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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Saturday morning notes: “Andy’s just a good guy”

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Notes on Mar 17, 2012 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Derek Jeter has a sore left calf, but it still took more than five minutes for any one of more than a dozen reporters to actually ask about it this morning. We all had Andy Pettitte on our minds.

“He retired mainly because he wanted to spend time with his family,” Jeter said before starting to crack a smile. “But maybe Momma got a little tired of him a little bit, told him to come back out here and pitch.”

Jeter said Pettitte never talked about coming back last season. It wasn’t until this winter that the topic started popping up in their conversations.

“Sometimes when people make decisions like that, you’re there to listen,” Jeter siad. “You give them your thoughts about it, but I would never try to steer someone in one direction or the other. You give him your opinion, you want what’s best for him, but I would never try to pressure him one way or the other.”

Happy to have him back?

“Andy’s done a lot for the organization,” Jeter said. “All the guys love him. He’ll add to our team, on the field, off the field. … Andy’s just a good guy. He’s a good person. I haven’t heard too many people say bad things about Andy Pettitte.”

• Just like yesterday, there was no lineup posted when the clubhouse opened this morning. Probably waiting to see how Eduardo Nunez and Nick Swisher feel.

• When someone finally got around to asking Jeter about his calf, the answer was exactly what you might expect from the Captain. “Thanks for asking after all this time,” Jeter said, giving us all a hard time. “I’m doing good.”

• Similar positive news from Nick Swisher who said his MRI came back clean. “Nothing,” he said. “Just as we expected.”

• Swisher, by the way, couldn’t believe Pettitte didn’t give him a heads up about the comeback. “I played golf with him like two or three weeks ago,” Swisher said. “We were kind of talking and I was like, ‘Man, you look like you’re in great shape. He was like, ‘Yeah, I’ve been working out a little bit.’ Now I know exactly what he was doing.”

• Nunez had a set of those electronic muscle stimulators attached to his hand and wrist today, clearly giving some more treatment to the bruised area. He’s supposed to take batting practice today, and right now he’s scheduled to make the road trip tomorrow, which suggests the Yankees expect him to play this weekend.

• Didn’t see Russell Martin until just as everyone was walking out of the clubhouse, so I have no injury update on him. However, he’s listed as making the trip tomorrow. Seems to be a positive sign that his groin/hamstring issue is better.

• Ramiro Pena was not walking with any sort of limp when he came into the clubhouse this morning. He said his sprained right ankle is feeling better. I wouldn’t expect him to play in the next two days, though.

• The clubhouse was a much more empty place this morning. One entire row of four lockers was cleared out — Stoneburner, Pope, Marshall and Burawa — and another group of eight lockers was down to just three active players. A 14-player cut makes the room feel significantly different.

• Pat Venditte, Mitch Abieta, Walter Ibarra and Abe Almonte are up from the minor league complex to serve as extra players today. Obviously I’m hoping Venditte gets in the game.

• One last locker room observation: Hiroki Kuroda has Pettitte’s old locker, and word is that Pettitte is going to be assigned a new one, probably near the front corner where Bernie Williams used to be.

Associated Press photos 

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260 Responses to “Saturday morning notes: “Andy’s just a good guy””

  1. Stoneburner March 17th, 2012 at 9:27 am

    Interesting – interesting – interesting – Mark Montgomery pitching w/ Trenton in minor league camp. . . .could be quick riser this year possibly.

    Yankeesource ? @YankeeSource Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
    David Phelps has impressed me, and his velocity has looked better as well. Big fan of Phelps so hopefully he has a solid year.

  2. J. Alfred Prufrock March 17th, 2012 at 9:30 am

    Villa Nova-Ya March 17th, 2012 at 8:53 am
    Wow.

    Talking about Montero and Posada as equals is really premature.
    ///

    The Posada comparison with Montero was strictly one of valuing (or not) a high OPS, somewhat less than optimal defensive catcher.

    The point was, Yankee fans who took the trade in stride seem to be the same fans who shrug off the loss of Posada and with that, a sense of what his bat during his catching years (and his genuine switch hitting, as opposed to a token switch hitter who is essentially a platoon type) contributed to the potency of the Yankee lineup.

    That is the extent of the comparison I made – and I assume you’re referring to my post on this, because no one else, to my knowledge, made the comparison last night.

    As for their having continued to put him into the lineup, that’s not entirely accurate. He was being periodically benched and that wasn’t helping his rhythm, weirdly, after he’d get hot (Girardi has a habit of doing this with part-time, and even, at times, FT players). They knew he’d never DH’d before, and they even acknowledged that the transition might be difficult. And that “any other player” would have been benched doesn’t mean they indulged him, it means that he has a history that would justify not folding so fast on him, and they were paying him $13 MM.

    And to the main point of my last night’s post, obviously, I disagree that they showed him proper respect, and I have not cared for the Yankee brass’s general treatment, and moreso, their public rhetoric, towards their older players since Bernie Williams.

  3. MTU March 17th, 2012 at 9:36 am

    Yankees might soon have another storefront open for buisness.

    “Surplus City”.

    We sell excess pitching.

    C’mon down y’all.

    We take trades.

    ;)

  4. yankeefeminista March 17th, 2012 at 9:36 am

    Maine, maybe they are in regardless. Agree about Walsh. Heading to appt. Later.

  5. Tar March 17th, 2012 at 9:36 am

    “And talk about disrespect which I think is over-talked here, when Posada was a free agent, who doesn’t think he would have jumped to the Mets for that extra year? ”

    Villa

    I’m not trying to pick on your post ( It has me thinking.. dangerous I know :D )

    But if you feel that was disrespectful from Posada’s vantage point, how would you characterize the Yankee negotiations with Jeter?

  6. MTU March 17th, 2012 at 9:43 am

    Gotta’ walk the Mops before the big storm hits.

    BIAW.

  7. Villa Nova-Ya March 17th, 2012 at 9:47 am

    J Alfred -

    I just think it’s a slippery slope to lump people together as having taken one stance or another, or that the origins of their opinions is simplistic.

    But that said, I went back and re-read what I thought I read, and I stand corrected and should not have made that statement.

    I don’t always like the way things transpire. But it’s a two-way street. It’s not all big-bad management. There is another side to these things. And I’m not comfortable with the respect/disrespect stuff. The end of a player’s career is gut-wrenching; the end of a favored player’s career is even more difficult for everyone involved. I think Cashman has taken the “tear off the bandaid” approach which is jarring, but in the end, you get the same result, I guess.

    As fans, we all want to see our stars go out gracefully and/or powerfully; we don’t want the switch suddenly turned off. For management, people who run a business, one can understand that there are other considerations.

