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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Ibanez and the lessons from the past

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Mar 19, 2012 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

It wasn’t meant to be a hard-hitting question, but it certainly put things in perspective. After another hitless game last night, Raul Ibanez was asked when he’d ever been surrounded by so many reporters after a spring training game.

“First time,” he said, smiling. “First time ever, so congratulations to me.”

In several corners of the Yankees fan base, Ibanez was not a very popular signing in the first place. He was essentially replacing Jesus Montero — who was supposed to replace Jorge Posada — and he was chosen ahead of Johnny Damon and Hideki Matsui, popular former Yankees who also fit the left-handed DH mold. Ibanez’s overall numbers weren’t very good last year, and although his splits vs. right-handers were better than any of the alternatives, those numbers weren’t overwhelming either. He’s 39 years old, and although he’s cheap and proven with a tremendous clubhouse reputation, he’s just not the kind of addition that sparks a ton of excitement. And his slow start certainly isn’t helping.

Ibanez is clearly not happy with his numbers, but he’s not moping through the clubhouse either. He’s learned to focus on something other than spring training results. Truth be told, so have the Yankees.

Marcus Thames
2010

Two years ago, the Yankees signed Thames to be a platoon designated hitter and occasional corner outfielder. He’d never hit higher than .256 in any big league season, but he also had a career .496 slugging percentage against lefties. The Yankees thought they could maximize his impact with specific at-bats.

Spring training: Thames was on a minor league deal, and made the team despite hitting just .135 in spring training. He struck out 21 times and didn’t homer until the final week.
Regular season: Wound up playing more than the Yankees expected and hitting better than they could have hoped. Thames even produced against right-handers finishing with a career-high .288 average and 12 home runs.

Andruw Jones
2011
Far removed from his superstar days in Atlanta, Jones hit .204/.312/.411 in the three seasons before he signed with the Yankees to be a platoon DH and corner outfielder. The Yankees liked him because he’d slugged .558 against lefties in 2010.

Spring training: In his first stint with the Yankees, Jones hit just .182/.265/.318 in spring training. He had one home run and 10 RBI, and that opened the gate to a slow start once the season began.
Regular season: By the end of the season, Jones had been everything the Yankees hoped. He got most of his at-bats against lefties and hit .286/.384/.540 against them. Turns out he was playing on a sore knee, and after getting that repaired this offseason, the Yankees re-signed Jones to play the same role this season.

Raul Ibanez
2012
With Jesus Montero traded and Jones signed to hit against lefties, the Yankees went looking for a one-year player who could hit right-handers. They settled on Ibanez ahead of familiar left-handed hitters Johnny Damon and Hideki Matsui, making their choice based on Ibanez’s .440 slugging percentage against righties last season, as well as his ability to play the corners occasionally.

Spring training: It’s been an ugly first impression for Ibanez who’s working with slightly adjusted mechanics and hasn’t been able to consistently hit the ball with any kind of authority. A deep fly ball to left field was one of a handful of hard-hit balls for Ibanez this spring.
Regular season: To be determined…

None of this is definitive. Just because Thames and Jones bounced back from rough spring trainings doesn’t mean Ibanez is going to do the same, but Thames and Jones were in similar situations. They were easy to write off in the spring only to produce in the regular season. At this point, I don’t think anyone can say whether Ibanez will actually hit come April and May, but I’m not sure an ugly spring training is proof that he won’t.

I’m sure patience is hard to have this time of year, but Ibanez isn’t going anywhere. He’s going to be given a chance to hit in the regular season. The Yankees just have to hope his timing issues sort themselves out, and he shows the kind of power the team is expecting against righties.

“I think his attitude has been really good, and he’s went about his work the right way,” Joe Girardi said. “I don’t care who you are, it’s not easy to struggle. We don’t wake up saying, I hope I struggle today. We don’t do it. I’ll probably have some conversation with him if it continues just to tell him to relax and do your thing, just be who you are.”

Associated Press photo

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410 Responses to “Ibanez and the lessons from the past”

  1. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 9:04 pm

    Winn…

  2. blake March 19th, 2012 at 9:05 pm

    One difference is that both Thames and Jones were about 6 years younger than Ibanez.

  3. Bronx Jeers March 19th, 2012 at 9:10 pm

    2 words:

    sh*t sandwich

  4. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 9:11 pm

    Ibanez may hit some HR to RF which may at least temporarily make it look like an all right signing, but the idea that they signed him because he can pretend to play the OF is, pardon the pun, indefensible.

  5. blake March 19th, 2012 at 9:14 pm

    I think it temporary anyway….Cashman is likely going to be shopping for a bat at the deadline if not before.

  6. mick March 19th, 2012 at 9:14 pm

    abreu

  7. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 9:18 pm

    Not Abreu.

  8. jacksquat March 19th, 2012 at 9:18 pm

    stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 6:53 pm
    Wow, something is sure happening with the Mariners this spring:

    Montero .296
    Seager .314
    Ryan .318
    Ackley .344
    Saunders .353
    Ichiro .385
    Liddi .393
    Smoak .400

    Impressive.

    Miraculous things can happen when you have Jesus on your side. ;)

  9. Pat M. March 19th, 2012 at 9:20 pm

    Good piece Chad, as both Thames and Jones were raked over the coals as were the few here who looked at the signings positively…..Same pissing and moaning by mostly the same disenchanted LoHuders…….They’re just entering the 3rd week of the expedition season…..

  10. RadioKev March 19th, 2012 at 9:21 pm

    Albert Pujols just makes everyone in the line up better.

    Jesus Montero just makes everyone in the line up better.

    [Insert nonsense here.]

  11. jacksquat March 19th, 2012 at 9:23 pm

    Thames: 33
    Jones: 34

    Ibanez: 40

  12. RadioKev March 19th, 2012 at 9:23 pm

    Will Jeremy Bleich even reach Alan Horne’s prospect status?

  13. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 9:23 pm

    “..Same pissing and moaning by mostly the same disenchanted LoHuders……”

    We were right about Winn, why overlook that?

  14. jacksquat March 19th, 2012 at 9:24 pm

    Pat M. March 19th, 2012 at 9:20 pm
    Good piece Chad, as both Thames and Jones were raked over the coals as were the few here who looked at the signings positively…..Same pissing and moaning by mostly the same disenchanted LoHuders…….They’re just entering the 3rd week of the expedition season…..

    Please, everyone stop grouping people with this generic and oversused lohud fallacy.

    I was ok with Thames and Jones, didn’t want Ibanez. So far I’ve been right.

  15. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 9:26 pm

    Albert Pujols just makes everyone in the line up better.

    Jesus Montero just makes everyone in the line up better.

    [Insert nonsense here.]
    __

    This is almost like saying that because Montero is not Pujols he can’t be an impact hitter, maybe sooner rather than later.

  16. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 9:26 pm

    Blake, so when young players don’t hit in ST it doesn’t mean anything, but when older players don’t it does?

  17. RadioKev March 19th, 2012 at 9:26 pm

    I love this Wikipedia entry:

    García’s numbers improved dramatically upon joining the Yankees, as he batted .305 in 52 games. He also displayed a far steadier glove, committing just two errors the rest of the way.
    He is likely best remembered for two incidents in the 2003 American League Championship Series at Fenway Park against the rival Boston Red Sox. Following a Hideki Matsui double that gave the Yankees a 4-2 lead in game three, García was plunked with a Pedro Martinez pitch thrown behind his head.[4] A verbal altercation with Martinez caused benches to empty, and interrupted play. Shortly afterwards, Martinez famously told Peter Gammons during an interview on ESPN:[5]

    “ Karim García, who’s Karim García? I have no respect for that guy. I don’t have anything to prove to that guy. He needs to be forcing himself to come up to where I am, to my level. When you talk about Jeter, Bernie Williams, Paul O’Neill, guys like that that you really tip your hat, that you can understand. But guys like Karim García, what? So what? Who are you? Who are you Karim García to try to test Pedro Martinez, a proven player for ten years? That’s what I don’t understand. Why would I hit Karim García? ”

    Later in the same game, García jumped into the bullpen to assist Yankees teammate Jeff Nelson in a fight with a groundskeeper.

