20th, 2010 at 11:36 pm

    Take care.

  88. blake December 20th, 2010 at 11:37 pm

    Carlo,

    The Angels could get involved and so could the Rangers if they decided to move Feliz to he rotation..?

    G’night all.

  89. grouchonyy December 20th, 2010 at 11:39 pm

    Damon’s ship has sailed. There’s no room for him here if he can’t play the outfield (he can’t). The DH position is Posada, a bit of Montero, and a way to give regular a day off. Any extra outfielder has to be a ball hawk. Soriano is worth the draft pick, especially if Andy retires. If there are a lot of “five and fly” pitchers, the pen better be strong.

  90. Eroc December 20th, 2010 at 11:40 pm

    “But the chances of any big pitcher (or even fairly big) being on the market for a reasonable price are extremely remote for the time being.”

    But does that really change in the immediate future either?

    If the argument is that we should save our bullets for a stud to become available, but the reality is that the chances of a stud becoming available within the 2011 season is very slim, doesn’t that make the strategy of waiting kind of pointless? They would be waiting for, in essence, a pipe-dream scenario to manifest itself. And remember, there are 29 other teams who will be all over this potential stud ace with no guarantee we will offer the most (or that the team will like our package better than another team’s).

    At least in 2008, there was a tangible solution (CC) that they took a risk for. They had a target identified and planned to heavily pursue that target. There is no such guy on the 2011 FA market.

    I’m not saying the strategy is wrong either, because Cashman seemingly has no other choice, just that it might lead to nowhere. In the end, the development of these young pitchers probably determines our fate. In the meantime, however, IMO they should be beefing up the pen to make it as easier for the young starters. I still think carrying 2 LOOGYs is kind of pointless too.

  91. Carlo December 20th, 2010 at 11:43 pm

    Blake –

    I think texas has said they aren’t moving feliz.

    Anaheim, as u said, is the concern, but if they sign beltre I don’t see them getting soriano as well when they can sell to their fans having rodney and thus not needing soriano. That’s what arte moreno is all about…..making it look like he is trying.

  92. Rich in NJ December 20th, 2010 at 11:53 pm

    “If the argument is that we should save our bullets for a stud to become available, but the reality is that the chances of a stud becoming available within the 2011 season is very slim, doesn’t that make the strategy of waiting kind of pointless?”

    Does the timing matter? According to most reports, no one is available of any consequence. So they really have no choice but to wait.

    The analogy to 2008 is that there is a solution that they are waiting on, but it’s an internal solution rather than a FA. It’s the develop of the Killer Bs.

    Anyway, as long Pettitte returns I think they can win it all, especially if their aging position players have a resurgence.

  93. LGY December 21st, 2010 at 12:11 am

    “Last year Cashman admitted 2009-10 off-season was not his best.”

    ——————–

    Hindsight is 20-20.

    Once Cashman acquired Vaz, his offseason plan last year looked great at the time.

    A year from now we may be saying it was a great offseason for various reasons. Maybe Lee suffers some big injury and it was great that he went to Philly. Maybe missing on Lee forced Nova into the rotation and he had a great year.

    There is no point in comparing one offseason in hindsight and another offseason without it. It completely contradicts the entire idea.

  94. Pat M. December 21st, 2010 at 12:13 am

    LGY…..Well one thing is for certain, Cliff Lee is in Philly and Jesus Montero is not in Seattle so in that regard we’re ahead of the game…….

  95. DaSaint007 December 21st, 2010 at 12:14 am

    If I’m signing Soriano (and I agree 3/$30M should do it), or Jon Rauch (3/$15M) as my EIG, it’s not just to be an EIG. It’s to save 10-15 games a season to take some wear and tear off Mariano, so that he’s fresh for the offseason.

    I wouldn’t want to waste him on interleague games, or the likes of KC. No, use Rauch or Soriano there. Keeps them sharp just in case, and takes a load off.

  96. YankFanCA December 21st, 2010 at 12:14 am

    Cashman has been all about excuses this offseason and now the Yanks may be heading into the season as a seriously flawed club.

  97. LGY December 21st, 2010 at 12:15 am

    “Both banuelos and betances need 2 more years of innings accumulation before they can even sniff where hughes was this year.”

    ———————

    Betances’ innings high is 121. Banuelos’ is 109.

    If they stay healthy in 2011, they will be in the 170+ range Hughes was in last year in 2012.

  98. Jerkface December 21st, 2010 at 12:16 am

    Granderson, Vazquez, Nick Johnson, no more melky, Hughes and Joba duking it out in the rotation. NJ may have been likely to be injured, but he played his 2nd fewest games ever. And Vazquez was so dominant last season. Go watch the highlights, he looked crazy untouchable, and then showed up in 2010 with no velocity. that was supposed to be a great trade, get a 4th starter as a cy young contender who can eat innings (even expecting a 4 ERA in the AL it was going to be a good deal) and he completely sucked and the yankees weren’t able to get a Type-A draft pick situation out of him.

