The LoHud Yankees Blog

A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


My MVP ballot

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Nov 21, 2011 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Apparently I am writing a little bit today.

Sitting at the airport with my family, but wanted to pass along my MVP ballot. Once I decided an elite starting pitcher should finish below an elite hitter, that meant I had to vote Justin Verlander beneath every hitter I considered to have a truly elite, MVP-quality season.

As for the Yankees: I think Robinson Cano is the team’s best player, but I think Curtis Granderson had the better overall year.

My ballot
1. Jose Bautista
2. Jacoby Ellsbury
3. Miguel Cabrera
4. Curtis Granderson
5. Robinson Cano
6. Justin Verlander
7. Adrian Gonzalez
8. Michael Young
9. Paul Konerko
10. James Shields

Comments

comments

 

Advertisement

444 Responses to “My MVP ballot”

  1. MTU November 21st, 2011 at 6:16 pm

    Have a good vacation Chad.

    Enjoy the Holiday with your loved ones.

    Thanks for all the hard work.

  2. Blutarsky November 21st, 2011 at 6:18 pm

    Close but not quite the cigar !

    Call your office and get those guys on the ball so you can enjoy your vacation.

  3. Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 6:21 pm

    Good list Chad. Thank you for not being a homer, and thank you for not buying into the hype. :)

  4. Laura - I Bleed Blue November 21st, 2011 at 6:22 pm

    When baseball wonders why it plays second fiddle to football in this country, it can look back on bonehead things like a pitcher winning MVP.

  5. MTU November 21st, 2011 at 6:26 pm

    I know this.

    Chad is the MVP of this blog.

    ;)

  6. Noreaster November 21st, 2011 at 6:32 pm

    The ‘tone’ of the blog really changed for the better when Chad took over. Hopefully he doesn’t read our comments because he is really off on vacation…

  7. MTU November 21st, 2011 at 6:36 pm

    Here’s my ballot :

    1 Chad Jennings

    2 Sam Borden

    3 Josh Thompson

    4 Vinny M

    5 Brian Heyman

    6 Peter Abraham

    :)

  8. yanks 27 November 21st, 2011 at 6:37 pm

    Ellsbury hit more HRs this year than in any of his other seasons combined. How is he possibly an elite player who should win the MVP? That would be almost as bad as Pedroia winning it in 08.

  9. Patrick November 21st, 2011 at 6:38 pm

    trisha, I prefer this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ln8BLZijyq0

  10. mick November 21st, 2011 at 6:42 pm

    no one has commented that verlander has won…lame as ever
    ellsbury, batista,grandy, miggy…

  11. Nick in SF November 21st, 2011 at 6:42 pm

    I prefer this video, but I didn’t click on the other ones, so maybe I don’t:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jXauj4GXhk

  12. Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 6:46 pm

    yanks 27 – Why does who he is or his prior skillset make a difference in the fact that he actually performed at an elite level this season? MVP is for one season, it’s not a career award… just ask Jeter.

  13. randy l. November 21st, 2011 at 6:47 pm

    ellsbury ahead of granderson?

    i don’t see it.

  14. Nick in SF November 21st, 2011 at 6:52 pm

    “no one has commented that verlander has won…lame as ever”

    Use your whole brain, please.

  15. trisha - true pinstriped blue November 21st, 2011 at 6:53 pm

    “Red Robin either has no job or no days off. Can’t be both, right?”

    :lol:

    *********

    Patrick, seriously I laughed myself sick! But that video is brilliant!!! I realize how extremely average and untalented I am when I see stuff like that. The background music is phenomenal. Seriously? I am still laughing!!! I LOVE IT!!!!! I wonder how that one stayed so far under the radar. Really so good!

    :D

  16. Erin November 21st, 2011 at 6:56 pm

    Hey-look, it’s a new post. Yay!!! ;)

  17. Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 6:56 pm

    whats not to see, randy?

  18. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 6:57 pm

    Reposting.
    Addendum: pitching is the lone exception for defense in terms of being quantifiable, IME.

    J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 6:41 pm
    ID, with all due respect, how do you know that Jacoby Ellsbury didn’t “mess up a single play in CF” in 2011?

    You would have had to watch every play he made, or failed to make (aye, there’s the rub: how do I know, not seeing every play, that the person or persons making that claim know how to properly interpret what they are watching in the first place?) to make such a claim.

    I suspect you did not personally witness every opportunity Jacoby, the defender, had to make a play, so my guess is you’re accepting the judgments of derivative sets of eyes.

    If people want to use numbers to quantify what is, IME, not quantifiable, I can’t stop them. For, even if you get a consensus on a system to evaluate defense, one would have to accept the judgments of people deciding what is and is not playable, catchable, etc., and then accept those “results” as somehow definitive.

    I find that, if you watch the players in question often enough, the truth will shake out. My “truth” on Granderson vs. Ellsbury is at great variance with whatever UZR stringers/data collectors concluded.

  19. trisha - true pinstriped blue November 21st, 2011 at 6:59 pm

    mick, I commented about Verlander winning. You just might not have appreciated the comment! But it was sincere.

    *******

    Are people seriously busting Chad’s chops for not posting anything? I’m thinking they are busting lohud’s chops maybe?

    Vacation means just that. The guy has a right to take a vacation. Vacation means getting the ell away from your job. Does anyone here like it if someone gripes that your not doing your job when they’re on vacation? Wouldn’t you think the person was a stone-cold idiot?

    Nobody here pays for this forum. They don’t owe use jack squat. We’re lucky to have the lohud forum to come to. So STFU and count your blessings. If you can’t survive the week that Chad is away without seeing new threads galore, maybe you need spoiled brat training!

    In case you haven’t noticed:

    1. this is a dreadful economy; lohud, like many many other places, laid reporters off!

    2. there isn’t a lot going on right now, seeing that it’s off season and there’s not a lot going on right now. Not a lot of Yankee stuff anyway. And guess what? What is going on out there will be brought here by other posters.

    3. Chad deserves to have a lovely week with his family and to enjoy his Thanksgiving without have

  20. Erin November 21st, 2011 at 7:03 pm

    Trisha- I wasn’t getting on Chad’s case at all. Just amused that no one else had posted anything all day.

  21. trisha - true pinstriped blue November 21st, 2011 at 7:04 pm

    continued

    3. Chad deserves to have a lovely week with his family and to enjoy his Thanksgiving without having to answer to nonpaying tapping keyboarders! As they say in the navy, I don’t see any anchor attached to to your butt. If you don’t feel like you’re getting what you paid for, find somewhere else to gripe!

    ***********

    Chad, don’t you dare post throughout the week because if you do, you will just show that you are the patsy a few total jerks want you to be. ENJOY YOUR VACATION!

    1va·ca·tion
    noun, often attributive \v?-?k?-sh?n, v?-\

    Definition of VACATION

    1

    : a respite or a time of respite from something : intermission

    2

    a: a scheduled period during which activity (as of a court or school) is suspended b: a period of exemption from work granted to an employee

    3

    : a period spent away from home or business in travel or recreation

  22. trisha - true pinstriped blue November 21st, 2011 at 7:06 pm

    Erin – it wasn’t you! It was a few of the guys who had made their usual crybaby remarks, starting last night.

    You are neither rude nor ignorant nor demanding.

    :)

  23. blake November 21st, 2011 at 7:07 pm

    I think Granderson was ahead of Ellsbury all season and Jacoby passed him in September……..Ellsbury was unreal down the stretch.

    My ballot would be.

    1. Cabrera
    2. Ellsbury
    3. Granderson
    4. Bautista
    5. Verlander
    6. Cano.

  24. blake November 21st, 2011 at 7:11 pm

    Grandy could have had the award I think…..he just slumped in September and it dropped his BA down to a level where the voters just weren’t going to give it to him. Had he been able to hit. 285 + I really think he may have won

  25. Erin November 21st, 2011 at 7:12 pm

    Trish-my bad. I’m on my blackberry so I didn’t see all the comments. Which might not be such a bad thing if people are yelling at Chad for taking a vacation. ;)

  26. Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 7:12 pm

    Wait til you see how bored i am right now… I apologize for this block of text that is coming… lol

  27. RI Attorney November 21st, 2011 at 7:13 pm

    “You are neither rude nor ignorant nor demanding.”

    But you are.

  28. RI Attorney November 21st, 2011 at 7:16 pm

    Historical Events of December 13th:

    1928 – Clip-on tie designed.

  29. Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 7:16 pm

    Ellsbury – 158g, 119runs, 105rbi, 32hr, 39sb, 98so, .321/.376/.552

    Granderson…
    156 games, wash. Bother players were there on the field where their team needs them.

    136 runs, but he does not control other players hitting him in, so this is crediting Granderson with something he did not control. How often he got on base would be a much better measure of productivity. Giving your teammates the opportunity to drive you in IS an identifiable skill. It’s called OBP.

    119 rbi, again he does not control over other getting on base ahead of him. The ability to put the ball in play and drivein multiple runs is roughly measurable with SLG, encompassing average and power… because putting the ball in play (and hard) is the only way to drive in runs, someone being on base is merely coincidence.

    41hr, advantage grandyman. can’t deny that hitting 9 more home runs is better.

    25sb, his SB may have suffered a bit this season because he was hitting so well. He had 232 stolen base opportunities this season, the second fewest of his career. Ellsbury had way more opportunities to steal this year at 289. They both had roughly the same success rate (71%).

    169so, this to me is the killer for Granderson. This is basically 71 more times than Ellsbury that he had absolutely no chance of improving the teams chance of winning by luck or otherwise. Strike outs are the worst single act you can perform as a hitter.

    .262 avg, certainly doesn’t help Granderson’s case… especially with more HR’s than Ellsbury (balls with no chance of being caught for outs), but balls in play are tricky. Ellsbury had a BABIP 40 points higher, (a .300 avg for Granderson would look might nice wouldn’t it?) so he was either luckier or has some magical ability to hit balls where there are no fielders. I doubt it.

    .364 obp, a little lower than Ellsbury but not completely detrimental. This is where you see the difference a team makes on your RUNS stat though, as Ellsbury was on base more often but Granderson was plated more often by his teammates because his team was better, not because he was (even subtracting the 9 HR difference).

    .552 slg, that this is the same as Ellsbury yet Granderson has more HR and more 3B shows that Ellsbury was a much more “productively powerful” hitter this season. Granderson was very all-or-nothing because of his strikeouts. His SLG should have been much higher to really garner MVP consideration.

    Fielding- Since you all refuse to take any value from UZR… I will only say that Ellsbury had a perfect fielding percentage this year and made more outs than Granderson (they both had 3 errors), making him very obviously the better, more useful fielder to his team this season.

    So without going to deep into those “scary saber numbers”, I don’t think there is any case where Granderson should have won the MVP award this year. His year was better than Cano’s under similar scrutiny so there is no argument for him either.

    Anyone expecting a Yankee MVP was only fooling themselves.

  30. trisha - true pinstriped blue November 21st, 2011 at 7:19 pm

    “But you are.”

    :lol:

    You don’t think I saw that coming? I just wanted which A-hole would be the first to think he was being, er, creatively clever.

    :roll:

  31. Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 7:20 pm

    OK, enjoy that… I’m going home. :)

  32. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 7:21 pm

    Heckuva goal by Sid the Kid! :)

  33. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 7:23 pm

    Fielding- Since you all refuse to take any value from UZR… I will only say that Ellsbury had a perfect fielding percentage this year and made more outs than Granderson (they both had 3 errors), making him very obviously the better, more useful fielder to his team this season.
    ////

    Fielding percentage???

    Please.

  34. Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 7:24 pm

    also quickly, blake I do agree that September probably cost granderson and won ellsbury the MVP (or should have anyway…).

    I haven’t spent any time talking about Miggy who had a great (possibly the best) season… but as a woman beater/drunk… he does not deserve to be discussed.

    Bautista and/or Ellsbury were robbed.

  35. blake November 21st, 2011 at 7:25 pm

    So NL MVP?

    Braun or Kemp…….or does somebody out there want to make Kershaw the MVP too?

    Id go with Braun …..numbers are close to Kemps and he did it for a contender.

  36. Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 7:25 pm

    prufrock – you ignore everything anyone writes about fielding, that only makes you ignorant… not right.

    You explain to me how Granderson was a better fielder than Ellsbury this year, I’ll come back and read it in a half hour. Let’s see what you got.

  37. trisha - true pinstriped blue November 21st, 2011 at 7:26 pm

    RI Attorney November 21st, 2011 at 7:22 pm

    :lol:

  38. RI Attorney November 21st, 2011 at 7:26 pm

    Wallace Matthews gets it right:

    “If you don’t have singles hitters,” says one American League advance scout, “you need hitters capable of becoming singles hitters when the situation calls for it. Against great pitching, in tight ball games, in the postseason, you almost always need a ‘short game’ to win.”

    The prime culprit seems to have been Mark Teixeira, who despite hitting 39 home runs and knocking in 111, hit just .248 overall and just .224 as a left-handed hitter, when he stubbornly insisted on hitting into the teeth of a shift that gobbled up anything that stayed in the ballpark.

    “You don’t want to turn me into a slap hitter,” Teixeira said when asked why he didn’t try to go the other way against the shift.

    It seems that a little slap single would have done the job quite nicely with the bases loaded against the Tigers that night, doncha think?

    Yup.

  39. Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 7:27 pm

    That could be the smartest thing Wallace Matthews has ever said. You know what they say about broken clocks and dogs behinds though…

  40. blake November 21st, 2011 at 7:28 pm

    Defense has no bearing to me on Grandy vs Ellsbury……I think at worst Grandy is comparable to Ellbury and probably better. I put very little stock in defensive metrics. I think Jacoby had a better full year than Grandy overall …….mainly because of how they finished. Trying to be objective.

  41. The Mick536 November 21st, 2011 at 7:29 pm

    drives me from the game just stupid eliminate the cy young

    how many games did he win because the defense played great or his hitters got on base and scored?

    if he holds the other team hitless or runless he loses if his team doesn’t field or hit

  42. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 7:31 pm

    It’s strikes me as extremely incoherent to argue that a pitcher cannot win the MVP, and then to have him appear further down on the ballot. If he can’t win, then he shouldn’t get any votes at all, not for second place, third place, or anywhere else down the ballot.

    For my money, I think Verlander deserved the MVP: It is hard to contemplate the Tigers being as successful as they were this year without him. I’m glad that the sportswriters didn’t let some silly, unspoken rule about pitchers not winning the MVP keep them from recognizing a truly exceptional season.

    Congrats to Grandy on a great year!

    Happy Thanksgiving, Chad…

  43. blake November 21st, 2011 at 7:32 pm

    And if Robbie hadn’t went in that funk for about 1/3 of the season he’d be the MVP as I believe he’s the best player in the AL

  44. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 7:32 pm

    Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 7:25 pm
    prufrock – you ignore everything anyone writes about fielding, that only makes you ignorant… not right.

    You explain to me how Granderson was a better fielder than Ellsbury this year, I’ll come back and read it in a half hour. Let’s see what you got.
    ///

    I ignore a prescriptive approach to something that inherently resists it.

  45. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 7:36 pm

    Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 7:27 pm

    That could be the smartest thing Wallace Matthews has ever said. You know what they say about broken clocks and dogs behinds though…
    ============

    Spot on.

  46. blake November 21st, 2011 at 7:40 pm

    Wally is just repeating what some scout said……he’d have never thought that up on his own.

  47. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 7:42 pm

    :D

  48. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 7:42 pm

    blake November 21st, 2011 at 7:40 pm
    Wally is just repeating what some scout said……he’d have never thought that up on his own.
    ////

    Dude, that’s funny. Probably true, too.

  49. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 7:43 pm

    Is there a worse combination than mediocrity and meanness? Ladies and gentlemen….Wally Matthews.

  50. Nick in SF November 21st, 2011 at 7:44 pm

    “National day of mourning in RI.”

    This seems inherently flawed.

  51. RI Attorney November 21st, 2011 at 7:44 pm

    Wally is a dolt most of the time but he got this one right.

  52. charlestonchew November 21st, 2011 at 7:45 pm

    I will say it: Ellsbury was robbed.

    Also, Chad, I have to disagree about putting Cabrera before Granderson. Granderson was more valuable, especially considering Cabrera’s below average defense.

  53. RI Attorney November 21st, 2011 at 7:45 pm

    Anyone care to take issue with this statement?

