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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Cashman: “It’s a misunderstanding”

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Jan 12, 2011 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Scratch that.

Just got off the phone with Brian Cashman who said The Daily News story about Andy Pettitte’s decision is not accurate. “It’s a misunderstanding,” Cashman said.

This was Cashman’s quote, as relayed by The Daily News: “I don’t think he’s determined if he’s officially finished or not, but he’s chosen at this stage at least not to start in 2011.”

Cashman said you could basically substitute the word “pitch” for the word “start.” What Cashman meant was, at this stage, Pettitte is choosing not to pitch in 2011, but the Yankees are — as they’ve been all winter — waiting for Pettitte to let them know something official. He’s leaning toward retirement, and he’ll let them know if that situation changes.

“Nothing new or different,” Cashman said. “Exactly what I’ve been saying for the past month or two months.”

Comments

comments

 

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290 Responses to “Cashman: “It’s a misunderstanding””

  1. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 9:22 pm

    I thought so.

  2. MTU January 12th, 2011 at 9:24 pm

    Rich-

    Hope renewed.

    See you tomorrow.

    :)

  3. West Coast Yankee Fan January 12th, 2011 at 9:25 pm

    That’s the most convoluted nonsence I have ever heard.

  4. West Coast Yankee Fan January 12th, 2011 at 9:26 pm

    sp-nonsense

  5. DocTodd January 12th, 2011 at 9:26 pm

    This is like our own Brett Favre retirement saga…….

  6. Chad Jennings January 12th, 2011 at 9:26 pm

    Biggest Yankees story in weeks, and it’s not a story at all! What a winter.

  7. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 9:26 pm

    GN, MTU

  8. DocTodd January 12th, 2011 at 9:27 pm

    Lawyerspeak

  9. joeman January 12th, 2011 at 9:29 pm

    was on this all along that he wasn’t going to pitch this year, even though it’s said no pitching to start the season …he’s done. Lets move on

  10. pat January 12th, 2011 at 9:29 pm

    “That?s the most convoluted nonsence I have ever heard.”

    Not even close. Much more convulated “nonsense” is spouted here all the time.

  11. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 9:31 pm

    actually it seems like Pettitte is likely to return late in the season,once he’s beyond the Clemens stuff & feeling healthier.I’m sure the groin has been a big factor,said he couldn’t work out per usual offseason.we go on & if he makes it back,it’s bonus time.

  12. austinmac January 12th, 2011 at 9:33 pm

    The practical effect of all this is Pettitte is presumably not getting ready as needed. If he does ever decide to pitch, when will be an issue. They need a starter.

  13. blake January 12th, 2011 at 9:34 pm

    I think Andy will pitch the full season. I don’t see him doing the half season thing…….maybe I’m wrong but I just have a feeling he’ll be back before ST

  14. RMS January 12th, 2011 at 9:34 pm

    repost

    Yankee rotation as of now-

    CC
    Hughes
    AJ
    Nova
    Mitre

    Yikes!

  15. joeman January 12th, 2011 at 9:35 pm

    not really a given that if he does pitch in 11 that it’s with the Yankees, he just may stay in Tex and pitch there….never know

  16. MattyAlou January 12th, 2011 at 9:36 pm

    Chad, you do not make it clear that this was CASHMAN’s error, NOT the Daily News reporter. Cashman read what he said, and realized he misspoke. Please be clear about that.

  17. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 9:36 pm

    Andy’ll be back. I guarantee it, like Joe Namath did 42 years ago today. :)
    Just not sure when.

  18. Jerzz January 12th, 2011 at 9:36 pm

    “actually it seems like Pettitte is likely to return late in the season,once he’s beyond the Clemens stuff”

    Depends how badly Clemens wants to drag Pettitte through the mud and if Andy chooses to defend himself against him. And these legal things always drag out, so it’s not like it’s just going to disappear. It will be on-going.

  19. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 9:37 pm

    WCYF – it’s as if you deliberately misunderstand something so you can take some indignant,wounded stance on it.

    Does it not make sense to you that he isn’t really healthy,doesn’t feel good about going to ST not certain of his health and not having had the benefit of his offseason routine,and facing having to testify??he wants that all behind him,which is why he isn’t saying “I’m done” unequivocally,because he’s still spiritually interested in resuming his pitching career.isn’t this just completely obvious??otherwise,he’d have slammed the door. as things stand,he doesn’t want us counting on him,so consider him not returning.yet i bet privately the yanks know there’s a good chance he comes back later in the season.

    convoluted??maybe his life is a little complicated right now & it isn’t cut & dry,even though you want it to be.& the guy who compared AP with Brett F, just FU.This is Andy Pettitte we’re talkin about.

  20. joeman January 12th, 2011 at 9:37 pm

    # RMS January 12th, 2011 at 9:34 pm

    repost

    Yankee rotation as of now-

    CC
    Hughes
    AJ
    Nova
    Mitre

    Yikes!
    ——————————————–

    for this to work AJ is going to have to be huge, Nova might improve but Mitre is what he is..

  21. blake January 12th, 2011 at 9:37 pm

    I think Pettite has said several times that he’s either retiring or pitching for the Yankees. He’s been pretty definitive about that.

  22. EA January 12th, 2011 at 9:38 pm

    The Clemens stuff will be an issue the whole year. April will only be the beginning of it. If his goal is to avoid being in the spotlight during the trial, well, then he probably should just retire.

  23. blake January 12th, 2011 at 9:38 pm

    I also don’t think there is any way Mitre will be in the rotation even if Pettite retires.

  24. Gary January 12th, 2011 at 9:38 pm

    Symantics, it’s still the same situation. He’s not pitching today, that is what Andy said, that’s what Brian said he said. I think telling the Yanks to move on is a pretty profound statement on Andy’s part. The SP remains still a big unknown and while there are interesting stories about a position player of two joing the team nothing comes out of it. Another day passes, just lkike yesterday, just like tomm.

  25. DocTodd January 12th, 2011 at 9:38 pm

    Andy WILL pitch again at the Stadium…..but it looks like it may be on Old Timer’s Day…

  26. 38HotDogs January 12th, 2011 at 9:38 pm

    You think this year’s rotation is scary – we got the CC opt out which isn’t helped by no Andy this year. Andy not coming back has HUGE implications not just on this year but next.

  27. joeman January 12th, 2011 at 9:41 pm

    # blake January 12th, 2011 at 9:38 pm

    I also don’t think there is any way Mitre will be in the rotation even if Pettite retires.
    ———————————–
    -and who’s the #5 SP then

  28. RMS January 12th, 2011 at 9:41 pm

    While Cashman is waiting for Andy’s decision, like he waited on Lee, what is his plan B? Thus far he has done nothing regarding the starting staff.

  29. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 9:41 pm

    One day, one season, at a time.

  30. brianlopez22 January 12th, 2011 at 9:41 pm

    OK, was Cashman asleep since September?
    He hasn’t done anything right.

    I, personally, think Nova is a great young starter in the MLB, but he can’t be the #4, this early and having an unknown #3 in AJ. Andy should be Cashman’s obsession after he struck out on Cliff Lee.

    I would take Millwood at this point. He is a horse and he’s definitely better than Mitre.

  31. West Coast Yankee Fan January 12th, 2011 at 9:42 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock – I was referring to the sloppy, convoluted reporting and Cashman misspeaking not Pettitte.

  32. Gary January 12th, 2011 at 9:43 pm

    I would take Millwood at this point. He is a horse and he’s definitely better than Mitre.

    _________________________________________________________________________

    I’, not sure about the Mitre part, but Millwood is terrible

  33. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 9:43 pm

    #5 starting pitcher will be the guy we haven’t picked up yet.

    I thought the Clemens case might end up being tried later. December sounds about right.:D

  34. austinmac January 12th, 2011 at 9:44 pm

    Blake,

    We are all open to non-Mitre starters. Suggestions? It seems to me trade options are few, if any, and one by one the incredibly weak free agent pitchers are signing.

  35. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 9:44 pm

    “Andy WILL pitch again at the Stadium…..but it looks like it may be on Old Timer’s Day”

    I get that you’re at least half-joking, but if so, it would coincide with Clemens’ trial. So it’s highly unlikely

  36. blake January 12th, 2011 at 9:44 pm

    Phelps, Noesi, Brackman, Joba, Garcia, Millwood, Francis, Duchscherer….etc. I think any of these would be the 5th starter before Mitre would….and I like Mitre for a long man/spot starter.

  37. joeman January 12th, 2011 at 9:45 pm

    yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 9:43 pm

    #5 starting pitcher will be the guy we haven’t picked up yet.
    ———————————————————————————-
    don’t hold your breath on that happening

  38. Gary January 12th, 2011 at 9:46 pm

    Personally I think all the Clemens stuff is a red herring, it has no bearing on anything. Interesting thing to talkk about, but it’s not driving the equation.

  39. brianlopez22 January 12th, 2011 at 9:48 pm

    Blake and austinmac,

    as long as we don’t trade any players for Zambrano. If we do trade for him, it better be a cash dump.

  40. Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 9:49 pm

    # RMS January 12th, 2011 at 9:41 pm

    While Cashman is waiting for Andy’s decision, like he waited on Lee, what is his plan B? Thus far he has done nothing regarding the starting staff.

    —————————————————–

    Plan B…..slug their way to the PS???????

  41. joeman January 12th, 2011 at 9:49 pm

    Phelps, Noesi, Brackman, Joba, Garcia, Millwood, Francis, Duchscherer….etc. I think any of these would be the 5th starter before Mitre would…

    ——————————————————————————

    lets sign one of these guys(Garcia,Millwood,Francis,Duchscherer) before you start talking about them, & joba is staying in the pen

  42. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 9:50 pm

    Having to be the star witness in a trial that could determine the legacy of arguably a top three pitcher in MLB history is hardly nothing, especially when you consider that he will have to face Clemens and be subject to cross-examination by a world class litigator.

  43. tyanksfan36 January 12th, 2011 at 9:51 pm

    If andy doesn’t want to come back then there’s nothing anyone can do about it. If I was constantly being hounded by someone I wouldn’t want to come back either. What if he were to come back and then have an awful year, everyone would be saying he shouldve retired instead of coming back. I’m sure Cashman and the Powers that be will figure something out. I think Nova will be fine as long as they get another starter.

  44. joeman January 12th, 2011 at 9:51 pm

    # Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 9:49 pm

    # RMS January 12th, 2011 at 9:41 pm

    While Cashman is waiting for Andy’s decision, like he waited on Lee, what is his plan B? Thus far he has done nothing regarding the starting staff.

    —————————————————–

    Plan B…..slug their way to the PS???????
    ————————————————————-
    every game that CC & Phil aren’t pitching will be 10-9 games

  45. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 9:52 pm

    EA January 12th, 2011 at 9:38 pm
    The Clemens stuff will be an issue the whole year. April will only be the beginning of it. If his goal is to avoid being in the spotlight during the trial, well, then he probably should just retire.

    ///
    yea but maybe he wants to lower himself into that & not have to worry about being an injured guy trying to go to ST & be a force in the rotation -all at once.i don’t think you or I can decide for AP what he “should” do.I’ll be happy as hell if he jumps on his white horse & heads for the Bronx when he’s ready.if he calls it a career,well that’s his call.

  46. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 9:55 pm

    Gary January 12th, 2011 at 9:46 pm
    Personally I think all the Clemens stuff is a red herring, it has no bearing on anything. Interesting thing to talkk about, but it’s not driving the equation.
    ///
    nah it’s a big deal.AP takes everything to heart,too.it has to be overwhelming enough,but this is a guy he called his best friend.

  47. West Coast Yankee Fan January 12th, 2011 at 9:56 pm

    Gary January 12th, 2011 at 9:46 pm

    Personally I think all the Clemens stuff is a red herring, it has no bearing on anything. Interesting thing to talkk about, but it’s not driving the equation.

    ****************

    Gary let me suggest to you why this is a serious issue for Andy Pettitte and not a red herring. Clemens attorneys who are as good as they come will be treating Andy Pettitte as a hostile witness and under oath he will be forced to answer truthfully a myriad of questions about his steroid use and other ancillary details.

    Hopefully, Pettitte was telling the truth the first time.

  48. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 9:56 pm

    joeman January 12th, 2011 at 9:45 pm
    yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 9:43 pm

    #5 starting pitcher will be the guy we haven’t picked up yet.
    ———————————————————————————-
    don’t hold your breath on that happening
    ______
    Don’t hold yours on it *not* happening. :D

  49. UpState January 12th, 2011 at 9:56 pm

    54 innings
    43 hits allowed
    1.093 WHIP
    3.33 ERA
    …..Mitre

    Only Mariano had a better WHIP than Mitre.
    Mitre had essentially the same ERA as Andy.

    Is Mitre ideal ?
    NO.
    Is/was he terrible ?
    NO.

    Limited innings – but not terrible.

    Millwood….more innings —yes
    ERA ….5.10
    WHIP …. 1.50

  50. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 9:56 pm

    West Coast Yankee Fan January 12th, 2011 at 9:42 pm
    J. Alfred Prufrock – I was referring to the sloppy, convoluted reporting and Cashman misspeaking not Pettitte.

