The LoHud Yankees Blog

A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Sneaking a peak behind the curtain

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Jan 31, 2011 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

To a very small extent, I’ve seen behind the curtain. I’ve been in Mark Newman’s office, asked him a question about a specific player, and watched him log into the Yankees database to pull up the necessary information.

I couldn’t see details — couldn’t really see the computer screen, didn’t try to sneak a peak — but it was crystal clear that Newman had all the information he could possibly need at his fingertips. And that information clearly went beyond fastball velocity and batting average on balls in play.

The Yankees know plenty of things we don’t know. Even in this media market, not everything goes public, and the things that do go public quite often come with internal or external spin. We all like to play general manager from our living room — Trade for Felix Hernandez! Make an offer to Jeremy Bonderman! Give Adam Warren a shot! — but we’re at a disadvantage.

With apologies to GI Joe, when it comes to being a GM, knowing isn’t half the battle. It’s the entire battle. And Cashman knows more than the rest of us.

To answer the three questions Jesse asked this morning:

1. What information could possibly be leaked to the public if WikiLeaks ever targeted the New York Yankees?

If the Yankees were lucky: In-depth scouting reports, records of free agent and trade offers, progress reports for minor leaguers and aging veterans. If the Yankees were unlucky: Disciplinary files, commentary on players’ personal lives, in-depth analysis of Yankees beat writers and bloggers!

2. What would be the aftermath of such information becoming public?

That depends. Is it only Yankees information that’s going public? If every team’s scouting reports were suddenly public knowledge, the resulting trade market would be fascinating. Whose scouts would teams believe? If only the Yankees information were leaked to the public, the result would be a massive disadvantage.

3. Would you, as fans, want to know these secrets, or prefer to be kept in the dark?

To some extent, I think the mystery is good. It’s good that some information is out of reach. It keeps the game from becoming too much of a science, keeps the winters buzzing with dreamed-up scenarios from living-room GMs. Then again, if that computer screen were right in front of you…

Associated Press photo

 
 

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263 Responses to “Sneaking a peak behind the curtain”

  1. MTU January 31st, 2011 at 11:48 am

    The only time I’d ever want to be a fly is so I could overhear the Yankees inner workings otherwise there is no percentage in it.

    Maybe I could just borrow one of those new-fangled flying military spy insects.

    That would work better.

    :)

  2. Rich in NJ January 31st, 2011 at 11:48 am

    I think the most interesting thing would be to know which trades the Yankees were willing to make but were turned down, since 1995.

  3. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 11:48 am

    Answering the questions above:

    1. In a nightmare scenario it would be information regarding the SteinBrothers looking into selling the team or information regarding other Yankees – key guys like Jeter and Posada – being on that list of 100 steroid users.

    2. Rampant speculation over who they might sell to and questions about how invested they are in the future of the organization and whether we can count on them to have the same zeal that their father did. If it was the latter – well can you imagine the fall out if Derek Jeter was said to be using steroids?

    3. I don’t need to know everything that the Yankees are doing behind the scenes and I certainly don’t need to know what players were and weren’t using steroids.

  4. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 11:49 am

    “Disciplinary files, commentary on players’ personal lives, in-depth analysis of Yankees beat writers and bloggers!”

    bloggers?!!!

    you mean cashman might have a file on me?

    that would explain why i have so much trouble getting into yankee games unless i go to fenway park.

  5. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 11:51 am

    MTU -

    Getting back to my comment to you on the last thread.

    I don’t think there’s much to worry about – even if Posada entertained offers from that team we shall not name – I doubt they would be willing to offer him the kind of money he would feel he’s entitled to.

    In that sense I do wonder what team is going to sign him next year or if he’s going to be another player who prices himself into retirement.

  6. SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 11:51 am

    With the exception of G Love’s guest spot and one or two others, this hasn’t been the best years for guest posts.

    Perhaps the first guest post, that rant filled, “Brian Cashman isn’t doing his job” post, set the tone for the off year of posts.

    Sort of like Jeets off season at the plate.

    Tell ya what hasn’t been off……

    Chad’s follow ups to the guest posts.

    Every one of them have been all star quality.

    Robbie Cano-like in their high level of success.

    This one is another example of that.

    Well written and well done Chad!

  7. Rich in NJ January 31st, 2011 at 11:51 am

    “you mean cashman might have a file on me?”

    Wait. You”re alleging that the obsession is bilateral? ;)

  8. blake January 31st, 2011 at 11:55 am

    Chad’s WARB (wins above replacement blogger ) are increasing all the time.

  9. MTU January 31st, 2011 at 11:55 am

    I second that on Chad SJ.

    He’s been diggin’ deep this OS and deserves a lot of praise.

    :)

  10. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 11:56 am

    I know Brian’s keeping a running list of all my trade proposals

  11. MTU January 31st, 2011 at 11:56 am

    Blake-

    :)

  12. MTU January 31st, 2011 at 11:57 am

    Chip-

    I don’t care what it takes. I do not ever want to see Jorge Posada in a non-Yankee uniform. Please.

    Yuck.

    :(

  13. MTU January 31st, 2011 at 11:59 am

    Chip-

    Maybe I could just close my eyes so I wouldn’t throw up.

  14. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 12:01 pm

    MTU January 31st, 2011 at 11:59 am
    Chip-

    Maybe I could just close my eyes so I wouldn’t throw up.

    —————————-

    head between your legs man, head between your legs.

  15. MTU January 31st, 2011 at 12:02 pm

    I was awful to see AP in another uni.

    I don’t want to see that repeated ever again for any core 4 player.

    It’s like removing one of the elements from the Periodic Table.

    It’s totally unnatural.

  16. Jerkface January 31st, 2011 at 12:02 pm

    I want all the information. I’d love an hour at a Yankee terminal. My all-too-brief taste of a Mets scout’s laptop at the winter meetings was not enough.

  17. MTU January 31st, 2011 at 12:02 pm

    edit: It

  18. Jerkface January 31st, 2011 at 12:03 pm

    Though the mets’ laptop being a speak ‘n’ spell had something to do with it.

  19. MTU January 31st, 2011 at 12:05 pm

    Jerkface-

    You’d be the right man to send undercover into a network of computers.

    No doubt about that.

    Kind of like “Tank” in the Matrix.

  20. MTU January 31st, 2011 at 12:08 pm

    But Jerkface.

    Can you reassure all of us that you can break thru the firewall at the Sux system so we all can sneak a peak at what makes Theo such a friggin’ genius ?

    :)

  21. LGY January 31st, 2011 at 12:08 pm

    I would want to know what the Yanks FO thinks of pocket protector wearing fans who are trying to water down the game I love with scorecard extensions :mad:

  22. MTU January 31st, 2011 at 12:09 pm

    LGY-

    You and Jerkface could be like stealth assasins.

    Think about it.

    ;)

  23. MTU January 31st, 2011 at 12:10 pm

    Got to run.

    I await THE answers.

    :)

  24. LGY January 31st, 2011 at 12:11 pm

    Chip

    Who DH in 2012 if you won’t bring Po back?

    Be forewarned. If you say something about a rotating DH there will be consequences

  25. LGY January 31st, 2011 at 12:15 pm

    MTU

    That would be cool of I wasn’t already a stealth asassin.

    Obliterating dumb ideas, false statements, and randys rambling with my saber power.

  26. Joe from Long Island January 31st, 2011 at 12:16 pm

    Hi guys – If anyone wants to read something interesting, I’d direct you to the investigative story in today’s NY Times sports section on the Mets’ owners and their history of shady investments. This was pretty good investigative reporting by the Times.

    Something is beginning to stink in Queens, and it isn’t just uncollected garbage. If things continue to get rough for the Wilpons, Bud and MLB will have franchises on both coasts with troubled ownership (LA and the Mets). I read the other day that Bud has already requested a meeting with Fred Wilpon.

    SJ, do you have any info on this?

  27. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 12:17 pm

    LGY January 31st, 2011 at 12:11 pm
    Chip

    Who DH in 2012 if you won’t bring Po back?

    Be forewarned. If you say something about a rotating DH there will be consequences

    ——————————

    Internal candidates:
    1. Alex (with Nunez or Jeter at 3b)
    2. Montero (with Martin and/or Romine behind the dish)
    3. Nick Swisher (if the team decides to bring in a RF or Laird is really that good)

    External candidates:
    Carlos Quentin

    Dream candidate:
    Albert Pujols

  28. Jerkface January 31st, 2011 at 12:17 pm

    Who DH in 2012 if you won’t bring Po back?

    Pujols

  29. blake January 31st, 2011 at 12:17 pm

    I really hope the Clemens trial isn’t what’s keeping Andy from coming on back……If he tries to destroy Pettite in his defense (which is about his only defense) then what little respect people in the game still have for him will likely be gone…….

  30. pat January 31st, 2011 at 12:17 pm

    Soundbytes from Jorge and Bernie from Saturday’s event courtesy of Sweeny.

    http://newyork.cbslocal.com/20.....ge-posada/

  31. LGY January 31st, 2011 at 12:18 pm

    I’m green friendly too.

    My saber runs on bacon grease.

  32. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 12:20 pm

    Joe from Long Island January 31st, 2011 at 12:16 pm
    Hi guys – If anyone wants to read something interesting, I’d direct you to the investigative story in today’s NY Times sports section on the Mets’ owners and their history of shady investments. This was pretty good investigative reporting by the Times.

    Something is beginning to stink in Queens, and it isn’t just uncollected garbage. If things continue to get rough for the Wilpons, Bud and MLB will have franchises on both coasts with troubled ownership (LA and the Mets). I read the other day that Bud has already requested a meeting with Fred Wilpon.

    SJ, do you have any info on this?

    ———————-

    It’s nice that Bud, who orchestrated one of the shadiest ownership deals of all time which allowed Jeffrey Loria to run two franchises into the ground and resulted in the bribing the Attorney General of Mass, is concerned about the state of the Mets.

    He probably just wants to make sure that Freddy Coupons doesn’t sell the team to someone who is outside Bud’s circle of friends.

  33. pat January 31st, 2011 at 12:23 pm

    jimbaumbach Bud Selig is en route from Milwaukee & scheduled to arrive in New York today, likely to meet with Wilpons later today or tomorrow.

  34. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 12:27 pm

    blake January 31st, 2011 at 12:17 pm
    I really hope the Clemens trial isn’t what’s keeping Andy from coming on back……If he tries to destroy Pettite in his defense (which is about his only defense) then what little respect people in the game still have for him will likely be gone…….

    ——————–

    A) In Roger’s place I think we would all do the same thing

    B) Who says that whatever dirt Roger might have on Andy isn’t true?

    Andy got away with a lot by resorting to his “aww shucks” shtick – being mad at him would be like being mad at Opie from the Andy Griffith Show. But what if there’s a lot more to his HGH story than we know about? Would it shock me? No, not really. But Andy got through it once by being “honest and open” about it – I don’t think that would work a second time around.

  35. Jerkface January 31st, 2011 at 12:27 pm

    1. Alex (with Nunez or Jeter at 3b)

    Don’t see this until like 2016. A-rod at DH, Nunez might replace Jeter as early as next year.

  36. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 12:28 pm

    “I think the most interesting thing would be to know which trades the Yankees were willing to make but were turned down, since 1995.”

    good one.

    what i’d like to see is the topographical and geophysical maps that prove that there is an elevation bump that goes from the shortstop position to a line straight back from second base.

  37. blake January 31st, 2011 at 12:30 pm

    Chip,

    If I were Roger I wouldn’t have lied to congress ….unless of course he is actually telling the truth. The evidence doesn’t suggest that’s the case however. Clemens is likely going to jail.

  38. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 12:33 pm

    is there a bigger fall from grace in sports that what’s happened with clemens?

    pretty sad story.

  39. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 12:34 pm

    Jerkface January 31st, 2011 at 12:27 pm
    1. Alex (with Nunez or Jeter at 3b)

    Don’t see this until like 2016. A-rod at DH, Nunez might replace Jeter as early as next year.

    ————————–

    Yeah – Nunez replaces Derek at SS, Derek replaces Alex at 3b, Alex replaces Jorge at DH.

    I think most likely though is Montero at DH with Martin and Romine working behind the plate. Of course that’s supposing that Romine or Montero aren’t traded before 2012.

    Either way – the point is that the Yankees will have a lot of options to consider before contemplating a new contract for a 40 year old Jorge.

  40. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 12:36 pm

    randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 12:33 pm
    is there a bigger fall from grace in sports that what’s happened with clemens?

    pretty sad story
    ————–

    Barry Bonds?