  18. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 9:27 pm

    “We were right about Winn, why overlook that?”

    Jones
    Thames
    Winn.

    .333 avg.

    NOT overlooked at all.

  19. RadioKev March 19th, 2012 at 9:28 pm

    Rich in NJ,

    Sorry, just rambling to myself. Wasn’t really saying anything about Jesus Montero, or Albert Pujols. I just hate the stupid saying ‘[Player] just makes everyone in the line up better.’

    Says who? How? Maybe it influences the guy in front and behind him, but it’s such a lazy old baseball saying.

  20. Bronx Jeers March 19th, 2012 at 9:29 pm

    Jones made sense. Thames could hit bombs fairly regularly off lefties.

    But to sign Ibanez because he could be the 5th or 6th outfielder is sort of a headscratcher.

  21. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 9:29 pm

    Just like pitching wins… ;)

    OK, I hear you, RadioKev.

  22. RadioKev March 19th, 2012 at 9:31 pm

    Just like pitching wins… ;)
    ——

    ..And I was trying to stir the pot with my D-Rob trade proposal :P

  23. blake March 19th, 2012 at 9:31 pm

    “Blake, so when young players don’t hit in ST it doesn’t mean anything, but when older players don’t it does?”

    that’s irrelevant….young players can improve….40 year olds who looked old and didn’t perform in the previous regular season and then carry it over into the following spring training often don’t….that’s the issue here….if Ibanez had been really good last year and struggled this spring then it would have been different…..I hope he turns it on and is a productive player for the Yanks….he seems like a nice guy and it would help the team…..and they will give him time in the season to prove himself…..I just don’t think it’ll be much past April if he doesn’t start hitting.

  24. Tar March 19th, 2012 at 9:33 pm

    Chad

    I think you do great job!!! Mucho gracias señor!!

    Blake

    I think some reinventing is in order. Barnes bringing the ball up and PJ starting…. what do you think? No way-no how– should White get anymore playing time than he is right now. Roy has less than a week to make it work. I really hope is he has something up his sleeve.

  25. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 9:33 pm

    Blake,

    Did either of the other candidates hit demonstratively better than Ibanez last year?

  26. mick March 19th, 2012 at 9:34 pm

    They’re just entering the 3rd week of the expedition season…..
    ===========
    funny

  27. mick March 19th, 2012 at 9:36 pm

    ibanez just shows the yanks frivolity towards the dh spot…they don’t seem to care about it…it’s a spot for an old man

  28. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 9:37 pm

    ibanez just shows the yanks frivolity towards the dh spot…they don’t seem to care about it…it’s a spot for an old man
    ______________

    As opposed to what younger man?

  29. blake March 19th, 2012 at 9:37 pm

    tar,

    I’m still holding out hope that Marshall can play….I don’t think they’ve said yet….my understanding was that if the fracture wasn’t displaced then he might could…..if he can’t then I’d see if Hairston can play point….I don’t think Barnes handles the ball well enough to do it a lot….it’s going to be tough…they might can beat Ohio without him but I don’t know if they can go much farther…..he’s so important to what they do.

    Stuckey,

    I think Damon did…..but nobody demonstratively….which is why they probably should have better planned for the spot if they were going to trade Montero….heck ask Posada to come back as he probably would have been pretty good in a platoon situation in his 2nd year DHing

  30. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 9:38 pm

    Celtics and the Hawks single-handedly setting NBA offense back to the pre-3 pt era…

  31. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 9:41 pm

    blake,

    But isn’t this where the argument just spins in place.

    You made it a point to argue age was a factor with Ibanez. Damon and Posada are both withing 18 months of him age wise.

    So how does age factor if we’re back to Damon and Posada being the alternatives?

  32. mick March 19th, 2012 at 9:41 pm

    As opposed to what younger man?
    ====================
    There is none.

  33. mick March 19th, 2012 at 9:42 pm

    posada and guerrero platoon 1m each

  34. blake March 19th, 2012 at 9:43 pm

    “You made it a point to argue age was a factor with Ibanez. Damon and Posada are both withing 18 months of him age wise. ”

    because they both might have more left in the tank….it’s not that complicated.

  35. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 9:43 pm

    mick,

    Then how can their choice of an “old man” demonstrate frivolity if there is no younger man available?

  36. jacksquat March 19th, 2012 at 9:43 pm

    Bronx Jeers March 19th, 2012 at 9:29 pm
    Jones made sense. Thames could hit bombs fairly regularly off lefties.

    But to sign Ibanez because he could be the 5th or 6th outfielder is sort of a headscratcher.

    I think that statement was just bull and they knew it when they said it. Either that or they are stupid. Ibanez is no better than Damon. Damon probably even has more speed, just no arm, but he can at least reach the cutoff man so it’s not that big of a deal, especially when the DH shouldn’t have to play the field that much.

    The Yankees are starting to get a little too obsessed with wanting multiple “super utility” guys on the bench. Just like their obsession with the changeup.

  37. RadioKev March 19th, 2012 at 9:44 pm

    Maybe CC Sabathia can be our DH two or three times a week. He’s a lefty, right?

  38. blake March 19th, 2012 at 9:44 pm

    but again….I would think Cashman is searching for hitters behind the scenes and I wouldn’t be surprised if he swings another trade before the deadline making the current DH situation temporary anyway.

  39. mick March 19th, 2012 at 9:44 pm

    sorry i don’t speak stuckey

  40. Pat M. March 19th, 2012 at 9:44 pm

    blake…..My point is this, why not give the guy some time before tossing him into the Harlem River……Guys like Ibanez will always be given a shot to see if there’s anything left in the tank and fill a need for a ball team like the Yanks….It’s always been like that and always will be……A veteran bat, it’s around here some don’t get that concept……A month ago I mentioned that there was talks about The Yanks & Angels swapping AJ for Bobby Abreu and the reaction was so negative….Well Ibanez will cost around 8 million less and still might work out……..It’s how ball clubs are assembled, GM’s will throw stuff vs. a wall hoping something sticks…..And for the record I thought Randy Winn for the price would stick, he didn’t….I also thought Jerry Hairston would stick and he did….Jacksquat, if you were ok with Jones last spring then you are one of 40 here who did……….Everything here for the most part is about absolutes and being right to pump fragile egos……Done with this crap

  41. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 9:45 pm

    “because they both might have more left in the tank….it’s not that complicated.”

    Neither of them had that much different a 2011. They’ll all relatively the same age.

    Ibanez in fact has less “wear” on the tires (less career games played).

    So how are you determining either has more left in the tank? (not even going to mention Posada retired and might even have meant it).

  42. Pat M. March 19th, 2012 at 9:46 pm

    Thanks Mick….Exhibition …..

  43. mick March 19th, 2012 at 9:46 pm

    blake…..My point is this, why not give the guy some time before tossing him into the Harlem River…
    =====================
    we are just planning ahead pat m

  44. David in Cal March 19th, 2012 at 9:48 pm

    I wonder if Ibanez’s supposed ability to play defense was just an excuse for not signing Damon. They don’t need Ibanez to play OF. Not only do the Yanks have 4 good-fielding outfielders, but Nunez could play OF in a pinch.

  45. mick March 19th, 2012 at 9:48 pm

    .Everything here for the most part is about absolutes and being right to pump fragile egos……Done with this crap
    ==================
    are you on painkillers again, you are so lucid when you are…

  46. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 9:48 pm

    “sorry i don’t speak stuckey”

    ____________

    More than one sentence????

  47. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 9:49 pm

    “I wonder if Ibanez’s supposed ability to play defense was just an excuse for not signing Damon. ”

    Finally someone gets it…

  48. blake March 19th, 2012 at 9:49 pm

    “My point is this, why not give the guy some time before tossing him into the Harlem River…”

    that’s fine…now that they signed him I’ll do just that and the Yanks will as well….I actually hope he plays well and proves everyone wrong….he just looks this spring the way he did last year…..kinda old…..maybe he’ll turn the clock back and knock a few into the short porch.

