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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Garza on the move?

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Jan 09, 2012 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Is another starting pitcher on the move? Is another massive prospect package about to change hands?

The late rumor tonight has the Tigers and Cubs talking about a deal that would send Matt Garza for Detroit in exchange for a group of young players that could include top pitching prospect Jacob Turner.

David Kaplan of CSNChicago is reporting that talks have progressed “far beyond the initial stages.”

As with all of the other starting pitcher moves this winter, the Yankees involvement seems to have hinged on the prospects required to make a move. So far they’ve balked at meeting the high asking prices.

A few other notes from this Hall of Fame Monday…

• Craig Calcaterra takes a look at the results of those players who didn’t gain election into the Hall of Fame this afternoon. Bernie Williams got enough votes to stay on the ballot, but not nearly enough to suggest he’ll ultimately be elected.

• Our own Rick Carpiniello wrote about his Hall of Fame ballot and his decision to vote for only one player: Don Mattingly.

• More good stuff on the pending retirement of Jorge Posada comes from three of the very best in New York. Tyler Kepner and Jack Curry and Mark Feinsand each wrote about the life and career of Posada. As always, those are must-read pieces.

• Speaking of Posada, over at The Hardball Times, Chris Jaffe takes a look at Posada’s career highlights and milestones. It’s an extensive list.

• Sports Business Journal writes that Major League Baseball is beginning to discuss how to schedule and televise an additional round of playoffs this year. 

Associated Press photo

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122 Responses to “Garza on the move?”

  1. GreenBeret7 January 9th, 2012 at 9:44 pm

    For a player of Garza’s talents, he certainly moves around a lot and never stays anywhere very long. 4 teams in 5 years.

  2. Joe from Long Island January 9th, 2012 at 9:47 pm

    GB – that’s the concern I’ve had about Edwin Jackson. Something’s fishy.

  3. GreenBeret7 January 9th, 2012 at 9:52 pm

    Joe,

    I think with Jackson, it’s more about unfulfilled talent and expectations so far. Garza has produced and still gets moved.

  4. blake January 9th, 2012 at 9:52 pm

    Turner is a pretty comparable prospect to Banuelos….he’s higher on some lists and and they are about the same age…if the Tigers go there then they must be all in for 2012…..would be a bit of a strange move to me as they really don’t have a pressing need in the rotation and they really don’t need to push that hard to win now as most of their key players are under contract awhile longer….

  5. blake January 9th, 2012 at 9:56 pm

    Garza got traded from the Rays because they had a surplus of pitching and because they knew they could get a lot in return for him…..maybe he didn’t get along with Madden or whatever I don’t know…..if he gets traded from the Cubs then it’ll be because they want to rebuild…..

    I don’t think guys getting traded always indicates there’s a problem….sometimes its just the situation and the teams they find themselves on don’t fit……Cliff Lee got traded 3 times also.

  6. GreenBeret7 January 9th, 2012 at 9:58 pm

    Another player like garza is Delmon Young. Odd that they were first traded for each other and would now be on the same team.

  7. Joe from Long Island January 9th, 2012 at 10:02 pm

    good night, all. less than a month and a half until pitchers and catchers.

  8. GreenBeret7 January 9th, 2012 at 10:03 pm

    When Detroit moves him or lets him walk, you’ll know somthing is up. There can’t be continuel excuses for moving the same player and there not being a reason for it. According to some, he’s the type that you keep to help build around.

  9. austinmac January 9th, 2012 at 10:15 pm

    Garza is a very good pitcher. The Cubs appear to be getting a lot for him to help their rebuilding. That doesn’t tell me anything nor do his prior trades since perceived value was received each time. Detroit must not see baggage.

  10. ADam January 9th, 2012 at 10:21 pm

    The simple reasons that the Tigers can make this trade much easier than the Yankees can:

    1. Verlander… No body is as good as this guy… Nobody. The tigers can afford to give up on a potential Ace much more than the Yank’s can or should simply because Verlander is Locked up for a few more years and no way the Tigers let him ever see free agency before the age of 33-34.

    2. Cubs and Theo will ask for more from the Yankees than they will from the Tigers( One of many problems with so called competitive balance)

    3. The Yanks have to many bad inflated contracts, If ownership had kept there mitts of Baseball Ops, ARod would not be owed another 146 million dollars, Jeter would not have a 4th year on his contract, and Soriano would not be in pinstripes not really making the budget stuff a problem

    4. Did I mention Verlander?

    5. The Yanks need to start getting good at developing thier own pitchers.. They could have an ace in Joba right now but for some inexplicable reason a kid who was a starting pitcher since he was 8 years old was deemed a natural reliever. I really hope cashman an co have learned from the sins of the past and start developing from within with success

    So whatever that’s worth..

  11. Stoneburner January 9th, 2012 at 10:24 pm

    GreenBeret7 January 9th, 2012 at 9:44 pm
    For a player of Garza’s talents, he certainly moves around a lot and never stays anywhere very long. 4 teams in 5 years.

    *********

    Player movement not that big of an indicator of his talent – case in point – for a play of David Cone’s talents, he certainly moves around a lot and never stays anywhere very long – could be said about Cone in early to mid 90s (1992 Cone – then to the Jays – then to Royals then back to the Jays – then to the Yankees finally in 1995 – case in point).

