“If he hadn’t struggled, he’s in there”
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Oct 18, 2012 
Print This Post
| 
Email This Post
It keeps coming back to Alex Rodriguez, doesn’t it? As the Yankees have struggled this postseason, every story seems to find its way back to the hot-button third baseman who’s always worth a back page and a big, bold headline.
“I think a lot of it is something he’s had to deal with his whole career,” Joe Girardi said. “Alex has always been someone who’s been talked about a lot, and that’ll continue, because he is Alex.”
Because he’s Alex, the stories don’t stop at his offense struggles. There’s a girl in the stands and a trade in the works and an ulterior motive to every decision. There’s something to be said for all of it, but all of it is meaningless without the bad at-bats and the disappointing numbers. None of it would matter if Rodriguez were still hitting.
“I always feel like I deserve a shot,” Rodriguez said. “Because I have tremendous confidence in my ability, and I feel like I started swinging the bat better at home, and I feel like at any point any time I’m in the box, there’s damage in the near future. That’s just the way I feel. I’ve never changed that feeling.”
If the Yankees still felt the same way, none of the secondary story lines would matter.
Alex Rodriguez as the scapegoat
Robinson Cano set a Yankees postseason record for consecutive hitless at-bats. Curtis Granderson has 15 strikeouts in eight playoffs games. Nick Swisher is hitting .154 with no track record of postseason success. Why is Rodriguez the one being benched all the time? Because he’s the one who’s been doing this most of the year, and he’s the one with a proven alternative.
“This isn’t just a short-term decision,” Brian Cashman said. “It’s a short-term decision based on the strikeouts that have occurred against the right-handed pitching during the playoffs, but if you look at his splits versus right-handed pitching and left-handed pitching for the season, it’s not a short-term sample.
“He has struggled with right-handed pitching this year altogether. It’s .600 OPS — somewhere in the .600s OPS — against right-handed pitching for the season. He’s .900-and-change OPS against left-handed pitching. So there’s a radical split there, for whatever reason. And it’s obviously gotten worse here in the postseason for some reason with the strikeouts. So we’re just making an adjustment as we move along, and we’re hoping that it gives us a better shot. And the only way you can make an adjustment (is to have an alternative). You referenced Robinson Cano. We have a legitimate guy with Chavez (to play third base). If you look at his year, he had a tremendous season for us. If you don’t have a legitimate alternative that happens to be left-handed, the opposite side, we probably aren’t doing anything. But since we do, we’re forced to have discussions about it and think through it and make a call.”
Alex Rodriguez as punished malcontent
In the late innings of ALCS Game 1, Rodriguez tried to get the phone number of a girl in the stands. That’s how the story goes. The New York Post has been reporting it for a few days now citing sources in the stands and friends of the women involved. Those of you who read my stuff regularly know that I just don’t care very much about the gossip stories. A player hitting on someone while in the dugout is bad and embarrassing, but if that player is hitting .350 with power, who cares? Might not be happy about it, but few people would question the player’s dedication.
Rodriguez works hard. Despite some outside opinions, he seems to be generally well liked and respected in the clubhouse. He’s said all the right things and has refused to rock the boat since being benched. Right now the Yankees are trying anything and everything to find a lineup that will produce, and if the Yankees wanted to punish Rodriguez, now would not be the time to do it.
“I love the Yankees,” Rodriguez said. “I love this organization. My focus right now is to help this team come together and win a game. Do not allow all this negativity and questions and gossip stuff or this crap or that crap, let’s just focus on winning a game and go from there.”
Alex Rodriguez as trade bait being forced out
Cashman has denied any trade talks with the Marlins, but that’s to be expected. It doesn’t mean there haven’t been vague conversations between non-GM front office officials. Doesn’t mean that somewhere, someone hasn’t engaged in a what-if phone call about what might or might not work. Rodriguez’s contract is a problem, and it makes sense to ask around to find out if anyone is interested.
But how does benching Rodriguez in the postseason help with that goal? The problem with Rodriguez is the perception that he’s a fading player who’s not worth such a massive deal. Benching him in a must-win game only reinforces that idea. The Yankees might need to convince Rodriguez to accept a trade, but they’d need to have a deal in place for that to matter. Is that really worth losing a postseason series?
“I’m looking at his at-bats against right handers,” Girardi said. “That’s what I’m looking at. … If he hadn’t struggled, he’s in there.”
—
There are other things going on with Alex Rodriguez — there always other things going on with that guy – but the real issue here is cut-and-dry. If Rodriguez were hitting, he’d be playing. Everything starts from that reality.
“I really feel that in my heart, anytime I’m in that lineup the team is a better team, without any question,” he said. “We’ll disagree there to the end, but I like Joe. I support Joe. Our job right now is to come together like a family. There’s tons of distractions, there’s a lot of wedges trying to be driven between us, and it’s not going to happen. We’re here to win a game. Our focus is to win one game tonight. I will be ready, I will be available, and if we win tonight, I like our chances.”
Associated Press photos
repost (good timing, too!)
Hey all I want to explain something I said last night where I definitely ended up using the wrong word (and no, the word wasn’t “win” )
Tar thought that the following from one of Chad’s leads-in contained a direct quote from Brian Cashman:
“It seems like Rodriguez has been the scapegoat, but Brian Cashman pointed out that Rodriguez’s struggles are not the small sample size that we’ve seen from guys like Swisher and Robinson Cano. Rodriguez has struggled against right handers all year, got much worse in the past month and a half, and has been awful in the playoffs.”
I said that it wasn’t a quote from Cashman but rather that Chad was “editorializing”. That’s definitely not the word I should have used and it certainly isn’t what Chad was doing! He was giving examples of why Cashman said it wasn’t a small sample size, and he was factually correct. I guess I should have said he was further explaining what Cashman was talking about.
Just wanted to clear that up!
GO YANKEES!!!
I meant to point it out yesterday, though I’m sure someone smarter already did, but Alex’s quote about the distractions was spot on.
Cashmoney October 18th, 2012 at 9:02 am
jap, scouting is all about projections and evaluation of tools.. that stats by and in itself does not reign supreme. Yanks need better talent evaluators imo. and the importation of talents, preferably youth, will be the key to this team long term success under the current system. Yanks needs put forth resources in this particular area.
Cashman acquired Ichiro, not exactly a home run hitter, replaced Nix with Nunez, replaced first Swisher and then Granderson with Gardner. Don’t say he/they aren’t willing to try different things, like speed, contact, defense.
Of course when he does that he gets criticized for that too, or there is just silence.
Again, there seems an effort to creat a narrative here rather than just be objective.
And too many people being lead around by the nose by media with their “sources” and “insiders”.
SMH. SMH. SMMFH.
While this is obviously true, it would sure help him out if he had, say, a Fielder behind him (maybe a RH version).”
Absolutely…..
“Again, there seems an effort to creat a narrative here rather than just be objective.”
I think Cashman is the one trying to create narrative…..there have been cracks forming in the offense for over two years and when the dam finally busts all fans want is for them to acknowledge there is a problem
Again, there seems an effort to creat a narrative here rather than just be objective.
———-
No one is creating a narrative.
jacksquat October 18th, 2012 at 9:05 am
Cashman acquired Ichiro, not exactly a home run hitter, replaced Nix with Nunez, replaced first Swisher and then Granderson with Gardner. Don’t say he/they aren’t willing to try different things, like speed, contact, defense.
———————–
Outside of Ichiro, you’re talking about the changes they made in the last 4 games…?
Cashman acquired Ichiro, not exactly a home run hitter, replaced Nix with Nunez, replaced first Swisher and then Granderson with Gardner. Don’t say he/they aren’t willing to try different things, like speed, contact, defense.
——
Ichiro was handed over the Yankees on a silver platter where there was little other options avail that did not solicit high cost of talents. Nunez was stuck in the minor to be punished by Yankees’s own folly to introducing him to a role that he is obviously not equip for. as for gardner , Cashman has publicly stated that they did not need him but rather he adds another element to the team and is only playing out of desperation. there is no narrative here except objective eavluations of C weakness as a GM. of course one man’s objective thoughts can be subject to other man’s subjectivity.
I think it was that AB vs. Darren O’Day that sealed A-Rod’s fate.
