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Notes and links: Darvish, Golson and the new labor contract

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Dec 13, 2011 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Before we get into the links, The Associated Press is reporting some of the changes in baseball’s new labor contract.

NEW YORK (AP) — Baseball’s new labor contract includes more video replay, the chance for a longer All-Star break and a small, but likely welcome perk for players: the chance to get a private room instead of a roommate during spring training.

The Associated Press obtained the document that includes several changes, many of them starting next year.

Teams from the same division will now be allowed to meet in the playoffs before the league championship series. There’s also a ban on players getting tattoos with corporate logos and the possibility that major leaguers can wear microphones during games.

• In a reader poll over at MLBTradeRumors, the Yankees were picked as the favorites to sign Yu Darvish, but the Yankees themselves are creating the exact opposite impression, saying they like Darvish but don’t want to pay the lofty cost to acquire him.

I realize this seems odd coming from the Yankees, but this is the impression they’ve been making — both publicly and privately — all winter. Maybe it’s a misdirect, but right now this doesn’t look like a winter of heavy spending, and Darvish certainly counts as heavy spending.

• Lou Piniella is reportedly on his way back to the Yankees to serve as a special instructor in spring training and as an occasional analyst on the YES Network.

• Didn’t take Greg Golson long to land on his feet. The former Yankees outfielder — released just a few days ago — has already signed a minor league deal with the Royals.

• Speaking of former Yankees, Jose Veras has been traded from the Pirates to the Brewers for third baseman Casey McGehee (meant to mention this yesterday). Veras was pretty good for Pittsburgh last year, but the Pirates traded him before paying him more money through arbitration.

• The Twins have reportedly come to an agreement with Josh Willingham (or maybe they’re just close to an agreement) but you have to assume Willingham takes them out of the mix to re-sign Michael Cuddyer.

• I know how much all of you love Dallas Braden: He’s agreed to a one-year deal with Oakland, avoiding arbitration.

Assocaited Press photo

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453 Responses to “Notes and links: Darvish, Golson and the new labor contract”

  1. jacksquat December 13th, 2011 at 9:41 pm

    Beane just has no reason to trade Gio unless he gets a big haul. He doesn’t cost that much.

  2. Tar December 13th, 2011 at 9:42 pm

    “That’s a great point. You’ve gotta be pretty good for them to keep running you out there if you’re not winning. In other words, it say something that Cy Young lost over 300 games.”

    Haha good one Ghost.

    Also I thought “WINS” and “LOSSES” was not politically correct anymore. Why are we discussing AJ’s winning percentage?

  3. Nick in SF December 13th, 2011 at 9:44 pm

    ” The spread of outcomes with this guy is so wide, it’s hard to know what to expect from him: He could be an ace, or he could be a guy that barely hangs onto his spot in the rotation. That kind of variability in outcomes would be acceptable with a smaller wager at risk.”

    That makes a good bridge between the Yu and AJ conversations. :grin:

  4. MTU December 13th, 2011 at 9:45 pm

    Jack-

    I don’t care what Beane does. He isn’t gonna be able to fleece us.

    That’s all that matters to me.

    ;)

  5. jacksquat December 13th, 2011 at 9:47 pm

    I don’t think the Yankees are bluffing on Yu. I think Hal is much more conservative than his father. I’d be surprised if they bid over 30-35, and I wouldn’t be surprised if it was in the 20′s.

  6. Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 9:51 pm

    Also I thought “WINS” and “LOSSES” was not politically correct anymore. Why are we discussing AJ’s winning percentage?

    Well its the most fair stat you can throw out about AJ. His ERA ain’t hot over those 66 games either. Way below league average. Most BAD teams dont send out a guy as bad as AJ for 66 games. He gets a lot of games to prove his worth because they pay him alot of money.

  7. RadioKev December 13th, 2011 at 9:51 pm

    Who else is a free agent next off season?

  8. Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 9:52 pm

    That makes a good bridge between the Yu and AJ conversations.

    :twisted: AJ’s expected performance was so variable factoring in his poor command and injury history yet the Yankees dropped 82 mil on him. I don’t think Darvish is as variable as anyone thinks, atleast on the poor end of things.

  9. MTU December 13th, 2011 at 9:54 pm

    Kev-

    here you go :

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/.....gents.html

    ;)

  10. blake December 13th, 2011 at 9:54 pm

    “Who else is a free agent next off season?”

    Hamels, Danks, Cain, Hamilton, Yadier Molina, Liriano…..not Matt kemp :(

  11. blake December 13th, 2011 at 9:55 pm

    Has any team admitted to being heavily in on Darvish?

  12. Tar December 13th, 2011 at 9:55 pm

    “Well its the most fair stat you can throw out about AJ.”

    Let me get this straight. Wins and losses is the most fair stat when judging AJ?

