Spring Training Game 5: Yankees vs. Astros
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Gameday Thread on Mar 02, 2011 
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YANKEES (1-3)
Derek Jeter SS
Robinson Cano 2B
Mark Teixeira 1B
Alex Rodriguez 3B
Jorge Posada DH
Andruw Jones LF
Francisco Cervelli C
Colin Curtis RF
Justin Maxwell CF
RHP A.J. Burnett (10-15, 5.26 in 2010)
Burnett vs. Astros
ASTROS (0-2)
Michael Bourn CF
Clint Barmes SS
Brian Bogusevic RF
Jason Michaels DH
Bill Hall 2B
Brett Wallace 1B
J.R. Towles C
J.B. Shuck LF
Matt Downs 3B
RHP Bud Norris (9-10, 4.92)
Norris vs. Yankees
TIME/TV: 1:05 p.m., YES Network and MLB Network
WEATHER: A few clouds in the sky, but otherwise a beautiful day with a pretty strong wind blowing in from center field. It’s going to take quite a bit to get a ball out of here today.
UMPIRES: HP Dan Iassogna, 1B Mark Wegner, 2B Manny Gonzalez, 3B Tyler Funneman
ON THE LINE: A.J. Burnett has a rotation spot locked up, but a strong debut might do a little bit to ease some of the concerns about last year’s numbers. This game is also another chance for Francisco Cervelli to make his case for the backup catcher job.
NEW EXPERIENCE: It’s not especially unusual when young National League pitchers face the Yankees in spring training, but Houston starter Bud Norris has never faced any of the Yankees in the regular season.
ALSO PITCHING TODAY: Sergio Mitre, Joba Chamberlain, Boone Logan, David Phelps, Hector Noesi and Luis Ayala should be enough to get the Yankees through nine innings. Mitre will likely throw two innings after Burnett throws his two innings.
ALSO PITCHING FOR HOUSTON: LHP Douglas Arguello, RHP Jose Valdez, RHP Casey Fien, RHP Jordan Lyles and RHP Cesar Carrillo. Rule 5 pick Lance Pendleton — taken from the Yankees — is on the trip, but he’s not on the list of scheduled pitchers. Looks like he’s a backup today.
ON THE BENCH: The Astros have two games today, and manager Brad Mills is with the half of the team that’s playing against the Tigers. Bench coach Al Pedrique is serving as the Houston manager in Tampa.
LOOKING FOR ONE MORE: Sergio Mitre will make his second spring training appearance. He got the win on Sunday, which has been the only Yankees win so far.
UPDATE, 1:10 p.m.: Eight pitches, seven strikes for Burnett in the first inning. He got a routine grounder, got Barmes looking at a breaking ball and got Bogusevic to roll over a ground ball to first. He’s cured!
UPDATE, 1:27 p.m.: Thirteen pitches, eight strikes for Burnett in the second inning. The Astros had two singles — one by Jason Michaels, one by Bill Hall — but both were weak flares to shallow right-center. With runners at first and second and no outs, Burnett got a double play and a ground out to third to end the inning without allowing a run. Hard to know too much after two innings, but that wasn’t a bad start.
UPDATE, 1:32 p.m.: Alex Rodriguez led off the bottom of the second with a double that one-hoped the wall in left field. Two ground outs brought him home for a 1-0 Yankees lead.
UPDATE, 1:38 p.m.: Francisco Cervelli fouled a ball off his foot in the bottom of the second, but he stayed in the game after being checked briefly on the field. As expected, here’s Sergio Mitre to pitch the third inning for the Yankees.
UPDATE, 2:12 p.m.: Francisco Cervelli has a bruised left foot. No tests currently scheduled.
UPDATE, 3:53 p.m.: Been up and down to the clubhouse in these late innings, so I haven’t seen a ton of the game. The Yankees, though, are making things interesting here in the bottom of the ninth. Down 5-1 when the inning started, four straight batters have reached base, it’s now 5-3 with no outs and the tying run at second base. I’ll be back down in the clubhouse shortly, so I might not see the end, but the young guys are making a run at it here in the end.
Granted, the young guys also kicked the ball around through a four-run, three-error seventh.
UPDATE, 3:55 p.m.: Game-tying, two-run single by Melky Mesa brings Eduardo Nunez to the plate. We’re now tied at 5.
Bojo,
Here’s a thought. Do you think Johan Santana would clear waivers?
Bret The Hitman March 2nd, 2011 at 1:00 pm
Bojo,
Here’s a thought. Do you think Johan Santana would clear waivers?
________________
Probably not…Alex Rios didn’t…
But that might actually work to Yankees advantage.
Doctors have siad it will take about 70 innings for Santana to be back to normal following rehab…that might mean he only has one good game in July.
That in turn might mean a smaller market for trading him, and Cashman might be the only GM who could take the risk of picking him up.
He would have to really believe the medical reports and opinions to take such a big gamble though.
“Probably not…Alex Rios didn’t…”
Manny Ramirez once did…though I still don’t think he knows it.
Speaking of SF (as some were), it appears Zito might get bought out and thus be available on the very cheap.
“A source close to the team indicated Tuesday that there is “exasperation” with Zito, that his status as the No. 5 starter is “definitely not safe,” and that the team would even consider buying out his expensive contract before Opening Day if that’s what it takes to say farewell.”
Not that I’d recomment it but given the Yankees’ affinity for “names” as projects . . .
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/.....ype=sports
By the time the trade deadline rolls around, the Mets will either be financially sound or under new ownership.
Santana is not going anywhere.
AJ will be better than Beckett in 2011. Any takers?
Zito has $46mil guaranteed left on his deal, and the Giants are HOPING he can be their 5th starter. Please do not bring up his name again :p
4 pitches into the game and I’m loving it already. I declare AJ a top Yankee pitcher for the 2011 season.
You read it here first!
Oh crap, another groundout for Jeter…
Oh, wait.
Sorry.
mets are desparate for cash to run the team, and the commish and the banks dont want to loan them anymore.
i can save them $68M in a 3-way trade:
yankees trade: aj, mitre, joba, and brackman and one other minor league pitcher not manny or dellin.
mets trade: santana, beltran and frankie rodriguez
twins trade: liriano, nathan and kubel
yanks get: santana, liriano and nathan (and pay half the difference between krod’s and nathan’s contracts assuming k rod makes his incentives) and loan the met’s the $68M they save in payroll at above market rates)
mets get: burnett, joba, mitre and kubel (and pay half of the diff between krod’s and nathan’s contracts total savings= $68M which the yanks loan them.
twins get: beltran, k rod and brackman and another aaa pitcher, plus the difference bet. nathan’s and k rod’s contract.
GO AJ!!!!!
Nice strikeout on a big curve and 2 easy ground outs. Very few pitches
nice easy inning for Aj!
I had no idea there were so many qualified medical professionals posting here.
Irreverent Discourse March 2nd, 2011 at 1:07 pm
By the time the trade deadline rolls around, the Mets will either be financially sound or under new ownership.
Santana is not going anywhere.
_____________________
I wish I were a betting man.
No team sale is going to go on that quickly, and they certainly won’t be out of the financial mess they are in by then. It is more than just the legal issues…underperforming real estate…over-extended on team, stadium, and network…lower revenues.
Where are you getting your facts from to put forth this comment?
Zito’s guaranteed is irrelevant if he gets bought out.
the payroll savings are approximate but its at least $60M +
Looking forward to seeing Sergio and Joba today.
Rumors of sold-out games at Steinbrenner field are greatly exaggerated…
Looks like he’s throwing easy. Keep an eye on what singleton was talking about with his leg. If he starts swinging that leg towards second he’ll lose his location.
Irreverent Discourse – I don’t think Santan’s going anywhere, anytime soon, but that’s because the Mets won’t be able to find a taker right now.
I know that the salary lines for some of these players don’t come close to matching the hundreds of millions of dollars the Wilpons are in the hole for. However, if they are experiencing an immediate cash flow problem – and it looks like they are, they hit up MLB for another $25M for short term expenses and where turned down – then that few million makes it easier for them to make it to the next month. I think they are literally living hand-to-mouth, going month-to-month, even week-to-week with their cash.
Between player salaries, interest due on bonds and loans, paying off vendors, I think they have a lot of “daily, recurring expenses” that unloading some player salaries makes easier to manage.
JMO, based on what I’ve read over time. Anyone is free to disagree, as I obviously don’t have any inside information.
West Coast Yankee Fan March 2nd, 2011 at 1:12 pm
I had no idea there were so many qualified medical professionals posting here.
___________
Try posting with references and facts, and you can join in too!
BoJo – under new ownership is not really what I meant… they are trying to take on a partner to infuse cash. They don’t need much… the Wilpon’s problem is they are hodling close to a billion dollars in escrow in case they lose this lawsuit.
Trading players away is not a solution to this problem. Its so much more money than that.
Jeter should not be the lead off hitter during the regular season
I’m not worrying about Derek. I believe that if he works long enough at what Long is advising, it will come. It appeared that his ground out crept more to the left than in the past, even if by inches.
I wasn’t talking to you Brad. Mind your own business.
They need the cash to start normal operations of the club. Once they start collecting revenue they will operate as normal for the season. There will not be a sudden need to move Johan in July.
Maybe I don’t understand the game, but why is Derek the leadoff hitter? Gardner is the fastest player and had the best OBP on the team last year. Can someone explain it?
WCYF – and no one was talking to you so… kettle?
ID–
Could you please post a link to the info on the billion in escrow? I’d love to read that.
As for their cash needs, I tend to think the low revenues at Citifield and debt that took on is going to put a lot of pressure on them to sell off contracts. We’ll see.
West Coast Yankee Fan March 2nd, 2011 at 1:12 pm
I had no idea there were so many qualified medical professionals posting here.
———————————————————————————————————————-
It’s never stopped you from remarking and being an expert on every subject.
ID I was making a general comment about all the medical opinion, I addressed it to no one. Kettle that.
GB – I give my opinions like you do, I never claimed to be an expert on anything. I think it’s fairly universal that everyone here is just a fan with an opinion.
Derek was moved to lead-off after the 2009 season because he was hitting into so many ground ball double plays that he was killing the lead-off on base. It seemed to make sense all around due to the great offensive campaign he had in 2009. People feel that moving him to the two hole is the answer but if he continues to ground out, Brett will have to have an incredible lead off first to make it to second.
Anyway, that’s what’s happening right now. Maybe they’re waiting to see what will happen in ST.
