Saturday morning notes: “Bartolo can do some different things”
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Notes on Mar 26, 2011 
Print This Post
| 
Email This Post
When he thought of Bartolo Colon in the bullpen, Yankees manager Joe Girardi thought of Alfredo Aceves, and he thought of Ramiro Mendoza. He thought of those long relievers who could do it all: Spot start when necessary, pitch multiple innings when asked, and get three big outs in key situations.
Girardi believes Colon could be that sort of reliever, the sort of reliever Sergio Mitre never was and the kind of reliever Freddy Garcia probably wouldn’t be.
“Serge was more of a starter,” Girardi said. “He was never really a one-inning guy. We just think Bartolo can do some different things… In a sense, you feel that not asking him to throw 200 innings might be easier on him, physically.”
Those seem to be the biggest factors in the Yankees final decision. Colon’s raw stuff has been impressive, and his ability to stay healthy is a concern. That combination, the Yankees feel, fits best in the bullpen.
Nova was clearly the best option as the No. 4 starter, and Garcia’s track record suggests he’s a reliable No. 5, but Garcia’s similar to Mitre in that he’s unlikely to be an overwhelming reliever. Colon has shown unexpected velocity and movement, and his fastball might play up in key situations. It’s also been five years since Colon last pitched more than 100 innings in the big leagues. The Yankees didn’t want to take their chances on hoping for 100-plus innings from him this year.
“We will make sure that we use him properly, that we don’t abuse him or throw him days in a row,” Girardi said. “We understand this is something he’s really never done a whole lot of, so we have to be smart about it. It’s kind of like when we moved Aceves, who had always been a starter, to the bullpen. How we did it with Phil Hughes when we moved him; you’ve got to be smart how you do it.”
• Colon was supposed to start tomorrow’s game, but now that he’s in the pen, the Yankees want to keep him fresh for Thursday’s opener. Colon will instead pitch briefly out of the bullpen on Monday. Tomorrow’s starter will be someone from minor league camp.
• A.J. Burnett will start on Monday, Garcia will start on Tuesday and Ivan Nova will stay behind to start a game on Wednesday. Phil Hughes will pitch in a minor league game on Tuesday.
• One other thing to consider about Colon in the bullpen: “He warms up quick,” Girardi said. “Larry talked about it, that when he gets ready for his bullpens, it’s quick. Serge wasn’t really fast about it because he had always been a starter. Most starters can’t do it very quickly.”
• Girardi said it’s “conceivable” that the Yankees will skip Garcia the first time through the rotation. This was one of those moments when “conceivable” clearly meant, “likely.”
• Pedro Feliciano is dealing with the same upper-arm tightness that slowed him down earlier this spring. He seemed to be on his way back, but Feliciano felt it again during his most recent bullpen. He’ll throw off flat ground tomorrow, but Opening Day is in doubt. The Yankees should know for sure by Tuesday.
• The first two pitchers Girardi named as possible replacements for Feliciano were Romulo Sanchez and Luis Ayala. Asked about Mark Prior, Girardi said, “anything is conceivable.” This time, though, the word conceivable was clearly being used to indicate a scenario that’s not at all likely.
• Girardi still thinks there’s a chance Curtis Granderson will be ready for Opening Day. He’s supposed to run and throw today. Tomorrow he’ll take some dry swings with a broom stick, and if that goes well, he’ll also hit a few balls off a tee tomorrow. “There’s a chance,” Girardi said.
• George King noted that Eric Chavez can ask for his release today, but it’s clear he’s going to make the team. “He’s looked really, really good,” Girardi said.
• Still no final decision on a backup catcher, but Girardi again sounded like he was leaning heavily toward Gustavo Molina. He compared Molina to Garcia, in that the Yankees knew what to expect from Molina and didn’t feel the need to give him many at-bats this spring. “We wanted to see what our kids could do, so we gave them a lot of playing time,” Girardi said. “Now we’ve started to play Molina more. If we decide to go in that direction, we want him ready to go.”
• Is the lineup set with Brett Gardner first and Derek Jeter second? “Still a topic of discussion,” Girardi said. “They’ve gotten plenty of opportunities to do it here and it’s been pretty good.”
• For you numbers folks out there: Kevin Millwood was given No. 45, and Chris Dickerson will wear No. 39.
• Off the bench: C Gustavo Molina, 1B Eric Chavez, 2B Doug Bernier, SS Ramiro Pena, 3B Ronnie Belliard, LF Austin Krum, CF Justin Maxwell, RF Abe Almonte.
• Out of the bullpen: Mariano Rivera, Rafael Soriano, Joba Chamberlain, Dave Robertson, Boone Logan, Mark Prior, Luis Ayala, Romulo Sanchez, Steve Garrison, Josh Schmidt, Pat Venditte and Chase Whitley.
• If you’re curious, I had a Brian Cashman story in the paper today.
Associated Press photos
They have better depth on the ML roster, apart from catcher, than they have had in recent seasons.
I suspect that Colon, if he remains healthy, will start at some point for them.
Colon can pitch in middle relief with Feliciano out.
Ayala or Sanchez can be the longman.
I think Nunez getting the start today and the fact he has nearly 20 more AB’s than Pena and has outperformed him makes it pretty clear he has made the teams.
Still find it curious Romine got today’s start with only 4 ST games left (and minor league camps in progress all around them).
Is the Molina talk an effort to try to light a fire under one of the kids?
I think Colon would rather have been a starter and it’s kind of foolish for Joe to say Colon can do all those things like Aceves or even Mendoza when it hasn’t been proven in the slightest that he has a rubber arm like that.