    Man you are reaching dude.

  13. MTU December 13th, 2011 at 9:57 pm

    Kev-

    I think this is the that interests a lot of people :

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/.....gents.html

    Includes some pretty big names on the picthing side.

  14. MTU December 13th, 2011 at 9:57 pm

    Kev-

    The 2nd post is the one for 2013.

  15. Ghostwriter December 13th, 2011 at 9:59 pm

    Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 9:51 pm

    Also I thought “WINS” and “LOSSES” was not politically correct anymore. Why are we discussing AJ’s winning percentage?

    Well its the most fair stat you can throw out about AJ. His ERA ain’t hot over those 66 games either. Way below league average. Most BAD teams dont send out a guy as bad as AJ for 66 games. He gets a lot of games to prove his worth because they pay him alot of money.
    ==================

    I wonder about whether AJ keeps getting chances because of his contract, or because he keeps showing enough to suggest that he might be putting it together. I suspect that it’s probably some of both. However, if AJ’s contract has been protecting his spot in the rotation, then the Yanks can’t afford to waste two spots in their rotation like that. And I can’t imagine that the Yanks would want to similarly saddle themselves again, now that they are finally free of Igawa, and they are almost out from under AJ’s contract.

  16. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 10:00 pm

    Citing AJ’s W/L record is a compliment.

    It makes it seem like he’s only a tick below average.

  17. blake December 13th, 2011 at 10:01 pm

    When you’re team is 106 games over .500 over a 3 year period and you have a losing record…..that’s not good.

  18. Ghostwriter December 13th, 2011 at 10:02 pm

    Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 9:51 pm

    Well its the most fair stat you can throw out about AJ.

    ==

    What does that mean? Does it mean that Wins and losses are the most fair stat that you can cite about AJ, or does it mean that they should be completely discounted?

  19. RadioKev December 13th, 2011 at 10:04 pm

    MTU December 13th, 2011 at 9:57 pm
    Kev-

    The 2nd post is the one for 2013.
    ——-

    That is a pretty robust class.

  20. Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 10:04 pm

    Instead of fair I should have said nice. His win and loss record is the nicest thing you can cite about AJ. I meant fair to AJ’s fragile psyche, not fair as in an objective manner of analysis.

  21. Nick in SF December 13th, 2011 at 10:05 pm

    I think it means the stat most favorable/beneficial/least ugly when looking at AJ. Not the most objective way to judge AJ.

  22. MTU December 13th, 2011 at 10:06 pm

    Kev-

    yeah. lot’s of possibilities assuming they make it to FA.

  23. Tar December 13th, 2011 at 10:06 pm

    Ouch Ghost is on fire tonight.

    “When you’re team is 106 games over .500 over a 3 year period and you have a losing record…..that’s not good.”

    Blake

    Thats not fair. Wins and losses is either good way or not to judge somebody.

    Again the implication of that tweet is that AJ is the worst Yankee pitcher since 1920–and I’m not buying it.

  24. Ghostwriter December 13th, 2011 at 10:07 pm

    Nick in SF December 13th, 2011 at 10:05 pm

    I think it means the stat most favorable/beneficial/least ugly when looking at AJ. Not the most objective way to judge AJ.
    ==========

    Got it. Thanks!

  25. CB December 13th, 2011 at 10:07 pm

    So much of the focus this off season is on adding a pitcher.

    However, the most direct way the Yankees can improve their rotation – and the way that may in fact be the most cost effective – is to remove AJ from the rotation.

    He was one of the worst pitchers in baseball the past two seasons.

    Just replace him with a pitcher who is slightly below average – and you have a major upgrade.

    For the regular season, it would achieve much the same as trading for a “2″, etc.

    Yes the money is an issue – you would have to eat a ton of cash. But unless you are getting a reasonable deal on a pitcher (either money to sign him or players to trade for him) then that “costs” something as well.

    Yes the team could use a 2. But the main priority is to make the pitching staff better.

    Due to the distribution of performances on the staff, the yankees are in the position to get better through subtraction. And that’s completely under their control.

    To be honest, it might be cost-effective to simply put AJ in the pen as a long may, pay him his money and put Noesi in that spot.

  26. Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 10:08 pm

    Again the implication of that tweet is that AJ is the worst Yankee pitcher since 1920–and I’m not buying it.

    Thats not the implication. The implication is that he is the worst pitcher to pitch as many games as he has, which is true.

  27. Ghostwriter December 13th, 2011 at 10:08 pm

    Thanks, Jerkface.

  28. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 10:10 pm

    My concern is the Yankees actually believe the one bad month line with AJ.