    ///
    sorry then.I guess I assumed it was another knock by you of Pettitte.

  51. DocTodd January 12th, 2011 at 9:57 pm

    On to plan ABM…….Anybody But Meattray

  52. Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 9:57 pm

    # joeman January 12th, 2011 at 9:51 pm

    # Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 9:49 pm

    # RMS January 12th, 2011 at 9:41 pm

    While Cashman is waiting for Andy’s decision, like he waited on Lee, what is his plan B? Thus far he has done nothing regarding the starting staff.

    —————————————————–

    Plan B…..slug their way to the PS???????
    ————————————————————-
    every game that CC & Phil aren’t pitching will be 10-9 games

    ————————————————–

    Yea pretty much

    Get your hitting shoes on boys you have to work tonight lol

  53. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 9:58 pm

    Gary January 12th, 2011 at 9:46 pm
    Personally I think all the Clemens stuff is a red herring, it has no bearing on anything. Interesting thing to talkk about, but it’s not driving the equation.
    ____
    How do you figure? The trial will be a huge deal to Andy on so many levels.

  54. joeman January 12th, 2011 at 9:58 pm

    yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 9:56 pm

    joeman January 12th, 2011 at 9:45 pm
    yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 9:43 pm

    #5 starting pitcher will be the guy we haven’t picked up yet.
    ———————————————————————————-
    don’t hold your breath on that happening
    ______
    Don’t hold yours on it *not* happening.
    ———————————————-
    YEP!!!

  55. Gary January 12th, 2011 at 9:58 pm

    Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 9:50 pm
    Having to be the star witness in a trial that could determine the legacy of arguably a top three pitcher in MLB history is hardly nothing, especially when you consider that he will have to face Clemens and be subject to cross-examination by a world class litigator.

    ________________________________________________________________________

    Rich, respectfully that has nothing to do with his decision to pitch or not in April.

  56. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 9:58 pm

    Just as a general observation:I’ve seen a really astonishing amount of criticism,covert & overt dislike of 3 of the core four guys on this site.makes you wonder what some people’s frame of reference is for being yank fans in the first place,but whatever floats your fragile little boats.

  57. West Coast Yankee Fan January 12th, 2011 at 9:59 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock – I understand, I do have my issues with Pettitte as you know but that comment was just on the reporting. Thanks.

  58. Bronx Jeers January 12th, 2011 at 9:59 pm

    I’m recalling that there wasn’t a heck of a lot of evidence in the deposition Andy gave to Congress.

    The phone call right before the Mitchell report was coming out and another phone call nearly 10 years ago where Andy says Clemens told him he was using HGH and Clemens claims he told him his wife was using HGH. The infamous “misremember”

    How long can it take to cover that?

  59. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 9:59 pm

    Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 9:57 pm
    # joeman January 12th, 2011 at 9:51 pm

    # Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 9:49 pm

    # RMS January 12th, 2011 at 9:41 pm

    While Cashman is waiting for Andy’s decision, like he waited on Lee, what is his plan B? Thus far he has done nothing regarding the starting staff.

    —————————————————–

    Plan B…..slug their way to the PS???????
    ————————————————————-
    every game that CC & Phil aren’t pitching will be 10-9 games

    ————————————————–

    Yea pretty much

    Get your hitting shoes on boys you have to work tonight lol
    _____
    Just have to have a shutdown bullpen. 6 innings and the game is over. :D

  60. blake January 12th, 2011 at 9:59 pm

    If the Cubs would do a salary dump deal for Zambrano then that would be OK….two ways to look at the Garza move for them. Either that now they could potentially spare Zambrano and would trade him or that they are going to try to compete in that division and won’t trade him to start the season. Still not clear which it is at this point…..I tend to think they’d unload that salary if the right came along.

  61. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 10:02 pm

    blake, I agree.

  62. joeman January 12th, 2011 at 10:03 pm

    yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 9:59 pm

    Just have to have a shutdown bullpen. 6 innings and the game is over.

    ——————————————————————
    much rather have a # 2 or # 3 SP…..but the only way they are getting that is a trade

  63. Gary January 12th, 2011 at 10:04 pm

    How do you figure? The trial will be a huge deal to Andy on so many levels.

    ____________________________________________________________________

    Why? he has already come clean on his own drug use so it’s not like there is a new story to come out. He already trumped his friendship with Roger opting instead to move on from his mistakes by reinforcing his personal values and his faith. I hardly thing he and Roger are buddy buddy anymore.

    He’s simply going to go up there and answer releavnt questions and tell the truth. By him coming out of the closet so to speak, he has so much more creditability than Roger who unfortantly continues to play this game and remain in denial.

  64. tyanksfan36 January 12th, 2011 at 10:04 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock says:

    January 12, 2011 at 9:58 pm

    Just as a general observation:I’ve seen a really astonishing amount of criticism,covert & overt dislike of 3 of the core four guys on this site.makes you wonder what some people’s frame of reference is for being yank fans in the first place,but whatever floats your fragile little boats.

    _____

    True that. There are so many times when I just want to question some people as to why they even bother being a fan when they have nothing positive to say about the team they are a “fan” of.

  65. Latroy Farnsworth January 12th, 2011 at 10:06 pm

    3rd place full steam ahead.

  66. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 10:06 pm

    “Rich, respectfully that has nothing to do with his decision to pitch or not in April.”

    Neither of us know. My point is that it’s possible.

  67. joeman January 12th, 2011 at 10:08 pm

    # tyanksfan36 January 12th, 2011 at 10:04 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock says:

    January 12, 2011 at 9:58 pm

    Just as a general observation:I’ve seen a really astonishing amount of criticism,covert & overt dislike of 3 of the core four guys on this site.makes you wonder what some people’s frame of reference is for being yank fans in the first place,but whatever floats your fragile little boats.

    _____

    True that. There are so many times when I just want to question some people as to why they even bother being a fan when they have nothing positive to say about the team they are a “fan” of.
    ——————————————————-

    besides the Jeter & Mo signing & the signing of a catcher that they really don’t know what they have with him give me some positive happenings with this team

  68. Jerzz January 12th, 2011 at 10:09 pm

    “Personally I think all the Clemens stuff is a red herring, it has no bearing on anything. Interesting thing to talkk about, but it’s not driving the equation.”

    The issue isin’t necessarily testifying against Clemens. The cross-examination is what could get real ugly. Basically, Clemens’ team will have to destroy Andy’s reputation and credibility and dig up anything they can to do so. So Andy is going to be dragged through the mud in public.

  69. Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 10:09 pm

    # yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 9:59 pm

    Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 9:57 pm
    # joeman January 12th, 2011 at 9:51 pm

    # Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 9:49 pm

    # RMS January 12th, 2011 at 9:41 pm

    While Cashman is waiting for Andy’s decision, like he waited on Lee, what is his plan B? Thus far he has done nothing regarding the starting staff.

    —————————————————–

    Plan B…..slug their way to the PS???????
    ————————————————————-
    every game that CC & Phil aren’t pitching will be 10-9 games

    ————————————————–

    Yea pretty much

    Get your hitting shoes on boys you have to work tonight lol
    _____
    Just have to have a shutdown bullpen. 6 innings and the game is over. :D

    —————————————————–

    Yea but who is a free agent that we can get to shorten the game hmmmm lol. Are there any options

  70. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 10:10 pm

    “Just as a general observation:I’ve seen a really astonishing amount of criticism,covert & overt dislike of 3 of the core four guys on this site.makes you wonder what some people’s frame of reference is for being yank fans in the first place,but whatever floats your fragile little boats.”

    Fact-based assessments are always in bounds.

    You project a lot of stuff about size. It’s kind of bizarre.

  71. blake January 12th, 2011 at 10:12 pm

    It’s really unfortunate that Clemens is going through with this unless he really is 100% innocent.

  72. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 10:16 pm

    “It’s really unfortunate that Clemens is going through with this unless he really is 100% innocent.”

    As George Costanza once said: “It’s not a lie if you believe it.”

  73. blake January 12th, 2011 at 10:17 pm

    Rich,

    True…I think that may be the case here

  74. Gary January 12th, 2011 at 10:17 pm

    Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 10:06 pm
    “Rich, respectfully that has nothing to do with his decision to pitch or not in April.”

    Neither of us know. My point is that it’s possible.

    _______________________________________________________________________

    Rich, I won’t disagree with your conclusion.

    What motivates me is that a professional athlete like Andy who has played for so long isn’t going in my opinion let a couple of days in a courthouse possibly after his last season is over cloud his decision as to if he plays this year. If Andy doesn’t play next year his reasons I think have to be far greater than the trial which is going to happen anyways regardless of what he decides regarding playing. I think love of the game, family, travel, skills errosion are the factors Andy has weighed. I believe he has already made his decision and is just giving it time to sink in that he is really done. I wouldn’t be a bit surprised to hear he has been talking to Mussina regarding how Mike bowed out after his great 20 win season.

  75. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 10:18 pm

    rich in nj — interesting that you choose to respond. well then, let’s focus on jeter, shall we? one or two posts about lack of range and declining on-base & power are fine.

    when a poster keeps pounding & pounding the same point, that’s where you tip your hand. it’s also pretty clear who is “concerned” about Jeter going forward & who is running like a wild stallion with the one bad yr to bury him.

    energy for a particular position & number of posts betray intent.

  76. tyanksfan36 January 12th, 2011 at 10:21 pm

    joeman says:

    January 12, 2011 at 10:08 pm

    # tyanksfan36 January 12th, 2011 at 10:04 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock says:

    January 12, 2011 at 9:58 pm

    Just as a general observation:I’ve seen a really astonishing amount of criticism,covert & overt dislike of 3 of the core four guys on this site.makes you wonder what some people’s frame of reference is for being yank fans in the first place,but whatever floats your fragile little boats.

    _____

    True that. There are so many times when I just want to question some people as to why they even bother being a fan when they have nothing positive to say about the team they are a “fan” of.
    ——————————————————-

    besides the Jeter & Mo signing & the signing of a catcher that they really don’t know what they have with him give me some positive happenings with this team

    —-

    I would say that they got someone who has been known to be a good defensive catcher to replace our catcher who was declining. We have Robinson Cano who was awesome last year. Phil hughes had a really good first starting season. Those are positive things I look forward to seeing next season.

  77. SAS January 12th, 2011 at 10:21 pm

    Did it ever occur to any of you that Andy just wants to skip the coldest days in NY. After all we play 19 games at home in April, and there must be a series at Boston. That was my first take on the news.

    I hope it has nothing to do with Clemens who I never liked anyway..

  78. Gary January 12th, 2011 at 10:25 pm

    The issue isin’t necessarily testifying against Clemens. The cross-examination is what could get real ugly. Basically, Clemens’ team will have to destroy Andy’s reputation and credibility and dig up anything they can to do so. So Andy is going to be dragged through the mud in public.

    ________________________________________________________________________

    Lawyers on both sides will jockey for position. The defense as you rightly said will try to damage his creditability, but they can’t come across as being heavy handed and the judge and the prosecution will make sure that questions go to the revelant aspects of the case.

    Your right though Andy may take a hit, but he made the bed he slept in that fact doesn’t go away and won’t change based on if he plays or not in April. The outcome remains the same.

  79. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 10:27 pm

    when a poster keeps pounding & pounding the same point, that’s where you tip your hand. it’s also pretty clear who is “concerned” about Jeter going forward & who is running like a wild stallion with the one bad yr to bury him.

    Does this work in reverse where people are pounding and pounding the same point that Jeter is fine and the yankees should just pay him whatever he wants?

  80. SAS January 12th, 2011 at 10:27 pm

    Gary,

    You are in Scottsdale right???

  81. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 10:30 pm

    Positives: Posada will be a better DH than most. Among top five if you consider what DH’s did this year.

  82. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 10:32 pm

    Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 10:27 pm

    Does this work in reverse where people are pounding and pounding the same point that *Jeter is fine* and the yankees should just pay him whatever he wants?
    _____
    Be careful not to go too small sample size though and relegate Jeter to his 2010 numbers, which seems to be a raison d’etre for some and counter to the preaching. ;)

  83. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 10:33 pm

    Does this work in reverse where people are pounding and pounding the same point that Jeter is fine and the yankees should just pay him whatever he wants?

    ///
    Jerkface,I don’t think you typify the hardcore Yankee fan.Clearly you became a fan when Alex got traded here.Of course you have no particular affinity for Jeter,and in fact, in the fanboy fantasy war between ARod and jeter,you line up against the yankee captain.both positions – that jeter should be “over” paid, & the ridiculous posts that he should get a 1-yr deal, are fraught with romanticism.the thing is,at least the former can be forgiven, erring on the side of affection.

  84. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 10:35 pm

    Be careful not to go too small sample size though and relegate Jeter to his 2010 numbers, which seems to be a raison d’etre for some and counter to the preaching.
    ///
    you kiddin’? that’s their FOOD.these are people who would throw a party if 2010 marks the beginning of the end for Jeter..

  85. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 10:37 pm

    Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 10:09 pm
    Yea but who is a free agent that we can get to shorten the game hmmmm lol. Are there any options
    ______
    Bullpen shouldn’t be too hard to build though. Free agent arms are variable, so no guarantee as we saw with Broxton and see w/countless others. We just need some live arms that can miss bats. I’m sure a couple of our mlb-ready prospects like Noesi and Brackman are possibilities.

