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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Pineda having labral surgery

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Apr 25, 2012 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Michael Pineda has been diagnosed with a right anterior labral tear and will have surgery next Tuesday, May 1.

Brian Cashman is going to host a conference call to give more details. Obviously this is bad news for the Yankees and their new young starter.

UPDATE: The basics of Cashmans conference call…

The Yankees believe Pineda can be ready to pitch in 12 months. They believe it can be fixed with a scope, which is key. The rotator cuff is not damaged.

This injury never showed up in previous MRIs, and the Yankees believe something very minor blew up into this during that 15-pitch rehab start. What he has now would have shown up on any MRI.

The Yankees are confident the Mariners knew nothing about this. Pineda has never had should issues before.

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360 Responses to “Pineda having labral surgery”

  1. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 4:54 pm

    Fire Cashman and I’m not joking.

  2. mick April 25th, 2012 at 4:54 pm

    Jack Z knew…

  3. LGY April 25th, 2012 at 4:54 pm

    Excellent job by Cashman acquiring a pitcher in back to back years who needed major arm surgery before throwing a single pitch for the Yankees

  4. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 4:54 pm

    SMH WTF

  5. Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 4:55 pm

    Terrible news.

  6. LGY April 25th, 2012 at 4:55 pm

    Fire Cashman and I’m not joking.

    ——-

    /BringBackTowers

  7. Chip April 25th, 2012 at 4:55 pm

    LGY April 25th, 2012 at 4:53 pm

    Excellent job by Cashman acquiring a pitcher in back to back years who needed major arm surgery before throwing a single pitch for the Yankees.
    ————————

    I’m with you on the Feliciano thing – mostly because of the whining that followed. But Pineda’s far from toast because of this. Players get hurt.

    If Montero broke his leg like Posey did last year and Pineda was in the Yankee rotation would that make it a bad deal for the Mariners? No.

    Pitchers come back from torn labrums.

  8. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 4:56 pm

    g. Love-

    I might be with you

    on that one.

    Wow. That is just terrible news.

    I really can’t believe it.

    Incredible.

    :(

  9. raymagnetic April 25th, 2012 at 4:56 pm

    Jack Z played Cashman by time! :x

  10. Chip April 25th, 2012 at 4:56 pm

    DavidWaldstein If they can see and fix the tear arthroscopically it’s relatively good news. If they can’t and they have to make an incision, that’s worse

  11. raymagnetic April 25th, 2012 at 4:56 pm

    Big time :x

  12. Rich in NJ April 25th, 2012 at 4:56 pm

    Is Cashman resigning or spinning?

  13. RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 4:56 pm

    Ouch. Let’s see what happens. This looks ugly..

  14. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 4:56 pm

    Oh well. The Yankees will still survive.

    Here’s hoping that Pineda heals well and comes back healthy.

    Onward and upward.

    By the way, I pay attention to nothing on this forum because the posters here are known crepe hangers.

    I’ll wait and I bet I’ll be rewarded for not panicking and calling this the end.

  15. Chip April 25th, 2012 at 4:56 pm

    Though I will say this – Cashman’s track record in bringing in pitchers is hooooorible.

  16. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 4:57 pm

    Name 2 pitchers who came back from torn labrums with their original velocity.

  17. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 4:58 pm

    None of you knows how terrible or not-so-terrible the news is so cut the drama – unless you are calling it terrible that he may be out for the season.

  18. Benny Blanco April 25th, 2012 at 4:58 pm

    WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!

  19. blake April 25th, 2012 at 4:58 pm

    Wonderful

  20. LGY April 25th, 2012 at 4:58 pm

    I’ll be at the Hospital for Special Surgery on Tuesday.

    Maybe I can thank Pineda for getting us Campos.

    /TheCamposTrade

  21. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 4:58 pm

    They do Chip but many times they are not the same.

    And it shows a vulnerability.

    You know I’m an optimist of the highest order but even in my world this is bad news.

    :(

  22. kd April 25th, 2012 at 4:58 pm

    could be worse…

    our starting left fielder who costs 20 million per year, could be heading to see dr. andrews cause his elbow still hurts

  23. kd April 25th, 2012 at 4:59 pm

    Joe Casale ? @sportsJC16

    Pineda injury means 3 things. 1) His days of throwing 98 are over. 2) Time for Phil Hughes to step up. 3) #Yankees are short pitching again.

  24. Kerry April 25th, 2012 at 4:59 pm

    Thank Jebus for Pettitte.

  25. raymagnetic April 25th, 2012 at 4:59 pm

    This is a tragedy without the comedy :x

  26. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 4:59 pm

    Actually rather than being all aghast and ready to tear up my Yankee membership card, I feel for Pineda. I hope he does well and recovers well. I know this will fall on deaf ears but you have no way of knowing whether the Yankees should have discovered this earlier.

  27. Nick in SF April 25th, 2012 at 4:59 pm

    This is not such a one-sided disaster; Montero is still at high risk for poetry wax burns.

  28. Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 4:59 pm

    None of you knows how terrible or not-so-terrible the news is so cut the drama – unless you are calling it terrible that he may be out for the season.

    We, as educated baseball fans, know the severity of a labrum tear for a pitcher. Just like we know the lack of severity for tommy john surgery.

    Shoulder problems that require surgery are NEVER good for pitchers.

  29. blake April 25th, 2012 at 5:00 pm

    What I wanna know is if he tore it in that last ST start when they left hin out there despite clearly not throwing the ball right.

  30. JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:00 pm

    This is pretty bad news. If I had to choose I’d actually prefer an elbow injury.

  31. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 5:00 pm

    If Cashman has a set of cojones, he will say we think this happened in Seattle and we’re going to try to get some compensation back from Seattle.

    The guy lost his velocity last year in the 2nd half. Seattle knew exactly what they were sending us. Damaged goods.

    Shame on the Yankees for dealing 2 healthy young players for a guy with red flags up the wazoo.

    Cashman got took and he shouldn’t be allowed to pick personnel anymore for this team.

  32. Tar April 25th, 2012 at 5:00 pm

    But if pitchers with torn labrums were horses, they’d be destroyed. Of the 36 major-league hurlers diagnosed with labrum tears in the last five years, only midlevel reliever Rocky Biddle has returned to his previous level. Think about that when your favorite pitcher comes down with labrum trouble: He has a 3 percent chance of becoming Rocky Biddle. More likely, he’ll turn into Mike Harkey, Robert Person, or Jim Parque, pitchers who lost stamina and velocity—and a major-league career—when their labrums began to fray.”

  33. Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 5:01 pm

    @jnorris427
    Ouch. Labrum tear for Pineda. Frame of reference, Jeremy Bleich tore his labrum. Last time he pitched? 5/16/10. #Yankees

  34. blake April 25th, 2012 at 5:01 pm

    Spend the freaking money and sign Cole Hamels……you’ve already lost Montero screwing around trying to be smarter than everyone else…..start being the Yankees again and get what you need without giving anything else up.

  35. Rich in NJ April 25th, 2012 at 5:02 pm

    “What I wanna know is if he tore it in that last ST start when they left hin out there despite clearly not throwing the ball right.”

    I guess we will never know, but his velo was down all spring, so there was probably something wrong. I think the issue is whether or not he made it worse.

    The only good to come out of this is for some accountability for the reckless GM.

  36. mick April 25th, 2012 at 5:02 pm

    Cashman got took and he shouldn’t be allowed to pick personnel anymore for this team.
    =============================
    What if he were told to deal him?

  37. Mike in Harrisburg April 25th, 2012 at 5:02 pm

    Good thing we have an unusually deep rotation.

    Still feel it was a good deal. This is the kind of trade you have to assess in five years’ time, not 5 months.

  38. RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 5:03 pm

    This could be one of the worst trades Cashman’s ever pulled the trigger on, but we’ll still have to wait and see. I have no idea what the time table
    Is for this injury. Anyone know the deal?

  39. Rich in NJ April 25th, 2012 at 5:03 pm

    “What if he were told to deal him?”

    Then he chose the wrong trade target.

  40. PacoDooley April 25th, 2012 at 5:03 pm

    Just about the worst news we could get. If it is a very small tear, he could be back in decent shape, but major shoulder surgery could be a killer that could derail his career. Elbows we seem to be able to fix, shoulders not so much.

  41. mick April 25th, 2012 at 5:03 pm

    So this whole thing was about the Arod contract?

  42. yankeefeminista April 25th, 2012 at 5:03 pm

    SMFH.

  43. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:03 pm

    “You know I’m an optimist of the highest order but even in my world this is bad news.”

    I guess I’m an optimist of a even higher order because I’m just going to wait to see how it all pans out without having high anxiety or any kind of morbid fear – or fearing the worst in terms of “how the trade looks now”. The trade is over and done. It’s the Yankees problem – not lohuds. As long as they field a winning team, let them deal with it.

  44. Tar April 25th, 2012 at 5:03 pm

    Sorry should have included link

    “http://www.slate.com/articles/sports/sports_nut/2004/05/labrum_it_nearly_killed_him.html”

    Also Just noticed that article was from 2004.

  45. Cashman needs to go April 25th, 2012 at 5:04 pm

    what is it 13 years as yankee gm with really only 1 WS title that he can call his own – and this is after he had to spend half a billion dollars after the yankees missed the playoffs entirely the year before… if THIS debacle of a trade doesn’t force him out I don’t know what will..

    the man is over his head when he doesn’t have hundreds of millions of dollars at his disposal..

    lets remember this is the same GM who not once but twice signed sidney ponson to pitch for this team…he can’t even do marital affairs correctly…but he can grapple with the best ofthem and wear fancy wigs…wha a bleepin loser and laughingstock – he made Jack Z look like a fricken genius

  46. mick April 25th, 2012 at 5:04 pm

    Then he chose the wrong trade target.
    ======================
    might have been the best available or only.

  47. J. Alfred Prufrock April 25th, 2012 at 5:04 pm

    Shocking. Not.

    Poor kid.

    Cashman/Girardi – I want them out.

  48. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 5:04 pm

    In 5 years time Pineda will be kicking around Scranton if he’s lucky.

    You don’t come back from labrum tears with real major league stuff. They are career killers.

    The Yankees lost the trade.

    Big time.

  49. Rich in NJ April 25th, 2012 at 5:05 pm

    “might have been the best available or only.”

    This makes no sense.

  50. Game of Inches April 25th, 2012 at 5:05 pm

    Just effing terrific.

    Nice move, Cash – your “major risk” just crapped out. Now what? “I’m sorry, I was too busy thinking with the little head at the time”?

    With Feliciano, he knew the Mets abused him, but signed him anyway. Just stupid, but that was only money.

    The silver lining is at least we have pitching depth at the upper levels of the minors.

    Time to give Phelps, Mitchell, etc. a real shot.

    They must be laughing their asses off at Safeco.

  51. Mike in Harrisburg April 25th, 2012 at 5:05 pm

    Pineda must feel absolutely terrible.

  52. hardwired7 April 25th, 2012 at 5:05 pm

    Cashman will skate, as always. He’s teflon.

  53. PacoDooley April 25th, 2012 at 5:05 pm

    Do you think Seattle will give the Yankees a do over? Maybe we could throw in a couple of guys and get Felix instead of Pineda?

  54. JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:06 pm

    # Mike in Harrisburg April 25th, 2012 at 5:05 pm

    Pineda must feel absolutely terrible.

    Yep. Poor kid.

  55. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:07 pm

    trisha – true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 4:58 pm

    None of you knows how terrible or not-so-terrible the news is so cut the drama – unless you are calling it terrible that he may be out for the season.

    ——————

    The fact he’s going for surgery is terrible. There is no way to spin this.

  56. Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 5:07 pm

    I guess I’m an optimist of a even higher order because I’m just going to wait to see how it all pans out without having high anxiety or any kind of morbid fear

    Thats cool, you’re free to be devoid of any opinion regarding this. Meanwhile, normal human beings will react to the terrible news that the player they traded for who was supposed to be a future ace now has one of the worst possible injuries a pitcher could have.

    It affects the team. Just like Joba getting hurt, Wang getting hurt, etc.

  57. GreenBeret7 April 25th, 2012 at 5:07 pm

    The Cards Chris Carpenter has had a torn labrum at a much later time in his career and seems to had a fairly good careerl.

  58. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 5:08 pm

    Jack Z is smoking cigars in Safeco right now toasting with very old single malt.

    He just schooled the GM of the Yankees. Maybe we can hire him?

  59. Giuseppe Franco April 25th, 2012 at 5:08 pm

    I’ve never been a Cashman basher but this predictable screw up is going to hurt this team a lot long term.

    I think YF said it best….

    SMFH.

  60. yankeefeminista April 25th, 2012 at 5:09 pm

    JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:06 pm
    # Mike in Harrisburg April 25th, 2012 at 5:05 pm

    Pineda must feel absolutely terrible.

    Yep. Poor kid.
    _______
    Yep. No wonder he was in tears. He probably knew there was something terribly wrong.

  61. Rich in NJ April 25th, 2012 at 5:09 pm

    “Jack Z is smoking cigars in Safeco right now toasting with very old single malt.”

    No freakin’ doubt. He owns Cashman.