They have Joba, Logan, and Robertson as setup relievers.
Repost
For those of us who are interested in what is happening with the players assigned to the Minor League camp this is from Donnie Collins -
Golson, Russo, Vazquez, Parraz and Laird were officially added to the Scranton/Wilkes-Barre roster. So were a group of pitchers: lefties Steve Garrison and Jose Ortegano and right-handers Eric Wordekemper, Ryan Pope and Warner Madrigal.
Pitchers Tim Notrton, Alan Horne and Grant Duff, shortstop Yadil Mujica and outfielder Damon Sublett were removed from the Triple-A work group and assigned to Double-A
Rich – absolutely. And if Garcia were sent to the pen, I think he’d be starting at some point. The one thing you can always rely on (well, I’d say 99% of the time anyway) is that your 6th starter ends up being part of the rotation at some point or another.
I love Girardi, the way he manages, and what goes into his decision-making. I’m happy he’s the Ys manager.
Not exactly encouraging news on Feliciano
# MaineYankee March 26th, 2011 at 11:14 am
mick
Neither of those two will get enough time off that early to justify having both there.
Possibly if they plan to use one as a 5th OF.
===============================
Maine
See my 11:12 above.
Either way is fine with me.
“I think Colon would rather have been a starter…”
So what if he did?
Cervelli could be up sooner than we think…
Romine starting probably as more to do with Banuelos than anything else.
I’ll say this. Certainly well-though-out reasons for keeping Colon in the pen. Not that I didn’t think they wouldn’t be. Girardi has a lot of savvy with these things. He’s dealing with fact and not pure emotion. I think his engineering background serves him well when it comes to that stuff.
Colon hasn’t pitched in the majors in a while. No need to overtax him, especially when he can serve so well in other capacities.
“Cervelli could be up sooner than we think…”
Don’t bum me out, mick!
“I really hate ST.”
lgy-
from following the yankees for almost 60 years, i don’t pay much attention to spring training except to hope that everyone stays healthy and to keep a watch out for the new guy who’s going to be a yankee for the next 10-15 years.
april will get my attention, but it’s really may that i start watching closely.
i think montero is going to be a big star, but i have no expectations for the first 6 weeks. he could go anywhere from hitting .100 to having an ops of 1.000. either one wouldn’t change my long term view of him.
my hunch if he starts on the mlb team,he’s going to be a .220 back up with some power for the first few months . and it won’t matter one bit. the kids going to be good. real good.
So what if he did? The point is, Joe has his reasons for sending Colon to the pen, but he shouldn’t make it sound like he’s doing Colon a favor – that’s weak.
etsy March 26th, 2011 at 11:12 am
Trisha, no I did not……and I wanted to read some more on this 5th starters stuff. What I’ve stopped reading are editorials, especially those that appear to harp on the negative.
===============
Then why do you dwell on it?
“Romine starting probably as more to do with Banuelos than anything else.”
Maybe, though Banuelos’ calling card is his command and advanced approach. Seems like someone who could throw to anyone.
The plan could be Molina for 2 weeks then Cervelli 2 weeks, then Montero.
While Colon may have preferred to be a starter, my guess is that he is tickled pink to be on a team, tickled pink to be with the Yankees and going back north in any capacity, and knows full well that as the sixth starter he will definitely end up seeing starts eventually. In the meantime, he continues to get work in, especially when he comes in as middle relief or for longer stints if one of the starters doesn’t make it out of the 4th or 5th inning, as is wont to happen.
Isn’t Banuelos starting today on tv at 1?
So it’s weak, Joe is talking to the Yankee fanbase not Colon.
Yes, Banuelos is starting today.
Betsy, he is doing the guy a favor by not taxing his arm when the guy hasn’t pitched more than 100 innings in 5 years! And I truly believe that baseball players understand that and don’t likely take it as sounding weak.
“So what if he did? The point is, Joe has his reasons for sending Colon to the pen, but he shouldn’t make it sound like he’s doing Colon a favor – that’s weak.”
Betsy, he was a spring training invitee who hasn’t pitched in the major leagues since 2009 and hasn’t pitched effectively since 2004.
He came into camp very overweight and has publicly declared his willingness to work outta the bullpen.
He made team. Scratch that. He made the YANKEES. And the Yankees traded a pitcher away just to be able to keep him.
Your view that a bullpen assignment is some form of punishment continues to perplex.
I have a hard time understanding any position other than Colon is a very, very happy man this morning.
I suspect Colon will be starting a game sooner rather then later.
Somebody will have a tight something or other, that will warrant him starting.
My guess is Montero starts in AAA, and if he plays well will be up in short order. I also believe if the Yankees think Martin is completely healthy, Cervelli is one of the moves Cashman is working on.
Funny stuff the last 2 days too bad Ruby / ER isn’t laughing, 0 -6 and still rolling down the hill.
C. Buchholz (L,0-2)
IP H R ER BB SO HR
4-11-11-6–1—5–4
J. Beckett (L,0-4)
IP H R ER BB SO HR
6-11 7–7–0– 5–1
Read it and weep.
conspiracy theories abound….why did Joe say this or Cash not say anything?
“Maybe, though Banuelos’ calling card is his command and advanced approach. Seems like someone who could throw to anyone.”
He’s still a pitcher that barely had 15 innings above AA ball. He’ll have the catcher that caught him for 2 months with him today for his last appearance in big league camp.
He compared Molina to Garcia, in that the Yankees knew what to expect from Molina
****
I would love to what those expectations are.
