Pregame notes: Garcia appears locked in for postseason start
Posted by: vmercogliano - Posted in Misc on Sep 05, 2011 
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The evolution of Freddy Garcia has truly been a remarkable case. After undergoing surgery on a torn labrum and rotator cuff in 2007, Garcia experienced a drastic drop in velocity. He was never necessarily a strikeout pitcher, but he could throw in the mid-90s, and had seasons such as 2004, in which in notched 184 punch outs. After three post-surgery seasons toiling between Detroit and Chicago, it appeared as if Garcia might be done. The results had not favorable, but the 35-year-old has experienced a rebirth here in 2011.
“The biggest thing is that you have to accept it,” manager Joe Girardi said at his pregame press conference on Monday before Garcia would face the Baltimore Orioles. “Say, ‘You know what? I have to make adjustments, because I’m different than I used to be.’ That’s how guys stay around and have long careers. If you don’t make adjustments, then you’re not going to have those long careers. Six, seven, eight years and then you’re out. Hitters have to do it, too.”
While it might have been reasonable to expect Garcia to duplicate the 12 wins that he picked up last season with the White Sox, no one could have envisioned the season that he’s had. Garcia has pitched to a 3.09 ERA (nearly a full run less than his career ERA of 4.06) and is on pace to allow less homers than he ever has in a full season’s worth of work — which is even more incredible when you consider the home park that he plays in.
“I think he’s probably exceed them,” Girardi said when asked about his expectations for Garcia. “Just his ability to keep us in every game and win ballgames for us… The innings he’s given us, and just the job that he’s done. I don’t think his first start was until two weeks into the season, and it didn’t bother him. He gets the extra rest, and it doesn’t bother him. He just goes out and pitches.”
One could make the argument that after CC Sabathia, Garcia has been the Yankees next most reliable starter. He’s given Girardi at least five innings in all but one of his starts this season, and his lowest ERA in any month this season was a 3.96 in June. That consistency makes him a tempting option in October, especially with the uncertainty that comes from start to start with the likes of A.J. Burnett, Phil Hughes and Bartolo Colon.
Girardi was asked if he would hesitate to use Garcia in the postseason due to his lack of overpowering stuff.
“There are offenses that are good fastball hitting clubs, and sometimes that offspeed stuff can give them trouble,” he said. “He’s matched up pretty good against some pretty good teams this year, so we’ve seen him do that. It’s a different style, and sometimes it helps who you follow. If you follow a power pitcher, that can be advantageous to both guys. Freddy just has the ability to make pitches when he has to, and I think that matches up pretty well.”
While we’d never be able to get Girardi to discuss it with close to a month remaining in the season, we have the luxury of being able to consider hypothetical situations on this forum. I want to know, if the postseason were to start tomorrow, what would your rotation look like?
Would you go with CC on short rest to pitch in Games 1, 4 and 7? Who starts Game 2? Who starts Game 3? If CC goes on short rest, would you feel comfortable allowing any other starts to do the same?
My opinion (which will surely change between here and October) is that you have to have CC go on short rest, simply because he is easily the most dominant pitcher on the staff, and he’s proven in the past that he can handle that. Then the question becomes, how do you fill in the gaps behind him? With Garcia and Ivan Nova being the Yankees most consistent starters after CC, I think those two have to handle Games 2 and 3. Colon may be the pitcher most likely to give you a seven inning gem, but Garcia and Nova are sure to give you a chance to win. I wouldn’t feel comfortable allowing anyone other than CC to go on short rest, so I’d probably pitch Nova in Game 2, Garcia in Game 3, CC in Game 4, Colon in Game 5, Nova in Game 6 and then back to CC for a potential Game 7.
What would you do?
Here are some more notes from Girardi’s press conference:
• Girardi announced the rotation beyond Hughes tomorrow and Burnett on Wednesday. Nova will pitch on Thursday, followed by Colon on Friday and CC on Saturday. Garcia will take the ball on Sunday. No one is getting skipped, so that means everyone gets an extra day of rest this week.
• Once again, Girardi sang Jesus Montero’s praises for his approach at the plate this morning. “What I’ve liked is that he’s made in-game adjustments,” Girardi said. “Where a pitcher has gotten him out with a pitch and made him look silly, and he’s either taken it the next time or gotten a base-hit. That’s a good sign for a young player.”
• In my two days around the Yankees, I’ve noticed that Montero has been one of the first two or three guys in the clubhouse each morning. Today around 10 a.m., he headed out to the field with bench coach Tony Pena before anyone else was even dressed to do some catching drills. They worked mostly on throws to second base, with Pena repeatedly saying, “Good, good.” He seemed to be making some strong throws, but there’s obviously a lot more to catching than just throwing. I don’t know whether he’ll ever be a reliable defensive option behind the dish, but I will tell you that he seems to have the work ethic to succeed. Montero will DH and bat eighth against the lefty Brian Matusz today.