BoJo – why else would they suddenly be cash poor right now? They didn’t lose money in the madoff deal… that’s why they’re being sued for the money they received.
West Coast Yankee Fan March 2nd, 2011 at 1:16 pm
I wasn’t talking to you Brad. Mind your own business.
______________
Nor was anyone talking to you the other night when you were called a troll. Get over yourself
Will anyone stop arguing and try to answer my question?
No doctor can give anyone an innings estimate on when a pitcher is going to be healthy off shoulder surgery.
Frankly, it’s ridiculous these guys allow themselves to get put in such a box.
After Santana had elbow surgery, he lost 3 MPH off his fastball and the feel for his slider.
He now has had shoulder surgery.
Thie idea he will throw harder coming off shoulder surgery? I’ll believe it when I see it.
Chien Ming Wang was supposed to be back by “Late May”, throwing “better than ever” last year.
He hasn’t pitched in a game since 2009.
Until guys actually come back and pitch, and pitch effectively, anything you hear about their physical condition is BS.
Get lost Brad.
Irreverent Discourse March 2nd, 2011 at 1:20 pm
BoJo – why else would they suddenly be cash poor right now? They didn’t lose money in the madoff deal… that’s why they’re being sued for the money they received.-
_________________
They took on a lot of debt for Citifield and SNY
No speeds on Burnett’s fastball, but, it seems to be getting on top of the hitters in a hurry.
St. Larry. I am going to find a way to get him cannonized. Imagine going to the pitcher’s home and meeting with him? I love the guy.
02 mph in first outing…looking good
92 that is
GoldGlove – what else do you do with jeter, bat him 9th? Thats a lot of dollars to be giving away almost 200 at-bats…
Gardner managed a .383 OBP once.
Jeter averages a .385 OBP for his career.
Which do you bet on?
Will anyone stop arguing and try to answer my question?
I DID!!!! What are you sexist? Or didn’t you like the answer?!
“Maybe I don’t understand the game, but why is Derek the leadoff hitter? Gardner is the fastest player and had the best OBP on the team last year. Can someone explain it?”
Sure, because though some fans would like it if teams and managers ran their ballclubs based solely on numbers and immediate evaluations. Most teams do not operate like that.
Jeter’s, experience, history and track record (and Gardner’s lack thereof) are factors.
And while we might not agree with sort of management style and there is certainly room for debate, anyone who pretends not to understand these factors is … well … pretending.
First speed that I’ve seen posted, fastball 92 MPH, breaking pitch at 88 MPH. 94 MPH. 84 MPH.
2 hits on short looping liners
So sorry Trisha I didn’t see your answer! I assure you that I am not sexist, other than my negative opinions of Suzyn Waldman.
GoldGlove, It’s okay.
I should have quoted your post. Then you would have known I was responding to it.
AndrewMarchand
It is nice that the seats behind home plate at Steinbrenner Field aren’t filled. Makes it look like a regular season game.
“# GoldGlove9486 March 2nd, 2011 at 1:16 pm
Maybe I don’t understand the game, but why is Derek the leadoff hitter? Gardner is the fastest player and had the best OBP on the team last year. Can someone explain it?
”
b/c Girardi is friends w/ the players. If Ozzie Guillen was the manager Jete would not be the leadoff hitter in 2011
two innings and 21 pitches.
He hasn’t even worked up a sweat, yet,
There are four ownership groups who are now undergoing MLB’s Due Diligence Program after passing the first level of scrutiny by Allen and Co., the investment banking firm hired by the Mets to seek investors.
Steve Greenberg of Allen and Co, someone with long term ties to MLB, is handling this deal.
Meaning, they have groups ready, willing, and able to do this deal.
They may have to give up more equity than they originally desired, perhaps even giving the new group a right of first refusal if they have to seek the franchise.
Hover, it seems more likely than not the Mets will have a partner sooner rather than later.
One other thing to consider……
Fred Wilpon is Bud Selig’s best friend in baseball. He will get every consideration, and more, to get a deal done.
“It is nice that the seats behind home plate at Steinbrenner Field aren’t filled. Makes it look like a regular season game.”
I really like AJ to Cervelli. I think I may have mentioned that in the past – about 5000 times!
JackCurryYES Cashman to Bill Hall, who the Yankees almost signed, “I almost had you. It was this close.” A sheepish Hall nodded and said, “Sorry.”
__
love it
sj you are selling santana way short. he had decreased velocity last year and pitched with an injury and posted a 2.98 era. thats great in any league.
179H/199 IP is no slouch either.
he’s a great pitcher.
AJ seems calm and collected and he didn’t get rattled with the men on base. I liked his mound demeanor – even though it’s just a spring training start, I am sure he and everyone else wants him to get off on the right foot and regain his confidence. What an asset a good AJ Burnett would be to the rotation.
“@wallacematthews crowd grumbling as AJ allows singles to first two hitters in the second. Meltdown ahead?
@wallacematthews AJ gets huge DP ball, Stros have runner on third, two out in the second about a minute ago”
I don’t care if he is going for ironic, this is just wrong.
Anyone else buying high on A-Rod in fantasy baseball this year? I am.
nice easy swing by alex..
I LOVE A-Rod’s stroke this spring. I’d much rather see him lace doubles all spring than hit a few out. Nice!
Gold Glove, you may see any host of responses from disgruntled posters who WANT Derek to move out of the lead-off position, but smart money tells you that a hitter who hit .342 (I think that’s what it was) the season before being moved into the lead off and never had a bad season until last year is probably still be given some room to see if last season was an aberration. If it was, it’s much smarter to have Derek leading off since his propensity to GIDP doesn’t seem to be going anywhere.
Where he ends up remains to be seen.
A-Rod is going to have a monster year.
Pretty swing by Rodriguez
Bojo,
SNY and Citi Field are separate companies from the Mets LLC. They aren’t all one company.
Alex has such a strong swing. He is a delight to watch. Pure natural talent. Like Robby Cano!
stuckey – matthews is a boston media shill assigned to cover the yankees. stop reading him.
SJ, did you see where Bobby Valentine has a group looking at buying 25% of the Mets?
a productive out by Jones…..
that was something completely missing last year.
SJ44 March 2nd, 2011 at 1:30 pm
Just more of his make believe garbage.
Y’s Guy,
He’s a great pitcher when healthy. He’s not healthy now and nobody has any idea when/if he will be healthy again.
Until you know he’s healthy again, he’s in the “Huge Risk” category when it comes to acquiring him.
irreverent discourse: i have arod 12th on my board in 5×5. i’d put him higher but he’s sure to be available to pick there.
For all the criticism that Cashman has gotten for not attempting to buy a championship, I love what he’s done in the offseason. Andruw Jones to strengthen the bench and the outfield, a bullpen of flippin’ Titans including the likely heir to Mariano (IMO), and two major leaguers in camp to see who can strengthen the rotation.
Oh yeah, and Russell Martin.
This is the kind of team I cannot wait to watch. I’ve never needed an All-Star at every position in order to feel good about the chances of the Yanks.
ID, I’m not.
Just saw it on the ESPN front page Twitter feed.
Of course your same argument might apply…:-)
GB,
I did and I know the Fund manager he’s partnered with in the deal. Very legitimate group and should breeze past the initial due diligence phase.
They are very legit players in this, IMO.
Ledger_Yankees Star Ledger
Well then. 8 pitches, 7 strikes for AJ. The ball was a high pitch, only AJ’s front foot landed away from the spot in front of the mound.
Geez, I know I’m not the most popular kid in class, but what does a guy have to do to get “Hey, welcome back” around here???
Either my television screen is in some elongated vertical mode, or Cisco looks like he took off some weight too!
This is the kind of team I cannot wait to watch. I’ve never needed an All-Star at every position in order to feel good about the chances of the Yanks.
__
agreed and this is also why i would be ok with an ok year waiting for montero, and the B’s to make the majors, instead of trading them for Liriano. (short of Johnson / Felix).
“# BTX March 2nd, 2011 at 1:26 pm
AndrewMarchand
It is nice that the seats behind home plate at Steinbrenner Field aren’t filled. Makes it look like a regular season game.
”
lol I guess it’s a light crowd…they used to sell out every game but don’t think it’s happened the last two springs…less disposable income out there
Ys – I’m in a 10 team keeper league and i’m really… really considering taking him with the 9th pick. I have Lee lined up for my second (pitchers are more valuable than usual in this league)
Something about “first regular offseason program since 2007″ makes me swoon for 140ish rbi’s again.
Alex is going to be on with Francesa after the game.
Alex will be my 1st pick in Fantasy baseball if he’s available.
Welcome back stuckey! I think you would have gotten more of a welcome if you didn’t come during a game, especially a game where AJ has started. People are concentrating.
SJ44 March 2nd, 2011 at 1:20 pm
No doctor can give anyone an innings estimate on when a pitcher is going to be healthy off shoulder surgery.
Frankly, it’s ridiculous these guys allow themselves to get put in such a box.
After Santana had elbow surgery, he lost 3 MPH off his fastball and the feel for his slider.
_______________
Your comments keep going in face of the info I am citing in links.
First, professional medical opinions ARE being given by the doctors on the case. Read trhe link I posed in earlier thread
Second, your comment from prior thread than a surgery is a surgery was ridiculous.
He had anthroscopic surgery on knee, not an ACL surgery.
He had bone chips removed in 2009, not TJ surgery.
And his recent procedure was not rotator cuff.
yes he is injured, but you also talked about his decreased velocity. i was pointing out that he already has learned how to deal with decreased velocity, putting up those great #’s last year.
if he comes back by the asb he could move at the trade deadline. more likely he will go this coming winter by which time you will already know whether he’s healthy or not.
he has shown he has what it takes to be an elite mlb picther and cy young winner, and to pitch like a leader even on a really crappy team. that counts alot for me.
let me see liriano show any of that.
A stuckey sighting …..ill welcome you back, just don’t cause too much trouble
“Alex will be my 1st pick in Fantasy baseball if he’s available.”
I would never share who my first pick is going to be sister sister! Well at least not on the forum, hee hee.
SJ, I wasn’t sure about the Valentine article. May be a nice guy, but, never could warm up to him, but, he could have been a really good ballplayer, until that fence. Thanks, as always for your updates
IMO, the Mets will not only get funded with new investors, it will be a very solid group.