?We will make sure that we use him properly, that we don’t abuse him or throw him days in a row,? Girardi said. ?We understand this is something he’s really never done a whole lot of, so we have to be smart about it. It’s kind of like when we moved Aceves, who had always been a starter, to the bullpen. How we did it with Phil Hughes when we moved him; you’ve got to be smart how you do it.”
*hear
Betsy
I’m sure Colon wanted to be a starter too but I think he, like Chavez knows he has to be able to stay healthy and productive and not being relied upon to be a starter might help him to stay healthy and effective.
I would like to hear from Colon on the situation though but I feel his comments will be that he is happy to be on the team. I believe he said he would be willing to go to the pen.
Also, why would they put someone who has pitched over 150 innings last year into the pen over someone who hasn’t pitched more than 50? I know it goes back to who is being most effective but I think putting Garcia in the pen is counter intuitive. The whole innings limit thing is annoying and a constant topic that is never adequately addressed, with Colon in the pen and not in the rotation we wouldn’t have to hear about it after each start.(That wasn’t directed at you but just something else I wanted to add)
“I would love to what those expectations are.”
98.6
I see nothing wrong with what Girardi said in his comments.
“I would love to what those expectations are.”
.122.
He didn’t say his expectations were good…
98.6
=====
A great song. Who did it?
The reason Ruby/ER is so obsessed with hoping for Yankee injuries is because it knows that’s the only way the Sox are going to beat them.
Tyanksfan, true. In any case, I’m glad he made the team and I feel sure that both he and Garcia will be important contributors.
“Tomorrow’s starter will be someone from minor league camp.”
…hoping that’s brackman. if milwood leaves may 1, brackman is in line for first call-up for a starter. it would be good to give him that start to show him how close he is to yankee stadium.
Keith
By the way Chad – great article on Cashman today!
Colon hasn’t piched in the bigs since July of 09. He’s looked good, and performed well, in ST this year, but let’s not overstate ST numbers. He’s on the team and will get a chance to show he can still get MLB’ers out.
Is Keith from the 60′s?
Y, I buy what you’re selling, but it’s just going to be whoever is on turn.
So it hurts Monteros development to only play a couple times a week at the major league level, but it is ok to have Nunez on the bench who is lucky to play a couple of times a month???
Betsy you have a lot more things to be thinking about. Like your trip. Hearing about that pearl place has made me give serious thought to putting a trip together for myself!
“I have a hard time understanding any position other than Colon is a very, very happy man this morning.”
Agree.
Trish, you should, lol. I can’t stand this wait anymore – how I let this many years come between me and WDW, I will never know……………There’s not really a lot for me to do now in terms of planning, though. I have my restaurant reservations and they aren’t changing. I’ve got my itineraries basically set for the parks. Well, I can start organizing- that will keep me busy, lol
98.6 from 1967
I’m of the mind that there’s nothing Montero can learn at AAA that he can’t learn in the big leagues under the watchful eyes of Tony Pena, Jorge Posada, and his manager who was once a catcher. He’s caught every pitcher in March that will be going north.
Gustavo Molina can work 25 hours out of 24 with Kevin Long and he’ll still never be able to hit like Montero.
An unknown factor is how the cold weather will affect Russell Martin’s knees in April. Better Montero than Molina.
mick – it said it hit the charts in 1967
LGY,
Nunez is not on the level as Montero as a prospect.
And Nunez is blocked by Jeter and Cano.
Montero only has Martin on a one year contract in front of him.
Apples and oranges.
Yanks might see a super-utility man as BEING Nunez’s ceiling/ML role, in which case they are giving him the job they project for him.
Doesn’t that make sense?
I thought 98.6 was done by a group like ? and the mysterions .
remember the association? they were good for a while.
Rich
mick – it said it hit the charts in 1967
================ever heard it?
Trisha,
Answered you in previous thread,but I’ll expand. The Yanks have made a mess with Joba CHamberlain. He’s now poised to make them look rather silly. I file this under an instance where the Yanks didn’t “know what they (were) doing.” On the other hand, they deserve praise for hiring Rothschild, & I have even perhaps gilded the lily on the good job they’ve done here.
But Tthey are capable of misfiring. Assuming people in positions of power or who have alleged knowledge always “know best”, or that this gloss should pre-empt the right or even FUN to question on the part of those observing, sits very uneasily with me.
Maybe you enjoy baseball as a great Holiday Float passing by in the street while you gaze from your window. There’s a kind of delight in that, letting it flow through & over you, in a pure, visceral way & I get that. IMO, LIFE should be experienced more like that (even ballplayers say “don’t think” to free up what’s innately theirs without too much intervention, cue Derek Jeter).
But I’ll bet,given your obvious fighting spirit, there are other things in life you’re not nearly so laissez-faire about. I can’t just let the Pinstriped Float go by my window. Sometimes,but that’s not my way of experiencing baseball 24/7. Most stuff that fans groan about doesn’t affect me. For example,I don’t worry too much about slumps in proven players. I don’t segment the season out like that. It’s what I consider pivotal decisions, that can deeply impact the team’s fortunes, that I pay attention to. Those that are misfires can sabotage an otherwise bright looking yr.
Montero getting ENOUGH TIME to warm up the plain silly level of offense his stick brings, & Joba’s now barely breathing ability to contribute another good young arm to THIS 2011 rotation, are two such vital things. The one is virtually already lost while the other still hangs in the balance.
So far, it’s 0-for-1 by the front office. If they make the right call on Montero, i’ll chime in to say so, addressing you personally, since you kindly took the trouble to address me with your thoughts.
