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Today’s main event: Qualifying offer decisions

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Nov 09, 2012 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Brian Cashman and the rest of baseball’s general managers will leave Indian Wells today. It’s been a typically quiet series of GM Meetings here in California, and the Yankees are predictably expected to leave town without getting any sort of real work done. They might very well have laid some groundwork and made some progress toward something, but right now they have nothing to show for it.

Instead, today’s main event is one set in motion exactly one week ago: Rafael Soriano, Nick Swisher and Hiroki Kuroda each have until 5 p.m. ET to accept or reject the Yankees qualifying offers. The basic expectation is that all three will decline, with Kuroda the only potential exception to the rule.

NICK SWISHER
The Yankees regular right fielder the past four seasons, Swisher could be one of the most popular free agents on the market, and it only makes sense that he’ll try to take advantage of that and land a multi-year contract elsewhere. It seems remarkably unlikely that such an offer will come from the Yankees, and there’s no question the Yankees have to find some way to replace Swisher’s spot on the roster and, ultimately, his production in the lineup.

“A switch hitter, plate discipline, power, he can play multiple positions; … That is a beast,” Cashman said. “What he’s done for us has been significant, especially when you balance the lineup out. All these left handers, it’s nice to have a Teixeira and Swisher (as switch hitters). Trying to retain him or having to replace him, if we don’t have that animal there, you’re going to miss it big time and it’s hard to replace.”

RAFAEL SORIANO
A closer turned setup man turned closer, Soriano opted out of the final year of his contract and seems certain to pursue a multi-year deal elsewhere. Barring a stunning surprise, Soriano will hit the market this afternoon and the Yankees will be left with a decision about whether or not they should replace him in the bullpen.

“I do like what we have,” Cashman said. “I think Joba’s going to be really good for us. I think Robertson, obviously, we already know how good he is. I think Logan has been very underrated. I think Clay Rapada was a huge addition for us. We got two real quality left handers out of our bullpen. I think Aardsma, a former closer with Seattle after Tommy John, I think that was a very low-cost move, a half-million bucks plus incentives. and I think that will serve us well. But I don’t know, it’s hard to say. Do we have to replace (Soriano)? Let’s first find out if he’s not even with us, I guess.”

HIROKI KURODA
Of these three, Kuroda is the only one worth considering as a potential qualifying offer acceptance. In this market, Kuroda could probably get more than $13.3 million and could probably sign for more than one year, but Kuroda is the rare player who seems to value situation ahead of contract, and he might actually prefer a one-year deal at this stage of his career. He would significantly improve the current Yankees rotation if he were to accept, but that seems unlikely, and the Yankees might have to increase their offer to retain Kuroda.

“I think he was very happy here,” Cashman said. “I think he loved it here. I think he’s had a positive experience with all the teams he’s played for. I can’t speak for him, I think he loved playing for the Hiroshima Carp, I think he loved playing for the Dodgers, and I think he loved playing for the Yankees. So what that means in 2013, I don’t know.”

Associated Press photo

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159 Responses to “Today’s main event: Qualifying offer decisions”

  1. Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 9:06 am

    YF-

    Day 12 no electricity?
    How’s your foot? I’m reposting the article you attached at the end of the last thread. Thanks.

    http://www.baseballamerica.com.....14298.html

  2. Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 9:14 am

    Correct me if I’m wrong, but the bottom ten teams in the 2102 standings have the 1st 10 picks and don’t lose their first round pick if they take one of the players offered the QO.

    Here’s the 1st round draft order:

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/reversestandings2012

  3. yankeefeminista November 9th, 2012 at 9:15 am

    YT, yes, Day 12 w/o power. At least the weather’s getting warmer. Hoping for electricity by football Sunday, but I will go check the house again in a couple of hours. The ankle is improving; thanks for asking. I’m hoping doc tells me this week that I can retire the walking boot and start PT. I hope you are doing well!

