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Pinch hitting: Ed Conde

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Feb 06, 2012 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Up next in our Pinch Hitter series is Ed Conde, the head of the federal government’s Alcohol Countermeasures Laboratory in Cambridge, MA. He was born in the Bronx and grew up in New York, so that explains his Yankees ties while working just outside of Boston.

For his post, Ed took a look at past prospects who have been considered truly elite. Do the game’s top prospects truly become the game’s top players?

Many baseball fans eagerly await the publication of the Baseball America Top 100 Prospects list to see how their team’s prospects stack up against the best. I decided to research and answer the following questions:

1) What is the best way to obtain elite prospects?
2) Do the Baseball America Top 100 Prospects lists accurately predict major league success?
3) How well have the Yankees obtained and developed elite prospects?

I took the ten highest rated prospects from each of the 22 annual Baseball America Top 100 Prospects lists. I then eliminated duplications where athletes appeared more that once and ended up with 163 elite prospects (60 pitchers and 103 hitters). I then used information and data from “Baseball Reference” to analyze these players.

I wondered how many of these elite prospects actually end up having successful careers. To measure this, I arbitrarily defined a successful career to be one where a player achieves average production for 10 years. According to Baseball Reference, 2 Wins Above Replacement (WAR) is the average for a “regular” starting ballplayer. Therefore 2 WAR per year times 10 years give 20 career WAR. Current hitters with about 20 career WAR are Adam Kennedy, Mark Kotsay, and Aaron Rowland. Do most elite hitting prospects reach 20 WAR? Current pitchers with about 20 WAR are Bronson Arroyo, Doug Davis, and Jeremy Guthrie. Do most elite pitching prospects reach this level?

How do teams obtain elite “Baseball America” prospects?
Of the 163 elite BA prospects, 90 (55%) were drafted in the first round, 33 (20%) were drafted in later rounds, and 40 (25%) were signed as international free agents. Of the 60 elite pitchers, 31 (52%) were drafted in the first round, 16 (27%) in subsequent rounds, and 13 (22%) were signed internationally. For the 103 elite hitting prospects, 59 (57%) were drafted in the first round, 17 (17%) in subsequent rounds, and 26 (26%) were signed as international free agents.

Clearly, the best way to get elite BA prospects is select them in the first round of the amateur draft. Historically this has been true for both pitchers and hitters.

Do most Baseball America elite prospects have successful careers?
How many of these elite BA prospects actually go on to have successful Major League careers (20 WAR)? What percentage of these elite prospects actually become the next Mark Kotsay or the next Jeremy Guthrie and reach 20 career WAR? Fifty percent? Seventy five percent?

Would you believe that only 10 of the 60 (16.6%) elite pitchers and 36 out of the 103 (35%) elite hitting prospects have reached 20 WAR? Only three young pitchers (Clayton Kershaw 16.9 WAR, Edwin Jackson 10.7, and David Price 10.4) and three young hitters (Prince Fielder 19.6 WAR, BJ Upton 16.7, and Justin Upton 11.0) are more than 1/2 way to 20 WAR and likely to reach it. Clearly fan’s expectations for these young players are unrealistic.

Were most successful Major League players once elite BA prospects?
I looked at the 20 best active pitchers and the 20 best active hitters (using career WAR) to see if most were once elite BA prospects.
Eleven of the 20 (55%) best active hitters were once BA elite prospects. Baseball America hit on over 50% of these projections — impressive. However, only three of 20 (15% – Sabathia, Felix, and Beckett) of the best active pitchers were once BA elite prospects! Pitchers like Roy Halladay, Mariano Rivera, Johan Santana, Roy Oswalt, and Cliff Lee never attained top 10 status.

Pitcher’s appear to be much more difficult to project. Top pitchers are often not first round draft picks. Of the top 20 active pitchers in career WAR, only six were first-round draft picks. Eight of the 20 were drafted in later rounds and six were international free agents.

Good major league pitchers often develop from lesser prospects. Conversely, many great pitching prospects fail. Since pitchers are hard to project and seem to develop slowly, teams should obtain as many good pitching prospects as possible and wait patiently for them to develop.

How well do the Yankees obtain and develop young talent?
There have been 163 different elite BA prospects (60 pitchers and 103 hitters) spread over 30 teams. This equates to 5.43 elite BA players per team (2.00 pitchers and 3.43 hitters.)

The good news is that the Yankees have obtained and developed 10 elite BA prospects — second only to the Atlanta Braves (11). No team has had more elite BA pitchers than the Yankees: (4 – Brien Taylor, Jose Contreras, Phil Hughes, and Joba Chamberlain). Only Atlanta, Toronto, and the Dodgers have also produced four.

The bad news is that the Yankees have been terrible at turning elite BA prospects into successful major leaguers. The Yankees are dead last among teams that have had five or more elite BA prospects. Derek Jeter is the only elite Yankees prospect who has reached 20 career WAR. Not a single elite Yankees pitching prospect has reached 20 WAR during the 22 years that “Baseball America” has created the lists.

The silver lining has been that the Yankees have had great success turning lesser prospects into successful players. Mariano Rivera, Andy Pettitte, Jorge Posada, Chien-Ming Wang, and Ivan Nova have far exceeded expectations.

The Yankees have been great at obtaining elite young talent. The lower levels of their minor league system is often brimming with talent. The next step is turning that elite talent into good major league ballplayers. If they better develop their elite prospects and continue to find hidden gems, then the future is bright.

Go Yankees!

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437 Responses to “Pinch hitting: Ed Conde”

  1. MTU February 6th, 2012 at 9:09 am

    “If they better develop their elite prospects and continue to find hidden gems, then the future is bright.”

    Without a doubt. Means implementing a quality process throught their system.

    One question I have is which team is the best at developing their elite talent ?

    Particularly their young Pitching.

    Would it be the Rays ? Someone else ?

  2. blake February 6th, 2012 at 9:11 am

    Good concept for a post. Not exactly a prospect huggers battle cry.

    I think one thing to consider though……is….how much does this indicate that prospects are really unpredictable? And how much does it indicate that maybe BA and other publications just aren’t that good at predicting them? I think maybe its a little ofthe both.

    Dante Jr wasn’t on anybody’s “big board” last year…..

  3. MTU February 6th, 2012 at 9:20 am

    Blake-

    This post is sure to stir some controversy.

    ;)

  4. Ys Guy February 6th, 2012 at 9:25 am

    great post! really punches a hole in alot of theories on here about how the yankees suppposedly can’t develop pitchers. this indicates that nobody else is very good at it either and that predictions of what a pitching prospect is going to become is only a guess, and a usually inaccurate guess at that.

  5. blake February 6th, 2012 at 9:27 am

    Developing pitching is tough…..I think luck plays a bigger part on it than anyone would like to admit. I think the best approach might be to get as many high upside arms ad you can and then hope a couple pan out……probably what the Yanks are doing now.

  6. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 9:29 am

    Alcohol Countermeasures in Boston? I bet ya that’s one enormous lab.

  7. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 9:30 am

    Nice concept but I really don’t understand the methodology.

    You are using a 20 WAR benchmark in the first section and career WAR subsequently.

    This is heavily biased towards older players and basically elimates the top 10 prospects from recent years.

  8. Doc Iac February 6th, 2012 at 9:31 am

    i think predicting pitchers is tough bc ur projectin so many things. projectin his FB gets faster, his control gets better and they develop another + pitch…

    if they do all those things they have a chance, but its not easy, which is why pitchin is way more valuable than hittin, in my opinion

  9. blake February 6th, 2012 at 9:34 am

    Also illustrates why its usually not a great idea to trade good hitting prospects for good pitching prospects.

  10. blake February 6th, 2012 at 9:36 am

    Good news for the health of Yankee hitters…..Guthrie headed to Colorado

    MLBTR

  11. MTU February 6th, 2012 at 9:45 am

    blake-

    yeah. But what about Padilla ?

    :(

  12. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 9:47 am

    Much better article on this subject

    http://mobile.royalsreview.com.....-prospects

  13. Barry February 6th, 2012 at 9:50 am

    Dreadfuls tuff. Baseball has been turning into a book keeper’s dream, all graph’s and prospects. Baseball is about fun, and MLB Yew York Yankee level baseball about winning ball games and championships, whatever it takes. Trades, free agents, promoting from within occasionally. Stop this boring Billy Beane approach, celebrated by baseball socialists (not quite the same as the real thing) . Must be because Oakland never wins, and no one goes. They are waiting to damage the game in another town when the team is moved. Charlie O understood what it takes, not this guy.

  14. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 9:51 am

    Barry – No.

  15. blake February 6th, 2012 at 9:51 am

    MTU,

    Padilla wont pitch enough to be a problem I don’t think ;) of course buck will probably designate another scrub to hit people

  16. Doc Iac February 6th, 2012 at 9:52 am

    barry

    …i do agree that to much is invested in stats, the X factor is human emotions which cant be measured

  17. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 9:55 am

    doc iac – You do realize that 90% of all stats are merely the results of the “human element” taking place on the field?

    It’s incredible to me that this guy puts 4 charts in an article and he’s instantly dismissed as a “saber nerd” confined to his mothers lower quarters.

    Some people really need to get their heads out of the proverbial sand.

  18. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 9:57 am

    LGY – That article was much better. At least the Yankees are still in the middle of the pack in the bust rates, and not at the bottom like some here would have you believe.

  19. Doc Iac February 6th, 2012 at 9:58 am

    irrevernt

    who called him a saber nerd?

    i said i think there is more to baseball than just stats, tuff guy

    u can predict to a certain extent what is gonna happen with stats but there are other factors that go into every single situation, they r not robots on the field

  20. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 10:00 am

    doc iac – who is ignoring these things that you felt the need to point that out?

    did you actually read the article above?

  21. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 10:01 am

    Or did you just glaze over it because there was a bar graph…

  22. Doc Iac February 6th, 2012 at 10:01 am

    i did read it

  23. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 10:02 am

    dic iac – I’m just curious if you saw something above that makes you say that, or if you are just responding to “barry” who… clearly didn’t read anything.

  24. Doc Iac February 6th, 2012 at 10:06 am

    i was agreein with what barry had said that too much time is placed into stats in my opinion, i didnt say anything bout the article,

    i enjoy stats and all but i personally think to much is placed in it, but if thats how u like to view baseball i dont have a problem with that, its not a facsit (spelling?) country, so however u like to enjoy the game is fine,

    I just dont put eveything into stats, like if were facin a pitcher with a 2 era and we are down 3 runs i dont think the game is over

  25. strongbad56 February 6th, 2012 at 10:10 am

    Yeah, I feel like if you were going to measure by career WAR, you should have left out the last 5-10 years of prospects. Yeah, no everyone is going to be Kershaw or Fielder, but a lot might be average players for a long time. A player who does in fact get 2 WAR every year would have to be from the 2001 top prospect list in order to qualify for your benchmark. And similar later players will be left out, despite being productive players.

    Also, @Doc Iac: Stats don’t pretend to be able to predict everything that happens on the field. Obviously the game is extremely unpredictable, and most “saber nerds” understand that. Like ID said, stats try to quantify the results of the human element of the game. They don’t always get it right, but they’re usually more accurate that a single person’s opinion after just watching it. Truth be told, we need both stats and observation to truly understand the game as well as we can.

  26. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 10:10 am

    Doc Iac – I’m not attacking you at all, it’s just early and things aren’t coming out clearly.

    Fair enough, I just didn’t see how any of that was relevant to this article which “Barry” was clearly responding to.

    I would say this is actually the exact way people should be using stats to enhance the experience. People clearly don’t remember how often prospects bust or succeed by the conversations around here and this article (while not as in depth as the one LGY posted) is enlightening to a degree.

    I think most people that say the stats are looked at “too hard” just don’t actually understand how they are being used. You do not appear to be that confused person. :)

  27. Doc Iac February 6th, 2012 at 10:12 am

    strongbad

    i enjoy stats, and i follow them, but like u said, i enjoy the observation of the game more, thats all

  28. Doc Iac February 6th, 2012 at 10:13 am

    ID – fair enuff

    no hard feelings, were all on the same team :)

  29. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 10:13 am

    The disconnect between the statistical record and the 900+ “human elements” that produce them every season has always been a little strange to me.

    There is no great divide here, it’s only in your mind(‘s eye) tee hee… :)

  30. epconde February 6th, 2012 at 10:16 am

    Understood, but did you read?: Only three young pitchers (Clayton Kershaw 16.9 WAR, Edwin Jackson 10.7, and David Price 10.4) and three young hitters (Prince Fielder 19.6 WAR, BJ Upton 16.7, and Justin Upton 11.0) are more than 1/2 way to 20 WAR and likely to reach it.

    “Yeah, I feel like if you were going to measure by career WAR, you should have left out the last 5-10 years of prospects.”

  31. BIG AL February 6th, 2012 at 10:16 am

    I thought it was a well researched and well presented post.

    Now, let’s play ball, 2 weeks seems so far away, now that football is over.

    Side note: Question, Mr. Brady, do you feel you are in the same elite group, now led by Eli? :) :)

  32. strongbad56 February 6th, 2012 at 10:17 am

    @Doc Iac:

    That’s totally fine, and I respect that. But I think you have an inaccurate perception of how stats people follow the game. No one thinks the game is over when we’re down 3 and a 2ERA pitcher is on the mound. I love stats, but I also love that stats can never truly predict baseball. That’s what makes it great. I just think stats people and non-stats people have a lot more in common than many on here would think.

  33. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 10:19 am

    I also never understood how the person cross-referencing tons of data to formulate opinions ends up being the person “ignoring half the game”.

  34. Doc Iac February 6th, 2012 at 10:20 am

    strongbad,

    thats valid,

    “but I also love that stats can never truly predict baseball. That’s what makes it great”

    ^ that was the point i was tryin to make…ur better with words than i am haha

  35. strongbad56 February 6th, 2012 at 10:21 am

    “Understood, but did you read?: Only three young pitchers (Clayton Kershaw 16.9 WAR, Edwin Jackson 10.7, and David Price 10.4) and three young hitters (Prince Fielder 19.6 WAR, BJ Upton 16.7, and Justin Upton 11.0) are more than 1/2 way to 20 WAR and likely to reach it. ”

    Yeah, I read that. I guess it seems like guys that are farther away from 20 WAR can still reach it if they have a consistent, average career. The second bar graph is deceiving because it makes it seem like barely any of the top prospects become good players. Clearly this is not true, and I know you know that. I just think it could have been made a little clearer on your graphs and writing.

    That being said, I really enjoyed the article. I’m not trying to tear you down; just offering some hopefully helpful critique. Thanks for writing.

  36. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 10:22 am

    ” My husband cannot throw the ****ing ball and catch the ball at the same time”

    - Gisele

    http://www.nydailynews.com/gos.....bled=false

  37. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 10:23 am

    She seems like a lovely, level-headed woman. Guess all that praying didn’t work out.

  38. epconde February 6th, 2012 at 10:27 am

    I could have done more, but what I did took an obscene amount of time to do.

    strongbad56 said, “That being said, I really enjoyed the article. I’m not trying to tear you down; just offering some hopefully helpful critique. Thanks for writing.”

  39. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 10:28 am

    epconde – Did you check out the article that LGY posted? that uses a little different methodology to reach similar conclusions, in case you decide to tackle this subject in the future.

  40. Shame Spencer February 6th, 2012 at 10:29 am

    Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 10:23 am

    She seems like a lovely, level-headed woman. Guess all that praying didn’t work out.
    ———————–

    Sorta brings us back to that article Trisha posted about some crazy percentage of Americans believing in the power a prayer ;)

  41. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 10:30 am

    shame – Perception is reality :) Maybe if there were some way of referencing the success rate of prayers… the sample rate must be astounding by now.

    OK, I’m obviously too bored today.

  42. Erin February 6th, 2012 at 10:31 am

    Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 10:22 am
    ? My husband cannot throw the ****ing ball and catch the ball at the same time?

    - Gisele

    *****************

    I’m sure her hubby’s teammates are thrilled with those comments. :P

  43. epconde February 6th, 2012 at 10:31 am

    There are no stats in this article. WAR is used as a measure of career sucess, because I can see nothing better. What are you going to use: all star appearances?

  44. epconde February 6th, 2012 at 10:34 am

    Yes. It is a great article. Mine took about 30 hours of research and preparation. I shudder to think of how much time he put into his. This was not meant as the last word. It was meant as something fun to get conversation started.

    Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 10:28 am
    epconde – Did you check out the article that LGY posted? that uses a little different methodology to reach similar conclusions, in case you decide to tackle this subject in the future.

  45. joeman February 6th, 2012 at 10:37 am

    Brady not having his best weapon healthy hurt him, also working the catch and run instead of getting the ball downfield worked against him

  46. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 10:43 am

    joeman – The pressure the giants front 4 was outstanding once again, and getting to Brady is the key to disrupting their whole game. You could see he could never really get comfortable.

    What were the vegas odds (calling all Nick’s) before the game of Brady getting an IG safety and throwing a back of the heels 40 yard interception… about a million to one?

    Just an all-around bizarre game for them. I think Brady’s shoulder was hurt a few weeks ago more than he let on.

    There was no acceptable outcome for me yesterday as a Jets fan and a Boston hater… at least it’s over. :p

  47. pat February 6th, 2012 at 10:44 am

    “I’m sure her hubby’s teammates are thrilled with those comments. ”

    TomRock_NewsdayTom Rock
    Waiting for Welker’s fiancée to fire back at Gisele and complain about how high that pass was.