  29. pkyankfan69 December 13th, 2011 at 10:11 pm

    blake December 13th, 2011 at 10:01 pm
    When you’re team is 106 games over .500 over a 3 year period and you have a losing record…..that’s not good.
    ——————————————–

    Mo is 7-8 the past 3 years… He BLOWS ;)

  30. Tar December 13th, 2011 at 10:11 pm

    “Instead of fair I should have said nice. His win and loss record is the nicest thing you can cite about AJ.”

    Bull.

    Again the tweet was about Yankee pitchers since 1920. Is AJ in bottom 5 of any pitching stat since than– other than apparently wins and losses over 96 games (which he is 1 game under 500)?

    It was a poor attempt at AJ bashing and nothing more.

  31. Tar December 13th, 2011 at 10:14 pm

    “The implication is that he is the worst pitcher to pitch as many games as he has, which is true.”

    Based on wins and losses?

  32. blake December 13th, 2011 at 10:15 pm

    I think Noesi would perform better than AJ and would have a chance to get better as well…..

  33. blake December 13th, 2011 at 10:16 pm

    JonHeymanCBS Jon Heyman
    once and for all, i dont want to hear that all 10-year deals are busts. how was derek jeter’s $189M for 10 yrs? #bargain
    37 minutes ag

  34. austinmac December 13th, 2011 at 10:17 pm

    I would be shocked if the Yankees have the top Darvish bid. They will try to bridge to Banuelos and Betances and hope at least one is a success.

    The Yankees cannot get a top 30 starter without at least one of the untradable three. They don’t seem inclined. I don’t disagree, but I sure would like some genuine off season effort to improve the team or the minors with some money expenditures. They sure didn’t spend a lot, to my knowledge, this year on the international front.

  35. Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 10:17 pm

    Only 29 pitchers have been as bad as AJ has in his last 2 years by ERA+, only 7 had ERAs worse than him. None pitched for the Yankees (except Sidney Ponson!)

  36. Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 10:18 pm

    Bull.

    Bull? You’re calling BS on a silly insult to AJ burnett? You’re really reaching in your defense of AJ.

  37. Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 10:20 pm

    Based on wins and losses?

    Well the tweets manner of analysis is lacking, but the tweet itself is true. AJ Burnett is the worst pitcher in Yankee History to have been allowed to pitch as many games as he has. Seriously, find any Yankee with 2 back to back seasons as poor as AJ with as many starts.

  38. Nick in SF December 13th, 2011 at 10:26 pm

    Don’t think of it as bashing AJ; think of it as praising all the Yankee pitchers who did better. Which is a lot of pitchers.

  39. Tar December 13th, 2011 at 10:30 pm

    “Bull? You’re calling BS on a silly insult to AJ burnett?”

    What I was doing was calling it a silly insult to AJ. You decided to defend the silliness which in turn made you look silly.

    It doesn’t help to pan a stats and than use it when it’s convenient. If wins and losses are stupid, you shouldn’t defend the use of that stat.

    “Seriously, find any Yankee with 2 back to back seasons as poor as AJ with as many starts.”

    Honestly I wouldn’t even know where to begin. I know I have I have seen a lot of bad pitching in my time, and AJ doesn’t come close. Now I will say AJ hasn’t gotten a lot more slack (probably because of his contract) but some of that is also circumstance. The Yankees haven’t had anybody better to fill his role.

    The AJ gratuitous bashing is getting old.

  40. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 10:32 pm

    I’m not great with play index and don’t have a b-ref subscription but from what I can gather…

    From 1901-2011, of Yankee pitchers with at least 300 IP, AJ has the 8th worst ERA.

    Hughes has the 13th worst.

  41. tucker December 13th, 2011 at 10:33 pm

    Any bid on Darvish will depend on how the scouts evaluate his skills and project how they will transfer to MLB. If they view Yu as a top of the rotation or a No. 2, expect an aggressive bid. They had the money reserved for Cliff lee that they largely did not spend. If they believe Yu is the target, they will bid strong.

  42. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 10:34 pm

    If you bump it up 400 innings pitched, AJ has the 4th worst ERA and Hughes the 7th.

    If you go to 500 innings pitched, AJ has the SECOND worst.

  43. Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 10:35 pm

    It doesn’t help to pan a stats and than use it when it’s convenient. If wins and losses are stupid, you shouldn’t defend the use of that stat.

    You’re not the boss of me and what I use to achieve comedic ends. I think its funny to think of AJ’s subpar win loss record as the nicest thing you can say about him.

    Also here is a hitn, you can’t find anyone because I am using BBRef play index and AJ Burnett is the only Yankee in history to have 66+ games started at an ERA+ of 90 or lower

  44. Ghostwriter December 13th, 2011 at 10:37 pm

    Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 10:20 pm

    Based on wins and losses?