    Is it easier to deal with a Bernie Williams getting offered a minor league contract or to see him try to take the field as a shadow of his former self or wasting away on the bench? I don’t know. When you have a yearly mandate to win it all, it seems like you can’t indulge the sentimental. Maybe there is a middle ground that would make everyone happy – I’m not sure in this case there is. I know you dislike Cashman intensely, and I admit to saying “What?” more than a few times, but he has an unenviable job.

  8. Villa Nova-Ya March 17th, 2012 at 9:51 am

    Tar -

    I was taken aback by the negotiations with Jeter. I thought they were harder-line than they needed to be.

    I was silly. I thought they had a piggy bank marked “Jeter” because they knew the contract was ending. I thought they’d figure something out where they’d be creative with money not counting toward the luxury tax. I put Jeter in a different category than any other player, except Mariano, and thought the Yankees would the same.

  9. Villa Nova-Ya March 17th, 2012 at 9:52 am

    But I want to add, Tar, that Jeter’s agent was very aggressive to begin the negotiations and perhaps set an unexpected tone. Still, it all played out way too publicly for my taste.

  10. MaineYankee March 17th, 2012 at 9:55 am

    JAP

    The point was, Yankee fans who took the trade in stride seem to be the same fans who shrug off the loss of Posada and with that, a sense of what his bat during his catching years (and his genuine switch hitting, as opposed to a token switch hitter who is essentially a platoon type) contributed to the potency of the Yankee lineup.

    ————————————————————————————

    Don’t you think that’s being a bit presumptuos.

    I highly respected what Posada meant to this team and was sad to see him retire even though to me it seemed the right thing.

    I’m not as invested in Montero so I take a different view.

  11. dogface March 17th, 2012 at 9:56 am

    I put Jeter in a different category than any other player, except Mariano, and thought the Yankees would the same

    ===================================

    I think a lot of fans felt that way, but in truth, we should be glad Cashman did not. As you suggest, the way that negotiation was played out so publicly was disappointing, but I think the Yankees approach was exactly as it should have been.

  12. jacksquat March 17th, 2012 at 9:57 am

    Carlo March 17th, 2012 at 8:26 am
    Neither hughes nor nova is likely to be traded because 2014 is right around the corner and they aren’t dumping young cost controlled starters for offense ahead of that.

    Hughes is a free agent after 2013. A lot of people don’t seem to realize that Hughes is only cost controlled for this year and next.

  13. Yazman March 17th, 2012 at 9:58 am

    Did anyone call “no trade backs” during the Pineida/Montero trade? If not…

  14. RadioKev March 17th, 2012 at 10:01 am

    Ys Guy March 17th, 2012 at 8:47 am
    i dont question arod’s greatness. but i did a mock draft last night and drafted him at #78, so the answer to your question of who’s better now is too numerous to mention.
    ————

    Well, what I said was, who’s been better on the Yankees, and in baseball, over the period of time that A-Rod’s been on the Yankees? This year’s fantasy draft doesn’t reflect on the time span. Obviously A-Rod isn’t likely to be the AL MVP this season, or the greatest player in baseball.

    My point is, you’ve got one or two guys max you could list ahead of A-Rod. None of them on the Yankees. Albert Pujols has been better – who else? Maybe Miggy’s been as good, but A-Rod has had a few better years than he did.

    So if A-Rod’s been one of the best players in baseball for years, while on the Yankees, how is he not a Yankee great? I don’t think anyone is out there saying he’s a Texas Ranger great, the only other time span that’s matched his Yankee production.

  15. Tar March 17th, 2012 at 10:01 am

    Thanks Villa we feel mostly the same way.

    I guess it just disturbs me when the Yankees start acting like the Red Sox when it comes to veteran beloved players. I won’t say Cashman totally crossed the line, but he definitely had one foot over.

    Yard work beckons me, and it’s a beautiful day here in Carolina. Have a nice day everyone.

  16. Villa Nova-Ya March 17th, 2012 at 10:01 am

    dogface -

    Cashman can’t be a fan. In the big picture, I appreciate this.

  17. MaineYankee March 17th, 2012 at 10:06 am

    Villa Nova-Ya

    You and I have the same sentiment at times.

    You just have a better way of expressing it. :D:

  18. Stoneburner March 17th, 2012 at 10:08 am

    Best Power Prospects
    1. Bryce Harper, of, Nationals
    2. Miguel Sano, 3b, Twins
    3. Jesus Montero, c/1b, Mariners
    4. Yoenis Cespedes, of, Athletics
    5. Gary Sanchez, c, Yankees
    Youngsters to watch: Jorge Alfaro (Rangers), Josh Bell (Pirates), Guillermo Pimentel (Mariners).

    From BA.

  19. Stoneburner March 17th, 2012 at 10:10 am

    est Speed Prospects
    1. Billy Hamilton, ss, Reds
    2. Mike Trout, of, Angels
    3. Gary Brown, of, Giants
    4. Roman Quinn, ss, Phillies
    5. Terrance Gore, of, Royals
    Youngsters to watch: Glynn Davis (Orioles), Bradley Marquez (Mets), Mason Williams (Yankees).

    From BA.

  20. Stoneburner March 17th, 2012 at 10:11 am

    By my count, I see 11 prospects who grade as No. 1 starters, with the Diamondbacks (Trevor Bauer, Tyler Skaggs), Mariners (Taijuan Walker, Danny Hultzen) and Pirates (Gerrit Cole, Jameson Taillon) having two each. Arizona has a potential third in Archie Bradley, if he can repeat and command his overpowering fastball and curveball.

    The other No. 1 starter prospects are Matt Moore (Rays), Yu Darvish (Rangers), Julio Teheran (Braves), Dylan Bundy (Orioles) and Shelby Miller (Cardinals). My next tier of pitching prospects includes Carlos Martinez (Cardinals), Perez, Drew Pomeranz (Rockies), Jacob Turner (Tigers) and Jarrod Parker (Athletics).

    From BA. Possibly why the Pineda/Campos deal was made. . . . .

  21. Villa Nova-Ya March 17th, 2012 at 10:11 am

    Maine Yankee -

    Thanks.

    (Mostly, I feel like a lot of my opinions are complicated – convoluted and only make sense to me. )

  22. Villa Nova-Ya March 17th, 2012 at 10:22 am

    And I should add some of my opinions are contradictory even to myself.

  23. MaineYankee March 17th, 2012 at 10:30 am

    Villa Nova-Ya

    (Mostly, I feel like a lot of my opinions are complicated – convoluted

    —————————————————————————-

    At times this place has that effect.

