The Week of Yu
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Dec 18, 2011 
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This was the week of Yu Darvish.
Even though we still don’t know the identity of the team that won the right to negotiate with him, Darvish speculation dominated the past week, largely overshadowing significant signings by Aramis Ramirez and Michael Guddyer, and a big trade between the Padres and Reds.
Once seen as favorites for Darvish, the Yankees are now believed to be bit players in the process. The Blue Jays seem to be the industry favorites while the Yankees continue to play offseason small ball.
The Nippon Ham Fighters have until Tuesday to announce the winning bid.
Some more of the past week in review…
• The non-tender deadline came and went with the Yankees tendering all of their players contract offers for 2012.
• Derek Jeter, Robinson Cano and Dave Robertson won GIBBY Awards, the annual honors handed out by MLB.com. Jeter was picked for the year’s best performance, Cano as the most exciting player and Robertson was tabbed as the best setup reliever.
• Colin Curtis cleared waivers and was outrighted to Triple-A. Greg Golson cleared waivers, became a free agent and landed a minor league deal with the Royals.
• Hal Steinbrenner landed on Sports Business Journal’s list of the most influential people in sports business. Who knew running the Yankees would get someone on such a list?
• The Yankees are bringing back veteran catcher Gustavo Molina on a minor league deal. He’ll serve the same insurance role he played last year. Meanwhile, Andrew Brackman — surprise! — got a big league deal with the Reds.
• The Red Sox made some moves, most notably adding former Yankees reliever Mark Melancon to their bullpen. Boston also added Nick Punto to play a utility role.
• Lou Pinella is coming back to the Bronx to work at the YES Network.
• We got a glimpse of what it might cost to trade for a young starting pitcher. The Reds acquired Mat Latos from the Padres at the expense of three prospects — all ranked in the organization’s Top 10 according to Baseball America — plus Edinson Volquez, who’s still fairly young and just a few years ago looked like an elite big leaguer.
• We also got a glimpse of what Nick Swisher’s value might be next winter with both Josh Willingham and Michael Cuddyer signing three-year deals.
• The new CBA was approved, and with it comes a series of changes. Baseball has also appointed a committee to begin looking into changes in the way teams acquire international talent.
Associated Press photo
After watching the 2nd Cespedes video…..I’m curious for sure about him. Unfortunately the video doesn’t show him trying to hit a John Lester cutter or a Felix Hernandez curveball…..but he does some things in that video that very few human being can do.
If the price is around Chapman money then I’d certainly be interested….even if it were a little more because the potential value would be so good. This guy has some Justin Upton like tools……only question is whether he has the all important “hit tool” against big league pitchers that really separates whether you can play in the big leagues or not.
I don’t trust any of the information out there on Darvish. Who exactly said that the Yankees made a “modest bid” anyway? That was never confirmed by anybody important with the Yankees as far as I know.
I’m not saying I think the Yankees won the bid…..but I’m not discounting it either because of the rumors that are out there. These things are always kept very close to the vest…..I don’t think anything can be known for sure until it’s officially announced.
Blake-
Don’t your hopes up.
At best it’s unlikely.
Not even sure they ahould pull the trigger anyway.
Blake-
And I think can forget Cespedes too.
Think filet of Soler.
edit : Yu can forget.
MTU,
Im not…..I just don’t believe all the stuff that’s swirling around. If the bid really waste up around 60 million then I hopebit wasn’t the Yanks . Because he’s going to require 60 or 70 million to sign…….and unless Hal is comfortable just paying that posting fee without it affecting other spending then that’s just way too much …. have to admit Im intrigued by Cespedes
MTU,
From a risk and value standpoint Soler makes a lot more sense…..hes a lot younger…..he will he a lot cheaper…..and you can develop him like a prospect more or less. However if they feel like Cespedes can make the transition and will have the ability to hit in theyear bigs then just sign them both as a last hooray into the international market before the restrictions come.
There have been multiple reports on the size of the bid. Logic suggests the Yankees wouldn’t bid that high on Darvish. Nothing is set in stone, but my expectations are low to say the least.
Blake-
Ok. I gotcha. That’s a different story.
The truth will be known soon.
I do believe Darvish will cost Dice-K money and then some.
In the current environment of cost-consciousness I do not see the Yankees spending for a guy like Cespedes.
He may look good, and we could use the talent at that position but I think he’s cost prohibitive also.
The rumors have been any where from 30 Mil on up.
Soler is further away but is way more affordable.
MTU,
Have you watched the 2nd video? There is a lot more baseball stuff in it and less nonsense…….I mean just from a showcase standpoint he looks like a 70 or 80 power guy and a 70 or 80 speed guy and those are tough to find. He hits a ball on a line over the right field wall that just very few guys can do…..power to all fields etc. It would be a gamble…..but with basically all the good young outfielders in MLB locked up it wouldn’t be the worst risk for an organization that can afford to take risks IMO
The Chapman contract was 6/30 I believe…..that’s an AAV of 5 million per year for ages 26-32 for Cespedes. They waste that on LOOGYs every year…….he may coat more than that but at that price the Yanks coukd more than cover the risk if he doesn’t pan out and from what I’ve seen the upside and potential is fairly big.
Blake-
I haven’t seen it. I’ll take your word on what you think you saw in him.
I do not really care either way as it ain’t my money.
The International market will change soon so I agree with you on that part.
Just do not think the Yankees do not want to open their wallets at this particular time.
That’s just my take. I could be totally wrong. I guess we’ll see.
I’d be shocked if Cespedes only costs 30 million. Shocked.
Radio,
I believe the bid is over 50 million……I’ve said all along that I thought it would be. I just don’t know about the other info that’s out there.
Would I call the Yanks favorites? No…..maybe they did bid “modestly” ……but would I be shocked if they announced Tuesday that the Yankees won the bidding for 55 million…….eh not really
……”but with basically all the good young outfielders in MLB locked up it wouldn’t be the worst risk for an organization that can afford to take risks IMO”
Except for the fact that really since the offseason of 2008 NY has demonstrated that they appear to be extremely risk averse- which means it would be a real shocker to me anyway that they would step out of their comfort zone and make a play on Cespedes.
“I’d be shocked if Cespedes only costs 30 million. Shocked.”
I think he will get more than Chapman…..but I don’t think he’s getting 50 or 60 either…..every team likely has the same concerns that we do about a jump from the Cuban league to the bigs.
