Wilson ignoring Yankees focus… for now
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Oct 14, 2011 
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In the postseason, starting pitchers hold a press conference the day before they pitch. The clubhouse isn’t open to media pregame, so these afternoon press conferences are a feeding frenzy for writers desperately needing some sort of early story or a sidebar that will hold up for the next day’s paper.
In the postseason, even an uninteresting starting pitcher gets several column inches of space in the next day’s paper.
Safe to say, C.J. Wilson is well aware that some of those column inches have been devoted to his pending free agency, and the possibility of joining the Yankees. I’m sure it comes up often, and he was asked about before last night’s start in Game 5 of the ALCS.
“Where else would I rather be than here right now?” Wilson said. “This is the ultimate spot to be. I am in a good organization. I have worked my whole life to get to this point. I am not going to misappropriate any mental resources towards the future. The only future for me is (today). That’s the only thing I am worried about.”
When the Rangers postseason run ends, Wilson will have little choice but to shift his attention. He’s expected to be the top free agent starting pitcher — unless CC Sabathia actually hits the market — and that’s going to make him an active part of the rumor mill. An agent speculated to Buster Olney last night that Wilson could get a five or six-year deal worth anywhere from $60 million to $100 million depending on his postseason success.
“I am a baseball fan so obviously I pay attention to everything that’s going on,” Wilson said. “I read stuff every once in a while about what is going on in baseball, in other organizations. I try to keep abreast of it because it’s my industry.”
Associated Press photo
Jeter: Luck. Same logic that had him keep Teixeira at #3 vs rhp hitting .220 until the last week of the season.
Robertson: Obvious move, if you think your second best reliever should always pitch the eigth inning, which is conventional “wisdom” and required little thought. I’d argue about using your best reliever in the highest leverage situations, but like LGY I’m tired of arguing that.
Montero: What? Lol. Oooh, Girardi stuck with Montero for more than one ab, brilliant! Montero forced what little he got by quick performance. Girardi still gave up on him quickly vs rhp.
Girardi would make a much better Drill Sergeant than MLB manager.
I have a “whatever” attitude with Wilson. If they get him, fine, if they don’t, fine.
Girardi would make a much better Drill Sergeant than MLB manager.
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Happy Birthday?
JoeAuriemmaYES John Henry didn’t support the Crawford signing? Isn’t he the one signing the checks? If he didn’t agree, why would he allow it to happen.
JonLaneNYC Henry: Red Sox players were ‘tired.’ The insane about of rain was hard on every team.
Erin October 14th, 2011 at 2:55 pm
Girardi would make a much better Drill Sergeant than MLB manager.
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Happy Birthday?
—
He did not wish me a happy birthday. :p
jacksquat-
I brought this up once before and nobody cared, but damn it, I’m bringing it up again. Half the guys on the team are rolling their pants up to their knees. The Steinbrenners can afford to invest in optional knickerbockers for those who want them. Or better yet, go back to the Mickey Mantle look of mid-calf pants and two-tone socks.
The Yankees looked like some minor league team from from Liberia this year.
“misappropriate my mental resources” – wow.
Good answer, CJ Wilson.
Red Sox tired?
Cry me a river!
I am not really impressed with Wilson. He looks like a potential left handed AJ to me. Great stuff, but an All-Star from the neck down. I would hate to see the Yankees commit $80 mil to Wilson for five years, but then again, it isn’t my money.
Erin,
I agree with you. C’est la vie. Translation: Whatever.
I like CJ’s quirkiness. You can tell he’s sharp.
He had a bad game yesterday. Likely cost him some.
Like I said yesterday, of course the Rangers would jump at CC. Their ace right now is…CJ Wilson.
How can people be tired of laughing at the expense of the Red Sox?
CJ takes cabs 5 blocks in NYC. Another of those soft SoCal guys.
John Henry: “Carmine has a seat at the draft table.”
Warning! Train wreck footage.
Henry did not support Crawford signing
Permalink|Comments (48) Posted by Peter Abraham, Globe Staff October 14, 2011 02:39 PM
By Peter Abraham, Globe Staff
John Henry is on 98.5 The Sports Hub now discussing the Red Sox with Felger and Mazz.
His most interesting point so far was that he did not support the signing of Carl Crawford.
More to come.
UPDATE, 2:45 p.m.: Henry on the antics in the clubhouse: “If Dustin Pedroia didn’t know how were we supposed to know?
Told by Felger that Pedroia was lying, Henry shot back, “You don’t know Dustin very well.”
UPDATE, 2:51 p.m.: Henry on the collapse: “What happened is that our starting pitchers had a 7.08 ERA. … It was all seven of these guys. … I didn’t see one player out there who wasn’t busting his ass to try and win games.”