  86. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 10:37 pm

    Jerkface,I don’t think you typify the hardcore Yankee fan.Clearly you became a fan when Alex got traded here.Of course you have no particular affinity for Jeter

    You’re going to be very disappointed to learn of my 3 Jeter Moon shirt.

  87. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 10:38 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock

    “rich in nj — interesting that you choose to respond. well then, let’s focus on jeter, shall we? one or two posts about lack of range and declining on-base & power are fine.

    when a poster keeps pounding & pounding the same point, that’s where you tip your hand. it’s also pretty clear who is “concerned” about Jeter going forward & who is running like a wild stallion with the one bad yr to bury him.

    energy for a particular position & number of posts betray intent.”

    If anyone is repeatedly expending energy on the same subject, it’s you.

    So yes, it does betray intent. It makes no difference to me though.

    I call things as I see them.

    Someone recently accused me (Carlos, I think his name is) of wanting to overpay Jeter. (why didn’t you defend me then?)

    When people said during the Jeter negotiations that he didn’t earn his last contract, I corrected them. (why didn’t you note that?)

    I let the facts guide my responses, be they about Jeter, Mo, Po, A-Rod, or some fungible scrub.

  88. Bronx Jeers January 12th, 2011 at 10:38 pm

    I’m recalling Hannibal Lechter vs. Clarice Starling right about now.

    Quid Pro Quo dammit!

  89. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 10:39 pm

    SAS January 12th, 2011 at 10:21 pm
    Did it ever occur to any of you that Andy just wants to skip the coldest days in NY. After all we play 19 games at home in April, and there must be a series at Boston. That was my first take on the news.

    I hope it has nothing to do with Clemens who I never liked anyway..
    ///
    lol SAS,I grew to like Clemens because he was my guy,but I always thought he rode the coattails of yankee success rather than had a primary hand in creating it.great pitcher,though.I’ll say this,I’d take Roger RIGHT NOW to be Joba’s personal pitching coach, Hughes’ too.They both seem to respond to him.Interesting observation about the cold month of April.they should just consider it winter at this point.can’t even sit in my seats at that time of yr.

  90. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 10:40 pm

    Are we supposed to be cheering for the New York Yankees or the New York Jeters?

  91. tyanksfan36 January 12th, 2011 at 10:42 pm

    Yankeefem

    I forgot that one. Posada is also a switch hitter who does fine hitting left and right handed pitching. Even with limited playing time and being injured he still hit 18 home runs. And who can forget his 2 grand slams from both sides of the plate!

    I think its okay to criticize and worry but to complain and have nothing positive to say about any of the people on the team…like, why be a fan if you don’t clearly don’t like anyone. (This wasn’t focused to you Yankeefem, just a blanket statement)

  92. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 10:42 pm

    Someone recently accused me (Carlos, I think his name is) of wanting to overpay Jeter. (why didn’t you defend me then?)

    ///
    gee rich,sorry I missed it.what could I have been thinking,not to have noted and scrolled for your every comment on the yankee captain.

    When people said during the Jeter negotiations that he didn’t earn his last contract, I corrected them. (why didn’t you note that?)
    ////
    I didn’t see it, but consider it noted.Good call.

    Just curious: how long have you been a yankee fan?

  93. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 10:43 pm

    “Just curious: how long have you been a yankee fan?”

    Since they sucked in the late ’60s.

  94. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 10:44 pm

    Are you positing that the longer you are a fan, the more likely you are to cheer for Jeter irrationally? Wouldn’t that just include a bunch of people with dementia?

  95. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 10:45 pm

    I was a fan of Bernie and Mattingly long before Jeter ever stepped foot in Yankee Stadium.

  96. Bronx Jeers January 12th, 2011 at 10:46 pm

    It’s the hypothermia that gets me cheering.

  97. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 10:46 pm

    Are we supposed to be cheering for the New York Yankees or the New York Jeters?

    ////
    this is just ineffably stupid.

  98. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 10:47 pm

    Bronx Jeers January 12th, 2011 at 10:46 pm
    It’s the hypothermia that gets me cheering.
    //
    me too,only way I can attend a home game in april.

  99. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 10:48 pm

    Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 10:44 pm
    Are you positing that the longer you are a fan, the more likely you are to cheer for Jeter irrationally? Wouldn’t that just include a bunch of people with dementia?
    ////
    what makes you think “cheering” or “rooting” is something that can be rationalized??LMFAO.

  100. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 10:49 pm

    Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 10:43 pm
    “Just curious: how long have you been a yankee fan?”

    Since they sucked in the late ’60s.
    ////
    those were the days.

  101. austinmac January 12th, 2011 at 10:50 pm

    Rich,

    And boy did they suck in the late 60s. Quite the comedown for we early 60s kids. I hope not to see that again any time soon.

  102. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 10:51 pm

    this is just ineffably stupid.

    No you are being stupid, you are trying to say that if you are nothing but a blind fan of Jeter that you are not a Yankee fan, but the Yankees existed before Jeter and will exist after him. There are some people, such as YankeeNMore who take their hatred to entirely new levels, but for others its just looking at the situations logically.

    I said I would prefer a 1 year deal for Jeter, would offer a 2 year deal, and was readily accepting a 3 year deal for the Captain. And yet everyone is up in arms, “4 years!! 20 million! give him what he wants he needs to be paid for his past accomplishments!”

    All I want is to discuss the Yankees in a rational and reasonable manner, which for Jeter fans is apparently blasphemy.

  103. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 10:51 pm

    well,at least you could always get a great seat back then.

  104. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 10:52 pm

    No you are being stupid, you are trying to say that if you are nothing but a blind fan of Jeter that you are not a Yankee fan, but the Yankees existed before Jeter and will exist after him. There are some people, such as YankeeNMore who take their hatred to entirely new levels, but for others its just looking at the situations logically.

    ///
    you are the king of passive aggressive Jeter posts,so please give me a break.

  105. Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 10:53 pm

    # yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 10:37 pm

    Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 10:09 pm
    Yea but who is a free agent that we can get to shorten the game hmmmm lol. Are there any options
    ______
    Bullpen shouldn’t be too hard to build though. Free agent arms are variable, so no guarantee as we saw with Broxton and see w/countless others. We just need some live arms that can miss bats. I’m sure a couple of our mlb-ready prospects like Noesi and Brackman are possibilities.

    ——————————

    I wouldn’t mind seeing those guys get a shot. It would be tough though having young pitchers pitch in a city where portions of the fan base are upset about: Lee not signing here, Andy possibly walking away, and Cashman’s off season.

  106. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 10:54 pm

    austinmac

    That’s actually why I am so adamant about building from within. In the ’60s, most of their players got old at the same time and they didn’t have the talented in-house options to replace them.

    That’s why I am concerned about the aging core!!!

  107. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 10:54 pm

    I said I would prefer a 1 year deal for Jeter, would offer a 2 year deal, and was readily accepting a 3 year deal for the Captain. And yet everyone is up in arms,

    ///
    umm…except this was never in the remotest realm of likelihood.just for the record,you’re not clever enough to have me up in arms,although I can’t speak for others,of course.

  108. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 10:55 pm

    you are the king of passive aggressive Jeter posts,so please give me a break.

    No breaks.

  109. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 10:55 pm

    “you are the king of passive aggressive Jeter posts,so please give me a break”

    That’s a misuse of the term.

  110. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 10:56 pm

    umm…except this was never in the remotest realm of likelihood.just for the record,you’re not clever enough to have me up in arms,although I can’t speak for others,of course.

    Oh this isn’t you up in arms? Or all your other rambling posts about Jeter? My mistake. And 3 years apparently was in the realm of possibility since it happened.

  111. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 10:57 pm

    Jerkface-
    All I want is to discuss the Yankees in a rational and reasonable manner, which for Jeter fans is apparently blasphemy.
    ______________
    Some of us actually have, dare I say it, gulp, affection for a player and yet comprehend all the “right” statistics at the same time. They aren’t mutually exclusive. It’s allowed. Really.

  112. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 10:58 pm

    Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 10:53 pm
    # yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 10:37 pm

    Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 10:09 pm
    Yea but who is a free agent that we can get to shorten the game hmmmm lol. Are there any options
    ______
    Bullpen shouldn’t be too hard to build though. Free agent arms are variable, so no guarantee as we saw with Broxton and see w/countless others. We just need some live arms that can miss bats. I’m sure a couple of our mlb-ready prospects like Noesi and Brackman are possibilities.

    ——————————

    I wouldn’t mind seeing those guys get a shot. It would be tough though having young pitchers pitch in a city where portions of the fan base are upset about: Lee not signing here, Andy possibly walking away, and Cashman’s off season.

    ///
    Agree Yankfem – as we’ve concurred before,it’s much easier to have young guys with live arms ease in in the BP since they don’t have to go round the block with the hitters they face.we basically did this in 2009.

    Against All Odds – well the yanks are just going to have to say “bleep it,” we’re putting the young guys in there,and live with the growing pains.really cashman has a deep lineup & a couple of veterans who helped us win a championship,plus rivera.if you can’t roll the dice a little with this veteran team for your spine,then you just don’t have one of your own.he’s talked the talk so far,now let’s see if he walks it.

  113. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:00 pm

    Some of us actually have, dare I say it, gulp, affection for a player and yet comprehend all the “right” statistics at the same time. They aren’t mutually exclusive. It’s allowed. Really.

    Great we should talk about Jeter rationally. Its true I don’t have much affection for Jeter, I think he has been a poor Captain outwardly and I dislike his postgame interviews. But the only other shortstop I’d rather have on the yankees the past 15 years would be A-rod.

    I dunno why I have to like Jeter. Why can’t I like O’Neil, Bernie, and any other Yankee I want?

    To me Posada is the leader of the old guard, not Jeter.

  114. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 11:00 pm

    I wouldn’t mind seeing those guys get a shot. It would be tough though having young pitchers pitch in a city where portions of the fan base are upset about: Lee not signing here, Andy possibly walking away, and Cashman’s off season.
    ________
    Ah, young kids bounce back easily, and sometimes young arms are better than arms like Marte’s (except in the playoffs of course!) and other arms with more mileage that often pitch while fatigued.

    Our 2009 bullpen was mostly youthful and inexperienced. Look at Hughes, for example.

  115. tyanksfan36 January 12th, 2011 at 11:00 pm

    Well since I became a Yankee fan, the only SS I knew was Jeter, I kinda remember Girardi but its always been Posada as catcher. Andy was always a starter, my favorite was always Orlando Hernandez and Tino Martinez was my favorite first baseman and Oneill and Bernie were my outfielders. I didn’t watch much TV but I knew that the Yankees were my team. Way before I realized they had won so often. I don’t know if it means I’m a bad fan because I’ve only known them as winners but I can’t help I was born in the late 80s

  116. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 11:01 pm

    tyanksfan36

    “I don’t know if it means I’m a bad fan because I’ve only known them as winners but I can’t help I was born in the late 80s”

    No, it means you’re a braggart. j/k

  117. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 11:02 pm

    Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 10:55 pm
    “you are the king of passive aggressive Jeter posts,so please give me a break”

    That’s a misuse of the term.

    ///
    it’s not but since I can’t summon the energy to research these unremarkable posts…

  118. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:03 pm

    And I think I would prefer not to watch the players of great yankee teams past struggling to hold on. Watching Bernie before he wasn’t brought back was quite difficult. And seeing Jeter struggle in 2010 was no treat.

  119. randy l. January 12th, 2011 at 11:04 pm

    “Are we supposed to be cheering for the New York Yankees or the New York Jeters?”

    jerkface-

    We all sure as hell aren’t cheering for the New York Cashmans like you are.

  120. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:05 pm

    We all sure as hell aren’t cheering for the New York Cashmans like you are.

    Shouldn’t you be rooting for the Minnesota Cliburns? Or the Tampa Bay Allens?

  121. Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 11:06 pm

    # J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 10:58 pm

    Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 10:53 pm
    # yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 10:37 pm

    Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 10:09 pm
    Yea but who is a free agent that we can get to shorten the game hmmmm lol. Are there any options
    ______
    Bullpen shouldn’t be too hard to build though. Free agent arms are variable, so no guarantee as we saw with Broxton and see w/countless others. We just need some live arms that can miss bats. I’m sure a couple of our mlb-ready prospects like Noesi and Brackman are possibilities.

    ——————————

    I wouldn’t mind seeing those guys get a shot. It would be tough though having young pitchers pitch in a city where portions of the fan base are upset about: Lee not signing here, Andy possibly walking away, and Cashman’s off season.

    ///
    Agree Yankfem – as we’ve concurred before,it’s much easier to have young guys with live arms ease in in the BP since they don’t have to go round the block with the hitters they face.we basically did this in 2009.

    Against All Odds – well the yanks are just going to have to say “bleep it,” we’re putting the young guys in there,and live with the growing pains.really cashman has a deep lineup & a couple of veterans who helped us win a championship,plus rivera.if you can’t roll the dice a little with this veteran team for your spine,then you just don’t have one of your own.he’s talked the talk so far,now let’s see if he walks it.