2nd and 3rd, 1 out in the bottom of the 8th and he took three of the worst swings of his career. Push one run across there and there’s no need for a Game 5. Instead, they were forced to play an extra game, lose the off day and not have CC ready for Game 1 against the Tigers.
He put himself in this position. Girardi gave him the golden opportunity, and he didn’t come through.
Cashmoney October 18th, 2012 at 9:03 am
Cashmoney October 18th, 2012 at 9:02 am
jap, scouting is all about projections and evaluation of tools.. that stats by and in itself does not reign supreme. Yanks need better talent evaluators imo. and the importation of talents, preferably youth, will be the key to this team long term success under the current system. Yanks needs put forth resources in this particular area.
///
They do need to beef up their scouting. But what sticks with me is the exit of two players who had/have projectable hit tool: Montero and Melky, and that they tried to trade Cano on three separate occasions – all on Brian Cashman’s watch. Very cavalier about guys who can hit for a high average.
Do I want this guy making more deals to fix the lineup? Not really.
JS,
If I recall correctly, Ichiro was deal made by the owners, not by Cashman. The other changes came after a colossal collapse of the Offense. He is good at getting talent of the scrap heap. That’s good for a short term fix. But for long term planning he has sucked big time. Six years in total control and very little to show for it. In fact, we are far worse as a franchise. The only reason he can brag of 4 WS is because of the core developed by Stick. He has failed miserably and has lead us to an inevitable downward period that could have been avoided.
Hal and Cashman are buds.
He isn’t going anywhere.
I’ll give the man his due.
Nice job of restocking the Farm in the P and C areas.
The next wave of young bats coming along (williams, Austin, Santana, Flores, Heathcott) just a little behind.
It’s probably his trades that invite the most controversy.
One great one was the Swish deal.
We can cite some the questionable ones.
I do wish he would realize, as Cashmoney points out, that the 98 team
had numerous .300 hitters, more SB’s, and less power.
They were fantastic at get ‘em on, get ‘em over, and get ‘em in.
The 98 team is the Platinum standard.
Cashman should look back to that.
The Cardinals are good modern example of a balanced young O.
Take heed Brian.
“Swisher was benched, and now Granderson will be benched (if they stick with the game 4 lineup). Are they “whipping boys” now also? Or are they also just underperforming badly and the team is simply searching for something that might work? Maybe the media and fans are the ones with the knives out and the team is trying to make rational decisions.”
jacksquat, I couldn’t agree more!
Who all is making Arod the “whipping boy”??? That’s what happens when fans wrap their arms around certain players and refuse to let go. Arod is the news for two reasons: one is that he is the highest-paid in baseball, and two is because he was ridiculous enough to try to score females when he couldn’t score in the game.
Girardi’s trying to win games. This forum is always good for a guffaw because you whine your way through the season about Girardi not sitting down people who aren’t performing and then when he does it, you whine your way through that.
In case you didn’t notice, Girardi has now sat SWISHER, GRANDERSON, AND AROD. Now your whining because he isn’t sitting Robby, a guy who has been the most productive for them this season? Arod’s not being some kind of “whipping boy” unless it’s because the press has focused in on the highest-paid player in baseball being benched.
Don’t know whether you noticed, but he hasn’t done well at hitting RHP. You would have had to be deaf, dumb, and blind not to notice that the Tigers are FILLED with RHP. It was talked about before the series even started!
If Arod were tearing the cover off the ball off RHP or had done so all season and was having a bad time of it right now, I could definitely understand consternation. But that just ain’t the case.
I want to see Games 5, 6, and 7. If sitting those guys and playing other guys gives us the best chance to do so, then I hope Girardi goes for it.
(I’ve already said I won’t be surprised if he comes off the bench at some point if the Yanks are struggling in the game, and I won’t. But I trust that Girardi wants to win and is doing everything he can to try to make that happen. If it doesn’t comport with any of your ideas – or mine – on how to win a game, that isn’t just of little moment, it’s of no moment. He’s not paid to listen to fans lament.)
I should add if not avoided, it could have been mitigated immensely
the contention here is simple, can Johnson and Johnson and berkshire hathaway of baseball do better than Cashman as a GM, I think so. There is always room for improvement rather than to be content resting on the laurels of making the playoff with the amt resources that Yankees possesses.
Cash-
I just don’t want to see the Yankees get on the wrong train for the future.
Love the Pitching. Now it’s time to concentrate on the O.
“I think Cashman is the one trying to create narrative…..there have been cracks forming in the offense for over two years and when the dam finally busts all fans want is for them to acknowledge there is a problem”
And the time to do that should be now, with an elimination game on the line? What a great strategy! Cashman should come up and hold a press conference telling the world there’s a problem with the offense and the Yankees should have seen that coming.
“Again, there seems an effort to creat a narrative here rather than just be objective.”
I agree with you again.
I understand it isn’t going top be easy to be easy transitioning the team to become more athletic, youthful and with the hit tool. I second Blake in all I want is for the team to tell us they see the needs and are trying to accomplish them.
hardwired7 October 18th, 2012 at 9:14 am
I think it was that AB vs. Darren O’Day that sealed A-Rod’s fate.
2nd and 3rd, 1 out in the bottom of the 8th and he took three of the worst swings of his career. Push one run across there and there’s no need for a Game 5. Instead, they were forced to play an extra game, lose the off day and not have CC ready for Game 1 against the Tigers.
He put himself in this position. Girardi gave him the golden opportunity, and he didn’t come through.
————-
This is about more than one at bat!
Who DOES hit Darren O’Day???
Well, they have a great opportunity to address the youth/athleticism issues in the OF this off-season, but if they pick up Granderson’s option, offer Swisher the qualifying $ 13.4 M and he accepts that opportunity goes away.
It comes down to how bold they are willing to be, and without being in the office during organizational meetings it’s impossible to know who wants to make dramatic changes and who wants to essentially stand pat.
MTU,
That job was/is Oppenheimer’s. He has done a very good job on the draft… Cashman has squandered most of it. Either by their minor league coaching, mid season knee jerk moves or trades pursuing the elusive unicorn of pitching that we don’t need or worse that has hurt our long term well being as a franchise. To top it all, he is so arrogant that he actually thinks he is doing great.
trisha – true pinstriped blue October 18th, 2012 at 9:26 am
“I think Cashman is the one trying to create narrative…..there have been cracks forming in the offense for over two years and when the dam finally busts all fans want is for them to acknowledge there is a problem”
And the time to do that should be now, with an elimination game on the line? What a great strategy! Cashman should come up and hold a press conference telling the world there’s a problem with the offense and the Yankees should have seen that coming.
——————-
Well…. he’s helping to create enough other distractions anyway, one more might not hurt.
Bring in the Goose October 18th, 2012 at 9:28 am
hardwired7 October 18th, 2012 at 9:14 am
I think it was that AB vs. Darren O’Day that sealed A-Rod’s fate.
2nd and 3rd, 1 out in the bottom of the 8th and he took three of the worst swings of his career. Push one run across there and there’s no need for a Game 5. Instead, they were forced to play an extra game, lose the off day and not have CC ready for Game 1 against the Tigers.
He put himself in this position. Girardi gave him the golden opportunity, and he didn’t come through.
————-
This is about more than one at bat!
Who DOES hit Darren O’Day???
_______________________________________
No, I’d say it was his at bat against Fister in game 1 in the 6th inning with 2nd and 3rd no out. He whiffed on 3 pitches very meakly. That was the end right there.
trisha,
Speaking of objectivity, when a number of us during the season said the Yankees had significant offensive shortcomings you acted as if we were all nuts. Objectively speaking, we were right. It is not about rearranging the deck chairs, it is getting some chairs with other skills.
Can you agree the offense needs help for next year or are you of the another year with a poorly timed offensive slump?
Reading this post, it’s hard to be anything but understanding of Alex.
Granted, he has not performed.
And possibly, yes, he did something inappropriate and ill-timed during Game 1.
But you have to admire the fact that he’s addressing it all and saying the right things. This has been an absolute circus – in fact, the ALCS has become page 2 stuff, the Arod stuff page 1. It’s a joke, already.
This guy should be given the chance to play out of this funk, right or lefty.