    That offseason ruled. So what if it didn’t work out? If Granderson smacks 40 then was it ok?

  99. DaSaint007 December 21st, 2010 at 12:16 am

    Current pen: Mariano, Robertson, Joba, Logan, Feliciano, Mitre

    If Mitre is in the rotation (God forbid), then there are 2 slots in the pen available. Cashman could do both Soriano and Rauch actually.

  100. DaSaint007 December 21st, 2010 at 12:18 am

    Of course, there’s always the posssibility of Mark Prior actually making the team out of ST…

  101. DaSaint007 December 21st, 2010 at 12:19 am

    Edit: Postseason not offseason.

  102. YankFanCA December 21st, 2010 at 12:19 am

    Some of you talk as though the Yankees are about to make a big bullpen pickup. Based on what, pray tell? Your own wishes? A complete lack of belief that the team might be done making moves? If it keeps you warm at night, then have at it.

  103. ZMAN December 21st, 2010 at 12:20 am

    “Of course, there’s always the posssibility of Mark Prior actually making the team out of ST…”

    At this rate, we might need him to

  104. DaSaint007 December 21st, 2010 at 12:20 am

    Yes, it keeps me warm at night.

  105. DaSaint007 December 21st, 2010 at 12:20 am

    Yes, it keeps me warm at night.

  106. backbench December 21st, 2010 at 12:21 am

    Sometimes you just have to play the hand you are dealt, and you make the best of it. San Diego used a lock down BP to change the way games were played. The NYYs can do the same.

    Get Soriano. Shorten the game to 7 innings or less for the opposing manager and force the other team to change their game plan. Redefine the game here, to some extent. How often did you here announcers say that team so and so better get something going soon because Mo will be coming in soon. The pressure that creates is tangible.

    Now magnify that to, “We better get something going by the 4th inning because…”

  107. ZMAN December 21st, 2010 at 12:22 am

    “Some of you talk as though the Yankees are about to make a big bullpen pickup. Based on what, pray tell? Your own wishes? A complete lack of belief that the team might be done making moves? If it keeps you warm at night, then have at it.”

    Cash already made the big BP move… he signed Vizcaino.

  108. DaSaint007 December 21st, 2010 at 12:22 am

    It doesn’t appear that any starting rotation moves of significance will be made, so it’s not unreasonable to think that an additional arm may be added to the pen to complement the Feliciano signing.

  109. backbench December 21st, 2010 at 12:22 am

    ***hear*** sorry.

  110. LGY December 21st, 2010 at 12:23 am

    Signing middle relievers almost never work out.

    Unless the Yankees can find someone on a 1 year deal it is not worth the money or the opportunity cost of being forced to stick with a reliever because you are paying him a lot of money.

  111. DaSaint007 December 21st, 2010 at 12:23 am

    I wouldn’t mind it if he signed Jose Veras to a minor league contract with an invite to ST. Had pretty good numbers last year for Cleveland.

  112. DaSaint007 December 21st, 2010 at 12:25 am

    LGY- yes Karsay, Farnsworth, and Marte fit that description.

  113. DaSaint007 December 21st, 2010 at 12:26 am

    Is it possible that the organization really has that much faith in Joba?
    Robertson, I get, but Joba?

  114. YankFanCA December 21st, 2010 at 12:28 am

    I hate to say it, but if the No. 4 and 5 starters are Nova and TBD (other than Pettitte), this team isn’t going anywhere in 2011. Too many 4 – 5 inning starters and no depth whatsoever to the rotation. It’s an unpleasant outlook.

  115. 4time December 21st, 2010 at 12:30 am

    “Is it possible that the organization really has that much faith in Joba?
    Robertson, I get, but Joba?”

    If they don’t add anyone else to the pen, especially from the right side, that’s what they will be telling you… that they believe Joba can play a significant role in the pen.

    Even if they like Robertson… you can’t live with 1 reliever. Doesn’t help that two of our relievers (Feliciano/Logan) are worthless against righties and are strictly matchup guys.

  116. MoRings42 December 21st, 2010 at 12:33 am

    If Pettitte retires, we’re done for 2011. Even with him, we have a slight chance but we’re still in a hole.

    Either Cashman pulls off a miracle trade or it’s going to be a rehash of 2008 with the “Future starter” nonsense.

    This offseason has become very depressing in Yankee land.

  117. Yank 97 December 21st, 2010 at 12:33 am

    Rivera, Robertson, Joba, Logan, Feliciano, Mitre, Vizcaino?

    With a CC, Hughes, Burnett, Nova, and Phelps/Garcia/Warren rotation?

    Yikes.

  118. G. Love December 21st, 2010 at 12:34 am

    If Soriano would come here for 4 years and 40 million and be willing set up Mo and close on Mo’s off days in the beginning of the deal then I would grab him right now and not look back.