  24. J. Alfred Prufrock March 17th, 2012 at 10:31 am

    Villa Nova-Ya March 17th, 2012 at 9:47 am
    J Alfred -

    “I just think it’s a slippery slope to lump people together as having taken one stance or another, or that the origins of their opinions is simplistic.”
    ////

    I THINK THAT there is a strong lack of awareness in here by some on what Posada’s actual contribution was that made it legitimate to call him great. I think this because only a handful of people (the same ones) even respond with any sort of acknowledgement regarding not just his “offense”, but the specific way his presence empowered the Yankee lineup and helped make it a virtual nightmare to pitch to. It’s not just having great hitters up and down who always come through: it’s the grinding down of very good starters, forcing early exits by them for other-handed pitchers, to try to defuse a same-side hitter, etc. It’s giving a manager the headache of trying to figure out when to waste that bullet early, and then lose his good starter, or let a guy who’s building a high pitch count and is facing possibly causing a game to get out of control, etc.

    THIS is what some here do not fully grasp about Posada’s sudden absence from the lineup, and why I think the attitude about the lineup is cavalier to a fault. I sometimes envy fans who don’t understand this significance; they can be blissfully optimistic, dismissing the difference between a HOF-type catcher with Russell Martin, or age, or severely declined numbers against hard throwing RHP….

    Of course, there are some who believe we “needed” another pitcher, a “No. 2″, more than we needed to continue to be potent behind the plate. I acknowledge that for some, this was more of a priority (but again, the argument is that there was enough pitching, and that the “Posada-like advantage” wasn’t what should have been sacrificed for what the Yankees already appear to have).

    “But that said, I went back and re-read what I thought I read, and I stand corrected and should not have made that statement.”

    ///
    That’s fine, I just wanted to clarify the intent behind the comparison I originally made. There’s an awful lot of ill will here, in terms of deliberately misinterpreting a post, and there is also an innocent misreading, and sometimes the original post just lacks the clarity to make the stance clear.

    “I don’t always like the way things transpire. But it’s a two-way street. It’s not all big-bad management. There is another side to these things. And I’m not comfortable with the respect/disrespect stuff. The end of a player’s career is gut-wrenching; the end of a favored player’s career is even more difficult for everyone involved. I think Cashman has taken the “tear off the bandaid” approach which is jarring, but in the end, you get the same result, I guess.”
    ////

    Nope, it’s not always “big bad management”, my point was not that Posada should have caught regularly, or even at all if that was their drift on things; it was the manner in which they tried to handle him that was objectionable, and from my viewpoint, disrespectful. They treat him right – I have no beef with them.

    “As fans, we all want to see our stars go out gracefully and/or powerfully; we don’t want the switch suddenly turned off. For management, people who run a business, one can understand that there are other considerations.”
    ////

    YEP, but there was a decided lack of grace, IMO.

    “Is it easier to deal with a Bernie Williams getting offered a minor league contract or to see him try to take the field as a shadow of his former self or wasting away on the bench? ”
    ////

    Again, it’s their method. I will say, though, that Bernie hit .280 in his final year. Should he have been roaming CF? No, those days were behind him. He could have been a useful bench player; again, those switch-hitting players with some pop are very useful ones.

  25. RadioKev March 17th, 2012 at 10:34 am

    The point was, Yankee fans who took the trade in stride seem to be the same fans who shrug off the loss of Posada and with that, a sense of what his bat during his catching years (and his genuine switch hitting, as opposed to a token switch hitter who is essentially a platoon type) contributed to the potency of the Yankee lineup.
    ————

    JAP, I took the trade in stride, and I shrug off the loss of Posada on a winning basis. I respect Posada, I was happy to see him go out on somewhat of a high note after his struggles last seasons, he’s a great Yankee and a borderline HOFer to boot, I’ll miss the guy.

    But replacing his DH production won’t be too hard. We didn’t need a guy like Montero to step into the DH slot to improve over Posada’s production. I earnestly believe Jones/Ibanez or whomever could do the trick. And Montero’s still just a prospect. We can’t assume he’ll come close to matching Posada’s career – behind the plate or with the bat.

    Down the road this offense will need to evolve, no doubt about it. But I agree with Cashman, and I agree with Chad, acquiring good offense is easier than acquiring good pitching.

  26. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 17th, 2012 at 10:35 am

    You know, reading over last night’s posts, the ones after I signed off, really makes me sad. I’ve had my moments here of getting down and dirty, but I can pretty much say that I had sand kicked in my face first and so I fought back. But when it was over, it was over – at least for me.

    The nastiness and apparent grudge-carrying here is astronomical. It’s so bad that certain posters automatically ascribe terrible intent to their rivals, no matter what the statement. I didn’t for a minute take GB’s post about the enemy to be anything other than an example. And you have to remember his background. jerkface automatically ascribed horrid intent to the post. And I believe jerkface believed it – which goes back to my assertion that the personal animosity between a variety of posters is such that they afford each other no credibility on any topic whatsoever. (didn’t mean to single GB and jf out; it’s the one that jumped out at me.)

    It makes me real sad because on what should be such a joyous day, the return of Andy, people weren’t able to put aside their differences to unite in super happiness.

    (By the way, Happy St. Paddy’s day to any of you who wear the green. I’d say your brought us the luck o’ the Irish, one day early!)

    But I’m still upset about the tenor of the forum. I guess when you have so many differrent personalties there’s nothing you can do about it.

    :(

  27. Bret The Hitman March 17th, 2012 at 10:36 am

    jacksquat March 17th, 2012 at 9:57 am

    Carlo March 17th, 2012 at 8:26 am

    Neither hughes nor nova is likely to be traded because 2014 is right around the corner and they aren’t dumping young cost controlled starters for offense ahead of that.

    Hughes is a free agent after 2013. A lot of people don’t seem to realize that Hughes is only cost controlled for this year and next.

    ***********

    shhh

    Not too loud.

  28. jacksquat March 17th, 2012 at 10:36 am

    In the end, Jeter got quite a nice contract relative to his present skills, even factoring in his fan draw. And iirc, his agent was the first to go public with comments about the contract negotiations, saying something to the effect that they didn’t understand the low initial offer.

  29. RadioKev March 17th, 2012 at 10:37 am

    Trisha,

    Maybe it’s the Presidential race. What’s more divisive? Spending and the Deficit or Pineda and Montero?

    That’s a joke people. Please don’t get political. ;)

  30. jacksquat March 17th, 2012 at 10:40 am

    Bret The Hitman March 17th, 2012 at 10:36 am
    jacksquat March 17th, 2012 at 9:57 am

    Carlo March 17th, 2012 at 8:26 am

    Neither hughes nor nova is likely to be traded because 2014 is right around the corner and they aren’t dumping young cost controlled starters for offense ahead of that.

    Hughes is a free agent after 2013. A lot of people don’t seem to realize that Hughes is only cost controlled for this year and next.

    ***********

    shhh

    Not too loud.

    Time flies. It is what it is. I like Hughes and hope he does well the next two years, but he’s not in the same category as Pineda and Nova now (and Banuelos, Betances, etc.), who can potentially give them several years of cost controlled performance.