    Still think Jose Ramirez should be in the top 10. Interesting that BA ranks Marshall do high. I like him. It don’t see him as the kind of arm that Cash favors.

  4. blake November 9th, 2012 at 9:16 am

    Soriano already has declined I believe…..Swisher will as well…..still hopeful Kuroda accepts because if he doesn’t it kinda complicates things a bit.

    If Kuroda declines then I think you just wait and see where his market goes…..make it clear to him that you really want him back and ask him to come back and talk before he signs elsewhere.

    If Kuroda will accept a 1 year deal then I’d probably go on up to 15 million to get him back for a year……if he’s considering other 2 year offers and it’ll take 2 years then I become more hesitant and would probably look in other directions……try to find a replacement and take the draft pick for him.

    Hopefully he’ll accept the offer and the Yanks can move on to ignoring the offense.

  5. yankeefeminista November 9th, 2012 at 9:17 am

    *so high. And *dont see himas the kind of arm…. Typing on my iPhone from a place with no internet but at least it is warm here.

  6. yankeefeminista November 9th, 2012 at 9:19 am

    If we don’t get Kuroda back, it definitely complicates things. Interesting to see how high we will go.

  7. austinmac November 9th, 2012 at 9:19 am

    MLB radio went over the possible list of Kuroda replacements on the short and cheap basis. Not all would likely do one year. Here they are. Read ‘em and weep:

    Oswalt
    Liriano
    Pavano
    DiceK
    Wang
    Blanton
    Saunders
    Milwood
    Young
    Villanueava
    Freddy

    Are they selling playoff tickets yet? They better do what it takes to have him return. I would not blow the deal for a million or two.

  8. Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 9:21 am

    Predictions:

    Swisher goes to the Red Sox-Yankees get a compensatry pick after the competiitve balance picks[6] are picked after the first round. Red Sox don’t lose their first pick. 31 first round picks from attached list.

    Yankees get pick #29 [if they don't sign a FA with a QO], and pick again around 38 or slightly higher.

    Soriano goes to the Marlins who also won’t lose their 1st round pick.

    Kuroda doesn’t take the QO today, taking more time to ponder all offers.

  9. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 9:23 am

    blake November 9th, 2012 at 9:16 am

    Soriano already has declined I believe…..Swisher will as well…..still hopeful Kuroda accepts because if he doesn’t it kinda complicates things a bit.
    ——————

    I don’t think Kuroda will – there is just too much interest in him for it to make sense. He can get a 2 year $30M contract from the Dodgers or even Boston.

  10. blake November 9th, 2012 at 9:24 am

    I’d talk to Dan Haren if Kuroda leaves…..I don’t know if he’d do a one year deal just to prove he’s healthy and then try for a bigger contract next year or not…..maybe.

    Also you could check on Garza…..who will be in his walk year but I’d imagine Theo will want way more than I’d give.

    Other than those 2 the options are all that great if you want to stay cheap and short term and also want to avoid trading a lot for a pitcher.

  11. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 9:24 am

    austinmac November 9th, 2012 at 9:19 am

    MLB radio went over the possible list of Kuroda replacements on the short and cheap basis. Not all would likely do one year. Here they are. Read ‘em and weep:
    ——————–

    I would add Dan Haren to that list.

  12. Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 9:25 am

    YF-

    I see where Jose Ramirez has the best fastball. Average velocity?
    Yankees could use a fireballer in the bullpen as Joba sits around 94-95 now.

  13. blake November 9th, 2012 at 9:25 am

    Kuroda could have probably gotten a 2 year deal last year as well….he seems to like one year deals….so as long as that holds true then the Yankees should do what it takes to get him back

  14. blake November 9th, 2012 at 9:26 am

    if Haren will do a one year deal the Yankees should arguably consider him even if Kuroda does come back.