    We’re looking at a 3-5 of our rotation without Andy that probably won’t make it past the 5th inning the majority of the time.

    The only way to win with the team presently constructed is with overwhelming offense and a bullpen that locks the game and leads down like a vice.

    That said, Cashman won’t sign him and Soriano probably won’t want to set up for Mo. It’s a pipe dream.

    The cold reality is that there isn’t much that can be done at this point to help the rotation.

    We lost our 8th inning guy and I doubt Soriano is the solution.

    This is going to be a scary off season for a lot of fans. I, for one, have little faith in 1, let alone all 3, of the killer B’s jumping from AA to the majors and being productive.

    I actually hope we sign Millwood just for the fact that at least we know he’ll give up 5 runs a game on average and can pitch into the 6th if we let him get lit up like that every night. He’s not a young pitcher who gives up runs early and loses composure and needs to be bailed out in the 2nd and 3rd. Millwood at least can go further in the game if you don’t yank him at the first sign of trouble.

    It’s a sad statement that on 12/21/10 I’m sitting here hoping we sign a guy who can average 5 runs a game and give us poor innings.

    Cashman needs to make a deal for a starter if there’s one out there. Hoarding prospects for mythical mid season deals for aces is about as sound as putting all your eggs into the Cliff Lee basket.

  119. BTX December 21st, 2010 at 12:42 am

    “Hoarding prospects for mythical mid season deals for aces is about as sound as putting all your eggs into the Cliff Lee basket.”

    Yet a lot of fans think this is a viable option. It is even worse than putting eggs in the Lee basket considering they had a high probability of signing Lee considering he was a FA. It was still was extremely dumb, but you could understand it. Waiting for this mythical ace, as you say, to hit the market in July is a failing strategy.

    Chances are, the same cast of characters that are available now will be available then, maybe even less (i.e. if the Chi Sox or Rays are in contention, why would they trade any of their productive starters?) and Cashman will be 10x more desperate if we’re sputtering and will end up paying more.

    Good luck to him if he thinks Freddy Garcia, Sergio Mitre, and some 2nd tier prospects will take us to the playoffs. We are closer to Tampa/Toronto than we are Boston.

  120. 4time December 21st, 2010 at 12:45 am

    G. Lovve,

    You bring up a great point – under this “plan”, we’re going to be in the pen early basically every game CC doesn’t pitch (or Hughes, perhaps). And our pen, sans Wood, is far from solid.

    If this is indeed the “plan”, it is even worse than 2008.

  121. Jerkface December 21st, 2010 at 12:48 am

    Chances are, the same cast of characters that are available now will be available then, maybe even less (i.e. if the Chi Sox or Rays are in contention, why would they trade any of their productive starters?) and Cashman will be 10x more desperate if we’re sputtering and will end up paying more.

    First of all, why would the Sox trade anyone now after they just spent a billion dollars making another run at a WS this off-season? Second of all, the Rays won’t trade with us so who cares about them. If cashman could trade for a starter he will. If the prices are too high for the talent coming back he won’t. And by the deadline teams that were in contention or planning to be won’t be anymore.

  122. Hopdevil December 21st, 2010 at 12:51 am

    The worst part is this: with just slight, marginal improvements from Tex, A-Rod, Jeter, Granderson, AJ, Hughes…this team would be a 105 game winner.

    /wrists

  123. Captain Clutch December 21st, 2010 at 12:55 am

    I think Cashman is going to have to bite the bullet and overpay for a starting pitcher(not Montero or the 2 b’s). If he finds a team willing to listen on a pitcher that is good but not great ie. Floyd, Jackson or a Garza type he has to pull the trigger. I know he would love to keep every single one of his prospects but that is not going to happen and some have to be used to fill needs. I am not saying to go crazy and offer up anyone but if he can get a good pitcher that he thinks is worth giving up a little extra he has to do it. I am sure he has been trying behind the scenes but we havent heard any rumors at all. Even hearing them interested in a starting pitcher would be nice. It’s too quite in Yankee land.

  124. West Coast Yankee Fan December 21st, 2010 at 12:55 am

    So many questions. Barring an unforeseen trade I’m afraid Cashman is going to try and round out the rotation from within. What does that mean? Nova and Mitre? Who is our eighth inning guy? Whose spelling A-Rod and Jeter that can hit and play defense?

    It kills me to read this from Heyman, but he may be right:

    “Word is that Pedroia and Youkilis are progressing nicely. Been a great winter for Red Sox all around. For Yankees, not so much”.

  125. Pat M. December 21st, 2010 at 12:56 am

    Well they won with Joba 6th / Robertson 7th / Hughes 8th / Mariano 9th…..Joba and Robertson have to be primed to move up an inning in their roles ……Well shouldn’t they ???

  126. Yank 97 December 21st, 2010 at 12:57 am

    “Even hearing them interested in a starting pitcher would be nice. ”

    Everyone is too expensive these days, apparently, either money or prospect wise.