  62. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 5:09 pm

    trisha-

    I’m not anxious or morbid about it.

    I’m saddened and possibly very angry.

    at this point, all we can hope for is that the tear is more minor and can be repaired with a minimum of intervention.

    If full surgery is required forget it.

    The fact that the injury occured at all is still not good news.

    I would like to know a lot more and I would like to see this thoroughly investigated and made transparent even though I don’t think it will be.

    You are entitled to your opinion. I respect it.

    That’s mine.

    ;)

  63. J. Alfred Prufrock April 25th, 2012 at 5:09 pm

    Pineda should sue the Mariners for abuse.

    They pushed him too hard, too soon. They may have destroyed his career.

    FU Mariners.

    As for Cashman, he is a reckless man with adolescent first chakra issues. I’m sorry, fire his ass. This is what he blew away Montero for.

    It’s tragic for everyone involved.

  64. raymagnetic April 25th, 2012 at 5:10 pm

    The good news is that Campos may have been the best player in the trade :|

  65. austinmac April 25th, 2012 at 5:11 pm

    Labral tears are very bad news. Some come back and some don’t. I wonder if anyone has ever come back and thrown 97 again. I doubt it.

    Since the plain MRI taken a few weeks ago didn’t show it, it means he may well have had it at the time of the trade because they did a plain MRI then. His drop in velocity for the last game of the season and his diminished velocity from day one makes me think it is not new.

    May I say, and I hate to, Randy was right about Pineda and his delivery. Ouch, that hurt almost as much as the news itself.

  66. LGY April 25th, 2012 at 5:11 pm

    @BloggingBombers: Cashman: “Without a doubt, the injury occurred during the rehab outing.” He said this tear would have shown up on a normal MRI.

    So the Yankees rushed and botched another rehab effectively killing another young pitcher. Excellent.

  67. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:11 pm

    Still feel it was a good deal. This is the kind of trade you have to assess in five years’ time, not 5 months

    ———–

    Still feel good lol. Based on what???? A few weeks ago ppl though he’d miss a month now he’s gone for the yr.

  68. JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:11 pm

    This is an interesting USA Today article about shoulder surgery for pitchers. Please excuse the fact that Curt Schilling is featured.

    http://www.usatoday.com/sports.....lder_N.htm

  69. kd April 25th, 2012 at 5:11 pm

    when did he get hurt?

    was he damaged goods before he was traded? surely the yankees took an mri before trading jesus superstar?

  70. Nick in SF April 25th, 2012 at 5:12 pm

    In practical LoHud terms, what this means is;

    1) I will lose my bet with Patrick
    2) Pat M. will lose his bet with me
    3) stuckey will not lose his bet with randy after all

  71. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 5:12 pm

    I’d like to nominate Randy for Yankees GM.

  72. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:12 pm

    I feel for Pineda. He’s the only one on my mind right now. The other peripheral stuff really doesn’t matter to me at all. If there’s something to be dealt with, hopefully it will be dealt with. I don’t need to witness an execution to feel good about life. If mistakes were made, hopefully the organization learns from them and deals with them in an appropriate fashion.

    Montero was a marked man. That’s obvious at this point. I guess you can be resentful that it was this particular deal where it happened, but I don’t think there was anything that was going to save him.

    Poor Pineda. He’s the victim in all this, not the Yankees, and certainly not anyone here.

  73. Rich in NJ April 25th, 2012 at 5:12 pm

    “@BloggingBombers: Cashman: “Without a doubt, the injury occurred during the rehab outing.” He said this tear would have shown up on a normal MRI.”

    So what explains the drop in velo prior to that? I don’t believe anything Cashman says.

  74. LockDown April 25th, 2012 at 5:13 pm

    Reading these posts on the injury makes me so sad. You guys make it sound like doom & gloom. I feel like crying. My eyes are swelling up. Poor Pineda. :cry:

    Is there a chance he can come back even if it’s w/o the 98? Wat kind of surgery did Garcia have?

    I just can’t believe this. *stunned*

  75. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:14 pm

    “was he damaged goods before he was traded? surely the yankees took an mri before trading jesus superstar?”

    We know they took an MRI. But that’s about all we know. Maybe the blame goes to the person who read the MRI? It’s really impossible to speculate and know we’re on target with this, especially at this point in time.

  76. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 5:14 pm

    On the plus this catastrophe is making that Phelps for Buhner deal look a little better in comparison, no?

  77. JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:14 pm

    Cash is just protecting himself there….

  78. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 5:15 pm

    G. Love-

    I second that.

    Randy saw a lot of this coming.

    Credit where credit is due.

    ;)

  79. Rich in NJ April 25th, 2012 at 5:15 pm

    “On the plus this catastrophe is making that Phelps for Buhner deal look a little better in comparison, no?”

    And it provides comedic material for any new iteration of “Seinfeld.”

  80. tomingeorgia April 25th, 2012 at 5:15 pm

    GB7,
    Carpenter seems to be doing OK. A lot of these people would not have responded as McCauliff did, and hoisted the white flag. I wish the kid the best.

  81. Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 5:15 pm

    Is there a chance he can come back even if it’s w/o the 98?

    Yes, he isn’t dead. But its a later rather than sooner thing. He is out for all of 2012, but even 2013 will be up in the air. Most pitchers, once they actually start pitching post shoulder injury, are still a shell of their former self for another season. Lack of velocity & command and all that.

  82. austinmac April 25th, 2012 at 5:16 pm

    A friend’s son, a college pitcher, had labral surgery three weeks ago. The doctor said he hoped he could be ready to pitch next season. I don’t know how invasive his surgery was, but his tear was not picked up by the first MRI either.

    Perhaps, Joe could tell us, but that suggests to me, and I play a doctor in the courtrooms, that it is a minimal tear.

  83. LGY April 25th, 2012 at 5:16 pm

    If the Yankees want to build a team around frontline pitching, how do they continue with a GM with such a horrible track record when it comes to evaluating and developing starting pitchers?

    I have always been a Cashman supporter, but not anymore especially with the direction the org is headed.

    Bring Back Towers!!!

  84. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:16 pm

    “He is scheduled to have arthroscopic surgery to repair the tear next Tuesday at the Hospital for Special Surgery. “

    Sounds like Chip was right. Arthroscopic surgery is certainly better than cutting the shoulder wide open.

  85. RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 5:16 pm

    The Yankees are saying it came on the final pitch on Saturday. After two MRIs, I’m inclinded to believe that Cashman didn’t trade for used goods. It could still be a spin job, maybe this injury actually occured during Spring Training, but it’s hard to say.

  86. Benny Blanco April 25th, 2012 at 5:17 pm

    Randy is somewhere crafting up his next post. I fully expect him to drop a bomb.

  87. JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:17 pm

    Another good shoulder surgery article….

    http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/.....id=5568179

  88. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:17 pm

    Rich in NJ April 25th, 2012 at 5:09 pm

    “Jack Z is smoking cigars in Safeco right now toasting with very old single malt.”

    ————

    Lol why did they constantly try to deal with him.

    He wanted Hughes for Washburn
    then wanted Ajax for Washburn
    The Cliff Lee fiasco
    And now Pineda

  89. yankeefeminista April 25th, 2012 at 5:17 pm

    Fragile young arms… the risk was huge, but we played with fire and got burned. Dumb. #heartsick

  90. Rich in NJ April 25th, 2012 at 5:18 pm

    “I have always been a Cashman supporter, but not anymore especially with the direction the org is headed.”

    So was I until the day this trade was made. The thought process was too flawed and the risk too great.

  91. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:19 pm

    RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 5:16 pm

    The Yankees are saying it came on the final pitch on Saturday. After two MRIs, I’m inclinded to believe that Cashman didn’t trade for used goods. It could still be a spin job, maybe this injury actually occured during Spring Training, but it’s hard to say.

    ———–

    Oh no.it is a spin job to cover his ass.

  92. JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:19 pm

    @DavidWaldstein

    Pineda will miss a whole year

  93. yankeefeminista April 25th, 2012 at 5:19 pm

    When is Cashman’s press conference?

  94. yankeefeminista April 25th, 2012 at 5:20 pm

    Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:19 pm
    RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 5:16 pm

    The Yankees are saying it came on the final pitch on Saturday. After two MRIs, I’m inclinded to believe that Cashman didn’t trade for used goods. It could still be a spin job, maybe this injury actually occured during Spring Training, but it’s hard to say.

    ———–

    Oh no.it is a spin job to cover his ass.
    _____
    On the final pitch? Yeah, right.

  95. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 5:20 pm

    Depending on the seriousness of the tear and the resultant surgery sure Pineda could come back.

    But I seriously doubt he’ll ever have the kind of blazing FB that he had.

    Does he need that to be successful ?

    maybe not.

    Depends on his ability to develop stronger 2ndary pitches.

    It will certainly set back his development and lower his cieling IMO.

    I am sorry for him. I hope things go as well as can be expected and he heals well.

    Just incredible.

  96. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:20 pm

    “at this point, all we can hope for is that the tear is more minor and can be repaired with a minimum of intervention.”

    Sounds that way. I don’t play the blame game without adequate reason MTU. And I don’t get charged up about things without knowing I need to get charged up. (I’m not saying you’re doing that, merely explaining my reaction)

    It is what it is. Now we hope for the best and realize life goes on and we have a game to win tonight.

    The ONLY thing I feel about this is sad for Pineda. I won’t waste a whit of my energy on fighting windmills.

    I respect the way you’re looking at it. I know you respect mine in return.

    :)

  97. Nick in SF April 25th, 2012 at 5:20 pm

    Shootout in the Champions League semi-final, on FX right now. #lookingforward

  98. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:20 pm

    And he’s missing the entire yr. This thing sucks so bad.

  99. JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:20 pm

    Mark Feinsand ? @BloggingBombers

    Dr. Ahmad said if rehab goes well, Pineda could be ready to pitch in major league games in 12 months. Best-case he’s looking at late-April.

  100. Giuseppe Franco April 25th, 2012 at 5:21 pm

    Rich in NJ April 25th, 2012 at 5:18 pm

    So was I until the day this trade was made. The thought process was too flawed and the risk too great.

    ———-

    That makes three of us.

  101. yankeefeminista April 25th, 2012 at 5:21 pm

    Rich in NJ April 25th, 2012 at 5:18 pm
    “I have always been a Cashman supporter, but not anymore especially with the direction the org is headed.”

    So was I until the day this trade was made. The thought process was too flawed and the risk too great.
    _____
    +1. Huge Cashman supporter up until the trade. No longer.

  102. JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:21 pm

    Mark Feinsand ? @BloggingBombers

    Cashman does not believe SEA sold him damaged goods. “Michael has never had a shoulder issue … This is just an unfortunate circumstance.”

  103. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:22 pm

    YF – I gave a rundown on today’s SWB game a few threads back. If you don’t feel like dealing with it now, you can give it a read later. I really liked what I saw from Warren, despite the runs he gave up.

  104. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:22 pm

    Looks like Hughes might just get a full yr in the rotation

  105. raymagnetic April 25th, 2012 at 5:23 pm

    Who didn’t see this coming?

    Karma is a beeyatch. You don’t trade your potential superstar bat for anything less than a fully developed ace.

  106. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:23 pm

    “Dr. Ahmad said if rehab goes well, Pineda could be ready to pitch in major league games in 12 months. Best-case he’s looking at late-April.”

    :)

    Good news.

  107. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 5:23 pm

    Not surprised that even in the best case that Pineda will miss a season.

  108. Nick in SF April 25th, 2012 at 5:23 pm

    Please, people, get a grip.

    Jamie Moyer has shown us that you can’t evaluate a pitcher’s career until he’s pushing 50.

    Get back to me in 2039 and we’ll talk about who “won” the trade.

  109. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:23 pm

    JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:21 pm

    Mark Feinsand ? @BloggingBombers

    Cashman does not believe SEA sold him damaged goods. “Michael has never had a shoulder issue … Thisisjustan unfortunate circumstance.”

    —————

    Lol unfortunatel circumstance yet another pitcher under his watch has been messed up.

  110. Nilsson April 25th, 2012 at 5:24 pm

    Really sad. First I feel bad for Pineda and then to read some of these self-righteous, gleeful posts. Really sad.

    Let’s hope MP can buck the odds and comeback from this as close to full capacity as possible.

  111. JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:24 pm

    # Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:22 pm

    Looks like Hughes might just get a full yr in the rotation
    ___________________

    Yep. And I don’t think Freddy is going anywhere

  112. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:24 pm

    “Who didn’t see this coming?

    Karma is a beeyatch. You don’t trade your potential superstar bat for anything less than a fully developed ace.”

    You really think a team was going to trade away a full-developed ace for Montero straight up?????

    Not happening in this lifetime. He was just one of the pieces in the Cliff Lee deal. The Ys were set on trading Montero. This was the trade, unfortunately.

  113. yankfan April 25th, 2012 at 5:25 pm

    there is NO defending cashman on this….this is a firable offense and he needs to be fired….traded a blue chip prospect for damaged goods who may never be the same

    he is too busy cheating on his wife to run a baseball team

    fire him

  114. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 5:25 pm

    I feel horrible for Pineda. It’s not his fault that our moron GM who was too busy trying to catch his blackmailer traded 2 valuable pieces for him.

