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Just a few notes and links

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Notes on Jan 29, 2011 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Is it time for spring training yet? Here are a few notes and links on this Saturday night.

• Jorge Posada spoke a little bit at an event with Bernie Williams tonight, saying he’s accepted the fact he’ll be a designated hitter this year, but he’s still planning to do at least a little bit of catching.

• Kevin Millwood is generating some interest from the Indians, but Jon Heyman reports that Millwood could still be a fallback plan for the Yankees if Andy Pettitte doesn’t change his mind.

• Kevin Towers is out of the Yankees organization, but his short tenure with the team left Towers with new respect for Brian Cashman. “I don’t care how smart and how good you are, if you take somebody from the outside to run the New York Yankees, I think he’ll be in for a big surprise,” Towers said.

• MLB.com has a video of Cashman’s night as a bartender.

• The Royals have decided to move their top catching prospect to the outfield to speed his path to the big leagues. To be fair, this is not a shocking move, there has previously been speculation about Wil Myers ending up in the outfield. The Royals have simply decided to make that move sooner rather than later.

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361 Responses to “Just a few notes and links”

  1. tyanksfan36 January 29th, 2011 at 9:41 pm

    This post came right at the moment in The Lion King when Simbas dad dies trying to save him. I was glad to read this during that intense moment.

  2. Doreen January 29th, 2011 at 9:48 pm

    I kind of nodded off there a bit, but in answer to jerkface’s post to randy that they’d see Wang threw a fastball with a vertical break of 8:

    jerkface -

    If I went to Fangraphs to find out how many sinkers Wang would throw, and I don’t know that a sinker is a type of fastball with a vertical break (don’t laugh), how would I find that information? I couldn’t.

    You may say that Fangraphs is not for the casual fan who doesn’t know that a sinker is a type of fastball. I’d answer that I am not a casual fan and I didn’t always know that. But I might read somewhere that Fangraphs is this really cool website that can tell you about what a pitcher throws, and decide I want to check it out.

    I’d see that it doesn’t list a sinker for Wang, and I’d think, what’s up with that?

  3. Nick in SF January 29th, 2011 at 9:53 pm

    “…the moment in The Lion King when Simbas dad dies trying to save him.”

    Spoiler alert????

    Geeeez, I was going to watch that.

    :mad:

  4. joeman January 29th, 2011 at 9:53 pm

    The Marmalade – Reflections Of My Life

  5. tyanksfan36 January 29th, 2011 at 9:56 pm

    Sorry Nick

    If anyone didn’t know what happened in The Lion King. Well that would just be sad.

  6. Doreen January 29th, 2011 at 9:57 pm

    jerkface -

    I saw your answer in the previous thread. Fair enough.

  7. joeman January 29th, 2011 at 9:57 pm

    THE HOLLIES – He Ain’t Heavy, He’s My Brother

  8. randy l. January 29th, 2011 at 9:57 pm

    “I’d see that it doesn’t list a sinker for Wang, and I’d think, what’s up with that?”

    doreen-

    precisely what happened to me.

    but jerkface agrees that they should have a category for sinker balls so all’s well.

    what i’m wondering is how many more sinkerball type situations that fangraphs is deficient in that jerkface is not telling us about :)

  9. Doreen January 29th, 2011 at 10:00 pm

    randy l -

    I watched that second video. It was pretty funny. Were they seriously playing pepper or just fooling around? The guy wasn’t choking up, was taking a full swing and didn’t have an open stance. He had no idea what he was doing.

  10. joeman January 29th, 2011 at 10:04 pm

    Dire Straits – Sultans Of Swing

  11. randy l. January 29th, 2011 at 10:07 pm

    doreen-

    from watching them i just think they weren’t any good at playing pepper.

    their whole rhythm was all off. the not choking up on the bat, not involving all the fielders by hitting the ball to different guys, and the bad tosses to the batter just showed these guys were not used to doing it.

    i think they were A ball Mets players too so it’s not like they weren’t good players.

  12. Carl January 29th, 2011 at 10:10 pm

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v.....re=related

    Kimba The White Lion > The Lion King

  13. joeman January 29th, 2011 at 10:11 pm

    ZZ Top – Sharp Dressed Man

  14. Doreen January 29th, 2011 at 10:17 pm

    I couldn’t get access to the full Towers article. Anyone read it?