    Well the tweets manner of analysis is lacking, but the tweet itself is true. AJ Burnett is the worst pitcher in Yankee History to have been allowed to pitch as many games as he has. Seriously, find any Yankee with 2 back to back seasons as poor as AJ with as many starts.
    ==============

    Scott Kamieniecki was pretty close. Imagine: $80 million for Scott Kamieniecki. It boggles the mind. :roll:

  45. Nick in SF December 13th, 2011 at 10:37 pm

    Of all the Yankee pitchers who have started at least 80 games from 1921-2011, AJ has thrown the most pies. #it’stheintangiblesthatmakehimspecial

  46. Tar December 13th, 2011 at 10:39 pm

    “You’re not the boss of me and what I use to achieve comedic ends. I think its funny to think of AJ’s subpar win loss record as the nicest thing you can say about him.”

    Well I think Yu are stupid. :D

  47. Ghostwriter December 13th, 2011 at 10:40 pm

    tucker December 13th, 2011 at 10:33 pm

    Any bid on Darvish will depend on how the scouts evaluate his skills and project how they will transfer to MLB. If they view Yu as a top of the rotation or a No. 2, expect an aggressive bid. They had the money reserved for Cliff lee that they largely did not spend. If they believe Yu is the target, they will bid strong.
    ============

    The Yanks dodged a bullet when Lee blew them off The new CBA is a Yankee-killer. If the Yanks had to deal with an extra $24 million per year under the new CBA, they would be pretty badly hamstrung.

  48. Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 10:40 pm

    Andy Hawkins is actually pretty bad! They let him pitch 2 bad seasons then traded him.

  49. Ghostwriter December 13th, 2011 at 10:42 pm

    Tar December 13th, 2011 at 10:39 pm

    “You’re not the boss of me and what I use to achieve comedic ends. I think its funny to think of AJ’s subpar win loss record as the nicest thing you can say about him.”

    Well I think Yu are stupid. :D
    ===============

    What did you ever do to Yu? :P

  50. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 10:42 pm

    I wanna know who the Yankee pitcher is that has at least 500 innings pitched and a worse ERA than AJ but bref is hiding it from me because I don’t have a sub :mad:

  51. Ghostwriter December 13th, 2011 at 10:43 pm

    Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 10:40 pm

    Andy Hawkins is actually pretty bad! They let him pitch 2 bad seasons then traded him.
    =================

    Andy Hawkins… :shudder: I just felt a chill…

  52. Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 10:45 pm

    LGY: Hank Johnson, but he only started 72 games!

  53. tucker December 13th, 2011 at 10:46 pm

    The new CBA also may be viewed as friendly to big market teams. Less revenue sharing. Yanks retain a larger share of their earnings. Particularly with the draft, teams that pick high in the draft will have a difficult time spending within the parameters. That could benefit big market clubs with top talent dropping in the draft.

  54. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 10:49 pm

    Wow. Hank Johnson was bad. And kinda scary you have to go back to the 1930s to match AJ’s level of futility.

    If Russell Martin is Thurman Martin, AJ has to be Hank Burnett.

  55. Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 10:50 pm

    Particularly with the draft, teams that pick high in the draft will have a difficult time spending within the parameters. That could benefit big market clubs with top talent dropping in the draft.

    Talent wont drop in the draft because you get paid less. All the teams that spent big in the draft were small markets. Now they are capped out AND the yankees have like 1/8th to spend on draft picks as those teams do with their own cap. You can’t not sign a top pick and allocate money elsewhere and theres effectively hard slotting.

    Top talent will not be dropping. It will just go to the smaller market teams on cheaper deals (or to another sport)

  56. jacksquat December 13th, 2011 at 10:54 pm

    I hear the Red Sox are looking for a closer. Maybe they’d like Soriano. Only 2 years left! :mrgreen:

  57. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 10:55 pm

    I wonder what GB can share with us about Hank Johnson.

  58. Tar December 13th, 2011 at 10:57 pm

    LGY

    What is AJ’s era over 500 innings? can You provide the link so I can look myself. Thanks.

  59. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 10:59 pm

    4.79 in 584 IP as a Yankee.

    http://www.baseball-reference......a.01.shtml

  60. Ghostwriter December 13th, 2011 at 11:01 pm

    LGY December 13th, 2011 at 10:49 pm

    Wow. Hank Johnson was bad. And kinda scary you have to go back to the 1930s to match AJ’s level of futility.

    ================
    Onnly if you arbitrarily hold the number of starts above 90. Ed Whitson and Jeff Johnson still take the prize as the worst Yankee pitchers of the last ninety years, as far as I’m concerned. AJ may have struggled, but he’s done enough to keep himself on the staff. Those other guys didn’t do enough to keep themselves from being run out of town. And I could name others if I tried.

  61. Ghostwriter December 13th, 2011 at 11:03 pm

    Tar,

    Here is a neat webpage that you might like: http://www.baseball-reference......itch.shtml.