Yankee21,
True…..but like I said…..they risk nearly as much on Pedro Felicianos every year.
@JimBowdenESPNxm JIM BOWDEN
Padres have interest in a package deal with the primary trade pieces being Anthony Rizzo and Matt Garza…should be interesting in Cubs view
7 hours ago via web
Do Theo and Hoyer feel remorse or something?
Just as soon as the Darvish suitor has been named, I expect rapid fire from Cashman in making moves for another starter (Kuroda) and another OF (either Jones or Beltran).
If it turns out to be Beltran, he can be used in RF only when Girardi needs to give Swisher a day off or when Teixeira gets a day off or is a DH with Swisher playing 1st base.
When Granderson is given a day off, Gardner moves to CF with Beltran playing LF. Being a switch hitter, Beltran can get some at bats as a LH hitter when Montero catches and Martin gets a day off. Having the flexibility the Yankees have does help.
I am surprised Hoyer wasn’t strung up or something already by the faithful 400 or so Padre fans out there by now.
What a joke of a GM Hoyer was for SD, or should I say working for BOS on SD payroll.
I think you’d have to guarantee Beltran an every day job to get him to sign. If they signed Beltran then my guess is that Swisher would be dealt in a package for a pitcher. The rumors are that Carlos is mulling 2 and 3 year offers.
108 stitches, I am more than fine with signing Beltran, but only if they find a taker for Swisher. The concern for me is ultimately he would wind up taking AB away from Montero as a DH, and that is a mistake imo.
I doubt they sign Beltran, too much money, not enough need, too much risk, so it wouldn’t fit into the nice sweet gingerly way NY is embarked on.
Well, yesterday I had about 9 or 10 Blue Jays frolicking in my dogwood. The little b a s t a r d s woke me up, in fact.
Maybe they knew Toronto had the highest bid on YuDarling?
Today, however, they’re nowhere to be found.
Maybe they know it’s a bluff, or that their inside scoop was an altogether misguided one, tickling their feathers for naught?
If they actually get this guy, and he doesn’t pitch decently for them, well, there’s nothing like the wrath of a real Blue Jay.
As for the Yankees, this is a rare occasion where I stand on neutral ground. 90 second videos can’t tell you all that much. But I would like to see the Cuban twins inked, if they’re what their optimal reports in advance of them claim. We are fine right now, but the OF is the uneasiest aspect of the ballclub, IMO.
50mm plus bid on Yu sounds Yankeeish. Would be one of Casmans greatest stealth moves but I don’t see it. That said I also don’t see Toronto or Texas shelling out that kind of coin as 120mm total package for someone who hasn’t thrown a MLB pitch appears borderline nuts.
Beltran would be a great fit for us but I think he wants too much money and a guaranteed full time position.
I do not think the Yankees would trade Swisher in order to make room for Beltran as a FT player.
Swisher is younger and more durable.
Also, I think Beltran will want too many years.
IMO we need a versatile 4th Of’er not a full time guy.
get Prado from the Braves.
If they could work out something for Swisher for a valuable piece or prospects then signing Beltran on a 2 year deal would be great.
You’d probably pay a little more in 2012 but Swisher isn’t going to be that cheap to re-sign most likely…..he’s going to be looking for a big payday as he’s never really gotten one and this is going to be his only chance.
I like Beltran better than Swisher as a player if healthy but the injury risk is an issue so to me you’d really have to get something of value for Swisher to justify the swap….I wouldn’t do it just to do it.
“We are fine right now, but the OF is the uneasiest aspect of the ballclub, IMO.”
SS for me long term.
I believe the bid is over 50 million……I’ve said all along that I thought it would be. I just don’t know about the other info that’s out there.
———–
I doubted it. I think the general Daisuke/Igawa remorse would throw the market off. I didn’t really count on the Blue Jays desperation, but that’s the factor with these types of contracts.
Blake, I know you disagree about the desperation idea, but I think that’s the the real anomaly in the market. The Yankees were driven by desperation for nearly a decade, resulting in so many god awful decisions. Carl Crawford and Jayson Werth were two of the latest desperation moves.
Forget Centipedes. Get Ahman Green.
Blake/MTU Morning guys
I’m just thinking and my opinion on the Yu yes he’s worth it, no he’s not debate. Until this guy does get out there and pitch how can anybody realistically make that judgement right now it’s just pure speculation. If he bombs it will be proven that it was just another bad investment in a Japanese pitcher, but if he goes out there and pitches to his current track record it will be one of the best investments that a club ever made.
At some point I think the law of averages says that all these guys can’t come here and just go belly up. This guy has perhaps the best potential to be that guy that turns that around. I think it will be proven that the guy was worth every $ that was spent. Just looks like performance wise and development he is way ahead of his peers.
blake December 18th, 2011 at 10:00 am
“We are fine right now, but the OF is the uneasiest aspect of the ballclub, IMO.”
SS for me long term.
———
I don’t get what’s wrong with our outfield. Swisher isn’t a superstar. So what? Yet again, how many clubs have better outfields?
Radio,
yea….I basically thought so because even if it seems like they will or should….baseball salaries just never really go backwards…..and Darvish is supposedly a lot better than Dice K.
LGY,
lol….those beach jumps look tough. I still don’t know about the guy but he is impressive in a try out…..you can look at it 2 ways I think. One way is that 30-50 million dollars is crazy for a guy that has never played against high level competition…..another though is to consider how cheap a 5 or 6 year deal at that money would be if he turned out to be legit……with the restrictions up coming and the Yankees revenue streams…..why not?
The Yanks have a lot more on the horizon in the outfield than they do at SS….that’s the toughest position to fill with quality in the game right now.
Gary,
good post…I agree. It’s all in how the Yankees evaluate him and how much they are willing to risk. As I’ve said before…..if I’m Cashman then to make a move on him I’d need to know that Hal isn’t going to consider the posting fee in the payroll….that’s he’s just going to pay it and move on like it were some other kind of bill that the organization pays.
Gary,
I don’t disagree. He’s got great potential. It looks like the Jays just wanted him more. CJ Wilson only got a $77.5 million investment, and he pitched to a 3.35 and 2.94 ERA in the past two years. It is hard to pony up $25 million more for a guy who hasn’t pitched in the majors.
I’m being a bit of an apologist about it, but I’d completely understand the Yankees thinking for not bidding higher on Darvish. I’d love to have him, but we don’t need him if we have faith in our young guys.