  127. West Coast Yankee Fan December 21st, 2010 at 1:02 am

    If would be great if Joba or Robertson could fill the 8th inning roll. It’s that day in and day out consistency I haven’t seen from either.

  128. jacksquat December 21st, 2010 at 1:09 am

    I’m not very down on Joba or Robertson like some here, but I’d like a top guy for the 8th if the starting rotation is going to be like it is looking it’s going to be.

  129. Yank 97 December 21st, 2010 at 1:10 am

    The pen was erratic until Wood arrived.

    And remember, in the first half last year, we were getting great length from everyone. CC/Andy/Vazquez were going 7 almost every time out. Even Hughes was doing well and going at least 6.

    I wouldn’t count on that being the case if we go the 2 rookie route, as G.Love mentioned.

  130. Captain Clutch December 21st, 2010 at 1:14 am

    Cashman would never spend $10m on a set up guy. That’s crazy. If he doesn’t improve the starting rotation 3 of the guys could have trouble even getting a lead to the bullpen. Cash should sign Rauch. I haven’t heard his name mentioned at all. I wonder if that’s because he is asking for too much money.

  131. G. Love December 21st, 2010 at 1:18 am

    The problem with relying on Joba and Robertsen is we’ve seen what happens to them with overuse.

    The way the starting staff is assembled at the moment, the bullpen will have their arms hanging out of the sockets by mid June.

    Right now, without a solid 8th inning type and without innings eaters in the back of the rotation, the pitching staff is a mess.

    Yes, CC to Mo looks spiffy. That’s 1 out of 5 starts. I’m banking on Hughes being a solid 7 inning starter too.

    It’s 3-5 I’m terrified about. The pen will be toast.

    Now that’s not abnormal in the AL. Most teams don’t go 5 deep in their rotation and the pen gets burnt trying to survive the innings from the back end of the rotation.

    But the Yankees are not most teams.

    I really feel in my heart that this off season has gone so totally wrong for the Yankees that it’s probable that something great is about to happen for this team.

    Maybe some team loves the prospects and puts up a real starter realizing the Yankees are willing to mortgage part of the future here.

    This can’t be the pitching staff. Something’s gotta give. I just can’t believe the Yankees are going to sell this rotation to the fans under the guise “wait till July and we’ll get an Ace!”.

    It’s too risky with all the money on the line at the gate.

    Maybe it’s wishful thinking, but I’m slightly more optimistic that something is coming.

    Because right now, the pitching staff is a complete mess and indictment of a front office that should have prepared better for this.

  132. LGY December 21st, 2010 at 1:21 am

    Why is everyone so focused on trading for an Ace?

    The Yankees already have one in CC.

    They just need depth behind their ace, which may come now or may come at the deadline.

  133. Pat M. December 21st, 2010 at 1:29 am

    G. Love…I’m starting to think that Cashman is determined to fill the pen slots from within with guys like Brackman, Noesi etc….The rotation is a concern of course, as I still feel that Pettite is unlikely returning ….The Clemens trial carries much weight on him as well as the club…..Bench is sofy and void of any power…..The bright side is they signed Martin who is going to be a hit in The Bronx and with Yankee fans……When was the last time the Yanks payroll was below 200 million ????

  134. jacksquat December 21st, 2010 at 1:42 am

    @MLBRumorCentral Yankees not in on Garza, Floyd, Jackson, but are eyeing a former ERA champ #mlb http://es.pn/fARn9l

    Who is this?

  135. jacksquat December 21st, 2010 at 1:45 am

    Oh, is that Freddy Garcia?

  136. 4 NYY December 21st, 2010 at 1:51 am

    Bring on St and the young guns !!! I really feel one or two of the young pitchers can make it this year. I don’t care if he’s 19 or 20 yrs. old. Wouldn’t be the first time in MLB history. Too much babying of these guys. All because of money. Same for Montero, if he earns it this spring, let’s go with him at part-time DH and PH while catching a little at least.

    Gardner probably will lead off.

    Jeter will rebound. ( How high? )

    Need some bench strength. Maybe a Laird will show up.

  137. Pat M. December 21st, 2010 at 1:55 am

    Freddy Garica, oh my !!!! If we’re searching the bargin bin, is Freddy a better option than Kevin Millwood ???

  138. Vineyard Yankee December 21st, 2010 at 2:14 am

    This is completely nutso talk, Garcia, Millwood etc. scrap heap garbage. For the 204th time, strengthen the pen, a combo of Rauch, Soria, Soriano, Fuentes to give us the toughest 6 thru 9 innings in MLB.

    Good nite.

  139. Ed December 21st, 2010 at 2:14 am

    “@MLBRumorCentral Yankees not in on Garza, Floyd, Jackson, but are eyeing a former ERA champ #mlb http://es.pn/fARn9l

    according to Wikipedia, it could be either Millwood or Garcia. ewww?