“Girardi’s trying to win games. This forum is always good for a guffaw because you whine your way through the season about Girardi not sitting down people who aren’t performing and then when he does it, you whine your way through that.”
Yeah… but doesn’t it strike you as odd that for the full course of a season (and Yankee managerial career) Joe managed one way and all of a sudden in the last month he’s managed using an entirely different methodology?
Trisha-
Good Morning.
I hope I’m not putting words in Blake’s mouth but I do not think he expects Cashman to make those statements now.
If I am wrong he can correct my error.
I Also think he probably would prefer that Cashman not make any Philosophical statements at all in the current environment.
And yes, I know it may have been in response to a query but he could have just deferred in terms of his answer.
We’ll see what adjustments are made when the Hot Stove season begins in earnest.
That’s where the rubber will meet the road and all questions laid to rest.
austinmac October 18th, 2012 at 9:27 am
I understand it isn’t going top be easy to be easy transitioning the team to become more athletic, youthful and with the hit tool
—————-
Weren’t we suppose to reach the point where the farm was going to ease the transition?
Forget the Alex quotes because I don’t expect anything but vanilla answers when it comes to his situation. Regardless of what Cashman is saying, I believe that his benching was at least in part due to his actions with the women. Also it is entirely possible that the trade discussions with Miami are going on above his level and haven’t reached him yet. In which case his statement that he’s had no trade conversations about Alex would be true.
The quote that bothered me though – the quote that got my blood boiling was the one that I anticipated. Brian sat there, with a straight face, and said that it is unfortunate that everyone got cold at the same time, but that doesn’t change his beliefs about the team. —when I filter that through the BS translator it reads “Don’t expect us to make major changes to this team this winter. We are staying the course and going to continue business as usual.”
It is completely safe in my view to offer Swisher and Soriano qualifying offers. Swisher will be in demand. The Dallas paper is all over him to replace Hamilton. The Boston papers have talked about him. Soriano is guaranteed more for next year if he doesn’t opt out. He sure won’t decline that and then accept less.
“I Also think he probably would prefer that Cashman not make any Philosophical statements at all in the current environment.”
It’s kinda funny how people are on here like ‘Oh my god LoHud, you guys suck, giving up on your team already!!’ when our GM is out there already doing press conferences about the small sample size the playoffs offer…..Has anyone seen David Dombrowski doing press conferences for line up decisions? No? Interesting!
Luis-
A good mgr knows how to delegate authority and has to trust his surrogates.
Cashman is responsible for surrounding himself with smart people.
He gets credit for that even if he is not the doing the actual research.
Cashman’s overall report card IMO is not as good nor as bad as some make it.
I absolutely agree that there is always room for improvement.
That is a part of any quality process.
Now it’s time to concentrate on the O.
—————
According to Cashman it’s just a slump at the wrong time. Ignore the fact they struggled all yr
AAO,
Yes, player development was supposed to solve these issues. When most of the players at AAA were in their 30s, I don’t think it is working.
“And the time to do that should be now, with an elimination game on the line”
Course not….it is what it is right now….
Guys,
Our offensive woes won’t be corrected in one OS. And trading for a bat would defeat the objective of rebuilding the team’s core, since it will cost us the few position prospects we have. We need to trade present for future to enhance our chances of hitting the jackpot. And we need more patience as fans. I just don’t think Cashman is the man for that process. Keep him as advisor to negotiate with other teams, he is good at that, but don’t let him handle the whole operation.
AAO-
I do not agree with that assesment.
IMO changes are needed.
There is too much age related risk in the lineup, and too many guys with low BA’s.
Guys like Nunez, GGBG, and possibly Adams may help.
I’d like to see what Romine can do too.
A rt.-handed compliment for Cano would be nice.
(yes, I’ve heard about Montero
)
Mike trout, Gaincarlo stanton, or JU sure would look nice standing next Cano.
A guy can dream can’t he ?
edit: next to
Stanton would play pepper with the third deck in LF
Luis-
if we can resign AP and Kuroda we will have enough excess pitching to make a trade for a bat.
Only question is which guy ?
MTU,
Agreed, a good manager delegates authority and builds a team around him. But more importantly sets the policy and overall strategy. He is not very good at this. He is a good tactician but a lousy strategist. We need more of the latter since we will heading to a rebuilding period.
Believe me, he is not the right man for the moment.
austinmac October 18th, 2012 at 9:39 am
AAO,
Yes, player development was supposed to solve these issues. When most of the players at AAA were in their 30s, I don’t think it is working.
—————–
It’s not working at. But hey don’t blame it on Cashman. The Yankees are just unlucky and draft late.
We need more ofthe latter since we will heading to a rebuilding period.
————
Wasn’t that one of the reasons the went to Girardi instead of an older coach?
They not the
when i look at whole picture…I think rebuilding and retooling is coming … there is no quick fix with a fixed budget and dead money on this team. any rational human being can see it. you don’t part pieces of future when you consider the inevitable high cost of acquiring player at the peak of their value. young and cheap talents is what the Yankees desperately in need of. retooling is coming it’s matter of when.
austinmac October 18th, 2012 at 9:37 am
It is completely safe in my view to offer Swisher and Soriano qualifying offers. Swisher will be in demand. The Dallas paper is all over him to replace Hamilton. The Boston papers have talked about him. Soriano is guaranteed more for next year if he doesn’t opt out. He sure won’t decline that and then accept less.
—————-
Agreed on Swisher. Not sure on Soriano. Teams will sign Swisher but we’ve seen that teams are loathe to sign relief pitchers who require compensation which Soriano would if the Yankees qualified him.
true or false – Girardi is a registered user at http://www.reformedguido.com ?
luis October 18th, 2012 at 9:51 am
MTU,
Agreed, a good manager delegates authority and builds a team around him. But more importantly sets the policy and overall strategy. He is not very good at this. He is a good tactician but a lousy strategist. We need more of the latter since we will heading to a rebuilding period.
Believe me, he is not the right man for the moment.
———————————–
For the most part I’ve defended Cash and I certainly don’t admire the position he’s been put in because for a large chunk of the time he’s been GM he’s had to answer to several different people all with (likely) different strategies/priorities. That can’t be easy and it probably contributes to the lack of linear decisions made.
That being said… those things have nothing to do with our present day situation lol.
Perhaps not Luis but the reality is that he is not going anywhere because he’s tight with Hal.
So I guess we’ll have to hope he has even more, and better advisors.
I am perfectly fine with a transition to the next great wave.
All I need is to know that the train is headed in the right direction.
That is what I’m wondering about.
I’ll know more soon enough.
Hike day for me today.
MTU,
If they do that, they will be compounding the problem. Pettitte and Kuroda are short term fixes. One more year at the most. Then one bat is not enough, we are several bats away from a good offense, we just don’t have the resources or pieces to bring them all in at once. Then we have the small problem of replacing the core. I believe it has to be homegrown for long term sustainable success ( Michael’s doctrine) or you want to go back to the 80′s, I sure don’t.
We are heading for a necessary downward period of rebuilding, what they do will depend the future of the franchise for at least the next ten years.
Against All Odds October 18th, 2012 at 9:51 am
austinmac October 18th, 2012 at 9:39 am
AAO,
Yes, player development was supposed to solve these issues. When most of the players at AAA were in their 30s, I don’t think it is working.
—————–
It’s not working at. But hey don’t blame it on Cashman. The Yankees are just unlucky and draft late.
—————-
My understanding after reading the blog for the last 3 days is that no one is at fault. Girardi clearly can’t be blamed for the players he’s been given, Cash can’t be blamed for the players he got, and the players can’t be blamed because the umpires are trying to screw them because they’re the Yankees.
I’m gonna need one hell of a hit from the objective pipe to be able to choke all that down, but I guess that’s what the munchies are for!
ARod is 3 for 23 in the postseason. Bad numbers.
In the first 6 games of the 2004 ALCS, Johnny Damon was 3 for 29. But, he started in game 7. He went 3 for 6 with 6 RBIs and 2 HRs that carried the Sox.
That is how quickly it can change.
austinmac October 18th, 2012 at 9:39 am
AAO,
Yes, player development was supposed to solve these issues. When most of the players at AAA were in their 30s, I don’t think it is working.
———————
I don’t think you can look at the ages of the AAA players as an indicator of the system.
