The LoHud Yankees Blog

A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Getting ready for baseball again

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Jan 06, 2011 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post


That’s a picture of Yankee Stadium being converted back into a baseball field after spending some time ready for football. Thanks to the Yankee PR staff for the photo. As usual, here are a few links from the day.

• Scott Boras says Rafael Soriano is willing to pitch the eighth inning for the Yankees. “I don’t think there is a team in baseball where he could be asked to be a setup guy other than the Yankees,” Boras told ESPNNewYork. Question is, does being willing to setup mean Soriano considers that job equal to a ninth-inning job elsewhere?

• Speaking of the ninth inning, Brian Fuentes is apparently still looking for a team that needs a closer.

• Not that he was ever a legitimate possibility for the Yankees, but it seems Carl Pavano is off the market. Ken Rosenthal says Pavano is closing in on a two-year deal with the Twins.

• If Edgar Renteria had experience at third base, I wonder if the Yankees might have become interested. Renteria seems to be on his way to Cincinnati on a one-year deal.

• The Indians made room on their roster for short-term Yankees outfielder Austin Kearns by designating Jordan Brown for assignment. Brown’s been a pretty good hitter in the minor leagues, but he doesn’t have much pop for a guy whose primary position is first base.

Interesting story in the Times about publicly funded stadiums (or the lack of publicly funded stadiums).

• Nothing good coming out of this Alfredo Simon shooting case. It seems he might have tried to cover his tracks by changing the barrel of the gun he turned over to police. Not a good situation.

Comments

comments

 

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241 Responses to “Getting ready for baseball again”

  1. MG January 6th, 2011 at 9:10 pm

    Message to Chad-one of the more moronic readers of your blog (Vineyard Yankee aka lots of others) just posted your entire article about Yankee farmhands and their winter baseball numbers on the Daily News Yankees blog with no attribution. I’m sure you and Mark are going to be very pleased about that.

  2. Wave Your Hat January 6th, 2011 at 9:10 pm

    repost-

    Soriano in a great season had a WAR (per fangraphs) of 1.6. Giving him leverage credit, say $6M per 1.0 WAR, that’s about a $9.6M year (fangraphs says $6.4 but I think they might not be fully crediting leverage).

    In the hypothetical (because unrealistic) situation where the Yanks could get Soriano on a one year deal, if I were Cashman I’d be willing to pay him up to $12M this year because (i) the Yanks are going to be leaning heavily on their bullpen so Soriano could be extremely useful and (ii) the Yanks have no better use this year for their money. My guess is on a per year basis that would be the high offer and would land him.

    But, we all know Soriano won’t do a one year deal. Here’s the rub. Relievers are notoriously unpredictable. And, next year, the Yanks may have a better use for their money. So, you can’t offer him 2/24 or 3/36 or anything like that.

    Based on the $9.6M value I generously gave him for 2010, is he worth 3/28? Let’s assign him $12M for 2011, is the remaining 2/16 worth it? Probably. I’d be OK with that I think.

    At 3/30+ I’m beginning to get cold feet. Not 4, not for a reliever.

  3. Patrick January 6th, 2011 at 9:19 pm

    Wave,

    I think its a good point that getting Soriano would be pretty key for this coming season because the Yankees will be leaning heavily on the bullpen.

    I still wouldn’t sign him (honestly the only reason I wouldn’t want him is the pick we’d lose) but thinking about it that way makes the idea more attractive..

  4. LGY January 6th, 2011 at 9:21 pm

    Pavano getting close to a 2 year deal with the Twins.

    I’m surprised they are not satisfied just sticking with the great pitchers they have developed ;)

  5. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 9:21 pm

    If Pettitte is indeed retired, the Yankees should offer him two years.

  6. joeman January 6th, 2011 at 9:22 pm

    # Wave Your Hat January 6th, 2011 at 9:10 pm

    repost-

    Soriano in a great season had a WAR (per fangraphs) of 1.6. Giving him leverage credit, say $6M per 1.0 WAR, that’s about a $9.6M year (fangraphs says $6.4 but I think they might not be fully crediting leverage).

    In the hypothetical (because unrealistic) situation where the Yanks could get Soriano on a one year deal, if I were Cashman I’d be willing to pay him up to $12M this year because (i) the Yanks are going to be leaning heavily on their bullpen so Soriano could be extremely useful and (ii) the Yanks have no better use this year for their money. My guess is on a per year basis that would be the high offer and would land him.

    But, we all know Soriano won’t do a one year deal. Here’s the rub. Relievers are notoriously unpredictable. And, next year, the Yanks may have a better use for their money. So, you can’t offer him 2/24 or 3/36 or anything like that.

    Based on the $9.6M value I generously gave him for 2010, is he worth 3/28? Let’s assign him $12M for 2011, is the remaining 2/16 worth it? Probably. I’d be OK with that I think.

    At 3/30+ I’m beginning to get cold feet. Not 4, not for a reliever.loser at 35 years old
    ——————————————————————————-
    Boras will want him to get at least 3 for 30 and if he signs with the Yankees he will be a closer at 35 years old

  7. LGY January 6th, 2011 at 9:23 pm

    In one aspect I didn’t want Pavano going back to the Twins, because with the Yankees likely entering the season as WC favorites instead of division favorites this year, I wanted the competition as weak as possible.

    On the other hand, the stronger the Twins are the more them, the WS, and Tigers can beat up on each other.

  8. LGY January 6th, 2011 at 9:25 pm

    Rich,

    Pavano made it public he really wanted to go back to the Twins, probably would do it even for less money some said.

    Even if the Yankees had interest in him, I am not sure he would come here.

  9. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 9:33 pm

    LGY

    If that’s the case, fine. I just think he’s the best available option, by far, and wanted him to have the chance to say no.

  10. Chad Jennings January 6th, 2011 at 9:38 pm

    MG-

    It happens all the time. When every blog out there goes behind a pay wall, stuff like this will be the reason. Thanks for the heads up, though. If the Daily News sees it, I’m sure they’ll take it down. Believe me, it will bother Mark more than it bothers me.

  11. LGY January 6th, 2011 at 9:38 pm

    Rich,

    I’m with you on Pavano. I would be very happy if the Yankees signed him to a 2 year deal.

  12. J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 9:38 pm

    G. Love January 6th, 2011 at 6:12 pm
    Who cares about giving the pick to Tampa? They are a budget operation who by the time that pick is ready for the majors, they’ll have lost Price, Longoria and anything else that is real talent they presently have.

    The Yankees should happily give up the pick and take the money they would have spent for the pick and buy the best International free agent on the table with it.

    Besides, not every late 1st rounder turns into an All Star. A lot of them turn out to be nothing.

    ///////

    OTOH,that 1st rounder could turn out to be David Price.I’m not deadset against signing Soriano,but giving a division rival our No. 1 pick in what is considered a very deep draft gives me pause.& the idea that Tampa is just going to suck because of their low budget isn’t a given.they already have quite an excellent staff queued for 2011,for instance.

  13. LGY January 6th, 2011 at 9:40 pm

    rich,

    To add to that, I am actually disappointed they didn’t make a run at him at all. Was just letting you know his apparent preference.

  14. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 9:43 pm

    Wave Your Hat January 6th, 2011 at 9:10 pm

    But, we all know Soriano won’t do a one year deal.
    +++++++++++++
    Like he didn’t last year? He accepted arbitration for a one year deal because it was the best annual salary he could get. If Cashman offers $11M or $12M, and others offer 2 or 3 years at $8M, move over Mo.

  15. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 9:45 pm

    LGY January 6th, 2011 at 9:21 pm

    Pavano getting close to a 2 year deal with the Twins.

    I’m surprised they are not satisfied just sticking with the great pitchers they have developed
    ++++++++++
    I sense sarcasm (the smiley face gave it away).

  16. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 9:46 pm

    A one year deal for Soriano is dumb from the Yankees’ perspective, in light of the pick.

  17. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 9:48 pm

    joeman January 6th, 2011 at 9:22 pm

    Boras will want him to get at least 3 for 30 and if he signs with the Yankees he will be a closer at 35 years old
    +++++++++++++++++++++
    I think the Damon negotiation with Cashman taught Boras that he won’t be dictating terms to Cashman. If no one else will pay Soriano closer dollars, and Cashman offers a 1 year deal at above everyone else, Boras has shown that he will park his client in the highest paying job, and wait for a better market to develop next year. He did this with Beltre too.

  18. blake January 6th, 2011 at 9:50 pm

    Sure anyone would have reservations about giving Soriano a 3 year deal for the money he will command, but with nothing else working out this winter it may be the best way to help pad a thin rotation and to keep your 41 year old closer healthy and rested. Its not ideal but it wont be a size contract that the Yankees couldn’t relatively easily absorb either if things didn’t work out.

  19. backbench January 6th, 2011 at 9:52 pm

    “”It is a different scenario,” Boras said.

    As accomplished as Soriano is, Boras — delving further into the “different reasons” Soriano would consider the Yankees — thinks that learning from arguably the greatest closer of all time would have added appeal.

    “There is also a value in playing with Mariano Rivera,” Boras said.”

    The proper respect has been shown. Soriano sees the moves on the chessboard.

    The FO needs to move on this. Having Soriano available to take the share some of the closer load with Mo (and no 2 inning saves) during the course of the year will help keep Mo healthy, and prolong his effectiveness. That is absolutely a worthwhile investment, IMHO.

  20. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 9:52 pm

    So before the 2009 Damon negotiations, Boras thought he could dictate terms to Cashman, when in the 2005 Damon negotiations, Boras asked for 7 years and got 4.

  21. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 9:53 pm

    Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 9:46 pm

    A one year deal for Soriano is dumb from the Yankees’ perspective, in light of the pick.
    ++++++++++++++
    I’d have to respectfully disagree.

    First, the addition of Soriano could fortify the bullpen in a year where it may be more important than ever with a questionable starting rotation.

    Second, the signing allows the possibility of moving Joba to SP if Andy retires.

    Third, If he performs great, the Yankees can offer arbitration and get 2 picks for the following year. If he doesn’t perform great, they can cut their losses.

    Fourth, they have a supplemental 1st round pick from Javy signing, and can use that pick to pay over slot to get the same type player they would normally get.

    Fifth, the amendment…still plays well.

    Sixth, how can you not like the thought of Sterling singing about “So and Mo–it’s the way to go!”

  22. backbench January 6th, 2011 at 9:53 pm

    “Having Soriano available to take on some of the closer load..”

    Sorry.

  23. blake January 6th, 2011 at 9:53 pm

    Rich,

    Yes,.I wouldn’t give up the pick for one year….and I highly doubt Soriano would accept a set up role for one year. If he takes a one year deal then it will be to.close for somebody to keep his value high. The only real reason he would come to NY and set up is if they lay the most money and most years.