  15. joeman January 29th, 2011 at 10:17 pm

    sugarloaf – green eyed lady

  16. GreenBeret7 January 29th, 2011 at 10:27 pm

    For the one disputing the reason I gave for parks not allowing games of pepper to be played on the grass. Along with foul balls, I gave another reason.

    “Banning of pepperSome ballparks have banned pepper games because of the danger of balls landing in the stands and injuring spectators or because its concentrated play damages the grass on the field. Many ballparks display “NO PEPPER” warnings behind or near home plate.”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pepper_(baseball)

  17. joeman January 29th, 2011 at 10:30 pm

    # GreenBeret7 January 29th, 2011 at 10:27 pm

    For the one disputing the reason I gave for parks not allowing games of pepper to be played on the grass. Along with foul balls, I gave another reason.

    “Banning of pepperSome ballparks have banned pepper games because of the danger of balls landing in the stands and injuring spectators or because its concentrated play damages the grass on the field. Many ballparks display “NO PEPPER” warnings behind or near home plate.”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pepper_(baseball)
    ———-
    nice job

  18. Jerkface January 29th, 2011 at 10:30 pm

    Doreen – I think you and Randy are taking issue with something unnecessarily, because the fangraphs pitching categories are fine for what they are: Showing a pitchers distribution between categories of pitches.

    It works for 99% of ball players, they throw fastballs, curves, sliders, changeups, etc.

    As I said in the other thread, a pitcher might throw 2 different kinds of curve balls and both will be put in the curveball category, they won’t be labelled curve 1 and curve 2. If all you want to know is how often a pitcher throws a 75-81 mph pitch with lots of break, then fangraphs data works fine.

    If you want to know how often a pitcher throws curve 1 vs curve 2 you’ll need to use a different resource. In Wang’s case, he already throws 90% sinkers so if you’re looking at fastball information, of which a sinker is a sub-category (sinking fastball), you can do fine with fangraphs at a glance.

    What I take issue with is Randy blowing up the problem to be bigger than it is, and as he just said ‘what are the other issues that I’m hiding’, as if I am the creator of fangraphs or whatever.

    And just as an aside, looking at how many hits a player gets doesn’t tell you the types of hits either, which you’d think would be useful, right? I don’t see Randy moaning about that.

  19. SAS January 29th, 2011 at 10:31 pm

    The old Yankee Stadium had ‘no pepper’ signs. I haven’t been to the new one so I don’t know

  20. joeman January 29th, 2011 at 10:34 pm

    Manfred mann – Do wah diddy

  21. GreenBeret7 January 29th, 2011 at 10:40 pm

    SAS, I’m sure they still play pepper before the crowds get in, but, on the warning tracks and probly the back fields in spring training. There are old clips of Ducky Medwick, Pepper Martin, Dizzy and Daffy Dean playing it. I’ve never noticed it in parks with artifical turf, though. I’m sure a lot of it stopped when people got lawsuit happy and started sueing BK and McDonald’s because the idiots tried driving and drinking hot coffee, then the clumbsy oxes would spill it on themselves.

  22. Jerkface January 29th, 2011 at 10:41 pm

    And as an aside, pitchfx did not really come into its own until after Wang had already died.

  23. joeman January 29th, 2011 at 10:42 pm

    I’m your puppet – James and Bobby Purify

  24. GreenBeret7 January 29th, 2011 at 10:47 pm

    If the clown running fangraphs think that sinkers are just fastballs, why aren’t sliders, cutters and curves classified the same. They’re still curves. Why aren’t forkballs classified as fastballs or change-ups? because it’s flawed, just like much of the other crap.

  25. tyanksfan36 January 29th, 2011 at 10:47 pm

    Carl says:

    January 29, 2011 at 10:10 pm

    Kimba The White Lion > The Lion King

    While ill give it to them that the names are similar…The Lion King was based off the story of Hamlet. So it does not suprise me that they would have similarities. I prefer The Lion King because I didn’t grow up in Japan in the 60s. I grew up in the US in the 90s. :)

  26. Jerkface January 29th, 2011 at 10:49 pm

    Sliders and Curves are not really as similar as a fastball is to a sinking fastball. The speeds are vastly different to go along with the movement planes.