    And I don’t see how Pettitte fits unless one of Pineda/Nova/Hughes is out of the rotation. No way they will go with a 6 man rotation. And this is already assuming Garcia is out.

  31. J. Alfred Prufrock March 17th, 2012 at 10:40 am

    MaineYankee March 17th, 2012 at 9:55 am
    JAP

    The point was, Yankee fans who took the trade in stride seem to be the same fans who shrug off the loss of Posada and with that, a sense of what his bat during his catching years (and his genuine switch hitting, as opposed to a token switch hitter who is essentially a platoon type) contributed to the potency of the Yankee lineup.

    ————————————————————————————

    Don’t you think that’s being a bit presumptuos.

    I highly respected what Posada meant to this team and was sad to see him retire even though to me it seemed the right thing.

    I’m not as invested in Montero so I take a different view.
    ///

    I don’t think it’s presumptuous, no, to qualify Montero as a catcher who will put up a high OPS throughout his career. In that way only, did I compare him with Posada.

    What I think he will do over his career in that regard is another conversation.

    My original comparison was just that: that those who seem at ease with the loss seem to be some of the same posters who appear utterly unconcerned that the Yankees’ offense, going forward (at least until/if Sanchez and perhaps, Murphy arrive) will be functionally, drastically different.

    It just points up that they never really got what Posada, or what a Posada-like (read: high OPS catcher) has meant historically to the Yankee lineup, and why, to a large extent, it has been so dangerous to pitch to. And I find that, forgetting opinions on the trade, to be kind of stunning.

  32. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 17th, 2012 at 10:41 am

    Yankee Maine, when we were kids growing up, our summer vacations were always spent going north. My dad loved the north and that’s all we did. The state we frequented most was Maine. One of my favorite memories was going to Machias Maine. I was really young and so what I remember was being in the car for what felt like forever and then having to take a boat over to the “mainland” when it was time to shop for groceries – something like that!

    The other favorite memory I have of going to Maine, in general, was picking blueberries that seemed as big as eyeballs and my mom making us blueberry pancakes and making fresh blueberry pies. We always stayed at some cabin on a lake, whatever the parts of Maine we were in. Good times.

  33. Betsy March 17th, 2012 at 10:41 am

    I do find it a shame that it’s come to a point where the Yankees care more about monetary concerns than they do about physical performance. IF Phil remains here for the next 2 years and pitches well, I don’t know why they wouldn’t want to re-sign him; he’d be in his prime and a much more known factor than any prospect coming up. I don’t see how he fits on the team anymore, though. I’d rather see him traded then sent to the pen, which would be a horrible decision in so many ways. His arm would yet again be bounced around and he’d be wasted. LGY was right last night; he or the 5th starter is just a placeholder for Andy. I think the Yankees will trade Phil and use a Phelps or Warren in that 5th spot temporarily – then send them down when Andy returns.

  34. Bret The Hitman March 17th, 2012 at 10:42 am

    jacksquat March 17th, 2012 at 10:40 am
    Bret The Hitman March 17th, 2012 at 10:36 am
    jacksquat March 17th, 2012 at 9:57 am

    Carlo March 17th, 2012 at 8:26 am

    Neither hughes nor nova is likely to be traded because 2014 is right around the corner and they aren’t dumping young cost controlled starters for offense ahead of that.

    Hughes is a free agent after 2013. A lot of people don’t seem to realize that Hughes is only cost controlled for this year and next.

    ***********

    shhh

    Not too loud.

    Time flies. It is what it is. I like Hughes and hope he does well the next two years, but he’s not in the same category as Pineda and Nova now (and Banuelos, Betances, etc.), who can potentially give them several years of cost controlled performance.

    And I don’t see how Pettitte fits unless one of Pineda/Nova/Hughes is out of the rotation. No way they will go with a 6 man rotation. And this is already assuming Garcia is out.

    *********

    We’re not supposed to talk about it…

    It makes people upset.

  35. dogface March 17th, 2012 at 10:45 am

    It just points up that they never really got what Posada, or what a Posada-like (read: high OPS catcher) has meant historically to the Yankee lineup, and why, to a large extent, it has been so dangerous to pitch to

    ============================================

    Wouldn’t presume to speak as to others’

  36. MaineYankee March 17th, 2012 at 10:45 am

    JAP

    What I was refering to is how you placed people in a catergory based on two seperate things.

    Because I’m not as against the Montero trade has nothing to do with how I feel about Posada.

  37. RadioKev March 17th, 2012 at 10:46 am

    JAP,

    No doubt, having a high OPS catcher is a weapon. At the very heart of the Montero trade is the question – does he stick at catcher? My opinion has been, unless he’s losing you games behind the plate, you keep him there. Yet it honestly seems like a concern amongst scouts and organizations.

    If all he is is a DH or 1B his value drops quite a bit. He wouldn’t be quite the same WAR machine. And we’ve got all that depth. If Sanchez/Murphy pan out, or Romine proves to be solid, we’re still in a good position moving forward.

    I’ll definitely agree that this offense is going to look very different in a couple of years. By necessity to win and because of the cap. I’m not a stat wizard, but is there a WAR/$ stat? What’s the WAR/$ for every day players versus pitchers? I’d bet the WAR/$ rate is higher for pitchers.

  38. MaineYankee March 17th, 2012 at 10:51 am

    trisha

    It would be along ride from RI to machias.

    Alot of people don’t realize just how big this state is.

    I think your memory is a bit fuzzy because Machais is on the mainland. :D:

  39. blake March 17th, 2012 at 10:51 am

    “LGY was right last night; he or the 5th starter is just a placeholder for Andy. I think the Yankees will trade Phil and use a Phelps or Warren in that 5th spot temporarily – then send them down when Andy returns.”

    I don’t think that’s a certainty….I think they have to first see how Andy looks and also they have to see what they can get for their pitchers…..I think they’ll take calls on Hughes and others and see what the return would be…..if the return is good and makes sense then ok….if not then it’s not worthwhile.

    Hughes is throwing the ball really well this spring…..he has life in his arm again…the curveball looks better….and he’s locating like a machine…..you don’t trade that unless it makes your team better…..and we don’t know that yet.

  40. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 17th, 2012 at 10:53 am

    Kev, it really is hideous though.

    An interesting thing. I remember when we posted on the NY Times Yankee forum that for quite a while I was the only female there. (Talk about having to hold your own!) Some of the guys would go at it like alley cats. Yet the next day, they’d be fine with each other. That taught me that guys are able to fight on a different level from females and think nothing of it.

    It doesn’t explain, however, the on-going level of anomosity between some of the posters here. It really puts an overall and continual taint on a pretty otherwise fun and nice forum.