    Cashman needs to go and they need a real baseball mind with an eye for scouting and player development in the front office.

    Enough is enough now.

    This a multi-billion dollar franchise that is being led by Gilligan.

  115. austinmac April 25th, 2012 at 5:26 pm

    Cashman is wrong about not seeing it in the first MRI means it didn’t exist. I know it from my friend’s personal, now operated on, shoulder. Further, why do a dye MRI unless it sees things plain film MRIs do not?

    I don’t make baseless charges, but I believe Cashman is being ignorant or dishonest.

  116. Captain Clutch April 25th, 2012 at 5:26 pm

    Cashman is a moron. Trading or signing any pitcher is a risk but especially the drop of his velocity in the 2nd half of last year should of been a big red flag. The Mariners definitely knew that he wasn’t 100% and that’s why he was available. Cashman is completely lost in the pitching department. They handled Pineda the same why they did Hughes. His velocity wasn’t there and everyone knew that something was wrong and of course they did the worst thing and let him pitch through it and make it worse.

  117. blake April 25th, 2012 at 5:26 pm

    Either way…..Cashman knew the risk when he made the deal for a young pitcher…..that’s why you dont trade you g hitters for young pitchers.

    I vote back to the old way where the Yanks get what they need WITHOUT traditional g their best prospect for it…….meaning……spend the money to sign Cole Hamels Hal.

  118. Betsy April 25th, 2012 at 5:26 pm

    I’m never one to blame the team for players’ injuries or performances, but IMO, this is ALL on the Yankees. I do not believe for one second that Pineda was damaged goods. He had shoulder weakness, like Phil – and yet, per Girardi, that ST start was a big one for Pineda. I said at the time that that was a joke and it turned out to be that – a bad one.

    I feel so sorry for Pineda that he got traded to a team that is so irresponsible when it comes to pitching. IMO, this is gross negligence and incompetence.

  119. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:26 pm

    “Really sad. First I feel bad for Pineda and then to read some of these self-righteous, gleeful posts. Really sad.

    Let’s hope MP can buck the odds and comeback from this as close to full capacity as possible.”

    Yes. I’m not surprised by the tenor of some of the posts, having been around lohud for a while now. I’m sure you’re not either.

    It takes all kinds.

  120. LGY April 25th, 2012 at 5:26 pm

    trisha – true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:23 pm
    “Dr. Ahmad said if rehab goes well, Pineda could be ready to pitch in major league games in 12 months. Best-case he’s looking at late-April.”

    Good news.

    ———

    It’s good news that the best case scenario is Pineda missing a full year of baseball?

  121. Betsy April 25th, 2012 at 5:27 pm

    As far as I’m concerned, both Girardi and Cashman need to go.

  122. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 5:28 pm

    I

    TOLD

    YOU

    SO!

  123. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:28 pm

    LGY April 25th, 2012 at 5:16 pm

    If the Yankees want to build a team around frontline pitching, how do they continue with a GM with such a horrible track record when it comes to evaluatingand developing starting pitchers?

    ————

    He’ll give you his spin. Pineda will be back strong, we expect full recovery, etc.

  124. LGY April 25th, 2012 at 5:29 pm

    @ESPNNYYankees: mets physician Altchek dping the surgery at Pineda’s request

  125. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:29 pm

    “It’s good news that the best case scenario is Pineda missing a full year of baseball?”

    Please. After the typical premature postmortem I read on here, I’m joyful that it’s just a full season of baseball. Heck, TJ recovery is longer than that and lots of players end up with that.

    Pineda is a young man. He has that on his side too.

    Sorry but I’m not going to vomit bile over this. I’ll look at the best-case scenario and be thankful for it. I’m an optimist by nature. I can’t get down over this. I was prepared to hear anything. So it could have been worse.

  126. austinmac April 25th, 2012 at 5:29 pm

    RAB is reporting it is good news as it is a discrete(misspelled by the reporter)year. I think discrete means pulled away or separated from it’s attachment. I don’t believe that answers the severity issue. The better hope is it was not severe or obvious enough in his first MRI(or two) to be noticed.

  127. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:30 pm

    Also, what’s good news is that it’s arthroscopic surgery.

  128. yankfan April 25th, 2012 at 5:30 pm

    this is a prime reason why you never give up so much for pitching prospect…a established ace is different….also shows why they shouldve gone after Yu Darvish

    he wouldve just cost cash, not prospects

    now yanks have no young ace and lost their best prospect

    fire cashman

  129. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:30 pm

    LGY April 25th, 2012 at 5:26 pm

    trisha – true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:23 pm “Dr. Ahmad said if rehab goes well, Pineda could be ready to pitch in major league games in 12 months. Best-case he’s looking at late-April.”

    Good news.

    ———

    It’s good news that the best case scenario is Pineda missing a full year of baseball?

    ——————

    If the worst case was career ending then I guess season ending is the bright spot.

  130. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 5:30 pm

    Doesn’t our genius PC Rothschild bear some responsibility in this ?

  131. RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 5:30 pm

    Jesus Montero can just as easily get injured, if he actually ever catches with any regularity. Wise up people. This was definitely the risk Cashman ran for trading for a pitcher, but he made a great value for value trade. You’re lying to yourself if you think otherwise.

  132. raymagnetic April 25th, 2012 at 5:30 pm

    “trisha – true pinstriped blue says:
    April 25, 2012 at 5:24 pm
    “Who didn’t see this coming?

    Karma is a beeyatch. You don’t trade your potential superstar bat for anything less than a fully developed ace.”

    You really think a team was going to trade away a full-developed ace for Montero straight up?????

    Not happening in this lifetime. He was just one of the pieces in the Cliff Lee deal. The Ys were set on trading Montero. This was the trade, unfortunately.”

    No I didn’t think Montero would get traded at all to be totally honest with you.
    There was absolutely no need to trade him

  133. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 5:31 pm

    None of us are cheering that Pineda is injured. We don’t blame him.

    We’re furious that the team traded what they did for him when red flags were waving all over the place.

    There’s a difference.

    As for his prospects coming back from this, historically they are not good. They could be saying “small tear” and then go in and realize it’s much worse. There’s no positive way to spin this.

    We traded a plus young bat who could catch and a back of the rotation starter for a guy who now has to learn how to pitch again with diminished capacity.

  134. yankfan April 25th, 2012 at 5:32 pm

    you will never see pineada again the same like last year, he will lose that velocity

    the question is if he can mold himself into a location movement pitcher post surgery

    either way, he should never have been traded for due to his bad 2nd half performance

    fire cashman for this blunder

  135. GreenBeret7 April 25th, 2012 at 5:32 pm

    tomingeorgia April 25th, 2012 at 5:15 pm
    GB7,
    Carpenter seems to be doing OK. A lot of these people would not have responded as McCauliff did, and hoisted the white flag. I wish the kid the best.

    ————————————————————————————————————————-

    Tom,

    Hard to believe that there are so many out of work GMs, pitching and hitting coaches and surgeons that hang out on this board all day long, along with all of the experts of everything. It’s obvious that there’s no chance that Pineda was hurt during ST….has to be damaged goods. cashman took an injured pitcher just to get Montero out of the organization so Girardi would be happy to not have an offensive minded catcher.

  136. luis April 25th, 2012 at 5:32 pm

    I don’t have to much time. I am sorry for the poor kid. Le’s hope for his quick recovery.

    I liked what Cashman did rebuilding the farm. But he needs to go.

  137. blake April 25th, 2012 at 5:32 pm

    Pineda has anterior labral tear, will have surgery next week By Mike Axisa

    Via Mark Feinsand, right-hander Michael Pineda has an anterior labral tear and will undergo arthroscopic surgery at Dr. David Altchek’s office next Tuesday. I suppose the good news is that they can use a scope and won’t have to cut him open, plus it’s not the rotator cuff or capsule. We’ll update with more info as we get it, but the Google tells me anywhere from 3-6 months recovery.

    http://www.riveraveblues.com

  138. Nick in SF April 25th, 2012 at 5:33 pm

    I had a bad feeling when Freddy Garcia slapped Pineda on his shoulder before the last Spring Training start and said “good luck, kid.”

  139. yankfan April 25th, 2012 at 5:33 pm

    a hitter can return from a shoulder injury much better than a pitcher

    pineada will have to relearn how to pitch as his velo will be gone

  140. JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:34 pm

    It is good news that they think it will only require arthoscopic surgery. However, there remains the possibility that when they go in they realize the tear is worse and it requires an incision. If that’s the case the recovery period will be much longer.

  141. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:35 pm

    “If the worst case was career ending then I guess season ending is the bright spot.”

    That’s exactly how I feel.

    **********

    raymagnetic I didn’t think he’d ever be traded either, but I definitely read those tealeaves wrong. The reason for trading him (whether we like it or not or agree with it or not) is that they had nowhere to put him. They prefer Romine, and they have a revolving-door DH. You know that. So that was the need to trade him.

  142. Betsy April 25th, 2012 at 5:35 pm

    I’m not furious about red flags, I’m furious about how they handled the kid once he got here. So Pineda struggled a bit in the 2nd half last year – that’s no big deal to me. They should have taken ALL the time in the world with him in ST – not tell the press it’s a big start for him so the poor kid takes all the pressure on himself and pushes himself. It’s very disturbing.

  143. LGY April 25th, 2012 at 5:35 pm

    trisha – true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:29 pm
    “It’s good news that the best case scenario is Pineda missing a full year of baseball?”

    Please. After the typical premature postmortem I read on here, I’m joyful that it’s just a full season of baseball. Heck, TJ recovery is longer than that and lots of players end up with that.

    Pineda is a young man. He has that on his side too.

    Sorry but I’m not going to vomit bile over this. I’ll look at the best-case scenario and be thankful for it. I’m an optimist by nature. I can’t get down over this. I was prepared to hear anything. So it could have been worse.

    ——-

    It’s not simply about returning to the mound. TJ surgery, even with a potentially slower recovery, would have been better news because we know how successful that surgery has been.

    With shoulder surgery, there is a distinct and potentially likely possibility Pineda is never remotely the same pitcher he was.

  144. NY Wankee April 25th, 2012 at 5:36 pm

    Pineda underwent a physical and nothing came out of that. Its easy to blame Cash for this but if there were flags, the medical should have raised them, not historical performance alone.

  145. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 5:36 pm

    “He’ll give you his spin. Pineda will be back strong, we expect full recovery, etc.”
    ==============================

    Yep… Get ready to hear Cashman and Co. talk about how “Pineda’s rotator cuff is A-Okay!”

    As if that matters… Torn labrum is something you don’t bounce back from and be anything close to what you were. PERIOD.

    I’ve been right about this every step of the way. I said this guy had shoulder problems when I saw him throw in early March. And when the Yankees said Pineda just had “inflammation” after their MRI just a few weeks ago, I told you his shoulder was blown out.

    Everything that comes out now is Brian Cashman trying to cover his @$$. That he still has a job is incredible.

  146. J. Alfred Prufrock April 25th, 2012 at 5:37 pm

    MTU April 25th, 2012 at 5:30 pm
    Doesn’t our genius PC Rothschild bear some responsibility in this ?
    ////

    Possibly, yes. When he was laboring in that ST game, and they left him in, that was stupid. And the whole ‘air it out’ thing was just wrong.

  147. Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 5:38 pm

    So according to the doctors, a small tear doesn’t show up on an MRI, so potentially had a small tear beginning to sap his velocity last year and exacerbated it this year.

  148. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:39 pm

    “Pineda underwent a physical and nothing came out of that. Its easy to blame Cash for this but if there were flags, the medical should have raised them, not historical performance alone.”

    You know, this is a good point. Cashman isn’t a doctor. And other pitchers have had tired shoulder and down second halfs because of extra innings on their pitching arms. The same thing happened to Alexi Ogando last season.

    I think we need to be careful in deciding whether blame needs to be assessed, and if so, where. JMO

  149. J. Alfred Prufrock April 25th, 2012 at 5:39 pm

    THe worst is yet to come, possibly. Cashman is still obsessed with the idea of getting someone’s young ace, which means more talent leaving the organization. Who’s next? Gary Sanchez? Mason Williams?

    Look within!

  150. blake April 25th, 2012 at 5:39 pm

    It does sound much milder than it could have been…..at least for now….but this is a bad day for the Yanks….and its why a team like the Yankees shouldn’t really ever have to trade their best prospects to take on as much risk as they did….

    Honestly….I put this as much on Hal as on Cashman if not more…..Cashman probably wanted to bid on Darvish and keep Montero…..Cashman probably wanted to sign Hamels next year…..Hal likely said no to both so he did what he did to try to improve the rotation…..

  151. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 5:39 pm

    NY Wankee April 25th, 2012 at 5:36 pm
    Pineda underwent a physical and nothing came out of that. Its easy to blame Cash for this but if there were flags, the medical should have raised them, not historical performance alone.
    ========================
    That physical was given by the same organization (run by Cashman) that said Pineda only had “inflammation” after his MRI a couple of weeks ago… RIGHT?