  12. Ys Guy January 9th, 2012 at 10:28 pm

    everything comes back to joba as a starter. settling the palastinian problem comes back to joba as a starter.

  13. Ys Guy January 9th, 2012 at 10:29 pm

    i was pretty sure garza would cost manny b plus.

  14. blake January 9th, 2012 at 10:34 pm

    I don’t think there is any denying that Bama and LSU were the two best teams…..but this game is almost as boring as the first time they played. Bama’s defense is unreal though…..

  15. J. Alfred Prufrock January 9th, 2012 at 10:35 pm

    Unless there’s some hidden health issue, the Tigers are out of their minds if they’re prepared to include Turner in a package for Garza. I don’t even believe this. They’re nuts.

  16. blake January 9th, 2012 at 10:37 pm

    Im still skeptical that they are actually offering Turner….that’s not been confirmed

  17. Ys Guy January 9th, 2012 at 10:39 pm

    idk, adam miller was rated as highly as turner and look how that turned out.

    you never know, look at joba, oh, i forgot, he was the second coming as a starter…

  18. GreenBeret7 January 9th, 2012 at 10:40 pm

    There’s more to those moves then money and rebuilding teams. something’s not right.

    Everybody wants him and nobody wants to keep him.

  19. J. Alfred Prufrock January 9th, 2012 at 10:40 pm

    It’s got to be BS.

  20. Ys Guy January 9th, 2012 at 10:41 pm

    the yankees got out early on the garza thing, to me that’s because turner was always in the deal and the yankees had to put manny in or forget it. reports are that turner was offered for gio gonzalez, so why wouldn’t he be in the garza deal?

  21. yankee 221 January 9th, 2012 at 10:41 pm

    Cliff Lee has been on 5 different teams (CLE, PHI, SEA, TEX, PHI) in the past 3 years. Haren has been on 4 different teams in 7 years. Gio Gonzalez has been with 4 teams in his career.

    Don’t think it says anything about Garza as a pitcher. He’s been on teams that couldn’t afford him or needed to rebuild. As for a pitcher to “build around” how many of them are there in baseball? And none of those guys are available anyway.

  22. blake January 9th, 2012 at 10:44 pm

    adam miller never performed in the minors the way Turner has. Miller was throwing 5 era ball in A ball as a 20 year old……Turner pitched well in AA and AAA last year as a 20 year old.

  23. Yanks78 January 9th, 2012 at 10:44 pm

    Why is it surprising? Give Detroit credit for actually trying to win a pennant while their star players are in their primes. That’s a novel concept.

  24. J. Alfred Prufrock January 9th, 2012 at 10:47 pm

    I don’t believe they offered him for Gio, either.

  25. blake January 9th, 2012 at 10:47 pm

    “reports are that turner was offered for gio gonzalez, so why wouldn’t he be in the garza deal?”

    because Gio is controlled twice as many years……I think if they’d been offering Turner already then they probably would have already made a deal happen…..maybe they’ve changed their mind and now are including him….but I wouldn’t be so sure.

  26. blake January 9th, 2012 at 10:49 pm

    all I’ve heard reported is that the Tigers would talk about Turner for the “right pitcher”…..they never have indicated who the “right pitcher” might be to my knowledge.

  27. GreenBeret7 January 9th, 2012 at 10:49 pm

    Yeah, I sure wish the yankees would send their top minor league players off for a low #2 or high #3 pitcher. Then spend, spend, spend. Cheap SObs are only spending $200 mil on payroll.

  28. J. Alfred Prufrock January 9th, 2012 at 10:50 pm

    Turner killed once he got to AAA. He has a dynamite arm. Like I said, they’d be out of their minds to move him for Garza. Not that I care – sure as hell don’t want to see him AND Verlander in postseasons to come.

  29. blake January 9th, 2012 at 10:50 pm

    this is the Field goal bowl part 2……

  30. GreenBeret7 January 9th, 2012 at 10:52 pm

    Don’t think it says anything about Garza as a pitcher. He’s been on teams that couldn’t afford him or needed to rebuild. As for a pitcher to “build around” how many of them are there in baseball? And none of those guys are available anyway.

    ————————————————————————————————————————-

    Bs. The most he’s ever made in one year was $5.9 mil and that was this year.

  31. Ys Guy January 9th, 2012 at 10:53 pm

    i dont know how they rate prospects, but miller was rated by ba as the #29 prospect after his 2007 in aaa. turner had better #’s and was rated #21. I’m not saying miller was better, he was not quite rated as highly in aaa, but he turned out to be nothing at all. as somebody said every prospect is suspect. i like the yankees chances if they stick with both betances and banuelos, though, but you never know…

  32. blake January 9th, 2012 at 10:53 pm

    @paul_maholm paul maholm
    I hope to get to continue some things when I visit during the year and start some great things as I start my Cubs career. #GodBless

    So I guess they signed him

  33. GreenBeret7 January 9th, 2012 at 10:55 pm

    Maybe Epstein is trying to convince Boston to give up Scutero and Andrew Miller for Garza.

  34. DaSaint007 January 9th, 2012 at 10:59 pm

    Confirmed: Cubs sign Maholm.

  35. blake January 9th, 2012 at 11:00 pm

    probably a decent sign that Garza will be dealt as the Cubs really didn’t need Maholm just to fill a rotation spot otherwise.

  36. J. Alfred Prufrock January 9th, 2012 at 11:07 pm

    Teams giving up young super projectable arms close to the majors for non elite starters are just plain stupid.

