The LoHud Yankees Blog

A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Waiting for doors to open

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Mar 03, 2012 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

There was nothing David Phelps, Manny Banuelos or Dellin Betances could have done this afternoon to make themselves favorites for the Yankees rotation. There are plenty of big league starters on the roster, and as long as everyone stays healthy, the next wave of pitching talent will have to wait.

But that wave might not have to wait for long. Joe Girardi has stressed that doors could open sooner rather than later.

“I made that clear in my first meeting with all the guys,” Girardi said. “I said, ‘Look, we used 28 pitchers last year, and I guarantee you all 28 weren’t on the 40-man when the year started. But at some point, they were there. If you think we’re not going to call you up because you’re not on the 40-man, think again. Everyone in this room has an opportunity to possibly pitch for us this year or you wouldn’t be here.’ I think it’s important that they know that. We like to use our system, and we want our system to be deep.”

The Yankees have homegrown Phil Hughes, Ivan Nova and Dave Robertson on the roster. Joba Chamberlain will be there soon enough, and guys like Betances, George Kontos and Kevin Whelan got some big league time last year. The young guys have seen doors open, and they’re well aware it could happen again.

“We saw it last year,” Phelps said. “The majority of the guys that were in camp last year helped the team at some point or another. It’s more about going out and trying to prove to myself that I can do it… We were down in Triple-A last year seeing a lot of our friends and teammates getting called up. It’s great watching them pitch, and it’s like, ‘I could be next.’ It’s a matter of going out and doing your job and hopefully your turn will come. It’s definitely motivation. It’s knowing that if you go out and do your job to the best of your ability, there’s a good chance that at some point during the season, you’ll be able to help the club.”

If one of those doors is opened much sooner than expected, these early spring outings could be a factor in which young pitcher gets the call. “You try to get a feel for who would handle the situation the best,” Girardi said. Today, Phelps seemed to make the best impression, but Adam Warren looked good yesterday and there’s still a long way to go.

“We get a lot of questions about how it feels to compete against your friends,” Phelps said. “We don’t see it as we’re competing against each other; we know that if we go out and do what we’re capable of doing, it’s not like if I pitch well, that means Warren isn’t going to get called up if Warren goes out and pitches well. If we all go out and do what we’re capable of doing, it’s going to be good for all of us. We feed off each other; when one is doing well, it really helps out the rest. We go over scouting reports, pick each other’s brains about how to set up hitters. If anything coming up with the same group of guys and being comfortable with them has made it easier to succeed as a group.”

Associated Press photo of Betances

 
 

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79 Responses to “Waiting for doors to open”

  1. GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 8:55 pm

    Some good news for Ike Davis,

    JonHeymanCBS Jon Heyman
    #mets people say ike davis’ valley fever situation isn’t as serious as it sounds, that doctors cleared him to play and he should be fine

  2. Joe from Long Island March 3rd, 2012 at 9:00 pm

    Phelps might have a shot at last spot in the bullpen. And, that’s assuming everyone stays healthy.

    He likely could help a lot of ML teams right now.

  3. Jerkface March 3rd, 2012 at 9:00 pm

    If it was the mets doctors that cleared him, and not actual competent doctors, that means that he is probably dead already and has become patient zero for a zombie type outbreak.

  4. Joe from Long Island March 3rd, 2012 at 9:02 pm

    GB- that’s great news for Davis, if it pans out that way. I know conor Jackson lost a season because of it.

    See, the great southwest isn’t all it’s cracked up to be. There’s no place like NY ;)

  5. Pat M. March 3rd, 2012 at 9:03 pm

    Good way to start off Early March Madness with NC Tars smacking Duke around at Cameron….Now let’s go Long Beach State……Cal tomorrow !!!! Phelps looked real good today, I’m going to rewatch his outing a little later for added review….

  6. Tar March 3rd, 2012 at 9:04 pm

    :D

    Coach K is a great coach and good man. His players are intelligent, hard working and well spoken all around good kids (for the most part, JJ excluded).

