The LoHud Yankees Blog

A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Granderson ain’t so bad

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Oct 26, 2012 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Curtis Granderson strikes out a lot and he was a disappointment in the postseason, but do the Yankees really need to trade him this winter?

Getting rid of Granderson has become a popular position ever since his dismal playoff performance — even before that, really — and I’ve said that trading Granderson might make sense if the Yankees can get a starting pitcher for him, but is Granderson really a must-go player who’s easy to lose and easy to replace?

“I will listen on anybody,” Brian Cashman told Joel Sherman. “But you would be hard-pressed to get enough to trade a center fielder who is a perennial 40-homer-plus man.”

If Alex Rodriguez is no longer a 30-homer guy, and Nick Swisher is on his way out, then only true home run hitters left on the Yankees roster are Robinson Cano, Mark Teixeira and Granderson. Granted, the team will almost certainly add some power at DH or an outfield corner, but the idea that this lineup is overloaded with home run hitters is an exaggeration. Frankly, putting those three — Cano, Teixeira and Granderson — in the 3, 4 and 5 spots wouldn’t be a bad middle of the order. Add Derek Jeter at the top, slide Rodriguez into the No. 2 or 6 spot, and the Yankees have the sensible beginnings of a pretty good lineup.

Three common complaints about Granderson:

1. He strikes out too much
He strikes out a lot, but does he really strike out too much? If he cut down on the strikeout numbers he’d be one of the elite hitters in baseball, but there’s a lot of gray area between the elite hitters and the guys who are a drain on the offense. It’s kind of like the bad routes Granderson takes in center field. Yes, he takes bad routes, but he’s athletic enough to make up for them a lot of the time. The trade off keeps him from being an elite defender, but it lets him remain a viable one. Yes, Granderson strikes out a lot, but those strikeouts come with the significant upside of 40-plus homers.

2. He was a massive disappointment in the postseason
So were most of the Yankees. If Granderson is going to be knocked for his dismal showing this month, it’s also worth noting that he hit more home runs in the final month of the season than in any other month, and before this postseason he was a career .267/.375/.535 hitter in the playoffs (.313/.459/.583 in his first two postseasons with the Yankees).

3. The Yankees can’t afford him beyond 2013
I tend to agree that the Yankees will have a hard time signing both Granderson and Cano beyond next season, and with so much center field depth rising through the system — and Brett Gardner available to play center at any point — it makes sense to leave Granderson off the priority list. But that expiring contract also limits Granderson’s trade value. As Sherman wrote, the idea of a Carlos Beltran-type deal for an elite young starter seems unlikely. It’s all about value here. If nothing else, the Yankees will be able to offer Granderson a qualifying offer at the end of next season and get a draft pick for him. That’s not a terrible fallback plan, and might be as valuable as anything the Yankees will find on the trade market.

Look, there’s some merit to trading Granderson, but a lot of that merit is based on the idea that some other team will value him as an elite run producer who hits for a ton of power out of the center field position. Thing is, the Yankees should — and do — view him the same way, and they’d have to get get similar value to make a trade worthwhile. He might be frustrating to watch swing and miss, but he might be just as frustrating to try and replace.

Associated Press photo

 
 

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74 Responses to “Granderson ain’t so bad”

  1. yanks61 October 26th, 2012 at 12:04 pm

    Re-post:

    Good, Mick. I look forward to Bret spinning out some groovy trade ideas.

    Yankee Trader – for an “old guy” you sure hit a lot of home runs with your posts.

    I’m all for getting younger and all, but you, austinmac, tomingeorgia, MTU, MG, Mick and few other vets are still more than just bench players on the Lohod roster. Keep up the good stuff!

    By the way, maybe Lohud should have awards like poster rookie of the year, most accomplished poster, most witty (Nick gets that one hands down, IMHO) etc. I think something like this was done in the past. I’m sure Tricia would be happy to count the votes.

  2. yanks61 October 26th, 2012 at 12:07 pm

    Oh, and I shouldn’t forget the Stoneburner – another invaluable member of the oldtimer’s contingent!

    And sorry if I left anyone off that list. Have a good afternoon everyone.

  3. austinmac October 26th, 2012 at 12:08 pm

    Does he really strike out too much?

    Yes.

  4. The Return of Stoneburner October 26th, 2012 at 12:11 pm

    blake October 26th, 2012 at 12:02 pm
    who is saying you don’t need pitching? I’m saying you need pitching and offense.

    *****

    Again – you made a sarcastic comment re: Gary Sanchez being traded for pitching – saying pitching is key!