    If I’m a Cubs fan and I went to sleep to Matt Garza, and woke up to Jacob Turner, I’d be ecstatic.

    Wake me up when pitchers and catchers report.

  37. Nick in SF January 9th, 2012 at 11:09 pm

    I should’ve played the “Honey Badger” drinking game instead. :neutral:

  38. GreenBeret7 January 9th, 2012 at 11:10 pm

    Out on waivers and with a minor league option left, he’s worth taking a crack at for one year.

    “The Mets waived Fernando Martinez earlier today, and Adam Rubin of ESPN New York says (on Twitter) one reason he is likely to get claimed is because he has a minor league option remaining. Martinez will take up a spot on the 40-man roster, but any team can send him to the minors without a problem in 2012.”

  39. Ys Guy January 9th, 2012 at 11:15 pm

    fernando martinez, another guy who was rated in the 20′s by BA and now waived after only 131 major league ab’s. just goes to show you never know with prospects…

  40. GreenBeret7 January 9th, 2012 at 11:18 pm

    Still, martinez is only 23 years old

  41. yankee 221 January 9th, 2012 at 11:26 pm

    “Bs. The most he’s ever made in one year was $5.9 mil and that was this year.”

    For Tampa? 1\6th of their payroll. They are loaded with young pitching, it was the perfect opportunity for them to reload their farm. This is what small market teams have to do.

    He is is a good #2-3 pitcher in a market devoid of pitching. If Theo can maximize his value and get a guy like Turner back, he’d be an idiot not to. 6+ years of an arm like Turner vs. 2 of Garza when they’ll likely not be contending? Not even a question.

  42. Best To Ever Do It January 9th, 2012 at 11:31 pm

    I really hope cashman an co have learned from the sins of the past and start developing from within with success

    ———————————–

    Wouldn’t bet my life on it remember they weren’t suppose to mess up Hughes either.

  43. Nick in SF January 9th, 2012 at 11:32 pm

    So in three weeks they play the rubber match for the national championship?

  44. BD (Boston Dave) January 9th, 2012 at 11:34 pm

    I’ve heard Garza is a bit of a punk. But just hearsay and doesn’t mean he can’t pitch.

    But let Detroit have him if they are giving up Turner+

  45. Best To Ever Do It January 9th, 2012 at 11:38 pm

    GreenBeret7 January 9th, 2012 at 11:10 pm

    Out on waivers and with a minor league option left, he’s worth taking a crack at for one year.

    ——————————-

    Picking him up wouldn’t hurt how old is he now 23 yrs old

  46. Best To Ever Do It January 9th, 2012 at 11:50 pm

    Ys Guy January 9th, 2012 at 10:28 pm

    everything comes back to joba as a starter

    ——————————

    It’s one of the biggest things they have messed up in recent history.

  47. Yankee Trader January 9th, 2012 at 11:54 pm

    Maybe Kuroda is on the move too?

    Nikkan Sports mentions that the New York Yankees may be close to a deal with Hiroki Kuroda: a one-year deal worth US$15.5M (around 1.2B yen) and the number 15.

  48. jacksquat January 9th, 2012 at 11:58 pm

    Garza may have had a conflict in TB, or maybe not, but as for the Cubs, they are dumping almost everybody they can. I don’t think them trading Garza necessarily means anything.

  49. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 12:02 am

    Has anyone heard or confirmed the above rumor that Kuroda might be signed by the Yankees?

  50. jacksquat January 10th, 2012 at 12:04 am

    Kuroda is not getting #15. 15 is retired (Munson).

  51. GreenBeret7 January 10th, 2012 at 12:09 am

    He’s not getting $15.5 mil, either.

  52. m January 10th, 2012 at 12:10 am

    $15.5M? WTF?

  53. jacksquat January 10th, 2012 at 12:12 am

    Yeah, 15.5 mil is high, but I was more offended by mention of him getting #15. Maybe they are both misprints, or just pure bs.

  54. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 12:13 am

    Agree no #15 jersey and no 15.5M for one year, but it’s been rumored that he’s planning to pitch with a contender with MLB, so maybe the Yankees will surprise us with a new starter.

  55. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 12:15 am

    Got to go to bed. Source of all Japanese news media rumors:

    http://yakyubaka.com/

  56. GreenBeret7 January 10th, 2012 at 12:43 am

    Hiroyuki Nakajima Re-Signs With Seibu Lions
    By Mike Axisa [January 9 at 11:20pm CST]
    After failing to come to a contract agreement with the Yankees, Hiroyuki Nakajima has returned to a Seibu Lions on a one-year contract worth $3.64MM plus incentives according to a Sanspo report passed along by Patrick Newman of NPB Tracker. The 29-year-old shortstop will become an international free agent after the season and is expected to pursue a deal with an MLB team.

    The Yankees won Nakajima’s negotiating rights with a $2MM bid in early-December. They offered a one-year contract but money was reportedly not the reason they failed to come to terms on a contract, instead it was years. Nakajima wanted to become a free agent after the deal expired while the Yankees wanted standard control (six years). He hit .297/.354/.433 with 16 home runs and 27 doubles in 633 plate appearances for Seibu in 2011.

  57. Nick in SF January 10th, 2012 at 12:44 am

    The #15 was a code, the person who passed on that rumor is trying to send a message that he’s being held captive by Kuroda’s agent. Send help.