A lot of teams have gone to using AAA as a stashing place for their taxi squad players rather than best prospects.
Are there some players at AAA who could help the club? Sure – CoJo, Romine, in theory Banuelos and Mustellier – but by and large that team was comprised of guys the Yankees were grabbing on minor league deals that they could call up in a pinch if someone got hurt (Dewayne Wise, Jack Cust, Chris Dickerson)
I would love to see the Yankees give guys like Almonte, Romine and Adams legitimate shots to win jobs that should be open in 2013 in the OF, 3b and C.
“Words are cheap. Actions are precious.”
Later.
Hughes is better, but makes more money and is much closer to FA.
Yanks would probably get more for Nova or Phelps in terms of young talent. Hughes would be part of a deal with Arizona for Justin Upton since they want to contend next year, whereas dealing with Colorado or San Diego or maybe Kansas city they could have different motivation.
A deal structured about Hughes or Nova for Alex Gordon might make sense for both teams.
@BenBadler: Mason Williams RT @willferman Out of all the Yankee prospects, who should fans be the most excited about?
“All I need is to know that the train is headed in the right direction.”
Ohhh this traiiiiin… ohhh this traiiiiin
(Thanks Hassey)
“According to Cashman it’s just a slump at the wrong time. Ignore the fact they struggled all yr”
Very true … how many times has the narrative of this team for 2012 been they cannot hit with RISP?
Cashman is dead wrong on this one … this post season is totally mirroring the weaknesses that were shown on a daily basis. If the Yankees don’t hit 3 run homers in bunches, then they struggle to score and win games.
You dont need to score 7 runs a game to win in the post season … you can average about 4 runs or so and still win as long as you take advantage of enough opportunities to score with the game on line. The Dynasty years proved this over and over again.
Luis-
My take is a little different.
I think we have enough excess pitching to start the process.
There are many more coming from the minors. Some getting real close.
The O needs a vitamin B shot right now.
I do not think it will hurt us to let go of one of Hughes/Nova/Phelps.
You pick which one.
Catch you later. Sorry I can’t continue right now.
In the first 6 games of the 2004 ALCS, Johnny Damon was 3 for 29. But, he started in game 7. He went 3 for 6 with 6 RBIs and 2 HRs that carried the Sox.
—-
this is perfect of example of just citing stats. Yanks had a command guy on a short rest in Javier Vazquez who simply did not have the stuff that day to put away Damon…. we can all cite stats as example of pillars of infallible truth. but baseball in far more complex than stats itself can paint.
On rod, have you seen his swing lately against rh. I am not saying Chavez is a great alternative. but you can all the stats out of the window by just observing arod’s current state of hitting.
“A deal structured about Hughes or Nova for Alex Gordon might make sense for both teams.”
I can’t think about trading Hughes right now….,he’s their 2nd best pitcher under contract for 2013…….now if they get Kuroda and Andy locked up early then that’ gives more flexibility but even still Kuroda will be 38 and Andy 41….
Hughes takes heat from all angles but fact is they wouldn’t have even made the playoffs without him this year….he was solid….he ate innings…. And he consistently gave them chances to win ball games….
I just don’t think you can trade him lightly anymore given the uncertainty with nova and Pineda and with the age on Kuroda and Andy even if they are back.
Okay, I’ll try to do this in order.
“Well…. he’s helping to create enough other distractions anyway, one more might not hurt”.
“trisha,
Speaking of objectivity, when a number of us during the season said the Yankees had significant offensive shortcomings you acted as if we were all nuts. Objectively speaking, we were right. It is not about rearranging the deck chairs, it is getting some chairs with other skills.
Can you agree the offense needs help for next year or are you of the another year with a poorly timed offensive slump?”
I agree that the offense needs help for next year – OR – that they need to change their style of play – or maybe a combination. But sure I agree with that. I don’t agree it could have been known unequivocally at the beginning of the season, just as nobody could have known that Arod would break his hand or Robby would stop hitting. But yes, you called it right.
“Yeah… but doesn’t it strike you as odd that for the full course of a season (and Yankee managerial career) Joe managed one way and all of a sudden in the last month he’s managed using an entirely different methodology?”
I think Joe’s change in methodoloy has been “forced” upon him by an offense that went cold at a most inappropriate time! If the guys were still hitting, or even if Robby were hitting and if the Yanks were winning, I don’t think you’d be seeing this at all. JMO
“Has anyone seen David Dombrowski doing press conferences for line up decisions? No? Interesting!”
Shame, be real. I’m sure you can figure that one out.
Shame,
Bad luck, bad timing, bad umpiring, bad AROD, but good team composition. Wait until next year as the veterans will be even more veteran next year. Plus, McGehee will still be available and maybe they can strive for Pearce again.
Of course Cashman blatantly lied about Arod’s performance against right ganders this year. During the regular season his OPS was above .700, not .600 as Cashman claimed. But do any of the “reporters” challenge Cashman’s claim? Of course not; they’re just stenographers writing down whatever the front office says.
blake October 18th, 2012 at 10:03 am
“A deal structured about Hughes or Nova for Alex Gordon might make sense for both teams.”
I can’t think about trading Hughes right now….,he’s their 2nd best pitcher under contract for 2013…….now if they get Kuroda and Andy locked up early then that’ gives more flexibility but even still Kuroda will be 38 and Andy 41….
————————-
This makes me crazy…. we will spend every off season until I day chasing starting pitching.
“Shame, be real. I’m sure you can figure that one out.”
Genuinely don’t know what this means.
Our GM is out there preparing the fanbase for the off season before we’ve finished this series. That was my only point.
Trisha,
I do question changing everything at this point. My view is the team will not win if AROD doesn’t reasonably produce. To do so, he must play.
Cashman said, yesterday I believe, the lineup is a group effort. I sincerely hope it is put together solely to enhance the chance of winning and not for message sending or any other ulterior purpose. Since when does the GM get involved in who plays? Nobody is advising Leyland who is to play. That is the manager’s job.
austinmac October 18th, 2012 at 10:04 am
Shame,
Bad luck, bad timing, bad umpiring, bad AROD, but good team composition. Wait until next year as the veterans will be even more veteran next year. Plus, McGehee will still be available and maybe they can strive for Pearce again.
——————-
Yeah it’s no one’s fault at all. Accountability is something we reserve for the umpiring crews and the fan base, who didn’t make enough happy noise at the stadium to help this team win.
I will admit that it made me shudder to hear Arod tell the press that he ABSOLUTELY makes every lineup better by being in it. I guess he believes it? Don’t get me wrong, I think he plays a great 3B. So if that’s part of what he meant then I give him a pass. But it really does sound arrogant to me. On the other hand, he’s in a position he’s never been in before and for someone with his cachet (and personality) it has to be really hard. So maybe that was more of a defensive statement than anything.
By the way, I don’t think Alex is washed up at all. I think we’ll still see good things from him and I don’t believe the Yanks are going to try to trade him. Does he have a no trade?
“Accountability is something we reserve for the umpiring crews and the fan base, who didn’t make enough happy noise at the stadium to help this team win.”
But not for Alex, right?
Thing i would like to know is why team changed its offensive philosophy started by Buck Showalter and company in early nineties of grind it out, on base percentage. good contact, high average hitters to this monstrosity of a homerun hitting, pull the ball, high strikeout , low average means nothing team? Who is responsible for this? Was Cashman trying to reinvent the team so that he could get all the credit and create his own legacy? What a joke.
“This makes me crazy…. we will spend every off season until I day chasing starting pitching.”
Pitching does hold the keys and the playoffs were a fluke #Cashman’d
@CST_soxvan: Sox lowering ticket prices, ‘creating affordable seating options that will be available to fans in lower and upper levels on daily basis.’
Blake/Shame —-
My Hughes/Gordon proposal was in direct response to a question as to who the Yanks could/should trade IF Andy and Hiroki return.
No way I move him until/unless that takes place. My preference would be to get younger. I think I’ve made that clear, but that’s a much higher priority with position players.
“I do question changing everything at this point. My view is the team will not win if AROD doesn’t reasonably produce. To do so, he must play.”