  49. mick March 19th, 2012 at 9:50 pm

    More than one sentence????
    ============
    it’s called brevity, you should try it..

  50. RadioKev March 19th, 2012 at 9:50 pm

    “My point is this, why not give the guy some time before tossing him into the Harlem River…”
    ———-

    He could swim over to Dinosaur BBQ :D

  51. Pat M. March 19th, 2012 at 9:51 pm

    Mick….Painkillers are part of my daily routine….However as Randy pointed out last week they have no bearing on me hitting 70 in the cage…..Although not with the greatest of ease anymore

  52. Wave Your Hat March 19th, 2012 at 9:51 pm

    The problem with Thames was in LF, not at the plate.

  53. blake March 19th, 2012 at 9:52 pm

    “I wonder if Ibanez’s supposed ability to play defense was just an excuse for not signing Damon.”

    yes….because that reason doesn’t even make any sense….they didn’t want to go down that road with Damon and have to release him if he didn’t perform.

  54. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 9:52 pm

    “it’s called brevity, you should try it..”

    How do you suggest I edit this to make it short enough for you to comprehend?

    Then how can their choice of an “old man” demonstrate frivolity if there is no younger man available?

  55. mick March 19th, 2012 at 9:55 pm

    perfesser stuckey are you casey stengel’s and prof irwin corey’s love child?

  56. Bronx Jeers March 19th, 2012 at 9:56 pm

    The Hudson’s better for dumping bodies. :wink:

    Hey Jones might get more work off righties with his new & improved physique anyway.

  57. mick March 19th, 2012 at 9:59 pm

    Then how can their choice of an “old man” demonstrate frivolity if there is no younger man available?
    =================
    The younger man was Jesus.

  58. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 9:59 pm

    mick, no, just someone with an equivalency degree in knowing when someone is avoiding a simple question.

  59. LGY March 19th, 2012 at 10:00 pm

    If Ibanez’s ability to play the field is just an excuse Girardi is quite the actor.

    His face lights up everytime he talks about the flexibility his bench gives him. Dude is an NL manager at heart.

  60. luis March 19th, 2012 at 10:00 pm

    “they didn’t want to go down that road with Damon and have to release him if he didn’t perform”

    This makes a lot of sense Blake, so there is no bad blood for Damon not taking the contract offer. But is out of respect for the player

  61. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:01 pm

    beat you…now don’t you feel foolish?

  62. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:03 pm

    sorry to hear that Pat M.

  63. luis March 19th, 2012 at 10:05 pm

    LGY March 19th, 2012 at 10:00 pm

    If Ibanez’s ability to play the field is just an excuse Girardi is quite the actor.

    His face lights up everytime he talks about the flexibility his bench gives him. Dude is an NL manager at heart.

    ===================================

    He is a little biased in that regard….remember he loves defensive no bat players like himself :D

  64. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 10:06 pm

    “If Ibanez’s ability to play the field is just an excuse Girardi is quite the actor….His face lights up everytime he talks about the flexibility his bench gives him”

    I think Girardi just has some idiosyncratic ideas about baseball.

  65. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 10:07 pm

    Luis, how do we know Girardi lives those kinds of players. He’s never had one.

  66. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:09 pm

    I think Girardi just has some idiosyncratic ideas about baseball.
    ==============================
    what about cash and hal?

  67. jacksquat March 19th, 2012 at 10:09 pm

    luis March 19th, 2012 at 10:00 pm
    “they didn’t want to go down that road with Damon and have to release him if he didn’t perform”

    This makes a lot of sense Blake, so there is no bad blood for Damon not taking the contract offer. But is out of respect for the player

    Sorry, I think it makes no sense. Damon is not Jeter, not anything like that, where it would be a problem to release him if he did not perform. I think this is just trying to make an excuse for an irrational decision by the Yankees.

  68. Bronx Jeers March 19th, 2012 at 10:09 pm

    “.However as Randy pointed out last week they have no bearing on me hitting 70 in the cage..”

    If you’re a LH hitting outfielder you might want to consider a trip to Tampa. :smile:

  69. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:11 pm

    damon wants guaranteed AB’s and playing time

  70. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 10:12 pm

    “what about cash and hal?”

    You mean like the pitching wins canard?

    Personally, I just find Cashman a lot more likable even if I disagree with him.

    As for Hal, I think he’s mostly about making money while honoring his father’s legacy, which is understandable. Beyond that, we really don’t know much about him.

  71. luis March 19th, 2012 at 10:12 pm

    It was a joke Stuckey, i think i am allow to do that once in a while right?

  72. jacksquat March 19th, 2012 at 10:12 pm

    mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:11 pm
    damon wants guaranteed AB’s and playing time

    Where did he say that? This is a guess, an assumption.

  73. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 10:13 pm

    “damon wants guaranteed AB’s and playing time”

    How many, now much? I haven’t read that from his mouth.

  74. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:13 pm

    hal is the eggman…
    cash is the walrus.

  75. blake March 19th, 2012 at 10:13 pm

    “Sorry, I think it makes no sense. Damon is not Jeter, not anything like that, where it would be a problem to release him if he did not perform.”

    you don’t think it could have caused some drama if they had to release Damon….the media would have made a big deal out of it and I don’t think they wanted that potential distraction….maybe that wasn’t the primary reason but I bet it was a factor….probably more of a factor than the phantom defense reason.

  76. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 10:13 pm

    My bad Luis.

    There are a few posters who really believe that. Didn’t know you hadn’t fallen into that trap.

    Good to know.

  77. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:14 pm

    This is a guess, an assumption.
    =================
    what isn’t here?

  78. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:16 pm

    in order to get 3000 hits at age 38 you need playing time

  79. luis March 19th, 2012 at 10:16 pm

    Sorry, I think it makes no sense. Damon is not Jeter, not anything like that, where it would be a problem to release him if he did not perform. I think this is just trying to make an excuse for an irrational decision by the Yankees.

    ===========================================

    He did win a ring with the team… but you could be right as well or maybe there is real bad blood for Damon turning down the two year offer?

  80. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:18 pm

    why hasn’t matsui signed?

  81. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 10:20 pm

    Why overcomplicate the Damon situation? Maybe they just got it wrong.

  82. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:21 pm

    hal has contempt for boras i would imagine

  83. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:22 pm

    damon in japan is the true test

  84. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 10:24 pm

    “hal has contempt for boras i would imagine”

    Yet he signed Tex to a huge contract after being played in the A-Rod negotiation.

    It’s business. They all make money. It’s not personal.

  85. luis March 19th, 2012 at 10:27 pm

    Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 10:20 pm

    Why overcomplicate the Damon situation? Maybe they just got it wrong.

    =======================================

    They got it wrong for sure, he was younger, still had enough bat speed for the job and he is a great teammate as far as i know.

  86. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:29 pm

    maybe he just doesn’t like dealing with boras

  87. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:30 pm

    luis, is trish gone for good?

  88. luis March 19th, 2012 at 10:33 pm

    mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:30 pm

    luis, is trish gone for good?

    ===============================

    I don’t know……I sure hope that she reconsiders….I respect her a great deal, and she is one heck of a Yankee fan, i miss her already.

  89. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:33 pm

    why don’t you email her and tell her that?

  90. GreenBeret7 March 19th, 2012 at 10:34 pm

    The Yankees are the most stupidly run organization in baseball. They’re the only ones not jumping at the chance to sign Damon, Matsui or Guerrero. Everybody else is fighting to get at them. What do they know that NYYs don’t?

  91. luis March 19th, 2012 at 10:35 pm

    I understand that she is going through a very tough time….Her Godmother is very ill, i hope everything turns out for the best with her.