  58. Ruby Red Sock January 10th, 2012 at 12:57 am

    Kuroda @ $15m, Garza for a big haul? What don’t you get?

    Cashman quieter than a mouse, isn’t paying ridiculous prices for this over priced crap.

  59. GreenBeret7 January 10th, 2012 at 2:01 am

    From MLBTR

    The Yankees maintain interest in re-signing reliever Luis Ayala according to MLBTR’s Ben Nicholson-Smith (on Twitter). Ayala posted a 2.09 ERA with a 50% ground ball rate in 56 IP for New York last season. Last month we learned that six teams were pursuing the righty.

  60. Ruby Red Sock January 10th, 2012 at 4:52 am

    Ayala now there is a good move, roster and dollar wise.

  61. pongo January 10th, 2012 at 5:06 am

    I think you’re onto something, West Coast Yankee Fan.

  62. Mike Ri January 10th, 2012 at 6:38 am

    just woke up to the Tigers / Garza news. sucks……. i really wanted Garza .

  63. Villa Nova-Ya January 10th, 2012 at 7:00 am

    As long as AJ is still a Yankee, there was never going to be another front-line pitcher coming to the Yankees, unless Nova was allowed to start the season in AAA. Garcia was not signed to be waiting in the wings, either.

  64. blake January 10th, 2012 at 7:12 am

    The Garza stuff isn’t official…..they are just talking so far……it may happen but not yet.

    No way the Yanks give Kuroda 15 million unless they can move AJ……still may nit go to that number.

  65. PacoDooley January 10th, 2012 at 7:19 am

    As we roll towards the season, there doesn’t seem to be many opportunities left to make a splash this offseason. So I am wondering if the Yankees will really have any interest in the two Cubans? They didn’t leverage their financial weight in the Darvish bidding (yes, the final cost was too high, but their bid was also laughably low). They didn’t go after Chapman when he was available, and so I assume that they will not go after either of the Cubans. Maybe they just don’t see a logical reason to spend that much on unproven talent, but if the cost is right, either of the Cuban players could be a nice opportunity to add some high end OF talent to the system…

  66. Mike Ri January 10th, 2012 at 7:19 am

    Blake-

    seems like we are going to war with what we have….. Garza seems like he’s heading to the Tigers. Kurodas’ asking price is ridiculous,, And the Yanks can’t move AJ .

    maybe we’ll take a shot on Oswalt .

  67. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 7:20 am

    Good morning-

    Posted this late last night from Japanese news media yakyubaka.com -it’s probably a totally unfounded rumor:

    http://yakyubaka.com/

    Maybe Kuroda is on the move too?

    Nikkan Sports mentions that the New York Yankees may be close to a deal with Hiroki Kuroda: a one-year deal worth US$15.5M (around 1.2B yen) and the number 15.

    15 is retired for Munson and can’t believe it’s for 15.5M. However he wants to play in the MLs and for a contender, so maybe talks with him and the Yankees are ongoing.

  68. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 7:23 am

    Is Cespedes the second coming of Bo Jackson? Will a Chapman deal seal it for a team? Is he free to sign with any team, or only the one that bids highest in an open bidding war?

  69. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 7:28 am

    seems like we are going to war with what we have…..
    ————————-
    Looks like that might be true and include a return of Luis Ayala.

    The Yankees maintain interest in re-signing reliever Luis Ayala according to MLBTR’s Ben Nicholson-Smith (on Twitter). Ayala posted a 2.09 ERA with a 50% ground ball rate in 56 IP for New York last season. Last month we learned that six teams were pursuing the righty.

    Good numbers, stranded 24 of 36 inherited runners, but everytime I saw him pitch, it seemed thaose were the times he let inherited runners score!!

  70. blake January 10th, 2012 at 7:31 am

    Trader,

    I just can’t see then adding 15 million unless they can subtract 8 or 9 million for AJ….maybe if its one year they’ll say ok…..signing him hurts Boston at the same time…..but based on his they’ve operated this offseason that’s tough to see.

    Mike,

    Im still skeptical of the Garza stuff…..we’ll see.

  71. Mike Ri January 10th, 2012 at 7:32 am

    Good numbers, stranded 24 of 36 inherited runners, but everytime I saw him pitch, it seemed thaose were the times he let inherited runners score!!

    ————————–

    LOL .. Yankee Trader … i remember him giving up runs as well ! ( its another arm.)

  72. champ809 January 10th, 2012 at 7:33 am

    Only makes sense for the Yanks to claim F Mart and bring him to spring training with an eye on starting him wit the Scranton Wanderers…..His Cano-like swing is tailormade for Yanks Stadium.

    He could emerge as Swisher’s 2013 replacement in RF.

    Some on here are seriously undervaluing how good Garza is…I’d certainly give up Turner + for him if I’m Dombrowski….but Cash is smart for not trading either Dellin or Manny for him as they both have ceilings higher than Turner and at least equal to Garza who can be a legit 1a/2 type starter on a championship caliber team.

    He was Tampa’s ace and best SP when they made their run to the series.

    Verlander
    Garza
    Fister
    Scherzer
    Porcello

    is a pretty stacked rotation of guys all in their 20′s….

  73. blake January 10th, 2012 at 7:34 am

    Id love for them to sign both Cubans…..they wont have this opportunity again and Cespedes could bring a big return on investment and Soler will be a minor league deal…..