    I found objection with the sarcasm saying that pitching is key – based on Brian Sabean.

    Of course you need offense – but pitching is more important – you can interchange and reivent the offense year to year instead of having your ideal fantasy of all 23-25 year old players at every position.

  5. Irreverent Discourse October 26th, 2012 at 12:11 pm

    Look, there’s some merit to trading Granderson, but a lot of that merit is based on the idea that some other team will value him as an elite run producer who hits for a ton of power out of the center field position. Thing is, the Yankees should — and do — view him the same way, and they’d have to get get similar value to make a trade worthwhile. He might be frustrating to watch swing and miss, but he might be just as frustrating to try and replace.

    QFT.

  6. Shame Spencer October 26th, 2012 at 12:12 pm

    Granderson wasn’t signed to carry the offense with Cano.. he was signed to compliment an offense that already had Cano, Tex and Arod in the middle of the order.

    He’s a good player. He’s just not a game changer all by himself (few are).

    Like Meryl Streep in The Iron Lady, he could use a better supporting cast.

  7. Shame Spencer October 26th, 2012 at 12:14 pm

    “The important thing is not to stop questioning.” – Albert Einstein

  8. RadioKev October 26th, 2012 at 12:15 pm

    Some reposts:

    Not winning the World Series sure wasn’t Granderson’s fault in 2010-2011. Last ALDS he had a .925 OPS. In 2010 his post season OPS was 1.121 in 9 Games.

    Also, let’s not get carried away with Austin Jackson yet. He’s still got to do it again next season. The player adjusts, and then the league adjusts. We’ll see.

    He’s had one better season, but that doesn’t mean he’ll be better again in 2013.

  9. Jerkface October 26th, 2012 at 12:15 pm

    You can re-invent pitching. Bumgarner wasn’t a full time starter in 2010, he was only 20 years old. Vogelsong wasn’t even on the team. They were the big guns this year behind Matt Cain.

    The giants had a very solid foundation with Posey & Sandoval, Matt Cain & Lincecum. They added around those guys.

    You can win in the postseason with any roster combination, but you need the luck & timeliness of actually getting good performances out of those guys. Any pitcher can pitch a good game. Any hitter can hit in a series. The key is balancing the roster so you have a high likelihood of both.

  10. The Return of Stoneburner October 26th, 2012 at 12:19 pm

    Jerkface October 26th, 2012 at 12:15 pm
    You can re-invent pitching. Bumgarner wasn’t a full time starter in 2010, he was only 20 years old. Vogelsong wasn’t even on the team. They were the big guns this year behind Matt Cain.

    The giants had a very solid foundation with Posey & Sandoval, Matt Cain & Lincecum. They added around those guys.

    You can win in the postseason with any roster combination, but you need the luck & timeliness of actually getting good performances out of those guys. Any pitcher can pitch a good game. Any hitter can hit in a series. The key is balancing the roster so you have a high likelihood of both.

    *****

    Bumgarner was part of that pitching in 2010 WS and he is a foundation going foward.

    Sandoval was non-existent – even benched at one point in the 2010 run.

    Again – once you have your staples and foundation – you can add around it. You need to have that foundation and also get lucky adding to it (Volgesong). Brian Sabean’s words are right:

    “Pitching, manager and coaching staff,” Giants general manager Brian Sabean said. “If you have strength and stability there it allows you to re-invent yourself like we have.”

    Better to have the pitching being a core strength going forward – - – -

  11. Jerkface October 26th, 2012 at 12:24 pm

    Better to have the pitching being a core strength going forward – – – -

    Disagree. Its too volatile. For example, Jonathan Sanchez & Tim Lincecum received the bulk of the starts for the 2010 Giants in the postseason. Sanchez is no longer on the team & Lincecum can only pitch in relief effectively. Pitchers are most likely to go down with injury as well. You need good pitching, I disagree that you should build your team around it. There was an article posted that was related to fantasy, but the gist was that smart team builders only allocate 30% of the budget for pitching because its volatile & prone to injury. I agree with that sentiment.

    And please, manager and coaching staff? The most overrated portion of any team.

  12. Shame Spencer October 26th, 2012 at 12:25 pm

    Lincecum…………what an effing mystery that is…

  13. Bronx Jeers October 26th, 2012 at 12:26 pm

    Granderson busted open the Yankee single season strikeout record in 2012.

    Who’s record did he break?

    Curtis Granderson in 2011.

    And he definitely helps them win games but in my simplistic formula for lineup construction, you need to limit the guys that have more Ks than hits.