    But, I like nothing better than to see Carolina rip the heart out of the student body and fan base.

    HAHAHAHAHAHA

    Tar Heels!!!! :D

    Back to Yankee baseball talk.

  7. Joe from Long Island March 3rd, 2012 at 9:05 pm

    ‘face- I remember Jerry Manuel’s remark that so-and-so had been diagnosed with a spraIned ankle, so surgery would likely be next Thursday….

  8. Pat M. March 3rd, 2012 at 9:11 pm

    Tar…..I made a bank on your Heels today as they were getting 1 stroke……Heels are a Final Four team, Duke might not get to the Sweet 16……They’re all about 3 pointers and the perimeter

  9. Bo knows March 3rd, 2012 at 9:12 pm

    GB7

    Thanks for the reply re Almonte. I know it was one at bat but it was woah. Caught my attention fo sure.

    Then again, I was on the Vechionacci bandwagon after everyone else had left. I think I was the one sweeping up.

  10. blake March 3rd, 2012 at 9:13 pm

    Revenge is so sweet!

  11. Tar March 3rd, 2012 at 9:15 pm

    Pat

    I saw that play you made, smart move. It was obvious (even last game ) who is the better team.

    I will say I do not like when the Heels take the foot off the gas. They are not a great half court team. They need to keep the pressure on longer, but other than that WOW. :D

  12. Stoneburner March 3rd, 2012 at 9:16 pm

    Yankeesource ? @YankeeSource Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
    @oswegos1 Key to Hughes is keeping the FB velocity up and commanding it well along with a put out pitch. If he can’t get that he’s a goner.
    In reply to Steve Skinner

    2m Yankeesource ? @YankeeSource Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
    @oswegos1 Hughes throwing much better with more life on the fastball in camp. We need to see what adjustments he made in-game though.
    In reply to Steve Skinner

    5m Yankeesource ? @YankeeSource Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
    @Hopjake Would be a great add to the system. DePaula has terrific stuff.
    In reply to Jacob Hopkins

    6m Yankeesource ? @YankeeSource Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
    @dshankpolitico Me neither, he’s the type of arm that would pitch well in any condition.
    In reply to darrin shank

    7m Yankeesource ? @YankeeSource Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
    @Hopjake The last time I spoke with DR scouts, they said that DePaula may indeed get his visa at some point this year. Still not concrete.
    In reply to Jacob Hopkins

    14m Yankeesource ? @YankeeSource Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
    @dshankpolitico Kuroda is a legit arm, he doesn’t throw 87 MPH. Can get it up to 94-95 on occasion with command, poise. A true pitcher.

  13. Tar March 3rd, 2012 at 9:16 pm

    Blake

    If I was a little younger I would be on my way to Franklin st. :D

  14. blake March 3rd, 2012 at 9:17 pm

    If the Heels make shots they are tough…..losing Strickland hurt….hopefully they can play 6 good games in a row in a couple weeks.

  15. blake March 3rd, 2012 at 9:18 pm

    Tar,

    Come.on man….all.ages are welcome…..im a little far away or id be headed down there

  16. Tar March 3rd, 2012 at 9:20 pm

    “losing Strickland hurt”

    Yeah Mcdonald too. PJ has been in a season long slump. But he had a big time dunk tonight though.

  17. Tar March 3rd, 2012 at 9:21 pm

    “.im a little far away or id be headed down there”

    Haha probably a little more than a mile. :D

  18. blake March 3rd, 2012 at 9:22 pm

    Hopefully Hairston will get hot at the right time….he can shoot.

  19. Yankee Trader March 3rd, 2012 at 9:22 pm

    Was away for awhile, but thanks GB on your update for the current OF’ers vying for a job at AAA.

    Luis- I’m not advocating that the Yankees should resign Swisher to a long term deal, just that if he produces like 2010, his numbers will be hard to replace. Maybe they’ll find another temporary fix, a player that will be a FA after the 2013 season.