  74. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 7:38 am

    Blake-

    I don’t see Kuroda on a one year deal for 15.5M. The only truth to that rumor “might” be that the Yankees are in active negotiations with his agent. The benefits of signing the soon to be 37 yo who can still pitch well and also had good stats away from Dodger stadium, to a one year deal, outweigh the negatives of trading away some of the Yankees top pitching talent for the likes of pitchers like Gonzalez, Latos, Garza.

  75. blake January 10th, 2012 at 7:41 am

    “Some on here are seriously undervaluing how good Garza is…I’d certainly give up Turner + for him if I’m Dombrowski…”

    Turner is better prospect than Betances and on par with Banuelos by most all accounts……..you still think the Yanks can get Garza for Romine and a bunch of B listers? ;)

  76. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 7:45 am

    Signing the 23 yo lefty outfielder,Fernando Martinez, to a minor league deal is definitely worth a shot.

    I’m not sure I’d even be willing to include Noesi in a deal for Matt Garza, the way he was pitching this winter.

  77. PacoDooley January 10th, 2012 at 7:46 am

    Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 7:23 am
    Is Cespedes the second coming of Bo Jackson? Will a Chapman deal seal it for a team? Is he free to sign with any team, or only the one that bids highest in an open bidding war?
    ———————————–

    My guess is that Cespedes and his agent will not really rely on a sealed bid process (and they already said that teams will be allowed to up their bids afterwards anyway). Maybe they think that a sealed bid process could lead to a jackpot like the Darvish and Matsusaka posting bids. But you have to imagine that a young Cuban player would love the opportunity to play for the NYY (or perhaps the Marlins) and are not going to turn down a competitive offer from the team just because it did not come through a sealed bid process.

    As for Chapman – the final cost was indeed pretty high, especially if he doesn’t make it as a starter. But the NYY would probably be better off with his risk/reward value compared to similar money theyu ended up giving to Soriano (but ownership would tell you that Soriano had a proven record of success, even if he did also cost a top draft pick)

  78. blake January 10th, 2012 at 7:46 am

    Trader,

    If they’ll spend the money then signing Kuroda is probably the best option….as they keep their prospects…..they’ll make their rotation better……and they’ll take away that option from Boston.

  79. Mike Ri January 10th, 2012 at 7:50 am

    Keep in mind that the Yankees are already over the luxury tax threshold, meaning that if they signed Kuroda an extra 40 percent would be tacked on. That makes a $14 million deal actually a $19.6 million deal,

  80. blake January 10th, 2012 at 7:52 am

    Mike,

    Yea I have a hard time seeing them add that sort of money unless they can unload AJ

  81. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 7:54 am

    Blake-

    The Cubs signed Maholm, who was being pursued by the Red Sox. Maybe the RS were offering more money, but he didn’t want to pitch in AL East or Fenway. It seems that the RS are very leery of going over the luxury tax threshold this year and now upping their penalty to 40%. The only teams that had reported interest in Kuroda in the past, in the NL, were the Diamondbacks and Rockies, both which have used their money on other signings.

    If the Yankees wait it out, maybe Kuroda signs with them for around 8M, with a vesting option for a second year. He can make extra in endorsements playing in NY.

  82. blake January 10th, 2012 at 7:57 am

    Trader,

    That’d be nice……

  83. Ys Guy January 10th, 2012 at 8:01 am

    fernando martinez has a ‘cano-like’ swing? He can’t even get out of the Met’s minor leagues but he’s gonna replace swisher? WOW!

    blake, do you really thing there’s any chance that anyone is going to pick up 8 or 9 million dollars of aj’s contract?

  84. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 8:01 am

    Blake-

    Of course, maybe the Yankees will go with the starters they have and try a get Kerry Wood to rejoin the bullpen, with the likes of Wade, Logan, Soriano, Robertson and Rivera.

  85. Ys Guy January 10th, 2012 at 8:04 am

    i have a cano-like swing, too. and i can do joe morgan, gary sheffield, jim thome and jeff bagwell pretty well, too…

  86. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 8:06 am

    do you really thing there’s any chance that anyone is going to pick up 8 or 9 million dollars of aj’s contract?
    ————————-
    The Bravess picked up 66% of Lowes, the Cubs 83% of Zambranos.

    If the Yankees are asked to pick up 75%, the middle figure, thats close to 25M of the 33M remaining, so yes I think someone would pick up the remaining 8M.

    However, I think he won’t be traded before the deadline, and perhaps not even till next offseason.

  87. Ys Guy January 10th, 2012 at 8:08 am

    i’ve been saying all along that if there is no improvement from aj, they will pull the plug after he clears waivers in august. but they aren’t going to pick up kuroda now based on dumping the last year and a month of aj.

  88. Phranchise January 10th, 2012 at 8:09 am

    Leaking Garza chat only helps in trying to push others to jump in and get more aggressive if they think this is coming to a head. If Theo gets a bunch of prospects for him such is life. The problem for the Yankees though is, it’s another upgrade for a Tigers team they didn’t beat last year. So if you need to face Verlander, Garza and Scherzer in a series this year it only gets harder for the Yankees. 3 power pitchers capable of shutting you down. Haren, Wilson, Weaver. The Yankees pitching staff cannot beat those staffs in the playoffs right now. And I stress right now, but I just don’t see how they would be able to upgrade that much if Garza comes off the table.