    K > H = NG :wink:

  14. Irreverent Discourse October 26th, 2012 at 12:34 pm

    Pitching is volatile, that’s exactly why you need to invest in it properly… and exactly why you can never have enough of it. Investing in pitching doesn’t necessarily mean spending money though. It’s also trading away excess batting talent for young cost controlled pitchers.

    I had argued earlier this year that pitching needs to be young and cost controlled as much as possible. Spending money on pitching is nuts. Money is much better spent on the lineup/bench. I’ll allot a team money spent on one solid ace, maybe a solid #2… but any more than that… or in the bullpen? Crazy.

  15. NYY_Girl_Penny October 26th, 2012 at 12:37 pm

    What is wrong with the current Yankees is a combination of management, single dimensional players, mediocre talent players,etc. This is my list of and my opinion.

    They are old
    Mostly same hitter type low BA with some power
    fastball only hitters
    Pull happy Hero HR swings (3 run HR with nobody on)
    Too many video tape dependent bats
    In their head over analyzing at the plate
    Forget to baseball is supposed to be fun
    Can’t hit with RISP
    Mark Tex offense major decline – (not what they thought they were getting at all)
    A lot of declining stars
    Situational hitting is non existent
    BB/Walks at all time low
    Swing at anything / behind in count
    Signing old role players only
    No young talent, Pass on free agents
    Trade away young potential talent
    didn’t replace Damon,Posada,Matsui
    have too many rings they seem non-chalant about more
    they don’t get excited about advancing/winning (possibly because above)
    Extremely wealthy players, at the apex of payday for career
    All about me and my stats (I know they say the right things in media)
    Lack of excitement, very dull to watch
    Too many long no trade contracts
    Bid against themselves when no other team would give close to what they give players
    overly paying players whos production in major decline
    penalizing fans for their bad contract signings
    Boring as heck to watch
    Seating prices arrangements
    focused only on pitching in off-season
    Budget Constraints
    Reducing payroll at worst possible time
    New Stadium design
    New Stadium Price
    Manager is a friend not manager
    Manager is media savvy not baseball savvy
    Baseball doesn’t interest new owners
    Owners not involved like George
    Cashman is omnipotent, his way or highway
    Girardi is not a good fit with this team regardless if he is a good manager or not (not)
    Hitting coach treats all like young Arods
    Rob Thomson has no business coaching

    These are just some of the reasons in no particular order that contribute to whats wrong with this team. Some things listed are much more severe and others petty, some a bit redundant but it all adds up and contributes to what we see and makes this team worse and of course less enjoyable to watch.

  16. NYY_Girl_Penny October 26th, 2012 at 12:40 pm

    Granderson would be a good fit on many teams but they way this team is built he is not. Sure his 40+ HRs are great but at what cost ? 200+ Strikeouts and a .230 BA ? When you have under performing Arod and Tex as your 3,4 with I can’t carry a team Cano, Granderson becomes a liability. Then again, if our 3,4,5 were better than what they are, he’d be an asset.

    The reality is the team on paper looks a lot better than how it plays on the field. Granderson might be able to bring back some young talent, which this team is in dire need of. I say trade him now while you can!

  17. NYY_Girl_Penny October 26th, 2012 at 12:43 pm

    Shame Spencer October 26th, 2012 at 12:12 pm
    Granderson wasn’t signed to carry the offense with Cano.. he was signed to compliment an offense that already had Cano, Tex and Arod in the middle of the order.

    He’s a good player. He’s just not a game changer all by himself (few are).

    —-

    Shame, exactly ! The issue isn’t Curtis as much as it is our 3,4,5. If they were what we all expected them to be, Grandy would be an excellent fit. Since our 3,4,5 are what they are well, he is more of a liability. This team needs bats that can hit for average and high OBP more than anything. How can you not bring Ichiro back especially not knowing what Jeter will be like ?

  18. blake October 26th, 2012 at 12:51 pm

    “Not winning the World Series sure wasn’t Granderson’s fault in 2010-2011.”

    didn’t say it was…..just said they haven’t won a WS with him and now Jackson is probably going to be a better player going forward than Granderson will be…..

    again doesn’t mean they shouldn’t have made the trade……or even that it was a bad trade…..it’s just that in the long run the Tigers are winning the deal…..that’s all.

    Basically my overall point is my belief that the Yankees should try to avoid trading good prospects when they can buy what they need……1) a lot of the times it comes back to bite you as the prospects may pan out 2) it may actually cost you more money in the long run.