  152. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:39 pm

    Yep… Get ready to hear Cashman and Co. talk about how “Pineda’s rotator cuff is A-Okay!”

    As if that matters… Torn labrum is something you don’t bounce back from and be anything close to what you were. PERIOD.

    I’ve been right about this every step of the way. I said this guy had shoulder problems when I saw him throw in early March. And when the Yankees said Pineda just had “inflammation” after their MRI just a few weeks ago, I told you his shoulder was blown out.

    Everything that comes out now is Brian Cashman trying to cover his @$$. That he still has a job is incredible.

    —————–

    Yes he will do a spin job and then talk up Campos. Watch him pump up Campos as a guy to keep an eye on.

  153. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:40 pm

    “So according to the doctors, a small tear doesn’t show up on an MRI, so potentially had a small tear beginning to sap his velocity last year and exacerbated it this year.”

    JF – that’s certainly possible. It’s also possible that his velo went down from tired arm and extra innings of work. Certainly hard to know.

  154. J. Alfred Prufrock April 25th, 2012 at 5:40 pm

    Small tear is better than big tear.

    At this point, really, screw Cashman. I hope that kid gets better for his own sake. He’s been possibly abused by two organizations. I hope he can salvage his career, and at a high level.

  155. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 5:41 pm

    JAP-

    Didn’t LR also design the rehab program which led to the tear ?

    Did he really know where Pineda was at ?

    ;)

  156. austinmac April 25th, 2012 at 5:41 pm

    Here are the facts. Pineda is out a year or may never pitch in the big leagues again. Neither we nor anyone knows which it will be. Carpenter is encouraging while Bleich not so much. We can hope for the best.

  157. yankeefeminista April 25th, 2012 at 5:41 pm

    With our luck they’ll rush Campos through the system as vindication. (Just kidding. Sort of.)

  158. yankfan April 25th, 2012 at 5:41 pm

    how do we know when he tore it?

    if a small tear doesnt show up on mri, is it not possible they didnt see it during his physical?

    but why would you trade for some1 who had such a bad 2nd half? thats a red flag

    cashman needs to go

  159. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:41 pm

    Honestly….I put this as much on Hal as on Cashman if not more…..Cashman probably wanted to bid on Darvish and keep Montero…..Cashman probably wanted to sign Hamels next year…..Hal likely said no to both so he did what he did to try to improve the rotation

    ————–

    True but Cash has been trying to trade Jesus for yrs and they did throw out a big contract to Lee.

  160. PacoDooley April 25th, 2012 at 5:42 pm

    You have to at least hope that Pineda spends his time getting into shape…

  161. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 5:42 pm

    RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 5:30 pm
    Jesus Montero can just as easily get injured,
    ==========================
    Montero can’t “just as easily get injured” as Pineda because Pineda was ALREADY INJURED, dopey.

  162. tomingeorgia April 25th, 2012 at 5:42 pm

    GB7,
    Every body has a t least two things, an opinion and . . .

  163. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:43 pm

    “That physical was given by the same organization (run by Cashman) that said Pineda only had “inflammation” after his MRI a couple of weeks ago… RIGHT?”

    Certainly you’re not suggesting that Cashman was master-minding some large cover-up and decided to throw Pineda back out there, only to feel more pain than he already felt, so he could say the tear was not discernible. I can understand (though I don’t necessarily agree right now) upset with Cashman, but don’t take it to ridiculous lengths.

    Again, Cashman is not a doctor, nor a radiologist. He depends on the information he receives from the professionals.

  164. blake April 25th, 2012 at 5:43 pm

    “True but Cash has been trying to trade Jesus for yrs and they did throw out a big contract to Lee.”

    He shopped him for veteran established #1 starters though…..Halladay and Lee.

  165. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:43 pm

    austinmac April 25th, 2012 at 5:41 pm

    Here are the facts. Pineda is out a year or may never pitch in the big leagues again. Neither we nor anyone knows which it will be. Carpenter is encouraging while Bleich not so much. We can hope for the best

    ———–

    Given this organizations history with young pitchers it’s not looking good.

  166. Captain Clutch April 25th, 2012 at 5:44 pm

    It’s amazing how the Yanks just went through this with Hughes and they didn’t learn anything from that. As soon as they saw that Pineda was only throwing 90 mph they should of shut him down to find out why. Everyone was questioning where his velocity was and what was wrong with him and they continued to ignore it. That was just stupid. Now they have to hope that the surgery is successful and they get something out of this trade.

  167. J. Alfred Prufrock April 25th, 2012 at 5:44 pm

    Honestly….I put this as much on Hal as on Cashman if not more…..Cashman probably wanted to bid on Darvish and keep Montero…..Cashman probably wanted to sign Hamels next year…..Hal likely said no to both so he did what he did to try to improve the rotation…..
    ///

    Sorry, no pity for Cashman. He could have signed Kuroda and left it alone, as I said to you yesterday and to which you agreed. He could have actually used guys we already have to fill in. If he wanted pitching from without, he didn’t have to go the the extreme and sacrifice Montero for it.

  168. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:44 pm

    Still shopped him though

  169. Don Vito A. Bellamo April 25th, 2012 at 5:44 pm

    Is it too late to gamble on Roy Oswalt? ;-)

  170. RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 5:44 pm

    Wake up and smell the coffee – all prospects carry risk. Pitchers probably carry more risk than every day players, but that’s the trade off you make. Banuelos/Betances are hardly showing they’re locks for big league aces.

    It sucks. Cashman took on risk. It’s gone wrong. That’s all there is to it. There’s no conspiracy, it wasn’t the worst decision in the world (unless Montero has some type of Hall of Fame career I guess), and it wasn’t an outrageously stupid decision.

  171. austinmac April 25th, 2012 at 5:45 pm

    The logic does support that sometime towards the end of last year he started the tear which caused diminished velocity in his last start. It should raise at least a yellow flag. I wonder if dye MRIs ever occur before trades or are they too intrusive.

  172. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 5:45 pm

    yankfan April 25th, 2012 at 5:41 pm
    how do we know when he tore it?

    if a small tear doesnt show up on mri, is it not possible they didnt see it during his physical?
    ================================
    Screw the physical… The Yankees gave him an MRI two weeks ago and didn’t see it!

    Michael Pineda was available FOR A REASON, people! His velocity fell through the floor over night FOR A REASON!

  173. JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:45 pm

    MarcCarig yes. the Bedard comp is not encouraging. But it’s the closest I can find for now.

  174. RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 5:46 pm

    CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 5:42 pm
    RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 5:30 pm
    Jesus Montero can just as easily get injured,
    ==========================
    Montero can’t “just as easily get injured” as Pineda because Pineda was ALREADY INJURED, dopey.

    —————-

    Montero’s been injured in his career too. What’s your point? Montero can get hit by a bus tomorrow. These are humans, this is life, and this is baseball, all three of those are highly unpredictable.

  175. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:46 pm

    “Small tear is better than big tear.

    …I hope that kid gets better for his own sake. He’s been possibly abused by two organizations. I hope he can salvage his career, and at a high level.”

    Amen

  176. Nick in SF April 25th, 2012 at 5:46 pm

    Trade for Chien-ming Wang, Mr. Cashman.

    Pineda needs a roadmap for a shoulder-surgery comeback.

    Wang needs to come back to an organization that’s more compatible with his lifestyle.

    Make it happen.

  177. blake April 25th, 2012 at 5:47 pm

    JAP,

    Yea I agree…..all im saying is that I doubt Cashman makes the move if he felt like the funds were available to go after Darvish or Hamels……I can see them trading more for Garza now or something like that.

  178. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:47 pm

    “Montero can’t “just as easily get injured” as Pineda because Pineda was ALREADY INJURED, dopey.”

    Already injured when?

  179. JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:47 pm

    MarcCarig Small labral tears are not visible on MRIs. When they are bigger, they can be seen. This is part of the issue with shoulder injuries.

  180. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 5:47 pm

    No Trisha… I’m not suggesting a Cashman cover up. I’m TELLING you somebody too stupid to see all the red flags hanging off this kid–red flags that date back to LAST SEPTEMBER–should not be the GM of the New York Yankees.

  181. TheBigOut April 25th, 2012 at 5:47 pm

    The Yankees are confident the Mariners knew nothing about this. Pineda has never had should issues before.

    ————–

    I’m not sure I believe this. What are they going to say ? We got sucker punched ? The whole trade was wrong from every aspect, this is just the straw to break the camels back.

  182. tomingeorgia April 25th, 2012 at 5:48 pm

    All ye without hope, enter here.

  183. Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 5:48 pm

    What’s your point? Montero can get hit by a bus tomorrow.

    Pitchers get injured, and get injured in a more severe manner than position players. Most batters don’t have an injury that completely destroys them. Where as pitchers often contend with this kind of possibility. Most hitters don’t ‘make it’ because of their skills and abilities. The pitcher grave yard of players that don’t make it in the show is littered with players that did not make it specifically because of injury.

    Don’t trade 1 for the other.

  184. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 5:49 pm

    Cashman walked up to Jack Z holding Montero and asked for Felix and Jack waved his hand and said, “these are not the droids you’re looking for”.

    He was supposed to deal him for an established ace.

    As a Yankee fan and ticket holder, I was thrilled with the glimpse I saw of Montero last September. Seeing his bat was one of the things I was most looking forward to.

    Now I feel like everyone else here who has said that deal robbed them of something they wanted to see happen.

    If we got a healthy pitcher who could pitch it would have softened the blow, but now we have a project, not a pitcher.

    On Twitter they are saying the closest comps to coming back from this are Eric Bedard.

    The Yankees need to get away from Cashman’s whole operation after this season and not allow him to make any other deals.

    If I were Hal and I was so wrapped up in the budget, I’d give Friedman in Tampa a blank check & the keys to the kingdom and tell him to run with it.

  185. JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:49 pm

    AndrewMarchand Just spoke to Seattle GM, Jack Zdurencik, he denies any prior knowledge of injury. Writing news story now.

  186. Locke April 25th, 2012 at 5:49 pm

    I don’t know if we’ll ever know 100% if we dealt for “damaged goods” or if he injured himself in that ST start. Either way, Cashman and Girardi really look irresponsible.

    Hopefully Hughes and Garcia can get back on track, Andy can continue being stretched out without any setbacks, and the Steinbrenners can stop kidding themselves about $189 payroll.

    I wish we had the BOSS back right now – heads would roll.

  187. tomingeorgia April 25th, 2012 at 5:49 pm

    Play tonight. win tonight. Go. Phil!

  188. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 5:50 pm

    “trisha – true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:47 pm
    “Montero can’t “just as easily get injured” as Pineda because Pineda was ALREADY INJURED, dopey.”

    Already injured when?”
    ======================
    When the trade was made… He blew out his shoulder just before or early during his final start last season.

    THAT’s why his velocity fell through the floor over night, THAT’s why he didn’t pick up a baseball ALL WINTER LONG, and THAT’s why a guy who had previously been COMPLETELY untouchable was suddenly available for this trade.

  189. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:50 pm

    “Wake up and smell the coffee – all prospects carry risk. Pitchers probably carry more risk than every day players, but that’s the trade off you make. Banuelos/Betances are hardly showing they’re locks for big league aces.

    It sucks. Cashman took on risk. It’s gone wrong. That’s all there is to it. There’s no conspiracy, it wasn’t the worst decision in the world (unless Montero has some type of Hall of Fame career I guess), and it wasn’t an outrageously stupid decision.”

    I agree with you Kev.

    If the Mariners felt something was up, shame on them.

    I can’t fault the Yankees for taking a chance on someone like Pineda. Again, it’s not unusual for a pitcher who adds a lot of extra innings to start to tire and then lose velocity. With that and nothing showing on an MRI, you really can’t say they were negligent in their choosing. I certainly can’t.

  190. J. Alfred Prufrock April 25th, 2012 at 5:50 pm

    RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 5:44 pm
    Wake up and smell the coffee – all prospects carry risk. Pitchers probably carry more risk than every day players, but that’s the trade off you make. Banuelos/Betances are hardly showing they’re locks for big league aces.
    ///

    Neither of those two are ready, they’re not who I’m talking about.

    I’m talking Phelps/Warren/Mitchell, each of whom would be quite serviceable. If they hadn’t traded Noesi, he would have been the other option. Banuelos and Betances are a year away.

  191. TheBigOut April 25th, 2012 at 5:50 pm

    blake April 25th, 2012 at 5:47 pm
    JAP,

    Yea I agree…..all im saying is that I doubt Cashman makes the move if he felt like the funds were available to go after Darvish or Hamels……I can see them trading more for Garza now or something like that.

    —————

    Absolutely. If Hal authorized Darvish funds this trade never would’ve occurred. You can’t blame Darvish on Cashman, but this trade was ridiculous. When ever do you trade an “A” prospect for a pitcher that showed serious concerns with regards to lost of velocity last year ?

  192. blake April 25th, 2012 at 5:50 pm

    AndrewMarchand Just spoke to Seattle GM, Jack Zdurencik, he denies any prior knowledge of injury. Writing news story now.