UPDATE, 2:56 p.m.: Henry on Beckett: “He’s one of the most competitive guys I’ve ever met.”
UPDATE, 2:58 p.m.: Henry ducked the question on Theo Epstein. But did say. “I would have loved for Theo to be our GM for the next 20 years. … I did everything I could personally to make that happen.”
The more competent lefty starters you can get for the Stadium, the better.
UPDATE, 2:56 p.m.: Henry on Beckett: ?He?s one of the most competitive guys I?ve ever met.?
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at what, beer pong?
Villa Nova-Ya October 14th, 2011 at 3:15 pm
“misappropriate my mental resources” – wow.
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Someone who so misappropriates the english language can’t be relied upon in a big game.
we did fine w/out him this year and 2013 offers a better crop of FA pitchers.
why take up the space of the Baby B’s in 2013 by a major hire now.?
seems inappropriate. not i line with the current philosophy. rather use what we have again
and pick up some bats than take on another aj contract.
he’s not the answer…
What a butt-face Henry is. If the owner says no to a FA signing, then it gets squooshed. But let’s pretend that he didn’t support the Carl Crawford signing, what good does it do say it on the radio. Carl Crawford getting the red
carpetsox treatment. And he hasn’t even left town yet.Sign CC, let the Rangers overpay for Wilson.
m- yeah, that’s got to make Crawford feel really good.
Henry on Beckett: “He’s one of the most competitive guys I’ve ever met.”
It’s true. Here’s the proof:
http://dcbeer.com/wp-content/u.....erfest.jpg
What a loser Henry is. Didn’t want Crawford? Nice welcome to a guy you’re now stuck with and who’s stuck with you. Way to give him a vote of confidence.
Did Pedroia really say he didn’t know?
http://www.bilerico.com/2010/0.....-evil1.jpg
Regarding free agents pitching this coming year, take away C C and the next best is Wilson. To me there is a huge gap between CC and Wilson basically because this is really only his second strong year. He had great numbers last year, and even better this year, but its a small sampling and he is 30 years old. He also has not proven to be able to carry his regular season ability into the post season which is key for the Yankees. Regarding Girardi, I felt with the Yankees offense and come back ability many times he threw in the towel when the Yanks got behind early, and allowed sub par relievers to give up tack on runs that killed any hopes of the late rally. Regarding the Red Sox, I am thankful the Yanks stayed away from posionous Lackey. I think Yanks should decide on Swisher or Gardner, but not to keep both. The Yankees may be the only team batting their corner outfielders 6/7 and 9th. Both are value, but I think Gardner strikes out way too much for a guy hitting 5 to 7 homers a year, and Swisher struggled early, and struggled again in the playoffs.
That’s one thing for me, blocking pitchers. But the Yankees are never going to get on board with that. So, it’s not worth worrying about.
Finally, I think signing CJ would be a misappropriation of funds.
Maybe Henry can Crawford out at left wing for Liverpool?
I’d love to know who tattled on the beer drinking during games. It has to be a clubhouse employee, right?
-try Crawford out-
d’oh
I really wish the media would stop asking guys like CJ Wilson about being pursued by the Yankees.
Like he gives a $hit!
He’s in the ALCS trying to pitch his team to the World Series.
Chad, I love your work, but posting a story like this is so poorly timed it reminds me of when ARod opted out during the World Series.
Next thing you know you guys will be asking Pujols or Fielder whether he’s thought about playing for another team next season.
Why don’t we let the season end before we start asking guys these kinds of questions?
Red Sox opposed to Theo taking aides. And so it begins! Way to treat your 2 time WS Champion* GM
I only get tired of laughing at the Red Sox, because we didnt win this year and thus are in no position to laugh. Also, I know how easy it is for things to turn around for Boston teams. They may be the biggest disaster right now, but World Series Champions* next year.
They have the ability to get what they want, when they want it. And they also generally have the best of luck.
while we will always spend money it’s time to spend it wisely
i don’t see current ownership throwing away aj dollars unless a guy is a bona fide superstar
which cj isn’t.
he might be the best on the market but there will be better.
the win at any cost philosophy died with george…
So Carl Crawford now gets to answer question for the next 6 years about how he feels that his owner never wanted him on the team… that whole situation in Boston is just getting better and better from an outsiders perspective.
butterball – when you do high socks the pants are supposed to be rolled up under the knee, it gives you extra padding when you slide. you dont get short cut pants…
CJ would be a nice addition to the starting rotation. Although he’s not a No.1-type, its important to have two effective lefties (assuming C.C returns) against its key rival, the left-hand dominant Red Sox. NYY management should also attempt to trade for SF’s Matt Cain, since they (Giant F.O) might want to drop some salary in order to sign a FA impact hitter. Yankees certainly have the prospects to attract the interest.