  48. Erin February 6th, 2012 at 10:48 am

    pat- :lol:

  49. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 10:50 am

    pat – I was going to try to make fun of Welker there but… then i realized his wife may be hotter than Brady’s at this point. :(

  50. pat February 6th, 2012 at 10:54 am

    2 guys walked into a Starbucks…..

    TomRock_NewsdayTom Rock
    Tuck and Perry Fewell. Tuck asked him “Hey, are you a world champion?” Fewell said: “I am, are you?” http://lockerz.com/s/181301616

  51. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 10:54 am

    “The bad news is that the Yankees have been terrible at turning elite BA prospects into successful major leaguers.”

    wow, you could have knocked me over with a feather when i read that.

    what a surprise!!!

    ed-

    sorry , couldn’t resist that.
    nice post. i’ll have to do it justice and read it more closely later when i’m less busy.

  52. Erin February 6th, 2012 at 10:55 am

    RealMichaelKay Update everybody: SB MVP Eli Manning will join the Michael Kay Show on Espn new york right at the top of the show at 3 pm.

    and in case you missed it in the last thread, he’ll also be on Letterman tonight.

  53. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 10:56 am

    After the Ravens game Brady told Robert Kraft that he’d play better in the Super Bowl. He didn’t.

  54. Shame Spencer February 6th, 2012 at 10:58 am

    Actually, Bronx, I think he did. His team didn’t though.

  55. pat February 6th, 2012 at 10:58 am

    TomRock_NewsdayTom Rock
    Ahmad Bradshaw tried to stop and talk to reporters, but his momentum kept him moving forward.

    Rimshot!

  56. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 11:04 am

    wow, you could have knocked me over with a feather when i read that.
    what a surprise!!!

    Then you will be equally surprised when you read the article LGY posted and realize they still do it better than half the teams in baseball… regardless of how bad you proudly think they are at it.

  57. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 11:06 am

    Brady’s eyes in the first quarter to me looked all droopy and watery. I wouldn’t be too surprised if we will find out he was on a crapload of painkillers for his shoulder. Not that it’s a great excuse but to me he certainly looked all pill’d up.

  58. Erin February 6th, 2012 at 11:06 am

    pat February 6th, 2012 at 10:58 am
    TomRock_NewsdayTom Rock
    Ahmad Bradshaw tried to stop and talk to reporters, but his momentum kept him moving forward.

    *****************

    :D

  59. Shame Spencer February 6th, 2012 at 11:10 am

    ID – I thought his passing game was better than against the Ravens. He seemed to be throwing more accurately and got that nice tight spiral on the ball.. only problem was not a lot of guys were catching the ones that they “should have.”

    I’m a Cowboys fan so this was sort of a winless victory but I’m always happy to see New Englanders in crisis. I’m just lucky I’m not an a$$hole Cowboys fan like many others that have been talking sh*t about the Giants for a decade when success in Dallas is now considered had when we can manage to win a singular playoff game… once… every ten years…

  60. trisha - true pinstriped blue February 6th, 2012 at 11:11 am

    “Brady’s eyes in the first quarter to me looked all droopy and watery. I wouldn’t be too surprised if we will find out he was on a crapload of painkillers for his shoulder. Not that it’s a great excuse but to me he certainly looked all pill’d up.”

    He was crying. At that point they were down 9-0 and he saw the handwriting on the wall.

    :)

  61. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 11:11 am

    I read somewhere earlier today that they had never discussed “not scoring” at the end of the game there… and Eli had just briefly said something to Bradshaw literally as he was handing him the ball.

    Makes that confused stumbling squat make SO much more sense. “hey don’t score” “what? hey I was… ahhhhhh *trip*”

  62. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 11:13 am

    Coughlin said score, Eli said kneel… but they never discussed what to do if the pats parted the sea (as they actually did).

    Nothing like the last minute :p

  63. Shame Spencer February 6th, 2012 at 11:15 am

    I really thought the Giants were in trouble when they burned that time out instead of taking the delay of game penalty and couldn’t convert the 1st down anyway… gotta hand it to the D for getting at Brady all night.

  64. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 11:18 am

    Shame – Ya, Eli will get all the accolades but their defense really kept that game in play. They should have been up even more than they were early… weren’t… could have ended up WAY behind in the 3rd… didn’t…

    I enjoyed the game a lot more than i thought I would considering I was rooting for a flood or locusts or something…

  65. pat February 6th, 2012 at 11:21 am

    I posted this last week and wouldn’t know how to verify the validity of it but it sounds like a whole bunch of #1 picks that were position players have underachieved expectations.

    d_a_cameronDavid Cameron
    40% of all the WAR produced by #1 overall position players comes from A-Rod, Griffey, and Chipper.

  66. trisha - true pinstriped blue February 6th, 2012 at 11:22 am

    OT

    Jerkface are you around? If not, are there any computer geeks out there? If so, can you tell me what this means? (see at end)

    These are specs for a Dell desktop I’m thinking of buying (on Ebay). I just spent a fortune on my laptop so will not for the desktop. But the desktop is where I do all my legal work so all I need is something peppy enough for word processing and having mutiple files open at a time, plus the internet running in the background. My current computer is horrendously slow.

    I read somewhere that with an AMD processor you should get the dual core with at least 2 Ghz. (I don’t even know what that means). But when I look at these specs I don’t see anything about “Ghz”. Thanks for any help. Otherwise I will wait for JF to show up.

    Processor: AMD Athlon 2900 II X2 245
    Memory: 4GB DDR3 (8GB Max)
    Hard Drive: 500GB 7200 rpm SATA
    Optical Drive: DVD+-RW Multi-Drive
    Graphics: ATI Radeon HD4200

  67. RayVT February 6th, 2012 at 11:22 am

    It is a good day when any team in the Boston area loses! It is even better when it is a NY area team that beats them out!

  68. RayVT February 6th, 2012 at 11:23 am

    Everyone does realize that Pats have not won a Super Bowl since they were caught cheating? LOL! I am so happy the cheaters lost again!!!

  69. 108 stitches February 6th, 2012 at 11:26 am

    The Yankees will have no shortage of people to throw out the 1st ball at the Stadium. Jorge should throw out the 1st ball on opening day.
    Eli and a cast of many G-Men will do the same during the season.

  70. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 11:26 am

    Go Big Blue!

  71. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 11:29 am

    i realize that this blog is so pro cashman that any thoughts of him having to leave the gm job because of the hot potato he’s dealing with right now probably will put most cashman supporters in denial, but from looking at what’s surfaced so far, i don’t think he has a chance of surviving this as the yankee gm.

    i think the best move for him and the yankees is to have him take a leave of absence while being slid sideways into another equal position in yankee management.

    here’s the problem. the woman jailed is likely going to get a high profile lawyer to get her out, because anyone reading the transcripts of when cashman and the police did set up to arrest will see all kinds of entrapment issues. she really didn’t say much during that sting operation that sounds illegal to my amateur mind.

    his wife also will have all kinds of leverage in a divorce settlement because she will also be able to go public if her demands aren’t met.threatening to go public is what louise meanwell is in jail for. i guess it’s extortion when you don’t have a lawyer do it for you.

    cashman’s wife ,most likely will have her attorney do it legally, but the legal extortion will be even more costly and time consuming for cashman than the illegal extortion was by mewnwell.

    the bottom line is cashman is going to be spending teh next year of his life sorting out this mess, and i don’t see how he’s going to put in a 100% effort with the yankees in the gm role.

    i can see him keeping a high level position that doesn’t demand a daily or weekly workload.
    i think that’s what is going to happen, and probably sooner than later.
    i don’t think he’ll make it through spring training in the gm job.

  72. Shame Spencer February 6th, 2012 at 11:31 am

    I’m glad New England got beat. But listening to Giants fans is going to bl*w. Especially when half of the ones I know only started being Giants fans in 2008.

    The worst offenders, however, are women. As a she-fan, there is nothing that gets under my skin more than these stupid b*tches that throw on a Giants jersey because they’re making a run at the Superbowl and try to talk garbage like they’re real fans because their dad/brothers/boyfriend also loves the Giants. When my team loses in the playoffs I don’t recover for months… I wake up the next morning sick to my stomach and have to Pepto and ginger ale the pain away for at least 2 weeks. Then the slow, dull disappointment sets in and lasts until the next sport season becomes interesting and distracts me for a while. By the time the next season rolls around, though, I still feel the hurt from the season before and the anxiety of being put through it all over again. Hell, there’s a playoff game Troy Aikman lost in 2000 that still haunts me. And it was an old Aikman on a sub-par team that didn’t deserve to win but the sting is still there man… and THAT is the worst part about the Giants winning the Superbowl. All of the people that, if the Giants had lost, would’ve moved on to worrying about who posted on their Facebook wall or what they’d eat for lunch next are now going to talk smack to me like they’re real fans.

    Phew.. that felt good. /rant :)

  73. BIG AL February 6th, 2012 at 11:35 am

    triaha -

    Read your E-mail.

  74. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 11:39 am

    Dear randy

    Please don’t make me defend Cashman.

    Thanks,

    Rich

  75. trisha - true pinstriped blue February 6th, 2012 at 11:41 am

    Big AL – thanks!

    :)

  76. BIG AL February 6th, 2012 at 11:43 am

    randy l. -

    Spoken like a true Cashman hater.

    Perhaps you lack the knowledge of how top executives think and react to adversity, how they are able to compartmentalize their lives, and issues they deal with, and perform their corporate duties, despite the distractions around them.

    As I posted yesterday, and you failed to respond to, I’ll wager you $100 Cashman remains on as the Yankees GM.

  77. joeman February 6th, 2012 at 11:45 am

    Next year the Pats will be working with the two TE’S,Welker & a few new WR’S

  78. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 11:48 am

    Randy you make it sound like Cashman’s the one being accused of a crime. Isn’t it the DA’s job to sort this out? And what exactly does “legal extortion” consist of? Does it open one’s self to liability?

    I generally like your posts here but in this situation you sound a little “meanwell”.

  79. BIG AL February 6th, 2012 at 11:51 am

    Bronx Jeers -

    :)

  80. blake February 6th, 2012 at 11:52 am

    Randy,

    I don’t think people care about this Cashman thing nearly as much as you’re suggesting…….literally the only place I’ve seen anything about it is on this blog…..now I haven’t searched much….but you know a true big story when its everywhere and impossible to avoid…..and Im not getting that from this…..I think itll blow over and life will go on with the Yanks

  81. BIG AL February 6th, 2012 at 11:56 am

    randy l. -

    Your silence is deafening, lol.

  82. blake February 6th, 2012 at 11:57 am

    And if Cashman and his wife were “on a break”….did he even do anything wrong? Depends on if you were on Ross or Rachel’s side I guess

  83. Joe from Long Island February 6th, 2012 at 11:57 am

    it’s nice to know that somethings don’t change.

    the giants beating the patriots in the super bowl.

    spring, and the season for baseball starting once again.

    randy still hating cashman.

    randy – i’ve long since given up trying to figure out what cashman did to you. you’re comments have long since gone from a fan criticizing to something well beyond that. fine, that’s your opinion. ok.

    but, there’s a few things in your latest comment that don’t seem entirely logical.

    first….since when did this blog become “pro-cashman”? you must not read a whole lot of the posts.

    second – does it really matter, in this day and age, what someone does in their personal life? heck, i just saw on the today show this morning that yet another woman came out with disclosure that jfk diddled her when she was a teenage white house intern. i don’t think she was unique in this regard, yet jfk seems to evoke pleasant memories of the good old days, and being a positive figure at president.

    the steinbrenner family is full of broken marriages, and marital discord, like a lot of america these days. i really don’t think that cash’s problems are a big deal for them, unless it affects his ability to do his job. as long as the money keeps rolling in, they’re happy.

    now, it may start to affect cash’s job performance. you rightly point this out.

    however, cash’s marital problems didn’t start last week, and likely has been going on for a long time. yet, the steinbrenner’s re-signed him to a new deal, with a raise.

    personally, i don’t root for anyone to have personal problems. i’m not wired that way. and, to me, the bottom line is for my favorite team to succeed. everything else is secondary. so, i’m rooting for cash, as the gm, to be very successful in putting together a winning team, and look for that parade in november 2012. if cash needs to be replaced, then i’ll root for whomever replaces him to succeed.

    i guess that makes me a fan of the ny laundry, but, so what? isn’t that we all are interested in? that, and the occasional player that strikes our fancy, whatever the uni.

    back to work.

  84. pat February 6th, 2012 at 11:59 am

    “i think the best move for him and the yankees is to have him take a leave of absence while being slid sideways into another equal position in yankee management.”

    Wasn’t GroundHogs Day last week?

  85. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 12:00 pm

    I’ve read the word diddled entirely too much on this blog the past week.

  86. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 12:02 pm

    This is the person’s opinion we are supposed to take as “evidence” of a prospects ability?

  87. BIG AL February 6th, 2012 at 12:04 pm

    It appears that when randy cannot defend his position with a great deal of hyperbole, he remains silent.

  88. BIG AL February 6th, 2012 at 12:07 pm

    A great beginning to 2012, the Giants once again spank the Pats and win the Super Bowl, and the Yankees appear to be set to have another great season, can’t wait.

    Y’all have a great day.

  89. Tom in N.J. February 6th, 2012 at 12:09 pm

    Randy’s obsession with Cashman is entering “Pete Abe’s obsession with Alex” territory. Yikes.

  90. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 12:09 pm

    Apropos of this thread (and Al’s last post), I wish the Yankees could be as good at developing talent as the Giants are.

  91. Erin February 6th, 2012 at 12:12 pm

    randy ? i?ve long since given up trying to figure out what cashman did to you.

    *******************

    my theory is Cash ran over his puppy and drove away laughing

  92. Cashmoney February 6th, 2012 at 12:13 pm

    I wish I could be as suave with the ladies as Cashman is and will be.

  93. Tom in N.J. February 6th, 2012 at 12:13 pm

    Amar’e Stoudemire’s Brother Was Killed This Morning In A Car Crash.

    http://espn.go.com/new-york/nb.....-car-crash

  94. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 12:16 pm

    I will say that I think Randy’s arguments against Cashman regarding his baseball acumen often do hold water. But the Yanks obviously don’t agree so it’s kind of a moot point.

    As always, we’ll see what the future tells us.

  95. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 12:19 pm

    rich in nj-

    i really don’t like seeing cashman in this kind of mess.

    i would have much rather been ragging on him because of the montero trade and the developing or lack of developing of young pitchers properly.

    i think anyone that does their homework and reads the details of messages back and forth or listens to cashman and meanwell talking on audio that deadspin has psoted will realize quickly that cashman is in pretty deep here and isn’t going to get past this easily.

    this is clearly a personal nightmare for him, and taking no action and going on with life as normal just isn’t going to happen.

    so i think the yankees and cashman should sit down and make a proactive decision before this gets any more uncomfortable for both sides.

  96. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 12:21 pm

    “I will say that I think Randy’s arguments against Cashman regarding his baseball acumen often do hold water.”

    I agree. That was really the point of my reply to his post. Baseball decisions should be the only reason that Cashman should keep or lose his job (along with would someone better replace him). Not this sideshow.

  97. Locke February 6th, 2012 at 12:25 pm

    Great post Ed. Really enjoyed it.

  98. Yankee Trader February 6th, 2012 at 12:25 pm

    I’m not a lawyer, but I suppose if there was a clause in his contract that included reasons for firing-moral terpitude- that the Steinbrenner’s could indeed invoke that option if they feel the issue brought severe embarrasment and harm to the NYY business reputation.

    Will await legal advice. :)

  99. Yankee Trader February 6th, 2012 at 12:31 pm

    It’s moral turpitude not terpitude

  100. trisha - true pinstriped blue February 6th, 2012 at 12:31 pm

    YT – you are correct, sir!

  101. trisha - true pinstriped blue February 6th, 2012 at 12:31 pm

    On both counts.

    :)

  102. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 12:34 pm

    “my theory is Cash ran over his puppy and drove away laughing”

    erin-

    the yankees are kind of the puppy if we want to use your analogy.

    i don’t like the way cashman does things with the yankees. so what?

    it’s baseball . it’s not life and death. it’s a game. how mad at the guy can i get ?

    if it was a real puppy then brian would really be having a problem if he drove away laughing.

    as it is it’s the yankees. it’s a game. it’s sports.

    i do also have the “suits” thing going that i tend not to like them in baseball. and yeah, i’ve met them and been around them. my opinion of cashman was formed a long time ago and none of the stuff going on now changes that.

  103. Yankee Trader February 6th, 2012 at 12:34 pm

    Trisha-

    Moral turpitude is a flimsy excuse for firing unless the person has committed a crime. Is that correct?

  104. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 12:39 pm

    The fact that the Deadspin reporter goes by the name “AJ” is somehow troubling. :wink:

    Also troubling is the fact that he refers to Casmman’s purported pajama bottoms as “game worn” I mean how exactly did he ascertain that? :shock:

  105. BoJo February 6th, 2012 at 12:39 pm

    Clearly, the best way to get elite BA prospects is select them in the first round of the amateur draft. Historically this has been true for both pitchers and hitters.
    _________________
    IIRC, I read another analysis last year on this topic, but the author concluded that first round picks after a certain number (10 or 15?) were not all that valuable as far as producing quality players. He did seem (IIRC) to indicate that the top 10 or 15 produced a higher percentage of top players.

    And I seem to recall also that he also concluded that gettting top stars was a crap shoot and teams need to pursue all avenues for player acquisition. Perhaps the answer also lies in better player development.