I think though, they will end up giving 35-49% of the team, with the new owners having a right of first refusal should the Wilpons need to sell controlling interest in the team.
Steve Greenberg knows how to get deals done. He’s a very, very, sharp guy.
“irreverent discourse: i have arod 12th on my board in 5×5. i’d put him higher but he’s sure to be available to pick there”
Drafted in a 12 team league last night and got him at #18.
Bono,
Believe what you want to believe.
The guy is still 3-4 months away from pitching. NOBODY knows what he’s going to be coming off surgery.
Until the ball leaves his hand in a game, it’s all guesswork.
blake, I don’t think I can promise you that.
Though after last October, I purposely stayed away for that very reason. Can’t imagine it was too pretty round here and I would have just made it uglier.
And for the record. Yanks are lock for the postseason this year.
Just getting that out there now.
Trisha,
I may be bluffing to get someone to pick Alex and leave me someone else
Regardless of the short liners to right, Burnett looked great today.
every surgery in sports goes “successfully”. Doctors give that as their professional opinion the day after they do every surgery. It means absolutely nothing.
Every player recovers from injury in different ways.
Ask Wang how successful his surgery was. His doctor said everything went “perfect”.
That was 2 years ago. He has yet to throw a pitch in the majors since.
Nice outing for AJ. Good start.
Stuckeyman!
What the hell happened to you?
ID if you are picking 9th and also 12th in a 10 team league, you should definitly wait and draft arod 12th and pick halladay or toulo or whoever falls (someone always does) at #9. i havent seen anyone else with arod in thier top 12.
Banuelos pitches on TV Friday night
It’s great to have one highly-rated pitching prospect on your team, to have three is amazing. Banuelos, Betances and Brackman — I sure wouldn’t deal them at this point unless it was a ridiculously favorable deal.
Just once would I like to see a doctor come out the next day and say “well, we reattached the ligaments in his elbow but… it could have gone better.”
The DUI report for today……. Coco Crisp. What the heck is going on lately?
SJ – even if the Mets get new investors, it is a process that will take months, at least. It appears that they have more immediate cash flow problems. If the usual commercial lendors are turning them down, and MLB turns them down as they recently did, how do the Mets/Wilpons get the cash?
The fact that they’re even looking for a loan implies to me that they don’t have any other source of cash. Even if Fred wanted to sell one of his other/Sterling properties, that process would also take some time.
Stuckey,
Eh it’s had its moments. Most realize that the Yanks are still one of the best teams in baseball though and are a starter away (either via trade or somebody stepping up) from being as good as anybody.
A-Rod is looking great this sping… I can say for sure he will be on my fantasy team if the price is right.
ID – a surgeon – saying something like that? Lol….
Stuckey
I need to introduce you to my buddy WCYF.
I think you two will get along great
LGY – a highly disappointed, agitated fanbase upset about 2010/nervous about 2011 and me just wouldn’t have been a good mix.
I can only imagine how things got when Lee went to Philly and the Sox got their guys.
Would have been combustible.
Ys – problem is, as a keeper league… there are a few players in that top 12 already missing.
I have Lee kept as my 2nd pick (12). For perspective, the 2 most valuable players in the league last year were Halladay and Lee.
So my only 2 chances at Alex are 9 or 19.
I don’t really think there’s a chance he’s still there at 19 (at that point there are probably 8 players kept off the board) . I’m willing to overpay to be allowed to root for ABombs
My surgery was “less than stellar” but should be “functional …..
blake, good to hear.
Either way, my winter sports attention was largely consumed by the ‘Melo watch.
I choose to ignore the Giants meltdown against Philly.
15 of 21 pitches by Burnett were strikes. That’s the best news along with hitting 94 MPH
I can hear it now… “Maxwell unleashes his hammer”….
so nobody liked my trade proposal? i think it was fair all the way around.
pat March 2nd, 2011 at 1:45 pm
The DUI report for today……. Coco Crisp. What the heck is going on lately?
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He should have stayed with putting milk in his Coco-Puffs instead of Scotch
Burnett looked good. New season, clean slate…..go get Uhm.
Betances and Banuelos are untouchable except for a Felix and then I would trade the former before the latter. Liriano? If the Twins are trading him, it’s for a reason – I would not give up any significant prospects for him.
Sounds like AJ did well. Early last season he was using his 2 seamer – he should use that more. Frankly, I think more Yankee pitchers coming up should use that pitch……
Jeter put a big rap on that liner. Good to see.
It only took MLB.com a year but the DVR functionality, which was in the player last season, is finally working!
“Trisha,
”
I may be bluffing to get someone to pick Alex and leave me someone else
Fran, there are really quite a few choices that would make good first choices. I guarantee you this much. This year come hell or high water I am going to have at least one Yankee position player on my team. I can’t believe that I didn’t get one last year!!!
“My surgery was “less than stellar” but should be “functional …..”
No wind blowing in and the gators in the pond are hiding.
Romine in, Cervelli out…bruised foot
My boyfriend A-Rod looks amazing.
Why has Mitre, who they continue to say is still a contender for the rotation, only getting 1 inning again?
joba and romine in the game!
“Romine in, Cervelli out…bruised foot”
On two counts. I’d rather have Joba be able to showcase his stuff with a catcher he’s familiar with, at least at this point. Doesn’t look like he’s having trouble though.
Lovin’ all of the ground outs so far this spring
Stuckey, glad to see you got your name back.
And glad that your here again.
Fran the original March 2nd, 2011 at 1:42 pm & Trisha!
And here I am setting up my whole draft based on you too locking in on ARod!
-you’re
Chamberlain not quite as sharp today
Ray, I would expect Arod to go very quickly so it’s probably more our position in the draft more than anything else that tells the story of who gets Arod.
Joba may not be used to Romine. But he did get the pitcher’s best friend.
SJ44–
Again, I am not disagreeing that he has to be healthy first before any trade is made. All I am saying is that there is a lot of info out there which indicates he MAY be healthy, and therefore, I don’t believe in shutting him out of the July conversation.
You have seemed to indicate that in no way would he ever be an option. That is where we disagree.
Stuckey Man……Welcome back, spring training is such a cool time of the year……
But at the end of the day SJ44, it is no big deal if we disagree. Time will tell, not our points in a blog.
trisha – true pinstriped blue March 2nd, 2011 at 2:06 pm
Joba may not be used to Romine. But he did get the pitcher’s best friend.
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Joba and I have nothing in common. My best friend has long auburn hair and green eyes. I guess I’m just not as dedicated to the team.
Loving AJ’s attitude.
Sometimes the free agent you don’t get is the best free agent of all.
Good riddance Cliff Lee!
the santana thing isnt in play yet, but its something that has to be monitored. in the yankees position especially, they have to anticipate what impact pitchers are most likely to become available and when and its at least possible he could come back this year.
he’s already throwing.
“Joba and I have nothing in common. My best friend has long auburn hair and green eyes. I guess I’m just not as dedicated to the team.”
So pardon me for having to catch-up, but it’s May, Seattle is 15 games under .500.
They call up Cash and say Hernandez for the killer Bs.. all three of them…
Who’s in/out?
Burnett isn’t happy with his strikeout curve. Called it rubbish.
I know there’s reason for it at the beginning of ST, but AJ looked like he was pitching in slo-mo compared to the way he usually pitches.
stuckey99 March 2nd, 2011 at 2:12 pm
So pardon me for having to catch-up, but it’s May, Seattle is 15 games under .500.
They call up Cash and say Hernandez for the killer Bs.. all three of them…
Who’s in/out?
______________
Out…but tempting…only because I never like young pitchers throwing so many innings before they reach 25 years old.
of course, with the new ballpark, the twins could trade liriano to the mets for santana.
I guess while he’s working on his new delivery that’s to be expected.
GB7 – it was, as he said, loopy.
also said he usually doesn’t throw it for a few starts so maybe he’s in a good place right now.
Stuckey,
That’s tough…..very tough.
Not tough at all – no way I do that.
trisha – i dont think slow-mo is the proper word. “under control” maybe.
less flailing and lateral movement is their focus. keeping his leg kick from swinging towards 2B and keeping all of his motion vertical.
“Why has Mitre, who they continue to say is still a contender for the rotation, only getting 1 “inning again?
doggfan, I don’t even want to guess at that. I love Mitre so am not thrilled with one inning. Maybe there’s a good reason for it.
stuckey, i’d have to say in.
I think Seattle would want Montero in any deal anyway.
PeterBotte Burnett: “There’s been a lot said, and why wouldn’t it after the year I had last year? Its my job to go out and shut some mouths.”
welcome back stuckey
you guys can have A-rod, I am picking Robbie!!!
Maybe a bit “loopy” but in a good spot. It started at the batter’s hip and broke down and over the inside corner. Not his usual knuckle curve.
As far as fantasy goes for 3rd base I would take Longoria and Wright (because of the steals) before Arod. Arod would be third off the board in the 14th to 17th range. he is more valuable in a roto league then a head to head one. Especially a daily one
Betsy,
Sabathia, Felix, and Hughes would be the best 3 in baseball and two of them would be under 25…..its a big price but he’s a guy you consider it for.
GB7 – i’ll be honest… my jaw dropped a little when he threw it.
somewhere between “i can’t believe he’s throwing a curve already” and “wow he located that really well”.
Blake, okay, take out anyone of the B’s and put Montero in his place.
ID, I guess I’m not used to see AJ with so much control. I don’t know what his fastball was clocked at but the placement was beautiful. Still I was surprised that they didn’t catch up with it. Maybe because it was so smooth and there wasn’t all that movement, it just appeared slower than usual.
The Yankees were looking to add Lee at 23 per year before they signed Soriano.
Now they are going to add a 28 million dollar pitcher in Santana in addition to Lee?
And CC is not going to care that his new teammate is making 5 million more than him?
There’s a disturbing amount of OCD going on in here of late.
It’s like those poor people who have to constantly wash their hands; Posters are posting the same exact thing and thoughts day after day after day after day…It’s really tough to read.
If it’s not the daily Hughes debate, it’s now the daily discussion about Johan Santana which is ludicrous. He’s on the Mets, injured, had shoulder surgery and can’t pitch yet and is owed MILLIONS of dollars. It’s downright bizarre.
I can’t wait for cuts to be made to the team and for the games to start.
“he is more valuable in a roto league then a head to head one.”
I would love an explanation of this. if anything steals (one category) are less important in H2H than roto.
upstate kate March 2nd, 2011 at 2:19 pm
You might have to trade with me to get him!! Let me know what your best offer is! LOL!