    “It seems that a little slap single would have done the job quite nicely with the bases loaded against the Tigers that night, doncha think?”

  54. Villa Nova-Ya November 21st, 2011 at 7:51 pm

    Grandy needed to hit a little over 270 and I think that may have done it for him.

    Ellsbury had a phenomenal season, but I have no idea where it came from.

  55. blake November 21st, 2011 at 7:56 pm

    Ellsbury has a really nice functional swing……he was healthy this year and he got in one or those grooves that lasts all year.

    I dont think he’s that type of player every year……but if he can stay healthy he’s a really good player and is somebody the Sox are going to have to give a bunch of money pretty soon to keep.

  56. RadioKev November 21st, 2011 at 8:00 pm

    blake November 21st, 2011 at 7:07 pm
    I think Granderson was ahead of Ellsbury all season and Jacoby passed him in September……..Ellsbury was unreal down the stretch.
    ———-

    blake November 21st, 2011 at 7:56 pm
    Ellsbury has a really nice functional swing……he was healthy this year and he got in one or those grooves that lasts all year.
    ————

    Agreed on both fronts. Ellsbury had a great September, one of the few on the Red Sox. Granderson had a poor September. I don’t blame anyone for voting for Ellsbury, it makes sense.

    Also, it seems Ellsbury may have reworked his swing a bit. Maybe a little closer to the plate, I don’t know, but it looked a bit more balanced this season.

    I really don’t get Jose Bautista. I just hate on that guy’s second half.

  57. Baseball Mogul November 21st, 2011 at 8:03 pm

    Ellsbury may have had a perfect fielding percentage, but an MVP catches this ball-

    http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play......5&v=3

  58. blake November 21st, 2011 at 8:04 pm

    Radiokev,

    Very quiet and short to the ball…….I love his swing. I don’t get Bautista either. His overall numbers look good but his 2nd half took away any real shot the Jays had of making a playoff run.

  59. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 8:09 pm

    Mogul, exactly the play that came to mind when the board was discussing Ellsbury’s UZR.

  60. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 8:10 pm

    Villa Nova-Ya November 21st, 2011 at 7:51 pm

    Grandy needed to hit a little over 270 and I think that may have done it for him.

    Ellsbury had a phenomenal season, but I have no idea where it came from.
    =================================

    I wonder what is the lowest recorded BA for an MVP…

  61. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 8:10 pm

    That ball was not catchable, according to the stringer in the stands working for fangraphs lunch money.

  62. blake November 21st, 2011 at 8:11 pm

    Anyone that’s thinks Granderson is a negative defender just doesn’t watch the games……

  63. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 8:15 pm

    I just found an answer for my question:

    “In the national league, it was Marty Marion who played for St. Louis, he had a batting average of .267 in 1944

    Roger Maris won it in 1961 batting .269 for the Yankees in the American League.”

    I’m pretty sure that hitting .270 wouldn’t have done it for Grandy..

  64. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 8:15 pm

    blake November 21st, 2011 at 8:11 pm
    Anyone that’s thinks Granderson is a negative defender just doesn’t watch the games……
    ///

    Some must hold tight to their pseudo science, no matter how absurd its claims…couldn’t believe my ears when I turned on ESPN one night and heard them saying that Granderson’s poor defense in CF was going to hurt his MVP candidacy…

  65. LGY November 21st, 2011 at 8:15 pm

    Ellsbury is terrible at coming in on the ball.

    The most entertaining part is how often he gets his glove on the ball just for it to slip out.

  66. Villa Nova-Ya November 21st, 2011 at 8:19 pm

    The only player I had an issue with winning the MVP was Verlander.

    The guy blatantly self-promoted for the MVP, as well, which kind of ticks me off. But it worked. He made his case and the voters listened.

    Which is not meant to take away from the season he had; he was already rewarded for it, however.

    With the MVP, you have to finish strong. It doesn’t count as much to the voters if you carry your team through the beginning of the season, but if you carry them for the month of September and especially if you end up in a playoff spot, you are golden. What have you done for me lately is the tune.

  67. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 8:19 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 8:15 pm

    blake November 21st, 2011 at 8:11 pm
    Anyone that’s thinks Granderson is a negative defender just doesn’t watch the games……
    ///

    Some must hold tight to their pseudo science, no matter how absurd its claims…couldn’t believe my ears when I turned on ESPN one night and heard them saying that Granderson’s poor defense in CF was going to hurt his MVP candidacy…
    =============

    What can you expect from innumerate bozos citing statistics that they don’t understand to confer authority onto their talking points?

  68. blake November 21st, 2011 at 8:19 pm

    “The most entertaining part is how often he gets his glove on the ball just for it to slip out.”

    That is entertaining…..he’s a decent CFer but his value is playing CF with good offense.

  69. Villa Nova-Ya November 21st, 2011 at 8:23 pm

    Ghostwriter -

    Good research! I was just going with a gut feeling, and a personal impression that .270 makes on me that .26x doesnt.

  70. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 8:23 pm

    Villa Nova-Ya November 21st, 2011 at 8:19 pm

    The only player I had an issue with winning the MVP was Verlander.

    The guy blatantly self-promoted for the MVP, as well, which kind of ticks me off. But it worked. He made his case and the voters listened.

    Which is not meant to take away from the season he had; he was already rewarded for it, however.

    ===============

    He was awarded for being the best pitcher in the league, not for being the most valuable player. Value is subjective, and reasonable People can differ on the question of the “most valuable player”. Verlander won the CYA almost by acclamation, but got fewer than half of the first-place votes, underscoring the subjectivity of the MVP vote.

  71. blake November 21st, 2011 at 8:24 pm

    I think Verlander had a terrific year…….but IMO its been overstated all year historically and him winning the MVP just caps that off.

  72. RadioKev November 21st, 2011 at 8:24 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 8:15 pm
    blake November 21st, 2011 at 8:11 pm
    Anyone that’s thinks Granderson is a negative defender just doesn’t watch the games……
    ///

    Some must hold tight to their pseudo science, no matter how absurd its claims…couldn’t believe my ears when I turned on ESPN one night and heard them saying that Granderson’s poor defense in CF was going to hurt his MVP candidacy…
    ————–

    I know. These guys NEVER talk about sabremetrics in terms of defense, but decided that they were a really valid argument against Granderson. I’d be shocked if Gardner in left isn’t affecting Granderson’s defensive numbers in some way or another.

  73. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 8:25 pm

    Villa Nova-Ya November 21st, 2011 at 8:23 pm

    Ghostwriter -

    Good research! I was just going with a gut feeling, and a personal impression that .270 makes on me that .26x doesnt.
    ==============

    .270, but he had to break a 34-year-old record to earn the MVP! No small feat…

  74. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 8:26 pm

    Rangers signed Joe Nathan.

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/.....than-.html

  75. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 8:27 pm

    Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 8:25 pm

    Villa Nova-Ya November 21st, 2011 at 8:23 pm

    Ghostwriter -

    Good research! I was just going with a gut feeling, and a personal impression that .270 makes on me that .26x doesnt.
    ==============

    .270, but he had to break a 34-year-old record to earn the MVP! No small feat…
    =

    And the biggest record in sports, no less…

  76. blake November 21st, 2011 at 8:27 pm

    Wow……I thought the Sox would sign Nathan. Feliz to the rotation.

  77. Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 8:31 pm

    I ignore a prescriptive approach to something that inherently resists it.

    You apparently have also failed to come up with any way of comparing one player to another while “watching him play”.

    So you can’t explain to me at all how Granderson was better than Ellsbury this year, going into veiled mocking statements about stats nerds (tee hee… get over it.)… and boldly proclaim claim that all defensive metrics are no good?

    Hah.

    No matter how bad and inaccurate and incomplete most defensive metrics are, when they are all trying to describe one thing… fielding… and they are all saying that one player was better than another this year… the burden of proof is yours.

    I think over multiple seasons Granderson is a much better fielder. The problem is no one is having that argument. We’re not trying to figure out which player is better. We’re trying to figure out which player was better in 2011.

    Granderson was not better than Ellsbury in the field in 2011 by every attempt at quantifying and recording defense you can find. The stats are not lies, they are records of actual events. You have to decide for yourself what they measure, and how to use that to intelligently form the opinion you so blindly create while only watching Yankee games. You can not say they measure nothing, because that is simply not true.

    If your only proof otherwise is you “saw it on TV”… well… the only suitable response to that is “I don’t care”.

    I’d be shocked if Gardner in left isn’t affecting Granderson’s defensive numbers in some way or another.
    This is only news to people who ignore stats and don’t try to use them to enhance their understanding of the game.

    From August… http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs.....prospects/

  78. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 8:31 pm

    blake November 21st, 2011 at 8:27 pm

    Wow……I thought the Sox would sign Nathan. Feliz to the rotation.
    ========

    Insurance for the ‘pen? Set-up man? If I was going to convert Feliz to a starter, I would want a more reliable choice than a 36-year-old reliever coming off an injury-shortened season…

  79. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 8:34 pm

    Ghost, UZR isn’t just off, it’s often comically wrong.

    I don’t care a crap if people want to declare this stuff the new religion, but it’s the zealots trying to bully everyone that grow tiresome – they just assume numbers assigned to something will make everyone drop their pants.

    How do I know that these guys sitting in ballparks know the difference between a sinking line drive and something with crazy top-spin, whether the guy got off the ball well, or not, for example… of course, they tell you that UZR covers “all contingencies…” :roll:

  80. blake November 21st, 2011 at 8:35 pm

    Ken Rosenthal @Ken_Rosenthal

    Source: #Rangers “not out” on starters,but committed to starting Feliz. #MLB

    11 minutes ago via Twitter for Mac

  81. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 8:37 pm

    Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 8:31 pm

    I ignore a prescriptive approach to something that inherently resists it.

    You apparently have also failed to come up with any way of comparing one player to another while “watching him play”.

    So you can’t explain to me at all how Granderson was better than Ellsbury this year, going into veiled mocking statements about stats nerds (tee hee… get over it.)… and boldly proclaim claim that all defensive metrics are no good?

    Hah.

    No matter how bad and inaccurate and incomplete most defensive metrics are, when they are all trying to describe one thing… fielding… and they are all saying that one player was better than another this year… the burden of proof is yours.

    ————————

    Ummm…. no it isn’t. Defensive statistics are notoriously unreliable. This has been fairly documented. The burden of proof is on you to prove or to provide proof that they are reliable statistics. After all, you are the one that is claiming that you have an objective basis upon which to compare the defensive play of differing players. If it is indeed objective, then you should be able to prove it. We don’t have to prove the negative.

  82. blake November 21st, 2011 at 8:39 pm

    Most teams that use advanced metrics to evaluate players have attempted to create their own in house stats for defense because they don’t trust the mainstream ones and see them as inaccurate.

  83. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 8:41 pm

    Discourse, Granderson gets better jumps, he goes back to the wall better, he’s more athletic and able to get better timed, higher leaps at the wall to make plays, he takes more direct routes to the ball. He’s a better CF, and I don’t think it’s all that close.

    If you crave a more byzantine response, you’ll have to look elsewhere to find it.

  84. Jerkface November 21st, 2011 at 8:46 pm

    BIS scorers are often former ball players/scouts. So I think they can see what a sinking line drive is.

  85. blake November 21st, 2011 at 8:47 pm

    SI_JonHeyman 18 mins Nathan signing with #rangers solidifies move of feliz to rotation. Nobody converts relievers like texas.

    Oh yea well nobody converts starters to relievers like the Yankees :/

  86. Villa Nova-Ya November 21st, 2011 at 8:48 pm

    Only a fool would say Verlander was not valuable to his team. :)

    I guess I fall into the group of folks who think the Cy Young is for pitchers and the MVP is for position players, except in the singular circumstance where there is no position player who had an MVP-type year.

    It would be simpler if they had Best Pitcher, Best Hitter, Most Valuable Player (pitcher or hitter).

  87. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 8:48 pm

    blake November 21st, 2011 at 8:47 pm

    SI_JonHeyman 18 mins Nathan signing with #rangers solidifies move of feliz to rotation. Nobody converts relievers like texas.

    Oh yea well nobody converts starters to relievers like the Yankees :/
    ============

    Sad but true…

  88. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 8:52 pm

    Jerkface November 21st, 2011 at 8:46 pm
    BIS scorers are often former ball players/scouts. So I think they can see what a sinking line drive is.
    ///

    That’s swell, who are they “seldom”? And how do you reconcile the “often” and “seldom” guys to achieve a balanced view of ALL, for example, center fielders? Further, subjective analysis is bound to be involved, here. They are, at the end of the day, making a judgment call.

    I prefer to watch players and draw my own conclusions. If they don’t jive with what defensive metrics claim, I’m going to partial what I actually witnessed, not defer to imaginary people.

  89. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 8:52 pm

    Villa Nova-Ya November 21st, 2011 at 8:48 pm

    Only a fool would say Verlander was not valuable to his team. :)

    I guess I fall into the group of folks who think the Cy Young is for pitchers and the MVP is for position players, except in the singular circumstance where there is no position player who had an MVP-type year.

    –I think that this played in Verlander’s favor this year. There were a lot of good cadidates among the position players but not a standout. This resulted in the position players spitting the vote. A standout offensive performer probably would have won.

    It would be simpler if they had Best Pitcher, Best Hitter, Most Valuable Player (pitcher or hitter).
    —I absolutely agree.

  90. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 8:53 pm

    *be partial to what I witnessed.

  91. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 8:55 pm

    JF, if one observer were watching every player’s every game at a given position it would be more accurate. And even then, the determination would be subjective.

    What about where said observer is seated? Might that not skew his perspective of what is and isn’t catchable? What about the theory that a team’s OF’s that face a higher number of FB% balls have better UZR’s than those teams with a lesser %? Etc. Etc.

    UZR might be useful as a place to start a discussion, but the way it is used as gospel by some and how much it influences WAR, another stat that is often used as if it is definitive does a disservice to a comprehensive understanding of a player’s game.

  92. Villa Nova-Ya November 21st, 2011 at 8:57 pm

    Ghostwriter -

    That’s a perspective I hadn’t really considered – too many that were too good and the vote got too split. I kept focusing on each of those position players have a good argument for getting the MVP; I didn’t think a lot about each of them having a reason NOT to get MVP. But it’s true.

  93. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 8:58 pm

    blake November 21st, 2011 at 8:47 pm
    SI_JonHeyman 18 mins Nathan signing with #rangers solidifies move of feliz to rotation. Nobody converts relievers like texas.

    Oh yea well nobody converts starters to relievers like the Yankees :/
    ——-
    QFT. It’ll be interesting to watch someone else’s pitcher–Neftali–evolve as a starter.

  94. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 8:59 pm

    Jerkface November 21st, 2011 at 8:46 pm

    BIS scorers are often former ball players/scouts. So I think they can see what a sinking line drive is.
    =====

    Perhaps. However, you are still relying on subjective judgment to classify the differing outcomes in a way that you don’t with most of the hitting pitching. I suspect that this inherent subjectivity is one of the key reasons why the defensive statistics are given to its wide observed wide variation…

  95. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 9:00 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 8:52 pm
    Jerkface November 21st, 2011 at 8:46 pm
    BIS scorers are often former ball players/scouts. So I think they can see what a sinking line drive is.
    ///

    That’s swell, who are they “seldom”? And how do you reconcile the “often” and “seldom” guys to achieve a balanced view of ALL, for example, center fielders? Further, subjective analysis is bound to be involved, here. They are, at the end of the day, making a judgment call.

    I prefer to watch players and draw my own conclusions. If they don’t jive with what defensive metrics claim, I’m going to partial what I actually witnessed, not defer to imaginary people.
    ______
    Again, who exactly are these recorders of history?

  96. tucker November 21st, 2011 at 9:00 pm

    Nathan to the Rangers. Papelbon to the Phils. Red Sox and no closer. With all these closers switching teams, it makes you appreciate (that much more) how much of steady influence Mo has been. No offseason fuss, just greatness every year.

  97. blake November 21st, 2011 at 9:01 pm

    So why is there virtually no buzz about Kershaw for MVP in the NL if Verlander had such an unreal season that he had to win it?

    Verlander: record- 24-5, ERA-2.40, WHIP-0.920, K’s-250
    Kershaw : record- 21-5, ERA- 2.28, WHIP- 0.977, K’s-244

    pretty close huh….