  15. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 9:30 am

    blake November 9th, 2012 at 9:26 am

    if Haren will do a one year deal the Yankees should arguably consider him even if Kuroda does come back
    ————–

    Agreed. Though I think Haren will want to stay on the West Coast – Padres seem like a good fit.

  16. blake November 9th, 2012 at 9:32 am

    If Kuroda accepts then the Yankees likely have a set rotation of Sabathia, Kuroda, Pettite, Hughes, and then either Nova or Phelps to start the year.

    That’s pretty strong and it would allow them to focus on other needs……if he declines then Cashman has has to again focus on pitching first to sure up the rotation and then that drags things along and limits what he can do elsewhere……take the offer Hiro!

  17. PacoDooley November 9th, 2012 at 9:33 am

    My guess is that Kuroda does not take the qualifying offer, but comes back to the Yankees for a bit more money. He was a steal last season at his salary and the qualifying offer would be a raise, but my guess is that they can offset any possible desire he might have for a multi-year deal by signing him to a 1 year $15m contract.

    Haren on a similar 1 year deal would be nice… Last year we learned that you can never have too many starters.

  18. Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 9:39 am

    Yankees scored 804 runs last year[4.96/game], second to the Rangers 808.
    Kuroda got 4.30 run support with a 3.32 ERA while CC got 5.71 run support with an ERA 3.38.

    Kuroda’s run support was even lower, about a full half run up until his last few outings of the year.

    The loss of Swisher, and the flameout of the offense in the playoffs, might have him concerned about re-upping for another year for a chance at a WS appearance.

  19. Shame Spencer November 9th, 2012 at 9:45 am

    “Per NY Post today, and Joel Sherman, Cano was telling teammates last month he is expecting a 10 year contract. Now a confidant of Cano informed Sherman that the second baseman already took a discount once to sign and won’t do it again.”

    ——————-

    This is exactly what I assumed would happen.. said so a couple seasons back. That initial extension was ridiculously good for the Yanks.

  20. Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 9:45 am

    He’d [Kuroda] be foolish to sign with the Red Sox and try and pitch in Fenway, where his 2012 ERA was 6.70 in 2 starts, with a team not going to the playoffs next year.

    He might possibly wait to see if the Yankees bring back Martin, his teammate with the Dodgers.

    Still predict he doesn’t take the QO, and takes time to weigh his options.

  21. blake November 9th, 2012 at 9:46 am

    Towers has made it clear to teams that he wants help on the left side of the infield, or a No. 1 starting pitcher. He has also made it clear that he needs major-league players.

    “We’re not in position to do prospect deals,” he said.

    The problem Towers faces now is that teams that have what he wants aren’t willing to move, at least not yet. Shortstop has become one of the toughest positions to fill, and true No. 1 starting pitchers are always at a premium.

    The Rangers would have been a good fit, because they have two shortstops. The problem is that they love both of them, and seem perfectly willing to find other ways to fit both into their 2013 lineup, besides trading one of them.

    Profar could end up playing second base, with Ian Kinsler moving to the outfield.

    Upton fits the Rangers well, because they’ll need someone to replace the power they’ll lose when Josh Hamilton doesn’t re-sign. While the Rangers haven’t publicly given up on retaining Hamilton, every indication has been that they won’t at all mind seeing him sign elsewhere.

    http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/b.....he-rangers

  22. CompassRosy November 9th, 2012 at 9:47 am

    Re: Haren…
    http://tinyurl.com/aus3bde

    “However, a long-time AL source who has watched Haren over the past several seasons confirmed to me that medical questions were the main reason the trade fell apart, with the Cubs having serious concerns over Haren’s back stiffness that sidelined him for a part of the 2012 season. Also, hip issues and a noticeable drop in his velocity that forced him to pitch differently than when he was a dominant power pitcher.”

  23. blake November 9th, 2012 at 9:47 am

    Jon Heyman ?@JonHeymanCBS
    #mariners have reached out to russell martin & mike napoli. also looking at corner OF bats.