• Derek Jeter had another big day yesterday, tying a career-high with five RBI. He drove a homer over the left field fence, and later knocked a two-out, two-run base hit up the middle. He’s been locked in since his return from the DL, batting .346 with 11 doubles, three triples, three homers and 34 RBI in 50 games. The important thing is, he’s driving the ball to all fields, and it’s no longer Groundout City in the Bronx. “I’ve said all along that I don’t think I realized the pressure that he was under to get that 3,000th hit,” Girardi said. “Everything that he’s done in his career, he’s handled with such grace and been able to relax in the big moment. Since he’s gotten by that, he’s been a different player.”
• An interesting milestone that not many people seem to be talking about: Mariano Rivera is just five saves away from tying Trevor Hoffman’s record of 601 career saves. He should become only the second player in MLB to reach the 600 marker, and will become the all-time saves leader shorter thereafter. With saves being a relatively new stat (compared to wins, hits, home runs, etc.), this record may not have the same lure as others, but it’s still a very big deal. Rivera is widely considered to be the greatest closer of all-time, and now he can make that official. “I think once he to 600 it will (be a big deal),” Girardi said. “Or even when he gets to 598. I think when he gets 600 it will get a lot more attention.”
• Nick Swisher is getting the day off, despite having five home runs and 17 RBI vs. the Orioles this season. That’s the most homers and second-most RBI he has against any team in 2011. He’s 1-for-16 against Matusz in his career, which explains Girardi’s thinking. Starting in his place in Andruw Jones, who is 0-for-6 against Matusz.
I just don’t get why Freddy is always questioned. I’d rather have a million of him than a few guys who throw hard and simply can’t pitch (not saying you are questioning him, Vincent). He’s been amazing and I would LOVE to have him back next year.
Colon should not be lumped in with AJ and Hughes – that’s not fair. We’ve gotten more than we ever could have expected from him, but it’s true that he really hasn’t been THAT good for awhile – that’s why I’d skip him a start.
CC will go on 3 days rest quite a bit, but I don’t feel that comfortable with it until he gets back in a groove.
One reason why no one is talking about the saves record is that it doesn’t really matter. No matter what that dude in San Diego said, Mo is far and away the greatest closer in history regardless of how many saves he accumulates.
“Would you go with CC on short rest to pitch in Games 1, 4 and 7?”
100% YES.
“Who starts Game 2?”
NO QUESTION NOVA.
“Who starts Game 3?”
TOUGH CALL BUT GARCIA.
“If CC goes on short rest, would you feel comfortable allowing any other starts to do the same?”
NO NEED TO SO NO.
J. Alfred Prufrock September 5th, 2011 at 11:54 am
Bo Knows, yep, Martin is 28 or 29 I think, but his body is “older.”
All the more reason to get Montero some reps back there. Despite Cervelli’s higher level of play recently, I do not want to have him be the guy in the postseason if Martin were unable to play. I’d want Montero’s bat.
Also, we’re not getting HFA in the WS. I really don’t want to be looking at Montero out of the lineup for potentially four of seven against Philadelphia, especially since he will abuse that ballpark if he’s in there….
Too be acknowledged by non-Yankee fans as the greatest closer in baseball history, Mariano should have the most saves. That takes almost all the subjectivity out of the equation.
Montero is a workhorse. He virtually reconfigured his body in order to be a more effective and agile catcher. His work ethic cannot be questioned. Good to see he is working with hard with Pena, who is the best.
Cervelli has a .316 OBP vs. righties and a 100 OPS+ overall. I’d rather have acclimated Montero earlier and had that bat in the lineup from catcher, as well as DH. Plus it would have kept Martin fresh but without the loss in offense. Hopefully, next year. Playoff 25 man will be interesting to say the least.
What Montero bat? He hasn’t proven yet to be better “right now” than Cervelli. Projections and reputations should take a back seat to performance and for the last couple of months Cervelli has been outstanding at the plate.
Freddy does what Freddy has been doing for most of his career, pitch (not throw) quality starts. He keeps hitters off balance which a pitcher should be doing.
Greg Maddox never had high velocity but made a living using every part of the strike zone. Freddy does a similar thing.
They won’t throw anyone else on 3 days rest. So, since they will need 4 starters anyway, I don’t think they’re throwing CC 3 times in the Alds.
“Cervelli has a .316 OBP vs. righties and a 100 OPS+ overall.”
****************
* In his last 10 games Cervelli is 12-29, a .414 BA.
* Since the All-Star break, Cervelli is 17-47, a .362 BA with a .434 OBP and .966 OPS.