  24. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 9:55 pm

    Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 9:52 pm

    So before the 2009 Damon negotiations, Boras thought he could dictate terms to Cashman, when in the 2005 Damon negotiations, Boras asked for 7 years and got 4.
    +++++++++++
    My point is that Boras is not going to dictate anything to Cashman and play the secret club in the wings with him. If there is no market, Cashman will say what he is willing to do, and Boras won’t have much leverage. Cash will say take it or leave it.

  25. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 9:57 pm

    blake January 6th, 2011 at 9:53 pm
    ++++++++++
    Hello???

    Give up one pick and perhaps get 2 back next year? Sounds pretty good to me.

  26. blake January 6th, 2011 at 10:01 pm

    Bojo,

    That’s a good point…..but I doubt he’ll do a one year deal in NY. He needs to close to keep his value up if he’s taking the insecurity of a one year deal unless the Yanks gave him 15 million or so for that one year.

  27. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:04 pm

    Blake–

    Boras will take top dollar if he feels there will be a better market next year. And there probably will be with KRod is dumped. He has shown this again and again.

  28. backbench January 6th, 2011 at 10:05 pm

    On a parallel note, Aceves is planning on being in Florida for the start of ST. The NYYs have offered him a minor league contract so as not to lose a roster spot while he is recovering (hopefully) from his really dumb bicycle ride.

    His back was well along to recovery before that move and the NYYs had laid out a pretty extensive rehab program for him.

    The rumor that the Rockies were interested was just that. Ace is commited to working his way back into the Yankees’ plans.

  29. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:05 pm

    But regardless of the structure, money will talk.

  30. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 10:07 pm

    “My point is that Boras is not going to dictate anything to Cashman and play the secret club in the wings with him. If there is no market, Cashman will say what he is willing to do, and Boras won’t have much leverage. Cash will say take it or leave it.”

    Of course not, because Soriano isn’t young enough and/or good enough to have that kind of leverage, and the Yankees don’t have a pressing need.

    If Boras was representing, for example, Cliff Lee, he could dictate the terms and Cash would have said yes to almost anything, as we have just seen.

  31. Against All Odds January 6th, 2011 at 10:08 pm

    Responding to previous post:

    • J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 5:26 pm
    Against All Odds (repost)
    Cashman left himself no wiggle room coming into the off season and now the Yankees are searching for arms. No it’s not Cashman’s fault that Lee chose to go to the Phils but it is his fault that the Yankees were put in a situation where Lee was a need or they would be in the situation that he is now.

    ///I missed this. YES. Lee might not have been so dramatically “a need” had Cashman not yanked Chamberlain from his starting role for 2010.If the yanks had just bit the bullet,he could have/should have resumed starting.Vazquez was supposed to provide length & save the bullpen.well Joba could have done a better job than Vazquez’s overall body of work last yr,I have no problem saying,and he would not have been innings restricted.you still had Hughes cruising along to his 18 wins,and Chamberlain would have had another yr of seasoning,perhaps lessening the need to cough up a fortune for an old pitcher (at least he would have been in his latter deal yrs).

    the decision to cut the cord on Chamberlain keeps on hurtin.

    ———————————————
    Yep the decision to stuff Joba in the pen has come back to bit them. I don’t want ppl to take that as Joba is on Lee’s level or that with Joba we didn’t need Lee but having Joba be a starter gave the Yankees options when it comes to starting. Would they be signed guys like Prior and looking into Colon if they weren’t desperate.

  32. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:09 pm

    Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 10:07 pm
    +++++++++
    Agreed

  33. LGY January 6th, 2011 at 10:11 pm

    Backbench

    Link?

  34. blake January 6th, 2011 at 10:11 pm

    Bojo,

    Its a little different situation here though than say with Beltre because he would be in a different role with the Yankees, he wouldn’t be closing. It’s too much of a risk with his value to take a non closing job on a one year deal…..I guess it’s possible but I highly doubt Soriano will be with the Yankees unless its at least a 3 year deal.

  35. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:12 pm

    AOG–

    I think they would have signed Prior no matter what. They have been following him for 2-3 years in his recovery, and remained interested in giving him a shot to see what he has left.

    But not having Joba in SP is leading to looking at Millwood, Garcia, Colon, Francis, etc.

    They should look at Bruce Chen! (I watched him pitch a few times late in season and his game has really picked up.)

  36. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 10:12 pm

    “First, the addition of Soriano could fortify the bullpen in a year where it may be more important than ever with a questionable starting rotation.”

    Then why only one year?

    “Second, the signing allows the possibility of moving Joba to SP if Andy retires.”

    I wish it were so.

    “Third, If he performs great, the Yankees can offer arbitration and get 2 picks for t
    he following year. If he doesn’t perform great, they can cut their losses.”

    Would Soriano, as a set up reliever, accumulate sufficient points in the ratings system to remain a Type A?

    “Fourth, they have a supplemental 1st round pick from Javy signing, and can use that pick to pay over slot to get the same type player they would normally get.”

    I view it as being about value, and giving up a 1st rounder for a set up reliever offers very little value back even if it’s for three years, but you can make a reasonable case to do it. For one year, it’s just not worth it.

    “Fifth, the amendment…still plays well.”

    I like all of the first ten.

    “Sixth, how can you not like the thought of Sterling singing about “So and Mo–it’s the way to go!””

    If you can get Sterling to retire, I’ll relent.

  37. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:16 pm

    Blake–

    I suspect if Soriano put up ridiculous numbers out of the EIR, that Boras would have NO trouble selling suitors on how that transfers. The saves would be irrelevant compared to how they are needed by other FAs.

    First, Soriano has done it before in AL East.

    Second, there are numerous other set up men who have landed closer roles this past few seasons.

    Third, if Soriano posts a sub 2 ERA, with a 10+K/9IP and low walks, he will have suitors.

    If there are more openings next year, Boras will be able to create a better market.

  38. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:19 pm

    Rich–

    One year in case Cash doesn’t want to risk being tied to an injured pitcher. Risk management.

    Scott Downs–Type A–set up man.

    The only person to ever be able to get John Sterling to retire was his auto mechanic–who was running a special on Goodrich tires.

  39. J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 10:21 pm

    Odds – it’s a big deal to begin with to be so jaded about wasting an arm like Joba’s,as the yanks seem to be and the hypnotized among fans.but what people miss is what you’ve pointed out – it continues to haunt the choices they’re forced to make as a result.it’s why developing yr own pitching is so important.why should the New York Yankees tremble and fall into disarray because a 32 yr old free agent pitcher who has never thrown a strike for them says,”gee,I think I’d rather pitch for the Phillies.”?yet most fans won’t connect this to failing to develop Chamberlain,but it is most certainly connected.

  40. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:23 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 10:21 pm
    ++++++++++++++++
    Thatis an excellent point worthy of a guest article for this blog. You should submit it.

  41. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 10:23 pm

    BoJo

    Rich–

    One year in case Cash doesn’t want to risk being tied to an injured pitcher. Risk management.
    __

    I would rather risk losing money than risk losing the fruits of a first round pick.

  42. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:24 pm

    Rich–do you have the draft order for 2011? I am curious where the supp pick falls for Javy…How many is it behind the 1st round pick?

  43. blake January 6th, 2011 at 10:25 pm

    Bojo,

    Yea but there really is no incentive to accept a one year set up role when he could likely just go back to Tampa and close again….unless the Yankees paid a lot more money for that one year.

  44. backbench January 6th, 2011 at 10:27 pm

    LGY

    No link. Very reliable source.

  45. LGY January 6th, 2011 at 10:30 pm

    backbench,

    Gotcha.

    Any idea of a timetable for him?

  46. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 10:31 pm

    BoJo
    Rich–do you have the draft order for 2011? I am curious where the supp pick falls for Javy…How many is it behind the 1st round pick?
    ___

    http://riveraveblues.com/2011-draft-order/

  47. J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 10:32 pm

    BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:23 pm
    J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 10:21 pm
    ++++++++++++++++
    Thatis an excellent point worthy of a guest article for this blog. You should submit it.

    ////

    Bojo,I think there are more of us that get this domino effect than I originally thought. Guys like you, Against All Odds, who raised the point here first,Rich in NJ, etc.

  48. JobaTipsHisCap January 6th, 2011 at 10:33 pm

    pitching, pitching, geez.

  49. blake January 6th, 2011 at 10:34 pm

    When they asked Robbie Alomar which players playing today that he liked and thought were great he said: Robinson Cano, Alex Rodriguez, and Derek Jeter. Cano might give Alomar a run for his money before he’s done…..

  50. backbench January 6th, 2011 at 10:34 pm

    LGY,

    Not sure, but the injury was to his left (not throwing) shoulder, so that may help.

    To say that he is embarassed by the dumb move would be an understatement, so there is strong motivation to get well and do well. The NYYS are apparently being supportive.

  51. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:34 pm

    blake January 6th, 2011 at 10:25 pm

    Bojo,

    Yea but there really is no incentive to accept a one year set up role when he could likely just go back to Tampa and close again….unless the Yankees paid a lot more money for that one year.
    ++++++++++++++
    And they would. I don’t see Rays paying $10M to him, but Yankees could easily.

    Again, and I hate to repeat this and sound like a broken record, but bringing in Soriano allows Cash to put Joba back in rotation and gain a potential impact arm. What’s that worth?

    Red Sox paid $50M posint fee for Dice K.

    A’s paid $14M (?) posting fee just to talk to the Japanese guy this past year.

    Yu Darvish posting fee probably like $30M…

    Thus paying Soriano $10-12M to allow Joba to move is a great investment. Add to it the return Soriano provides as a lock down set up guy, and the possibility of getting 2 picks back if he wants to move on after a year…

    All adds up to a great move IMO

  52. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:36 pm

    blake January 6th, 2011 at 10:34 pm

    When they asked Robbie Alomar which players playing today that he liked and thought were great he said:
    +++++++++++++
    They had to ask twice…at first he just heard the first part and answered Ru Paul.

  53. LGY January 6th, 2011 at 10:38 pm

    Backbench

    That’s great news. Hopefully he can get himself healthy and in the mix to compete for a spot at the back of the rotation.

    I think he could be a really solid starter.

  54. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:39 pm

    Thanks Rich–

    So, the Yankees get the 31st and 48th…I still think there will be talent they can sign over slot at that late pick.

    Someone made a very good point yesterday about other clubs willing to siugn over slot and thus making it tougher for them, but in looking at the list, it appears there may be only 2 picks like that–the Red SOx picks. And who knows how willing they will be to sign high risk, high reward guys after all the money they are tying up in contracts.