The team won without Arod reasonably producing for good parts of the season, and they did it without Arod producing in the series against Baltimore at all. I don’t put someone who can’t hit RHP and has been flailing at the plate into an elimination game “just because”. That makes NO sense to me. Get past these games and make it further, think about it then. Get to the world series and have LHP. Definitely think about it then. Not now.
BUT – much greater minds than mine will make the decision, and if he ends up in the lineup, then so be it.
Cashmoney -
Citing stats is exactly what the ARod bashers are doing. You could say the same thing about Cano’s recent swings or Granderson’s (whose swings against even RHPs may be even WORSE than ARod’s).
The point is that Damon was in a terrible slump. And came out of it with a superlative game. ARod deserves that same chance. Even though it was against a LHP, ARod did get a nice clean hit up the middle in his last AB – typically a good sign that the hitter is seeing the ball better. The AB before, he lined out hard to left.
Yes, ARod has looked terrible to this point (as has nearly all the Yankees’ hitters). But, is his only chance to play if he somehow comes out of his slump with a complete 180? Four straight extra base hits? Is the bar that high? What if his line out had been a hit? Would two hits in a game give anyone any confidence that he may have been breaking out of a slump?
I guess the difference in opinion is that it would shock me much more to see Chavez going 3 for 5 with 3 RBI’s as opposed to ARod doing the same thing.
trisha – true pinstriped blue October 18th, 2012 at 10:13 am
“Accountability is something we reserve for the umpiring crews and the fan base, who didn’t make enough happy noise at the stadium to help this team win.”
But not for Alex, right?
———————–
I’m not sure I understand what you’re saying.. ?
That Alex is an example of us holding someone accountable?
Re-sign Dioner Navarro to share catching duties with Cervelli.
Re-sign Melky Cabrera for LF (two years at $11M a year for $22M total should do it) and Juan Rivera for RF (one year $3.5M so he still makes $4M total for 2013 the Dodgers will not pay him as they will most likely decline the $4M team option for 2013 they have on him and buy him out for $500K.)
Trade A-Rod and $78M to the Cubs for Alfonso Soriano so the Cubs still pay only $36M (what they’d pay Soriano if they kept him) plus my guess only the first $12M of A-Rod’s $30M homerun milestone bonus money as I don’t see A-Rod reaching 755 HR before contract’s end. That’s $48M total across five years, not even an average of $10M a year.
Start Nunez at 3B, Gardner in CF (trade Granderson.)
Reacquire Jesus Montero for 1B and trade Teixiera for prospects.
Under my plan the entire 2013 Yankees starting nine is homegrown like this:
C – Navarro-Cervelli
1B – Montero under control through 2017
2B – Cano in his walk year
3B – Nunez under control through 2017
SS – Jeter in a possible walk year if he declines his $8M player option for 2014
LF – Cabrera signed through 2014 only
CF – Gardner under control through I believe 2014
RF – Rivera in his walk year
DH – Soriano signed through 2014 only
The Yanks should re-sign Chavez (backup 1B-3B), Nix (backup 2B-SS) and Dickerson (#4 OF.)
“My Hughes/Gordon proposal was in direct response to a question as to who the Yanks could/should trade IF Andy and Hiroki return.”
Yea I know….and Id consider that deal….but I’d much rather trade Nova at this point….I think Hughes ha begun a 5-6 year stretch of being a really solid big league starter….JMO
86w183 October 18th, 2012 at 10:16 am
Blake/Shame —-
My Hughes/Gordon proposal was in direct response to a question as to who the Yanks could/should trade IF Andy and Hiroki return.
————-
The thing that is annoying is that even if they do return for one year what does that leave us with in 2014 besides a prayer lol? We don’t have anyone that is even challenging for 2014 at this point with the Manny set back. Warren? Mitchell? Do they help us next year?
hman, at this point i don’t think it makes any dif if rod or chavez plays tonight. I trot him out there. I am just saying i don’t rem damon swing thru 90 mph fb down the middle. I don’t remember Damon being auto strike out machine either… in short, to think Arod will snap out this by some magical means is little optimistic at this point.
then, there is scherzer, who would oppose problems to anyone when he is on.
hman23 October 18th, 2012 at 10:18 am
I guess the difference in opinion is that it would shock me much more to see Chavez going 3 for 5 with 3 RBI’s as opposed to ARod doing the same thing.
——————–
Chavez has not been putting up good ABs. In the middle of the year, he was lighting it up and it almost seemed like he’d never go cold.. but his numbers in the last 2 months took a real dip, he’s been hitting like .220.
Where the Yankees lose their credibility with me with this Alex this is this crap about Chavez being a good alternative. Really? What has Chavez done this offseason? Nothing. Just like 90% of the other team. You will never be able to convince me that a struggling Alex Rodriquez isn’t better than “don’t touch him or he’ll break” Eric Chavez. And I happen to like Chavez, but I’m putting Alex in there over here everyday of the week and twice on Sunday.
Why play Arod if a deal is in the works?
What if he gets hurt?
That last post has a lot of typing mistakes, but you know what I’m trying to say. The Yankees are lying; plain and simple. Look for Alex to be dealt over the winter. And watch him rake for his next team while the Yankees are paying 90% of his salary.
hman, you’d have a better case if Robby struggled against RHP. Also, Swisher and Granderson have been benched.
At this point I just want to win. If the Babe’s ghost can play, I say let him!
************
I tend to go blithely along thinking everything is going to work. It’s my personality, it’s how I’ve always lived. I’m not huge into conspiracy theories and I do TRY to be objective. But the entire time I’ve been posting this morning, ESPN has talked about nothing but Arod. And one of the main themes has centered around whether or not Arod is going to be traded.
So I have to wonder if I’m missing something here or whether this is just typical ESPN, making a story where there isn’t one. As with everything in life, I guess I’ll know when I know.
**********
Have a good day all! I am going to concentrate on controlling and solving things that I know I can – like getting some bills paid and some work done!
blake – I dunno what to do about Hughes/Nova/Phelps..
My reaction right now is you can’t afford to trade any of them because in 2014 you might need 2 more starters and have a hard budget line to stick to… Nova doesn’t have the upside Hughes does but he can give you 200 innings (*knock on wood*).
Phelps….. they gotta get him more innings next year. If they do what they’ve done with Noesi and Hughes it’s really wasting potential.
mick October 18th, 2012 at 10:26 am
Why play Arod if a deal is in the works?
What if he gets hurt?
————————–
How this whole situation is not hurting any trade opportunities I can’t imagine.. but then again, small sample size and all that jazz!
Plus, I want to know who is playing 3rd after Alex leaves? Is there a hot 3B guy hitting free agency? Are they going to plug Nunez over there? What’s the plan, Cash?
Interesting re: Leyland receiving two lineup cards – one with Alex and one without.
My guess is Girardi had him in there initially and word came down from Levine/Cashman to remove him. Probably ownership discussions re: the behavior from Game 1.
Levine is a jacka$$. He’s the guy that should be removed.
Making this entire postseason a circus. Poor Joe – bet he wishes he could just do his job.
Look for the Yanks to clean house and soon.
Reyes and Bell for Arod—I would do it.
“.I think Hughes ha begun a 5-6 year stretch of being a really solid big league starter….JMO”
*************************************************************************
I share that opinion but if KC is moving Gordon it’s for a veteran starter and that’s Hughes much more so than Nova.
If Nova would focus on FB command I think he has a really high ceiling.
I would assume Phelps is the 5th starter next year. Resign Pettitte and Kuroda to 1 year deals and you have CC/Kuroda/Pettittw/Hughes/Phelps with Nova and Pineda waiting…..
Despite what people think, I don’t see Alex on this team next year after all of this. Cash will work something out with the Marlins that he feels works for the Yankees and Alex will agree because he needs a fresh start..
I used to hate Levine but now I wonder if he’s Team Greedy’s only ally in the FO!!
“My reaction right now is you can’t afford to trade any of them because in 2014 you might need 2 more starters and have a hard budget line to stick to… Nova doesn’t have the upside Hughes does but he can give you 200 innings (*knock on wood*).”
I think Cashman needs to act quickly on Kuroda and Pettite and get that resolved soon after the season….if he has those two locked up then you have more flexibility as to what you can do…….I really don’t think they can have the rotation issues lingering around all winter as it’ll take away from the focus …..which should be fixing this offense
Also, i think we all believed that Banuelos would be in the rotation in 2014, but that is not possible now, which makes holding onto Nova and Phelps even more important….