    —————————————————-

    He would walk the walk for a yr then go into FA and spend some dough in the off season because he knows that if he doesn’t the screams will only get louder.

  122. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 11:06 pm

    Some of us actually have, dare I say it, gulp, affection for a player and yet comprehend all the “right” statistics at the same time. They aren’t mutually exclusive. It’s allowed. Really.
    ///
    there’s a type,dare i say a stereotype,that prides himself on being “affection” less but is affectionately invested in being perceived as such ;).

  123. Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 11:08 pm

    # yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 11:00 pm

    I wouldn’t mind seeing those guys get a shot. It would be tough though having young pitchers pitch in a city where portions of the fan base are upset about: Lee not signing here, Andy possibly walking away, and Cashman’s off season.
    ________
    Ah, young kids bounce back easily, and sometimes young arms are better than arms like Marte’s (except in the playoffs of course!) and other arms with more mileage that often pitch while fatigued.

    Our 2009 bullpen was mostly youthful and inexperienced. Look at Hughes, for example.

    —————————————–

    That’s true the 09 BP was mostly from the farm. It was definitely one of the things I liked about that yr.

  124. tyanksfan36 January 12th, 2011 at 11:08 pm

    Rich

    Haha, honestly though it wasn’t until I graduated high school and got my own computer and could look up whatever wanted when I realized how often they won. I went to Spring Training every year since they moved to Legends field and for a long time the only way I knew they had won the series from the year before was reading about it in the spring training program. My TV never had cable so I couldn’t watch them but if you asked me who I liked it was always the Yankees. I studied the spring training programs though, I could probably have told you everyone on every yankees team from like 1997 to 2005.

  125. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 11:09 pm

    “it’s not but since I can’t summon the energy to research these unremarkable posts…”

    It’s ironic really. You attacked people from the comfort of your home for merely posting their opinions about Jeter, and yet they are, in your words, passive-aggressive. You can’t make this stuff up.

  126. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 11:10 pm

    Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:00 pm
    Some of us actually have, dare I say it, gulp, affection for a player and yet comprehend all the “right” statistics at the same time. They aren’t mutually exclusive. It’s allowed. Really.

    Great we should talk about Jeter rationally. Its true I don’t have much affection for Jeter, I think he has been a poor Captain outwardly and I dislike his postgame interviews. But the only other shortstop I’d rather have on the yankees the past 15 years would be A-rod.

    I dunno why I have to like Jeter. Why can’t I like O’Neil, Bernie, and any other Yankee I want?

    To me Posada is the leader of the old guard, not Jeter
    _______
    No one expects you to like Jeter, but it is clear that you do not like him. So, isn’t that kind of the point? It is on display for all to see. Why should that dislike have to be tolerated? As for being a poor Captain “outwardly.” I am not even sure what that means. Now who is going off into the land of irrationality?

    Bernie was my favorite Yankee so you can say I had great affection for him, but it didn’t cloud my realization while attending multiple games that he could no longer play CF. But I would never denigrate him. I rather felt sad.

    I agree with Pruf that there is a pleasure people (Yankee fans) display who irrationally dislike Jeter, and it is loathsome. I don’t care one iota whether you “like” Jeter or not. It is that emotion you betray that you yourself seem to dislike in the reverse that I am critiquing.

    Anyway, carry on. I have had my say.

  127. ac1 January 12th, 2011 at 11:10 pm

    now the Rays want Andruw Jones too?

  128. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 11:11 pm

    He would walk the walk for a yr then go into FA and spend some dough in the off season because he knows that if he doesn’t the screams will only get louder.

    ///
    that’s his MO,isn’t it?he naively went with the kids in 2008 & then threw up his hands after a yr and a half of Joba the Starter.If he caves that quickly with the next generation,it will be a sorrowful waste of what could be a great rotation for yrs to come.

  129. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:14 pm

    I’d love to see examples of my taking pleasure in hating Jeter. And the Captain example is that from the media, Jeter has really not been a very good Yankee captain. He rarely says anything of consequence, doesn’t defend his teammates especially the most prominent one on his team (A-rod), doesn’t get fired up about anything. Posada seems to care more about the rest of the team’s effortlevel and focus than Jeter.

    The problem with discussing Jeter is that posting anything negative, statistically or otherwise is considered denigrating him. How can anyone have a discussion on what should be done at SS or with Jeter when the idea of him not being a great player forever is shouted down?

  130. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 11:15 pm

    “it’s not but since I can’t summon the energy to research these unremarkable posts…”

    It’s ironic really. You attacked people from the comfort of your home for merely posting their opinions about Jeter, and yet they are, in your words, passive-aggressive. You can’t make this stuff up.

    ///
    yes,how dare I “attack” those who have made a commenting career of feasting on jeter’s deficiencies,the harbingers of certain doom for the rest of his yankee days? The injustice of it! And on a Yankee blog,of all places!

  131. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 11:15 pm

    Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 11:08 pm

    He would walk the walk for a yr then go into FA and spend some dough in the off season because he knows that if he doesn’t the screams will only get louder.
    _____
    That’s true the 09 BP was mostly from the farm. It was definitely one of the things I liked about that yr.
    _____
    Right, we fill in a couple from outside, but I am thinking we have consistently come up with homegrown players for the pen every year. Usually, we have 1 FA that shines, and I am not sure who that will be, but otherwise, I am not too worried about the pen. We just need someone to replace stretch drive and playoff Kerry.

  132. Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 11:19 pm

    # J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 11:11 pm

    He would walk the walk for a yr then go into FA and spend some dough in the off season because he knows that if he doesn’t the screams will only get louder.

    ///
    that’s his MO,isn’t it?he naively went with the kids in 2008 & then threw up his hands after a yr and a half of Joba the Starter.If he caves that quickly with the next generation,it will be a sorrowful waste of what could be a great rotation for yrs to come.

    ———————————————-

    Yea it is his MO. I hope he sticks to going with the kids but I wouldn’t be surprised if he didn’t. That’s why I have a hard time with plan B is patience. How he tell the fans to be patient when they aren’t patient with their own plans. It’s almost like they want to go with the kids but the potential growing pains are too much for them to handle.

  133. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 11:21 pm

    _______
    No one expects you to like Jeter, but it is clear that you do not like him. So, isn’t that kind of the point? It is on display for all to see. Why should that dislike have to be tolerated? As for being a poor Captain “outwardly.” I am not even sure what that means. Now who is going off into the land of irrationality?

    Bernie was my favorite Yankee so you can say I had great affection for him, but it didn’t cloud my realization while attending multiple games that he could no longer play CF. But I would never denigrate him. I rather felt sad.

    I agree with Pruf that there is a pleasure people (Yankee fans) display who irrationally dislike Jeter, and it is loathsome. I don’t care one iota whether you “like” Jeter or not. It is that emotion you betray that you yourself seem to dislike in the reverse that I am critiquing.

    ////
    this is money, Yankee Fem.i share this response utterly.it IS loathsome.Interesting you bring up Bernie.It made me sick inside to listen to people kick him around in his last couple of yrs.Any Yankee fan intuitively understands this.& yes,it was hard to watch him in CF, like a bird that has a clipped wing but keeps trying to fly,not understanding it can’t any more. It’s weird,I had the same mournful sense when my cat couldn’t catch birds any more.she’d make this sound in her throat,can’t describe it.it’s a feeling a fan experiences that another fan just understands.the same feeling of disgust I get when I see jeter run down on these pages,one others totally understand, like yourself.

  134. Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 11:22 pm

    # yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 11:15 pm

    Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 11:08 pm

    He would walk the walk for a yr then go into FA and spend some dough in the off season because he knows that if he doesn’t the screams will only get louder.
    _____
    That’s true the 09 BP was mostly from the farm. It was definitely one of the things I liked about that yr.
    _____
    Right, we fill in a couple from outside, but I am thinking we have consistently come up with homegrown players for the pen every year. Usually, we have 1 FA that shines, and I am not sure who that will be, but otherwise, I am not too worried about the pen. We just need someone to replace stretch drive and playoff Kerry.

    ——————————————

    I think the concern that many fans have is Joba and D-rob are the main guys ahead of Mo. With fans it’s always what have you done for me lately and alot of ppl still have the regular for Joba and the PS for D-rob still on their mind.

  135. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 11:25 pm

    “yes,how dare I “attack” those who have made a commenting career of feasting on jeter’s deficiencies,the harbingers of certain doom for the rest of his yankee days? The injustice of it! And on a Yankee blog,of all places!”

    You’re missing the point.

    The attacking, from the comfort of your home, makes you passive-aggressive.

    No one is feasting about anything.

    I hope Jeter puts up an .850 OPS for the life of this contract (and beyond).

    I just doubt that he will. I would love to be proved wrong.

    It’s as if you think that anyone who disagrees with you isn’t a fan.

    That’s nonsense.

  136. randy l. January 12th, 2011 at 11:25 pm

    jerkface-

    the really cool thing about growing up playing baseball all day in the fifties and rooting for mantle, maris, howard, ford, etc and the yankees was that people that ran their mouths like you had to come out onto the baseball field to do it.

  137. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 11:26 pm

    The problem with discussing Jeter is that posting anything negative, statistically or otherwise is considered denigrating him. How can anyone have a discussion on what should be done at SS or with Jeter when the idea of him not being a great player forever is shouted down?

    ///
    except this is not the truth.those comments/criticisms became obsessive and jeering.& that is the truth.

  138. Rich in NJ January 12th, 2011 at 11:28 pm

    randy

    The fights I had on the baseball field (or any sports field) weren’t about any opinions about professional athletes. They were about OUR games.

    You really fought about Maris and Mantle? Really?

  139. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 11:33 pm

    Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 10:44 pm
    Are you positing that the longer you are a fan, the more likely you are to cheer for Jeter irrationally? Wouldn’t that just include a bunch of people with dementia?
    ____
    Some of us actually don’t disdain the players we have rooted for our whole lives when they decline somewhat. We also don’t exaggerate their decline based on one year.

    Some of us actually have, dare I say it, gulp, affection for a player and yet comprehend all the “right” statistics at the same time. They aren’t mutually exclusive. It’s allowed. Really.
    Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:14 pm
    I’d love to see examples of my taking pleasure in hating Jeter. And the Captain example is that from the media, Jeter has really not been a very good Yankee captain. He rarely says anything of consequence, doesn’t defend his teammates especially the most prominent one on his team (A-rod), doesn’t get fired up about anything. Posada seems to care more about the rest of the team’s effortlevel and focus than Jeter.

    The problem with discussing Jeter is that posting anything negative, statistically or otherwise is considered denigrating him. How can anyone have a discussion on what should be done at SS or with Jeter when the idea of him not being a great player forever is shouted down?
    ________
    All is good, Jerkface. Seriously whatever you want to think is fine by me.

    However, I always find this stuff laughable about Jeter not being a leader. If you go to games, he is always very involved with his teammates in warm-ups, was a bud from the beginning to Cano and the younger players, always takes to heart every little play, hates losing, takes all the charity stuff and being a representative of the Yankees extremely seriously. It is all out there right in front of your face to see. He is one of the fiercest competitors I have ever watched. Because he doesn’t talk to the media, we assume he isn’t a leader, huh? & vocal leader Posada always talks about what a leader he is, etc. I get it; again it is this weird Alex-Jeter dichotomy that is ingrained in you. However, Alex seems to adore Jeter, so maybe the guy whose corner you are in still defending is actually Jeter’s biggest fan.

    As for having a reasonable discussion, no rational person would collapse your talking about Jeter’s limited range to his left or inferior 2010 numbers with denigrating Jeter unless of course you were denigrating Jeter. Big difference. :)

  140. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:34 pm

    .those comments/criticisms became obsessive and jeering.& that is the truth.

    where are examples of obsessive jeering comments?

  141. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:39 pm

    However, I always find this stuff laughable about Jeter not being a leader. If you go to games, he is always very involved with his teammates in warm-ups, was a bud from the beginning to Cano and the younger players, always takes to heart every little play, hates losing, takes all the charity stuff and being a representative of the Yankees extremely seriously. It is all out there right in front of your face to see. He is one of the fiercest competitors I have ever watched. Because he doesn’t talk to the media, we assume he isn’t a leader, huh? & vocal leader Posada always talks about what a leader he is, etc. I get it; again it is this weird Alex-Jeter dichotomy that is ingrained in you. However, Alex seems to adore Jeter, so maybe the guy whose corner you are in still defending is actually Jeter’s biggest fan.

    Jeter does do those things. He is friends with yankee players, and I am sure he hates losing, but I don’t think that is much different from any player in baseball? Nick Swisher is buddies with guys, A-rod is famously good with younger players ala Melky and Cano. I’m talking about when he has opportunities to back up his teammates he always chooses a neutral comment because he is teflon and wants to avoid media drama. I get why he does it, but I don’t like it. I don’t think the Captain should skirt from controversy. I’m sorry the most prominent example is about A-rod, but he didn’t back A-rod on anything while he publicly backed Giambi. I wish he would speak on Yankee related topics with more substance. I don’t live in the Yankee Clubhouse unfortunately so maybe he is more of a leader in there, but the reporters suggest he is a ‘lead by example’ captain and not a vocal captain. Maybe I prefer a vocal captain?