  98. blake November 21st, 2011 at 9:03 pm

    The Sox have to sign Madson or Bell right? Their pen going to be very thin if they don’t over pay one of those 2

  99. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 9:04 pm

    EDIT:Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 8:59 pm

    Jerkface November 21st, 2011 at 8:46 pm

    BIS scorers are often former ball players/scouts. So I think they can see what a sinking line drive is.
    =====

    Perhaps. However, you are still relying on subjective judgment to classify the differing outcomes in a way that you don’t with most of the hitting pitching statistics. I suspect that this inherent subjectivity is one of the key reasons why the defensive statistics are given to its wide observed wide variation…

  100. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 9:04 pm

    Again, who exactly are these recorders of history?
    ///
    LOL, all I know is, Granderson is actually a really, really good center fielder…so I guess the discussion starting point is out…;).

  101. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 9:04 pm

    Prufrock, in reading that interview w/Charleston’s pitching coach, besides addition of slider, nice to see that Ramirez’s delivery according to him is back to pre-injury status.

  102. blake November 21st, 2011 at 9:05 pm

    Buster_ESPN Buster Olney
    Texas rotation for 2012, at the moment: Colby Lewis, Derek Holland, Matt Harrison, Alexi Ogando, Neftali Feliz. You can win with that.
    5 minutes ago

    eh…….doesn’t scare me much. Very reliant on Holland taking another step and what Feliz becomes.

  103. RadioKev November 21st, 2011 at 9:05 pm

    Sweet. Now when we rock Joe Nathan, it’ll be against a better team than the Twins.

  104. blake November 21st, 2011 at 9:06 pm

    Joelsherman1 Joel Sherman
    going to 50 pct tax begin in ’14 season. The only team that has consistently been over threshhold has been #Yankees
    6 hours ago

    Joelsherman1 Joel Sherman
    I heard in new CBA, luxury threshold will remain at $178M for 2012-13, go to $189M for ‘14-‘16, with repeat offenders (cont)
    6 hours ago

  105. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 9:07 pm

    I’m a little surprised that the Rangers aren’t more of a playerr in signing Wilson, after they were talking smack about making a run at Sababathia.

  106. blake November 21st, 2011 at 9:07 pm

    Funny that they’d move the luxury tax number to where it affects one team……

  107. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 9:10 pm

    yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 9:04 pm
    Prufrock, in reading that interview w/Charleston’s pitching coach, besides addition of slider, nice to see that Ramirez’s delivery according to him is back to pre-injury status.
    ///

    I heard they were working with that. Boy, when I saw him, he was pretty effortless in delivering the ball. Hope he moves fast and gets to Trenton soon. If he can really become something, and they can get that freakin’ DePaula his papers, and Brett Marshall moves fast…Trenton could be awash again in exciting, big upside arms…

  108. RadioKev November 21st, 2011 at 9:15 pm

    Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 9:07 pm
    I’m a little surprised that the Rangers aren’t more of a playerr in signing Wilson, after they were talking smack about making a run at Sababathia.
    ———

    Maybe it’s just for leverage.

  109. Joe from Long Island November 21st, 2011 at 9:17 pm

    while this could be a nice move by the rangers – not being held hostage by cj wilson – it could also backfire, and not just by feliz not adapting to his new role. joe nathan is, what, 37 yo, and coming off arm surgery, even though it is tj surgery. there’s no guarantee that he’ll be the same old joe nathan.

    then again, there are never any guarantees in baseball. still, there is some risk in this move.

  110. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 9:17 pm

    you are still relying on subjective judgment to classify the differing outcomes in a way that you don’t with most of the hitting pitching statistics.
    ///

    Right, hitting and pitching can be measured. That doesn’t mean they can’t be interpreted or qualified further, but the numbers have intrinsic meaning.

  111. blake November 21st, 2011 at 9:18 pm

    last year Felix had a 2.27 ERA last year and a better ERA+ than Verlander did this year……and the finished 16th in the MVP voting….who said wins don’t matter anymore

  112. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 9:18 pm

    Pruf, as well as Stoneburner. I won’t hold my breath on DePaula though.

  113. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 9:24 pm

    YF, what the hell is holding up the papers? Sheesh!

  114. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 9:25 pm

    Pruf, the INS?

  115. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 9:26 pm

    YF, yeah, they’re a mess, but can’t we get past it that the kid lied and made up a name already?

  116. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 9:27 pm

    *lied about his age….

  117. trisha - true pinstriped blue November 21st, 2011 at 9:27 pm

    It’s early and things could change dramatically but I am SOOO happy to see KC ahead of the Pats at this moment. If you could have heard WEEI today you’d think that KC should be embarrassed to even be on the field, so inferior are they to the Pats…

    :roll:

  118. kd November 21st, 2011 at 9:37 pm

    any thoughts as to when cespedes will sign?

  119. Nilsson November 21st, 2011 at 9:56 pm

    Looking at American League leaders in WAR category for this season, Verlander tied Bautista (8.5) while Ellsbury finished 3rd (7.2). That may have influenced some writers to vote for Verlander.

    Interestingly, Kemp at 10.0 was head and shoulders above everyone in NL. Braun finished 2nd with 7.7.

  120. yanks 27 November 21st, 2011 at 10:09 pm

    Felix was on a team well-below .500 last year
    Kershaw was on a sub .500 team this year

    In order for a pitcher to win it, he needs to be an indispensable pitcher on a playoff team. Dodgders/Mariners would be more terrible without their aces. What separated Detroit from the rest was Verlander.

  121. tucker November 21st, 2011 at 10:10 pm

    Still think Texas will go after CJ Wilson. That starting rotation would create a lot of wear and tear on he bullpen. Ogando and Feliz, in particular.

  122. blake November 21st, 2011 at 10:15 pm

    “What separated Detroit from the rest was Verlander.”

    what separated Detroit from the Dodgers and from the Mariners last year is that their other 24 players are better……you could have put 2010 Felix or 2011 Kershaw on the Tigers this year and they would have made the playoffs just the same.

  123. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 10:16 pm

    http://i40.tinypic.com/96xj11.jpg

  124. Against All Odds November 21st, 2011 at 10:30 pm

    # blake November 21st, 2011 at 9:05 pm

    Buster_ESPN Buster Olney
    Texas rotation for 2012, at the moment: Colby Lewis, Derek Holland, Matt Harrison, Alexi Ogando, Neftali Feliz. You can win with that.
    5 minutes ago

    eh…….doesn’t scare me much. Very reliant on Holland taking another step and what Feliz becomes.

    ——————————————

    Wow look at that an organization giving a starter turned reliever another chance to start.

  125. jacksquat November 21st, 2011 at 10:46 pm

    Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 5:25 pm
    Let me just clear up a pretty large misconception here… UZR is only inconsistent from year to year if you are trying to use it to predict future results.

    Otherwise it tells you exactly what happened. Granderson botched a few VERY EASY plays this season that completely shot his UZR in the foot. It’s not wrong, he messed these plays up and they were recorded as such. Ellsbury did not miss a SINGLE PLAY in the outfield this year, hence his 15+ UZR.

    That’s ridiculous, a few plays is not going to be the difference between -5 and +15. And I doubt you saw every game Ellsbury played in. Earlier you said that Granderson had the 8th best season obviously from just looking at fangraphs and forgetting to even take NL players out of the equation. What did you do this time, look at Ellsbury’s 0 errors and Granderson’s 3 errors and come up with that statement above? Seems like it. Hello Red Robin?

  126. jacksquat November 21st, 2011 at 10:49 pm

    Nilsson November 21st, 2011 at 9:56 pm
    Looking at American League leaders in WAR category for this season, Verlander tied Bautista (8.5) while Ellsbury finished 3rd (7.2). That may have influenced some writers to vote for Verlander.

    Interestingly, Kemp at 10.0 was head and shoulders above everyone in NL. Braun finished 2nd with 7.7.

    And CC’s WAR was higher than Verlander, so there you go. His FIP and xFIP were lower also…

  127. CB November 21st, 2011 at 10:50 pm

    Free agents, making trades… moving Feliz to the rotation will be one of the best personnel moves made all winter.

    The Rangers should have done this last winter. But better late than never.

  128. Against All Odds November 21st, 2011 at 11:05 pm

    The Rangers should have done this last winter. But better late than never.

    ———————————-

    They didn’t get trapped by the moment when it comes to Feliz and his future.

  129. Benny Blanco November 21st, 2011 at 11:08 pm

    My question is will Feliz have an innings limit and what will the ramifications be if his arm throws 200 innings next year?

  130. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:08 pm

    Wow look at that an organization giving a starter turned reliever another chance to start.
    ///

    Imagine that :roll:

  131. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:14 pm

    Against All Odds November 21st, 2011 at 11:05 pm
    The Rangers should have done this last winter. But better late than never.

    ———————————-

    They didn’t get trapped by the moment when it comes to Feliz and his future.
    ///

    So does this mean I have to concede that good ‘ole boy Nolan is smarter than our own little whiz kid, Billy Eppler? I guess that’s just what it means. Grrrrrrrrrr!

    By the way, Odds, Joba really looks to be in tremendous physical shape. Either something is covertly in play or he’s just decided, “F-it! Freedom and starter $$$ are nigh.”

  132. Against All Odds November 21st, 2011 at 11:15 pm

    # J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:08 pm

    Wow look at that an organization giving a starter turned reliever another chance to start.
    ///

    Imagine that :roll:

    ——————-

    Crazy concept isn’t it and Feliz was an AS closer as a rookie and then followed it up with another season but yet they decided this kid has to start.

  133. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:17 pm

    Odds, SMH.

  134. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:18 pm

    Whelp, so much for the Chiefs.

  135. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:19 pm

    …where have you gone, Lenny Dawson…

  136. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 11:20 pm

    Joba :mad:

  137. Ghostwriter November 21st, 2011 at 11:20 pm

    jacksquat November 21st, 2011 at 10:46 pm

    Irreverent Discourse November 21st, 2011 at 5:25 pm
    Let me just clear up a pretty large misconception here… UZR is only inconsistent from year to year if you are trying to use it to predict future results.

    Otherwise it tells you exactly what happened. Granderson botched a few VERY EASY plays this season that completely shot his UZR in the foot. It’s not wrong, he messed these plays up and they were recorded as such. Ellsbury did not miss a SINGLE PLAY in the outfield this year, hence his 15+ UZR.

    That’s ridiculous, a few plays is not going to be the difference between -5 and +15.

    =======================
    It wouldn’t surprise me if the difference betwen -5 and +15 is just several plays on the season. This result would underscore how intractable UZR can be: There isn’t a clear-cut way to tell if there is a true statistically significant difference between two apparently disparate statistics. If Ellsbury made a couple of plays that Granderson didn’t over the course of a 162-game season, then what of it? Is a hitter that gets a couple of hits more than the next guy demonstrably better? Is there a significant difference between a .351 and a .348 batting average? I doubt it. Besides, how many playable chances did Gardner take away from Granderson? I would bet that Gardy took at least a few outs away from Grandy…

  138. Against All Odds November 21st, 2011 at 11:23 pm

    # J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:14 pm

    Against All Odds November 21st, 2011 at 11:05 pm
    The Rangers should have done this last winter. But better late than never.

    ———————————-

    They didn’t get trapped by the moment when it comes to Feliz and his future.
    ///

    So does this mean I have to concede that good ‘ole boy Nolan is smarter than our own little whiz kid, Billy Eppler? I guess that’s just what it means. Grrrrrrrrrr!

    By the way, Odds, Joba really looks to be in tremendous physical shape. Either something is covertly in play or he’s just decided, “F-it! Freedom and starter $$$ are nigh.”

    ————————–

    Well so far I think it’s fair to say that the Rangers have done a good job in turning their pitching around. I’m sure we all remember the Rangers starting pitching being a joke. When it comes to Eppler what can he really hang his hat on.

    I think him getting in great shape is about just trying to come back as soon as possible. He hates being away from the game.

  139. Against All Odds November 21st, 2011 at 11:24 pm

    # J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:18 pm

    Whelp, so much for the Chiefs.

    ———————————

    They didn’t stand a chance

  140. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:29 pm

    Well so far I think it’s fair to say that the Rangers have done a good job in turning their pitching around. I’m sure we all remember the Rangers starting pitching being a joke. When it comes to Eppler what can he really hang his hat on.

    I think him getting in great shape is about just trying to come back as soon as possible. He hates being away from the game.
    ///

    Could be. I’d rather think big ;).

    Yea, well, Feliz in the rotation is a big upgrade over CJ, even if they wind up re-signing the latter, he’ll move down the ladder ;).

  141. Against All Odds November 21st, 2011 at 11:30 pm

    # J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:19 pm

    …where have you gone, Lenny Dawson…

    ———————————-

    Colin Cowherd: By the way Len Dawson no longer quarterbacks Kansas City and John Elway is retired too Brandon. So you go back to your mom’s basement and call the show tomorrow.

  142. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:34 pm

    LOL, Odds. Len Dawson and Otis Taylor. Some kind of hookup.
    ///

    Chiefs do suck, but if I have to worry about them as a Jet fan, I might as well pack it in right now. I can’t really complain, any way, since virtually everyone the Jets needed to lose yesterday, did.

  143. Against All Odds November 21st, 2011 at 11:37 pm

    # J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:29 pm

    Well so far I think it’s fair to say that the Rangers have done a good job in turning their pitching around. I’m sure we all remember the Rangers starting pitching being a joke. When it comes to Eppler what can he really hang his hat on.

    I think him getting in great shape is about just trying to come back as soon as possible. He hates being away from the game.
    ///

    Could be. I’d rather think big ;) .

    Yea, well, Feliz in the rotation is a big upgrade over CJ, even if they wind up re-signing the latter, he’ll move down the ladder ;) .

    ——————————-

    I know you’re still holding out hope. I don’t t think it will happen but I would love to see it.

  144. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:38 pm

    Well, goodnight everyone/anyone.

    I’ve a hunch when I wake up tomorrow, there won’t be a report that Rafael DePaula, or whatever his name actually is, has his visa.

  145. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:39 pm

    Odds, just a gut sense. We’ll have a virtual beer or two if it happens, to celebrate ;).

    Have a good night.

  146. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 11:41 pm

    Joba to the SP. Believing is making it happen. :twisted:

  147. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 11:42 pm

    :mrgreen:

  148. J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:42 pm

    LOL, Yankeefem, you sound like one of Joba’s tweets ;).

  149. yankeefeminista November 21st, 2011 at 11:43 pm

    :!:

  150. Against All Odds November 21st, 2011 at 11:51 pm

    Good night Pruf.

    I like the sound of that. That would be something to toast to.

  151. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 12:14 am

    J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:34 pm
    LOL, Odds. Len Dawson and Otis Taylor. Some kind of hookup.
    ///

    Chiefs do suck, but if I have to worry about them as a Jet fan, I might as well pack it in right now. I can’t really complain, any way, since virtually everyone the Jets needed to lose yesterday, did.
    ______
    Peyton to Harrison wasn’t too shabby. Loved to watch them play and looking forward to Harrison being inducted into Indy’s Ring of Honor on Sunday.

  152. DaSaint007 November 22nd, 2011 at 12:14 am

    Papelbum to the Phillies.
    Nathan to the Rangers. Feliz to the starting rotation.

    9th inning just got a bit easier against 2 key rivals.

  153. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 12:15 am

    J. Alfred Prufrock November 21st, 2011 at 11:42 pm
    LOL, Yankeefem, you sound like one of Joba’s tweets.
    ________

    :facepalm:

  154. Your Worst Nightmare November 22nd, 2011 at 12:50 am

    trisha – true pinstriped blue November 21st, 2011 at 9:27 pm

    It’s early and things could change dramatically but I am SOOO happy to see KC ahead of the Pats at this moment. If you could have heard WEEI today you’d think that KC should be embarrassed to even be on the field, so inferior are they to the Pats…

    ================

    Oops………..hate the Pats but they crushed the lowly Chiefs.

  155. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 1:02 am

    Unless a team just absolutely bowls him over with a high-ball offer, CJ Wilson is gonna wait and see IF Darvish gets posted. If Darvish does get posted, Wilson will continue to wait, and whatever Darvish signs for, Wilson then expects more $$$. Basically, Wilson is gonna let Darvish set the bar, then expect teams to exceed it regarding his contract.