  55. backbench January 6th, 2011 at 10:43 pm

    “bringing in Soriano allows Cash to put Joba back in rotation and gain a potential impact arm.”

    Love the optimism, but the FO is really at sea with what to do with Joba. They now believe they drank their own marketing ‘kool aid’ on him and now would like nothing more than a decent opportunity to trade him.

  56. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:44 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 10:32 pm

    BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:23 pm
    J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 10:21 pm
    ++++++++++++++++
    Thatis an excellent point worthy of a guest article for this blog. You should submit it.

    ////

    Bojo,I think there are more of us that get this domino effect than I originally thought. Guys like you, Against All Odds, who raised the point here first,Rich in NJ, etc.
    +++++++++++++++
    Then AAO should write the thread–it’s a case that needs to be made. Maybe Cash will actually read it!

  57. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:47 pm

    backbench January 6th, 2011 at 10:43 pm

    “bringing in Soriano allows Cash to put Joba back in rotation and gain a potential impact arm.”

    Love the optimism, but the FO is really at sea with what to do with Joba. They now believe they drank their own marketing ‘kool aid’ on him and now would like nothing more than a decent opportunity to trade him.
    ++++++++++
    I believe you are right unfortunately. Same brilliant thinking that allowed Blue Jays to obtain Brendan Morrow from Ms.

    In fact, the 2 pitchers are remarkably similar. Given a good pitching coach that believes in him, I think Joba would emulate the success and growth Morrow had. Same stuff…same ceiling.

    How much would the Yankees like to have Brendon Morrow now? That is what they should be thinking about for Joba.

  58. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:49 pm

    I hope someone in FO goes back and looks at the tapes of Joba in the first half of 2009 up to about August 6. There is a lot of potential in that kid, and for them to miss the boat on that tells me they need to fire some people.

  59. West Coast Yankee Fan January 6th, 2011 at 10:50 pm

    Are you guys serious with the Joba back in the rotation talk? It’s not happening, how many times do Cashman and Girardi have to say it in no uncertain terms?

    The guy had his shot and couldn’t get the job done according to the powers that be who evaluate such things. He does not have the temperament to be an effective starter, his command was not good enough, he nibbles, he doesn’t seem willing to make the commitment to staying in shape and as a starter his velocity drops to 91-92. Whether it is his shoulder or just his physiology, or whatever, he cannot sustain the velocity on his fastball to get the job done.

    It’s over for him as a starter with this team.

  60. Pat M. January 6th, 2011 at 10:52 pm

    Rich in NJ….I see your point however is that lost draft pick worth not making it to October baseball ??? At this point the Bombers have their hands tied……If Joba can build upon the last 2 months of last season and if Brackman is that close to finding a spot in the pen then Cashman rolls the dice and says no…..The other option is to move players that are near to contribute to KC for Soria……With all the talent in the system it just hard to believe that the club is in this bind…..The perfect answer would be to give Joba a rotation slot and give him till July 15 th or so to see if he can be effective and sign Soriano and bite the bullet……

  61. J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 10:53 pm

    BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:44 pm
    J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 10:32 pm

    BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:23 pm
    J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 10:21 pm
    ++++++++++++++++
    Thatis an excellent point worthy of a guest article for this blog. You should submit it.

    ////

    Bojo,I think there are more of us that get this domino effect than I originally thought. Guys like you, Against All Odds, who raised the point here first,Rich in NJ, etc.
    +++++++++++++++
    Then AAO should write the thread–it’s a case that needs to be made. Maybe Cash will actually read it!
    ////

    He actually does read this thing & other boards,lol.agree that morrow is a cautionary tale for the yanks,as well as bumgarner.again,I have a hunch Rothschild may flip Chamberlain yet again.how better to make a splash & prove your worth as the new guy than to “fix” Joba & restore that 4-pitch arsenal to the rotation,if it can be done?

  62. blake January 6th, 2011 at 10:53 pm

    Again, I just don’t think we are getting the full story with regards to Joba and him starting. His 2009 season wasn’t great but it really wasn’t unlike a lot of other young pitchers with talent in their first full season in a rotation. He had flashes of being very good that year. There must be some other reason we don’t know about as to why they shut that down for good if that’s indeed the case. Maybe (as others have mentioned) they are waiting for Joba to take the bull by the horns and show them he wants that….I don’t know. I’ve said all along that if they have an opening this spring then they should let him in the mix to compete for it…I don’t see what harm it could cause.

  63. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:54 pm

    Pat M. January 6th, 2011 at 10:52 pm

    The perfect answer would be to give Joba a rotation slot and give him till July 15 th or so to see if he can be effective and sign Soriano and bite the bullet…
    +++++++++++
    Great suggestion!

  64. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:56 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 10:53 pm

    how better to make a splash & prove your worth as the new guy than to “fix” Joba & restore that 4-pitch arsenal to the rotation,if it can be done?
    ++++++++
    Love it!

  65. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:58 pm

    Blake–

    You might recall that Morrow was jerked around like this in Seattle, and needed to be told what his role was and given the opportunity to fail. He also saw his FB dipping to 90-92 at that time.

    I read somewhere that the great thing about Rothschild is that he is a big believer in power pitching…going for the strikeout. That type of coach is just what Joba needs.

  66. blake January 6th, 2011 at 10:58 pm

    I wouldn’t give Joba a rotation spot….I’d let him fight for one though, especially if they do sign Soriano.

  67. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:00 pm

    blake January 6th, 2011 at 10:58 pm

    I wouldn’t give Joba a rotation spot….I’d let him fight for one though, especially if they do sign Soriano.
    ++++++++++
    I would disagree…only because they need to show him they believe in him and are supportive–like what Morrow got in Toronto.

    Making him fight for a spot says we still don’t know if we believe in you or know what role to put you in….This kid needs to focus on only one thing…his next start.

  68. blake January 6th, 2011 at 11:02 pm

    Bojo,

    The Mariners royally screwed that one up. They could have Hernandez and Morrow atop that rotation right now where they both could lose games 1-0……Morrow is going to be good though…..he already is.

  69. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 11:03 pm

    Pat M

    First round picks have a lot of value now. I’m not sure what the hit rate is, but given that the Yankees are willing to pay overslot, they usually get an opportunity to draft a pretty talented player any time they keep their pick.

    They also have an aging core of position players that may need replacing sooner rather than later. So even if the drafted player never becomes a Yankee, he will probably be a valuable trade chip, if needed.

    To give that up for a set up reliever seems to be an example of chasing a player at a price that exceeds his value.

    I understand that we are talking about the Yankees, so the win-now wackiness often guides their thinking. As a result, I could see them doing it, and if that somehow gives Joba another shot as a starter, then it may well be worth it. (I doubt that will happen).

    But what I am really against is only signing Soriano for one year.

    I have no interest in giving up what the Royals will likely want for Soria.

  70. backbench January 6th, 2011 at 11:04 pm

    “how better to make a splash & prove your worth as the new guy than to “fix” Joba & restore that 4-pitch arsenal to the rotation,if it can be done?”

    Get AJ to deliver at his full potential.

    The ‘powers that be’ believe Joba is not consistent enough to rely on in almost any role.

  71. blake January 6th, 2011 at 11:05 pm

    Bojo,

    I agree with that to some extent but Joba for all we know Joba hasn’t shown the Yankees that he wants or deserves that. As it stands right now, the Yankees really can’t afford to take him out of the bullpen anyway. I would like to see him have one more chance at starting…….don’t think that road has been explored to an end yet.

  72. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:06 pm

    Blake–

    Felix, Lee, Morrow, Vargas…not too bad..add Fister…very good.

    They should have kept him and signed Lee to longer term deal right away.

    Then they could have piecemealed together an offense like SF did.

  73. blake January 6th, 2011 at 11:07 pm

    The Yankees core isn’t really as old as it seems. Jeter, Arod, and Posada are all that’s old and Posada will be replaced soon by a 21 year old. Everyone else is in their prime or younger.

  74. J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 11:07 pm

    blake January 6th, 2011 at 10:58 pm

    I wouldn’t give Joba a rotation spot….I’d let him fight for one though, especially if they do sign Soriano.
    +

    ///

    ya mean like last ST’s fake “fight” that was pre-determined?it may be that there’s some mysterious explanation for the yanks’ intractable stance but I don’t think that’s going to muzzle intelligent fans that understand the gravity of losing a potential legitimate starter with the upside joba has & it’s hard to just misremember his 2008 season.

  75. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:09 pm

    Backbench–Same feeling were there about Morrow in Seattle…just needed a coach who believed in him and a chance.

    Saying that Joba will be too inconsistent based on his performance as a 24 year old in his first year as a starter is beyond idiotic. It is criminally stupid.

    Or judging him based on how they twirled his head around last year also defies logic.

  76. blake January 6th, 2011 at 11:09 pm

    Bojo,

    Yup…Jack Z isn’t the brightest crayon. Doubt Lee would have stayed longterm even if they tried but they still missed the boat on Morrow big time.

  77. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 11:10 pm

    “Get AJ to deliver at his full potential.

    The ‘powers that be’ believe Joba is not consistent enough to rely on in almost any role”

    If that’s true, it’s the reason the Yankees’ “braintrust” should be criticized.

    They gave a 30 something pitcher, who has been inconsistent throughout his career, $80+m, and they stick with him even though he had an historically bad season, yet Joba, who is only 25 and two years away from dominance can’t get another extended shot.

    That’s just bad decision-making.

  78. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:12 pm

    Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 11:10 pm
    ++++++++++++++
    Great point.

  79. blake January 6th, 2011 at 11:13 pm

    The “fake” fight served a purpose in that competition pushes people to better themselves. For example, if Pettite retires then the Yankees could hold a “competition” for the 4th and 5th spots and go in having an idea who they would like to step forward and win those spots, but not giving them away forces guys to show up ready to go and win them. Hopefully Andy comes back and they only have to worry about the #5.

  80. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:14 pm

    blake January 6th, 2011 at 11:07 pm

    The Yankees core isn’t really as old as it seems. Jeter, Arod, and Posada are all that’s old and Posada will be replaced soon by a 21 year old. Everyone else is in their prime or younger.
    ++++++++++++++
    Agreed. And they have replacements in pipeline for Andy and perhaps Mo…

    The only spots they need to shore up are SS and 3B in case of injury…but they can do that through FA and trades if needed.

  81. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 11:15 pm

    blake

    “The Yankees core isn’t really as old as it seems. Jeter, Arod, and Posada are all that’s old and Posada will be replaced soon by a 21 year old. Everyone else is in their prime or younger.”