  27. Jerkface January 29th, 2011 at 10:50 pm

    And having data, even if it is flawed (though I think pitch labelling is less of a flaw than inaccurately measuring the speed and break), is better than having none at all.

    Which is where we’d be if morons like you got your way. And imagine in the olden days when every pitcher threw a fastball, just some had a ‘tail’ or ‘some sink’ or ‘some fade’, but they were all fastballs. Glory to the guy who thought outside of the box enough to classify them as different pitches.

  28. joeman January 29th, 2011 at 10:52 pm

    Simply Red

  29. LGY January 29th, 2011 at 10:56 pm

    Keep in mind when randy says this sinker thing may me a sign of other problems that he has been beating the same drum for over a year now to no avail.

  30. joeman January 29th, 2011 at 10:58 pm

    Aerosmith – Crazy

  31. coney1 January 29th, 2011 at 11:00 pm

    Met Brian Cashman today at the MAB Celebrity Pinstripe Passion show in NJ. Very down to earth guy, really great with the fans. I wanted to thank him for the job he has done, despite the fans, including myself, playing Monday Morning GM all the time and second guessing him. Real nice guy.

  32. Doreen January 29th, 2011 at 11:02 pm

    jerkface -

    I guess it depends on what a person is looking for, what kind of information, and how motivated a person is to dig deeper.

    For a person like me, it would happen as I described it. I might have heard or read about Fangraphs and decide to take a look. I suppose if I was motivated enough, if i didn’t find the information I wanted there, I could try and find out where to find it. Or I could get distracted by the information it DOES have and shrug off what it doesn’t. It’s going to depend on the consumer.

    My only issue in this was your statement that seemed to say that a person would necessarily know that a fastball with a particular break is a sinker. In fairness, I’m sure that most people who are going to go to Fangraphs, or at least those who return there, are going to know a bit more.

  33. joeman January 29th, 2011 at 11:02 pm

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_w0Jwq5nuM

  34. GreenBeret7 January 29th, 2011 at 11:04 pm

    There’s as much difference in a sinker and fastball as a slider and curve.

  35. Jerkface January 29th, 2011 at 11:07 pm

    I guess it depends on what a person is looking for, what kind of information, and how motivated a person is to dig deeper.

    My only issue in this was your statement that seemed to say that a person would necessarily know that a fastball with a particular break is a sinker. In fairness, I’m sure that most people who are going to go to Fangraphs, or at least those who return there, are going to know a bit more.

    On your first point, well, yea. There isn’t anything that is 100% user friendly for novices out there right now. However, how many novices want to argue about specific pitch selection or whatever the information would be used for? I hope one day the systems are better, faster, easier to use, and with more information. I think right now they do a good job.

    And if a casual fan is watching baseball and you see Wang throwing, are they necessarily going to be able to tell the difference between a sinker and a regular fastball anyways? Wang’s sinker was considerably faster than many pitchers 4seam fastballs, and all the ‘action’ on the pitch is in the last instant before a batter makes contact. Its still fast, its still a fastball, so if you want to know how many sinkers he threw, I think at a glance the fangraphs value is going to be pretty accurate. More than a normal pitcher for sure.

  36. Jerkface January 29th, 2011 at 11:07 pm

    There’s as much difference in a sinker and fastball as a slider and curve.

    Describe the differences.

  37. joeman January 29th, 2011 at 11:14 pm

    Santana – Soul Sacrifice (Woodstock 1969)

  38. Doreen January 29th, 2011 at 11:15 pm

    jerkface -

    They may not be able to tell the difference just by looking, but when you watch a game, most of the time you also listen, and the booth guys talk about the types of pitches. They’re going to comment on Wang’s sinker – how players say it’s like hitting a bowling ball, etc. Anecdotal stuff.

    And as more sportswriters incorporate references to sites like Fangraphs in their articles (and they do), I think more people click the links and check them out.

    Maybe with more exposure the information gets more refined?

  39. Jerkface January 29th, 2011 at 11:18 pm

    Maybe with more exposure the information gets more refined?

    Well for fangraphs pitch charts BIS would have to refine the data that they chart at every game. Or Fangraphs would have to move to a pitchfx system. They do, actually, have a pitch fx tab for every pitcher, but as the data only goes back to 2007 (and 07 is spotty at best as not every park had cameras) its not great yet. If they cared to, they could always take the RAW pitchfx data and do their own pitch models.