YankeeRay December 18th, 2011 at 9:58 am
50mm plus bid on Yu sounds Yankeeish. Would be one of Casmans greatest stealth moves but I don’t see it. That said I also don’t see Toronto or Texas shelling out that kind of coin as 120mm total package for someone who hasn’t thrown a MLB pitch appears borderline nuts.
Beltran would be a great fit for us but I think he wants too much money and a guaranteed full time position.
____________________________________________________________________________
Ray I guess it’s how you look at it. If the guy goes out and pitches to his current track record he’s worth all that money, if he goes out and doesn’t then he wasn’t. My problem here is that you can’t assume either so you have to go with the data and the assessments of the scouts that have seen them, all of which are are that he is real deal assessment and his stats sure don’t indicate he will be a flop as a pitcher.
You don’t have the benefit on a Japanese pitcher of having the MLB data and I can’t fathom that becomes a deal breaker for Japanese pitchers and players. The basis for much of the money debate is really the posting price and the bid, it’s a fault of the system not the player. If this was just a salary discussion it would have far less controversy.
If I were a Padres fan, I’d be very insulted by that Garza/Rizzo rumor. It just makes no sense, other than suggesting the Padres are the Cubs’ new farm team.
If I were the Padres I’d trade Rizzo for Garza in a heartbeat….then flip Garza for something better. That whole situation with Hoyer was shady IMO.
yankee21 December 18th, 2011 at 9:54 am
108 stitches, I am more than fine with signing Beltran, but only if they find a taker for Swisher. The concern for me is ultimately he would wind up taking AB away from Montero as a DH, and that is a mistake imo.
I doubt they sign Beltran, too much money, not enough need, too much risk, so it wouldn’t fit into the nice sweet gingerly way NY is embarked on.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The whole idea behind Beltran if he’s signed reasonable enough for 2 years with a team option for a 3rd year is NOT to replace Swisher but to give enough flexibility while Mason Williams and other young hopeful OF’s develop within the minor league levels.
Andruw Jones only has value as a sometime corner OF and very limited at bats as a DH with Montero now around.
How about a 3 way between the Padres, Yanks , and Cubbies.
….”The whole idea behind Beltran if he’s signed reasonable enough for 2 years with a team option for a 3rd year is NOT to replace Swisher but to give enough flexibility while Mason Williams and other young hopeful OF’s develop within the minor league levels….”
That is your idea and it may be NY’s idea, but do you really think that’s Beltran’s idea to sign on to be some team’s option and add flexiblity?
IMO Beltran is looking for some more coin, and the only way he is going to get that coin is if he lands a starting gig. As it stands now, NY cannot offer him that unless they move Swisher or Gardner, and I doubt they move Gardner as they would not have a b/u CF.
We don’t know how much playing for a championship would mean to Beltran at this point in his career….also coming back to NY.
perhaps he’d prefer to play for a title on a 2 year deal with the Yankees as opposed to a 3 year deal for a non contender…..he’s already made a lot of money in his career.
Who is a non-contender anymore?
Serious question.
With the additional wild card spot, there are a lot of teams that qualify as contenders these days.
I think Beltran fits better into a four outfielder scheme myself.. I wouldn’t want to depend on him.
Gary, I agree. I like Yu from what I’ve read and the few clips I’ve seen of him. I’ve been tracking him for a couple of years and obviously our scouts have as well. This is a great opportunity to pick up a stud pitcher if thats how they evaluate him without giving up our best prospects.
Thats why I wouldn’t be shocked if Cash weant stealth and picked up the tab.
But the luxury tax is probably the deciding factor that would keep us out unfortunately.
“Who is a non-contender anymore?”
Padres, Astros, Mariners, Mets, Royals, A’s, Orioles etc…..non-contender wasn’t the best choice of words though. What I meant was that maybe he’d like to maximize his chances at winning a title and the Yankees certainly are one of the teams that could offer a good chance at getting to the WS.
Good morning-
Wonder how Yu Darvish feels about playing for the Blue Jays in the Homerdome? Bid of 51M or higher might mean there will be no sincere effort to give him 15M+/yearX minimum 5-6 years.
He made 6M last year playing ball and an estimated 6M in endorsements+ he’s going thru divorce proceedings.
Will he sign for less than 15M/year? Is this just a game of poker by Toronto, with no intention of signing him, only to block other AL teams from getting him?
Montero was third on MLB networks breakout candidates for 2012 and FWIW Heyman said some really nice things about him….compared him to Manny Ramierez and said he thinks he will be a star and soon.
Maybe it’s best to refer to those teams as rebuilders.
There have been reports that the Blue Jays bid between 40-50 million….and also reports that the winning bid beat Dice K’s…..if those are true then the Jays couldn’t have won? I don’t think anyone knows who won except MLB right now to be honest.
blake December 18th, 2011 at 10:32 am
We don?t know how much playing for a championship would mean to Beltran at this point in his career?.also coming back to NY.
perhaps he?d prefer to play for a title on a 2 year deal with the Yankees as opposed to a 3 year deal for a non contender?..he?s already made a lot of money in his career.
——
Blake, who is to say if Beltran thinks he can win here in the next 2 years? Maybe he and his agent think we are not going to win so maybe he just focuses on a starting gis and the money.
Giambi came here and talked about winning 10 titles. Arod did the same thing and has 1 so far.
No guarantees that we will win so Beltrans perception might be different than ours and be all about the Benjamins.
” The Week of Yu ”
In what sense ?
L . o . l .
Nothing happened .
L . o . l .
“Blake, who is to say if Beltran thinks he can win here in the next 2 years? Maybe he and his agent think we are not going to win so maybe he just focuses on a starting gis and the money.”
why would they think that? The Yankees have missed the playoffs 1 time in almost 2 decades.
winning the WS is hard…..making the playoffs every year though gives you the best chance to do it and the Yankees are as much of a lock for that as any team in baseball.
When your looking at an International player and guessing whether the Yanks are gonna pursue that player in ernest, it’s $$$ 1st, and the appraisal of the Yankee scouting dept. 2nd. The Yankee scouts absolutely raved about Darvish, and the Yanks bid modestly according to All reports. With the reports coming outta Japan that the winning Darvish bid was in excess of Dice K’s $51 Mill, you gotta figure that aint Hal. Remember Cashman’s “pitching, pitching ,pitching” quote, and couple that with the miserly attitude Now being employed by Hal before salavating over Any international offensive players. If Hal can get an international player of merit on-the-cheap like Nakawhatever, he’ll do it. Other than that, you better strictly use that Hot Stove for warmth. It’s the only legitimate purpose it’s gonna serve.