    Had the Yankees signed Holliday instead of making that trade then right now they’d have Holliday locked up and they’d have Jackson in CF….meaning they may not even need more offense going in to 2013…..

  19. Out Pitch October 26th, 2012 at 12:58 pm

    Granderson Aint So Bad..

    My opinion, after noting that in the last 5 years he’s averaged 32 home runs (not perennially 40+) is that it’s more important to determine the shape the overall offense and decide based upon that. Do they want a team of sluggers, contact hitters, a mix etc. Obvious stuff. I’m just saying that you can’t make a decision about Granderson in a vacuum. Plus, having too many streaky guys on one team just aint good.

  20. The Return of Stoneburner October 26th, 2012 at 12:59 pm

    Basically my overall point is my belief that the Yankees should try to avoid trading good prospects when they can buy what they need……1) a lot of the times it comes back to bite you as the prospects may pan out 2) it may actually cost you more money in the long run.

    Had the Yankees signed Holliday instead of making that trade then right now they’d have Holliday locked up and they’d have Jackson in CF….meaning they may not even need more offense going in to 2013…..

    *******

    Holliday is the type of deal I would think the Yankees will want to avoid going forward as much as possible – 7 year deals where you get a lot on the front end and not much in the back end – - – -

    Which is what makes the Granderson trade so great. You get Granderson for 3-4 years – he replaced the lefty power we lost in the OF when Matsui and Damon left – he is just one year removed from a top 5 MVP season – his 43 homers were still valuable in reaching the postseason – going forward they have more financial flexibility than investing in the last 4 years of Hollidays contract which could be very expensive and less than profitable. Plus Jackson is now entering arbitration years with Scott Boras as his client. When we look at Jackson’s most valuable years as far as cost controlled versus what Granderson has given the Yanks as far as Lefthanded power – and given Granderson is not a longterm contract and the Yanks are locked in – it is not as much as one-sided going forward as many make it seem. Let’s just see how this plays out when it is all said and done. As of now, I am taking Granderson 2010-2012 over Jackson 2010-2012 – or it is at least a push. Jackson becomes more expensive in the coming years and is not yet signed to a team friendly contract – and with Boras in the room now – cost controlled/team friendly becomes less iffy – maybe Jackson signs for a team friendly Weaver/CarGo – but maybe he takes the Elvis Andrus/Teixeira route – - – -

  21. The Return of Stoneburner October 26th, 2012 at 1:03 pm

    No more longterm contracts for offense – that means Holliday in hindsight and players going forward – unless you can swing a team friendly Cano type contract with your own – - – -

  22. The Return of Stoneburner October 26th, 2012 at 1:03 pm

    And by team friendly Cano contract – I mean the one Cano is currently playing on – - – -

  23. Bo knows October 26th, 2012 at 1:07 pm

    Had the Yankees signed Holliday instead of making that trade then right now they’d have Holliday locked up and they’d have Jackson in CF….meaning they may not even need more offense going in to 2013…..

    —————-
    You see, I totally agree with the above statement. Then there is Upton. Urk!

  24. Jerkface October 26th, 2012 at 1:08 pm

    Holliday’s long term deal isn’t that bad though. Holliday is only signed through age 36 and is paid 17 million AAV. That is a pretty good contract. He makes 5 million less per year than Mark Teixeira. They are basically the same age:

    2010-2012 .252 .347 .484 .831 vs .302 .385 .517 .903

  25. blake October 26th, 2012 at 1:09 pm

    “Holliday is the type of deal I would think the Yankees will want to avoid going forward as much as possible – 7 year deals where you get a lot on the front end and not much in the back end – – – -”

    Holliday’s deal has been pretty darn good so far. They are 3 years in to the 7 year deal and he’s went .922, .912, .877…. with similar power numbers. That’ll probably turn out to be one of the better contracts of that size you’ll see IMO

  26. blake October 26th, 2012 at 1:11 pm

    “You see, I totally agree with the above statement. Then there is Upton. Urk!”

    yea….it goes against my policy…..which is why I’ve argued that if they can get Hamilton for 5 years then that’s maybe better than trading a bunch of players for Upton.

  27. jacksquat October 26th, 2012 at 1:13 pm

    but the idea that this lineup is overloaded with home run hitters is an exaggeration.

    It’s not that the lineup is overloaded with home run hitters, it’s overloaded with guys trying to hit home runs.

    Only Jeter and Gardner/Ichiro weren’t trying to hit homeruns. Swisher, Cano, Tex, Arod, Granderson, Ibanez, Jones and Martin all had the same hitting approach.