    Wang pretty much only threw Sinkers, except for that one game against the Mets where he dialed it up all over them on ESPN sunday night baseball with a 4seam, so I don’t have any real issue with the way fangraphs lays out his pitching tendencies.

  40. randy l. January 29th, 2011 at 11:20 pm

    “Describe the differences.”

    when you catch a four seam fastball at 95 it just pops nicely in your mitt.

    when you catch a heavy sinker you feel like your thumb is going to break.

    they are two distinct pitches and should not be classified as the same pitch.

    http://www.fangraphs.com/pitch.....position=P

    am i correct in the pitchfx graph that the FA% is supposed to be four seam fastballs and FT% is two seam fastballs?

  41. Jerkface January 29th, 2011 at 11:24 pm

    when you catch a four seam fastball at 95 it just pops nicely in your mitt.

    when you catch a heavy sinker you feel like your thumb is going to break.

    they are two distinct pitches and should not be classified as the same pitch.

    Both are mid nineties pitches with varying degrees of movement. A sinker is still closer to a fastball than a slider is to a curve, especially Wang’s which had 4-seam velocity. I agree, in ideal they are different pitches and I think they should be categorized separately, but in the end a sinker is just a fastball that drops an extra inch at the end.

    Realistically, every single different pitch thrown by all pitchers should be categorized differently. Not everyones fastball is equal. Some are straight, some have movement. Ubaldo Jimeanez’s 99 mph fastball that moves 6 inches horizontally is not the same as anyone elses fastball.

  42. randy l. January 29th, 2011 at 11:36 pm

    http://www.fangraphs.com/pitch.....position=P

    okay .i have another one.

    it says here if i understand it right that aj burnett threw 0% CU ( assume this is curve balls) in 2010 after throwing 29.7% CU’s in 2009.

    how’s that possible?

    from 2009 to 2010 aj went from 0% KC %( assume this is knuckle curve) to 27.2 KC% in 2010.

    so aj burnett last year abandoned the curve ball and threw the knuckle curve instead ?

  43. GreenBeret7 January 29th, 2011 at 11:37 pm

    When a sinker comes in at mid thigh and dive bombs down the the ankle, that’s a lot different than one the comes in at mid thigh and drops to just above the knees. Stottlemyre threw a heavy sinker that chewed up a catcher’s hand. Munson always said that it was the rotation buried the ball in his hand. Posada said that Wang’s wasn’t as heavy as Clemens’ Split because Wang didn’t bury it as hard. I’ll have to go with that since I was never a catcher. I was a pitcher.

  44. Jerkface January 29th, 2011 at 11:38 pm

    1. [Pitcher] is using his [pitch type] a lot more this year, according to PITCHf/x, where [pitch type] = two-seamer, cutter, etc.

    The pitch classifications in the PITCHf/x data, as shown on Brooks Baseball, Texas Leaguers and Fangraphs (not to be confused with the BIS pitch classifications also on Fangraphs), are done by an algorithm developed by Ross Paul at MLB Advanced Media. Ross has made significant updates to this algorithm every year, and one of the most noticeable impacts is that the percentage of pitches classified as two-seam fastballs has increased with each update. This does not mean that the pitchers themselves have changed anything about their pitch selection or the movement on their pitches.

    If you want to know if a pitcher has really added a new pitch type, explore his data on a site like Texas Leaguers and see if he’s added a completely new pitch cluster from the previous year. Don’t pay attention to how the pitches are labeled; learn for yourself how the different pitch types behave. When you have mastered that, then you’re ready to identify when a pitcher has added a new pitch.

    For example, take a look at the following two graphs that can be found on Texas Leaguers for Ricky Romero. They show the pitch speed versus spin axis angle for 2009 and 2010. The MLBAM pitch classifications are indicated by the different symbols on each graph. Note how Romero’s stuff has remained mostly the same from 2009 to 2010, but the classifications attached to the pitch clusters have changed dramatically.

  45. Betsy January 29th, 2011 at 11:41 pm

    What makes the Yankees think Millwood will still be around? It’s almost February – the guy is going to want to know where he’s pitching. They are doing exactly what Andy said not to do – he said to proceed as if he’s not coming back and they are still waiting.

  46. GreenBeret7 January 29th, 2011 at 11:41 pm

    that’s a lot different than ***a fastball***that comes in at mid thigh and drops to just above the knees.