Cervelli has a .316 OBP vs. righties and a 100 OPS+ overall. I’d rather have acclimated Montero earlier and had that bat in the lineup from catcher, as well as DH. Plus it would have kept Martin fresh but without the loss in offense. Hopefully, next year. Playoff 25 man will be interesting to say the least.
///
Yankeefem, can you imagine if Martin were to go down, having Cervelli to throw at Cliff Lee in Philly in the World Series, instead of Montero??
As per Freddy, he succeeded in AL previously with the White Sox. No surprise that he continues to pitch well as an AL pitcher in 2011.
“What Montero bat? He hasn’t proven yet to be better “right now” than Cervelli. Projections and reputations should take a back seat to performance and for the last couple of months Cervelli has been outstanding at the plate.”
Do you really believe this? Small samples can deceive…..Montero is a better hitter and always has been. Cervelli isn’t a bad contact guy but you can’t allow a little hot stretch to blind you from the track record…..which is of a back up catcher with back up catcher offensive ability.
A lot of being able to catch is the willingness to do the work…..if Mike Piazza could make himself into a passable catcher in the big leagues then Montero should be able to as well because he has more ability defensively and a better arm.
Freddy just plain and simple knows how to pitch…
Greg Maddux threw 94 in his prime. It’s true that he was throwing mid 80′s at the end of his career, but in his prime he had nasty stuff. Also, it’s dangerous to compare anyone to one of the 15 best pitchers in history.
There was a stretch where Cody Ransom was hitting over .300 (and he didn’t have a bad bat, either). No one would have suggested, however, that he play over Alex Rodriguez.
Montero has Rodriguez-like power, plus a short stroke that the Yankees’ lineup against Lee last postseason couldn’t muster. The Giants, however, went with pitches and drove the ball the other way….Montero will make a career of doing so, and with power…
Blake for some reason Freddy’s success is viewed as a fluke. I see no reason why he can’t pitch well in the playoffs………….
17-47 is a pretty small sample size….Cervelli is an improving back up catcher…..that’s what he is.
Yes to CC.
Game 2
Andy Pettitte
Too early to tell. Let it play out, and ride the hot hand.
I would not pitch a rookie. So no to Nova.
If Hughes is dominant from here on out, you would have to consider him. Otherwise, Colon or Freddy. And for me it would depend on who had the better numbers against the opponent.
Nova probably for game 3.
Betsy,
It’s no fluke…..I do think you just look at matchups though in the playoffs. I would have no problem throwing Freddy against the Rangers or Tigers…..Boston I’d be a little more hesitant because of their approach at the plate. Freddy has to really be on with his location to have success against a very patient lineup like that.
Montero will not catch in the playoffs. Anyone hoping that he’ll be the backup is in for a disappointment. The only way montero makes the playoff roster is if he hits with authority over the next 4 weeks. Next yr is a different story.
Freddy Garcia is smart, he knows he does not have the fastball to get hitters out anymore.
He throws it only 36% of the time, the lowest percentage in the major leagues for a non-knuckleball pitcher.
Cervelli has improved, that’s really great for him.
Contextually, though, this is apples and oranges. You don’t hold back a hitter who can change your lineup and who can win games with his bat, win a series, even…that’s what Montero’s potential is…
Colon or Freddy regardless of what anyone else does from hereon out – AJ and Hughes as long-men in the pen
“No one would have suggested, however, that he play over Alex Rodriguez”
Except one ex blogmeister, Pete A.
I could probably find the post if you want to laugh. GFand others let him have it.
Garcia is my game 2 starter without hesitation. The only question I have Nova and Colon 3-4 or Colon-Nova.
Garcia has had a better season than Nova and is a seasoned veteran that won’t be intimidated by the big stage.
WC, Cervelli has done a good job lately, props to him, but those numbers wouldn’t sustain in larger samples. His righty splits are pretty bad overall, and he has zero power from that side. With Montero on the horizon, Cervy isn’t long for this lineup after this year and you can’t compare the two bats.
Blake, but he did just pitch well up there recently…………It’s fine to play the matchup game, but IMO he should get a start regardless of who they play. Let’s face it, Boston is a tough go for any team………but we don’t have to worry about that now because that matchup may never happen
Tar, it had to be a joke, no? That would make me laugh, because it is spectacularly stupid
.
blake September 5th, 2011 at 12:07 pm
“17-47 is a pretty small sample size….Cervelli is an improving back up catcher…..that’s what he is.”
“What Montero bat? He hasn’t proven yet to be better “right now” than Cervelli. Projections and reputations should take a back seat to performance and for the last couple of months Cervelli has been outstanding at the plate.”