    That’s true, but…

    There’s also Pettitte, who they haven’t replaced, and I don’t think they can win without A-Rod and Jeter playing at a high level.

    Plus, it’s tough (if not nearly impossible) to find infielders who can do what they have done (and hopefully will continue to do, but may not).

    So the Yankees need the ability to replace or supplement them, if necessary, and that would be very, very costly.

    I also want to actually see Montero get that shot, and not be traded. I’m skeptical.

  82. LGY January 6th, 2011 at 11:16 pm

    He does not have the temperament to be an effective starter, his command was not good enough, he nibbles, he doesn’t seem willing to make the commitment to staying in shape and as a starter his velocity drops to 91-92.

    ******

    If I had a nickel for every young starter that was described in that way, I would have a lot of nickels. Young Master Hughes was labeled a nibbler by many a impatient Yankee fan.

    In terms of velocity, baseball is littered with starters effective in the low 90s.

    I am skeptical abut Joba being a successfil starter in 2011, but these should not be the reasons why.

  83. backbench January 6th, 2011 at 11:16 pm

    Bojo,

    Your scenario would be great to see. I for one love the idea of the Yankee farm system delivering home grown winners.

    Unfortunately, my understanding is that Joba shares a problem with the former pitching coach and the NYYs have 0 tolerance.

  84. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:17 pm

    That fight only served to confuse and embarrass Joba….he came into camp ready to go, got sick with a bad flu for about 7 days, was weak in 1st few starts, and then recovered well–only to be told “you no longer have a future here as a starter.” THat is a kick in th egroin to any player that knows that the starters get the big paychecks while middle relievers and set up man are left with a lot less.

    In retrospect, they should have sent him back to SWB and had him build up strenght and work on mechanics. Of course, hindsight is always 20-20.

  85. RMS January 6th, 2011 at 11:17 pm

    Cashman has said Joba will be in the pen. Why give him another shot at starting?

  86. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:18 pm

    Ewwwwwwwww!

    Wow!

    Calling Sudden Sam…calling Sudden Sam!

  87. LGY January 6th, 2011 at 11:18 pm

    I’m skeptical about Joba because of how he threw the ball last year.

    But it is foolish right now to not give him a shot to win a rotation spot

  88. blake January 6th, 2011 at 11:24 pm

    Rich,

    I just don’t see how they can trade him now unless its for something really special (say if the Mariners gave up in June and made Hernandez available)

    They have theoretical replacements for Pettite on the the way in Betances and Banuelos but you’re right Jeter and Arod will need replacing at some point….those players don’t grow on trees and finding that kind of value won’t be easy and may not be possible. They may have to find that kind of production in other areas….hopefully Cano and Montero will be part of that.

  89. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 11:26 pm

    “Cashman has said Joba will be in the pen. Why give him another shot at starting?”

    1) need
    2) demonstrated past performance;; even his 2009 season was better than AJ and Vazquez’s 2010 seasons

  90. G. Love January 6th, 2011 at 11:26 pm

    If the choice to me was trust Joba as the 8th inning guy or sign Soriano and give Joba one last shot in the rotation, then I sign Soriano and tell Joba to come to camp ready to start.

    I’d also wouldn’t guarantee Joba a spot in the rotation and tell him he is pitching for a spot and there’s a chance he may get sent down to work on his game if the team doesn’t think he’s ready to be in the rotation opening day.

    The Morrow example is a valid one. Although I’m not sure if Morrow ever lost the velocity that Joba loses and gains and loses again.

    I can’t worry about giving TB a 1st round draft pick at the end of the round. You’re giving it to TB who doesn’t traditionally spend the money to sign an overslot player. They hit all the right notes in the draft when they were drafting at the top. Price, Longoria were consensus top picks. They didn’t slip into the 3rd round.

    That said, I don’t see the Yankees making the move for Soriano. It makes too much sense to those of us who want to see the team turn the pen into a huge strength, but all I can see is Cashman sitting there thinking Soriano is going to be Karsay or Farnsworth part II and he doesn’t want to deal with the criticism. I think his need to not deal with criticism is part of the reason why he’s trying to keep the payroll below 200 million.

    It’s scary if the GM of the team is worried about his perceived rep more than the needs of the club.

    I’m not saying that’s the case, but he has given me the impression in the past that he’s out to prove something to people that he’s not just a checkbook.

    I still can’t forget him before the 2008 season going on the speaking tour with Theo where the two of them were crowing about their keen player development.

    Theo meanwhile trades the farm and opens the checkbook. He couldn’t even build a pen from his system.

    I don’t think Cash is back to his 2008 ways. The offer to Lee tells us he wasn’t ready to hand rotation spots to prospects.

    That said, Soriano would be a pitching weapon for a team that needs pitching weapons. 3 years and 30 million is worth the risk when you pay Igawa what you’ve paid him to pitch in Scranton.

  91. blake January 6th, 2011 at 11:26 pm

    Bojo,

    Would you agree that the Yankees made the right decision in picking Hughes last spring? I can’t disagree that maybe they should have sent Joba to Scraton to work on things but their reasoning was probably that they needed him in the bullpen in NY.

  92. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:27 pm

    3B won’t be that hard to fill…you can always move a player there or find a FA with a decent bat…as long as the rest of the offense is balanced and Cano and montero stay monsters, the offense will be fine.

    And replacing DJ will also be no problem if Gardner can bat lead off…even Pena or Nunez would be fine hitting 9th.

  93. Against All Odds January 6th, 2011 at 11:29 pm

    # J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 10:21 pm

    Odds – it’s a big deal to begin with to be so jaded about wasting an arm like Joba’s,as the yanks seem to be and the hypnotized among fans.but what people miss is what you’ve pointed out – it continues to haunt the choices they’re forced to make as a result.it’s why developing yr own pitching is so important.why should the New York Yankees tremble and fall into disarray because a 32 yr old free agent pitcher who has never thrown a strike for them says,”gee,I think I’d rather pitch for the Phillies.”?yet most fans won’t connect this to failing to develop Chamberlain,but it is most certainly connected.

    ————————————————————————————————-

    Oh yea they are both connected and the lack of developing starters has once again caught up with the Yankees. Think about it this way a couple of off seasons ago after signing CC who was an absolute need; the yankees had to sign CLiff Lee. How many teams pick up an ace and 2 off seasons later have to pick up another 1 or their rotations is in shambles.

  94. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:30 pm

    Blake–

    I didn’t like the competition at the time, and thought they should not have acquired Vasquez….I was fine with giving Joba and Hughes roles in the rotation…

    But to answer your question, Joba’s flu made it hard to pick him at that time…so he should have been sent down to get stronger and work on those mechanics.

  95. Against All Odds January 6th, 2011 at 11:31 pm

    # RMS January 6th, 2011 at 11:17 pm

    Cashman has said Joba will be in the pen. Why give him another shot at starting?

    ————————————————————

    Because the guys they are interested in or have in house are either not as good of worse than him. The Yankees have been liked to Bartolo Colon….Bartolo Colon

  96. blake January 6th, 2011 at 11:32 pm

    Bojo,

    I loved the Vasquez move at the time which shows you what I know….but then again I didn’t know his arm was going to be shot either.

  97. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:34 pm

    G. Love January 6th, 2011 at 11:26 pm

    I’d also wouldn’t guarantee Joba a spot in the rotation and tell him he is pitching for a spot and there’s a chance he may get sent down to work on his game if the team doesn’t think he’s ready to be in the rotation opening day.
    ++++++++++++
    No way to send him down without sending him through waivers now. If he doesn’t land a roster spot, they have to trade him.

    The Morrow example is a valid one. Although I’m not sure if Morrow ever lost the velocity that Joba loses and gains and loses again.
    +++++++++
    Yeah…he was having exactly the same problems. Velocity dipped…wild…inconsistent..etc.

    I can’t worry about giving TB a 1st round draft pick at the end of the round. You’re giving it to TB who doesn’t traditionally spend the money to sign an overslot player. They hit all the right notes in the draft when they were drafting at the top. Price, Longoria were consensus top picks. They didn’t slip into the 3rd round.
    ++++++++++
    Agreed

    It’s scary if the GM of the team is worried about his perceived rep more than the needs of the club.
    +++++++
    The fans will eat him alive and call for his head.

  98. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:35 pm

    blake January 6th, 2011 at 11:32 pm

    Bojo,

    I loved the Vasquez move at the time which shows you what I know….but then again I didn’t know his arm was going to be shot either.
    +++++++++++
    No one did, but I just believed in the plan to develop internally, and that meant sticking with Joba and moving a young starter into #5 slot each year.

  99. LGY January 6th, 2011 at 11:36 pm

    “I think his need to not deal with criticism is part of the reason why he’s trying to keep the payroll below 200 million.

    It’s scary if the GM of the team is worried about his perceived rep more than the needs of the club.”

    ———————–

    There is no evidence that he is trying to keep the payroll below 200 million or he cares about his rep.

  100. SAS January 6th, 2011 at 11:37 pm

    This has been an excellent conversation.

    If I am not mistaken, and I may be Nunez was supposed to be the anointed one to replace Jeter when the time came. Is this my imagination or have opinions changed about Nunez?

  101. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 11:37 pm

    “That said, Soriano would be a pitching weapon for a team that needs pitching weapons. 3 years and 30 million is worth the risk when you pay Igawa what you’ve paid him to pitch in Scranton.”

    Your post makes sense, but a primary (if mistaken) reason that they signed Igawa was to avoid giving up a first round pick to sign Lilly*. That saved pick became Brackman.

    Ironically, the decision on whether or not to sign Soriano could turn on the same consideration.

    * http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/kei_igawa/

    Peter Abraham of The Boston Globe tweets that Ted Lilly was “begging” the Yankees to sign him before the 2007, but they went for Kei Igawa instead.

  102. blake January 6th, 2011 at 11:38 pm

    They did move a young starter into the rotation in 2010….they only had one opening and Hughes clearly was the right choice for it.

  103. Against All Odds January 6th, 2011 at 11:39 pm

    # BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:44 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 10:32 pm

    BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 10:23 pm
    J. Alfred Prufrock January 6th, 2011 at 10:21 pm
    ++++++++++++++++
    Thatis an excellent point worthy of a guest article for this blog. You should submit it.

    ////

    Bojo,I think there are more of us that get this domino effect than I originally thought. Guys like you, Against All Odds, who raised the point here first,Rich in NJ, etc.
    +++++++++++++++
    Then AAO should write the thread–it’s a case that needs to be made. Maybe Cash will actually read it!

    ——————————————————————–

    Yea his off season hasn’t been too busy so he can do some reading on lohud.

  104. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:39 pm

    Nunez is the annointed one so much that htey drafted a SS with one of their top picks last year.