  47. GreenBeret7 January 29th, 2011 at 11:43 pm

    It also doesn’t appear that Millwood is in any hurry to sign either.

  48. Betsy January 29th, 2011 at 11:43 pm

    Jorge still hasn’t grasped the fact that he’s not going to catch unless there is an emergency, so is he planning for this emergency?

  49. Betsy January 29th, 2011 at 11:44 pm

    Why Millwood instead of Deustcherer anyway?

  50. GreenBeret7 January 29th, 2011 at 11:47 pm

    You can bet that Posada will catch some games, especially against tough right handers. and what difference does it make if he comes to camp and prepares himself to DH and catch?

  51. randy l. January 29th, 2011 at 11:53 pm

    gb7

    i don’t know if you remember him from the mid 80′s , but rick lysander threw a heavy sinker and the first time i caught him was in live pre season bp and he just killed my thumb. it took 6 months before it was back to normal.

    i was catching jack armstrong at the same time and he was throwing 96-97 mph heat and he was easy to catch. armstrong started the national league all star game that summer so he was good.

    i’m not saying lysander was better than armstrong but he was a B to catch.

    that was a real fun time to be the bullpen catcher. danny boone threw a knuckleball and pitched for the orioles in the majors that year.

    so i’d go sometimes from armstrong to boone to lysander right in a row sometimes. 97mph fastball to knuckleball to heavy sinker.

    i think it was … actually i know it was lysander who started calling me “Clank”. :)

  52. GreenBeret7 January 29th, 2011 at 11:55 pm

    Lysander with the Twins, right?

  53. randy l. January 29th, 2011 at 11:56 pm

    that’s right.

    great guy.

    really funny.

  54. GreenBeret7 January 29th, 2011 at 11:57 pm

    Never could figure out why Armstrong turned sour. Had some really good years with the Reds and then I left the country and he started floating from team to team. Did he get hurt?

  55. SAS January 30th, 2011 at 12:00 am

    GB,

    You have a terrific memory. I remembered the name, but not the team.

  56. jacksquat January 30th, 2011 at 12:01 am

    Imo, a “sinkerball” is a two seam fastball.

    If the pitch is breaking from thighs to ankles, it’s not a sinkerball, or it has been thrown at a very slow velocity (which is more like a changeup). A “fastball” pitch that breaks that much is likely thrown with a forkball or splitfingered fastball grip. Or you are getting on top of the ball and it’s a curveball. No sinker breaks that much.

  57. pat January 30th, 2011 at 12:02 am

    If Jorge can talk Andy into coming back, he should be allowed to catch all his starts! :wink:

  58. GreenBeret7 January 30th, 2011 at 12:04 am

    The Reds had an outstanding young pitcher back in the late 60s/early 70s Name was Gary Nolan. Big hard throwing right hander. Never could stay healthy. Always dreamed about the Yanks stealing him and Mario Soto.

  59. UpState January 30th, 2011 at 12:06 am

    now pitching…….Pedro Borbon.

  60. randy l. January 30th, 2011 at 12:10 am

    gb7-

    i’ll tell a story that tells it all with jack.

    tony cloninger the pitching coach came over to jack while he was throwing to me one morning and asked him if he had ever thrown a splitter . jack said no and tony showed him the grip and jack throws it to me with the same motion as his fastball and the ball gets 3-4 feet in front of the plate and the bottom just drops out of it and bounces by me.

    jack was not happy because the ball got wet from the dew on the grass. i could only get two balls for him to warm with because the team rationed them. tony had a look like holy crap because of the movement on the split finger.

    tony tells him to throw it again. same thing happens. totally unhittable pitch. bottom drops out. jack is really mad now because both balls are wet. he looks at tony and says. i can’t throw that pitch, it moves too much”.

    true story.

    jack only had two pitches at that time . the 96-97 four seamer and a decent hard slider. the splitter would have really made armstrong totally nasty. for all i know that was the only two he ever threw.

  61. GreenBeret7 January 30th, 2011 at 12:13 am

    SAS January 30th, 2011 at 12:00 am
    GB,

    You have a terrific memory. I remembered the name, but not the team.