  41. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 12:38 pm

    blake January 31st, 2011 at 12:30 pm
    Chip,

    If I were Roger I wouldn’t have lied to congress ….unless of course he is actually telling the truth. The evidence doesn’t suggest that’s the case however. Clemens is likely going to jail.

    ——————

    What is it George Costanza used to say, “A lie’s not a lie if you believe it.”

    The fact is Roger did what he did and now he’s going to do what he’s been doing which is fight anyone who is against him. If that means tossing Andy under the bus then he’ll do it in a heartbeat – the fact of the matter is that we don’t know what Andy did other than what was brought up in the Mitchell Report.

    As I said though, knowing how close he was to Clemens I wouldn’t find it hard to believe if those couple of times with HGH were just the tip of the iceberg for Andy.

  42. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 12:40 pm

    bonds was so openly using peds that being exposed didn’t do much to his image.

    clemens was a shocker to most people.

    it looks like he’s going to be as much of a pariah as pete rose became.

  43. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 12:43 pm

    randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 12:40 pm
    bonds was so openly using peds that being exposed didn’t do much to his image.

    clemens was a shocker to most people.

    it looks like he’s going to be as much of a pariah as pete rose became.

    ——————-

    Don’t know if you can call Clemens a shocker. The guy was cooked at the end in Boston and then somehow rebounded to go on and win what – 3 more Cy Young awards.

    I was shocked by Alex, mildly surprised about Andy, but I fully expected Clemens to be outed.

  44. mick January 31st, 2011 at 12:44 pm

    the pete and clemens comparison is true.
    both were adamant in their denials.

  45. blake January 31st, 2011 at 12:44 pm

    Chip,

    Lies that have jail time potentially attached to them are different than what George is talking about…..doesn’t matter if he believes it or not. Unless he’s 100% innocent then dragging your “best friend ” through the mud to try and protect your hide from your own lies is pretty shameful behavior.

  46. mick January 31st, 2011 at 12:45 pm

    you can throw palmiero into that mix.
    he will never make the HOF now.

  47. BoJo January 31st, 2011 at 12:45 pm

    I want Jeter’s black book.

  48. BoJo January 31st, 2011 at 12:46 pm

    Or should I say his relational database?

  49. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 12:46 pm

    mick January 31st, 2011 at 12:44 pm
    the pete and clemens comparison is true.
    both were adamant in their denials.

    ——————

    Pete was adamant to the press and fans – as soon as he was presented with evidence he folded. Clemens has been presented with the evidence and is still denying it.

  50. BoJo January 31st, 2011 at 12:47 pm

    I also want to see copies of the restraining orders against Chip :lol:

  51. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 12:48 pm

    blake January 31st, 2011 at 12:44 pm
    Chip,

    Lies that have jail time potentially attached to them are different than what George is talking about…..doesn’t matter if he believes it or not. Unless he’s 100% innocent then dragging your “best friend ” through the mud to try and protect your hide from your own lies is pretty shameful behavior.

    ————————-

    I don’t disagree. But if there’s a deal to be made by naming others I can’t blame him for going that route. For what it’s worth – Andy’s not innocent in this. He made his bed too and now he has to lay in it.

  52. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 12:48 pm

    BoJo January 31st, 2011 at 12:47 pm
    I also want to see copies of the restraining orders against Chip
    ——————————

    I’m not allowed to touch Cashman’s IPhone to make any calls to any other GMs.

  53. blake January 31st, 2011 at 12:50 pm

    I think Roger has opted to hold the line on his story for better or worse…..even if it means going to jail if he never admits it and continues to profess his innocence then maybe there will be people out there that still believe him and think he got the shaft…….to him that’s probably better than admitting it. He’s too far in now…..lies begat more lies.

  54. Bronx Jeers January 31st, 2011 at 12:51 pm

    I would like to know who’s idea it was to check your cell phone as you enter the stadium.

    Also:

    Who dreamed up the Mohegan Sun Bar ?

  55. mick January 31st, 2011 at 12:51 pm

    Pete was adamant to the press and fans – as soon as he was presented with evidence he folded.
    ======================
    Pete screwed with the wrong guy in Giammati. He was as good as Pete was bad.
    When Bart died , Peter then had Giammati’s right hand man. Faye Vincent to carry on his legacy.
    No way Baseball overturns that.

    Clemens will fold too.

  56. BoJo January 31st, 2011 at 12:52 pm

    Who DH in 2012 if you won’t bring Po back?
    ++++++++++++++
    My wish candidate would be Bryce Harper–or play him in RF and make Swisher the DH.

  57. BoJo January 31st, 2011 at 12:53 pm

    I want to get guys when they are still going up the curve, not coming down it.

  58. BoJo January 31st, 2011 at 12:53 pm

    Chip January 31st, 2011 at 12:48 pm

    BoJo January 31st, 2011 at 12:47 pm
    I also want to see copies of the restraining orders against Chip
    ——————————

    I’m not allowed to touch Cashman’s IPhone to make any calls to any other GMs.
    ++++++++++++++
    :lol:

  59. blake January 31st, 2011 at 12:54 pm

    Chip,

    Roger is on trial for perjury, not for using PEDs. His only defense is to destroy the credibility of the key witness. He knew that when he chose to go the route he has…..if he’s innocent then I don’t blame him one bit……if he’s not then he’s scum.

  60. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 12:54 pm

    354 wins down the drain for clemens.

    he can’t go to a golf course with his buddies without someone whispering behind his back.

    it is a huge fall from grace.

    the only chance he has of getting some respect back is going 100 % public with what he did.

    if the public can get over what michael vick did , they can at least get some respect as a human being for clemens again.

    hall of fame?

    that ship has sailed.

  61. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 12:55 pm

    mick January 31st, 2011 at 12:51 pm
    Pete was adamant to the press and fans – as soon as he was presented with evidence he folded.
    ======================
    Pete screwed with the wrong guy in Giammati. He was as good as Pete was bad.
    When Bart died , Peter then had Giammati’s right hand man. Faye Vincent to carry on his legacy.
    No way Baseball overturns that.

    Clemens will fold too.
    ——————-

    I’ve always said that Pete accepted a “lifetime” ban from the game. That’s pretty black and white to me. The year he dies he should be enshrined in Cooperstown with his crime listed. Until then, he’s on the outside looking in.

  62. 86w183 January 31st, 2011 at 12:55 pm

    Guys Clemens has NOTHING to gain by dragging Andy Pettite through the mud. the only dispute they have is a conversation where Andy remembers Roger saying something and Roger insisting that his friend “mis-remembers”

    The quicker that goes the better for his side. Smearing Andy calls into doubt his own credibility

  63. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 12:57 pm

    “I would like to know who’s idea it was to check your cell phone as you enter the stadium.”

    bronx jeers-

    they actually make people do that?

  64. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 12:58 pm

    blake January 31st, 2011 at 12:54 pm
    Chip,

    Roger is on trial for perjury, not for using PEDs. His only defense is to destroy the credibility of the key witness. He knew that when he chose to go the route he has…..if he’s innocent then I don’t blame him one bit……if he’s not then he’s scum.

    ——————

    So if Roger turns around and says “hey, you can’t trust what Andy’s telling you. He said he only did HGH twice when I know for a fact he’s been doing it regularly for 5 years now. He’s been cheating on his wife for years with a former bat boy and he cheats on his taxes too.”

    If that’s what it takes to put a question in the mind of those who will sit in judgement of him about Andy’s statement – then so be it – and what’s more – who is to say that Roger is lying when he says that about Andy?

  65. SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 12:58 pm

    I think Tiger Woods fall from dominant golfer to “run of the mill” guy is more dramatic than Clemens.

    Roger was always a polarizing figure. Tiger was not.

    Now you have media people trying to rationalize just how bad a golfer Tiger has become.

    The guy literally can’t hit three quality shots in a row now. Even on courses he used to dominate.

    Aside from OJ, who had to kill two people to lose his place in sports immortality, I think history will show Tiger Woods fall as the most dramatic.

  66. West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 12:59 pm

    It’s a sad situation when two friends like Roger and Andy are immersed in this mess. I’m sure Roger would have preferred if Pettitte had not recalled what happened.

  67. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:00 pm

    86w183 January 31st, 2011 at 12:55 pm
    Guys Clemens has NOTHING to gain by dragging Andy Pettite through the mud. the only dispute they have is a conversation where Andy remembers Roger saying something and Roger insisting that his friend “mis-remembers”

    The quicker that goes the better for his side. Smearing Andy calls into doubt his own credibility

    ——————-

    Not true – if Roger has honest to goodness dirt on Andy that shows that HE lied when he sat down in Tampa and said that he only used it a couple of times, blah blah blah – then that could call everything Andy says into question.

  68. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:02 pm

    West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 12:59 pm
    It’s a sad situation when two friends like Roger and Andy are immersed in this mess. I’m sure Roger would have preferred if Pettitte had not recalled what happened.

    ————————

    Again, I have no pity for whatever cards Roger plays at Andy’s expense. You lay down with dogs you’re going to get fleas. Andy knew what he was getting into when he started working out with Roger and McNamee and now he’s got to deal with it. If he would feel more comfortable dealing with it in Deer Park with his family than in the Bronx in front of throngs of reporters – I can’t say I blame him. Seems a little chicken poopish to me, but I can’t blame him.

  69. blake January 31st, 2011 at 1:05 pm

    Chip,

    He should have just told the truth…..problem solved. Maybe he did…..but it certainly doesn’t look like it

  70. West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 1:07 pm

    Pettitte better get ready, Rusty Hardin and his team are as good as they come and will not hesitate to try everything they can to destroy Pettitte’s credibility on the stand.

  71. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:07 pm

    blake January 31st, 2011 at 1:05 pm
    Chip,

    He should have just told the truth…..problem solved. Maybe he did…..but it certainly doesn’t look like it

    ——————-

    I agree. But what he should of done is moot right now. What he did do is get himself into a perdiciment where destroying Andy Pettite may be the only way he stays out of jail. Given those two choices: jail or ruin your buddy’s credibility by publically airing his dirty laundry – I can’t think of a single rational person who would pick jail.

    I would rather be a free pariah than an imprisoned saint.

  72. pat January 31st, 2011 at 1:08 pm

    The Prosecution seems to be trying anything they can to keep Pettitte from being cross examined by Hardin.

    Makes me think there is something or someone they are trying to protect.

  73. blake January 31st, 2011 at 1:09 pm

    I would agree Tiger’s fall has been more dramatic…..however I think he still has a chance to rebuild his image, maybe not to where it was….it’ll never be that again but at least somewhat because he’s still playing. If Roger is found guilty and goes to jail then he’s done….he’s never going to improve his image and really has no vehicle to do so. Tiger is still pretty young for a golfer …..he starts winning majors again then things will change.

  74. SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 1:10 pm

    Joe,

    I live in South Florida. Two of the gated golf communities close to mine were known as “Madoff Communities” for years because of the number of people who lived there dumpers to have invested heavily with Madoff.

    A large number of the homes in both communities are on the market. Some for up to 50% under market value.

    Once Jeffrey Picour’s (sp) widow agreed to give the group tracking down Madoff’s money over 4 BILLION dollars, the Wilpons were going to be in trouble.

    There have been rumors for two years the Wilpons were deep into Madoff’s investments.

    Do I think they knew he was a crook? No.

    Do I think they, like many of the investors, failed to ask questions the answers of which would have made them uncomfortable? Absolutely.

    When you have years that an excellent return on an investment portfolio would yield you a 5-6% return, and Madoff clients were getting a 20-30% return, someting ain’t right.

    The SEC had received numerous complaints about Madoff over the years. They never acted on them.

    Personally, absent a real sugar daddy coming to the rescue of the Wilpons, I think they are going to have to sell the tea.

    This trustee for the victims, Picard, is a real bulldog.

    He’s going after individual investors who made less than $200k investing with Madoff.

    For people who have invested in him like the Wilpons did? He’s not going to rest unless he gets a HUGE chunk of money from them.

  75. blake January 31st, 2011 at 1:10 pm

    Chip,

    If I were Clemens right now and I knew I was guilty. I would call the trial off, plead guilty and take my medicine. I would much rather do that than ruin my friend for my lies.

  76. Erica in NY January 31st, 2011 at 1:11 pm

    I would like to know why the pretzels at Yankee Stadium are always cold

    Yet the ice cream is melted all over me before I even get back to my seat

  77. mick January 31st, 2011 at 1:11 pm

    # randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 12:57 pm

    “I would like to know who’s idea it was to check your cell phone as you enter the stadium.”

    bronx jeers-

    they actually make people do that?
    =========================
    They could care less…just tell them you don’t have one.
    You must also take your cap off when you enter Stadium.