Do you really believe this? Small samples can deceive…..Montero is a better hitter and always has been. Cervelli isn’t a bad contact guy but you can’t allow a little hot stretch to blind you from the track record…..which is of a back up catcher with back up catcher offensive ability.
**************
Montero has proven nothing in the big leagues so far. I am not saying he won’t. I am saying right now, Cervelli is a very experienced backup catcher who happens to be very hot at the plate and is the better option by far.
There is no way I start Montero behind the plate in a post-season game. Why? To put him in a position to fail?
LGY, that seems to have gone unnoticed – I guess because Freddy isn’t flashy. I think Nova will be fine, but I totally agree about Freddy -he won’t be intimidated.
Freddy has really become one of my favorites this year. I love his approach and his professionalism. With his command of the strike zone and ability to change speeds, he almost doesn’t need a good fastball–mid-eighties is sufficient. Like the OP noted, following Freddy after a hard thrower, like CC, Nova, or Colon, probably would work to Freddy’s advantage. And it helps the pitching staff to have a variety of different looks on any given day.
J A
I’m more of a – let’s see what happens. My only fear is pushing a kid before he’s ready. We’ve seen too many careers ruined by early success. Montero is exactly what this team needs going forward and if he continues hitting he will be on the PS team. The only kicker might be the Posada factor. Yankees major strength in the PS is the BP and a rested Alex. I’d like to see Teix dropped to the five spot but that’s a different subject and again let’s see what happens.
J alfred
No joke. His hatred for all things Alex had no boundaries.
“There is no way I start Montero behind the plate in a post-season game. Why? To put him in a position to fail?”
I wouldn’t start Montero behind the plate in a playoff game either…..that’s not what you were talking about though….you were talking about hitting.
yankeefeminista September 5th, 2011 at 12:13 pm
WC, Cervelli has done a good job lately, props to him, but those numbers wouldn’t sustain in larger samples. His righty splits are pretty bad overall, and he has zero power from that side. With Montero on the horizon, Cervy isn’t long for this lineup after this year and you can’t compare the two bats.
*************
You say Cervelli has done a good job, I call those numbers since the All-Star break better than good.
I am not comparing Cervelli’s bat with Montero’s. I am saying that as of right now, the better option at backup catcher is Cervelli.
Montero is on the horizon – next year is that horizon.
Freddy would be in the postseason rotation right now for me as well…..which game I started him though would depend on the team they are facing.
“What Montero bat? He hasn’t proven yet to be better “right now” than Cervelli. Projections and reputations should take a back seat to performance and for the last couple of months Cervelli has been outstanding at the plate.”
but you were talking about their bats?
LGY September 5th, 2011 at 12:13 pm
Garcia is my game 2 starter without hesitation. The only question I have Nova and Colon 3-4 or Colon-Nova.
Garcia has had a better season than Nova and is a seasoned veteran that won’t be intimidated by the big stage.
============
I would certainly consider giving him the chance, depending on the match-ups. It would also depend on the bullpen. The thing with Freddy is that I wouldn’t want to get greedy with him against a club like the Sox, who would start to time him the third time through the order. I would get Freddy out of the game after 5 or 6 innings, without fail, in a close scoring game.
CC, Freddy, Nova, Colon, against anybody.
blake September 5th, 2011 at 12:16 pm
“There is no way I start Montero behind the plate in a post-season game. Why? To put him in a position to fail?”
I wouldn’t start Montero behind the plate in a playoff game either…..that’s not what you were talking about though….you were talking about hitting.
************
I was rebutting some comments above that espoused Montero catching instead of Cervelli. Giving him reps at catcher so he could catch instead of Cervelli if Martin went down or needed a spell.
CC, Freddy, and Nova are in…..assuming health.. They next month is a tryout to see who deserves that final spot…..
Ghost, that would be unfair – if Freddy is doing the job, he’s doing the job. He shouldn’t be treated any differently than anyone else – and he’s earned my trust.
With 4 good starters, there’s no reason to throw CC on short rest.
Blake, I don’t agree – why? Colon hasn’t been great, but he’s still more than earned his spot with how he’s pitched this year. No way do I want either Hughes or AJ starting in the post-season.
“was rebutting some comments above that espoused Montero catching instead of Cervelli. Giving him reps at catcher so he could catch instead of Cervelli if Martin went down or needed a spell.”
well if they wanted to make that an opinion they needed to bring him up a long time ago so he could learn the staff etc…..which is why many of us have been calling for that. It’s ok…..Cervelli has improved to the point where I would feel ok about him catching a big game…..and of course hopefully Martin won’t get hurt anyway.
Bo, I’ve seen enough of this kid to not worry about anybody’s ability to ruin him.