  92. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:37 pm

    they will all be signed at the last minute for the club’s price

  93. luis March 19th, 2012 at 10:37 pm

    mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:33 pm

    why don’t you email her and tell her that?

    ==========================

    I don’t have it, i’m not that close to her

  94. Against All Odds March 19th, 2012 at 10:37 pm

    mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:29 pm

    maybe he just doesn’t like dealing with boras

    —————————————

    Isn’t Boras the agent for Jones

  95. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:39 pm

    I don’t have it, i’m not that close to her
    ========================
    how do you know about her godmother, never mentioned here?

  96. luis March 19th, 2012 at 10:41 pm

    Mick,

    I read it in the morning thread this afternoon…She posted a little bit.

  97. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:41 pm

    Isn’t Boras the agent for Jones
    ===================
    didn’t say he wouldnt deal with him and we’re talking peanuts

  98. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 10:41 pm

    “Isn’t Boras the agent for Jones”

    There’s a lot of strange stuff posted here…

  99. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:42 pm

    There’s a lot of strange stuff posted here…
    ==================
    that’s what makes this place so interesting rich

  100. jacksquat March 19th, 2012 at 10:42 pm

    mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:21 pm
    hal has contempt for boras i would imagine

    I would guess Cashman has comtempt for Damon.

    And Ibanez is more Girardi’s “type”.

    But who knows, maybe Johnny has a huge schlong and makes everyone uncomfortable when he struts back from the showers.

  101. luis March 19th, 2012 at 10:43 pm

    GreenBeret7 March 19th, 2012 at 10:34 pm

    The Yankees are the most stupidly run organization in baseball. They’re the only ones not jumping at the chance to sign Damon, Matsui or Guerrero. Everybody else is fighting to get at them. What do they know that NYYs don’t?

    =====================================

    Good point, but do you think Ibanez would have had a line of teams looking for him if he doesn’t signed with the Yankees?

  102. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 10:48 pm

    “Good point, but do you think Ibanez would have had a line of teams looking for him if he doesn’t signed with the Yankees?”

    Of course, because because the Yankees never do wrong in some peoples’ eyes.

  103. GreenBeret7 March 19th, 2012 at 10:49 pm

    I have no idea of why the Yanks would prefer Ibanez over the others, but, with Damon, I would imagin the idea of him demanding more money or more playing time would have something to do with it and with Guerrero has lost a lot more than a step over the last two years and has never been the most patient of hitters. Not exactly the sort of imfluence you’d want around less than patient hitters like Cano and Nunez. as I said earlier, other teams seem to have the same concerns about those players.

  104. GreenBeret7 March 19th, 2012 at 10:51 pm

    Of course, because because the Yankees never do wrong in some peoples’ eyes.

    ————————————————————————————————————————-

    and never do anything right in other peoples’ eyes.

  105. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:54 pm

    ..and celluloid heroes never really die.

  106. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 10:54 pm

    “and never do anything right in other peoples’ eyes.”

    Kuroda was a great signing. Tex was a good signing even if he may be declining prematurely from the left side. Signing and extending CC was brilliance, especially since it followed not trading Hughes for Santana. Extending Cano has been a master stroke.

    See, it’s just not true.

  107. luis March 19th, 2012 at 10:54 pm

    GreenBeret7 March 19th, 2012 at 10:49 pm

    I have no idea of why the Yanks would prefer Ibanez over the others, but, with Damon, I would imagin the idea of him demanding more money or more playing time would have something to do with it and with Guerrero has lost a lot more than a step over the last two years and has never been the most patient of hitters. Not exactly the sort of imfluence you’d want around less than patient hitters like Cano and Nunez. as I said earlier, other teams seem to have the same concerns about those players.

    ==================================

    I completely agree on Guerrero….Probably the playing time issue might have played a role in Damon’s case, but strictly talking about tools he was the best choice.

  108. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:57 pm

    luis. that was some thread. nick moved to mexico, betsy reappeared,trisha informed us of her godmother, and randy apologized to trish…that could be the thread of the year, even the century. i hope all works out for everybody…

  109. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 10:58 pm

    “Of course, because because the Yankees never do wrong in some peoples’ eyes.”

    Signing Arod was a mistake, twice.

    Overriding your GM to sign Soriano was a mistake in principle alone.

    AJ Burnett was an overreach.

    As were Pavano and Wright.

    Did I just prove something too?

  110. mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:59 pm

    what about feliciano?

  111. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 11:01 pm

    “what about feliciano?”

    LH relievers have always been Cashman’s white whale, but it was just money, unlike that stud hitter they burned this offseason.

  112. mick March 19th, 2012 at 11:02 pm

    i pined for montero like j. alfred but decided to not let it ruin my winter….my summer might have other consequences.

  113. mick March 19th, 2012 at 11:04 pm

    cash is always in search for the perfect lefty….i think rapada and andy will do it this time

  114. luis March 19th, 2012 at 11:06 pm

    mick March 19th, 2012 at 10:57 pm

    luis. that was some thread. nick moved to mexico, betsy reappeared,trisha informed us of her godmother, and randy apologized to trish…that could be the thread of the year, even the century. i hope all works out for everybody…

    =================================

    Yes it was!, i very seldom post in the mornings because of work or in the weekends i do a lot of stuff in those hours, but sometimes like today i get to read them in the afternoon to see what the main subjects were and get a feel of what is being discussed.

    But as you can see the tone of the blog has improved tremendously, which i think is good, because IMO you don’t have to go at each others throats when you disagree. I always say that the truth is a very relative thing, it depends on how you view things. Usually there a very reasonable arguments on both sides of an issue, there a very few absolutes in life.

  115. mick March 19th, 2012 at 11:06 pm

    enough of this nonsense…

  116. mick March 19th, 2012 at 11:07 pm

    not meaning you luis, that was a very meaninful post, ive had a long day and it’s time for slleep, nite all…

  117. mick March 19th, 2012 at 11:08 pm

    …serenity now.

  118. Betsy March 19th, 2012 at 11:09 pm

    I love Damon, but I’m certainly not up in arms because he’s not here. Just like with Thames and other professional hitters, I don’t care about ST – and I’m willing to wait and see how it goes in the regular season before making any snap judgements.

  119. luis March 19th, 2012 at 11:10 pm

    Good night Mick, take care, i’m retiring too GN all

  120. Jerkface March 19th, 2012 at 11:10 pm

    http://www.youtube.com/user/Ba.....ture=watch

    Interesting slow motion youtube of Trevor Bauer’s pitches & mechanics. Ain’t technology grand.

  121. Duh Innings March 19th, 2012 at 11:13 pm

    Because the Yanks have signed Ibanez to a one-year $1.1M deal which is low-risk high-reward, he drove in 84 runs last year, and his career I say okay, give him a shot at DH despite his spring training, but give him ’til only mid-May to produce which is a fair shot for a guy his age who can’t run or play the field capably anymore. If he stinks it up, the Yanks should release him, go with a Swisher-Jones dual DH where Jones gets more starts in RF than Swisher, make Dickerson the backup outfielder to start 2012, and get a bat in June or July if they need one.

    The problem I have with Ibanez on the 2012 Yankees is every game he doesn’t start is a game the Yanks are short a pinch-runner and one more fielding player on the bench since again he can’t run or play the field capably anymore and you bring in the catcher on the bench only in case of emergency. That wouldn’t be the case in games where someone else is on the bench. All you can realistically get from Ibanez in games he doesn’t start is a pinch-hit at-bat and you’d be burning another bench player if Ibanez gets on base in a close game late as you’d need Dickerson, Nunez, or whichever regular is resting that night to pinch-run for him, on top of replacing the guy Ibanez pinch hit for in the field.

    Jones in RF would be a defensive upgrade from Swisher and most likely an offensive upgrade from Ibanez while Swisher at DH would be an upgrade at DH.

  122. GreenBeret7 March 19th, 2012 at 11:16 pm

    stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 10:58 pm
    “Of course, because because the Yankees never do wrong in some peoples’ eyes.”

