The LoHud Yankees Blog

A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Surgery for Mariano?/bleacher tickets going up

Posted by: Brian Heyman - Posted in Misc on Nov 22, 2011 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

This has nothing to do with Mariano Rivera’s arm. Anthony McCarron of the Daily News and Barbara Barker of Newsday both reported on Twitter that the Yankees’ closer said at a charity function today that his vocal cords have been issue for a month, that the problem is making it difficult for him to talk and that he could need surgery.

Rivera plans to consult with a specialist early next week.

In other Yankees news, the team announced its plan for 2012 ticket costs today. The price of watching a game from the bleachers, for those of you who want an unobscured view, will be rising $5. But overall the cost of more than 70 percent of the tickets will be remaining the same or are going to be cut. Field level outfield seats along fair territory will be reduced from $10 to $35. The Yankees say almost a third of the seats in the house for next season will run $30 or less. And the rest …

Anyway here’s a link to a yankees.com story that reviews the specifics, including info on their new nine- and 12-game ticket plans: http://atmlb.com/vqc6CY

Comments

comments

 

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623 Responses to “Surgery for Mariano?/bleacher tickets going up”

  1. Nick in SF November 22nd, 2011 at 6:23 pm

    Was Bald Vinny priced out?

  2. Red Robin November 22nd, 2011 at 6:27 pm

    ” Surgery for Mariano ”

    Sensationalized headline . Little substance .

    You and Yahoo! have a lot in common .

  3. m November 22nd, 2011 at 6:29 pm

    Baldy Vinny opted out.

  4. m November 22nd, 2011 at 6:34 pm

    Oops.

    Bald Vinny.

    Speaking of baldy. Anyone see the picture of Weiner & Selig ass-slapping over the new CBA? Weiner has a huge bald spot and a forehead full of curly bangs. Man needs a makeover.

  5. Pat M. November 22nd, 2011 at 6:44 pm

    Mr Franco……Getting into a winter fitness program for the 2012 season ???? Pilate’s or Yoga ??? I tried Yoga in January 1973 a month before camp opened, that sh*t almost killed me…..Here I am 38 years later and now I have to do yoga starting next week…..

  6. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 6:52 pm

    Pat M,

    How are you? Any rumblings in the baseball underground?

  7. joeman November 22nd, 2011 at 7:09 pm

    if Garza can be had…I’m putting Gardner in a package for him

  8. Gary November 22nd, 2011 at 7:16 pm

    Hope it’s nothing, but issues with voice and the throat can often become something more significant. Doing the right thing getting it addressed and from what I know he’s not one of these dummies cramming in smokless tobacco and puffing on tons of cigarettes.

    Blake doesn’t seem to be rummblings from anywhere. I did hear that more damaging alegations came out on the PSU thing today.

  9. Nick in SF November 22nd, 2011 at 7:16 pm

    Gardner in a package? That’ll be the day!

    Pat M, intriguing showdown tonight between the Cal Bears and the Missouri Tigers, both teams riding blowout wins last night and easily covering 6/4.5 point spreads. I got Cal +2.5 earlier, they’re now at +1.5 on my book. Maybe you can do better.

    Go Bears!

  10. joeman November 22nd, 2011 at 7:17 pm

    Nick in SF November 22nd, 2011 at 7:16 pm
    Gardner in a package? That’ll be the day
    ——————
    meaning ?

  11. LGY November 22nd, 2011 at 7:19 pm

    @LoMoMarlins: The Social Media clause in the new CBA is calld the LoMo Act & will b met w/ the same outrage as the Volstad act #ImKidding #BoardwalkEmpire

  12. Nick in SF November 22nd, 2011 at 7:23 pm

    Meaning the same thing that John Wayne meant when he said it in the Searchers and Buddy Holly meant in the song “That’ll Be The Day”.

  13. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 7:29 pm

    “I did hear that more damaging alegations came out on the PSU thing today”

    Yea sounds like…..hits keep on coming ….c

  14. LGY November 22nd, 2011 at 7:30 pm

    if Garza can be had…I’m putting Gardner in a package for him

    ——-

    I think it’s more fun if you tell us who you wouldn’t trade Gardner for.

  15. m November 22nd, 2011 at 7:31 pm

    joeman,

    You continue to find new and creative ways to ship Gardner out!

    In theory it is a good idea. I hope it doesn’t happen…and it most likely won’t. I’ve heard the Yankees absolutely LOVE Gardner.

  16. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 7:36 pm

    The Nats would like Gardner……

  17. Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2011 at 7:45 pm

    There isn’t a team in baseball that Gardner wouldn’t upgrade one of their 3 OF positions.

  18. raymagnetic November 22nd, 2011 at 7:53 pm

    Wait, what??!?!?

    Surely you mean defensively. 700 ops corner outfielders are a dime a dizen

  19. raymagnetic November 22nd, 2011 at 7:53 pm

    dozen

  20. Irreverent Discourse November 22nd, 2011 at 7:54 pm

    I mean as a whole. I don’t look at just offense or just defense from any player.

  21. m November 22nd, 2011 at 7:58 pm

    Yes, they are a dime a dozen.

    But, Gardner is still developing. And he is perfect for this team. He’s young, speedy, and a good defender. He’s still learning at the plate, but he has an exceptional eye. For a team that is one of the older teams with a lot of power, he’s a great complimentary player.

  22. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 8:02 pm

    I was trying to come up with a team that would discredit ID’s statement…….can’t really think of one.

  23. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 8:03 pm

    Closest might be Texas or Arizona or the brewers

  24. Duh Innings November 22nd, 2011 at 8:04 pm

    $20 isn’t bad considering the usual price for a ticket in a Manhattan movie theater is $13.

    I’d rather spend $20 to watch a Yankees game than $13 watch a movie, but that’s just me.

    Movie admission is cost-prohibitive to me. Why on Earth would I pay $13 to see a movie I could own on dvd for less, the same, or slightly more? To see it on a bigscreen? Big deal.

    At least with taking in a game from the bleachers I could catch a homerun ball or a ball Swish tosses into the stands if his putout ends the inning. I get to see him do his customary acknowledgement of the Bleacher Creatures when he takes his position to start the game and occasional turn around if someone catches his ear. I’m outdoors (sun out or not) surrounded by friends and the best fans on Earth. I have at least one vivid memory of every game I’ve ever attended so I’m buying at least one a game.

  25. raymagnetic November 22nd, 2011 at 8:09 pm

    Gardner is what he is. A mediocre offensive player who plays good defense.

    I won’t knock him though.

  26. m November 22nd, 2011 at 8:27 pm

    Defensively, the Yankees were second only to Arizona. And it was negligibly close.

  27. m November 22nd, 2011 at 8:28 pm

    Sorry, about that. That’s outfield defense.

  28. Nilsson November 22nd, 2011 at 8:38 pm

    No salary cap and no tobacco ban. As long as players’ union got those two things, everything else is negotiable. And thus labor peace in major league baseball.

  29. Pat M. November 22nd, 2011 at 8:41 pm

    Nick in SF……Cal + 1.5 / Michigan + 6.5 ( Duke ) UCLA + 8.5 ( Kansas ) I also played UCLA on the $ line ( 345.00 )…..All are 50.00 wagers…

  30. RMS November 22nd, 2011 at 9:13 pm

    But, Gardner is still developing. And he is perfect for this team. He’s young, speedy, and a good defender. He’s still learning at the plate, but he has an exceptional eye. For a team that is one of the older teams with a lot of power, he’s a great complimentary player.
    ——————————————————————————————–
    Still developing? A great eye? I agree, he is fast and plays great defense. But he has no power and needs to learn how to bunt. At times he does take too many first pitches for strikes.

  31. RadioKev November 22nd, 2011 at 9:27 pm

    Still developing? A great eye? I agree, he is fast and plays great defense. But he has no power and needs to learn how to bunt. At times he does take too many first pitches for strikes.
    —————

    I love Gardners approach. He’s not usually going to punish the ball, so why be over aggressive? Take the first pitch and see where it goes from there. It’s a good thing if Gardner works a walk.

  32. CompassRosy November 22nd, 2011 at 9:39 pm

    “Since you mentioned the ASG I wish they could have done away with the stupid rule saying that the winning league gets home field advantage in the WS – it should be simple, team with the best record gets homefield. It’s not right that the mandatory additions from the Pirates and Mariners determine the rules for a series they won’t be playing in (barring a trade)”
    =============

    While I agree that HFA for the WS being tied to the results of an exhibition game is pretty silly, I think teams with “mandatory” All Stars usually only have one. The M’s had three All Stars last season (Felix, League and Pineda) and, while the overall team sucked, I’m thinking those three made it purely on merit ;-)

    ___________________________

    “The international stuff and taking draft picks away for paying over slot is really concerning.”
    =============

    Yeah, I haven’t read the details but, the M’s have been reliant on International signings in recent years and sounds like things got a bit more difficult…

    shannondrayer
    Wow. New international draft signing changes in the CBA not good for the Mariners! #nosirdontlikeit

  33. Carlo November 22nd, 2011 at 9:49 pm

    Agree that even at $20 a game the bleacher ticket is one of the best entertainment values in NYC. Here however are the problems:

    1 – ticket prices for bleacher sections are up 66% since 2009 (25% last year and 33% this year)
    2 – if ur in RF u have to endure that mush swisher and his theatrics

  34. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 10:09 pm

    The new draft and international rules will affect all teams….maybe the big market teams a little more but the money advantage was already being marginalized in the draft by more teams paying over slot…..now nobody will.

    The bigger issue is whether or not the restrictions on spending will start to push elite athletes towards other sports in both this country and internationally…..thus watering down the level of future play.

    The good news is that the agreement is only for 5 years…..if they notice that trend they’ll have to adjust again.

  35. Nick in SF November 22nd, 2011 at 10:12 pm

    Don’t knock the wee bairn Gardy.

    The lad is still learning the game. He will turn 28 in the very same year the Yanks will win their 28th title.

  36. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 10:16 pm

    Gardner’s biggest issue offensively is the inconsistency…..he can be a dynamic player when he’s getting on base at a .380 or so clip……the problem is that he’s not always that guy and has been prone to pretty prolonged funks……it’s still TBD if this can be attributed to growing pains….or if that’s just who he is as a player.

    The Yanks probably need to decide which they believe in the next year….(Maybe Gardy will make it obvious with his play)…..but he’s inching closer to 30 and he’s going to start making real money soon as well….so they need to decide if he’s a long term option…..or if not whether they should sell on him while his value is maybe highest.

  37. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 10:21 pm

    Buster Olney
    @Buster_ESPN
    The Angels have intensified their search for a catcher.

  38. Jerzz November 22nd, 2011 at 10:23 pm

    Cervelli, Romine+ for E. Santana….

  39. LGY November 22nd, 2011 at 10:25 pm

    Buster Olney
    @Buster_ESPN
    The Angels have intensified their search for a catcher.

    ——-

    Why are they doing that? Napoli is one of the best catchers in the game…

    Oops.

  40. m November 22nd, 2011 at 10:26 pm

    I doubt that Gardner is in any long term plans for the Yankees.

    But I also doubt he is traded. The Yankees don’t have any glaring holes, and we kinda sorta need an athletic outfielder. Why not one of the best (and cheapest)? At best, Gardner would be a throw in, so he might have more value than us.

    RAB did a thing on Gardner being a candidate for an extension to buy out his arb years. I don’t think the Yankees need to. He doesn’t hit for enough power to cost the Yankees if they go to arbitration.

    Here’s a made up award from a Fangraphs contributor. Guess who won?

    http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs.....s-of-2011/

  41. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 10:27 pm

    They could trade Haren for Napoli

  42. m November 22nd, 2011 at 10:27 pm

    OOOhhhh!!!! GIVE THEM MARTAIN!!!!!! Tell him he can live in Ontario….California.

  43. Nick in SF November 22nd, 2011 at 10:28 pm

    The wee bairn Gardy will nae give up his pinstripes lightly.

  44. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 10:29 pm

    “RAB did a thing on Gardner being a candidate for an extension to buy out his arb years. I don’t think the Yankees need to. He doesn’t hit for enough power to cost the Yankees if they go to arbitration.”

    Yea I agree…I see very little reason to consider doing that

  45. m November 22nd, 2011 at 10:30 pm

    You know. For all the grief the Yankees (and Martin) get re: their catching situation, we are sitting pretty. Look around the league. There aren’t a lot of elite catchers. One day, our catching cache will be in full bloom. Kudos to Cashman for building up the #1 farm system stacked with catching talent. And for signing Martin to bridge the interim.

  46. m November 22nd, 2011 at 10:32 pm

    Raise your hand if you want to see another year of Varitek.

  47. blake November 22nd, 2011 at 10:34 pm

    m November 22nd, 2011 at 10:32 pm
    Raise your hand if you want to see another year of Varitek.”

    I like watching him stink and the Sox having to play him every 5th day because of Beckett…

  48. LGY November 22nd, 2011 at 10:46 pm

    Interesting article about Dan Lozano and how some baseball agents operate.

    http://m.deadspin.com/5861982/

  49. LGY November 22nd, 2011 at 10:52 pm

    Was this posted already? It should keep Bret the Hitman going for at least a week.

    “The New York Yankees have been reluctant to move top pitching prospects Manny Banuelos and Dellin Betances for all the right reasons. However, if Oakland shops southpaw Gio Gonzalez, who has one of the best left-handed breaking balls in the AL, Yankees general manager Brian Cashman will adjust and include at least one of the two in the right package. Cashman is also pursuing Jair Jurrjens from the Braves, dangling shortstop Eduardo Nunez , but so far will not give up either Banuelos or Betances for Jurrjens.”

  50. Pat M. November 22nd, 2011 at 10:56 pm

    This has all the makings for a memorable bad night for me in College hoops…….Looking at a 0-4′er right in the eyes …..Bruins in Ruins right now

  51. RadioKev November 22nd, 2011 at 10:59 pm

    I think it would be reasonable to give up Betances and others for Gio Gonzalez. Do we honestly think it’s likely that Betances will become better than Gio Gonzalez? I’m not knocking the guy, I just don’t think he’s a lock for that type of quality.

  52. Nick in SF November 22nd, 2011 at 11:07 pm

    Hopefully important lessons will be learned. :oops:

  53. yanks 27 November 22nd, 2011 at 11:07 pm

    “I think it would be reasonable to give up Betances and others for Gio Gonzalez. Do we honestly think it’s likely that Betances will become better than Gio Gonzalez?”

    Guy has a career 4.23 ERA outside the spacious confines of OAK. Pitching most of his games in Camden Yards, Fenway, Rogers Center, etc. will not be friendly to him.

    Betances can easily put up better than a 4.23 ERA with his stuff

  54. Pat M. November 22nd, 2011 at 11:13 pm

    Nick in SF…..Can’t be gun shy !!!!

  55. Nick in SF November 22nd, 2011 at 11:15 pm

    Not too shy, I’m taking Cal -4 2H. #fingerscrossed

  56. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 11:16 pm

    LGY, source?

  57. LGY November 22nd, 2011 at 11:18 pm

    Fem

    http://insider.espn.go.com/blo.....jim-bowden

  58. yankeefeminista November 22nd, 2011 at 11:19 pm

    LGY, thanks.

  59. Nick in SF November 22nd, 2011 at 11:21 pm

    Which one to keep? Which one to trade away? #cashmanschoice

  60. Giuseppe Franco November 22nd, 2011 at 11:30 pm

    Pat M. November 22nd, 2011 at 6:44 pm

    Mr Franco……Getting into a winter fitness program for the 2012 season ???? Pilate’s or Yoga ??? I tried Yoga in January 1973 a month before camp opened, that sh*t almost killed me…..Here I am 38 years later and now I have to do yoga starting next week…..

    ———

    Pat M,

    Sorry for the late response. Happy Holidays to you and Mrs. Pat.

    I’m doing a lot of lifting these days as well as focusing on my core. I’ve never tried yoga (good luck with that), but I do pilates pretty regularly.

    Not a big fan of pilates (I’m guaranteed to be the only dude in the class) but it does help and I’ve seen some significant gains in a rather short amount of time.

    The local YMCA offer classes a few times a week so I try to go to those classes in the evening in addition to my normal routine at another gym in the AM.

    The guys that play in my summer league have been playing together for several years, so they’ve had a lot more practice than me.

    And get this….their team name is the Red Sox!!!!! ARGH!!!!!!

    So I told my brother-in-law that I had no intention of wearing any Red Sox gear and insisted that I wear my Yankee cap and shirt instead.

    The team wasn’t crazy about it, but it was either that or they forfeit.

    This Yankee fan isn’t going to wear any RS rags. Some of us have morals.

  61. Against All Odds November 22nd, 2011 at 11:42 pm

    The bigger issue is whether or not the restrictions on spending will start to push elite athletes towards other sports in both this country and internationally…..thus watering down the level of future play.

    —————————————–

    Isn’t the idea to encourage young children that baseball to pursue their dream of making it to the show. SMH why drive children away from the game

  62. CompassRosy November 23rd, 2011 at 1:40 am

    “The new draft and international rules will affect all teams….”
    ============

    And, according to this…
    http://tinyurl.com/7zn585u

    some moreso than others.