  41. J. Alfred Prufrock March 17th, 2012 at 10:54 am

    RadioKev March 17th, 2012 at 10:34 am
    The point was, Yankee fans who took the trade in stride seem to be the same fans who shrug off the loss of Posada and with that, a sense of what his bat during his catching years (and his genuine switch hitting, as opposed to a token switch hitter who is essentially a platoon type) contributed to the potency of the Yankee lineup.
    ————

    JAP, I took the trade in stride, and I shrug off the loss of Posada on a winning basis. I respect Posada, I was happy to see him go out on somewhat of a high note after his struggles last seasons, he’s a great Yankee and a borderline HOFer to boot, I’ll miss the guy.

    But replacing his DH production won’t be too hard. We didn’t need a guy like Montero to step into the DH slot to improve over Posada’s production. I earnestly believe Jones/Ibanez or whomever could do the trick. And Montero’s still just a prospect. We can’t assume he’ll come close to matching Posada’s career – behind the plate or with the bat.

    Down the road this offense will need to evolve, no doubt about it. But I agree with Cashman, and I agree with Chad, acquiring good offense is easier than acquiring good pitching.
    ///

    Where we differ is, I don’t just consider Montero as having been a guy who could improve on 2011-edition Posada’s production at DH. I consider him to be someone who could be one of the most dangerous DH/C’s in the game. I also don’t necessarily agree that Montero is doomed to a career as a strict DH; that is the Yankee point of view. I believe they made a rash call on that, for starters. But even if that was their position, dismissing Montero’s bat, even as a DH, is foolish, IMO. You can’t find that kind of bat easily, and here’s another point of departure for people who disagree: you cannot just replace a bat of that magnitude. THAT was a big issue.

    Finally, the Yankees were extremely fortunate to have the “Posada advantage” all these years, and they had a cheap and, IMO, extremely worthy successor to continue that almost unfair advantage, and they blew it up to acquire a pitcher who they did not really need. He’s real good, but he was not a necessity for the Yankees to win the division and sustain a long playoff run; that’s another area of departure between the sides.

    I understand your stance, here. I’m just finding that boiling this down to replacing 2011 Posada’s DH production as not being “too hard” to do as really missing the mark on the ramifications of this deal.

    I think we understand each other’s views.

  42. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 17th, 2012 at 10:55 am

    Maine, is it possible that we went to Machias and then took a boat over to the cabin? Is there some lake there where you would need to take a boat to get to cabins on the lake? I know we definitely took a boat to get to the mainland.

    Yeah, it was one long ride though!

    A very beautiful state.

  43. dogface March 17th, 2012 at 10:55 am

    oops

    Wouldn’t presume to speak as to others’ thoughts on Posada’s value, but I do think that people do get what Posada has meant. However, IMO, what he meant to the lineup from 1998-2007 was considerably more significant than what he meant to it from ’08-2011. Over the course of the 4 year contract signed in early 2008, Posada caught only 192 games, or a little less than 50 games per season, peaking at 88 games in 2009. Guess what I’m trying to say is that in a “what have you done for me lately” world, Posada’s most recent contributions to the team don’t necessarily serve to provide a true appreciation for what Montero would have meant to the Yankees lineup. Maybe that’s why some are as dismissive of it as they seem to be.

  44. Bret The Hitman March 17th, 2012 at 10:56 am

    “LGY was right last night; he or the 5th starter is just a placeholder for Andy. I think the Yankees will trade Phil and use a Phelps or Warren in that 5th spot temporarily – then send them down when Andy returns.”

    **********

    I agree with LGY. Another option is to trade Phil and use Freddy Garcia in the 5th spot temporarily – then put him in the bullpen as an emergency spot starter/long reliever when Andy returns. This way preserves greater depth. Phelps, Warren or Mitchell would still be available for a callup of course.

    The guy I’d like to get is Chase Headley. He would replace Ibanez.

  45. blake March 17th, 2012 at 10:56 am

    Alex’s ABs give me as much hope for the season as anything so far….he looks explosive again….the ball he hit yesterday was vintage….the hip rotation ….the extension….everything…..one of Girardi’s primary challenges this tear is to keep him healthy…..if he can then this team has a shot to be really special with the pitching depth they have…..they are one bat away from being a monster club…

  46. jacksquat March 17th, 2012 at 10:58 am

    I think they would look to trade Garcia. Someone is going to need a pitcher, and Garcia is serviceable, and AL tested. I think he’d approve a trade if he was told he wasn’t going to start if he stayed.

  47. RadioKev March 17th, 2012 at 10:58 am

    Hughes is throwing the ball really well this spring…..he has life in his arm again…the curveball looks better….and he’s locating like a machine…..you don’t trade that unless it makes your team better…..and we don’t know that yet.
    ————-

    Yup, I don’t see it. I’m also skeptical that a GM is going to call up Cashman and offer someone worthwhile for Hughes – but you never know. We’ve got a lot invested in Hughes, and it looks like this season could be the payoff. Maybe there’s a package deal of Hughes plus Phelps/Warren/Mitchell and another minor leaguer (Laird type, who knows?) that could haul in a good quality player.

  48. Nilsson March 17th, 2012 at 10:59 am

    Hughes indeed has the life back in his fastball and is locating it well. Betsy, just take it one day at a time with Phil. Let it play out this season.

    As for the Hughes haters, I’d stifle it for the time being. If he’s healthy and primed like he is right now, he’s gonna pitch well.

  49. Stoneburner March 17th, 2012 at 11:00 am

    1998-2007

    ******

    Relevant time period is really 2000-2009 – those were the prime seasons where his offense made an impact on the lineup (minus 2008 with the injury). ’98 and ’99 Posada was not a difference maker and significant advantage lineup wise.

  50. Villa Nova-Ya March 17th, 2012 at 11:00 am

    J Alfred -

    Bernie could have taken the minor league contract. His teammates and manager begged him to. He could have proved Cashman premature.

    Two or more sides to every situation.

    I don’t think there is a lack of understanding of what Posada brought to the Yankees in any aspect by the majority of people here. However, people process these things differently.

    Same with whether or not there was a “need” for another pitcher and whether or not Montero was expendable. People just process these things differently, maybe see different sides, maybe agree and disagree at the same time with even their own opinions. Randy called me a fence sitter. I think, rather, that I suffer from being able to see different sides to things.

    There’s too much animosity here in any event.

  51. blake March 17th, 2012 at 11:01 am

    Watching Hughes yesterday…..the thing that jumped out at me was the Wilson Ramos AB in his first inning…..he was in a bit of a jam with runners on first and third and one out with a good hitter in Ramos at the plate……he got him to two strikes then elevated a fastball for a foul then put him away with a very good hook low and away……that’s something he couldn’t have done last year…..he couldn’t have missed a bat there like that.