  106. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 12:41 pm

    “but I suppose if there was a clause in his contract that included reasons for firing-moral terpitude- that the Steinbrenner’s could indeed invoke that option if they feel the issue brought severe embarrasment and harm to the NYY business reputation.”

    yankee trader-

    why throw cashman under the bus. why not bump him sideways into an equal , but less accessible to the media position ?

    i have always lied the idea of keeping key yankee people in the organization even if they bump heads with each other. i’d prefer cashman to stay with the yankees. why not keep his knowledge in the organization and help the new gm instead of just fire him.

    i don’t think that’s the route the steinbrenners would take anyway. firing is too extreme.

  107. Yankee Trader February 6th, 2012 at 12:42 pm

    Whatever Cashman said to the Yankees after being shut out in Atlanta by then rookie Tommy Hanson in 2009, helped spark the team to the playoffs. I was at that game and witnessed Posada achieve the “Golden Sombrero” striking out all 4 times. The NYPost article:

    http://www.nypost.com/p/sports.....PlbZHhsXWP

  108. BoJo February 6th, 2012 at 12:43 pm

    trisha – true pinstriped blue February 6th, 2012 at 11:22 am
    OT

    Jerkface are you around? If not, are there any computer geeks out there? If so, can you tell me what this means? (see at end)

    These are specs for a Dell desktop I’m thinking of buying (on Ebay). I just spent a fortune on my laptop so will not for the desktop. But the desktop is where I do all my legal work so all I need is something peppy enough for word processing and having mutiple files open at a time, plus the internet running in the background. My current computer is horrendously slow.

    I read somewhere that with an AMD processor you should get the dual core with at least 2 Ghz. (I don’t even know what that means). But when I look at these specs I don’t see anything about “Ghz”. Thanks for any help. Otherwise I will wait for JF to show up.

    Processor: AMD Athlon 2900 II X2 245
    Memory: 4GB DDR3 (8GB Max)
    Hard Drive: 500GB 7200 rpm SATA
    Optical Drive: DVD+-RW Multi-Drive
    Graphics: ATI Radeon HD4200
    ___________
    Trisha–

    That is what would be considered a decent computer now-a-days. The 4GB RAM (memory) is plenty to run the apps you mention…the hard drive is fine and fast enough…won’t be large enough if you ever get into file sharing and collecting songs and movies, but fine for work. The graphics card is decent and will handle your work. The processor is fine.

    You could probably buy one of these refurbished or on eBay for about $400.

  109. trisha - true pinstriped blue February 6th, 2012 at 12:44 pm

    Well I don’t know that it’s flimsy so much that it’s put there to attempt to insure that people don’t do things that bring “ill repute” to the organization. For example, (true story) a woman where I used to work was at a wedding where a number of people from her department were also present. They were all seated at the same table and started to discuss candidates who had recently come in for interviews for a job in her department. Whether she had had too much to drink or was just telling her true feelings, she made a comment that no n*gger (she said the word) was going to get a job in her department. Some of the members of her department took extreme umbrage to that comment and soon it was the talk of the organization. The organization fell back on the moral turpitude clause in her contract and she was fast-tracked out of there.

    She hadn’t committed any crime in the technical sense, but she had done something that the org. felt was not representative of someone they wanted working there. (It got extremely complicated because members of her department were lobbying for her to get canned because they didn’t want to work with someone who “felt that way.”

    Don’t know if it’s a good example for you, but someone can do things that are not necessary illegal but are so “self destructive” that it gives a black eye to the company to keep them there.

  110. trisha - true pinstriped blue February 6th, 2012 at 12:46 pm

    Bojy!! Thanks and welcome back!!!

    :)

  111. BoJo February 6th, 2012 at 12:49 pm

    Thanks Trisha! Can’t hang around too long. BTW–I can give you a complete desktop system for free if you ever wish to come down to New Haven to pick it up….1.8GHz processor and about $6K worth of software on it. Win XP, MS-Office 2010…Adobe Master Collection CS3…multiple browsers. I had built it for a young couple in need of help, but they lost their home and no longer need it.

  112. BoJo February 6th, 2012 at 12:51 pm

    Oh–also has 15″ flat screen Dell monitor and speakers, keyboard and mouse and 120GB drive…you can install a second 500GB drive for about $100 and thus keep your operating system and work files on separate drives (always a good idea).

  113. austinmac February 6th, 2012 at 12:52 pm

    If unfaithfulness is lack of moral turpitude and .subjects one to dismissal, no team’s rosters are big enough. Never read Ball Four?

  114. Yankee Trader February 6th, 2012 at 12:52 pm

    Trisha-

    Thanks for your input.

    If you are shopping for a computer I do know that Costco will take back any electronics within 90 days, which is better than most other stores which you need to return within 14 days to a month. I believe Target will also. No restocking fees.

    Off to see the wizard.

    Have a great day everyone.

  115. trisha - true pinstriped blue February 6th, 2012 at 12:53 pm

    Geeze Louise Bojy! I’m blown away!!! Will be in touch either way!

    :)

  116. DONNYBROOK February 6th, 2012 at 12:55 pm

    Ed’s stats sighted above, shows Baseball America aint the Holy Grail a lotta the stat geeks around here claim it to be. Basically, BA has a flip-the-coin success rate at the Absolute Best. I’ll string along with Prufrock’s eyes, before I put any credence into a publication that is Now over-priced, over-hyped, and jumped-the-shark a while back.

  117. BoJo February 6th, 2012 at 12:55 pm

    My pleasure Trisha–also has wireless LAN card so you can connect to your router without cables, or hack into local Subway or free wifi store if you live within 150 yards of one. save on internet service fees.

  118. BoJo February 6th, 2012 at 12:56 pm

    DONNYBROOK February 6th, 2012 at 12:55 pm
    ——————
    Agreed…they lost it for me in the 90s

  119. Yankee Trader February 6th, 2012 at 12:57 pm

    Austinmac and for any coaches out there with moral turpitude clauses in their contracts. :)

    http://www.bmebsports.com/articles/9

    Really need to go now.

  120. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 1:00 pm

    randy wrote: “i don’t think he’ll make it through spring training in the gm job.”

    I would like to bet you $50 that you’re wrong.

    I wager that Brian Cashman will still be the GM of the Yankees on Opening Day.

  121. G. Love February 6th, 2012 at 1:00 pm

    trisha – if you want buy a windows pc tower I have a beast of one sitting in my office I was thinking of putting up on ebay. It’s about a year old. I bought it at Best Buy. This year I switched to Mac’s this year for some video editing work I’m doing so I put this in my closet..

    It’s a Gateway DX4300-11. Desktop PC – AMD Phenom II X4 805 2.5GHz, 8GB DDR2, 1TB HDD, DVDRW, HDMI, Gbit LAN, Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit

    It works perfect. Let me know if you’re interested. It’s a more powerful machine than the one you’re looking at.

  122. BoJo February 6th, 2012 at 1:01 pm

    Off to enjoy the day. Have a good one everybody!

  123. BoJo February 6th, 2012 at 1:04 pm

    Trisha–

    G. Love’s machine is a very nice one! Very powerful…and I also agree with him that Macs are better. I used to be a PC guy because of the price/benefit issue, but believe Macs are taking over the market with their integration of PowerMacs, Iphones, IPads, iCloud, and iMacs.

  124. BoJo February 6th, 2012 at 1:06 pm

    And G. Love…if you would like to donate that machine to a charity, I can get you a tax receipt for full value that you can write off. I’ll use the machine to give it either to a young family struggling to make ends meet or an agency here that works to bring food and clothes to the poor and homeless.

  125. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 1:07 pm

    Basically, BA has a flip-the-coin success rate at the Absolute Best.

    Which is most likely a much higher rate of success than you or any other individual person… What is your point? You trust your eyes, that’s nice… none of the 30 baseball teams do though. If you know so much, shouldn’t you be working for one of them, or a publication like BA?

    I’ll trust their opinions for what they are. Opinions.

  126. trisha - true pinstriped blue February 6th, 2012 at 1:10 pm

    Guys – I refuse to go away from a PC.

    :(

    So a PC works just fine for my purposes!

    :)

    G. Love – let’s talk! I will email Chad and ask him to forward my email address to you.

    Bojy – you are a total sweetheart for the offer. Based on what you said about G. Love’s machine (and the distance between Rhody and New Haven) I will probably go for his. But I will not forget your kindness. You know that.

  127. BoJo February 6th, 2012 at 1:13 pm

    No problem Trisha…his is one fine machine…here is a link to read about it

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Gatewa.....460079231f

  128. BoJo February 6th, 2012 at 1:13 pm

    Now I really have to run. Bye all!

  129. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 1:14 pm

    “I would like to bet you $50 that you’re wrong.

    I wager that Brian Cashman will still be the GM of the Yankees on Opening Day.”

    nick in sf-

    if i bet $50 , then i’d be rooting for it to happen because i’d like the 50 bucks :)

    i’m more making an observation, rather than a prediction or a bet.

    seriously, cashman is in trouble.

    i think it’s going to take the blog some time to wrap their head around this, but i think it’s going to be a very big deal before it’s over.

  130. trisha - true pinstriped blue February 6th, 2012 at 1:19 pm

    Look, I don’t know how this is going to end, and for Cash’s sake I hope it ends well because I do love the guy. And I am loathe to ever agree with randy on anything – :) , but I think some may be underestimating the drama surrounding this one. This isn’t just about someone being unfaithful. It’s about a lot of the stuff going into this one – the money paid out, talk of a “medical procedure”, talk of abortion, talk of what information he may have shared with that psycho. There’s a lot being put out there.

    It may all blow away nicely. But it may not.

  131. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 1:19 pm

    i think it’s going to take the blog some time to wrap their head around this, but i think it’s going to be a very big deal before it’s over.

    So far its only a big deal to you. Separated man gets involved with crazy lady, news at 11? No, not really.

  132. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 1:23 pm

    randy, do you think he’s going to be the GM of the Yankees on Opening Day or not?

  133. blake February 6th, 2012 at 1:23 pm

    Unless there is a lot more to the Cashman story than is what’s being reported now….. just can’t see it being a big issue…..its pretty tame on the scandal scale

  134. DONNYBROOK February 6th, 2012 at 1:26 pm

    As I mentioned a few days ago, the religous overtones are Now coming into play.

  135. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 1:27 pm

    Personally I’m taking a baby steps approach to all this. It’s all my little head can handle.

  136. G. Love February 6th, 2012 at 1:35 pm

    trisha – definitely do that. I was seriously thinking of putting it up on ebay this week so when I saw your post I figured I’d reach out. If Chad won’t give you my email for some reason I think you can private message me through Twitter through my FakePeteGammons page and then I’ll touch base with you directly from there.

  137. trisha - true pinstriped blue February 6th, 2012 at 1:42 pm

    G Love –

    will do.

    :)

  138. pat February 6th, 2012 at 1:44 pm

    Unless the money came from a Yankee account without Yankee approval, nothing reported so far is illegal and the Yankees handle embarassing better than most.

    Being involved with someone Sturtze or Giambi were friends with is the most embarassing thing for Cashman that I’ve read. :wink:

  139. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 2:06 pm

    “Unless the money came from a Yankee account without Yankee approval…”

    No chance. It’s far too little money for a man in Cashman’s position.

    This isn’t the ’50s or ’60s when TV shows portrayed married couples as sleeping in twin beds. Most people understand that married life is sometimes messy for a lot of people. If somehow the Yankees think otherwise, and they are embarrassed by this, they can make the appropriate decisions.

    But again, the only debate about Cashman’s tenure should be about competence or lack thereof.

  140. UnKnown February 6th, 2012 at 2:08 pm

    Wow Eli right now is seriously doing a live interview with ESPN straight from Disney World. I thought that they were just kidding when the MVP would say I am going to Disney World. Guess not…

  141. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 2:14 pm

    unknown – Disney took hold of that a while ago, they have a whole parade and everything.

  142. DONNYBROOK February 6th, 2012 at 2:16 pm

    Like it or not, a guy in Cashman’s position represents the company 24\7. That’s why Cashman initially shelled out the coin. Cashman should be OK, as long as the church or some of its’ members don’t raise the issue concerning what the $$$ was gonna be used for.

  143. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 2:18 pm

    “randy, do you think he’s going to be the GM of the Yankees on Opening Day or not?”

    i think cashman will be either gone or in another position with the yankees before pineda develops a plus change :)

  144. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 2:24 pm

    That’s nifty, randy, but could you bring back the randy who doesn’t think Cashman will make it out of spring training as the GM? I want to take $50 of his money. :evil:

  145. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 2:30 pm

    ” That’s nifty, randy, but could you bring back the randy who doesn’t think Cashman will make it out of spring training as the GM? I want to take $50 of his money.”

    nick in sf-

    since you’re pressing me here, i don’t bet with people i don’t trust .

  146. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 2:33 pm

    So you do believe Cashman won’t survive spring training as the GM and you would be willing to bet $50 on it but just not with me because you don’t trust me?

  147. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 2:34 pm

    nick , i don’t have a gambling addiction the way you do. i could care less about betting.

  148. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 2:35 pm

    Dear NYY

    Sign Damon and all this junk goes away.

    Thanks,

    Rich

  149. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 2:37 pm

    randy – “Betting” is merely a way to get someone to stand by their statement, which you don’t seem apt to do in this case.

  150. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 2:41 pm

    So the thing you just said about not betting with people you don’t trust is now inoperative?

    Because the clearest implication from that is that you do believe Cashman won’t survive spring training as the active Gm of the Yankees but that you won’t wager on it with me because you don’t trust me.

  151. blake February 6th, 2012 at 2:47 pm

    “Sign Damon and all this junk goes away.”

    Sign Cespedes and Damon and it really goes away

  152. pat February 6th, 2012 at 2:49 pm

    How about randy pick someone he trusts as a proxy to hold the bet?

  153. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 2:52 pm

    pat, you skipped ahead a couple moves. ;)

  154. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 2:53 pm

    blake, FTW!

  155. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 2:54 pm

    Get it done, Yankees!

  156. Pat M. February 6th, 2012 at 2:59 pm

    Sign the Cuban outfielders

  157. pat February 6th, 2012 at 3:07 pm

    Nick

    Apologies. Was just trying to help eliminate obstacles.

  158. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 3:12 pm

    No apology necessary, and I think the “trust” issue was just a red herring anyway.

    Our mutual pal Pat M would probably be happy to host the wager.

  159. DONNYBROOK February 6th, 2012 at 3:14 pm

    Madonna doing her, “Help I’ve Fallen and I Can’t Get Up” dance moves last night was pathetic.

  160. jacksquat February 6th, 2012 at 3:19 pm

    Did Johnny Damon give in yet?

  161. DONNYBROOK February 6th, 2012 at 3:23 pm

    Damon wants more\$$$ than the Yanks will spend on that spot. Matsui I believe would fit.

  162. pat February 6th, 2012 at 3:27 pm

    “I think the “trust” issue was just a red herring anyway”

    Shocking! :wink:

  163. Cashmoney February 6th, 2012 at 3:32 pm

    Sergio Mitre will wind up Dh-ing some..since the pitching staff may be crowded come spring.

  164. BD (Boston Dave) February 6th, 2012 at 3:33 pm

    Nick in SF,

    How’d your bets do yesterday?

  165. DONNYBROOK February 6th, 2012 at 3:39 pm

    Hughes has an option. Were the Yanks to send Pinero down outta ST, the Montero Huggers would bring out the tar and feathers.

  166. BD (Boston Dave) February 6th, 2012 at 3:47 pm

    Yanks got Joel Pinero? ;)

  167. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 3:48 pm

    BD, I was all over the Giants and the under, so I did well overall, but I did lose a few.

    I had the over teased down to 40 and 43 in a couple hedges, so if it had gotten up to 44 points I would have hit the middle.

    I only bet on one of the exotic props: I bet that Kelly Clarkson would go over 1 minute 34 seconds on the anthem. I felt badly about it as soon as I saw she had drummers involved, I think that reined her in. It must have been just a fraction over the time, because they took a long time to grade it out as a winner, whereas last year a similar bet was graded a winner within a couple minutes.

    Giants +1 1H was a push. I lost on an alternative Giants -6.5 first half bet, but I won on the alternative Giants -3.5 overall bet and also on the Giants +2 2H bet, as well as various straight Giants +3 and Giants money line bets and parlays and teasers with the under. And I’d been building up various teasers and parlays with the Giants and some basketball and soccer teams over the course of the two weeks.

    Do the Knicks usually cover their first game after a Giants’ SB win??? :grin:

  168. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 3:51 pm

    There’s always Eduardo…

  169. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 3:54 pm

    Do the Knicks usually cover their first game after a Giants’ SB win???

    ——-

    Do you believe in Linsanity??

  170. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 3:55 pm

    nick in sf-

    there’s nothing complicated what i’m saying about cashman being in much deeper trouble than most on the blog are aware of .

    this is simply because most people aren’t reading the articles or listening to audio that’s out there because they don’t want to look into it for whatever reason.

    the last time someone was trying to talk me into betting was when this pro golf gambler wanted my long drive in a scramble event where they were playing for $25,000 a hole up at kiawa island. i asked this guy ken who wanted me on his team how we would know the other guys would pay up. he opened a pocket on his golf bag and pointed at a revolver inside. naturally, any interest i had went by the wayside pretty quick.

    now this gambling story has nothing to do with you, but trying to make a bet to prove something is to me kind of silly. i don’t bet as a rule when guns are part of the deal or when they aren’t .

    if you like to bet, knock yourself out. i don’t bet , but i do know cashman is in deep trouble with this problem he has. if he’s not spending most of his time on this problem right now, i’d be surprised.

    and if he’s spending all kinds of time on his own personal legal problems and divorce where he’s going to get killed financially, how is he going to have time to put n 24/7 time on the yankees?

    i think it’s agreed the gm job with the yankees takes total focus.i don’t see cashman being able to give the yankees 100% right now or in the near future.

    i think the steinbrenners will be coming to the same conclusion.