  63. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 7:14 am

    I would trade Betances for Gio……he has some warts but he’s roughly the same age as Betances is (just a year ir so difference) …..and he’s already an established LH big league pitcher.

    Yes the ballpark he’s pitched in has helped……yes the walk rate is concerning……but let’s remember that he’s cheaply controlled for 4 more years and he’s probably nit a finished product. Command…..especially for lefties is sometimes the last thing to develop.

    Ill always take the establishes big league pitcher with warts over the guy still in AAA with some warts……especially if the are around the same age and the big leaguer has multiple years of control.

  64. RadioKev November 23rd, 2011 at 7:18 am

    Yeah Blake. We all know Betances has good stuff, but so does Gio. I’d play it by the book on that one and trade up for the big league talent. I would still hold onto Banuelos, though.

  65. Mike Ri November 23rd, 2011 at 7:20 am

    I too would trade Betances for Gio.

  66. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 7:30 am

    Radiokev,

    I wouldn’t include Banuelos either……but I don’t view him and Betances as equivalent prospects……I know some do and that’s fine…….maybe Betances does have an equal or higher ceiling……but from the age, to delivery, to everything else I think Manny is much more likely to hit his barring injury.

  67. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 7:34 am

    Having said all that…….if I could get a guy like Danks for a year and keep Betances and all my top end guys……then Id still probably prefer that. I think Beane would demand Montero for Gio….

  68. Baseball Mogul November 23rd, 2011 at 7:40 am

    If Beane wants a Haren-like return (CarGo plus an arm) and has reportedly asked for LoMo or Stanton, then he’d certainly ask for Montero.

  69. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 7:42 am

    Yea I just can’t see Betances being the centerpiece for any deal like that with the way they need offense.

  70. MTU November 23rd, 2011 at 7:49 am

    Good morning.

    Hope all you have a great Thanksgiving and get to enjoy being with your loved ones.

    My order of preference for a lefty would be :

    Danks (Non-rental only)
    Beurhle (No more than 2 yrs.)
    Gio/Andersen

    Dealing with Beane is usually a pain the you-know-what so I think Gonzalez would probably be overpriced.

  71. RadioKev November 23rd, 2011 at 7:57 am

    blake November 23rd, 2011 at 7:42 am
    Yea I just can’t see Betances being the centerpiece for any deal like that with the way they need offense.
    ———

    I think even Beane would know we’re not trading Montero for Gio. Perhaps we’re not trade partners.

    I also agree, it seems more likely that Banuelos will become more consistent than Betances. I think most Yankee fans would be happy to keep both and see what happens. All I’m saying is if Betances were a center piece in a Gio Gonzalez trade, I’d be happy with that. Similar to Granderson/Jackson feeling.

  72. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 8:06 am

    ” All I’m saying is if Betances were a center piece in a Gio Gonzalez trade, I’d be happy with that. Similar to Granderson/Jackson feeling.”

    Maybe Cash could pull a third team in…..where is Chip? :)

  73. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 8:07 am

    Morning MTU,

    Have you started making your pecan pies for tomorrow yet?

  74. MTU November 23rd, 2011 at 8:10 am

    Blake-

    Unless they serve it on airplanes- No.

    :(

  75. disco stu November 23rd, 2011 at 8:10 am

    I would think that Beane would hold out for Banuelos over Betances in a deal for Gio Gonzalez with his rationale being that he is trading an already established 26 year old left handed starter who is just starting to emerge who is not earning big bucks and would want a top left handed pitching prospect in return who will essentially be groomed to take his place.

    Personally, I think Gio Gonzalez is a really good pitcher who may yet become a great pitcher. A left handed starter who averaged nearly a strikeout per inning and is only in his mid-20′s is nothing to sneeze at … his best years may still be to come.

  76. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 8:12 am

    MTU,
    Safe travels my friend.

  77. Mike Ri November 23rd, 2011 at 8:18 am

    disco stu -

    disco. . Personally im not trading Manny B. unless its for a legit Ace or a Supreme Bat… Im bullish on Gio .. but he’s a not an Ace. (yet )…… if Beane asks for Montero or Manny B , I walk away.

  78. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 8:18 am

    Callis has an article on http://www.baseballamerica.com that suggests that theactual draft tax may not be as bad as initially thought.

    The penalties for going over are still stiff……but apparently the recommendations for the slotting might be increasing as well…..which would help.

  79. MTU November 23rd, 2011 at 8:18 am

    Thanks Blake.

    I think we both agree that the Yankees are in a strong position this OS.

    No need to make any rash moves.

    If the right opportunity comes along that’s fine.

    If not there will be time later.

  80. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 8:20 am

    A good well thought out draft budget will be essential now………

  81. disco stu November 23rd, 2011 at 8:25 am

    Mi Ri -

    If push comes to shove and Beane is inisistent on Manny Banuelos for Gio Gonzalez, I think Cashman will walk away … considering how protective he is now of his top prospects it would be a shock if he decided otherwise.

    But at some point there is going to be a deal that Cashman makes where he has no choice but to give up a lot for something big in return … wheather it is because there is a glaring need to fill or because the player available is too good to pass up on … it will be very interesting to see just how much he is willing to deal away when that time comes.

  82. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 8:26 am

    I think what you’ll start seeing is teams drafting and then trying to sign guys “under slot”……so that they’ll have money left over to pay a guy they like “over slot”. I liked the old system better…….and I really don’t see why they changed it.

  83. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 8:31 am

    I still think Danks makes the most sense and is the most likely on the trade front…….only concern there is if Texas or some other team gets involved and pushes the price higher than Cashman’s comfort level. Cashman has made it pretty clear that he’ll pay fair prices in trades……but he wont pay more than he feels is appropriate……the Lee situation was the ultimate show of restraint there.

  84. jacksquat November 23rd, 2011 at 8:32 am

    Can you pass on draft picks? For example, could you choose to not choose a player with your 2nd round pick, for the purpose of using that slot money to go over slot for your 1st round pick?

  85. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 8:35 am

    “Can you pass on draft picks? For example, could you choose to not choose a player with your 2nd round pick, for the purpose of using that slot money to go over slot for your 1st round pick?”

    Sure…..I don’t see why you couldn’t……but I think in that case you still pick someone and then just work to sign the guys you want after the draft is over. This stuff works off who you sign …..not who you draft. I guess if you really wanted a player……you could pay over slot for him……then try to save money later in the draft.

  86. PittsburghYankeeFan November 23rd, 2011 at 8:41 am

    Gio Ganzalez, John Danks, and Jair Jurgens are all way overpriced for what you get. W-L around .500, ERA + around 110, WHIP around 1.3.

    Mediocrity. Yankees are getting that with AJ. Plus, Danks agent is Boras–no way he’ll sign anything reasonable.

    Just sign Freddy G for $4 million or so and call it a day. Give the B’s another year to see what you have. Trade one of your catchers at midseason if you need someone.

    It makes for a boring hot stove, I know.

  87. jacksquat November 23rd, 2011 at 8:41 am

    Or I guess you could reach down with some picks to pay above slot to others. But that might be a problem with the guys you reach down for as they may be expecting money in line with the slot they were drafted in, even though you reached down.

    Anyway, this kind of screws guys not in the system yet, I guess the guys already in don’t really care. It does fit with Buds strategy of trying to increase profits for owners by requiring them to spend less.

  88. GreenBeret7 November 23rd, 2011 at 8:42 am

    Once you pass one making a choice in any round of the draft, you’re out of the rest of the draft.

  89. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 8:43 am

    So basically it seems like you’ll have a set number of money you can spend on the first 5 rounds…..based on where you pick and how many picks you have. (Between 4.5 and 11.5 million). You just have to stay under that number when you go to sign the players…….teams are going to have to be good at guessing what players will accept

  90. MTU November 23rd, 2011 at 8:43 am

    Pitt-

    I hope they offer Garcia Arb.

  91. MTU November 23rd, 2011 at 8:44 am

    GB-

    Since you’re around.

    Have a great Thanksgiving.

  92. GreenBeret7 November 23rd, 2011 at 8:48 am

    Cashman can’t go through another winter of doing nothing but picking up table scraps, even though the table scraps are from Mickey Mantle’s. He fears LoHud backlash.

  93. GreenBeret7 November 23rd, 2011 at 8:50 am

    Thanks, MTU. Same for you and your family……and the snake food on a leash. Have a great holiday.

  94. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 9:02 am

    I don’t see a downside to offering Freddy arbitration.

    Pittsburgh,

    I don’t agree on Danks. If he pitched the way he did in 2010 then he’d push for 20 wins on a team that can hit and play defense……its all about the cost to aquire for me given it’ll be a rental

  95. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 9:04 am

    Urban Meyer just took the Ohio State job ESPN is reporting……so much for wanting to spend time with his family ……can’t imagine Gator fans are too happy with him right now.

  96. Baseball Mogul November 23rd, 2011 at 9:06 am

    For me, the downside to offering Garcia arbitration is his accepting and having Noesi in the pen again. Why give him innings in winter ball to have him go back to the pen?

  97. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 9:09 am

    I don’t think Garcia would make enough money that he’d keep Noesi out of the rotation if the Yanks felt he deserved it. Just trade AJ…..problem solved.

  98. MTU November 23rd, 2011 at 9:09 am

    IMO odds are Freddy declines and goes for a 2yr. deal elsewhere.

    We get the draft pick in the process.

  99. MTU November 23rd, 2011 at 9:11 am

    Blake-

    AJ who ?

    :)

  100. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 9:14 am

    MTU,

    I agree…..I think Garcia gets a two year offer from someone……..if he did accept arbitration though then it just gives you depth. They could always trade him as well if they wanted.

  101. MTU November 23rd, 2011 at 9:16 am

    Blake-

    Yup.

  102. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 9:32 am

    blake November 23rd, 2011 at 8:26 am
    I think what you’ll start seeing is teams drafting and then trying to sign guys “under slot”……so that they’ll have money left over to pay a guy they like “over slot”. I liked the old system better…….and I really don’t see why they changed it.

    ——————-

    They changed it because Bud was tired of seeing top talent slip in the draft because of “signability.” Really this is all overcompensation for the 2004 draft where the Padres took Matt Bush #1 over Justin Verlander and Jared Weaver because San Diego was scared off by their asking prices.

    It is not out of character for baseball to overreact to a single incident (such as the All Star game determining home field after the tie fiasco)

  103. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 9:35 am

    On a slightly related CBA note:

    Now that he won’t cost a draft pick, I absolutely try to sign Cuddyer if I’m Cashman. Right handed bat with power that can play all four corners – Might even make it possible to deal Swisher in the right scenario.

  104. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 9:36 am

    Chip,

    If Bud was paying attention though he’d see that it wasn’t just the Yankees that were paying over slot. None of the top “signability ” guys in the 2011draft draft were taken by big market teams..

  105. Baseball Mogul November 23rd, 2011 at 9:38 am

    I’d rather let him walk and get the draft pick. I do think there’s a chance he accepts- he’s older, has made some $, had an interest in returning, and may value having a shot at winning. If I were another team, I wouldn’t touch him for two years with the miles he has on him. Doesn’t mean some team won’t do it though.

  106. Yankee Trader November 23rd, 2011 at 9:42 am

    Good morning. Want to wish all of you a Happy Thanksgiving.

    With the new CBA do you still get a compensatory pick for what was a Type B FA?

  107. Yankee Trader November 23rd, 2011 at 9:47 am

    Chip-

    I’ve always liked Michael Cuddyer. Came up as a 3rd baseman-not his best position. Filled in at 2nd also this season. I don’t think it happens, but maybe if the Giants come to the Yankees seeking Swisher, a deal for one of their starters could be worked out.

  108. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 9:53 am

    blake November 23rd, 2011 at 9:36 am
    Chip,

    If Bud was paying attention though he’d see that it wasn’t just the Yankees that were paying over slot. None of the top “signability ” guys in the 2011draft draft were taken by big market teams..

    ——————-

    I agree with you completely – and if you read a lot of what’s being written you’ll see that the people complaining most about this CBA are the mid market GM’s. Teams like Tampa that have been built mostly through successful drafting now fear two things:

    1. The talent available to them in the draft won’t be as good
    2. They won’t be able to overspend in the draft.

    If you want to look at it from a different perspective, this CBA sorta helps the large market teams. The Yankees and Red Sox for example can spend on free agents without sacrificing draft picks and thus weakening their minor league system, but Tampa, who doesn’t have the financial resources to woo top free agent talent now won’t be able to compensate as well through the draft to make up for the players they lose.

  109. Against All Odds November 23rd, 2011 at 9:55 am

    blake November 23rd, 2011 at 9:04 am

    Urban Meyer just took the Ohio State job ESPN is reporting……so much for wanting to spend time with his family ……can’t imagine Gator fans are too happy with him right no

    ————————

    Penn State fans aren’t too happy either

  110. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 9:56 am

    Yankee Trader November 23rd, 2011 at 9:47 am
    Chip-

    I’ve always liked Michael Cuddyer. Came up as a 3rd baseman-not his best position. Filled in at 2nd also this season. I don’t think it happens, but maybe if the Giants come to the Yankees seeking Swisher, a deal for one of their starters could be worked out.

    ————-

    I could see Swisher going to Atlanta in part of a Jurrjens deal or to the Cubs in a Garza deal.

  111. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 10:00 am

    In terms of things that may force Mariano Rivera‘s retirement, I’ll put “needing to cut back his hours so he can remain eligible for Social Security” at the top of the list. It’s certainly more plausible than “the Yankees won’t want him back” and “he can’t get guys out anymore.”

    I would have to agree.

  112. Giuseppe Franco November 23rd, 2011 at 10:04 am

    I can’t see any high profile coach taking the Penn State job right now. That situation in Happy Valley is too big of a mess.

    In a few years, I can see it – but not now.

  113. Yankee Trader November 23rd, 2011 at 10:04 am

    Chip

    Not interested in Jair Jurrjens anymore. Loss velocity, too many injuries last 3 seasons and if the Braves are willing to deal him, in light of rehab to Tommy Hanson, it smacks of the other players the Yankees either traded for or signed as free agents that were Braves the previous season.

    I have not heard of any rumors that Matt Garza was even on the trading block.

  114. Mike Ri November 23rd, 2011 at 10:06 am

    Yankee Trader –

    According to FOX Sports’ Ken Rosenthal, the Cubs’ new regime is “willing to move” Matt Garza.

  115. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 10:07 am

    Trader -

    I hear you on Jurrjens – I’m terrified of Atlanta and Oakland pitchers who are available.

    Theo has said he would listen on Garza.

  116. Against All Odds November 23rd, 2011 at 10:08 am

    # Giuseppe Franco November 23rd, 2011 at 10:04 am

    I can’t see any high profile coach taking the Penn State job right now. That situation in Happy Valley is too big of a mess.

    In a few years, I can see it – but not now.

    ——————————–

    Exactly and it was foolish for Penn State fans to think a guy like Meyer would step into that type of situation. Why go to Happy Valley when it could take yrs to get through all the mess that went on. You go to OSU and face some sanctions for tattoos and memorabilia lol. Seems like an easy choice.

  117. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 10:12 am

    Yea Im sure Theo is willing to move Garza…..for a big return.

  118. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 10:15 am

    I don’t believe the Yanks are gonna trade for any SP until the Darvish situation is resolved. As long as the Yanks are in the running to bid\sign The Pachinko Kid, they are hanging onto Swish, Gardner, Nunez, Killer B’s, or any other Yankee Player that you guys sittin’ around the cracker barrel are discussing. I like Cuddyer, I also like Kubel’s lefty stick in Yankee Stadium, but right now, Darvish is Priority #1 in Yankee Land, putting everything else ON HOLD.

  119. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 10:19 am

    Blake:

    Swisher, Betances, Romine and Nunez for Garza, Blake DeWitt and Sean Marshall

  120. Yankee Trader November 23rd, 2011 at 10:20 am

    2009-2010 profits for college football teams.
    #1 Texas-Total Revenue: $93,942,815

    Total Profit: $68,830,484

    #2 Univ of Georgia- Revenue: $70,838,539

    Profit: $52,529,885

    #3 Penn State-Revenue: $70,208,584

    Profit: $50,427,645

    #4 Univ of Michigan-Revenue: $63,189,417

    Profit: $44,861,184

  121. Hassey November 23rd, 2011 at 10:21 am

    Unless they can upgrade Swisher, the Yanks should do nothing this Winter except make a public committment to bleeding the young guys into the everyday lineup and rotation. It’s time to see what they have, THIS YEAR. Maybe they’ll fill in the blanks for us in the playoffs.

    Garza, etc.? Why would we want guys who no one else seems to be willing to commit to? You can only catch lightniong in a bottle so many times, and we may have filled our quota for the decade, all last season.

  122. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 10:24 am

    Theo and the Garza move is about dumping salary. He’s got his eye on Pujols. He’s love to dump Z also, but there are just no takers. I can’t avoid just how closely Z and AJ line up. Both meltdown mentally which corresponds to their onfield performance. Their yearly $$$ figures are also close I believe.