How is Reyes liking the Marlins?
The weather today in Detroit isn’t any better than last night from what I hear. I wonder how long they wait today to try and get this game in.
blake October 18th, 2012 at 10:13 am
“This makes me crazy…. we will spend every off season until I day chasing starting pitching.”
Pitching does hold the keys and the playoffs were a fluke #Cashman’d
————-
If our offense was even mediocre right now we would be dominating.
There are many factors as to the offense collapsing. Granderson fell apart mid season, could the organization predict something this drastic? A-Rod’s hand was broken, causing him to fall of a cliff. Cano set a record hitless streak. Jeter broke his ankle.
I’ll argue all off season long that the roster construction isn’t the problem.
Yeah it’s no one’s fault at all. Accountability is something we reserve for the umpiring crews and the fan base, who didn’t make enough happy noise at the stadium to help this team win.
///
Ha! You’re killin’ it this morning, Shame.
“I share that opinion but if KC is moving Gordon it’s for a veteran starter and that’s Hughes much more so than Nova.”
That deal really makes some sense for both sides IMO….I can’t see KC being able to lure anybody better than Hughes as a FA……..Id consider if IF the Yanks can get Kuroda and Andy back and if its looking like Pineda is on track….Gordon is a good player ad he’s on a reasonable contract…..
Id obviously offer guys other than Hughes first though in any trade…..
Any team that lets the Yankees dump Alex on them without paying at least 90% of his salary are idiots. I still can’t believe BOS got LAD to take their boat load of unwanted players.
I dont believe fixing the offense is going to be a 1 year thing. I’d like to see the Yankees move their quality offensive bats through the system quicker than they normally do. No reason why the Mason Williams and the Tyler Austins couldnt be ready for 2014. No reason not to give David Adams a chance to play 3b in 2013 if he continues to hit throughout the winter…. With the chance Jeter doesnt start the season, good time to tell Nunez, this is your spot until Jeter gets back, make the most of it…… Maybe even see Corban Joseph, Zoilo Almonte, etc…
Give these guys a chance and i bet we see them bring some energy to this team we havent seen in a while.
Shame Spencer October 18th, 2012 at 10:29 am
blake – I dunno what to do about Hughes/Nova/Phelps..
My reaction right now is you can’t afford to trade any of them because in 2014 you might need 2 more starters and have a hard budget line to stick to… Nova doesn’t have the upside Hughes does but he can give you 200 innings (*knock on wood*).
Phelps….. they gotta get him more innings next year. If they do what they’ve done with Noesi and Hughes it’s really wasting potential.
////
….And then there’s this healthy, 27 year old pitcher who has a killer slider, 96-99 FB, good curve and serviceable change up hangin’ around, just waiting to be told by someone intelligent that the sixth inning isn’t worthy of him
Any team that lets the Yankees dump Alex on them without paying at least 90% of his salary are idiots. I still can’t believe BOS got LAD to take their boat load of unwanted players.
___
Probably but i think it will happen. We will have to pay significant part of his salary and maybe even take on Heath Bell’s remaining 2 years but it may still be worth it. I said yesterday, if they can get out of this paying anything under 50% of the remaining 114, they need to do it. Freeing up 12-14 mil/year is a big deal, especially if you replace Alex with someone like David Adams who makes chump change.
ac1 October 18th, 2012 at 10:34 am
Also, i think we all believed that Banuelos would be in the rotation in 2014, but that is not possible now, which makes holding onto Nova and Phelps even more important….
—————–
Yeah it makes you wonder if they can afford to trade Nova/Phelps when you could risk Hughes becoming expensive.
I think if I’m Cash my off season plan goes like this:
1) Sign Kuroda, Pettite, and extend Hughes for at least 3 years.
2)
Fix the offense using magic beans and a ouija boardCheck on Pineda’s progress and see if you can afford to trade Nova/Phelps for a bat.3) Try to extend Cano.
4) Sign Ichiro and Ibanez to cheap one year deals.
5) Try to get Martin to sign for less than $5 million per, no more than 2 years.
….And then there’s this healthy, 27 year old pitcher who has a killer slider, 96-99 FB, good curve and serviceable change up hangin’ around, just waiting to be told by someone intelligent that the sixth inning isn’t worthy of him
____
Miss the days where we had hope Joba would be a solid #1-2 starter…..
Maybe after he is a free agent and another team gives him a chance.
I’ll argue all off season long that the roster construction isn’t the problem.
——————-
Hey, someone’s gotta be on the other side of the debate. God speed bro!
I’ve seen a lot of “Corban Joseph as 2B option” here over the last few weeks – usually as a solution to trading Cano.
Joseph is a very limited defender. He is a very good and smart LHB, who could teach some of these “veterans” a thing or two about hitting. He would be fine off the bench and an occasional 2B start to give Cano a rest.
He is NOT 2B material as a starter. No way, no how.
Miss the days where we had hope Joba would be a solid #1-2 starter…..
Maybe after he is a free agent and another team gives him a chance.
///
ac1,
It’s probably in vain, but I am still holding out hope that Rothschild says, why’s this guy a BP arm? He’s got swing and miss stuff and four good-to-go pitches?… and they reapply themselves here…
J. Alfred Prufrock October 18th, 2012 at 10:36 am
Yeah it’s no one’s fault at all. Accountability is something we reserve for the umpiring crews and the fan base, who didn’t make enough happy noise at the stadium to help this team win.
///
Ha! You’re killin’ it this morning, Shame.
————
It’s ridiculous!! Some of the same people blaming the umpires for our teams poor offensive performance are the same people that are cool with our highest paid player riding the pine!!!
It’s like, which is it?? Are the umpires so bad that none of our offense can hit? Are we only blaming them for some of our players performances??
I think if I’m Cash my off season plan goes like this:
1) Sign Kuroda, Pettite, and extend Hughes for at least 3 years.
2) Fix the offense using magic beans and a ouija board Check on Pineda’s progress and see if you can afford to trade Nova/Phelps for a bat.
3) Try to extend Cano.
4) Sign Ichiro and Ibanez to cheap one year deals.
5) Try to get Martin to sign for less than $5 million per, no more than 2 years.
____
I agree with most of this. I wonder how cheap they can get Ichiro. I also try to trade Granderson to someone who believes they are one OF away from winning in 2013. Nationals may be if LaRoche doesnt resign and they move Morse to 1b. I am on the fence about Martin. While i want someone with experience, i am also thinking that having Cervelli and Romine play (if Romine is ready), may be worth it. Maybe even Jose Molina to back up one of them.
I would go outside the box. Easy for me, im not the GM.
“Any team that lets the Yankees dump Alex on them without paying at least 90% of his salary are idiots. I still can’t believe BOS got LAD to take their boat load of unwanted players.”
**************************************************************************
I don’t disagree, unless that new team is able to purge toxic contracts at the same time OR has a potential pay off. Acquiring Alex would sell tickets in Miami, there’s no doubt in my mind about that. If they want to keep Reyes maybe Alex and some $$$$ for Heath Bell and Buerhle?
Bell and Buehrle = $ 71 M in future obligations. Yanks could also take on John Buck ($ 6.5 M) to get the $$$ to work.
It’s probably in vain, but I am still holding out hope that Rothschild says, why’s this guy a BP arm? He’s got swing and miss stuff and four good-to-go pitches?… and they reapply themselves here…
____
I can already hear their excuses against it. Hasn’t had enough innings in the last three years, yadda yadda. Look he is a FA after 2013. Might as well give it one last try. If it doesnt work, well then let him walk after the season.
ac1 October 18th, 2012 at 10:39 am
I dont believe fixing the offense is going to be a 1 year thing. I’d like to see the Yankees move their quality offensive bats through the system quicker than they normally do. No reason why the Mason Williams and the Tyler Austins couldnt be ready for 2014. No reason not to give David Adams a chance to play 3b in 2013 if he continues to hit throughout the winter…. With the chance Jeter doesnt start the season, good time to tell Nunez, this is your spot until Jeter gets back, make the most of it…… Maybe even see Corban Joseph, Zoilo Almonte, etc…
Give these guys a chance and i bet we see them bring some energy to this team we havent seen in a while.