Betsy, I was walking with Brian’s wife yesterday (I think I am going to start doing my walks with her, especially since she goes later in the day and with the season starting, things could get very acrimonoius with me and Brian!) and asked her if she felt like going to Disney. She said she would but that she’d rather go to Vegas. If she isn’t up for a Disney trip, I am pretty sure I am going to plan one myself. I haven’t been there in a while. I was in Disney in California with my sister about 6 years ago, but it isn’t the same as Orlando, of course. What a difference when you see the two parks. Cali really shows the wear.
Stuckey
They are not giving Nunez that job though.
He would be the backup 2B and SS and that’s it.
Good morning fellow Yankee fans. Hiya Joe from LI!,
Just curious. Have any season ticket holders received their tix yet?
“I’m of the mind that there’s nothing Montero can learn at AAA that he can’t learn in the big leagues under the watchful eyes of Tony Pena, Jorge Posada, and his manager who was once a catcher. ”
And you’re probably right about that.
But getting him off to a good start (particularly accounting for 2010) for a short period is a whole other, different consideration.
The kid is 21 and people are making it like April and maybe some of May 2011 is some sort of eternal purgatory.
I suspect the Yankees will be very clear with Montero what their expectations are for him and what their plan is if he meets them. I doubt he’ll be twisting in the wind.
LGY March 26th, 2011 at 11:37 am
So it hurts Monteros development to only play a couple times a week at the major league level, but it is ok to have Nunez on the bench who is lucky to play a couple of times a month???
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Nunez will see more time than a couple of times a month. Every time the Yankees are holding a sizeable lead in late innings, Nunez will be in the games to replace either Jeter or Cano to save their legs.
The same applies to Eric Chavez to replace Alex at 3rd base or Teixeira at 1st base. Jorge Posada won’t DH for 162 games and Chavez will also get at bats there.
? did “96 Tears.”
Nobody But Me
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v.....re=related
Why does the BACK UP catcher have to be a silver slugger candidate? Isn’t that why we have Tex, Cano, Swish, arod, posada, granderson?
As long as he doesn’t throw the ball to center field, let them get past him etc then he is doing what he is supposed to be doing.
Stuckey
Some people make this into a philosophical issue about Montero being there from day 1.
Personally I think it’s there own selfish viewpoint of “wanting it now.”
Sure it’s been a long winter but isn’t the onset of baseball enough for them?
The new toy will be here soon enough.
Every time the Yankees are holding a sizeable lead in late innings, Nunez will be in the games to replace either Jeter or Cano to save their legs.
****
How many times a month will that happen?
Trish, who’s Brian? I went to Disneyland for a day when I was 13 and we’d taken a trip to CA -all I remember about it is my sister getting somehow “misplaced” for awhile, lol. People who have gone to both seem to love DL for different reasons than WDW – of course, WDW is much, much bigger. If I ever went to CA again, I would go to DL – it was the original. Of course, I have a huge, soft spot in my heart for WDW. Some people will say that Vegas is like Disney in a way, lol
J Al, here seems to be the difference. My ego isn’t all caught up in whether the Yankees do things the way I think they should. I am bright enough to realize they have far more baseball knowledge, experience, and INFORMATION at their fingertips than I have in my entire life.
Rather than viewing it as a Great Holiday Float, I view it as something that far wiser people have put together so that I can enjoy the best of it without attempting for a second to think that I could have done it better. I am passionate in my love for the Yankees. I have little passion expending energy trying to orchestrate something over which I have no control.
You feel free to do whatever you want. So far it’s 100-0, front office, and whether Montero comes up or goes down, it will still be 100-0 as far as I’m concerned. So your crowing should you be correct will have no impact on me whatsoever since I am of the belief that their decision-making takes the day.
When I posit a thought about what may or may not happen, it’s always in the context of trying to think of what the Yankees will do. I have zero vested interest in anything other than cheering on the team that they put out on the field. After all, it wasn’t you or anyone else here that delivered postseasons or world series rings.
LGY,
He’s been playing outfield (as late as last night if memory serves). If you object to the word “super” qualifying utility, that’s fine. But I do think they see him as someone who might not get many starts in the OF, but at least gives them options late in games.
He’d also likely off the bench as a pinch runner in a LOT of games where Posada reaches base late in games.
But general point still stands.
What do you think of the prospect that the Yankees maybe feel Nunez’s value to be greater to them as a superior utility player to Pena, as opposed to trade bait at AAA?
“Why does the BACK UP catcher have to be a silver slugger candidate? Isn’t that why we have Tex, Cano, Swish, arod, posada, granderson?
As long as he doesn’t throw the ball to center field, let them get past him etc then he is doing what he is supposed to be doing.”
tyanks, I have always thought the same way.
ome people make this into a philosophical issue about Montero being there from day 1.
Personally I think it’s there own selfish viewpoint of “wanting it now.
///
Just curious, because my reading experience tells me that virtually every poster expressing a preference for Montero coming north has intelligently qualified that preference, whether one is in agreement with the opinion or not.
Which “people” in here can’t hold the piss & “want it now” for its own sake?
The bigger question about Montero is what they do with him if Martin goes down for an extended period?
“? did ’96 Tears.’”
I had to look it up. ? and the Mysterians!!!
******************
Betsy, Brian used to post here as “Brian Sox Fan”.
virtually every poster expressing a preference for Montero coming north has intelligently qualified that preference,
===============
the key word being “virtually?”
Stuckey
I think they are wrong because he probably won’t get more than 100 PAs next season.
Seems like a big waste for someone who they speak so highly about and can be a valuable trade chip.
“Which “people” in here can’t hold the piss & “want it now” for its own sake?”
Some of us are a lot more mellow about letting things unfold in their own time. Believe it or not.