Nick Swisher? He’s no bargain at #10.5 Mil and should not be resigned. Mediocre outfielder, terrible post-seaosn performer and below average baseball IQ (baserunning, advancing runner, throwing decisions). For the same salary, Free Agent RFer Michael Cuddyer would be a nice pickup.
Cuddyer is like a thousand times worse than Swisher.
Irreverent Discourse October 14th, 2011 at 3:58 pm
butterball ? when you do high socks the pants are supposed to be rolled up under the knee, it gives you extra padding when you slide. you dont get short cut pants?
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High Socks for Hope!!!
Also hurt all the time
“win at all costs” is a misappropriation of language.
It implies that there is a price to pay for “winning”, but the “winning” part is assumed. Usually, a “win at all costs” philosophy does not result in winning; you compromise your future chances of winning, and also fail to win in the present.
Lose-lose.
Cuddyer has played one full season in 11 years.
Swisher is a better hitter and an infinitely better fielder.
so we lost this year, i am over it.
it was worse in 04, much worse,
it’s time to move on,
wisely.
winning it all every year is an adjunct to winning every game of the year, it’s impossible…
Losing in ’04 probably saved our future.
Winning it all every year would be feasible if the Yankees got treated fairly by the HP umpires in the playoffs. The HP umpires make it infinitely more difficult for us. They tried to steal away the 2009 WS, especially in Game 6. Thankfully, we had Lord Matsui
TylerKepner I actually feel bad for Carl Crawford. By all accounts he works extremely hard, cares, apologized to fans for his bad season.
For the same salary, Free Agent RFer Michael Cuddyer would be a nice pickup.
–
Did you mean, for league minimum?
JAP – Not really. We were stuck with Torre for 3 more years after 2004, so it didnt do much.
Teary – I highly doubt anything the umpires do is intentional, it’s just incompetence due to a very difficult task. They mess up in the other direction just as much, you only remember it when it hurts the Yankees.
TylerKepner Crawford is overpaid and had a terrible season. But he doesn’t deserve this from John Henry. No one forced Henry to pay him $142M.
The Angels should approach the Red Sox about trading for Crawford. The Sox might eat money to make the contract go away.
Pretty funny both big Tampa free agents from last year have now been publicly informed they were not wanted.
Erin October 14th, 2011 at 4:06 pm
TylerKepner I actually feel bad for Carl Crawford. By all accounts he works extremely hard, cares, apologized to fans for his bad season.
—————————–
At least the guy didn’t blame the schedule like their other $100 million man.
Soriano will prove to be an important part of the 2012 team.
I never get tired of laughing at the expense of the Red Sox. To collapse like they did is one thing. It happens-once every lifetime.
But for the entire organization to completely meltdown? After all of the praise that has been heaped on this team by the local and national media?
This can’t get much better. Perhaps Lucchino and Henry will end up getting in a fist fight in a Boston bar.
On the field, they have too much talent, particularly pitching talent, to be a bad team next year, unless they dump guys like Lester and Beckett. But there is a sideshow which is going to follow this team for a while.
Now we can all hope and pray that they name Bobby V. as the manager so we can have this sort of entertainment everynight.
Crawford doesnt strike me as one of those guys that will make an issue of this either, ie: show up out of shape to camp. He’ll probably be all respectful about it.. kind of a shame.. if it were Manny or someone I’d be preparing to get the popcorn out.
There’s a difference between the owner saying it and the GM saying it. One is business, and the other is personal. Not much of a difference, but it’ll be awkward the next time Crawford shows up at the yacht.
Because Manny quit on the red sox his final month with the team…. batting a piss poor .340
Shame Spencer October 14th, 2011 at 4:15 pm
Crawford doesnt strike me as one of those guys that will make an issue of this either, ie: show up out of shape to camp. He’ll probably be all respectful about it.. kind of a shame.. if it were Manny or someone I’d be preparing to get the popcorn out.
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I agree. Crawford seems like a genuinely decent guy. I feel bad for him. He doesn’t fit in at all with the 2011 Red Sox. I wish there were other options for him.
It is sort of shocking to see so many members of the same organization publicly embarrassed in such a short period of time. This has to be some kind of record, no?
with the success of the garcia/colon experiment and the emergence of nova pitching was not the problem
assuming we can replicate the pitching success of 2011
and place ourselves back in the playoffs
what we need is more timely hitting
living with swisher thru the reg season is fine but he will kill us in the post
montero as the DH/BUC and beltran in RF for 1 year will change that
Crawford should ask the Packers to trade for him.
The only thing with Matt Cain and John Danks is they are FA’s next year, so I would be hesitant in giving up top prospects.