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    SAS, I can remember everything but my phone number. Back when I first went into the military in the late 60s, they didn’t use SSN. They had serial numbers. It took me a week to remember that thing and my rifle serial number. I still remember those and for the life of me, I’ve tried to forget them, They had a 2 letter prefix and 8 digits. RA for regular army, NG for national guard, AR for active reserve and US for draftees.

    By the way, I received the message from Chad. I hadn’t looked at me e-mails for a few days. Sorry for the delay.

  62. GreenBeret7 January 30th, 2011 at 12:15 am

    great story on the All American Boy, Randy. Cloninger had to be rolling after that exchange.

  63. randy l. January 30th, 2011 at 12:16 am

    gb7-

    tony cloninger taught a nasty spitter too .

    he said it kept him pitching his last few years .

  64. SAS January 30th, 2011 at 12:17 am

    GB,

    I am good with people’s phone numbers, at least most of them, but unless the pitcher was outstanding I can’t remember for the life of me. I do remember Pedro Borbon pitching for the Reds.

    No problem about the email situation. Just curious

  65. GreenBeret7 January 30th, 2011 at 12:19 am

    I’m guessing that Tony C. learned the spitter from Spahn and Burdette. He was a Hell of a good pitching coach.

  66. randy l. January 30th, 2011 at 12:25 am

    gb7-
    tony was with the yankees then and jack was with the reds so he wasn’t going to get all authoritative with jack.

    tony just walked away shaking his head laughing.

    another thing about jack. he was into being in a rock band in high school and didn’t follow baseball much the way i understood it. pete rose was the manager of the red then and other players swore he didn’t know who pete rose was. i introduced him to clete and he had never heard of clete.

    jack was perfectly fine to work with and obviously had major talent, but he had no baseball background and few baseball instincts.

  67. GreenBeret7 January 30th, 2011 at 12:27 am

    SAS, I’ll send it out to you when I wake up.

    I lived in an area where there were about 8 teams that I could listen to on the radio, day and night, and one station in South Bend, Indiana that carried the Yankee games. I was as happy as a pig in slop. I remember most of those players, big and small because of that…and, I just love baseball. I pitched in little league through high school and on the post team in the military before going to Vietnam. I pitched because I was on the smallish side, and could hit, but only for singles and noy fast enough to steal bases. It kept me out of trouble.

    Most of the time.

  68. GreenBeret7 January 30th, 2011 at 12:31 am

    Randy,

    That’s some funny stuff. These are the little tidbits and stories that make this place fun. The over anylization and the other crap bores me stiff.

    That’s not an open line for you to rag me, either, Randy.

  69. randy l. January 30th, 2011 at 12:33 am

    ” He was a Hell of a good pitching coach.”

    yes, he was with the yankees for way more than ten years and has been with the red sox for the last 9-10 years.

    he was a real gentleman too. one of the really good guys.

  70. Rich in NJ January 30th, 2011 at 12:35 am

    “If Jorge can talk Andy into coming back, he should be allowed to catch all his starts!”

    Based on last season, I would rather have Posada catch than Cervelli.

  71. GreenBeret7 January 30th, 2011 at 12:37 am

    the Yanks really messed up letting him and Stottlemyre leave. The one guy that I thought would have made a great piyching coach was Mel’s son Todd. He absolutely hated GMS and they Yankees because the the way George did Mel after he tore his rotator cuff.

  72. randy l. January 30th, 2011 at 12:37 am

    “These are the little tidbits and stories that make this place fun. The over anylization and the other crap bores me stiff.”

    gb7-

    i told them partly to get all that fangraphs stuff out of my head. i would have had nightmares if i would have gone to sleep with all those numbers spinning around.

    and on that note i’m out of here.

  73. GreenBeret7 January 30th, 2011 at 12:39 am

    LMAO. Later, Randy.

  74. Betsy January 30th, 2011 at 12:50 am

    Rich, lol, so would I. I think it would be a good idea to have Jorge catch a few games anyway, just to really keep him into it – this is going to be a rough transition for him.

  75. DaSaint007 January 30th, 2011 at 1:14 am

    Agree with Betsy. If Pettitte comes back, I’d love to see Posada catch each of his games. The two of them should be allowed to walk into the sunset together at the end of the season, as they’ve been great battery-mates.

  76. Crawdaddy January 30th, 2011 at 4:01 am

    I agree, if Pettitte comes back let Posada catch him.