  20. Tar March 3rd, 2012 at 9:24 pm

    “he can shoot.”

    He really can and he’s so overdue. I feel the shot like the shorts are going to start falling like crazy for him. Hopefully just in time for when it really counts. What a big time warm-up tonight was for the big dance.

  21. GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 9:29 pm

    Joe from Long Island March 3rd, 2012 at 9:02 pm
    GB- that’s great news for Davis, if it pans out that way. I know conor Jackson lost a season because of it.

    See, the great southwest isn’t all it’s cracked up to be. There’s no place like NY

    ————————————————————————————————————————-

    Joe, I was concerned about my living in the southeast until the desart that I live by was full of water. That is a huge break for Davis, though. Just hope the diagnosis was correct. I was a little shocked that he’s been cleared to play, though. He trained a lot in the Mojave and we always had a few cases and it really knocked those guys for a loop. Was surprised to learn that the only women that seem to get it are pregnant women and men.

  22. GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 9:37 pm

    Bo knows March 3rd, 2012 at 9:12 pm
    GB7

    Thanks for the reply re Almonte. I know it was one at bat but it was woah. Caught my attention fo sure.

    Then again, I was on the Vechionacci bandwagon after everyone else had left. I think I was the one sweeping up.

    ————————————————————————————————————————-

    How did Vechinacci do in Japan last season? After about 6 years, he was just learning to hit. Wonder if moving over to 1st base got his mind off of his fielding?

  23. GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 9:40 pm

    Any time, Trader. There could always be a position switch or a shocker from the lower levels. Don’t forget that Laird also plays the outfield corners.

  24. GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 9:45 pm

    Wasn’t aware that Dontrell Willis was related to th Michelin Man. He looks like he has an extra body in those pants.

  25. luis March 3rd, 2012 at 9:45 pm

    Yankee trader,

    Sorry, you are right, his production is going to be very hard to replace….But i liked what i saw from Dickerson and Almonte today, they hold the fort until somthing better comes along…I think that the cap is circunstantial ( to many bad longterm contracts ), but the team is going to be allright in the long run….This team investing in young players, with their financial might is going to be dangerous even with this new CBA.

  26. luis March 3rd, 2012 at 9:47 pm

    They might hold the fort until something better comes along….

  27. GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 9:48 pm

    Almonte isn’t close to being ready for NY and Dickerson’s best position is #4 outfielder.

  28. GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 9:53 pm

    I wonder why when Philadelphia announcers always talk about the great Phillie players, they never mention Jim Bunning, Chuck Klein, Chris Short, Dick Allen or Greg Luzinski?

  29. luis March 3rd, 2012 at 9:54 pm

    GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 9:48 pm
    Almonte isn’t close to being ready for NY and Dickerson’s best position is #4 outfielder.

    ===========================

    As i was saying earlier, i don’t see the Yankees keeping both Granderson and Swisher…..Do you think they can keep both?, or Do you think they might have to get one through a trade?. or Do you there is someone who can fill the need from within by 2013? I would realyy like to hear what you think

  30. GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 9:56 pm

    They can keep both, but, keeping Martin too may be tough, Just don’t see cheaper, younger and better alternatives available.

  31. luis March 3rd, 2012 at 10:00 pm

    GB7,

    Makes sense, i was thinking under the assumption that they were keeping Martin, because of Romine’s health….For the record i am against extending martin i rather give Romine the chance, but this back problem is concerning

  32. GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 10:02 pm

    If Selig had any sense, they’d do a bit of AL realignment. Moving Toronto to the AL Central to give Detroit a rivalry and some competition and moving Cleveland to the East.

  33. GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 10:04 pm

    NYYs haven’t had a rookie starting catcher since 1970. Before that, it was Bill Dickey. Don’t see that changing.

  34. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:11 pm

    Hey all! Just got back from seeing Safe House with Denzel Washington. It was actually pretty good.