  140. Pat M. December 21st, 2010 at 2:25 am

    Edwin Jackson would be a nice addition to the Yanks rotation but apparently he’s not on the to do list …….

  141. Vineyard Yankee December 21st, 2010 at 2:41 am

    Edwin Jackson a career sub .500 picher who gives up 4 walks per 9 innings with a career 4.62 ERA, sounds almost like another guy we have……………..AJ Burnett. BUILD THE PEN !

  142. Pat M. December 21st, 2010 at 2:45 am

    Vineyard…I rather him than Garcia or Millwood…..My hope is that somehow Cashman can get Zambrano at a good price…..

  143. YsGuy December 21st, 2010 at 2:49 am

    im up moon-watching but its nice to know that when im usually dead asleep, in the middle of december, people are still her grinding over milwood vs edwin nunez.

    its a beautiful Orange Moon!

  144. YsGuy December 21st, 2010 at 2:49 am

    jackson, sorry half asleep

  145. Vineyard Yankee December 21st, 2010 at 3:03 am

    Build the pen and shorten the game.

  146. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 7:05 am

    SAS-

    Sorry I missed your question last eve about the rain out here.

    The answer is no. It hasn’t stopped and much like Pat M. I haven’t seen the Sun in days.

    I continue working diligently on my Ark in the hope that I can have it ready in time.

    ;)

  147. Doreen December 21st, 2010 at 7:27 am

    Morning, MTU.

    Sorry to hear about your soggy state.

    We’ve just got cold.

    I didn’t manage to stay up for the lunar eclipse last night. I collapsed (and actually made it up to bed, rather than stay on the sofa) at about 10 pm. This time of year really wears me out!

  148. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 7:29 am

    So far this off season If it wasn’t for bad luck the Yankees would have no luck at all.

    Andy. Are you really gonna retire ?

    Bummer if you do. The team really needs you for one more go around.

    Please don’t make the Yankees go dumpster diving for a Pitcher.

    If you have to hang ‘em up then I guess we’ll have to understand.

    :(

  149. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 7:34 am

    Doreen-

    I’m working on growing some Gills.

    In 2005 we had a 100 year flood event.

    It was on National TV. Some people’s homes were actually swept into the river.

    This year is on a similar track at this point.

    Our home sits on a Mesa 600 feet above the river.

    I want to get out there as soon as possible so I can Photograph the awesome power of Nature. There will be waterfalls where there aren’t normally any.

    Maybe by Thurs. or Fri. if all goes well.

  150. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 7:45 am

    Doreen-

    So what do you think ? What are the Yanks gonna do about there Picthing in 2010 ?

  151. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 7:46 am

    edit: “their” not “there”. sorry.

  152. austinmac December 21st, 2010 at 7:49 am

    The Daily News lists the pitchers of interest to the Mets, Garcia, Young and perhaps Webb. At this point, I suspect the “price” pf all of them will be too high. But, then again, what isn’t this year. As I recall the “price” was too high at the deadline last summer as well. Cashman is maybe expecting a post-holiday sale.

    Don’t worry though. This year, after 100 or more games are played, the Yankees will again look at the market.

  153. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 7:52 am

    Austin-

    Morning.

    What do you think the Yanks should do at this point ?

    Do you see a solution ?

  154. blake December 21st, 2010 at 7:57 am

    Wonder if the braves would trade juirjins….?

  155. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 7:59 am

    Options:

    1 Go with the Kids (Not likely IMO), and try to acquire someone at the TD.

    2 Go dumpster diving for a starter now.

    3 Beef up the Pen and strengthen the offense even further.

    4 Pull a Rabitt out of a hat

    5 Forfeit the season

    6 None of the above

  156. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:00 am

    Morning Blake-

    Wasn’t Jurrjens injured last season ?

  157. Doreen December 21st, 2010 at 8:01 am

    MTU -

    Sorry for the lag – getting daughter ready for school.

    As far as the Yankees and their 2011 pitching, well, I haven’t a clue. :lol:

    Whatever they do will be fine with me, if only because I’m not clever enough to come up with alternatives. I don’t know enough about the pitchers who may be available; I don’t know enough to know whether a deal is a good one or a fleecing (especially where other people’s minor leaguers are concerned). I stay out of that end of it.

    I would have liked to have had Lee; I was iffy on Greinke because of the cost/risk ratio; I’m warming to the idea that a Zambrano could work here; and I don’t think it’s a bad idea to get a back-end of the rotation veteran on a one or two year stay (but that’s what Javy was supposed to be before his arm decided to die on us last season). Pitching is a crapshoot. I’d be okay with Nova or an equivalent in the back of the rotation. I never thought Andy was coming back, but I’ve had my fingers crossed that I’d be wrong.