  78. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:11 pm

    blake January 31st, 2011 at 1:09 pm
    I would agree Tiger’s fall has been more dramatic…..however I think he still has a chance to rebuild his image, maybe not to where it was….it’ll never be that again but at least somewhat because he’s still playing. If Roger is found guilty and goes to jail then he’s done….he’s never going to improve his image and really has no vehicle to do so. Tiger is still pretty young for a golfer …..he starts winning majors again then things will change.

    ——————-

    If Mike Vick can rehab his image to the point where the president is saying he’s proud of him, then anyone’s image can be rehabbed.

  79. 86w183 January 31st, 2011 at 1:12 pm

    I disagree completely because then Roger’s congressional testimony could be used against him in terms of his friendship for Pettite and all the rest.

    He never claimed Andy intentionally lied or was a disreputable character back then. In fact he acknowledged that they were close friends and that his friend simply didn’t remember things correctly. It would blow up in his face if he tried to play that card now.

    This is not new testimony (if it happens). Everything he says has to be consistent with what he said before Congress because his truthfulness THEN is what’s at issue.

    His position has to be this — his friend is mistaken — his ex trainer is a lying piece of crap — and you (the govt.) can’t prove otherwise.

  80. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:13 pm

    blake January 31st, 2011 at 1:10 pm
    Chip,

    If I were Clemens right now and I knew I was guilty. I would call the trial off, plead guilty and take my medicine. I would much rather do that than ruin my friend for my lies.

    ——————-

    blake -

    I’m not questioning your integrity but it’s one thing to say that from the comfort of where ever you are and another thing to do it when actually faced with the hard choice.

  81. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 1:13 pm

    sj44-

    i think how tiger plays from now on until his career is over will determine his legacy.

    the stack and tilt swing he’s learning is not the easiest swing to learn coming from where his swing was. from watching him show signs of playing well this winter and getting in contention before the rails fall off i think he will come back and win tournaments and majors.

    if he doesn’t then i agree that he’d be right up there with rose and clemens. the two things tiger has going for him is he freely admitted his trangressions and he has a good ten years of playing to change the publics view of him.

    watching him, i think he’s going to take a good 6 months to get natural with the new swing. but time will tell. he’s definitely not the same golfer right now.

  82. Erica in NY January 31st, 2011 at 1:13 pm

    Please. For some reason when I enter the stadium my purse always gets thouroughly inspected. I have also been frisked once (oddly, by a woman).

    And I can assure you, I am not a threatening looking person

  83. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:14 pm

    Duchscherer signing with Baltimore.

    not terribly upset over losing a guy who has thrown almost as many innings in the bigs over the last two years as I have.

  84. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:15 pm

    Erica in NY January 31st, 2011 at 1:13 pm
    Please. For some reason when I enter the stadium my purse always gets thouroughly inspected. I have also been frisked once (oddly, by a woman).

    And I can assure you, I am not a threatening looking person

    ——————–

    Women always frisk women men always frisk men – it is done to prevent charges of sexual misconduct.

  85. mick January 31st, 2011 at 1:16 pm

    Rusty Hardin and his team are as good as they come
    ==================================
    He seemed like a doofus to me.

  86. SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 1:16 pm

    The average age for golfers winning majors in the last 15 years, Tiger’s span in the game, is 32.

    Tiger is 35.

    Most people in the game believe a tour golfer hits his peak at 31-36 and then begins a slide downward.

    There are exceptions to the rule, Nicklaus was 46 when he won the Masters in 1986 but, that was a different era. Especially from an equipment standpoint.

    Like every other sport, golf is trending younger these days.

    It’s going to be interesting to see if Tiger has the goods to get back to his place as a dominant player.

  87. Erica in NY January 31st, 2011 at 1:17 pm

    Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:15 pm
    Erica in NY January 31st, 2011 at 1:13 pm
    Please. For some reason when I enter the stadium my purse always gets thouroughly inspected. I have also been frisked once (oddly, by a woman).

    And I can assure you, I am not a threatening looking person

    ——————–

    Women always frisk women men always frisk men – it is done to prevent charges of sexual misconduct.

    **************

    I still could have sued the way this woman frisked me.

  88. 86w183 January 31st, 2011 at 1:20 pm

    SJ A big reason golf is trending younger is $$$$. Veteran golfers have made so much and can make so much in a good month that they don’t play anywhere near the schedules that they used to. Thus more chances for younger guys to win and earn $$$

    I agree Tiger is at the “north” end of his golfing prime.

  89. West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 1:21 pm

    “…if he doesn’t then i agree that he’d be right up there with rose and clemens. the two things tiger has going for him is he freely admitted his trangressions and he has a good ten years of playing to change the publics view of him”.

    **************

    Apples and oranges. Rose and Clemens harmed the integrity of the game, they cheated. Tiger cheated on his wife.

  90. mick January 31st, 2011 at 1:22 pm

    Tiger’s inabilities are interesting, in that we don’t know the exact cause of it.
    Is it a lack of confidence, embarassment over his actions, in which he was caught red-handed.
    Is it a loss of the edge of living a life that gave him the extra thrill of being on top of the world AND living the high life to the hilt.
    The extra stimulus could be compared to steroids.

  91. mick January 31st, 2011 at 1:23 pm

    Women always frisk women men always frisk men – it is done to prevent charges of sexual misconduct.
    =====================================
    Why can’t a woman sue another woman for sexual harassment?

  92. Bronx Jeers January 31st, 2011 at 1:25 pm

    # randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 12:57 pm

    “I would like to know who’s idea it was to check your cell phone as you enter the stadium.”

    bronx jeers-

    they actually make people do that?

    ———————————————————————————————————————–

    They’ve been doing that for maybe 5 years now. They even want you to turn it on. I once asked why and was told that they wanted to ensure that the phone is not a flask. Ridiculous.

    The security there generally takes an uber-wannabe cop attitude.

    You also have to take off your hat which isn’t that big of a deal but I’ve also been frisked, asked to raise my shirt and empty my pockets.

    I’ve probably been to about a dozen MLB stadiums. Yankee stadium has by far the worst staff. Maybe it’s a New York thing.

  93. West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 1:25 pm

    They search purses and look under hats for security reasons. The public good outweigh individual rights sometimes. That’s the world we live in now, it’s not going to change anytime soon.

  94. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:25 pm

    mick January 31st, 2011 at 1:23 pm
    Women always frisk women men always frisk men – it is done to prevent charges of sexual misconduct.
    =====================================
    Why can’t a woman sue another woman for sexual harassment?

    —————

    They can. It’s just less likely.

  95. Joe from Long Island January 31st, 2011 at 1:26 pm

    SJ – thanks for getting back to me. As you know, I find the business end of the game fascinating, and as a New Yorker this is especially intriguing.

    Thank goodness it’s the Mets and not the Yankees!

  96. 86w183 January 31st, 2011 at 1:27 pm

    Rose bet on his team to win. Most of the world has already forgiven him.

    PED users followed the blueprint that Baby Doc Selig and the rest of baseball’s leadership laid out fo them in the mid 90′s. They are no more cheaters than those who used amphetamines illegally… which is damn near everyone since the 1930s.

    Everyone in baseball was complicit in the steroid era and all should equally share in any punishment(s) that come out of it. Unfortunately in our world hypocrisy and sanctimony have taken over and if things don’t change more than half the top 20 HR hitters may not be in Cooperstown.

  97. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:28 pm

    Bronx Jeers January 31st, 2011 at 1:25 pm
    # randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 12:57 pm

    “I would like to know who’s idea it was to check your cell phone as you enter the stadium.”

    bronx jeers-

    they actually make people do that?

    ———————————————————————————————————————–

    They’ve been doing that for maybe 5 years now. They even want you to turn it on. I once asked why and was told that they wanted to ensure that the phone is not a flask. Ridiculous.

    The security there generally takes an uber-wannabe cop attitude.

    You also have to take off your hat which isn’t that big of a deal but I’ve also been frisked, asked to raise my shirt and empty my pockets.

    I’ve probably been to about a dozen MLB stadiums. Yankee stadium has by far the worst staff. Maybe it’s a New York thing.

    ———————-

    The reason your cell phone is checked is because they want to make sure it is real and functional and you haven’t turned it into an IED.

    I worked the 2004 Presidential Conventions in Boston and New York – every electronic device was checked, they would check our shoes to ensure that they didn’t have false bottoms. They’re not effing around with this security these days.

  98. mick January 31st, 2011 at 1:28 pm

    They make you take a sip of water out of your water bottle if it’s unopened and full.
    They rarely frisk you so just keep your cell phone in your pocket.
    They are afraid of detonation I believe from a cell phone.

  99. Yankee Trader January 31st, 2011 at 1:29 pm

    I think Tiger Woods fall from dominant golfer to “run of the mill” guy is more dramatic than Clemens.
    ——————————————————————
    I think O.J. Simpson tops them all!

  100. mick January 31st, 2011 at 1:30 pm

    Rose bet on his team to win.
    ===================
    So what?
    It can’t effect tomorrow’s game if you bring in your closer for 2 innings to save today’s bet?

  101. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:31 pm

    mick January 31st, 2011 at 1:28 pm
    They make you take a sip of water out of your water bottle if it’s unopened and full.
    They rarely frisk you so just keep your cell phone in your pocket.
    They are afraid of detonation I believe from a cell phone.

    —————-

    It’s not really that big of a deal to show the guy that your phone is a phone is it? I mean it’s not like we’re being strip searched to get into the stadium.

  102. mick January 31st, 2011 at 1:34 pm

    It’s not really that big of a deal to show the guy that your phone is a phone is it? I mean it’s not like we’re being strip searched to get into the stadium.
    ==================================
    I understand the reality of it. If someone wanted to get through them i would be easy enough and when that happens they will go airport on you.

  103. mick January 31st, 2011 at 1:35 pm

    If someone wanted to get through them i would
    ==============================
    it would

  104. SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 1:36 pm

    Joe,

    For the last year, the Wilpons have quietly shopped an interest to the team to perspective investors with no results.

    Once you go public, it gets risky these days.

    Mainly because, most people who now publicly state they are “interested” in buying the team fall into two categories:

    1. Grandstanders.
    2. Folks who may have the money but, aren’t willing to be passive investors.

    Fred Wilpon is a very respected man in NYC. His son? Not so much.

    With all the big money people Fred has access to, he was unable to find an investor willing to come on board on his terms.

    Now, with everything that’s happening, it’s going to be quite a challenge to find someone willing to do this deal in the way the Wilpons want it done.

    If it was me, I’d only do the deal if I can be the majority owner and I would give the Wilpons the right to buy my majority shares out, at a healthy profit, once the lawsuit is settled or disposed of in some manner.

    Giving a guy 200-250 million dollars, which still may not be enough to make the suit go away, and have little say in the investment, is not a good business deal, IMO.

    It would be much easier to find an investor willing to invest under Fred’s terms if he made the lawsuit go away ASAP.

  105. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:36 pm

    mick January 31st, 2011 at 1:34 pm
    It’s not really that big of a deal to show the guy that your phone is a phone is it? I mean it’s not like we’re being strip searched to get into the stadium.
    ==================================
    I understand the reality of it. If someone wanted to get through them i would be easy enough and when that happens they will go airport on you.

    ——————

    Agreed.

    Heck at Giants games I just put the cap to my water bottle in an inside pocket, walk the open water bottle through and then recap it.

    I’m just saying that in general these procedures are nothing to get in a twist over.

  106. Yankee Trader January 31st, 2011 at 1:39 pm

    Does anybody think that Punxsutawney Phil will predict on Groundhog Day this Wednesday, that Andy will announce he’s going to pitch for the NYY one more year?

  107. Bronx Jeers January 31st, 2011 at 1:40 pm

    What happens if the battery on my cell is dead?

    Am I denied entrance because I can’t prove my phone isn’t a bomb ?

    Has anybody even heard of a “cell phone bomb”? How about a wallet bomb ? A sandwich bomb?

    I understand tight security at Presidential conventions. But why is Yankee stadium the only place I’ve ever been to that makes me do these things?

  108. mick January 31st, 2011 at 1:41 pm

    I’m just saying that in general these procedures are nothing to get in a twist over.
    ==========================
    Tell that to Erica.
    Sounds like they did a number on her.
    Why harass a select few and not all?
    G-d forbid they profile.

  109. DocTodd January 31st, 2011 at 1:43 pm

    Tiger just can’t put it in the hole any longer…….maybe he has a problem with his putter??