    Signing Arod was a mistake, twice.

    Overriding your GM to sign Soriano was a mistake in principle alone.

    AJ Burnett was an overreach.

    As were Pavano and Wright.

    Did I just prove something too?

    ————————————————————————————————————————-

    They signed him twice?

  123. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 11:18 pm

    “I always say that the truth is a very relative thing, it depends on how you view things. Usually there a very reasonable arguments on both sides of an issue, there a very few absolutes in life.”

    Its interesting to see you write that Luis, because I have a different view.

    I think there are more truths than people are frankly interested in pursuing.

    Look at the rise of cable news, an industry based largely on the premise of giving people an interpretation of events that appeals to their sensibilities.

    Is the birth status of a certain public servant in this country a matter of truth, or a matter of how you view it?

    I think more and more people are inclined to think all most things are subjective, for the same reason I cite above. People prefer their “beliefs”, and they really, really, REALLY don’t like it when someone suggests their facts or this logic are questionable.

  124. stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 11:18 pm

    “They signed him twice?”

    No, they acquired him twice. Once by trade, once by free agent signing (since he had opted out).

    I used shorthand.

  125. Bret The Hitman March 19th, 2012 at 11:19 pm

    MLB.com on Pettitte

    As manager Joe Girardi said, “Our expectation is that he’s going to be who he was when he left. I don’t think we would have signed him if we didn’t expect him to be who he was when he left.”

  126. Rich in NJ March 19th, 2012 at 11:25 pm

    http://www.marketwatch.com/sto.....ry_popular

    Since Lin’s Feb. 4 breakout game, sales at online Knicks-linked stores — which carry about 50 Lin-related items — have surged fortyfold, while sales at the arena are up 70%, according to management, with Lin-related gear accounting for about half of online sales and about a third of in-arena sales.

    Top selling jerseys
    Sales so far in 2012
    PLAYER TEAM
    1. Jeremy Lin N.Y. Knicks
    2. Derrick Rose Chicago Bulls
    3. Carmelo Anthony N.Y. Knicks
    4. LeBron James Miami Heat
    5. Kobe Bryant L.A. Lakers
    Source: SportsOneSource

  127. Cashmoney March 19th, 2012 at 11:36 pm

    http://mlb.mlb.com/news/articl.....8;c_id=mlb.
    ——–
    all in all, this might be pretty ‘good’ news for the Wilpons.

  128. GreenBeret7 March 19th, 2012 at 11:45 pm

    stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 11:18 pm
    “They signed him twice?”

    No, they acquired him twice. Once by trade, once by free agent signing (since he had opted out).

    I used shorthand.

    ————————————————————————————————————————-

    Yeah, 2 MVP seasons in 3 years and 7 straight 30 homer, 100 RBI seasons. Brutal.

  129. Bronx Jeers March 19th, 2012 at 11:47 pm

    Nick moved to Mexico?

    Those Zodiac cops must be hot on his trail.

  130. Cashmoney March 19th, 2012 at 11:51 pm

    I am fairly certain that if Sergio Mitre was a hitter he would have been our dh this year.

  131. RMS March 19th, 2012 at 11:53 pm

    Yeah, 2 MVP seasons in 3 years and 7 straight 30 homer, 100 RBI seasons. Brutal.

    —————————————————————————————————-
    When the Yanks signed Alex after he opted out, they overpaid him by plenty. In the latter years of this contract the Yanks will choke on it.

  132. Bronx Jeers March 19th, 2012 at 11:59 pm

    One could argue that if it weren’t for Arod, the Yanks would still be trying for # 27.

    Personally, Ive enjoyed following his career with the Yanks.

  133. stuckey March 20th, 2012 at 12:02 am

    Yeah, 2 MVP seasons in 3 years and 7 straight 30 homer, 100 RBI seasons. Brutal.

    ___________________________

    Why do you say “Brutal” like I’ve made any negative comment about his production.

    And I’ll save you the trouble. I have no issues with his personality. I don’t care about this so-called social awkwardness and I’m apathetic to his personal life.

    I thought at the time and continue to that Arod changed the dynamics of the team. He + the Yankees was and continues to be recipe for impossible-to-meet expectations.

    Now you can argue speculatively that the 9 year post-season run they had leading up to his acquisition would have ended had he not been there providing his huge production since 2004, but we can say the Arod era has been no more successful than the pre-Arod era, either in the regular or post-season.

    I’m a chemistry guy. I don’t think he’s been good for that.

    But he’s a AWESOME player and for all I care, a fine person and teammate.

  134. stuckey March 20th, 2012 at 12:07 am

    “One could argue that if it weren’t for Arod, the Yanks would still be trying for # 27. ”

    I’d be glad to concede he was the difference between winning and losing in 1999.

    But what happens in 2004-2011 without him is an utter unknown.

  135. GreenBeret7 March 20th, 2012 at 12:07 am

    Yes, that Giambi was such a chemistry guy. Wells and Mussina were certainly chemistry guys, too. Rodriguez hasn’t done anything to destroy team chemistry, except in the eyes of some idiot fans and the media.

  136. Bronx Jeers March 20th, 2012 at 12:09 am

    I’d be glad to concede he was the difference between winning and losing in 1999.

    But what happens in 2004-2011 without him is an utter unknown.

    ——————–

    Huh?

  137. CompassRosy March 20th, 2012 at 12:11 am

    stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 6:53 pm
    ::: Wow, something is sure happening with the Mariners this spring ::::

    shhhh ~ don’t jinx things ;)

    but, FTR, you forgot …
    Catricala .286
    Wilson .313
    Kawasaki .320 (everyone’s raving about his personality, his hitting seems to be a bonus)

    at last look, the M’s rank as follows (including Cactus AND Grapefruit League play)…
    - 2nd most runs
    - tied for 4th in homers
    - tied for 5th in triples

    Hopefully, at least some of this will carry over into the regular season….

    Baby steps.

  138. Rich in NJ March 20th, 2012 at 12:13 am

    A-Rod’s only sin is his body breaking down.

  139. GreenBeret7 March 20th, 2012 at 12:14 am

    stuckey March 20th, 2012 at 12:07 am
    “One could argue that if it weren’t for Arod, the Yanks would still be trying for # 27. ”

    I’d be glad to concede he was the difference between winning and losing in 1999.

    But what happens in 2004-2011 without him is an utter unknown.

    ————————————————————————————————————————-

    He wasn’t even with the Yankees in 1999 and they won that year. If not for the numbers that he put up in the 2004 series against the Twins and hid numbers against the Red sox in the first 3 games, NYYs might not have gotten as far as they did. Nobody hit much of anything against the Red sox in the last 4 games.

  140. stuckey March 20th, 2012 at 12:15 am

    “Yes, that Giambi was such a chemistry guy. Wells and Mussina were certainly chemistry guys, too. Rodriguez hasn’t done anything to destroy team chemistry, except in the eyes of some idiot fans and the media.”

    Why don’t you just save yourself the trouble and having a fight with the bogyman of your invention, because that’s what you clearly what to do.

    I didn’t say he destroyed team chemistry. I said he altered it, and I’m not sure how much common ground I can find with someone who is prepared to deny the presence of Arod doesn’t alter team chemistry.

    I’m in fact recognizing something you yourself are identifying – the weight of expectations.

  141. stuckey March 20th, 2012 at 12:15 am

    I meant 2009.

    C’mon fellas.

  142. GreenBeret7 March 20th, 2012 at 12:15 am

    and ***his*** numbers against

  143. Bronx Jeers March 20th, 2012 at 12:16 am

    Hopefully, at least some of this will carry over into the regular season….

    Baby steps.

    ————————————-

    If history is any indication I’d expect things to really start heating up in approximately 33 years.

  144. stuckey March 20th, 2012 at 12:20 am

    “If not for the numbers that he put up in the 2004 series against the Twins and hid numbers against the Red sox in the first 3 games, NYYs might not have gotten as far as they did. Nobody hit much of anything against the Red sox in the last 4 games.”