If Cervelli misses any time, we may be that much closer to Montero in the bigs.
If I am Cashman I hang up. As good as King Felix is, I wouldn’t even consider giving up those three at this point in time.
I know I’m going to be sorry I asked, but what the hell are people debating about Hughes?
Montero, Betances, and Brackman for Felix? I don’t know ….depends on what Montero does between now and then and what Sanchez is doing at Charleston. That’s still tough….Im leaning towards no on that one.
Logan’s not good today.
I read somewhere they clocked AJ’s FB around 94 MPH. Not bad for ST.
kate if he’s picking 9th, cano will be long gone when he picks. he’s going pretty much 5-7th in standard 5×5 leagues.
Is it bad that the Yankees really don’t have any base hits this spring?
G. Love March 2nd, 2011 at 2:21 pm
He’s on the Mets, injured, had shoulder surgery and can’t pitch yet and is owed MILLIONS of dollars. It’s downright bizarre.
*******************
Great post.
“you guys can have A-rod, I am picking Robbie!!!”
Uh, not so fast!
Kate, I just don’t think it’s good business to tell people who your picks are, at least not your competitors!
Blake, maybe, but I’m not willing to sacrifice that many pieces of our future for one player, no matter how great Felix is.
Hard to blame Rodriguez on the bunts. They were nearly perfect.
“Is it bad that the Yankees really don’t have any base hits this spring?”
No.
I wouldn’t trade Montero, I don’t think……..but it’s moot because Felix is not available nor do I think he will be.
The good news for today is it sounds like AJ has a chip on his shoulder. If his personality is the type to be motivated by that, he could definitely do a big reversal on what he did last season. I’d love to see him get nasty and start knocking guys off the plate. He has the stuff to pitch like that.
blake, I knew you were going to take out Banuelos….
Logan’s not fooling anyone.
Cano getting dirty in spring training – love it.
GoldGlove – I’ll tell you if you stop asking negative questions for the rest of the day.
I love all three “killer B’s” but let’s remember that Felix isn’t much older than Betances and is about the same age as Brackman…..and is either the best or 2nd best pitcher in baseball. ….a trade like that would hurt but would also make the Yankees a monster with the best rotation, bullpen, and lineup in baseball.
Betsy,
Here the thing though….Felix would be the new future, he’s 25.
Impressed with Romine’s work behind the plate. Logan is all over the place
“Is it bad that the Yankees really don’t have any base hits this spring?”
Even if they didn’t I would say it wasn’t of major concern. But they do.
*************
stuckey – please don’t ask. I don’t think there is any debate. I’m in the minority on the forum when it comes to not needing to talk about “possibilities ad nauseum” especially when a game is going on. But apparently people feel the need to talk about trades that likely never will happen, endlessly.
It’s a baseball forum so it’s fair game.
But during a game you’d think they’d be more interested in watching the game so that they’d be better informed on whether or not their endless trade talk even makes sense.
“Blake, maybe, but I’m not willing to sacrifice that many pieces of our future for one player, no matter how great Felix is.”
Betsy, the counter argument to this if of course personified by Joba Chamberlain.
Doing it at the major league level and being a really, really good prospect are just two different animals entirely.
# Irreverent Discourse March 2nd, 2011 at 2:27 pm
GoldGlove – I’ll tell you if you stop asking negative questions for the rest of the day.
Asked one negative question. My other question was to see if someone could answer my confusion as to why DJ was hitting leadoff, and it was answered properly. I’m sorry you’re having a bad day.
Stuckey,
I really like Banuelos…
So was Joba good today?
I didn’t see whether everyone Boone faced was a lefty, but since that’s his specialty, I’m not stunned that he didn’t mow them down 1-2-3 – or that he was all over the place.
Joba was very good.
GoldGlove – I’m not having a bad day, I just don’t understand what spring training hits (even though you were wrong and they have won a game…) have to do with anything.
Ah, so may I assume trading Hughes at the “height” of this value?
Sorry, can’t help myself.
Blake, he’s a teen, lefty and has that Guidry thing going for him.
I gotta imagine he’s everyone’s fav of the three.
Irreverent Discourse,
Arod is more valuable in a roto league then head to head because you want consistent guys in head to head. Arod is very streaky. Plus most head to head leagues are weekly leagues so Arod has a tendency to miss some games during the week he can’t get replaced till the next week. Yes steals are one cat but the goal in the first 3 rounds in a 5 by 5 league should be to get as many 5 cat hitters as you can.
Go look at any ADP list. Yahoo,MDC,ESPN. All of them have Wright ahead of Arod.
Joba gave up a few hits but I think it was more his unfamilarity with Romine than anything else. But he still pitched a scoreless inning.
Hi, stuckey.
Great job holding that to just one run.
re: Felix. He may be young, but his arm is old. Lots if innings
I don’t really want to give up a ton for Felix…unless CC opts out and ends up on another team.
trisha,
I don’t know if should believe you! Every Yankee is very good in your world at all times, lol!
stuckey
don’t cause trouble, no one wants to trade Phil…well maybe a few did for Felix…
stuckey,
Now stop it. It’s my fault for mentioning Hughes in my rant above. Please pretend we have an edit function and I took that out.
There is no daily Hughes debate in this dojo.
Drop it now!
“trisha,
I don’t know if should believe you! Every Yankee is very good in your world at all times, lol!”
That’s fair G Love!
blake March 2nd, 2011 at 2:28 pm
Betsy,
Here the thing though….Felix would be the new future, he’s 25.
___________________
Doc Gooden and Kerry Wood and Mark Prior all looked pretty good at 24 too
Was today the first appearance for Sergio?
Back to back, really nice hit by jeter
It’s spring training Kenny calm down.
G Love, I retract that! It’s my perspicacity that allows me to realize that every Yankee is indeed very good and my patience that allows me to realize that if they are not at this moment, they will be soon!
great throw.
I would say no on taking Felix just on principal, Seattle played NY so they could get Smoak from the Rangers. I wouldn’t have anything to do with them. Who is to say NY can’t have their own homegrown Felix?
“Was today the first appearance for Sergio?”
2nd I believe. Definitely not the first.
G. I honestly saw no mention of Hughes.
I literally haven’t read a single post here since the Texas series. I thought a past debate was being referred to.
I’ll own up to causing trouble, but this time I’m really not.
Thats what I thought Trisha, but I can’t remember the other one for some reason.
If Joba threw a scoreless inning, then he pitched very good. Blame any issues throwing today on Romine since his father was a Red Sox player. It’s in the blood.
Cano has no hits this spring. He must have been busy reading his press clippings over the winter.
Romine looked good behind the plate.
Anytime you can get a king felix you do it as long as it is not highway robbery.
I would do a montero,brackman,nova in a minute.
We are a win now team that is getting older,cc will opt out,king felix is the best pitcher in baseball,we still keep 2 of the killer b’s & still have gary sanchez,romine,cervelli.
Getting king felix is going to hurt but a rotation of:
cc
king felix
hughes
burnett
garcia???
While still keeping banuelos & betances,i take my chances.
trisha – true pinstriped blue March 2nd, 2011 at 2:36 pm
Funny you should say that! I am always torn wanting to see all the Yankees do well in ST, yet I keep thinking that Baseball is a game of averages and things tend to go to the average of that individual. In other words if they hit .500 in ST, then the next month they may hit .100 to average things out. LOL! So I kind of root for the reverse! LOL!
Girardi said Sergio will start a few out of bullpen and then get a start because he has so many pitchers to work in to so few games.
stuckey!
I’m not taking your bait! Do not write that name in here again! I’m begging you. For the love of Jesus Montero please don’t post that name in here again today!!!
I hope all of you Liriano freaks are listening to this interview.
If you want to know about Hughes or what people would give up for Felix, there’s quite a few posts where hours upon hours in the comments section have been devoted to such topics. It would be really stupid to try to bring it all up again and create more debates. Want to know how people feel about that stuff? Do some research in the posts and have at it. Just quit bringing it up.
That is command folks.
Gooden, Prior, and Wood didn’t have near the track record that Felix has already compiled and Felix hasn’t had Dusty Baker…..he has thrown a lot of innings but they have never abused him.
You can set your clocks for a debate for every 5 days. It’s actually unfair to one person. Kind of taken a life of its own.
But the more negative I hear, the more positive I get.
As long as there’s no hard feelings, it’s all good.
Nice pitching by phelps
If the Yankees do eventually land King Felix, is Felix our #1 or #2?
Nice downhill delivery – Phelps looked good.
i hate to keep saying this, but if phelps was a red sox prospect, pg would be calling him the next mussina.
man, morneau still not cleared to play. concussions are really scary
That’s the David Phelps of the last two years. Even in ST, the kids get the willies
# GreenBeret7 March 2nd, 2011 at 2:43 pm
That’s the David Phelps of the last two years. Even in ST, the kids get the willies
He looked great.
How high can he get the fastball up to?
Phelps is good.
here’s how santana explained his timeline when he was on francessa about 10 days ago.
he was then in the 2nd week of a 6 week program of strtching his arm out with long toss, etc.
he said he would then be able to start pitching and it would take a minimum of 6 weeks from there till he could come back.
as soon as he got off the phone, francessa ‘reviewed’ what santana had said and added an extra 6 week rehab in his fuzzy timeline and pronounced him out till august at least. (he never misses a chance to make this mets season look like a total disaster)
the way johan said it, a no-setback rehab would have him back on the mets by mid june. any setback of 2 weeks or more probably pushes that back to the asb, but the schedule he laid out could have him back before mid-season.
If Phelps were a Red Sox farm hand then everyone would rave about his “pitchability”….
G. Love March 2nd, 2011 at 2:21 pm
You got that right. Just a wee bit of redundancy no ? LOL !
tyanksfan36 – based on prior experience, if anything that has been discussed before could not be discussed again, I believe the forum would grind to a halt.
I’m honestly just playing catch-up with fellow Yankees fans and nothing I’ve asked has sparked a flame war.
Its all good.
Nova, Banuelos, Betances, Brackman, Noesi, Warren, Phelps, DJ Mitchell, Brett Marshall, Stoneburner, Bryan Mitchell, Jose Ramirez, Rafael DePaula.
Where are all these guys pitching in the Bronx?