The Red’s Latos deal is getting overshadowed with the growing drumbeat surrounding the winning Darvish bid. A young Chucker getting dealt with the numbers of Latos is Big news. Throw in the fact that the Cards are Worse after losing Pujols, and the Brewers are Worse after probably losing Fielder, and Braun’s offensive numbers now resembling those of a mere mortal after being exposed, and you got an NL Central that is now a 3 team race. Should Theo\Cubs manage to get Fielder, you then got a 4 team race.
JonHeymanCBS Jon Heyman
If #cubs get rizzo, certainly cheaper than prince. But fielder has plenty of other interest. Hear 5-6 teams in.
3 minutes ago
If the Padres got Garza then you’d have to believe it would be either to flip him or the deal is a 3 way…..just can’t see why the Padres would have any use for 2 years of Garza when they are clearly rebuilding.
Blake-
Focus first on another starter and then see if if the Yankees allot the kind of $$$ it’ll take to sign Boras client Beltran.
Kuroda makes a lot of sense on a one year contract, and perhaps a club option for a 2nd year. Going the FA route, conserves the kind of elite trade chips the teams want for the likes of Danks, Floyd, Garza, Gonzalez, Wade, Shields, etc.
I’m bringing this pitchers name up because he’s a lefty, not a FA, but with a contract next year of 10M, and potentially obtainable without giving up top prospects. We haven’t discussed him for a long time, and I’m not necessarily supporting trading for him because it’s potentially a 3 year committment, and I’m not sure he’ll pitch well in AL East, but he is a lefty-Wandy Rodriguez.
Thoughts?
Beltran has a limited amount of teams he could land with and only the Yankees in the AL East could possibly fit him. Detroit is a maybe in the AL Central, none in the AL West. A few NL possibilities that might spend the money but very few.
Orioles – Markakis
Jays – Bautista
Rays – Joyce and other options
Socks – Too rich for their spending; desperate for pitching.
Trader,
how are ya? The problem with Wandy is that the Astros ARE asking for top prospects it seems…..at 32 I just don’t think it would be a good idea.
I like Kuroda if Darvish goes elsewhere and the trade market for guys like Danks never becomes affordable.
108,
Cardinals…Berkman going to 1B….he’d be a good fit for them in RF
Blake-
Well thanks. I’ve mentiones this before, but the route the Yankees might take is:
Sign Kuroda
Sign Nakajima
Perhaps offer SS Nunez to the SS seeking Braves for super utility type arb eligible Martin Prado, especially if Andruw Jones signs elsewhere or is looking for 4-5M.
Good morning folks.
My 2 cents on Cespedes – I think he winds up in Miami. A perfect fit with the city having a large Cuban population, and a Hispanic manager he can communicate with. Miami is not afraid to spend this year, and Cespedes would be a big draw at the gate.
Write it down, Cepedes will be playing for Miami in 2012.
question, have you ever seen an organization go out of their way as much as the Yankees have done recently to temper excitement, lower expectations, and just flat out put a wet blanket on anything positive then Cashman and company have done recently?
with the prices these eggheads are charging for tickets, concessions and parking and at the same time talking incessantly about budgets and process and patience and the like makes me very frustrated with this team and the direction they are going.
they are a team with a model that depends on high level of attendance and buzz and it seems as though they are doing everything in their power to turn this franchise into a freaking lumber company in terms of anticipation over product launches…
I am not asking for moves for moves sake but for crying out loud, can the front office speak with a little more excitement once in a while about what the future holds and the direction they are heading or is that too much to ask?
Trader,
that wouldn’t be a flashy offseason but it would be a pretty good one…..
Who the hell is Rizzo? Good enough to headline a deal for Garza? A cheaper option than Prince? But bumped by Yonder Alonso? And not even the best prospect in the Gonzalez trade?
Who is this enigma?
I am not asking for moves for moves sake but for crying out loud, can the front office speak with a little more excitement once in a while about what the future holds and the direction they are heading or is that too much to ask?
=======================
by all means, bring on the hype…
Just found this on MLBTRs.
The Astros seem willing to take on some salary in a Wandy Rodriguez trade. We heard during the Winter Meetings that Houston didn’t want to eat any of Wandy’s contract to move him, so perhaps the club modified that stance after Jeff Luhnow took over as GM.
Those on this board satisfied with just making the PS each year, please stand next to Hal. Those of us that remember the real goal each year is to be good enough to win a WS, please remember George and what he was all about.
George = Winning!
Hal = Making the biggest profit.
Miami is not afraid to spend this year, and Cespedes would be a big draw at the gate.
================================
why do you think they would draw now when they couldn’t when they won it all in 03?
Rizzo was the Red Sox minor league 1st baseman included in the deal for stealing Adrian Gonzalez away from the Padres.
- YANKEE TRADER SP WISH LIST -
(1) SHIELDS – Tampa aint dealin’ with the Yanks.
(2) WADE – See above
(3) DANKS – No soap onna 1yr crap shoot that is gonna cost me good, young, cheap players.
(4) FLOYD – The guy is just too inconsistent to give away players for. Another crap shoot.
(5) WANDY – NIX on NL Chuckers.
(6) KURODA – Double whammy. NL Chucker AND 1 yr rental.
(7) GARZA – Has positive AL East numbers. I’m listening, though discouraged seeing Theo is dealin’ the cards.
Also meant to add the signing of Jorge Soler along with Kuroda, Nakajima and the trade for Martin Prado.
Those on this board satisfied with just making the PS each year, please stand next to Hal.
===================
This team was good enough to win it all last year as they are now.
Where is the big splash to be made?
Forget Wandy, even if HOU at some cash, they would want the moon for what would amount to at best a #4 starter in the AL East.
HOU is also stupid for trading Melancon a guy that looks to be a potentially good closer for a mediocre return from BOS.
What’s wrong with the direction they are going?
They are trying to model their team after the dynasty teams by building a core of young talent they developed in their own system and plugging in FAs where they see fit.
And those complaining about the lack of spending…didn’t they just sign their ace to an extension?