Not sold on lefty CJ Wilson for the likely money he’ll be asking for, especially with his postseason ERA so far of 8.04 in 3 unimpressive starts. Not advocating lefty Mark Buehrle, but for cheaper dollars and a shorter contract he might be worth a look.
John Henry is a super genius. Crawford is signed for big bucks and a decent length of time, and he didn’t want to sign him. Nope, the guy who wanted him is gone, even though he wanted him to remain there 20 years.
mick – Beltran? hahahahaha you must have tripped and fell into 5 years ago.
montero as the DH/BUC and beltran in RF for 1 year will change that.
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If the Yankees are going to bid on Beltran than they should pick up Swisher’s option, as Boras clients often don’t sign until late in the year. At that point they can trade Swisher for prospects.
However Boras will be seeking more than one year for Beltran, and Kemp might be available in next years FA market.
Reading the comments over at Extra Bases, they also seem embarrassed by Henry’s comments so at least their fans aren’t as foolish as their ownership. Funny enough.. they also seem to want to show Ortiz the door. Not saying I dont understand their position completely, but you gotta wonder who they can get in there to replace that production..
Yogi, I see. The guy he didn’t want is now a lifer, and the guy he wanted to be a lifer is now gone.
LOL.
Not everyone is cut out to own a sports team John….. Im sure players just can’t wait to sign with the Red Sox now
blake – To your point, this was what one person wrote that had me cracking up:
“hyperRevue wrote:
“Hey, CJ Wilson, thanks for coming for a visit. We really want you to sign with us. Fair warning, though, if you struggle in your first year, our owner will disavow ever wanting to sign you in the first place. And, honestly, if you go on to have a great career, once you leave we’ll trash you anonymously to the Globe. So, do we have a deal?”
10/14/2011 3:14 PM EDT”
football to instill HGH testing.
how many baseball players will be suspended if that happened right now?
I don’t think prospective free agents will be too enthralled with the Red Sox with the extraordinary bad public relations and mistreatment of coaches and now players. Crawford can’t be happy. Henry is truly a jerk.
YT,
Buehrle is what, two years older than Wilson? A far better and longer record, too. He should be looked at.
I wanted Carlos in the worst way, but George was as tantalized by someone else’s aged left-hander as Levine & Co. were as recently as 2010.
Back then, it was pass on Beltran & fork out for Randy Johnson. In 2010, it was give up stud Montero for Lee.
& people wonder why some fans don’t just blindly trust the front office.
Today, though, I don’t want Carlos, because Carlos is now a stick of dynamite.
If the Yankees are going to bid on Beltran than they should pick up Swisher’s option, as Boras clients often don’t sign until late in the year. At that point they can trade Swisher for prospects.
However Boras will be seeking more than one year for Beltran, and Kemp might be available in next years FA market.
=================
doubt there will be a big market for beltran, maybe 2 years or 2 w/ an option.
why commit to 10.25 to swish then deal him, save the 9.25 and use it to replace him
austinmac October 14th, 2011 at 4:30 pm
I don’t think prospective free agents will be too enthralled with the Red Sox with the extraordinary bad public relations and mistreatment of coaches and now players. Crawford can’t be happy. Henry is truly a jerk.
_____________________________________________________________________________
Perhaps, but with a new coach and GM they may see it going now in the opposite direction. I don’t know what percentage of players think the owner is an idiot, maybe on the cowboys 100%, but I don’t think that makes much of a difference, it’s more the agents turf. Players may resoante with a new approach of a new coach, GM and some new players. Hard to tell, generally most of these money wh^^es just follow the cash.
Back then, it was pass on Beltran & fork out for Randy Johnson.
–
Stupid thing about this was we could have had them both. Beltran offered to sign for under 100 mil with NY. The AAV was like 16-17 mil per year. Super cheap.
If Beltran was coming here as a platoon player and for platoon player money he’d be well worth the signing… but he won’t so its all moot. The guy will not stay healthy for all of the 2012 campaign no matter what team he plays with.
why commit to 10.25 to swish then deal him, save the 9.25 and use it to replace him
–
You commit to swish because he is a valuable commodity at a cheap price for a limited time, which is like the epitome of a high valued trade asset outside of a young cost controlled star.
Everyone needs to face the fact that NY will pick up Swisher’s option, and it will be the right choice.
Shame, there are actually some pretty smart Red Sox fans. On one board, they were all dismissing the “Greatest Team Ever” stuff with the same concerns about their team that Yankee/baseball fans here were observing. The pink hat crowd at Fenway, & the big mouths that jumped on the bandwagon in 2004, have grown in numbers, though. Still, there are some lifers who are good baseball fans.
Tom-
At the same time, Wilson only has 2 year@200 innings/year of wear and tear on his arm.