  52. Bret The Hitman March 17th, 2012 at 11:03 am

    I’d keep Garcia because he could be used in long relief. With his soft stuff he doesn’t need to be stretched out. He can make spot starts and throw 3-4 emergency innings on any given day.

    I’d rather keep the AAA stretched out in the minors. I wouldn’t want Mitchell, Phelps or Warren in the BP following in the footsteps of Noesi.

    Maybe Freddy Garcia just wants to be on the Yankees period and doesn’t care about starting or relieving. He’s good insurance and his trade value doesn’t fill a need unless some team is willing to give us a quality lefty reliever for him or an upgrade over Ibanez.

    I would do Hughes for Chase Headley. He’s controlled through 2014 and can back up 3b.

  53. blake March 17th, 2012 at 11:04 am

    I think the only way you deal Hughes is if you find a team that needs pitching now and that has young hitters to spare…..the Royals are a good match if it were for Gordon or Myers….or if you coukd build a package to acquire Choo or Morison or somebody like that…..somebody either really good and established…..or somebody that’s young and cheap and has upside……if you can’t get a player like that then you keep him because I really think he’s going to have a good season……he looks great.

  54. blake March 17th, 2012 at 11:06 am

    I don’t like Headley that much and that deal doesn’t make a lot of sense for the Padres to me anyway…..

  55. blake March 17th, 2012 at 11:07 am

    The Padres are in aquiring young cheap players mode…..if they move Headley then they’ll want service time guys back…..Hughes will be a FA in two years…..

  56. Bret The Hitman March 17th, 2012 at 11:07 am

    Blake,

    If he looks great to you then you have to believe that opposing scouts studying his starts won’t miss anything and their GM will evaluate appropriately and offer fair value. Teams are hungry for pitching. They were able to move AJ Burnett. Hughes does have value. You’re right about that. It seems strange that the scouts would not take notice of his spring. It’s not like he is a rookie with no track record, untested against MLB hitters.

  57. tucker March 17th, 2012 at 11:08 am

    Hughes has done very little to set up hitters. He would just hope hitters would swing at his high fastball. Except it wasn’t explosive enough to miss bats. Sounds like he has a better idea of setting up hitters … A split would be a good pitch for him.

  58. Bret The Hitman March 17th, 2012 at 11:09 am

    The Padres have Headley for 3 more years compared to 2 for Hughes. I don’t see much of a service time gap there. And the Padres were in on Burnett, so they’ve talked to the Yankees about pitching and were willing to take on AJ, even if only for 2 years. AJ is not young and cheap so I don’t see them being in “young cheap players mode”. That division is wide open and they need pitching.

  59. J. Alfred Prufrock March 17th, 2012 at 11:11 am

    MaineYankee March 17th, 2012 at 10:45 am
    JAP

    What I was refering to is how you placed people in a catergory based on two seperate things.

    Because I’m not as against the Montero trade has nothing to do with how I feel about Posada.
    ///

    But it does follow, that the idea that getting a “No. 2″ arm trumps continuing the catcher advantage Posada-like gave the lineup, is by definition, devaluing that advantage. I understand some don’t think Montero can catch, based on what the Yankees think. I suppose you can argue that if they weren’t going to use him back there, then they weren’t; that whether they should or should not give him a longer trial would be beside the point.

    That’s a fair point, of course, but it does then come down to wondering, especially if you really value what Posada brought all these years, if the Yankees have their priorities in order? How bad could Montero be, that they would throw that away? He’s completely not remediable? At 22?

    I think people who really feel the sting of a Posada-less offense (this isn’t the realm of sentiment, at the moment) are the same people who seriously question what seems like a very flip judgment that Montero can never be even serviceable behind the plate.

  60. blake March 17th, 2012 at 11:12 am

    Bret,

    Why would a non competitive team trade 3 years of service time for 2?

    Tucker,

    Yea I agree…..I like his sequencing so far this spring…..I think last year he just had no idea what to do out there because he didn’t have his fastball …….this spring he’s getting late swings again on the heater and its allowing him to get some swings and misses on a still not great but much better breaking ball……

  61. jacksquat March 17th, 2012 at 11:14 am

    Yeah, I’ve been saying for at least a couple years that a split might work well for Hughes, but the organization obviously pushes the changeup, and may even actively discourage the splitter (if they don’t already throw one).

  62. J. Alfred Prufrock March 17th, 2012 at 11:15 am

    Villa, I’m changing locations, but my animosity for management I think I have well explained. As for animosity in here, it comes about because of deliberate misreadings and dumbing down of posts, and other disingenuousness, at least from my end. I am glad we could have a reasonable discussion about this, though, so thank you for that.

    Good afternoon :D

  63. blake March 17th, 2012 at 11:15 am

    Id ask the Royals what they want for either Gordon or Will Myers…..Id ask about Dom Brown….Id ask about Logan Morrison…..Choo, Ethier, etc…..Alex Gordon would be awesome if his 2011 was for real…….no clue if they’d trade him but he’s nearing free agency and will be getting expensive.

  64. stuckey March 17th, 2012 at 11:15 am

    So *I* get criticized for the length of my posts… :-)

    Annnnyywaaay….

    A response to this developing narrative about the unappreciated value of Posada’s offense from the C position and its effect on the length of the line-up.

    Unfortunately, when you try to apply objective perspective the career and contributions to a long-time, beloved, border-line HoF player like Posada, you get the line of ‘argument’ the started to develop last night and continues today – that you don’t appreciate him and disrespect him and don’t understand what he meant.

    Well, first of all, the prime-Jorge Posada can catch on my team every day.

    That said, Jorge Posada WAS a very uneven postseason performer.

    This is a fact.

    I offer this because I suspect this ‘don’t appreciate what Posada meant’ narrative is at least partially in response to Russell Martin’s tough 2011 ALDS.

    But I can’t ignore that .675 was Posada’s highest OPS during the postseason years 2002-2004. Or that it was .435 in 2007, or .646 in 2010. Even in 2009 it was a decent but relatively modest .765.

    Now to be fair, he was stellar in 2005 (1.012) and 2006 (1.348), both in first round losses.

    The point is, his “value” in terms of lengthening the line-up and being the rare, unique-to-the-Yankees offense from the catching position is more theory than practical application, at least in the postseason.

  65. Bret The Hitman March 17th, 2012 at 11:15 am

    Because they are competitive in that division. It’s wide open. If they add a pitcher, they can easily do what AZ did with a makeshift offense.

  66. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 17th, 2012 at 11:15 am

    “LGY was right last night; he or the 5th starter is just a placeholder for Andy. I think the Yankees will trade Phil and use a Phelps or Warren in that 5th spot temporarily – then send them down when Andy returns.”

    “I don’t think that’s a certainty….”

    The above should tell you all you need to know about who we are. Nothing more than fans with opinions.

    Nobody knows for certain, no matter how certain you think you are!