  123. Mike Ri November 23rd, 2011 at 10:25 am

    Garza, etc.? Why would we want guys who no one else seems to be willing to commit to? You can only catch lightniong in a bottle so many times, and we may have filled our quota for the decade, all last season.


    Hassey – its about the Money.. not the talent

  124. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 10:26 am

    “Swisher, Betances, Romine and Nunez for Garza, Blake DeWitt and Sean Marshall”

    That might make the Yankees worse …..

  125. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 10:27 am

    DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 10:24 am
    Theo and the Garza move is about dumping salary. He’s got his eye on Pujols. He’s love to dump Z also, but there are just no takers. I can’t avoid just how closely Z and AJ line up. Both meltdown mentally which corresponds to their onfield performance. Their yearly $$$ figures are also close I believe.

    ————-

    It’s also about restocking a depleted farm system.

    Theo has two really good assets to trade: Garza and Starlin Castro. He’s not about to trade a young, controllable SS so that leaves Garza. He can get at least a couple of good minor leaguers for him and maybe a young player and knows it.

    Ideally he would love to keep Garza and deal Soriano and Zambrano, but unless the Angels are looking for another LF I don’t see how they move Sori.

  126. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 10:29 am

    I don’t see Theo dealing Garza unless its for a significant haul of controlled players. Im not big on Garza anyway

  127. Yankee Trader November 23rd, 2011 at 10:30 am

    Darvish is Priority #1 in Yankee Land, putting everything else ON HOLD.
    ————————————————
    It can take 5-6 weeks before Yu Darvish is signed sealed and delivered.

    1. Has to request to be posted
    2. Team has to agree and then contact MLB commissioner
    3. Commish has to set up a silent 4 day auction for MLB teams to bid
    4. Then after 4 days, Commish has to notify the team that won.
    5. Team gets 30 days to work out a contract.
    6. If no deal the posting fee is never paid and the player goes back to Japan and cannot request to be posted until the subsequent season

    Yankees if unsuccessful, now would be stuck with Plan D or E -not a very desirable place to be when looking for starting pitching.

  128. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 10:33 am

    blake November 23rd, 2011 at 10:26 am
    “Swisher, Betances, Romine and Nunez for Garza, Blake DeWitt and Sean Marshall”

    That might make the Yankees worse …..

    ————

    How so?

    You get a solid addition to the rotation. DeWitt can take over for Nunez as the utility IF, Marshall is a solid option out of the pen – though I would love to convert him back to starter. And you can replace Swisher through FA either with Kubel, Cuddyer or Cespedes.

  129. Hassey November 23rd, 2011 at 10:35 am

    Mike Ri – Yep, I understand it’s all about the money, to the Yanks, Cubs, MLB, NBA, you, me and everyone on this site. So let me be more specific – why would the Yanks wants to commit money to guys to whom no one else seems to want make a financial committment?

    “Because they can” is the OLD answer…the last decade of flameouts has proven that is the wrong strategy.

  130. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 10:38 am

    blake November 23rd, 2011 at 10:29 am
    I don’t see Theo dealing Garza unless its for a significant haul of controlled players. Im not big on Garza anyway

    —————

    Why are you down on Garza?

    28 years old

    Sub 4 career ERA doing most of his pitching in the AL East

    Not an ACE but a solid 2/3

    Compare to Danks (whom I know you like)

    Garza’s a couple of years older but has an ERA that is .2 points lower and Garza is under team control for another year.

  131. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 10:39 am

    Chip,

    Because whoever you replace Swisher with will be worse…..you lose your young utility guy and backup SS…..you lose a future catcher and you lose a SP with big upside…….all that foe the marginal upgrade of Garza……I wouldn’t do that from either side .

  132. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 10:39 am

    I’m not big on Garza. If I was Theo I would move Castro ASAP. The guy’s got an Attitude to go along with his 29 ERRORS. When I see a young player\rookie displaying this physical and mental ineptness at the MLB Level, it tells me the minor league organization from which he came is an absolute disaster. Theo needs to fire and then hire Coaches that actually teach The Game both mentally and physically.

  133. Yankee Trader November 23rd, 2011 at 10:40 am

    “Swisher, Betances, Romine and Nunez for Garza, Blake DeWitt and Sean Marshall”
    —————————–

    Theo and the Garza move is about dumping salary.
    ————————————–

    That above trade is, money wise, close to a wash. If Theo is trying to free up money it won’t work.
    Marshall due 3.1M
    DeWitt made .46M due arbitration
    Garza made 5.95M due arbitration

  134. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 10:40 am

    Kubel, Cuddyer or Cespedes are not upgrades from Swisher… they are not even side-grades…

  135. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 10:41 am

    “Garza’s a couple of years older but has an ERA that is .2 points lower and Garza is under team control for another year.”

    Yea its not that I wouldn’t like to have him…..I just think he’s going to cost more than he’s worth

  136. Yankee Trader November 23rd, 2011 at 10:45 am

    Kubel, Cuddyer or Cespedes are not upgrades from Swisher… they are not even side-grades…
    —————————-
    ID-

    Although I like Cuddyer, I agree with you. However if the Yankees had to include Swisher in a deal for a #2 pitcher, with the contingency plan of signing Cuddyer to replace Swisher in RF, I’d have no problem with his bat in the lineup and his versatility.

  137. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 10:48 am

    blake November 23rd, 2011 at 10:39 am
    Chip,

    Because whoever you replace Swisher with will be worse…..you lose your young utility guy and backup SS…..you lose a future catcher and you lose a SP with big upside…….all that foe the marginal upgrade of Garza……I wouldn’t do that from either side .

    ————–

    That’s very fair.

    But I’m alright taking a hit in RF and a slight hit at utlity infielder (there’s nothing to stop the Yankees from upgrading this position through subsiquent deals) to upgrade the rotation.

    As for the catcher – it’s one spot where the Yankees have a lot of depth to deal from, so that’s a non-issue.

    As of now, there are significant questions in the rotation:

    1. Which Phil Hughes will be pitching in 2012
    2. What are they getting from AJ Burnett
    3. Can Ivan Nova repeat
    4. If he’s back, can Freddy Garcia repeat
    5. If Garcia’s not back, are any of the minor leaguers ready to make the jump Nova made

    By getting Garza I elminate at least two of those questions and marginalize two more.

    Instead of a rotation of:

    CC
    Nova
    Hughes
    Garcia
    AJ

    I’m looking at a rotation of:

    CC
    Garza
    Nova
    Hughes
    AJ

    The hardest thing to do during the season is find pitching. If you tell me that I can improve my pitching and take a chance in RF – I’m going to do it.

  138. Giuseppe Franco November 23rd, 2011 at 10:49 am

    I don’t see how anyone here can make the argument that signing a guy like Cespedes is an upgrade over Swisher when you haven’t even seen him play.

    Swisher’s production the last three years in pinstripes is more significant than his detractors want to give him credit for.

  139. Yankee Trader November 23rd, 2011 at 10:51 am

    Do you think Freddy Garcia will get an offer of arbitration, with a private “handshake” agreement in place, that he will decline it?

  140. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 10:53 am

    Personally, I would take Cuddyer over Swish. Cespedes aint even in the discussion as he is a pig inna poke. Kubel is certainly not as good as Swish defensively, but if moving Swish upgraded the SP, I could live with the defensive downgrade. This is exactly why I believe the Yanks are better of sticking with what they have, and shelling out the $$$ for a possible Darvish bid\signing. Short of Darvish, I would take a run at Gio Gonzalez. I wouldn’t give up Montero for him, but Gio’s age, and very high ceiling makes him the best option to me.

  141. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 10:53 am

    Yankee Trader November 23rd, 2011 at 10:45 am
    Kubel, Cuddyer or Cespedes are not upgrades from Swisher… they are not even side-grades…
    —————————-
    ID-

    Although I like Cuddyer, I agree with you. However if the Yankees had to include Swisher in a deal for a #2 pitcher, with the contingency plan of signing Cuddyer to replace Swisher in RF, I’d have no problem with his bat in the lineup and his versatility.

    ————-

    Agreed

  142. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 10:54 am

    Giuseppe Franco November 23rd, 2011 at 10:49 am
    I don’t see how anyone here can make the argument that signing a guy like Cespedes is an upgrade over Swisher when you haven’t even seen him play.

    Swisher’s production the last three years in pinstripes is more significant than his detractors want to give him credit for.

    ————

    By that same token, how can you make the argument that Cespedes isn’t an upgrade over Swisher?

  143. Yankee Trader November 23rd, 2011 at 10:55 am

    Again, that Cub/Yankee trade does not free up salary for the Cubs. Honestly, although the Cubs are unlikely to want to even consider trading lefty Sean Marshall, he’s the one pitcher the Cubs have who I’d love to see in pinstripes with the thought of making him a starter again.

  144. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 10:56 am

    Chip,

    I think that’s a fair breakdown also…..its just more than Id give especially if I could get Danks cheaper or potentially get Darvish for cash.

    The Cubs have little motive to move Garza unless it makes their team significantly better….and those situations are the knew you want to avoid when looking for trades.

  145. Mike Ri November 23rd, 2011 at 10:56 am

    Hassey —

    the last decade of flameouts has proven that is the wrong strategy.
    —–

    I don’t think Garza is a flameout at all. He’s solid . He’s a competitor ( which i love ) . he has good numbers across the board. ( a little hick up last year .. but not a big deal ) . He’s AL East battle tested , including good numbers against the sox .

    and remember . . the Yanks took a chance on two “flameouts” last year Garcia and Colon. … i think it worked out pretty well .

  146. Germfree Adolescents November 23rd, 2011 at 10:57 am

    Swisher looks great in the post season. Wouldn’t want to disturb that great swing of his

  147. MaineYankee November 23rd, 2011 at 10:59 am

    Giuseppe Franco November 23rd, 2011 at 10:49 am
    I don’t see how anyone here can make the argument that signing a guy like Cespedes is an upgrade over Swisher when you haven’t even seen him play.

    Swisher’s production the last three years in pinstripes is more significant than his detractors want to give him credit for.

    ——————————————————————————

    You’ve been here long enough to know that they need at least one player to attack.

  148. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 11:00 am

    Garza is a blooming Z. His temper was evident going back to his TB days. A team can live with that type of temperment outta an offensive player, (Pauley), but NOT from a pitcher.

  149. Giuseppe Franco November 23rd, 2011 at 11:00 am

    Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 10:54 am

    Giuseppe Franco November 23rd, 2011 at 10:49 am
    I don’t see how anyone here can make the argument that signing a guy like Cespedes is an upgrade over Swisher when you haven’t even seen him play.

    Swisher’s production the last three years in pinstripes is more significant than his detractors want to give him credit for.

    ————

    By that same token, how can you make the argument that Cespedes isn’t an upgrade over Swisher?

    ——–

    Any GM worth a damn isn’t going to gamble by moving a guy who has been as productive as Swisher the last few years in favor of a guy who is a complete unknown.

    Cashman isn’t going to do that.

  150. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:00 am

    Garza is a good pitcher….but he’s a flyball guy and he’ll cost at least Betances plus more.

  151. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:04 am

    “Any GM worth a damn isn’t going to gamble by moving a guy who has been as productive as Swisher the last few years in favor of a guy who is a complete unknown.”

    I agree……id like to see them take a gamble on Cespedes if they like him…..but not at the expense if the current outfield. I think you have to see what he is first before making any moves there. You put him at AAA and he tears it up then maybe you move Swisher then…..but you can’t initially.

  152. Yankee Trader November 23rd, 2011 at 11:05 am

    Trading for good good starting pitching is going to require a premium in return, especially this year when more teams will be in the hunt for postseason berths.

    The A’s wanted Logan Morrison or Mike Stanton from the Marlins for Gio Gonzalez, who I’m not sure he’s even a solid #2 relying mostly on the fastball and curveball, throws in 5% CU’s and walks a lot of batters, plus got hammered in YS, Fenway and Rogers stadium this year in his only starts there.

  153. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 11:12 am

    Giuseppe Franco November 23rd, 2011 at 11:00 am
    Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 10:54 am

    Giuseppe Franco November 23rd, 2011 at 10:49 am
    I don’t see how anyone here can make the argument that signing a guy like Cespedes is an upgrade over Swisher when you haven’t even seen him play.

    Swisher’s production the last three years in pinstripes is more significant than his detractors want to give him credit for.

    ————

    By that same token, how can you make the argument that Cespedes isn’t an upgrade over Swisher?

    ——–

    Any GM worth a damn isn’t going to gamble by moving a guy who has been as productive as Swisher the last few years in favor of a guy who is a complete unknown.

    Cashman isn’t going to do that.

    ————

    Really? Don’t GMs do that all the time when they decide to move out a veteran player or let him walk via free agency to free up a spot for a prospect? Cespedes is no different. A little older sure, but then so was Ryan Howard when the Phillies traded Jim Thome to free up 1b for him. And don’t say Cashman “isn’t going to do that” how is gambling on Cespedes any different than passing on established ML players to gamble on Hideki Matsui or El Duque or Contreras?

    Remember also, Cespedes may be an unknown to fans and the media, but teams have entire departments that scout Latin ball players – including Cubans.

  154. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 11:14 am

    blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:04 am
    “Any GM worth a damn isn’t going to gamble by moving a guy who has been as productive as Swisher the last few years in favor of a guy who is a complete unknown.”

    I agree……id like to see them take a gamble on Cespedes if they like him…..but not at the expense if the current outfield. I think you have to see what he is first before making any moves there. You put him at AAA and he tears it up then maybe you move Swisher then…..but you can’t initially.

    ————-

    Based on the reported asking price for Cespedes he’s not coming to the US to play in Scranton. Just my opinion.

  155. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 11:14 am

    Your talkin’ about trading a player in order to promote a player within your own organization that you have evaluated for several seasons. Cespedes is a crapshoot at this point.

  156. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:17 am

    “Cespedes is no different.”

    The Cuban league has been compared to A ball in the states……Im not moving Swisher to make room for a 26 year old that has been tearing up the equivalent of the Sally league. Now he might be the real deal…..but Id need to see it in AAA first.

  157. Yankee Trader November 23rd, 2011 at 11:18 am

    Chip-

    Really don’t see the Yankees trading for Garza. However if CJ Wilson is signed by the Angels, and they are willing to move Haren/Santana for offense, I’d be more than interested.

    Have to go. Until later.

    Everyone have a great day and a wonderful Thanksgiving.

  158. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 11:19 am

    DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 11:14 am
    Your talkin’ about trading a player in order to promote a player within your own organization that you have evaluated for several seasons. Cespedes is a crapshoot at this point.

    —————–

    That’s true too – but regardless of how much evaluation you’ve done of a minor league player you don’t know if he’s going to perform at the major league level. How many times have we seen guys who were considered tremendous prospects come up and completely flame out?

  159. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 11:21 am

    blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:17 am
    “Cespedes is no different.”

    The Cuban league has been compared to A ball in the states……Im not moving Swisher to make room for a 26 year old that has been tearing up the equivalent of the Sally league. Now he might be the real deal…..but Id need to see it in AAA first.

    ———————–

    I’m not a scout, I don’t pretend to be. But it would seem to me that the percentage of Cuban players who have performed in the majors is better than the percentage of Japanese players who have performed in the majors

  160. comet November 23rd, 2011 at 11:22 am

    Happy Thanksgiving to all and especially, GB, MTU, Ray, Tar, Trisha, Doreen, Pat M, Erica, Angel, m, Shame, Uncle E, Upstate, Kate, SAS and Nick in SF.

    I envy you having Turkey and Pumpkin Pie!

  161. LGY November 23rd, 2011 at 11:25 am

    People need to realize that bottom rung teams with long term plans to contend like the Cubs, A’s, Mariners, etc. will have no interest in Nick Swisher.

    Same thing for Phil Hughes.

    They want young cheap players. Not guys who are expensive and will hit free agency before they have a shot at making the playoffs.

  162. MoRings42 November 23rd, 2011 at 11:25 am

    instant replay for fair/foul balls is in this new CBA. Something they said would never happen.. So logically, Balls/strikes will be the next eventual. Way to kill baseball, Selig.

  163. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 11:25 am

    True. But the point is an organization has had several seasons of in-depth\up close evaluation. Cespedes has been shopped recently via video footage. As for the Japanese players, (Matsui, etc), MLB players go over there and play against and see these guys with their own eyes. MLB GM’s have even gone over to Japan to watch Darvish 1st hand. That cannot be said about Cespedes.

  164. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 11:29 am

    LGY November 23rd, 2011 at 11:25 am
    People need to realize that bottom rung teams with long term plans to contend like the Cubs, A’s, Mariners, etc. will have no interest in Nick Swisher.

    Same thing for Phil Hughes.

    They want young cheap players. Not guys who are expensive and will hit free agency before they have a shot at making the playoffs.

    —————–

    I don’t know if that’s 100% true.

    Granted, Nick Swisher won’t be there to help the Cubs when they’re ready to win, but that doesn’t mean he can’t help them get to that point. The Cubs (as an example) could find plenty of teams in the hunt in July who are willing to deal a quality minor leaguer or two for Swisher for the stretch run.