BryanHoch Bryan Hoch
Francisco Cervelli limping, has foot lightly wrapped. Says he will have x-rays today.
blake, if Phelps were a Red Sox farmhand we’d all be complaining that he’s overrated
Doc Gooden didn’t have arm trouble; he had head troubles.
As luck would have it, I had to be out anyway this afternoon and just got in. I see Romine is in and Cervelli got a foot bruise. GB7 – Romine looks better?
manban > kershaw? holy cow!
Martin : Banuelos more polished than Kershaw at this point.
wow.
Fate would seem to be intervening this spring, no?
Martin comparing Banuelos to Kershaw?
I think only one hour a day should be devoted to talking about Phil, and outrageous trade proposals. Its kind of ridiculous to come on here 4 hours later and people still be arguing.
m
It would be okay if there was debate but people start attacking people on here, things get out of hand fast. Its crazy.
I wish I could be watching this game, or even listening to it. By the time I get out of class it will be over.
Those are some HUGE words of praise by Martin.
stuckey,
My advice to you? Don’t look back. Just stay on the path we’re on. Head towards the light!
Doreen, he does. He must have spent the winter working with a catching instructor. I didn’t see one dropped pitch today…always his problem, along with interference calls. Looked quiet and smooth. want to see it a couple more times, though.
Do we have movement atop the the catcher leaderboard? That would suck for Cervy if he gets significant injury.
Unknown, he pitched in the second game and was the winner. 1-0
************************
“If Joba threw a scoreless inning, then he pitched very good. Blame any issues throwing today on Romine since his father was a Red Sox player. It’s in the blood.”
I knew it I knew it I knew it!!!! Pukelis called Romine’s father and had him screw up Joba for hitting him every time he faced him!
So there ya go. Joba was perfect except for Romine.
yeah, Mel, it would. I want to see who ever gets the job get it by outplaying everyone else.
I’d say “who gives a rat’s butt about Johann Santana, this is Yankee Spring Training!!!” but apparently some people do.
So, uh, never mind.
Wouldnt it be awesome if the blog had a pivot function for comments like in excel lol
Then I could filter out anything that says Lee, Santana, or Bill Smith.
By the way, here’s my Red Sox conspiracy theory for the day.
I believe that Theo through his marionette Peter Gammons, has told Daniel Turpen to pitch horribly as a Yankee on purpose early this spring so the Yankees send him back to Boston via the rule V where once he’s back in Boston, he will be featured in a Gammons article as a future closer, a great clubhouse guy, a family man, one of the best relief arms in baseball and a friend to every fireman, longshoreman, teacher and food truck vendor in Boston.
You heard it here first.
Am I in there pitching now? I tend to discount everything that happens after the 6th inning in early ST games.
LGY,
They are all at different stages of development so, it’s a moot point.
Guys get hurt. Guys get stalled. Guys take longer to develop than others. Guys develop faster than others.
The key is to have depth, which the Yankees have.
Martin’s comments about Banuelos is why he isn’t getting traded and certainly wouldn’t be included in any Liriano talks.
That kid will be in the rotation next year. You can book that.
He could end up, along with Betances, in the bullpen in September.
Both are that good.
“Then I could filter out anything that says Lee, Santana, or Bill Smith.”
I’d add Francisco Liriano and the word “trade” to mine!
“I believe that Theo through his marionette Peter Gammons, has told Daniel Turpen to pitch horribly as a Yankee on purpose early this spring so the Yankees send him back to Boston via the rule V where once he’s back in Boston, he will be featured in a Gammons article as a future closer, a great clubhouse guy, a family man, one of the best relief arms in baseball and a friend to every fireman, longshoreman, teacher and food truck vendor in Boston. ”
LMAO!!!
Phelps looks like the type of pitcher Twins would like.
I love Jack Curry in the booth
SJ,
If Banuelos is in the rotation next year, what are Brackman and Betances doing?
I’m drinking the Manny B. kool aid that SJ has been serving for quite some time now
# LGY March 2nd, 2011 at 3:01 pm
SJ,
If Banuelos is in the rotation next year, what are Brackman and Betances doing?
Yankees have 2 rotation spots open.
SJ -
Among the three of them (Banuelos, Betances, Brackman) who do you think is most likely to contribute in the bullpen come September? I imagine we might see all three.
Exciting times to be a Yankees fan. I keep telling the guys at work about Montero and the pitching that is a year or so off, but all they want to talk about is Cliff Lee. (I work in Philly)
i dont usually speculate about trades but this year its going to happen. even if the young guys come up and pitch great, they will run out of innings and even if hughes and aj pitch great the yankeees will want to bolster the staff with an expeience pitcher.
so its all speculation now, but sometime this season the yankees will make a trade to upgrade the rotation for the PS. and it doesnt have to wait till the trade deadline.
Dave K – I was at a phillies game once, and the guy behind me spent 45 minutes talking to people about how Lidge was better than Mo because Lidge didnt blow any saves one year.
Long story short, they are all idiots.
LGY March 2nd, 2011 at 2:47 pm
Nova, Banuelos, Betances, Brackman, Noesi, Warren, Phelps, DJ Mitchell, Brett Marshall, Stoneburner, Bryan Mitchell, Jose Ramirez, Rafael DePaula.
Where are all these guys pitching in the Bronx?
______________
At Yankee Stadium?
I think I’m drinking that kool aid too Pat M.
I’m almost a little weary of my level of optimism regarding the three B’s as well as Montero. I’m trying to temper expectations. There will be bumps along the way. Those pesky unforeseen issues that can arise at any given moment. But I really, really like these kids.
I wish I remembered baseball before 1995, because I could only imagine what it would be like to have followed Derek, Mo, Posada, and Andy up the ladder.
“Yankees have 2 rotation spots open.”
———————
What happened to Nova?
LGY – Nova is a long term solution now? Come on.
Defense on 4 plays have killed Phelps
I’ve been living and working in Philly now for 5 years – the fans definitely suffer from a complex. All I hear (and all I’ve heard from day 1) is how Lidge is better than Mo, Rollins superior to Jeter, etc.
I had a good time with them though after ’09.
Brewer…you’re a better outfielder than that.
Brackman is in the bullpen or traded and Betances is in AAA, probably a half season away from taking his spot in the rotation.
I believe, if they stay healthy, Banuelos and Betances will both be in the rotation no later than mid-season 2012.
I don’t think Yankee fans understand yet just thow good both of those kids are and why the Yankees aren’t dealing them.
Manny is a little ahead of Dellin because he has greater command of his secondary pitches.
Both kids though are studs.
“LGY – Nova is a long term solution now? Come on.”
——————–
I said they should trade Nova for Liriano yesterday because he is not a long term solution and was criticized for that as well
Shame,
You really didn’t follow Derek, Mo, Jorge and Andy up the ladder prior to 95. There was no internet and the NY papers really didn’t talk prospects much at all.
The most you could get were minor league stats in the sunday NY Times where you’d see names but had no idea who they were. If you didn’t order that one prospect handbook that was around then, you didn’t know who they were.
Spring training was when you’d get a quick glimpse at them maybe. Not a lot of hype for them at all prior to their arrival.
Boys and their toys!
I have a great idea. Instead of enjoying the here and now and watching what is going on in the game why not talk about what possibly might happen in the year 2050 with the Yankee rotation! Instead of letting this season unfold why not worry about possible trades that you pray are going to be made.
Why do you bother following the Yankees if you’re not going to really follow them. Nobody knows how any player is going to work out/progress, so you couldn’t possibly know who is going to be playing/pitching for the Yankees beyond perhaps today!
Geesh
JMO of course.
Do you think Brackman’s long-term role is more suited to the bullpen? Think he ever starts for the Yanks?
I’m about as optimistic as one gets, but even I recognize 2010 was a very “fortunate” year for the Yankees system.
Besides Montero’s slow start, Romine’s slow finish and the 5 minutes that was Christian Garcia’s latest comeback, almost EVERYTHING went right for the Yankees, some to ridiculous lengths.
Expect SOME adversity this year.
Brewer’s a very good right fielder and a good center fielder. Left is completely backwards for him.
Oh SJ I know both kids are studs. I wouldn’t trade Manny for Liriano.
This may come as a surprise because I am for trading Betances for Liriano, but he is actually my favorite prospect in the system. Remember reading an SI article on him when the Yankees drafted him and have been following the kid ever since.
Just trying to balance short and long term goals here and I happen to think very highly of Liriano.
I like Nova. Nobody knows whether or not Nova is going to be a long-term solution. It appears he does have the ability.
Maybe we wait and watch!
“I believe, if they stay healthy, Banuelos and Betances will both be in the rotation no later than mid-season 2012.”
Which one will be taking Cliff Lee’s spot?
Sorry, that’s been in my system all winter and I’m getting it out now…:-)
I hate to bring this up, but unless a trade happens or Soriano opts out, the Yankees actually don’t have an open spot in the bullpen for the forseeable future.
Long man
Logan
Feliciano
DRob
Joba
Soriano
Mo
There are no open spots out there.
SJ, unless NYYs get a really good deal on Brackman, always felt he was a closer in waiting.
I love Jack Curry, too.
***
Perhaps I should shut the tv. They’ve been doing well without me watching. This is a sloppy inning.
Have a good day guys.
I think I’ll watch the game and talk to myself about today’s game and the Yankees as they are now.
Later.
SJ -
What makes Brackman the expendable one?
***
I should’ve shut the tv. They did better when I wasn’t watching. Sloppy inning there.
I remember reading the Yankee minor league stats in the Sunday times every weekend. I was very confused that we had a B. Williams and G. Williams who were both OF’ers.
If you followed their stats in the minors, I vaguely remember that Gerald Williams always had better stats than Bernie Williams, so I was convinced that Gerald Williams was going to be a superstar when he came up and Bernie was “the other Williams”.
By the end of 2012, Burnett will be ripe for trading with 1 year left on his deal.
I think the Yanks will have the following rotation to start the year:
SP1 – CC
SP2 – AJ
SP3 – PH
SP4 – Nova
SP5 – Garcia
I think the Yanks will have the following rotation on Sept 1:
SP1 – CC
SP2 – AJ
SP3 – PH
SP4 – Nova
SP5 – Brackman
LGY, he’s good, but I don’t think Robertson is going to block a huge ceiling guy.
And I’m not sure Chamberlain is destined for a long career as a Yankee reliever. Some team (Texas) will decide he’s worth a shot in the rotation and will give a little something up for him.