Montero likes the big spot, he’s not in awe of anything, IMO. My point is, if Martin goes down, I want Montero in his place, and Alex is one reason…if Alex is himself, that is, the Alex we’re used to, that in itself is huge to the lineup success. Alex, though, is 36 years old, and has a balky hip/knee potentially, possibly hindering his power. Montero is the perfect insurance policy, and brings something no one else from the right side can: Alex like power and Alex like ability to hit for average.
Tex is actually another good reason for Montero as insurance. Tex has become an essentially poor contact hitter, all or nothing type prospect hitting left-handed. I agree he should drop down when batting lefty especially. When we’re clicking the lineup is ferocious, when it stalls, things like Tex’s poor mechanics, Gardner’s lack of slug/LD ability, Alex’s uncertain health, come rushing to the fore. A bat like Montero’s can be more of an equalizer than anyone else we have…I want that bat warmed up and thumping if the less than optimal lineup shows up…
I don’t see the rush with Montero. I understand it emotionally but not logically. The Yankees in this case IMO are doing it exactly right.
They brought him up in a fairly low pressure, low expectation capacity to get his feet wet. The Yankees are playing great with Martin and Cervelli behind the plate and Cervelli has been hot. If it’s not broke don’t fix it.
# Tar September 5th, 2011 at 12:12 pm
“No one would have suggested, however, that he play over Alex Rodriguez”
Except one ex blogmeister, Pete A.
I could probably find the post if you want to laugh. GFand others let him have it.
————
You asked for it, here it is…….
http://yankees.lhblogs.com/200.....ent-704410
Betsy September 5th, 2011 at 12:20 pm
Ghost, that would be unfair – if Freddy is doing the job, he’s doing the job. He shouldn’t be treated any differently than anyone else – and he’s earned my trust.
==============
It’s not about fair; it’s about winning. I wouldn’t want to give the Sox lineup four looks at Freddy’s slow stuff, because they will figure it out eventually. Besides, bringing in Hughes in the sixth, throwing gas at the Sox after being flummoxed by Freddy for five innings sounds like good, clean fun to me!
WC, Yanks chose not to acclimate him, so discussion about Montero catching for us in postseason is likely moot. But I agree that they *could* and *should* have integrated him with pitching staff earlier. You can’t put in Cervelli and not lose something at the plate. As pitching gets tougher, Cervelli doesn’t have the bat to be a force they way Montero does. Hopefully, we will only see Martin back there in the playoffs, but eliminating Montero in WS for 4 games isn’t a great move, esp. if Alex isn’t his usual SLG self
*the* way
The guy who allows the most HRs will be the #2 starter in Detroit
The guy who allows the least HRs will be the #2 starter in Texas
behind CC of course.
Both lineups are RH heavy
CC had a great post-season in 2009, but for the rest of his career, his post-season ERA is 7.02, including a pedestrian (at best) 5.62 last year. I have confidence in the other 3 Yankee starters (Nova, Garcia and Colon) and unless one of those 3 is injured, there’s just no reason not to use them.
Tar September 5th, 2011 at 12:15 pm
J alfred
No joke. His hatred for all things Alex had no boundaries.
///
That’s unfair, but at least the notion wasn’t grounded in an actual belief that Ransom was a better option…
Ghost, I’m going to wait and see how Hughes does in the pen before I decide he’s going to blow anyone away. This is not 2009 and even in 2009 he was bad in the post-season. We can agree to disagree on Freddy.
blake September 5th, 2011 at 12:22 pm
“was rebutting some comments above that espoused Montero catching instead of Cervelli. Giving him reps at catcher so he could catch instead of Cervelli if Martin went down or needed a spell.”
well if they wanted to make that an opinion they needed to bring him up a long time ago so he could learn the staff etc…..which is why many of us have been calling for that. It’s ok…..Cervelli has improved to the point where I would feel ok about him catching a big game…..and of course hopefully Martin won’t get hurt anyway.
**************
The Yankees have obviously taken the go slow approach with Montero. If Cervelli was a disaster the second half, perhaps they would have been more motivated to call Montero up sooner. But that wasn’t even close to the case. There was no reason to do so.
Yanks78 – AJ has allowed the most homers this year – you mean to tell me that he will be the #2 starter in Detroit? God help us.
Cervelli does this every season. He goes on a tear and then turns into a pumpkin for a couple months.
And on this board we have to suffer through things like Cervelli is better than Posada. Cervelli is better than Montero. etc.
2010
First 62 PAs of the season: .415/.483/.528
Last 48 PAs of the season: .394/.553/.485
2009
Post ASB (only 16 PAs): .438/.438/.500
Cervelli is a decent backup but he fools people because he has some strange ability to go on short runs where no one can get him out.
Betsy,
I have at least some concern that Bartolo is running out of gas…..