  89. Gary January 10th, 2012 at 8:16 am

    PacoDooley January 10th, 2012 at 7:19 am
    As we roll towards the season, there doesn’t seem to be many opportunities left to make a splash this offseason. So I am wondering if the Yankees will really have any interest in the two Cubans? They didn’t leverage their financial weight in the Darvish bidding (yes, the final cost was too high, but their bid was also laughably low). They didn’t go after Chapman when he was available, and so I assume that they will not go after either of the Cubans. Maybe they just don’t see a logical reason to spend that much on unproven talent, but if the cost is right, either of the Cuban players could be a nice opportunity to add some high end OF talent to the system…

    ____________________________________________________________________________

    I think to be consistent with the way the winter has gone you would have to have very reduced expectations. They won’t spend money on a pitcher, but they spend it on a OF I don’t see much chance of that happening.

    I continue to chuckle at some of the posts that we have seen here all off season. The Yanks make no moves and it a absolutly brillant decision in the eyes of some, while when all the other clubs who make moves they get zinged for making such stupid/dumb decisions. Shame on all the other clubs in baseball for having such incompetence in their front offices. They should check in here prior to making a move so that the baseball minds can advise them on what to do. :-)

  90. Tom in N.J. January 10th, 2012 at 8:17 am

    If a team were to pick up “8 or 9 million dollars of aj’s contract” it would only cost them 4-4.5 million a year!

  91. blake January 10th, 2012 at 8:19 am

    “blake, do you really thing there’s any chance that anyone is going to pick up 8 or 9 million dollars of aj’s contract?”

    I don’t know……I didn’t think Vernon Wells or Derek Lowe, or Zambrano could be traded either though……I think it depends…….

  92. Tom in N.J. January 10th, 2012 at 8:19 am

    Are minor league contracts luxury tax-able?

  93. Gary January 10th, 2012 at 8:20 am

    Hard to believe, 100 days after the last game and all the hype about pitching pitching pitching immediatly after the last loss and it’s still pitching pitching pitching.

  94. Gary January 10th, 2012 at 8:22 am

    blake January 10th, 2012 at 8:19 am
    “blake, do you really thing there’s any chance that anyone is going to pick up 8 or 9 million dollars of aj’s contract?”

    I don’t know……I didn’t think Vernon Wells or Derek Lowe, or Zambrano could be traded either though……I think it depends…….

    ____________________________________________________________________________

    Blake I just don’t think anybody is of the midset to help out the Yanks right now. I think the other teams see the Yanks staff as weak and the Yanks payroll as a problem and they aren’t predisposed to be in the charitable mood.

  95. dogface January 10th, 2012 at 8:23 am

    Turner is a pretty comparable prospect to Banuelos….he’s higher on some lists and and they are about the same age

    ========================

    Just reviewing Frankie Piliere’s Top 100 for Scout.com and he has Baneulos #9 and Turner #11. Both pitched largely in AA in 2011, with both also making a few AAA starts. Turner posted the better numbers, though that appears to be case largely because he was walking 3 fewer batters per nine than Banuelos was. They seem to be reasonable comps.

  96. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 8:25 am

    Phranchise-

    These are the career stats of Garza vs the Yankee batters:

    http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/.....matt-garza

    The Yankees lost the Tiger series because they failed to get one more timely hit and Scherzer, who had an ERA> 5.0 in YS pitched the game of his life.

    You’re right. On paper the staffs of Detroit, even without Garza and the Angels look formidable.

    However the Yankees won 97 games with many of their hitters having subpar years and Montero only on the big league squad for a month.

    The playoffs are a long way off, and the Yankees still have time to upgrade their pitching staff, even if it’s at the deadline in July.

  97. dogface January 10th, 2012 at 8:26 am

    Are minor league contracts luxury tax-able?

    ===============================

    I think they are only if the player attached to said contract is on the 40 man roster.

  98. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 8:27 am

    Are minor league contracts luxury tax-able?
    ——————————–
    I believe it’s only the 40 man roster that’s in place at the end of the regular season.

  99. Gary January 10th, 2012 at 8:28 am

    Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 8:25 am
    Phranchise-

    These are the career stats of Garza vs the Yankee batters:

    http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/…..matt-garza

    The Yankees lost the Tiger series because they failed to get one more timely hit and Scherzer, who had an ERA> 5.0 in YS pitched the game of his life.

    You’re right. On paper the staffs of Detroit, even without Garza and the Angels look formidable.

    However the Yankees won 97 games with many of their hitters having subpar years and Montero only on the big league squad for a month.

    The playoffs are a long way off, and the Yankees still have time to upgrade their pitching staff, even if it’s at the deadline in July.

    ____________________________________________________________________________

    What batters had sub par years? Besides ARod who was injured who would you group in there?

  100. PacoDooley January 10th, 2012 at 8:30 am

    I don’t see a reason to complain about the Yankees lack of activity as long as I don’t see a move that they should have made. Like when the Cliff Lee deal went down, if the Yankees hadn’t been right there in the mix you could complain. But the high asking price for FAs and trades, and their constraints caused by bad recent contract decisions, has made them reluctant in a mostly smart way (and as for those bad contracts, A-Rod and Soriano are obviously most notably – you can’t really complain that much about Jeter – he brings huge value to the team compared to his salary, even if he is overpaid relative to his on field accomplishments).

