No doubt about it, Colon’s back in the game
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on May 03, 2011 
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Prospects are players who haven’t proven anything yet.
It’s an idea that drives me crazy when used in a certain context — as in, trade all the young guys because they haven’t proven anything yet — but it’s also a idea that has to be kept in mind when thinking about short-term production and long-term development.
The Yankees have upper-level pitching depth. If you don’t know that by now, welcome to the blog. It must be your first day. That upper-level pitching depth is an incredible tool, but it’s not a proven tool. The Yankees system might very well have been able to fill the Phil Hughes’ rotation void, but no one knows that for certain.
That’s why Bartolo Colon has been such a remarkable find.
“You think about, if we had to go further down in our system with some younger kids, it’s difficult,” Joe Girardi said. “He has really picked us up.”
Maybe one of the young guys could have filled those shoes. Maybe D.J. Mitchell or David Phelps is ready for the big time. Maybe Hector Noesi would have shined if given the chance. Maybe the Yankees already had the pieces in place to fill in for the extended absence of an 18-game winner. Colon lets the Yankees remove any doubt.
If it doesn’t last, then they’ll begin the process of sorting through the high-end potential, but for now they have the answer right in front of them. And for now, that’s all they need.
“I appreciate the Yankees giving me the opportunity,” Colon said. “I’m very happy that I’m back in baseball.”
Associated Press photo
repost
SJ44,
There were tons of different reports. 1 report had Andy coming back if the Yankees had signed Lee. If LoHud had a decent search function I could find your post on the topic.
If the trial was the real reason why couldn?t he come back and pitcher after that and in the playoffs?
MTU – I agree. This place has been a ghost town lately. I just want to sing sad odes to our fallen friends whenever I’m here. As you could imagine, this makes my coworkers extremely uncomfortable.
And Bartolo, the feeling is mutual.
We appreciate what you have done for us.
Bravo ! Try your best to keep it up.
Colon isn’t lucky. He’s a seasoned veteran that knows how to pitch and it shows in how he spots his pitches. He throws strikes with a purpose. Why else would Tony Pena stick his neck out and recommend that the Yankees give him a spring training look ?
Now he has his old confidence back and at just the right time for the Yankees who should ride the wave for as long as it lasts.
Colon rules.
MTU says it best!
Colon looks like a Hispanic Baby Huey.
Shame-
I’m an optimist, and somehow I just can’t help but think things will gets righted sometime.
Until then we just carry on the best we can. That’s the way it is.
Yeah, ya gotta give Tony Pena credit for Colon. He is so steady on the mound, it appears that nothing fazes him.
I am very happy to hear that Phil’s tests came back negative.
And on a completely unrelated subject, checking out the MLB Schedule, I found some terrible news for BoSux fans. The Angels have only 3 games left to play ALL YEAR against Boston! Boston’s record against all teams not playing in Anaheim is 8-15.(.348) They are 5-0 against the Angels, which is a major factor in them only being 2 games under .500 (.464 at 13-15 ) Unbelievable.
I’m a little surprised with the way Colon must have been pitching in winter ball that the Yanks were the only ones seemingly interested. I think I vaguely remember hearing he has a couple other offers but he went with the Yanks. It isn’t as if they offered him a ‘can’t refuse’ contract, so I wonder if other teams had just written him off.
I broke my hip last Friday, emerged from surgerey and a fog of drugs yesterday, start rehab today (ouch, in advance> But like Bartolo, I’ma thankful to the Yankees and Lohud for keeping me in th game.
Shame-
“Colon looks like a Hispanic Baby Huey.”
But he throws a baseball like the Latin Incredible Hulk.
Tom-
Sorry to hear that.
MTU,
I did go out with a former Cowboy cheerleader some years ago. She confirmed what I had heard and previously rejected, that looks aren’t everything. My wife, of course, has it all. She has seen your hiking pictures and she knows mountain men are peculiar.
This seems to be the year of lost velocity. I noticed Ubaldo Jimenez velocity is also down 3-4 mph this year. Maybe pitchers are babied too much in development and then when they are asked to pitch a lot of innings are just not physically developed.
Colon’s nasty 2 seamer is not a fluke, and it is what has brought him back to the front end of baseball pitchers. He controls that pitch in the zone and it kills both lefties and righties (though it appears to really kill righties when it move back into the strikezone).
He may not be an ace in a month or two, but right now he has been about as good as anyone in the league. I hope for his sake that he signed an incentive laden contract since he has, thus far, been earning a nice bonus over the baseline value of that contract. He was high risk when he was signed, but is clearly high reward thus far…
Gossip Break: http://tiny.cc/gs9ki
Tom – So sorry to hear that but its good to know you’re spirits are high! We’ll try to entertain you the best we can so you don’t get yourself into some kind of Rear Window situation…
Tom-sorry to hear that. Hope your rehab goes well!!
Erin – How did Charlie and his goddesses not top that list? #49 seems kinda low, I think Cammy is holding him back.
Tom-
I have personal experience with this. As long as you are determined you will bounce back well and be 100%.
Just look at Martin.
Austin-
I’m sure she does. Glad you got me off the hook.
The whole point of all the innings and pitch count guidelines is to help to prevent injury.
That said, there does not sem to be a perfect formula, and there probably never will be.
I really like what Mike Marshall has to say on this subject. You might try watching his videos. They are free. just go to his website.
Very informative IMO.
Shame- LOL Something would be very wrong with the world if Charlie and the goddesses topped the list.
Thanks for the good wishes. I’ve met with my rehabbers, now, Simon Legree and Rasputin, and I don’t think much sympathy for my plight is going to flow. so might as well bight the bullet and get the hell out of here as soon as possible!
Tom-
One more thing I almost forgot to mention that I think is very important.
Once your pain level is down a bit make SURE that you specifically request that they put you on a non-addictive type of pain killer.
They have them and they are effective. It’s one less thing to have to overcome.
I believe the generic name is Tramadol. They often just slip you the addictive stuff.
Hope that helps a little.
best of luck to you Tom in your recovery
Tom-
If you meet up with one Named Wratchett who has a hairy legs and a beard, drags a leg, and has a cloven hoof watch out !
Get out of there immediately.
GB can tell you all about “it”.
I like this guy’s attitude!
Wang-
Who me, or Bartolo ?
good morning all. I woke up this morning hoping that my throat would be better, if I could only be so lucky.
I am hoping to catch a game on TV one day, I saw the last inning of the game the other day when they were on TBS. I like reading about them the day after.
Both of you, MTU!!
Ty-
Be glad it’s only a cold and not Maddon’s kisser.
Wang-
OK. just wanted to be sure.