    As far as the bullpen goes, it would have been nice for Wood to come back, but he was a pleasant surprise last summer, not a given, and it’s just as likely he wouldn’t be as effective this year as he was last year. I think Robertson will be good. I have no idea what to expect from Joba. I like Cashman’s system of going into the minors to fill the bullpen – middle relievers and bridges to Mariano that he’s paid for have more often than not turned sour – the longer the deal, the sourer they turned and the more quickly they turned.

    I’m not overly worried about the bench, because I think that that’s something that can be addressed better during the season. I think there’s a lot of veterans who still want a shot at being more regular players and who won’t resign themselves to bench duty until it becomes apparent that’s all that’s left.

    It’s not worth getting aggravated over the situation. The games have to be played and you can’t write off a season before a pitch is thrown. I never feel the Yankees owe me a world series. They don’t even owe me a winning season, though it’s a lot more fun to watch when they’re winning.

    There’s a little too much “they better win or else” feeling in sports today, in general, than I remember.

  158. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:02 am

    Blake-

    Only 116 IP in 2010.

    ?

  159. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:05 am

    Doreen-

    When the Yanks whiffed on Lee it blew a hole in the USS Yankee
    amidships and we’ve been taking on water ever since.

    :(

  160. blake December 21st, 2010 at 8:06 am

    MTU,
    Yea a bit. I think he’s fine now though. He’s good and about to hit arbitration….still has upside. Braves would probably have a lot of interest in Gardner but that just opens up another hole. Gardner would be great for the Braves……but then he’s pretty good for the Yanks as well.

  161. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:06 am

    And Cashman did not appear to have the lifeboats ready.

    :(

  162. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:08 am

    Blake-

    I wouldn’t trade GGBG for Jurrjens at this point.

    And you’re right it would just open up another gaping hole which isn’t gonna be filled by Kemp, Rasmus, or Upton.

  163. Bronx Jeers December 21st, 2010 at 8:10 am

    “Our home sits on a Mesa 600 feet above the river.”

    You may be the His choice for the role of Noah in case He decides to do a revival of that particular performance. :wink:

    I do love how Pat M complains that he hasn’t seen the sun in 4 whole days. It’s good to live in So-Cal.

    The Yanks rotation? Step 1 is pray for Pettitte. If that fails I suspect they’ll probably pick someone up that many will not like and then fill in the last spot with the winner of a Spring competition.

  164. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:12 am

    Jeers-

    I like the idea of growing Gills better than building an Ark.

    It’s a lot less work.

    How have you been ?

  165. disco stu December 21st, 2010 at 8:12 am

    I wonder if the Yankees are being a little short sighted in evaluating the cons of bringing in Rafael Soriano. Yes, on paper they would be paying him closer money to setup up Mo and you can certainly understand their thinkng that it makes little sense to do that.

    However, we have all seen how cautious the team is now with not wanting to overuse Mo these days and over the past few seasons there have been times where they have either had to sit him for extended periods because of nagging health issues. And he is not getting any younger … even though he is still incredible when he does pitch.

    Would not having Soriano give the Yankees more of a luxury to keep Mo’s workload at a comfortable level for him during the season? Just think how much more fresh he would be down the stretch and hopefully into October. Besides, if the worst case scenario would to ever happen and Mo is lost for an extended period of time, the Yankees would have the best possible “in house” option available to fill in for him while he is hurt (instead of having to trade for someone like a Soriano).

    I just think that the money they pay Soriano buys them a lot more than just Mo’s setup man.

  166. blake December 21st, 2010 at 8:13 am

    MTU,

    right. If you have a deal in place for one of those guys you mentioned or a suitable replacement for Gardner then you could consider it….but otherwise you really can’t right now.

  167. Mell December 21st, 2010 at 8:14 am

    “Wasn’t Jurrjens injured last season ?”

    Missed May then suffered torn meniscus towards the end of the season. Supposed to be good to go for ST.

    Kinda doubt Braves would look to move him. Pretty good #4, and the Braves believe they can compete for a playoff spot.

  168. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:15 am

    Blake-

    So, for the time being, it’s “check” again.

    Let’s not get to “checkmate” please.

    ;)

  169. Doreen December 21st, 2010 at 8:16 am

    MTU -

    It was actually Werth who blew a hole in a lot of ships.

    I do believe Crawford was Plan B. But once the price got ridiculous, that become less attractive. Still if the Red Sox don’t sign him up, he may still have been a viable Plan B.

    Getting Crawford frees up Gardner or whoever to include in a trade without blinking an eye.

    The problem here on this blog is that no one here knows the internal discussions that go on inside Yankeeland. No one has the same information they do. I’m not upset they didn’t get Greinke. I didn’t think they needed Crawford. I did think Lee was important, but ultimately it was not Cashman’s fault that Lee is not here, unless one thinks Cashman should have gone to 8 years and a gazillion dollars for a 32 year old pitcher who may or may not have an issue with his back. I think it killed Cashman to include the 7th year. Notice the Phillies did not have to do that.