  28. The Return of Stoneburner October 26th, 2012 at 1:14 pm

    blake October 26th, 2012 at 1:09 pm
    “Holliday is the type of deal I would think the Yankees will want to avoid going forward as much as possible – 7 year deals where you get a lot on the front end and not much in the back end – – – -”

    Holliday’s deal has been pretty darn good so far. They are 3 years in to the 7 year deal and he’s went .922, .912, .877…. with similar power numbers. That’ll probably turn out to be one of the better contracts of that size you’ll see IMO

    *****

    We will just have to see – b/c the back end of the deal is where the pain of the deal is usually most felt.

  29. jacksquat October 26th, 2012 at 1:14 pm

    blake October 26th, 2012 at 1:11 pm
    “You see, I totally agree with the above statement. Then there is Upton. Urk!”

    yea….it goes against my policy…..which is why I’ve argued that if they can get Hamilton for 5 years then that’s maybe better than trading a bunch of players for Upton.

    I don’t want either unless Upton is less costly than expected.

  30. Mike Ri October 26th, 2012 at 1:15 pm

    I think Granderson is our best trade bait …… dangle him out there and see what you can get for him…….

  31. ron October 26th, 2012 at 1:22 pm

    What keeping a granderson does is,not enable the yankees to change,or add payroll,or trade for a few players that will make the team better.
    Example;How long are we going to keep him before he get’s paid more than he is worth,and we run out of time to trade him,and lose that window to trade him for something of value?

    After his option year,is he really going to be worth what the yankees give him,or we will lose him for something less than what we can get for him now.
    Same with cano.
    Cano is going to lose all of his value after we sign him to a 7/140 million dollar deal,or more,and i’d rather get 3 nice players now for cano than sign him for what it will take.
    If we trade cano,and granderson,that allows us to rebuild,after we got the best years from them,avoids longterm contracts,and allows us too spend in free agency,take on payroll from trades,etc… that we can’t do with a maxed out payroll.
    Too put it simple,I think we would be a better team trading cano,and granderson,for something nice,then adding a few free agents on more team friendly contracts.

    We can’t keep paying max dollar for every player,paying for what they have already done,into,and past their mid 30′s.

    Lineups have too change.

  32. Lost October 26th, 2012 at 1:22 pm

    Penny:

    I agree that there is a lot wrong with the Yankees Universe right now that its much more than just a single thing to focus on. They no doubt have a lot of work to do and I don’t know if they can do it all by 2013 season. The good news is that they are going to get there eventually.

    Cashman:

    The one thing people seem to easily dismiss is that Brian Cashman will never tip his hat in the media. Brian uses this as a tactic to keep other teams guessing as well as lower expectations. When have you known him to not spend if he wants to do something ? I think this winter we will see a lot of changes but we’ll have to wait and see the market develop first. Let me remind you with a Cashman quote, doing the opposite as he says.

    Cashman: “going after Tex is just fantasy”.

    Cashman has made his share of mistakes but he also has done a good job as well. I don’t think anyone can handle NY as well as him, be careful what you wish for because if he is replaced down the road you may just get someone much worse. A lot of folks wanted Torre out of NY and they got Girardi as a result. I wonder how many of those folks would rather have Torre back ?

    Arod:

    Majority would like to see Arod out of NY but don’t expect that to be published. At the same time few are opposed to seeing how he responds to the post-season conundrum. Make no mistake, Alex has a massive ego and it was severely damaged. He is motivated like no tomorrow.

    Hamilton:

    There would have to be a lot of pieces moved that took place before this was seriously considered. As of now, I’d say no chance, the goal is to get younger and cheaper, JH doesn’t fit the bill. With that said, Yanks would have to switch gears and JH would have to accept a 2-3yr deal. We’ve all seen stranger things happen but the chances of this happening is even slimmer then seeing Alex in a different uniform next year.

  33. RadioKev October 26th, 2012 at 1:26 pm

    Blake,

    First I don’t really see how winning or not winning the World Series has much to do with “winning” the Granderson/Jackson trade. What if the Tigers don’t win the World Series with Jackson? Could they have had a better chance with Granderson?

    Granderson can still outperform Jackson next year. It’s certainly within the realm of possibility. It’s also within the realm of possibility Jackson starts striking out more again. Who knows? I mean, just last season, Jackson had a 88 OPS+.

    Obviously if you look at this past season and think the trends will continue moving forward, the Yankees made a bad decision, but that’s just one possibility. Who’s to say these trends are linear? All we know for certain is that Granderson outperformed Jackson since that trade.