Buehrle also had similar numbers, but from the left side, as Garcia did last year.
Maybe forget about either one and sign lefty Bruce Chen to a one year incentive contract. Oh no did I just say that. Signing an older FA pitcher to a one year contract might make sense, in order to see if either of Banuelos or Betances are ready to come aboard in 2013. Kuroda anyone?
i don’t know how valuable swisher is
you know he craps the bed in the PS
we can get there w/out him
J. Alfred – I give them all credit. In that type of market you’re bound to have a higher baseball IQ than most fans. I just cant imagine if the roles were reversed – this blog would be a disaster zone. Its almost enough to make me feel bad for them… almost
PeteAbe
Big picture: The owner has to be the adult in the room and look at the big picture. Henry is showing that.
PeteAbe
Henry’s interview is over. Pretty good stuff. Could be the start of a turning point of sorts
Jerkface October 14th, 2011 at 4:40 pm
Everyone needs to face the fact that NY will pick up Swisher’s option, and it will be the right choice.
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Well I think your right on the first part, on the second part it’s open for some debate.
Guy drives people nuts with his approach and antics. If he comes back, which I agree he probably will I’d like to see a different approach out there starting to canning the looking to the heavens before each pitch and trying to put the ball in play somewhere as opposed to the all or nothing he does today.
Jerkface October 14th, 2011 at 4:38 pm
Back then, it was pass on Beltran & fork out for Randy Johnson.
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Stupid thing about this was we could have had them both. Beltran offered to sign for under 100 mil with NY. The AAV was like 16-17 mil per year. Super cheap.
//
Yea. Let’s count are blessings, though, that twice in the last six years opposing GMs have saved the Yankees from themselves.
Arizona refused Cano, and Seattle turned down the Montero headlined deal.
Twice in six years the Yankees have tried to trade away arguably their two most talented hitters today and twice have failed. Were they both just meant to be Yankees? I hope so, because I wouldn’t put it past them to try and do it a third time, but this time they won’t get turned down.
*our blessings
In all likelehood, the starting offense will be the same, with Montero replacing Posada. Hopefully the players will spend the offseason working hard on their deficiences and Girardi will rework the batting order to maximize run potential.
Red Sox–fuggeabout it. Toast, Done and in extra dark and crispy, Burnt up. They’re back to the unlovable losers they always were.
Nobody likes them now. Nobody wants to play for them now. Nobody drafted wants to sign with them now.
That’s why it is so much fun to revel in their destruction.
Think about this, Batman. If this beer stuff is the tip of the iceberg, and has been going on for a long time, as David Ortiz implies, what about steroids?
Don’t you think the whole darn team was taking them? With Jerry Remy’s son the supplier (what do you say about that, Rem Dawg)?
It makes that complete scumbag part owner of the Red Sox, George Mitchell, even more of an immoral scumbag for trying to deflect blame from his obviously tainted franchise onto ARod, Pettitte, et al.
George–you get what you deserve. May you and your team rot in the AL cellar for the next 50 years.
I have no pressing need to get rid of Swisher, but I also don’t want him actually hitting in that situation, late in a game as we’re running out of outs and it’s a must win.
It’s not like he’s Alex, whom you let bat and come what may.
You talk about Montero for Lee like it would have been a bad idea… but Sabathia wouldn’t have the team by the balls, there would be no position lockup around the DH spot and who knows… they may still be playing baseball this week.
Picking up Swishers option is a no brainer ……I would shop him though and see what he’d being back.
Shame,
Irs a joke really….as I said yesterday….I feel as bad for Crawford as I can for somebody making g 20+ million dollars a year to do something Id probably do for meal money…
I have no pressing need to get rid of Swisher, but I also don’t want him actually hitting in that situation,
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isn’t that a contradiction?
why repeat this same nonsense in the 2012 alds?
What does this mean?: “[Crawford was ] definitely a baseball signing. In fact, anyone involved in the process, anybody involved in upper management with the Red Sox will tell you that I personally opposed that. They all know that,” Henry said.
“I’ll just tell you that at the time I opposed the deal, but I don’t meddle to the point of making decisions for our baseball people. Theo will tell you, this was driven by our baseball people. It wasn’t a PR move.”
How was Crawford a baseball move?! The people on this blog were able to point out all of the reasons why Crawford made absolutely no sense for that team. He did not address any of the needs the Sox actually had last off season. How is that a baseball move???? Or, maybe what he’s saying is it was a baseball move but an ill-advised one?
Prufrock – What team in baseball would want their 5th or 6th best hitter up in that position? None.
If it comes to that, enough other things went wrong already that losing that game/series is not Swisher’s fault anyway.