    Thing is there’s not much out there this season. And I would rather not sell the farm (unless it’s for a Felix Hernandez – and even then, I’m still hesitant just because pitchers don’t always travel well).

  170. Betsy December 21st, 2010 at 8:19 am

    GLove, I fear you are right about this pen. Even if Phil does become a 7 inning pitcher, that’s 2 out of 5 spots – you’re right; the pen is going to be exhausted after the first month of the season. That’s just reality. Cashman is going to have to find an innings-eater somewhere…….period.

  171. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:20 am

    Doreen-

    I understnad what you are saying.

    Very reasonable position.

    I don’t agree with all of it, or I might add a footnote or two.

    So I guess you’re indicating Choices 1 or 2 from my list above ?

  172. Bronx Jeers December 21st, 2010 at 8:21 am

    MTU,

    I like the idea of taking to the sea but I’d probably prefer to remain a mammal. I recall hearing about a theory that our lack of body hair suggests that we may have evolved from a sort of aquatic monkey.

    That’s my first choice. :wink:

  173. Doreen December 21st, 2010 at 8:21 am

    Disco Stu -

    I don’t think Soriano wants to be a set up guy for two years. Unless something happens to Mo (Heaven forbid), that would be his situation. Setting up with some closing opportunities. If he signs for 4 years, that’s too far in the future, I think for the Yankees to commit to someone who wouldn’t even be doing the job he should be doing for the first 2 years of his contract.

    And all that is moot, because Soriano wants to close and will close somewhere.

    Everyone acts as if Mo is a given because he’s been so consistently excellent throughout his career. But the last two years they’ve had to really had to take care of him and they really could use a second closer. Maybe Brackman can fill the role? I don’t know. I think Mo is moving toward question mark status. I know this is Yankee heresy, but how can anyone not start to think this way?

  174. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:22 am

    Option 7

    AP returns, and 1-6 become moot.

    I like that one the best.

    :)

  175. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:23 am

    Jeers-

    I’m goin’ with the “Waterworld” thing ala Costner.

    ;)

  176. austinmac December 21st, 2010 at 8:23 am

    MTU,

    How are things on Mt. Ararat?

    I see two options at this point. Either sign Soriano and add an injury plagued pitcher and pray or trade for Zambrano, add Rauch and pray. In keeping with the ark theme, bring them in by twos.

  177. Doreen December 21st, 2010 at 8:23 am

    MTU -

    Based on your list, and at this point in time, yeah, I think the more likely scenario is 1 and 2. If I have to choose.

  178. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:28 am

    Mac-

    Other than needing the aforementioned ” Waterworld” changes fine.

    Zambrano is a loose cannon. If Rothschild told Cash that he could tame the raging bull then maybe Cash pulls the trigger on that one.

    That’s kind of out there though IMO.

    If Rauch is the best we can do and doesn’t cost too much then I’m fine with him.

    So far. Not a lot of options especially good ones.

    Let’s just forget this and go Winter hiking at RMNP.

    :)

  179. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:29 am

    Doreen-

    You don’t have to choose but Cashman does.

    ;)

  180. Mell December 21st, 2010 at 8:30 am

    MTU:

    Option 7 seems the most likely scenario.

    Still think the White Sox might be open to moving a starter. With the addition of Crain, they’re up around $110M to 16 guys, not including what should be $5M+ arb 2 awards for Danks and Quentin. Maybe they’re all-in enough for 2011 to carry a $125M or so payroll, but their recent history suggests they’re more comfortable in the $100M – $110M range.

  181. 108 stitches December 21st, 2010 at 8:30 am

    I can’t figure out the Pettitte situation. Allowing him several weeks to think out his baseball future is very understandable but that time has passed. How long does it take to sit down for one day and have a serious family pow-wow about what will likely be his final year as a pitcher ?
    Reports say the family is all in with his coming back for a final year so what’s the holdup ?
    He has to realize that his decision affects how the pitching rotation plans will be decided moving forward. It’s not like he was a bench player or a back of the bullpen pitcher.

  182. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:32 am

    Mell-

    OK.

    Please go get me Floyd, or Jackson if you have to.

    Thanks in advance. Concerned Yankee fan known as MTU.

    :)

  183. Bronx Jeers December 21st, 2010 at 8:32 am

    MTU,

    I’d challenge you for the affections of Jeanne Tripplehorn but I doubt I’d get very far as a swimming apeman.

    Anyway off to the gym. Us coastal people need to be fit when it comes time for “the big swim”

  184. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:34 am

    Jeers-

    Say Hi to Desmond Morris for me at your Gym.

    ;)

  185. Doreen December 21st, 2010 at 8:34 am

    108 Stitches -

    From what I understand the rehab from the groin injury really took a toll on Pettitte. Plus you can’t discount the upcoming Clemens trial as a factor (it’s been delayed, but still looms for some time during the 2011 season).