  110. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:44 pm

    SJ -

    I would say that the level of respect for Fred around this town has dropped a bit.

    That said, this trustee is out of line with the suit. Unless he can prove that Freddy Coupons and Sterling Mets had direct knowledge of what Madoff was doing then there’s no way he should be liable for what others lost in the scheme.

    I understand why he’s doing it – getting money from Wilpon is easier than getting money from Madoff – let Wilpon sue Madoff later – but that doesn’t mean I agree with it.

  111. mick January 31st, 2011 at 1:44 pm

    Tiger just can’t put it in the hole any longer…….maybe he has a problem with his putter??
    ======================================
    My point.
    Has he lost his edge?
    Jeter has his Edge.

  112. GreenBeret7 January 31st, 2011 at 1:45 pm

    Yankee Trader January 31st, 2011 at 1:39 pm
    Does anybody think that Punxsutawney Phil will predict on Groundhog Day this Wednesday, that Andy will announce he’s going to pitch for the NYY one more year?

  113. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:46 pm

    Jeers all I can tell you is that if you don’t like the rules you’re welcome to stay home and watch the game on TV.

  114. Yankee Trader January 31st, 2011 at 1:46 pm

    Bronx Jeers-

    “Has anybody even heard of a cell phone bomb?”

    Yes!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjbRnmJrWIQ

  115. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 1:47 pm

    Mick -

    I’m not a cop but I profile.

    We all do to some extent.

  116. GreenBeret7 January 31st, 2011 at 1:48 pm

    Yankee Trader January 31st, 2011 at 1:39 pm
    Does anybody think that Punxsutawney Phil will predict on Groundhog Day this Wednesday, that Andy will announce he’s going to pitch for the NYY one more year?

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    I have very little faith that Punxsutawney Phil will ever improve. He doesn’t use a change-up shadow, and there is no depth. He is what he is…at best, a #3-#4 groundhog.

  117. mick January 31st, 2011 at 1:50 pm

    I’m not a cop but I profile.
    ==================
    Isn’t profiling just using your judgment?
    Why was Erica profiled?

  118. Yankee Trader January 31st, 2011 at 1:52 pm

    I have very little faith that Punxsutawney Phil will ever improve. He doesn’t use a change-up shadow, and there is no depth. He is what he is…at best, a #3-#4 groundhog.
    ——————————————————-
    GB7-

    At this point a #3 and/or a #4 would be a welcome addition! LOL!

    Star athlete with the biggest fall from grace- still going with O.J. Simpson.

  119. Betsy January 31st, 2011 at 1:54 pm

    I just don’t like the idea of going with another kid in the rotation when we already have a kid- the backend of the rotation for sure is going to be a bullpen killer.

    As to Jorge, Cash said under NO conditions is he catching, so unless there is an absolutely extreme emergency, I don’t see it. I feel for him a bit – I wouldn’t want to DH and I think Cash’s attitude that Jorge can’t catch at all is rather extreme just because he can’t catch 140 games.

  120. blake January 31st, 2011 at 1:56 pm

    Chip,

    Sorry I had to go work for a minute. But anyway….I can say pretty confidently that I would do that because 1) its the right thing to do 2) I would probably get off easier by not forcing a trial. Now if I were innocent I would fight tooth and nail to clear my name…..but if I were guilty and I knew it then I would just end the whole mess…..it would go away much faster and Id feel better about myself.

    SJ,

    Yea it will be interesting. I still think.Tiger has a 2nd act and I still think he’ll break Jack’s record…..his swing is just so out of whack right now……if he doesn’t have it together by the end of 2011 then may Ill change my mind. I do agree that competition is greater than maybe it ever has been due to the equipment and also the conditioning that more players are partaking in these days.

  121. Yankee Trader January 31st, 2011 at 1:57 pm

    As to Jorge, Cash said under NO conditions is he catching.

    —————————————————–

    Is that accurate? Didn’t he say to prepare in the offseason to be the DH?

  122. West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 1:58 pm

    It’s not a matter of profiling. New York City is a target and a packed stadium is certainly one. No security measures are foolproof but the appearance of tightened security it is believed may help to deter some efforts.

  123. Betsy January 31st, 2011 at 1:58 pm

    I would say OJ Simpson qualifies as the biggest fall from grace – the man killed two people.

    I love Andy, but he did use HGH, so he’s just not innocent. Roger has to do what he has to do for himself – if that means spilling the beans on Andy, so be it. He really brought this on himself, though, so I can’t feel sorry for Roger – and I was a huge fan of his. I mean, he likely had that affair with the babysitter as well. Its’ a shame because the guy was one of the greatest pitchers of all time and now look what’s happened to him

  124. Betsy January 31st, 2011 at 2:00 pm

    Yankee Trader, he didn’t actually say under No conditions, but Cash has made it as plain as the noses on all of our faces that Jorge isn’t going to catch….again, unless there is a dire emergency.

  125. mick January 31st, 2011 at 2:01 pm

    Why is the Hall of Fame even an issue anymore.
    Some of these guys belong in the Hall of Shame.
    The deeper Rocket gets into this the more harm he does.
    Yet guys like Arod will get in.
    It’s all in how you handle the damage. Damage control.

  126. Joe from Long Island January 31st, 2011 at 2:02 pm

    Chip – I’m no lawyer, but reading the NY Times’ story there’s a passage that indirectly deals with that issue.

    Like Madoff case, Sterling was involved in a ponzi scheme in the early 2000s’. Like with the Madoff case, Sterling withdrew their money before the scheme collapsed. Despite that, the investors who had lost their money came after Sterling, charging that they knew or should have known what was going on when they withdrew their money.

    Apparently, in cases like this, the burden of proof lies with the defendant to prove they acted in good faith. That appears to be the key thing. As SJ pointed out, it might be hard to do that when you’re returns are so out of line with the rest of the market.

    The judge then gave Sterling and Fred Wilpon a choice. Either settle the case with the other investors, or let a jury decide. Sterling opted to settle, handing over about half of their money (12.9M out of about 29M).

    So, there appears to be precedent, at least, for the Madoff trustee to come after the Sterling Equities and the Wilpons.

  127. Erica in NY January 31st, 2011 at 2:03 pm

    I graduated from a New York City public high school in 1998. (A pre-9/11 world).

    To enter my high school in the mid-90s, I had to go through more security than was at the airports at the time. This included punching my photo-ID in an acceptance machine, putting all belongings in an x-ray machine, walking through a metal detector, and getting frisked.

    The security guards didn’t care when you left school for the day, but you couldn’t re-enter. Seriously, I would see people walking out the front door and waving goodbye to security after first period.

    My senior year, they stopped allowing beverages in the building. There were no vending machines either. Apparently, they caught on that kids were putting alcohol in water bottles, so liquids of any kind were forbidden. Even if they were in clearly sealed containers.

    One day, a teacher asked me to pick up a giant sheet cake for her at a local bakery on my way into school. Security would not let me bring the cake into the front entrance without putting it through an x-ray machine. Apparently, I could have had the Sugar Bun baker bake a gun into the center of the cake.

    And this was just for high school…..

    So the moral of the story is……
    A little frisking doesn’t bother me :-)

  128. GreenBeret7 January 31st, 2011 at 2:04 pm

    Cashman never said that Posada wasn’t catching under no circumstance other than extreme emergeny. He said that he was the primary DH. Posada said that he was a catcher because that’s what he’s always been since he arrived. It’s no differnt from what Yogi Berra said near the end of his career. He played in left field more than he caught, but, still considered himself a catcher. Ellie Howard played left field but considered himself a catcher first. Johnny Bench spent a year at third base, but, considered himself a catcher. Fisk, in left field. Not a thing wrong with a player refusing to quit being what he’s always been. Posada has something else those just mentioned had…the desire to win and do whatever it takes to help the team win. He’d just prefer that it was catching and he will catch again. Call it ego or self-confidence, but, it’s pride in your ability to adapt and overcome.

  129. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 2:05 pm

    sj44-

    obviously tiger has lost a few key years off his career, and you are right that all the new young players are taking over the tour. there are lots of guys who can hit the ball with or well past tiger because they have grown up letting it rip.

    that said, tiger does have a strong competitive will inside. i’m rooting for him to get back to winning majors, but i agree it’ll be an uphill battle.

    the swing that kevin long is having jeter do with the no stride , lift up the front foot/step back down movement is kind of like the stack and tilt swing that tiger is using now. it does the same thing in eliminating moving parts and creating a more rotational swing.

    it’s going to take a lot of reps for jeter to get comfortable without striding. i think if he can do it , it’s a good swing for him. stride length is real hard to change though because it’s such a timing mechanism.

    it’s possible that jeter will not be able to do what long would like but will be able to tighten up the overly long stride he’s developed. but that’s something productive. it’ll be interesting to see how jeter does with the new swing.

    it’s going to be very easy even for the casual fan to see what he does with his front foot.

  130. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 2:07 pm

    Joe from Long Island January 31st, 2011 at 2:02 pm
    Chip – I’m no lawyer, but reading the NY Times’ story there’s a passage that indirectly deals with that issue.

    Like Madoff case, Sterling was involved in a ponzi scheme in the early 2000s’. Like with the Madoff case, Sterling withdrew their money before the scheme collapsed. Despite that, the investors who had lost their money came after Sterling, charging that they knew or should have known what was going on when they withdrew their money.

    Apparently, in cases like this, the burden of proof lies with the defendant to prove they acted in good faith. That appears to be the key thing. As SJ pointed out, it might be hard to do that when you’re returns are so out of line with the rest of the market.

    The judge then gave Sterling and Fred Wilpon a choice. Either settle the case with the other investors, or let a jury decide. Sterling opted to settle, handing over about half of their money (12.9M out of about 29M).

    So, there appears to be precedent, at least, for the Madoff trustee to come after the Sterling Equities and the Wilpons.

    ———————–

    I wasn’t aware of the backstory. Thanks.

  131. Yankee Trader January 31st, 2011 at 2:09 pm

    Erica-

    Attached are scenes when the Muppets visited Yankee Stadium. They didn’t have to remove their shoes when going thru security!!

    http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/Baseball

  132. mick January 31st, 2011 at 2:09 pm

    I never thought of that.
    Maybe they think it’s alcohol in the water bottle.
    I know they gave me a hard time about a samwich once.
    Don’t want to cut into their profit margin.

  133. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 2:10 pm

    blake January 31st, 2011 at 1:56 pm
    Chip,

    Sorry I had to go work for a minute. But anyway….I can say pretty confidently that I would do that because 1) its the right thing to do 2) I would probably get off easier by not forcing a trial. Now if I were innocent I would fight tooth and nail to clear my name…..but if I were guilty and I knew it then I would just end the whole mess…..it would go away much faster and Id feel better about myself.

    ————————–

    Then you are a very rare breed.

    In the end, there’s a difference between being found not guilty and being innocent. OJ was found not guilty but we all know he was far from innocent. Roger’s certainly not innocent of what he’s being charged with – but Rusty Hardin is going to use every trick in the bag to get them to find Clemens not guilty.

  134. Bronx Jeers January 31st, 2011 at 2:10 pm

    Yankee Trader,

    But that was a working phone! It would have passed security at the stadium ! :lol:

  135. Fran the original January 31st, 2011 at 2:10 pm

    Erica,
    It is still that way in NYC High Schools. Now they have to take their shoes off too.

  136. ConcernedCitizen January 31st, 2011 at 2:11 pm

    Tiger’s problem is summed up really well by this headline: http://failblog.files.wordpres.....dad62d.jpg

  137. jacksquat January 31st, 2011 at 2:11 pm

    Erica in NY January 31st, 2011 at 2:03 pm

    A little frisking doesn’t bother me

    Oh really? ;)

  138. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:11 pm

    “Pettitte better get ready, Rusty Hardin and his team are as good as they come and will not hesitate to try everything they can to destroy Pettitte’s credibility on the stand”

    Actually Andy’s credibility has held up really well and it’s Clemens that has taken the hit. That’s why Clemens was indicted by a federal grand jury and that’s also why Clemens was unable to get McNamee’s suit against him dismissed, while McNamee was able get Clemens defamation suit against him dismissed in a Houston court and the Houston federal court refused to reinstate it.

    Hardin is hardly looking good these days. But when you have that megalomaniac for a client, you do what he says. Roger’s biggest problem was that he thought his cachet was such that he was going to be able to bamboozle everyone with whom he came into contact. He lied from the beginning and never stopped, despite the fact that his stories were extremely transparent, embarrasingly so. He insisted on going on national television, despite his attorney’s recommendation to the contrary, and he insisted on testifying in front of Congress, despite the ranking Republican member telling Hardin that Roger did not have to testify, that it would be entirely voluntary, and that he needed to know that if he did testify, anything he said that was not truthful could be grounds for perjury. But Roger insisted.