Which “people” in here can’t hold the piss & “want it now” for its own sake?
=============================
He wants me to name names.
Cervelli will be rehabbing and begin getting playing time at AAA in about 2-3 weeks. If the plan is for him to return as the BUC then so be it. If the braintrust thinks Montero should return to AAA to get more playing time then so be it. Either way, Molina should be a backup at either AAA or AA.
“the key word being ‘virtually?’”
Very good Mick!
I have zero vested interest in anything other than cheering on the team that they put out on the field. After all, it wasn’t you or anyone else here that delivered postseasons or world series rings.
//
RIght, but cheering on the team they put on the field is automatic. I don’t cheer them the less if I think they goofed on something. They are not mutually exclusive.
I’m glad you cleared that up about not personally contributing to championships. All this time I thought it was ME, & not ARod, that had that heroic run of hitting when we needed it most, to capture No. 27
.
Thanks for your reply.
major major props to ivan nova for winning a rotation spot against some ‘heavy’ competition.
we can make jokes about bartolo but when he walked in to yankees camp he got the respect due a cy young winner with 150+ major league wins and who pitched a gem in his only alcs appearance to beat the yankees.
garcia won more games than aj last year and you can be sure nova knows who he is
nova pitched like it was his spot and he wasn’t giving it up for anyone.
and he didn’t.
“Cervelli will be rehabbing and begin getting playing time at AAA in about 2-3 weeks. If the plan is for him to return as the BUC then so be it. If the braintrust thinks Montero should return to AAA to get more playing time then so be it. Either way, Molina should be a backup at either AAA or AA.”
Ah.
Trish, excellent excellent summary @ 11:55.
“I can’t just let the Pinstriped Float go by my window. Sometimes,but that’s not my way of experiencing baseball 24/7. ”
J . not for nothing, but you have to. You have no other choice.
Your only REAL choice is observing the machination of the Yankees, not affecting them.
I don’t think it’s accurate to call someone who accepts that premise at a deeper level than you as being “laissez-faire.”
You, me, Trisha, LGY, mick, Betsy, et al. We’re all passive observers, not active participants. We have more in common than differences.
mick March 26th, 2011 at 12:00 pm
virtually every poster expressing a preference for Montero coming north has intelligently qualified that preference,
===============
the key word being “virtually?”
///
Virtually, because there may have been one or two posts that screamed “MONTERO! NOW! OR ELSE!” that I’ve forgotten about, although I don’t remember any. But apparently there were a lot more, because you seem to recall “people”.
I’m just asking, since you made a kind of hand sweep of “people” – what people?
nova pitched like it was his spot and he wasn’t giving it up for anyone.
and he didn’t.
=================================
and montero didn’t.
there are no freebies in yankeeland.
except the occasional keychain or visor.
You, me, Trisha, LGY, mick, Betsy, et al.
==========================
Kumbaya my man kumbaya!!
J Al, there are people who have intelligently posited that they believe Montero is ready to come up and there are people who have intelligently posited that they believe Montero needs more time down below.
That Yankees break the tie.
I think Girardi explaned it very well why Colon would be the better BP.
It never fails to amaze me how some folks think they know more about MLB than the GM’s and manager’s.
Both Colon and Garcia had stated they would be willing to pitch out of the BP, so when some that say Colon may opt out if he comes to the BP, don’t follow the Yankees as close as they say, perhaps they’re not all that interested in the Yankees anyway.
I think this will be a fairly strong team, and if we can get a similar performance from Garcia as his last season numbers, we’ll be OK.
I believe Nova will surprise many, and put up good numbers.
Thursday can’t come quick enough, Go Yankees!
I’m just asking, since you made a kind of hand sweep of “people” – what people?
=================
Is that wrong?
I have no problem with Colon in the bullpen and Garcia in the rotation even if that’s not the way it eventually works out.
The good decision made by the Yankees is trading Mitre and keeping Colon, who offers far more potential and contribution in 2011.
By 2012 the Yankees pitching staff should be overloaded with candidates from the system and I doubt that they will be looking for unsigned veterans to compete for roles on the staff by then.
As for Montero, he’s 20 years old. What happens to him in the next few months (or even the entire season) isn’t going to make a bit of difference in his career. I have plenty of issues with the way Girardi manages (sometimes) but can’t argue with any decision he and Pena make about a catching prospect, there is just too much major league experience at a high level for any fan to think they know more.
mick March 26th, 2011 at 12:07 pm
I’m just asking, since you made a kind of hand sweep of “people” – what people?
=================
Is that wrong?
///
Wrong? It’s a question. What people?
We’re all passive observers, not active participants. We have more in common than differences.
=====================================
While it’s a definite kumbaya again some say we are passive-aggressive.
Wrong? It’s a question. What people?
=======================
Not singling you out…
Dionysius – thanks.
Prufrock, in answer to your last question, was it you or someone else who claimed that Montero was already better than Buster Posey sometime in the past week?
Anyone making that claim based on current ability and performance just doesn’t know baseball or is so wrapped up in the thought of a young superstar in the making on the Yankees he/she has blinders on.
well the library beckons….peace all.
Later.
“We’re all passive observers, not active participants. We have more in common than differences.”
Perfect.
peace out mick. (are you studying for exams or something?)
mick March 26th, 2011 at 12:09 pm
Wrong? It’s a question. What people?
=======================
Not singling you out…
////
Thanks, I get that. Let me see if I can eliminate some people, hopefully they won’t think me presumptuous.
Me, Rich in NJ, Jerkface, YankeeFem, & I think also, LGY I believe were all in favor of having Montero here early so that (qualifier) he could GET THROUGH the learning curve of facing ML pitching sooner (logic being) so he’d be in a much better position to contribute sooner & also LATE, when the chase for the division polarizes.