  142. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 11:42 pm

    No one is feasting about anything.

    ////
    Rich in NJ – so you’re speaking for everyone here who has criticized Jeter..I see, they all have the best of intentions,bear him no ill will,have no desire to see him fail…it’s a spectacular leap from a person who so deliberately attempts to present himself as some kind of depository for objective “facts”.

    Even if you don’t consider yourself as having an “agenda” when you comment about Jeter, to confidently say that “no one” is feasting on anything has got to be disingenuous & does, after all, indicate some kind of agenda and “WEspeak” that doesn’t differentiate your own motives from others commenting, negatively, on Derek Jeter.

  143. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:45 pm

    I don’t feel full, so I don’t think I’ve feasted on anything, and the Red Sox have yet to send me any money for making a career out of bashing Derek Jeter so I don’t think I’ve done that either.

    Rich famously said during the Great-Jeter Debates of Nov ’11 that, “I want Jeter to OPS .850+ over the life of his contract, I just don’t think it is likely to happen’. Count me in that boat.

    For Jeter to jump .100+ OPS points from 2010 to 2011 he has to decrease his ground ball percentage because he isn’t going to walk more than he currently is, so his OPS increases have to come from .avg and power. Which he isn’t going to do grounding out 65%+ of the time.

  144. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 11:45 pm

    Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:34 pm
    .those comments/criticisms became obsessive and jeering.& that is the truth.

    where are examples of obsessive jeering comments?

    ///
    Do you imagine I’m going to comb through your posts on Derek jeter?I’m not, friend,& I don’t have to convince you, of all people, that you have an axe to grind with Jeter.Go re-read them yourself & draw your own conclusions.

  145. heyman_sux January 12th, 2011 at 11:48 pm

    1. Concern for Jeter’s long term production based on his advancing age is understandable.

    2. Doom and gloom based on a single down year of production (immediately following an MVP caliber year) from Jeter is premature.

    3. Believing that Jeter should have been offerred a 1-year contract is absolutely delusional (and hilarious, seriously i’m still laughing).

    Feel free to criticize the captain, no player is free from the criticism of fans. But jeez, how do you disrespect the guy who has been the face of the franchise regardless if he’s never been your favorite Yankee with a 1-year contact offer?

  146. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:48 pm

    Well you’ve already combed through them all apparently to label me as a career-hater and feaster. How about you just paraphrase then?

  147. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:50 pm

    But jeez, how do you disrespect the guy who has been the face of the franchise regardless if he’s never been your favorite Yankee with a 1-year contact offer?

    Uh if he is 37 years old? This what I’m talking about. You can’t even suggest a 1 year deal, with no money listed, because of JETER THE ICON! DISRESPECT! Don’t disrespect jeter! Even though you’ve more than respected him in the past as he has made 200 million in his career.

    Argh, exactly what I’m talking about.

  148. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 11:53 pm

    JF, I’m really not interested.I didn’t comb through them, don’t flatter yourself.The piling on is evident to anyone who had the misfortune of being on at those times or who scrolled back looking to read the exchanges on a given day.I am really not going to spend time putting your Jeter posts together. If you’re so wounded by my impression that you delight in knocking Jeter at every opportunity, insinuating yrself into every discussion about him to raise the same redundant points,well have at your posts.

  149. LGY January 12th, 2011 at 11:54 pm

    Having affection for professional athletes is for sissies.

  150. Jerzz January 12th, 2011 at 11:55 pm

    SI_JonHeyman
    #yankees still trying for rafael soriano. said to be other teams involved. it isnt known which teams, but not the #angels 5 minutes ago

  151. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:55 pm

    I’ll inseminate any discussion I choose.

  152. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 11:56 pm

    Feel free to criticize the captain, no player is free from the criticism of fans. But jeez, how do you disrespect the guy who has been the face of the franchise regardless if he’s never been your favorite Yankee with a 1-year contact offer?

    ///
    My point.I’ve discussed with my baseball friends what confronts the team as Jeter declines.of course, you talk about.

  153. heyman_sux January 12th, 2011 at 11:56 pm

    Jerkface,

    I can see how you might think my position is to pay him for past achievements bc thats all you heard the media talk about for a month. But no, thats not why you don’t offer him a one year deal.

    You don’t offer him a one-year deal because it’s stupid. Do you know what happens in the real world for an employee who works for their entire career only to find out towards the end they will be offered a nice pay cut? The disrepect drives them to retirement or leaving just out of spite.

    Yea there weren’t any other suitors out there who would have paid anywhere near what the Yankees did. While I don’t count myself among the “give him a blank check” crowd, penny pinching with the guy is stupid. Go ahead, offer him your one-year deal. And when he’s gone, and we have a replacement level shortstop, then you can join the other folks on this blog jumping off bridges about how terrible the Yankees are

  154. yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 11:56 pm

    Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 11:22 pm

    DRob had the cranky back, but his K rates are still around his norm. I am not at all worried about him. And Joba was erratic but I think we tend to remember the bad rather than the good. As long as he is healthy, he should be useful at the least and hopefully better than that. Plus he pitched pretty well in some losing causes in the playoffs and I believe his velocity was up. Hopefully, his mechanics will be more consistent in ’11.

    I am excited to see Brackman out of the pen, whenever they choose to use him. However, I still believe he will start for most of the season in the minors. But we shall see.

  155. J. Alfred Prufrock January 12th, 2011 at 11:57 pm

    JF,I’m even less interested in your frustrated libido than I am in your snarky jeter comments.now go find a fantasy draft.

  156. LGY January 12th, 2011 at 11:58 pm

    The idea that posting true things about a Yankee player on a Yankees blog is somehow disrespectful is one of the most ridiculous things I have ever heard.

  157. Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:58 pm

    I’ve had enough of your snide insinuations.

  158. Against All Odds January 13th, 2011 at 12:01 am

    # yankeefeminista January 12th, 2011 at 11:56 pm

    Against All Odds January 12th, 2011 at 11:22 pm

    DRob had the cranky back, but his K rates are still around his norm. I am not at all worried about him. And Joba was erratic but I think we tend to remember the bad rather than the good. As long as he is healthy, he should be useful at the least and hopefully better than that. Plus he pitched pretty well in some losing causes in the playoffs and I believe his velocity was up. Hopefully, his mechanics will be more consistent in ’11.

    I am excited to see Brackman out of the pen, whenever they choose to use him. However, I still believe he will start for most of the season in the minors. But we shall see.

    ————————

    It will definitely be an interesting yr out of the bp pen. I can’t wait to see Brackman either. It seems like we’ve been hearing about him forever lol. I like D-rob he’s pretty solid and seems to have a fire to succeed. Hopefully Joba puts together a good season because the pen will definitely needs him.

  159. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 12:03 am

    “true” is a relative term. a poor season is “true”. declaring a player finished and doomed to fail forever as a result of it is speculation.Don’t confuse what you predict,or what you wish for, as “true”.

  160. Jerkface January 13th, 2011 at 12:03 am

    You don’t offer him a one-year deal because it’s stupid. Do you know what happens in the real world for an employee who works for their entire career only to find out towards the end they will be offered a nice pay cut? The disrepect drives them to retirement or leaving just out of spite.

    Yea there weren’t any other suitors out there who would have paid anywhere near what the Yankees did. While I don’t count myself among the “give him a blank check” crowd, penny pinching with the guy is stupid. Go ahead, offer him your one-year deal. And when he’s gone, and we have a replacement level shortstop, then you can join the other folks on this blog jumping off bridges about how terrible the Yankees are

    Baseball isn’t the real world. Players deal every off-season with the reality that they no longer command impressive salaries or multi-year deals. Jeter is not immune to this. I would gladly have overpayed Jeter for 1 year to mitigate the risk of him declining further. And you have no read my posts if you think I would join anyone in jumping off a bridge. I don’t preach gloom and doom, I don’t think the Yankees suck, I may be one of the few here who thinks they are a playoff team next year (even with jeter on the team!).

    I said back on Nov 7 that I would have offered Jeter 2 years at 30 million to start, and I would be fine going to 3 years 45 million, so I was ultimately pleased with the deal Cashman worked. 1 year is just what I would have preferred, because it offers the least risk to the Yankees.

  161. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 12:04 am

    Jerkface January 12th, 2011 at 11:58 pm
    I’ve had enough of your snide insinuations.
    ///
    um..ok.

  162. Jerkface January 13th, 2011 at 12:06 am

    https://twitter.com/#!/SI_JonHeyman/status/25409557979205633

    SI_JonHeyman Jon Heyman
    cashman backed off comment he didn’t believe pettitte would “start” (year). im hearing pettitte is working out. my guess: he pitches in ’11

    Glad to see Heyman using me as a source

  163. 38HotDogs January 13th, 2011 at 12:07 am

    @River Ave. Blues @SI_JonHeyman How do you reconcile this interest with Cashman’s statements that they won’t surrender a draft pick?

    Heyman finally called out on this Soriano nonsense

  164. yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 12:07 am

    Jerkface

    Jeter does do those things. He is friends with yankee players, and I am sure he hates losing, but I don’t think that is much different from any player in baseball? Nick Swisher is buddies with guys, A-rod is famously good with younger players ala Melky and Cano. I’m talking about when he has opportunities to back up his teammates he always chooses a neutral comment because he is teflon and wants to avoid media drama. I get why he does it, but I don’t like it. I don’t think the Captain should skirt from controversy. I’m sorry the most prominent example is about A-rod, but he didn’t back A-rod on anything while he publicly backed Giambi. I wish he would speak on Yankee related topics with more substance. I don’t live in the Yankee Clubhouse unfortunately so maybe he is more of a leader in there, but the reporters suggest he is a ‘lead by example’ captain and not a vocal captain. Maybe I prefer a vocal captain?
    _________
    This is all too hypothetical for me (and for you, or it should be, shoudn’t it?). I recall that whole Alex thing and it was the media building a case vs. anyone on the Yankees doing so. No leak from *any* player being critical of Jeter ever, and if there were some truth to the media accusations, you usually would have one or two. But again, this is something so incredibly media-created that I really don’t know why you are giving it so much credence.

    However, I do recall the very bipartisan Jeter-Alex wars on saber sites. Saber fans were for Alex, non-sabers were for Jeter. As I root for both players, and follow both saber and non-saber stats, I never quite understood the dichotomy. Also, as I was a fierce defender of Alex at games while he was being denigrated and showered with boos, I never could conjure up any alliance with the Jeter over Alex crowd. I thought the whole thing was dumb and rather polarizing. As far as saber followers’ modus operandi, the Jeter dislike seemed to belie the very saber-like neutrality that the numbers were supposed to instill. However, there always seemed to be this excess emotion expended on condemning Jeter, perhaps because he got too much attention based on a saber-conception of the numbers he put up. But it leaked out into criticizing his captaincy, leadership, questioning his character, no?

  165. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 12:09 am

    LGY January 12th, 2011 at 11:54 pm
    Having affection for professional athletes is for sissies.
    ///
    sure it is,just like having allegiances based on regions is parochial and falsely sentimental,impacting nothing of your life on a practical level,unless you’re a broker in a buyer’s market.in fact,rooting is just plain silly,soggy,sentimentalism.

  166. Rich in NJ January 13th, 2011 at 12:09 am

    J. Alfred Prufrock

    I’m only certain about my own feelings, but I’m confident that, for example, lgy and jerkface have good intentions as well.

    I don’t read everyone’s posts, but yeah, I know they are some weirdly negative posters here.

    The funny part is that it often seems like anyone who dares to take a realistic view is lumped in with the crazies.

    But you’re saying that’s not true, so that’s a positive development.

    My agenda is to win. To achieve that goal, no player is more important than the team.

  167. LGY January 13th, 2011 at 12:10 am

    The beauty of growing up when I did is that the sissies only talked smack on the baseball field.

    The real men saved it for when we were playing other sports and they didn’t have a baseball bat in their hand to protect them.

  168. Jerkface January 13th, 2011 at 12:10 am

    You should invest in a better space bar.

  169. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 12:12 am

    SI_JonHeyman Jon Heyman
    cashman backed off comment he didn’t believe pettitte would “start” (year). im hearing pettitte is working out. my guess: he pitches in ’11

    ////
    I believe we will see Andy on the mound this season.

  170. heyman_sux January 13th, 2011 at 12:12 am

    I said back on Nov 7 that I would have offered Jeter 2 years at 30 million to start, and I would be fine going to 3 years 45 million, so I was ultimately pleased with the deal Cashman worked. 1 year is just what I would have preferred, because it offers the least risk to the Yankees.
    _______

    I’m glad you looked this up (date and everything) cause I wasn’t going to. Look I agree, he’s not worth the same dollars. Fine. Ultimately I thought 3yrs/45M was fair and when Close pushed for more, it was predictable that the two sides would simply settle somewhere in the middle.

    Obviously the front office thought he was worth the risk. 3yrs/45M was the lowest offer they were prepared to make. Trust in their wisdom behind this. I don’t think its a long shot to assume they deal with Jeter/Close more regularly than you or I. But I guarantee you, if Cash offered anything less than 3 yrs, regardless of what you think Jeter is worth, DJ and Close would have issued a collective “F U”.