    I guess people checking in on ST is a visual interest thing. It can’t be anything more because we all know that ST is always a work in progress and today’s “hero” could be tomorrow’s “goat” and vice versa. We also know that the beginning of ST is pretty meaningless in terms of what you see happening since players are woodshedding more than anything else.

    About Girardi saying the rotation isn’t set. So BFD even if he believes it is. Nothing like throwing cold water in the faces of players down there trying to make the team and show what they’ve got. You think maybe he should have said “We’ve already decided who the starting pitchers will be but feel free to waste your time out there since nothing you do is going to change our minds.”

    Good for Girardi. He has more managing cachet in his little finger than this entire forum has put together ten times!

    I think I’ll start a bandwagon for fans who want to enjoy the hell out of ST and not find any need to be critical about anything. Anyone who wants to hop on is free to hop on.

    Think outside the box people. Drop the microscope and look through the big-picture lens. I guarantee you you’ll be right 10 times out of 10 if you can do it that way.

    GO YANKS!!!

    :)

  35. luis March 3rd, 2012 at 10:14 pm

    GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 10:02 pm
    If Selig had any sense, they’d do a bit of AL realignment. Moving Toronto to the AL Central to give Detroit a rivalry and some competition and moving Cleveland to the East.

    ===================

    They could also have allow the current contracts not count in to the cap, since they were signed before the new CBA

    GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 10:04 pm

    NYYs haven’t had a rookie starting catcher since 1970. Before that, it was Bill Dickey. Don’t see that changing.

    ==============

    What about Berra or Elston Howard or Posada? Or you mean that they were eased in to the position, not given that position from start?

  36. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:14 pm

    Great television day tomorrow! For those of us with DVRs, we are the lucky ones – unless you want to watch the Yanks tomorrow night, which you can also do.

    Yanks v. Phils tomorrow at 1.

    Knicks v. Lakers tomorrow at 1.

    :)

  37. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:15 pm

    I meant to say Knicks v. Celtsux tomorrow at 1.

  38. luis March 3rd, 2012 at 10:17 pm

    Hi Trish!!

    Glad that you are back! Your perspicacity meter most be full! :D

  39. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:27 pm

    luis – always! :lol:

    I’m sure there are some who would agree my perspicacity meter is full – full of it, that is!

  40. GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 10:30 pm

    Berra’s and Howard’s rookie seasons were mostly as left fielders. Posada backed up Girardi for his first 4 years or so.t

  41. luis March 3rd, 2012 at 10:35 pm

    trisha – true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:27 pm
    luis – always!

    I’m sure there are some who would agree my perspicacity meter is full – full of it, that is!

    ======================

    LMAO! You know, down here we have a saying that goes along this lines….”Nobody is a gold coin to be liked by everybody” . But in my book, you are as close to a gold coin as anybody can be. We may disagree sometimes, but you are class act.

  42. luis March 3rd, 2012 at 10:36 pm

    GreenBeret7 March 3rd, 2012 at 10:30 pm
    Berra’s and Howard’s rookie seasons were mostly as left fielders. Posada backed up Girardi for his first 4 years or so.t

    =================

    Yup, that what i thought you meant.

  43. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:37 pm

    I definitely want to catch Pineda’s first outing so I think I’ll watch the Yanks for that part of the outing and then maybe switch over to the Knicks for a while. The beginning of ST is nothing to obsess over but rather something to just observe and enjoy. I’m excited about Pineda so will be interested in watching him. And if he gives up 25 home runs I won’t have any trepidation whatsoever. Again, we all know that ST is nothing to vomit over, especially the first games of ST. Still I want to watch his outing. I have high hopes for (and great belief in) Pineda.

    Yahoo!

  44. rm March 3rd, 2012 at 10:37 pm

    Trisha,

    I just checked the link to the Yankee Wins predictions you’ve got me down for 98 Wins but I actually picked 108 Yankee wins.