    Looks like a solid if unspectacular player…like perhaps an Andre Robertson.

  105. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 11:40 pm

    Andre Roberston was never the same after the car accident.

  106. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:40 pm

    Against All Odds January 6th, 2011 at 11:39 pm
    ++++++++++++++
    Well, at least he would be doing something productive!

  107. Jerkface January 6th, 2011 at 11:41 pm

    From my own reliable source, Andy texted employee of the Yankees saying he has begun working out… could point to wanting to be in ‘game shape’

    also Rich: “Would Soriano, as a set up reliever, accumulate sufficient points in the ratings system to remain a Type A?”

    I don’t see why not. Grant Balfour was a Type-A. Soriano is a very highly rated Type-A right now, he should be a Type-A next season since its rolling 2 year averages.

  108. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:41 pm

    Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 11:40 pm

    Andre Roberston was never the same after the car accident.
    ++++++++++++++++++
    Proving the old adage once again that one shouldn’t be coming and going at the same time.

  109. blake January 6th, 2011 at 11:41 pm

    But Igawa was an all time level bust and Brackman was on the verge of being as well before his comeback last year….and he still hasn’t reached the big leagues. That example could be used for why you should worry about draft picks….but it could also be used for why you shouldn’t.

  110. Rich in NJ January 6th, 2011 at 11:42 pm

    Jerkface

    So you’re OK with a one year deal?

  111. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:42 pm

    Jerkface–

    Scott Downs also was a Type A. Soriano will be a type A

  112. Jerkface January 6th, 2011 at 11:43 pm

    Nunez is the annointed one so much that htey drafted a SS with one of their top picks last year.

    I don’t think this is how anyone should look at talent. Hughes is such a good prospect that they drafted 1 million pitchers? Cano is so good yet they drafted David Adams?

    You try to get players you think will be good and make the majors. Not going by need. The Yankees might think Nunez is a major league caliber SS, and it will take years for Cito Culver to reach the majors. Someone has to be able to play short stop in his absence.

  113. Jerkface January 6th, 2011 at 11:44 pm

    So you’re OK with a one year deal?

    No. I don’t think so. I don’t want to sign him at all. I hate the idea of losing a pick, giving Tampa 2 extra picks, in a draft everyone is saying is deepest in a while.

  114. SAS January 6th, 2011 at 11:44 pm

    If a few present pitchers in the system work out for the Yankees, and that is at least speculated on here, then the Yankees should be going after other position players for their future. We should have enough catchers and pitchers for the next years.

    Nunez could get hurt, etc.

  115. LGY January 6th, 2011 at 11:45 pm

    The Face has a a reliable source?

    What is going on with the Yankees this winter. They’ll talk to anyone :D

  116. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:45 pm

    Jerkface–my point (poorly made) was that it is always a cr*p shoot with prospects so they hedged their bet. Nothing is a sure thing.

  117. SAS January 6th, 2011 at 11:45 pm

    Jerkface,

    How deep is the current draft supposed to be? I haven’t the foggiest idea.

  118. BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:46 pm

    Good night all. Work day tomorrow.

  119. West Coast Yankee Fan January 6th, 2011 at 11:46 pm

    LGY January 6th, 2011 at 11:16 pm

    He does not have the temperament to be an effective starter, his command was not good enough, he nibbles, he doesn’t seem willing to make the commitment to staying in shape and as a starter his velocity drops to 91-92.

    ******

    If I had a nickel for every young starter that was described in that way, I would have a lot of nickels. Young Master Hughes was labeled a nibbler by many a impatient Yankee fan.

    In terms of velocity, baseball is littered with starters effective in the low 90s.

    I am skeptical abut Joba being a successfil starter in 2011, but these should not be the reasons why.

    ***********

    Starters who are effective throwing in the low 90′s have good command which Joba does not have and they also usually can throw their breaking ball for strikes which Joba does not do consistently.

    As to a couple of the other comments about the 5th starter competition in ST last year being pre-ordained, that is just not true, it’s totally fabricated and there is no evidence whatsoever that is the case. Phil Hughes pitched better than JOba did, it’s that simple. And his 18-8 record proved that was the correct decision based solely on the merits.

  120. backbench January 6th, 2011 at 11:46 pm

    “From my own reliable source, Andy texted employee of the Yankees saying he has begun working out? could point to wanting to be in ?game shape?

    Outstanding. That may mean that he got enough of the family stuff whale watching on the ‘Hula Girl’ and now wants to get back to the serious pursuit of his HOF election.

  121. Jerkface January 6th, 2011 at 11:46 pm

    How deep is the current draft supposed to be? I haven’t the foggiest idea.

    -

    Last years was supposed to be light. This years is supposed to be the deepest in recent memory. Prospects coming out this year who will be in the end of the 1st and supplemental round would be top 15 picks in other years.

  122. Jerkface January 6th, 2011 at 11:47 pm

    The Face has a a reliable source?

    Well I do have Jon Heyman’s phone number :x

  123. LGY January 6th, 2011 at 11:47 pm

    backbench has some good info too tonight.

    What else can you spill?

  124. Pat M. January 6th, 2011 at 11:51 pm

    One thing is for certain, Serigo Mitre is not an option….As for Joba there must be some it side stuff that is being kept locked away….The guys I’ve spoken with in the game have always viewed him as a reliever and also have said that the club is exasperated with him….He was offered up in The Hallady and Haren deals only to be rejected by both clubs……However at this point he has to be a more viable option than the hacks that are being spoken about, besides the bullpen choices are not only better than what’s out there for starters they’re easier to obtain…….Cal Berkley Bears at + 13 is looking really good right now…….Nick in SF has to be loving this….

  125. Hopdevil January 6th, 2011 at 11:52 pm

    In MLB always draft best available talent – don’t draft based on need. Tons of prospects in baseball and they take years to develop.

  126. Against All Odds January 6th, 2011 at 11:54 pm

    # West Coast Yankee Fan January 6th, 2011 at 10:50 pm

    Are you guys serious with the Joba back in the rotation talk? It’s not happening, how many times do Cashman and Girardi have to say it in no uncertain terms?

    The guy had his shot and couldn’t get the job done according to the powers that be who evaluate such things. He does not have the temperament to be an effective starter, his command was not good enough, he nibbles, he doesn’t seem willing to make the commitment to staying in shape and as a starter his velocity drops to 91-92. Whether it is his shoulder or just his physiology, or whatever, he cannot sustain the velocity on his fastball to get the job done.

    It’s over for him as a starter with this team.
    —————————————————————-

    Well let’s be honest about 1 thing his shot was what a yr and a couple of months. This is not a stab against Hughes but how many shots was he given.
    07- struggled at moments, got injured but finished the yr well
    08 – bombed…..won 0 games his best starts was the 1st one of the season and the last one of the season against the Blue Jays
    09- had a great game against the Tigers in his 1st start, struggled in every start after that, pitched great against the Rangers, and then got lit up against the Tribe. He was going to get sent down but campaigned to stay and pitch out of the pen
    10- Went in ST in a “battle” for the 5th spot when in reality it was his job to lose because they were not going to delay his development for another yr.

  127. SAS January 6th, 2011 at 11:55 pm

    Thanks, Jerkface. I hope we get our share.

  128. Against All Odds January 6th, 2011 at 11:59 pm

    # blake January 6th, 2011 at 11:02 pm

    Bojo,

    The Mariners royally screwed that one up. They could have Hernandez and Morrow atop that rotation right now where they both could lose games 1-0……Morrow is going to be good though…..he already is.
    ———————————————————–

    Yea Morrow is a beast didn’t he strike out 17 Rays in the near perfect game. Striking out the Rays isn’t hard but still what a performance.

  129. LGY January 6th, 2011 at 11:59 pm

    Face,

    So reliable is this reliable source?

  130. LGY January 7th, 2011 at 12:02 am

    “Starters who are effective throwing in the low 90?s have good command which Joba does not have and they also usually can throw their breaking ball for strikes which Joba does not do consistently.”

    —————-

    Some examples:

    -Matt Cain throws in the low 90s and in his first full year starting had 4.1 BB/9
    -Gio Gonzalez 4.1 BB/9 last year, 4.7 BB/9 in his career so far
    -Chad Billingsley 5.8 BB/9 in his first year, 3.9 in his second
    -Jonathan Sanchez 4.6 BB/9 in his career
    -CJ Wilson 4.1 BB/9 last year

  131. Jerkface January 7th, 2011 at 12:06 am

    So reliable is this reliable source?

    Probably not that reliable. How reliable is anyone that isn’t Andy or Cashman?

  132. LGY January 7th, 2011 at 12:07 am

    Of starters who threw at least 150 innings in 2009, only 22 had a fastball with a higher average velocity than Joba.

  133. Against All Odds January 7th, 2011 at 12:09 am

    # SAS January 6th, 2011 at 11:37 pm

    This has been an excellent conversation.

    If I am not mistaken, and I may be Nunez was supposed to be the anointed one to replace Jeter when the time came. Is this my imagination or have opinions changed about Nunez?

    —————————————-

    As long as he’s still in the organization he’s the one but I only see him as a stop gap. Not saying that he’s going to suck or be a fraud but does anyone see Nunez as a guy playing 10 yrs with the Yankees especially when it comes to replacing the captain. You never want to be the guy replacing the guy. Just like with Mo they could go with a kid from the farm but we all know if they have a chance to acquire one of the best in the game they will do it

  134. SAS January 7th, 2011 at 12:16 am

    Against All Odds,

    You are absolutely right, nothing is tougher than replacing the greats. I remember when Murcer replaced Mickey. He turned out to be a pretty good player, but it is inevitable now that Jeter and then Arod will need to be replaced. I think it seems easier to get a good 3rd baseman than SS to begin with and Jeter, well he can’t be replaced in the hearts and minds of some of us…however, someone will come along and be that guy.

    I am sentimental about the guys who are special to me. I am not happy about Pettitte and still hope he will return for one more year.

  135. LGY January 7th, 2011 at 12:18 am

    Even if you bump the IP down to 100, 28 pitchers had a higher average fastball velocity.

    Even with reduced velocity in 2009, Joba was in the top 25% for starters.

  136. Against All Odds January 7th, 2011 at 12:23 am

    # West Coast Yankee Fan January 6th, 2011 at 11:46 pm

    LGY January 6th, 2011 at 11:16 pm

    He does not have the temperament to be an effective starter, his command was not good enough, he nibbles, he doesn’t seem willing to make the commitment to staying in shape and as a starter his velocity drops to 91-92.

    ******

    If I had a nickel for every young starter that was described in that way, I would have a lot of nickels. Young Master Hughes was labeled a nibbler by many a impatient Yankee fan.