    Duh

  193. GreenBeret7 April 25th, 2012 at 5:51 pm

    CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 5:47 pm
    No Trisha… I’m not suggesting a Cashman cover up. I’m TELLING you somebody too stupid to see all the red flags hanging off this kid–red flags that date back to LAST SEPTEMBER–should not be the GM of the New York Yankees.

    ————————————————————————————————————————-

    Were those the same red flags waved because of Sabathia’s drop in velocity late last year?

  194. LGY April 25th, 2012 at 5:52 pm

    Montero’s been injured in his career too. What’s your point? Montero can get hit by a bus tomorrow. These are humans, this is life, and this is baseball, all three of those are highly unpredictable.

    ———-

    It’s not unpredictable that Pineda carried SIGNIFICANTLY more injury risk than Montero. That was perhaps the biggest issue with the trade so you can’t just toss it up to bad luck or “stuff happens.”

    Pineda is 1) a pitcher 2) under 25 and 4) already missed almost an entire year with elbow issues 4) throws a ton of sliders.

    This was not an upredictable or unlikely result.

  195. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:52 pm

    Are ppl still not concerned

  196. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 5:52 pm

    JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:49 pm
    AndrewMarchand Just spoke to Seattle GM, Jack Zdurencik, he denies any prior knowledge of injury. Writing news story now.
    ==========================
    What would you EXPECT him to say???

    Do you think the Mariners shut him down all winter long because they thought he was HEALTHY??? Do you think they suddenly made him available for a trade, when he had previously been completely untouchable, because they thought he was HEALTHY???

  197. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:53 pm

    5) Has a violent delivery

  198. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 5:53 pm

    “When the trade was made… He blew out his shoulder just before or early during his final start last season.”

    And you know this how?

    That is nothing more than irresponsible conjecture on your part.

    ***********

    GO YANKEES!!!

    GO PHIL!!!

    I’m hoping for the best for Pineda. I’ll leave the anger and spinning to anyone who wants to continue it. Not my style, especially without real proof of anything but lohud sayso.

    By the way, Pineda never told the Yankees he was having any pain until the night they took him out of the game. But he said he had had pain before that. I know players don’t aways tell, but there’s no way to know how much damage he inflicted upon himself in this whole deal.

    Of course, it didn’t help that he had to keep hearing about the angry mob mentality that he should be Jesus since Jesus was traded away.

    Oh well.

  199. RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 5:54 pm

    You never ever trade position players for pitchers? When did God write this rule up?

    I totally agree and understand and appreciate pitchers are riskier than position players, but it’s situation to situation. Pineda didn’t scream risk, even with his second half. His peripherals were fine in the second half.

  200. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 5:54 pm

    OK.

    We’ve got another game tonight.

    I hope we win it in convincing fashion.

    That will make me feel a little better.

    ;)

  201. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:54 pm

    What’s your point? Montero can get hit by a bus tomorrow

    —————-

    What does that have to do with it

  202. JM April 25th, 2012 at 5:55 pm

    BobKlap Barring any setbacks tonight, it’s a good bet this will be Pettitte’s final minor league start. He could face #Orioles Monday or Tuesday

  203. RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 5:55 pm

    His elbow had nothing to do with this! That’s why it’s a “sh!t happens” moment!

  204. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:55 pm

    We didn’t trade for CC

  205. Playedcatchwithmunson April 25th, 2012 at 5:56 pm

    CashmanSUX is on the money. Having had a labrum tear, they usually occurs over time and se to tear. When there is weakness or lack of armstrength, it is definitely a signal that this might be something that should be examined. The decision NOT to investigate this AGAIN, should remove evidence Cashman from pitching decisions. Seattle screwed him twice, last year with Cliff Lee and now. I felt the same seeing Jay Burner go.

  206. Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 5:56 pm

    Pineda didn’t scream risk

    Did you have ear muffs on?

  207. TheBigOut April 25th, 2012 at 5:56 pm

    G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 5:49 pm
    Cashman walked up to Jack Z holding Montero and asked for Felix and Jack waved his hand and said, “these are not the droids you’re looking for”.

    He was supposed to deal him for an established ace.

    As a Yankee fan and ticket holder, I was thrilled with the glimpse I saw of Montero last September. Seeing his bat was one of the things I was most looking forward to.

    Now I feel like everyone else here who has said that deal robbed them of something they wanted to see happen.

    If we got a healthy pitcher who could pitch it would have softened the blow, but now we have a project, not a pitcher.

    On Twitter they are saying the closest comps to coming back from this are Eric Bedard.

    The Yankees need to get away from Cashman’s whole operation after this season and not allow him to make any other deals.

    If I were Hal and I was so wrapped up in the budget, I’d give Friedman in Tampa a blank check & the keys to the kingdom and tell him to run with it.

    ===============

    The issue is Hal is not and never was a baseball guy. His dad was but he is not at all whatsoever. They rely on Cashman. I wouldn’t doubt the conversation going like this.. “Brian, we want to cut cost but we need arms, is there a trade we can make without being forced into paying for this Darvish guy?”

    Cashman, “Oh I’ll throw the farm at Seattle for King Felix”
    Hal, “excellent! do so”.

    time passes..

    Cashman, “well they won’t give us the Kind, but we can get this other kid who has a lot of potential.. Pineada”

    Hal, “well if it is that or paying 50mil posting fee, I am going ot choose that.. what do you think ?”

    Cashman, “well I prefer to go at Darvish since he only costs money not prospects, but if you’re concerned about budget/payroll, then the trade is the way to go.. ”

    Hal, “done then, let’s do the trade.. oh I’ll be away for a few weeks, I have a poetry meeting to attend and a bankers association”

    Cashman, “okay lil boss”.

  208. Dill Pickler April 25th, 2012 at 5:57 pm

    This was a horrible trade before this injury. Pineda was a risk — as far as trading Montero for him — before the injury. For years all we heard out of Cashman was that he would only trade Montero for an “ace” level pitcher — like cliff lee. Then he suddenly trades him for a guy who had 3 good months for Seattle.

    Especially when you look at our farm system — how many top level pitching prospects vs. how many top level hitting prospects — this was a horrible trade BEFORE the injury.

    Now it’s a fireable offense.

  209. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 5:57 pm

    GB, you see less than Ray Charles and he’s blind AND dead!

    You think the Mariners shut Pineda down all winter because they thought he was healthy??? You think they suddenly were willing to trade a guy who had previously been COMPLETELY unavailable because they thought he was healthy???

    Moreover, Sabathia’s drop in velocity was a steady slide that coincided with weight gain. Pineda went from 95 to 90 in the span of ONE START. And don’t give me the extra rest crap… That should make you STRONGER, not weaker, and Pineda kept his velocity in two other second-half starts with extra rest.

  210. Locke April 25th, 2012 at 5:58 pm

    Oh well. In the end the Yankees will be fine without Pineda. We’d be better with him or Montero but we’re still one of the best team in baseball.

    At least we aren’t Red Sox fans.

  211. blake April 25th, 2012 at 5:58 pm

    Hughes was probably just extended a lot more rope…..I hope he makes the most of it…..they really need hin to step up

  212. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 5:58 pm

    if he didn’t scream risk then he definitely whispered proceed with caution.

  213. LGY April 25th, 2012 at 5:59 pm

    GreenBeret7 April 25th, 2012 at 5:51 pm
    CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 5:47 pm
    No Trisha… I’m not suggesting a Cashman cover up. I’m TELLING you somebody too stupid to see all the red flags hanging off this kid–red flags that date back to LAST SEPTEMBER–should not be the GM of the New York Yankees.

    ————————————————————————————————————————-

    Were those the same red flags waved because of Sabathia’s drop in velocity late last year?

    ——-

    When did Sabathia see a velocity drop last year?????

  214. austinmac April 25th, 2012 at 5:59 pm

    Their is no way to prove the tear existed before the trade. I strongly suspect it, but trades are not voided for suspicions. Cashman’s best position is that this is just one of those things, and I traded for Pineda for the very reason pitchers can get hurt.

    The Yankees have no remedy. Bud? Does anyone really believe he would unless their were photos of the Mariners looking at prior films of the tear?

  215. jacksquat April 25th, 2012 at 5:59 pm

    Ignore on this subject:

    Cashman haters, check.

    Montero Mourners, check.

    As for the others, he had two MRI’s, before the trade, and after the first time he had pain this spring. Neither showed this. This is not Cashman’s fault.

    And it’s only 1 year, get some perspective.

  216. TheBigOut April 25th, 2012 at 5:59 pm

    Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 5:56 pm
    Pineda didn’t scream risk

    Did you have ear muffs on?

    lol

  217. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 5:59 pm

    “When the trade was made… He blew out his shoulder just before or early during his final start last season.”

    And you know this how?
    ==================
    Because I have enough common sense to know 2+2 = 4.

  218. LGY April 25th, 2012 at 6:00 pm

    Not seeing a velo drop from CC here

    http://www.fangraphs.com/pitch.....position=P

  219. blake April 25th, 2012 at 6:00 pm

    Big Out,

    Id say that’s pretty close to be honest…..at least the just of it. Darvish was a risk to……but it was a money risk only…..you didn’t lose one of the best prospects in baseball by doing it.

  220. theREALkevin April 25th, 2012 at 6:01 pm

    Cashman better root for Montero being a bust now, because if he ends up being a perennial All-Star, this could be one of the worst trades ever.

    And all because there was no room for Montero. ****ing revolving DH to give people overrated half off days. Because they love Russell “Thurman Munson” Martin soooo much. Didn’t think Montero could play D even adequately? Yeah, right.

    And if you trade a guy like Montero, you BETTER build a package around him & get a Felix Hernandez type pitcher or a young impact bat. If you can’t, you don’t do it at all. Pitchers are way more unpredictable than position players as it is, and they also carry a larger injury risk as this trade demonstrates. I was against this from day one, and unfortunately my fears have been realized.

    Passing on Darvish also looks way worse now.

  221. RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 6:02 pm

    We can all agree that this totally sucks.

  222. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 6:02 pm

    Methinks that when all is said and done, all the money Cashman thought he saved dealing Montero for Pineda will end up costing the team more than Darvish would’ve on the salary cap.

    Just a hunch.

  223. mick April 25th, 2012 at 6:02 pm

    If this occurred on the last pitch of ST then maybe Joe left him in too long?

  224. yankeefeminista April 25th, 2012 at 6:02 pm

    So, now Andy who they said would get two or three more milb starts is coming back after one milb start? Is this a PR move or is Andy suddenly actually ready for prime time?

  225. Betsy April 25th, 2012 at 6:03 pm

    Win or lose, it would make things a lot better if Phil stepped up and re-discovered his curve. Ditch the cutter. Pitch well – he’s really needed now.

  226. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 6:03 pm

    “When the trade was made… He blew out his shoulder just before or early during his final start last season.”
    —————————————————
    And you know this how?
    =============================

    To be more specific Trish, I know this because of SUDDEN loss of velocity in last start, Shut down ALL WINTER LONG, a guy who was previous untouchable is available for trade.

    Hopefully you can comprehend the Cliff Notes version. A little common sense, people. That’s all I’m asking!

  227. tomingeorgia April 25th, 2012 at 6:03 pm

    APB: Guards to all bridges. STAT!

  228. yankfan April 25th, 2012 at 6:03 pm

    http://www.slate.com/articles/.....d_him.html

  229. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 6:03 pm

    And all that’s required

  230. blake April 25th, 2012 at 6:03 pm

    They passed on Darvish…..but unless he signs an extension the Yankees still have an opportunity to do what they should have planned all along……make do this year and then buy Cole Hamels…..an established top of the rotation starter who is already past the age that most pitchers get injured.

  231. yankfan April 25th, 2012 at 6:04 pm

    i cant believe people are defending cashman for this blunder

  232. Captain Clutch April 25th, 2012 at 6:04 pm

    If the Yanks traded Montero for Felix, Lee or Halladay and this injury happened I would be ok with it and say crap happens. Pineda wasn’t worth giving up Montero for. A young pitcher with no track record in the majors was too big of a risk for this organization and didn’t make any sense. It was obvious that Montero was only trade bait to Cashman.

  233. blake April 25th, 2012 at 6:05 pm

    Im not defending Cashman…..it was a risky trade…..I just think he was probably pressed by ownership to improve the pitching…..and to do so without spending any money.

  234. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:05 pm

    “Ignore on this subject:

    Cashman haters, check.

    Montero Mourners, check.

    As for the others, he had two MRI’s, before the trade, and after the first time he had pain this spring. Neither showed this. This is not Cashman’s fault.

    And it’s only 1 year, get some perspective.”

    Good post, jacksquat.

    I’m dancing in the street that it’s arthroscopic surgery and not some career-ending injury.

    I refuse to find bogeymen under every bed just because some “creative” minds are setting landmines in the field.

    Since we don’t know the genesis of this whole thing, I’m not going to go around pointing fingers and making all kinds of accusations.

    Let’s hope this gives Phil and Freddy extra motivation to get the job done.

    And thank the lord for the return of Andy Pettitte. God sure works in strange ways!

  235. mick April 25th, 2012 at 6:06 pm

    It was obvious that Montero was only trade bait to Cashman.
    =================================
    Cashman is a puppet. He was told to do this.