Obviously the worry about Colon is that he gets hurt, or if he doesn’t, what he’ll look like in the summer since it’s been a while since he’s been a FT starter.
But no matter what happens, Cashman has already got more than his money’s worth from Colon and Garcia. They came in and gave a best case scenario for the first month of the season. Now if/when 1 or both of them go down, the Yanks can look at how certain guys are performing in the minors and bring the hot guy up.
I don’t believe Cliff Lee would have been a difference maker. The cost factor of Lee notwithstanding, it allowed the Yankees to get better looks at the young arms and gave them incentive of trying to earn their way without a long term contract blocking their ambitions.
True, Bartolo Colon and Freddy Garcia have been pleasant surprises but the question remains. Would this team have a better record than they have now because of Cliff Lee ? Doubtful.
MTU
thats gross lol
Bartolo expressed his gratitude to Tony Pena and the Yankees for the opportunity in the post-game last night.
He seems even more easy going than CC if that’s possible.
When asked about joking with Andruw Jones between innings last night he said it’s a game and it’s supposed to be fun. A persepctive sometimes lost on some fans (and you know who you are.
)
CC-
To use a few analogies.
If you were a Miner. You stumbled onto the Motherlode.
If you had a lotto ticket. You hit Powerball (
).
And if you were running for President. You just got elected in a landslide.
That’s Bartolo for now.
“Martin is becoming one of my favorite players.”
————————–
me too, Blake. Me too.
haven’t enjoyed watching a Yankee starting pitcher this much, since El Duque in his prime. No exaggeration.
thank you, Bartolo.
TY-
Just trying to remind you to count your blessings.
And that things could always be worse.
I don’t think the Yankees or even Colon himself could have imagined that he would pitch this well. Thing is that his stuff looks as good as it did when he was one of the better pitchers in the AL….as long as that’s there and he keeps locating like he is then there is no reason he can’t continue to do what he’s doing…..as others have said, this isn’t luck…..its legit stuff, command, and know how getting big league hitters out.
Tom,
So sorry to here that….feel better my man.
108 stitches,
No they wouldn’t have a better record if they had Lee but that isn’t the point. Lee makes the difference int he post season not in the regular season. Also if Lee would have come here what young pitcher would he prevented from starting. The only way Nova wouldn’t have been starting was if Pettitte came back as well
cgrand14 It was good to see some old friends and fans last night, but I also loved seeing so many Yankees fans in the stands!
MTU
Oh definitely. Tom here is a perfect example. I’d take this tonsillitis over a broken hip any day.
I don’t think Colons stuff is nearly as good as when he was in his prime. He’s a more experienced and smarter pitcher yes. And a different pitcher.
Hopefully arod starts hitting.
I have martin on my fantasy team,bautista also.
I remember drafting bautista & the commish of my league im’d me & said noooooooooooo,he will never repeat.
Who would of known that he might be a more productive fantasy player than arod?
I don’t think Colons stuff is nearly as good as when he was in his prime. He’s a more experienced and smarter pitcher yes. And a different pitcher.
————————————————
are you serious?
the movement on Colon’s pitches, is as good as any pitcher in recent memory. Maybe you mean to say he doesn’t have the same velocity (debatable)…
You’ve heard of Barolo wine; how about Bartolo? 2011 vintage, an explosion of violet and long-lasting tannins.
Trenton is playing a morning game–an “educational” day when all the kiddies get to play hooky; Romine and CoJo are getting a rest.
Whatever Colon is throwing up there right now I think Billy Ray Cyrus
said it best, “I like it. I love it. I want some more of it.”
LOVE Curtis Granderson. He’s quietly been building a really good rapport with fans in the city, IMO.
If Colon keeps this up, he’ll end up on the All-Star team this year.
Agree, the movement on Colon’s pitches is ridiculous.
YF-
I am ready to receive your report.
Fire away.
Billy Ray Cyrus said it best
*********************
Have those words ever been spoken before???
(I kid, MTU)
YF-
Nope. It’s not the movement that’s ridiculous it’s the hitter’s swings on it.
Especially funny are the baffled looks on the called 3rd strikes.
Hillarious.
Sure Erin.
But I can take it.
just sitting down to take a break, what’s going on with Tom? Is it TominGeorgia, or NJ?
Colon doesn’t have the 98 like he had in his prime but he has touched 96 with his 4 seamer and he’s throwing a 2 seamer 91-94 that moves a ton. His stuff is well above big league average right now.
Joe-
Tom in G. Unfortunately, he broke his hip.
Fortunately, I warned him to be on the lookout for Wratchett.
Oh my goodness
My country loving brain just exploded!
That is not Billy Ray Cyrus, its Tim Mcgraw lol
Blake-
So. Would you sign him ?
TY-
Sorry. I’m old. It happens. Wouldn’t want to confuse those 2.
MTU,
For when? I still can’t believe what Im seeing.
tyanksfan36 May 3rd, 2011 at 10:17 am
Oh my goodness
My country loving brain just exploded!
That is not Billy Ray Cyrus, its Tim Mcgraw lol
**************************
Don’t tell my heart….my achey breaky heart.
Blake-
Let’s just enjoy the party for as long as it lasts.
I was just funnin’ ya’.
Nobody is talking about the Marlins but they have quietly had a great start to the season…..they are now tied with the Phillies at 18-9.
“Nope. It’s not the movement that’s ridiculous it’s the hitter’s swings on it”
————————————————
MTU: am not YF, but if the movement on Colon’s pitches isn’t ridiculous, why aren’t hitters even swinging at his pitches. The ball is dancing so much, the players don’t even bother to swing. Of the 7 K’s Colon had last night, would venture to say 5 or 6 were called 3rd strikes. Same for his previous 2 starts
I got to go create some pupdemonium soon but it’s good to see some levity in here, and the mood elevated again. Maybe it will be contagious.
Carry on.
MTU,
Unless he breaks down….I see no reason why he can’t continue to pitch well. Hopefully he wont.
MTU May 3rd, 2011 at 10:07 am
YF-
I am ready to receive your report.
Fire away.
_____
On Manny Banny? I will give you a more recent update on Thursday when he pitches again. He was pretty much typical Manny though w/a little less command of pitches since coming back from the blister. He is pretty consistent. But looked good in spite of a couple of BB, and a WP that scored a run. 3 hits, 1 R. Only one ball hit had real loft. Threw more FB’s than usual. Sat mostly 93. Only threw 85 pitches, missed the win by 1/3 an inning. But change still looked nasty, around 82. Threw less CB’s. I think Norris has video up on his site, if you want to actually see the pitches.