    In terms of velocity, baseball is littered with starters effective in the low 90s.

    I am skeptical abut Joba being a successfil starter in 2011, but these should not be the reasons why.

    ***********

    Starters who are effective throwing in the low 90?s have good command which Joba does not have and they also usually can throw their breaking ball for strikes which Joba does not do consistently.

    As to a couple of the other comments about the 5th starter competition in ST last year being pre-ordained, that is just not true, it’s totally fabricated and there is no evidence whatsoever that is the case. Phil Hughes pitched better than JOba did, it’s that simple. And his 18-8 record proved that was the correct decision based solely on the merits.
    ——————————————————-

    The job was Hughes’ to lose for a variety of reasons.

    1) Hughes needed to get his innings in 2010 because he hadn’t pitch a full season as a starter. Since he needed those innings he wasn’t going to spend another yr in the pen

    2) They weren’t going to put Joba or Hughes in AAA because how came you put either one in the minors after the yr they had. Hughes was great during the regular season and Joba was solid in the PS

    3) Javy being traded to the team meant there was only one spot and Hughes had to be in the 2010 rotation. If he wasn’t it would once again delay his opportunity to make 30 starters and pitch 160-180 innings.

  137. yankeefeminista January 7th, 2011 at 12:26 am

    BoJo January 6th, 2011 at 11:30 pm
    Blake–

    I didn’t like the competition at the time, and thought they should not have acquired Vasquez….I was fine with giving Joba and Hughes roles in the rotation…

    But to answer your question, Joba’s flu made it hard to pick him at that time…so he should have been sent down to get stronger and work on those mechanics._______
    __________
    Sound logic there. Get the flu for a week and you may suddenly be relegated to the bullpen for life. lol.

  138. Against All Odds January 7th, 2011 at 12:26 am

    # Pat M. January 6th, 2011 at 11:51 pm

    One thing is for certain, Serigo Mitre is not an option….As for Joba there must be some it side stuff that is being kept locked away….The guys I’ve spoken with in the game have always viewed him as a reliever and also have said that the club is exasperated with him….He was offered up in The Hallady and Haren deals only to be rejected by both clubs……However at this point he has to be a more viable option than the hacks that are being spoken about, besides the bullpen choices are not only better than what’s out there for starters they’re easier to obtain…….Cal Berkley Bears at + 13 is looking really good right now…….Nick in SF has to be loving this….

    ————————————————-

    Was he rejected by the Jays and Dbacks or did Casjman refuse to move him?

  139. LGY January 7th, 2011 at 12:27 am

    “As to a couple of the other comments about the 5th starter competition in ST last year being pre-ordained, that is just not true, it’s totally fabricated and there is no evidence whatsoever that is the case.”

    ———————

    In the next few days, Joe Girardi will make it official that Phil Hughes is the Yankees’ fifth starter.

    There are still meetings this week, still final statements that could be offered, still an injury that can change minds and needs. But this was a competition in the faintest of ways. As I reported in early February, the Yankees brass was going to enter spring privately viewing Hughes as the clear fifth starter frontrunner.

    The reality is that no one else could win the job. Hughes could only lose it. And strangely, he sealed the win Monday when, of all things, he lost by surrendering three homers, including a walk-off shot by Philadelphia’s Wilson Valdez.

    Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports.....z1AKAWlaDM

  140. yankeefeminista January 7th, 2011 at 12:27 am

    Or you could say the job was never Joba’s to win in 2010. We all knew that beforehand. Curious charade by the Yanks.

  141. yankeefeminista January 7th, 2011 at 12:28 am

    & yes, Pruf, Bumgarner is another good example. He was getting trashed by so called prospect pundits b/c of his diminished velocity and look at him now.

  142. yankeefeminista January 7th, 2011 at 12:30 am

    Yep, LGY, remember all of it like it was yesterday.

  143. Against All Odds January 7th, 2011 at 12:33 am

    # SAS January 7th, 2011 at 12:16 am

    Against All Odds,

    You are absolutely right, nothing is tougher than replacing the greats. I remember when Murcer replaced Mickey. He turned out to be a pretty good player, but it is inevitable now that Jeter and then Arod will need to be replaced. I think it seems easier to get a good 3rd baseman than SS to begin with and Jeter, well he can’t be replaced in the hearts and minds of some of us…however, someone will come along and be that guy.

    I am sentimental about the guys who are special to me. I am not happy about Pettitte and still hope he will return for one more year.
    ——————————–

    Yea replacing the greats is not easy especially when those greats have championship rings.

    Andy might give it one more yr but I can see him walking away. IDK he seems likes a guy that just loves to pitch.

  144. Against All Odds January 7th, 2011 at 12:35 am

    LGY with the walk off homerun

  145. yankeefeminista January 7th, 2011 at 12:35 am

    Guess Yanks need to get the Stadium field in tip-top baseball shape for the Select-A-Seat ticket derby. They’ll try again to sell some of those field level seats between the bases. Anyone going to that in an attempt to upgrade their seasons?

  146. Pat M. January 7th, 2011 at 12:36 am

    Against all odds…..The word was he was offered in both trades, Toronto wanted Hughes and Arizona wanted either Brackman or Robertson to be included with Ivan Nova…….Three was speculation that when the Yanks spoke to Philly about Lee before he went to Seattle that Joba was mentioned along with a few others but that’s never really been confirmed……I think SJ knew something about this though……

  147. Against All Odds January 7th, 2011 at 12:38 am

    Thanks for clearing it up.

    I have seen ppl mention that Cashman refused to move him in both deals which is why fans get so upset about the non trade for Haren

  148. Rich in NJ January 7th, 2011 at 12:38 am

    Something was totally fabricated…

  149. yankeefeminista January 7th, 2011 at 12:41 am

    The Yanks totally devalued Joba before deciding they didn’t like him after all.

  150. RC January 7th, 2011 at 12:43 am

    “The reality is that no one else could win the job. Hughes could only lose it. And strangely, he sealed the win Monday when, of all things, he lost by surrendering three homers, including a walk-off shot by Philadelphia’s Wilson Valdez.”

    heh i was there!

  151. yankeefeminista January 7th, 2011 at 12:45 am

    Interesting that Rays have hired Eiland, but only for scouting purposes. No way they will let him get near the pitchers as far as development goes. He would turn Hellickson into a reliever.

  152. Pat M. January 7th, 2011 at 12:47 am

    LGY…..Hughes was penciled into the rotation before the last pitch on the 09 World Series was thrown…….The trade for Vasquez sealed Joba’s fate as a starter….

  153. Against All Odds January 7th, 2011 at 12:48 am

    Hey guys it’s been fun but I’m calling it a night. There were alot of good discussions in here. I like SAS bringing up Nunez being the one to replace Jeter. And of course the Joba debate is always entertaining no matter what side ppl fall on. Enjoy the rest of the night and see you again tomorrow.

  154. Rich in NJ January 7th, 2011 at 12:50 am

    “Interesting that Rays have hired Eiland, but only for scouting purposes. No way they will let him get near the pitchers as far as development goes. He would turn Hellickson into a reliever.”

    I think they want his Yankee info, nothing more. It’s gamemanship.

  155. SAS January 7th, 2011 at 12:50 am

    Pat M.

    Have you been in touch with SJ and will he be back with us?

  156. yankeefeminista January 7th, 2011 at 12:54 am

    Rich in NJ January 7th, 2011 at 12:50 am
    “Interesting that Rays have hired Eiland, but only for scouting purposes. No way they will let him get near the pitchers as far as development goes. He would turn Hellickson into a reliever.”

    I think they want his Yankee info, nothing more. It’s gamemanship.
    _________
    Well, we know Eiland has an axe to grind. But which Yankee pitching info, depending on what mood, which week, who’s in and who’s out?

  157. yankeefeminista January 7th, 2011 at 12:56 am

    SAS, I assume you finally reached your destination? It must have been an adventurous ride. I think we are supposed to get more snow in the East tonight.

  158. Pat M. January 7th, 2011 at 12:58 am

    SAS….I’m going to call him tomorrow….He’s been all over the country covering Bowl games and NFL games……

  159. yankeefeminista January 7th, 2011 at 1:05 am

    LGY January 7th, 2011 at 12:02 am
    “Starters who are effective throwing in the low 90?s have good command which Joba does not have and they also usually can throw their breaking ball for strikes which Joba does not do consistently.”

    —————-

    Some examples:

    -Matt Cain throws in the low 90s and in his first full year starting had 4.1 BB/9
    -Gio Gonzalez 4.1 BB/9 last year, 4.7 BB/9 in his career so far
    -Chad Billingsley 5.8 BB/9 in his first year, 3.9 in his second
    -Jonathan Sanchez 4.6 BB/9 in his career
    -CJ Wilson 4.1 BB/9 last year
    ________
    This is kind of par for the course with most young pitchers. Kershaw was over 4 in his first year, and 4.79 in his second year, but this year he was in the mid 3′s.

  160. SAS January 7th, 2011 at 1:07 am

    Pat M.

    Tell him that we miss his input.

  161. SAS January 7th, 2011 at 1:12 am

    YankeeFeminista,

    Thanks, yes we are ensconced in AZ. It has been cold here, but compared to the East and even the far West we are doing OK here.

    I like a snowfall…especially when I am watching it snow and it is clean and white. It is the cold and gray days that I find depressing. I don’t know if you have ever been to AZ, but the desert here is gorgeous.

    Hope you don’t get too much snow tonight/tomorrow.

  162. Pat M. January 7th, 2011 at 1:30 am

    SAS…I’ll pass that along of course……Has Betsy been around ??

  163. CompassRosy January 7th, 2011 at 2:10 am

    You might recall that Morrow was jerked around like this in Seattle, and needed to be told what his role was and given the opportunity to fail.

    The M’s first mistake with Brandon, IMO, was bringing him up too fast. Most young pitchers need more than 7 games in rookie ball and 1 game in A ball before being brought up. But, as noted in the link below, Brandon jerked himself around a bit as well…
    http://tinyurl.com/2attoqd

    He was also given plenty of opportunity to fail – which he did in spectacular fashion at times (especially closing in Arlington). While Jack’s “Brandon for Brandon” swap did leave a few scratching their heads – I guess, for whatever reason, he didn’t think that Brandon was going to be an effective starter in Seattle. Either that, or he was just continuing to purge the system of all things Bavasi ;-)

  164. SAS January 7th, 2011 at 2:34 am

    Pat M.

    I haven’t seen Betsy. I sent her an email for the New Year and she mailed back her good wishes. Last I have heard from her.