  236. austinmac April 25th, 2012 at 6:06 pm

    Jacksquat,

    I have defended and argued with the Montero hall of famersbut this is very bad news. He could conceivably be back next year. That is only a weak maybe.

    The last start did raise issues. Many on this board noted it. An MRI is the usual investigation. No one can ever say it previously existed, but I sure wish they had demanded a dye injected MRI.

  237. raymagnetic April 25th, 2012 at 6:06 pm

    Jack Z ” I played Cashman like a ukelele”

  238. tomingeorgia April 25th, 2012 at 6:07 pm

    Captain, would you be happier if they traded him for Ubaldo?

  239. RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 6:07 pm

    And for the record, we saw Cashman call out the Mets organization too when he thought they injured a player. Why would he act differently now?

  240. TheBigOut April 25th, 2012 at 6:07 pm

    theREALkevin April 25th, 2012 at 6:01 pm
    Cashman better root for Montero being a bust now, because if he ends up being a perennial All-Star, this could be one of the worst trades ever.

    And all because there was no room for Montero. ****ing revolving DH to give people overrated half off days. Because they love Russell “Thurman Munson” Martin soooo much. Didn’t think Montero could play D even adequately? Yeah, right.

    And if you trade a guy like Montero, you BETTER build a package around him & get a Felix Hernandez type pitcher or a young impact bat. If you can’t, you don’t do it at all. Pitchers are way more unpredictable than position players as it is, and they also carry a larger injury risk as this trade demonstrates. I was against this from day one, and unfortunately my fears have been realized.

    Passing on Darvish also looks way worse now.

    ———————-

    Well said. The day I heard this trade, I was like WTF? ” the media especially YES tried to sell us how great Pineda was.. I wasn’t buying it. It was a bad trade to start..

  241. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 6:08 pm

    It’s not only 1 year. They have no idea if he’s going to return with a major league fastball.

    He’ll be in the minors trying to learn how to pitch again in 12 months if he’s very lucky.

    If you think he’s going to be in the Yankee rotation firing bullets in 12 months than you need some serious perspective.

  242. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:09 pm

    “i cant believe people are defending cashman for this blunder”

    Can you believe that we actually want better information before we run off half-co cked?

  243. TheBigOut April 25th, 2012 at 6:09 pm

    LOL @ the justification here.. the yankees brass can do no wrong with some of you.. if they traded jeter for a no name, you’d say “He was old I trust they know whats best”.

    a few of you are not even baseball fans here, it’s obvious you’re here for the attention. Is your life really that mundane ?

  244. mick April 25th, 2012 at 6:10 pm

    Hal calls the shots not Cash.
    This is not George’s team anymore.
    Penny wise pound foolish.

  245. JM April 25th, 2012 at 6:10 pm

    # G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 6:08 pm

    It’s not only 1 year. They have no idea if he’s going to return with a major league fastball.

    He’ll be in the minors trying to learn how to pitch again in 12 months if he’s very lucky.

    If you think he’s going to be in the Yankee rotation firing bullets in 12 months than you need some serious perspective.
    ______________________

    Yep. He’s going to have to learn how to pitch all over again, most likely with reduced velocity.

  246. theREALkevin April 25th, 2012 at 6:10 pm

    You can’t assume the Yanks can get Cole Hamels though. They thought Cliff Lee was in the bag & it blew up in their face. Hamels is from California & I could see him going to the Dodgers for example if they opened their checkbook. Regardless of where Hamels ends up, you can’t assume you’re going to get any free agent. Which is why Darvish was such a great target…. you win the posting bid, you have exclusive rights to him. The Yanks got cheap precisely at the wrong time unfortunately.

  247. JK April 25th, 2012 at 6:11 pm

    Pineda didn’t lose velocity in the second 1/2. STOP IT! He lost velocity in his LAST START pitching on 10 days rest.

    There were no warning signs!

  248. Betsy April 25th, 2012 at 6:12 pm

    Ibanez in LF………….that’s nice

  249. tomingeorgia April 25th, 2012 at 6:12 pm

    JM,
    May I see your medical boards?

  250. Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 6:13 pm

    He lost velocity in his LAST START pitching on 10 days rest.

    Pitchers are usually weak after being skipped a start. Totally normal. Not.

  251. RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 6:13 pm

    “Sign Cole Hamels: Because signing an older pitcher to a 9 year contract doesn’t carry nearly as much risk as trading for a young starter.”

  252. Locke April 25th, 2012 at 6:13 pm

    yankfan April 25th, 2012 at 6:03 pm

    http://www.slate.com/articles/…..d_him.html

    ———————————————————–

    Wow, that article makes it seem horrible. Hopefully Pineda ends up in the 3%. I really feel for the guy.

    Something that sticks out to me is that the Mariners have have multiple pitchers suffer this injury in the past.

    “The Seattle Mariners, perhaps more than any other team, have suffered on account of the labrum. When Seattle drafted 6-foot-10 Ryan Anderson in 1997, it seemed preordained that the titanic lefty would be the next Randy Johnson. Then Anderson had labrum surgery. He missed the entire 2002 season—and every season since. The Mariners’ 25-year-old right-hander Gil Meche has already missed two full years on account of labrum-related ailments. Meche returned to the majors in 2003, but faded badly in the second half.”

  253. yankfan April 25th, 2012 at 6:14 pm

    “Can you believe that we actually want better information before we run off half-co cked?”

    hear from dr andrews, who is a world expert orthapedic surgeon and what he says on labrun tears

    3% chance of returning, so sad…fire cashman

    the only thing cashman can do right is cheat on his wife, he should be in charge as ‘director of player night entertainment,’ not the GM of the team

  254. austinmac April 25th, 2012 at 6:14 pm

    Blake,

    I agree with you on these two things: the old ways of spending money was much more fun and the refusal to do so was a factor in this trade. Otherwise, Darvish would have been an obvious choice.

  255. mick April 25th, 2012 at 6:14 pm

    We don’t throw money around anymore.
    Geo. threw it up against the wall and saw if it stuck.
    Did he make mistakes, yes. But he always went after impact players.
    Now that day is over.
    Now we are going to depend on our minors like small market teams do.
    This bandaid won’t be ripped off for a few years and it might hurt bigtime.

  256. RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 6:14 pm

    Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 6:13 pm
    He lost velocity in his LAST START pitching on 10 days rest.

    Pitchers are usually weak after being skipped a start. Totally normal. Not.

    ———–

    And Pitchers never lose their velocity in one outing and regain it the next.

    Absolutisms!

  257. TheBigOut April 25th, 2012 at 6:15 pm

    Al Leiter just said he felt something was wrong with Pineda last year, “You do not lose 5-7MPH at that age for no reason”

    Al Leiter for GM.

  258. theREALkevin April 25th, 2012 at 6:15 pm

    Cole Hamels will only be 29 next season. That is not old at all for pitcher. Also, who said he’s going to get 9 years? And you’d be risking money, not your top prospect.

  259. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:15 pm

    CashmanSUX, common sense could also tell you that a pitcher who wasn’t under the Joba rules and had a ton of extra inings would tire and have bad starts and lose velocity. Again, I use Alexi Ogando as an example. Ogando went through the same thing last season. He now has a 1.00 ERA and a .44 WHIP. No torn labrum.

    There isn’t just one possible answer to this scenario. I believe in being fair and getting all the information I can and not jumping to conclusions.

    And about him being shut down all winter long – the Yankees were in trade talks with the Mariners. For all you know the Ms could have told him not to play winter ball because they didn’t want anything to happen to him. Also, wouldn’t it be prudent for them to shut him down if he was operating from tired arm syndrome from overuse? Of course, it would.

    There are more possibilities than the ones you’ve sugggested.

  260. Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 6:16 pm

    And Pitchers never lose their velocity in one outing and regain it the next.

    6 mph? Yea generally no.

  261. LGY April 25th, 2012 at 6:16 pm

    So, the Yankees will be entering next winter with CC, Nova, and possibly Hughes penciled in the rotation.

    For a guy that claims to value starting pitching so much, Cash is somehow desperate for starters every winter.

  262. TheBigOut April 25th, 2012 at 6:17 pm

    P.S. Al Leiter came back from a torn labrum.

  263. yankfan April 25th, 2012 at 6:17 pm

    for those who missed the link first

    here it is

    http://www.slate.com/articles/.....d_him.html

    3% chance, good luck cashman

  264. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 6:17 pm

    It’s not the Yankees fault that that this frickin’ CBA went into effect when it did.

    They want to reset the tax.

    I don’t blame them. They are subsidizing teams like all get out.

    And they shouldn’t continue to do it IMO.

    Unfortunately, it has temporarily comprised their financial edge.

  265. Niblick April 25th, 2012 at 6:18 pm

    Cashman has been way too busy playing with his girlfriend. It’s time for him to hit the showers and let someone with a bit of common sense, a few brains, and an interest in actually doing a job, instead of having affairs, take over.

  266. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 6:18 pm

    edit : compromised. But it does comprise their financial edge. weaker though it may be.

    sorry.

  267. RadioKev April 25th, 2012 at 6:18 pm

    theREALkevin April 25th, 2012 at 6:15 pm
    Cole Hamels will only be 29 next season. That is not old at all for pitcher. Also, who said he’s going to get 9 years? And you’d be risking money, not your top prospect.
    ——————

    29 with a 7-9 year contract equals an older pitcher at some point, who you’re paying big bucks for. You can’t say it’s just “risking money.” I get that it’s not your money, but the team’s money is still critical to the team.

    Evil twin, we meet again!

  268. mick April 25th, 2012 at 6:19 pm

    Unfortunately, it has temporarily comprised their financial edge.
    ========================
    They are not our fathers Yankees anymore.

  269. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 6:19 pm

    You might as well put Phelps in the rotation this season so you develop him to be a part of it next season.

    Make Freddy the long man.

    At least then we have CC, Nova, Hughes & Phelps penciled in before next off season.

  270. NY Wankee April 25th, 2012 at 6:19 pm

    [quote] Cashman SUX: Because I have enough common sense to know 2+2 = 4. [/quote]

    Thank god for that, because if it wasn’t it would somehow be Cashman’s fault.

    Bidding so low on Darvish was really stupid though and that I fault Cashman for.

  271. RMS April 25th, 2012 at 6:20 pm

    If Pineda’s velocity drops teach him how to throw a knuckle ball.
    It’s Cashman’s fault-No
    It’s the dr. who read the 1st mri incorrectly-No
    Injuries happen, get over it.

    As far as Montero. A 22 year old as a DH is a waste and will limit his career (no NL.)
    There is not a DH who is anywhere near Montero’s age.
    Let him catch or find another position.

  272. jacksquat April 25th, 2012 at 6:21 pm

    G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 6:08 pm
    It’s not only 1 year. They have no idea if he’s going to return with a major league fastball.

    He’ll be in the minors trying to learn how to pitch again in 12 months if he’s very lucky.

    If you think he’s going to be in the Yankee rotation firing bullets in 12 months than you need some serious perspective.

    I don’t think he is accruing service time if he has to spend extensive time in the minors next year. So nothing really lost there, just pushed back.

    Either way, my main point is Cashman has to rely on information from expert doctors for health evaluations, and they showed no problem. One start with diminished velocity at the end of the year on 10 days rest does not mean anything.

  273. mick April 25th, 2012 at 6:21 pm

    It’s not the Yankees fault that that this frickin’ CBA went into effect when it did.
    =================
    It starts at the top MTU.
    Geo. would have spent like a drunken sailor, screw the luxury cap.
    It’s a different direction we are headed toward.
    Our HOF IF will get old, then what?

  274. TheBigOut April 25th, 2012 at 6:21 pm

    I think it’s time we ban the ban on steroids. Get our offense batting averages up again so we don’t have to rely so much on starting pitching.. I just couldn’t resist.

  275. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 6:21 pm

    FYI – That 22yo DH is catching Felix tonight.

  276. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:22 pm

    Thanks for the May 2004 article JM. I think I’ll pass on that.

    “hear from dr andrews, who is a world expert orthapedic surgeon and what he says on labrun tears

    3% chance of returning, so sad…fire cashman”

    Did Dr. Andrews examine him? Has he seen the MRI? Is this “3%” from the same May 2004 article JM linked to? Have there been any advances between 2004 and 2012?

    The man doing the surgery said that he’ll be back next April at the latest.

    I think I’ll go with that prognosis.

  277. Niblick April 25th, 2012 at 6:22 pm

    So the trade really boils down to Montero and Noesi for Campos.

    Campos better be the next coming of Clemens.

  278. theREALkevin April 25th, 2012 at 6:23 pm

    RadioKev, LOL, indeed.

    Yeah, I know it’s not my money…. but if we’re strictly comparing just the two scenarios, I’d prefer signing a guy like Hamels over trading my best prospect for a unproven albeit talented pitcher who possibly had some red flags. I don’t think Cole will demand 10 years or something absurd like a position player like Albert. And many pitchers can pitch at a high level well into their 30s, so there’s that. I understand your argument though.

  279. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:23 pm

    “FYI – That 22yo DH is catching Felix tonight.”

    And?

  280. Dill Pickler April 25th, 2012 at 6:23 pm

    What difference does it make how old your dh is?
    If a 22-year-old dh hits a home run, do the umps change it to a double because he’s only 22?
    Ridiculous argument.