    Rick (rm)

  45. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:40 pm

    luis, I really appreciate you saying that. No matter how I may come across at times, I do know that my heart is pure and my intentions good.

    :)

  46. luis March 3rd, 2012 at 10:40 pm

    rm March 3rd, 2012 at 10:37 pm
    Trisha,

    I just checked the link to the Yankee Wins predictions you’ve got me down for 98 Wins but I actually picked 108 Yankee wins.

    Rick (rm)

    ==========================

    Man! those are lofty expectations!…But nothing like the poster that predicts 162 wins!! he or she is bound for a big dissapointment, =D

  47. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:41 pm

    rm – thank you for checking up on me! Damned if I can ever go through a season getting everyone’s picks right! Grr! That’s why I continually post the charts – along with letting others know they are out there.

    Will make the change right now.

    :)

  48. RhapsodyInBlue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:44 pm

    The Heels looked great, nothing better than a win in Cameron.

  49. luis March 3rd, 2012 at 10:45 pm

    Well guys i hope you all have a good night, got an early start tomorrow

  50. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:45 pm

    rm – it really annoys me that I got that one wrong because I was so impressed when I saw it! I think having both charts open at the same time and putting in Sux predictions probably messes me up. After all, they are a come down!

    :)

    2012 YANKEE PREDICTION CHART

  51. RhapsodyInBlue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:46 pm

    Knicks are at Boston tomorrow.

  52. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:46 pm

    Have a great night luis! Talk to you tomorrow I hope.

    :)

  53. Jerkface March 3rd, 2012 at 10:49 pm

    Man just rechecking the spring schedule, I could have sworn when it was first posted sunday was Garcia/Pineda. Now its just Garcia, boo. Now Hughes is doubling up with CC. Wonder what that means for a rotation spot for Hughes. Everyone gets their own day but him for now.

  54. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:50 pm

    Well I still want to see Hughes so I’ll watch that part of it. I thought someone said Pineda was going tomorrow. I hope we have television when he does go.

  55. Yankee Trader March 3rd, 2012 at 10:55 pm

    I think Pineda is going Monday back at Clearwater vs Blanton.

    Trisha- – Do you enter my win prediction-103- or can I do it myself?

  56. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:56 pm

    Trader – I have to enter it. I also need you to give me a Sux prediction. We’re using that chart as a possible tie breaker.

    I’ll post it for you to see.

    2012 SUXIAN FUTILITY CHART

  57. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 10:59 pm

    It appears that MLB TV is going to broadcast Monday’s game too!

  58. Yankee Trader March 3rd, 2012 at 11:06 pm

    I just checked my MLB TV guide for Monday. It’s on live at 1 PM and for any lonely Met fans they are on at 6PM vs the Nats.

    Sux and the sinking Titanic vs the curse of the Andino with help from the new oft injured Carl Crawford somehow pull out 92 wins out of their……………

    That’s my story Trish and I’m sticking to it———————-for now

  59. m March 3rd, 2012 at 11:11 pm

    JF,

    We’ve known since the sked came out that Hughes was doubling up with CC. They said “don’t read too much into it”. They set it up this way because there’s a DH coming up. Hughes will start one if those games.

  60. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 11:12 pm

    Trader – :)

    I’ll put you down for 92. You have ’til opening day to make any changes (hopefully in a downward direction!)

  61. Yankee Trader March 3rd, 2012 at 11:12 pm

    Further predictions for playoffs:

    Wild card-Rays and Rangers=play at Arlington Rays win.
    Yankees go to Tampa-win series
    Tigers play at home vs Angels-lose series
    Yankees at home vs Angels—win and off to the WS!!!

  62. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 11:15 pm

    Love your predictions.

  63. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 3rd, 2012 at 11:18 pm

    Check you out on the morrow!