CC had a great post-season in 2009, but for the rest of his career, his post-season ERA is 7.02, including a pedestrian (at best) 5.62 last year. I have confidence in the other 3 Yankee starters (Nova, Garcia and Colon) and unless one of those 3 is injured, there’s just no reason not to use them.
—————-
Which is why I’d prefer Texas. Gives us more margin for error if CC is mediocre, which he has been most of his postseason career.
A “grinding” performance by CC will do nothing for us against Verlander. We need him to be shutdown.
I too would just roll out the 4 guys and see what happens.
Blake, so do I, that’s why I think he should be skipped a start. However, he’s a lot better than either Hughes or AJ…………..
Betsy September 5th, 2011 at 12:21 pm
Blake, I don’t agree – why? Colon hasn’t been great, but he’s still more than earned his spot with how he’s pitched this year. No way do I want either Hughes or AJ starting in the post-season.
====================
I think that the last slot is between Colon and Burnett. If Burnett can be the guy that we faced in ’08, or the guy that we had in ’09, then I think it would behoove us to give him a chance. He’s got about 4 starts to prove himself, and I suspect that he has a very big hill to climb to regain Girardi’s trust–I can’t imagine that anybody would be eager to bet on Burnett with his track record.
yankeefeminista September 5th, 2011 at 12:25 pm
WC, Yanks chose not to acclimate him, so discussion about Montero catching for us in postseason is likely moot. But I agree that they *could* and *should* have integrated him with pitching staff earlier. You can’t put in Cervelli and not lose something at the plate. As pitching gets tougher, Cervelli doesn’t have the bat to be a force they way Montero does. Hopefully, we will only see Martin back there in the playoffs, but eliminating Montero in WS for 4 games isn’t a great move, esp. if Alex isn’t his usual SLG self
************
Montero is being given the opportunity to DH to show what he can do. How are you eliminating Montero’s bat if he is going to DH a great deal of the time. Girardi has also intimated that he will DH against right-handers as well. I don’t think it’s totally a platoon situation. (Of course his playing time does depend on other players getting half-days off.)
Cervelli catching and Montero at DH are not mutually exclusive.
Wcyf,
Yea I get that…..I just think there is a counter argument to be made that their caution was actually too cautious……it’s not a huge deal but I would have liked to see him up sooner.
Niblick September 5th, 2011 at 12:26 pm
CC had a great post-season in 2009, but for the rest of his career, his post-season ERA is 7.02, including a pedestrian (at best) 5.62 last year. I have confidence in the other 3 Yankee starters (Nova, Garcia and Colon) and unless one of those 3 is injured, there’s just no reason not to use them.
===========
I tend to agree with this. There is no need to go with CC on short rest with the pitching staff that this team has. I would rather use him on regular rest, and possibly use him out of the bullpen in a must-win spot if he’s up for it.
Colon’s peripherals have really fallen off since that Tampa start before the ASB
HRs are way up, Ks are down, walks are up (not by much, but still up), hitters are batting 50 points higher against him.
Giving him some time off might do him some good.
Ghost, I don’t think there is any audition going on – I really do not think that Colon is in danger of losing his spot. I never thought that AJ was intimidated by the post-season; his inconsistencies in 2009 were because he’s just an inconsistent pitcher and he did come up beyond huge in WS game 2. I just don’t think that at this point that you can take Colon out for a guy who has had 1 good start in months…….. The Yankees need to try and get Colon refreshed – that’s their best bet.
I am not so quick to decide rotation yet. Depends on opposition and ballpark. Nor ready yet to boot AJ out of the rotation, especially at home. We still have 25 days until postseason. Let’s see how we look at that point.
I don’t see the rush with Montero. I understand it emotionally but not logically. The Yankees in this case IMO are doing it exactly right.
///
It has absolutely nothing to do with emotion. Emotion is not even in the equation here: it has to do with a 36 year old who might not be able to deliver the game changing power he contributed in 2009, a 3-hitter who kills rallies because of a mechanical issue that is not going to be solved, if at all, until it gets addressed in the offseason, and a left fielder who goes through long spells of not being able to hit the ball out of the infield.
This lineup is more variable than the one we had in 2009, which had Damon, Matsui and Alex Rodriguez having an October/November for the ages…
Colon has still pitched ok…..but its more and more looking like he doesn’t have a real plan B if that 2 seamer is working and he can’t locate…….he’s just not.been nearly as sharp in the 2nd half. Some of that coukd be the innings…….and some of it coukd be the league adjusting to him.
CC pitched with a bad knee in the 2010 post-season, you can throw those numbers away.
Anyone who watched him in the 2009 post-season understands just how good he can be in those situations.
blake September 5th, 2011 at 12:32 pm
Wcyf, Yea I get that…..I just think there is a counter argument to be made that their caution was actually too cautious……it’s not a huge deal but I would have liked to see him up sooner.