MTU – thanks for the info.
broken hips are bad news at any age, worse in the older pop., like some of us (no names, please).
TominGeorgia – if you’re out there – hope you’re doing well under the circumstances. FWIW, your friends here are rooting for you.
Vinny-
It was a joke. Of course his stuff is riduculous.
You ought to know me by now.
blake May 3rd, 2011 at 10:20 am
Don?t tell my heart?.my achey breaky heart.
****************
NOOOOOOOO!!!!
It was a joke. Of course his stuff is riduculous.
You ought to know me by now
——————————
my bad, MTU
Erin,
I had to
MTU
Thanks for the laugh. Much to my brother chagrin I am a huge country music fan. I can tell you who sings almost any true country song but have trouble distinguishing “the cars” from “the doors” and alice cooper from KISS.
YF-
Thank you very much. I appreciate it. I’ll look forward to the next one. Thanks for the velo reading.
Joe-
You are most welcome.
Blake-
That IS the concern. We’ll hope for the best, and take what we get.
It is already way more than we had a right to.
Tom, feel better.
TY-
I need a minder. Thanks.
Tom-
Why are you telling yourself to feel better ?
You OK ?
MTU is an honorary southerner….so he knows about country music, sweet tea, and pecan pie.
MTU May 3rd, 2011 at 10:28 am
YF-
Thank you very much. I appreciate it. I’ll look forward to the next one. Thanks for the velo reading.
_____
You are welcome.
Manny said he expects to go @100 pitches next game. However, sounds like they are being very careful with him, so we shall see.
pecan pie is one of the few thing from the south that I do appreciate. That, and the occasional bourbon.
Blake-
And I am honored to be so Sir.
P.S. I really dig Mint Juileps too. They go down real easy on a hot summer’s day.
Let’s NOT forget the pulled pork and oysters either.
blake May 3rd, 2011 at 10:30 am
MTU is an honorary southerner?.so he knows about country music, sweet tea, and pecan pie.
**********************
this is why I could never live in the south. The only one of those things I like is pecan pie. LOVE pecan pie
MTU, whenever a Tom get’s hurt, be it a Tom-girl, a Tom-cat or a tom in georgia, it hurts. I hope that all the Toms in all the land are safe and sound. Even the Toms in NJ.
In all seriousness, I hope that Tom in Georgia feels better, and more importantly, get’s better soon.
blake May 3rd, 2011 at 10:22 am
Nobody is talking about the Marlins but they have quietly had a great start to the season…..they are now tied with the Phillies at 18-9.
_____
QFT, and Hanley isn’t even putting up his normal numbers yet.
Erin-
As long as that still leaves the West I’m Ok with it.
Back later.
Y’all play nice. Y’ hear.
MTU:
fresh off the wire. Took it you may be interested in this:
On May 17, “Honest Hearts” (DLC which accompanies Fallout New Vegas Xbox 360 and PS3) will pit you against a tribal band of raiders in Utah’s Zion National Park.
Hopefully Nova continues to progress and get opportunities. There is no substitute for learning at this level.
Blake-
“and the South shall rise again”.
At least the good things about it will.
Just ask all the transplants and snowbirds.
Speaking of a Cyrus.. did anyone here foolishly subject themselves to watching the video of Miley “singing” Smells Like Teen Spirit? I did. And now I can’t unsee it.
I’ve been keeping an eye on the Marlins. Since I hate the Rays and can’t watch the Yankees I have been watching the Marlins since their games play up here in Tampa. They’ve been doing a good job. I watched JJ vs. Ubaldo the other day.
And I am a true southerner, I love sweet tea, fried chicken, pecan pie, country music and collard greens. Only thing is I hate grits.
Vinny-
My 5 seconds of fame.
Question I heard raised this morning…..
Are the Yankees going with the norm for now with Derek to avoid controversy in the lead up to his 3000th hit but will be willing to discuss moving Derek from lead off after the milestone is achieved?
I’m sure they would like to avoid the debate forever but I never considered getting through the 3000th hit could be involved in a timeline for a possible change.
Shame Spencer May 3rd, 2011 at 10:40 am
Speaking of a Cyrus.. did anyone here foolishly subject themselves to watching the video of Miley ?singing? Smells Like Teen Spirit? I did. And now I can?t unsee it.
***********************
I didn’t know this even existed. I will try to avoid it at all costs. Thanks for the warning.
Yea can’t beat some pulled pork and even a little brisket and fried okra……
I hate snowbirds
Tyyanks,
I.don’t like grits either…..I can eat them with tons of butter and salt but those other things are all good.
pat-I was actually talking about that with my brother on Sunday. He’s convinced that they’re waiting for the 3,000 hit and then a lineup change will occur. I’m undecided. lol
Colon’s doing a great job and deserves huge credit. But has anyone considered whether Russell Martin deserves some credit here, too? Martin does a great job calling a game and moving things along both in time between pitches and in keeping the pitches close to the plate, and that may be part of the reason that everyone’s pitch count seems to be nice and low, so we get more innings out of them. Burnett and Chamberlain seem to be different pitchers this year — attacking the hitters rather than fighting themselves.
The long at bats the Yanks had throughout the game were also a key. Notwithstanding Verlander’s gutty performance, his innings were limited, and the ninth inning speaks for itself.
vinny-b May 3rd, 2011 at 10:06 am
I don’t think Colons stuff is nearly as good as when he was in his prime. He’s a more experienced and smarter pitcher yes. And a different pitcher.
————————————————
are you serious? the movement on Colon’s pitches, is as good as any pitcher in recent memory. Maybe you mean to say he doesn’t have the same velocity (debatable)…
***************
I disagree. I probably saw him make 6-7 starts in Anaheim in 2005 when he was 21-8 and beat out Mariano to win the Cy Young. He was a different pitcher. He threw the four seamer much more than the two seamer, he was a true power pitcher. He always had good control and command and walked very few. His stuff is different. He’s smarter.
Erin – It just hit the net yesterday. Surf safely.
And nothing beats a good pulled pork sandwich. Dinosaur BBQ is my fav in the city.
Are the Yankees going with the norm for now with Derek to avoid controversy in the lead up to his 3000th hit but will be willing to discuss moving Derek from lead off after the milestone is achieved?
I’m sure they would like to avoid the debate forever but I never considered getting through the 3000th hit could be involved in a timeline for a possible change.
____________
Of course it’s a factor, as some of us have been suggesting here for a while now.
And I’ll do you one better, there is no real imperative for change right now.
Yankees are in first in their division and only 2nd in the AL to a team no one expects to maintain their current winning %.
They are scoring more runs per game than any team in baseball, and are ahead of last years pace in a year where offense is down league-wide.