    Yankees can’t do that. The teams that would want Swisher at that point are the teams that likely would be competing with the Yankees for a playoff spot. Or that they may have to face in a World Series scenario.

  165. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:30 am

    “But it would seem to me that the percentage of Cuban players who have performed in the majors is better than the percentage of Japanese players who have performed in the majors”

    Yea but you coukd say the same thing about the state of Texas……a lotof more guys have tried it from Cuba than from Japan. Also that doesn’t mean the actual league is better….

  166. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 11:32 am

    Teams ALWAYS want more from the Yanks whenever they trade a player. It’s been proven time after time.

  167. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:34 am

    The Cubs aren’t trading for Swisher just to shop him this summer…..the Yanks would want something real in return and it wouldn’t be worth it for Theo. Them has 3 valuable pieces (Castro, Garza, and Marshall (somewhat))…..to move those guys he needs building blocks for the future.

  168. LGY November 23rd, 2011 at 11:34 am

    Why would the Cubs acquire Swisher in order to trade him a few months later at lower value?

    If their end game is acquiring prospects they’ll just so that from the start with Garza.

  169. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:37 am

    ‘ Balls/strikes will be the next eventually”

    No it wont

  170. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 11:39 am

    Theo has to put an acceptable product on the field NOW. He can not just build up the Minors, and let the Major League team turn into the ’61″ Mets. Swish would fit nicely in the Cub OF, and would be a great ambassador. I just believe Garza is Plan C or D for the Yanks. Again, the temperment of a pitcher is very important. Do the Yanks want both Garza and AJ in the rotation?

  171. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 11:41 am

    blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:30 am
    “But it would seem to me that the percentage of Cuban players who have performed in the majors is better than the percentage of Japanese players who have performed in the majors”

    Yea but you coukd say the same thing about the state of Texas……a lotof more guys have tried it from Cuba than from Japan. Also that doesn’t mean the actual league is better….

    ————–

    that’s also true.

    Look, I don’t want to sound like I’m running Swisher out of town or that he’s a bad player – but he’s not Paul O’Neill either. He’s a very nice, productive, replaceable player – much like the guy he replaced (Bobby Abreu) was.

  172. comet November 23rd, 2011 at 11:42 am

    Happy Thanksgiving also to Blake, LGY and Ghostwriter!

  173. pat November 23rd, 2011 at 11:42 am

    jonmorosi
    Source tells http://FOXSports.com Grady Sizemore has passed physical, deal is done with #Indians — $5M base salary with $4M in incentives. $500,000 for Comeback Player of the Year

  174. comet November 23rd, 2011 at 11:42 am

    And to Joe in Long Island and family, a Happy thanksgiving!

  175. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 11:44 am

    LGY November 23rd, 2011 at 11:34 am
    Why would the Cubs acquire Swisher in order to trade him a few months later at lower value?

    If their end game is acquiring prospects they’ll just so that from the start with Garza.

    ————–

    In the deal I proposed the Cubs are getting prospects for Garza (Betances, Nunez and Romine) along with Swisher. If you don’t like the Swisher to the Cubs aspect of that – fine, expand it. Make it a 3 team deal where Swisher winds up in San Francisco (for example) and a San Fran prospect like Belt ends up in Chicago.

    It’s neither here nor there – Theo’s still getting prospects and the Yankees are still getting Garza and the only player they’ll really miss going away is Swisher who, as stated above, is a very nice, productive but replaceable player.

  176. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:45 am

    Post at RAB on Garza. I didn’t see him pitch much last year…..but sounds like he changed his approach a bit for the better. Still think he’d cost a lot to aquire……probably Betances, Romine, and two more good prospects or something like that. Im sure they’d ask for Montero and Banuelos first.

  177. MoRings42 November 23rd, 2011 at 11:45 am

    ‘ Balls/strikes will be the next eventually”

    No it wont

    That same answer was given to foul/fair balls a few years ago. They already have questek (sp?) in place that influence some who make calls. You honestly think they won’t try to perfect that process to make the umpiring more perfect. Everything else in the game will now be a video game. Why leave that one imperfection?

  178. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:46 am

    “Theo has to put an acceptable product on the field NOW.”

    Why?

    Happy Thanksgiving comet!

  179. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:50 am

    “You honestly think they won’t try to perfect that process to make the umpiring more perfect.”

    Nah I really don’t. The strike zone is subjective……safe/out, fair/foul are not…there is no grey area on those calls.

    If they went to a robot strike zone then the hitters would quickly learn it and pitchers would be in serious trouble…..

  180. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 11:55 am

    No way a 1st yr GM allows the product that fans see at the MLB level, and the W-L Record to degenerate. Again, I want nothing to do with Hot Head Garza.

  181. Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 11:57 am

    blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:45 am
    Post at RAB on Garza. I didn’t see him pitch much last year…..but sounds like he changed his approach a bit for the better. Still think he’d cost a lot to aquire……probably Betances, Romine, and two more good prospects or something like that. Im sure they’d ask for Montero and Banuelos first.

    ————-

    I think you can get him for Betances, Romine and Nunez.

  182. MoRings42 November 23rd, 2011 at 11:58 am

    We’ll have to disagree there. If it was truly subjective than there would have been no reason to install questek.

  183. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:59 am

    “I think you can get him for Betances, Romine and Nunez.”

    Id consider that….

  184. Against All Odds November 23rd, 2011 at 12:02 pm

    # blake November 23rd, 2011 at 11:59 am

    “I think you can get him for Betances, Romine and Nunez.”

    Id consider that….

    —————————-

    I would consider that too.

  185. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 12:03 pm

    Home plate Umps are needed as the strike zone for batters changes based on the batters normal stance\crouch. That’s what bugs the hell outta me concerning the strike zone box that all broadcasts now use. The distance from the top to the bottom of that box NEVER changes. Rickey Henderson’s stance reduced his strike zone to that of a Munchkin when he batted, and the Umps called his strike zone accordingly.

  186. Mike Ri November 23rd, 2011 at 12:06 pm

    I think you can get him for Betances, Romine and Nunez

    Count me in on that as well

  187. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 12:08 pm

    Questek is just a tool to judge the umpires by…..it would have much bigger implications if it were used in the games.

  188. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:08 pm

    The strike zone is subjective

    This is false. It is subjective because the umps suck at their jobs and call it that way, but it is strictly defined in the rulebook.

  189. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 12:08 pm

    Absolutely NO WAY I trade a Killer B, a young Catcher with MLB experience, AND a young improving utility IF’er with both power and speed, for Hot Head Garza. Not gonna happen.

  190. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:09 pm

    that being said, we’ll see replay on tag plays and plays at the plate before they ever broach the idea of calling or helping the umpire call the strikezone.

  191. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 12:09 pm

    I don’t however think Theo would do that.

  192. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:10 pm

    Rule 2.00: The Strike Zone

    The STRIKE ZONE is that area over home plate the upper limit of which is a horizontal line at the midpoint between the top of the shoulders and the top of the uniform pants, and the lower level is a line at the hollow beneath the kneecap. The Strike Zone shall be determined from the batter’s stance as the batter is prepared to swing at a pitched ball.

    That can easily be calibrated for each batter each at-bat. Technology is amazing.

  193. Mike Ri November 23rd, 2011 at 12:13 pm

    per Mlbtraderumors

    WEDNESDAY, 10:55am: Gio Gonzalez trade talks haven’t really started, reports ESPN’s Buster Olney, who notes that the A’s did not ask for Logan Morrison in brief check-in talks with the Marlins.

  194. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 12:13 pm

    The strike zone is clearly defined in the rulebook…..but when you add live baseball into the equation it becomes subjective because what do you define as exactly where the knees and the letters are? Its a loose definition

  195. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:15 pm

    it doesn’t “become subjective”, the umpires are simply incapable of calling a strikezone accurately.

    The margin of error for a human eye perceiving quick motion (like a 90mph fastball flying through an invisible box in empty space) is much higher than that of a video camera or laser system.

  196. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 12:16 pm

    ID,

    See but those things are different for each player…….having a computer generated strike zone would be death for pitchers…….

  197. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 12:16 pm

    It’s each hitter’sl Normal Stance that makes the strike zone vary.

  198. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 12:17 pm

    ID,

    It would significantly change the game…..unlike safe/out, fair/foul calls.

  199. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:19 pm

    blake – no, a computer generated strike zone would be adjusted accordingly for every player. it simply programming the soft5ware to do that.

  200. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:19 pm

    it’s umpires that don’t adjust the strikezones for different players, or make adjustments between innings when they are missing inside/outside pitches. they just call the wrong strikezone all the time, basically.

  201. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 12:22 pm

    “blake – no, a computer generated strike zone would be adjusted accordingly for every player. it simply programming the soft5ware to do that.”

    Im not arguing that they couldn’t come up with a computer generated robot strikezone…..im arguing that its a bad idea and that they’ll never go there.

  202. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:22 pm

    it would be a huge advantage for pitchers because the inside/outside boundries of the strikezone would be the same for every. single. batter.

    unlike now where umpires don’t even put their head in the middle of the plate, and basically set themselves up to miss the pitch either inside or outside on any given play.

  203. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:23 pm

    blake – it’s not a bad idea at all, but i don’t think they’ll go there any time soon (i believe it is inevitable that computers will call the strikezone, just not yet).

  204. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 12:23 pm

    The video reviews have already changed the game. Not to mention the stupid on field conferences the Umps now conduct. I liked it when an Ump simply said, “It’s my call”. They will miss one here and there, but they are excellent in general.

    -WORST CALL I HAVE EVER SEEN-
    That call vs the Angels in the “09″ Playoffs, where the Yanks had 2 runners standing OFF 3rd base, both were tagged while OFF the bag, and both were NOT declared out. HILARIOUS

  205. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:25 pm

    what i would like to see first is the umpires using the data available to fix their crap strikezones between innings, rather than just continue to make bad calls an entire game.

    CC doesn’t lose in the ALDS this year with a proper strikezone. He doesn’t lose an entire half of the plate one night at random because the umpire decided the zone was not actually over the plate that day.

  206. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 12:26 pm

    “it would be a huge advantage for pitchers because the inside/outside boundries of the strikezone would be the same for every. single. batter.”

    Yes….and the hitters would quickly learn what pitches not to swing at…….pitches chased would decrease…. part of the reason you swing at a borderline pitch is the fear the ump will make a mistake……you take that fear away and hitters will have a field day

  207. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:28 pm

    blake – your fear is irrelevant, because it should not exist. how many batters strike out then stand there are argue with the home plate umpire? they dont just quietly go away, they know where the strikezone is supposed to be.

    you are telling me that it’s better that the umpire influences the outcome of the game due to his physical incapability of calling a consistent strikezone, rather than letting the players determine the outcome of the game by their actions.

  208. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:29 pm

    the batters are no more capable of telling where a borderline pitch is than the umpire. in fact, they have a much worse perspective on making that determination.

  209. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:29 pm

    blake – what if the area and size of home plate was left up to the judgement of the umpire, and players had to guess every time they came home to score where that plate was? doesn’t make any sense, right?

  210. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 12:30 pm

    “you are telling me that it’s better that the umpire influences the outcome of the game due to his physical incapability of calling a consistent strikezone, rather than letting the players determine the outcome of the game by their actions.”?

    No Im telling you that its a human part of the game that’s been around forever and makes it what it is……its part of the strategy and gamesmanship that makes baseball great. To each his own…..

  211. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 12:31 pm

    The human element is a huge part of the game. Remove that, and your watching a video game.

  212. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:33 pm

    just because it has been around forever doesn’t make it the best way to do it. the “human element” is bullsh*t, and it’s a really sad place to take your stance. it has no part in any strategy and gamesmanship, it only has to do with the umpires getting calls incorrect and influencing the outcome of the game.

    i don’t know about you, but i watch baseball to see the players on the field determine the outcome, not the unskilled schmuck wearing a black mask blowing calls.

  213. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 12:34 pm

    “just because it has been around forever doesn’t make it the best way to do it.”

    In your opinion.

  214. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:36 pm

    donny – no, you would be watching a game with actual rules, rather than half-assed rules like we have now.

    I never understood why people are ok with some of the rules being cut and dry, and some of the rules being fudged every day by an umpire should should have no bearing on the game, yet does every day.

    people want replay so that home runs, fair/foul and tag plays are called correctly, because there is no other way. the calls are either correct or they are not, out or not, foul or not. there is no grey area. These same people when pushed to itseem to be perfectly OK with the umpire making up the strikezone from pitch to pitch… i just don’t get it.

    you would not sign up to play any game under those rules.

  215. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:37 pm

    blake – your contrarian nonsense bores me. “because it’s the way it has been” is stupid. do you know how many rules in baseball are not “they way it has been”? i dont see you complaining about those changes.

  216. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 12:39 pm

    “blake – your contrarian nonsense bores me. “because it’s the way it has been” is stupid. do you know how many rules in baseball are not “they way it has been”? i dont see you complaining about those changes.”

    It seems you’re the one complaining to me.

  217. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:40 pm

    lets play a game, it will follow all of the rules written in this book except… i am the home plate umpire and whatever i say is a strike is a strike… oh and you aren’t allowed to argue with me or i’ll throw you out of the game no matter how wrong i am. don’t bother looking at the rulebook because whatever i say the strikezone is goes, even though it may be explicitly defined int he rules, i don’t care and don’t have to follow them.

    you would play that game? most people would not. especially not if their careers were decided on the whims of the man behind the plate.

  218. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 12:41 pm

    You can be in favor of a computer strike zone…..that’s your right.

  219. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:41 pm

    blake – no, you inject yourself in every conversation. i don’t care what you think, especially if what you think has been stuck in the mud for 50 years.

  220. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:42 pm

    lets go back to the days where batters were allowed to ask for a high or low strikezone when they approached the plate. that’s the way it always was before they changed it to this heathen method of a “standard strike zone”, it must have been better.

  221. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 12:46 pm

    Who injected themselves in to this conversation again? as I said….you can have whatever opinion you want on the rules of baseball.

  222. tomingeorgia November 23rd, 2011 at 12:46 pm

    Turn the game into a video game, get the umpires off the field entirely. Computers make every call. I’d probably not watch as much, but ID’s statistics would be ready-made for him. Not the game I grew up with. All I ask is that umpires do the best they can. Use the computers to grade the umps, not to call the games.

  223. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 12:48 pm

    To say “there is no grey area” is a blown call on your part. How many times have we seen the ball and runner reach 1st base at the same time even in super slow mo? It happens. Tag plays on runners attempting to steal 2nd, same thing. Foot hits bag just as runner is tagged. It happens. Both grey areas. The Umps generally do an outstanding job. The complaint about the strike zone with a few Umps is legit. The problem is that MLB is not calling an Ump on the carpet, disciplining if necessary, and firing as a last resort. I realize there are Union protections involved, but there are union employees disciplined\fired in all walks of life.

  224. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:49 pm

    it doesn’t make it a video game, i don’t understand that sentiment at all.

    the “human element” is the players on the field, not those determining the rules.

    use the computers to HELP the umps, not remove them from the field.

    When the only stance you have is to wildly swing in the opposite directiont o try to make my position look ridiculous…

  225. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 12:52 pm

    -IRREVERENT-

    I know what your saying. It irritates me to no end every time I hear, “It is what it is”. That is not only non-responsive, it fails to address the issue.

  226. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 12:52 pm

    donnybrook – that’s a perfect example for what i want to happen. those plays happen at such a high speed that the umpire literally has no chance of making the right call other than guessing. the use of technology would improve his chances of making a correct call.

    how is making more correct calls a bad thing for baseball?

    also, in super-slow-mo (actual high FPS cameras, not the BS you see on TV now) there would be very few if any “simultaneous plays” because stuff like that rarely happens in nature.

  227. tomingeorgia November 23rd, 2011 at 12:56 pm

    But why bother paying umps at all if every bang-bang play is subject to being overruled?

  228. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 12:59 pm

    Your dissatisfaction seems to be confined to the Home Plate Umps interrpretation of the strike zone. That can be remedied without going to video reviews, or electronic stike\ball calls. Your throwing the baby out with the bath water. We gotta great game going, and I believe the more technology intrudes upon it, the more it approaches something outta Farenheight 451. Anything that employs human beings to perpetuate it, is gonna be flawed to some extent. That’s a given.

  229. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 1:01 pm

    bang-bang plays would be subject to replay, someone still has to be on the field making the initial call… we’re not replacing the umpires here we are augmenting their ability to make calls correctly.

    all the home plate ump really needs is a little light inside his mask telling him if a pitch was a ball or strike, could be almost instantaneous and infinitely more accurate than the human eye.

  230. J. Alfred Prufrock November 23rd, 2011 at 1:02 pm

    Betances wants to be factor for Yankees in 2012
    Yankees Blog
    By DAN MARTIN

    If there’s one thing Yankees general manager Brian Cashman has made clear this offseason, it’s that he wants help for the starting rotation.
    He’s open to trades or free agency, and he also has said that if need be, the Yankees would give some of their younger arms a chance.
    Dellin Betances said he hopes that’s the case.
    “I feel like next year is a big year for me,” Betances said. “There are definitely spots that are going to be open, and I need to show what I can do in spring training.”
    Betances suffered through a disappointing 2011 and was unimpressive in two appearances with the Yankees in the final weeks of the regular season, but the 6-foot-8 New York City native said he will look at Ivan Nova for inspiration.