    :)

    I always think it’s wise to let it play out, for that reason. There are so many possible intervening variables for every scenario that what you think is a lock today could be dust tomorrow.

    ;)

  67. blake March 17th, 2012 at 11:17 am

    I also think Hughes has perfect arm action for a split….but whether he coukd throw it I have no idea…..

    Hughes can be good either way so long as he’s locating his fastball in 4 quadrants and has a workable curveball….

  68. MaineYankee March 17th, 2012 at 11:20 am

    JAP

    The point was, Yankee fans who took the trade in stride seem to be the same fans who shrug off the loss of Posada and with that, a sense of what his bat during his catching years (and his genuine switch hitting, as opposed to a token switch hitter who is essentially a platoon type) contributed to the potency of the Yankee lineup.

    ———————————————————————-

    I’ll try one more time.

    You said if someone took the trade in stride they also dismiss what the loss of Posada means.

    Two seperate issues.

    Because I may be in line with the first doesn’t mean I’m in line with the second.

  69. blake March 17th, 2012 at 11:22 am

    “Because they are competitive in that division. It’s wide open. If they add a pitcher, they can easily do what AZ did with a makeshift offense.”

    They are a long ways off…..the Dbacks and Giants are both quite a bit better then them

  70. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 17th, 2012 at 11:22 am

    Bret, if you’d like to accuse me of arrogant absolutism and be correct about it, you might go back to my statements on Montero.

    I guaranteed this forum that the Yankees would never trade Montero. I told them to take it to the bank.

    I definitely misread those tea leaves.

    It happens.

    Just another point toward letting things play out and no certainties.

    Much of what we have on a forum is a compilation of fans wishes and expectations. Whether or not they end up gibing with Yankee reality is always the wild card.

  71. Stoneburner March 17th, 2012 at 11:23 am

    It is inaccurate to say that high impact bat at catcher is always needed.

    During the 1996-2000 run – Posada’s bat was only significant advantage in 2000 – the year he emerged. From 2000 to 2009 he was a tactical advantage for the lineup – but that is b/c we were disadvantaged at other traditional power positions. Case in point:

    2000: Brosius was not your traditional 3b slugger
    2001: Martinez was no longer your 1b power option
    Remember LF was not a real consistent offensive advantage until Matsui arrived
    In 2003 – the Yankees had Aaron Boone – not your traditional 3b slugger
    No – it was not until 2004 when A-Rod arrived that 3b became what it is meant to be
    Remember during this period – Bernie Williams was beginning to decline in the 2005s and 2006s. RF was also in transition after O’Neil retired until Gary Sheffield was acquired.

    So throughout the years – while the Yankees have had a significant advantage w/ Po and his offense behind the plate – they have at practically the same time other positions with less than traditional bats.

    But now – we have an above average bat at 2b (WAR 4.6) and CF (WAR 5.4) – two positions where there are not that many dynamic bats. Based on last year – SS is still an above average offensive position. Say what you will – but 1b is still a power position for us with Tex (though WAR 2.4). RF while not great – still a 3.4 WAR last year. Even Brett Gardner enjoyed a nice WAR of 4.4.

    So the Yankees right now get above average production from their 2b and CF.

    They get an undervalued LF with Brett Gardner

    Their 1b is a traditional power position

    SS was better in the second half

    RF is solid

    The only positions that appear to be in question going into this season are what kind of production will we get from 3b, DH, and catcher (even though Martin had a + WAR of around 1ish last season). DH is a non-factor b/c it will be shared by many hitters for almost half of the bats. It comes down to 3b and catcher – but in past years the Yankees have had championship teams where two such positions were below average offensively (see 99 team with 3b and LF).

    Plus comparisons b/w Posada and Montero are shortsighted: (1) Posada was a switch hitter -huge difference, (2) Posada was more athletic, (3) plus Posada was a pretty decent catcher in his early career:

    Caught Stealing as C s c a p y
    2000 AL 34 (3rd)
    2001 AL 37 (3rd)
    2002 AL 31 (4th)
    2003 AL 28 (5th)
    2004 AL 25 (5th)
    2005 AL 39 (1st)
    2006 AL 38 (2nd)
    2007 AL 32 (4th)
    2009 AL 31 (2nd)

    It is apples and oranges b/w Posada and Montero – b/c there we are not sure if Montero will be able to stay at catcher for his CAREER as Posada primarily until the end.

  72. MaineYankee March 17th, 2012 at 11:25 am

    trisha

    You may have gone to an island off the coast of Machais.

  73. MTU March 17th, 2012 at 11:30 am

    Trisha-

    I agree with you that it’s too bad some people some of the time can’t disagree w/o being disagreeable.

    As you pointed out, yesterday seemed to me to be a day to celebrate the return of the Priodigal Son in AP.

    You may have noticed my rational exhuberance.

    OTOH, this is an Internet baseball blog. That kind of thing is probably par for the course.

    I think it’s better to just skip over the stuff you don’t like.

    That’s the ignore button LoHud never gave us.

    ;)

  74. Ys Guy March 17th, 2012 at 11:33 am

    i think its extremely insulting to a great player like posada to be compared to someone who has done absolutely nothing to this point in his career. a veteran who has been out there busting it for decades, fighting thier way through, keeping in shape, keeping out of trouble, contributing to the team and performing at the top of thier ability and winning championships. nothing against montero, but he has done none of it so far. he shows ability but there’s a ton of people out there with ability who haven’t done squat. how many ‘next mickey mantle’s’ and ‘next willie mays’s’ have come and gone since the real thing did what they did? and how many panned out to be even half as good as willie or mickey? none, thats how many.

    montero may turn out to be a great, or he could be working at macy’s in 2 years, thats mostly up to him, but until he does something, don’t put him up with a great player who has taken that ability and actually accomplished something with it.

  75. Rich in NJ March 17th, 2012 at 11:34 am

    When you look at Pineda, Nova, and Hughes, the only thing that the first two have over Hughes is a better 2011 season. Yes Pineda has the best FB and slider (assuming his velo ticks back up), but when he is right, Hughes’ has a very effective FB as well and a decent cutter. The trajectory of most young pitchers’ careers can be extremely variable early on. So if signing Andy means that they will just sell low on Hughes when he is showing renewed promise, it could turn out to be a net mistake.

  76. MTU March 17th, 2012 at 11:35 am

    Another thing Trisha.

    Things sometimes get lost in tarnslation on the Internet.

    It’s sometimes hard to know when certain folks are just kidding because you’re not face to face to see the nuance.

    I try to overcome that with “smileys”. Tends to make your intent clearer. Less room for misunderstandings.