    Trying to subtract Arod out of historical events and argue whether his presence would or wouldn’t have made a difference is futile.

    Kay’s fallacy of the predetermined outcome applies here.

    Arod is never acquired before 2004, everything from that point forward happens differently.

  145. GreenBeret7 March 20th, 2012 at 12:20 am

    CompassRosy March 20th, 2012 at 12:11 am
    stuckey March 19th, 2012 at 6:53 pm
    ::: Wow, something is sure happening with the Mariners this spring ::::

    shhhh ~ don’t jinx things

    but, FTR, you forgot …
    Catricala .286
    Wilson .313
    Kawasaki .320 (everyone’s raving about his personality, his hitting seems to be a bonus)

    at last look, the M’s rank as follows (including Cactus AND Grapefruit League play)…
    - 2nd most runs
    - tied for 4th in homers
    - tied for 5th in triples

    Hopefully, at least some of this will carry over into the regular season….

    Baby steps.

    ————————————————————————————————————————-

    Don’t the Mariners usually hit well in the dry desert air in the spring time, and by the time they reaxh Seattle, they discover that they’ve left their bats in arizona.

  146. Bo knows March 20th, 2012 at 12:20 am

    Interesting slow motion youtube of Trevor Bauer’s pitches & mechanics. Ain’t technology grand.

    —————————–
    I absolutely love Lincecum mechanics that are on that youtube site. He’s like a giant rubber band – talk about core flexibility and torque. They talked about the fact that Lincecum’s stride is 120 percent of height. I know Rob’s stride is unusually long, I wonder how he does compared to Lincecum.

  147. m March 20th, 2012 at 12:24 am

    Rosy,

    Is your ST park the same dimensions as your home park?

    Our college park is at sea level w/ heavy ocean air to
    depress HR production, is it the same thing for the Mariners?

    As for the A-rod discussion, the boring crew we heard yesterday said Alex missed about 70 games over the last 2 years.

  148. Rich in NJ March 20th, 2012 at 12:26 am

    Can we trade Alex for Montero? :D

  149. GreenBeret7 March 20th, 2012 at 12:29 am

    In 2011, Rodriguez was hitting at the same rate as he had in the last four years until his knee went out. He could have been fine until he damaged his thumb. That affected his hitting in September and October possibly more than the knee injury did.

  150. Pat M. March 20th, 2012 at 12:30 am

    As great as Gerrit Cole is and how great he will be in future years, Trevor Bauer was the best pitcher last year for UCLA…..I wonder if he’ll crack the D-Backs rotation when camp breaks……He’s real good

  151. GreenBeret7 March 20th, 2012 at 12:33 am

    Pat M. March 20th, 2012 at 12:30 am
    As great as Gerrit Cole is and how great he will be in future years, Trevor Bauer was the best pitcher last year for UCLA…..I wonder if he’ll crack the D-Backs rotation when camp breaks……He’s real good

    ————————————————————————————————————————-

    Zoilo Almonte doesn’t think much of Cole’s pitching. He hit a 2 run homer off of him in Florida yesterday. Still wish he had signed with NYYs, though.

  152. CompassRosy March 20th, 2012 at 12:36 am

    :::: If history is any indication I’d expect things to really start heating up in approximately 33 years. ::::

    nah, I think they’ll be a little ahead of that curve ;-)

    Heck, they still have a chance to “be younger” in their first WS than a couple of their division rivals (the Halos were 42 and the Rangers 50 – the M’s just turn 35 this season)

  153. CompassRosy March 20th, 2012 at 12:57 am

    GB ~
    No, as a team, the M’s don’t typically hit this well – even in the springtime desert air (2009 being one exception). If nothing else, maybe it will act as a confidence booster for the young guys (since there are A LOT of those).

    ***

    m ~
    The stadium in Peoria is a bit further to CF and shorter to either corner than Safeco Field.
    Not sure how the other parks around the desert compare. I’m not sure where to find the stats on it, but the general feeling is that homers are definitely few and far between at The Safe, especially in the spring….

    ***

    Rich in NJ ~
    No.

    ;)

  154. GreenBeret7 March 20th, 2012 at 1:04 am

    Still need a center fielder to replace Guitierrez and hope Smoak is better than he’s shown along with wondering if Suzuki is rebounding or going in the tank. It’s an issue with all aging players, and NYYs are no exception. That’s a lot of offense to pray over.

  155. Rich in NJ March 20th, 2012 at 1:23 am

    Rosy

    Somehow, someway that horrendous blunder trade needs to be undone. ;)

  156. CompassRosy March 20th, 2012 at 1:37 am

    Jeff Datz (M’s 3B and Catcher’s Coach) on the Cactus League Report tonight

    http://tinyurl.com/73d7ntx

    on Montero’s “big night” – catching 3 of the young guns in one game last week… [paraphrased]

    “We caught him that night for that reason – it’s a special crew you’re going to see a lot of here in the future as we go forward. To see him handle them the way he did – we had just talked to him about a couple of things that morning and cleaning up some things and working on some things … he started that night carrying it into the game. It’s good to see. It’s still a work in progress – we know that and he knows that but, we are being patient with him. Our goal is to make him an everyday catcher and he’s going to be something special to watch for years to come in Seattle.”

  157. GreenBeret7 March 20th, 2012 at 1:42 am

    Newman on Williams, Banuelos and Austin.

    http://www.nypost.com/p/sports.....um=twitter

  158. CompassRosy March 20th, 2012 at 1:50 am

    GB ~
    For sure, it’s a long row to hoe but…

    Saunders is fighting the good fight for CF and seems to be winning. He sought out his own hitting coach in the off-season and tried some pretty unconventional methods (something about huge rubber bands and a weighted bat to help shorten up his swing) and, so far, they are paying off. We’ll see if it carries over to the regular season.

    Ichiro seems a bit energized with the novelty of hitting third (hit a homer today) and starting the season in his homeland might boost his energy even more. I think his countryman-teammate, Kawasaki, is loosening him up a bit too ;-)

    I would be shocked if Smoak doesn’t come around….
    can’t imagine there was anyone else that dealt with the combination of tragedy and freak injury he suffered last season.

  159. UnKnown March 20th, 2012 at 1:58 am

    I see a trade involving Abreu and Freddy was brought up earlier in today in the comments section. I like it.

  160. GreenBeret7 March 20th, 2012 at 2:03 am

    Rosy, I forgot about Saunders. On occassion he could be pretty impressive, but, was pretty irratic. The one bat that that would have helped Seattle was Morse. Wonder how much the PED use led to him being moved?

  161. GreenBeret7 March 20th, 2012 at 5:02 am

    Carig On Pettitte’s Return and Lance Berkman’s view on why Pettitte’s return.

    http://www.nj.com/yankees/inde.....witterfeed

  162. PacoDooley March 20th, 2012 at 5:14 am

    I get all of the arguments and lessons from the past that say that we should not write off Ibanez just yet. However, those lessons from the past do not apply in this case given his age and hugely declining numbers coming into this spring. There is no reason to believe that he will be anything other than horrendous once the season starts.

    I’ll be pleased if I am wrong, but I doubt that I am. My only concern is that they stick with Ibanez while passing on better options. Personally, I prefer that they try Maxwell as a stopgap player. He will be better defensively than Ibanez and is quite likely to have a higher OBP and better speed on the bases. Ibanez may put up better ISO power numbers in the Stadium, but I bet Maxwell would significantly our WAR him..

  163. Crawdaddy March 20th, 2012 at 6:14 am

    “See, it’s just not true.”

    Neither is your point that the Yankees can’t do anything wrong with certain Yankee fans. I thought they made a major mistake not investing more in the IFA market since the Gary Sanchez signing. The same applies to their recent amateur drafts as now the new CBA restricts them from giving high bonuses to not only IFA prospects, but amateur prospects that fall in the draft due to signability issues.