    “He had a chance to be the Rookie of the Year,” Betances said of his former Gulf Coast League teammate who had 16 wins. “Those are the footsteps I want to follow in.”
    Chances are, Cashman will make some additions that will get in Betances’ way, but the right-hander said he is confident the worst is behind him and he’s working on his balance and conditioning this offseason.
    “I learned a lot this year,” Betances said while at a charity event with Yankees scout Cesar Presbott in The Bronx. “I have a lot more to prove.”
    ////

    I’m looking forward to a big first half from Betances.

    Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports.....z1eYK7KZQt
    ///

  231. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2011 at 1:03 pm

    To say there would be “very few if any simultaneous plays” with review is in error. You get into can you see if the ball is in the 1st baseman’s mitt as the foot hits the bag, etc. The TIE PLAY is gonna exist.

  232. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 1:06 pm

    donny – the human eye is just not fast enough to call a strikezone accurately, especially once you pass the age of 35. your brain simply doesn’t operate at the speeds necessary to see where the ball crossed the plate.

    the game is great, but when things happen like umps blowing fair/foul calls in the postseason *cough* mauer *cough*, or when your ace gets run off the mound because the umpire’s strikezone was not covering half of the plate… it’s embarrassing and detrimental to the game.

    the calls can only be made more accurately, and more consistently through technology.

  233. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 1:08 pm

    donnybrook – it’s not in error at all, simultaneous events are extremely rare. regardless of your concern… they would not happen any more ofeten than they do now, and the ones that were not in fact simultaneous (even though an ump may think so) will be called correctly.

    Armando Galaragga would have a perfect game under his belt, but he doesn’t because some schmuck umpire thought something was simultaneous, and replay showed that it clearly was not.

    you can’t only be concerned with the extreme limitations of the system when the other 99% of it is a considerable improvement.

  234. slim November 23rd, 2011 at 1:09 pm

    Yankees are going to have a hard time pulling off a trade for a top pitcher.
    Gio, Garza, Danks, Cain, etc…
    It sounds like they and most fans don’t want to trade Manny B or Montero but the SP they want the respective GM’s have no reason to trade except to stock their own systems.

    They need to justify the return and adding spare parts without a big name rarely works.
    Everyone is going to ask for one of those 2 top guys. Of the 4 names above, I think only Danks could be had without giving up one of the 2 top as a headliner. Danks will likely cost you the other Killer B.

    Personally I would trade any of the possible pieces for Gio in a one for one deal- but I would most likely not add other pieces to a Manny B or Montero the A’s would ask for.
    A talent like him under cost control and at his age is not coming over via trade without top talent going back. He has his worts but has enormous potential.

  235. MoRings42 November 23rd, 2011 at 1:31 pm

    Just wait for the first blown call at the plate during an important game.. articles will start appearing and as Irreverent proves, these people do exist.

    The game is ruined.. and the “it’ll only be for HR’s” started it all.

  236. Pat M. November 23rd, 2011 at 1:31 pm

    Happy Thanksgiving to all LoHuders…..Blows my mind that Christmas is less than 5 weeks away…….Where did 2011 go ????? Thanks Comet !!!

  237. pat November 23rd, 2011 at 1:41 pm

    Rangers will be offering C.J. Wilson salary arbitration.

  238. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 1:41 pm

    if having calls made correctly ruins it for you, i question why you watch at all.

  239. joeman November 23rd, 2011 at 1:44 pm

    so Mo’s talking retirement after the 12 season….could see this coming a mile away

  240. Villa Nova-Ya November 23rd, 2011 at 1:45 pm

    J Alfred Prufrock -

    These kids are so motivated, love to read about it. thanks for posting that. I think it is super cool that Betances is looking to Nova for inspiration. Very very cool. :)

    ****

    I Hope Everyone here has an Enjoyable Thanksgiving.

  241. Jerzz November 23rd, 2011 at 1:50 pm

    We don’t really matchup well with teams like OAK/LAA/SF because we don’t have hitting to give up aside from Montero.

    Danks and Garza are probably our best shot.

  242. Pat M. November 23rd, 2011 at 1:55 pm

    RI Attorney…..The 1948 date I find confusing ???? Villa Nova – Ya…..Happy Thanksgiving, same to you RI Attorney…..Morning fog has burnt off time to hit the produce store…..Eat well, eat slow and remain thankful….

  243. EA November 23rd, 2011 at 1:55 pm

    I offer Betances, Nunez, Romine for Danks, Gio, Garza, Haren, E Santana, Hamels, Cain – see which one of them bites.

    I’d offer Romine/Nunez and their choice of Warren/Phelps/Mitchell for guys like Floyd, Jurrjens, Billingsly.

    As far as Noesi… for Hamels (as unlikely as it is) or Haren, I’d give him up.

  244. Pat M. November 23rd, 2011 at 2:03 pm

    Before I head out I wanted to comment on all the hot stove speculation regarding the staff…..I think plan A, is Darvish and plan B is Wilson….I think the club would rather spend dough before trading their top young arms and that includes Hughes and Nova …..

  245. Giuseppe Franco November 23rd, 2011 at 2:07 pm

    Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 11:12 am

    Giuseppe Franco November 23rd, 2011 at 11:00 am
    Chip November 23rd, 2011 at 10:54 am

    Giuseppe Franco November 23rd, 2011 at 10:49 am
    I don’t see how anyone here can make the argument that signing a guy like Cespedes is an upgrade over Swisher when you haven’t even seen him play.

    Swisher’s production the last three years in pinstripes is more significant than his detractors want to give him credit for.

    ————

    By that same token, how can you make the argument that Cespedes isn’t an upgrade over Swisher?

    ——–

    Any GM worth a damn isn’t going to gamble by moving a guy who has been as productive as Swisher the last few years in favor of a guy who is a complete unknown.

    Cashman isn’t going to do that.

    ————

    Really? Don’t GMs do that all the time when they decide to move out a veteran player or let him walk via free agency to free up a spot for a prospect? Cespedes is no different.

    ———-

    Get real.

    We’re talking about Cashman – not just any GM. Has Cashman given us any indication whatsoever based on his history of moves the last several years that he would take a huge gamble like that on an unknown while trading one of his productive players earning a semi-reasonable salary?

    Not a chance. I know you like making trades for the hell of it but your argument doesn’t pass the smell test.

    There’s a very big difference between letting one of their own prospects that they’ve known for years win a job on the big league club than gamble like that on someone who has never played ball outside of Cuba.

    You are comparing apples to hand grenades.

  246. m November 23rd, 2011 at 2:09 pm

    I hate it when a call goes against us. But I don’t want to get too mechanized or technological.

    No, to manager challenges. Yes, to the umps using review to get a call right if the crew can’t agree on a call. No, to a computerized strike zone, but yes to a financially punitive system for calls that go outside a certain deviation of the strike zone.

    Yes, to foul, HR, and trapped balls.

    Yes, it adds time. But who the hell cares? Baseball has no clock. Get it right, without being ridiculous.

  247. RI Attorney November 23rd, 2011 at 2:13 pm

    Swish is cheap and good for 25-85. Trade him? Seriously? Come on now.

  248. m November 23rd, 2011 at 2:31 pm

    Okay, maybe you can’t fine an ump for calling a ball in the batter’s box a strike. But, put some teeth into the review system that is currently in place.

  249. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 2:42 pm

    m- thats almost my point exactly, the umpires don’t take their jobs seriously. there are plenty of systems in place already they could use to improve the strikezonet hat umpires call…

    if they cared they would be looking at video of calls between innings, or at least be corrected by someone watching. In Japan umpires are out there before games practicing the strikezone during BP, and there are 2-3 backup umpires out there also practicing their strikezone. Here, they take no pride in it… almost like they are proud they get it wrong.

  250. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 2:54 pm

    ID,

    If you’re talking about using technology to make the umpires better and using technology to get rid of the crappy umpires then Im all for that…..some of them have no business being out there because they are either too old or too bad. I just don’t want that element taken out of the game completely………helping the umpires improve is one thing…..taking them off the field entirely is another.

  251. tomingeorgia November 23rd, 2011 at 3:04 pm

    Do you install the balls and strikes machine in the Minors, too? Otherwise, God help the rookies when they get to MLB.

  252. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 3:05 pm

    blake – I never asked them to be removed from the field, only augmented so they can actually call a game right. The loonies that have to resort to hyperbole to discount my argument are the only ones that think that introducing more technology means replacing human umpires.

  253. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 3:06 pm

    god help the rookies that would be getting the strike zone called the way the umpire SHOULD HAVE BEEN CALLING IT in the minors?? i’m sure they would be so upset… lol

    tom, i don’t get your position at all.

  254. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 3:09 pm

    I don’t want to replace them on the field… i just want to take the more complicated decisions out of their hands so we are not relying on their fallability.

    Something as complicated as a hovering strike zone (where is the front of the plate? where was the ball when it crossed that imaginary line? the ump has literally no idea) and 90+mph baseballs breaking in 2 directions… its just not possible to perceive fast enough to provide an accurate call. especially since after the age of 35 your brain and eyes literally operate at a slower speed year after year. this means the older you are, the more “frames” of life you are missing, and basically making it even harder for you to accurately call a strike.

    For balls/strikes it can be as advanced as giving him and augmented reality display with a strike zone hovering in it and a dot that shows him where each pitch went… or as simple as an indicator light that flashes inside the home plate umps mask whether a ball is actually a strike or not. You still get the cursory illusion of the umpire “making the call”… but it will no longer be relying on the whims of “the human element” to make that decision. The “human element” can only be “more wrong” than reality, it is impossible to be “more right”. Human eyes are imperfect and only operate at certain speeds, people blink… heck… someone having a bad day or not can have a profound impact on the calls a ML umpire makes… and that should be eliminated from the game because I’m not here to watch the umpire.

  255. tomingeorgia November 23rd, 2011 at 3:31 pm

    ID,
    My point is that sports, like art and literature, is a human pursuit, made by humans with rules written by humans expressly to be enforced by humans. It is not a mechanistic exercise, any more then “Dancing with the Stars” is, or criminal trials, for that matter. I agree with blake, use advance technologies to weed out bad umpires, but not to call games.

  256. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 3:44 pm

    tom – basically you are saying “I support preventable errors affecting the outcome of games.”

  257. tomingeorgia November 23rd, 2011 at 3:50 pm

    ID,
    You’re right, I do. Otherwise, every conceivable statistic from the past is worthless except for home runs.

  258. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 3:50 pm

    So the sanctity of past games called under a flawed system is more important than getting calls right? Is that seriously your stance?

  259. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 3:52 pm

    “Just keep doing it wrong, we’re too deep”

    lol…

  260. LGY November 23rd, 2011 at 4:03 pm

    Do we know that an electronically engineered mask can withstand the impact of a foul ball and continue to function properly?

  261. Tar November 23rd, 2011 at 4:06 pm

    It’s part of the game. I’m all for making it better to a point (accountability, training etc ) but not eliminating the human element.

    When I was taught, and when I was a coach, part of my education was to watch the umpires for patterns and use that knowledge (as much as possible)to my advantage. ” He has a low strike zone” is an example.

    It seems like there has been a rash of bad umpiring over the last few years, I’m all for cleaning that up. But defiantly NO to a computerized strike zone.

  262. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 4:10 pm

    LGY – I’m going to guess that the impacts of space travel are slightly more jarring on electronics so… yes?

  263. LGY November 23rd, 2011 at 4:12 pm

    LGY – I’m going to guess that the impacts of space travel are slightly more jarring on electronics so… yes?

    ——–

    MLB is going to shell out for NASA engineered masks for every umpire?

  264. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 4:13 pm

    LGY – Stop being ridiculous. Electronics survive “impacts” every single day.

  265. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 4:13 pm

    You know what doesn’t survive impacts? Umpires heads.

  266. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 4:14 pm

    I can kick my computer and it still gives me 2+2=4 every single time.

    If I kick an umpire in the head, I don’t think he’ll be giving you much of anything.

  267. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 4:15 pm

    This is worrying about the wrong things again. if the mask breaks he can go get a new one out of the clubhouse. if he gets a concussion from a foul ball he can’t go get a new brain to use that day.

  268. J. Alfred Prufrock November 23rd, 2011 at 4:16 pm

    Villa Nova-Ya November 23rd, 2011 at 1:45 pm
    J Alfred Prufrock -

    These kids are so motivated, love to read about it. thanks for posting that. I think it is super cool that Betances is looking to Nova for inspiration. Very very cool.

    ****

    I Hope Everyone here has an Enjoyable Thanksgiving.
    ///

    Right back at you, Villa. Happy Thanksgiving, one and all.

  269. tomingeorgia November 23rd, 2011 at 4:20 pm

    ID,
    I don’t care about stats the way you do, obviously. I just like to watch baseball. I like some of the advanced stats, but not one of them will predict that a player will get a hit in a given pressure situation, or that a fielder will muff an easy play or make an outstanding one. The probability of a bad umpire making a bad call is measurable. What to do about is a human call.

    They are human, and you can draw all the bell charts you want. Horses don’t bet on people, because people almost never play to the mean in a given instance. Seeing that all your statistics are based on past performance, based on a “human” system of judgment, is why I just like to watch. Hope you have a wonderful Thanksgiving!

  270. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 4:25 pm

    You brought up the stats, not me. I can’t follow your argument at all. Even if you “just like to watch” that should imply you like to watch the game being played… by the players… not the umpires interpretation of the rules and how it changes the outcome of every at-bat.

  271. Jerkface November 23rd, 2011 at 4:26 pm

    The umpire could wear a monocle with a small AR display under his mask that shows the strike zone and places pitches based on the pitch fx system.

  272. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 4:28 pm

    The purpose of “rules”, such as the defining of the strike-zone in the rulebook… is so that every game being played everywhere operates under the same set of rules and regulations. A strike in NY should be a strike in LA and vice-versa.

    Allowing every umpire to call whatever strikezone they want does not meet this purpose.

    Rulebooks are written under the predetermination that those enforcing these rules are both unbiased and infallible… both of which we know to be untrue about humans in general… it really has nothing to do with baseball in particular.

  273. LGY November 23rd, 2011 at 4:29 pm

    ID

    I have issues with the umpires but I don’t think the solution is as easy as you are making it sound.

    Look at how long it took someone to develop a functional batting helmet that can withstand a 100 mph fastball?

    Now factor in having a electronic laser system added to the equation.

    I’m no engineer but I don’t think it will be an easy development process. And I’m pretty sure if they can develop a functional, lightweight, sturdy, etc. mask with the technology it will be VERY expensive.

  274. Jerkface November 23rd, 2011 at 4:30 pm

    I actually had an idea for how to do it, atleast from a programming end, but the person I contacted to design the HUD lost interest.

  275. tomingeorgia November 23rd, 2011 at 4:32 pm

    ID,
    I get your take, that technology is better than humanity. Just don’t agree, even though I’m pretty tech savvy. Baseball is a game.

    To you and everyone else, have a wonderful Thanksgiving.

  276. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 4:32 pm

    “The umpire could wear a monocle with a small AR display under his mask that shows the strike zone and places pitches based on the pitch fx system.”

    What if Carmine hacks into the system?

  277. LGY November 23rd, 2011 at 4:32 pm

    That’s interesting Face.

    Any particular reason the person you contacted lost interest?

  278. Jerkface November 23rd, 2011 at 4:32 pm

    Now factor in having a electronic laser system added to the equation.

    I’m no engineer but I don’t think it will be an easy development process.

    You’re making it harder than it has to be. They already wear nice masks. You put a piece of resistant plastic that has a simple HUD embedded which is just a box with the ability to place X’s or O’s on the surface and connect that to a wireless receiver/electronic box they clip to the back of their belt which talks to the pitchfx system. The box translates the pitchfx data into coordinates which appear on the HUD.

  279. Jerkface November 23rd, 2011 at 4:33 pm

    Any particular reason the person you contacted lost interest?

    Prolly because I didnt offer to pay them anything.

  280. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 4:34 pm

    Baseball makes lots of money, the construction/purchase of these augmented masks would be the least of their problems.

    Getting people to acknowledge the inaccuracies of the umpires as wrong and detrimental to the game is the real mountain to climb.

    Like you said, look how long it took someone to develop a batting helmet that can protect the human brain, because the human brain is squishy and prone to all sorts of mistakes and outside influences. Have you ever seen a broken computer give the wrong answer to a question? Drop a computer in water and have it tell you that 2+2=5? No, they generally work fine or do not turn on at all.

    The system itself does not have to exist inside the mask, only the display that the umpire sees. All the dirty work of figuring out the correct call would be done behind the scenes and only the result delivered to the umpire.