They have lost 2 games in a row once this year and haven’t yet lost 3 in a row, and are better than .500 on the road in the early going.
Aside from fan frustration by bad ABs with runners on, there is nothing compelling the move right now.
In fact, if you really want to have fun with the issue, while batting lead-off will get Jeter more AB’s than the guys hitting 7-9, it at least guarantees one AB a game he WON’T come up with runners on.
That issue isn’t going away with him down in the order.
Dinosaur BBQ is my fav in the city.
———————————-
A Syracuse original………… great food.
“Of course it’s a factor, as some of us have been suggesting here for a while now.”
Sorry for being repetitous. I’ve been skimming more than reading here lately and hadn’t picked up on that angle being discussed.
No harm, no foul Pat.
I guess this is what first place and 3 wins in a row will get ya…
Watching the game last night, it looked to me that Alex looks a little disinterested , for lack of a better word, at the plate. Anyone sense that?
what? you mean no complaints about too many HR, no bunts/steals, who is leading off, who is struggling, the usual Jeter/Po complaints etc etc?
“The last thing you want to do when you’re not swinging the bat well is to get the most at-bats on the team”
-Kevin Long
“no bunts”
————
Too many bunts!
Girardi has lost his mind and must be thinking that he is back managing the Marlins.
Too many bunts!
____
Have you seen how many double plays the yankees hit into?
That’s probably why Joe is bunting.
Have you seen how many double plays the yankees hit into? That’s probably why Joe is bunting
—–
That strategy would cost you way more runs than the risk of hitting into DPs.
Especially since the bunts last night were attempts to set up the worst hitters on the team.
Why not just tell his hitters to intentionally strike out to avoid any chance of double play?
BUnting is a terrible idea unless it’s late innings and 1 run will win the game.
“The last thing you want to do when you’re not swinging the bat well is to get the most at-bats on the team”
-Kevin Long
______________________
Just FYI, this quote is Kevin Long describing the feeling from the player’s POV.
JackCurryYES Colon keeps firing that 2-seam fastball to succeed. In 7 innings vs Det, 91 of 97 pitches were fbs. Also, 19 of 21 outs via K or in infield.
BUnting is a terrible idea unless it’s late innings and 1 run will win the game.
___
This would all be irrelevant if players would play close to their potential.
They are winning yes, but in spite of themselves.
Why was alex hacking at the first pitch against valverde after granderson and tex both walked?
Why can’t Jeter figure out what the rest of the world sees, and adjust to hitting the inside low fastball?
I am not saying win all 162 games, but these are the basics!
“It’s a smart move. He’s a smart kid, so he gets it. He doesn’t have to be happy about it, but at this point in time, it’s the best thing to do.”
-hitting guru Kevin Long.
and with the talent on this team, if you do the basics right, you should dominate on the offense.
BloggingBombers For those interested in such things, Nick Swisher has signed an endorsement deal with New Balance.
“and with the talent on this team, if you do the basics right, you should dominate on the offense.”
Leading MLB in runs scored is what, then?
pat May 3rd, 2011 at 10:41 am
Question I heard raised this morning…..
Are the Yankees going with the norm for now with Derek to avoid controversy in the lead up to his 3000th hit but will be willing to discuss moving Derek from lead off after the milestone is achieved?
I’m sure they would like to avoid the debate forever but I never considered getting through the 3000th hit could be involved in a timeline for a possible change.
—
I mentioned that a few days ago on this blog. I don’t think they’ll move him down before #3000.
“Leading MLB in runs scored is what, then?”
Texas?
BloggingBombers New Balance will be Swisher?s official on-field footwear and on and off-field athletic footwear and apparel provider.
BloggingBombers New Balance will also partner with Swisher to sponsor his ?Swish?s Wishes? charity.
Honest question.
What benefit does it serve at this point to leave Jeter at the top of the lineup?
Watching the Dan Patick show on DVR delay and Bob Costas pops in the studio for a 45 minutes or so…
On his way out, Costas, talking about Derek Jeter during commercial to Dan, says, “…if Jeter’s name was Derek Jones…” commerical.
Would LOVE to have heard the rest of that thought, but I’m pretty sure I could ballpark what he was about to say.
ac1,
I have no idea how your argument applies to bunting
LGY May 3rd, 2011 at 11:49 am
Honest question.
What benefit does it serve at this point to leave Jeter at the top of the lineup?
—————————————————————————–
There is only one benefit.
He gets to 3,000 hits faster. And the faster he gets to 3,000 hits, the faster the Yankees can seriously consider dropping him in the order and/or taking away playing time.
“Leading MLB in runs scored is what, then?”
Texas?
___________
No, the answer you were looking for is St. Louis actually, but the Yankees (of course) for those who know to look are scoring the most runs PER GAME in MLB.
They’re just played 2 to 3 less games than all the other teams that have scored more run culmulatively.
“No, the answer you were looking for is St. Louis actually, but the Yankees (of course) for those who know to look are scoring the most runs PER GAME in MLB. ”
Ah but that wasn’t the question you asked. And since you asked for the major leagues I assumed you meant the American League only…
The ‘because his name is Derek Jeter’ is for simpletons.
It implies some other factor other than the Yankees believe in his body of work.
Magglio Ordonez still bats 3rd for the Tigers.
As is Hanley Ramirez for the Marlins.
Nick Markakis batted 2nd for the O’s last night.
Torii Hunter batted 4th for the Angels.
Perdroia batted 2nd for the Sox while Lowerie batted 7th.
Berkman and Holliday are p*****g on Pujols, but he’s still batting 3rd.
Yankees never moved Teixeira from the 3rd hole all April 2010.
All of the “moves” (or lack thereof) are made for the same reasons, teams don’t give-up on veterans as readily as panicky fanboys do.
Now of course the natural counter will be Jeter is older and he struggled in 2010, but that’s doesn’t change the TEAM’s reasoning, which is they aren’t giving up on the player as quickly as you.
You can argue until you’re blue in the face whether that’s wise or appropriate, but to constantly ignore the obvious fact is ridiculous.
As I say, hit your head against the wall all you like, but eventually someone is going to ask you “what the point”.
Fanboys seem to hate that question.
I have no idea how your argument applies to bunting
____
Doesn’t really. Was two different arguments.
However, bunting is a fundamental that they don’t really seem to have a grasp on either.
Doesn’t really. Was two different arguments.
However, bunting is a fundamental that they don’t really seem to have a grasp on either.
—
In my opinion it shouldn’t matter, bunting should be an extremely rare occurrence for this team. Unfortunately that is not the case
They’re just played 2 to 3 less games than all the other teams that have scored more run culmulatively.