    Also, I still wish they went after Darvish and if the trade rumors were true then Cashman really screwed up the potential Haren trade a few years ago. The Soriano debacle is generally thought as such by most Yankee fans, but the blame goes to Levine on that one. The Marte/Nady trade didn’t work out for him, but luckily for him I don’t think any of those prospects traded will come back to hurt him, unless, Tabata really develops into an elite outfielder. I understood the second Javy trade at that time, but it didn’t work out for him, but he might luck out if Dante Jr. becomes their future 3rd baseman despite giving up Vizcaino, who might need TJS. Cashman’s record with free agent relievers is terrible which is probably why he prefers in-house candidates or cheaper alternatives now as relievers outside the elite ones can be very iffy to predict their future performances.

  164. Crawdaddy March 20th, 2012 at 6:17 am

    Most GMs including the elite ones will make their share of mistakes along with making the correct moves that prove golden to them. If a GM doesn’t make any mistakes then in my opinion, he’s not doing enough to improve his ballclub as sometimes you just have to make a calculated risk when it comes to deals.

  165. Ys Guy March 20th, 2012 at 7:29 am

    Girardi’s message to whiney pitchers:
    “If you don’t want somebody to take your job, pitch that way; it’s really simple,” Girardi said.”
    “That’s the world we live in in New York.”

    http://www.nydailynews.com/spo.....-1.1047150

  166. Ys Guy March 20th, 2012 at 7:35 am

    hahaha! the barklay center in brooklyn is going to sell bagels….from florida!

  167. blake March 20th, 2012 at 7:40 am

    Yu kinda looks like Dice K with a little better stuff so far…..

  168. Gary March 20th, 2012 at 7:55 am

    Morning, haven’t been on in a while, retirement is busy :-)

    Going to Tampa Sunday for the game. I’ve been to Steinbrenner a couple of times but never for a game. Anybody got any tips regarding traffic and such? Raymond James right across the street can get congested for a game, but we are talking about alot more people. Thanks

  169. dogface March 20th, 2012 at 8:03 am

    Girardi’s message to whiney pitchers:
    “If you don’t want somebody to take your job, pitch that way; it’s really simple,” Girardi said.”
    “That’s the world we live in in New York.”

    =================================

    Generally agree, though I support Garcia’s right to be a little bit miffed about this, especially knowing that the groundwork for Pettitte coming back was being laid as Garcia was signing. I doubt the Yankees promised him anything more than an opportunity, but between Pettitte coming back and a predisposition to Hughes over Garcia for the 5th starter even before the Pettitte return was introduced, the deck was stacked decidedly against him.

  170. dogface March 20th, 2012 at 8:04 am

    The Marte/Nady trade didn’t work out for him, but luckily for him I don’t think any of those prospects traded will come back to hurt him, unless, Tabata really develops into an elite outfielder
    ==============================

    Didn’t work out, but at the time it did make sense.

  171. Crawdaddy March 20th, 2012 at 8:08 am

    “Didn’t work out, but at the time it did make sense.”

    No question, but he was unlucky as you can’t Nady to need TJS for the second time while Marte did help during the playoffs that season despite his injuries.

  172. dogface March 20th, 2012 at 8:11 am

    No question, but he was unlucky as you can’t Nady to need TJS for the second time while Marte did help during the playoffs that season despite his injuries

    ========================================

    Actually, I believe that was the year they missed the playoffs, but at the time of the trade they were a half game out of the playoffs and within a few games of 1st. Shortly after the deal, Chamberlain was hurt and things went decidedly the wrong way. It was the right move to make though and Marte did indeed help them in the playoffs in ’09.

  173. Crawdaddy March 20th, 2012 at 8:13 am

    Right, the WS year.

  174. Ys Guy March 20th, 2012 at 8:15 am

    you also have to consider the predicament tabata put them in. he had basically been thrown off the trenton team after not going after a few balls in the field then having a yelling match with tony franklin. i dont know what the behind-the-scenes situation was but my impression was that the thunder weren’t going to take him back at least not willingly. and they were concerned how his bad attitude and how they handled it could affect ajax.

  175. MTU March 20th, 2012 at 8:15 am

    Don’t forget Sunglasses.

    40 Mil right down the crapper.

  176. Crawdaddy March 20th, 2012 at 8:17 am

    “Don’t forget Sunglasses.”

    I’m trying to and unfortunately, the Yankees haven’t forgotten which is probably one of the reasons why they were gun shy about Darvish.

  177. dogface March 20th, 2012 at 8:18 am

    you also have to consider the predicament tabata put them in. he had basically been thrown off the trenton team after not going after a few balls in the field then having a yelling match with tony franklin.
    =================================

    Yeah, Tabata had some issues, many of which seemed tied to that marriage to the older woman that he was apparently duped into IIRC. Classic “needed a change of scenery” guy.

  178. Betsy March 20th, 2012 at 8:19 am

    The article is unreadable to me, but I don’t know why Girardi has to make such pronouncements. Who the heck is whining? He’s responding to stupid media reports making mountains out of molehills in regards to Phil and Freddy’s responses to questions about Andy. Give me a break.

    On that note, Cashman needs to just be quite. All he’s doing with his Pineda comments is feeding the media beast.

  179. PacoDooley March 20th, 2012 at 8:22 am

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    The Marte/Nady trade didn’t work out for him, but luckily for him I don’t think any of those prospects traded will come back to hurt him, unless, Tabata really develops into an elite outfielder
    ==============================

    Didn’t work out, but at the time it did make sense.
    ———————————————–

    All I ask of the GM is to make trades that make sense. Stuff happens that cannot be foreseen and player development is unpredictable. Tabata had no future in NY, and really hasn’t been that good in Pitt. I don’t see any way he makes the NYY team, so he would have been traded regardless. He is a starting outfielder for a team like the Pirates, not the Yankees.

  180. blake March 20th, 2012 at 8:23 am

    I don’t blame Freddy for being miffed a bit either….but its just the way it is….I would guess he will be given the opportunity to start somewhere whether its with the Yanks or not.

    One thing to remember about Pineda is that if he spends just a month in the minors I believe then the Yanks get an extra year of service time with him….not saying they should do that but its something to consider if they don’t think his arm strength isbwherrbit needs to be or they want him to further refine his CU….

  181. Crawdaddy March 20th, 2012 at 8:24 am

    Betsy,

    Stop protecting your players. They’re big boys they can handle some criticism from their manager and GM.

  182. GreenBeret7 March 20th, 2012 at 8:25 am

    Garcia signed on the 9th of December. Pettitte turned down a $10 mil a year contact in December. Nobdy knew that the Pineda deal would come down a month later. As far as Hughes goes, he outpitching every starter in camp, including Garcia. Garcia sure has been shafted by everyone. What could possibly be worse than trying to improve the team?

  183. MTU March 20th, 2012 at 8:25 am

    I’m not a fan of Cashman’s new found candor.

    I liked it better when he spoke like a Politician and spoke in riddles like Jeter.

    The less the press knows the better. They love to sensationalize stuff and build mountains out of
    molehills.

    Sells newspapers.

  184. Crawdaddy March 20th, 2012 at 8:27 am

    “I’m not a fan of Cashman’s new found candor.”

    It’s the post-George era when he’s the one filling the void of not having George speak his mind to the media. Hal likes to remain in the backdrop.

  185. MTU March 20th, 2012 at 8:30 am

    Garcia will get over it as soon as he is starting for someone else.

    I hope he gets to go to a place of his liking, has a great season in the NL, and brings us back something we need.

    :)

  186. GreenBeret7 March 20th, 2012 at 8:30 am

    Why are you back on the tabata kick? He has hardly ripped the baseball world apart….not to mention the distraction with the nutcase he’s married to. he’s also been hurt about every year. Not the biggest loss they could suffer.

  187. Ys Guy March 20th, 2012 at 8:31 am

    the mets could sure use garcia and wilpon says he wants to restore the team now that he got away with profiting from madoff’s ponzi scheme, they must have something of value over there.