Aren’t they going to have the highest payroll in MLB for the umpteenth year in a row?
I’d rather the front office spend wisely and make the right decisions than spend like a drunken sailor whether the moves make sense or not.
I think someone should investigate to see if Racheal Phelps actually bought the Astros.
- BIG AL -
Your sentiments are exactly why yesterday I called for letting HANK call the shots. He at least does things with winning a World Series in mind. CPA Hal issa bottom liner that also substitutes for a health dose of sominex.
The Cardinals might not be in on Carlos Beltran. They already have Holliday, Jay, Craig, and Schumaker can play OF if needed.
Wouldn’t be surprised if the Tigers, who are looking to add a lefty to the rotation, go after Wandy Rodriguez.
mick -
There is great interest in the team moving into their new stadium, and the team is spending a great deal of money on players, which has generated a large sall of season tickets already. drawing in the large Cuban population is one of the main reasons they went hard after Albert, and will now go hard after Cespedes, butts in the seats equals enough money to pay those higher salaries.
Rizzo was the Padres #1 prospect before they made the Latos trade……he’s also an ex-Theo prospect so perhaps he wants to get him back……or perhaps he and Hoyer just have built up guilt over how they screwed the Padres over.
ANY team exiting in Rd 1 of the Playoffs has work to do. A team exiting in RD 1 with the highest payroll in MLB needs revisions on the field And off.
Ken_Rosenthal Ken Rosenthal
Source: #BlueJays were finalist on Latos, as mentioned by @pgammo. Romero, Latos and possibly Darvish. Would have been pretty good! #MLB
1 minute ago
“ANY team exiting in Rd 1 of the Playoffs has work to do. A team exiting in RD 1 with the highest payroll in MLB needs revisions on the field And off.”
do you think the Cardinals were the best team in baseball in 2011?
DONNYBROOK December 18th, 2011 at 11:32 am
ANY team exiting in Rd 1 of the Playoffs has work to do. A team exiting in RD 1 with the highest payroll in MLB needs revisions on the field And off.
———
The offseason isn’t over yet. ST doesn’t start until mid-Feb.
The Cards were the best team in MLB in the month of Oct. That is what feeds the bulldog, and Always has.
“The Cards were the best team in MLB in the month of Oct. That is what feeds the bulldog, and Always has.”
so the Yankees should try to find players that will get hot in October?
Really the Yankees offense would improve if the players would hit their “contract”
Some fans clearly refuse to adapt to the culture change going on in MLB.
mick -
If you take an honest look at our SP, and all the question marks around them, can can say you believe the Yanks SP stacks up well against teams they would face in the PS, you are dreaming.
This team needs, as Cashman has been saying for quite a while, a #2 SP, and could use a solid bat off the bench.
I’m not satisfied with just making the PS, I want to win it all, and that appears to conflict with Hal’s thinking, keep the team competitive, but keep costs down.
With the top teams in the AL getting better each year, and the Yankees basically standing pat, we are losing ground, and will soon be simply a good to very good team, as oppossed to being a championship team, IMO.
AL
Not buying the Miami hype. Pujols was never going there. He wants to DH eventually and Miami obviously didn’t overwhelm him with their money. They couldn’t sell out their 03 WS why will they now? It’s just not a baseball town.
I am surprised Hoyer wasn’t strung up or something already by the faithful 400 or so Padre fans out there by now.
What a joke of a GM Hoyer was for SD, or should I say working for BOS on SD payroll.
___
I am surprised there was not talk about investigating this…..
He literally went to SD for a year, gave the sox their best player for NOTHING and then left.
I mean the Reds gave 4 good players for Mat Latos.
If you take an honest look at our SP, and all the question marks around them, can can say you believe the Yanks SP stacks up well against teams they would face in the PS, you are dreaming.
=============================
AL
SP didn’t win this years WS. They are building a staff from within, what you need is patience.
I’m not satisfied with just making the PS, I want to win it all, and that appears to conflict with Hal’s thinking, keep the team competitive, but keep costs down.
=====================================
AL
Highest payroll in MLB.
mick -
We’re all free to think what we want, and believe what we want, we just disagree, which is fine. Have a good day.
With the top teams in the AL getting better each year, and the Yankees basically standing pat,
==========================================
97 wins, most wins in the AL.
We’re all free to think what we want, and believe what we want, we just disagree, which is fine.
================
AL
Thanks for that reminder.
Try basing your arguments on facts for a change.
I’d still say on paper the Yankees are the best team in baseball. How do the Phillies and Sox look coming into this year? How about the Rangers after losing Wilson? How about the Cardinals?
The Angels needed to make some moves to compete this year, I don’t think they vaulted straight to the top.
George was hit and miss when it came to acquiring high paid talent. Reggie and Catfish were no brainers. Most of the time he overspent. Hal is hardly running this team into the ground. Hank has no baseball acumen and should be kept gagged in the basement where he has been relegated by Hal and Cash.
- BLAKE -
The Yankee problem the last 2 yrs in Oct has Not been the players in Oct. It has been the way these players have NOT been used in Sept. The last 2 seasons Girardi has gone into that, “keep my players fresh” song-and-dance, giving offensive players frequent days off. This has resulted in the Yanks staggering into Oct. flat assa pancake. I can see giving offensive players that are nursing injuries a few day off in Sept, but other than that, it’s peddle-to-the-metal. The last 2 seasons Girardi has rendered the Yanks DOA heading into Oct. THAT is the problem with the Yankee offense in Oct.
“This has resulted in the Yanks staggering into Oct. flat assa pancake”
like when they swept the Twins in the ALDS last year?
mick -
Having the highest payroll means nothing, when you consider 4 players make up the majority of that payroll.
CC – pitched poorly in the PS
A-Rod – did nothing in the PS
Tex – Enjoyed another not so good PS
Jeter – At least he got some hits, just not the timely hits needed.
So, if you’re satified with the team as is, and you believe that the top prospects will all turn out to be great and carry this team in the near future, good for you. I’m not buying into all that hype. I do believe over the next 3-4 years we will benefit from the farm system, not we’ll still need to sign FA to stay on top.
I don’t however believe in over paying, but the International market and FA’s available this off season could have made the Yankees much better suited for the PS, than the present makeup.
Those on this board satisfied with just making the PS each year, please stand next to Hal. Those of us that remember the real goal each year is to be good enough to win a WS, please remember George and what he was all about.