  34. blake October 26th, 2012 at 1:32 pm

    “First I don’t really see how winning or not winning the World Series has much to do with “winning” the Granderson/Jackson trade”

    Because the value was in the short term and they haven’t won theWS since the deal….

    Look I’m not in anyway saying the trade was a bust…..it’s not….Grandy has been good and almost won an MvP…..but if you had a time machine would you still make it knowing what you know now? I wouldn’t

  35. ron October 26th, 2012 at 1:33 pm

    Cashmans statements scare me.
    Sounds like he is saying everything stays the same,and that will not work,imo.

    Look at arod.
    What if arod was making 15 million a year,then we traded him right before he started struggling,for 3 top prospects,or some combination of players,then had that money in addition to spend?
    Same will happen with cano.He will be making 23 million a year,and he will be 35 years old,and unmovable.
    Trade him now for some nice players,then spend in free agency,and that allows us too keep our other prospects.

  36. RMS October 26th, 2012 at 1:34 pm

    I think Granderson is our best trade bait …… dangle him out there and see what you can get for him…….

    ———————————————————————————————————-
    I agree, no harm in looking. I am tired of seeing almost every Yankee hitter swinging from the heels and striking out. With a runner on third, how about getting him in while making an out. Unheard of on this team. They are not fun to watch.
    Wouldn’t you like to see some outfielders on this team that can hit for average, play solid defense, and steal bases? Ichiro, Gardner, Melky?

  37. ron October 26th, 2012 at 1:39 pm

    The yankees with ajax,minus what granderson cost in comparison,and ajax being under control for more years,makes the yankees better because the money saved can be used in other areas.
    Now add ian kennedy,coke,etc…

    The yankees have to get smart,and trade these players at max value,before they pay them more than any player is worth.
    Yes there are exceptions,but they will be insane to give cano 7 years,minimum at 23 million a year,m inimum,or let granderson go for almost nothing.
    We will find replacements,and have more money too spend in fa.

  38. blake October 26th, 2012 at 1:40 pm

    Lost,

    I agree they need to get younger…..but that’s not always easy and sometimes you have to trade good young players to get younger…..what do you think about Upton? Headley?

  39. blake October 26th, 2012 at 1:45 pm

    To me….if you can get Hamilton for 5 years or less then I look at it as a star stop gap…..he hopefully would be able to bridge the gap to the group of young players they have coming before he falls apart…..and he will probably fall apart somewhere around 34 or 35 but you have to know that going in……

    if they signed him for 5 years and he just had 2 elite years left then 2 more Nick Swisher type seasons then it would be worth it even if he fell off the face of the planet in year 5

  40. Duh Innings II October 26th, 2012 at 1:50 pm

    2012 Granderson hit .232 and got on base at a .319 clip.

    His SLG was inflated by his homeruns.

    His stolen bases, stolen base attempt, doubles, and triples are down.

    He struck out 195 times.

    From his baseball-reference.com page:

    “Similar Batters
    View Similar Player Links in Pop-up
    Compare Stats to Similars

    Wally Post (922)
    Jason Bay (921)
    Preston Wilson (912)
    Nick Swisher (904)
    Phil Nevin (904)
    Larry Hisle (899)
    Glenallen Hill (899)
    Gus Zernial (894)
    Bob Horner (893)
    Jose Cruz (891)”

    Not exactly guys who set the baseball world on fire.

    He turns 34 in 2014 spring training and will most likely want a contract taking him through age 37.

    Forget it.

    Trade him.

  41. mick October 26th, 2012 at 1:52 pm

    No way Hal signs JHam to a long term deal.
    I don’t think he wants to sign Cano to a LTD.
    I think he will take the risk of having losing years instead and keep on signing bargain basement old timers.
    Why would he change?
    As Cash said, they were only 4 wins away from another WS…

  42. Bo knows October 26th, 2012 at 1:52 pm

    yea….it goes against my policy…..which is why I’ve argued that if they can get Hamilton for 5 years then that’s maybe better than trading a bunch of players for Upton.

    —————–
    To me – too much risk and hoohah with Hamilton – too much splash and dash. Which is why I’m on board with Hunter. Same principle, save the assets. Suffer another old man for a couple of years.

    Granderson trade – Return now, should net at least one, top fifty prospect, plus. Next year draft pick.

  43. Vanquisher October 26th, 2012 at 1:54 pm

    The Yankees don’t need to get equivalent “trade value” back for Granderson. They can trade him for some other team’s top prospect. The 13 mil saved + the 10 mil 2012 salary of Nick Swisher saves the Yankees 23 mil that can be used to net in Granderson’s replacement. Even more money can be saved if the Yankees can trade Arod.