___
it is true they have the most runs per game, but we watch the games. It is real sloppy for 7 innings and then an outburst of homeruns or the occassional rally where the runs come from.
Yes wins are wins and homeruns are good, but they cannot be 100% happy with how the offense is actually hitting. They are not near the top in batting average, just a ton of homeruns.
Jeter-What can I say that I have not already said.
His weakness is anything hard on the inside half of the plate.
For whatever reason, he is unable to get the bat through the hitting zone quick enough to make contact on this pitch.
I know Verlander throws 100, so the match-up is difficult for just about anybody.
Despite that, Jeter still looks overmatched on any pitch that is inside and his two hits last night really does not say much. Just another infield dribbler that should have been an out.
RiverAveBlues AP reports Yanks have signed former farmhand and LHP Brad Halsey to a minor league deal. http://wapo.st/iuqDsl (scroll down)
Honest question
What benefit is it to keep discussing the same thing regarding Derek Jeter over and over again every day?
It is what it is. They are going to give him time to figure this out (as they should ) and he either will or he wont. The Yankees will be a better team if he does and that’s why they are giving him the chance to do so….its not that hard to understand and talking about it 24/7 isn’t going to change a thing.
In my opinion it shouldn’t matter, bunting should be an extremely rare occurrence for this team. Unfortunately that is not the case
___
For the most part i agree, especially if you are setting up the RISP for Jeter.
I am just going to assume Joe knows more about baseball and his players than us, hence his sometimes odd decisions.
I do agree though that Jeter getting the most ABs makes no sense, given what we see right now, though i can giarantee no matter where he is in the lineup, the ABs with runners on late in games will still find him.
Jeter has a .583 ops,.270 slg with no hr’s.
Looks like age has caught up to him,hope i’m wrong.
What will happen with almost 4 years left?
You just can’t play him f/t with numbers that bad & almost anybody being a better option,once he get’s 3,000 out of the way.
If he can’t put up better numbers,girardi will have the decision of his life to make.
Do we put him in lf & bite the bullet?
What do we do with gardner when jeter probably will never outplay gardner going forward?
Playing him anywhere else can never be justified not to mention he is blocked everywhere.
This is not a few week slump we are talking about.
Curious to see where jeter sits in ops for f/t players?
RiverAveBlues Halsey, 30, was in the package deal for R. Johnson in 2005. He hasn?t pitched in Majors since 06 but made 20 starts for IND team last year.
All of the “moves” (or lack thereof) are made for the same reasons, teams don’t give-up on veterans as readily as panicky fanboys do.
———
This doesn’t seem accurate.
The Derek Jeter situation is extremely complicated on much more than just a baseball level.
To assert that the reason Jeter is still at the top of the lineup is solely because a faith in veterans approach, is well….
A simpletons argument.
To ignore that there are quite obviously other factors and motivations at play. Major ones in fact. Like who Derek Jeter is frankly, extremely naive.
Neither argument is correct. As usual, the answer lies somewhere in the middle.
Ron, I truly believe as long as Jeter passes 3000 hits, he will consider retirement after this year if he ends much worse than last year.
Blake
I’m really curious if there is some benefit that I’m missing.
Even Pat M suggested moving Jeter down yesterday.
LGY, there’s no immediately obvious candidate to replace Jeter at the top of the lineup, is there? Or do you think Gardner should swap with Jeter?
blake May 3rd, 2011 at 12:09 pm
Honest question
What benefit is it to keep discussing the same thing regarding Derek Jeter over and over again every day?
It is what it is. They are going to give him time to figure this out (as they should ) and he either will or he wont. The Yankees will be a better team if he does and that’s why they are giving him the chance to do so….its not that hard to understand and talking about it 24/7 isn’t going to change a thing.
********************************************************************
Why? While I watch his at bats its very clear to me that he has little chance of driving the ball hard somewhere.
K. Long has helped several Yankees at the plate. K. Long has worked with these players, tweaked a thing or two so the hitter could be in a better positition to succeed at the plate.
The work K. Long did with Jeter seemed to last what, a few weeks at the most.
Jeter is becoming selfish. His ego is getting the best of him and if he continues to stand at the plate like he is now, the stats will get worse at the season goes. Time to make an adjustment and trust K. Long
“it is true they have the most runs per game, but we watch the games. It is real sloppy for 7 innings and then an outburst of homeruns or the occassional rally where the runs come from.”
So you’re rather have nice tidy, consistent scoring that results in less runs per game all the other 29 ML teams?
“Yes wins are wins and homeruns are good, but they cannot be 100% happy with how the offense is actually hitting. They are not near the top in batting average, just a ton of homeruns.”
MLB doesn’t award style points.
I’ll say it again, scoring is down all over MLB. For the 2nd consecutive year, and for the 2nd consecutive year, the Yankees are outperforming the general league-wide decline.
And they Yankees really haven’t even had a hot stretch yet, which will come.
I see nothing to complain about. I LIKE winning ugly, because in my mind it’s like money in the bank.
LGY,
The benefit is that when Jeter is right he makes the team better hitting atop the lineup……they are hoping he can get back to his career norms and giving him time to see if he can. If he’s still struggling by June then they will probably move him down against RHP.
I hope yer right because it will be tough to watch.
Do you think jeter leaves 3 yrs & all that money on the table?
Do we buy him out/give him a nice present.
I think this is the end for jeter as far as being nearly as productive,simply because it has been a while now,his age.
He also looks so much older almost overnight.
You can’t play a .583 ops player much regardless of how good the offense is because there will be many better options,including nunez.
Right now nunez is a better option,probably by a lot.
I hope i am wrong.It is not like i wan’t to sit him but his numbers are attrocious.
How about the Yankees keep Jeter in the 1 and 2 spots, and the squad keeps winning series and taking 2 out of 3 from teams. Jeter can hit .220 or .340 but the pitching dictates the teams success. Right now the team has to ride the hot starting pitching and rack up wins. Keep Jeter 1 and 2, don’t create any stories, and keep on winning games.
stuckey99 May 3rd, 2011 at 12:04 pm
The ‘because his name is Derek Jeter’ is for simpletons.
It implies some other factor other than the Yankees believe in his body of work.
Magglio Ordonez still bats 3rd for the Tigers.
—————————————————————-
Magglio Ordonez hasn’t sucked since last June.
As long as the Yankees keep winning , the Jeter situation will fly under the radar
PS. I don’t think Bob Costas is a “simpleton.” Certainly not when it comes to baseball.
You’ll forgive me if I place more weight on his baseball opinion than I do on yours.
“Neither argument is correct. As usual, the answer lies somewhere in the middle.”