  77. blake March 17th, 2012 at 11:37 am

    “When you look at Pineda, Nova, and Hughes, the only thing that the first two have over Hughes is a better 2011 season”

    And 3 more years service time each…..which is important with the budget nonsense they keep talking about

  78. MTU March 17th, 2012 at 11:37 am

    sp: translation. No idea what tarnslation is.

    :)

  79. blake March 17th, 2012 at 11:39 am

    Id trade Hughes, Nova, or Pineda if the right bat was coming back…..but who knows if that’s a possibility or a not…..

  80. Stoneburner March 17th, 2012 at 11:39 am

    Ys Guy March 17th, 2012 at 11:33 am
    i think its extremely insulting to a great player like posada to be compared to someone who has done absolutely nothing to this point in his career.

    *****************

    You speak the truth. But what is also insulting is saying a player is generational – saying he WILL BE a Dave Winfield type bat, a Frank Robinson type bat, an Albert Pujols type bat – individuals who already have generational hitting and power abilities. This debate about the trade would be fine if people realized that Montero has potential BUT he is NOT what people are saying he will be yet – we do not know. This trade can be evaluated in years – NOT in the few months since it was completed. Prospect hugging fan boys have taken their fandom and exuberance to another level with this trade – and it has hurt other individuals that follow the minors but realize no prospect is certain, they are suspects until they do it and make those most important adjustments throughout their career.

  81. MTU March 17th, 2012 at 11:40 am

    Blake-

    Easy now big Fella’. Resetting the Lux tax isn’t just nonsense IMO.

    IMO after they get that done they’ll be free to be spend a bit more liberally again, and they will have reduced the help that their competitors get out of the free ride.

    At least that’s my theory anyway.

  82. Rich in NJ March 17th, 2012 at 11:42 am

    blake

    Why should that affect their thinking over the next two years, given that apart from CC, no other pitcher that is currently in the rotation can be counted on in 2013?

  83. Rich in NJ March 17th, 2012 at 11:44 am

    Yes, in the right deal I would trade anyone, just as I would have traded Montero in a package for a young impact bat.

  84. MTU March 17th, 2012 at 11:47 am

    Rich-

    No one really knows what the Yankees are gonna do with the current surplus.

    Speculation abounds.

    Maybe it will just suddenly dissapate on it’s own due to injury, etc.

    No one knows for sure that the Yankees are gonna move Hughes.

    Especially if he has 1 or 2 more great seasons.

    Maybe the price will be right under those conditions ?

  85. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 17th, 2012 at 11:49 am

    MTU – if you were to skip over the posts you didn’t like last night, you might have ended up only reading 2 or 3!

    Maybe I’m an idealist (maybe?) but I think that human beings can communicate with each other without resorting to personal insults and downright nastiness and rudeness. I know I’ve put the gloves up at times, but it’s only when I feel someone is being personally offensive.

    It does bother me to see posters go at each other with rudeness and personal insults, especially when it’s obvious that it’s part of some on-going vendetta.

    But, I guess, such is life. We never know where someone else has been in life and what kinds of horrific experiences might have caused someone to be less than pleasant.

    There but for the grace of God go we, in those situations.

  86. yankeefeminista March 17th, 2012 at 11:49 am

    Bryan Hoch ? @BryanHoch Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
    Eduardo Nunez’s hand passes the BP test. He’s in today’s Yankees lineup.

  87. MTU March 17th, 2012 at 11:51 am

    The only thing I am fairly certain of is that I do not believe that the Yankees will be able to afford
    Cano, Grandy, Martin, and Swisher and still make it under the Cap.

    Of that group, if I were to speculate on the one to go, I’d say it would be Swisher.

    It might even be possible that 2 of them are gone.

  88. blake March 17th, 2012 at 11:52 am

    “IMO after they get that done they’ll be free to be spend a bit more liberally again, and they will have reduced the help that their competitors get out of the free ride.”

    Yea if that were true…..I kinda think they aim to get below 189 and stay there.

    Rich,

    Because if they are serious about 189 then their rotation will have to be cheap ….and Hughes is going to get expensive. Part of the reason they traded for Pineda is because he’s controllable for 5 years……im not advocating trading Hughes…..and have spent all morning talking about how good he looks……but I wouldn’t rule it out if something good came along……..the issue is….if he pitches well over the next two years silk they be able to fit him in the budget anyway gong forward?….

  89. Crawdaddy March 17th, 2012 at 11:53 am

    Trisha,

    Be kind to Randy today.

  90. trisha - true pinstriped blue March 17th, 2012 at 11:57 am

    Craw, I offered him my baseball tickets. What more could you ask?

    :)

    I believe in kindness. You really have to wrestle it away from me in order for it to disappear for a spell!

  91. MaineYankee March 17th, 2012 at 11:57 am

    blake

    The Yankee’s seem to fit the ones into the budget that they deem worth going above and beyond.

  92. MTU March 17th, 2012 at 12:00 pm

    Trisha-

    When many people go at each other here I am fairly certain they each feel they were the ones attacked first.

    A lot is lost in translation here.

    IMO misunderstandings are common and somewhat unavoidable.

    Like I said that’s one of the reasons I use the “smileys”, etc. to try to reduce that.

    It is clear to me that some people just plain don’t like each other though and really could care less.

    That’s unfortunate.

    One thing I don’t care for is people trying to control what does and does not get posted here.

    We all have our preferences for how things should go but the essence of a place like this is the free flow of ideas.

    Where do you apply for the job of blog Policeman ?

    Do you know ?

    Anyway, try to have fun. I’ve learned a lot visiting here. About all sorts of things.

    :)

  93. blake March 17th, 2012 at 12:01 pm

    “The Yankee’s seem to fit the ones into the budget that they deem worth going above and beyond.”

    Before the soft salary cap….I don’t know if they will continue that.

  94. Tar March 17th, 2012 at 12:02 pm

    “Be kind to Randy today.”

    This place should be about exchanging opinions not winning debates. If that fails, attack the post not the poster.

    It will make this place much more enjoyable and informative.

  95. MTU March 17th, 2012 at 12:04 pm

    Blake-

    Of course I respect your opinion but in this instance I do not agree with you.

    I think the budgetary restraint is a temporary phenomenon brought on by MLB trying to “equalize”
    certain kinds of perceived advantages.

    I could be wrong and time will tell.

    I do hope I’m right and you are wrong in this instance because Yankee financial muscle has been considerable over the years.

    I don’t want to see that go totally away.

  96. mikey487 March 17th, 2012 at 12:04 pm

    Reincarnation appears to be a real thing. It can’t just be the pot calling the kettle black

  97. MaineYankee March 17th, 2012 at 12:05 pm

    MTU

    Anyway, try to have fun. I’ve learned a lot visiting here. About all sorts of things.

    ———————————————————————–

    Some of what you’ve learned here would be better to stay here. :D:

  98. MTU March 17th, 2012 at 12:05 pm

    New thread —–>

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