    :)

  64. rm March 3rd, 2012 at 11:20 pm

    Luis,
    Yes I am being extremely optimistic with my prediction. But right now as long as they stay relatively healthy and Jeter, A-Rod and Tex don’t continue to decline I think the Yankees will have the best offense and the best pitching in baseball.
    The Red Sox on the other hand have 2 big holes in their starting pitching rotation that has caused them to that to try to move their set up man and best middle reliever into the starting rotation thus hurting both their starting and relief pitching. They also have no RF or SS.
    The Yankee don’t have anything resembling this type of problem. If they can stay healthy they can win a lot of games.

    rm

  65. Jerkface March 3rd, 2012 at 11:30 pm

    m,

    good to know, must havebeen my dyslexia confusing the double up as garcia pineda. I hope soe good prospects or relievers follow sweaty freddy

  66. Yankee Trader March 3rd, 2012 at 11:32 pm

    Goodnight all.

  67. stuckey March 3rd, 2012 at 11:33 pm

    Hey Jerkface, got a minute?

  68. Jerkface March 3rd, 2012 at 11:35 pm

    For you stuckey I have hours and hours.

  69. m March 3rd, 2012 at 11:40 pm

    and days and days…

    :P

  70. stuckey March 3rd, 2012 at 11:51 pm

    Good, probably best to do this while it impacts others the least.

    I was reminded of something after our conversation the other day about whether or not Tampa and Kansas City could compete with the Yankees in (relative) payroll expenditure, and I understood your position that to be yes, they could, they choose not to.

    During that conversation I also got the impression you are saying the Yankees value as a franchise was due mostly by being a model run franchise and not due to a regional advantage.

    So what did that get me thinking about?

    The NY Knicks and this:

    http://www.forbes.com/nba-valuations/list/

    Now the NY Knicks are a well-known franchise, but hardly one of the game’s elite in terms of performance or stature in the game. Up until summer 2010, they’re were arguably the worst run franchise in sports for more than a decade (since the ill-conceived Ewing trade).

    Yet for only a new mega-billion dollar media deal which caused the Lakers to jump in front of them, they are one of the game’s best revenue-generating (in fact, the top revenue-generating by far) franchises.

    This team is valued (by Forbes) as being worth 62% more than the Boston Celtics, generating nearly twice the revenue.

    There are model franchises who have been successful in terms of winning, sell out their arena and spend far above the NBA soft cap to put out a competitive product (the Spurs for example.)

    Heck, even the Heat’s value didn’t increase year-to-year as much as the Knicks, despite creating the Big 3.

    So my question to you would be this (and it’s a genuine one). Assuming Forbes is in the ballpark, is there any way to look at those numbers and conclude anything else but THE single most valuable thing in the entire NBA (much less the Knicks) is the Knicks’ zipcode?

  71. Pat M. March 3rd, 2012 at 11:58 pm

    Stuckey…..I don’t think The Knicks have been valued more than The Lakers since the Ewing / Pat Riely days after the Lakers Sowtime era…….And Dolan owns The Garden as well , Lakers lease their time at Staples……

  72. smurfy March 3rd, 2012 at 11:59 pm

    Another great article, Chad. Pretty color, and another good thinking and articulate interviewee. Simple, clean approach: throw a variety of strikes.

    ManBan looked a bit too articulate in his set up, the foot and hip pivot: thinking he should simplify, and devote his motion to follow through.

  73. stuckey March 4th, 2012 at 12:04 am

    Pat M.

    “The New York Knicks replace the Los Angeles Lakers as the NBA’s most valuable team, worth $655 million, up 12% from last year. Signing Amar’e Stoudemire has been a big help both on the court and with sponsors. ”

    And good point about the arena differential, and the KNicks indeed do enjoy the vast advantage in operating income, reflecting those factors. But the KNicks still produced the most revenue in the the NBA (bat far) in 2011, essentially one year removed from being the league’s laughing stock for a decade.