  156. DaSaint007 November 22nd, 2011 at 1:08 am

    DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 1:02 am
    Unless a team just absolutely bowls him over with a high-ball offer, CJ Wilson is gonna wait and see IF Darvish gets posted. If Darvish does get posted, Wilson will continue to wait, and whatever Darvish signs for, Wilson then expects more $$$. Basically, Wilson is gonna let Darvish set the bar, then expect teams to exceed it regarding his contract.
    ———————————————————-
    Posting fee doesn’t count. Darvish’s contract probably won’t exceed Dice-K’s, so Wilson will do better regardless, and is a proven commodity vs. Darvish. Besides, if Wilson waits too long, and teams fill their rotations, it works the opposite for him. Timing is everything.

  157. NYYanksFan November 22nd, 2011 at 2:57 am

    MLB_Europe Derek #Jeter’s been vacationing in #Stockholm–

    http://www.aftonbladet.se/spor.....3960171.ab

  158. Blutarsky November 22nd, 2011 at 4:09 am

    Good one, all you need now is a translation.

  159. pkyankfan69 November 22nd, 2011 at 8:12 am

    Texas signing Nathan doesn’t help them much if at all.
    Yanks own Nathan even when he was on the top of his game.

    Feliz = Joba #2

  160. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 8:13 am

    Good morning all.

    Winter meetings are coming up……I think they’ll be wild this year.

  161. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 8:16 am

    Nathan was starting to get his velo back at the end of the year last season. If he allows Feliz to go to the rotation and he’s successful there then it definitely helps their club……

    I really thought Boston would sign Nathan as he was the cheaper alternative and it just felt like a fit to me……now they are going to either still with what they have or probably over pay Bell or Madson. Bell in particular I think would not be a good fit in the AL east and would be a clear downgrade from Papelbon.

  162. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 8:29 am

    blake November 22nd, 2011 at 8:13 am
    Good morning all.

    Winter meetings are coming up??I think they?ll be wild this year.

    *********************

    How wild are we talking here? Cash showing up in his elf costume wild?? ;)

  163. MTU November 22nd, 2011 at 8:36 am

    Blake-

    The Sux are more effed up than a wooden watch.

    ;)

  164. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 8:39 am

    Erin,

    Yes…..that wild ;)

    MTU,

    Still a lot of talent in that clubhouse but I think its very interesting what’s going on there. A known saber franchise considering Bobby V? How much power dies Cherington have?

  165. upstate kate November 22nd, 2011 at 8:41 am

    good morning all!

    I probably wont be around much due to holiday preparations, so I want to wish everyone a very Happy Thanksgiving ahead of time :)

  166. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 8:45 am

    Happy Thanksgiving Kate :)

  167. filthy slider November 22nd, 2011 at 8:55 am

    great , you put a juicer in the #1 spot.

  168. Benny Blanco November 22nd, 2011 at 8:57 am

    MTU,

    With feliz moving to the rotation, does texas really expect him to throw 200 innings?

  169. MTU November 22nd, 2011 at 9:00 am

    Have a great Holiday everyone.

    Treasure your loved ones.

    :)

  170. MTU November 22nd, 2011 at 9:04 am

    Benny-

    Can’t see how. Not sure he can handle the # required for a 5th starter.

    ;)

  171. jacksquat November 22nd, 2011 at 9:04 am

    Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 8:29 am
    blake November 22nd, 2011 at 8:13 am
    Good morning all.

    Winter meetings are coming up??I think they?ll be wild this year.

    *********************

    How wild are we talking here? Cash showing up in his elf costume wild??

    Maybe even Theo Epstein in his gorilla suit wild.

  172. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 9:06 am

    They jumped CJ straight to 200 innings and that worked out……(at least so it would seem so far)

  173. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 9:07 am

    My guess is they will be more cautious with Feliz though than they were with Wilson……maybe get him 175 or so innings.

  174. Benny Blanco November 22nd, 2011 at 9:10 am

    Texas must be doing something right if they jumped Wilson to 200. Maybe hughes problems were related to his arm being “out of shape”? Just a thought.

    Texas converts relievers to starters like no other team.

  175. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 9:11 am

    jacksquat-now we’re talking. ;)

  176. MTU November 22nd, 2011 at 9:14 am

    I believe age is a factor when it comes the “Verducci” rules.

    Feliz is quite a bit younger than CJ.

    ;)

  177. Against All Odds November 22nd, 2011 at 9:16 am

    # pkyankfan69 November 22nd, 2011 at 8:12 am

    Texas signing Nathan doesn’t help them much if at all.
    Yanks own Nathan even when he was on the top of his game.

    Feliz = Joba #2

    ————————————

    So Feliz will go through the normal growing pains as a starter and then unfortunately get forced back into the bullpen.

  178. Against All Odds November 22nd, 2011 at 9:17 am

    # Benny Blanco November 22nd, 2011 at 9:10 am

    Texas must be doing something right if they jumped Wilson to 200. Maybe hughes problems were related to his arm being “out of shape”? Just a thought.

    Texas converts relievers to starters like no other team.

    ——————————–

    Yankees should take notes

  179. Baseball Mogul November 22nd, 2011 at 9:20 am

    Feliz’s BB/9 were up and K/9 were down, so that’d be a concern if I were Texas. I don’t think they are looking at him replacing Wilson’s innings. They’re interested in bringing him back (at the right price) and will be in on Danks for the right package.

  180. Germfree Adolescents November 22nd, 2011 at 9:22 am

    I wonder if they are going crazy on talk radio over there like they did here during the Joba debacle?

  181. Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2011 at 9:30 am

    Discourse, Granderson gets better jumps, he goes back to the wall better, he’s more athletic and able to get better timed, higher leaps at the wall to make plays, he takes more direct routes to the ball. He’s a better CF, and I don’t think it’s all that close.

    Does your disdain for defensive metric also make you incapable of analyzing a player or answering a simple question? Apparently, yes.

    No one is telling you Granderson is a bad outfielder, so stop being so defensive (tee hee) about it.

    All I want to hear from you is how Granderson was better than Ellsbury this year, but you seem incapable of citing any specific plays or mis-plays from 2011 to back up your nonsense.

    Sounds to me like your method for evaluating defense… sucks. It’s certainly not of any use to anyone trying to determine which player was better during a particular season.

    I guess just keep avoiding the topic, hiding behind your disdain for recorded information. At this point I’m not expecting an intelligent response from you anymore.

  182. Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2011 at 9:32 am

    Texas must be doing something right if they jumped Wilson to 200. Maybe hughes problems were related to his arm being “out of shape”? Just a thought.

    You won’t be saying that if he ends up with elbow surgery in year 2 of his new deal. Like playing football with a ticking bomb.

  183. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 9:32 am

    “and will be in on Danks for the right package.”

    Agree…….however I think the Yanks match up better unless Texas wants to include their best guys.

    As an aside ……..if teams ever did this sort of thing……would it make sense for the Yanks to attempt a prospect trade with Texas for Profar? They have Andrus…..

  184. Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2011 at 9:35 am

    Prufrock – If they don’t jive with what defensive metrics claim, I’m going to partial what I actually witnessed, not defer to imaginary people.

    That’s great… but in that respect, no one cares what you think either. I’ll trust the guys who’s job it is to record these things. Not some “imaginary person” in the internet with no proof or ability to compare players over a single season.

  185. Baseball Mogul November 22nd, 2011 at 9:37 am

    The Yankees just drafted Culver in the first round though. Both are so far away that it’s almost a crapshoot.

  186. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 9:38 am

    For example……would Gary Sanchez for Profar make sense for both teams? Now teams never do stuff like that……but should they?

  187. Germfree Adolescents November 22nd, 2011 at 9:39 am

    You won?t be saying that if he ends up with elbow surgery in year 2 of his new deal. Like playing football with a ticking bomb.

    ———————————————————–

    Are you trying to equate the way the Yankees handle young pitchers and the way Texas does?
    If Feliz gets hurt at some point does that invalidate every success they have had?

  188. Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2011 at 9:40 am

    Germfree – What success have they had? Wilson can still easily get hurt and make this RP->SP “method” a complete failure.

  189. Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2011 at 9:41 am

    Wilson is going to meet with the Marlins to get low-balled after turkey day. I wonder if players/agents just use teams like that as practice for negotiating their talking points with the bigger clubs….

  190. pkyankfan69 November 22nd, 2011 at 9:41 am

    Just a hypothetical question:

    For the next 2 years would you rather have Nathan @ 14.5 million or Soriano @ 25 million???

    If the money was the same I’ll take Soriano but is he worth the extra $10.5M?

  191. Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2011 at 9:46 am

    Is he worth an extra $10mil? No… but I would still rather have Soriano over Nathan.

    Soriano’s career has gone like clockwork, one injury riddled bad year followed by 2 outstanding seasons. We should be in for a good ride this year, and then he’ll opt out and look for closer money :)

  192. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 9:47 am

    Id definitely rather have Nathan for 10 million cheaper because I don’t think they need either one of them.

  193. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 9:49 am

    If Nathan is back from the TJS….and he was looking closed at the end if last year……then he’s better than Soriano anyway.

  194. austinmac November 22nd, 2011 at 9:50 am

    I am on the way to the hospital to hold my first grandchild. Look for a switch hitting shortstop in 20 plus years.

    So much to be grateful for this Thanksgiving.

    May all my blogging friends have a wonderful Thanksgiving.

  195. Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2011 at 9:51 am

    blake you’re right, they probably don’t really need either of them… but i think horse RP’s are not too different from starters. can never have enough. where would the bullpen be last year if they didn’t have 4-5 extra good relievers and the ability to take feliciano/joba/mitre going down without flinching? Comparatively… Nathan was pretty good in the second half last year… but i guess i’m painted back into my “it’s just money” stance :p

  196. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 9:55 am

    austinmac- congratulations!! Boy or girl?

    Happy Thanksgiving to you :)

  197. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 9:56 am

    austinmac-missed the shortstop part of your post, so nevermind the boy or girl question. ;)

  198. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 10:00 am

    Mac,

    That’s awesome! Congrats

    ID,

    Got Jobber coming back also next year who looked like he was starting to come into his own before he got hurt…… I wish they’d build him back as a starter but they wont …….so he could make the pen just unreal if they get him right in the 2nd half.

  199. Germfree Adolescents November 22nd, 2011 at 10:03 am

    Germfree ? What success have they had? Wilson can still easily get hurt and make this RP->SP ?method? a complete failure.

    ————————————————————————-

    any pitcher can get hurt whether he is a reliver or a starter. It’s the nature of the beast. Nobody could have expected Wilson to have had the success he has had so far these past 2 years. Ogando has done well also

  200. pkyankfan69 November 22nd, 2011 at 10:08 am

    Wilson has to already be considered a successfull RP to SP conversion.

    The jury is still out on Ogando considering his ERA was 4.48 post ASB.

    I would not be surprised one bit if we see further regresion with Ogando in 2012.

    I do not see him sticking longterm as a SP.

  201. Germfree Adolescents November 22nd, 2011 at 10:09 am

    I will leave judgement on Hughes until after next year but when was the last young starter that the Yankees developed and kept here that has had success as a starter?

  202. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 10:18 am

    YankeesPR NYY ’12 general tix prices are out. 70+% of tix prices will remain unchanged or be reduced. Nearly 1/3 of avail tix priced at $30 or less

  203. MaineYankee November 22nd, 2011 at 10:20 am

    austinmac November 22nd, 2011 at 9:50 am
    I am on the way to the hospital to hold my first grandchild. Look for a switch hitting shortstop in 20 plus years.

    So much to be grateful for this Thanksgiving.

    May all my blogging friends have a wonderful Thanksgiving.

    ——————————————————————————

    Congrats. I have 2 and the best part is when you can send them home when you’ve had enough. :lol:

    It sounds like your Thanksgiving got alot more meaning. I hope you have a good day on Thursday.

  204. Mike Ri November 22nd, 2011 at 10:22 am

    According to FOX Sports’ Ken Rosenthal, the Cubs’ new regime is “willing to move” Matt Garza.
    The Cubs will probably have to be blown away by an offer to actually trade the right-hander, but the market for available starting pitchers is rough this winter and many teams are likely to come calling. Garza, 27, posted a 3.32 ERA and 197/63 K/BB ratio in 198 innings this year. He’s due a raise over the $5.95 million salary that he earned in 2011 as a second-year arbitration-eligible player. The Rangers have shown interest in the past.

    ( i know im in the minority on this ) …. But I like Garza alot !.. young . competitive , AL East battle tested , good overall numbers.

  205. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 10:22 am

    All field level seats at #Yankee Stadium btw bases to stay same or go down. Field level outfield seats in fair territory to see reductions. Ticket price increases tied to places such as non-obstructed bleachers, which will see $5/gm hike.

  206. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 10:26 am

    A few thoughts on the last couple of weeks:

    1. Verlander shouldn’t have been the MVP. He had a fantastic season and I don’t want to diminish it, but the fact is that it is tough to consider a player who only appeared in 251 of a possible 1,458 innings the most valuable player no matter how good he is. It is akin to giving the MVP to a player who had a fantastic start to the season and then broke his leg in July and missed the remainder of the year. He just doesn’t impact enough of the games to consider him the most valuable guy on his own team, let alone the league.

    2. The signing of Jonathan Papelbon just gets worse and worse for the Phillies. First of all it was a stupid contract to begin with, and now the announcement of the new CBA comes with the provision that none of this year’s Type A free agent relievers will require draft pick compensation to sign, but that’s not retroactive. Philly still has to give Boston its pick for Papelbon, but they will not get one back for Madson.

    3. On the flip side I like their trade for Ty Wiggington. I couldn’t imagine them going forward while Howard was out with Thome playing at first on a regular basis. And when Howard returns, Wiggington gives them some flexibility at 3b where Polanco is over-the-hill and at 2b where Utley isn’t as durible as he once was – bottom line is that team is old and getting older and if they don’t win the title in 2012 I think their window will slam shut.

    4. Boston is a mess. Is there any doubt at this point that Ben Cherrington is just a puppet and Larry Luccino is calling the shots up there? They interview a whole bunch of guys who never managed and then announce that their priority is finding someone with managerial experience? Well if that was the case why waste time interviewing half the guys you did?

    5. Yankees are moving very slowly this winter – which I expected. The free agent market is very thin and Cashman doesn’t like being used to drive up player costs.

    6. Braves are interested in Eduardo Nunez, ok. Depending on what they’re willing to give back, I’m fine with letting Nunez go and seeing what’s out there to replace him with. Maybe Nunez, Venditte (whom the team will lose in the Rule 5 Draft) and a more prospecty minor leaguer like Phelps for Jurrjens – though I doubt that will be enough for the Braves.

    7. Speaking of Venditte – I hope he does get claimed in the Rule 5 draft and winds up with a team that views him as more than a curiosity and lets him try to earn a spot.

    8. Hate the new realignment rules. Interleague play on an everyday basis is stupid. If you’re going to do that – you have to either eliminate the DH (which I and the union are against) or make it uniform across the sport (which NL owners are against)

    9. I don’t often agree with Keith Law but I will on this: The Pirates signing of Clint Barmes for 2 years $10 mil makes no sense. I like Barmes, but as a utility guy. They should have just picked up Cedeno’s option for $3 mil and spent the $7 mil elsewhere.

    10. I am not giving Billy Beane what he wants for Gio Gonzalez. I’m sorry, I just don’t buy him.

  207. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 10:29 am

    The Feliz thing is interesting – they had great success converting CJ Wilson from reliever to starter so it gives them confidence going forward with Feliz. I really like the guts that organization shows when it comes to pitching development.

  208. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 10:30 am

    austinmac

    Congratulations! Health and family are good things to be thankful for.

    Take a picture of the baby next to the turkey so he can have a visual of how small he was years from now. :wink:

  209. 86w183 November 22nd, 2011 at 10:31 am

    Congrats Austinmac!

    Erin — Don’t be so sure… She could be a switch-hitting shortstop on a fast pitch softball team!

    I’ve always liked Garza, aside from the dead caterpiller on the chin beard thing

  210. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 10:32 am

    Hi MaineYankee!