If as Martin reportedly said Banuelos is already more polished than Clayton Kershaw then Banuelos should be in the Yank rotation now. Given the limited opportunity Martin has had to see Banuelos pitch I suspect the wish may be father to the thought.
This fielding by the youngsters has been an issue throughout the system for quite a while. They have to get more/better instructors at all levels.
GB – I had the same thought.
Wave – I think his innings limit is a factor here.
I have heard Banuelos compared to Santana. Does anybody have any comps for Betances?
I would still like to see the Yanks bid on Darvish if he posts
LGY…..Ivan Nova is going to surprise many here who just don’t get it…..
Brewer looked very awkward on the balls hit down the line. Romine did not impress catching Phelps.
Why do you bother following the Yankees if you’re not going to really follow them. Nobody knows how any player is going to work out/progress, so you couldn’t possibly know who is going to be playing/pitching for the Yankees beyond perhaps today!
–
Perhaps people who follow every level of the yankees and baseball abroad are following the Yankees more closely than you are? Why do you care what everyone is posting? Are you only able to do one thing at a time? Some people are capable of watching a game and having a discussion at the same time.
Maybe try not policing the other fans.
Zero reason to bring Banuelos north with the Yankees and put him on the 40 man roster until he gets to at least one season of 150 innings.
Wave,
He might have been had he not lost two months of last season due to his appenecdomy.
He needs innings. That’s why he’s not in the rotation right now.
Doreen,
The only reason Brackman is more expendable than Betances or Banuelos is age. At 25, he’s older than the other two.
Even so, they won’t trade him unless it’s for a deal involving an impact player.
Absent that, he’s part of their future.
“Zero reason to bring Banuelos north with the Yankees and put him on the 40 man roster until he gets to at least one season of 150 innings.”
Yes, in part because Banuelos is not as polished as Clayton Kershaw.
If as Martin reportedly said Banuelos is already more polished than Clayton Kershaw then Banuelos should be in the Yank rotation now. Given the limited opportunity Martin has had to see Banuelos pitch I suspect the wish may be father to the thought.
–
If he is as good as Kershaw then he should be up midseason from AA to the majors. But I suspect his innings issue will stop that from happening, but I think it is certainly reasonable to think his ability right now could play in the majors.
We’d never know unless the Yankees call him up.
“LGY, he’s good, but I don’t think Robertson is going to block a huge ceiling guy.
And I’m not sure Chamberlain is destined for a long career as a Yankee reliever. Some team (Texas) will decide he’s worth a shot in the rotation and will give a little something up for him.”
————————
Maybe, but then what do you do with DRob? Also, Joba has 3 more years of team control left, so while he may not be signed as a FA the Yankees still control him for 3 more seasons if they want.
Basically, the Yankees have a crapton of pitchers between the Bronx, Scranton, and Trenton and only 12 spots to go around (with some of those spots already basically guaranteed for some players).
Something has to give whether it is trading some of the kids or trading some of the big leaguers.
Ok, my gameday says phelps gave up 4 runs, none earned. How did that go down?
Did Martin say he was more polished and Kershaw, or more polished than Kershaw was at a comparable age?
Because those are two different things.
Did Martin say he was more polished and Kershaw, or more polished than Kershaw was at a comparable age?
Because those are two different things.
–
Kershaw made the majors at age 20… which would be this year for Banuelos.
Dave K March 2nd, 2011 at 3:07 pm
I’ve been living and working in Philly now for 5 years – the fans definitely suffer from a complex. All I hear (and all I’ve heard from day 1) is how Lidge is better than Mo, Rollins superior to Jeter, etc.
_______________
Dave–
For the past few months, I have been working on a project in Philly and definietely know what you mean. Phillies fans are nuts. Gladly, I’ll be wrapping up soon and heading home.
if aj can repeat that delivery rothschild taught him, he might be onto something
not exactly breaking 2 lamps in a room, right Randy…
“We’d never know unless the Yankees call him up.”
The problem is that as far as pitchers go the Yanks don’t have a great track record when it comes to the minor league-major league transition.
The problem is that as far as pitchers go the Yanks don’t have a great track record when it comes to the minor league-major league transition.
–
Hughes, Joba, and Kennedy were all pretty good in their first call ups.
“Did Martin say he was more polished and Kershaw, or more polished than Kershaw was at a comparable age?
Because those are two different things.”
I thought Kaye said the former, but maybe he intended the latter.
Martin said that Banuelos is more polished than Kershaw when Kershaw first came to the majors.
LGY, depth charts are almost always tested with injuries to some degree.
But as unusual it would be for the Yankees to trade a productive player, it’s always a tool in the bag.
“Hughes, Joba, and Kennedy were all pretty good in their first call ups.”
I’d say all three had their ups and downs, but overall more rocky than not.
Pat M. March 2nd, 2011 at 3:24 pm
LGY…..Ivan Nova is going to surprise many here who just don’t get it…..
_____________
Agreed
Its just another way of saying banuelos could succeed in the majors *right now*, which I don’t think many people doubt in the baseball world. The only thing stopping him is pitching innings, which I don’t think is really polish as I understand it.
Alex is on WFAN. Said all his daughters want to do is feed him popcorn
I’d say all three had their ups and downs, but overall more rocky than not.
–
Nah, come on. Kennedy had like a 1 ERA in his september call up and Hughes was good + great in the playoffs in 07 and of course Joba was amazing.
The next year kennedy and hughes were injured, but I don’t know if the Yankees could have done something to stop that by keeping them in the minors.
The Yankees have not allowed Banuelos to pitch winter ball, so, this is the extent of his innings in pro ball.
http://www.thebaseballcube.com.....l-Banuelos
216 innings in 3 years of pro ball.
Martin said Namuelos is more polished than Kershaw at the same stage of development.
Had he not lost time last year, he would be in the same developmental track as Kershaw.
Since Manny is only 19, and Martin has caught both, perhaps he has greater insight on them than some on here.
The fact is, Manny’s change up is already upper level quality. His command is also ahead of his experience/age level.
He just needs more innings and a little more time to round out his development.
Once he gets them, and stays healthy, he’s in the rotation.
arod on francessa. not taking the bait of excuses for the past 2 seasons.
sounds so relaxed.
move him up another notch on the draftboard.
jerkface-
Come on, Kennedy had a good m onth, then came up the next year, started poorly, got hurt and the Yanks essentially gave up on him.
Joba we all know the story, the great 2007 and then what came after?
Hughes? He would still be in the pen if Wang hadn’t gone south.
Alex said he will keep on top of Robbie to make sure the drive and hunger stay strong.
“Since Manny is only 19, and Martin has caught both, perhaps he has greater insight on them than some on here.”
How much has Martin caught ManBan?
you can have Arod Ys Guy, I want Robbie
Thanks, SJ.
so i didnt hear this martin quote directly yet.
did he say manny b is as developed as kershaw was at the same age?
anybody have the link?
“you can have Arod Ys Guy, I want Robbie”
Cano will likely go before Rodriguez, Kate. Don’t wait on him.
“How much has Martin caught ManBan?”
He could probably pick him out of a lineup now.
“Since Manny is only 19, and Martin has caught both, perhaps he has greater insight on them than some on here.”
Exactly who is disagreeing with Martin?
I just wanted to know what he actually said.
I haven’t seen anything but superlatives in reference to Banuelos. People are simply astutely discussing his innings limitations and his place in the rotation whenever that’s less of a factor.
robbie goes #6 he wont be around if im picking arod.
Ys Guy-
I don’t have Martin’s actual quote. I just heard it reported during the game. If somebody has a link to the actual quote, that would be cool.
“Joba we all know the story, the great 2007 and then what came after?”
A VERY effective 2008 by any reasonable standard of measurement.
Martin said : Manny is more polished than Kershaw.
“A VERY effective 2008 by any reasonable standard of measurement.”
Yeah, I hear Joba is either the 8th inning set-up guy or a lock for the rotation.
Oh, wait a minute…
ok so kershaw went 5-5 4.26 107IP, 109H 100K 52 BB with the dodgers his rookie year at 20 y/o.
Joba we all know the story, the great 2007 and then what came after?
Hughes? He would still be in the pen if Wang hadn’t gone south.
–
Hughes would still be in the pen? Uh I doubt it.
Ys Guy, great job by Alex in the interview.
*************
Kate, I want Alex
Yeah, I hear Joba is either the 8th inning set-up guy or a lock for the rotation.
Oh, wait a minute…
–
Meanwhile Hughes is a good starter who won 17 games, and Kennedy put up an excellent season without spending any extra development time in another system.
yeah some people are saying they mean manny is more polished than kershaw now. thats ridiculous.
ARod said he’s never see so many talented prospects. Said that The Yanks are ‘loaded’.
Fran
I thought you wanted Robbie, or do you want them both?
“We have guys here in the minors now I wouldn’t trade for anyone”- Alex Rodriguez
Picking Banuelos out of a line-up is easy. He’s the one that looks like a senior high school kid…like Pena.
“Meanwhile Hughes is a good starter who won 17 games, ”
And it took him 4 years.
“Kennedy put up an excellent season without spending any extra development time in another system.”
Emphasis on another system.
Hughes was good in 07, injured in a significant manner in 08, and excellent in 09 and 10. Seems he made the transition.
WYH – context, brother. Context.
“The problem is that as far as pitchers go the Yanks don’t have a great track record when it comes to the minor league-major league transition.”
Someone then brought up Chamberlain.
There is no argument that Chamberlain isn’t as effective as we thought he’d be, but he “transitioned” just fine. Which is a fair and relevant contextual rebuttal to your assertion.
Emphasis on another system.
–
WITHOUT. He was traded and immediately broke camp with the diamondbacks.
Phelps works low 90s but dialed up 95 a few times last year.
Banuelos and Betances are givens. Brackman, though the oldest of the three, could stilll surprise based on how it was coming together last year. In that case, you keep him, too, if you can.
He’s caught bullpens with him since he came to camp.
That’s how catchers get to know pitchers.
He also saw him pitch the other day.
You don’t have to be a pitching genius to see how good the kid is and whynthe Yankees have placed the value on him they have.
I know catchers who have caught the kid, and faced him in games, who rave about how good he is.
Folks can play the contrarian role if they feel they need to do so.
However, Manny Banuelos is the real deal and he’s going to be in the Yankee rotation very soon.
BTW,
Hughes wouldn’t still be in the bullpen of Wang didn’t get hurt. He was always going to go back to being a starter.
Wang’s injury has nothing to do with it.