  62. tucker December 13th, 2011 at 11:05 pm

    Not necessarily on the draft. I could see a scenarion where a top-flight HS pitcher sends out signals that he signs for X amount. The teams drafting high may not be able to meet that price. The kid falls to a late first-round selection. The team signs for a large amount, basically foregoing signing money for later rounds. You can see teams drafting late opting to target money for just a handful of their top picks, say 3 out of the first 10 picks. It would be a risky strategy, but elite talent may justify such a risk.

  63. Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 11:06 pm

    Tucker,

    You don’t understand the new CBA, thats essentially not possible.

  64. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 11:08 pm

    Whitson pitched 37 innings as a Yankee with a 7.54 ERA.

    Wanna know what AJ’s ERA was in his last 10 starts of the season last year? 7.66 in 52 IP.

    The numbers of IP are not arbitrary. The major point is that AJ has been awful AND the Yankees have continued to let him pitch. That’s the issue.

  65. Nick in SF December 13th, 2011 at 11:09 pm

    It’s not really so arbitrary. It’s the number of starts that AJ has had as a Yankee. I think that’s the idea, that no one has had such a poor record and gotten that many starts as a Yankee from 1921 to now. Not that AJ has been the worst Yankee pitcher over that time frame.

  66. 4 NYY December 13th, 2011 at 11:09 pm

    I must admit, I can’t tell if the Yanks are gonna bid on Yu or not. They have said one thing and done the opposite in the past , but this time I just don’t know. I hope they do, I think the guy is damn good.

    Kuroda I also think would help.

    Anyone who thinks AJ is gonna be a plus with the Yanks after what he’s done so far needs to see a doctor. It ain’t happening ! He might go somewhere else and do better, who knows ?

  67. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 11:14 pm

    Arbitrary implies that the numbers selected are random.

  68. Jerkface December 13th, 2011 at 11:16 pm

    Let me explain why its not possible:

    You get taxed on each slot if you go over recommendation.

    “Tax on over-slot signings – 75% tax on up signings up to 5% over recommendation, 75% tax and loss of first round pick for signings from 5.1% to 10% over recommendation, 100% tax and loss of first and second round picks for signing 10.1 to 15% over recommendation, and finally, a 100% tax and loss of two first round picks for signing of greater than 15% over recommendation.”

    This is super prohibitive.

    You lose any money you could have spent if you don’t sign a pick, so you can’t ‘forego’ later rounds, you lose the money.

    If you sign anyone for more than their slot you basically guarantee you go over the cap and lose a pick next year + tax.

    The Yankees draft pool is 4.5 million next year. So if they go 675k over total on any bonus they lose 2 first round picks and pay 100%. 450k its a 1st+2nd+100%. So that prospect better be damn good cuz you’re paying for him twice and having opportunity cost of losing 2 picks the next year

  69. Ghostwriter December 13th, 2011 at 11:16 pm

    LGY December 13th, 2011 at 11:08 pm

    Whitson pitched 37 innings as a Yankee with a 7.54 ERA.

    =================

    ???? That stat doesn’t seem right to me.

    At any rate, Whoever made the initial post picked 90 or more starts, and found that AJ had the worst record among those with as many starts. The choice of restricting the number of starts is by definition arbitrary. We don’t need to look at some esoteric cut of the data to find that AJ has been a disappointment.

    And Whitson was so bad, that he got run out of town after 34 starts. Johnson was worse still. So, you don’t have to go back eighty years to find somebody that struggled as badly as AJ.

  70. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 11:20 pm

    Oh my bad. I was looking at just 1986.

    Whitson pitched 196 innings with a 5.37 ERA. So, Whitson was basically what AJ has become the past 2 seasons.

  71. Ghostwriter December 13th, 2011 at 11:21 pm

    LGY December 13th, 2011 at 11:14 pm

    Arbitrary implies that the numbers selected are random.
    ====

    No it means that it was chosen subject to one’s individual discretion or judgment.

  72. Ghostwriter December 13th, 2011 at 11:22 pm

    Nick in SF December 13th, 2011 at 11:09 pm

    It’s not really so arbitrary. It’s the number of starts that AJ has had as a Yankee. I think that’s the idea, that no one has had such a poor record and gotten that many starts as a Yankee from 1921 to now. Not that AJ has been the worst Yankee pitcher over that time frame.
    ============

    Fair enough, if that is as far as it’s taken. However, it seemed that it was being extended beyond those confines.

  73. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 11:24 pm

    Any number selected would be subject to one’s individual discretion or judgement.

  74. RMS December 13th, 2011 at 11:24 pm

    The AJ story- Paid big bucks to pitch like a #2 and pitches like a 4/5.
    Is fragile.
    Too many walks.
    Too many wild pitches and if not for Martin, who have had a lot more.
    Implosion at any time.
    Cannot stop the bleeding.