  186. austinmac December 21st, 2010 at 8:35 am

    MTU,

    I’m in for the hike. A relative of my wife has a place we could stay is Park City over the summer. How is hiking in that vicinity?

    Final word–Zambrano and Rauch. Add a right handed bat and medication to calm Zambrano and take our chances.

  187. Mell December 21st, 2010 at 8:35 am

    “Zambrano is a loose cannon. If Rothschild told Cash that he could tame the raging bull then maybe Cash pulls the trigger on that one.”

    If Rothschild told anyone he could tame the raging bull, what reason would they have to believe him? Man’s been his pitching coach for 9 seasons and he’s still nuts. Unless this Year 10, of a decade long taming process, I think Cashman has to assume that Zambrano comes with the crazy.

  188. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:38 am

    Austin-

    Share it with family only. Be greedy.

    Hiking in that area is awesome.

    I’ll accept your final word.

    :)

  189. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:40 am

    Mell-

    I think that would indeed be a more prudent course of action.

    The pickings are slim. And who the heck knows if AP is coming back ?

    I do not want to settle for options 1 or 2 if possible.

    Fingers crossed.

    ;)

  190. blake December 21st, 2010 at 8:44 am

    Mell,

    I agree that the Braves are trying to a playoff spot….I think they would maybe consider moving him for Gardner because they need something better than Mclouth out there pretty badly. Gardner would be perfect for them….grew up in Braves country etc…..but as previously discussed, the Yankees need him too right now unless they could line up a replacement simultaneously. Probably not happening….just thinking out loud.

  191. mick December 21st, 2010 at 8:45 am

    Hope Garcia isn’t this years Park…

  192. Mell December 21st, 2010 at 8:49 am

    MTU:

    Don’t know enough about the White Sox needs. Obviously a guy like Floyd, with a pretty reasonable contract and the ability to give you 200 IP from the mid to lower end of the rotation would be nice. Not sure where the Cubs are on Tyler Flowers? Disappointing season in AAA last year, but still pretty young. Would they be interested in Romine? Romine and a pitcher from the tier just below the B’s? I don’t know.

  193. MTU December 21st, 2010 at 8:51 am

    Mell-

    We don’t know but I hope Cashman does.

    ;)

  194. mick December 21st, 2010 at 8:52 am

    Why would any team want to help us. We aren’t offering anything of value.

  195. Mell December 21st, 2010 at 8:53 am

    By Cubs, of course I meant White Sox.

    More coffee!!!!

  196. mick December 21st, 2010 at 8:54 am

    All of these proposed trades makes me think of Fantasy Baseball.
    Sometimes they work in fantasy, hardly reality.

  197. pat December 21st, 2010 at 8:54 am

    What Cashman seems to have grasped that some fans seem to be having a hard time with is he doesn’t have total control over the situation when it comes to players.

    People say just get this one or that one but Cashman can write a really big check and whiser sweet nothings in their ear and Soriano and Pettitte can say no thank you because they like another situation better.

    He can call GMs from every team and offer up Montero and Gardner and Joba and 10 other players and they can say no thank you because they want the player to stay as much as the Yankees want to get him.

    Calling everyone every day to see if situations change but dealing with people who are knocking on his door is probably the most prudent approach right now. Those people aren’t the sexiest options but they probably are the ones who are most signable right now.

    If something better develops down the road, they are also the ones easiest to cut ties with.

  198. mick December 21st, 2010 at 8:57 am

    In reality, maybe it would be better if Andy retires.
    Considering the austerity budget we are on, maybe we can give Soriano his money.
    But what about next year?
    Nevermind.

  199. blake December 21st, 2010 at 8:57 am

    Warning! Putting on my hair brained pretend GM cap because im bored:

    Trade Gardner straight up for Jair Juirjins.
    Call up good buddy Kevin Towers and make it happen for Justin Upton
    Sign Pettite
    Sign Rauch

    Best team in AL. See there’s still hope…….in fantasyland.

  200. mick December 21st, 2010 at 8:59 am

    Forget Soriano, use Andy’s money for Zambrano.
    2 years and out.

  201. clownthrowindown December 21st, 2010 at 9:01 am

    Just because Yankee fans scoff at teams like Chicago, Detroit, Atlanta, etc., it doesn’t mean that they – and their fans – don’t feel like they can win. Teams that feel they can make the playoffs are not going to trade top or middle of the rotation starters to NY. Especially AL teams. No one in those cities wants to hear about rebuilding…they think they have a shot. So its as fruitless to speculate on them trading talent as it would be for them to think the Yankees would make Hughes available.

  202. mick December 21st, 2010 at 9:07 am

    at least luis vizcaino is back…

  203. BoJo December 21st, 2010 at 9:44 am

    Doreen December 21st, 2010 at 8:01 am
    +++++++++++++
    Thank you. One of the best posts I have read all season.


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