  165. West Coast Yankee Fan January 7th, 2011 at 5:08 am

    The pitchers named have better command and are better pitchers than Joba. That was my point. Joba isn’t a good “pitcher”.

    And since when does a Joel Sherman after the fact article prove anything? Joba did not beat out Hughes for the fifth spot. It was a public competition in that the Yankees announced it – if Joba had dominated, and he didn’t, he would have won the job.

    THis is even a discussion only because the Yankees didn’t unload Joba a long time ago.That was a mistake.

    Peace.

  166. YankeesNmore January 7th, 2011 at 6:01 am

    People REALLY need to stop pretending the money matters…

    The “budget” is only an excuse to be used at the Yankees’ whim.

    Remember the winter of 2008??? The Yankees had reached their “budget.” Told everybody who would listen, we’ve spent the money we had to spend…

    But they found another $180 million for Mark Teixeira, didn’t they?

    So let’s all stop pretending what they pay Soriano matters for next year and beyond… It only matters is they Yankees WANT it to matter… When they really want somebody, they sign him, for whatever it takes.

    That’s also why the Yanks could have paid Cliff Lee almost anything, and it wouldn’t have mattered. And if they REALLY wanted him, they would have… Just as they did with Sabathia.

    For God’s sake, their TV network ALONE is worth BILLIONS! The Yankees are playing with dollars while everybody else is playing with nickles.

  167. YankeesNmore January 7th, 2011 at 6:23 am

    According to Buster Olney, we can all forget about Rafael Soriano.

    “Soriano would have to make himself absurdly cheap — on a very short-term (1-year or 2-year deal) — before NYY would even consider him,” Tweets Olney.

    Just when you thought the winter couldn’t be more of a pathetic joke, here comes the Christmas elf to $#!t all over everything… Again!

    Perhaps if Soriano had blown or his arm twice, his shoulder once, and generally sucked while pitching only 17 total innings the last three years, or worthless piece of $#!t GM would be interested.

  168. Mike Ri January 7th, 2011 at 6:42 am

    And a Very Good Morning to you YankeesNMore, !! Glad to see we’re still in a chipper mood .

    Soriano would have to make himself absurdly cheap — on a very short-term (1-year or 2-year deal) — before NYY would even consider him,” Tweets Olney

    —–

    That sucks … but its understandable .

  169. YankeesNmore January 7th, 2011 at 6:52 am

    QUOTE: “That sucks … but its understandable.”
    ———————————————–
    there is nothing “understandable” about what our piece of $#!t GM has (not) done this offseason.

    And Cashman’s hibernation is probably going to lose us Andy Pettitte, as well.

    Remember the reports about how much more likely a Pettitte return would be if the Yankees signed Lee?

    Now read Pettitte’s latest quotes (from yesterday, at his home)…

    Andy sounds like a guy who would like to pitch in 2011, but one who has no interest in sinking on the $#!TTY ship Brian Cashman is building,

  170. YankeesNmore January 7th, 2011 at 6:55 am

    Btw, Pettitte’s quotes can be found in the Post story from this morning. http://m.nypost.com/;s=ldm_vEp.....UuO27kAfAN

  171. Mike Ri January 7th, 2011 at 7:05 am

    YankeesNMore –

    Look the Main Prize was Cliff Lee , It didn’t happen . He wanted to pitch for the Phillies. Cashman can’t force someone pitch for us.

    Then came plan B Grienke . For me it was very appealing . .but the price to land him was CRAZY !!!! Cashman did the right thing to pass.

    Now its Plan C- Sign Pettite .. Give it some time . .one way or another we’ll find out. But if Pettite wants to retire. .. thats his choice . . Again we can’t force someone to pitch for us.

    After that .. There isn’t much left. Soriano is nice .but paying big time money , giving up a first round draft pick , and giving up multiple years to a relief pitcher with elbow and arm problems is a big risk. just look at Marte.

  172. Gary January 7th, 2011 at 7:21 am

    Well the Pettite interview didn’t add much.

    So much disinformation out there, Yanks on hold waiting for Andy, but Andy says don’t wait on me.

    The only real reality right now is it is January 7th and we don’t have a rotation to go into the season, unless you want to consider a couple of imposters in there.

  173. Gary January 7th, 2011 at 7:23 am

    Now its Plan C- Sign Pettite .. Give it some time . .one way or another we’ll find out. But if Pettite wants to retire. .. thats his choice . . Again we can’t force someone to pitch for us.

    _________________________________________________________________________

    How much time do you want to give it? The season ended in early October and spring training is 5 weeks away. Is there a plan D?

  174. YankeesNmore January 7th, 2011 at 7:40 am

    Make all the excuses you wish to make for HOW we got here.

    The fact that the Yankees find themselves little more than a month from spring training with no setup man and only one reliable starter is obscene.

    The Yankees have more resources than anybody and spend more money than anybody, and THIS is the best Cashman can do???

    Past time for a change.

  175. Mike Ri January 7th, 2011 at 7:41 am

    How much time do you want to give it? The season ended in early October and spring training is 5 weeks away. Is there a plan D?

    ———Gary ————

    I agree Gary … its getting a little sickening .. . Plan D is going to battle with what we have.

  176. Doreen January 7th, 2011 at 7:46 am

    Good morning.

    Where’s the (usual) morning people? ;)

    Mike Ri -

    Marte was a good example – everyone wanted him before we got him. I don’t know if you were a LoHud reader before Marte came aboard, but his was the name of the most-wanted relief pitcher (lefty). All you read was “Cashman needs to get Marte.” Well, he got him. And with the huge exception of the World Series in 2009, Marte hasn’t contributed much at all due to injury. And he got a fairly long contract for a relief pitcher, too.

    I would like Soriano, but he’s a risk. Just like they’re all risks. Just as likely to do well as to stink.

  177. upstate kate January 7th, 2011 at 7:47 am

    good morning all
    If it does end up worst case…going w/ the current roster…does anyone really believe that there wont be additions along the way?
    The Rangers and Giants had quite different teams at the end of the year from where they began.

  178. MTU January 7th, 2011 at 7:48 am

    Good morning Doreen-

    Time to go out and buy that Tiguan.

    :)

  179. MTU January 7th, 2011 at 7:50 am

    Kate-

    Aren’t we getting Garza ?

    :)

  180. Gary January 7th, 2011 at 7:50 am

    Mike I agree, plan D could be to fill out the rotation with a few pitchers either over the hill or close to it. There is zero bandwidth out there for any injury of any type, including many of the position players.

  181. upstate kate January 7th, 2011 at 7:52 am

    well yes MTU…at least in my dreams!

  182. Gary January 7th, 2011 at 7:54 am

    If it does end up worst case…going w/ the current roster

    _______________________________________________________________________

    That’s my nightmare, I personally don’t think many teams will be in a mindset to help out the Yanks as time goes along and it seems to be popular now to use the Yanks to get the price up with no intention of dealing them here and go elesewhere. If we start the season with this roster the outlook has to be glum.

  183. Gary January 7th, 2011 at 7:56 am

    MTU

    Garza isn’t coming here, Rays won’t give him to us. Could be wrong, but they have to think about their team also. Who wants your competitor coming to town and beating you with a pitcher that the fans see should be pitching for your team.

  184. MTU January 7th, 2011 at 7:56 am

    Kate-

    Do you have any other surprises in store for us ?

  185. upstate kate January 7th, 2011 at 7:57 am

    I would be really surprised if it comes to that Gary

  186. MTU January 7th, 2011 at 7:57 am

    Gary-

    It’s a running joke between me and Kate.

    ;)

  187. Doreen January 7th, 2011 at 7:59 am

    MTU -

    Well, I told the salesman if he throws in the Mat Package, he’s got a sale. So….

  188. upstate kate January 7th, 2011 at 8:00 am

    Gary
    on the Garza thing…I thought since everyone else put their crazy suggestions out there, I would go w/ someone I like…I know it wont really happen :)

  189. MTU January 7th, 2011 at 8:00 am

    Doreen-

    If he doesn’t do that he’s an absolute idiot.

    Silver ?

  190. Mike Ri January 7th, 2011 at 8:00 am

    Marte was a good example ? everyone wanted him before we got him. I don?t know if you were a LoHud reader before Marte came aboard, but his was the name of the most-wanted relief pitcher (lefty). All you read was ?Cashman needs to get Marte.? Well, he got him. And with the huge exception of the World Series in 2009, Marte hasn?t contributed much at all due to injury. And he got a fairly long contract for a relief pitcher, too.

    I would like Soriano, but he?s a risk. Just like they?re all risks. Just as likely to do well as to stink.

    —————————–
    Doreen , I came aboard a little after the 2009 World Series, But Marte is a perfect example ! I too would like Soriano.. ( for the right price and year(s).. ) .. But with Scott Boras as his agent , the chances of landing him are slim.

  191. yanks61 January 7th, 2011 at 8:03 am

    “Doreen – I was reading Consumer Reports on cars today – I’m in the market myself – they have some concerns about VW reliability. FWIW”- Joe in Long Island,

    Doreen, Joe may be correct, but the fact is that every car has their issues. Quite simply, cars are a losing proposition (and my best friend back in the States, who owned his own small dealership, will back that up!)

    Working as a sales manager for some 40 years, in the U.S. and in Europe, I’ve been lucky to have company financed cars throughout my career, and with mileage averaging about 50,000 miles a year, I got a new car every 3 – 4 years. So between my wife and I, we’ve owned several Chevies, a Volvo, 3 different SAABS, a Rambler, 3 different Renaults, a Ford Mondeo, 2 VW Passats, a VW Polo, a Citroen C5 (their top of the line at the time with hydrolic suspension), a Citroen C3 (another of my wife’s cars) and my present car, an Audi A4 that’s now 3 1/2 years old.

    By the time I traded them in, I usually had one to several minor issues with each and every car and a major issue with the Volvo.
    The A4 is easily my favorite car. It’s a sedan that drives quite a bit like a sports car. Until now, I’ve not had a single problem with it, but I do know that, in Europe at least, they have only an average repair rating (compared to BMW, for example.) The Audi fit my budget better (the money I got for the car from my company) and for a substantial saving over a Beemer, I took the risk and, as I said, so far, so good.

    I think the VW Tiguan is a really nice vehicle. But regardless of how well rated any car is concerning repairs, the most important thing for me in buying a new car is how much I like to drive it – a very personal thing. With a few exceptions, I’ve just never been turned on by Japanese cars, for example, no matter how reliable they are (and I love my Canon 50D, so I’m not anti-Japanese!) For me, it’s the esthetics of the car – the exterior styling, the comfort, the driving experience and the interior cabin build (the dash layout and the quality of the materials.) Again, this is a very personal thing, but it’s that, I believe, that you have to be happy with.