So it’s none of those?
“Some of us are a lot more mellow about letting things unfold in their own time. Believe it or not.”
I continually find it interesting that every spring, very passionate and knowledgeable fans seem to forget how LONG a season it is and how things in August and September can utterly make April and May seem like a whole other season ago.
Remember when the Yankees were 0-8 against Boston?
When people thought David Ortiz was “done” in April and May of 2009 AND 2010?
How many of us thought (including me – guilty) Burnett might have found something last April?
How many of us truly remember that the Yankees got 577 AB’s last year from Pena, Wynn, Curtis, Russo, Johnson, Moeller, Huffman, Miranda and Kearns to really meager combined production, and still led the league in runs scored by a wide margin?
In September 2011, April 2011 is going to distant memory and things we took for granted in the first part of the season will be very, very different back part of the season.
I can make that prediction with absolute certainty it will come to pass.
Montero could come up in June and still win ROY, for instance.
It’s a long, LONG season.
I can’t speak for anyone else, but I must say, I was disappointed to read Girardi singing a very different tune regarding Montero yesterday than he was at the beginning of camp – using himself and Posada as examples explaining why Montero could learn a lot being the backup at the big league level.
Now, Girardi is saying that Montero needs to play everyday. Basically a complete 180 from 4-5 weeks ago.
The thing is that I believe this might be the perfect time to bring in Montero due to the fact that we still don’t know how Martin’s health is going to hold up this season and I don’t imagine Girardi is going to ride him especially hard in April, especially with the expected cold weather and all in addition to having fewer off days earlier in the season than usual. Of course, postponements could change all that.
It would seem that Montero would get more opportunities to play as a result instead of only getting opportunities once a week.
MG March 26th, 2011 at 12:12 pm
Prufrock, in answer to your last question, was it you or someone else who claimed that Montero was already better than Buster Posey sometime in the past week?
///
His bat projects to be better. My point was that Posey contributed to a championship in his first yr in the majors. My belief is that Montero could not only contribute, but that his bat could put the Yankees over the top.
Trisha, no he’s not – I once said I was at the library during my work lunch break and so it’s just another jab at me.
GF,
That’s why I think they probably shouldn’t have talked so much if they weren’t confident he was making the team.
Agreed, blake.
Girardi can be very tight-lipped when he wants to be. Perhaps he should have used a little more discretion at the time.
Montero could come up in June and still win ROY, for instance.
It’s a long, LONG season.
///
If Montero came up in early June, he might have enough of a dress rehearsal to help us over the 2nd half of the season. The worry, for me, is they will bring him up after the ASB.
Just enjoy the great voice of Joan Baez for a few minutes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3AQJZys0cvI
Geraldine Ferrero has just passed away. RIP lady.
I still think they should take Montero personally …..I understand the reasons for not.doing so but I think the upside of incorporating him now could pay off in the 2nd half. He’s going to struggle some but Im willing to accept that. Worst case you can send him back down….his options shouldn’t matter as he’s not going to need them all most likely.
Giuseppe, perhaps the Jesus Montero he was expecting to see in ST was not the Jesus Montero he actually saw in ST.
Understand I’m sure Girardi has seen plenty of tape of Montero, but this is the first time he got to see him everyday since last spring training, when he had a cup of coffee in camp and had no chance of making the club.
Isn’t it entirely possible what the Yankee brass saw from Montero these last few weeks is affecting their decision how to handle him?
We all KNOW he regressed defensively within a few weeks time. We saw it with our own eyes. That he somewhat rebounded just further illustrates that perhaps… just perhaps, the 21 year old is dealing with confidence and/or maturity and/or concentration issues that affected the Yankees plan for him.
Not sure why a lot of smart people are so convinced the plan the Yankees maybe envisioned 8 weeks ago is the plan they HAVE to carry out, regardless of what they may have learned and observed the last 6 weeks?
BIG AL March 26th, 2011 at 12:03 pm
It never fails to amaze me how some folks think they know more about MLB than the GM’s and manager’s.
—
I’ve seen several people now say this.
It never fails to amaze me how some folks think managers and GM’s are perfect and never make mistakes. As if we should just never question them and have zero discussion of their decisions other than complete approval.
Managers and GM’s are not perfect beings. All GM’s make moves that turn out to be bad. Some even are obviously bad at the time of the trade. As for managers, it’s very rare that you become a manager without being a player first. Players become professionals mostly for their physical ability, not because they are geniuses.
So I hardly think it is silly to question moves by GM’s and managers.
trisha – true pinstriped blue March 26th, 2011 at 12:07 pm
J Al, there are people who have intelligently posited that they believe Montero is ready to come up and there are people who have intelligently posited that they believe Montero needs more time down below.
That Yankees break the tie.
///
Sure but mick didn’t question the people who intelligently posited their belief that he should be demoted. He singled out “people” who FAILED to support him remaining with the team, other than “WANT)ING IT NOW!”.
“Basically a complete 180 from 4-5 weeks ago.”
GF – could it be that he’s seen things in the 4-5 weeks that have changed his mind?
But if he was so effusive at the beginning of camp and giving people the impression that Montero was coming up, I certainly see what you’re saying. I haven’t been paying attention to all of the organization comments being made about this and that during ST, because I know it is a very fluid situation. I always had the belief (not impression) that Cervelli was going to be backup so wasn’t really paying a lot of attention beyond that. But I just wait and watch anyway.
“Geraldine Ferrero has just passed away. RIP lady.”