Some crankiness here today.
“WITHOUT. He was traded and immediately broke camp with the diamondbacks.”
NOT with the Yanks. Which was my original point.
And I would argue that Joba is STILL in a transitional phase, which supports my original point which you so kindly quoted.
“Folks can play the contrarian role if they feel they need to do so.”
LOL…
Who is???
“He also saw him pitch the other day.”
One inning, I believe.
“Hughes wouldn’t still be in the bullpen of Wang didn’t get hurt. He was always going to go back to being a starter.”
Yes, of course. I was overstating to make a point. It took forever and some chances of fortune for Hughes to be installed permanently in the rotation.
stuckey99-
Don’t worry, SJ44 was just making one of his little jokes at my expense.
NOT with the Yanks. Which was my original point.
And I would argue that Joba is STILL in a transitional phase, which supports my original point which you so kindly quoted.
–
Which young players came up and weren’t in a transitional phase for a few years? And what the heck, what does the Diamondbacks transitioning service (does this even exist) have to do with Kennedy going from the Yankees minor leagues to the majors and succeeding? It seems the Yankee minor leagues prepared him to start in the majors.
Kate, I’ll take both
Seriously if both are available, I’d take ARod.
“And I would argue that Joba is STILL in a transitional phase, which supports my original point which you so kindly quoted.”
If by “transition” you mean quickly developed into a quality major league and STAYED that way indefinitely, well then that’s a very specific definition.
But the leading theory regarding Chamberlain post-2008 is his shoulder injury sustained that season.
Critiquing his “transition” (he proved effective as both a starter and reliever) seems a little misplaced.
we gon’ win dis game
Here we come. Let’s make this comeback happen kids.
Hey UnKnown, way to stick with the game.
# 77….I remember that uni number
“Which young players came up and weren’t in a transitional phase for a few years?”
Clayton Kershaw? Just to pick a name at random…
Theres that Toolsy Mesa that you guys where telling me about yesterday upon my inquiry. Yes Baby.
I like Melky Mesa, I hope he can keep his strikeouts under control enough to make it to the bigs.
Those Melky’s like the 9th inning.
Now lets finish this, I don’t think anyone really wants to go extras.
1. CC (at least 5 years depending on the opt out)
2. Hughes (3 more years of team control)
3. AJ (3 more years)
4. open
5. open
6. long man
7. Logan (2 more years of team control)
8. Feliciano (2 years)
9. Robertson (4 years)
10. Joba (3 years)
11. Soriano (1-3 years)
12. Mo (2 years)
What’s gonna give?
“It seems the Yankee minor leagues prepared him to start in the majors.”
Yes, but not with the Yanks. Come on JF, give it a rest.
Yo SJ…..Which way is the wind blowing ??? Beware of the yellow rain
Clayton Kershaw? Just to pick a name at random…
–
And from the same system it took time for Billingsley to be made a full time starter. So whats the point? The dodgers seem just as hit or miss. They got 1 guy, Kershaw who came up from AA and it took him another year to pitch 200 innings.
Melly Mesa, my sleeper … well, maybe not sleeper … my resting on the couch prospect for 2011.
Melky take your number, Pat M.? I figured that it would be retired by now.
Yes, but not with the Yanks. Come on JF, give it a rest.
–
What does that have to do with how well they prepare their players? Its still the Majors.
What did Melky do?
This is fun sorta.
You weren’t overstating your poimt. You incorrectly made a point.
Catching bullpens is how catchers learn about their pitchers. At this stage, it’s more valuable than catching them in games.
Developing pitching takes time. Needing 3-4 years to make the majors is not an excessive amount of time. In fact, it’s about the average time it takes to reach the majors.
At this point, only a person either unfamiliar with the arms in the system or one who believes none of these kids will tuen out will argue the inability of the Yankees to develop pitching.
Right now, the organization has an embarrassment of riches with their young arms.
Fans may be impatient but, that doesn’t change the fact the pitching talent is there and the Yankees are beginning to add these arms to their major league roster.
“Which young players came up and weren’t in a transitional phase for a few years?”
Clayton Kershaw? Just to pick a name at random…”
lincecum
1. CC (at least 5 years depending on the opt out)
2. Hughes (3 more years of team control)
3. AJ (3 more years)
4. open
5. open
6. long man
7. Logan (2 more years of team control)
8. Feliciano (2 years)
9. Robertson (4 years)
10. Joba (3 years)
11. Soriano (1-3 years)
12. Mo (2 years)
–
What are we talking about here? I can see the Long Man, Logan’s spot, Robertson’s spot, Joba’s spot, and Soriano’s spot, as well as the 2 rotation spots being available indefinitely.
What was WYH’s original point?
Pat M. March 2nd, 2011 at 3:57 pm
Yo SJ…..Which way is the wind blowing ??? Beware of the yellow rain
———————————————————————————————————————-
LMAO. I always remember that Bouton line from “Ball Four”.
LGY, between injuries, loss of effectiveness, and contractual options/uncertainty, I can see 6 of those spots opening up within 2 years without breaking a sweat.
“What did Melky do?”
Singled in the tying runs…….then got tossed out stealing.
I knew I shoulda recorded past 4 pm
Anyone that thinks our bullpen will consist of mostly the same pitchers in three years….please, watch more baseball.
GB……It’s a very or at least it was a widely used baseball expression …..It still lives on here at The LoHud
What was WYH’s original point?
—
The yankees are bad at preparing pitchers to go from the minors to the majors. I would think no team has a lock on this. Randy’s favorite Twins send their players up and down. The Red Sox struggled to keep Buchholz and LEster in the rotation as well as their parade of scrubs.
Lincecum, Kershaw, are exceptions I’d think, rather than things to be emulated. If we wanted to emulate it, then bring Banuelos up this year.
Thanks, Mell. Did you notice what kind of pitch it was?
GB…. # 77 was my issued number in 73, down from # 91 that I sported in 72
Liriano was very poorly prepared for a major league transition.
i love the yanks,,,but just realized i could give 3 sXXXs if they win this game in the 9th..
I think Nova might turn out to be far better than some fans think.
I hope Laird doesn’t win this game, people will never stop hyping him up.
“You weren’t overstating your poimt. You incorrectly made a point.”
No, I made my point just fine.
I hope Laird doesn’t win this game, people will never stop hyping him up.
–
I hope he does win it, because it won’t change anything except give the Yankees a spring training W they sorely need to keep up with the grape fruit cup.
“Anyone that thinks our bullpen will consist of mostly the same pitchers in three years….please, watch more baseball.”
—————–
Who thinks that?
Pat, sounds like you were advancing up the system. Either that or got to camp early that year.
That Amarillo team with Bouton, Linz and Pepitone had to drive the manager nuts that year. still a great read, as was “Joe, You Coulda Made Us Proud”. Funny stories.
Don’t you just love Melky’s batting stance. Its so awkward
JF-
You won’t give it a rest? OK, I said the YANKS have a spotty track record transitioning minor league pitchers to the majors.
To me, that includes pitching in the majors FOR THE YANKS. That seems obviously part of the premise. If you want to change the premise go ahead but it has nothing to do with my point.
I don’t know what the point of all this is. The Yankees can’t develop pitching?
They developed Hughes, he is in the rotation, and was an all star and 18 game winner in his first full year as a starter.
For all of the Joba talk, he has still been a solid contributor to the team, and still has the potential for more since he is only 25.
David Robertson has been an excellent addition to the bullpen.
Ian Kennedy, developed by the Yankees, is in the Arizona rotation.
Phil Coke helped win the Yankees a ring and is in the Tigers rotation.
Ivan Nova, only 24, now has a shot of taking a rotation spot for this year.
You have three upper level prospects in Banuelos, Brackman, and Betances knocking on the door, along with 3-5 other interesting arms in the system.
This is all since 2006!
I guess it gets down to what folks expectations are in terms of developing pitching.
It seems to me, given these results, the organization is on the right track.
Pendleton was never anything special, but, like Phelps, he knew how to win games.
We’ve had hits and misses. We’ll have more hits as we’ve drafted better AND stopped trading the farm for veteran players.
You won’t give it a rest? OK, I said the YANKS have a spotty track record transitioning minor league pitchers to the majors.
To me, that includes pitching in the majors FOR THE YANKS.
–
So you meant the Yankees have a spotty record transitioning minor league pitchers to the yankees, not the majors? What are you including here? Their instruction? Their use? Their roles? How much value they provide?
Wow that 2-0 pitch was right down the middle.
The umps are fine, they aren’t ruining the sport at all.
YEAH!!!!!
Martin has a great eye. Love that and fits right in.
Take that Wally Matthews. Go cry in your beer with Pete Abe.
THE YANKEES WIN THEEEEEE YANKEES WIN!!
AJ needs to drive back to the ballpark to give Martin a pie!!!!
LOL.
Martin hit a homer?
Well that ended well.
Yanks won that game the same way they were losing it…bad/ugly defense.
SJ44-
I never said the Yanks couldn’t develop major league pitching. And I never said that Banuelos etc weren’t good.
I said the Yanks have had a spotty record transitioning minor league pitchers to the majors, and I stick with that.
I’ve implied that Martin does not have enough experience with ManBan to give me much comfort regarding his comparison to Kershaw, which I will also stick with. I have made absolutely no statement about whether Banuelos will be better than, as good as, or worse than Kershaw.
And I’ve said when and if the Twins ever put Liriano on the market (which I doubt, at least any time soon), Cashman would ultimately be willing to put Banuielos or Betances in the deal, and I’ll stick with that. That is not saying I don’t like either one of them.
As to my point about Hughes, that was made in friendly banter with jerkface, who I trust to ultimately respond in kind. I wasn’t expecting you to jump in because we engage differently.
“So you meant the Yankees have a spotty record transitioning minor league pitchers to the yankees, not the majors? What are you including here? Their instruction? Their use? Their roles? How much value they provide?”
I thought the Yanks were in the majors? Last time I checked they were.
so a few years ago the yankees has 3 good young prospects we were talking about alot: phil, joba and kennedy.
now we see phil is already a #3 and still developing, kennedy got moved out and starts for arizona and joba contributes in the yankees pen.
that is actually great returns for 3 prospects! and the yankees likely kept the best one of the 3 so they played it just right.
thats good development.
I thought the Yanks were in the majors? Last time I checked they were.
–
They are, but so are the rest of the teams. You think there is something unique about throwing a baseball in pinstripes?