  281. J. Alfred Prufrock November 23rd, 2011 at 4:34 pm

    tomingeorgia November 23rd, 2011 at 3:31 pm
    ID,
    My point is that sports, like art and literature, is a human pursuit, made by humans with rules written by humans expressly to be enforced by humans. It is not a mechanistic exercise, any more then “Dancing with the Stars” is, or criminal trials, for that matter. I agree with blake, use advance technologies to weed out bad umpires, but not to call games.
    ///

    tom, that’s well said, and it reminded me of what happened AFTER Joyce blew that gimme at 1B to cost Galarraga his perfecto:

    “By now, everyone knows about the call heard around the world. It’s been played countless times on TV and the internet. It’s been discussed non-stop by every talking head and fan of the sports world.

    Everyone knows what happened on Wednesday evening.

    In case you were in a remote South African jungle village that has yet to embrace the wonders of satellite television, let me set the scene for you.

    Bottom of the ninth in Detroit. Tigers pitcher Armando Galarraga has one out left to become the 21st pitcher in MLB history to complete the perfect game. Indians infielder Jason Donald hits a routine ground ball that was cut off by Tigers first baseman Miguel Cabrera. Cabrera fielded the ball, and threw it to Galarraga who was covering first.

    Galarraga caught the ball and stepped on first and went down in the hist…not so fast!

    First base umpire, and one of the best in the game, Jim Joyce, called Donald safe at first even though he was out by a step. That call blew Galarraga’s perfect game and took his name off the record books.

    After the game, Joyce retreated back to the locker room and watched replays of the now infamous call. He broke down in tears as he realized Donald was out. Joyce was so distraught that he requested to speak with Galarraga. The pair even shared hugs.

    Today, Joyce was behind the plate for a matinee tilt between the Tigers and Indians. Walking out onto the field, Joyce was obviously in tears. He didn’t even try to hide it. Fortunately, the Detroit faithful didn’t drown the poor guy in a chorus of boos, and instead gave him a warm round of applause as he stood by home plate.

    Then, instead of Jim Leyland handing Joyce the lineup card, a forgiving Armando Galarraga walked out from the dugout and handed the card to a crying Jim Joyce and the two greeted each other. Finally, Galarraga retreated back to the Tigers dugout to a loud ovation.

    http://bleacherreport.com/arti.....tory-books

  282. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 4:34 pm

    So cyborg umpires?

  283. Nick in SF November 23rd, 2011 at 4:36 pm

    I like the idea of a monocle if they also have a top hat and cane. I’ve mocked up a crude prototype:

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wi.....peanut.png

  284. LGY November 23rd, 2011 at 4:36 pm

    Aren’t there consistency issues from park to park with the pitch FX system?

    MLB would really have to refine it if they are going to overhaul the umpire system.

  285. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 4:37 pm

    Can they use instant replay now to give Galaraga his perfect game?

  286. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 4:38 pm

    prufrock – that the men can get together afterwards and be civil is a great show of solidarity and understanding… and that could have all been avoided and deemed unnecessary if the tools to make the proper call were in place.

    If you had to ask Galarraga if he would take his perfect game or Jim joyce’s apology… which do you think he would choose?

  287. J. Alfred Prufrock November 23rd, 2011 at 4:40 pm

    blake, what he lost in perfection he gained in grace ;).

    Have a great Thanksgiving.

  288. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 4:41 pm

    JAP,

    Both guys handled the whole thing unbelievablely well……he will be remembered forever regardless

  289. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 4:42 pm

    Happy Thanksgiving to you as well also!

  290. Jerkface November 23rd, 2011 at 4:43 pm

    Aren’t there consistency issues from park to park with the pitch FX system?

    MLB would really have to refine it if they are going to overhaul the umpire system.

    Well I’d rather the consistency issue be something fixable than be about human brains/egos. Its silly to say ‘well pitchfx isnt perfect so lets do nothing’. You overhaul both. And pitchfx being ‘off’ is already better than most human umpires.

  291. J. Alfred Prufrock November 23rd, 2011 at 4:43 pm

    ID, he may have preferred to have his name in the record books, but instead he received a much greater opportunity, and he really showed the world the real meaning of grace under pressure.

    Happy Holidays, Lohud.

  292. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 4:44 pm

    SI_JonHeyman 27 mins slot numbers for 1st 6 picks r $7.2M, 6.2M, 5.2M, 4.2M, 3.5M, 3.2M. final pick of 1st round will have $1.6M slot. #cba

  293. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 4:50 pm

    If they had allowed the trading of draft picks…..it would have made it all more tolerable…..and would have made the whole thing more fun.

  294. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 4:52 pm

    Although they would have to be sure and not tell Randy Levine that they coukd just trade e draft picks for players.

  295. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 4:52 pm

    LGY – As far as I know the only inconsistencies are where the strike-zone is painted in the system, because it is not used for live umpiring it is not calibrated as often as it should be (probably true of the entire system). jerkfaces idea of just dumping PitchFX into a display is not so much of an actual solution, but a good idea in the right direction. Something built like PitchFX, but with software designed to provide the data to the umpires we are requesting (rather than trying to shoehorn the current system) is simply a matter of implementation and programming. The system would have to be re-written to do all of the things it needs to do, as it is not designed for that today.

    What we do know is that the technology they already use pinpoints the ball to less than 1 inch in space, something the human eye simply cannot do.

    i’m curious, when people watch games on TBS in the postseason and they have the strikezone up… do you look at it and go “pffft the computer was probably wrong” all the time? What makes you think that?

  296. Jerkface November 23rd, 2011 at 4:53 pm

    The system would have to be re-written to do all of the things it needs to do, as it is not designed for that today.

    Not really, if you trust the pitchfx data you already have all the coordinates. You don’t have to re-write anything.

  297. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 4:56 pm

    jerkface – Well, I want it to adjust the strike zone per batter as it is written in the rulebook.

  298. Jerkface November 23rd, 2011 at 4:57 pm

    jerkface – Well, I want it to adjust the strike zone per batter as it is written in the rulebook.

    You could easily add height indicators or allow the umpires to call it based on where the balls land in the ‘zone’.

  299. Irreverent Discourse November 23rd, 2011 at 4:58 pm

    Jerkface – Certainly… I was also thinking that every player could have “strike zone” calibrated maybe once a year in ST… and then it could be loaded no matter what park they are in.

  300. Red Robin November 23rd, 2011 at 5:52 pm

    How come there are no more

    10,000-word essays on this site on the PSU/Poterno scandal ?

    Indulge me , someone please put up a

    10,000 word post on the subject .

  301. Red Robin November 23rd, 2011 at 5:54 pm

    Time for that new post , Mr. Heyman .

  302. RhapsodyInBlue November 23rd, 2011 at 7:06 pm

    Must be a street loaded with Thanksgiving travelers driving double duty somewhere close that Red Rectum can play on.

  303. RadioKev November 23rd, 2011 at 7:33 pm

    I’ve been hoping for a Garza trade since last years trade deadline. I’d rather have him over Danks.

  304. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 8:44 pm

    Only thing is that Garza will cost more than Danks……I would like to know the pricetag though.

  305. djsunyc November 23rd, 2011 at 8:46 pm

    I don’t see how anyone here can make the argument that signing a guy like Cespedes is an upgrade over Swisher when you haven’t even seen him play.

    Swisher’s production the last three years in pinstripes is more significant than his detractors want to give him credit for.

    —————

    what is the objective? b/c there are different courses of action based on the team’s objectives.

    swisher is a very solid regular season player. he helps us make the playoffs. the question is whether you can find an OF that can do a good enough job to also get into the postseason and then actually perform in the postseason. both things are very difficult to find.

    we know what we have in swisher. both regular season AND unfortunately, postseason. so the question is whether you are ready to look at other options b/c if the ultimate objective is the world series, then we know swisher is not going to help you there once october starts.

  306. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 9:29 pm

    Joel Sherman @Joelsherman1

    I heard #Yankees signed utilityman Jayson Nix to a minor league contract with an invite to minor league camp.

    9 minutes ago via TweetDeck

  307. Giuseppe Franco November 23rd, 2011 at 9:45 pm

    djsunyc November 23rd, 2011 at 8:46 pm

    I don’t see how anyone here can make the argument that signing a guy like Cespedes is an upgrade over Swisher when you haven’t even seen him play.

    Swisher’s production the last three years in pinstripes is more significant than his detractors want to give him credit for.

    —————

    what is the objective? b/c there are different courses of action based on the team’s objectives.

    swisher is a very solid regular season player. he helps us make the playoffs. the question is whether you can find an OF that can do a good enough job to also get into the postseason and then actually perform in the postseason. both things are very difficult to find.

    we know what we have in swisher. both regular season AND unfortunately, postseason. so the question is whether you are ready to look at other options b/c if the ultimate objective is the world series, then we know swisher is not going to help you there once october starts.

    ——–

    So the alternative to Swisher is signing a complete unknown in Cespedes? That’s not exactly a sound strategy for a team built to compete for a WS every season.

    The Yankees know what Swisher is going to do for them. They don’t know if Cespedes is a Triple-A player or a major league All Star.

    That is why you’re not going to see them take such a gamble with RF when they already have a stable and productive player for that position at a semi-reasonable cost.

    I wouldn’t have any issues if they signed Cespedes and let him compete with Swisher or Gardner for playing time. That’s a fair argument (albeit, one that’s not likely to happen due to cost).

    But there’s no chance they are just going to move Swisher and give Cespedes the starting RF job when they don’t even know if he can play at the major league level.

    Signing Beltran is also not going to happen because of his age, decreased range, durability, and demands for a multi-year contract.

    Whether Yankee fans like Swisher or not, they are going to have to accept that he’s going to be the starting RF again in 2012.

  308. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 9:57 pm

    Yanks offered Freddy arbitration……good move.

  309. djsunyc November 23rd, 2011 at 9:58 pm

    not necessarily cespedes by himself. i wouldn’t mind doing an RF by committee approach…

  310. blake November 23rd, 2011 at 10:01 pm

    Sign Cespedes and keep Swisher to start the year…..then see how goes

  311. tucker November 24th, 2011 at 12:08 am

    Yanks nearing deal with Freddy Garcia. Probably a smart move:
    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/.....qus_thread

  312. m November 24th, 2011 at 12:26 am

    Jason Nix? Nunez’s replacement? :P

  313. GreenBeret7 November 24th, 2011 at 2:03 am

    Nix is a fill-in at AAA in case Chavez out prices himself. He plays so positions that well and although he has power, not an especially good hitter. He’s insurance. As for Garcia? Why not? He’s at least a good draft pick.

  314. jacksquat November 24th, 2011 at 2:18 am

    CC – Nova – Garcia – AJ – Hughes doesn’t seem like enough unless AJ and Hughes are going to pitch much better than last year.

  315. GreenBeret7 November 24th, 2011 at 2:22 am

    He plays ***no*** positions that well

  316. GreenBeret7 November 24th, 2011 at 2:25 am

    Instead of focusing on just 3 starts at the start of Hughes season, starting looking at the rest of his starts after he was finally healthy. 3 three bad starts after returning not withstanding, he pitxhed extrmely well, mostly great.

  317. GreenBeret7 November 24th, 2011 at 2:52 am

    he ***pitched extremely*** well, mostly great.

  318. blake November 24th, 2011 at 7:42 am

    Happy Thanksgiving everyone!

    Glad to have Freddy back……think that’s a very good decision.

    Nix isn’t very good…..but he’s depth and that’s something Cash has really started pursuing lately…..depth in the rotation and on the bench.

  319. Joe from Long Island November 24th, 2011 at 8:10 am

    Good morning, and Happy Thanksgiving, all.

    Nix is a good insurance move, and here’s hoping Freddy re-ups.

    I would be for signing this Cespesdes guy, but I wouldn’t break the bank, and I’d let him come to camp and show what he’s got, rather than hand him a job.

  320. LGY November 24th, 2011 at 8:23 am

    Yanks nearing deal with Freddy Garcia.

    ———–

    Yay Chief.

    I don’t think Cash stops there with the rotation. AJ or Hughes won’t be back IMO.

  321. blake November 24th, 2011 at 8:35 am

    LGY,

    If they aquire another starter then there wont be room for both Hughes and AJ. My guess is that Cashman his going to try very hard this winter to find a taker for Burnett.

    Ideal scenario you have Hughes and Noesi fight it out in ST for the 5th spot……

    Sabathia, Nova, pitcher x, Garcia, Hughes/Noesi would be very strong.

  322. MaineYankee November 24th, 2011 at 8:45 am

    Good morning.

    Happy Thanksgiving.

    LGY

    Which one won’t be back?

    If that’s the case my guess would be A.J.

    I think they need to see if Hughes can meet his potential.

  323. blake November 24th, 2011 at 8:48 am

    If the Braves coukd trade Lowe then Cashman should be able to trade AJ IF Hal is willing to eat some money

  324. Erin November 24th, 2011 at 9:11 am

    Happy Thanksgiving LoHudders! :)

  325. Red Robin November 24th, 2011 at 9:12 am

    Hello ….. Any one here ?

  326. MaineYankee November 24th, 2011 at 9:20 am

    Erin

    My wife is a Junior Mint lover as well.

    She didn’t seem to know of the Christmas ones.

    Maybe you can enlighten her seeing you’re an expert. :D:

  327. blake November 24th, 2011 at 9:21 am

    Good turkey rub:

    1/8 cup of each per turkey breast. Double for whole bird.

    Seasoning salt
    Black pepper
    Ionized salt
    Lemon leper
    Cayenne pepper

    Rinse turkey and pat dry. Cover whole turkey and rub into the skin. Put in grocery bag and then into a large bowl and refrigerate over night (or a few hours).

    Cook 4 minutes per lb in 350 degree peanut oil. Mmmmm

  328. spidanyc November 24th, 2011 at 9:23 am

    According to David Waldstein of the New York Times, the Yankees are nearing a one-year deal with Freddy Garcia.
    Garcia was offered arbitration by the Yankees late Wednesday night after posting a surprising 3.62 and 1.36 WHIP ERA over 146 2/3 innings during the 2011 regular season. He’s likely to see a significant raise from his $1.5 million 2011 salary. The Red Sox were known to have some amount of free agent interest in him.
    ——————————————————————————————————————–

    Really? So the Yankees are most likely gonna havethe same rotations as last year. I guess Yankee brass is consent with a 1st round playoff exit again. Should have let Freddy sign with another team and net a draft pick.

  329. Erin November 24th, 2011 at 9:25 am

    MaineYankee- your wife is a very smart woman. This year I believe there are peppermint flakes on top of the mints. Very festive. :)

  330. MaineYankee November 24th, 2011 at 9:33 am

    Erin

    Last year she found some with red centers but she hasn’t seen the ones you mentioned.

    As far as her being smart, I think it’s obvious seeing the choice she made. :lol:

  331. Erin November 24th, 2011 at 9:34 am

    Parade alert: I believe Joba will be making an appearance at the Macy’s parade.

  332. Erin November 24th, 2011 at 9:38 am

    MaineYankee-yeah, I haven’t spotted the red centers this year either. They must be changing it up this year

  333. Yankee Trader November 24th, 2011 at 9:39 am

    Happy Thanksgiving Day everyone.

    Why aren’t you watching the Macy’s Day Parade??

  334. austinmac November 24th, 2011 at 9:41 am

    Happy Thanksgiving everyone. Let’s all remember the good things in our life today.

  335. Erin November 24th, 2011 at 9:43 am

    Yankee Trader- hasn’t started for central time zoners yet. ;)

  336. Erin November 24th, 2011 at 9:47 am

    Scratch that- I guess it has started showing, but not on NBC which is my preferred channel to view it on. :P

  337. Bret The Hitman November 24th, 2011 at 9:48 am

    Hartnett: Yankees Can Meet Oakland’s Price For Gio Gonzalez

    Deal Built Around Montero And Betances Could Land Gonzalez

    November 22, 2011 2:21 PM

    “Gonzalez is believed to be a long-term target of Brian Cashman, who was rumored to have checked on Gonzalez’s availability near last season’s July trade deadline.”

    http://newyork.cbslocal.com/20.....-gonzalez/

    ************

    This article also claims Cashman shot down ATL for Eduardo Nunez:

    n offer built around Betances and either Eduardo Nunez or Jesus Montero could be what Beane desires. Nunez is able to compete right away with Scott Sizemore and Cliff Pennington for a spot on the left side of the A’s infield. The Atlanta Braves inquired about Nunez’s availability but were shot down by Cashman who had no interest in dealing away Nunez for Jair Jurrjens who has suffered from recurring knee issues.

    Cashman has been reluctant to move Nunez whom he rates highly but Montero could make sense for Oakland. The A’s desperately need a long-term power bat and Montero exactly the kind of hitter they’re desperate to add. Beane could slot Montero into the vacant DH spot immediately or season him in the minors between catcher and first base to determine which position would be his best fit.

  338. Baseball Mogul November 24th, 2011 at 9:54 am

    I don’t think Cashman trades Montero after invoking the names of Cabrera and Manny in comparison and inferring that Cliff Lee was a special case.

  339. Joe from Long Island November 24th, 2011 at 10:09 am

    1. I’m sure that adding banuelos and Hughes to that package of montero and betances could absolutely get it done. So what? Just because Billy beane wants it doesn’t make it going to happen.