If they can sign Beltran for 2 years or less then they should …..package Swisher for prospects or a pitcher
Shame – i think he’s saying that his GM wanted him because of his skills as a ballplayer, and Henry didn’t want him for some other (personal, probably racist) reason.
blake – Who is going to trade for Swisher at $12mil and part with anything of consequence?
Well, if Henry was that opposed to signing Crawford, why did he sign the check? Was Luca Brasi holding a gun to his head?
mike just made a good point
bard and papelschmear blew game after game
beckett had a 4-1 lead to balt in the 7th
why blame francona?
i hope they lose ortiz and papelblown next
Not giving Montero ABs in the ALDS cost us the series
Not giving him more ABs in the regular season cost us more wins there too
The obsession with Russell Martin is going to cost us dearly. Whether that is the manager’s role, GM’s call, coaches call, etc. that person needs to be overruled.
I know Girardi sees himself in Russll Martin and Cervelli and thats why he wants them as his catcher, but the GM needs to step in here. If he doesn’t, he is just as culpable. Girardi is like 5th or 6th in the totem pole behind Hank, Hal, Levine, Trost, Cashman and who knows who else… the Streinbrenner sisters, Felix the Gardner, Afterman, etc. But whatever the case, they cannot let Girardi ruin Montero’s career just because he sees himself in Martin/Romine/Cervelli who are all noodle bats
blake – Who is going to trade for Swisher at $12mil and part with anything of consequence?
===============================
the need is evident-we need timely hitting.
if it takes a platoon, so be it.
swisher is not a big loss-opt out
address the need.
Not giving Montero ABs in the ALDS cost us the series
lol… did your magic 8-ball tell you that?
Yea, I think trading away the next great hitter for a north of 30 LHP would have been a disastrous idea.
As for Swisher, he shoulhd have been pinch hit for. The problem with Girardi is, he’s not discerning. Has no intuition on when a move is needed. It’s like the Yankees have to just be loaded to withstand his inability to improvise. That’s why some of us feared Martin being the starting catcher. Not because we hate Martin, but because we knew Girardi’s sense of Martin would somehow cost us.
Great accountability shown by Mr. Henry.
Did Posada batting almost .500 cause us to lose the series too?
Oh good, the Martin/Montero stuff yet again. That would be my cue to leave.
Have a good evening everyone.
Has no intuition on when a move is needed.
==============================
There are certain ppl whose feelings he doesn’t want to hurt.
Funny how he tried to bat jorge 9th tho.
jorge wasn’t having it.
ID, & nobody said it was Swisher’s fault, because nobody who understood what was needed there was surprised by the result.
How do you buy timely hitting? is that a skill? (hint: no)
ID –
Prufrock – it’s easy to make assumptions like that after the fact, when they already went wrong. You pinch hit for him there, and Montero strikes out. Now what? You have no power PH left, you lower your defense for the rest of the game, and you still lose.
Irreverent Discourse October 14th, 2011 at 5:01 pm
Did Posada batting almost .500 cause us to lose the series too?
///
??
Posada should have been moved up to Swisher’s spot, based on how he was hititng.
“Funny how he tried to bat jorge 9th tho.
jorge wasn’t having it.”
But maybe its those PR nightmares that cause Uncle Joe to not make the right moves… which is no excuse, but has to be considered at least. Sometimes, the microscope keeps people honest. Other times, I think it keeps them scared.
That’s why some of us feared Martin being the starting catcher.
====================================
and why some feared playing detroit with their righty starters.
would have liked to see more of montero and jones vs texas
funny they had 3 leftys, det 3 rightys
But Swisher out hit Teixeira… so is he playing first base now batting 5th? You can’t operate in hindsight, it’s loony.
Irreverent Discourse October 14th, 2011 at 5:04 pm
Prufrock – it’s easy to make assumptions like that after the fact, when they already went wrong. You pinch hit for him there, and Montero strikes out. Now what? You have no power PH left, you lower your defense for the rest of the game, and you still lose.
///
Well, I think I just said you let Alex hit. Alex did strike out. I don’t now revise my sense that Alex still should hit in that situation. SO trying to paint me as ultra-result oriented isn’t going to fly.
Would like some feedback on the merits of bringing back Joba as a starter.
Joba has one of the best sliders in the game. The slider is associated with elbow injuries, and slider pitchers experience injuries at a slightly higher rate than other pitchers. In a 2002 study done on teenagers the slider was responsible for an 86% increase chance of elbow injury.
Whether this study is valid or not, is Joba, returning from ulnar collateral ligament replacement, going to be able to rely on his slider with the volume of pitches he’d be throwing as a starter?
the yanks of the late 90′s, had key platoons at a few positions, whatever happened to that concept?
YT,
If he signs with Texas in a couple of years, he will.