    Then he did something that was a total aberration from congressional hearing policy. He decided to meet individually with the hearing members ahead of time, where those who agreed to meet with him and their staffs asked to have their pictures taken with him and asked for his autograph.

    He also sent his investigators to meet with McNamee before the hearings were held and had them secretly tape him, and then he called a press conference and played specially selected parts of the tape at the press conferece. Luckily McNamee’s attorney was able to have the entire tapes subpoaned and played, at which point it was obvious that what Clemens had played at the press conference was entirely misleading.

    I’m not thinking that Andy is going to take too much of a hit if he’s called upon to testify. What Andy has going for him is that he owned up to using HGH. At this point Roger’s word isn’t good for much.

    And oh yeah, one of the critical points had to do with a party at Canseco’s house where McNamee said the discussion about using steroids first came up. Clemens absolutely denied that he was even at the party. He was able to come up with a recepit from a golf course where he said he had played golf that day. And then someone who was at the party that day provided the feds with pictures that Clemens took with his kid at that very party.

    :)

    Oh what a tangled web we weave.

  139. Erica in NY January 31st, 2011 at 2:14 pm

    Yankee Trader January 31st, 2011 at 2:09 pm
    Erica-

    Attached are scenes when the Muppets visited Yankee Stadium. They didn’t have to remove their shoes when going thru security!!

    http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/Baseball
    ******************

    So cute.
    And umm.. how did I not know about that website?

  140. Erica in NY January 31st, 2011 at 2:15 pm

    Fran the original January 31st, 2011 at 2:10 pm
    Erica,
    It is still that way in NYC High Schools. Now they have to take their shoes off too.

    ***********

    Unbelieveable.

    I am surprised they aren’t up to strip searches yet

  141. Yankee Trader January 31st, 2011 at 2:16 pm

    Erica-

    I just googled Bert and Ernie go to Yankee Stadium! :)

  142. West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 2:16 pm

    trisha – true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:11 pm

    “Pettitte better get ready, Rusty Hardin and his team are as good as they come and will not hesitate to try everything they can to destroy Pettitte’s credibility on the stand”

    Actually Andy’s credibility has held up really well and it’s Clemens that has taken the hit.

    ***************************

    Andy Pettitte has not been on the stand yet where he will be cross-examined as a hostile witness by a very, very good defense team. His credibility has not been tested legally yet.

  143. 108 stitches January 31st, 2011 at 2:19 pm

    Making gazillions makes some feel bulletproof.

    Eldrick Woods and Roger Clemens are at the top of those that will never have the glare and respect they once did.

  144. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:19 pm

    I actually soured on Clemens when he said that he was retiring from baseball because his mother wasn’t well with her emphesyma and he wanted her in the front row when he went into the HOF because she was so instrumental in his getting where he got (she worked two jobs, one of them cleaning office buildings at night so that loser could have the equipment he needed to play baseball) – and then he decided not to retire. For that alone I hope he burns in hell.

  145. Erica in NY January 31st, 2011 at 2:20 pm

    Yankee Trader January 31st, 2011 at 2:16 pm
    Erica-

    I just googled Bert and Ernie go to Yankee Stadium!

    ******************

    There is an old Sesame Street clip of Ernie playing baseball. He hit the ball hard and broke a window.

    The Yankees should look into his asking price!

  146. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 2:20 pm

    West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 2:16 pm
    trisha – true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:11 pm

    “Pettitte better get ready, Rusty Hardin and his team are as good as they come and will not hesitate to try everything they can to destroy Pettitte’s credibility on the stand”

    Actually Andy’s credibility has held up really well and it’s Clemens that has taken the hit.

    ***************************

    Andy Pettitte has not been on the stand yet where he will be cross-examined as a hostile witness by a very, very good defense team. His credibility has not been tested legally yet.

    ——————————

    And again – we don’t know what dirt Roger has given Hardin about Andy.

  147. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 2:21 pm

    trisha – true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:19 pm
    I actually soured on Clemens when he said that he was retiring from baseball because his mother wasn’t well with her emphesyma and he wanted her in the front row when he went into the HOF because she was so instrumental in his getting where he got (she worked two jobs, one of them cleaning office buildings at night so that loser could have the equipment he needed to play baseball) – and then he decided not to retire. For that alone I hope he burns in hell.

    ———————————–

    He ain’t the first guy and won’t be the last guy to change his mind about retiring.

  148. mick January 31st, 2011 at 2:22 pm

    Who cares what Clemens has on Andy?
    Who believes a word he says?

  149. GreenBeret7 January 31st, 2011 at 2:23 pm

    Erica in NY January 31st, 2011 at 2:20 pm
    Yankee Trader January 31st, 2011 at 2:16 pm
    Erica-

    I just googled Bert and Ernie go to Yankee Stadium!

    ******************

    There is an old Sesame Street clip of Ernie playing baseball. He hit the ball hard and broke a window.

    The Yankees should look into his asking price!

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    The Yankees don’t need offense. They need pitching. Look into Big Bird. I hear that he can really “wing it”.

  150. Erica in NY January 31st, 2011 at 2:24 pm

    GreenBeret7 January 31st, 2011 at 2:23 pm

    The Yankees don’t need offense. They need pitching. Look into Big Bird. I hear that he can really “wing it”.

    ************

    :shakeshead:

  151. mick January 31st, 2011 at 2:24 pm

    Isn’t there some kind of Fonzie Scheme going on that will effect the Mets?

  152. West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 2:25 pm

    It’s not about what Clemens says personally about Andy, it’s about Clemens defense team trying to impugn Pettitte’s credibility. You can be assured they have hired numerous private investigators and spared no expense to try and do so.

  153. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:25 pm

    “Andy Pettitte has not been on the stand yet where he will be cross-examined as a hostile witness by a very, very good defense team. His credibility has not been tested legally yet.”

    Seriously? Tell you what. If you can sit in a Congressional hearing, on national television, and be treated like a hostile witness by the republican contingency and hold your own, which Andy did, I have no fear about what a castrated Hardin is going to be able to do.

    By the way, his credibility has been entirely tested legally since he was sworn in when he testified in front of the Congressional committee.

    If it comes to a question of a jury or a judge having to decide to believe the testimony of Pettitte or Clemens, when the entirety of the trial is over, Clemens is going to have a difficult time since he is the one who was indicted for perjury by a federal grand jury, and all of the information that has been obtained since that time (his DNA on the syringes, the pictures of Clemens at the party he said he wasn’t at), it isn’t going to much matter how hard Hardin goes at Pettitte. Pettitte isn’t on trial, Clemens is.

  154. GreenBeret7 January 31st, 2011 at 2:26 pm

    Oh, come on, Erica. You know that you’re sitting there giggling. It’s not even the worst pun on here.

  155. mick January 31st, 2011 at 2:27 pm

    Good luck impugning Andy’s credibility.
    Sounds like a losing battle.

  156. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 2:28 pm

    “Oh what a tangled web we weave.”

    that’s true, but anyone who doesn’t think mcnamee is scum isn’t paying attention.

    personally i think the sooner this whole thing is in the rear view mirror the better.

    unfortunately, the rest of the story going to have to go through it’s news cycle.

    we’ll be talking about it.

    i do however look forward to murphydog’s take on it.
    anything that gets him on the blog is a plus.

  157. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 2:28 pm

    trisha – true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:25 pm
    “Andy Pettitte has not been on the stand yet where he will be cross-examined as a hostile witness by a very, very good defense team. His credibility has not been tested legally yet.”

    Seriously? Tell you what. If you can sit in a Congressional hearing, on national television, and be treated like a hostile witness by the republican contingency and hold your own, which Andy did, I have no fear about what a castrated Hardin is going to be able to do.

    By the way, his credibility has been entirely tested legally since he was sworn in when he testified in front of the Congressional committee.

    If it comes to a question of a jury or a judge having to decide to believe the testimony of Pettitte or Clemens, when the entirety of the trial is over, Clemens is going to have a difficult time since he is the one who was indicted for perjury by a federal grand jury, and all of the information that has been obtained since that time (his DNA on the syringes, the pictures of Clemens at the party he said he wasn’t at), it isn’t going to much matter how hard Hardin goes at Pettitte. Pettitte isn’t on trial, Clemens is.

    ———————-

    The good news for Roger in all of this is that the Jury is not likely one that will be made up entirely of Yankee fans.

  158. mick January 31st, 2011 at 2:28 pm

    Hardin is a tool.
    He’s just in it for the money.
    Clemens is a bigger fool to use him.

  159. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:29 pm

    Chip, I hate to tell ya, but there is no good news waiting for Roger.

  160. mick January 31st, 2011 at 2:30 pm

    Met fans should be happy about Wilpon selling the team.

  161. Erica in NY January 31st, 2011 at 2:30 pm

    GreenBeret7 January 31st, 2011 at 2:26 pm
    Oh, come on, Erica. You know that you’re sitting there giggling. It’s not even the worst pun on here.

    *************

    True. I am pretty sure I have seen worse.

    Speaking of muppets, where is my younger twin Erin?

  162. GreenBeret7 January 31st, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    I’m betting that this hearing/trial doesn’t even take place until November…after the elections take place.

  163. SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    It’s not in Clemens best interests to have Andy and his wife testify.

    They DO come across as credible witnesses. Much more credible than Roger at this point.

    Anybody who watched Andy’s PC, or watch how he beats himself up, will see him as a credible witness.

    Even good people make mistakes. Juries are forgiving of that behavior.

    Taking an arrogant, scorched earth policy? Juries tend to look less favorably at that kind of behavior.

    In addition, there is a question as to whether or not Hardin and/or members of his team, can cross-examine Andy because of the time he represented Andy on this and other matters.

    The smart move for Rogwr would be to plea this out. Going forward to a trial is a very risky proposition at this time, IMO.

  164. yankeefeminista January 31st, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    Bronx Jeers January 31st, 2011 at 1:25 pm
    # randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 12:57 pm

    “I would like to know who’s idea it was to check your cell phone as you enter the stadium.”

    bronx jeers-

    they actually make people do that?

    ———————————————————————————————————————–

    They’ve been doing that for maybe 5 years now. They even want you to turn it on. I once asked why and was told that they wanted to ensure that the phone is not a flask. Ridiculous.

    The security there generally takes an uber-wannabe cop attitude.

    You also have to take off your hat which isn’t that big of a deal but I’ve also been frisked, asked to raise my shirt and empty my pockets.

    I’ve probably been to about a dozen MLB stadiums. Yankee stadium has by far the worst staff. Maybe it’s a New York thing.
    ______
    Yanks do not take your cell phone; they only ask you to have it on and show it, so they “check” it, meaning they look at it. If it is off and in your pocket, they don’t bother. Only if they see it.

    They only make you take your hat off once in a great while these days. For a Red Sox game or playoff game, maybe. But not usually.

    They are much more lenient in the new Stadium. Any kind of beverage can be brought in and unlike at the Meadowlands, you should have it capped. They used to actually not let you bring in beverages unless they were unopened, but seemed to care less about that in 2010. You can basically bring in whatever you like except not in glass bottles. You can also bring in food.

    They search bags, but not very closely. And especially if you go close to game time. It is only when you get there early and there is no crowd yet, that they take their time searching you.

    The new ushers/attendants at new Stadium are *very* nice and solicitous, not like the old place. They also smile a lot. A little too much sometimes, but it beats the old grouches at OYS. NYS is generally very customer friendly. They obviously worked on their bedside manner once they crossed the street from OYS to NYS.

  165. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    mick, Hardin knows he has no case. But he is making huge bucks defending this clown. He couldn’t even get Clemens defamation case against McNamee heard in a Houston court!

  166. austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 2:32 pm

    86w183,

    As an old trial lawyer, I agree with you on your Pettitte testimony take. Clemens lawyer will only hurt himself if he has a jury believe Pettitte, Clemen’s good buddy, was a regular PED user.

    I believe Pettitte’s hesitation is health and durability concerns he has. If he has them, the Yankees do as well.

  167. blake January 31st, 2011 at 2:34 pm

    Chip,

    Im not really I don’t think….Clemens is going to lose without a serious rabbit out of the hat move by his attorney. He then will go to jail, be blackballed from baseball, and be the punchline in many jokes. If he just called the whole mess off and admitted it then he would likely receive a lesser punishment and earn a dab of respect in the process. Unless he’s innocent or actually has a good gameplan to win then it would actually be smarter to just admit it and let it be done with.