    2. The As want montero to address their longterm offensive problems, but the Yankees don’t have that worry?

  340. Joe from Long Island November 24th, 2011 at 10:13 am

    If absolutely pressed, I would agree to a deal of aj Burnett and Francisco cervelli for hip Gonzalez. That would absolutely work for me. ;)

    Happy thanksgiving Brett.

  341. RadioKev November 24th, 2011 at 10:14 am

    Writers suggesting Cashman would move Montero for Gio Gonzalez are clueless.

    On that note..Happy Thanksgiving!

  342. pat November 24th, 2011 at 10:28 am

    Happy Thanksgiving LoHudders. Enjoy your day.

  343. austinmac November 24th, 2011 at 10:31 am

    I don’t see Cashman considering Montero for Gonzalez. He would move Betances, I believe. A second piece, an offensive player, would also be needed. Personally, I would include Nunez even though I think he will be a good player. One must give to get.

    Betances is only two years younger than Gonzalez. Gonzalez has some control issues, but Betances has major issues with control. We don’t know if he will ever overcome then. If he does, admittedly, he could also be very good.

  344. RadioKev November 24th, 2011 at 10:31 am

    I’ll also be surprised if Phil is moved this off season. He’d only be traded for a pitcher unquestionably better than he. Who is it? I wouldn’t count Danks as he just came off of an down season and he’s a rental – Hughes has more value than that. Is Gio Gonzalez unquestionably better than Hughes? Is Jurrjens? Whoever it is, I don’t think he’s currently on the market.

  345. disco stu November 24th, 2011 at 10:33 am

    I would hate to lose Montero, even if it does bring back Gio Gonzalez … someone who I have thought would be a great pickup for the Yankees.

    But there have been reports that the organization is split on Montero’s long term future with the Yankees because of his defensive inadequacies at catcher and it is not as if he is going to ST next year with a chance to win the starting catcher’s job (Martin may be here for another contract for all we know).

    So if his role on the team projects to back up catcher and DH (which wont be full time because the Yankees are on record saying that they will be using the DH spot on many days as way to give vets like Tex, Arod, Jeter, and Cano days off in the field), then maybe they are of the belief that now may be the best chance they have to bring back a big piece in exchange for him.

    But to give up BOTH Montero and either Banuelos/Betances would be a lot … maybe Cashman can hold out for more quantity than quality … keep the Killer B’s and try and increase the package of prospects and have Beane choose from a list of Warren, Phelps, Mitchell, Hall etc.

  346. Joe from Long Island November 24th, 2011 at 10:35 am

    RadioKev- Happy Thanksgiving. I tend to agree with you about Hughes.

  347. Nick in SF November 24th, 2011 at 10:36 am

    “Parade alert: I believe Joba will be making an appearance at the Macy’s parade.”

    Wow, he’d better get to the fat farm asap.

  348. DONNYBROOK November 24th, 2011 at 10:39 am

    NO way Montero is included inna Gio deal. Cash would be nuts to include a Killer B. Give Beane a lower level arm, one of the kid catchers, (or Cervelli if that’s their preference), and a minor league bat. As long as Darvish is in play, Beane has NO LEVERAGE with the Yanks, who have the $$$ to win the bidding. Besides, what exactly do the Yanks gain by giving up a Killer B to get Gio. The Killer B’s should be roughly where Gio is in 2 seasons. Not worth it. Darvish is gonna cramp Beane’s style for awhile.

  349. RadioKev November 24th, 2011 at 10:44 am

    With Montero, I’ve said this all along, Cashman would be foolish to come down off of Montero’s market value. He got an agreement with Jack Z for a Montero/Cliff Lee trade, and clearly they made the wrong prospect decision. Montero is worth a Cliff Lee quality pitcher (although it would have been a rental).

    Now I wouldn’t mind Gio Gonzalez at the right price, but Montero is too good for him. Gonzalez isn’t a top shelf pitcher right now, he’s as much of a prospect as Montero is. I’d only trade Montero for a sure thing.

    Cashman was wise not to bite on the Jimenez deal, I can’t imagine him taking the bait this time around.

  350. RadioKev November 24th, 2011 at 10:46 am

    Eh, I don’t think Betances will definitely have as much success as Gio Gonzalez. He’s also got control problems. At least Gio has proven he can hang around at worst.

  351. MaineYankee November 24th, 2011 at 10:46 am

    disco stu

    I’m not sure I’d put much stock in the reports on how the Yankees view Montero and his ability to catch.

    If the Yankees thought he might be someone they would trade I don’t think they would be publicly downgrading his ability to catch.

  352. Erin November 24th, 2011 at 10:47 am

    Nick- :D

  353. DONNYBROOK November 24th, 2011 at 10:48 am

    Should Phil The Phenom get dealt, Cash would probably deal him outta the AL. If Hughes should pan out after being dealt, the haunting reminder for seasons to come would make Cashman look like George C. Scott agonizing over what ultimately became of Tiny Tim.

  354. austinmac November 24th, 2011 at 10:49 am

    Beane has plenty of leverage from many other teams desire for Gonzalez and his relatively low cost. I don’t want the Sox to add him, and yes they could.

    No one knows if Darvish will be posted, and then no idea in a blind bid they would get a chance to sign him. I do not want the current rotation to be the one that starts the year.

  355. Gary November 24th, 2011 at 10:50 am

    RadioKev November 24th, 2011 at 10:31 am
    I’ll also be surprised if Phil is moved this off season. He’d only be traded for a pitcher unquestionably better than he. Who is it? I wouldn’t count Danks as he just came off of an down season and he’s a rental – Hughes has more value than that. Is Gio Gonzalez unquestionably better than Hughes? Is Jurrjens? Whoever it is, I don’t think he’s currently on the market.

    ___________________________________________________________________________

    Morning, happy T’day and three NFL games!!!

    At this point given all the comments from the front office I’d be surprised if anyone gets moved. The commentary has been pretty uniform that the team is pretty set so I expect the same guys to go do battle again with the same outcome if they get to the playoffs. So we all need to all get used to the fact that it will be the same team out there next year. Most of these guys are in at least their 30′s and some have crossed that great divide past the mid 30′s. It’s going to be a few years before the many of these positions get turned over to someone else, I’m not very optomistic about the next few years.

  356. yankee21 November 24th, 2011 at 10:52 am

    No way can Cashman even remotely consider moving Montero for GIO. That would be the height of stupidity to give up Montero for a likely #3 starter in the AL East. I wouldn’t even trade him straight up much less as part of some idiot reporters potential package that would “get it done”.

    I wouldn’t hesitate putting Betances in a deal for GIO though. Perhaps a deal centered on Nova or Noesi and Betances could pull it off and add AAA 1b/DH Vazguez to sweeten the pot.

  357. Gary November 24th, 2011 at 10:53 am

    austinmac November 24th, 2011 at 10:49 am
    Beane has plenty of leverage from many other teams desire for Gonzalez and his relatively low cost. I don’t want the Sox to add him, and yes they could.

    No one knows if Darvish will be posted, and then no idea in a blind bid they would get a chance to sign him. I do not want the current rotation to be the one that starts the year.

    ___________________________________________________________________________

    Boy I would second that (the rotation) given how the pitchers have pitched in the last two years and the pathetic offense in the offseason the only chance is to have a lockdown staff like Andy, CC , and AJ did the last time we won the big show.

  358. Yankee Trader November 24th, 2011 at 10:55 am

    Joba in parade right now

  359. Yankee Trader November 24th, 2011 at 10:56 am

    Joba+Snoopy for a Gio

  360. RadioKev November 24th, 2011 at 10:57 am

    I’m sitting in an airport right now. That’s why I’m so quickly responding to things – what else to do? :P

    Gary, happy thanksgiving. I’m extremely optimistic about the Yankees next season. It looks like a more dynamic team than the 2009 Yankees, no? Of A-Rod is healthy (if) we should be good. Maybe Tex hit rock bottom last season (can it get worse?). Our bullpen could be even better this season. Is the rotation any worse than last season? No lightning in a bottle Colon, but a healthy Phil Hughes and a full season of Nova could be even better.

    And if Montero has a solid season as a line up regular, we should have a stronger offense.

    Think about it like this. On paper who has a better team entering the season? Maybe the Rangers? Phillies and Red Sox have some serious questions.

  361. Gary November 24th, 2011 at 10:57 am

    yankee21 November 24th, 2011 at 10:52 am
    No way can Cashman even remotely consider moving Montero for GIO. That would be the height of stupidity to give up Montero for a likely #3 starter in the AL East. I wouldn’t even trade him straight up much less as part of some idiot reporters potential package that would “get it done”.

    I wouldn’t hesitate putting Betances in a deal for GIO though. Perhaps a deal centered on Nova or Noesi and Betances could pull it off and add AAA 1b/DH Vazguez to sweeten the pot.

    ____________________________________________________________________________

    Montero is not going anywhere, he is at least the DH for next year. If he isn’t the DH then who is?

    I’ve said several times that in order to get anyone the Yanks will have to part with a player or two that they won’t part with. Hence my non optomisim that any high impact trade gets done. Better hope they get somebody on the FA market, it’s the best shot.

  362. MaineYankee November 24th, 2011 at 11:04 am

    Yankee Trader November 24th, 2011 at 10:56 am
    Joba+Snoopy for a Gio

    ————————————————————————-

    If you do that you need to get Yankee Snoopy from Erica.

    Good luck with that. I’ve tried without any success.

  363. Gary November 24th, 2011 at 11:07 am

    RadioKev November 24th, 2011 at 10:57 am
    I’m sitting in an airport right now. That’s why I’m so quickly responding to things – what else to do?

    Gary, happy thanksgiving. I’m extremely optimistic about the Yankees next season. It looks like a more dynamic team than the 2009 Yankees, no? Of A-Rod is healthy (if) we should be good. Maybe Tex hit rock bottom last season (can it get worse?). Our bullpen could be even better this season. Is the rotation any worse than last season? No lightning in a bottle Colon, but a healthy Phil Hughes and a full season of Nova could be even better.

    And if Montero has a solid season as a line up regular, we should have a stronger offense.

    Think about it like this. On paper who has a better team entering the season? Maybe the Rangers? Phillies and Red Sox have some serious questions.

    ____________________________________________________________________________

    Hope so, but I’m sure not that optomistic. These guys never showup in the playoffs and there is quite a bit of data out there. I really hope ARod comes backs and does well, but you know with the injury thing there always are injuries who else might go down.

    As far as Tex it will become known fairly quickly is it’s a different Tex. If he doesn’t change his approach and become effective at it they are just going to continue getting him out. Swisher I just think they are going to get him out anyways. I hope Grandy and Cano can repeat the years they had we will need them. I guess my point alot of things need to go right.

  364. mick November 24th, 2011 at 11:09 am

    joba is a legend in his own mind..

  365. DONNYBROOK November 24th, 2011 at 11:11 am

    I’d love to play some poker with you Nervous Nellies. Darvish is Cashman’s ace-in-the-hole. Whether Cash is a serious player for Darvish or not, whether Cash wins the bidding, whether Cash signs the guy after winning the bidding is IRRELEVANT. Perception is reality when your going eyeball to eyeball with Shallow pocket teams\GM’s like Beane. The Yankee farm system is loaded and Highly regarded making them one of the Few teams Beane can go to concerning Gio. And Gio aint no sure bet. He is no Cliff Lee, which is the way some of you are approaching this. Cashman has a TON of leverage should he belly up to the bar concerning Gio. Now, should Darvish vanish from the radar screen, THEN Cashman’s advantage diminishes appreciably. As in life, timing is everything.

  366. RadioKev November 24th, 2011 at 11:12 am

    Yeah, but a lot of things have to go right for any team to win the World Series. Even the best teams need to stay healthy to make it, never mind the lucky teams like The Giants and The Cards.

  367. Yankee Trader November 24th, 2011 at 11:12 am

    Maine-

    A very happy Thanksgiving day to you and your family.

    Where is Erica these days?

    Joba was on TV for a split second in the Macy’s parade followed by the Snoopy baloon and float.
    Maybe we could substitute Elmo for Snoopy in the trade for Gio, but then I’ll have Erin mad at me!! :)

  368. yankeefeminista November 24th, 2011 at 11:17 am

    Happy Thanksgiving, Yankee people.

    Just a drive by to say:

    lol, Betances AND Montero for Gio? Um, I don’t think so. Montero isn’t going anywhere. And it’s interesting the way Betances’ control is blown way out of proportion while Gio has a mlb career walk rate of 4.44/9. In Gio’s last year of milb, he walked 5.02. Also, Gio was actually better vs. righties than lefties in 2011 and his numbers against the AL East were not very good.

  369. Gary November 24th, 2011 at 11:18 am

    RadioKev November 24th, 2011 at 11:12 am
    Yeah, but a lot of things have to go right for any team to win the World Series. Even the best teams need to stay healthy to make it, never mind the lucky teams like The Giants and The Cards.

    ____________________________________________________________________________

    I don’t really consider the Cards lucky. They had to play ball the last week and a half as opposed to the Yanks who took it off and then played the same way in the playoffs. They also went out and beat the Phillies with Carpenter 1-0 in the last game vrs Halliday. I think the way they played to get into the playoffs and then win three series on the road against the Phils, Brewers, and Rangers to take the WS you were the best team out there.

  370. Yankee Trader November 24th, 2011 at 11:18 am

    DONNYBROOK-

    IF, Yu Darvish wishes to be posted and is granted that wish by the Nippon Ham Fighters, until he’s signed sealed and delivered to a team{Yankees}, it could take 5-6 weeks. Cashman should have most of his rotation settled or waiting on Darvish could be a mistake.

    So work on the rotation and bid on Darvish if posted.

  371. Gary November 24th, 2011 at 11:20 am

    Yankee Trader November 24th, 2011 at 11:12 am
    Maine-

    A very happy Thanksgiving day to you and your family.

    Where is Erica these days?

    Joba was on TV for a split second in the Macy’s parade followed by the Snoopy baloon and float.
    Maybe we could substitute Elmo for Snoopy in the trade for Gio, but then I’ll have Erin mad at me!!
    ____________________________________________________________________________

    Can’t wait to see what the Joba Rules part 2 will be with him coming off his injury.

  372. Yanksgal07 November 24th, 2011 at 11:21 am

    Happy Thanksgiving to one and all on the blog …especially Chad…:). If you are traveling have a safe trip and always be thankful for family and friends…the greatest gifts of all. I’m also VERY thankful I’m a Yankee fan!!!

    Don’t forget to gobble, gobble, gobble as Thanksgiving is calorie free (that’s my story and I’m sticking with it…haha)

    Have a great day …ENJOY !!!!

    Go Yankees 2012 !!!!

  373. Yankee Trader November 24th, 2011 at 11:21 am

    Yankeefem-
    Happy Thanksgiving.

    Gio was rocked in YS, Fenway and the Rogers Center in his only appearance there. Relies on fastball and curveball with 5% CU’s.
    Could he be another AJ?

  374. Gary November 24th, 2011 at 11:23 am

    Yankee Trader November 24th, 2011 at 11:18 am
    DONNYBROOK-

    IF, Yu Darvish wishes to be posted and is granted that wish by the Nippon Ham Fighters, until he’s signed sealed and delivered to a team{Yankees}, it could take 5-6 weeks. Cashman should have most of his rotation settled or waiting on Darvish could be a mistake.

    So work on the rotation and bid on Darvish if posted.
    ___________________________________________________________________________

    If they go after him I’m sure it will be with the absolute intent to do whatever it takes to get it done. It will be hard to have a plan B unless they have two SP slots they want to fill. They can’t do anything about the wait, several teams if he comes out will be in the same boat.

  375. J. Alfred Prufrock November 24th, 2011 at 11:24 am

    Happy Thanksgiving, folks.

    Seeing Betances’ name so cavalierly thrown about this blog as trade bait speaks of the complete lack of familiarity some fans have with this guy, so in the interest of balance: Betances has two secondary offerings that blow Gio Gonzalez out of the water, including the curveball.

    He also throws a 2-seamer and a cutter very effectively to go with a heater that, when he’s reasonably commanding it, is something Gio Gonzalez could only dream about.

    If Cashman wants to go for cost control and handedness over potential greatness – and a RHP who has always had a great plan of attack and success against LHB – then I guess he can do that, but it would be a mistake, IMO, because that tall kid with the lightning arm, and the best FB, CB, and changeup in the entire Yankee system, has pitched over large chunks of the calendar without big command issues.

    He did it in 2010, both in Tampa and Trenton – for the latter, I was there and SAW it, so I know he can do that. Who knows when the Yankees will be in position again to draft a play of his sky high upside potential.

    I’m not even going to insult Cashman by addressing trading a Killer B AND Montero for Gio.
    ///

    P.S. I thought I’d surprise my wife with a pumpkin pie (made with coconut milk – unreal). The crust was an unmitigated disaster, but the filling was “outstanding”, as she noted; she’s a glass half full kind of gal. In any case, I have a newfound respect and awe for the seasoned pastry chef, thanks to this humbling experience. My crust could have cracked a tooth; I apparently didn’t properly distribute the half butter/half coconut oil that the recipe I used promised would produce the flakiest of crusts.

    Good health and good eating to one and all today!