Yankee Trader October 14th, 2011 at 5:07 pm
Would like some feedback on the merits of bringing back Joba as a starter.
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he has a short attention span a la AJ…can change from inning to inning, pitch to pitch.
better suited as a reliever.
“October 14, 2011 at 4:55 pm blake – Who is going to trade for Swisher at $12mil and part with anything of consequence?”
A team that needs offense and is close to winning….like the Phillies or Giants or Braves. You’re not going to get a star back but you could get something of value maybe.
mick October 14th, 2011 at 5:05 pm
That’s why some of us feared Martin being the starting catcher.
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and why some feared playing detroit with their righty starters.
would have liked to see more of montero and jones vs texas
funny they had 3 leftys, det 3 rightys
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But if he were a thinking manager, and wasn’t a slave to things like handedness at all costs, one wouldn’t have to pray for a certain opponent because of the manager’s literal mindedness. They had options to exercise in the regular season they didn’t even explore. They could have brought Montero up earlier and given him Cervelli’s spot. They could have also had Posada take more turns behind the plate…They had two other catching options that could have worked in relief, were they not so terrorized in mind by the bogey man of bad catching that has far less reality than they gave it…they’re just not creative thinkers, & nothing anyone says here will change that.
they’re just not creative thinkers, & nothing anyone says here will change that.
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you know joe could give you an answer
“Would like some feedback on the merits of bringing back Joba as a starter.”
Considering they don’t need a closer……don’t need a set up guy……and don’t need a 7th inning guy even…….it makes a heck of a lot more sense than wasting him in the bullpen.
Whether this study is valid or not, is Joba, returning from ulnar collateral ligament replacement, going to be able to rely on his slider with the volume of pitches he’d be throwing as a starter?
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Yes, because as a reliever he is nearly 50/50 FB, SL. As a starter he would have to use his curve and change more.
A team that needs offense and is close to winning….like the Phillies or Giants or Braves. You’re not going to get a star back but you could get something of value maybe.
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take the option and give beltran the 9.25 for 1 year.
I still think they’re going to have a change of heart on Chamberlain’s role.
well what do i want for dinner that is the pressing question
Joba has to be a reliever because he might get hurt if he starts……oh wait.
Swisher does not cost 12 mil. A RFer with average to above average defense and an .860 OPS that switch hits for 1 year 10 mil is a bargain. Look at Werth and Crawford.
Swisher could return a mid rotation starter or some good prospects.
There was one guy who was married to this idea. Hopefully he takes a job elsewhere. They already got rid of the pitching coach who turned his back on Joba the Starter.
They can tell the world they have new people who have a different take, if they need to construct some rationalization.
blake October 14th, 2011 at 5:13 pm
“Would like some feedback on the merits of bringing back Joba as a starter.”
Considering they don’t need a closer……don’t need a set up guy……and don’t need a 7th inning guy even…….it makes a heck of a lot more sense than wasting him in the bullpen.
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First of all does he have the mindset of a starter ? The last time it was tried he was a different pitcher for the 2nd time through an opposing lineup. No quite the implosions of Burnett but the 5th inning saw a different Chamberlain.
They can tell the world they have new people who have a different take, if they need to construct some rationalization.
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It shouldnt take much to change the narrative since before it was ‘Joba can’t warm up fast enough to relieve, he is a starter!’ and then they changed it to reliever.
mick,
bbq ribs, mac and cheese, slaw and corn bread, and a couple of crispies.
“Swisher could return a mid rotation starter or some good prospects.”
Yes…..the phillies should be all over him. They can’t sign a big name because they already have Upwards ridiculous deal……and Swished is a lot better than any of the other 1B stopgap type guys out there……plus they could put him on LF when Howard comes back.
blake October 14th, 2011 at 5:15 pm
Joba has to be a reliever because he might get hurt if he starts……oh wait.
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& TJS is another good, counter intuitive, argument for having him start again.
Blake-
The question about Joba as a starter had to do with his reliance on his best pitch, the slider, which will put more strain on his elbow, as he would now be throwing more innings every 5 days.
if he drops the slider from his arsenal if he becomes a starter, do you still see him as valuable in that role?
tom
sounds good, a little heavy but good, can’t eat like i used to
“First of all does he have the mindset of a starter ? The last time it was tried he wastes a different pitcher for the 2nd time through an opposing lineup. No quite the implosions of Burnett but the 5th inning saw a different Chamberlain.”
Couldn’t we sag the same about Nova last year? They didn’t exactly give Joba much time to learn
It shouldnt take much to change the narrative since before it was ‘Joba can’t warm up fast enough to relieve, he is a starter!’ and then they changed it to reliever.