“I said the Yanks have had a spotty record transitioning minor league pitchers to the majors, and I stick with that.”
But an assertion like that can’t be made in a vacuum. It’s a relative comparison.
So without some empirical data suggesting there is a body of major league teams with more success at it, it’s simply a shot in the dark.
Which you’re perfectly entitled to take, lest there is any confusion.
Oh, Jesus…now Francesa and call-in is now saying that Torre would have handled the jeter contract differently/better. hey, dummies, it was winter time and Torre wouldn’t have been asked about player contracts even if it was summer time.
Nice to get the win… didn’t want this losing streak to continue. We were reeling for a few games now. Hopefully now we can go on a little run here and get a few wins in a row.
Jerkface March 2nd, 2011 at 4:20 pm
You think there is something unique about throwing a baseball in pinstripes?
***************
Uh. Yes. : )
Will the Yankees be willing to break in 2 of the 3 B’s in the rotation at the same time?
Oh, No!!!! Not the Dreded Florida Reel? Is that anything like the Virginia Reel?
LGY-
no.
correction…***Dreaded***
“Will the Yankees be willing to break in 2 of the 3 B’s in the rotation at the same time?”
Nah…
One this year. One next spring. One mid-2012.
This is of course assuming all three are healthy, productive in the minors and productive when they get to the majors.
And as talented as they all are, the odds of ALL this happening are slim.
There isn’t more home grown talent on our pitching staff (i.e. 100%) because of their world series or bust philosophy. Not because they can’t develop pitching.
So without some empirical data suggesting there is a body of major league teams with more success at it, it’s simply a shot in the dark.
————
LAD, Oakland and Twins come to mind. But to me, the most important part of dev major league starter is the talent evaluation. Aggressiveness in procuring those talents thru means of trade,IFA, draft etc, etc…
“hey are, but so are the rest of the teams. You think there is something unique about throwing a baseball in pinstripes?”
Well, first, of course there is something unique about throwing a baseball in pinstripes! Both trisha and I agree on that point, so I am sure it is true!
Second, be speaking about the Yankees having a spotty record transitioning minor leaguers to the majors, it seems to me apparent that that includes both pitching in the Yankee minor league system and as a Yankee in the majors. That seems to me to be the essence of the Yanks doing the transitioning. If another team does the transitioning, then it would not be the Yanks doing the transitioning, unless that other team were also the Yanks, which would mean there were two Yankee teams which would become very confusing in the standings and besides which I think it was prohibited about 80 years ago by Judge Landis.
All clear?
stuckey,
Who/how/when does one get broken in this year?
Ledger_Yankees Cervelli: MRI was today and results were inconclusive. Doctors must review again.
How did AJ look today ?
I was out.
“So without some empirical data suggesting there is a body of major league teams with more success at it, it’s simply a shot in the dark. ”
With all due respect, stuckey99, I think that was not a comparative statement. I was just talking about our guys. And of course it’s just my opinion, I don’t get it direct from the Almighty.
The baseball is the same for every team (except maybe the rockies). The only thing a yankee player has to deal with is that they will get passed up or replaced quicker if they don’t succeed. Its easier to hang around on the Royals.
But as stuckey said, what are you comparing it to? Reasonable opinion says that the yankees getting 3 of their pitching prospects to succeed at the major league level is a success.
our WS or bust statement may net us lower amateur drafts, but there are other means to procure talents via IFA or overslot picks. Betance and Brackman was part of that, so is marshall and many others, we got Mo, Bernie, Po via IFA. It you have guys who can identify the right talent you will have ml pitching with patience and little bit of grooming. And sometimes, u just get lucky with a guy like Pettite.
“LAD, Oakland and Twins come to mind. But to me, the most important part of dev major league starter is the talent evaluation. Aggressiveness in procuring those talents thru means of trade,IFA, draft etc, etc…”
Well, even if we to agree those team make “transition” pitchers to the majors in superior fashion to the Yankees, they’d still compromise the top 10 percent.
I don’t think I’d feel comfortable calling the Yankees track record “spotty” for anything less than 60%, which means we have to identify about another 10 teams with superior records than the Yankees.
Unless we’re defining “spotty” as “not in the upper echelon”, which would be somewhat an odd way of defining it.
The Dodgers have exactly 2 home grown pitchers in their rotation, unless you count Lilly after 13 years out of the system.
And I don’t agree with your weird 2nd team tangent. Transitioning from the minors to the majors is about the instruction in the minors and the results in the majors. At the major league level Ian Kennedy is doing well. Hughes is doing well. Joba has done well. It doesn’t matter that Ian Kennedy is playing for the Dbacks. He got his instruction from the Yankees.
The Twins fail Wave Your hats definition of successful transitioning.
So Indians fans are arguing right now that they can’t develop good pitching?
why 13 yrs? i give u one, edwin jackson.
“But as stuckey said, what are you comparing it to?”
JF, it I were making a comparitive point I would have said the Yanks have a worse (or better) record than other teams in transitioning etc. I did not use such a term, I simply said something about the Yanks’ record, I am beginning to forget my actual words.
And whatever I said, I still believe.
“With all due respect, stuckey99, I think that was not a comparative statement.”
Likewise Wave, it HAS to be as comparative statement.
Being a .300 hitter isn’t inherently, objectively good. It’s relatively good because comparative history has proven it to be.
Criticizing the Yankees for not doing something that history may demonstrate is extremely difficult is, as I said earlier, a pure shot in the dark, and somewhat meaningless without a comparative control.
why 13 yrs? i give u one, edwin jackson.
–
By wave your hats definition that was a very unsuccessful transition.
“The Twins fail Wave Your hats definition of successful transitioning.”
Where’s randy l?
The Yankees have been horrendous at developing Albert Pujolses
oh, that an arbitrary number jerk.
“Being a .300 hitter isn’t inherently, objectively good. It’s relatively good because comparative history has proven it to be.”
I disagree, stuckey. .300 is indeed a comparitive term, but a spotty record is a spotty record whether all teams are spotty or some are more spotty than others.
# m March 2nd, 2011 at 4:29 pm
There isn’t more home grown talent on our pitching staff (i.e. 100%) because of their world series or bust philosophy. Not because they can’t develop pitching.
—————————————–
But that WS or bust philosophy is their mission statement and it plays a role when it comes to developing. Yes guys on the Yankees get a chance as a opposed to yrs ago when they didn’t but how much of a chance do they get. If Montero struggles how long before you hear “Yankees are down on Montero” Whether it’s true or not I’m sure there will be ppl within the organization that believe maybe he isn’t as good as we think he is. If you’re a prospect on the Yankees you have to produce early or the doubts start to creep in.
Where’s randy l?
–
Don’t get him started. The Twins routinely bring players up too early, watch them struggled, send them back down, it takes year for a twins pitcher to keep a spot and most don’t ever keep their spots.
Liriano? Failure.
Blackburn? Failure.
Baker? Failure.
Duensing? Failure.
Slowey? Failure.
etc.
At least, if you’re measuring them by the same strict criteria that you are applying to Hughes, Joba, and Kennedy
On Cervelli
Ledger_Yankees Star Ledger
CTscan came back negative. Gonna be at least two days.
Garza, admitted failure since they traded him because Stu Cliburn hated him or whatever.
oh, that an arbitrary number jerk.
–
It took Edwin Jackson 6 years to ever pitch a decent season, is what I meant, and he did it for the Rays not the Dodgers. Terrible transitioning by them.
“At least, if you’re measuring them by the same strict criteria that you are applying to Hughes, Joba, and Kennedy”
My point, if I recall correctly, had to do with transitioning and not ultimate success at having homegrown pitchers on the staff.
And I’ve stayed out of the Twins crossfire and intend to continue to do so.
“but a spotty record is a spotty record whether all teams are spotty or some are more spotty than others.”
If we can desctibe the same thing as being relatively superior to comparable success rates AND being “spotty” at the same time, I need to turn in my English language club card.
“If we can desctibe the same thing as being relatively superior to comparable success rates AND being “spotty” at the same time, I need to turn in my English language club card.”
Stuckey99-
You and jerkface are concerned over whether the Yanks do things better or worse. I believe I originally said the Yanks don’t have a great track record transitioning pitchers. “Spotty” was subsequently introduced as shorthand for that. I still don’t think they have a great track record, at least as far as starters go, it took Hughes four years and he got an assist from Wang, the “Joba Rules” and all that, Kennedy getting buried and finally being traded away.
If you think that’s fine transitioning, OK by me.
Kennedy getting buried and finally being traded away.
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Kennedy didn’t get buried. He had an aneurysm in his armpit. Had he been healthy he would have got a shot in 2009.
# Jerkface March 2nd, 2011 at 4:52 pm
Kennedy getting buried and finally being traded away.
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Kennedy didn’t get buried. He had an aneurysm in his armpit. Had he been healthy he would have got a shot in 2009.
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He might not have been buried but he was definitely pushed aside.
“Kennedy didn’t get buried. He had an aneurysm in his armpit. Had he been healthy he would have got a shot in 2009.”
In 2008 he started 12 games for Scranton with a 2.35 ERA.
In 2008 he started 12 games for Scranton with a 2.35 ERA.
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After losing the middle of the season to injury. Though I suppose a team that was better at transitioning would have dumped him back in the big leagues?
I guess you think the Yankees should let their prospects over-ripen in the minors?
Or bring them up and leave them in to flounder or thrive regardless of results?
jerkface,
2008, if I recall correctly, wasn’t a banner year for the Yanks. If the Yanks were that interested they could have called him up, they were going with Aceves and a hurting Pettitte. They didn’t.
“Or bring them up and leave them in to flounder or thrive regardless of results?”
And why are you assuming he’d flounder? Or thrive?
They did call him up, and he gave up 9 hits and 5 runs in 2 innings. Then he had 2009 tanked by his aneurysm
And why are you assuming he’d flounder? Or thrive?
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Because that is what players do? Fail or succeed.
Too many variables other than ‘transitioning services’ go into a rookie maintaining a roster spot. Especially for the Yankees.
This no longer makes enough sense to even continue being silly.
You’ve transitioned this debate poorly.
“You’ve transitioned this debate poorly.”
Compared to whom?
“Too many variables other than ‘transitioning services’ go into a rookie maintaining a roster spot. Especially for the Yankees.”
Ah! You concede my original point. About time.
What was your original point? I’m still saying the Yankees transition their pitchers just fine.