  75. Nick in SF December 13th, 2011 at 11:25 pm

    ” Whoever made the initial post picked 90 or more starts, and found that AJ had the worst record among those with as many starts.”

    Or he could have been looking at AJ’s record and wondering if any other Yankee pitcher has gotten that many starts while being that bad.

  76. Ghostwriter December 13th, 2011 at 11:27 pm

    LGY December 13th, 2011 at 11:20 pm

    Oh my bad. I was looking at just 1986.

    Whitson pitched 196 innings with a 5.37 ERA. So, Whitson was basically what AJ has become the past 2 seasons.
    ========

    Yes. Except Whitson quit. I give AJ a lot of credit for hanging in there. It must be tough to go through what he’s been going through over the last couple seasons. Far being mentally fragile as some suggest, I think AJ is pretty tough to hang in there without complaining or feeling sorry for himself. Nevertheless, I am ready to move on. I think that Noesi could do at least as well as AJ ayt this point.

  77. Tar December 13th, 2011 at 11:27 pm

    Ghost

    Thanks for the link Thats the one I really wanted, very cool.

    “It’s not really so arbitrary. It’s the number of starts that AJ has had as a Yankee.”

    Nick

    The amount of starts was not correct. And I get the idea. It was to to bash AJ using wins and losses.
    And the implication is clear to me, or why mention 1921?

    “AJ Burnett is the only pitcher to make at least 96 starts with the Yankees since 1921 and have a losing record, 34-35.”

    Anyway I’m tired, goodnight all.

  78. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 11:28 pm

    AJ has $16.5 million reasons not to quit.

  79. Nick in SF December 13th, 2011 at 11:30 pm

    Why did Pete Townsend pick 1921the as the year to begin Tommy?

    “Had a feeling ’21 was gonna be a good year
    especially if you and me see it in together”

  80. Nick in SF December 13th, 2011 at 11:32 pm

    “I had no reason to be overoptimistic
    but somehow when you smile I can brave bad weather”

    AJ :grin:

  81. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 11:37 pm

    I make fun of Martin and Hughes but I actually like those guys. I wanted the Yankees to sign Russ this time last year when he was non tendered and I still believe Hughes will be a good major league starter some day.

    AJ just needs to disappear.

    And a Japanese pitcher needs to take his place!!

  82. Nick in SF December 13th, 2011 at 11:39 pm

    “What about the boy???
    What about the boy????
    What about the boy
    He saw it all!”

    AJ :shock:

  83. trisha - true pinstriped blue December 13th, 2011 at 11:52 pm

    Just read a bunch of posts referring to AJ.

    I’m still in his corner. Not surprising I’m sure.

    Where there’s life, there’s hope.

    2012 might well be his year to shine.

    :)

    Back to holiday stuff.

  84. LGY December 13th, 2011 at 11:56 pm

    YES needs to find someone like this guy. His commercials always rock.

    @JRyan_MSG: Latest #Knicks commercial “Big 3″ Arrival can be found here!!! Hope you like it! @TinaCervasio http://t.co/dH1PqUXr

  85. m December 14th, 2011 at 12:43 am

    Just when thought Heyman couldn’t possibly be much dummer.

    Comparing Jeter’s $189M contract at a much younger age to Alex & Pujols significantly more expensive over-the-age-of 30 ten year contracts?

    And if Alex didn’t have injuries over the last few seasons, this current contract wouldn’t be as horrible.

  86. jacksquat December 14th, 2011 at 1:14 am

    Heyman is probably just trying to help Boras get his client Prince Fielder a 10 year deal.

  87. Triple Short of a Cycle December 14th, 2011 at 8:05 am

    Why did the Yankees bother scouting Darvish for 2 years if they just lump him in with the other Japanese failures and are not planning a big bid? Makes no sense

  88. Villa Nova-Ya December 14th, 2011 at 8:08 am

    Just because they scouted the guy doesn’t mean they have to bid on him. They may have come to the decision that the cost of Yu Darvish simply isn’t worth the risk. They may have come to the decision that he won’t translate much better than most Japanese pitchers.

    They had to scout him. They don’t have to want him.

    I suspect they will enter a bid, but it will be what they think he is worth to their organization, and take the risk into account. If it ends up being the winning bid, fine; if not, fine too.

  89. dogface December 14th, 2011 at 8:10 am

    Why did the Yankees bother scouting Darvish for 2 years if they just lump him in with the other Japanese failures and are not planning a big bid? Makes no sense

    ===============================

    Everybody’s scouted him. Not everybody will bid.

  90. blake December 14th, 2011 at 8:13 am

    They scout everybody …..what’s not known is their true intentions yet. There hasn’t been any teams come out and say “oh yea…..were all in on him”. They all are down playing interest.