  168. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 2:34 pm

    Look – it’s the way things go. McNamee and Radomski are in trouble so they sell out guys like Clemens. Clemens is in trouble so he’s going to sell out Andy. Who knows who Andy’s going to sell out.

  169. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:34 pm

    “The smart move for Rogwr would be to plea this out. Going forward to a trial is a very risky proposition at this time, IMO.”

    Not a question. In good ole Roger fashion, he seems hell bent to have his day in court. But as the time comes closer, maybe he’ll listen to reason seeing the evidence against him is overwhelming if not air tight. If he takes a plea, you know he will say he is innocent but he didn’t want to drag his family through it

  170. mick January 31st, 2011 at 2:34 pm

    from what remember about hardin he seemed like a real goober

  171. G. Love January 31st, 2011 at 2:35 pm

    Could it at all be possible the the Yankees and Andy Pettitte are playing some kind of game to skirt the luxury tax and not announce his signing until after opening day so it doesn’t affect this years payroll like the Red Sox are rumored to be doing with Gonzalez’s extension?

    I mean, could the Yankees allow him to skip spring training and he trains himself at home and shows up in late April at Yankee Stadium after a couple of tune up starts in the minors?

  172. West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 2:35 pm

    Pettitte was not cross examined in Congress as a hostile witness. This is an entirely different situation. If Andy is telling the truth he has nothing to worry about. If he hasn’t told the truth and Hardin can prove it, he’s in some trouble if he lies under oath.

  173. GreenBeret7 January 31st, 2011 at 2:35 pm

    Erica in NY January 31st, 2011 at 2:30 pm
    GreenBeret7 January 31st, 2011 at 2:26 pm
    Oh, come on, Erica. You know that you’re sitting there giggling. It’s not even the worst pun on here.

    *************

    True. I am pretty sure I have seen worse.

    Speaking of muppets, where is my younger twin Erin?

    ———————————————————————————————————————-

    Not sure. She was on briefly yesterday. Maybe she’s getting into her Irish mode with St. Patty’s day coming up fast. “Erin Goes Braghless”?

  174. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 2:35 pm

    GreenBeret7 January 31st, 2011 at 2:31 pm
    I’m betting that this hearing/trial doesn’t even take place until November…after the elections take place.

    ————————

    No elections this year. Did you mean November 2012?

  175. mick January 31st, 2011 at 2:36 pm

    what does clemens have on andy?
    that he;s as big a douchbag as he is?
    what are ya talkin about?

  176. austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 2:37 pm

    Trisha and Nick,

    Rusty Hardin is a very capable lawyer. Don’t let his country boy ways fool you. He has successfully defended some very big criminal cases.

    As a lawyer, I reject any idea he is riding this case for the money. Clemens is pushing this case. His legacy, as well as lots of endorsement money over the rest of his life, depends upon him winning the case. A lawyer who has a client who wants a trial, needs to give him one once he has taken on the case. We certainly have no idea what advice is being given and rejected.

  177. SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 2:37 pm

    You can hire all the PI’s you want. Most of any “dirt” they could dig up would be inadmissible at trial.

    Unless they can provide evidence Andy was untruthful in his testimony, they can’t burn the guy.

    Even Clemens himself has not said Andy is lying. He’s just saying he “misremembered”.

    Randy is right, McNamee is pure scum. For my money, he’s less likable than Roger.

    I like Roger Clemens. To me, having a big ego is not a crime.

    He’s a good guy, given a ton to charity, and has lived a pretty solid life.

    Unfortunately though, he’s gotten himself into a real jackpot.

    Finding a positive solution to this mess is not going to be easy.

  178. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 2:38 pm

    blake January 31st, 2011 at 2:34 pm
    Chip,

    Im not really I don’t think….Clemens is going to lose without a serious rabbit out of the hat move by his attorney. He then will go to jail, be blackballed from baseball, and be the punchline in many jokes. If he just called the whole mess off and admitted it then he would likely receive a lesser punishment and earn a dab of respect in the process. Unless he’s innocent or actually has a good gameplan to win then it would actually be smarter to just admit it and let it be done with.

    ———————

    Blake -

    I’m going to reserve judgement until I know what Roger has on Andy. Seriously, the guy might be the nicest person in the world but then again he could also be a tremendous scumbag with a lot of skeletons who is just really good at putting on a good public image. We just don’t know.

  179. austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 2:39 pm

    Make that Mick and not Nick as addressee.

  180. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:39 pm

    “Clemens is in trouble so he’s going to sell out Andy.”

    Andy already admitted to using HGH. There’s nothing to sell out.

  181. mick January 31st, 2011 at 2:40 pm

    Clemens will never regain his legacy.
    His endorsements are done forever.
    Sure Hardin will take his case and Roger is pushing it, why wouldn’t he, it’s easy money, win or lose.

  182. West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 2:41 pm

    It depends, it would be admissible if it goes to Pettitte’s credibility, namely whether he was telling the truth or not, and, whether or not he should be believed.

  183. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 2:42 pm

    SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 2:37 pm
    You can hire all the PI’s you want. Most of any “dirt” they could dig up would be inadmissible at trial.

    Unless they can provide evidence Andy was untruthful in his testimony, they can’t burn the guy.

    Even Clemens himself has not said Andy is lying. He’s just saying he “misremembered”.

    Randy is right, McNamee is pure scum. For my money, he’s less likable than Roger.

    I like Roger Clemens. To me, having a big ego is not a crime.

    He’s a good guy, given a ton to charity, and has lived a pretty solid life.

    Unfortunately though, he’s gotten himself into a real jackpot.

    Finding a positive solution to this mess is not going to be easy.

    ———————–

    That’s not exactly true.

    In a case like this Hardin can discredit any public statements Andy has made on steroids or any other topic to challenge his credibility.

    For example, if Andy said in some NY Post article that he’s a good family man.

    Hardin, “well Mr. Pettitte, if you’re a good family man then what are you doing in these pictures taken of you and 28 hookers at a pool in Las Vegas”

    Andy, “I only took HGH those two times”

    Hardin, “really Mr. Pettitte, you sure it wasn’t more like 50 times as our rebuttal witness will testify to?”

    Hardin, “And if you’re not able to give us truthful statements about that – then how can we be so sure you were correct in your previous testimony against my client”

  184. mick January 31st, 2011 at 2:43 pm

    I don’t think Hardin thinks he can win this case and doesn’t care either, win or lose, he wins, Roger loses.

  185. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 2:43 pm

    trisha – true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:39 pm
    “Clemens is in trouble so he’s going to sell out Andy.”

    Andy already admitted to using HGH. There’s nothing to sell out.

    ———————-

    Again – that’s a heck of an assumption.

  186. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:44 pm

    austinmac, you probably know that both SJ and I are also attorneys. I’ve followed this from jump street. Clemens has been caught in lie after lie after lie, the first one being that he knew nothing about Mitchell wanting to talk to him, after his attorneys said they had received communications from Mitchell and passed them on to Clemens. He’s been indicted by a federal grand jury for perjury. They have resounding evidence against him. I’m not worried at all for Andy.

  187. austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 2:44 pm

    Mick,

    I would say this is far from “easy money”. Plentiful, but not easy. It is his job to represent people who need it. I expect Clemens is a very difficult client who doesn’t want to listen to anyone.

  188. mick January 31st, 2011 at 2:44 pm

    Hardin, “well Mr. Pettitte, if you’re a good family man then what are you doing in these pictures taken of you and 28 hookers at a pool in Las Vegas”
    ==================================
    Prove they’re all hookers.

  189. mick January 31st, 2011 at 2:45 pm

    Mac

    Depends on your definition of “easy.”

  190. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:45 pm

    Actually since Andy is not the one on trial the only questions Hardin can ask will be to the extent of what the prosecution asks and what Andy has already said at a legal hearing.

  191. SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 2:46 pm

    Clemens ismpushing the case, not Rusty.

    Rusty doesn’t need the money. He’s got a ton of cash.

    I don’t think there is any question it’s Roger who is pushing this thing along.

    Rusty is just doing his job.

    West Coast,

    If Andy Pettitte was lying to Congress, he would be facing the same charges Roger is facing right now.

    Don’t think for a minute that Jeff Novitsky didn’t check every word of Andy’s testimony for any lies.

    It would be a feather in his cap to indict a Yankee on perjury charges.

    Having spent the multiple of millions of dollars of taxpayer money he spent on these cases, the more indictments he could bring makes him look better.

    Andy told the truth and that’s why Roger is in the jackpot he’s in.

  192. GreenBeret7 January 31st, 2011 at 2:46 pm

    Swisher is selling himself and taking bids on EBay.

    http://stores.ebay.com/TwitCha.....34.c0.m322

  193. blake January 31st, 2011 at 2:48 pm

    I think the whole thing Clemens trying to protect his legacy….he’s holding on frying to salvage it any way he can. I can understand that in a way because I don’t think its fair to torch all of his accomplishments because he took PEDs…..the problem is the perception that if you took steroids then you would have stunk without them and that’s just not the case.

    His stubbornness got him in to this mess…..only telling the truth will get him out of it.

  194. Bronx Jeers January 31st, 2011 at 2:49 pm

    I think Clemen’s team will knock Pettitte out pretty early.

    All they have to do is ask him if he’s 100% positive he remembers exactly what Clemens said to him in 1999.

    In his deposition he pretty much alludes to the fact that it’s possible he didn’t remember correctly.

    One thing he will be grilled about is McNamee. The only time McNamee mentioned Clemens taking steroids to Andy is when McNamee was angry with Roger about wanting to get paid for endorsing a vitamin company McNamee was working with.

    I think that’s the defense’s plan. McNamee did this to either get back at Roger over $$ or that he did it to extort Clemens.

    And I agree Hardin’s only in this for the money. What lawyer in their right mind is going to let their client testify in front of Congress?

  195. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:49 pm

    mick, I’m with you. This is all over except for the crying.

    **********

    SJ, why would you call McNamee a scumbag and Clemens a good guy? McNamee was going to jail if he didn’t cooperate. Clemens was the one who started with the dirty pool, including secretly taping McNamee and then redacting the parts of the tape he didn’t want the press to hear. McNamee was the one who supplied the steroids, at Clemens request, but that doesn’t make Roger a choir boy. Roger is all about Roger as far as I’m concerned. He even threw his own wife under the bus at the Congressional hearings. And tried to taint the jury pool ahead of time. I think he’s total scum.

  196. austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 2:50 pm

    Trisha,

    Clemens is what he is. He believed he could scare his trainer, clear his name and be a tough guy. Intimidation doesn’t work as well off the pitcher’s mound.

    I am not defending Clemens, but he is entitled to a good lawyer and Hardin is one. I agree it very tough. Thus, my comment this is far from easy money. We lawyers don’t like to lose and will invest very much of ourselves, as I am sure you well know.

  197. West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 2:51 pm

    Clemens will defend himself two ways. First of all, he will question the veracity of McNamee’s evidence, attack his background, and I am sure question the DNA, storage of needles, etc. Secondly, he will challenge Pettitte’s testimony that he told him he used Human Growth Hormone. His attorney’s will suggest that Pettitte misremembered the conversation and that Clemens was joking.

    They are just seeking reasonable doubt; all it takes is one juror.

  198. SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 2:51 pm

    Chip,

    None of that would be admissible.

    The only relevant testimony would be involving the testimony Andy has already given.

    Here’s how I know Andy is in the clear…….

    If they had a “smoking gun” on Andy, it would have already been leaked by the Clemens people right now to attempt to poison the possible jury pool.

    Rusty Hardin is no dummy. He knows Andy will come across as a believable witness.

    He also knows any attempt to smear him or Laura will backfire on him bigtime.

    It’s why I believe he’s probably trying to get Rogwr to realize going after Andy and Laura is a failed strategy.

    That would probably insure his conviction.

  199. blake January 31st, 2011 at 2:52 pm

    Trisha,

    Im not an attorney so you would know better than I but what strategy could Clemens have other than trying to discredit the witness (Pettite). I just don’t see where they are going with this….isn’t it going to be like trying to prove the sky isn’t blue? All the evidence is against him.

  200. austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 2:52 pm

    No lawyer can stop a client from doing anything. He can advise. Is it really inconsistent with your vision of Clemens that he is likely a bull-headed, thoughtless client?

  201. 108 stitches January 31st, 2011 at 2:52 pm

    It’s doubtful that Suzyn Waldman cares to get in a discussion about anything to do with Clemens.
    All the money Clemens made in his last prorated contract with the Yankees has gone to Rusty Hardin.