    The Yanks can afford to pay and stash Igawa in the minors. Two wrongs don’t make a right, but this is a case where the Yankees said “why fool around”. They got the contract done, and if he doesn’t perform up to the full value of the contract it won’t matter bc he’s likely to outperform 90% other MLB SS’s anyway

  171. Jerkface January 13th, 2011 at 12:13 am

    Randy can save his smack for the octagon. It’ll be fitting to bloody my fists on an octogenarian.

  172. Jerkface January 13th, 2011 at 12:15 am

    Obviously the front office thought he was worth the risk. 3yrs/45M was the lowest offer they were prepared to make. Trust in their wisdom behind this. I don’t think its a long shot to assume they deal with Jeter/Close more regularly than you or I. But I guarantee you, if Cash offered anything less than 3 yrs, regardless of what you think Jeter is worth, DJ and Close would have issued a collective “F U”.

    The difference between myself and others here, if they issued a collective FU to the yankees, I don’t think it would have been the end of the world.

    Jeter needs the Yankees more than he needed to collect his 3000th hit in a giants uniform.

  173. heyman_sux January 13th, 2011 at 12:17 am

    The difference between myself and others here, if they issued a collective FU to the yankees, I don’t think it would have been the end of the world.

    Jeter needs the Yankees more than he needed to collect his 3000th hit in a giants uniform.
    ______________

    If you offered 1yr/15M, he would be a SF Giant. Then instead of Jeter (even at 37 years), you have Nunez or Pena or whoever. Great. If you’re the GM responsible for that one, you’re toast.

  174. Rich in NJ January 13th, 2011 at 12:18 am

    If Jeter played for another team it would harm his brand far more than the Yankees’ brand.

  175. heyman_sux January 13th, 2011 at 12:19 am

    If Jeter played for another team it would harm his brand far more than the Yankees’ brand.
    ______________

    If Jeter played for another team it would harm the 2011 Yankees. And their brand. And if he left because he was lowballed, I don’t think anyone would blame him.

  176. Against All Odds January 13th, 2011 at 12:20 am

    I’m going to hit the bed enjoy the rest of the night. Take care everyone

  177. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 12:21 am

    My agenda is to win. To achieve that goal, no player is more important than the team.

    ///
    it’s my desire too, I can’t say it’s my agenda, because I can’t impact it.

  178. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 12:21 am

    good one, AAO.

  179. Jerkface January 13th, 2011 at 12:21 am

    If you offered 1yr/15M, he would be a SF Giant. Then instead of Jeter (even at 37 years), you have Nunez or Pena or whoever. Great. If you’re the GM responsible for that one, you’re toast.

    I don’t think the GM would be toast. Especially if the yankees won. Cash seemed pretty much backed up by ownership.

  180. Rich in NJ January 13th, 2011 at 12:24 am

    “If Jeter played for another team it would harm the 2011 Yankees. And their brand. And if he left because he was lowballed, I don’t think anyone would blame him.”

    If Jeter’s 2011 season is like his 2010 season, that harms the Yankees.

    If Jeter signed with another team for less money than the Yankees offered, which is what you are talking about, how could reasonable people think that the Yankees lowballed him?

    Unreasonable people thought the Yankees lowballed him if they didn’t give him everything he wanted.

  181. heyman_sux January 13th, 2011 at 12:25 am

    I don’t think the GM would be toast. Especially if the yankees won. Cash seemed pretty much backed up by ownership.
    _______

    They backed him bc he’s their employee. And he chose to offer a reasonable 3 yr. contract. Would he still be backed had things gone south? Imagine this offseason was described by not only the miss opportunity of Cliff Lee, but also the entirely unneccesary loss of the starting shortstop. I wonder how much they’d back him at that point…

  182. Rich in NJ January 13th, 2011 at 12:25 am

    “it’s my desire too, I can’t say it’s my agenda, because I can’t impact it.”

    We’re told that Cash gets ideas by reading Yankee blogs…

  183. yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 12:26 am

    Against All Odds January 13th, 2011 at 12:01 am

    Have a good night!

  184. Rich in NJ January 13th, 2011 at 12:27 am

    If the Brothers Steinbrenner wanted to give Jeter a much larger offer, I guarantee they would have irrespective of anything Cashman advised them.

  185. randy l. January 13th, 2011 at 12:27 am

    one of the things i’ve never understood about the kind of people who don’t play a game( or haven’t played it very much) is why they even care about the game .

    why does bill james care about baseball? you don’t get the feeling he respects the players. you get the feeling he thinks he’s better than the players because he perceives he’s smarter.

    i think that if he really is smarter that he should be doing things like being a doctor and saving people’s lives or something like that. the game goes on nicely without having so much cerebral energy going into it.

    it’s a game. it’s not supposed to be analyzed to death.

    i have no idea what it is that james, law, or neyer even likes about the game. they seem to like to compete on how much they know about the game. the problem is that it’s a game. if you’re going to dedicate your life to proving how much you know about something, why not dedicate it to something that matters in real life.

    isn’t law’s life kind of a waste? the guy is brilliant. he could have been any kind of professional he chose to be- lawyer, doctor, humanitarian, or a business leader in a field that does good. but no , he sits around and analyzes a game with arrogance dripping from almost every sentence.

    why? money? that makes no sense because he could make much more in other fields. he doesn’t seem to respect players or the people who coach in the game. people like this are just weird to me.
    i think they should get on with their lives and do what they’re really here for because baseball is a game that’s fun and there’s northing fun about the way they go about it.

  186. heyman_sux January 13th, 2011 at 12:28 am

    If Jeter signed with another team for less money than the Yankees offered, which is what you are talking about, how could reasonable people think that the Yankees lowballed him?

    Unreasonable people thought the Yankees lowballed him if they didn’t give him everything he wanted.
    ____

    What another team offers is irrelevant bc everyone knows the Yankee resources. Everyone knew that they were getting ready to drop 150M on a 32 yr old pitcher. Everyone knows they have a soon-to-be 40 yr old DH on the hook for 15M. Everyone knows they have Igawa on the books.

    The Yankees money is a gift and a curse. (Again, I’m not saying give him whatever he wanted. That’s not what happened anyway….)

  187. Rich in NJ January 13th, 2011 at 12:29 am

    randy

    Bill James is so 1990s.

  188. Nick in SF January 13th, 2011 at 12:31 am

    Well this thread is one giant train wreck.

    Prufrock can’t be trusted and randy has lost his mind to his own private jihad.

    The good thing about playing internet poker with people in Norway is… well, that’s another topic.

  189. yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 12:31 am

    Rich in NJ January 13th, 2011 at 12:29 am
    randy

    Bill James is so 1990s.
    ___________
    But the 90′s were so good to us. :)

    Brilliant post, Randy. lol.

  190. heyman_sux January 13th, 2011 at 12:32 am

    Prufrock can’t be trusted and randy has lost his mind to his own private jihad.
    _____

    If it’s a jihad against Bill James, i’m down

  191. Rich in NJ January 13th, 2011 at 12:34 am

    “What another team offers is irrelevant bc everyone knows the Yankee resources. Everyone knew that they were getting ready to drop 150M on a 32 yr old pitcher. Everyone knows they have a soon-to-be 40 yr old DH on the hook for 15M. Everyone knows they have Igawa on the books.

    The Yankees money is a gift and a curse. (Again, I’m not saying give him whatever he wanted. That’s not what happened anyway….)”

    What other teams offer sets the market value for any player. Are you saying that the market is irrelevant?

    That 32 year old pitcher is still at the top of his game. Jeter is coming off a career worst season. The comparison is inapt.

    So let me get this straight: You’re saying that because the Yankees have made mistakes with prior contracts, they are obligated offer more bad contracts?

    Here’s the difference: When they gave Posada and Igawa those contracts, they had a reasonable belief that: 1) someone else would offer a similar contract; and/or 2) that they would perform in accordance with those contracts.

    Apparently, they didn’t feel that way with Jeter. Given his 2010 season, it’s not hard to wonder why.

  192. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 12:37 am

    The funny part is that it often seems like anyone who dares to take a realistic view is lumped in with the crazies.

    ///
    realism is fine.what’s odd though is the naive counter-indignation in response to the indignation over Jeter.It’s a Yankee blog.Jeter is Jeter.sticking a sword in him every five minutes is going to ruffle some feathers,here.& in some cases,I think that’s even the point, which is grating & tedious.
    it’s as if there’s this sort of anti-heroic delusion about knocking the icon down a few pegs in view of Yankee fans,coloring or hiding behind the more “neutral” comments in the post,& invariably one is led to the character “flaws” of Jeter as well (not a real leader,etc.).it’s so obviously driven by dislike to suggest otherwise is an insult of the intelligence of the reader who appreciates the difference.

    it’s not the same as opining that Jeter will eventually need to be moved off of short stop & wondering where he will fit positionally when that day arrives.In fact,there have been dozens of posts like this.If I wasn’t joining in the discussion,I wasn’t saying anything to those folks.they didn’t disrespect & try to denigrate the player.I think the difference is obvious between the two kinds of posts.

  193. tyanksfan36 January 13th, 2011 at 12:40 am

    Nick in SF

    Random question but I figure you’re the person to ask.

    I’m gonna go out on a limb here and assume you’ve probably been to a game at AT&T Park. Is it a nice place for a ball game? it looks cool and breezy.

    I’ve only been to a major league game at Tropicana and I can tell you it is not cool nor breezy and AT&T park looks the total opposite.

  194. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 12:41 am

    Nick in SF January 13th, 2011 at 12:31 am
    Well this thread is one giant train wreck.

    Prufrock can’t be trusted and randy has lost his mind to his own private jihad.

    The good thing about playing internet poker with people in Norway is… well, that’s another topic.

    ///
    I can’t even trust myself:

    “Do I dare? And do I dare?”

    You are right not to trust a mere figment of T.S. Eliot’s imagination, trying vainly to escape the poem that is my context but also my prison.

  195. randy l. January 13th, 2011 at 12:42 am

    rich in new jersey-

    seriously, you think someone as brilliant as law should waste his life analyzing a game that doesn’t need him and got along just fine for a hundred years without him. you don’t think maybe there’d be something more rewarding he could do with all that brilliance.

  196. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 12:43 am

    heyman_sux January 13th, 2011 at 12:32 am
    Prufrock can’t be trusted and randy has lost his mind to his own private jihad.
    _____

    If it’s a jihad against Bill James, i’m down

    ///
    I’m in (but…do I dare??)

  197. Rich in NJ January 13th, 2011 at 12:43 am

    J. Alfred Prufrock

    “realism is fine.what’s odd though is the naive counter-indignation in response to the indignation over Jeter.It’s a Yankee blog.Jeter is Jeter.sticking a sword in him every five minutes is going to ruffle some feathers,here.& in some cases,I think that’s even the point, which is grating & tedious.”

    I think you’re defining tedious down.

    “it’s as if there’s this sort of anti-heroic delusion about knocking the icon down a few pegs in view of Yankee fans,coloring or hiding behind the more “neutral” comments in the post,& invariably one is led to the character “flaws” of Jeter as well (not a real leader,etc.).it’s so obviously driven by dislike to suggest otherwise is an insult of the intelligence of the reader who appreciates the difference.”

    You do realize that his contract was up, right? That sort of made the discussion reasonable, topical, and unavoidable.

    I stay away from discussions of character of non-politicians unless they compare someone to Hitler.

    “it’s not the same as opining that Jeter will eventually need to be moved off of short stop & wondering where he will fit positionally when that day arrives.In fact,there have been dozens of posts like this.If I wasn’t joining in the discussion,I wasn’t saying anything to those folks.they didn’t disrespect & try to denigrate the player.I think the difference is obvious between the two kinds of posts.”

    I wanted Jeter to move to CF years ago. That shipped has long sailed. I don’t think he can play the OF anymore, and I don’t think he can hit enough to play 3B, 1B, or DH.

  198. heyman_sux January 13th, 2011 at 12:44 am

    Rich,

    I don’t think its a stretch to say in this instance the market was indeed irrelevant. Literally every team knew ahead of time that Jeter would be overpaid. Jeter operated under the assumption he would be overpaid. But he would have left or another team would have become interested if the price was right (granted, I have no idea what that level was)

    And i’ve literally said several times I don’t condone bad contracts simply bc of prior bad contracts. Sometimes, there are special circumstances (see: AJ Burnett’s contract, Cliff Lee’s proposed contract).

    I don’t even care about the “brand” argument. The point is, why mess around? No, don’t give a blank check, but get the guy signed.

  199. Rich in NJ January 13th, 2011 at 12:45 am

    randy

    I don’t have time to read Law, only the Law.

  200. Nick in SF January 13th, 2011 at 12:49 am

    I have been to lots of games at AT&T, it’s a fabtastic park. But do dress for cold weathee, especially in the summer. Very cool and certain parts of the park can be quite breezy indeed.

  201. Rich in NJ January 13th, 2011 at 12:51 am

    heyman_sux

    But the market still helped define his value. If, like Rivera, the RS or some other team made a comparable offer, we’d hear about it, and no doubt that his agent would have used it in the negotiations because that’s his job.