  91. austinmac December 14th, 2011 at 8:14 am

    The new CBA will prevent big expenditures on new players this year and the next two, at least. They will try to win with youth. I see no way for Darvish or any of the large contract pitchers for next year.

    They are betting big on their young pitchers. It is a risky bet to be sure.

  92. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:14 am

    I like VN’s approach.

    :)

  93. blake December 14th, 2011 at 8:16 am

    From what I’ve read…..the guy they really might want to take a chance on is Soler…..19 years old with huge upside….and wont cost as much as Cespedes. Baseball America said he’d have been a top 5 pick in the draft and compared him to Bubba Starling with regards to tools……the Yanks wont get opportunities at guys like that much longer.

  94. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:17 am

    Mac-

    The Yankees could use a bona fide, left-handed #2 starter.

    They have plenty of guys to fill the middle/back end.

  95. Triple Short of a Cycle December 14th, 2011 at 8:17 am

    They have said they are leery to bid on him based on their experience with Igawa so to me that is a blanket rule for any Japanese pitcher

  96. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:17 am

    Blake-

    I’m all in on Soler.

  97. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:18 am

    Triple-

    I think the Yankees have a # in mind. If it costs more they likely will not be interested.

  98. upstate kate December 14th, 2011 at 8:20 am

    Garza is still available! just sayin’

  99. blake December 14th, 2011 at 8:21 am

    Good fall back options if you lose the bid on Darvish would be to either sign Kuroda to a one year deal or wait out Kenny Williams on Danks.

    If the Rangers get Darvish then that’ll likely wittle Danks’s market down even further…..I can’t see Beane ever gettin his heart right on Gio.

  100. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:22 am

    Blake-

    I don’t think it will be the anlters and claws.

    budget constraints.

  101. Gary December 14th, 2011 at 8:22 am

    Morning Blake, off to do some offshore fishing, lets see who wins today me or the fish :-)

    Saw your posts, most of the stuff I’m reading is setting expectations pretty low for Yu and the Yanks. Well I guess we will see in the next few days if it’s a head fake or not. Still gotta believe someone throws big money at him.

  102. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:23 am

    Sorry Kate but I’d rather trade for Danks or GG ahead of Garza.

    :(

  103. blake December 14th, 2011 at 8:24 am

    MTU,

    I only know what I’ve read…..but a 19 year old with 5 tools (Soler)….sounds better than a 26 year old that’ll cost twice as much (Cespedes) to me.

  104. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:25 am

    Blake-

    same here.

    Price will be much more reasonable.

    We need to continue to fill the OF pipeline.

  105. blake December 14th, 2011 at 8:26 am

    Morning Blake, off to do some offshore fishing, lets see who wins today me or the fish”

    That’s really not fair……good luck and please remember those of us stuck at work ;)

  106. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:26 am

    gary-

    catch me a Dorado.

    ;)

  107. blake December 14th, 2011 at 8:29 am

    I really think the wildcard in this Darvish thing is the Nationals……..they have seen first hand what Strasburgmania did a couple of years ago…….and their owner has the money to drop a big bid if he wants.

  108. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:30 am

    Blake-

    Any team that is particularly thin at Pitcher and has money could be the one to take the risk.

  109. Villa Nova-Ya December 14th, 2011 at 8:31 am

    What I like about Soler is they can start him in AA/AAA because he’s so young. Less risk and you have some input into development.

    With Cespedes, I’d expect he’d want to be on the ML team at the start; same with Darvish.

    Although, if they got Darvish and could convince him that at the start of the season the team doesn’t need 5 starters and it would benefit him to work regularly in AAA, to acclimate at least a little, that could be a plan. Don’t think Darvish would go for that, though.

  110. upstate kate December 14th, 2011 at 8:32 am

    when is the winning bid revealed?

  111. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:32 am

    VN-

    Not likely Soler starts that high in the food chain.

  112. Triple Short of a Cycle December 14th, 2011 at 8:32 am

    I think the Yankees have a # in mind. If it costs more they likely will not be interested.

    ————————————————————————–

    But then why even make a bid. They know they won’t land him for a bid in the 30′s. Also bidding in the 30′s is never going to land these top Japanese guys anyway. It just seems like a fruitless effort.

    I know the Yanks won’t win the bid so I’m at least hoping the Nationals do and its not the Jays or Rangers

  113. yanks61 December 14th, 2011 at 8:33 am

    CB repeated an excellent point last night in the previous thread; namely how getting rid of AJ would be almost as good as getting that Nbr. 2 starter.

    In fact, Branch Rickey came up with the best phrase for it many years ago and called it “addition by subtraction.”

    If the Yanks get nothing else in return but to get rid of part of his salary, and added Noesi to take his place (or Kuroda for a year), they will have added GREATLY by the subtraction.