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I understand that. The anticipation and excitement about Montero is justified and as a fan I get that. I do think that whatever one thinks of them, Cashman and Girardi’s job is to be totally analytical and dispassionate when make those kinds of calls. That he is 21 years old and given the Yankees have played great baseball lately has a lot to do with it I think.
Whatever they are doing, whatever chemistry they have, it’s working big time. I wouldn’t make big changes right now.
P.S. I think that has something to do with why they decided not to yank someone from the rotation right now. Everything is as good as it can be right now.
“I am not so quick to decide rotation yet. Depends on opposition and ballpark”
Yeah, I agree. Big difference facing the Rangers lineup in Arlington vs. Detroit’s in Comerica. Plus if the Angels make a big run, that changes things quite a bit as well.
Nib,
I meant among Nova, Colon, and Garcia. AJ is out, obviously.
yankeefeminista September 5th, 2011 at 12:34 pm
I am not so quick to decide rotation yet. Depends on opposition and ballpark. Nor ready yet to boot AJ out of the rotation, especially at home. We still have 25 days until postseason. Let’s see how we look at that point.
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Wise words.
J A
I think the Yankees are handling Montero exactly the right way. If he forces his way onto the PS lineup that’s optimum. If he doesn’t, well by what we’ve seen, he’s finally not going anywhere. That to me was a major fear.
The Yankees needed the RH bat going forward more than starting pitching. You’re totally right on Alex and Teix.
As to pitching I love the situation. The Yankees strength is depth. Having two of three of Hughes, Burnett, Colon coming out of the BP as hard throwing long relievers, anytime any starter struggles, is a significant factor.
I love good management and this year Cashman has outdone himself. Talk about belts and suspenders. Situation A, apply solution X and so on. Hey, it might not work but the forethought is there.
blake, I am also worried about Colon potentially being gassed. Giving him a blow here and there is a good idea. If you recall, how did Colon’s 2-seamer look in last game? Wasn’t really watching. But I noticed afterwards that he threw it much more than he had in previous start.
Freddy Garcia has postseason experience with the 2005 White Sox.
http://yankees.mlb.com/team/pl....._id=150119
Tank September 5th, 2011 at 12:33 pm
Colon’s peripherals have really fallen off since that Tampa start before the ASB
HRs are way up, Ks are down, walks are up (not by much, but still up), hitters are batting 50 points higher against him.
Giving him some time off might do him some good.
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The thing is that I don’t see any sign of fatigue when he’s pitching. The velo and the command are there, and his ball appears to be moving. I understand that the results aren’t as good as they were in the first half, but it simply might be a matter of the law of averages evening things out a bit. I think that he needs to mix in his breaking stuff a bit more often, because it seems to me that folks l are sitting on his two-seamer. I’m not real worried about Colon breaking down.
I agree on Cash….stellar year for him after losing out on Lee…..there was no panic even though basically the entire media universe was freaking out and claiming the Red Sox were going to win the division by 10 games
So the Chief already has a ring then? don’t remember him on that ChiSox team of ’05
Bo knows September 5th, 2011 at 12:41 pm
J A
I think the Yankees are handling Montero exactly the right way. If he forces his way onto the PS lineup that’s optimum. If he doesn’t, well by what we’ve seen, he’s finally not going anywhere. That to me was a major fear.
The Yankees needed the RH bat going forward more than starting pitching. You’re totally right on Alex and Teix.
As to pitching I love the situation. The Yankees strength is depth. Having two of three of Hughes, Burnett, Colon coming out of the BP as hard throwing long relievers, anytime any starter struggles, is a significant factor.
I love good management and this year Cashman has outdone himself. Talk about belts and suspenders. Situation A, apply solution X and so on. Hey, it might not work but the forethought is there.
================================
QFT. Cashman deserves executive of the year in my book for the job that he’[s done with this club this year.
yankeefem,
better….he at least threw it some but it still wasn’t as crisp as it was earlier in the season. I would probably skip his next start and see how he responds after that. If you consider him matching up against other teams #4′s though then that’s kinda favorable.
Ghost,
I agree with you about Colon. In the last innings of his starts, he’s throwing harder than Hughes in his first innings. Blake remarked about Freddy that he knows how to pitch. So does Colon. Anybody make the same claim for Hughes or AL?
AJ
Tom, that’s why it’s silly to even suggest the possibility that Colon not be in the rotation.