  77. Crawdaddy January 30th, 2011 at 4:02 am

    Cashman will let Girardi decide who plays where and when.

  78. Crawdaddy January 30th, 2011 at 4:12 am

    A good article on Betances and some other young arms from Kernan of the NY Post.

    http://www.nypost.com/p/sports.....CHhItBjP/0

  79. Rich in NJ January 30th, 2011 at 6:41 am

    From Craw’s linked article:

    “They really have a lot of great young arms,” one National League scout told The Post. “They just have to give those kids a chance.

    That’s what should define the next few years, giving the elite prospects a chance to succeed as Yankees, rather than following Hank’s “we better bleepin’ win” nonsense.

    It’s not about hugging prospects. It’s about recognizing that’s the Yankees are thin in the rotation and have some aging bats.

    Assembling this kind of young talent isn’t easy. It would be a enduing shame to burn their best young talent for a quick fix.

    Once some of these kids establish themselves, then you can start trading the lesser, more redundant ones for veterans to supplement the emerging young corp.

    That’s how the WS teams of the ’90s were built.

  80. Crawdaddy January 30th, 2011 at 8:32 am

    “Once some of these kids establish themselves, then you can start trading the lesser, more redundant ones for veterans to supplement the emerging young corp.”

    You might have to trade some of them beforehand because the best of them Betances and Banuelos are behind guys like Noesi, Phelps and Warren and you can’t keep them all in the bullpen or at AAA level.

  81. MTU January 30th, 2011 at 8:43 am

    The Yankees need to develop a systematic approach to breaking in their best young arms (perhaps they already have one).

    IMO the the BP and then the 5 slot should be the path.

    This will most likely be AP’s last season (if he returns) , and AJ will be gone soon too.

    That means the Yankees need to prepare 2 or 3 guys to start.

    I have seen Banuelos pitch, and if he masters just one more pitch he will be the best of the lot IMO.

    I would not under rate guys like Warren and Phelps.

    They may not have the absolute power stuff but they throw strikes and know how to pitch.

    I have never seen Betances pitch but I sure would like too.

    The Yankees have a mother lode of talent at Pitcher and catcher.

    It’s exciting.

    :)

  82. blake January 30th, 2011 at 8:46 am

    One thing you can’t have too much of is good young pitching under 25. That’s one reason Im mire excited for ST this year than I have been in awhile….I want to see some of these kids that I have yet to see throw.

  83. MTU January 30th, 2011 at 8:47 am

    Betances sounds like he has a great attitude.

    Got to love that.

    A hard worker with a boatload of talent.

    My hope is that these guys just stay healthy.

    If they can, it’s time to reap the benefit of what the Yankees have sown. Could be a bumper crop.

  84. MTU January 30th, 2011 at 8:49 am

    Blake-

    I think I’m gonna spring for the Milb gameday package this season.

    :)

  85. blake January 30th, 2011 at 8:52 am

    MTU,

    I like Phelps and Warren a lot as well….perhaps not the ceiling of Betances and Banuelos but definitely the potential to be solid. I’ve only seen clips of Betances….but he’s huge and has absolute ace potential from what you read. Banuelos has it all if he can maintain that velocity……exciting times.

  86. tyanksfan36 January 30th, 2011 at 8:52 am

    Betances was the most impressive pitcher I saw in the 2 months I went to TY games. I cannot say enough about the game when he struck out 5 in a row. I was blown away. I didn’t want him to get promoted and I’m jealous of all the people in Trenton who will get to see him this year and those who watch SWB cause he might end up there near the end. I’m going to have to buy the MiLB.tv subscription and hopefully catch a game or his if they show one.

  87. blake January 30th, 2011 at 8:57 am

    MTU,

    yea I got it last year…..its worth it. They show a lot of SWB games but not else though, they do have radio feeds

  88. upstate kate January 30th, 2011 at 8:58 am

    good morning all…just back from a snowy walk w/ my pup.

    After hearing so much about them, I am really looking forward to seeing some of the young guys. The Yankees will never be a team that totally builds from within, but you need the influx of young blood. I remember how much fun it was to watch when Robbie and Melky came up…same w/ Cervelli, the Energizer bunny.

  89. MTU January 30th, 2011 at 9:01 am

    Blake-

    I think Man-Ban needs just one more pitch.

    Something that sits between that FB and the CU.

    Maybe a cutter, or slider.