JB one of the few who can sell a Dylan cover. Must be all those yrs they spent together & her angel voice. Joe Hill, Diamonds & Rust, if you really want chills.
Well, this has been fun. mick, get back to me if the spirit moves you. Need to take a walk before taking in the Next Great Yankee Left-hander.
Enjoy the game, folks.
Prufrock, you actually said Montero was a better offensive player, not that he ‘projects better’. You even came back at SJ after he called you on it. I’m not picking a fight, but this is why I place so little credence on the things many of you say on this blog.
——————————————————————————-
J. Alfred Prufrock March 23rd, 2011 at 12:23 pm
Not like he doesn’t warrant the optimism. A guy who can spray HRs all over Fenway Park can’t help us win the East? He’s got power to nearly every part of a ballpark. He’ll kill it in that toystore. Did you notice Posey’s contribution in his first yr? Montero is a superior offense player to Posey.
J. Alfred Prufrock March 23rd, 2011 at 12:46 pm
think it’s overstating it that Montero is, or will be, a superior offense player to Buster Posey.
If he gets that level? Fantastic.
Right now? Not even close.
///
“Right now” he is slugging under .300, too. So much for “right now.”
“If Montero came up in early June, he might have enough of a dress rehearsal to help us over the 2nd half of the season. The worry, for me, is they will bring him up after the ASB.”
Teams fortify themselves at the trading deadline every year.
You’re a smart guy J. but these proclamations about when it would be too late for Montero to help the Yankees, and exactly how much the Yankees would need his run production is just purely arbitrary.
I think the Yankees can score enough runs without Montero to qualify themselves for the postseason partly due to the fact they did last year, and lesser so but also because they did it the year before too.
So I’ll ask you, is there any empirical evidence or data to suggest to you the Yankees offense won’t be strong enough to compete for a postseason berth without the production of someone who’s never had a ML AB?
If there’s one thing posters should have learned about ST is that things are subject to change based on what the Yanks see during the course of ST.
My most recent case in point is when Gardner beat out Melky for the start in CF (was it CF?)
If they are making the decision on a couple weeks of spring training when they admit he might be pressing then I think that’s a little short sided……he was doing fine until he found out he has a real shot to make the team.
Phil, Nova, and CC are lined up then for the Sux of the 2nd weekend of the season.
Stuckey,
Perhaps they also had a hand in his so called struggles this spring?
They told him to focus on his defense and wanted him to stay clear of the bat rack. They also had a lot of glowing reviews on how he looked early on and continued to talk about how they could very easily bring him up with the big club.
Maybe they put a little extra pressure on him, intentionally or unintentionally, with their actions and helped contribute to his regression and “pressing” at the plate?
It wouldn’t be the first time a young kid started to feel the pressure a bit given the circumstances and certainly won’t be the last.
blake – who knows. “He might be pressing” might be kindly euphemistic for “He needs more time down below.”
Maybe, just maybe, they are gunshy about bringing up kids before they think they are really ready to be up, based on their 2008 experience.
In any event, I think we can all trust that the Yankees are out to win, while at the same time, not jeopardizing the futures of their best prospects by doing anything they think might work to thei detriment of those kids.
Did the Metropolitans were Feliciano out the past few years. Shoot.
GF – I haven’t been following Montero but I will say this. If there is any question about his defense, that to me is the better reason for keeping him in the minors (if they decide to do that).
“It never fails to amaze me how some folks think managers and GM’s are perfect and never make mistakes. ”
I’m 100% confident there isn’t a single poster here who has ever made that argument.
Here’s things I’m sure of, however:
The Yankees have qualified for the postseason 15 out of the last 16 seasons. This doesn’t make them infallible. It means their track record is excellent.
Being a member of this forum means understanding that many of its members nitpick daily decisions, and continue to do so on the everyday basis even after the Yankees decision makers prove they were more right than the fans, and perhaps some of the more reasoned critics get unfairly batched in with the daily bridgejumpers and whiners.
But having faith in the Yankees decision makers isn’t blind loyalty, or belief they are perfect, it’s simply factually acknowledging their track record.
Trisha:
Saw your earlier post about Disney. You mentioned that DisneyCA looked old when you were there. I am a big fan of Disney, just curious as to what made you say it looked old other than its been there almost 60 years. I always thought they did a pretty good job of up keep given the amount of people that roll through there.
Well all, good discussion this morning. Interested to see Banuelos today.
Have a great day. The tie that binds is that we are all Yankee fans.
didn’t Montero have a very rocky start at SWB last year? If he goes back there and has a great April plus shows development behind the plate it’s entirely possible that he comes back up in May and the Yankees decide to trade Cervelli. At that point in time it would be based on what they know, not what they ‘project’ or ‘hope for’.
Vineyard, you know maybe because it doesn’t have all of the newer bells and whistles of Orlando, it made me think of it as looking older. They certainly keep it up well that’s for sure.
Trisha,
Maybe…..I do think that with most prospects if you keeping asking the question. “Are they 100% ready” than you may never know for sure that they are and you wind up wasting years of their career trying to figure it out. Players can continue development in the big leagues and sometimes it’s best for both the player and the club to.do that
Thanks, just curious about your perspective. Been there many, many times with my 5 kids. Of course I’m still a big kid at heart as well.
Vineyard when is your 16th birthday?
“Perhaps they also had a hand in his so called struggles this spring?”
Very fair question.
“They told him to focus on his defense and wanted him to stay clear of the bat rack.”
Okay, but one of the oldest chestnuts in baseball is your don’t take your struggles at the plate into the field (which is especially relevant for catchers) and he appears to have done exactly that.