————
Those who want any prospect to be sent down to the minors after an 0-for-5, stand next to George.
He may have been “all about winning” – but that is not always a good thing.
The Yanks have some areas where they could improve that would maximize their chances at winning the WS….the problem is doing those things without mortgaging the next 10 years and that’s the balancing act the Yanks are trying to accomplish right now.
Later folks – Y’all have a great day.
Donnybrook,
A-Rod was out of whack through no fault of Girardi’s. Tex had consistency issues all season long.
AND The team threw up some big numbers against the Tigers too.
I’m not buying what you’re selling.
I don’t however believe in over paying, but the International market and FA’s available this off season could have made the Yankees much better suited for the PS, than the present makeup
===========================================
Name names AL.
Cash obviously disagrees and will wait it out for more sure things to go with our prospects.
If you were GM we might not have any.
RadioKev December 18th, 2011 at 10:03 am
blake December 18th, 2011 at 10:00 am
“We are fine right now, but the OF is the uneasiest aspect of the ballclub, IMO.”
SS for me long term.
———
I don’t get what’s wrong with our outfield. Swisher isn’t a superstar. So what? Yet again, how many clubs have better outfields?
///
It’s not that there is something “wrong” with it; it’s that it’s heavily dependent on the CF. I’d like some more balance, especially since Girardi showed a reluctance to use his bench when a better option was needed in spots late in games in ALDS.
My thought is, given that conservatism, you want more oomph up and down, so it doesn’t come down to, say, a decision to leave a batter in there who is swinging out of his shoes, or one who is must overmatched, with the bases juiced, when we just need a contact guy who isn’t going to wave at everything a pitcher is throwing and get himself out.
I don’t really expect much innovation from Girardi, so my thought is, make the status quo a little more potent, so it doesn’t necessarily boil down to a do-or-die type of AB that rests on the manager’s decision.
It may come down to that any way, but the point is, IMO, Girardi’s weakness appears to be improvising away from his rote habits, regardless of the stakes. Give him less “difficult” decisions to make by having inherent options… Now, who knows if that’s one of these Cubans, or a Carlos Beltran… given Beltran’s age and the pessimism from some about Cespedes (who may well be a guy who’ll swing out of his shoes)…those options might be just as unreliable or moreso…. I just would like to see an attempt at upgrade, or depth added, especially in the Cubans’ case, since there’s no penalty to pay by adding them.
If they can’t hit, or Soler can but isn’t ready, and Cespedes they’re not confident about, well then, they’re not going to sign the latter and at worst, we’ve just added some depth in the former who’ll have roughly the same arrival times as Williams, etc….
I can live with that OF, but it would be sweet if we could add a 26 year old who has a dynamic bat. What if this guy really takes off, can field, throw and hit, making the decision to slate him in the everday lineup easy? And during the regular season? I have heard his plate discipline isn’t great, so he may not be the answer or at least not an immediate answer, but if they sign him, then that says their thinking is otherwise…
It’s far too difficult to speculate about a guy you’ve never seen…but I’d be feeling more secure with a better bat out there if it could painlessly appear…
Blake, SS is more of a down the road concern, more than the OF, for sure, since we have a healthy number or really good OF prospects a few years away… There are some SS options, possibly, but they’re way down there and who knows how they’ll grow physically…a bigger concern, long term, no doubt…
It’s really tough to win a WS….so many things have to go your way to win 3 straight series against good teams…..it’s why you just don’t see dynasties in baseball anymore and why the Yankees of the late 90′s were so special.
J Alfred Prufrock,
I appreciate that Swisher isn’t a superstar.
How many teams have better outfields? I’m honestly not looking at anything right now, but I’d bet the Yankees have a strong WAR outfield.
Latest predictions before I go, subject to change at any minute:
Fielder to Cubs, despite the winds that blow in at Wrigley in April and May. Wants to play in the field as he’s only 27. Sorry Mariners.
Darvish returns to Japan, as a contract of 15-16M/year times 6 years can’t be worked out. he makes 12M/year in salary and endorsements already in Japan.
Andrew Baily gets traded to Red Sox for Josh Reddick and 2 others.
Cespedes as Big AL feels is signed by the Marlins and Logan Morrison is packaged for another starter.
Yankees sign Kuroda for one year, sign Nakajima, and Jorge Soler.
Have a great day. Until later.
the prophet has spoken
Andrew Baily gets traded to Red Sox for Josh Reddick and 2 others.
———–
Puketastic
JAP,
yea….the Yanks have pretty good depth and upside everywhere except SS. They have some good OF prospects (and could improve that this winter by signing Soler), they have the catching pipeline, Montero can play 1B in a few years, and they are deep on the mound. Maybe Culver takes a step forward this year.
You couldn’t be more wrong about Girardi’s approach with the lineups at the end of the regular season.
The Yanks had a rough Sept with all the postponements from earlier in the season. No days off and a few doubleheaders tossed in there.
Check out the lineups after the Yanks clinched. I’d argue that Girardi didn’t rest his regulars ENOUGH the last week of games, especially the last few games against TB when none of those games meant squat to them.
Beane won’t give the Sox a sweetheart deal for Bailey….if they trade for him it will hurt….and probably more than just signing Madson for the money. I almost hope they trade whats left of their farm system for a closer coming off surgery.
RadioKev-
Pukestatic.
Meant to add that Bailey has trouble not only staying off the DL but pitching in the AL East.
Beltran should not be limited to RF, he should be able to play LF also. If the Yankees acquired him 1. it would be for near full time play, 2. he would either replace Swisher who gets traded or replace Gardner who could become the 4th of and still get a decent amount of playing time (he doesn’t have to be traded). Beltran replacing Gardner has a much bigger impact on the offense than him replacing Swisher. That said I’m only in favor of it if it’s a 2 year deal, not 3, and him replacing Gardner makes much more sense than him replacing Swisher (not that I hate Gardner).
Maybe Nunez is this team’s future shortstop.
- BLAKE -
So you regard beating the Twinks as some kinda conquest? Your credibility is in serious jeopardy.
“Beltran replacing Gardner has a much bigger impact on the offense than him replacing Swisher.”
I’d agree with that assuming Beltran could be effective and stay healthy roaming that big LF at YS.
I think though if they signed Beltran then they would want to trade Swisher to offset salary and to get something for him…..unless of course they got a pretty big return for Gardner in a deal.