    Happy 2 Days Before Thanksgiving ;)

  211. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 10:32 am

    Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 9:56 am
    austinmac-missed the shortstop part of your post, so nevermind the boy or girl question.
    ____
    Girls can play SS too. ;)

    Yankees have no choice but to hold the line on tickets. STH’s are dumping them in droves, especially full season holders. They can buy better and cheaper seats on Stubhub.

    UZR is a flawed stat; home-field bias, counting bias, et al. To use it within the context of other stats is one thing, but to categorically accept its number as some sort of evaluative measure of a player without any qualifiers is just plain silly.

  212. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 10:34 am

    should read, other stats and *viewing the game live, as much as possible*

  213. Jerkface November 22nd, 2011 at 10:34 am

    With those luxury tax changes the Yankees should be doing everything possible to skirt the tax, like acquiring Yu Darvish :twisted:

  214. Mike Ri November 22nd, 2011 at 10:34 am

    what would it take to land someone like Garza. . . would Theo and the boys give us a discount ?? lol

  215. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 10:35 am

    oh, and congrats, austinmac! & happy cooking and Thanksgiving, upstate kate!

  216. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 10:35 am

    JF, QFT.

  217. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 10:36 am

    yankeefem-very true. :)

  218. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 10:37 am

    Cubs moving Garza, could be Cubs moving salary=Pujols attempted signing. Theo did move Garciaparra, so he has shown he is not afraid to make a SPLASH Move. If I was Theo, I’d offer Pujols 10yrs at $30 Mill per. Pujols seems to wantta return to St. Louis and would probably give the Cards a hometown discount. Yea, he turned them down earlier, but he is now realizing how small the market is for his services and the $$$ he wants. The Cubs have to get Albert’s attention, and that of the baseball world. They are a bad team with a lotta holes. Though expensive, Pujols immediately makes the Cubs better, the Cards worse, (their division winner), and like a good magician always does, distracts the audience\fan base. Whether he signs Pujols or Not, Theo will have made his presence known in Chicago. This move has nothing but short-term upside for Theo, and a GM inna major media market lives on the shorterm.

  219. MaineYankee November 22nd, 2011 at 10:40 am

    Erin

    Thanks.

    I hope the same for you.

    Do you put Junior Mints on your turkey :D:

  220. Gary November 22nd, 2011 at 10:40 am

    Morning, not much out there. I see Wilson is spending sometime with the Angels and Buehrle is being wooed by the Nationals and Marlins. Not sure what Brian is up to, he was sleeping out the other night and probably like all of us getting ready for T’day and football. Maybe the offseason gets going soon. February coming on pretty quick, next month has to be moving day like at the Masters. Given the holidays I think not much happens this month except perhaps for the Darvish decision.

  221. jacksquat November 22nd, 2011 at 10:41 am

    Jerkface November 22nd, 2011 at 10:34 am
    With those luxury tax changes the Yankees should be doing everything possible to skirt the tax, like acquiring Yu Darvish

    He needs to be posted first…

  222. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 10:42 am

    MaineYankee- Believe it or not no.

    Although at some point this weekend I have to buy the special red and green Junior Mints. Seriously one of the best parts of Christmas. ;)

  223. Gary November 22nd, 2011 at 10:43 am

    Yuck Giants 7 point underdogs to Brees and company. Probably about right. Mindboggling this team plays so poorly in the second half especially when the guys just quit out there. New Coach?

  224. Nick in SF November 22nd, 2011 at 10:43 am

    Derek Jeter in Sweden – here Sportbladet meet with New York icon
    He is one of the world’s most powerful, richest and most popular athletes.
    Sportbladet got an exclusive chat with the New York Yankees icon and captain Derek
    Jeter.
    - I love Stockholm, it’s wonderful here, he says.
    He plays in a club that is valued higher than Manchester United, Real Madrid and Barcelona. He has played twelve All-Star games, won five gold gloves and won five World Series titles.
    New York Yankees captain Derek Jeter is one of America’s most powerful athletes, and now the icon for a visit – in Sweden.
    “Stay a few days”
    - I love Stockholm, it’s wonderful here, he says when Sportbladet have a chat with the star.
    Jeter, who brings in more money than almost any other athlete, had lunch at the Grand Hotel on Saturday and then take a boat trip in the Stockholm archipelago.
    - I just got here. I’m here to meet some friends and will stay for a few
    days.
    Yankees won the World Series in 2009, but when the contract would be extended before last season ended up the club and Jeter in a dispute. After many ifs and buts, the parties eventually agreed on a three-year contract – worth $ 51 million.
    In recent years, has been shaky for the team captain. He had his worst season statistically in 2010 and last season was not much better.
    Reached the dream border
    But for the coming season is Jeter positive.
    - I think we will do a very good season, it feels good, he says.
    In July, Jeter the first Yankees player ever to reach the dream limit of 3000 hits in his career.
    Yankees were, however, out in the playoffs first round by Detroit.
    Malin Wahlberg

    World’s most valuable CLUBS
    First New York Yankees
    Second Manchester United
    Third Real Madrid
    4th Dallas Cowboys
    5th Bayern Munich
    6th Boston Red Sox
    7th Barcelona
    8th Arsenal
    9th Milan
    10th New England Patriots
    Source : Forbes.

    Derek Jeter
    Born : 26 June 1974. Salary : $ 29 million per year.
    Career : Made his debut in Major League Baseball 1995th Won the World Series for the first time a year later with the New York Yankees. Has since won the title in 1998, 1999, 2000 and 2009. 2003 he was appointed captain of the club.
    Last summer, he reached the frontier dream 3000 hits in his career.

    http://www.aftonbladet.se/spor.....3960171.ab

  225. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 10:46 am

    si_vault Joe Torre and Elmo have a heated dispute: http://pic.twitter.com/Mp87tVdV

    I’m siding with Elmo ;)

  226. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 10:53 am

    “8. Hate the new realignment rules. Interleague play on an everyday basis is stupid. If you’re going to do that – you have to either eliminate the DH (which I and the union are against) or make it uniform across the sport (which NL owners are against)”

    If they keep the same number of games and just spread them out them I don’t see the big deal…..which seems like what they are going to do. Now id they increased the number of games in any significant way then yea……I think they’d have to universalize the rules.

  227. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 10:54 am

    Nick,

    You owe me a cajun filet biscuit and a sweet tea ;)

  228. tucker November 22nd, 2011 at 10:55 am

    Wouldn’t surprise memto see a strong year from Soriano followed by an opt out, particularly if Mo retires … It’s the Boras way.

  229. Nick in SF November 22nd, 2011 at 10:56 am

    Fair enough, blake, but I think you owe me a defibrillator. That was a wild game.

  230. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 11:01 am

    “Fair enough, blake, but I think you owe me a defibrillator. That was a wild game.”

    Lol…..always trust the Panther choke.

  231. J. Alfred Prufrock November 22nd, 2011 at 11:03 am

    Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2011 at 9:35 am
    Prufrock – If they don’t jive with what defensive metrics claim, I’m going to partial what I actually witnessed, not defer to imaginary people.

    That’s great… but in that respect, no one cares what you think either. I’ll trust the guys who’s job it is to record these things. Not some “imaginary person” in the internet with no proof or ability to compare players over a single season.
    ///

    Hey ID, you can rely all you want on derivative “insight”, and a flawed system, if that’s how you want to “watch” baseball.

    I’m not sure, though, why you feel you need to try to undercut fellow posters with your caustic, humorless, True Believer, self important commentary, but that’s not something new from you. I’ll just compensate for you with polite internet etiquette in even responding to you with any civility, since the holidays are here ;).

    What – you’re expecting a “report” from me, a game by game breakdown of Granderson vs. Ellsbury? So I can “prove” what is not “provable”, and what your numbers fail to prove? That’s the point: at the end of the day, it is someone’s subjective opinion….those numbers are arrived at by a judgment someone is making. You want to give one opinion more credence than another, that’s fine, but that is essentially what you are doing.

    There is no objective, quantitative way to measure defense.

  232. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 11:03 am

    No thanks on Garza for what thethe Cubs would ask………

  233. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 11:04 am

    Nick adding to the most interesting man on Lohud legend with the Swedish translation.

  234. Mike Ri November 22nd, 2011 at 11:09 am

    Blake-

    what do you think the Cubs would ask for ?

  235. Nick in SF November 22nd, 2011 at 11:11 am

    I had help.

  236. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 11:17 am

    Mike,

    Probably Montero…..

  237. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 11:17 am

    Well if you read Dan Shaunnessy the price for Garza should have been Theo – which is just silliness.

    I think at this time of year every GM is willing to listen on every player. Doesn’t mean they’re looking to deal. But if you’re not listening (and that includes Cashman on Cano) then you’re not doing your job.

  238. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 11:19 am

    Or at the very least Manny or Betances plus……he, Castro, and maybe Marshall are like the only guys in their entire system worth anything. If Theo isn’t getting a lot in return he might as well keep Garza.

  239. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 11:22 am

    Chip,

    On the surface it seems like you are dead right on Cherington……Theo clearly had some pull in that organization…….its yet to be seen how much power Cherington actually has or will have.

  240. Against All Odds November 22nd, 2011 at 11:27 am

    I really like the guts that organization shows when it comes to pitching development.

    ————————————–

    Yankees need to take notes because that’s one area they are lacking in.

  241. pkyankfan69 November 22nd, 2011 at 11:27 am

    Gary November 22nd, 2011 at 10:43 am
    Yuck Giants 7 point underdogs to Brees and company. Probably about right. Mindboggling this team plays so poorly in the second half especially when the guys just quit out there. New Coach?
    —————————-
    I like Tom a lot but if they do miss the playoffs again this season it is time for a new voice in the locker room.

    The guy they need to dump is Brandon Jacobs.
    The guy has been a worthless sack of S__T for a few years now.

    With Jacobs gone after this year, Bradshaw always hurt, and apparently no faith in Scott the Giants need to draft a RB this year along with much needed offensive line.

    Richardson will go too high so you have to scout the next group hard and see if you really like anyone of the Lamar Miller/David Wilson/Chris Polk/Montee Ball group.

  242. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 11:29 am

    The Cubs gave up a haul for Garza. I can’t imagine them, accepting anything less than a Killer B and an A position prospect.

  243. Against All Odds November 22nd, 2011 at 11:31 am

    # Germfree Adolescents November 22nd, 2011 at 10:09 am

    I will leave judgement on Hughes until after next year but when was the last young starter that the Yankees developed and kept here that has had success as a starter?

    ——————————————-

    You have to go all the way back to Pettitte which is what 15-16 yrs ago. If you take a look at other teams most of them don’t have to go back that far. smh

  244. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 11:34 am

    The guy\$$$ the Cubs would love to dump is Z. I blame Sweet Lou for letting that guy get outta control to the point the Cubs could not deal him. Pinella shoulda straightened Z out right outta the gate, and if the confrontations with teammates continued, given Mgt an ultimatum of “he goes or I go”. As Spock would say, “Sometimes, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few……….or the One”. I believe Lou has been shell-shocked when it comes to going nose-nose with a player since The Main Event with Rob Dibble. Pinella will climb all over the media as he did with his, “I’m not a Dummy” diatribe, but when it comes to confronting a player, the guy turns into Harpo Marx.

  245. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 11:35 am

    blake November 22nd, 2011 at 11:22 am
    Chip,

    On the surface it seems like you are dead right on Cherington……Theo clearly had some pull in that organization…….its yet to be seen how much power Cherington actually has or will have.

    ———————

    Well Cherrington did bring some of it on himself. If you look at the guys he wanted to interview, it was Theo’s list – he didn’t show any forethought of his own, just went with what Theo had come up with when they were looking to replace Tito before the Cub thing came up.

    Cherrington may have agreed with that list wholeheartedly, but the fact that there wasn’t a single other guy out there he wanted to bring in, that he didn’t really bring any new idea to the table probably opened the door for Luccino to step in and say “boy, lemme show you how it’s done” Frankly, as a Yankee fan, there’s nothing better than to have Luccino running the show in Boston – he’s not a baseball man, never has been and never should be. It would be like Randy Levine running around making player decisions for the Yankees.

  246. Mike Ri November 22nd, 2011 at 11:36 am

    Blake –

    would you give up Betances and some extra for Garza ?.

  247. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 11:36 am

    yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 11:29 am
    The Cubs gave up a haul for Garza. I can’t imagine them, accepting anything less than a Killer B and an A position prospect.

    ————–

    Different GM made that deal – Theo’s not beholden to it. He doesn’t have to justify what he gave up to get Garza vs. what he takes back because he didn’t give up anything for Garza. Someone else who is no longer with the organization did.

  248. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 11:38 am

    Mike Ri November 22nd, 2011 at 11:36 am
    Blake –

    would you give up Betances and some extra for Garza ?.

    ——————

    I would – 27 year old pitcher under contract who has a sub 4 career ERA while pitching all but one year in the AL East for a prospect who many predict will profile best in the pen and another minor leaguer – heck yes.

  249. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 11:41 am

    Chip, it has nothing to do with who made the deal as much as what level prospects Garza could and still can garner. Especially after the kind of year he had.

    And btw, Garza will be 28 this week.

    And for the record, Betances doesn’t profile best as a reliever.

  250. Mike Ri November 22nd, 2011 at 11:41 am

    Chip — I agree . . I would too ! .

  251. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 11:45 am

    yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 11:41 am
    Chip, it has nothing to do with who made the deal as much as what level prospects Garza could and still can garner. Especially after the kind of year he had. I don’t disagree, but my point is that what was given up to get Garza by Hendry has zero impact on what Theo would want for him

    And btw, Garza will be 28 this week. Happy birthday to him

    And for the record, Betances doesn’t profile best as a reliever. depends on who you read

  252. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 11:47 am

    Floating Garzal about $$$. Sure, Theo wants to get the best value back possible, but this is a Purse Letting 1st. As for the R\Sox, they are looking for an experienced Mgr due to their payroll. NO WAY they let an inexperienced driver behind the wheel of their Porche. The Job is Valentine’s if he wants it. Valentine has gotta make sure the R\Sox realize their team is in shambles, and that they probably are gonna have a 3rd straight season of not making the Playoffs. The last thing Bobby wants is to get fired during or at the end of his 1st season. That would be the end of his days as a Mgr, and the guy LOVES the limelight showered upon him in that role.

  253. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 11:47 am

    Against All Odds November 22nd, 2011 at 11:31 am
    # Germfree Adolescents November 22nd, 2011 at 10:09 am

    I will leave judgement on Hughes until after next year but when was the last young starter that the Yankees developed and kept here that has had success as a starter?

    ——————————————-

    You have to go all the way back to Pettitte which is what 15-16 yrs ago. If you take a look at other teams most of them don’t have to go back that far. smh
    ——————

    Was CM Wang here long enough to count?

  254. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 11:51 am

    “would you give up Betances and some extra for Garza ?.”

    Depends on who the extra is but if its nobody significant then yes I probably would. Garza isn’t a #1 but he’s a 3 with 2 upside for me…….I would take that bird in the hand over Betances upside in the bush……but that’s just me.

    Im not a huge Garza guy so I wpjkdbt have a problem if the Yanks said no on that potential deal.

  255. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 11:52 am

    I would not, on the other hand, touch Gio Gonzalez.

    He scares the heck out of me – a 26 year old pitcher who has never faced a single pressure inning in his career and has clearly benefitted by playing in a pitcher’s park (3.56 Home ERA vs. 4.32 on the road) has flourished early and faded late in seasons, has (in limited sample size) pitched terribly in Fenway, Yankee Stadium and the Trop, and has a relatively high WHIP of 1.4.

    Plus Beane is going to ask for a ransom for him.

  256. pkyankfan69 November 22nd, 2011 at 11:52 am

    If the Yankees move Nunez in any sort of deal what do you think about trying to trade for Chone Figgins?

    His contract is bad: ’12:9M – ’13:8M – ’14 vesting option for 9M (needs 600 PA in ’13 to kick in)

    I’ve read that Seattle is willing to pick up a portion of his contract.
    If the Yankees could get him for nothing of value and only have to pay him 10M over 2 seasons he might be a pretty valuable sub for multiple positions(no way the Yanks would let the evsting option kick in.) Last year was the only REALLY bad season he has ever had.

    Chone can play 2B,3B, and the OF. Only problem is no SS exp.

    If he is healthy he might be a guy to keep an eye on.