  281. mick April 25th, 2012 at 6:23 pm

    The man doing the surgery said that he’ll be back next April at the latest.
    ======================
    Please define “back.”

  282. Captain Clutch April 25th, 2012 at 6:24 pm

    If Hamels doesn’t resign with the Phillies the Dodgers or some other team is going to give him a ton of money. I would love for the Yanks to sign him but I think everyone knows that Hal won’t be playing in that play ground. If they were even considering it than they wouldn’t of traded for Pineda. It would of been nice to have Montero and Darvish or Hamels. But Hal is all about saving money now and that’s most likely why the Pineda deal was made.

  283. TheBigOut April 25th, 2012 at 6:24 pm

    G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 6:21 pm
    FYI – That 22yo DH is catching Felix tonight.

    ———

    UGHH I was waiting for that, but I expected different uniforms !

  284. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 6:24 pm

    Apparently, the 22yo DH knows how to catch an ace pitcher and isn’t just a DH.

  285. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:25 pm

    “If Pineda’s velocity drops teach him how to throw a knuckle ball.
    It’s Cashman’s fault-No
    It’s the dr. who read the 1st mri incorrectly-No
    Injuries happen, get over it.”

    Unless and until I know otherwise, I am in agreement.

  286. G. Love April 25th, 2012 at 6:25 pm

    Right now, I hope Dellin Betances realizes the door is open wider for him than it has ever been. Get those mechanics in order young man and come claim your spot here.

  287. mick April 25th, 2012 at 6:25 pm

    Apparently, the 22yo DH knows how to catch an ace pitcher and isn’t just a DH.
    ==================
    The Arod contract.

  288. mick April 25th, 2012 at 6:26 pm

    Right now, I hope Dellin Betances realizes the door is open wider for him than it has ever been. Get those mechanics in order young man and come claim your spot here.
    =================
    Later, rather than sooner.
    Now theyre rushing Andy..

  289. Bret The Hitman April 25th, 2012 at 6:27 pm

    Curtis Granderson just lost his job in favor of Cole Hamels or Zack Greinke.

  290. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 6:27 pm

    yes Mick it’s true.

    We will not spend money like we used for a while.

    GMS did not worry about that.

    His son does. He’s a number cruncher. Not a baseball man.

    He does not share the same passion.

    The only way they will spend is if things turn sour. I don’t think they will.

    At least not right now, and not sufficiently to cause the dam to break.

  291. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:27 pm

    “Apparently, the 22yo DH knows how to catch an ace pitcher and isn’t just a DH.”

    So now it’s time to crucify the Yankee organization for prefering Romine because you wanted Montero? They were NOT impressed with his catching ability. They had OTHERS in the system they held in higher regard!

    Is that so difficult to comprehend?

  292. luis April 25th, 2012 at 6:27 pm

    If you miss once is ok.

    If you missed twice is ok.

    If you missed thrice is ok

    I am sorry, but when are you going to wake up?

    It baffles me the amount of excuses people come up with to save C’s A-s.

    He makes the same mistakes over and over again. At some point you have to understand that he won’t be able to learn from them and it is time to move on.

    Oppenheimer for GM

  293. yankfan April 25th, 2012 at 6:28 pm

    cashman is such a slick salesman, its amazing to see how many people here buy the BS he is selling

  294. JK April 25th, 2012 at 6:29 pm

    Didn’t Wang come back from shoulder surgery in the Yankees minors?

    Bleich had a serious tear and has not been seen since. Cotham on the other hand had shoulder surgery and has comeback throwing the ball fine since last year.

    It doesn’t sound like this is a major tear, the cuff is fine and he’s not going to get cut open. Hopefully the kid is a hard worker.

  295. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 6:29 pm

    fan-

    That Slate article was just dismal.

    Just unbelieveable.

    Odds not good.

    Hope he is one of the few lucky ones.

  296. mick April 25th, 2012 at 6:29 pm

    Cash does what he’s told…

  297. HebrewHammer April 25th, 2012 at 6:30 pm

    Derek Jeter SS — on fire — clutching lately – still diving for pitches out of zone with RISP
    Curtis Granderson CF — lost – short porch fever
    Alex Rodriguez 3B — gone forever – auto out – he should never speak to the media with his fakeness
    Robinson Cano 2B — lost when I grew up I wanna be Vlad Guerrero (I did win the HR derby)
    Mark Teixeira 1B — gone forever – auto out – will have 36 HR’s but a .227 BA
    Nick Swisher RF — good for an occasional HR, more often lost — hal will take discount instead of Hamilton
    Raul Ibanez LF — hungry and passionate but Damon or Matsui was the answer
    Eric Chavez DH — still thinking of retiring but good for bench player
    Russell Martin C — all defense and auto out

    whatta potent offense

  298. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 6:30 pm

    At this point, to believe Brian Cashman did NOT trade for damaged goods in Pineda requires a string of coincidences that is just too long to fathom.

  299. GreenBeret7 April 25th, 2012 at 6:31 pm

    In other news, Carl Crawford is going to Birmingham to see Dr. James Andrews about his elbow. So far that’s been a $142 mil disaster. Who’s going to admit wanting him in Pinstripes? Come on, now. There were plenty of you.

  300. yankfan April 25th, 2012 at 6:31 pm

    “Apparently, the 22yo DH knows how to catch an ace pitcher and isn’t just a DH.”

    So now it’s time to crucify the Yankee organization for prefering Romine because you wanted Montero? They were NOT impressed with his catching ability. They had OTHERS in the system they held in higher regard!

    Is that so difficult to comprehend?”

    romine has a bad back, LOL

    even if you dont like montero, trade him for a established vet, not a damaged goods

  301. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 6:32 pm

    If you read the Slate article posted above you find out that labrum tears are worse than almost any other type of arm injury.

    The successful return rate is very poor.

  302. HebrewHammer April 25th, 2012 at 6:32 pm

    I like you. You’re nice.

  303. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 6:33 pm

    yankfan April 25th, 2012 at 6:28 pm
    cashman is such a slick salesman, its amazing to see how many people here buy the BS he is selling
    ========================
    It’s easy to sell to Kool Aid-guzzling sheep.

    Now Cashman is actually trying to convince people that Pineda’s injury happened on the very last pitch in that rehab start.

    CYA!

  304. mick April 25th, 2012 at 6:33 pm

    If you read the Slate article posted above you find out that labrum tears are worse than almost any other type of arm injury.

    The successful return rate is very poor
    =======================
    may be why he was crying.

  305. HebrewHammer April 25th, 2012 at 6:34 pm

    GreenBeret7 April 25th, 2012 at 6:31 pm
    In other news, Carl Crawford is going to Birmingham to see Dr. James Andrews about his elbow. So far that’s been a $142 mil disaster. Who’s going to admit wanting him in Pinstripes? Come on, now. There were plenty of you.

    ===

    Apple’s to Oranges you clown.
    – Sponsored by another ridiculous statement by GB7 is there air up where my head is foundation.

  306. HebrewHammer April 25th, 2012 at 6:35 pm

    greenberet7, wanna Skype with me during the game ? I’ll teach you about all facets of the game.

  307. Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 6:36 pm

    I don’t think he is accruing service time if he has to spend extensive time in the minors next year. So nothing really lost there, just pushed back.

    He accrues service time while on the DL. So they lose a year, and they were already down 1 year vs what they were giving up in Jesus. 4 potential years of Pineda time now. Any more DL and they begin to lose even that.

  308. LockDown April 25th, 2012 at 6:36 pm

    I used to be a huge Cashman supporter until 2012… BUT I’m thinking Pineda got hurt during ST and was not damaged goods. Injuries happen. So i don’t blame Cashman for not knowing about a potential injury before ti happened.

    My issue was that I wanted to keep Montero for reasons people have already stated a multitude of times AND since I lost faith in Hughes (but hope I’m wrong) I felt we needed a good young starting pitcher by the the name of YU. ;)

    And the injury has nothing to do with my not liking the trade. If Pineda was healthy I would still not like it.

    As for Pineda, he is the one that has the most to lose here. I wish him well. Hopefully he heals fast, and can return. If it means a loss of velocity & learning a different style of pitching, so be it. My heart goes out to him.

  309. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 6:36 pm

    MTU April 25th, 2012 at 6:32 pm
    If you read the Slate article posted above you find out that labrum tears are worse than almost any other type of arm injury.

    The successful return rate is very poor.
    ============================
    Wont stop Cashman from attempting to sell his snake oil. And it won’t stop the sheep from guzzling every drop they can get their hands on.

  310. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:37 pm

    “fan-

    That Slate article was just dismal.

    Just unbelieveable.

    Odds not good.

    Hope he is one of the few lucky ones”

    MTU – that article was written in 2004. You know how medicine has advances all the time. In the body of the article they referred to “newer techniques.” What were “newer techniques” in 2004 are undoubedtly old techniques now.

    With advances in medicine come better outcomes and higher percentages.

    Not that I want to read one, mind you, :) but I think I’d put a lock more stock in an article that was a heck of a lot more current.

    Or said another way, if I read about 3% in a reliable article written any time recently, I’d probably feel sick to my stomach. Not from a 2004 article.

  311. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 6:38 pm

    Mick-

    I feel really bad for Pineda.

    That is one super bad break.

    Heartbreaking really.

    Maybe he’ll be one of the lucky ones.

    I’m gonna hope for it and pull for him to make it back.

    Nothing to lose there.

    :)

  312. luis April 25th, 2012 at 6:38 pm

    Lockdown,

    Good post, very thoughtful.

  313. Nick in SF April 25th, 2012 at 6:39 pm

    Silver lining: Pineda’s new fastball can replace his old change up?

  314. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:39 pm

    THE SLATE ARTICLE WAS WRITTEN IN 2004!

    Get a grip, please.

  315. jacksquat April 25th, 2012 at 6:40 pm

    Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 6:36 pm
    I don’t think he is accruing service time if he has to spend extensive time in the minors next year. So nothing really lost there, just pushed back.

    He accrues service time while on the DL. So they lose a year, and they were already down 1 year vs what they were giving up in Jesus. 4 potential years of Pineda time now. Any more DL and they begin to lose even that.

    On the DL, yes, the year he is injured. But if comes back next year and is optioned to the minors for a few months, he does not get service time then, right? That’s what I was talking about.

  316. vrsce April 25th, 2012 at 6:40 pm

    Too bad, at least Andy is coming back.

    On the other hand they should have kept Montero and gone after Darvish.

    Also ARod was a disgrace last night.

  317. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 6:40 pm

    BUT I’m thinking Pineda got hurt during ST and was not damaged goods.
    ====================================
    So you believe it’s just a coincidence that Pineda first lost his fastball, suddenly, in his final start last season, and it’s just a coincidence that he showed up at ST with that exact same 90mph fastball, and it’s just a coincidence that the Mariners completely shut him down throughout the winter, and it’s just a coincidence that he was suddenly available in a trade after previously being COMPLETELY untouchable???

    That’s what you believe?

  318. HebrewHammer April 25th, 2012 at 6:41 pm

    MTU–

    Is there a reason why you double space ?

    I mean why ?

    Its rather annoying..

    PLease goto google and type in “paragraphs”.

  319. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:42 pm

    “I used to be a huge Cashman supporter until 2012… BUT I’m thinking Pineda got hurt during ST and was not damaged goods. Injuries happen. So i don’t blame Cashman for not knowing about a potential injury before ti happened.

    My issue was that I wanted to keep Montero for reasons people have already stated a multitude of times AND since I lost faith in Hughes (but hope I’m wrong) I felt we needed a good young starting pitcher by the the name of YU. ;)

    And the injury has nothing to do with my not liking the trade. If Pineda was healthy I would still not like it.

    As for Pineda, he is the one that has the most to lose here. I wish him well. Hopefully he heals fast, and can return. If it means a loss of velocity & learning a different style of pitching, so be it. My heart goes out to him.”

    Lock, this is such a good post and has a total ring of integrity. I really respect everything you’ve written.

    Good for you, girl!

  320. Frozen Rope April 25th, 2012 at 6:42 pm

    trading super prospects is fine. if they were so set on dumping montero they should have snagged a POSITION prospect like Giancarlo Stanton from Florida. trading the best prospect you have for a pitcher, let alone one with the performance issues Pineda had in the 2nd half, is moronic.

    this is the same guy who traded arodys vizcaino for Javier Vazquez (who had already shown he was too soft to handle NY). Cashman’s ineptitude with pitching truly knows no bounds. amazing how arodys was unknown in his time as a Yankee mL-er and becomes a super prospect as soon as he gets out of here.

    this organization is unbelievably stupid when it comes to young pitching.

    but hey, relax y’all!! Pineda’s rotator cuff is okay, it’s only arthroscopic, and he will be back in only a year! in the meantime grab a happy meal and watch young Phil Hughes get torched by the Rangers tonight.

  321. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 6:42 pm

    trisha-

    Let’s hope so. Let’s hope their have been significant advancements.

    Some of our guys have certainly had the gaunlet laid down in front of them.

    Just unbelieveable.

    I hope I don’t fall off a Mountain next.