  74. Jerkface March 4th, 2012 at 12:09 am

    I do not know where they generate revenue. Maybe they have bargained a pretty good TV deal. Do the knicks sell out a lot? Do they charge higher prices? Do people buy more knicks stuff because they are a new york team? I don’t know, I do not follow basketball much at all. Location matters, I can’t argue that, but I think in the context of wanting to bring the yankees down to a ‘fair level’ to satisfy your spirit of competition I just disagree. Getting there first should count for something, and being unable to work your environs should count as well.

  75. Pat M. March 4th, 2012 at 12:11 am

    And to think how expensive it is to go see The Lakers I can only imagine what a ducket cost to go see The Knicks now….I remember it costing about 30.00 to see the Knicks / Lakers in the 72 NBA Championship at The Garden and they were good seats in the lower bowl area…..

  76. Jerkface March 4th, 2012 at 12:26 am

    The knicks are one of the original franchises as well, maybe historical appeal helps them out. :)

  77. stuckey March 4th, 2012 at 12:26 am

    “I can’t argue that, but I think in the context of wanting to bring the yankees down to a ‘fair level’ to satisfy your spirit of competition I just disagree. ”

    I don’t believe I’m asking you to.

    I’m addressing a specific point that cropped up during the discussion – the notion that other smaller markets HAD the revenue generation and/or borrowing power to meet the standards the Yankees have set. I understood you to argue they could and any market that didn’t did so by choice were “cheap”.

    The NBA figures suggest a clear regional advantage in terms of revenue generation and franchise value, independent of the ability to sell out your home arena (Tampa’s home part came up) or on-field-court success.

    I’m asking simply this, do you still maintain that pragmatically, the Tampa Rays not competing with the Yankees in payroll is a practical (I’ll grant literal) choice? And they they have or could generate competitive revenue with the Yankees in the optimal circumstances?

  78. stuckey March 4th, 2012 at 12:34 am

    “The knicks are one of the original franchises as well, maybe historical appeal helps them out. :)

    Almost certainly.

    I was interested on your take of the numbers and now I’ll give you my answer.

    THE most value thing in the NBA and about the NY Knicks is indeed the “NY”. And nothing else is even close.

    Since you’re not to familiar with the NBA, let me tell you (and please don’t take my word for it) the fact that the KNicks not only beat, but blow away, the Celtics, the Spurs, the Heat, etc…and are toe-to-toe with the Lakers in terms of of revenue and value is AMAZING contextually.

    There overall history isn’t terribly impressive and they were almost without question the worst run organization in ALL sports for the last decade.

    Their value is nearly pure mailing address.

  79. Jerkface March 4th, 2012 at 10:16 am

    I’m asking simply this, do you still maintain that pragmatically, the Tampa Rays not competing with the Yankees in payroll is a practical (I’ll grant literal) choice? And they they have or could generate competitive revenue with the Yankees in the optimal circumstances?

    I still think the Rays and Royals et al can spend more money. And if they can’t, they should not be in the league. I expect them to have to take losses to generate more revenue. There should be an expectation of putting in everything you’ve got in sports, and if you don’t want to do it then don’t complain when another owner did.

    The rays most certainly could make more money if they were not stuck in one of the worst stadium situations in the league. Its a pain in the butt to get too the stadium, and do you even WANT to get there?

    I think a lot of merchandise revenue is shared among all the teams, but official team stores & stadium stores get to keep it. The Yankees near sell out, or atleast sell out to ticket brokers, most of their games. They make a lesser amount than they could on a media deal because the steinbros have a huge ownership stake in YES, so they gave YES favorable terms when starting up the network. LAA & Texas just got huge media deals that doubled their income from media.

    If the Rays cannot get people to come to their dumpy stadium, or watch them on TV, that is really their fault. Up until a year ago, they played on a TV channel that didnt even get carried in central florida.

    The Yankees do get benefit from being in New York, but they should. I’d be fine if MLB wanted to add more teams back to New York. They could also do away with those silly media territories that leave some states blacked out from 6 teams with no channels to watch them on.


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