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  189. MTU March 20th, 2012 at 8:32 am

    Craw-

    Like I said I’m not a fan of it.

    Loose lips sink ships.

    And besides I like people who have tact and manners especially when they are in leadership positions.

    My 2 cents.

  190. dogface March 20th, 2012 at 8:36 am

    the mets could sure use garcia and wilpon says he wants to restore the team now that he got away with profiting from madoff’s ponzi scheme, they must have something of value over there.

    ========================================

    $4M off the books is the value. Garcia isn’t bringing back anything in the way of good prospects. B list guys at best. He does free up $4M, which might be useful when it’s time to find a bat.

  191. Ys Guy March 20th, 2012 at 8:36 am

    i dont mind the joking about arod, but his niece should be off-limits imo.

  192. MTU March 20th, 2012 at 8:37 am

    Ponderosa Pineda today.

    Looking forward to him keeping his promise and showin’ us the FB.

    :)

  193. Betsy March 20th, 2012 at 8:37 am

    Craw, I am not protecting them, but I don’t agree with this stuff so I’m not going to pretend I do. I was fine with Joe publicly questioning Hughes’ efforts last offseason because I think it was done for the right reasons, but I don’t find these players whining, so I don’t see how any point to what Joe said (or likely said since I couldn’t read the article).

  194. Betsy March 20th, 2012 at 8:39 am

    MTU, he comes off as a jerk. Honesty is one thing, tactfulness is another. It’s not always good to be totally honest, something Cashman doesn’t realize. I don’t want to hear my GM admitting he’s concerned about Pineda’s velocity; no wonder the media is making a stink. I’m not concerned at all, but even if Cashman really is, why does he have to reveal that to the world? He’s great media fodder now.

  195. Betsy March 20th, 2012 at 8:40 am

    MTU, yep. Why Cashman would feel the need to replace George in that area is beyond me.

  196. Crawdaddy March 20th, 2012 at 8:45 am

    Betsy,

    Then we just disagree because I don’t think Cashman nor Girardi are particularly outspoken and when they say something like Girardi did in today’s article, I find it refreshing.

  197. Bret The Hitman March 20th, 2012 at 8:45 am

    Girardi/Cashman would be better off if they phrased things differently.

    ex

    “Look these guys are professionals and they know that you have to earn your place in the New York Yankees rotation. We expect a healthy level of healthy competition and so do they.”

    Is it that hard?

  198. MTU March 20th, 2012 at 8:47 am

    Betsy-

    I agree.

    Whatever Cashman needs to say to players, or other Yankee personnel should be kept behind closed doors IMO. same for Joe G.

    Calling out players in public is classless IMO and amounts to throwing them under the bus.

    One of the reasons I can’t stand guys like Guillen.

    And as far as how Cashman or Girardi respond to the press they are under no particular obligation to
    reveal more than they want to.

    Another thing I don’t want to see them doing is dissembling.

    The less of that the better.

  199. Crawdaddy March 20th, 2012 at 8:48 am

    The poor babies.

  200. blake March 20th, 2012 at 8:49 am

    I think Cashman only said Pineda’s velocity was curiosity ….not a concern….he said he thought that Pineda probably didn’t throw or work out much this winter and is using ST to get in shape…..which was a dumb comment because the media will take that and run…Kay ranted for like 5 minutes on it yesterday……but either way I think Pineda’s velo will round into form and the most important thing for him so far is the CU development which seems to be coming along……this is a long term investment …..and at his age there are going to be hiccups as they didn’t aquire a finished product and hopefully they knew that going in.

  201. Villa Nova-Ya March 20th, 2012 at 8:52 am

    Girardi did not say his pitchers were whining – the media characterized as such. I don’t see what is wrong with saying if a guy wants to make sure he’s pitching for the team, then he needs to pitch well.

  202. MTU March 20th, 2012 at 8:52 am

    Craw-

    I think your missing the point.

    It’s not that the players can’t take the honesty, or deserve criticism at times.

    It’s just that the criticism should not be put out in the public realm IMO.

    That lacks class.

  203. Crawdaddy March 20th, 2012 at 8:52 am

    The media’s been ranting on Pineda’s velocity long before Cashman said anything. Furthermore, they will continue to do so until his velocity comes up or he pitches well once the season starts next month.

  204. Bret The Hitman March 20th, 2012 at 8:52 am

    I’m glad Pineda didn’t touch a ball all off season. He probably needed the break and it probably helped him recover from a strenuous first full season. I’d say by him doing that his risk of injury went down.

  205. blake March 20th, 2012 at 8:53 am

    Girardi didn’t say anything wrong….he challenged his guys and that’s it….the media spun it in to a story because that’s what they do.

  206. Crawdaddy March 20th, 2012 at 8:54 am

    “It’s just that the criticism should not be put out in the public realm IMO.

    That lacks class.”

    Then every ballclub lacks class as what Cashman or Girardi said isn’t any different than what any other manager or GM has said about their ballclub. I think you’re overreacting.

  207. Villa Nova-Ya March 20th, 2012 at 8:54 am

    He did not call them out in public, either. If you read the entire piece, it says that Girardi spoke to them privately as soon as Pettitte was signed. Girardi never says anything to the press that he hasn’t already said to his players. (At the very least, he makes a conscious effort not to.)

  208. blake March 20th, 2012 at 8:55 am

    “I’m glad Pineda didn’t touch a ball all off season. He probably needed the break and it probably helped him recover from a strenuous first full season. I’d say by him doing that his risk of injury went down.”

    That’s impossible to say…..but i would guess they want to ramp him up slowly so he gets to full strength and stays there for October…..

  209. Crawdaddy March 20th, 2012 at 8:55 am

    “Girardi didn’t say anything wrong….he challenged his guys and that’s it….the media spun it in to a story because that’s what they do.”

    Correct, I loved reading it as I expect my manager to hold his players accountable for their performances.

  210. MTU March 20th, 2012 at 8:57 am

    Well then Cashman or any other Yankee official don’t need to be adding any fuel to the fire.

    Why feed a pack of wolves anything if it’s gonna be counter productive ?

    The object should be to calm them down not whip them up.

    Take the heat. Don’t create more of it.

    ;)

  211. MTU March 20th, 2012 at 8:58 am

    New thread —–>

  212. Crawdaddy March 20th, 2012 at 8:58 am

    If you call that adding fuel to the fire then you should have been around when George was in his prime.

  213. GreenBeret7 March 20th, 2012 at 8:58 am

    What are Cashman and Girardi doing going on for days and not even ranting on over and over about Hughes? They need to bury him in the back yard. He won’t bring anything back in a trade.

  214. blake March 20th, 2012 at 8:59 am

    The Yankees clearly think Andy can be close to what he was…..and hearing Andy yesterday he does as well….Andy doesn’t seem to be the type of guy who would have done this if there was any doubt in his mind he coukd be successful……so we will see how it goes….if Andy is Andy then that’s a difference maker in a playoff series…..Freddy Garcia isn’t….Freddy is a solid get you through the season type pitcher right now.

  215. Villa Nova-Ya March 20th, 2012 at 8:59 am

    Furthermore, Cashman and Girardi are responding to questions put to them by reporters. I’m really not sure what you would have them say.

    If a reporter asks point blank to Cashman, are you worried about Pineda’s velocity, I guess you’d want him to say no, because any other answer (we’re a little concerned, we’re keeping an eye on it, etc.) is critical of the player? And then of course the posts here would be, how stupid is Cashman/Girardi for not caring about his velocity/they’re spinning it to protect themselves, etc.

    I mean they have said it’s too early to be concerned, and he’s building armstrength. At least that’s what I remember reading. Of course it’s something they will watch. I really don’t see that as harming a player’s psyche.

    Same with Girardi saying the guys need to pitch themselves into the rotation. I really don’t understand the brouhaha.

  216. Crawdaddy March 20th, 2012 at 9:02 am

    “I really don’t understand the brouhaha.”

    You and I, both.

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