108 stitches September 5th, 2011 at 12:42 pm
Freddy Garcia has postseason experience with the 2005 White Sox.
http://yankees.mlb.com/team/pl….._id=150119
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Freddy is 6 and 2, with a 3.11 ERA in the postseason–not shabby at all. The guy reminds me a lot of Andy in that he seems utterly unflappable. I said a couple of months ago that I expected Freddy to surprise a lot of folks in the postseason, and I think that it might come to pass…
Bo Knows, I hope that Alex is Alex – that really gives us our best shot to win No. 28.
This team is so good and deep, that I feel confident looking all the way to the World Series.
With that in mind, and a hypothetical showdown with the 2011 Phillies, a much better team than the one we faced in 2009, and the possibility that Martin may not be available at some point to catch, I want another game changer in the lineup, not Francisco Cervelli, especially if the lineup is having trouble in the ways cited.
I want Montero to be prepared, if it comes to that. That’s all.
Colon does know how to pitch as well…..but I’m not sure he currently has the bag of tricks that Garcia does. If something isn’t working for Freddy he basically a kitchen sink full of junk to throw up there…..Bartolo relies more on very good fastball command and movement on that 2 seamer.
montero can catch.
i have no doubt of this .
i want to see him catch some innings this september for pure entertainment value.
the yankees are a lock for the playoffs. the yankees should have some fun and let montero catch a few innings.
Colon needs to find something offspeed to get the hitters off of his fastball. The home runs have hurt him a lot over the last ten games or so.
blake,
Colon also has a 97 mph four-seamer, up and in. It’d keep me loose in the box!
It’s really difficult to know much about a pitcher unless you see him on a consistent basis.
Stats don’t tell you everything, that’s why CC is an even better pitcher than most of us thought before the Yankees signed him, Burnett isn’t anything close to what was expected, and Freddy Garcia has been an outright revelation, he’s just someone who knows how to pitch by executing the right pitch at the right time.
At this point in time it should be AJ and Phil as the long men.
Set AJ’s mechanics every morning before he might go out there. Don’t think AJ, that could be dangerous – follow the formula.
Phil, go inning by inning – Joe will look after you.
What is a weakness on Yankee pitching ie no dominating second starter becomes a strength.
I see no rush to make a rotation decision anymore at this point in the season. Girardi seems comfortable going game by game. That having been said, this is my inclination as to how I would manage our pitching staff in the postseason.
ALDS:
Sabathia
Nova
Garcia
ALCS & WS:
Sabathia
Nova
Garcia
Colon
Bullpen:
Mariano, Robertson, Soriano, Hughes, Logan, Burnett, Noesi.
blake September 5th, 2011 at 12:49 pm
… If something isn’t working for Freddy he basically a kitchen sink full of junk to throw up there…..
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Nice turn of a phrase and an apt description– I’m stealing it!
LOL and someone said yesterday that the non-decision was a joke; I wonder who that was?
Randy, Montero needs to catch someone like Garcia or Hughes, just to break in. Let him work up to a Colon or Sabathia. I’d keep him away from Burnett, though. Montero’s too big to see him crying on the field.
tom,
yea….he has that sometimes.
Ghost,
thanks:)
GreenBeret7 September 5th, 2011 at 12:56 pm
Randy, Montero needs to catch someone like Garcia or Hughes, just to break in. Let him work up to a Colon or Sabathia. I’d keep him away from Burnett, though. Montero’s too big to see him crying on the field.
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Hughes? That’s the opposite of what I would do. I would pair the newbie catcher with the best, most proficient pitchers. In this case, I would have Montero catch CC, Freddy, and Bartolo—they hit their spots, and they know how they want to attack the hitters…all that Montero has to do is set the target and catch the ball..
Betsy September 5th, 2011 at 12:55 pm
LOL and someone said yesterday that the non-decision was a joke; I wonder who that was?
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I guess you can’t read and don’t understand what “anymore” or “at this point in the season means”.
WQhat a difference a day (or 18 hours) makes!
Ghost,
Hughes shouldn’t be that tough to catch. He doesn’t throw many pitches in the dirt, like Sabathia, who uses that pitch to get a lot of strikeouts. Not sure how he and Colon would mesh, though he should be easy to ctch, also.
“Randy, Montero needs to catch someone like Garcia or Hughes, just to break in.”
gb7-
the kid didn’t choke one bit facing lester in his first at bat in the majors.i don’t think he’s gonna choke catching his first game either.
those two pitchers you mention would be fine, but i might take the reverse strategy and have him catch burnett.
catchers do not need to be babied. they are not pitchers.
throw montero in there against anyone and have them throw the effing ball. i guarantee he’ll catch it.
can you imaging thurman munson worrying about who he was going to catch first?
come on, montero isn’t the least bit worried who he’s going to catch.
did they worry about you when they threw you out of your first plane?
no they didn’t.
likewise, the yankees should just throw him out there against whoever.
Why did Joe start AJ today?