And you of all people LGY are perfectly aware I’m made both sides of the argument, no less than an hour or so ago in this same thread, in fact.
My point was to respond in context, specifically to the “name” argument. Yes, there ARE various issues involved, including the 3000 factor, and the media storm that would ensue if he were moved.
But to someone single out Derek Jeter as some special case of a struggling veteran who hasn’t been “demoted”, which the pejorative implications that implies, is in ignorance of what’s happening all around MLB, which is my point.
Mike Ri May 3rd, 2011 at 12:23 pm
As long as the Yankees keep winning , the Jeter situation will fly under the radar
———————————————————————
Obviously not.
It’s becoming more and more a topic with each passing day. And not just here.
Actually, since they have pitchers in their lineups, I would say in context both St. Louis and Cincinnati have more potent offenses than the Yanks right now.
“I am just going to assume Joe knows more about baseball and his players than us, hence his sometimes odd decisions.”
I don’t like this argument because it completely invalidates any conversation we have. If you can just fall back on “well Joe does this for a living, clearly he knows better” it’s pointless to have any discussion in the first place. The fact is, we’ve seen Joe screw up. He’s NOT always right. And the bunts he called for last night were absolutely wrong.
WTP, ftr, you didn’t even approach answering Blake’s question.
Fixed for me:
You’ll forgive me if I place more weight on anyone’s baseball opinion than I do on yours.
Gossip Break
Cameron (#4) and Minka (#52) both on the Maxim Hot 100 for 2011.
Patrick May 3rd, 2011 at 12:27 pm
Fixed for me:
You’ll forgive me if I place more weight on anyone’s baseball opinion than I do on yours.
—————————————————————–
That’s cool. Ask Bob Costas about Derek Jeter, if you get the chance. Ask ANY major league baseball scout who has seen him over the last year.
It’s not as if I’m lone wolf in the night on this issue.
YankeesNmore—
There nothing the Yanks can do . . Jeter isn’t moving to LF . .( its not going to improve his bat any ) . We aren’t going to drop him in the order … . He’s not retiring …..
We have to be patient and go threw the pains of watching a legend decline . It sucks . .believe me ..
LGY, there’s no immediately obvious candidate to replace Jeter at the top of the lineup, is there? Or do you think Gardner should swap with Jeter?
=================
Gardner has found his way on base 13 times in the last 5 games. He gets back to that .370-.380 OBP level, and it gets harder and harder to argue against him at the top. Hasn’t earned yet w/ 5 good games, but he’s showing signs that he’s finding his legs.
But to someone single out Derek Jeter as some special case of a struggling veteran who hasn’t been “demoted”, which the pejorative implications that implies, is in ignorance of what’s happening all around MLB, which is my point.”
————
That doesn’t make any sense though, because Jeter’s situation is not remotely comparable to a guy like Magglio Ordonez or Hanley Ramirez.
You can’t say it’s a simpletons argument that Jeter isn’t being moved down because of his name and then it is obviously a factor.
A team owes it to itself & the fans to put the best team on the field,not play jeter because he is jeter.
If his numbers were somewhat respectable,maybe.
But zero hr,6 rbi,.583 ops,.270 slg,we can pull almost any player out of our farm system to match that production,nunez would easily do it.
It is a very difficult decision & a players production usually 99.9 % of the time will solve these issues itself but if he can’t better his numbers,give me an example of any other team that would not sit a player with similar numbers,taking jeters age into consideration,providing he has similar numbers after the asb.
The team will not play him f/t with an ops under 6,imo of course.
Something will have to give.
Hopefully jeter retires & enjoys his beautifull mansion.
“Cameron (#4) and Minka (#52) both on the Maxim Hot 100 for 2011.”
Minka should be indignant. So should eveyone else from #5 to #100.
Wave,
Gardner is probably not there yet as Mell suggested, but I would be in favor of Martin hitting 2nd.
“Magglio Ordonez hasn’t sucked since last June.”
“Now of course the natural counter will be Jeter is older and he struggled in 2010, but that’s doesn’t change the TEAM’s reasoning, which is they aren’t giving up on the player as quickly as you.”
Reading comprehension is a GOOD thing.
“You’ll forgive me if I place more weight on his baseball opinion than I do on yours.”
You really do have difficulty holding an intelligent substantive conversation Larry.
Any push back immediately and invariably winds up with you declaring how lowly you value someone else’s opinion (as if that’s relevant) rather than actually replying in context.
Watch what happens now…
Larry, Yankees aren’t moving Jeter right now and you know that as well as I do, as Bob Costas for that matter.
So what is his and your point?
This is when the crickets start chirping.
“Gardner is probably not there yet as Mell suggested, but I would be in favor of Martin hitting 2nd.”
And who leadoff?
pat May 3rd, 2011 at 12:29 pm
Gossip Break
Cameron (#4) and Minka (#52) both on the Maxim Hot 100 for 2011.
*******************
I’m actually surprised that Cameron ranked higher than Minka.
Speak of the devil
“Tigers manager Jim Leyland said that he will consider moving Magglio Ordonez down in the batting order once Victor Martinez (groin) returns from the disabled list.”
That’s the other issue. A lot of other teams have such crappy lineups that the benefit is much smaller of moving a veteran down because of who you are replacing him with.
How the hell is Cameron number 4
And who leadoff?
——–
Granderson
who was number 1 ……
And who leadoff?
—
Who cares? Lineup order has very little tangible difference on games.
Have Nick Swisher lead off for all I care
I think the Yanks will give Jeter until the all-star break to figure things out. If he starts driving the ball again then he will stay near the top (either 1st or 2nd). If he doesn’t then they’ll drop him down against RHP and lead Gardner off with Martin, Swisher, or Granderson hitting 2nd.
I think some of you are worried that they will just hit him leadoff forever no matter what…..they won’t, if he doesn’t improve then they will move him down but as I’ve said he’s earned the right to have a good bit of rope to play with and they are a better team with him performing atop the lineup.
For now….support him and hope he gets better because that’s whats best for the Yankees.
LGY-
I don’t deny Granderson has been more productive than Jeter but Granderson is no leadoff hitter, his OBP will be too low in the long run.
The fact is, Jeter’s OBP hasn’t been too much worse than the OBP of those who’d replace him.
As a result of that and the Yanks’ good start, there’s no crisis yet. Jeter won’t be moved until there is and there’s a good candidate to replace him.
“Who cares? Lineup order has very little tangible difference on games.”
Then why the hubbub over Jeter, since lineup order has little tangible difference on games?
Suttle, 2B, 3B, BB so far today in the Trenton game. He is seeing the ball as well as anyone.