  257. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 11:53 am

    Chip, any reputable scouting pundit wouldn’t categorize a 3 plus pitch pitcher as profiling better as a starter, especially considering he was an All Star and certainly not until he had been given the opportunity to start and had failed in that capacity. Who the heck are you reading?

  258. 86w183 November 22nd, 2011 at 11:55 am

    Theo has the freedom to do what he wants and is not under pressure to deliver immediate results.

    He can go three ways with Garza —-

    1. Get as much major league ready talent he can get to improve the Cubs in 2012 and beyond

    2. Get a huge haul of prospects for 2013 and beyond

    3. Tell someone you can have Garza for a couple of “B” prospects —- IF you take Soriano too.

    If I’m the Yanks I’m interested in # 1 and # 2, but no way on # 3.

  259. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 11:56 am

    blake, Garza threw his FB 20% less this year. I recall with the Rays, he would get in trouble when he overused his FB and that he had one great game against the Sux where he was throwing a lot of secondary pitches and kept them off balance. I haven’t really seen him pitch much with Cubs, but as a Garza fan, I would be interested to see if he has become more of a pitcher. Would I deal top notch prospects for him though? No.

  260. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 11:56 am

    Garza does nothing for me. He had his struggles in the NL in 2011, and you can multiply that 3 or 4 fold in the AL East. Of all the SP’s rumored to be available, Gio Gonzalez would have my attention 1st, and last. I don’t know if the rumors are true about requiring Montero to get it done, but short of that, I would focus on Gio. Still a very high ceiling with GG

  261. pkyankfan69 November 22nd, 2011 at 11:57 am

    ***MLBTR thinks Seattle may eat upwards of $15 million of the remaining $17 million on Figgins’ contract

  262. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 11:57 am

    *has* failed

  263. Mike Ri November 22nd, 2011 at 12:01 pm

    DonnyBrook – Have you seen his numbers in AL East ! . . there not that bad! . .Garza is a competitor with good stuff…. . One so so season in a new league shouldn’t discount what type of pitcher Garza is.

  264. GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 12:01 pm

    Something to read besides the same silly assed trade proposals, non-sense from the germy adolescent, who did or didn’t deserve awards.

    It’s what may be an on-going series of articles by Josh Norris on the kids in the minors, starting with Gary Sanchez complete with videos.

    http://minormatterstrenton.blo.....nchez.html

  265. Mike Ri November 22nd, 2011 at 12:01 pm

    DonnyBrook .. brw . . Gio would be my first choice as well. .. than Garza followed by Danks

  266. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 12:02 pm

    How about a three team deal:

    Cubs get: Nick Swisher, Phil Hughes and Martin Prado
    Braves get: Eduardo Nunez, Andrew Cashner, Brandon Laird and David Phelps
    Yankees get: Matt Garza and Jair Jurrjens

    Yankee rotation:
    CC
    Jurrjens
    Garza
    Nova
    Burnett

  267. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 12:02 pm

    YF,

    Yea im going more off what I saw when he was with the Rays……fly ball guy that tried to throw 92 mph fastballs by people too often…….he may have progressed since them.

    I would take a flyer on Figgkns if Seattle paid virtually his entire salary…….he used to be a decent t player so maybe getting out of the land where hitters go to die would help him……I

  268. 86w183 November 22nd, 2011 at 12:02 pm

    Tell the Mariners that the Yanks will eat ALL of Figgins’ contract in order to facilitate a deal for King Felix!

    Noesi, Nunez, Kontos, Romine and Adams for Felix and Figgins?

  269. GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 12:03 pm

    Since Figgins can’t play shortstop and has forgotten how to hit, what use is he?

  270. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 12:03 pm

    yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 11:53 am
    Chip, any reputable scouting pundit wouldn’t categorize a 3 plus pitch pitcher as profiling better as a starter, especially considering he was an All Star and certainly not until he had been given the opportunity to start and had failed in that capacity. Who the heck are you reading?

    ————

    Keith Law and the folks at Baseball America. But with prospects, people can be wrong as often as they’re right.

  271. Against All Odds November 22nd, 2011 at 12:04 pm

    # Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 11:47 am

    Against All Odds November 22nd, 2011 at 11:31 am
    # Germfree Adolescents November 22nd, 2011 at 10:09 am

    I will leave judgement on Hughes until after next year but when was the last young starter that the Yankees developed and kept here that has had success as a starter?

    ——————————————-

    You have to go all the way back to Pettitte which is what 15-16 yrs ago. If you take a look at other teams most of them don’t have to go back that far. smh
    ——————

    Was CM Wang here long enough to count?

    ———————

    How long was he here for 4-5 yrs??? His 06 and 07 seasons were really good and his 08 season was good until he got hurt. And we all know 09 was a disaster.

  272. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 12:04 pm

    Re: Gio.

    To me…..its all about whether you feel the command is coming…..he’s still really young. If the command develops last (as it does with a lot of guys) and he reduces the walk rate then he could be a very good pitcher. He’s got a great breaking ball……

  273. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 12:04 pm

    GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 12:03 pm
    Since Figgins can’t play shortstop and has forgotten how to hit, what use is he?

    ———-

    Really expensive pinch runner? And he can explain to everyone how “CHONE” ends up pronounced “Shawn”

  274. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 12:05 pm

    blake November 22nd, 2011 at 12:04 pm
    Re: Gio.

    To me…..its all about whether you feel the command is coming…..he’s still really young. If the command develops last (as it does with a lot of guys) and he reduces the walk rate then he could be a very good pitcher. He’s got a great breaking ball……

    —————

    That’s a lot of risk to take on a guy who is going to command a lot go the other way in trade.

  275. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 12:05 pm

    “Since Figgins can’t play shortstop and has forgotten how to hit, what use is he?”

    Not much unless Chavez retired and/or they traded Nunez.

  276. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 12:07 pm

    “That’s a lot of risk to take on a guy who is going to command a lot go the other way in trade.”

    I wasn’t necessarily talking about trading for him……in that case you’d have to see what Beane wanted.

  277. Patrick November 22nd, 2011 at 12:07 pm

    Cubs get: Nick Swisher, Phil Hughes and Martin Prado
    Braves get: Eduardo Nunez, Andrew Cashner, Brandon Laird and David Phelps
    Yankees get: Matt Garza and Jair Jurrjens

    Yankees give up Swisher, Hughes, Laird, Nunez and Phelps and get back Garza and Jurrjens? Way too good a deal from the Yankees pov.

  278. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 12:08 pm

    Love the way we are getting Garza, Jurrjens and even King Felix in these deals and not even giving up one A prospect. :roll: Only in your dreams.

    GB, thanks for heads up on Norris stuff. I haven’t even been checking his site…

    I am hoping we get a Sanchez game on ESPN Deportes before the DWL season is out.

    If we take credit for CMW, then we have to take damnation for screwing him up too.

  279. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 12:09 pm

    “Noesi, Nunez, Kontos, Romine and Adams for Felix and Figgins?”

    Even if he were available…….the Ms would accept no less than the top guys. Montero , both bs ….plus more

  280. Nick in SF November 22nd, 2011 at 12:15 pm

    Chien-ming Wang was mainly developed by dumb luck that buddy of randy’s who Cashman fired the brave spirit of Taiwan.

  281. Patrick November 22nd, 2011 at 12:18 pm

    nick,

    Don’t you dare besmirch the name of the legendary Neil Allen!

  282. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 12:18 pm

    Chip, Keith Law is a fool.

  283. Patrick November 22nd, 2011 at 12:19 pm

    Chip, Keith Law is a fool.

    Look at how wrong you are :(

  284. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 12:20 pm

    Yea, Seattle really put the fork in Ichiro. Come on, it aint the city. I believe not having Scisocia at the controls was what threw Figgins off. He had horrible stetches with the Angels, but always turned it around. Scioscia’s the difference. Still, I would have no interest in him based on the current Yankee 25 man. Nunez at this point is a better bet than Figgins even if the Mariners ate the salary.

  285. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 12:24 pm

    Patrick November 22nd, 2011 at 12:07 pm
    Cubs get: Nick Swisher, Phil Hughes and Martin Prado
    Braves get: Eduardo Nunez, Andrew Cashner, Brandon Laird and David Phelps
    Yankees get: Matt Garza and Jair Jurrjens

    Yankees give up Swisher, Hughes, Laird, Nunez and Phelps and get back Garza and Jurrjens? Way too good a deal from the Yankees pov.

    ———-

    Alright – send Romine to the Cubs as well and switch Betances in for Phelps.

  286. Patrick November 22nd, 2011 at 12:25 pm

    Alright – send Romine to the Cubs as well and switch Betances in for Phelps.

    That’s more reasonable but I don’t think it would get done. Fun to speculate though :)

  287. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 12:27 pm

    Cubs would have little interest in Swisher, Hughes, and Prado……that team isn’t close to competing and all those guys are close to free agency. If the Cubs do anything it’ll be to acquire guys with longterm control that they can use to rebuild with.

  288. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 12:29 pm

    Patrick, he hasn’t seen some of the players he evaluates but once. BA is fun, but it is notorious for undervaluing certain players, such as Montero who they/Law trashed way back when. You have to read a range of scouting reports, but also trust your own multiple live evaluations. I will trust having seen Betances pitch 10 times to Law’s once a season.

  289. Patrick November 22nd, 2011 at 12:29 pm

    blake,

    Yeah true, didn’t really think about that. Theo is too smart :(

  290. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 12:30 pm

    Law is like the scouting equivalent of a mall cop

  291. Patrick November 22nd, 2011 at 12:31 pm

    feminista,

    At least Law watches the players, unlike several other “prospect gurus”

    Law never trashed Montero, he said his defense was bad (it is). He still raves about how great Montero is at the plate and that he should start every day for the Yankees in 2012.

  292. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 12:33 pm

    With the Cub payroll, market, and that 100+ yr thing, there is no long-term rebuilding going on. Theo was hired to fix-it NOW.

  293. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 12:33 pm

    Just heard on the radio that some guy broke into Kenny Williams house…..was wearing his clothes and was thawing a lobster to cook when he was caught…..was wearing his 2005 WS ring.

  294. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 12:33 pm

    Oh, and Law DID move Betances up from 73 on his early top 100 mlb prospects list to #34 on his latest mlb prospects llst. So…guess Law is reevaluating his original report on Betances.

  295. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 12:34 pm

    “Theo was hired to fix-it NOW.”

    Nah….he was very clear and the Cubs have been very clear that they need a total rework from the ground up.

  296. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 12:37 pm

    Blake –

    NL Central is, as always, up for grabs – especially with two of the best players in it not locks to return to their current teams. If the Cubbies made that deal, and then maybe also signed Prince (well within their budget) they are looking at a team that has:

    Prince – 1b
    DeWitt – 2b
    Castro – SS
    Prado – 3b
    Sori – LF
    Byrd – CF
    Swisher – RF
    Soto – C

    Rotation is Z, Dempster, Hughes, Wells and Coleman/Carpenter/someone else.

  297. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 12:38 pm

    Patrick, law is OK, but it is just that a lot of these scouting reports, judgments are made without seeing the players play enough. It is the nature of the beast when you are covering so many players, but if you are someone who sees said player throughout a season, it is foolhardy to prioritize “expert” reports based on one viewing and some anonymous and potentially biased scout over what you know. I read all these guys from Law to Goldstein, but doesn’t mean I agree with some of what they state, often unequivocally.

  298. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 12:41 pm

    Chip,

    That rotation is awful…..and that lineup still isn’t very good.

  299. m November 22nd, 2011 at 12:41 pm

    Chip,

    The Braves get the short end of that trade.

  300. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 12:42 pm

    Yea, like either Theo or The Cubs are gonna yell FIRE inna crowded theatre. Come on. You do not pay Theo level $$$, and surrender compensation to merely follow-the-yellow-brick-road. You wantta see the Emerald City IMMEDIATELY. This aint Kansas, Dorothy.

  301. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 12:45 pm

    Ken_RosenthalKen Rosenthal
    New CBA will expand instant replay to include fair/foul and “trapped” ball plays, subject to discussions between #MLB and umpires.

    Buster_ESPNBuster Olney
    On HGH testing: It’s TBD when/if it goes into effect. There will be a test of HGH testing in the upcoming spring training. Players will be blood tested this spring, to determine energy levels after testing; results of testing will be discarded. Then, after results of physical reaction to blood testing is determined, the two sides will determine when and how to proceed.

    Results will be discarded….. haven’t I heard that somewhere before?

    HGH testing sounds like union allowing Bud a moral victory to help his legacy as the steroid commissioner more than serious about doing something about HGH in baseball.

  302. Mike Ri November 22nd, 2011 at 12:45 pm

    per rotoworld.com

    According to Nick Camino of 1100 WTAM in Cleveland, the Indians will announce a new contract for outfielder Grady Sizemore “by tonight or tomorrow.”

  303. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 12:47 pm

    “You do not pay Theo level $$$, and surrender compensation ”

    They have yet to give anything for Theo and will end up giving up a nobody prospect for him. They have been trying quick fixes for years……they hired Theo to build a complete organization that can sustain success. That’s the ultimate goal for them and it could take awhile…..if they are able to win now at the same time them that’s gravy.

  304. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 12:49 pm

    Ken_RosenthalKen Rosenthal New CBA will expand instant replay to include fair/foul and “trapped” ball plays, subject to discussions between #MLB and umpires.”

    Yay

  305. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 1:00 pm

    From ESPNNY…..

    “Thanks to his fourth-place finish in the voting, it will now cost the Yankees an extra $2 million to pick up Granderson’s option, if they so choose, for 2013. Among the provisions in the five-year, $30.25 million contract the Yankees inherited when they obtained Granderson in a three-way trade with the Tigers is that a fifth-place or better finish in the MVP voting for 2011 or 2012 would increase the cost of picking up his option from $13 million to $15 million. “

  306. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 1:00 pm

    Subjecting Trapped Balls to instant replay is severely problematic. What happens when a player feels he has caught a ball, and throws to a base to double off a runner off who has advanced, though the Ump has ruled the ball was trapped? The instant replay is viewed by the Umps showing the ball was actually caught, yet the runner that was doubled off, advanced because he saw the Ump originally ruling the catch a trap. Could get really complicated with more than 1 runner. I’m not a replay guy. Umps have and always will occasionally blow a call. That’s part of the game. You got Bud and others, (including the Umps) complaining about the length of time most games run. Replays make games longer. And don’t give me that, “we just wanta get it right” malarkey. This is an imperfect world run by imperfect carbon based entities.

  307. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 1:02 pm

    Buster_ESPNBuster Olney
    ST blood samples that will be taken in ’12 will be on non-game days; the game-day samples will be voluntary, discarded, to check reaction.

  308. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 1:07 pm

    -BLAKE-
    We will see how Theo goes about his business. I say he makes BOLD moves just as he always has. You say he goes the steady-but-slow route. I say Grasshopper, you say Ant. Time will tell.

  309. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 1:08 pm

    pat November 22nd, 2011 at 1:00 pm
    From ESPNNY…..

    “Thanks to his fourth-place finish in the voting, it will now cost the Yankees an extra $2 million to pick up Granderson’s option, if they so choose, for 2013. Among the provisions in the five-year, $30.25 million contract the Yankees inherited when they obtained Granderson in a three-way trade with the Tigers is that a fifth-place or better finish in the MVP voting
    ———–

    I’m sure that’s 2 mil the Yankees are glad to pay.

  310. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 1:12 pm

    Buster_ESPNBuster Olney
    Players pushed for tobacco policy that will go into effect: No tobacco products visible in interviews, interaction with fans.

  311. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 1:13 pm

    .” I say he makes BOLD moves just as he always has. ”

    Im not necessarily saying he won’t make bold moves……I just think if he does they will be big picture oriented and not solely focused on winning in 2012

  312. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 1:16 pm

    ESPNNYYankees: Yankees squeeze Bleacher Creatures – Yankees Blog – ESPN New York http://es.pn/sGT3zi

  313. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 1:18 pm

    WAFFLE, WAFFLE, WAFFLE. What office are you running for?