  171. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 4:00 pm

    there’s nothing complicated what i’m saying about cashman being in much deeper trouble than most on the blog are aware of .

    There’s nothing that makes what you are saying true either. Were you on here in 2009 saying the same exact thing the last time Cashman had a lady in the paper?

    … but I guess we’ll find out won’t we. At what point will this have not happened and you’d admit you overstated the importance of Cashman’s marital endeavors?

  172. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 4:01 pm

    and if he’s spending all kinds of time on his own personal legal problems and divorce where he’s going to get killed financially, how is he going to have time to put n 24/7 time on the yankees?

    i think it’s agreed the gm job with the yankees takes total focus.i don’t see cashman being able to give the yankees 100% right now or in the near future.

    Cashman has been dealing with this for a year. Somehow he was able to pull off a huge trade and sneakily sign one of the better FA pitchers to a reasonable deal while also handling arbitration with many of his players.

    He is in much less trouble than you are aware of.

  173. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 4:03 pm

    “I think the “trust” issue was just a red herring anyway””

    actually the betting was a distraction from the real issue so that’s the real red herring.

    the issue is whether cashman is going to be able to give the yankee a 100% effort with all the legal hassles and entanglements that he’s going to have to deal with in the next few months.

  174. kd February 6th, 2012 at 4:05 pm

    is anyone else surprised that the cuban outfielders are not signed yet? cespedes has been a free agent for a while, is he still asking for too much?

    and soler has to be itching to get signed. any money at this point has to be better than what he’s been getting.

    sign the two of them, put them in the minors and let them show what they can do

  175. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 4:06 pm

    They can’t sign yet due to OFAC regulations or some nonsense. Atleast that is what twitter is saying.

  176. Pat M. February 6th, 2012 at 4:07 pm

    Tin Cup could be on to something regarding Cashman a nd a leave of absence….Disn’t the Yanks just hire Henley ???? Gym time as I’m getting into shape for a May golf tornament in May vs. some old teammates from 40 years ago…So far it’s 2 foursomes , the West Haven boys…

  177. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 4:08 pm

    jerkface-

    have you listened to the audio posted on deadspin?
    it’s halfway down on the article in this link:

    http://deadspin.com/brian-cashman-affair/

  178. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 4:09 pm

    randy, if you really don’t bet then didn’t you say so in the first place instead of inserting some nasty dig about not trusting me? Anyone who read that would think that you don’t believe I would pay up if I lost the bet. Is that how you feel?

    You are absolutely right that you have read a lot more about this than I have. I pretty much dropped out after skimming the first deadspin article, so if your superior research and insights are accurate, you could have a good advantage.

    The purpose of the bet is to take your money. I chose $50 because I am owed $25 each by stuckey and Bret the Hitman, who are approximately 9 and 14 months delinquent in paying up (unless payment has arrived since my last visit to my p.o. box). Despite your slippery rhetorical style, I have confidence that you would pay up if you lost the bet.

    I can’t make someone bet if they don’t want to, but at least be upfront about your reasons.

    Do you think that Cashman will NOT be the Yankees’ GM on Opening Day?

  179. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 4:10 pm

    Do you think that Cashman will NOT be the Yankees’ GM on Opening Day?

    Its what he is wishing and hoping for, but his gut knows Cash will still be there.

  180. blake February 6th, 2012 at 4:13 pm

    I don’t think Soler is a FA yet is he?

  181. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 4:14 pm

    “Minutes later, Cashman asked Neathway what she meant by a settlement — in what might have been an attempt to draw her into a conversation that could be used as evidence in a trial.”

    jerkface-

    this is how you want your gm spending his time ?

    read the transcripts before answering.

    http://www.nydailynews.com/spo.....-1.1017694

  182. kd February 6th, 2012 at 4:16 pm

    Yankees @YankeeSource

    I think Cespedes will end up signing for a 4-5 mil per year deal. No team is highly interested in his services.

    at 4 million, they really should sign him

  183. Against All Odds February 6th, 2012 at 4:16 pm

    blake February 6th, 2012 at 1:23 pm

    Unless there is a lot more to the Cashman story than is what’s being reported now….. just can’t see it being a big issue…..its pretty tame on the scandal scale

    —————————–

    You rarely hear about it on the radio. Boomer and Carton brought it up a couple of times and so did Joe and Evan. Did Mike mention it? Did guys like Kay and Cowherd even mention it?

  184. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 4:16 pm

    Randy,

    I have seen all of the stuff out there on this. You’ve got a case of wishful thinking if you believe Cashman is going to get fired or set aside over this.

  185. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 4:17 pm

    I’ve listened to that recording several times and I’m not hearing anything incriminating coming from Cashman.

  186. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 4:18 pm

    The sonogram has been proven fake, Cashman cooperated with police to put her away, and its pretty clear she is a mental patient trying to extort a rich dude.

    Cashman will go about his business in the same way he has, and the Steinbrenner’s will back him.

  187. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 4:18 pm

    I’ve listened to that recording several times and I’m not hearing anything incriminating coming from Cashman.

    You have to play it backwards then Cashman starts saying all this satanic stuff!!

  188. Against All Odds February 6th, 2012 at 4:21 pm

    Cashman is a Freemason :O

  189. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 4:22 pm

    “randy, if you really don’t bet then didn’t you say so in the first place instead of inserting some nasty dig about not trusting me? ”

    nick in sf-

    you’ve taken enough unsolicited pot shots at me over time that i don’t trust you as far as i can throw you. we do best when we keep or comments focussed on the issue at hand . you trying to bait me into betting and creating a smokescreen for the issue just ticks me off and makes me remember how annoying that tactic of yours is.

    play it with someone else.

  190. jacksquat February 6th, 2012 at 4:23 pm

    The only stuff that could make Cashman look really bad is coming out of the mouth of an insane woman, so no, I’m not really worried about it.

  191. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 4:26 pm

    “I’ve listened to that recording several times and I’m not hearing anything incriminating coming from Cashman.”

    it’s the other way around. what is on that tape that gets someone arrested for?

    you realize she’s complaining that cashman’s lawyer was trying to get her mother to have her committed.

  192. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 4:28 pm

    “The only stuff that could make Cashman look really bad is coming out of the mouth of an insane woman, so no, I’m not really worried about it.”

    you are not concerned that your gm was hanging out with this “insane” woman for a major part of the last year?

    no cause for worry there?

  193. blake February 6th, 2012 at 4:31 pm

    “at 4 million, they really should sign him”

    Absolutely ….they waste that much every year on nothing.

  194. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 4:32 pm

    you are not concerned that your gm was hanging out with this “insane” woman for a major part of the last year?

    no cause for worry there?

    When he recognized she was crazy he stopped it. People don’t get fired for having a relationship go sour.

  195. blake February 6th, 2012 at 4:33 pm

    “you are not concerned that your gm was hanging out with this “insane” woman for a major part of the last year?”

    My guess is that she’s good at acting not crazy when you first meet her…….

  196. Benny Blanco February 6th, 2012 at 4:34 pm

    Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 4:18 pm
    I’ve listened to that recording several times and I’m not hearing anything incriminating coming from Cashman.

    You have to play it backwards then Cashman starts saying all this satanic stuff!!

    =====================

    LMAO!! Hilarious

  197. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 4:35 pm

    randy, you really are a piece of work. When you tell someone that you won’t bet with them because you don’t trust them, and then repeat it as you just did, you’re questioning that person’s integrity — in this case mine, and in a forum where the two of us have both been active for years.

    If you’ve got it in your head that someone who tangles with you on here has an integrity problem, I think that actually says more about you than it does about me, but whatever. We could easily get Pat M to host the bet so there would be no question about the winner being compensated and the loser paying up.

    There is no smokescreen on my end. You said you don’t think Cashman will make it through spring training as the Yankees’ GM. I disagreed and proposed a wager on that simple statement. Then came a bunch of hooey about trust and what the “real issue” is, etc. There are a number of issues related to this Cashman business, but I proposed a wager on one of them, not the others.

    You’re the one who brought up the “trust” issue as your excuse for not betting. Why not just say:

    1) Ok, I don’t really think Cashman will fail to make it to Opening Day as GM.

    or

    2) I do not want to risk losing a bet to someone I don’t like, therefore, no bet.

    http://www.leninimports.com/ec.....ter_2a.jpg

  198. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 4:36 pm

    “.Disn’t the Yanks just hire Henley ???? ”

    pat m-

    i hadn’t thought of of that. i’ll bet you’re right :)

  199. Felix Unger February 6th, 2012 at 4:37 pm

    Tin Lincecum loses 22lbs. Cuts down on fast food and takes up swimming. Didn’t think he had 22lbs to lose.

    http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/.....00400.html

  200. Felix Unger February 6th, 2012 at 4:38 pm

    Tin Lincecum

    —————

    That would be Tim not Tin

  201. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 4:40 pm

    nick in sf-

    what part of “NO” don’t you understand?

    i have no interest in betting with you . just because you brought it up and initiated it you seem to think i’m under some obligation to play this game with you. betting has nothing to do with anything i’m interested in.

    pat m loves to bet . bet with him :)

  202. Cashmoney February 6th, 2012 at 4:41 pm

    you are not concerned that your gm was hanging out with this “insane” woman for a major part of the last year?
    —–
    No. I was mainly concerned with the Yankees’ records and their chances of making the playoff. Cashman could fly across Yankees stadium with a Jet propulsion booster and a clown uniform on opening day with her on his lap… my main concern will still be Yankees and their chances of making the playoff this year.

    Whether or not Cmoney as Randi predicted to is to be overly distracted by this whole affair and subsequently unable to execute with due diligence as NY GM is hypothesis be proved or disapproved in the future which, is moot to argue at this point.

    move on peeps

  203. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 4:48 pm

    randy, you’re under no obligation to do or say anything, but you still took the time to write both this:

    “i don’t think he’ll make it through spring training in the gm job.”

    and this:

    “since you’re pressing me here, i don’t bet with people i don’t trust .”

    You twist yourself into these rhetorical knots, is it so hard for you to just back down from something you just said?

  204. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 4:49 pm

    randy – For someone who claims to have “read everything on the subject” you have a very wrong concept of how much time they spent together in the last year.

  205. yanks 27 February 6th, 2012 at 4:50 pm

    Buster_ESPN
    Yankees in position to add one of these three hitters in the next week: Raul Ibanez, Johnny Damon or Hideki Matsui. Ibanez may be best fit.

  206. blake February 6th, 2012 at 4:54 pm

    If the Yankees signed Cespedes to a 4 year deal……would they still have him under control for 2 additional years after the contract? I think they would.

  207. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 4:55 pm

    I think they would.

    Yes

  208. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 4:55 pm

    If you are going to sign someone old and terrible please let it be Damon or Matsui so we can at least delude ourselves with memories of 09.

  209. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 4:55 pm

    “My guess is that she’s good at acting not crazy when you first meet her…….”

    blake-

    i was renting a first floor condo from a ex nfl tight end beach volleyball friend of mine. he lived upstairs and one night a woman he had been seeing brought a pistol over after he broke things off and shot out every window he had on his really nice beach front condo.

    i slept right through the whole thing. she was wealthy and instead of being arrested they just had her committed for a short time, and she got out of the whole thing without being convicted of a crime.

    so if this woman, louise meanwell, is really crazy, she’s not going to get convicted of anything either
    the question for cashman is how much he pushes things himself that keeps the police thing alive which feeds the media.
    cashman filing charges was what made this a media event. i’m not sure that was the smartest thing to do.

    my nfl friend just layed down on the floor until the glass stopped breaking. he was out on the beach playing volleyball the next day. no testifying in court. no filing charges.
    something to think about.

  210. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 4:56 pm

    you realize she’s complaining that cashman’s lawyer was trying to get her mother to have her committed.

    —————————————————

    I think there are more facts involved. The mother was the one that told Cashman that the abortion story was a ruse and that she had done this before. There was a a conference call with the mother, Cash, the lawyer and the woman’s psychiatrist. The psychiatrist suggested calling 911.

    Now I do recall reading something several days ago about some coaching by the lawyer and the original 911 call being blown off and I think this may be what is driving this with you but I’m just not sure those early reports had all the facts straight. A clearer picture has emerged since then.

  211. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 4:59 pm

    my nfl friend just layed down on the floor until the glass stopped breaking. he was out on the beach playing volleyball the next day. no testifying in court. no filing charges.
    something to think about.

    But the friend had the ex-gf committed, and you just blamed cashman for trying to take that approach like 30 minutes ago. So how does that make sense? Once again you use a story that has very little to do with the situation at hand to try and prove something but it fails :(

  212. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 5:01 pm

    “You twist yourself into these rhetorical knots, is it so hard for you to just back down from something you just said?”

    the day i back down from anything from nick in sf is the day i shoot myself.

    and that ain’t happening :)

  213. blake February 6th, 2012 at 5:01 pm

    Randy,

    But I bet she didn’t act crazy at first right……..I just don’t see this as a big deal with relation to the Yankees…….maybe it doesn’t reflect well I Cashman’s personal life……but I don’t care about his personal life much….

  214. blake February 6th, 2012 at 5:05 pm

    Trade AJ
    Sign Cespedes
    sign Soler
    Sign Damon

  215. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 5:05 pm

    So randy is not backing down because then he would have to shoot himself. Very credible statement.

    But he’s also not actually standing by anything he’s saying, either in word or in deed.

    LoHud purgatory?

  216. TD213 February 6th, 2012 at 5:05 pm

    The most significant part of that Deadspin article was the idea that he was talking smack about Girardi… that means they are not as close as it appears and Cashman isin’t likely listening to him for personnel decisions (i.e. Montero).

  217. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 5:06 pm

    “But the friend had the ex-gf committed, and you just blamed cashman for trying to take that approach like 30 minutes ago. ”

    jerkface-

    it’s jock humor. it was very funny that this happened to my friend. blake gets jock humor. my coment was directed to him. i get it that you don’t get the humor in it.

    my friend didn’t press charges. she was still shooting when the police got there. they did their own thing.

    it’s a pain in the butt to be a witness in a court proceeding and very time consuming. too bad murphydog wasn’t still here to shed some light on this cashman thing. he, however likes cashman so he’d be taking that side of the argument, but he’d do it so much better than what i’m hearing here today :)

  218. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 5:07 pm

    The most significant part of that Deadspin article was the idea that he was talking smack about Girardi… that means they are not as close as it appears and Cashman isin’t likely listening to him for personnel decisions

    Eh or it just means they are close collaborators and Cashman wanted to vent about someone he works with. I’ve talked plenty of smack about people I work with. I don’t think it means what you think or that its likely Girardi isnt part of personnel decisions.

  219. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 5:07 pm

    Buster_ESPN
    Yankees in position to add one of these three hitters in the next week: Raul Ibanez, Johnny Damon or Hideki Matsui. Ibanez may be best fit.
    _

    ’cause he sucks?

  220. blake February 6th, 2012 at 5:11 pm

    Randy,

    The moral of that story is that you need to be careful when hanging out with friends that date crazy people…..next time you see GB7…watch for nurse K.

  221. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 5:12 pm

    it’s jock humor. it was very funny that this happened to my friend. blake gets jock humor. my coment was directed to him. i get it that you don’t get the humor in it.

    Hmm not sure how thats jock humor. The story on its own is slightly amusing I guess? But you posted it for a reason, related to Cashman, and thats where it doesn’t hold up. Nothing about it holds up in this context. This lady isn’t rich enough to buy her way out of the police (true or not from your story), you would be killing cashman if he let it go long enough for her to shoot his proverbial windows (or literal windows) with a gun, it’d be bigger news for sure and you you’d be crowing for his firing even more.

  222. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 5:12 pm

    Bart: Dad, what’s the point of this story?

    Homer: I like stories.

  223. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 5:12 pm

    The most significant part of that Deadspin article was the idea that he was talking smack about Girardi…

    —————————————

    I’d be more troubled if was singing Giradi’s praises. :wink:

  224. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 5:14 pm

    “But he’s also not actually standing by anything he’s saying, either in word or in deed.

    LoHud purgatory?”

    nick in sf-

    are you mentally ill?

    how could i state any clearer what i think about cashman keeping his gm job?

    i don’t think he’s going to make it though spring training.

    as pat m said , the timing of hiring of jim hendry is interesting in light of what the steinbrenners knew about what was soon going to be public knowledge with cashman and louise meanwell.

  225. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 5:14 pm

    it’s jock humor. it was very funny that this happened to my friend. blake gets jock humor. my coment was directed to him. i get it that you don’t get the humor in it.

    Bahahahahahaha

    Man, you are nuts.

  226. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 5:14 pm

    “I’d be more troubled if was singing Giradi’s praises.”

    Really. Maybe there’s still hope for Cashman.

  227. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 5:15 pm

    GUYS, randy doesn’t think cashman will be the GM in spring training.

    This means exactly… nothing.

    he just went out of his way to say that he would never admit he was wrong, and would kill himself to avoid doing so.