    I just don’t want to see them hold back on a move that would improve the team solely because they have a lack of activity momentum at this point.

  101. dogface January 10th, 2012 at 8:30 am

    What batters had sub par years?

    =====================

    Probably Teixeira to some degree. Of course, it could also be argued that Granderson had an “over par” year.

  102. Phranchise January 10th, 2012 at 8:33 am

    Oh I agree, but in the playoffs you need some shut down pitchers in a short series. If those guys are healthy you need a lot of timely hits to hope to get to all of them. And our rotation simply doesn’t have those shut down type of guys. The Angels guys I would say are better and more consistent. Verlander is a beast and the other two may be a little more unknown what you get. But I’d take them over CC, Nova and whomever pitches third. If Nova stays as good as he was last year and Hughes gets back to form I feel better. But some ifs for us. Those other teams would feel pretty good going into the season with what they have. The Tigers series was frustrating with this lineup, but I agree, from what we saw with Montero he will struggle some next year, but the line drives, ability to hit a variety of pitches and ability to go the other way should help him break slumps quickly. I just wish the Yankees got a couple tougher outs in there, even on the bench. The Tigers subs killed us just by being annoying. We need some annoying pesky hitters, don’t have to be superstars, just productive outs and less ks. No matter what Girardi says, when you rely on the long ball you can get killed in a short series. Over the year it works, but you need to be somewhat hot hitting.

  103. Gary January 10th, 2012 at 8:34 am

    Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 8:25 am
    Phranchise-

    These are the career stats of Garza vs the Yankee batters:

    http://espn.go.com/mlb/player/…..matt-garza

    The Yankees lost the Tiger series because they failed to get one more timely hit and Scherzer, who had an ERA> 5.0 in YS pitched the game of his life.

    You’re right. On paper the staffs of Detroit, even without Garza and the Angels look formidable.

    However the Yankees won 97 games with many of their hitters having subpar years and Montero only on the big league squad for a month.

    The playoffs are a long way off, and the Yankees still have time to upgrade their pitching staff, even if it’s at the deadline in July.

    ____________________________________________________________________________

    Tired of this one timely hit logic. The Yanks lost the series for a lot or reasons, start with the number of HR balls they gave up some non HR hitters. On offense it wasn’t so much as not getting the hit, some guys never even got the ball in play when is all that was needed was a SF or a Ground ball. The guys who haven’t produced in the playoff’s historically didn’t produce again. Start with Swisher, 5 wiffs on called strikes and 2 foul outs.

  104. Ys Guy January 10th, 2012 at 8:34 am

    i think we’re sacrificing now to stay competetive in 4-5 years. we will need young cheap talent, especially pitchers to contribute in order to get past the back end of these long-term contracts. getting under the luxury tax threshold one time will give them much more payroll flexibility down the road. The tigers are going all-in now, good for them, expect the breakdown and rebuild to start in a few years. They Phillies are just about to fall into that pit now.

    Cashman is betting on his rebuilt minor league system to restock the yankees and keep them competitive continuously. While I wanted the rotation upgraded this season, I havent seen anything that made sense at this point, not darvish, wilson, latos, gonzalez and it doesnt look like garza. I’d like to see them get Kuroda, but I don’t think they are going to pony up the $18-20M he will likely cost.

    Tough times, while I wish something had shaken out, the present cost of elite pitching is too much to pay, imo. So much depends on what we get from our young arms. If one of Manny/Dellin turns out to be elite, we’ve made the right moves this offseason, if both do, we’re golden.
    Meanwhile we have upgraded at DH, hopefully Phil Yews and Hector Noesi have an impact on the rotation.

    AROD, WE NEED YOU, MAN!

    I’m cool, bring ‘em on!

  105. Gary January 10th, 2012 at 8:36 am

    dogface January 10th, 2012 at 8:30 am
    What batters had sub par years?

    =====================

    Probably Teixeira to some degree. Of course, it could also be argued that Granderson had an “over par” year.

    ____________________________________________________________________________

    Hmm 39 HR’s and 111 RBI’s some off year, 76 walks. I would hate to think what Tex’s stats would be if he had a real off year.

  106. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 8:36 am

    Gary-

    I think it all boils down to the Steinbrenner’s wanting to be under the 189M luxury tax threshold, taxed at 50% for them in 2014. Plus there are some 40M in other incentives they’d receive by staying under that figure, not to mention resetting the LT threshold back to 17.5%.

    As it is, A-Rod, Tex, CC, and Jeter, if he picks up his option will count for some 78-80M for 2014. Then there’s Cano and possibly Granderson to resign, plus the rest of the 40 man roster.

    The Yankees problem is that they are the only team, currently paying 40% and most teams are so far under the threshold that they can sign the big ticket FA’s or trade for the costly or potential costly players that will be on their rosters in 2014.

    Just a thought.

  107. Ys Guy January 10th, 2012 at 8:42 am

    verlander and miguel cabrera are both 28, so i shouldn’t be so quick to predict their rebuilding.

  108. 108 stitches January 10th, 2012 at 8:44 am

    I don’t expect the Yankees can get a Garza or Kuroda and would prefer that they don’t. Burnett is in the way of any move. If he were to be moved I’d rather see Noesi and Warren or maybe Phelps to heavily compete for the rotation left with the departure of Burnett in 2012.
    2013 gets even more complicated if Burnett is still around. What if Cole Hamels is signed ? What if Banuelos and Betances have made better than expected progress with a full year at AAA in 2012.
    Freddy Garcia will be gone but Burnett could (unless moved) still be around for his final contract year getting in the way of progress.