  44. Bo knows October 26th, 2012 at 1:59 pm

    It’s not that the lineup is overloaded with home run hitters, it’s overloaded with guys trying to hit home runs.

    ———-
    Now that broke me up.

    Simple is always more complicated than it looks. It’s not the HR hitters, it’s the wannabees. A Duuh moment.

  45. mick October 26th, 2012 at 2:02 pm

    Remember the days when Scott Brosius knocked in 100 runs?
    Those days can be here again, with the amount of runners we get on base,
    and it doesn’t have to come from a hairy monster.
    It can come from a Scutaro. A guy who gets close to 200 hits per season and
    has been so under the radar that fans think because he is in the spotlight now and producing
    that it is just a recent phenomenom.

    This is incorrect.
    Check out his past 5 years, when he gets the AB’s he gets close to 200 hits per.

  46. blake October 26th, 2012 at 2:04 pm

    The Yankees realize Curtis Granderson adds value and will almost certainly avoid trading him in a reactionary move, Sherman writes. “I will listen on anybody, but you would be hard-pressed to get enough to trade a center fielder who is a perennial 40-homer-plus man,” GM Brian Cashman said of Granderson, whose 2013 option will be exercised in the coming weeks. Rival executives told Sherman that Granderson could draw trade interest from teams aiming to contend in 2013 if the Yankees made him available.
    Read more at http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/.....HHUxHDl.99

    more value than a lot of folks think.

  47. mick October 26th, 2012 at 2:09 pm

    The Yankees realize Curtis Granderson adds value and will almost certainly avoid trading him in a reactionary move,
    ==============
    Imagine what Cano could bring.

  48. Jerkface October 26th, 2012 at 2:11 pm

    Why does trading Granderson have to be ‘reactionary’, why can’t it be ‘proactive’ :( Or just like… a wise move to make.

  49. Against All Odds October 26th, 2012 at 2:13 pm

    ron October 26th, 2012 at 1:33 pm

    Cashmans statements scare me.
    Sounds like he is saying everything stays the same

    ———————

    Or he could be in his ninja mode

  50. mick October 26th, 2012 at 2:13 pm

    It is a perfect storm for Hal as in 2014 when Granderson and Cano will be looking for top dollar and years, Hal will come back with 189 as his chip.

    I almost feel Hal would rather lose than spend more money than he feels they’re worth.

  51. 86w183 October 26th, 2012 at 2:17 pm

    Remember the days when Scott Brosius knocked in 100 runs?

    ****************************************************

    I sure don’t…. cuz it never happened.

    He did drive in 98 runs once — never more than 71 in any other season

    When people lament bad moves, they need to put retaining Brosius and trading Mike Lowell for three crummy pitching prospects on the list.

  52. Hassey October 26th, 2012 at 2:18 pm

    would you prefer to trade Grandy straight up for 1990 Roberto Kelly, or 1992 Roberto Kelly?

  53. mick October 26th, 2012 at 2:18 pm

    If , in fact, KLong is emphasizing a long ball approach (no pun intended) then he should be replaced.

    In that stadium there is no need to.

    A line drive approach will produce the same amount of HR’s as they are just doubles that accidentally got out of the park.

  54. mick October 26th, 2012 at 2:20 pm

    Remember the days when Scott Brosius knocked in 100 runs?
    =============================
    My point remains the same at 98, professor. ;)

  55. Hassey October 26th, 2012 at 2:20 pm

    right now, they’re accidentally sending fans out of the park

  56. 86w183 October 26th, 2012 at 2:23 pm

    I guess I don’t get the point since it happened once in four years….

  57. mick October 26th, 2012 at 2:23 pm

    Point being, we have enough hairy monsters. Get some single and double hitters and they too can knock in 100. It doesn’t have to be from HR hitters.
    Better yet make em RH hitters to keep them from looking at the short porch.

  58. mick October 26th, 2012 at 2:24 pm

    Our problem wasn’t getting men on base, it was bringing them in…

  59. Hassey October 26th, 2012 at 2:27 pm

    and that problem was far too often caused by an inability to hit mistake pitches (bat speed?) and the inability to make contact to at least extend ABs until you get a pitch to handle. Look at how the Giants created their second run in WS game 1. This year’s Yanks (at least in the playoffs) would have struck out in either or both of those ABs long before putting something in play, fair

  60. tucker October 26th, 2012 at 2:27 pm

    I don’t see the Yanks as better than this Giants team. Giants have better pitching and a proven ability to put the bat on the ball.