    By the way, do insurance companies in the States not sell special packages covering repairs? For a modest addition to my car insurance, I’ve bought a package that covers repairs on all major parts. It’s a very comforting ‘extra’ – especially when parts for luxury cars are costing as much as they do.

  192. Chuck58 January 7th, 2011 at 8:04 am

    Good morning, friends :-)

  193. Gary January 7th, 2011 at 8:05 am

    Kate, there have been some real interesting suggestions out there for sure this winter.
    :-)

  194. upstate kate January 7th, 2011 at 8:05 am

    good morning Chuck

  195. Gary January 7th, 2011 at 8:06 am

    Just in, Andy said he got a nice tan in Hawaii. :-)

  196. Chuck58 January 7th, 2011 at 8:09 am

    Hi, Kate :-)

    Saw that about the tan, Gary; reporter asked Andy
    “See ya in ST?” Nice touch, but Andy didn’t fall for it :-(

  197. Doreen January 7th, 2011 at 8:14 am

    MTU -

    Alpine Gray.

    yanks61 -

    Thanks for the info. :)

    I will look into that when we speak with our insurance company about the car. We actually test drove the Audi A4 since they didn’t have any Q5s available to test drive. It drove beautifully. Ultimately, it came down to cost. We also passed on the premium navigation package in the VW. It was a “nice to have,” and not a “need to have.”

    When I took the second test drive in the Tiguan, I just felt very at home in it; it felt like “me.”

    We are very disciplined with maintenance of our cars and I do think that helps out a bit with regard to repairs (though, it’s not failsafe). The Tiguan impressed on every level and came out with average reliability ratings. Since I’m happy with everything else, I can live with average. :)

    Ugh. I also have to call XM Radio and find out how we transfer out account to the new car. Sigh.

    Gotta get to the gas station and supermarket this am. It’s started to snow. Why do we always run out of milk on a snow day??????

  198. yanks61 January 7th, 2011 at 8:16 am

    LGY January 6th, 2011 at 7:50 pm
    I think Doreen should get a Vespa.

    LGY, Doreen wants luxury. If she’s going to go Italian, it should be Ducati! :)

  199. Chuck58 January 7th, 2011 at 8:17 am

    Hi, Doreen!
    Good luck driving in the snow [but thank you for taking the snow - we don't look to be getting any ;-)]

  200. Gary January 7th, 2011 at 8:17 am

    Chuck, he sure didn’t.

    Don’t know if it’s a guy that’s just trying to play it caggey or that is not coming back. I sure went down on the side of he’s not coming back after reading it.

  201. MTU January 7th, 2011 at 8:18 am

    Doreen-

    Let me be the first to wish you best of luck on your upcoming purchase.

    :)

  202. MTU January 7th, 2011 at 8:21 am

    Doreen-

    And with that we have brought YOUR OS to a successful conclusion.

    Now. If only the same thing happens to the Yanks.

    ;)

  203. UpState January 7th, 2011 at 8:24 am

    FWIW:
    I also drive an AUDI A4.
    Best car I’ve ever had.

  204. yanks61 January 7th, 2011 at 8:24 am

    Speaking of Italian, I saw a Maserati in a parking garage a few days ago. My God, was it beautiful. But I’d probably have to sell my house and live in the car. While my wife liked the car, too, I’m not sure she’d want to live out of one! :)

    Any idea when we may finally have some juicy baseball stuff to talk about?

  205. upstate kate January 7th, 2011 at 8:26 am

    ah its not successful yet MTU…suppose the Tiguan decides it really wanted to go to another owner all along

  206. MTU January 7th, 2011 at 8:28 am

    If I ever were to get an Audi, and I could afford the freight, I’d get the A8.

    Of course, since I already have my custom hand-crafted Bugatti it really won’t be necessary.

    Will it ?

    :)

  207. MTU January 7th, 2011 at 8:29 am

    Kate-

    In Doreen’s case it’s a done deal.

    ;)

  208. Doreen January 7th, 2011 at 8:33 am

    upstate kate -

    That is a chance. There were only two available (and not at my local dealership) that were what I wanted, and both had to have the Mat Package ordered. The salesman said as soon as I committed verbally he would try to lock one of them down, but who knows? But if all goes well, I could be driving it by mid-week. :)

    MTU -

    Thank you. I know you are not in favor of the Tiguan…

    yanks61 -

    The Audi would have been luxury, a real indulgence. The VW allows us a slight uptick in the luxury department while still maintaining our practicality and staying within the budget we had allotted.

    :)

  209. Chuck58 January 7th, 2011 at 8:35 am

    That’s for sure, Gary. Sadly, I don’t think Andy is coming back.

    61, nothin’ juicy…. that’s why we’re talking Maseratis and Ducatis [moto bella!]
    ;-) Maybe Italian cuisine and vino is next?

  210. Doreen January 7th, 2011 at 8:38 am

    When do the guest posts start?

  211. MTU January 7th, 2011 at 8:39 am

    Doreen-

    As long as you are happy driving your new vehicle that’s all that matters.

    I’m just very practical when it comes to cars.

    As you know, I off road a lot and if I can’t absolutely depend on my vehicle it could be very serious. Even fatal.

    Getting back from the middle of nowhere on foot ain’t easy.

    Especially when you live in the high desert.

    That is a priviledge I usually reserve for unwitting Sox fans.

    ;)

  212. Doreen January 7th, 2011 at 8:41 am

    MTU -

    Absolutely – you have very different needs in a car. The closest to off-road I will get? Pulling over if i get a ticket??? (Heaven forbid!)

  213. MTU January 7th, 2011 at 8:47 am

    Doreen-

    I always have a good chuckle when I come across someone who has a 4WD who hasn’t even taken it off the pavement.

    Too funny.

    I feel like telling them to check the owner’s manual.

    They may not be using all of the features they paid for.

    Don’t want them to miss out.

    :)

  214. MTU January 7th, 2011 at 8:52 am

    Nothin’ like a fresh coat of dirt and an extra set of “Utah pinstripes”
    on your vehicle to make your day.

    :)

  215. Doreen January 7th, 2011 at 8:57 am

    MTU -

    The AWD/4WD – we got it for the same reason we got a fireplace in our house: if we sell, people will expect it. :?

  216. Against All Odds January 7th, 2011 at 8:57 am

    # West Coast Yankee Fan January 7th, 2011 at 5:08 am

    The pitchers named have better command and are better pitchers than Joba. That was my point. Joba isn’t a good “pitcher”.

    And since when does a Joel Sherman after the fact article prove anything? Joba did not beat out Hughes for the fifth spot. It was a public competition in that the Yankees announced it – if Joba had dominated, and he didn’t, he would have won the job.

    THis is even a discussion only because the Yankees didn’t unload Joba a long time ago.That was a mistake.

    Peace.
    ————————————————-

    Why would it be out of the realm of possibility if Hughes was the odds on favorite to win? Does anyone think if Hughes lost they would have sent him to the pen or Scranton. There was no way Hughes was going to lose the job barring an injury

  217. 108 stitches January 7th, 2011 at 8:57 am

    Again …… move on with the premise that Andy is retiring. Get serious about Soriano to be sure the bullpen is strong which it will need to be.
    The Lee and Pettitte dollars are still available and the contracts of Posada, Marte, and Igawa are off the books after 2011.
    No guarantees that Rothschild can re-make Burnett and Chamberlain.
    Always the man with a plan, Cashman is moving uncharacteristically slow after saying on a few occasions that the offseason would be about pitching and pitching.

    32 more days until pitchers and catchers report to Tampa.

  218. upstate kate January 7th, 2011 at 8:58 am

    4WD is also good for driving on snowy roads. I had a little Toyota wagon that would go anywhere when you popped it into 4WD.

  219. BIG AL January 7th, 2011 at 8:58 am

    Good morning folks.

    Doreen, I’d go for the better Nav system, well worth the difference.

    MTU – 4WD is not just for going off road, it’s for those snow days, or even while driving in very heavy rain. In my case, going off road means I missed the turn.

  220. ac1 January 7th, 2011 at 8:59 am

    Make all the excuses you wish to make for HOW we got here.

    The fact that the Yankees find themselves little more than a month from spring training with no setup man and only one reliable starter is obscene.

    The Yankees have more resources than anybody and spend more money than anybody, and THIS is the best Cashman can do???

    Past time for a change.

    ___

    YOu do now Cashman doesn’t OWN the team right? He is being TOLD what he can spend and how far he can go to get some people. Clearly new Steinbrenner has told him we cannot go spend the way he used to. I like Soriano too, but i can imagine if Cashman is not being budgeted, that spending 10 mil/year on a set up guy who has injury history is in his mind.

    Also, Cashman isnt at fault for the last of ML ready minor leaguers. Since he took over, he has begun rebuilding a system that wasn’t very good before.

  221. MTU January 7th, 2011 at 9:01 am

    Doreen-

    Again, being practical, our FP is turned on right now.

    Definitely takes the chill out in the morning.

    It’s nice to actually use the things we have.

    You should try it.

    :)

  222. BIG AL January 7th, 2011 at 9:03 am

    MTU -

    You have A/C? Well turn it on. Oh, you mean, only use it when necessary.

  223. MTU January 7th, 2011 at 9:04 am

    Kate/Al-

    I knew that. I was just givin’ you all a hard time.

    But it still is funny when someone’s 4WD looks like it never left the showroom floor.

    :)

  224. BIG AL January 7th, 2011 at 9:04 am

    New thread >>>>>>>>>>>>>>

  225. Doreen January 7th, 2011 at 9:06 am

    MTU -

    I was never comfortable starting the fire. And when we used to use it, my husband spent all his time tending it. We looked into getting the automatic start or whatever you call it. We didn’t pursue it, and I don’t recall why.

    I have AWD in the MDX – it does come in handy in the snow. :)

    Big Al -

    Not to my husband, it wasn’t. He said it was up to me, but I know when I’m being given a false choice. :)

  226. BIG AL January 7th, 2011 at 9:07 am

    Later folks

  227. 86w183 January 7th, 2011 at 9:14 am

    All I care aobut is the team that leaves Florida for opening day. The Yanks don’t have to win November or December or even January.

    Soriano is potentially a great addition, potentially a big waste of money. If he would take 3 years for $ 25 M with increases based on finishing games, I’m in. If a $ 30 M guarantee is needed I get a bit squeamish too.

    I am starting wonder what the heck Pettite is waiting for. It’s been ten weeks for cryin’ out loud. It’s time for “Favre Lite” to make his decision, isn’t it?

    I know Cashman claims the Yanks are assuming he’s done, but is there anyone who doesn’t think they are holding $ 12 M in reserve in case he does come back?

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