  202. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 2:52 pm

    SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 2:46 pm
    Clemens ismpushing the case, not Rusty.

    Rusty doesn’t need the money. He’s got a ton of cash.

    I don’t think there is any question it’s Roger who is pushing this thing along.

    Rusty is just doing his job.

    West Coast,

    If Andy Pettitte was lying to Congress, he would be facing the same charges Roger is facing right now.

    Don’t think for a minute that Jeff Novitsky didn’t check every word of Andy’s testimony for any lies.

    It would be a feather in his cap to indict a Yankee on perjury charges.

    Having spent the multiple of millions of dollars of taxpayer money he spent on these cases, the more indictments he could bring makes him look better.

    Andy told the truth and that’s why Roger is in the jackpot he’s in.

    ——————————–

    Remember – Roger never accused Andy of lying to Congress. He said Andy “misrememberd” that’s a huge difference.

    All Hardin has to do is push Andy hard enough for Andy to sit up there and say, “you know what, Rog maybe was right, I may have confused some details when I spoke to Congress.”

    That’s not perjury – at least not definitively enough to prove a case.

  203. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 2:52 pm

    “The smart move for Rogwr would be to plea this out.”

    i agree.

    it would bring a rapid end to the feeding frenzy and media circus that this will no doubt become .

    it would also allow clemens the chance to apologize publicly to everyone he needs to and have a one time press conference.

  204. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:53 pm

    SJ is right on the money. Clemens has been pushing this from the beginning. He did mostly everything against advice of attorney. And Novitsky is no novice.

    “In his deposition he pretty much alludes to the fact that it’s possible he didn’t remember correctly”

    Jeers, in his deposition he said he went home and told his wife exactly what Roger said to him and his wife has corroborated the fact. If they don’t remember the exact date it happened, that is no big whoop. That it happened is the whoop. Andy and his wife are saying it happened (his wife by way of hearing it from Andy), Roger is saying he misremembered.

  205. mick January 31st, 2011 at 2:54 pm

    Rose, Rocket, Palmiero.
    I won’t say McGwire because he didn’t adamantly lie, he denied.
    People hate adamant liars.
    And if they think you are lying then you are lying.
    Guilty to proven innocent and they never are.
    Even OJ isn’t viewed as badly as bold face liars, that are perceived to be lying.
    Those legacies will never be restored.

  206. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 2:56 pm

    SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 2:51 pm
    Chip,

    None of that would be admissible.

    The only relevant testimony would be involving the testimony Andy has already given.

    Here’s how I know Andy is in the clear…….

    If they had a “smoking gun” on Andy, it would have already been leaked by the Clemens people right now to attempt to poison the possible jury pool.

    Rusty Hardin is no dummy. He knows Andy will come across as a believable witness.

    He also knows any attempt to smear him or Laura will backfire on him bigtime.

    It’s why I believe he’s probably trying to get Rogwr to realize going after Andy and Laura is a failed strategy.

    That would probably insure his conviction.

    ————————

    It’s absolutely admissable because if Hardin can prove that Andy lied or “misremembered” when giving public statement A then that calls into question whether he may have lied about statement B. It’s about a pattern of behavior and lawyers do it all the time to impune witnesses.

    And I think the way you’re describing Andy and his wife you sound as if you believe the jury will be made up of baseball fans – and while one or two of them may in fact be baseball fans I would wager there will be people on that jury who have, if any, simply a passing knowledge of who Andy is and not any clue as to the kind of person his public personal suggests that he is.

  207. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 2:56 pm

    I also think Blake has it totally correct. Clemens is trying to protect his legacy and he is in so deep now it is probably impossible for him to get out.

    The other thing is his personality. I don’t see him as the kind of person who is going to back down and admit he lied. His whole persona is based upon his pitching prowess. To say he took steroids would be to call his whole career a lie – if you see what I’m saying.

  208. West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 2:58 pm

    It’s the justice system, hello! All you need is one juror. Since when does the truth even matter? Just look at the innocent people who have been executed or exonerated on death row.

  209. SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 2:59 pm

    Trisha,

    I know McNamee a bit. He’s a worm.

    A lot of people tried to warn Roger about disassociating himself with him. Including some present Yankee players.

    He was groupie than fitness guru. A guy you always had an uneasy feeling about if you know what I mean.

    Here is the way I look at it…………

    He could have been more like Greg Anderson, and be a stand up guy, if he really cared about Clemens and his family.

    Barry Bonds is the scumbags, scumbag. Yet, he had a guy who engendered that kind kind of loyalty.

    Let’s be candid……this is not about covering up a murder. It’s about PED use in sports. Not exactly, “groundbreaking” stuff.

    McNamee kept those needles to use as blackmail in case Roger dumped.

    Chain of custody issues alone make it dicey that he did it to protect himself legally. It was more blackmail than anything else.

    Roger is certainly no saint. Hover, McNamee is neither a “Norma Rae” type whistleblower, nor victim in this case.

    He’s a worm.

  210. Yankee Trader January 31st, 2011 at 3:00 pm

    Would Andy Pettitte settle for Hiroki Kuroda money?

    http://mlbbuzz.yardbarker.com/....._post=true

    Could Andy’s deal be structured and announced in such a way to minimize the 40% additional hit in luxury tax? 6M 2011 salary with a club option for 2012 with a buyout of 7-8M??

  211. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 3:00 pm

    Andy and his wife will come across as much more credible witnesses than Clemens. They are who they are. I don’t think you need to be a baseball fan to decide that Andy is entirely believable and Clemens is a blowhard. That isn’t going to change in court. Again, this is a trial against Clemens and the evidence is overwhelming. Andy is a bit player in this. McNamee is the one with the plethora of information.

  212. austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 3:00 pm

    I have never been a criminal defense attorney, but I do agree that convictions are rarely sure things. If Pettitte were to say maybe I heard wrong and I just reiterated to my wife my mishearing, Pettitte’s value as a witness would be minimal.

    Ultimately, it will be the physical evidence or lack of it that will tell the tale.

  213. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 3:03 pm

    “It’s the justice system, hello! All you need is one juror. Since when does the truth even matter? Just look at the innocent people who have been executed or exonerated on death row.”

    :D

    No juror wants to look like a fool in front of the entire country. Again, the evidence is overwhelming. They have the glossies. Case closed.

  214. austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 3:05 pm

    Chip,

    I assure you Andy having a photo with women, whether hookers or not, is not admissible. End of that story.

  215. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 3:05 pm

    trisha – true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 3:03 pm
    “It’s the justice system, hello! All you need is one juror. Since when does the truth even matter? Just look at the innocent people who have been executed or exonerated on death row.”

    No juror wants to look like a fool in front of the entire country. Again, the evidence is overwhelming. They have the glossies. Case closed.

    ————————

    Um…they had more on OJ

  216. mick January 31st, 2011 at 3:06 pm

    how can clemens ever regain his legacy?
    that is gone forever….win or lose, he looks bad.

  217. SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 3:06 pm

    I don’t think the case will ever go to trial.

  218. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 3:06 pm

    austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 3:05 pm
    Chip,

    I assure you Andy having a photo with women, whether hookers or not, is not admissible. End of that story.

    ——————

    If it impunes a statement Andy made about being a great family man and never cheating on his wife then yes it is – for the simple reason that if he lied about this he may have lied about that.

  219. mick January 31st, 2011 at 3:07 pm

    a photo with a woman means he slept with her?
    really now..

  220. Bronx Jeers January 31st, 2011 at 3:08 pm

    True about his wife Trisha but he does admit, three times in fact, that he misunderstood the phone call in 99′

    I have a question though.

    Did Hardin/Clemens see Andy’s deposition before the hearing?

  221. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 3:08 pm

    SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 3:06 pm
    I don’t think the case will ever go to trial.

    ————–

    I don’t know – Roger doesn’t strike me as the type to go this far and then settle.

  222. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 3:08 pm

    “Roger is certainly no saint. Hover, McNamee is neither a “Norma Rae” type whistleblower, nor victim in this case.

    He’s a worm.”

    mc namee was lucky he wasn’t arrested for rape with that incident of the unconscious woman in the pool at the yankees hotel. this is one of those cases where almost everyone is trying hide something.

    even the feds could be exposed into some illegal activity if they have to tesify.

    with all the problems this country has and the lack of resources, the best thing for everyone would be for roger to come clean and have everyone move on asap.

    probably not going to happen though.

  223. mick January 31st, 2011 at 3:09 pm

    time to change the subject but what do I know…I’m not a lawyer and proud of it.

  224. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 3:09 pm

    mick January 31st, 2011 at 3:07 pm
    a photo with a woman means he slept with her?
    really now..

    —————–

    Well again – I was using it as a hypothetical. But for the sake of argument say they do have some evidence Andy cheated on Laura.

  225. austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 3:10 pm

    Trisha,

    As a lawyer, don’t you think it might be better to decide guilt after the evidence? I bet their is a lot of evidence, one way or the other, we don’t know about. Their may be other pieces of evidence we have heard about that are inadmissible.

    I will wait to see what happens rather than pre-judging without all the facts.

    If that sounded like a grade school lecture, I apologize, but I really do believe in this system in which I have spent the last 35 years of my life.

  226. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 3:11 pm

    mick January 31st, 2011 at 3:09 pm
    time to change the subject but what do I know…I’m not a lawyer and proud of it.

    —————–

    Yeah but if you needed a lawyer you would want one just like Hardin

  227. mick January 31st, 2011 at 3:12 pm

    i told you my opinion of hardin, not my kinda guy

  228. SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 3:13 pm

    Chip,

    AUstinov is right, that would be inadmissible.

    It’s not TV, that example isn’t how one goes to attack the credibility of a witness.

    To attack the credibility of the witness, it would be more in line of Hardin introducing evidence of Andy’s PED use outside of what he testified to to Congress.

    Trust me, Rusty isn’t opening the door to personal indiscretions. That won’t be beneficial to Roger! lol

  229. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 3:13 pm

    austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 3:10 pm
    Trisha,

    As a lawyer, don’t you think it might be better to decide guilt after the evidence? I bet their is a lot of evidence, one way or the other, we don’t know about. Their may be other pieces of evidence we have heard about that are inadmissible.

    I will wait to see what happens rather than pre-judging without all the facts.

    If that sounded like a grade school lecture, I apologize, but I really do believe in this system in which I have spent the last 35 years of my life.

    ———————

    I think there are going to be a lot of issues with McNamee’s syringes – if for no other reason than that it seems unlikely that he kept Roger’s needles and no one else’s and how were they stored etc…

    As I said – the evidence against OJ was a lot more compelling and he got off so forgive me if I don’t start fitting Clemens for his Club Fed jumpsuit just yet.

  230. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 3:14 pm

    austinmac, I think we all know that Pettitte isn”t going to change his testimony.

    Do you all remember what this case is about? It’s a perjury case. Lying to Congress. Andy’s testimony isn’t what cracked the case. It helped move it along, but it was all of the discrepancies they found in Clemens testimony that sealed it. Even the ranking republican member had to “reluctantly” agree to send it to a grand jury. That’s how egregious his story-telling was.

    This is about whether Clemens lied to a grand jury. Clemens said he was not at a party at Canseco’s house. He whipped out a receipt from a golf course as his proof. Then the prosecution got their hands on pictures that Clemens took with some kid at the party, plus they have the tesimony of his maid, who said he was there. They call that lying. And that particular lie went to the heart of the matter since it was at that party that McNamee said Clemens questioning using steroids first came up.

    **************

    SJ I don’t know McNamee, but I do know that he didn’t give up the information willingly. No he isn’t a Norma Rae whistleblower. He’s someone who used the “get out of jail free” card and gave up Clemens in the process.

  231. SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 3:15 pm

    Austinmac….sorry for the typo.

  232. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 3:16 pm

    “McNamee is the one with the plethora of information.”

    trisha-

    you don’t seriously think mcnamee is a good guy in this do you?

    i assume you believe he’s a bad guy telling the truth because he got a deal from the feds.

  233. mick January 31st, 2011 at 3:16 pm

    Mike seems real worried about the outcome of this Mets fiasco.
    Making a big story out of it.
    Wonder why?
    Did he lose $$$ to Madoff?

  234. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 3:17 pm

    SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 3:13 pm
    Chip,

    AUstinov is right, that would be inadmissible.

    It’s not TV, that example isn’t how one goes to attack the credibility of a witness.

    To attack the credibility of the witness, it would be more in line of Hardin introducing evidence of Andy’s PED use outside of what he testified to to Congress.