    No one should care what randy thinks.

    Move on.

  228. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 5:16 pm

    randy asked me if I was mentally ill.

    That’s not worth $50, but we’re getting closer.

  229. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 5:17 pm

    jerkface-

    if you don’t think the jocks in the yankee clubhouse are privately laughing their asses off with what’s happened with cashman, i’m betting you’re wrong.

    sorry, that betting thing was a figure of speech.

  230. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 5:17 pm

    randy is the only jock on this message board. he said so.

  231. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 5:18 pm

    if you don’t think the jocks in the yankee clubhouse are privately laughing their asses off with what’s happened with cashman, i’m betting you’re wrong.

    And the smart people aren’t? Do you think ‘dating a crazy lady’ doesn’t translate across different personal cultures? You’re a weird guy.

  232. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 5:20 pm

    Of course in Randy’s situation, the ‘jocks’ are laughing their asses off about Cashman because they all secretly hate him despite him signing them for all the money in the world.

  233. blake February 6th, 2012 at 5:20 pm

    Cashman and Girardi were probably arguing over who likes Russell Martin more.

  234. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 5:20 pm

    One perk of being kind of well-off is that you can afford to pay off loony chicks without it putting a crimp in your lifestyle.

  235. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 5:21 pm

    Rich – You can also afford a nice lawyer so you can get divorced without being distracted from your job. :)

  236. blake February 6th, 2012 at 5:24 pm

    The Cubs designated Blake Dewitt for assignment …..is he better than Chavez? He’s got a cool name anyway.

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com

  237. SoS February 6th, 2012 at 5:25 pm

    Didnt we cut or not resign Damon and Matsui after 09? Did they some how get younger and I just didnt get the memo? Can we stop thinking with our heart for once. Like my son always tells me.
    JUST BECAUSE ITS CLASSIC, DOESNT MAKE IT GOOD!

    Id rather use all or nothing Vasquez than any of those 3 options. He could be the next Adam Dunn. Strikeout 200x to go along with his 35 round trippers.

    Nick in sf,
    I bet you my longhorns beat your bears in the bowl game.

  238. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 5:26 pm

    Cashman and Girardi were probably arguing over who likes Russell Martin more

    —–

    Nice. LMAO

  239. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 5:26 pm

    “The moral of that story is that you need to be careful when hanging out with friends that date crazy people…..next time you see GB7…watch for nurse K.”

    yes, even gb7 is afraid of her. the weird thing is she’s better looking than louise meanwell.

    ok, that was a low blow.

    even i admit that one.

    on a humorous note, i liked the part about stanyon turtze joking with louise meanwell that he was going to blackmail cashman to be his assistant gm by exposing the cashman/meanwell relationdhip.

    see, now that’s another example of jock humor. tanyon is not that smart though. being the bullpen coach probably would have been more fun.

  240. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 5:27 pm

    now that’s another example of jock humor.

    Please define jock humor, because what you’re describing is just ‘humor’. Please stop incorrectly segmenting humor into your own stupid category.

  241. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 5:28 pm

    Pretty sure everyone on this blog has made a joke about someone having naked pictures of someone else so that they can get something. We’re all jocks, yay

  242. Joe from Long Island February 6th, 2012 at 5:30 pm

    well, after an especially challenging afternoon, i come here for comic relief…..and i’m happy to say i’m not disappointed. emphasis on the comic part.

    i’ve never been one for debate clubs, but my wife was on the debate club/team at penn. i often kid her that she should have gone to a jesuit school, because their emphasis on intellectual rigor and an argument based on logic is well known, and would have suited her personality well. i’ve picked up a few things from her, on logic and how to argue a point, over the years.

    randy is losing badly here. his only hope is that nick in sf is not a woman; otherwise he would never hear the end of it.

    time to go home. it’s going to be a scotch night.

  243. SoS February 6th, 2012 at 5:30 pm

    randy asked me if I was mentally ill.

    That’s not worth $50, but we’re getting closer.

    ========

    Nick,
    Youve been stuck at this half benjamin. Maybe its time to meet him in the middle.
    mentally ill + $25.

    Jerkface,
    Who was that goup in the 80′s that supposedly had a message on one of their songs if played backwards? They were one of my favorites at the time but im drawing a blank. Early signs of Alzheimer i guess.

  244. jacksquat February 6th, 2012 at 5:30 pm

    Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 5:07 pm
    The most significant part of that Deadspin article was the idea that he was talking smack about Girardi… that means they are not as close as it appears and Cashman isin’t likely listening to him for personnel decisions

    Eh or it just means they are close collaborators and Cashman wanted to vent about someone he works with. I’ve talked plenty of smack about people I work with. I don’t think it means what you think or that its likely Girardi isnt part of personnel decisions.

    Or she is a crazy, manipulative, pathological liar talking about a guy who just had her arrested…

  245. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 5:31 pm

    SoS, it was painful enough watching that game, I don’t need to lose out again.

    But thank you for trusting me enough to make a wager. Some people on here pretend to refuse to do that.

  246. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 5:31 pm

    “JUST BECAUSE ITS CLASSIC, DOESNT MAKE IT GOOD!”

    This isn’t about what would be ideal, it’s about what is realistic given the options in light of what they reportedly have to spend.

    Damon hit well away from the Trop last season: .280 .345 .463 .807

    Overall 2011 OPS+

    Damon: 110
    Ibanez: 91

    So he will likely be far better than Ibanez.

  247. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 5:31 pm

    As a jock, I did find it humorous when Derek Jeter got broken up with by Minka Kelly when he got caught in the gift basket scandal, and he had to buy her a paris trip to make it up to her. Hilarious. I high fived a few people over that one.

  248. SoS February 6th, 2012 at 5:32 pm

    The Cubs designated Blake Dewitt for assignment …..is he better than Chavez? He’s got a cool name anyway.

    =======

    Blake,
    Reminds me of the movie Starsky and Hutch. The line the Hutch stole from Starsky. Do it, do it.

  249. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 5:33 pm

    Damon would bring the Yankee clubhouse IQ low enough to appreciate the Cashman story. I say sign him.

  250. Irreverent Discourse February 6th, 2012 at 5:33 pm

    jerkface – HIGH FIVE! DUDES YEAH!

  251. Tom in N.J. February 6th, 2012 at 5:34 pm

    Blake DeWitt would give Chad a Missouri guy to hangout with…

  252. SoS February 6th, 2012 at 5:34 pm

    Nick,
    Tell me the truth. Were you telling yourself “thank god I didnt bet SoS $50 or he would probably use $100 in gas just to drive up here and get it.”

  253. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 5:35 pm

    Joe, I would pass on some Scotch recommendations, but you might just toss them into the Long Island Sound just as you tossed my restaurant tips into the Seine. :(

  254. Yankee Trader February 6th, 2012 at 5:37 pm

    Could this be the “cheap” lefty hitter the Yankees land to fill in at 3rd, DH and play some corner OF?

    By Ben Nicholson-Smith [February 6 at 4:06pm CST]
    The Cubs announced that they designated infielder Blake DeWitt for assignment. The move creates 40-man roster space for Adrian Cardenas, who the Cubs claimed from Oakland today.

    DeWitt, 26, posted a .265/.305/.413 line in 243 plate appearances in 2011, playing left field, second base and third base. The 2004 first rounder owns a .260/.329/.385 career line in four seasons with the Dodgers and Cubs.

    DeWitt and the Cubs had agreed to a $1.1MM salary for 2012 earlier in the offseason, avoiding arbitration. The Cubs could attempt to deal DeWitt, but if they release him, I expect they’ll be responsible for one sixth of his salary (approximately $183K). He was arbitration eligible for the first time this offseason

  255. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 5:37 pm

    Blake DeWitt is an atrocious defender according to UZR, and can barely hit. As a health option he’d probably last the entire season over Chavez. I dunno if he is worth picking up.

  256. stuckey February 6th, 2012 at 5:37 pm

    “It’s not lying, if you really believe it” – George Costanza

  257. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 5:38 pm

    Yeah, DeWitt is not a DH.

  258. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 5:38 pm

    He has a reverse platoon split as well, so he doesn’t solve the righty weakness.

  259. blake February 6th, 2012 at 5:41 pm

    “Blake DeWitt is an atrocious defender according to UZR, and can barely hit. As a health option he’d probably last the entire season over Chavez. I dunno if he is worth picking up.”

    Yea….I think id rather take that money they’d waste and put it towards gambling on the Cespedes.

  260. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 5:41 pm

    If the Yankees are committed to developing Nunez as a UIF I’d prefer he gets the most amount of PAs and reps in the field as possible.

    Pena is fine for maybe the handful of times 2 starting infielders are out of the lineup on the same day.

  261. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 5:41 pm

    SoS, the truth is that I was in the air for most of the Holiday Bowl. I had bought plane tickets before the bowl schedule was finalized.

    I came very close to either paying the change fee to take a different flight, trying to go standby to take an earlier flight, or just “missing” my flight to watch the game and then see what happened.

    Instead, I just dvr’d the game and made it across the country and back home without finding out what happened. I did watch a big chunk of the first quarter in a bar in O’Hare.

    So the truth is, when it was finally over, I was really relieved that I didn’t pay an extra hundred bucks to see that crap live.

    I probably would have bet you had we set it up in advance. If you’re ever in SF, a meal at La Taqueria or ramen at Katana-Ya is on me.

  262. SoS February 6th, 2012 at 5:43 pm

    Jerkface,
    It was Motley Crue. I believe it was the Shout at the Devil album. BTW, you can only here it if you were a TRUE heavy metal fan back in the day. Otherwise it fell on deaf ears.

  263. Yankee Trader February 6th, 2012 at 5:44 pm

    He has a reverse platoon split as well, so he doesn’t solve the righty weakness.
    ——————————

    JF-
    So did Damon and Matsui last year. I’d like to see Damon back, but would Guerrero be a better option for full time DH? Looked at his spray/hit chart in Camden last year and he hits to all fields, unlike Damon whose power at Tropicana was solely to right.

  264. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 5:46 pm

    Yankee Trader, if they just wanted someone to hit, I’d take Guerrero. DeWitt has a reverse split for his entire career, where as Damon and Matsui were good agaisnt Righties for most of their careers.

    So probably right now I’d prefer Guerrero then one of Matsui/Damon, and no Dewitt.

  265. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 5:46 pm

    “randy is losing badly here. his only hope is that nick in sf is not a woman; otherwise he would never hear the end of it.”

    joe on long island-

    yeah , i’m losing now like i was losing when i was saying hughes and wang were being ruined by the way they were being used. the reality is when what i say happens people like nick in sf disappear into the woodwork for a while until people forget the positions they took.

    until we see how things play out, no one knows who is right do we?

    actually, now that CB isn’t here hardly anymore, the best poster on the blog is a woman. yankeefeminista gets my vote for all around best yankee baseball knowledge on this blog.

    so i’m not quite sure what you mean by saying it’s a good thing nick in sf is not a woman.
    it might be better if he was.

  266. Villa Nova-Ya February 6th, 2012 at 5:46 pm

    Take him up on Katana-Ya.

  267. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 5:49 pm

    “Damon would bring the Yankee clubhouse IQ low enough to appreciate the Cashman story. I say sign him.”

    yes damon is so dumb he can’t even spell IQ.

    but he’s a real good sitational hitter especially in the clutch.

  268. SoS February 6th, 2012 at 5:49 pm

    You got it Nick. Dont know what those restaurants offer. But I either go for
    steak and Lobster = $50
    or
    50 orders off the dollar menu. Ill cover the tax.

  269. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 5:50 pm

    Being “right” once doesn’t make you more likely to be right again, especially on a completely unrelated topic. “Hughes got hurt, ergo I know how this cashman thing is going to play out!!”

  270. SoS February 6th, 2012 at 5:52 pm

    Where is Kevin Maas when you need him.

  271. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 5:54 pm

    randy apparently does not subscribe to the “when you find yourself in a hole, stop digging” rule.

    I do like how randy said “people like nick in sf disappear into the woodwork for a while until people forget the positions they took…” since he probably knows he can’t back up any claim that I ever did that and we now know that his ego doesn’t allow him to admit to me that he’s wrong about something.

    I suspect that the people who are both “like” me and disappeared into the woodwork after losing to randy in an argument are people who exist only in his imagination.

  272. SoS February 6th, 2012 at 6:00 pm

    Hey Nick you watch the pac 12. How do think Luck will do in the NFL? The times I watched hiim, he didnt show me “once in 2 decade qb”. My boy Manning is going to have to switch teams for
    the so called next big thing. Just want to know if hes the next Manning or that #2 pick that year. BTW, I go where Manning goes. If he retires, then I will have to yet again find someone that resembles Marino in the pocket.

  273. stuckey February 6th, 2012 at 6:00 pm

    “It’s not lying, if you really believe it” – George Costanza

  274. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 6:05 pm

    “randy apparently does not subscribe to the “when you find yourself in a hole, stop digging” rule.

    I do like how randy said “people like nick in sf disappear into the woodwork for a while until people forget the positions they took…” since he probably knows he can’t back up any claim that I ever did that”

    nick in sf-

    so what was your position on hughes when he was first brought up?

    what was you position on wang with how the yankees were using him? or joba?

    i pointed out the problems these guys were going to face when most of the rest of the blog took the status quo position. i believe you are usually in that camp, but do tell what your position was on those past issues before they happened.

    the thing joe on long island doesn’t get is that you and i are not having a logic debate. something is going to happen that proves rightness and wrongness.

    just like what happened with hughes, wang.
    , and joba, etc

    and don’t fixate only on cashman. i’ve said clearly i think the yankees are going to mess up pineda too.

    and no i’m not rooting for that any more than i was rooting for the yankees to ruin wang .

    the fact is rightness and wrongness gets down to what happens in the future. we’ll see.

  275. ron February 6th, 2012 at 6:07 pm

    The hendry hiring might be so he can take over a % of the gm duties while cashman deals with this mess,but no title will change,and the entrapment stuff.
    If the police were in on it,cashman is not getting in trouble for it.
    Worst thing that can happen,if the lady proves entrapment is,they drop some charges.

    When do police ever get in trouble?

  276. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 6:07 pm

    “Where is Kevin Maas when you need him.”

    Based on some posts here, his ghost may have been traded to Seattle………….

  277. SoS February 6th, 2012 at 6:07 pm

    “My husband can not f—— throw the ball and catch the ball at the same time. I can’t believe they dropped the ball so many times,” Bundchen said in a video captured by theinsider.com, a gossip website.

    ==========

    Speaking of women bus drivers.

  278. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 6:08 pm

    “Being “right” once doesn’t make you more likely to be right again, especially on a completely unrelated topic.”

    once?

    i thought you were good with numbers.

  279. ron February 6th, 2012 at 6:12 pm

    Yankees would be better off sending pineda to AAA til he developes a changeup.

    They have too many starters as it is,and can survive for a while without pineda.

    Him developing a change is important enough to warrant him being sent to AAA,imo.

    He just turned 22 years old./

  280. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 6:14 pm

    once?

    Lumped all your pitching ‘rightness’ into one pile. None of it amounts to knowing whats going to happen with Cashman, as much as you’d like him to get fired.

  281. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 6:22 pm

    “Lumped all your pitching ‘rightness’ into one pile. None of it amounts to knowing whats going to happen with Cashman, as much as you’d like him to get fired.”

    i didn’t want to add livan to the pile, but i probably should. that was before your time, but no one like my thoughts on him either.

    i don’t think they should fire cashman. he knows too much. he has too much experience to throw that away.

    they should bump him sideways into some new title.

  282. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 6:25 pm

    ” Yankees would be better off sending pineda to AAA til he developes a changeup.

    They have too many starters as it is,and can survive for a while without pineda.”

    i totally agree

  283. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 6:26 pm

    i don’t think they should fire cashman.

    Yes you do, don’t hide what you really want. You’re disguising it by calling it a lateral move, but what you want is him to be gone from the GM position, the position that makes the baseball moves. And on that subject you’re just dealing with your own emotional need for Cashman to be dismissed, not with any form of objective logic.

  284. kd February 6th, 2012 at 6:40 pm

    any post that blake dewitt got cut by the cubs?

    why not sign him? he’s more versatile that chavez and could be a good bench player

  285. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 6:42 pm

    he’s more versatile that chavez and could be a good bench player

    Well he isn’t very good at any defensive position and he can’t hit. Probably wouldnt be worth the 1 mil it would take to hold him in a roster spot. If he were better against righties it would make sense. The cubs cut him despite his 1 million dollar salary, it wasn’t because he was secretly good.

  286. kd February 6th, 2012 at 6:47 pm

    face,

    insurance policy. keep him in aaa if nunez gets hurt. won’t cost much at all and he’s better than pena

  287. CompassRosy February 6th, 2012 at 6:52 pm

    I only bet on one of the exotic props: I bet that Kelly Clarkson would go over 1 minute 34 seconds on the anthem.
    ===============

    :-)

    I never win Super Bowl bets.
    Except, it seems, when the Giants and Patriots are the participants.
    I won my straight bet and TWO 3-part parlays.
    (the really good news is that I still get to spend two more days in Lake Tahoe!)

    Anyway – Congrats to the Eli and the G-Men!

  288. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 6:54 pm

    DeWitt has played two ML games at SS, both in 2009.

  289. Joe from Long Island February 6th, 2012 at 6:56 pm

    just got home, and waiting on dinner…..with that scotch.

    randy – the question at hand is not your opinion of how the yankees handled chien ming wang, phil hughes, or joba. don’t get distracted. the issue is nick from sf challenging you, and your reluctance to take him up on his challenge.

    my comment was based on being an observer of your’s and nick’s interplay.