“So you regard beating the Twinks as some kinda conquest? Your credibility is in serious jeopardy.”
you said Girardi had the team limping into the playoffs the last 2 seasons…..well they swept the Twins and won game 1 of the ALCS in 2010 after he rested guys in September. If you call winning the first 4 games of the playoffs being rusty or whatever then ok……
RadioKev December 18th, 2011 at 11:59 am
J Alfred Prufrock,
I appreciate that Swisher isn’t a superstar.
How many teams have better outfields? I’m honestly not looking at anything right now, but I’d bet the Yankees have a strong WAR outfield.
///
Radio, it’s not about the OF relative to other teams’. For me, it’s about upgrading because we can, if we can (that is, if they think those two kids are worth it). Swisher not being a “superstar” is not my issue: Ideally, I would like a different kind of hitter in that mix.
Keeping Gardner and taking him off of the field seems totally useless to me. If it’s four, Gardner keeps his spot and it’s Beltran and Swisher in RF/DH.
JonHeymanCBS Jon Heyman
If rizzo does go to #cubs for garza, it presumably would be part of package. Some wonder why cubs seem so willing to trade garza tho
2 minutes ago
Montero must be in virtually every lineup, IMO, whether as BUC or DH.
“Montero must be in virtually every lineup, IMO, whether as BUC or DH.”
or 5-10 games at 1B against tough righties
Radio, it’s not about the OF relative to other teams’. For me, it’s about upgrading because we can, if we can (that is, if they think those two kids are worth it). Swisher not being a “superstar” is not my issue: Ideally, I would like a different kind of hitter in that mix.
——-
And might point is we’ve got a lot of value in that outfield. I understand the wishlist aspect of having an all star team, anyone would want that, but is it realistic? Is it realistic to be concerned too?
I don’t think trading Swisher would return much value and then we’d overspend on Beltran who has to turn old at some point. He’ll probably land a three year deal somewhere too.
Stay away from the committment and just keep rolling with what we’ve got, my opinion.
Blake is right.
The Yanks were 4-0 (3-0 against the Twins and 1-0 against the Rangers) after their first 4 games of the 2010 postseason.
The facts do seem to counter the “Yanks were rusty” theory.
If your looking to replace Gardner in LF, I would go to KC and inquire about Alex Gordon. The problem with adding Beltran to the Yanks is that Montero has the DH Slot clogged. This gives the Yanks no where to go with Beltran should his knees act up. NIX on Beltran
40 games behind the plate, 5 games at 1B, and 110 games at DH would be good for Montero. Assuming of course that he wasn’t a disaster at 1B in ST…..I doubt that part will happen….but Posada played acceptably at 1B last year a few times at nearly 40. They should get his feet wet and at least start getting him some experience there IMO when they can.
Off to the local sports bar to catch the G Men, put the GB game on instead here ?*#$@!@
BIG AL December 18th, 2011 at 11:53 am
mick -
Having the highest payroll means nothing, when you consider 4 players make up the majority of that payroll.
CC – pitched poorly in the PS
A-Rod – did nothing in the PS
Tex – Enjoyed another not so good PS
Jeter – At least he got some hits, just not the timely hits needed.
So, if you’re satified with the team as is, and you believe that the top prospects will all turn out to be great and carry this team in the near future, good for you. I’m not buying into all that hype. I do believe over the next 3-4 years we will benefit from the farm system, not we’ll still need to sign FA to stay on top.
I don’t however believe in over paying, but the International market and FA’s available this off season could have made the Yankees much better suited for the PS, than the present makeup.
==========================
That team lost because of an inability to score runs consistently. They Yanks scored 20 runs in two games, and 9 in the rest of the series. The pitching was good enough to win the series; the run production was not.
they lost this year because they got shut down by Scherzer and because they didn’t make Fister pay for the numerous mistakes he made in game 5…..it happened…..the Tigers were always a bad matchup for them because of their good RH pitching……if they played that series 10 times I think the Yankees would have won 6 or 7 of them…..they just didn’t win the 1 series that was played.
While it would be more than amusing, and controversial to say the least, if Darvish were to pass on a ML contract that did not suit his wishe$, I don’t think the Ham Fighters would be laughing. Reportedly, they are counting on collecting the hefty posting fee, which they’d lose if he doesn’t sign a contract. I’d have to think there would be a lot of pressure brought to bear on Darvish.
16M X 5 = 80M. That’s a lot of salary and years to commit to, and it doens’t take into account the upfront posting fee. All for a pitcher who is a very big question mark.
Can you imagine what might happen to the GM who signs Yu Darvish, and he doesn’t pan out?
blake December 18th, 2011 at 12:20 pm
they lost this year because they got shut down by Scherzer and because they didn’t make Fister pay for the numerous mistakes he made in game 5…..it happened…..the Tigers were always a bad matchup for them because of their good RH pitching……if they played that series 10 times I think the Yankees would have won 6 or 7 of them…..they just didn’t win the 1 series that was played.
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I’m not sure that I buy that. Maybe the Tigers were a bad match-up. However, the Yanks exit from the playoffs was entirely predictable. The problems that the Yanks had producing runs in the postseason were very similar to the problems that they had in the regular season. Until they figure out how to score on a more consistent basis, they will be subject to hot streaks to win.
GGBG is going to have a bounceback year offensively speaking I like what he brings to the line- up, even if it’s in the bottom of the order. If an OF has to be traded I’m betting it’s swisher.
Thinking out loud I wonder what it would take to get the good Upton? Nevermind I don’t want to know.
Yeah Blake,
The Yankees just got beat these past two years. And that’s baseball. Even the best teams in the game lose around 60 times a year. You just can’t win them all.
The Yankees scored the 2nd most runs in baseball and had the best run differential in 2011 by far despite having a fairly mediocre rotation. This wasn’t by accident…..every team has hot and cold spells over the course of the season offensively…..it’s not just the Yankees.
- WHY YANKS LOST VS. DETROIT IN PLAYOFFS -
(1) YANKEE OFFENSE RENDERED IMPOTENT DUE TO GIRARDI SITTING REGULARS IN SEPT.
(2) “ACE” CC MIA.
“Thinking out loud I wonder what it would take to get the good Upton? Nevermind I don’t want to know.
”
Montero, Banuelos, Gary Sanchez, and Mason Williams. That’s what I’d ask for if I were Towers…..it would have to be a major major haul.