“That doesn’t make any sense though, because Jeter’s situation is not remotely comparable to a guy like Magglio Ordonez or Hanley Ramirez.”
Why isn’t it?
Because he’s struggled since last year?
It’s still May 3rd.
Again, the POINT is MLB teams don’t act as quickly nor are they as fatalistic as fans are.
Simple question LGY, in your mind, do you think Joe Girardi and Kevin Long are convinced Jeter is done, won’t improve, and are keeping him at the top of the line-up without any expectation of improvement?
That’s a simple yes or no question that be able to be answered simply.
“You can’t say it’s a simpletons argument that Jeter isn’t being moved down because of his name and then it is obviously a factor.”
When the implication is it’s the ONLY factor I can, quite appropriately.
You also missed the context of the ‘name’ thing. Derek Jeter is “Derek Jeter” foremost because he has 5 rings, he’s a first-ballot HoFer and arguably one of the 2 greatest SS in MLB history.
The “name” argument seems to inherently imply his celebrity status, as opposed to what’s admittedly his currently past accomplishments.
I think Derek Jeter gets a long rope because of the respect he’s earned on the field, not because he dates Minka Kelly and is in Ford and Gillette commercials.
Then why the hubbub over Jeter, since lineup order has little tangible difference on games?
–
He shouldn’t be in the lineup at all.
Jeter is going to continue to lead off against lefties because even now he still hits them well (.400 OBP against them this year). The question is against RHP and if they move him against them then Gardner can lead off there.
“He shouldn’t be in the lineup at all.”
who should be in his place?
who should be in his place?
–
I’d give Nunez a shot. To start I’d split time 50-50 between Nunez and Jeter and see what happens.
Wave,
I’m not concerned about Granderson’s OBP in the long run.
The extra PAs are the concern.
Jeter has 22 more PAs than Martin despite playing only one more game. 6 more than Cano despite playing the same amount.
9 more than Granderson even though Grandy has played one more game.
Jeter leads the team in PAs and hasn’t even played in every game this season.
“Then why the hubbub over Jeter, since lineup order has little tangible difference on games?”
Because some fans are never comfortable. They’re always nervous.
They don’t like and continue to try to deny that undeniable aspect of the game that over 162 games, 25 man rosters are rarely if ever perfect.
These fans peck at guys with below average production like chicken’s peck at the ones with black heads.
I can’t believe hanley has a lower ops than jeter.
Jeter is 23 in ops for ss.
Yes numbers are down in the league but jeter was always in the top for ss production.
To simply equate it to what is happening in mlb is not correct.
26th in slg
18th in obp
19th in avg
21st in hits
This is compared to other ss.
In 2006 jeter was 1st in ops for ss
3rd in slg
1st in obp
1st in avg
2nd in rbi
7th in hr
1st in hits
4th in runs
Compared to other ss.
Suttle, 2B, 3B, BB so far today in the Trenton game. He is seeing the ball as well as anyone
=================
Maybe today. 35/5 K/BB ratio on the year. .279 OBP with 20 K’s and a walk in his last 10 games.
Erin
Cameron’s June movie with Timberlake is getting big 18-24 male demo pub. Being talked up as this summer’s raunchy comedy hit.
Patrick,
Come on now….that’s knee jerk big time. Nunez isn’t ready defensively to play SS every day and would likely be exposed offensively with more playing time.
Their best case scenario is for Jeter to bounce back….its way too early to pull the plug on that.
pat May 3rd, 2011 at 12:48 pm
Erin
Cameron?s June movie with Timberlake is getting big 18-24 male demo pub. Being talked up as this summer?s raunchy comedy hit.
***********************
oh, that’s right….I forgot about that.
That movie does look pretty good.
stuckey,
The situation is not comparable because we have no idea how much each factor in the decision is playing a role.
It is perfectly reasonable to think that outside factors like who Derek Jeter is actually OUTWEIGH the baseball aspect of it where Girardi and Long think he will improve.
And it’s hard to imagine that Jeter won’t improve somewhat, because right now he is abysmal. The question is though, even if he improves how much will it be.
Who even brought up his celebrity status? You are putting arguments on other people that aren’t there to try to prove your point.
Why would you mess with benching Jeter, which would be a large story, when the team is rolling? It makes no sense. You know how many questions the players would have to answer, the stories everyday, the questions the manager would answer daily. A total distraction for no reason.
Keep on sending the same lineup out there and keep on winning games like they have been doing all year.
Come on now….that’s knee jerk big time. Nunez isn’t ready defensively to play SS every day and would likely be exposed offensively with more playing time.
Their best case scenario is for Jeter to bounce back….its way too early to pull the plug on that.
—
Jeter has been really bad for over a year now, I don’t think it’s knee jerk at all. It’s past time Nunez got at least 50% of the starts. If Jeter outplays him give him more starts, if not, it goes the other way.
Come on now….that’s knee jerk big time. Nunez isn’t ready defensively to play SS every day and would likely be exposed offensively with more playing time.
——————————————-
Everyone loves Nunez we’ll see how long that lasts.
Be intereting if Jones plays today. Even though Penny is a righty Jones has great numbers against him. 15-24 with 6 bombs.
No team is going to give a player a 3 year, $48MM contract plus an option and then bench him in May. Try to keep the comments in this universe at least.
Nunez makes too many bone headed plays for my liking. I am sure it comes with trying to hard to make an impact. But he needs to limit those mistakes in my opinion.
Patrick,
That’s the definition on knee jerk especially when you don’t have a sure thing to replace him. You just signed him to a new contract…..you’re giving him 1 month to figure this out? Do you really want a media firestorm so that Eduardo Nunez can play more? They are going to give the HOFer time because they are better with him playing well.
No team is going to give a player a 3 year, $48MM contract plus an option and then bench him in May. Try to keep the comments in this universe at least.
—
Contract has zero bearing on his playtime. If the team is suffering with Jeter getting near 100% of the starts they have to make the best decision for the present and future. And I never said he shouldn’t play at all. But it’s way past time Nunez got an extended look.
Brad Halsey could be the second lefty in the pen.
LGY,
Again, I asked a reasonable, fair, simple question.
Why it is too much to expect a response in kind?
I follow baseball pretty closely and I can’t think of ANOTHER player who get the “his name is” argument like Jeter does. In fact, I’m not aware of another player where criticism is voiced in those terms at all.