That too should inform his readiness.
“Maybe they put a little extra pressure on him, intentionally or unintentionally, with their actions and helped contribute to his regression and “pressing” at the plate?”
Again, that’s fair speculation.
But be that as it may or may not, two “wrongs” don’t make a right. The impetus is still on Montero to handle the distractions and expectations and play through them.
I’m not a proponent of the argument that the Yankees may have created the situation, so therefore they have to atone for or ignore it.
Montero is still extremely young. A virtual baby for the position he plays.
I still don’t see the fire.
Whenever he starts contributing, be it May, June, July, August, September or April 2012, he will be one of the youngest catchers in the majors.
JAP/ Blake/GF-
I agree with your collective POV’s.
Stuckey-
you did make a good point about the Yanks not seeing exactly what they expected to see.
I’ll have perspicacity either way in the end.
WCYF:
Yesterday, wise guy…………..obviously you forgot or ‘is the card in the mail’ ? LOL !
“Players can continue development in the big leagues and sometimes it’s best for both the player and the club to.do that”
blake, since I have no idea of where Montero is going to end up at the beginning of the season, this thought process may be all wet. I always thought Cervelli was going to be the one to go north, and if that were the case thought of it as a totally sound decision because it would have been best for the club based on the fact that the Yankees have a rotation in flux. I definitely would prefer to have catchers with major league experience dealing with new pitchers. The fact that Posada isn’t catching added to that thought process. For Russel Martin anyway, this is a team of entirely new pitchers. At least he has major league experience. The next best thing was to have Cervelli there since he had familiarity with at least some of the rotation.
If this happened to be a rotation of known quantity (CC, King Felix, Doc, Lincecum, fill in the 5th), I personally wouldn’t have hesitation about bringing up a rookie and letting him work out his kinks, especially one with Montero’s seeming potential.
But we don’t have that. In this case I don’t think it benefits the club, and it very well in turn may not benefit the player.
JMO
Card is in the mail!
“I’ll have perspicacity either way in the end.”
And tell me what beats that!
Later y’all.
Enjoy the game folks.
It’s gonna be fun to watch “The Prodigy”
dismantle the Pitt lineup.
MTU:
How’s the weather out your way ? Been raining straight through here for days on end, Tahoe has gotten 10 plus feet of new snow since Monday.
Just wondering if the rain here has hit you and forced you into rubber dinghies yet ?
The game is on WCBS radio for those interested.
wc:
Let me guess ? You sent the card with Gio and the leftover Chicken Parm in the saddlebags ?
Gio sent me a text and said he is pissed, been on the road too long now without his blanket and pillow.
My chicken parm is too good for goats! Sorry Gio. Enjoy the game.
Mlb.TV is giving a free preview of their online product today. All you have to do is have an account with mlb.com. Great News.
Before I go I just want to tell you about something pretty trisha-like. I’ve watched DirecTV asking myself what the big deal is about their HD since it looks like regular tv to me. So I kept getting a message on my screen about resolution, and I kept ignoring it. Because I want to tape this game (leaving in a few – I can’t DVR DirecTV, only tape) I actually had to go over to the tape player. The same message was on my television, and I finally decided to see what the heck it was all about. Well it told me that for the best resolution (I already knew I had that so didn’t have to bother) I should push the resolution button on the receiver until it went to 1080. I looked down at the button and saw it was on 480.
What a difference!
The difference between TJ SImers and Jon Heyman is Simers has the cojones to say things to a players face.
SI_JonHeyman mike hampton, 2nd most overpaid player of alltime (after aj burnett), retires.
Trisha, a few years ago I had a friend move into a new apartment and got entirely new furnishings, including HD TV’s for the first time.
He had the TV on channel 2 and said he really didn’t understand what all the hype was about HDTV.
This was months after he moved in.
I told him he wasn’t watching HDTV and that the HD channels were up in the high hundreds.
My friend is very smart and has a Masters Degree, btw..
Simers is still slimier, but Heyman is getting up there (what on earth is his problem with AJ – enough already). Ok, so Hampton wasn’t great, but he’s retiring – does Heyman have to kick him on his way out? He’s probably on the list of most overpaid sportswriters…………
So Freddy Garcia is allowed to have the worst numbers in the starter competition and win the spot, but Jesus Montero isn’t allowed to have a bad spring and be brought north for a journeyman who will make us all long for Chad Moeller?
Colon deserved the spot. They Yankees could be taking lightning in a bottle and bottling it now that they shove him into the pen with no set role.
Why there is more allegiance to Garcia who has been a Yankee as long as Colon has is a mystery to me. I get that Garcia threw 150 innings last year, but the year before he bounced around so much he couldn’t even make the Mets.
I hope Colon accepts the role, keeps throwing with the stuff he has and claims a spot in the rotation. I can’t imagine what he feels like doing everything he could this spring short of no hitting everyone and not getting a starter job. And all this stuff about comparing him to Aceves is garbage. Colon never worked as a reliever before in his life. Expecting him to be some jack of all trades out there when he’s spent his career starting every 5th day is silly.
I hope Garcia can pitch well enough to make me not be upset about this, but from what I’ve seen of him this spring, hitters hit the snot out of the ball when they connect on his pitches.
As for Montero being passed over for the Ramiro Pena w/o the glove of catchers, I can’t even start to understand why the team would bring a void of a player north with them for several weeks when you have a young guy who could win a game with his bat and soak up the experience of being in the majors at the same time.
This makes me wonder if the Yankees are keeping Montero’s arb clock shut off so he’s more appealing in a trade.
95 on the gun for the baby banuelos
NEXT===>>>>