    Although some probably wish I would.

    They might even provide a shove.

    :)

  322. HebrewHammer April 25th, 2012 at 6:42 pm

    vrsce April 25th, 2012 at 6:40 pm
    Too bad, at least Andy is coming back.

    On the other hand they should have kept Montero and gone after Darvish.

    Also ARod was a disgrace last night.

    -0-0-0-0-0-0–0-0

    just Arod ? Just last night ? Tex not having a hit since Boston either doesn’t count ?

    how about the team aside from Jeter was a disgrace last night ?

  323. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 6:44 pm

    trisha – true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:15 pm
    CashmanSUX, common sense could also tell you that a pitcher who wasn’t under the Joba rules and had a ton of extra inings would tire and have bad starts and lose velocity.
    ===============================
    Over an externded period of time, sure… Pineda lost his fastball literally over night. Big difference.

  324. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:44 pm

    “So you believe it’s just a coincidence that Pineda first lost his fastball, suddenly, in his final start last season”

    You read this where? I understood that he started to lose velocity during the second half of the season. Tired arm would explain that THE WAY IT EXPLAINED IT FOR ALEXI OGANDO.

  325. tomingeorgia April 25th, 2012 at 6:44 pm

    Aramaic Sledge,
    You’re just really annoying.

  326. vrsce April 25th, 2012 at 6:44 pm

    Hebrew

    Double spacing is for those of Yu who are not quite into reading laborious long winded run-on sentences that stretch out for hundreds of words.

  327. Frozen Rope April 25th, 2012 at 6:45 pm

    meanwhile we can watch Noesi become a better pitcher then Hughes will ever be.

    thanks again, Cashman.

  328. jacksquat April 25th, 2012 at 6:46 pm

    Here’s something newer than 8 years old:

    http://www.rushortho.com/news/.....urgery.cfm

  329. vrsce April 25th, 2012 at 6:46 pm

    ARod was particularly disgraceful,producing that pathetic effort with one out and the bases loaded. Shameful.

  330. Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 6:46 pm

    On the DL, yes, the year he is injured. But if comes back next year and is optioned to the minors for a few months, he does not get service time then, right? That’s what I was talking about.

    Yes, but what makes you think they are going to option him? If he isn’t healthy next year, he is going on the DL again and will rehab in the minors.

  331. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:48 pm

    MTU – NEVER! You are far too valuable a member of this forum. Truth.

    I’m not a doctor but I’m the sister of one. And I’ve been a patient on too many occasions to count and as such have ton tons of (self-interested) medical research. The advances in medicine are astronomical, and you can bet one area where a ton of research is done is sports medicine, mainly because it’s such a big-money arena.

    I would be totally flawed if 2004 research has any relevance today, especially, again, in sports medicine. And I don’t think Dr. Ahmad would be talking about his return next season if he knew there was only a 3% success rate. It certainly wouldn’t be great for his reputation!

    Be hopeful. I believe there is every reason to be.

    :)

  332. HebrewHammer April 25th, 2012 at 6:48 pm

    Arod’s 3 HR’s have been on first pitch swings.. he expected fastballs and cheated on each one. Why he is batting 3rd I have no idea. Oh wait, because 8 for 37 is not all that bad compared to the rest of the team ? I’d rather have Gardner hitting 3rd than Aroid.

    Arod said, “I only used steroids in Texas.. LOL yeah okay Arod”.

    Tex and Arod together make just as much as the entire Pirates team.

  333. raymagnetic April 25th, 2012 at 6:48 pm

    They didn’t need two Arods on the team :|

  334. HebrewHammer April 25th, 2012 at 6:49 pm

    vrsce April 25th, 2012 at 6:46 pm
    ARod was particularly disgraceful,producing that pathetic effort with one out and the bases loaded. Shameful.

    agree. I wanna thro rotten tomatoes at him.

  335. Frozen Rope April 25th, 2012 at 6:49 pm

    no one can be surprised about the outcome of this trade coming from a GM who brought us Javier Vazquez and Ponson TWICE, brought back Nick Johnson, and this isn’t even scratching the surface.

  336. Frozen Rope April 25th, 2012 at 6:52 pm

    JK April 25th, 2012 at 6:29 pm
    Didn’t Wang come back from shoulder surgery in the Yankees minors?

    —————–

    And Wang never made his bones as a flame thrower either. apples and oranges. plus Wang wasn’t that heralded so the Yankees didn’t get a chance to ruin him like Joba, Hughes etc etc.

  337. HebrewHammer April 25th, 2012 at 6:52 pm

    Im just trying to type as much as Trisha, since she responds constantly and knows the least about baseball here.

  338. okeygrak April 25th, 2012 at 6:52 pm

    While not a professional athlete, I do have some experience with the matter. I’ve had 2 SLAP (labrum) repairs on my dominant arm, at 26 and 28 years old, both performed at HSS by one of the top doctors there equivalent to Dr. Altchek.

    I rehabbed extensively, and although I’m sure Pinieda will have a much more thorough rehabilitation process, I can say that at least in my case a shoulder will never be the same. History shows that most pitchers who have this procedure either have lingering issues or don’t return to the same level. Pretty unfortunate, but I wish him the best. The shoulder is the most complicated joint in the body, and the challenge involved is more about learning how your repaired should behaves than trying to recover fully expecting the shoulder to return to good-as-new.

  339. Against All Odds April 25th, 2012 at 6:53 pm

    This is off topic but I’m finding this out for a friend. Does anyone know how much it would cost to transfer a Nic license to a ny license. He mover to NJ a few yrs ago but moved back here to NY. He was under the impression that he would have to go up NJ but was told about transferring it from one to the next. I know it sounds confusing but that’s how he told it to me. He said they do it according to age

  340. TheBigOut April 25th, 2012 at 6:53 pm

    I’m concerned for Hughes tonight, the good news is he has pitched well against Texas before. This start for him will say a lot.

  341. vrsce April 25th, 2012 at 6:53 pm

    At least he did not re-sign Pavano.

    The failure to not pursue Darvish will haunt Cashman for years.

  342. MTU April 25th, 2012 at 6:54 pm

    jack-

    Thanks for that updated article.

    Maybe Romeo should do the surgery ?

    Sounds like it’s still in the experimental stage though.

    No results with professional as of yet.

    He also said that as of 2010 it’s grim news to hear for a Pitcher and that maybe by 2015 they’d have it down.

    Trisha-

    Since it over what we have now is the hope that Michael will prove to be exceptional.

    :)

  343. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:54 pm

    “Here’s something newer than 8 years old:

    http://www.rushortho.com/news/…..urgery.cfm”

    jacksquat – BRAVO! that’s the kind of thing I’m talking about. Progress always occurs when cooler heads prevail.

    Good job.

  344. tomingeorgia April 25th, 2012 at 6:55 pm

    To quote Donny,
    I Gotta getouta this Place!

  345. RMS April 25th, 2012 at 6:55 pm

    What difference does it make how old your dh is?
    If a 22-year-old dh hits a home run, do the umps change it to a double because he’s only 22?
    Ridiculous argument.
    ——————————————————————————————————
    Hey, Dill Pickle
    Reread my post. Montero should catch, not 2 times a week, almost exclusively. He plays for a crap team.
    He is too young to be a regular DH. It is a position for old men.

  346. Jerkface April 25th, 2012 at 6:56 pm

    “We don’t have that Tommy John yet,” said Romeo, who just received a $50,000 grant from MLB to experiment with cadavers to further explore how the surgery can shorten recovery time and extend careers. “We do have a number of high school- and college-level players (such as DiCostanzo) who have had a (torn labrum), and we’ve done this surgery, moved the biceps out, and they’ve gotten back to the same level. We just haven’t had an example like that at the major-league level… yet.”

    Has Pineda donated his body to science?

  347. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:57 pm

    MTU – no way of knowing what has transpired between 2010 and now. And if Romeo knows about this, trust that the jungle drums were beating rapidly throughout the profession.

    I don’t think Michael has to be the exceptional one. I don’t buy a 2004 article. I think Michael has to rehab properly and do whatever he has to in order to still have a good career. He’s a young man. That’s on his side.

    :)

  348. raymagnetic April 25th, 2012 at 6:57 pm

    Hughes will probably be carefree tonight. His spot is pretty secure right now.

    Phelps hasn’t been damaged enough to move to the rotation and Freddy has been even worse than him!

  349. Frozen Rope April 25th, 2012 at 6:58 pm

    forget about hamels. george’s sons are too cheap now that the payroll is this high and they want to reset for the luxury tax by 2014. so instead, the last few years they’ve blown money on chumps like Soriano (when they already had comparable parts to him), Feliciano etc.

  350. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:59 pm

    “Im just trying to type as much as Trisha, since she responds constantly and knows the least about baseball here.”

    What a sweet thing to say. I bet in real life you are a total doll.

    :)

  351. Warning Track Power April 25th, 2012 at 7:00 pm

    horrible news about Pineda. i’m certain the M’s had no knowledge.
    tables could be turned. Montero could have suffered a season ending injury during ST with the M’s.

    sucks for the Yankees right now, but a healthy Pineda might return to his old form next season.

  352. Dill Pickler April 25th, 2012 at 7:06 pm

    RMS, David Ortiz was 27 years old when the Red Sox got him and installed him as their full-time dh.

  353. austinmac April 25th, 2012 at 7:07 pm

    Trisha,

    I believe it has been well documented here that his velocity was well down in his last start. Yes, it have been fatigue, but it is rather coincidental.

  354. austinmac April 25th, 2012 at 7:12 pm

    I agree with Carig’s take referenced on the right. It is common sense.

  355. LockDown April 25th, 2012 at 7:12 pm

    luis, trisha: TY

    CashmanSUX “So you believe it’s just a coincidence that Pineda……”:
    I stand by what I posted.

  356. mick April 25th, 2012 at 7:12 pm

    NEXT===>>>

  357. Dill Pickler April 25th, 2012 at 7:22 pm

    “tables could be turned. Montero could have suffered a season ending injury during ST with the M’s.
    sucks for the Yankees right now, but a healthy Pineda might return to his old form next season”

    how often do position players suffer injuries that can potentially, for all practical purposes, end their careers?

    this happens to young pitchers a lot, unfortunately. That headline today shouldn’t have been a huge surprise to anyone. Now, if it said, “Pineda having labium surgery,” I would have been surprised.

  358. CashmanSUX April 25th, 2012 at 8:19 pm

    trisha – true pinstriped blue April 25th, 2012 at 6:44 pm
    “So you believe it’s just a coincidence that Pineda first lost his fastball, suddenly, in his final start last season”

    You read this where?
    ======================
    As Ive been saying for more than a MONTH now, check the pitchFX velocity chart on Pineda… There was no “second-half” gradual loss of velocity… He had the same velocity right up until his final start when it fell through the floor.

    http://www.fangraphs.com/pitch.....8;pitch=FA

    There it is… Now let’s play the Sesame Street game and tell me which one of those doesn’t belong… Hint: It’s the last one.

  359. Year of the Dragon April 26th, 2012 at 12:21 am

    People lets take a deep look at this Pea brain AKA Brian Cashman as been taken to the bank again. And if I hear another Happy go Lucky everything is Sunshine person say that Brian built the Yankees Dynasty remind me to vomit in there FACE ! Pinhead has traded away a sure fire future back stop Hall Fame or one that hit like one , can you name many catchers that tore up the Minors at a very , very young age like Montero has . Hard to answer , right , that’s because there where zero. Don’t believe take a look at the minor league history archives and you will see what I am talking about and again at the age of 17 when he started in the Yankee system. Now let’s address all of the Yankees groupies who just love Brian ( Small Brain ) Cashman. I know ,I know you our going to bring up the argument that he won 5 World Championships with us well lets take a real good look at Brian’s track record shall we. First and foremost Brian did not draft Riveria , Pettie, Jeter, Posada or that matter Bernie William’s and he did not trade for Paul O’Neil or Jimmy Key and David Cone. Who did well folks it was a man named Gen “Stick ” Michael’s and if you don’t believe me look that one up too. So we can pretty much come up with the conclusion that those players where the hart and soul of the Dynasty wouldn’t you say ! Well then let’s look at Brian’s body of work we can say that to his credit from 2001 to present is his legacy is it not ? From those date’s Brian has had a payroll hovering around $200 mill. a year he has been in 2 World Series since those date’s winning just 1 so pretty much Brian has produced 1 W.S.C over an 10 year period now you tell me is that a good investment on payroll near 1 Billion dollars over that time period. Sorry folk’s that is SH** in my book’s. Give me a credit card of 200 mill. a yr. I think I could find a lefty to balance out our bullpen or most importantly find and groom a HOME GROWN starting pitcher , who can actually produce and have a long career . Wake up folk’s this guy is a bad’ bad G.M. and in till the Yankee’s see the light and wonder why he’s sleeping with the bum’s in the off season or climbing building or have side girlfriend’s instead of doing what he is hired for , then the Yankee’s will keep wasting mililion’s and million’s of dollars on waste product’s

  360. Dill Pickler April 26th, 2012 at 2:59 pm

    Not the biggest fan of Cashman, but your punctuation is below that of most 8-year-olds I know.

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