——————–
*Applause*
I would bet money in Vegas that A-Rod starts 2013 as a Miami Marlin. Don’t know how it will go down yet, but it has the feel of the end of the line in NY for Alex.
Reyes and Bell for Arod—I would do it.
—
How does the money work out?
ac1 – My plan doesn’t work if you move Alex.. and I have no idea what to expect of Pineda. I really do hope the kid becomes a factor because that could be so huge for us. You can’t count on it though.. same way you can’t count on Gardner playing all year or Pettite giving you more than 100 innings in the regular season.
I’d like to add a young OFer, but I dunno who we have in the minors that could be the guy. I didn’t think Dickerson looked awful, but I dunno that you can make him your rotating 4th OFer. I’d probably consider shifting Grander to LF and sliding Gardner to CF no matter what. Ibanez would the be emergency OFer and DH only.
Again though.. depending on what happens with Alex all this could look very different.
Can we sign David Wright?? No?
“1) Sign Kuroda, Pettite, and extend Hughes for at least 3 years.
2) Fix the offense using magic beans and a ouija board Check on Pineda’s progress and see if you can afford to trade Nova/Phelps for a bat.
3) Try to extend Cano.
4) Sign Ichiro and Ibanez to cheap one year deals.
5) Try to get Martin to sign for less than $5 million per, no more than 2 years.”
I like this plan…..the 2nd point is pretty key though as they really need a bat or two…..this is no longer some of us projecting that they will need bat…..the time is here now…..they need offense and I don’t see how they can ignore it anymore…..if they do then it’s just neglengence and more budget related nonsense
Granderson*
“I like this plan…..the 2nd point is pretty key though as they really need a bat or two…..this is no longer some of us projecting that they will need bat…..the time is here now…..they need offense and I don’t see how they can ignore it anymore…..if they do then it’s just neglengence and more budget related nonsense”
I’d be more detailed if we had any idea if we could add a corner IFer. That changes the whole landscape of our club.
Arod to the Mets for Ron Darling!
Tackelberry,
It looks to me it is going to clear this afternoon. Leet’s hope so.
Reyes and Bell for AROD–Of course the Yankees would do it, but why would the Marlins? Reyes had a good year. If Cashman could pull that off, he is GM of the decade.
It’s ridiculous!! Some of the same people blaming the umpires for our teams poor offensive performance are the same people that are cool with our highest paid player riding the pine!!!
It’s like, which is it?? Are the umpires so bad that none of our offense can hit? Are we only blaming them for some of our players performances??
///
Umps have sucked, and behind the plate, the incompetence has been unreal. But I don’t think anyone who really can identify a quality AB from just a result would cling to that excuse, or would be calling the hitting issues a “slump” (except in Cano’s case). It’s coming from the same people who think Cashman’s been doing a bang up job, so consider the sources, I would say?
Reyes and Bell for AROD–Of course the Yankees would do it, but why would the Marlins? Reyes had a good year. If Cashman could pull that off, he is GM of the decade.
____
More likely it is Alex for $$$$/Bell and maybe Buherle
Ac1,
Good post…
Primo,
Good to see you around
Got to go for real
Reyes and Bell for Arod—I would do it.
—
How does the money work out?
=============================
From Joel Sherman this morning:
“Miami could be an ideal landing spot since Rodriguez is from there. In spring, Marlins owner Jeffrey Loria joked with Yankees president Randy Levine about wanting A-Rod for the opening of their new stadium, a source said, and Levine kidded back to make an offer. But there is no joke now.”
“For what it is worth, Rodriguez is owed five years at $114 million and Jose Reyes and Heath Bell together are owed, yep, exactly $114 million.”
Cashmnoney -
For what it is worth, Damon had 8 Ks through 6 games.
Buerhle would be a steal.
Primo,
Your last post…ha! Right on
I just don’t see why they’d move Reyes.. wouldn’t the whole point be to have star power with both Arod and Reyes?
“1) Sign Kuroda, Pettite, and extend Hughes for at least 3 years.
2) Fix the offense using magic beans and a ouija board Check on Pineda’s progress and see if you can afford to trade Nova/Phelps for a bat.
3) Try to extend Cano.
4) Sign Ichiro and Ibanez to cheap one year deals.
5) Try to get Martin to sign for less than $5 million per, no more than 2 years.”
**************************************************************************
So much for getting younger and more athletic.
Reyes has $ 96 M coming to him, Bell has $ 20 M on the way so those $$$ do work. Miami might do it because Alex sells tickets and Reyes didn’t. Yanks would have to add to the deal with Nunez and maybe Joba.
They’d also have to convince Jeter that it’s time for 3B.
I can already hear their excuses against it. Hasn’t had enough innings in the last three years, yadda yadda. Look he is a FA after 2013. Might as well give it one last try. If it doesnt work, well then let him walk after the season.
///
If Soriano is outta here, they’ll cast him as “insurance” for Rivera again. SMH. Maybe they’re afraid he’d be nails, and then they’d look even more foolish in their hasty 2010 decision. For a while, Cashman was defying Eppler and Eiland on Joba. But then he caved.
Shame Spencer October 18th, 2012 at 9:57 am
Against All Odds October 18th, 2012 at 9:51 am
austinmac October 18th, 2012 at 9:39 am
AAO,
Yes, player development was supposed to solve these issues. When most of the players at AAA were in their 30s, I don’t think it is working.
—————–
It’s not working at. But hey don’t blame it on Cashman. The Yankees are just unlucky and draft late.
—————-
My understanding after reading the blog for the last 3 days is that no one is at fault. Girardi clearly can’t be blamed for the players he’s been given, Cash can’t be blamed for the players he got, and the players can’t be blamed because the umpires are trying to screw them because they’re the Yankees.
I’m gonna need one hell of a hit from the objective pipe to be able to choke all that down, but I guess that’s what the munchies are for!
—————-
Lol exactly no one is to blame it’s just bad timing
I don’t think Williams, Austin or Sanchez will be ready for 2014. Williams and Sanchez haven’t played above high-A and Austin has only played a handful of games in AA. I think Williams and Sanchez start the year in Tampa and mid year if they perform well get promoted to AA. Austin, keep in AA for the entire season. So that leaves them all in AA after 2013 meaning a 2014 promotion is pretty aggressive.
Joseph might be an option for the majors next year. Adams I’d like to see in AAA, he might be ready mid-season for the majors if needed. Romine needs to stay in AAA, he didn’t play much in 2012.
I think the plan right now for keeping the payroll down is to sign a bunch of short term contracts until the aforementioned prospects are ready. That being said I think this offseason we will see short contracts – Kuroda, Pettitte, Ichiro, pick up Granderson’s option, maybe Martin, etc. The only other route is to make trades but that cuts into your “bank” of prospects.
Teixeira and A-rod’s contract really hamstrings this franchise if they want to operate with a budget.
JAP – The umps have been terrible and the calls on the bases have been…. I can’t even put it into words.
But if the umps are being blamed for why we can’t score 3 runs per game, then that should apply to all the players, right? No one is to blame!
primo! Have a great day, buddy. Nuney and C lead us to live another day! Check back in after we win
gotta earn some $$$$
Have a great day… good luck to us this afternoon
mick,
That’s interesting but I think the Yankees would need to throw in prospects to make the deal more attractive for Miami. A-rod for Bell is bad contract for bad contract but Reyes is still a good player.
Romine needs to stay in AAA, he didn’t play much in 2012.
———————-
I heard JR Murphy has been doing very well, especially with the bat. I wonder what they can do with him next year. I’d hate to have he and Romine splitting time at that level.
“It’s like, which is it?? Are the umpires so bad that none of our offense can hit? Are we only blaming them for some of our players performances??”
I KNOW you can’t mean me, J Al!
But I will answer to that since I am down on the umpires AND fine with Alex sitting.
There can be a union, you know, between the umpires being terrible and Alex needing to sit. There’s no question he looks lost at the plate. That you can see from the eye test! Same thing with Granderson, who is sitting, same thing with Swisher, who has sat. Add to it Alex’s difficulty hitting RHP all season long, it’s really not that hard to understand. Chavez had a great season against righties, Swisher better than Alex, Granderson worse than Alex. Granderson and Alex are sitting, Chavez is playing, Swisher is playing. Pure math to me.