  314. GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 1:18 pm

    jimcallisBA Jim Callis
    RT @jeffpassan: Go over 5% is a 75% tax, 10-15% over, 100% tax and loss of 1st- and 2nd-rd picks. 15% and higher is 100% tax & loss of two 1st-rd picks #mlbdraft

  315. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 1:19 pm

    si_vault You asked for it (one follower, actually, but it still counts), you got it. A gallery of The Muppets and Sports: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.c.....ent.1.html

    Belive it or not, I was not the follower who asked for this ;)

  316. GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 1:21 pm

    Erin, it was you. You sent it under the name of Mrs. Bert

  317. Jerkface November 22nd, 2011 at 1:21 pm

    Holy crap, that draft tax is heavy. Why did they agree to screw the draft so hard?

  318. GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 1:22 pm

    Mrs. Bert Muppet.

  319. Bret The Hitman November 22nd, 2011 at 1:23 pm

    I’d take Figgins off Seattle’s hands for 2 million dollars to be a bench player. Adding Figgins frees up E. Nunez for a trade and Nunez has significant trade value for a bench player.

  320. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 1:23 pm

    GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 1:21 pm
    Erin, it was you. You sent it under the name of Mrs. Bert

    ******************

    :lol:

    I’ll never tell

  321. Jerkface November 22nd, 2011 at 1:24 pm

    Baseball is going to enjoy lots of 2 sport players opting for the second sport.

  322. m November 22nd, 2011 at 1:24 pm

    # pat November 22nd, 2011 at 1:02 pm

    Buster_ESPNBuster Olney
    ST blood samples that will be taken in ’12 will be on non-game days; the game-day samples will be voluntary, discarded, to check reaction

    ——————————————————–

    Reaction: Player “X” knocked sample out of my hand and said, “Get the **** outta here!”

    Is that the kind of stuff they’re looking for?
    :P

  323. GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 1:24 pm

    One way to end that draft/sign tax is for agents to convince some of the best players to bolt for Japan for a year or two on the condition they be posted.

  324. Jerkface November 22nd, 2011 at 1:25 pm

    lmao drafted players cant sign MLB deals.

  325. Jerkface November 22nd, 2011 at 1:26 pm

    ASG participation mandatory. Players must follow ‘social media policy’, so good bye to the personality on twitter.

    This CBA is mostly terrible.

  326. m November 22nd, 2011 at 1:26 pm

    Did the players association show up for these negotiations?

  327. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 1:26 pm

    I’d stick with the younger, improving Nunez. Plus, Nunez has a big power advantage over Figgins. I like Figgins, but age, power, and Nunez not having reached his ceiling makes me say no to a Figgy deal.

  328. GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 1:27 pm

    They can sign in japan before being drafted.

  329. Jerkface November 22nd, 2011 at 1:27 pm

    Did the players association show up for these negotiations?

    Might be a case of the current PA members screwing the future members because they are mad that draftees can get big bonuses.

  330. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 1:32 pm

    When you got guys like Barmes, Carroll, and Ellis getting multi yr deals for $4-$5+ Mill a year, the players union is gonna bend over backward to get a deal done.The Union is doing exactly what the Players are paying them to do. Line their pockets.

  331. m November 22nd, 2011 at 1:37 pm

    JF,

    So players aren’t allowed to rework their minor league deals?

    What multi-sport athlete is going to choose to be an indentured servant for league minimum until they are arbitration eligible?

  332. J. Alfred Prufrock November 22nd, 2011 at 1:52 pm

    Since when is Figgins SS material? I don’t see how he helps compensate for Nunez in the most important aspect of what Nunez brings.

  333. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 1:58 pm

    Is their a no end zone dancing clause in there somewhere?

  334. LGY November 22nd, 2011 at 1:58 pm

    Now we know why there was no labor strife.

    The current players did nothing to protect their future union members.

  335. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 1:59 pm

    The Gazoo helmet lives!

    BizballMauryMaury Brown
    By 2013, all Major League players will wear a new batting helmet developed by Rawlings that protects against pitches thrown at 100 MPH.

  336. austinmac November 22nd, 2011 at 2:00 pm

    Back from the hospital. Beautiful little boy. Now, grandpa needs a nap.

    I think GB’s thoughts on draft picks signing in Japan is brilliant. My only question is whether the agreement with the Japanese prohibits it.

    I like Garza and would include Romine and Betances. That is still not enough, but it is as far as I would go.

  337. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 2:01 pm

    jimcallisBAJim Callis
    By my calculations, TWENTY teams went 16% or more over slot this year, which would have triggered 100% tax & loss of two 1st-rders #mlbdraft

  338. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 2:02 pm

    Nunez’s value is as a super utility …..not as a back up SS. Figgins could cover every other positions that Nunez would play if he were traded. The issues would be 1) could you get a worthwhile return for Nunez 2) would Seattle pick up basically all of Figgins salary 3) do you believe Figgins would rebound if he got out of the land of no offense?

    Lot of ifs.

  339. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 2:02 pm

    Congrats Austinmac.

  340. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 2:06 pm

    Killer B AND Romine? Too high a price for me. I wait on Darvish. Should Darvish not be posted, I go after Wilson. My preference is to spend $$$ before giving up good,young,cheap players. I also value (L)Wilson higher than(R) Garza.

  341. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 2:07 pm

    Braun wins MVP. I think they got this one right personally

  342. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 2:08 pm

    The power issue concerning Nunez vs Figgins issa deal breaker.

  343. pkyankfan69 November 22nd, 2011 at 2:08 pm

    Have to say I am surprised with Braun over Kemp for NL MVP.

  344. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 2:09 pm

    and the winner is ryan braun

  345. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 2:10 pm

    “The power issue concerning Nunez vs Figgins issa deal breaker”

    Id rather have Nunez…..Id only consider Figgins if Nunez could be dealt for something else I wanted.

  346. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 2:11 pm

    Brauns number were close to Kemps and he did it for a playoff team. Where did Kershaw finish?……since his numbers we’re nearly the same as Verlander’s.

  347. austinmac November 22nd, 2011 at 2:13 pm

    Thanks everyone. I haven’t held a newborn for a long time. It is amazing to have a grandchild. Were it to have been a girl, I am sure my son would teach her to switch hit too.:)

  348. BJK November 22nd, 2011 at 2:14 pm

    Someone left Pujols off the ballot completely?

  349. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 2:18 pm

    So Verlander was so dominant that he just HAD to win MVP……..but yet Kershaw with basically the same numbers failed to finish in the top 10. What a joke…….

  350. LGY November 22nd, 2011 at 2:18 pm

    Is there anything in this new CBA that can be seen as a win for the players?

    Who the hell was negotiating for them? Randy Levine?

  351. J. Alfred Prufrock November 22nd, 2011 at 2:18 pm

    blake November 22nd, 2011 at 2:02 pm
    Nunez’s value is as a super utility …..not as a back up SS. Figgins could cover every other positions that Nunez would play if he were traded. The issues would be 1) could you get a worthwhile return for Nunez 2) would Seattle pick up basically all of Figgins salary 3) do you believe Figgins would rebound if he got out of the land of no offense?

    Lot of ifs.
    ///

    Right, Nunez is more than a backup SS, but that’s a critical role and the toughest to refill in this SU thing.
    ///

    I don’t even like Figgins at ALL, and especially since he can’t play short.

    One of Nunez’s most important contributions will be, not necessarily being pressed into service should Jeter/ARod go down, but keeping Jeter/ARod/Cano healthy and refreshed for October.

    Any way, the Mariners aren’t giving us Felix for Noesi/Romine/Nunez/Adams/Kontos if that’s where this stuff started. Obviously if THAT were in play, you’d live with Pena as Jeter’s backup or find someone else who sucks enough to do the job…

  352. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 2:22 pm

    pat November 22nd, 2011 at 1:59 pm
    The Gazoo helmet lives!

    ****************

    Yay!! Love the Gazoo helmet ;)

  353. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 2:28 pm

    This is actually a pretty fair deal for everyone which means there’s something in it that everyone will dislike:

    Big Market owner win: No more revenue sharing dollars going to large market teams with cheap owners. Getting to keep a larger percentage of revenue if you keep your payroll under a threshold, not having to sacrifice draft picks for every “type A” free agent

    Big Market owner loss: Penalties for flexing financial muscle in the draft and international free agent markets.

    Small Market owner win:
    Extra picks in the draft

    Higher luxury tax penalties

    Small Market owner loss:
    The cap on slotting could hurt even with the extra picks
    No more cheap owners in big markets filling their pockets with revenue sharing dollars (read Florida)
    Higher min salary for ML players
    Earlier arbitration for players with 2-3 years service time

    Player wins:
    Revamp of Type A compensation
    Higher base salary
    better arbitration awards

    Player losses
    HGH testing – which could also be considered a win from a PR stand point

    Sure the future players currently in HS and college get screwed a little – but that always happens – look at the deal the NFL struck and what Cam Newton made as the #1 pick compared to what Sam Bradford made the year before. The players will still get their money.

  354. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 2:29 pm

    “Is there anything in this new CBA that can be seen as a win for the players? ”

    ML minimum salary definitely better than COLA.

  355. Against All Odds November 22nd, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    Jerkface November 22nd, 2011 at 1:27 pm

    Did the players association show up for these negotiations?

    ——————————

    Somewhere Donald Fehr is shaking his head.

  356. Trigeminal Neuralgia Yank November 22nd, 2011 at 2:32 pm

    No pinch hit bloggers??

  357. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 2:33 pm

    Kerlander’s 2011 season has just been urinated on by the scribes.

  358. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 2:44 pm

    JackCurryYES Based on what Selig said at CBA press conf, I’d be surprised if there wasn’t a 2d wild card team in 2012.

  359. Joe from Long Island November 22nd, 2011 at 2:46 pm

    austinmac – congrats. you are blessed.

  360. tomingeorgia November 22nd, 2011 at 2:46 pm

    Next new post: Next Monday?

  361. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 2:48 pm

    Trigeminal Neuralgia Yank November 22nd, 2011 at 2:32 pm
    No pinch hit bloggers??

    ********************

    I think we’re supposed to have some, but so far they’re MIA

    I think they forgot about us. ;)

  362. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 2:48 pm

    Federal minimum wage increase in the last 10 years was 41%.

    MLB minimum wage increase in the last 10 years was 140%.

  363. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 2:53 pm

    JackCurryYESJack Curry
    Interesting CBA tidbits: 26th player will be added for some D-headers. Players will be required to play in All-Star Gm. New helmets in 2013

  364. DaSaint007 November 22nd, 2011 at 2:53 pm

    Congrats austinmac!

  365. Trigeminal Neuralgia Yank November 22nd, 2011 at 2:55 pm

    Erin / Tom ,
    It’s funny, this is my go to site for all yank info .
    All the regulars are great at updated info via the comment section. But I have no patience to scroll, so I want immediate satisfaction from the main post ;)

    I guess I’ll have to RAB . Any other suggests?

    Happy thnxgiving all, can’t wait till spring!
    Or at least a FA move will passify me.

  366. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 3:00 pm

    pat November 22nd, 2011 at 2:48 pm
    Federal minimum wage increase in the last 10 years was 41%.

    MLB minimum wage increase in the last 10 years was 140%.

    —————-

    Federal min wage is what $8.25/hr?

    MLB min wage is now $500k

    comparing professional sports’ contracts to reality is not worth the time.

  367. tomingeorgia November 22nd, 2011 at 3:00 pm

    Trigeminal,
    RAB and MLBtraderumors.

  368. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 3:01 pm

    Trigeminal- yeah, your best bet ’til Chad gets back is probably RAB

  369. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 3:04 pm

    pat November 22nd, 2011 at 2:53 pm
    JackCurryYESJack Curry
    Interesting CBA tidbits: 26th player will be added for some D-headers. Players will be required to play in All-Star Gm. New helmets in 2013

    —————–

    Since you mentioned the ASG I wish they could have done away with the stupid rule saying that the winning league gets home field advantage in the WS – it should be simple, team with the best record gets homefield. It’s not right that the mandatory additions from the Pirates and Mariners determine the rules for a series they won’t be playing in (barring a trade)

  370. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 3:09 pm

    Is it me or does the it seem like the goal of each CBA negotiation is to figure out a way to stop the Yankees. Its been that way forever…….its one reason the draft was created in the first place.

  371. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 3:10 pm

    The ASG rule will stay until Bud leaves and then the new commish will zap that first thing……

  372. djsunyc November 22nd, 2011 at 3:11 pm

    unless you have alot of money to burn…or are a super duper fan that wants to go to every game, is there any incentive for anyone to have season tickets (regardless of the sport)???

    with stubhub available, you can go to any game you want.

    and if you try to sell tickets, you may be able to make money on some marquee games but lose out on almost all the others.

    the cons definitely weighs out the pros…

    and i didn’t even mention the comfort of watching the sport in crystal clear HD at home (and possible soon to be 3D)…

  373. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 3:12 pm

    The MLBPA is and always will be concerned with coming out of any CBA with the following: No salary cap.

    Everything else is on the table. The only “players” who get negatively impacted by this CBA are future players who are not members of the union. I don’t think you’ll find too many union heads who will hold up a deal that’s good for the current members to protect future members.

    Will it impact the quality of player coming to baseball? I don’t know. I think there’s already pretty serious disinsentives to coming to baseball if you can play two sports – most notably the fact that you’re going to have to toil in the minors for at least a couple of years before reaching the majors whereas in basketball and football you’re a “major leaguer” if not a starter your first game. And regardless of what the bonus structure was – a guy was always going to make more money signing an NFL or NBA entry level contract than a MLB one. So that really doesn’t change.

    Bad organizations like the Pirates might lose a guy who has a college commitment because they can’t overpay him, but that’s really the only impact you’re going to see. And as we’ve seen, unlimited bonuses don’t automatically mean that a player is going to forgo college to sign with a pro team (Gerrit Cole)

  374. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 3:17 pm

    “Will it impact the quality of player coming to baseball? I don’t know. I think there’s already pretty serious disinsentives to coming to baseball if you can play two sports – most notably the fact that you’re going to have to toil in the minors for at least a couple of years before reaching the majors whereas in basketball and football you’re a “major leaguer” ”

    True but once you actually get to the bigs its pretty nice…..guaranteed contracts……you make the most money…..and you can play for a long time.

    Why anybody would want to be an NFL running back is beyond me…..they can cut you at any time and your professional lifespan is like 3 or 4 years.

  375. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 3:17 pm

    “comparing professional sports’ contracts to reality is not worth the time.”

    Real dollars would be crazy to compare but % increase is a more fair comparison.

    140% increase in the 10 years in reality would be the equivalent of a starting teachers salary being $30K in 2002 and $72K in 2012.

  376. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 3:20 pm

    blake November 22nd, 2011 at 3:09 pm
    Is it me or does the it seem like the goal of each CBA negotiation is to figure out a way to stop the Yankees. Its been that way forever…….its one reason the draft was created in the first place.

    ———————-

    Not just the Yankees – but the top level revenue teams (of which the Yankees are the highest) yes.

    It’s about trying to create an even playing field among organizations that are completely uneven. The Yankees will always have more money than the Royals and New York will (to most players) be a more desirable destination than Kansas City, so the other owners want to set things up so that the Yankees or Red Sox or Angels or Phillies can’t just go out and sign every player…I get that part of it. It’s not right, and I hate people saying that it has worked in the NFL – no it hasn’t. All the NFL has done is make the entire league mediocre instead of letting some teams be elite.

    The issue I have isn’t the design to take down the big market team, it’s the fact that a lot of it is also designed to protect the small market team from himself – draft slotting for example. Think about the angst going through the Nationals’ owners box when Strasburg blew out his elbow – the amount of money he had tied up in him to sign him as a first round pick and it might have been for nothing.

    What I will give credit to this CBA for is that it spreads the screw evenly among the small and large revenue owners. Small market owners now have to pay more for players making the minimum, arbitration years come sooner, they don’t get draft picks for their own free agents unless it’s a top level guy who gets more than $12 mil/year (which means I think you’re going to see a lot of guys sign for an AAV of $11.9 mil) and what’s better – it really screws the owner of a team in a major market who is content to spend nothing and collect revenue sharing dollars…you hear me Jeff Loria…yeah I’m looking at you pal!

  377. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 3:20 pm

    The truly elite athletes should want to play baseball because they can make the most money and they can play the longest……

  378. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 3:22 pm

    blake November 22nd, 2011 at 3:17 pm
    “Will it impact the quality of player coming to baseball? I don’t know. I think there’s already pretty serious disinsentives to coming to baseball if you can play two sports – most notably the fact that you’re going to have to toil in the minors for at least a couple of years before reaching the majors whereas in basketball and football you’re a “major leaguer” ”

    True but once you actually get to the bigs its pretty nice…..guaranteed contracts……you make the most money…..and you can play for a long time.