    Trust me, Rusty isn’t opening the door to personal indiscretions. That won’t be beneficial to Roger! lol

    ————————

    SJ -

    I hear where you’re coming from but I don’t think Rusty or Roger care about opening the personal indiscretion door…better to be embarassed than imprisoned.

    Again, this is all speculation – let’s wait and see how it plays out. I just have a feeling there are a lot of laundry Andy would rather not have aired in public by Roger.

  235. Yankee Trader January 31st, 2011 at 3:18 pm

    Changing the subject. From MLBTR-

    I’d like an opinion.

    Would Andy Pettitte settle for Hiroki Kuroda money?

    http://mlbbuzz.yardbarker.com/….._post=true

    Could Andy’s deal be structured and announced in such a way to minimize the 40% additional hit in luxury tax? 6M 2011 salary with a club option for 2012 with a buyout of 7-8M??

  236. blake January 31st, 2011 at 3:18 pm

    SJ,

    that would make the most sense…..but for it not to go to trial wouldn’t Clemens have to admit in some way that he lied to congress? I think he should use Rose as an example and realize that the sooner you come clean the better. Arod and Pettite immediately confronted the issue and I think history may be kinder on both of them for it….

  237. austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 3:18 pm

    This case and the Bonds case do seem like selective prosecution. The common denominator besides steroid allegations are that they are unpleasant people. Palmeiro denied use and had a positive test. That would seem to be an easier case to prosecute.

    I think the original point of all this was about Pettitte. I doubt this is why he is wavering upon a return. What we need is to have a Yankee reporter to find out about his current workouts, compare them to those of the past and see how well he can do them.

  238. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 3:18 pm

    mick January 31st, 2011 at 3:16 pm
    Mike seems real worried about the outcome of this Mets fiasco.
    Making a big story out of it.
    Wonder why?
    Did he lose $$$ to Madoff?

    —————

    No – he’s just an idiot who has been smugly telling Met fans for the last year that the Wilpons are fine financially when in reality he was just parroting the bull they were feeding him.

  239. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 3:19 pm

    didn’t see your post trisha.

    just wanted to make sure on that.

    you answered it.

  240. Chip January 31st, 2011 at 3:20 pm

    blake January 31st, 2011 at 3:18 pm
    SJ,

    that would make the most sense…..but for it not to go to trial wouldn’t Clemens have to admit in some way that he lied to congress? I think he should use Rose as an example and realize that the sooner you come clean the better. Arod and Pettite immediately confronted the issue and I think history may be kinder on both of them for it….

    —————–

    Rose did time and was banned for life from baseball. How is that a good choice for Clemens? On the other hand Bonds has never changed his story and is home with his feet up.

  241. pat January 31st, 2011 at 3:20 pm

    Attorneys-

    I’ve been asking this for a few days with no response……. why is the prosecution making such a big effort to keep Hardin from cross examining Andy?

    The judge denied their request once and they have now filed a second request on new grounds.

  242. SJ44 January 31st, 2011 at 3:22 pm

    Trisha,

    No doubt he didn’t give up info willingly.

    To me though, him holding onto those syringes puts him in “worm” territory.

    It’s just unseemly to me.

    If you are the guy’s friend, you don’t hold onto the syringes.

    That ain’t good.

  243. blake January 31st, 2011 at 3:22 pm

    Chip,

    Because I think if Rose had admitted it a long time ago he may have been reinstated by now…..people don’t like being lied to. America in general doesn’t like liars.

  244. mick January 31st, 2011 at 3:23 pm

    No – he’s just an idiot who has been smugly telling Met fans for the last year that the Wilpons are fine financially when in reality he was just parroting the bull they were feeding him.
    ======================================================
    That makes no sense.
    He is a self promoter that is looking towards the next show.
    Far from an idiot.

  245. SAS January 31st, 2011 at 3:24 pm

    Randy,

    You are absolutely right. The very fact that our courts and Congress spent time and money on this is a disgrace. We have more problems and less money to solve them with than is imaginable to me.

    If the issue with Roger Clemens should be investigated further, it should be by MLB, not our courts. For Roger the worst thing that can happen to him is lose his good name (done already) and not get into the HOF.

    After Congressman Rangel got by with a slap on the wrist for lying to Congess and cheating on his taxes, far worse crimes than anything Clemens (who I despise) ever did.

  246. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 3:25 pm

    There is no question that there could be a good chain of custody argument made by the defense. However that is just one flyspec in the perjury case. Testimony was about many other things.

    ********
    “As a lawyer, don’t you think it might be better to decide guilt after the evidence? I bet their is a lot of evidence, one way or the other, we don’t know about. Their may be other pieces of evidence we have heard about that are inadmissible.”

    austinmac, as a lawyer I know the guy is guilty as sin from all that has already come out. This isn’t going to be a brand new trial. This is a trial for perjury based on what happened at the Congressional hearing. McNamee isn’t going to be changing his testimony. In fact anyone who tries to change testimony does it at the risk of also being accused of lying to Congress.

    You feel free to wait it out. I respect that. I also respect the fact that unless the feds totally drop the ball and put on the most unbelievably poor case (something I don’t see happening), Clemens doesn’t have a chance. The punch line is that I have already seen the evidence to date. The feds case certainly isn’t going to get any weaker. And I’ve already told you that they now have pictures from a party and testimony from his maid. His maid certainly had no incentive to lie.

    No, I’m quite satisfied that the guy is a stone-cold liar who tried to peddle his influence by having meetings with the hearing panel before the hearings even began.

    His best shot would be to admit the truth and save everyone the aggrevation of a trial. That way he could be preparing for the next trial, the defamation suit McNamee has against him.

  247. West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 3:25 pm

    No one knows whether or not Andy Pettite lied about his steroid use. Maybe he told the truth and maybe he didn’t.

  248. SAS January 31st, 2011 at 3:27 pm

    After all*

  249. austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 3:29 pm

    Pat,

    I would guess, and it is only a guess, that the prosecution fears Hardin, with his past relationship with Pettitte, may be able to lead Pettitte in softening what he has said. It is truly amazing what can be done with some witnesses.

    The prosecution may also fear Hardin has some inside information on Pettitte. However, he can’t use anything he learned from Pettitte in the course of his representation. Doing so, would lead to State Bar isssues.

    In further answer, Hardin could likely be prohibited from examining Pettitte if his representation of Pettitte overlapped the subject matter, even slightly, of this case or Pettitte’s testimony.

  250. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 3:31 pm

    pat, because Hardin once represented Andy so it could be seen as a conflict of interest. There’s attorney-client privilege that would come into play.

    ***********
    “You are absolutely right. The very fact that our courts and Congress spent time and money on this is a disgrace. We have more problems and less money to solve them with than is imaginable to me”

    SAS, if MLB had done its job, it would have never gotten to Congress. This all happened because Canseco’s book opened up a huge can of worms and at the same high school kids were dying from using steroids. Someone had to make an example of steroid use. That’s what the Mitchell report was all about, to see whether there was anything behind all of the accusations. And Congress has MLB over a barrel in that baseball is the only sport that has an antitrust exemption. That’s Congress’s hold on MLB.

  251. pat January 31st, 2011 at 3:34 pm

    Thanks austinmac.

    They are trying too hard for it to mean nothing.

  252. austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 3:36 pm

    Trisha,

    We will agree to disagree. I commonly get disagreed with on this board.:)

    Now, my wisdom on one of my true areas of expertise, building the better pitching staff. . . .

    But, I must say, this really is a new trial. The game has not even begun. What you have seen or read is like the hot stove league, interesting, but not the season.

  253. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 3:36 pm

    “No one knows whether or not Andy Pettite lied about his steroid use. Maybe he told the truth and maybe he didn’t.”

    What they know is that Andy was one of the people named in the Mitchell report, and Andy admitted to using. That gives him huge points as opposed to Clemens who was also named and totally denied, despite the evidence that continued to mount.

    West Coast, a lot of times it gets down to which party is the more believable.

    ************

    Randy this is one of those times when the posts fly by so quickly that I have probably missed half of them! (happens to me a lot in the heat of these kinds of discussions.)

  254. pat January 31st, 2011 at 3:36 pm

    trisha

    Judge already ruled conflict wasn’t an issue and the person at jeopardy from the conflict would be Roger and he’s okay with it.

  255. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 3:37 pm

    “The very fact that our courts and Congress spent time and money on this is a disgrace. We have more problems and less money to solve them with than is imaginable to me.”

    SAS-

    and and sj44 says, it’s over PEDS and not murder.

    baseball itself gets a black eye if this goes to trial because there is no way roger clemens existed in a vacuum.

    i do hope they make him an plea offer that clemens accepts and moves on.

    no one wins if there is a long trial.

  256. SAS January 31st, 2011 at 3:37 pm

    :arrow:

  257. West Coast Yankee Fan January 31st, 2011 at 3:39 pm

    Hardin will not be cross-examining Pettitte, he brought in a lawyer from another firm in San Diego Michael Attanasio to do so; who happens to be a close friend of Kevin Towers by the way. Attanasio represented Towers during the Mitchell Commission’s investigation.

  258. austinmac January 31st, 2011 at 3:42 pm

    An interesting question is whether Clemens will testify. That is rare in a criminal case since much of what people think is evidence may only be admissible as impeachment when a defendant testifies. My bet is Hardin will beg him not to, but Clemens will insist.

  259. Doreen January 31st, 2011 at 3:45 pm

    Sorry out all day and trying to catch up, but I couldn’t let the Jorge DH stuff pass:

    http://www.nypost.com/p/sports.....fPEzQcVi7N

    Jorge was told he’d be the DH, but to prepare as a catcher as usual. That’s as I remembered it.

    ****

    I look forward to murphydog’s take on the Clemens trial; he was a great resource with the Mitchell Report came out.

    However, I gotta say, I will probably be a scarce person in these parts if it does come to a trial. I truly won’t be able to deal with the fallout here.

  260. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 3:46 pm

    pat, that’s fine then because Hardin wouldn’t be allowed to use anything that he knows about Andy, from Andy, because of the lawyer-client privilege.

    ************

    Well right now it’s over PEDs and lying to Congress, but a sidebar is that it is about murder since high school kids have died from using steroids and Congress feels the need to make an example of PED use in sports. They have baseball by the throat due to the anti-trust exemption. If Roger hadn’t imposed himself on the hearings none of this would be happening. I surely don’t blame Congress for this. The blame falls squarely on Clemens. Had he not insisted on testifying and then lying, Congress wouldn’t have been put in the position of having to show the country that perjury in front of a congressional committee is unacceptable.

    ************

    mick, if you’re still around, I’m with you. I’m not impressed at all by Hardin. So far he’s batted zero with the courts in Houston. I’m not thinking he’s going to do much better with a federal court.

    ***********

    Onward and upward!

  261. randy l. January 31st, 2011 at 3:47 pm

    “Randy this is one of those times when the posts fly by so quickly that I have probably missed half of them! (happens to me a lot in the heat of these kinds of discussions”

    trisha-

    yeah, these kind of discussions create too many comments to respond to all of them.

    when i take a contrary position on the blog i usually just respond to a few people to keep things from going off on tangents.

    just the fact this old clemens thing can wake up the blog shows that barring a plea deal it will become a media circus .

    i do think it’s also in the governments best interest to settle it too because the feds haven’t had the best behavior either in the PED war on baseball. they have been reprimanded a lot in the bonds case by judges and in the case where they tried to show all the ped results that arod was exposed in, they lost.

    just because the feds do something , it doesn’t mean it’ legal. that’s why there are judges that oversee them.

  262. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 3:51 pm

    austinmac, Hardin has already said that Clemens looks forward to being able to clear his name. You know he is going to insist on testifying.

    *********

    Doreen, murphydog will indeed have an interesting perspective as a defense attorney. I trust it will be much different from what you have heard from the “prosecution” side. While I understand your desire to disappear if this goes to trial, I’m looking foward to the whole thing. I don’t think there’s going to be any particular fallout here since what will happen will happen. People may think he did or didn’t get a fair shake, but if the trial is run well, the evidence will speak for itself.

  263. trisha - true pinstriped blue January 31st, 2011 at 3:56 pm

    randy, it will be interesting to see if they offer him a deal. And then it will be doubly interesting to see if he takes it. I don’t think the feds have anything to fear here, because this one has been pretty well aired out already. My fear is that he is in so deep that he will refuse to do anything but forge ahead, probably thinking that his doing so gives the appearance of his innocence. In this one he definitely has been his own worst enemy. The saying that “a person who is his own lawyer has a fool for a client” rings more true than ever, because he really has been calling all the shots and not doing a lot of listening.


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