We’re at an elimination game. I personally don’t see any percentage in trying to see if Alex can change things at this point. JMO. Others feel differently, I respect that too. All a matter of opinion.
Ozzie and Arod sitting in a tree..
Shame,
Murphy struggled with the bat a bit last year. I would keep him in AA for 2013.
patk
who knows what marlins are thinking…they might be salivating for arod….still say alex not playing is to protect him from possible injury, something’s in the works..
Yankee Trader,
They have to make the qualifying offer to Soriano if he opts out. IF he accepts they actually pay him slightly less than his option is worth & he won’t have a no trade so they can trade him if they want. If he declines, which I guarantee he will or else why would he opt out, they get a draft pick.
The reason why swisher/soriano/whomever are almost guaranteed to decline the offer is that it comes right at the start of free agency & they only have a week to accept or pass. No way are Soriano or Swisher, both looking for big deals, going to accept a 1 year offer right at the start of free agency.
trisha,
You are right. Benching A-rod, Granderson and Swisher is all about numbers and how they have performed up to this point. If the Yankees somehow pull off a miraculous come back and make it to the world series we might see A-rod start with a lefty on the mound. Or pinch hit. There is still a shot for him to redeem himself.
Also why is it an insult to bench A-rod but not an insult to bench Granderson and Swisher? All 3 have done poorly, all 3 have been benched. But for some reason with A-rod it’s an insult? Please..
Patrick October 18th, 2012 at 11:02 am
I don’t think Williams, Austin or Sanchez will be ready for 2014. Williams and Sanchez haven’t played above high-A and Austin has only played a handful of games in AA. I think Williams and Sanchez start the year in Tampa and mid year if they perform well get promoted to AA. Austin, keep in AA for the entire season. So that leaves them all in AA after 2013 meaning a 2014 promotion is pretty aggressive.
Joseph might be an option for the majors next year. Adams I’d like to see in AAA, he might be ready mid-season for the majors if needed. Romine needs to stay in AAA, he didn’t play much in 2012.
———————–
I think they’ll give Adams a look in Spring Training at 3b – if he shows enough they may leave Alex at DH assuming he’s on the team.
I don’t know where CoJo factors into this team – he doesn’t have the arm for a corner spot and barring a trade, 2b is pretty set.
Romine I think will also be given a long look behind the plate if he’s healthy this spring. I think that they’ll bring back Martin, but not on such a high level deal that it would stand in the way of him being made part of a tandem behind the plate with Romine.
I agree with you on the younger guys.
disco stu October 18th, 2012 at 10:00 am
“According to Cashman it’s just a slump at the wrong time. Ignore the fact they struggled all yr”
Very true … how many times has the narrative of this team for 2012 been they cannot hit with RISP?
Cashman is dead wrong on this one … this post season is totally mirroring the weaknesses that were shown on a daily basis. If the Yankees don’t hit 3 run homers in bunches, then they struggle to score and win games.
You dont need to score 7 runs a game to win in the post season … you can average about 4 runs or so and still win as long as you take advantage of enough opportunities to score with the game on line. The Dynasty years proved this over and over again.
————————–
Very well said but Cashman is the type of guy that gets set in his ways. He can be stubborn when it comes to his beliefs.
I would only trade Arod If:
1) they could save significant money on his contract….like 20% or more
2) they could actually get a goo player in return or prospects
3) if behind the scenes their are issues that will hurt the clubhouse and cause distractions
If the relationship with Alex and the club is reparable…..and they’d had to eat all his salary to trade him then they are much better off keeping him an hoping he figures out how to hit again…..because they don’t have another 3B and they already are short RH bats……
But if the umps are being blamed for why we can’t score 3 runs per game, then that should apply to all the players, right? No one is to blame!
Shame,
Is this about our embattled 3B?
Patrick October 18th, 2012 at 11:07 am
Shame,
Murphy struggled with the bat a bit last year. I would keep him in AA for 2013.
////
He did struggle offensively, but he made strides as a catcher. The bat will be there again, the catching progress is very encouraging.
Chip,
I think Adams will be at spring training but I think there is very little chance he makes the team. He’s only played in AA, never in AAA. He’s also a righty so I don’t think he would be a good choice to split time with A-rod at third. Yes I think A-rod will be back and at least split time at 3B, he can still field the position. Also, how is Adams at 3B, his natural position is 2B.
trisha – true pinstriped blue October 18th, 2012 at 11:06 am
“It’s like, which is it?? Are the umpires so bad that none of our offense can hit? Are we only blaming them for some of our players performances??”
I KNOW you can’t mean me, J Al!
///
trisha, you quote Shame, not me
.
” I personally don’t see any percentage in trying to see if Alex can change things at this point. JMO. ”
This seems a little defeatists, trisha, we might have at least 8 more games to play this season. I’d like to think one of the best players to ever play the game could get a shot to be a difference maker.
Chavez certainly was a difference maker in game 3, I’ll give you that…
As awful as Granderson has been, I would bat him against Scherzer. IMO, this is the game he should be in the lineup for.
“J. Alfred Prufrock says:
October 18, 2012 at 11:20 am
As awful as Granderson has been, I would bat him against Scherzer. IMO, this is the game he should be in the lineup for.”
I think Joe probably thinks that Swisher has a better chance to get on base and is also less susceptible to Coke coming in and striking him out on 3 pitches …….also and this isn’t talked about ….but I think another reason joe chose the lineup he did yesterday was because he preferred Gardner in the big Detroit CF to Granderson ……
reyes a yankee? my goodness…i’m about to hurl…
with that said, reyes, gardner, ichiro, nunez is quite alot of speed to utilize.
I think Gardner will be the Yanks CF next year whether Granderson is back or not…..the question is who will they put on either side of him….
Every team let’s players skip AAA if they are good enough. The Yankees did it with Melky. I doubt, however, with the possible exception of Adams, anyone is remotely being considered.
With respect to who plays third, I have more faith Alex can hit than Chavez. Have any of his supporters noticed how bad he has been for months? Plus, he is hitless in the playoffs. Now, is not the time to give up on a player who was considered good enough to play regularly during the year.
I don’t know why the Marlins would put Reyes in an Arod deal unless they are saving a whole lot of money…..and for that to happen the Yanks would have to take on more payroll and they can’t do that…..they have to save money if they trade Alex….not add more
Patrick October 18th, 2012 at 11:09 am
Also why is it an insult to bench A-rod but not an insult to bench Granderson and Swisher? All 3 have done poorly, all 3 have been benched. But for some reason with A-rod it’s an insult? Please..
———————-
I know this was not to me, but IMO, it is wrong to bench all of them. They are part of the lineup that got you here, so I think you stick with them and hope they come out of it before the series ends.
“The Yankees will probably talk to the Marlins about a deal involving Rodriguez “just to get rid of an outdated superstar,” Olney writes. Mark Buehrle and Heath Bell could end up going from Miami to New York if the sides complete a trade. The Yankees and Marlins have had preliminary talks about a possible deal.
”
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com
I’d like to have Buerle but Bell is terrible an you’d really have to know how the money shook out to know if something like this would make sense…..the Yanks can’t afford to add more payroll just to get rid of Alex and that trade would do nothing to address te fact that they can’t hit
Buerle and Bell are owed 71 million between them…..so Id assume the Marlins would at least want enough money kicked in so that the money was even……the question is that would that make the Yankees better? I dunno…..I guess it would depend on if Alex bounced back and how they’d replace him in the lineup….
The Marlins are not going to give the Yankees anything of value for Alex. Stop with all the Reyes and Buerle talk.
If anything does happen, it would simply be the Marlins shipping out Bell which they want to get rid of in the worst way, in exchange for Alex who the Yankees want out of NY. The Marlins would pay Alex the amount still owed to Bell with the Yankees paying the difference between that amount & the reminder of $114 million they still owe Alex. Then the Yankees would still have to pay Bell his remaining salary.
In other words they are still paying the $114 million. In this scenario however, they would get Arod out of NY and all the hoopla he attracts; and they can replace Soriano with Bell or possibly use him for trade bait.