    Sitting in the low to mid eighties.

    That will give him a nice velocity range and look.

    A two seamer is a nice weapon to add if he doesn’t have one.

    It will make him even more effective against lefties.

    His CU has the usual sink and fade against righties.

  90. J. Alfred Prufrock January 30th, 2011 at 9:03 am

    Betances is the man.the way he gets on top of hitters and just suffocates them is amazing.he’s got a dazzling arm & the size don’t hurt.& for a kid with his bulk & height he doesn’t waste anything when he throws the ball.I’m glad there are stories comin out about him because I got tired of seein his name,like the fourth or fifth in a line of names,being tossed into every trade proposal by commenters,like he was Alan Horne or something.of course those silly, uninformed proclamations on ‘prospect hugging’ & the community’s rush to validate them didn’t help,but maybe the GM stumping for this kid & the articles about him will wake up some sleepy heads.

    Rich in NJ,good post.you said more in those brief comments than some of these winding hot air guest spots.We keep the top guns & creatively use the depth to make the odd trade.That’s how to keep the wheels turnin at the top.

  91. yankeefeminista January 30th, 2011 at 9:07 am

    tyanksfan36 January 30th, 2011 at 8:52 am
    Betances was the most impressive pitcher I saw in the 2 months I went to TY games. I cannot say enough about the game when he struck out 5 in a row. I was blown away. I didn’t want him to get promoted and I’m jealous of all the people in Trenton who will get to see him this year and those who watch SWB cause he might end up there near the end. I’m going to have to buy the MiLB.tv subscription and hopefully catch a game or his if they show one.
    __________
    I saw all three of Betances’ Trenton starts. He just gets better and better. My plan is to try not to miss any of his home starts in 2011. He needs to pick up exactly where he left off last season. His ultra smooth delivery and plus changeup have made all the difference. He supposedly worked on holding runners on and his fielding in the off-season. I can’t wait until Trenton’s season starts.

  92. tyanksfan36 January 30th, 2011 at 9:11 am

    Yankeefem

    I saw 3 of his starts and he won all of them. I wish I could have gone to more but I’m glad to say I got to see a few and get his autograph before he moved up. Ill definitely be keeping an eye on the play by play during his starts. I was glad to see him get promoted but sad cause I knew I wouldn’t see him again. Unless he pitches the ST games I go to.

  93. yankeefeminista January 30th, 2011 at 9:12 am

    Rich in NJ January 30th, 2011 at 6:41 am
    From Craw’s linked article:

    “They really have a lot of great young arms,” one National League scout told The Post. “They just have to give those kids a chance.”
    _________
    This is critical. Another reason Andy coming back helps, as blocking Betances, Banuelos with a pitcher we have to deal for and commit to to replace Andy would be a mistake.

    Andy coming back also hopefully means Cashman gets rid of that dumb idea to use Montero as trade bait for a pitcher. Rather than feel pleased that Cashman touted Montero’s catching abilities the other day, I was concerned that it was a Cash strategy in terms of using Montero as trade bait to land a front-end starter. Betances is that guy. Don’t block him.

  94. yankeefeminista January 30th, 2011 at 9:22 am

    tyanksfan36 January 30th, 2011 at 9:11 am
    Yankeefem

    I saw 3 of his starts and he won all of them. I wish I could have gone to more but I’m glad to say I got to see a few and get his autograph before he moved up. Ill definitely be keeping an eye on the play by play during his starts. I was glad to see him get promoted but sad cause I knew I wouldn’t see him again. Unless he pitches the ST games I go to.
    ________
    It is amazing how much bulk he has added. I remember him as that skinny kid we drafted. Now he’s 270lbs and with that power arm and downward plane, he must be so intimidating to batters. I sit about 5 rows behind the plate when he pitches, and he is just so formidable. I can see the Jimenez comps.

    milb-tv is useful, but too bad they rarely show any AA games.

    JAP, Yes, hilarious the way people keep throw Betances into trades as if he is just some prospect. We do not want to trade this guy.

  95. yankeefeminista January 30th, 2011 at 9:22 am

    *throwing*

  96. J. Alfred Prufrock January 30th, 2011 at 9:45 am

    yankfem – don’t you know all prospects are the same guy & that guy is just so fuzzy & cute we just can’t stop hugging & hugging & hugging him.

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