Unless you or someone else can correct me, it seems unique to Jeter, so I’m willing to listen to any arguments that the “name” critique is somehow not inherent to his unique celebrity status.
teixeiramark25 I have been keeping this quiet for a while but now that Doug has made it public, here you go http://fb.me/XGd8bvvW
That’s the definition on knee jerk especially when you don’t have a sure thing to replace him. You just signed him to a new contract…..you’re giving him 1 month to figure this out? Do you really want a media firestorm so that Eduardo Nunez can play more? They are going to give the HOFer time because they are better with him playing well.
—
First of all, even if it was only 1 month, that’s plenty of time. But the fact of the matter is, it’s been going on for over a year. And where am I saying that Jeter should be replaced? I’ve said like 5 times now that I only want to see Nunez get about half the starts. Maybe he ends up being better?
And I don’t give a crap about the media, they are mostly idiots anyways. Not including Chad of course.
At what point does it become “acceptable” for Nunez to get some playing time because Jeter is bad? 2 months? A year? Do the Yankees have to miss the playoffs?
“Do the Yankees have to miss the playoffs?”
Is this a pre-cursor to the “sure, they’re in first place, on pace to win 100 games NOW, but just wait…” argument?
I think the tough part of this Jeter debate is the only reasons for keeping him atop this lineup is not to create a media frenzy and unrest in the clubhouse and not to wound his ego.
The guy is powerless at the plate. In the next 100 at bats he has to show something otherwise his contributions to the team are only based on legend.
I’m hoping for a miracle here, but it’s been so long since we’ve seen him do anything really great with the bat going back to last season.
That said, the Yankees will cover their eyes and let him get his 3000 hits at the top of the lineup. At that point, if he’s still powerless and grounding everything at record levels, they’ll have to do something.
The only good point I saw this morning was from stuckey where he said letting Jeter lead the game off is good since no one is on base for 1 of his at bats guaranteed.
That said, handing him the most plate appearances on a team with better options is foolhardy. If he were a .300-.310 hitting singles hitter it’d be one thing, but I’m hoping for .260 at this point.
As for his retiring, even if he stinks this year he’ll come back for one more to try to prove that he still has it. If he has a poor year this year and next year, I think he’ll walk away before his contract runs out like Joe D. did. I don’t think he can take 3 seasons of being a punchless ground ball machine. He’s already a hall of famer and a Yankee legend.
The interesting thing to me is if he is bad this year, does Cashman go and get a SS and tell Jeter he’ll play a little bit here and there but is basically a cheerleader for the team from here on in.
That’s what is so intriguing about this story to all of us. Seeing whether the Yankees defer to him or try to improve the team at the expense of his ego.
stuckey,
How did I not answer your question?
No one cares that Derek Jeter is dating Minka Kelly. You really think people are making the argument that who he dates and what commercials he does keep him at the top of the lineup?
He is the face of the franchise and the golden boy of MLB. Most have that having to do with how he has performed on the field in his career. That’s the argument.
What person that follows baseball would actually think that Derek Jeter’s girlfriend is influencing this decision?
New Post: LoHud Yankees chat tomorrow
Patrick,
Are the Yankees struggling to win games ? They are on a 106 win pace…..Jeter is a year and a half removed from being an MVP candidate…..he may never be that player again but he is the captain of the team and an on field leader and still can be productive whether he is or not.
Are the Yankees struggling to win games ?
—
Obviously not but do you really want to carry a black hole at the top of the lineup for the whole season? I’m not even saying Jeter is done, but it’s way past time Nunez got some significant playtime to see if he’s an upgrade.
# Mell May 3rd, 2011 at 12:48 pm
Suttle, 2B, 3B, BB so far today in the Trenton game. He is seeing the ball as well as anyone
=================
Maybe today. 35/5 K/BB ratio on the year. .279 OBP with 20 K’s and a walk in his last 10 games.
______
If you are seeing him play, you’ll recognize that Suttle is having very good AB’s. If you want to quote such small sample sizes, then by all means don’t disregard that he is something like 9 of his last 12 AB’s with 2 BB. The player jumped from Tampa to Trenton, is hitting in a pitcher’s park, and is batting .368/.515/.883 vs. righties even after a slow start. He is also a work in progress who is coming back from two labrum surgeries. While his K’s have to improve, your small sample number is out of whack with his norms. Suttle has been around 25% K rates when he is right; however, he is working on plate discipline. Plus he has a lot of pop, and career-wise he has walked around 10%. I would take that in a heartbeat. If you have seen him play lately, you might sing a different tune than quoting small sample sizes. A healthy Suttle = a top prospect.
LGY,
I find it somewhat telling that people seem to avoid answering a simply question whose answer doesn’t support their argument.
You “answered” only by speculating that maybe the fact he’s Derek Jeter outweighs Girardi and Long’s opinion of his chances for improvement.
Why can’t we just recognize that as a legitimate factor rather than trying to dismiss it (vaguely) outta hand.
I think Girardi and Kevin Long genuinely think he’s going to get better.
Can you effectively argue otherwise?
And for someone who went on a 2-day rant about being “genuinely concerned” about my fixation, you’re not only equally engaging (as always) you’re trying a little bit too hard.
His celebrity girlfriends, and Q factor due to TV appearances and endorsements are illustrative example of the celebrity of Derek Jeter and I honestly don’t think when people pin the wholly unique “name” criticism on him, they are just talking about the fact he’s had a remarkable career.
It has obvious negative implications and gets applied to his contract negotiations, his leadership qualities, etc.
I think you’re being naive if you genuinely not recognize the obvious.
“but it’s way past time Nunez got some significant playtime to see if he’s an upgrade.”
So you’re going to bench a legend after a month “to see” if Eduardo Nunez is an upgrade? That’s not how it works in real life…..its easy to do that from a recliner, much more difficult from the bench. It’s not a realistic or even smart idea.
What will happen with jeter after his 3,000 hit,girardi will initially sit jeter once against a rh pitcher & like every time in baseball history it will become more & more difficult to keep jeter in the lineup against rh pitcher,against lh pitchers will follow as his production decreases.
Don’t know when but it has been a long time since jeter has been productive against righties.
Any other player it would be done,long ago but it is not any other player,it’s jeter & he should be given more time than most others but if he doesn’t get better it will & has to happen.
You don’t say we are in 1st or have the offense to compensate,etc… because you just don’t know how it affects the team negatively going forward until it’s to late.
The difference in ss production might make the difference.
It will play itself out & jeter will get a veeeeeeeeeeeery long rope but the time will come where jg will have no choice other than to sit jeter because of the large production gap.
It might be this year,maybe next.
Hopefully he starts hitting & it all goes away.
As a yankee fan i would love nothing more but you can’t play an under .600 ops player when almost anybody is a better option.
It will also start grinding on the team,jg & jeter himself.
Hopefully jeter does the right thing for the team,after a fair chance.