  290. Duh Innings February 6th, 2012 at 6:58 pm

    Brian Cashman is a lowlife crumb the Yanks should fire ASAP because he has disgraced the Yankee name and cannot possibly concentrate on being the Yankee GM with this whole situation which looks like it’s coming to a head.

    Also, he has endangered the lives of everyone in the Yankee organization by getting involved with this wackjob woman because what if she gets out and decides to target someone in the organization other than or along with Cashman? It’s not that difficult to get to people nowadays.

    Forget a demotion or lateral promotion which is even more embarrassing.

    Four World Championships in six tries and only one season of not making the postseason because your ace was out for the season after a season-ending injury in mid-June (2008) across thirteen seasons is a nice run, especially when you got a job with the Yankee organization only because your dad was a fellow horse owner pal of George Steinbrenner. Cashman is only 44. Hypothetically he could take off a year and I’m sure he could land a GM job elsewhere.

  291. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 7:03 pm

    “Yes you do, don’t hide what you really want. You’re disguising it by calling it a lateral move, but what you want is him to be gone from the GM position, the position that makes the baseball moves”

    jerkface-

    you can read my mind? i ‘ll have to call you jerkadamus from now on.

    here’s the kind of thing i was writing five years ago on this site. i realize you weren’t here then but if you were , you probably would have been on the opposite side i was on. if you would have been you would have wrong.

    http://yankees.lhblogs.com/200.....g-reasons/

    randy l April 26th, 2007 at 10:30 pm
    “The Yankees were 8-11 last April too and finished with the best record in the sport. Take it easy.”
    you take it easy. my eyes see a team in disarray. you want to use the yankees for a hughes developmental league. he has no arm strength. 90mph after 75 pitches. maybe he’s been babied ,but he’s only good for 75 pitches right now. his arm is not strong enough.
    why throw him into this mess? you have a blue chip pitcher and you want to take a chance on asking too much of him. he does not have good stuff from 75 pitches on right now. bring him up to 100 pitches at triple a and if he can still throw his maximum velocity in the late innings than maybe. till then , forget it.”

  292. tomingeorgia February 6th, 2012 at 7:03 pm

    Duh,
    Endangered the lives of everyone in the Yankee organization? That outdoes even randy.

  293. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 7:06 pm

    randy, you are distorting the past, as is your wont.

    You said before that you won’t back down to me, but you already have, though you might not understand it. A little while ago you were accusing me or people like me of disappearing into the woodwork and you’re already backtracking and admitting you don’t know what I said about these things you think you were right about but you just figure I took a “status quo position” since I am “usually in that camp…”

    So you don’t know what I said and you’re not even going to bother trying to prove that I “disappeared into the woodwork” for any amount of time. Nor will you identify people like me who did. Who exactly is like me?

    Hughes and Wang and Joba all all side issues, but you’re also perpetuating a myth about what you predicted and that you were somehow proven correct. You didn’t predict that Phil Hughes would come into the 2008 season with some secret rib injury that he didn’t disclose until it knocked him out of the rotation. Maybe you predicted that he would have a hamstring problem while no-hitting Texas in 2007; I don’t remember it, though.

    You didn’t predict that Wang would sustain a Lisfranc injury while rounding third base in Houston. I don’t think anyone else did either. You did criticize the Yanks for how they rehabbed Wang — after the fact. Critics are often correct. You also made the wild claim that the Yankees — on orders from Cashman — were ordering Wang to change his arm slot and release point. It turned out that you were wrong about that and you admitted that a lot of what you had said was just to stir the pot and drive conversation. Remember that? I do.

    So the Yankees very well may have screwed up Wang’s re-hab — you won’t catch me trying to argue that they handled it well — but that doesn’t really make you right about some prediction.

    “something is going to happen that proves rightness and wrongness…. the fact is rightness and wrongness gets down to what happens in the future.”

    Gee, you think??? I’m going to say that Joe in Long Island read your posts and my posts and knew what he was talking about in a wise, measured way, as usual. This little kerfuffle is about your prediction of a future event: that Cashman won’t be the GM on Opening Day.

    I’m willing to wager $50 (or some other amount) that he will be the GM on Opening Day. Pretty clear cut that one of us will be right and one of us will be wrong. But you don’t want to bet because gurglegurglegurgle/you don’t bet with people you don’t trust/blurbleblurbleblurble/you won’t ever back down/blahblahblah. Everything else is noise.

  294. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 7:08 pm

    I think that’s sarcasm.

  295. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 7:09 pm

    “the issue is nick from sf challenging you, and your reluctance to take him up on his challenge.

    my comment was based on being an observer of your’s and nick’s interplay.”

    joe form long island-

    i get it that you were being light hearted , but as i said, the rightness and wrongness of what nick and i are debating will be proven by reality.

    its not a logic debate. real events are going to determine the outcome. i think people here actually feel they can win debates by making debating points.

    it’s all in what happens. no one knows that yet. we’ll see.

  296. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 7:10 pm

    hey nick, were you here in spring 2007?

  297. Benny Blanco February 6th, 2012 at 7:10 pm

    Now we’re sending down Pineda ( a pitcher who some of you only see a handful of times) down to AAA to start the season so that he can work on his change up?? Anyone got any more brain-busting ideas? Is it possible? Absolutely. Will it happen? Not likely.

  298. RadioKev February 6th, 2012 at 7:18 pm

    You know, Pineda starting in the minors wouldn’t be the worst thing in the history of baseball. However I think it would be a waste as he can clearly be successful in the majors right now – and he’s probably going to be more productive than Nova/Garcia/Hughes/Burnett.

  299. stuckey February 6th, 2012 at 7:19 pm

    “The Yankees were 8-11 last April too and finished with the best record in the sport. Take it easy.”

    “you take it easy. my eyes see a team in disarray.”

    History proves that “Team in disarray” went on to win 94 games and qualify for the postseason by 6 games.

    Interesting choice of self-quoting.

  300. austinmac February 6th, 2012 at 7:20 pm

    Rosenthal via MLBTR says the Yankees are in “serious discussions” with Ibanez. You bet it does.

  301. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 7:21 pm

    randy, the logic part that Joe was referring to is seeminly going over your head; he can explain better but I think he’s referring to how you refused to bet me rather than the topic of the bet, this that will be settled on Opening Day.

    You made your prediction about Cashman and I invited you to wager on it.

    You made a couple jokes but then said, since I was pressing you, that you don’t wager with people you don’t trust. Clear statment. You don’t trust me, so no wager.

    I posit that trust is not an issue in why you won’t wager, since we could easily have Pat M hold the money and we both trust him.

    Then you threw up a lot of other stuff, said you refused to bet, asked if I was mentally ill, and said you would shoot yourself before you would back down to me.

    You don’t want to risk losing a bet to me because… Phil Hughes?

  302. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 7:21 pm

    Not a big fan of the 40 year old DH. Couldn’t we sign Barry Bonds instead?

  303. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 7:25 pm

    Rosenthal via MLBTR says the Yankees are in “serious discussions” with Ibanez. You bet it does.

    ——–

    FML

  304. blake February 6th, 2012 at 7:25 pm

    I hope the Ibanez leak is a negotiating ploy

  305. austinmac February 6th, 2012 at 7:28 pm

    Face,

    I would bet on Bonds, even now. I’m not sure what they see over Damon and Matsui other than last year’s splits.

    It also seems to say trading excess pitching for a hitter isn’t working. Seven pitchers still with five spots, or six counting long man.

  306. comet February 6th, 2012 at 7:28 pm

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com

  307. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 7:28 pm

    From the Ibanez wiki page:

    “In a poll of 290 Major League players by Sports Illustrated, Ibáñez was voted the second nicest major league player, after Jim Thome.”

  308. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 7:28 pm

    Is there some opposite thing of KURODA that I can do to ensure they don’t sign Ibanez?

  309. kd February 6th, 2012 at 7:29 pm

    you gotta think that damon has more left in the tank than ibanez.

    what’s up with chavez? if he got 300 ab’s, is it hard to think he’d have 15 hrs?

  310. blake February 6th, 2012 at 7:30 pm

    Ibanez can still play outfield a little bit and he’s supposedly a great clubhouse guy…..but id rather have Damon…..Ibanez and Cespedes if no Damon and Cespedes.

  311. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 7:30 pm

    “I’m willing to wager $50 (or some other amount) that he will be the GM on Opening Day. Pretty clear cut that one of us will be right and one of us will be wrong. But you don’t want to bet because gurglegurglegurgle/you don’t bet with people you don’t trust/blurbleblurbleblurble/you won’t ever back down/blahblahblah. Everything else is noise.”

    nick in sf-

    i don’t bet because i think betting is kind of a dumb thing to do.

    and it has nothing to do with being right or wrong.

    you’ve made it pretty clear you have little respect for me.
    i’ve made it really clear i have little respect for you.
    why are we having a conversation?

    to me , you’re the kid that was always jealous that i could play well and you couldn’t. i’ve dealt with passive /aggressive morons like you all my life. who cares. i look at our conversations as you playing out your old insecurities. i’m frankly not interested in your games. play them with someone else.

  312. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 7:32 pm

    I’d rather Dickerson be the LH DH than Ibanez.

  313. Bret The Hitman February 6th, 2012 at 7:33 pm

    blake February 6th, 2012 at 7:25 pm

    I hope the Ibanez leak is a negotiating ploy

    ****************

    I truly hope so as well. To go from Beltran to Ibanez is just a huge drop and shows they can’t turn some of that pitching into a long-term solution in the OF.

  314. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 7:33 pm

    what’s up with chavez? if he got 300 ab’s, is it hard to think he’d have 15 hrs?

    ———

    Can’t decide what’s less likely.

    The Ghost of Eric Chavez staying healthy for 300 at bats or hitting 15 HR.

  315. Cashmoney February 6th, 2012 at 7:35 pm

    Damon is my choice out of the trio of Mat.Iba and D.

  316. stuckey February 6th, 2012 at 7:38 pm

    “To go from Beltran to Ibanez is just a huge drop..”

    You can’t “go” from someone you never had, or were never in for…

    And it’s Feb. 6.

    We all know you REALLY like trades Bret, but every year in ST SOMEONE’s arm falls off. If that someone is with the Yankees, makes sense to hold onto your depth.

    If that someone is someone on another team, perhaps the Yankees depth gains new value that it has right now.

    There is just no compelling information to base any conclusions on.

  317. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 7:39 pm

    “History proves that “Team in disarray” went on to win 94 games and qualify for the postseason by 6 games.

    Interesting choice of self-quoting.”

    stuckey-

    it’s what i wrote. i was talking to mike plugh. read the posts. the context was phil hughes.

    go back and see why hughes was brought up. “disarray” was probably an understatement.

  318. Bret The Hitman February 6th, 2012 at 7:40 pm

    Passing on Beltran is still a head scratcher.

  319. MTU February 6th, 2012 at 7:44 pm

    Randy-

    If you lose your pistol duel with Nick I would really appreciate if you would do me a solid and leave me some of your Apple stock.

    TIA

    :)

  320. MTU February 6th, 2012 at 7:47 pm

    Nick-

    If you lose the duel I’d appreciate it if you would consider leaving me a portion of your bobblehead
    collection, and some of your In N Out coupons.

    Much appreciated. Thank you kindly for your consideration.

    :)

  321. stuckey February 6th, 2012 at 7:47 pm

    Randy, I read the exchange in context. You replied specifically to someone who was urging fans caution during their slow April start, citing the slow start they had in April 2006.

    In DIRECT response to that, you replied, ““you take it easy. my eyes see a team in disarray.”

    Your misfire on this issue is self-evident. Even if your point is self-congratulations for the Hughes things, at best the evidence you chose to reveal shows someone batting .500.

    Understand, I’m just offering this perspective into the public discourse. I’m fully aware self-awareness is not a club in your bag.

  322. Joe from Long Island February 6th, 2012 at 7:49 pm

    bret – hi, hope you’re well. passing on beltran makes sense, only, within the context of trimming payroll for the lux tax penalty, and trying to get below it for the future. that clock seems to reset itself, to only a 17.5% rate, i think.

    i could see them going with dickerson at the start, he can play the field and is a good baserunner.

    boy, all this over a simple bet…..that and testosterone.

    nick – we had only a week, 8 days, in paris. but, do not assume we will not be going back. that restaurant, moroccan, no?, still intrigues me. as it turned out, we got a bottle of caol ila scotch whisky from the duty free shop, and really enjoyed it in the hotel when we got back at the end of the day.

  323. stuckey February 6th, 2012 at 7:52 pm

    “Passing on Beltran is still a head scratcher.”

    It is if you just choose to hold out hope the Yankees are doing business the way you want them to do business, rather than just accept the ample evidence to the contrary.

    Yankees weren’t spending $13 on DH or using it to move a current outfielder making $10m to the DH slot.

  324. Giuseppe Franco February 6th, 2012 at 7:54 pm

    Bret The Hitman February 6th, 2012 at 7:33 pm

    blake February 6th, 2012 at 7:25 pm

    I hope the Ibanez leak is a negotiating ploy

    ****************

    I truly hope so as well. To go from Beltran to Ibanez is just a huge drop and shows they can’t turn some of that pitching into a long-term solution in the OF.

    ———–

    They already have 3 outfielders signed for this season and they aren’t getting a long term OF option unless Gardner or Swisher is sent elsewhere, which isn’t going to happen.

    You keep griping about the Yanks needing a long term bat yet you were including the one bat they had in Montero in every stupid trade proposal.

    Once they decided to include Montero in a deal it was inevitably going to be significantly tougher to find a long term replacement.

    In other words, don’t expect anyone like that this season. They made their bed with that decision so they will have to sleep in it for awhile.

  325. Bret The Hitman February 6th, 2012 at 7:55 pm

    Joe,

    Yes things are great here. I’m getting much better at staying away from crazy girls and have focused more on my studies. There are still plenty of distractions but I’m trying to stay strong!

    As for Beltran, I don’t like it. He wanted a 2 year deal here through 2012 and 2013 so the whole 2014 luxury tax thing would not have been an issue with him.

    I had faith the Yankees could spin some of that pitching surplus into a long-term solution in the outfield but if they sign Ibanez that to me is a sign of surrender. But who knows…maybe Stuckey’s right, one of the pitchers gets injured in ST and Hughes steps up and shines in his place. Then when said injured pitcher returns, the Yankees have a good problem on their hands and Hughes would hold more value at that point as a trade asset than he does now. Maybe they could spin him for a young OF prospect in AAA with an ETA of 2013 so they don’t have to pay Swish. They really need to turn Hughes into a cheap long-term solution in the OF (preferably RF) or they have absolutely zero shot of fitting Cole Hamels under the 2014 cap. It’s a long-shot as it is but locking up Swisher to a big long-term prospect makes it pretty much impossible.

    So when I yearn for a trade in this instance, my eyes are on Cole Hamels and squeezing in his contract under the 2014 cap.

  326. BD (Boston Dave) February 6th, 2012 at 7:59 pm

    Damon clearly wants more $$.

    Ibanez will take less money to play for the Yankees (than he could get somewhere else.)

    Once again, if Damon wants to be a Yankee, there is room for him. If he wants a few extra bucks to be an Oriole or A, more power to ya.

  327. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 8:01 pm

    stuckey-

    if you think the 2007 yankee team was a good one i see the problem we have.

    i grew up with the yankees being a dynasty. maybe i’m spoiled by mantle, maris, berra , ford, howard, etc., but i seem to have way higher expectations than you do.

    94 victories

    wow

    real good team

  328. MTU February 6th, 2012 at 8:02 pm

    I wonder if the author of this post also owns a travel magazine named after him and his cousin Mr. Naste ?

    Inquiring minds want to know.

    ;)

  329. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 8:07 pm

    Melo with a strained groin. Dude can’t catch a break this season.

  330. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 8:10 pm

    “i don’t bet because i think betting is kind of a dumb thing to do.”

    That kind of calls into question your statement that you don’t bet with people you don’t trust. It would have been much easier for you to say then that you think betting is a dumb thing to do, but itstead you used the reason that you don’t trust me. So instead of saying you just didn’t want to bet, you questioned my integrity and used that to decline my invitation to wager.

    You also suggested that I or people like me disappeared into the woodwork after losing some phantom argument with you but you’ve abandoned that line of argument with alacrity.

    Why did you do those things? Before you answer, should you choose to do so, consider that everyone reading this already saw you state that you’d rather shoot yourself than back down to me, and every answer you give will be read in that light.

    Now do you have a better idea of what Joe in Long Island was getting at?

    “you’ve made it pretty clear you have little respect for me.”

    It’s not that simple. I have quite a bit of respect for your baseball background and the insights and recollections that you bring to the blog and I have never been shy about agreeing with you when I do or giving you credit when I think you’re right about something. We have argued on the same side of issues more than once.

    I don’t have a lot of respect for the way you sometimes conduct yourself in arguments on this blog because a lot of the time they’re filled with dodges, distortions, omissions, half-truths, and nonsequiturs. You undermine your own expertise.

    Case in point, I asked why your expert opinion on Pineda should be accepted over the expert opinions of former maor league baseball players, scouts, GM’s, etc. Your first answer was that you wouldn’t apologize for having gotten off your couch and doing something — which was not a real answer to any question anyone had asked you.

    “i’ve made it really clear i have little respect for you.”

    I can’t really argue with that.