  109. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 8:45 am

    What batters had subpar years?

    Teixeira hit .223 from the left side.
    Swisher hit .232 from the left side. Playing now for a big contract.
    Gardner’s OB% was only .345.
    Martin’s BA .237
    A-Rod played a little more than half a season.
    Granderson hit well but struck out 169 times.

    There is room for improvement. This being said, they were 2nd in all of MLB in runs scored with 867, close to the RS at 875.

  110. dogface January 10th, 2012 at 8:49 am

    Hmm 39 HR’s and 111 RBI’s some off year, 76 walks. I would hate to think what Tex’s stats would be if he had a real off year

    ===================================

    40 points below his career average, 30 points below his career OBP, 70 points below his career OPS. Some could be attributed to bad luck as he posted a career low BABIP, but some of that may have been the issues he has hitting around that shift when batting lefthanded. .224 average and sub .800 OPS against righthanded pitching last year.

  111. Ys Guy January 10th, 2012 at 8:50 am

    arod’s the guy. tex will hit better with arod ripping it behind him. cano will see more pitches to hit with tex hitting behind him. we need the real arod. the contract is already causing alot of troubles, but nothing can be done about that. but if arod doesn’t give us arod production, that really punches a hole in the middle of the lineup and drags everybody else down a notch.

  112. Best To Ever Do It January 10th, 2012 at 8:53 am

    Ys Guy January 9th, 2012 at 10:39 pm

    idk, adam miller was rated as highly as turner and look how that turned out.

    you never know, look at joba, oh, i forgot, he was the second coming as a starter…

    ————————————–

    You have a strong dislike for Chamberlain not sure why though smh

  113. blake January 10th, 2012 at 8:54 am

    “Are minor league contracts luxury tax-able?”

    They can be if the player is on the 40 man I believe……in Soler’s case probably wouldn’t be.

    DF,

    The scout.com rankings are the only place I’ve seen Banuelos ranked ahead of Turner…..they are usually lumped pretty close together though……both in the top 10 of overall pitching prospects and both pretty close to the big leagues.

    The Tigers can probably afford to lose a guy like that more than the Yanks though as they have established youth in their rotation already.

  114. Best To Ever Do It January 10th, 2012 at 8:55 am

    What if Cole Hamels is signed ?

    ——————————–

    By who the Yankees I don’t see that happening

  115. Tom in N.J. January 10th, 2012 at 8:58 am

    Tex and Swisher were uneven at the plate. They both had bad years against RHP, with Teix hitting .224 and Swish hitting .232. If they can improve vs righties, that would be a big help…

  116. pat January 10th, 2012 at 8:58 am

    “tex will hit better with arod ripping it behind him. cano will see more pitches to hit with tex hitting behind him.”

    Robbie batting third, Tex 4th and Alex 5th?

  117. Yankee Trader January 10th, 2012 at 9:02 am

    Have to go. My predictions are subject to change at any time. :)

    Darvish will not sign for Matsusaka Money-6 years, 52M guaranteed. He’ll accept 11-12M/year for 5-6 years or go back to Japan. He’ll be a Ranger.

    Kuroda will sign this week with a ML team. Will he accept less to play in NY?

    Fielder will still be a National.

    Garza will be traded this week to the Tigers.

    Cespedes will be a Marlin.

  118. dogface January 10th, 2012 at 9:05 am

    They both had bad years against RHP, with Teix hitting .224 and Swish hitting .232. If they can improve vs righties, that would be a big help

    ===============================

    Swisher’s always hit righties for a low average and most of his power. .232 is a handful of hits fewer than his career average of .246

    By the way folks, the notion that Swisher is suddenly going to become something other than what he’s been for the past 3 seasons (and 5 of the past 6 seasons) because his contract up is about as ridiculous as the “pitching to the score” theory applied to Jack Morris.

  119. Felix Unger January 10th, 2012 at 9:08 am

    New Thread :arrow:

  120. dogface January 10th, 2012 at 9:09 am

    Kuroda will sign this week with a ML team. Will he accept less to play in NY?

    =====================

    Do you mean if one MLB team offered Kuroda X and the Yankees offered X minus Y, would Kuroda play for the Yankees offer? Or do you mean will he play for less than the $13M he is supposedly speaking if the high offer is less than that and it comes from the Yankees.

    If it’s the latter, then I’d think the answer is YES. If it’s the former, then I’d think the answer would be NO EFFING WAY

  121. 86w183 January 10th, 2012 at 9:16 am

    and Soler will be a Yankee?

  122. Ys Guy January 10th, 2012 at 9:17 am

    “You have a strong dislike for Chamberlain not sure why though smh”
    ==================================

    no, i actually like Chamberlain for what he is, an up and down guy who’s shown flashes of talent and also dissappointed in spots. the book about joba is still to be written. but people on here make out like taking him out of the rotation was the move that precipitated the decline and fall of the roman empire. He really wasnt very good as a starter, and was annoying as hell to watch in that role. I hope he comes back strong and does great, be that as a starter or reliever, i just don’t see him as some lynchpin upon which rests the crown upon the heads of the Yankees like so many on here do.

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