Speaking of Towers…..how about the arms he’s collected there. There starting pitching is going to be unreal in a couple of years if even a couple of the upside starters they have pan out.
Do you right for the NY Post?
Write, I should say
gotta run…been fun this morning. Yall have a good day
“.every team has hot and cold spells over the course of the season offensively…..it’s not just the Yankees.”
I pretty much agree with everything you saying, but I think last years team was consistently inconsistent in scoring runs. And it came back to bite them when it counted most.
“Deal With It December 18th, 2011 at 6:32 am
First everybody here is hot to trot for Yu and can’t live without him, he is the alleged savior.. Now that the supposed bid posting amount is leaking out, coupled with his expected contract demands he is now much too expensive. ”
Nice example of the LoHud Fallacy.
DONNYBROOK December 18th, 2011 at 12:30 pm
- WHY YANKS LOST VS. DETROIT IN PLAYOFFS -
(1) YANKEE OFFENSE RENDERED IMPOTENT DUE TO GIRARDI SITTING REGULARS IN SEPT.
************
Total BS – Yanks outscored Detroit by wide margins in games one and four – they had difficulty hitting w/ RISP – but so do a lot of teams in the playoffs – it happens – that is the difference sometimes b/w a team winning it all or not. But this had nothing to do with Girardi resting his players in September – which he did not completely do as he did in 2010 AND 2009 (when they won the whole thing).
Facts and LoHud blog do not go together.
blake December 18th, 2011 at 12:28 pm
The Yankees scored the 2nd most runs in baseball and had the best run differential in 2011 by far despite having a fairly mediocre rotation. This wasn’t by accident…..every team has hot and cold spells over the course of the season offensively…..it’s not just the Yankees.
=======================
No, I’m not buying that. This has been going on since Matsui, Damon, and Cabrera left. What happened in Detroit is not at all unlike what happened in the regular season. The offense averaged 6 runs per game, despite being veritable no-shows for three of the five games. This Yankee team over the last couple years has been way too dependent on hot streaks for their run production…
- STONEY -
Cano grand slam late, made that 1 Yankee win look like a lopsided affair. It was NOT.Yanks were horrible in Sept as they tanked it per Girardi’s lineups, and that carried over in Oct. CC stunk it up too.
Stoneburner December 18th, 2011 at 12:35 pm
DONNYBROOK December 18th, 2011 at 12:30 pm
- WHY YANKS LOST VS. DETROIT IN PLAYOFFS -
(1) YANKEE OFFENSE RENDERED IMPOTENT DUE TO GIRARDI SITTING REGULARS IN SEPT.
************
Total BS – Yanks outscored Detroit by wide margins in games one and four – they had difficulty hitting w/ RISP – but so do a lot of teams in the playoffs – it happens – that is the difference sometimes b/w a team winning it all or not. But this had nothing to do with Girardi resting his players in September – which he did not completely do as he did in 2010 AND 2009 (when they won the whole thing).
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B-b-but, he put it in alll caps!
Nick in SF December 18th, 2011 at 12:34 pm
“Deal With It December 18th, 2011 at 6:32 am
First everybody here is hot to trot for Yu and can’t live without him, he is the alleged savior.. Now that the supposed bid posting amount is leaking out, coupled with his expected contract demands he is now much too expensive. ”
Nice example of the LoHud Fallacy.
===========
this team doesn’t need a savior. It can win as it is currently constituted. With a couple of tweaks, it could be a juggernaut. Who knows? Maybe getting Montero into the lineup on a regular basis might cure what ails this club.
You know, it’s funny that Swisher’s post season is held against, and Gardner’s good post season doesn’t do anything for him either.
Something’s incosistent in the logic.
RadioKev December 18th, 2011 at 12:49 pm
You know, it’s funny that Swisher’s post season is held against, and Gardner’s good post season doesn’t do anything for him either.
Something’s incosistent in the logic.
===========
Or something very consistent with it. It’s funny that way….
OK, here are some random Sunday thoughts for Yu all…
Let’s start with the basics.
(1) GMs try to make their clubs better on the field for the regular 162 as cost efficiently as possible. That’s what they are paid to do. They don’t deal for the postseason, to make a “splash,” to “counter their rivals,” etc. That is all just fanboy and sports blog nonsense.
(2) As the ancient and learned Bobcat said “you hear what they want you to hear.”
(3) What if the rumors that the Jays bid high and the Yankees bid low were rumors from a few hours BEFORE the 4 PM Wed deadline, and were the GMs messing with each other? The Jays (who should have no interest) would want the Yanks to bid high, and the Yankees (who should have a lot of interest) would want the Jays to bid low. These rumors are in both of their interests.
(4) Given (1) above, the Jays and Cubs have a lot more holes to fill than a potential #2. It makes no sense for either of them to blow all of their $$$$ on an unproven Japanese pitcher, no matter how potentially good. Remember, JP Riccardi was dumped in part due to exorbitant contracts for Vernon Wells and BJ Ryan. Same thing with the Cubs old GM, for the Zambrano contract amongst others.
(5) The Yankees most pressing need is a #2. They have really few other glaring holes to fill. They have a stacked minor league roster full of SPs if the gamble does not work out. They are willing to spend for pitching, and gamble with it (Carl Pavano, AJ Burnett, anyone?). That means if they really did bid, they bid to win. Nothing else makes sense.
(6) An important aspect of Japanese culture is “face.” It is terrible to lose “face.” If someone offers a bid of $40-50 million and the player is then not signed, everyone loses “face.” Remember the Dice-K debacle of a few years ago? Boras and his antics were overridden at the last minute by Dice-K, remember–and it was about losing “face.” This may explain the Ham Fighters reluctance to accept the bid. They want to be sure it is from a club that will sign the player, and a player the club wants to go to–especially when the player criticized the club and the posting system in public (a very big no-no in Japan). They are probably doing everything they can to be sure that it was the Yankees who made the high bid, and it is taking few days.
(7) The logical conclusion is that the Yankees made the high bid, and the Hams are being sure it was them and that Yu will sign with them. I cannot think of any other outcome that makes sense. Rangers? Mariners? Their money is better spent more efficiently elsewhere.
Very interesting next 48 hours.
PS–Jed Hoyer will never be a GM for any club other than the Cubs again. He screwed himself big time as Theo’s lackey.