    “to me , you’re the kid that was always jealous that i could play well and you couldn’t. i’ve dealt with passive /aggressive morons like you all my life. who cares. i look at our conversations as you playing out your old insecurities.”

    Morons? Playing out insecurities? There’s a lot of pop psychology there that someone could have fun trying to unravel. I don’t think you did yourself any favors by posting that. Nothing to argue against, though, but that might explain why you won’t allow yourself to admit (to me) being wrong about something and wouldn’t want to risk losing a bet to me.

  331. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 8:13 pm

    I wonder if the author of this post also owns a travel magazine named after him and his cousin Mr. Naste ?

    ———————————————————————

    MTU,

    It was posted so long ago I had trouble figuring out just what the heck you were talking about.

    Actually, with its WAR theme, it sort serves a bit of foreshadowing into what today’s thread ultimately devolved into with a jock pounding his chest and everybody else kind of going “Huh?”

  332. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 8:13 pm

    “If you lose your pistol duel with Nick I would really appreciate if you would do me a solid and leave me some of your Apple stock.”

    mtu-

    i sold it all. cashed it all in.

    i think jobs dying is going to be a real problem for apple. they have probably hit their high point of creativity.
    what a great run though.

    me and nick go way back on this blog and we really do not like each other.
    i come on this blog for about ten people and he ain’t one of them.

  333. Bret The Hitman February 6th, 2012 at 8:13 pm

    G. Franco,

    Basically I choose not to engage in baseball conversation with you because that is not what you seek with me. You decorate your insults (use of the word stupid in this case) and try to pass off your veiled insults to the members of the blog as conversation. It’s not conversation. It’s insult.

    So are you afraid that people are going to cast judgment on you if you are a blatant prick, a more obvious jerk?

    If you’re going to be an internet bully, don’t fake conversation, man up and be a bully.

    I’ve told you several times, I don’t want to talk baseball with you…but then a post from you appears insulting me.

    You enjoy demeaning me and belittling me and insulting my intelligence but you don’t have the stones to do it more directly.

    Don’t act like you want conversation with me.

    You don’t.

  334. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 8:14 pm

    LINSANITY!!

  335. stuckey February 6th, 2012 at 8:17 pm

    Randy,

    Were you a fan of the 1952 Yankees, who won 95 games?

    How about the ’58 team that won 92?

    ’59′s 79 wins must have been tough to swallow, eh?

    I was born in the 70s, so quite understandably I can’t pine for the days of a 16 team league, no amateur draft, and no luxury tax rules and before free agency changed the financial structure of the game.

    My experience obviously brings to mind 1996 when they won 92 games and a World Series, or 2000, when they won 89 games an a World series and both times had to team 2 additional teams and win 7 more games in the postseason than those team in the 50s had to.

    The person you responded to in 2007 made a specific point, which was it was too early to be concerned about the long-term prospects of the team.

    That person was right.

    If you’d like to harken back to a bygone era with little relevancy to today’s game in an effort to contend 94 wins qualifies for a team in “disarray”, you may.

    Again, I’m quite aware you have no intellectual conscious to appeal to.

  336. MTU February 6th, 2012 at 8:20 pm

    Jeers-

    Time to wander out into the Desert again, grab some shrooms, and watch the stars all melt away.

    Randy-

    Doesn’t hurt to try.

    Jobs left 4 years more of innovations behind. After that ????

    Congratulations. Must feel nice to be wealthy.

    :)

  337. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 8:21 pm

    if you think the 2007 yankee team was a good one i see the problem we have.

    i grew up with the yankees being a dynasty. maybe i’m spoiled by mantle, maris, berra , ford, howard, etc., but i seem to have way higher expectations than you do.

    94 victories

    wow

    real good team

    Hm well it stacks up there with 50 era yankees.

    From 50-60 the low points for the Yankees were 79 wins, 92, and 95. We obviously cannot do the 60′s to 70s or 70s to 80s or 80′s to 90s, that’d sully your memory of their dynasties.

    From 2000 to 2010 we have lows of 87 (Ws win though), 94 and 89. Over 100 wins 4 times. Pretty good considering the 50s yankees only won 100 once. Scoffing at 94 wins? Doesn’t seem very smart.

  338. Tar February 6th, 2012 at 8:23 pm

    What the hell did I walk into here. :shock: step away from the keyboard.

    One last thing GIANTS!!!!!!!!!!!!

  339. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 8:25 pm

    Crisis averted

    @AndrewMarchand: Nothing imminent with Yanks and Ibanez, but he is still in play. http://t.co/XQKug3hJ

  340. MTU February 6th, 2012 at 8:26 pm

    Catch ya’ all later.

    Maybe we can settle the last of our baseball matters in the next few days.

  341. Bret The Hitman February 6th, 2012 at 8:30 pm

    Thank God, no Ibanez.

    I hereby BAN the word Ibanez from LOHUD, just as I banned Mike Cameron before him and Adam Dunn.

    Ibanez=BAN

  342. Cashmoney February 6th, 2012 at 8:32 pm

    Ibanez

  343. Tom in N.J. February 6th, 2012 at 8:36 pm

    Who demanded satisfaction?

    http://www.amazon.com/Duelling.....gy_b_img_b

  344. Bret The Hitman February 6th, 2012 at 8:36 pm

    Crap it didn’t work. I suck at computers.

  345. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 8:38 pm

    “Were you a fan of the 1952 Yankees, who won 95 games?

    How about the ’58 team that won 92?”

    stuckey-

    i did kind of like the 154 game regular season.

    i think it made for higher quality baseball.

    here’s some more of the mike plugh exchange if you like history- you know, stuff that really happened:

    mike plugh of canyon of heroes on peter’s blog that day said,”we can baby him at the MLB level. We can watch his pitch counts and innings just as easily in the Bronx as we can in SWB …”
    “Pitching at SWB does not, I repeat, does not in any way, shape, or form prepare a man to pitch in those conditions. You know what does?
    Pitching to Frank Thomas in front of 50,000 fans”
    i said ,”why throw him into this mess? you have a blue chip pitcher and you want to take a chance on asking too much of him.”

    we know what has happened with rushing hughes.
    there is no debate that it was wrong.

    yup ,mike plugh was a flippin genius.
    you aren’t mike plugh are you?
    actually that would be kind of cool. i could rag on both of you at the same time :)

  346. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 8:41 pm

    Did I miss something? Who is Mike Plugh?

  347. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 8:43 pm

    “Scoffing at 94 wins? Doesn’t seem very smart.”

    yup, that 2007team was a real powerhouse.

    so you’d be happy with that this year?

  348. blake February 6th, 2012 at 8:45 pm

    Jeremy Guthrie Jeremy Guthrie @JGuthrie46
    Follow

    Winners & Losers of @Rockies / @Orioles trade: Winners- #Yankees training staff. Losers: @NickSwisher batting avg.

    seriously

  349. RadioKev February 6th, 2012 at 8:47 pm

    Ha, that tweet is so self aware. Hate Guthrie, but love it.

  350. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 8:50 pm

    That’s pretty effed up.

  351. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 8:54 pm

    “Did I miss something? Who is Mike Plugh?”

    lgy-

    just an example os someone who sounded pretty good on the blog who was wrong.

    Mike Plugh April 26th, 2007 at 10:10 pm
    Peter,

    “Yes, a 20-year old kid overthrows when there are 50,000 people in the stands and Frank Thomas at the plate. Guess what? So does everyone else. Pitching at SWB does not, I repeat, does not in any way, shape, or form prepare a man to pitch in those conditions. You know what does?

    Pitching to Frank Thomas in front of 50,000 fans. Every player goes through it at some point in their lives. That’s why they call it a “debut”. That’s why people don’t throw the fish back after the “debut”. They let the sample size grow and watch how the player reacts to a month of work, or two months of work. That’s what happens in every sport. Hughes can’t be judged ready or not ready by today. He will show us how ready he is by his 4th or 5th start. If he’s doo-dooing the bed in start #5, he goes back. He’s a big boy. He can take it.”

    this is just an example of how people take opposing positions on the blog and how the games themselves answer the questions. no amount of debating determines anything until we get results.
    plugh was dead wrong. hughes was injured with the hamstring soon after these posts, and he’s had a checkered career ever since. if you notice peter abraham and sj44 also nailed it ahead of time and were right.

  352. Giuseppe Franco February 6th, 2012 at 9:00 pm

    Bret The Hitman February 6th, 2012 at 8:13 pm

    G. Franco,

    Basically I choose not to engage in baseball conversation with you because that is not what you seek with me. You decorate your insults (use of the word stupid in this case) and try to pass off your veiled insults to the members of the blog as conversation. It’s not conversation. It’s insult.

    So are you afraid that people are going to cast judgment on you if you are a blatant prick, a more obvious jerk?

    If you’re going to be an internet bully, don’t fake conversation, man up and be a bully.

    I’ve told you several times, I don’t want to talk baseball with you…but then a post from you appears insulting me.

    You enjoy demeaning me and belittling me and insulting my intelligence but you don’t have the stones to do it more directly.

    Don’t act like you want conversation with me.

    You don’t.

    ————

    Get real. I don’t have the “stones” to do it more directly? How could I possibly be more clear or direct with you?

    People know my reputation here – the good and/or the bad. As LoHud regulars, we’ve all earned our reputations. Regulars either like me or they don’t but at least both sides know where I stand.

    Yes, I can be abrasive at times and I won’t apologize for it. But you have become a target because you make it easy for people because most of your suggestions don’t have an ounce of realism and you often lack an understanding of the front office game.

    If you choose to offer unrealistic and/fantasy content within these walls you’re going to get called on it. That’s the way blogs work.

  353. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 9:01 pm

    yup, that 2007team was a real powerhouse.

    so you’d be happy with that this year?

    They scored 968 runs that year, I’d take that in a heart beat.

  354. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 9:06 pm

    “me and nick go way back on this blog and we really do not like each other.”

    Perhaps that’s true for you but not for me. This may be beyond your powers of comprehension, but I not only don’t dislike you, I like you. I have old friends and relatives who say all kinds of crazy, whacked out stuff too, but I can still like and/or love them.

    “i come on this blog for about ten people and he ain’t one of them.”

    You’ve sung a nicer tune about me in the past, but I do believe that’s how you feel at the moment, and if you feel it at the moment you might also think it’s how you’ve always felt.

    As for myself, I come on to this blog for more than ten people and you are one of them.

  355. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 9:09 pm

    Ironically I came to this blog looking for Mike Plugh but couldn’t find him.

  356. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 9:20 pm

    Was Mike Plugh still commenting here during the 2007 ALDS?

    Didn’t Phil Hughes come into that game Roger Clemens started and get the win? The only game we won in that series?

    Maybe Mike Plugh had already realized he had nothing left to learn on Lohud by then.

    As for myself, I can actually document the claims I made in 2007, therefore I am the only straight shooter in this discussion:

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/9.....3451651434

  357. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 9:21 pm

    “Ironically I came to this blog looking for Mike Plugh but couldn’t find him.”

    here’s some more then:


    randy l May 2nd, 2007 at 3:48 am
    if you want to see some interesting commentary, check out peter’s post on april 26th:
    http://yankees.lhblogs.com/200…..g-reasons/

    mike plugh of canyon of heroes on peter’s blog that day said,”we can baby him at the MLB level. We can watch his pitch counts and innings just as easily in the Bronx as we can in SWB …”
    “Pitching at SWB does not, I repeat, does not in any way, shape, or form prepare a man to pitch in those conditions. You know what does?
    Pitching to Frank Thomas in front of 50,000 fans”

    i said ,”why throw him into this mess? you have a blue chip pitcher and you want to take a chance on asking too much of him.”
    these two differing opinions were representaive of two opposing schools of thought.
    we knew where peter came down then and we know it now. he told it straight and it turned out he was right.
    no one is happy to say” i told you so”. this is a screwup that is historic and sad and upsetting to any yankee fan,and it didn’t have to happen. it’s that simple.

  358. randy l. February 6th, 2012 at 9:28 pm

    “They scored 968 runs that year, I’d take that in a heart beat.”

    yeah , i would too.

    how was the pitching?

  359. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 9:40 pm

    “how was the pitching?”

    Good enough to help the team win 94 games?

    Not good enough to advance past Cleveland when the 19-game winner Wang got shelled twice and they lost a gem that Pettitte pitched in the game with Joba and the midges.

    Is there anywhere in your back-and-forth with Mike Plugh where either of you predicted that Phil Hughes would win the Yanks’ only game of that series coming in to relieve Clemens?

    “no one is happy to say” i told you so”.

    :shock:

    You are happy to say it whether or not you ever told anyone so!

  360. sammiejohnson February 6th, 2012 at 9:44 pm

    Nick in SF

    OT, but I was wondering if you know where I can find a line on thurs. St. Marys @ Gonzaga game.

  361. jacksquat February 6th, 2012 at 9:47 pm

    blake February 6th, 2012 at 8:45 pm
    Jeremy Guthrie Jeremy Guthrie @JGuthrie46
    Follow

    Winners & Losers of @Rockies / @Orioles trade: Winners- #Yankees training staff. Losers: @NickSwisher batting avg.

    seriously

    Well FU too Guthrie, enjoy Coors Field and having to get in the batter’s box now.

  362. jacksquat February 6th, 2012 at 9:53 pm

    Ibanez road 2011: .210/.261/.317

    Damon road 2011: .280/.345/.463

    They really, really should get Damon over Ibanez.

  363. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 9:55 pm

    sammiejohnson, a few sportsbooks I know about have basketball lines the night before the game, others only the day of the game.

    I don’t know if any line exists this far away from the matchup.

  364. blake February 6th, 2012 at 9:56 pm

    I think they are just trying to get Damon’s price down.

  365. PittsburghYankeeFan February 6th, 2012 at 9:56 pm

    As long as we’re talking 94 games, look what happened last night. A 9-7 regular season team just won the Super Bowl.

    After watching this for nearly 40 years, my own (perhaps dumb) observation is this:

    All you can do is put the best team on the field to win 95 plus, get a playoff spot, and hope you’re pitching is hot. Unless your team is so overwhelming (i.e. the 98 Yankees), asking for a championship every year is unrealistic.

    Nowadays, with video, the internet, and 24 hour news, teams and players are more transparent than ever, and it gets even harder to rise above the pack.

    Could the Yankees buy their way to the WS every year? Probably, but they’d have to spend $250 million plus per year on payroll, which nobody wants to do.

    Given this, I think the decision (a reasonable one) has been made by the Steinbrenners to leverage the Yankee $$$$ (which is still more than everyone else) in ways consistent with the CBA. MLB has tried to structure the CBA to prevent this, but they can’t stop the Yankees all the time. The Yankees are not dummies, no matter what some here on LoHud say. No more paying over slot in the draft? No more buying the best international FA? They will find a way.

  366. PittsburghYankeeFan February 6th, 2012 at 9:57 pm

    Damon as usual is overrating his skill set and worth, and asking for too much $$$, or it would be him. Remember Cashman saying after 09 that it is tough for a player to come back to a team for so little $$$ that paid him so much in the past?

    Matsui is too banged up.

    Ibanez is cheaper than Damon, and could likely hit 30 HR in YS. I’ll take that for $2-3 million.

  367. Bronx Jeers February 6th, 2012 at 10:01 pm

    Since were strolling down memory lane…

    Who said this?

    ——————————————————

    “No question, I said that. When I saw him pitch in Texas, I realized I was dead wrong about him.

    The kid is the real deal. He isn’t afraid, which most of the guys on the current pitching staff are, to throw strikes. When I heard him say he told Posada to, “Punch me in the face the next time I walk a guy after going 0-2?, which he said after he walked Kenny Lofton to start the game, that’s when I knew he was ready for the majors.

    The kid was too good to keep in the minors.

    He got hurt in a freak way. Its impossible, IMO, to hang his injury on Cashman.

    He could have gotten hurt the same way in Scranton, as Ohlendorf did a couple of weeks ago.”

    —————————————————————————

    Randy,

    This was directed at you. I’m sure you know who said it and it wasn’t Mike Plugh.

    Was he right? Back then he may have been and currently he probably isn’t but we may know more at the end of this season. It’s 5 years later and the jury is still out. Phil still has a chance to help this team and another esteemed poster that we all respect very much thinks he will.

    What’s my point? Viva la Difference!

  368. sammiejohnson February 6th, 2012 at 10:01 pm

    ok thanks. Zags were blown out at St. Marys a month ago. Blown out again at BYU on thurs. And though they won, looked real shakey in the 2nd half sat. against lowly Pepperdine. Was just wondering if I could find a points spread for St. Marys coming to Spokane thurs. I am not really a betting man, so I did not really know how to look it up. I didn’t know that they just came out the night before. Thanks.

  369. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 10:01 pm

    It’s Jeremy Lin’s world, everyone else is just living in it.

  370. blake February 6th, 2012 at 10:06 pm

    Damon stole 19 bases last year too….he just brings more to the table than the other candidates in that role IMO….Vlad is probably still the best hitter….but Damon can do the most things, we know he can play in NY….and he’s just the best fit if they go that route.

  371. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 10:07 pm

    Ibanez is cheaper than Damon, and could likely hit 30 HR in YS. <————- No

  372. jacksquat February 6th, 2012 at 10:10 pm

    I’ll take the Toyota over the Yugo even though it costs a little more.

  373. TD213 February 6th, 2012 at 10:16 pm

    Jeremy Lin = Victor Cruz

  374. Wave Your Hat February 6th, 2012 at 10:19 pm

    Hughes has been disappointing. But there’s no way to prove it was because “he was rushed”. If you are sure that’s true, examine your predispositions.