    Cash should also take into consideration the health and welfare of the manager and coaches everytime AJ goes to the mound. He must take quite a toll on their nerves.

  114. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:34 am

    Kate-

    I think it is 4 days from today.

  115. dogface December 14th, 2011 at 8:34 am

    What I like about Soler is they can start him in AA/AAA because he’s so young. Less risk and you have some input into development.

    =================================

    You probably can’t start him in AA/AAA because he’s probably not ready for it. Most likely starts in the Sallie League. Maybe the FSL.

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  117. blake December 14th, 2011 at 8:36 am

    Soler Soler Soler!

  118. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:36 am

    Triple-

    It’s a blind bid. Nobody knows what anyone else is gonna do.

    that means there is always a chance a lower bid takes it.

    As I said, I think the Yankees value him in a conservative way and their bid should reflect that evaluation.

    JMO.

  119. dogface December 14th, 2011 at 8:36 am

    I think the Yankees have a # in mind. If it costs more they likely will not be interested.

    ==========================

    Wouldn’t this be true of every team who bids? Or doesn’t bid for that matter?

  120. Villa Nova-Ya December 14th, 2011 at 8:37 am

    MTU -

    Even better.

  121. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:38 am

    Dog-

    What I meant is that the Yankees may not be as motivated as some.

  122. dogface December 14th, 2011 at 8:40 am

    MTU:

    Probably not. My point was nobody will bid beyond their comfort level.

  123. Villa Nova-Ya December 14th, 2011 at 8:40 am

    dogface -

    You’re right. I shoulda just said “somewhere in the system not the major leagues.” :)

  124. blake December 14th, 2011 at 8:41 am

    They should let Hank bid.

  125. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:45 am

    Dog-

    Gotcha but some teams are more motivated than others.

  126. Triple Short of a Cycle December 14th, 2011 at 8:45 am

    But why do they keep on bringing up Igawa as a reason for their low bid? Igawa wasn’t even supposed to translate well here and his numbers were far worse then Darvish. Its like comparing a BMW to a Yugo

  127. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:46 am

    Damn good thing the Marlins have exhausted themselves (I hope). They were buying everything in sight.

  128. dogface December 14th, 2011 at 8:50 am

    Igawa wasn’t even supposed to translate well here

    =======================

    $46M says the Yankees believed otherwise.

  129. Villa Nova-Ya December 14th, 2011 at 8:52 am

    Triple -

    The way I’ve understood it, they bring up Igawa to point out that they’ve learned from that experience. I got the impression that they learned what things to look for, or look out for, and to fine-tune the lens through which they view Japanese pitchers. This doesn’t mean they’d stay away from all Japanese pitchers, but I do think it impacts just how much they would expect to gain by signing one. So a Darvish, who comes with great hype at top dollar means you have to be very careful.

    And actually, they expected Igawa to translate here, just that he wasn’t expected to translate any higher than a #5 in the order (and he didn’t even achieve that). But having Igawa in the system for those 4 years had to give them some insight into other things besides whether a guy strikes out a lot of hitters.

  130. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:53 am

    “Lost” had an interesting remark last night.

    I’ll parphrase it :

    If the Yankees are gonna spend that kind of money (on darvish) they prefer more certainty.

    Sorta makes sense doesn’t it ?

    ;)

  131. Villa Nova-Ya December 14th, 2011 at 8:53 am

    And I don’t think the Yankees have said one way or another whether they are going to bid, and if they do whether the bid will be high or low or middling. It has been pure speculation by media and fans.

  132. Villa Nova-Ya December 14th, 2011 at 8:54 am

    MTU -

    But the Marlins have all that Pujols money left, don’t they?

  133. Villa Nova-Ya December 14th, 2011 at 8:55 am

    MTU -

    I’d expect the Marlins to go after Cespedes more than Darvish.

  134. dogface December 14th, 2011 at 8:56 am

    And I don’t think the Yankees have said one way or another whether they are going to bid, and if they do whether the bid will be high or low or middling. It has been pure speculation by media and fans
    ======================

    Nobody has said they are going to bid or not bid. Nobody’s going to. You can’t bluff in blind bidding, so there’s no point in saying anything. Speculation is it. The posting process turns us all into a bunch of Heymans.

  135. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:57 am

    VN-

    If they do then they might be ones to get Yu and Cespedes.

    They have been after all the shiny toys.

    I was kinda hoping they were done.

    maybe not ?

  136. blake December 14th, 2011 at 8:57 am

    “But the Marlins have all that Pujols money left, don’t they?”

    I think that was a special case because they thought Albert would drive the Latin america market in Miami……if they we’re dead set on spending that money then you’d think they’d be in on Prince.

  137. MTU December 14th, 2011 at 8:58 am

    New thread —->

  138. Erin December 14th, 2011 at 9:00 am

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