    Why anybody would want to be an NFL running back is beyond me…..they can cut you at any time and your professional lifespan is like 3 or 4 years.

    ——————

    Yeah but it’s all about the instant reward vs. the potential of never making it. For example, you think Drew Henson wishes he had passed on the Yankees to stick to football?

  379. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 3:25 pm

    JackCurryYES Michael Weiner said negotiations on HGH blood testing “wasn’t that difficult.” He said players “wanted a level playing field.”

  380. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 3:25 pm

    “Yeah but it’s all about the instant reward vs. the potential of never making it. For example, you think Drew Henson wishes he had passed on the Yankees to stick to football?”

    Eh he wasn’t very good at either……I agree about the potential vs the more sure thing though……getting to the big leagues is a long hard road…….baseball is the hardest game to become great at and then sustain it IMO….besides maybe NFL quarterback.

  381. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 3:26 pm

    Henson left $12 mil on the table when he walked away from baseball (upon realizing he was never going to make it). But had he stuck to football all along he likely would have been a high enough draft pick at QB to make that in his first signing bonus. And he would have been on the big stage right out of the gate, not toiling infront of 6,000 fans in Tampa, Norwich and Columbus.

  382. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 3:26 pm

    Players are required to play in All-Star game?………….. Or else what? Sounds lke MLB Negotiators saw the direction negotiations were going, and just started adding every nit-picking issue they could think of. NO player should be FORCED to play in the All-Star game. The owners are gonna find out that they do not want important dinged-upped players with big guaranteed contracts being put at risk to play inna exhibition game.

  383. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 3:29 pm

    Chip,

    Making it as a QB in the NFL might ne the hardest thing to do in sports……that was no guarantee either.

  384. djsunyc November 22nd, 2011 at 3:30 pm

    to play inna exhibition game.

    ————

    it’s not an exhibition game. the result of the game impacts the amount of $$$’s one can make in the world series.

  385. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 3:30 pm

    Blake -

    At the very least Henson would have been a Matt Leinart/Brady Quinn – each of whom made serious money by the sheer virtue of being first round picks and don’t have to ride a bus except to get from the 5 star team hotel to the stadium on Sunday mornings.

  386. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 3:32 pm

    SI_JonHeyman 3 mins If goal is competitive balance, pitt, kc, wash shd spend on draft. Hopefully, taxation system won’t restrain them 2 much

    SI_JonHeyman 9 mins concerned about new tax system discouraging pitt, kc, wash from spending on draft. Those 3 were wisely spending decent draft $

    Agree…….the small market teams had started paying over slot……this may prevent them from doing so.

  387. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 3:33 pm

    blake November 22nd, 2011 at 3:29 pm
    Chip,

    Making it as a QB in the NFL might ne the hardest thing to do in sports……that was no guarantee either.

    —————-

    You’re right – but again it’s the minor league thing – “prospects” see their careers derail in small towns, riding busses, staying in cheap hotels. NFL players never have to put up with that. Granted, when you retire from MLB you can still walk and go on to live a productive life since your brains are not turned to goo.

  388. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 3:34 pm

    blake November 22nd, 2011 at 3:32 pm
    SI_JonHeyman 3 mins If goal is competitive balance, pitt, kc, wash shd spend on draft. Hopefully, taxation system won’t restrain them 2 much

    SI_JonHeyman 9 mins concerned about new tax system discouraging pitt, kc, wash from spending on draft. Those 3 were wisely spending decent draft $

    Agree…….the small market teams had started paying over slot……this may prevent them from doing so.

    —————-

    Especially since they’re going to be given extra picks.

    That’s the other part of this they screwed up – you still can’t trade draft picks.

  389. Nick in SF November 22nd, 2011 at 3:34 pm

    Is there anything in the CBA which would preclude the Yankees from just buying all of, say, Taiwan?

  390. m November 22nd, 2011 at 3:35 pm

    Over the next few years, independent leagues might become more popular for some of the better players.

  391. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 3:36 pm

    With the $$$ MLB players are now making, the World Series shares are chump change.

  392. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 3:39 pm

    Chip,

    True…..I think in his case though the chances of him making it as a baseball player were greater than sticking as a QB. You only have to be a good player in the bigs to make as much money as the very elite in the NFL make.

  393. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 3:42 pm

    Could be the guy just wanted to be a professional baseball player. NOT everything boils down to $$$$. There are still people in this world that prefer doing what they Enjoy vs the green back.

  394. Joe from Long Island November 22nd, 2011 at 3:42 pm

    RAB has a nice review of the new CBA. And, I agree, it looks like a fair deal for everyone except players coming down the road. They will have an artificial ceiling on their earnings. If someone who is really good, and has an option to go to college, and maybe play another sport – football or basketball, they will.

  395. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 3:48 pm

    RAB has a great summary of the new CBA.

    The international stuff and taking draft picks away for paying over slot is really concerning. The draft is going to be super boring now ………so much for trying to market that puppy.

  396. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 3:50 pm

    Pretty much nobody is going to pay over slot now…….if a team really wants a guy maybe they’d push a little …….but I can’t we’d anybody going far enough over so as to risk losing their first rounder the next year unless its just an extreme case.

  397. m November 22nd, 2011 at 3:50 pm

    Anyone with the choice of going to the NFL with a shot at being a QB will choose that over baseball anyway. Within 3 years, they’ll know if they will stick or not. A position player would know in even less time. They could go play in an independent league at that point, and eventually make their way. Might beat selling insurance. (not that there’s anything wrong with selling insurance.)

  398. m November 22nd, 2011 at 3:54 pm

    Sorry, make that *skill* players would know in even less time. Too much baseball on my mind!

  399. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 3:56 pm

    $$$ Vlaue of The Pachinko Kid just went up appreciably.

  400. m November 22nd, 2011 at 3:56 pm

    So, AJ can’t carry his tin of tobacco in his pocket and Joba will be limited in his tweeting.

    Can anyone argue this CBA isn’t an Anti-Yankee-A?!

    :mad:

  401. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 4:00 pm

    Throat sugery for Mo?

    http://www.nypost.com/p/blogs/.....um=twitter

  402. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 4:04 pm

    pat November 22nd, 2011 at 4:00 pm
    Throat sugery for Mo?

    http://www.nypost.com/p/blogs/…..um=twitter

    ********************

    :( Poor Mo

    I guess the good news is it’s not arm related

  403. GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 4:04 pm

    Catcher’s Day, Part !! (JR Murphy), from Josh Norris

    http://minormatterstrenton.blo.....urphy.html

  404. DONNYBROOK November 22nd, 2011 at 4:07 pm

    Mo needs to get in touch with Joe Buck. He was sounding progressively worse, and his Dr. got him sounding as horrible as usual.

  405. Chip November 22nd, 2011 at 4:11 pm

    m November 22nd, 2011 at 3:35 pm
    Over the next few years, independent leagues might become more popular for some of the better players.

    ————–

    I don’t know – I think once-in-a-while you’ll see the JD Drew scenario play out – but more likely the kids who don’t like where they’re picked or what they’re offered will just go to college (or go back to college) rather than play in indy ball.

    Two reasons:

    1. Indy ball is like a scaled down version of the minor leagues, smaller crowds, often accomodations that are just as poor.

    2. Exposure. If you play in a big time program you’re going to get some ESPN love, the scouting sites spend much more time focused on NCAA programs than they do the Indy leagues.

    You might lose a couple of guys to Japan, but as I understand it the Japanese league would require them to go through the posting process just like they do their own players.

  406. pat November 22nd, 2011 at 4:12 pm

    Doing Work

    RickyRo24Ricky Romero
    300 yard shuttles for conditioning in under a minute 3x got me today!!! How u feeling @PhilHughes65 ???

  407. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 4:14 pm

    DRob30 So proud of all the people who r working so hard to rebuild tuscaloosa. Check out one of the beautiful new homes! http://yfrog.com/ntat4kqj

  408. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 4:20 pm

    DRob30 here is another one built with help from #highsocksforhope http://yfrog.com/nuj63ewj

  409. GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 4:20 pm

    Guest bloggers don’t usually start until after the first of the year.

  410. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 4:23 pm

    Ricky Romero is very underrated…..good pitcher.

  411. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 4:26 pm

    SI_JonHeyman 43 mins From team to team, draft pool threshholds range from $11.5M to $4.5M. Mlb people suggest it will only level off draft spending

  412. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 4:30 pm

    GB-he meant the guys who are supposed to be filling in for Chad this week.

  413. GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 4:34 pm

    Apparently Ricky Romero and Phil Hughes are in the same workout program.

    RickyRo24 Ricky Romero
    300 yard shuttles for conditioning in under a minute 3x got me today!!! How u feeling @PhilHughes65 ???

  414. GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 4:36 pm

    Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 4:30 pm
    GB-he meant the guys who are supposed to be filling in for Chad this week.

    ————————————————————————————————————————-

    Not sure the guest bloggers wouldn’t be better than the fill-ins.

  415. Erin November 22nd, 2011 at 4:36 pm

    GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 4:36 pm

    Not sure the guest bloggers wouldn?t be better than the fill-ins.

    ***********************

    Fair point. ;)

  416. GreenBeret7 November 22nd, 2011 at 4:37 pm

    looks like pat beat ricky Romero’s speed times, too.

  417. Giuseppe Franco November 22nd, 2011 at 4:40 pm

    I really wish I had the time (and cold hard cash) to join Athletes’ Performance myself. That would be awesome.

    I’ve got to train for my own baseball season starting in May.

  418. Baseball Mogul November 22nd, 2011 at 4:43 pm

    Maybe Romero can show Hughes how to throw a change up while he’s at it.

  419. Joe from Long Island November 22nd, 2011 at 4:46 pm

    Best luck to Mo.

    GB – thanks for the link about JR Murphy.

    We’ll see how the draft business plays out, and hope they can amend the Basic Agreement to iron out the rough spots. Overrall, I don’t like ceilings/limits on anything.

    GF – what league are you playing in?

  420. m November 22nd, 2011 at 5:00 pm

    This is from yesterday, so I guess it’s still appropriate. ;)

    Funny stuff from RAB, text “chats” with the FO guys.

    This was my fave:

    Me: I hear the Braves are interested in trading for Eduardo Nunez.
    Cashman: i kno lmao

  421. Giuseppe Franco November 22nd, 2011 at 5:01 pm

    Joe from Long Island November 22nd, 2011 at 4:46 pm

    GF – what league are you playing in?

    ——-

    It’s just a local summer baseball league. I played a few games last season when my brother-in-law’s team was a man short and would’ve had to forfeit otherwise. So he recruited me. Prior to that, I hadn’t seen live pitching in about 20 years.

    My goal was simple – don’t embarrass myself. And surprisingly, I did okay.

    So now I’m readying myself for a full season next year – about 35 games. It’s something to “train” for and to keep me motivated all winter.

    Really looking forward to it. I feel like I’m in high school again.

  422. m November 22nd, 2011 at 5:01 pm

    http://riveraveblues.com/2011/.....ees-59574/

  423. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 5:05 pm

    Jim Callis @jimcallisBA

    By my calculations,TWENTY teams went 16% or more over slot this year,which would have triggered 100% tax & loss of two 1st-rders #mlbdraft

    Yikes.

  424. Eroc November 22nd, 2011 at 5:09 pm

    Basically, they did whatever they could to screw the big market teams in the new CBA, short of adding a salary cap.

  425. Joe from Long Island November 22nd, 2011 at 5:12 pm

    GF – I’m envious. I’m a lousy ballplayer, ;)

    blake – not surprised by that callis tweet. The goal of owners is to keep more money in their own pockets. It’s why I think the MLBPA sold off the players of the future. It’s an easy thing for them to do, those future players aren’t current PA members. The game as a whole will suffer unless it’s fixed.

  426. ZMAN November 22nd, 2011 at 5:14 pm

    Yay… we get to watch the Yankees take more Cito Culvers in the early rounds…

    Yanks should have known this was coming and taken more risks/signability/high ceiling guys in the draft the last 2 years. Now their opportunity is over and they can take as many Cito Culvers and cheap signing guys as they want….

    Perhaps Cole and Brackman scared them off. Either way, now its pretty much all cheap guys.

  427. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 5:24 pm

    M,

    That’s funny :)

    Joe,

    Yea im surprised the Players association gave so much in that area……hope it doesn’t affect the quality of the game in the future.

  428. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 5:26 pm

    Axisa can be really funny……..he reminds me of Pete abe except that he is you know….a yankee fan.

  429. Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2011 at 5:30 pm

    prufrock – I don’t know why you think I’m attacking you. Well… I do.. you ahve no way of answering a simple question and you’re squirming.

    Don’t come at me and tell me that my method of evaluating defense is flawed when you can’t explain to me which of 2 outfielders what better this season. I’m not asking you to use any stats, use your own method to explain to me why Granderson missed more plays than Ellsbury this year.

    You can’t do that, so your “method” is a bad joke.

  430. jacksquat November 22nd, 2011 at 5:35 pm

    So basically the draft taxes made it a defacto hard slotting system, because I can’t see anyone losing draft picks to go over slot.

  431. RS November 22nd, 2011 at 5:39 pm

    “By my calculations,TWENTY teams went 16% or more over slot this year,which would have triggered 100% tax & loss of two 1st-rders #mlbdraft”

    How about if every team goes overslot…then it’s like the first round never happened

  432. Joe from Long Island November 22nd, 2011 at 5:44 pm

    How about if every team goes overslot?then it?s like the first round never happened

    Just say NO to the slot!

  433. Tom in N.J. November 22nd, 2011 at 5:45 pm

    Oddly enough, if Jacoby Ellsbury made this catch he may have won the MVP.

    http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play......8;c_id=mlb

  434. Tom in N.J. November 22nd, 2011 at 5:46 pm

    Here’s Granderson showing Ellsbury how it’s done.

    http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play......8;c_id=mlb

  435. Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2011 at 5:47 pm

    thanks tom, 2 plays out of 162 games, very helpful.

  436. Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2011 at 5:48 pm

    tom – but, at least you can come forward with something other than “i watch granderson and he’s better”…

  437. Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2011 at 5:52 pm

    This is from a ML scout:

    “The best asset he possesses is his well above-average speed, which enables him to correct initial mistakes with reads and routes, and his ability to go all out to make a play.

    He does not react well off the bat, almost as if he has a depth perception problem, which really shows up on hard line drives at him, which is a difficult play for most, and hard to practice. Having help in left, he will cheat his positioning, yet he still gets burned, as he will play too shallow or too deep. There seems to be no happy medium.”

  438. Tom in N.J. November 22nd, 2011 at 5:56 pm

    ID, All kidding aside, I have know idea if Ellsbury is a better OF’er than Granderson. Or vice versa. I don’t watch the Sox.

  439. ZMAN November 22nd, 2011 at 6:00 pm

    JeffPassan
    One more incentive to not exceed draft cap: The 1st-round picks forfeited by those that do get tossed into a lottery for those that didn’t.

  440. Against All Odds November 22nd, 2011 at 6:15 pm

    Smh I don’t like the new CBA at all

  441. totus44 November 27th, 2011 at 2:06 am

    ellsbury before granderson? not sure how any sox player could be in the top 10 given their late season collapse. how was that ‘most valuable’ to his team, let alone among the rest of the al? you have a strange perception of ‘value’.

  442. Free Download August 22nd, 2014 at 8:18 am

    Anyone essentially produce very seriously articles or blog posts I would personally declare. This is the very first time My partner and i visited your site webpage and so much? We astonished with all the research you made to make this actual organize incredible. Great task!

  443. Siobhan Prinkey August 22nd, 2014 at 10:07 pm

    September 9th, 2008 at 9:21 pm

  444. Curt Hardister September 1st, 2014 at 2:34 am

    You have got an intriguing acquire. I like it! Wonderful post!

Leave a comment below


Sponsored by:
 

Search

    Advertisement

    Follow

    Mobile

    Read The LoHud Yankees Blog on the go by navigating to the blog on your smartphone or mobile device's browser. No apps or downloads are required.

Advertisement

Place an ad

Call (914) 694-3581