    The problem was no other team really wanted him because of his age and his 2010 season. In contrast, if he became a FA after the 2009 season, he would have had several big offers.

    Granted, Jeter got a Jeterian premium, but that’s what made the negotiations so bizarre. The Yankees offered far more than his market value, yet at least initially, that still wasn’t enough to get a deal done.

    So in essence, some fans (and maybe Jeter and Close) wanted the Yankees to just keep negotiating against themselves.

    I guess they did to a point, but only to a point.

  202. yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 12:55 am

    tyanksfan36 January 13th, 2011 at 12:40 am

    Speaking of weather, these forthcoming April games in NY are going to be freezing cold, esp. with the swirling winds. We’re talking winter coat, scarf and gloves. Who ever heard of a March 31st Opening Day?

  203. heyman_sux January 13th, 2011 at 12:56 am

    So in essence, some fans (and maybe Jeter and Close) wanted the Yankees to just keep negotiating against themselves.

    I guess they did to a point, but only to a point.
    ______

    Exactly, but that only supports my point that the market didn’t matter in this instance. Jeter and Close knew they could push bc they knew the Yankees could afford it. I don’t think its a stretch to assume that a lot of free agents operate in this manner when negotiating with the Yankees.

  204. DaSaint007 January 13th, 2011 at 1:00 am

    Guess I didn’t miss much here tonight. Whoever said this post is a train wreck is right.

  205. Rich in NJ January 13th, 2011 at 1:01 am

    “Exactly, but that only supports my point that the market didn’t matter in this instance. Jeter and Close knew they could push bc they knew the Yankees could afford it. I don’t think its a stretch to assume that a lot of free agents operate in this manner when negotiating with the Yankees.”

    Only at the extremes though.

    The market set the limits on the negotiations. IOW, there was no way Jeter wasn’t going to have to accept a paycut because of the market, or more specifically, the lack thereof.

    The Yankees are willing to pay a premium for great players. The problem is that truly great players don’t reach free agency very often.

  206. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 1:01 am

    I wanted Jeter to move to CF years ago. That shipped has long sailed. I don’t think he can play the OF anymore, and I don’t think he can hit enough to play 3B, 1B, or DH.
    ///
    Well even if he hits,& I think he will in any case, in 2011,& even if some slug returns,it’s not a COF/CIF slug.however,we currently have a LF who is not going to slug,so we are already in unconventional mode.if they move Gardner at some point,replacing him with a slugging LF, or they move Granderson and move Gardner to CF,then your lineup could better tolerate a 3B/1B/DH with compromised slug.as it is,he’ll remain at SS for the time being,where his slugging has been high for a SS, excepting 2010. I am not really going to be concerned about Jeter just yet unless he repeats 2010,which I don’t anticipate. He’s around 9th or 10th in slugging over the last three years at his position & I believe in 2009 he was fourth. If he leans more toward 2009 than 2010,that will more than suffice.

  207. randy l. January 13th, 2011 at 1:03 am

    “I don’t have time to read Law, only the Law.”

    while you’re at it , could you make a law against law.

    something like being annoying without a license.

  208. heyman_sux January 13th, 2011 at 1:09 am

    Only at the extremes though.

    The market set the limits on the negotiations. IOW, there was no way Jeter wasn’t going to have to accept a paycut because of the market, or more specifically, the lack thereof.

    The Yankees are willing to pay a premium for great players. The problem is that truly great players don’t reach free agency very often
    __________

    Agreed.

    I don’t hate the contract and I didn’t hate the process – it all led to a very predictable compromise. Remember, most people thought it would be a contract fairly similar to his last, though not in years. The two sides got creative, and if you really look at the contract, he’ll likely end up making a similar AAV. I thought it was a obviously dramatized through the media. Sure Jeter was upset, but most people who take pay cuts are.

    In summation, even Jeter is not immune to criticism, and thats OK. He’ll make a ton of money, and thats OK too bc really what other options were out there?

  209. Rich in NJ January 13th, 2011 at 1:11 am

    J. Alfred Prufrock

    Jeter likely can’t play LF for even 120 games.

    Jeter will stay at SS until they have a better option. They currently don’t have one.

    I don’t want to compromise SLG at another position for Jeter or anyone else.

  210. yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 1:11 am

    LGY January 12th, 2011 at 11:54 pm
    Having affection for professional athletes is for sissies.
    ______________
    And for the record, there is no such thing as a “sissy.” It is a made up concept created by bullies. :D

    Good night all!

  211. Jerkface January 13th, 2011 at 1:19 am

    http://www.thediamondangle.com.....egame.html

    Sabremetrics from 1910, didn’t need it then, don’t need it now!!

  212. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 1:19 am

    Rich,not suggesting he play LF,merely using Gardner as an example of a nontraditional approach to a traditionally power position that is in play already.

    you’re not going to get what you want because he’s on the team for the next 3 years.if leaving him at SS becomes untenable he will be shuffled somewhere else,likely a power spot or he becomes the DH.the concern lies in the future for me, not the present.

  213. Jerkface January 13th, 2011 at 1:20 am

    Jeter should be shifted to the bench if he has to move.

  214. yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 1:20 am

    Before I go, there are no slugging SS’s available. Tulo and Hanley are tied up indefinitely, and most of the other SLG SS’s are old and not worth getting. Therefore, right now, Jeter remains our best option.

  215. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 1:20 am

    Goodnite Yanfem.may I say you’re a very good read.

  216. yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 1:22 am

    ‘Night Prufrock.

    I loved “The Wasteland,” btw. :)

  217. yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 1:24 am

    Jerkface January 13th, 2011 at 1:20 am
    Jeter should be shifted to the bench if he has to move.
    _____
    Likely.

  218. yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 1:25 am

    Once he can’t play SS. But he isn’t done yet.

  219. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 1:26 am

    yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 1:22 am
    ‘Night Prufrock.

    I loved “The Wasteland,” btw.
    ////
    BUT I’M NOT IN THAT POEM!!!

    Madame Sosostris gets all the props :(. What do I get???!!! Sawdust restaurants with oyster shells.

    Goodnight sweet ladies, good night. Good night.

  220. Rich in NJ January 13th, 2011 at 1:26 am

    “Rich,not suggesting he play LF,merely using Gardner as an example of a nontraditional approach to a traditionally power position that is in play already.”

    Garnder has unique OBP skills. He’s an outlier.

    “you’re not going to get what you want because he’s on the team for the next 3 years.if leaving him at SS becomes untenable he will be shuffled somewhere else,likely a power spot or he becomes the DH.the concern lies in the future for me, not the present.”

    What I want is the best players to be put on the field.

    Are you saying that Jeter will want to remain on the field when he isn’t one of the team’s 8 best players?

    If so, that’s a diss, imo.

  221. yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 1:27 am

    J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 1:26 am
    yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 1:22 am
    ‘Night Prufrock.

    I loved “The Wasteland,” btw.
    ////
    BUT I’M NOT IN THAT POEM!!!

    Madame Sosostris gets all the props . What do I get???!!! Sawdust restaurants with oyster shells.

    Goodnight sweet ladies, good night. Good night.
    ______
    lol. No worries, I like almost all of your creator’s poems. Even “Ash Wednesday.” ;)

  222. yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 1:31 am

    OK, let’s not fabricate scenarios in which Jeter asserts his ego over the well-being of the team.

  223. P January 13th, 2011 at 1:31 am

    Cash –

    What’s a misunderstanding is the state of this team.

    It’s tough to say this but I’m preparing for a very disappointing season as a result of our 2 pitchers ( CC, Hughes) and the rest of our question marks.. I know we won a lot of games last year, but people seem to forget that itches our pitchingvthat carried us! Especially before allstar break.

    FYI, my dad says that Andy gas serious doubts that his body would physically last an entire season.. But he is going to prepare and be ready to come pitch if we really need him .. Meaning that, if we are fighting for first place come allstar break and Andy is healthy he’ll come pitch.. If were many games out, he’ll call it a career.

  224. yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 1:33 am

    Gardner’s 2010 was an outlier, but let’s see what he does in 2011 before making proclamations.

  225. P January 13th, 2011 at 1:33 am

    Sorry about the typos it’s hard to type on my mobile !

  226. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 1:33 am

    What I want is the best players to be put on the field.

    Are you saying that Jeter will want to remain on the field when he isn’t one of the team’s 8 best players?

    If so, that’s a diss, imo.
    ///
    huh? No, but if he hits like he did in 2009 but is no longer negotiable at SS,they’ll still try to find a place for his bat.we don’t even know what the lineup will be like by then.probably their thought is he’ll remain at SS for the 3 yrs. Gardner’s on base in the second half was not nearly as good let him repeat 2010 first half again before declaring him an OBP machine.let’s see how he is with the fixed thumb or wrist.

  227. yankeefeminista January 13th, 2011 at 1:34 am

    I’m out, good night.

  228. J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2011 at 1:36 am

    lol. No worries, I like almost all of your creator’s poems. Even “Ash Wednesday.”

    ///
    he writes well enough but he’s a tad full of himself. farewell! (my wife has turned off the bedside lamp and is grumbling about my bright screen :)).

  229. P January 13th, 2011 at 1:36 am

    Just as many here were very optimistic about meljys potential.. I get the same feeling about peoples optimism regarding this team currently.. I hope to be wrong but as long as we show some fight I’ll watch 90% of the games no matter where we are in the standings!!!!!

  230. P January 13th, 2011 at 1:38 am

    Gardner needs to practice bunting a bit more and he’ll get on base more!

  231. P January 13th, 2011 at 1:39 am

    Jerkface says:
    January 13, 2011 at 1:20 am
    Jeter should be shifted to the bench if he has to move.
    ———

    What’s the alternative? I don’t see any..

  232. Jerkface January 13th, 2011 at 1:41 am

    What’s the alternative? I don’t see any..

    Agreed, if he has to move some where there is no alternative to the bench.

  233. stuart a January 13th, 2011 at 1:55 am

    no pettitte and no vazquez that is about $30 mill. off the books. the yanks will have a under $200 mill payroll for sure this year.

    the young arms better be good else big trouble. also I am glad cashman did not overpay for old past their prime players.

  234. YsGuy January 13th, 2011 at 2:15 am

    my prediction of a june return for pettitte is looking better and better…

  235. jacksquat January 13th, 2011 at 4:46 am

    Ah, the tough guy jocks vs the nerds. It’s like high school all over again…

  236. joeman January 13th, 2011 at 6:11 am

    # tyanksfan36 January 12th, 2011 at 10:21 pm

    joeman says:

    January 12, 2011 at 10:08 pm

    # tyanksfan36 January 12th, 2011 at 10:04 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock says:

    January 12, 2011 at 9:58 pm

    Just as a general observation:I’ve seen a really astonishing amount of criticism,covert & overt dislike of 3 of the core four guys on this site.makes you wonder what some people’s frame of reference is for being yank fans in the first place,but whatever floats your fragile little boats.

    _____

    True that. There are so many times when I just want to question some people as to why they even bother being a fan when they have nothing positive to say about the team they are a “fan” of.
    ——————————————————-

    besides the Jeter & Mo signing & the signing of a catcher that they really don’t know what they have with him give me some positive happenings with this team

    —-

    I would say that they got someone who has been known to be a good defensive catcher to replace our catcher who was declining. We have Robinson Cano who was awesome last year. Phil hughes had a really good first starting season. Those are positive things I look forward to seeing next season.
    ———————————————————–
    Stop….I’m talking about this off season

  237. Doreen January 13th, 2011 at 6:53 am

    Good morning, morning people.

    :)

  238. upstate kate January 13th, 2011 at 6:59 am

    good morning!
    Hope everyone has been able to dig out from the snow storm.
    This wasn’t the kind of Andy news I wanted to wake up to:(

  239. Fran the original January 13th, 2011 at 7:16 am

    Good morning.
    All of the snow is cleaned off. After the Christmas weekend blizzard, this snowfall didn’t seem so bad.

    Saw in the NY Post that Derek is going to start working out in Tampa with Kevin Long in 2 weeks. Getting closer to baseball :)

  240. blake January 13th, 2011 at 7:19 am

    Interesting …..Buster says that Andy isn’t working out and wont be ready to start the season. Heyman says he is working out and bets he pitches in 2011……which will be right?

    Sounds like there may be a little trouble in St.louis and Pujosland……

  241. upstate kate January 13th, 2011 at 7:22 am

    really Blake? what kind of trouble?

  242. Doreen January 13th, 2011 at 7:24 am

    Fran -

    I was just saying to my mom yesterday that after 22 inches, 6 inches is like a dusting of snow! Our street was plowed before 6 am yesterday. My husband had the driveway and walk cleared before 7. We did get a new snowblower and it seemed to work very well. It was relatively quiet, too.

    I am getting antsy for the season to start. There is nothing on television most nights. Though I have become very fond of The Middle. It cracks me up. But most nights it’s like a wasteland. The more I watch Glee, the less I like it.

    blake -

    It makes you wonder where these people get their information from when they’re so diametrically opposed.

  243. blake January 13th, 2011 at 7:28 am

    Doreen,

    It really does.

    Kate,

    Could be nothing….their.owner just came out and sounded a little pessimistic about re-signing him…..could be just posturing.