  376. Red Robin November 24th, 2011 at 11:25 am

    PeteAbe working today :

    ” The Red Sox also offered arbitration to right-handed reliever Dan Wheeler, a Type B free agent. If Ortiz signs with another team, the Red Sox would receive two draft picks as compensation. Wheeler would return one. The Sox are already getting two picks in return for Jonathan Papelbon, who signed with the Phillies. “

  377. Yankee Trader November 24th, 2011 at 11:25 am

    Gary-

    If Joba comes back in shape, hope he gets prepped to be a starter again. The Yankees can find some other 6th inning reliever!

    Have a great Thanksgiving day.

  378. Gary November 24th, 2011 at 11:27 am

    P.S. I thought I’d surprise my wife with a pumpkin pie (made with coconut milk – unreal). The crust was an unmitigated disaster, but the filling was “outstanding”, as she noted; she’s a glass half full kind of gal. In any case, I have a newfound respect and awe for the seasoned pastry chef, thanks to this humbling experience. My crust could have cracked a tooth; I apparently didn’t properly distribute the half butter/half coconut oil that the recipe I used promised would produce the flakiest of crusts.

    Good health and good eating to one and all today!

    ____________________________________________________________________________

    My mom made fantastic crust and pies, we never have been able to capture the same result no matter what we do. We have buying those Pilsbury crusts in the refrigerated section, actually they are very good and pretty close. Alot less mess too. :-)

  379. DONNYBROOK November 24th, 2011 at 11:28 am

    CJ Wilson is tied at the hip to Darvish. I expect him to be out there roughly as long as Darvish. That gives the Yanks 2 options for a while. AND, should the Yanks dump AJ, the Rotation is immediately better BEFORE they even fill that hole. Addition by subtraction. You guys are too jumpy, and you want everything done yesterday. You gotta realize Your the guy holding ALL the cards, and I’m not even gonna get into the $$$ aspect. When you gotta ton of more chips than your opponent(s), you push ‘em all over the place. The new CBA is doing it’s best to remove this advantage, so the Yanks need to use this weapon while it can.

  380. RadioKev November 24th, 2011 at 11:28 am

    On paper it was very unlikely the Cardinals made the playoffs, beat the Phillies, and beat the Rangers. Particularly the Rangers, who I think most people would say, were the better team.

    The on paper stuff doesn’t always work out, the games need to be played and crazy stuff happens in baseball. But the best a GM can do is set up the best team on paper.

  381. Yankee Trader November 24th, 2011 at 11:31 am

    Good health and good eating to one and all today!
    ——————————————————–

    Pies, sweet potato souffle, stuffing, turkey………………

    For one day it’s good eating and hope to stay healthy! :)

  382. Gary November 24th, 2011 at 11:31 am

    DONNYBROOK November 24th, 2011 at 11:28 am
    CJ Wilson is tied at the hip to Darvish. I expect him to be out there roughly as long as Darvish. That gives the Yanks 2 options for a while. AND, should the Yanks dump AJ, the Rotation is immediately better BEFORE they even fill that hole. Addition by subtraction. You guys are too jumpy, and you want everything done yesterday. You gotta realize Your the guy holding ALL the cards, and I’m not even gonna get into the $$$ aspect. When you gotta ton of more chips than your opponent(s), you push ‘em all over the place. The new CBA is doing it’s best to remove this advantage, so the Yanks need to use this weapon while it can.

    ____________________________________________________________________________

    I’m wondering if the Nathan/Felix flip flop sends a real signal that Wilson is gone. I have always thought he stays a Ranger, now I’m not so convinced.

  383. Red Robin November 24th, 2011 at 11:32 am

    ” Budget-minded shoppers will be racing for bargains at ever-earlier hours while the rich mostly will not be bothering to leave home. “

  384. yankeefeminista November 24th, 2011 at 11:32 am

    YT, Happy T-Day you too! And this is what I mean about Gio. I think we become too enamored of other team’s shiny toys. Why can’t we just try to develop/fix our own, instead of turning them into RP’s. ;)

    Pruf, :lol:

    Gary, bet your mom’s crusts were better! ;)

  385. Red Robin November 24th, 2011 at 11:33 am

    Low- and middle-income shoppers ?are the folks that are really getting squeezed ? in the third quarter of this year, real incomes actually declined and the savings rate declined … ?

  386. Red Robin November 24th, 2011 at 11:34 am

    ” At Saks Fifth Avenue and other luxury stores, full-price selling has generally been increasing. “

  387. DONNYBROOK November 24th, 2011 at 11:34 am

    Pay the $$$ and get an Edwards cream pie. Go 1st Class and stop the skin-flint stuff. It’s embarassing onna Yankee Blog.

  388. Red Robin November 24th, 2011 at 11:34 am

    ” High-end retailers ?don?t have to do anything desperate ? it?s kind of hard to see a 5 a.m. queue outside of a Fifth Avenue luxury retailer,? said Chris Donnelly, a senior executive in Accenture?s retail practice. ?If you don?t have to put it on sale and people are still going to buy it, why put it on sale?? “

  389. Red Robin November 24th, 2011 at 11:35 am

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11.....rs.html?hp

  390. yankeefeminista November 24th, 2011 at 11:35 am

    Gary, you have to wonder if Texas would be content going with so much young pitching though. I’d think they would add some insurance policy pitcher if they let CJ go.

  391. J. Alfred Prufrock November 24th, 2011 at 11:36 am

    My mom made fantastic crust and pies, we never have been able to capture the same result no matter what we do. We have buying those Pilsbury crusts in the refrigerated section, actually they are very good and pretty close. Alot less mess too.
    ///

    Gary, your mom might consider that Pillsbury solution heretical, no? Although if I’d gone your route, we wouldn’t have to dig the stuff out of the shell (still can’t get it out of the pie plate; the filling’s long gone!).

    My Dad’s always been the pie maker par excellence in my family, and although I earn a humble living based primarily on my powers of observation, I guess I blew it in the pastry making department by not paying attention. BUT: pumpkin pie with coconut milk, dried dates and maple syrup for sweetening, was actually richer than the dairy version. I’ll give myself credit for this: I bought two sugar pumpkins and cooked that part fresh, instead of wimping out and using the canned stuff…makes a big difference!

  392. Red Robin November 24th, 2011 at 11:37 am

    ” … everyone needs to recognize a chilling reality: One in three Americans ? 100 million people ? is either poor or perilously close to it. “

  393. Yankee Trader November 24th, 2011 at 11:38 am

    Gary-

    CJ Wilson might be signed by the Angels. If that happens they could put Santana/Haren out there to get more offense.

    Everyone have a great day. Enjoy family, friends and good food. Until later.

    Wiill the Packers finally lose a game today? Lions haven’t won on Thanksgiving day since 2003.

  394. Red Robin November 24th, 2011 at 11:38 am

    ” Government surveys analyzed by the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities indicate that in 2010, just over half of the country?s nearly 17 million poor children, lived in households that reported at least one of four major hardships: hunger, overcrowding, failure to pay the rent or mortgage on time or failure to seek needed medical care. A good education is also increasingly out of reach. A study by Martha Bailey, an economics professor at the University of Michigan, showed that the difference in college-graduation rates between the rich and poor has widened by more than 50 percent since the 1990s. “

  395. RadioKev November 24th, 2011 at 11:39 am

    The Feliz/Nathan flip is awfully strange. If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.

  396. J. Alfred Prufrock November 24th, 2011 at 11:40 am

    yankeefeminista November 24th, 2011 at 11:32 am
    YT, Happy T-Day you too! And this is what I mean about Gio. I think we become too enamored of other team’s shiny toys. Why can’t we just try to develop/fix our own, instead of turning them into RP’s.
    ///

    YF, did you see that blurb on Betances in the Post? I read a tweet where he’s been working out for a 3 weeks. Cash loves his work ethic and upside, so I’d be surprised, as well as greatly disappointed, if he caved on this with Betances so very close….

    Happy TG to you, I’m off for a constitutional…

  397. DONNYBROOK November 24th, 2011 at 11:41 am

    Priority 1 if I was the Rangers, would be getting Cruz outta RF. They were inna No Doubles Defense in the 9th inning\2 outs of Game 6, and somehow that ball go over his head to tie the game. His shoddy defense is the reason they are NOT World Champs.

  398. J. Alfred Prufrock November 24th, 2011 at 11:41 am

    Yankee Trader November 24th, 2011 at 11:31 am
    Good health and good eating to one and all today!
    ——————————————————–

    Pies, sweet potato souffle, stuffing, turkey………………

    For one day it’s good eating and hope to stay healthy!
    ///

    Trader, sweet potato souffle sounds awesome.

    Enjoy, all.

  399. MaineYankee November 24th, 2011 at 11:42 am

    YT

    Thanks and a happy Thanksgiving to you and yours as well.

    When Damon went to Tampa she switched teams. :lol:

    Actually I think the resident troll drove her off.

  400. yankeefeminista November 24th, 2011 at 11:42 am

    Pruf, right, Betances’ walk rates were 2.41 and 1.88 in 2010.

  401. J. Alfred Prufrock November 24th, 2011 at 11:43 am

    If Joba comes back in shape, hope he gets prepped to be a starter again. The Yankees can find some other 6th inning reliever!
    ///

    Had to honk on this before I go….

    Joba is a STAHTIN’ PITCHAH!

  402. J. Alfred Prufrock November 24th, 2011 at 11:44 am

    yankeefeminista November 24th, 2011 at 11:42 am
    Pruf, right, Betances’ walk rates were 2.41 and 1.88 in 2010.
    ///

    Fem, if these folks had witnessed what we did – his upside in action – they would not utter such blasphemy ;).

    I’m out, good one, all :D.

  403. tucker November 24th, 2011 at 11:44 am

    Yanks should not trade Montero. Their long-term challenge will be maintaining a strong offense as A-Rod and Jeter age. They have enough pitching w/CC, Nova and Hughes along with Noesi and Banuelos waiting in the wings. Either Phelps or Warren will be a useful big-league starter. I’d move Betances before Banuelos … Montero needs to stay in pinstripes. They need his bat.

  404. DONNYBROOK November 24th, 2011 at 11:45 am

    Without getting into names\politics, this country has been turning into a Banana Republic for some time now.

  405. yankeefeminista November 24th, 2011 at 11:45 am

    Happy Thanksgiving, Pruf, et al. I did read the Betances’ article and tweet. I am excited to see him pitch and expect he’ll evolve in terms of both BB rates and throwing the change. It’ll help that he will now get to use all his pitches. Here’s to health for him and all our budding pitchers.

    Catch you all, later; enjoy! (I have to make one more grocery store dash before the stores close for the day.)

  406. tomingeorgia November 24th, 2011 at 11:45 am

    Happy Thanksgiving to all! Kind of an unusual one for me and the wife. It’s just us this year, first time ever, sisters, kids and grandkids scattered all over the country and none could make it this year. We’re doing it up right, though, the whole deal. Just put the turkey in the oven. Used to deep-fry it, but missed the aroma wafting through the house of an oven-roasted bird. Remember our troops at dinner today, and God bless you all.

  407. yankeefeminista November 24th, 2011 at 11:47 am

    YT, +1 on the sweet potato souffle. Later, all.

  408. tucker November 24th, 2011 at 11:49 am

    From MLBTradeRumors:

    The Yankees agreed to terms with Freddy Garcia on a one-year deal, according to ESPN.com’s Buster Olney. The sides were nearing a deal last night, after the Yankees offered the right-hander arbitration.

  409. yankeefeminista November 24th, 2011 at 11:50 am

    tomingeorgia, Happy Thanksgiving. I am sure your family is with you in spirit.

  410. tomingeorgia November 24th, 2011 at 11:52 am

    Thanks, yankeefem. Just doesn’t feel right, though, but we have a lot to be thankful for, which, after all, is the whole point.

  411. yankeefeminista November 24th, 2011 at 11:56 am

    Glad to hear it, tom. Amen. Catch you later. :)

  412. Gary November 24th, 2011 at 11:56 am

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    ____________________________________________________________________________

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  413. Gary November 24th, 2011 at 11:58 am

    Guilty, I already been into the stuffing we had to cook in a dish because the bird was full. Tasty.

  414. MaineYankee November 24th, 2011 at 11:58 am

    tomingeorgia

    Happy Thanksgiving.

    I hope you and your wife enjoy the time alone.

    The smells here are so good I may have to leave till it’s time to eat. :D:

    My wife likes to have it at home so she can have the leftovers.

    She also makes a very flaky crust for her pies.

    I’m really spoiled. :lol:

  415. blake November 24th, 2011 at 12:00 pm

    If Cashman trades Montero Im going to join Randy’s anti-Cashman club.

  416. DONNYBROOK November 24th, 2011 at 12:03 pm

    You guys sound like “The Old Man”\ Turkey Junkie from “A Christmas Story”. I prefer the salads and deserts.

  417. tomingeorgia November 24th, 2011 at 12:05 pm

    Maine,
    We took a crowd out for Thanksgiving once. No turkey sandwiches and turkey soup later? Never again!

  418. Gary November 24th, 2011 at 12:10 pm

    yankeefeminista November 24th, 2011 at 11:32 am
    YT, Happy T-Day you too! And this is what I mean about Gio. I think we become too enamored of other team’s shiny toys. Why can’t we just try to develop/fix our own, instead of turning them into RP’s.

    Pruf,

    Gary, bet your mom’s crusts were better!

    ___________________________________________________________________________

    Nothing was as good as Mom’s pie’s or Mom’s Pizza for that matter. We are remembering her today as she has been gone for 5 years. Wish she was still here making dinner. :-)

  419. Gary November 24th, 2011 at 12:13 pm

    Occupy Turkey is being done today by the Stuffing Society. I think they make up at least the 99%. :-)

  420. Gary November 24th, 2011 at 12:15 pm

    tomingeorgia November 24th, 2011 at 12:05 pm
    Maine,
    We took a crowd out for Thanksgiving once. No turkey sandwiches and turkey soup later? Never again!

    ____________________________________________________________________________

    Traveling back from Japan one time I had Turkey Dinner at a Denny’s on Wakiki beach overlooking the surf and white sands too funny.

    We bought way too much Turkey this year just so we could have lots of Turkey Sandwiches and Turkey Soup.

  421. trisha - true pinstriped blue November 24th, 2011 at 12:19 pm

    A quick drive by to wish you all a happy, healthy, safe, loving, and peaceful Thanksgiving. I know we all have much for which to be grateful, not the least of which is our love for the greatest team in the history of sports.

    Just think – you could have been born a Sux fan!!!

    :)

    Have a great day and wish my family luck, since I’m cooking the dinner. (Hint: made gravy ahead because my turkey is brined and didn’t even know the controls on my stove well enough to figure out medium high. Punch line – recipe is supposed to give you 6 cups of gravy. I ended up with 1 and 1/2. No lie. Guess it evaporated!)

  422. tomingeorgia November 24th, 2011 at 12:24 pm

    Gary,
    Way, way back, I had Thanksgiving dinner alone at a Howard Johnson’s, but it overlooked Interstate 90. I’ll take your location.

  423. tomingeorgia November 24th, 2011 at 12:29 pm

    trisha,
    Well, dry turkey is OK, I guess, but the stuffing and mashed potatoes need gravy. In fact, I take that back. EVERYthing needs gravy, which I’m starting on now: giblets, onions and celery simmering down,

  424. Benny Blanco November 24th, 2011 at 12:33 pm

    Happy Thanksgiving to all of the lohud Bloggers…

    Blake,

    I’m gonna try that receipe. :)

    Cashman better not trade Montero.

  425. spidanyc November 24th, 2011 at 12:36 pm

    Yankee Trader November 24th, 2011 at 11:38 am
    Gary-

    CJ Wilson might be signed by the Angels. If that happens they could put Santana/Haren out there to get more offense.

    Everyone have a great day. Enjoy family, friends and good food. Until later.

    Wiill the Packers finally lose a game today? Lions haven’t won on Thanksgiving day since 2003.

    ——————————————————————————————————————–

    Why would the Angels sign CJ Wilson and trade Dan Haren? Dan Haren is 2X better than CJ Wilson.

  426. austinmac November 24th, 2011 at 12:36 pm

    Trisha,

    I will say a little Thanksgiving prayer for your meal.:)

  427. Tar November 24th, 2011 at 12:37 pm

    Happy Thanksgiving to all my LoHud friends. :D

  428. tomingeorgia November 24th, 2011 at 1:02 pm

    It’s too easy cooking Thanksgiving dinner for two. No crowd in the kitchen kibitzing, telling you how they would do it, but then again, there’s no one drinking our liquor but us. Mixed blessing.

  429. mick November 24th, 2011 at 1:41 pm

    It’s too easy cooking Thanksgiving dinner for two. No crowd in the kitchen kibitzing, telling you how they would do it, but then again, there’s no one drinking our liquor but us. Mixed blessing.
    ================
    you got it tom..happy bird day

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  431. Stoneburner November 24th, 2011 at 2:41 pm

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    ——-

    I like Buehrle – but there is a lot of chatter about possibly Wilson – especially if Darvish is not posted.

  432. Stoneburner November 24th, 2011 at 2:50 pm

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    SI_JonHeyman
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