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LOL, I forgot about that one. They can say, he got hurt because he needs a longer warmup time than is practical when fortunes change & you need him out of the pen on the spot.
you guys keep talking about joba the arm vs joba the head…of no import?
mick,
then have smaller portions, in you can do it.
joba nd nova are 2 entirely diffrent thinkers
tom
i eat what they give me…
“The question about Joba as a starter had to do with his reliance on his best pitch, the slider, which will put more strain on his elbow, as he would now be throwing more innings every 5 days.”
He has a new and stronger elbow now……look the Yanks are running out of time with Joba. They have two years to get value out of him…….why not try? It would be different if they didn’t already have 3 closer arms in their pen…..
Trader, repetition of the same movement, every other day or so, probably is worse. He has other weapons that open to him as a starter, and he’d have a four day recovery period.
you got chinese, pizza,gyros,mexican,same old same old…
Yes, because as a reliever he is nearly 50/50 FB, SL. As a starter he would have to use his curve and change more.
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Jerkface-Thanks for the feedback on Joba. If he relies more on the curve his 3rd best pitch and the CU, his worst pitch, will he be an effective starter?
If you don’t give Joba an honest chance to start, he’s a free agent for sure, unless you secure him with an immense overpay as a reliever. He’s what, 25? He thinks he can start, and he is going to keep that dream.
joba would have to stay in shape to start, no small task
Joba should be able to get away with not having the slider. He can always develop his other pitches to take its place.
He’s going to start throwing from 60 feet next week. That sounds crazy!
Joba won’t be sliding into the rotation anytime soon. I know that Strausberg will be on an innings limit next season.
Joba as part of a 6 man…nevermind.
They’re not going to take the slider away from him. He is in shape. Haven’t you seen the pictures? That’s one reason I think there’s an unspoken new plan in play.
The Joba discussion still ranging on
tomingeorgia October 14th, 2011 at 5:26 pm
If you don’t give Joba an honest chance to start, he’s a free agent for sure, unless you secure him with an immense overpay as a reliever. He’s what, 25? He thinks he can start, and he is going to keep that dream.
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Yes, and he’ll go somewhere else and become what he was on his way to in 2008, and break our hearts.
why not bring back bart and freddy ?
with cc,aj,nova and hughes …
loser to the pen.
Odds, funny you should pop in!
JAP,
The power of aspiration is large, and gets larger every time somebody tells you you can’t do it.
BTW, if instructs are any indication, the Yankees have gotten away from their slider phobia. The returns were all about the great sliders everyone was throwing…
I am certainly not arguing against Joba becoming a starter. Does anyone know of any relievers, becoming starters immediately after their recovery from TJ surgery? I know John Smoltz became the closer for the Braves right after his TJ surgery.
Joba’s slider is wipeout when he’s right….he needs to keep it……if he’s on top of the ball then it shouldn’t be a problem. If the Ya kees don’t try him again as a starter then somebody is going to 2 years from now.
tomingeorgia October 14th, 2011 at 5:31 pm
JAP,
The power of aspiration is large, and gets larger every time somebody tells you you can’t do it.
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…Especially when you’ve indicated you can!
“Does anyone know of any relievers, becoming starters immediately after their recovery from TJ surgery?”
I don’t ….but Joba is a unique case because he’s been both. Build him back as a starter ……what’s the downside? He can’t do it and you let him go as a FA.
Had Robertson not become the best set up man in baseball…..then keeping Joba in the pen would make some sense at least. They don’t need him in the bullpen……
Early Joba had a great fastball that rode up and in at the last minute against RHB. You can see it on videos (sometimes it got away from him, but that scary factor was part of his intimidation). That, and the slider just dropping into hell, were devastating.
Right, Blake, what IS the downside???
He said what?!
“Henry vehemently disagreed with the perception that Francona was fired, saying that the manager instead chose to leave. Henry did say, however, that the options would not have been picked up if Francona had expressed a desire to stay. ”
http://espn.go.com/boston/mlb/.....y-francona
So he wasn’t fired but he would have been?
m – Oh yeah. That makes perfect sense.
m
Whoa, what Francona said was you can’t fire me, I quit.
Next year is Mariano’s last year under contract and he may likely retire. When the Yankees are certain that Chamberlain is 100% let him audition for the closer situation unless D-Rob beats him out.
Not because of the postseason, but I’m skeptical with C.J. Wilson. Would prefer FA Mark Buehrle for a 2-year deal until Banuelos is ready. Less money / less years tied up opposed to what Wilson will want.
I don’t think Joba is really closer material.
He’s a much better candidate to be a above average starter, IMO. You have more time & a longer leash to wiggle out of self-imposed trouble as a starter. Margin of error doesn’t exist as a reliever.
The unconsidered consensus for so long is that he’s got a reliever’s mentality. I say he’s got a starter’s.
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