    And why all this 2007 comment mining anyway? If you let me mine my 2007 comments, you’ll find out I’m a genius. If you could get old SJ44 back here to mine them, you’ll find out I’m an idiot.

    Who cares?

  375. Yankee Trader February 6th, 2012 at 10:27 pm

    Then of course, if Damon would like to stick it to the Rays for letting him leave in favor of Pena and Scott, then by all means he should sign with the Yankees! :)

  376. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 10:27 pm

    LGY, I had a feeling there would be some Giants at that game and the Knicks would benefit.

    Now it’s going to be a new rule for me: always bet on the Knicks the first game after the Giants win the Super Bowl.

    “And why all this 2007 comment mining anyway? …Who cares?”

    The guy who said ““no one is happy to say” i told you so” is one doing the comment mining and the one who cares.

  377. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 10:31 pm

    @AdamZagoria: “I’m riding him like friggin Secretariat.” — D’Antoni on Jeremy Lin #Knicks

  378. Nilsson February 6th, 2012 at 10:32 pm

    I don’t think the CBA, particularly the new amateur draft and IFA rules, were created to specifically target the Yanks.

    It affects a lot of teams across the board. It won’t be as easy to exploit inefficiencies as it was under the previous conditions. Besides, I think the next 5 years is just prelude before MLB institutes a worldwide draft. So it only gets more difficult to accumulate amateur talent.

    As for remaining FA hitters, it looks to be the same playbook for Kuroda. Yanks likely have a player in mind and they’re just waiting.

  379. Yankee Trader February 6th, 2012 at 10:35 pm

    Now it’s going to be a new rule for me: always bet on the Knicks the first game after the Giants win the Super Bowl.
    ———————————–

    Would that be the same as betting the stock market will finish higher when a team from the old National Footbal league wins the Super Bowl?

  380. Nick in SF February 6th, 2012 at 10:39 pm

    YT, close, but I think my new method allows for more theoretical emotional causation.

    I kind of hoped that the good vibes and crowd excitement would carry over and help the Knicks cover the 3 point spread.

    Don’t know if that was any factor at all, but the Knicks covered. :grin:

  381. Deal With It February 6th, 2012 at 10:49 pm

    How ridiculous, still the off season with no substantial baseball news to discuss apparently. Arguing over a proposed wager about who says what. No one cares. Perhaps Nick in SF should devote more of his time trying to collect his previous uncollected wagers that are now bad debts. Try a collection agency.

  382. LGY February 6th, 2012 at 11:06 pm

    How ridiculous, still the off season with no substantial baseball news to discuss apparently. Arguing over a proposed wager about who says what. No one cares. Perhaps Nick in SF should devote more of his time trying to collect his previous uncollected wagers that are now bad debts. Try a collection agency.

    ——————–

    You sound angry. Perhaps you need some Jeremy Lin in your life?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7HzhtJaCo0

  383. Deal With It February 6th, 2012 at 11:10 pm

    Don’t like the Knicks.

  384. Jerkface February 6th, 2012 at 11:14 pm

    yeah , i would too.

    how was the pitching?

    Well the had a 190 run differential, which is on par with the Yankees of last year and a very good mark for any team. They only gave up ~770 runs, but went into the playoffs with a Wang, Pettitte, Clemens rotation which I imagine to be as good as one could hope for in any given year.

  385. pat February 6th, 2012 at 11:30 pm

    ESPNNYYankees
    Smells like team spirit: Yankees launching official fragrance – Yankees Blog – ESPN New York http://es.pn/yAQOaU

  386. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 11:38 pm

    Rosenthal via MLBTR says the Yankees are in “serious discussions” with Ibanez. You bet it does.
    __

    It just keeps getting better an better.

  387. Rich in NJ February 6th, 2012 at 11:49 pm

    Crisis averted

    @AndrewMarchand: Nothing imminent with Yanks and Ibanez, but he is still in play. http://t.co/XQKug3hJ
    __

    In play as in for another team?

  388. TD213 February 6th, 2012 at 11:55 pm

    They already made the most egregious error of all trading Montero – anything they do after this will pale in comparison. I would have been thrilled if Ibanez was the worst move they made this winter, unfortunately, they made a significantly worse one so this won’t be that much of a downer.

  389. Deal With It February 7th, 2012 at 12:13 am

    ESPNNYYankees
    Smells like team spirit: Yankees launching official fragrance

    =================

    Called, simply, “New York Yankees” and “New York Yankees for Her,” the team will introduce two “official fragrances” at a c*cktail reception in Manhattan on Tuesday, February 21.

    =======

    “New York Yankees for Her” Will Cashman be the host / speaker ?

  390. UnKnown February 7th, 2012 at 1:58 am

    CC_Sabathia CC Sabathia
    On our way to see Hov at Carnegie Hall! http://pic.twitter.com/VBcF55db
    7 hours ago

    —–

    CC looking good. BSOHL??

  391. jacksquat February 7th, 2012 at 2:31 am

    CC looking good. BSOHL??

    Nah, black is slimming. Looks like the belly is still there, he’ll probably always have it. But obviously he can pitch with it just fine.

  392. jacksquat February 7th, 2012 at 2:35 am

    PhilHughes65 Tampa bound! 36 minutes ago

    Hughes already going to Tampa?

  393. PacoDooley February 7th, 2012 at 4:37 am

    This thread just reminds me of why I am generally fine with trading prospects for relatively young established players. I prefer the bird in the hand to the two in the bush. There are some trades that I am glad the Yankees didn’t make (like the Santana deal), but others that were clearly opportunities that were missed (Haren, Lee – I think they win the Series if that trade went through). But on the whole, you can see the value of selling high on prospects (Joba was untouchable, but he could have gotten them a nice return at one point).

  394. PacoDooley February 7th, 2012 at 4:39 am

    UnKnown February 7th, 2012 at 1:58 am

    CC looking good. BSOHL??
    ————————–

    Does look like he may have lost some of that fat he added last season.

    Anyone seen Joba? Seems like he is in the WSOHL. Hopefully TJ rehab will get him back into shape…

  395. 108 stitches February 7th, 2012 at 5:47 am

    13 more days until pitchers and catchers report for 1st formal workouts in Tampa. Several players are at the minor league complex for early workouts.

  396. Benny Blanco February 7th, 2012 at 8:04 am

    What will be the most discussed story line in spring training this year?

  397. blake February 7th, 2012 at 8:08 am

    “What will be the most discussed story line in spring training this year?”

    Probably the yearly 5th starter competition ……especially if they don’t trade anybody. I can see it becoming somewhat of a distraction with Garcia, Hughes, and AJ all being established guys……little different than youngsters fighting it out.

  398. MTU February 7th, 2012 at 8:18 am

    Blake-

    The market for AJ must have been zilch.

  399. LGY February 7th, 2012 at 8:18 am

    What will be the most discussed story line in spring training this year?

    ——-

    Jeremy Lin.

  400. dogface February 7th, 2012 at 8:19 am

    What will be the most discussed story line in spring training this year?

    ============================

    I think Blake has it right. How that 5th starter thing plays out will be the biggest story, with how the DH plate appearances are expected to be parceled out being a distant 2nd.

  401. austinmac February 7th, 2012 at 8:21 am

    The Post says the Yankees may have only $1M for the DH. They appear to target Ibanez for this reason.

  402. dogface February 7th, 2012 at 8:22 am

    The market for AJ must have been zilch.

    ===========================

    Looks that way. The two years is probably the biggest hangup. I could see the Yankees chowing down on the dead salary sandwich if Burnett had only a year to go. Don’t imagine they, or anyone else has the appetite for doing it for 2 years.

  403. Yankee Trader February 7th, 2012 at 8:23 am

    Good morning.

    The market for AJ was probably there, but interested teams most likely valued his worth as a 3M/year pitcher like Zambrano, where the Cubs absorbed 83% of his contract.

  404. Yankee Trader February 7th, 2012 at 8:26 am

    If Hughes wins the 5th starter spot and everyone is healthy when the team goes North, what will Garcia’s role be if the Yankees put Burnett in the bullpen?

  405. MTU February 7th, 2012 at 8:29 am

    YT-

    They might decide to trade Garcia.

    I thought he had a no-trade clause but have been correct here that he does not.

  406. dogface February 7th, 2012 at 8:30 am

    The market for AJ was probably there, but interested teams most likely valued his worth as a 3M/year pitcher like Zambrano, where the Cubs absorbed 83% of his contract.

    ==========================

    This is what I’m talking about. We’ve seen the Braves and Cubs both take big dead salary hits to move pitchers they didn’t really want around. However, in both cases, the pitcher in question had only 2012 left on their contracts. I think not moving Burnett is more about the Yankees not wanting to pay him $11M-$12M per year to pitch for someone else for two seasons than it is anything else.

  407. LGY February 7th, 2012 at 8:30 am

    International superstar, Jeremy Lin. Sorry, I mean Madonna, will be performing at YS September 6th.

  408. dogface February 7th, 2012 at 8:33 am

    International superstar, Jeremy Lin. Sorry, I mean Madonna, will be performing at YS September 6th

    =======================

    If I were the Yankees, I’d be announcing that in the middle of the night, under the cover of darkness, too.

  409. blake February 7th, 2012 at 8:35 am

    The market for AJ is either non existent…..or the Yanks are just refusing to pay the bulk of his salary……

    That 1 million for a DH stuff is crap…..play hardball but get the best guy you can get…..its for one year…..the YES network made 400 million dollars last year…..and……good grief.

  410. Benny Blanco February 7th, 2012 at 8:35 am

    Blake,

    I thought it was going to be the evolution of Pineda’s change-up? :)

  411. MTU February 7th, 2012 at 8:38 am

    Blake-

    Kotchman took 3 mil + incentives.

    How about a similar deal for Damon ?

  412. blake February 7th, 2012 at 8:39 am

    I think they could probably move Garcia and his salary if they wanted and he’d ok a deal…..im just not sure id actually want to trade him. Hughes is a health risk….they don’t have Noesi anymore……and AJ is awful after about mid May every year.

    If they don’t trade anyone….then Id hold a real competition for that last spot….not some lip service thing like they’ve done the last two years. If Hughes wins it outright then its his……if not then use his option and send him to AAA and out AJ in the pen.

  413. blake February 7th, 2012 at 8:40 am

    “I thought it was going to be the evolution of Pineda’s change-up?”

    Oh im sure that’ll be discussed ….probably a lot of CU discussion as always

  414. blake February 7th, 2012 at 8:42 am

    “How about a similar deal for Damon ?”

    Works for me…..a sticking point with Johnny might be ABs though in addition to money……he coukd be holding out to see if he can get a full time DH spot somewhere

  415. pat February 7th, 2012 at 8:42 am

    “What will be the most discussed story line in spring training this year?”

    Whatever Alex does or fails to do. :wink:

  416. MTU February 7th, 2012 at 8:43 am

    Blake-

    Maybe that is exactly what they will do.

    I do not think AJ would be very good out of the pen considering his lack of command but ya’ never know. Maybe he would be effectivlely wild in shorter stints. Just keep him away from the high-leverage stuff.

    ;)

  417. dogface February 7th, 2012 at 8:43 am

    Kotchman took 3 mil + incentives.

    How about a similar deal for Damon ?

    ==================================

    If I’m Damon, I’d take the position that “I’m a much better offensive player than Kotchman”, which is true. Of course, his contributions in the field are now somewhat limited, while Kotchman plays a pretty good 1B. I don’t know. I can see Damon thinking he’s worth more than that. Sounds like maybe more than 1 team is interested.

  418. Benny Blanco February 7th, 2012 at 8:46 am

    Saw moneyball for the first time on sunday. I thought it was pretty good.

  419. dogface February 7th, 2012 at 8:47 am

    Whatever Alex does or fails to do.

    ========================

    Wouldn’t be surprised if there is some discussion about what can be expected of him in terms of games played. Sounds like he’s coming to camp in good health. But he came to camp in good health last year too. At his age, injuries seem a little easier to come by and a little more difficult to play thru.

  420. MTU February 7th, 2012 at 8:49 am

    DF-

    Well I guess we can’t get Johnny D then because the Yankee budget for the lefty DH seems very
    restricted.

    Frankly, I’m not sure they would even go that far, or that he would.

    Seems like whoever is willing to take the cheap deal is gonna get the nod.

    Apparently the right bat was not available thru trade either.

  421. Yankee Trader February 7th, 2012 at 8:49 am

    If the Yankees were looking for a full time DH, of the remaining FA bats, Guerrero makes the most sense, as he consistently hits righties and lefties equally well.

    Ibanez offers the Yankees a playerr to share some OF duty, although I don’t know how his 40 yo legs will be in LF in YS.

    Damon has the most intangibles, minus the glove than all lefty bats remaining that could be had on the FA market-Matsui, Ibanez, Drew, Branyan, Fukudome.

    The only thing with Damon, is he needs two years to reach 3000, and will he get enough ABs with the Yankees?

  422. blake February 7th, 2012 at 8:50 am

    MTU,

    I actually think AJ could be really good out of the pen….his issue is always keeping his delivery together for a full game….maybe he could do it for a shorter period…..also his stuff would probably play up a bit and that’s what he’s all about…..you’d obviously need to watch him closely …..but I think its possible he coukd be a good reliever……problem is the Yanks really have no need for right handed short relievers…..maybe AJ would have better command Lefty?

  423. Benny Blanco February 7th, 2012 at 8:51 am

    “If the Yankees were looking for a full time DH, of the remaining FA bats, Guerrero makes the most sense, as he consistently hits righties and lefties equally well.”

    I’m defintely on the vladdy bus but I think the yankees want someone that can play in the field.

  424. Benny Blanco February 7th, 2012 at 8:54 am

    Blake,

    I agree with your AJ take, it’s just a damn shame that there’s 16.5 million reasons why I don’t believe the yankees will stick “King of Inconsistency” in the pen.

  425. Yankee Trader February 7th, 2012 at 8:57 am

    Once the Yankees sign the 1M$ man, they still have room for one more bench addition.

    Who will that be? Laird, Chavez, Romine, Molina, Other?

  426. blake February 7th, 2012 at 8:58 am

    Vlad has the most potential left in his bat of those guys I think……but he just can’t do anything else at all……Damon can still steal a base…..can still play OF in a pinch and hits lefties and righties well enough to play every day if somebody got hurt.

  427. J. Alfred Prufrock February 7th, 2012 at 9:00 am

    TD213 February 6th, 2012 at 11:55 pm
    They already made the most egregious error of all trading Montero – anything they do after this will pale in comparison. I would have been thrilled if Ibanez was the worst move they made this winter, unfortunately, they made a significantly worse one so this won’t be that much of a downer.
    ///

    Yes.

    Ibanez or Johnny Damon, I’m beside myself with good cheer and excitement.

    Cashman, and whomever else thought it was a neat idea to trade away Montero, all need to go.

  428. blake February 7th, 2012 at 9:00 am

    I hope they are playing possum on Cespedes…..they probably aren’t…..but id like to see them gamble on him if were talking about 5-6 million a year……the Yanks can cover that if he busts….and it would be a huge bargain if he even becomes a good player…..

  429. MTU February 7th, 2012 at 9:01 am

    Blake-

    More than likely AJ is gonna start.

    We all would be surprised if it were any different.

    Maybe Hughes will be in stud mode and will force their hand.

    If Hughes does not get the 5th starter job I hope they keep him stretched out at AAA rather than sticking him in the pen.

  430. PacoDooley February 7th, 2012 at 9:01 am

    Benny Blanco February 7th, 2012 at 8:04 am
    What will be the most discussed story line in spring training this year?
    —————————–

    I agree that it will be the 5th starter issue. It will definitely be interesting to see what they can do with Garcia since he seems like the odd man out to me. I think they want Hughes in the rotation and AJ could potentially go to the pen, but Garcia seems ill suited to the bullpen and I don’t see them wanting to give him the job just because they are paying him (given that he has a 1 year contract and isn’t making a ton).

    I think there is a very real possibility that they trade Garcia once he is eligible to be traded. They would potentially invent an injury to get him some minor league rehab starts. I just don’t see a role on this team for him after the Kuroda signing.

  431. J. Alfred Prufrock February 7th, 2012 at 9:02 am

    *whoever

  432. Yankee Trader February 7th, 2012 at 9:04 am

    Blake-

    I agree on Damon. Also of the bats available, he’s the only one who can go from 1st to 3rd on a single to RF.

    I believe the A’s have interest. Are there any other AL teams that need a DH-Orioles? I don’t believe there’s a p0tential contending team that can use a DH.

    But playing on a contending team might not be important to him as he has the rings. he needs the hits for a chance at HOF.

  433. randy l. February 7th, 2012 at 9:05 am

    “This guy is the front man of the organization with both the players and the media,” a baseball source said. “He’s the guy in charge of discipling players. How are they going to have any respect for him after this? To say this has nothing to do with the Yankees is naïve on their part.”

    Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/spo.....z1lhkrJMtq

    the biggest story this spring will be cashman.

  434. J. Alfred Prufrock February 7th, 2012 at 9:11 am

    Cashman getting axed does no good if Eppler takes his place.

    They need to sweep the lot of these guys out who sat in that room and said “aye” to trading away Jesus Montero.

    Keep the dissenters.

  435. MTU February 7th, 2012 at 9:16 am

    Blake-

    The budget appears tighter than a crab’s you-know-what.

    There’s a New thread ——>

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