    Over 162 games, the Yanks may have a higher OPS and may score more runs, but the offense is not built to manufacture runs against top-quality pitchers in the postseason. Anybody who watched all 162 games could see how the offense struggled against quality pitching.

  61. mick October 26th, 2012 at 2:32 pm

    which is why we need more intelligent hitters who stay within themselves i.e. not more power hitters who are focused on the fences.
    we are like a softball team except in softball they are unlikely to get off speed pitches so they wait on the fastball and get it.

  62. 86w183 October 26th, 2012 at 2:35 pm

    Point being, we have enough hairy monsters. Get some single and double hitters and they too can knock in 100. It doesn’t have to be from HR hitters.

    ***************************************************************************

    Ok, now I get it.

    The Yanks badly need to add speed. Higher average hitters would also help as would cutting down on the strikeouts. Adding speed should also help a mediocre at best defensive OF.

  63. mick October 26th, 2012 at 2:36 pm

    Ok, now I get it.
    ===========
    I knew you would eventually…

  64. mick October 26th, 2012 at 2:41 pm

    Mike F. is saying NYers who are Cowboy or Steeler fans are so because their parents got them footie pajamas for those teams.

  65. mate October 26th, 2012 at 2:47 pm

    It should be a no brainer that this Granderson trade was HORRIBLE.

    You have to give the kids a chance. Period. It sure as heck would have been nice to have both Ajax and Kennedy right now, same for Montero.

    BTW, for all the fascination with Justin Upton around here … Austin Jackson is a better, much more valuable player.

    This years numbers:

    STATS: AVG 2B 3B HR SB BB SO OBP SLG OPS
    Austin Jackson: 300 29 10 16 12 67 134 377 479 856
    Justin Upton: 280 24 4 17 18 63 121 355 430 785

    Thoughts?

  66. munson15 October 26th, 2012 at 2:52 pm

    40 HR’s just ain’t what they used to be. I like Grandy, but he has morphed into Dave Kingman with speed.

  67. blake October 26th, 2012 at 2:53 pm

    40 homers is actually more than it was 10 years ago….it’s just in 2012 that’s really about all Granderson did….

  68. Jerkface October 26th, 2012 at 2:56 pm

    Thoughts?

    Jupton had an injury plagued down year, Austin Jackson is meeting his own potential. Upton crushed Ajax last season and for his career.

  69. UnKnown October 26th, 2012 at 2:59 pm

    http://www.freep.com/article/2.....dyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE

    ————

    Have the Tigers just been a victim of bad luck?

    Thankfully in the comments section Tiger fans don’t think this is the case and that they just flat out are getting beat. Actually accepting that your team has not played well is a concept that some Yankee fans don’t get. It’s refreshing to see that even on Baseball’s greatest stage fans can decipher between weak excuses and reality.

  70. mate October 26th, 2012 at 3:03 pm

    Jerkface October 26th, 2012 at 2:56 pm
    ——————————————
    Injuries are part of the equation. They both are the same age, so staying healthy counts. Also, Upton has been longer in the league.

    I argue that going forward you will see similar production from these two, at much lower price for Jackson, hence more valuable. Also I believe Jackson’s overall numbers next year will again be better than Upton’s but that’s just me speculating.

    But certainly, Upton is not crushing Jackson in anything.

  71. munson15 October 26th, 2012 at 3:03 pm

    Blake, was talking more from a production standpoint. With 40 taters, and a few less K’s, you should be driving in 110-115 runs.

  72. 86w183 October 26th, 2012 at 3:17 pm

    mate —-

    sorry, but Justin Upton indeed crushes Austin Jackson is you look at the last three years.

    Same Batting average (.280)… but Upton has 35 more HR, 72 more RBI, just 4 fewer SB.

    AND Upton is 7 months younger

    I really like A-Jax as a player, but Upton has clearly outperformed him

  73. Bo knows October 26th, 2012 at 3:39 pm

    I mourn Grandy’s swing change at about August of last year. As the pitcher is delivering, his hands are moving backwards

  74. Frankg October 26th, 2012 at 4:52 pm

    They overpaid badly to get Granderson, whose shortcomings were known at the time. Cashman should not have given up 3 good players to get him, Kennedy, Coke and Jackson. That’s part of the reason people are so upset with Granderson. Cashman is a lost cause.

    I shudder to think about any trade he makes and I hope he leaves to become a GM on another team, so the Yankees can take advantage of his tendency to overpay.


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