  244. Fran the original January 13th, 2011 at 7:31 am

    Doreen,

    Glad you got a new snowblower. Our streets were plowed quickly too. After the debacle in NYC after the blizzard, this was one of the fastest clean-ups I can remember.

  245. upstate kate January 13th, 2011 at 7:36 am

    we have been utilizing our human snow blower…too bad he returns to college this weekend :(

  246. Doreen January 13th, 2011 at 7:36 am

    My husband cancelled a trip to Cleveland because of the snow. As it turns out both flights (departing and arriving) flew without delay. Go figure. I told him had he NOT cancelled the trip, it would be certain he’d have been stuck in Cleveland.

  247. Doreen January 13th, 2011 at 7:40 am

    upstate kate -

    He had a nice long break, though. When is spring break?

    It’s very strange now that our daughter does not get a those breaks. She was able to spend almost 2 weeks with us at Christmastime, but we’re used to her being around for almost 5 weeks. Summer is going to be the strangest….

    We have planned a vacation for the first week in April and she’s able to come with us. We thought she might have to fly down by herself and join us for a shortened time, but it worked out.

  248. upstate kate January 13th, 2011 at 7:45 am

    Doreen
    His spring break is in March, which of course does not coincide w/ my husband’s Feb break or April spring break. It makes it tough to plan family vacations.

  249. Doreen January 13th, 2011 at 7:50 am

    upstate kate -

    Ugh. I sympathize with that. We haven’t had both girls in the same school system in over 10 years.

  250. MTU January 13th, 2011 at 7:59 am

    Blake-

    I can’t say I would be surprised if it were difficult for the Cards to come to terms with Pujols.

    As great a player as he is he is going to command a Mega contract.

    Can St. Louis handle the freight ?

  251. Doreen January 13th, 2011 at 8:03 am

    Why can’t they all play for free? It’s just a game, after all?

    j/k

  252. MTU January 13th, 2011 at 8:03 am

    We’re talkin’ A-Rod money.

  253. upstate kate January 13th, 2011 at 8:06 am

    what is the financial picture like for the Cards? I would think fans would be very unhappy if Pujols wasn’t re-signed. Especially since they over paid for Holliday, which I thought was to show Pujols they were committed to putting a winning team on the field.

  254. pat January 13th, 2011 at 8:06 am

    Per the NY Post, K. Long is busy, busy busy.

    He is working with Tex in NY next week, then Derek in Tampa the following week and Alex and Jorge in Miami the week after that.

    He’s already worked with the Miami crew once and worked with Swish and Colin Curtis in LA last week.

  255. MTU January 13th, 2011 at 8:06 am

    Well folks. It should be an interesting season.

    We’re likely to get a good look at exactly how deep and quality our farm system might be.

    Time to harvest wether it’s exactly on time or not.

  256. blake January 13th, 2011 at 8:08 am

    MTU,

    honestly…..they would be better off in the longterm dealing him for a.mega package of prospects/players if they could. I don’t know their exact financial situation but if giving Pujols 250+ million or whatever it takes means they can’t re-sign Wainwright in a couple years then they shouldn’t do it.

  257. MTU January 13th, 2011 at 8:09 am

    Kate-

    Pujols is a phenomenal ballplayer. Maybe the best all around hitter in the game right now.

    As such he is going to have to be paid like it.

    I’m sure no one would want to lose a player like that.

  258. MTU January 13th, 2011 at 8:11 am

    Blake-

    Very few teams could afford him.

  259. disco stu January 13th, 2011 at 8:15 am

    Assuming that Buster Olney is right and Andy has not been working out in preperation for coming back one more year, then what is Andy’s motivation for continuing to delay what he apparently has resigned himself to be doing and why not just announce now that he is retiring?

    It had to be galling for him to have NY reporters show up at his door asking him what he plans to do the other day … the longer this goes on, maybe more people start hounding him and it becomes more of a distraction for him. If he is going to retire, just have a PC that he is leaving the game and officially walk off into the sunset. I really don’t get it. He is not posturing (either for more money or publicity) the way Favre has done, so what is his motivation for delaying things?

  260. MTU January 13th, 2011 at 8:16 am

    Blake-

    Did you happen to notice that the Tigers might prefer Penny to Gallaraga for the back end of their rotation ? (this from MLBTR).

    I find that rather surprising.

    In fact, they said they may make him available.

    I know he doesn’t have that much of a track record but he is young and maybe he just needs a change of scenery ?

    Have you seen him pitch ? I think he has potential. I’m surprised they’re giving up on him that soon.

  261. Doreen January 13th, 2011 at 8:17 am

    “It’s hard to say goodbye, my love…”

    (From Dream Girls)

  262. Mell January 13th, 2011 at 8:22 am

    “As great a player as he is he is going to command a Mega contract.

    Can St. Louis handle the freight ?”

    It’ll be tough. Lot of arb cases coming up and decisions to be made on guys like Carpenter (big option year) and Franklin (he too hits free agency). With the Yankees and Red Sox unlikely suitors, his market may not be what he hopes it is. He should still have no trouble landing in the $24M-$25M range, but there’s probably nobody out there willing to meet the craziness of Arod’s deal.

    Getting Pujols is obviously a big deal to the Cards. That’s one reason I could see Carpenter being made available come July.

  263. MTU January 13th, 2011 at 8:27 am

    Mell-

    There isn’t a team in baseball that wouldn’t like to build their team around a guy like Sir Albert, and even fewer who can afford the luxury.

  264. Mell January 13th, 2011 at 8:29 am

    MTU:

    Gallaraga turns 29 in a couple days. He’s not a kid. What you see now is probably what you get. Nothing in his minor league history (losing record, 4+ ERA, 1.30 WHIP) to suggest he was going to be especially good at the big league level. His 2008 season appeared to be the exception rather than the rule with him. I wouldn’t want him on my team. Not in an important role anyway.

  265. MTU January 13th, 2011 at 8:30 am

    edit: should have “but few who can …..”. Duh. sorry.

  266. yanks61 January 13th, 2011 at 8:31 am

    OK, so the ideal situation is for the Cards to get a great prospect package for Pujols, right?

    So, here’s what the Yanks do:

    They trade a bunch of top level prospects (take your pick) to StL. for Pujols, then trade Tex to SF for Cain or Timmy. Well, I can always dream, can’t I :)

  267. joeman January 13th, 2011 at 8:32 am

    Fran the original January 13th, 2011 at 7:16 am
    Good morning.
    All of the snow is cleaned off. After the Christmas weekend blizzard, this snowfall didn’t seem so bad.

    Saw in the NY Post that Derek is going to start working out in Tampa with Kevin Long in 2 weeks. Getting closer to baseball
    —————————————————————

    got 28″ of the white stuff here yesterday on top of the crap we already had …..sick of it…3hrs clearing snow off driveway,cars,sidewalk

  268. Mell January 13th, 2011 at 8:32 am

    “There isn’t a team in baseball that wouldn’t like to build their team around a guy like Sir Albert, and even fewer who can afford the luxury”

    A lot fewer. Unless Pujols wants to commit to a life of DH’ing, he’s not going to be a Yankee or Red Sox. Guess the teams I’d look at would be the Angels, Cubs, and maybe the Mets. Still think he ends up with the Cards though.

  269. blake January 13th, 2011 at 8:32 am

    MTU,

    I really haven’t seen Galaraga pitch enough to have an opinion on him….he’s worth a look I guess though if available. Also, my guess is that the Angels, Cubs, Rangers, Mets, Yankees, Nationals, and Red.Sox are the teams that could possibly afford him….along with maybe a couple others if they really wanted.

    Mell,

    Agreed regarding Carpenter….if they aren’t winning their division come June, I think they may move him.

  270. MTU January 13th, 2011 at 8:33 am

    Mell-

    He may be a bit older but he has not had any significant injuries that I’m aware of.

    Granted he is not Cy Young but he did have a very good season no that long ago.

    What exactly does Brad Penny bring that you wouldn’t want to give gallaraga another try over him ?

  271. blake January 13th, 2011 at 8:35 am

    I don’t see the Yankees ever trading for Pujols but if he ever hits the open market I bet they have discussions on whether they could make it work. He’s too good not to at least consider the possibilities.

  272. joeman January 13th, 2011 at 8:35 am

    blake January 13th, 2011 at 8:32 am
    MTU,

    I really haven’t seen Galaraga pitch enough to have an opinion on him….he’s worth a look I guess though if available. Also, my guess is that the Angels, Cubs, Rangers, Mets, Yankees, Nationals, and Red.Sox are the teams that could possibly afford him….along with maybe a couple others if they really wanted.

    Mell,

    Agreed regarding Carpenter….if they aren’t winning their division come June, I think they may move him
    ————————
    wild card might still be in play for them….don’t see them moving Carpenter if thats the case

  273. blake January 13th, 2011 at 8:38 am

    Joeman,

    Depends on a lot of things…..how hamstrung they are by whatever deal Pujols signs, what they figure their chances at a WS are, and what they could get in return for him.

  274. MTU January 13th, 2011 at 8:40 am

    Blake-

    What an AA battery that would be (Alex and Albert),

    Enough power to light up the whole baseball world.

    And if that doesn’t just drive your fantasy imagination wild throw in Jesus.

    P.S. what’s the world w/o dreams ?

    :)

  275. Mell January 13th, 2011 at 8:41 am

    “What exactly does Brad Penny bring that you wouldn’t want to give gallaraga another try over him ?”

    That’s a fair point, and one I can’t offer much of an answer on. Guess the only thing that makes sense is that he lends a little veteran’s presence to a relatively young rotation with Verlander, Scherzer and Porcello.

    That’s a pretty weak reason though.

  276. blake January 13th, 2011 at 8:41 am

    Heyman has continued to post two things that are contradictory to other reports 1) that the Yanks are still in on Soriano 2) that Andy is working out and preparing for the season.

  277. upstate kate January 13th, 2011 at 8:44 am

    in that case, I am going to believe Heyman! Hey, he was correct about the mystery team for Lee (altho IIRC he didn’t say it was the Phillies)

  278. blake January 13th, 2011 at 8:44 am

    MTU,
    it would be incredible for sure. Cano, Alex, Pujols, Teixera in the same lineup…..as I said yesterday, you could play Albert in CF and as long as he hit 4-5 times a game the Yanks would be a better team……of course its a lot more complicated than that and extremely inlikley but its nice to dream.

  279. Mell January 13th, 2011 at 8:48 am

    “Heyman has continued to post two things that are contradictory to other reports 1) that the Yanks are still in on Soriano 2) that Andy is working out and preparing for the season.”

    Not really buying #1. Not only are the Yankees “still interested” but that “other teams” are involved. Sounds like Boras is pulling the strings on that one.

    #2 just seems like guess work. Read more guys saying he has not initiated his normal activities than those who say he has, but I don’t anyone besides Pettitte and the Yankees really know.

  280. MTU January 13th, 2011 at 8:48 am

    Blake-

    Right now I’d settle for a middle of the rotation starter.

    :)

  281. blake January 13th, 2011 at 8:49 am

    Cashman’s statements on the draft pick didn’t leave much wiggle room so if they are still talking with Soriano then you have to think a 3rd team might be involved.

    I think its possible that the Yankees may be the only team willing to pay close to the money they are asking for but refuse to give that and the pick as well…so they could be trying to find a way around it.

  282. MTU January 13th, 2011 at 8:51 am

    blake-

    I would say that Towers owes Cash one.

    ;)

  283. blake January 13th, 2011 at 8:51 am

    Mell,

    I agree…..likely only Pettite knows truly what’s going on.

  284. MTU January 13th, 2011 at 8:52 am

    Blake-

    And Andy’s barber.

    :)

  285. blake January 13th, 2011 at 8:52 am

    MTU,

    Id say those two will pull.off a big trade at some point…..maybe not now……maybe when Swishers’s deal is up ;)

  286. joeman January 13th, 2011 at 8:52 am

    blake January 13th, 2011 at 8:38 am
    Joeman,

    Depends on a lot of things…..how hamstrung they are by whatever deal Pujols signs, what they figure their chances at a WS are, and what they could get in return for him.

    —————————————–
    also a FA….so they would have to trade for him(Carpenter) and then try to sign him ….what kind of deal he might look for at 36 years old

  287. MTU January 13th, 2011 at 8:54 am

    Blake-

    I think that one is in the bag at some point.

    ;)

  288. blake January 13th, 2011 at 8:56 am

    Joeman,

    I think the Yankees would just be interested in trading for him this year and then determining whether to pick up his option after the season.

  289. Mell January 13th, 2011 at 8:57 am

    “also a FA….so they would have to trade for him(Carpenter) and then try to sign him ….what kind of deal he might look for at 36 years old”

    Carpenter’s deal features an option year for 2012, so if anyone traded for him this summer, they’d be getting a year and half of his services.

  290. 108 stitches January 13th, 2011 at 8:57 am

    Go figure. Upwards of $30M saved from Lee and Pettitte money and neither Soriano or Zambrano can be pursued.
    Too many things have to go right with the starting rotation as presently constructed with the chance of an overworked bullpen.
    It shapes up to be a stormy ride. Lots on the shoulders of offensive production.

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