  24. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 9:48 am

    I just noticed that Tyler Austin has stolen 41 bases and only been caught 2 times. What’s up with that? He is not known as a speedster I think…?

  25. Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 9:49 am

    Shame-

    Good morning. We talked about Cano this morning on the last thread. Couldn’t seem to find a trade for him, when the GM/Team, obtaining him is only guaranteed one year of Cano, when Boras usually takes his players to test the FA market.

  26. Shame Spencer November 9th, 2012 at 9:50 am

    The Mariners need a catcher that can hit :oops:

  27. Shame Spencer November 9th, 2012 at 9:52 am

    Trader – Cano is absolutely trade-able, you just need the right circumstances. I just don’t think we could get enough back at this point to make it worth our wild, but at the same time….. we may end up losing him for nothing.

    Maybe 1 year of Cano for 2 years of Wright!! :twisted:

  28. Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 9:56 am

    Shame-

    Read some of the prior posts. The best deal I could come up with was a trade to the Marlins for Giancarlo Stanton. However just Cano would not seal that deal. Might have to add David Robertson and a prime minor league prospect or two for one guaranteed year of Cano. Even that might be enough, unless Cano agree to an extension at the time of the trade.

  29. RadioKev November 9th, 2012 at 9:56 am

    blake November 9th, 2012 at 9:47 am
    Jon Heyman ?@JonHeymanCBS
    #mariners have reached out to russell martin & mike napoli. also looking at corner OF bats.
    —————-

    That tweet speaks volumes. Not that I like Heyman, but…

  30. austinmac November 9th, 2012 at 9:57 am

    If they are not relaistically going to sign Cano, they must deal him if they can get significantly more than a supplemental pick. It seems a no brainer but not happening.

    I doubt Martin will return and that is the reason for the interest in Ross. Ross has never been a starter in the MLB. Ross and Stewy. Let the downgrades continue.

  31. Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 9:57 am

    Shame-

    The Yankees already gave the Mariners a catcher who can hit. :(

  32. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 9:57 am

    Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 9:49 am
    Shame-

    Good morning. We talked about Cano this morning on the last thread. Couldn’t seem to find a trade for him, when the GM/Team, obtaining him is only guaranteed one year of Cano, when Boras usually takes his players to test the FA market.

    There is the Mark Teixeira trade as an example: Elvis Andrus, Neftali Feliz, Matt Harrison and Jarrod Saltalamacchia. That was for two months of Tex.

  33. Benny Blanco November 9th, 2012 at 9:59 am

    if the mariners are reaching out to russel martin its basically saying that they dont believe Montey is an everyday catcher. shocking!!!

  34. RadioKev November 9th, 2012 at 10:00 am

    Benny Blanco November 9th, 2012 at 9:59 am
    if the mariners are reaching out to russel martin its basically saying that they dont believe Montey is an everyday catcher. shocking!!!
    ——–

    But he caught a no hitter!

  35. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:01 am

    jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 9:57 am

    Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 9:49 am
    Shame-

    Good morning. We talked about Cano this morning on the last thread. Couldn’t seem to find a trade for him, when the GM/Team, obtaining him is only guaranteed one year of Cano, when Boras usually takes his players to test the FA market.

    There is the Mark Teixeira trade as an example: Elvis Andrus, Neftali Feliz, Matt Harrison and Jarrod Saltalamacchia. That was for two months of Tex.
    ———–

    No it wasn’t. When the Braves traded for Tex he had another year on his contract. The Braves traded him to the Angels in his walk year and got Casey Kotchman and a minor leaguer (Steve Marek) who never made it.

  36. Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 10:03 am

    Austinmac-

    I actually wouldn’t mind Georgia native, David Ross, as the Yankee catcher. Better than Martin at throwing out baserunners[SB% .559], showed some pop 9 homers in 176 at bats, pitchers like him.

    I expect him to stay with the Braves. He’ll be their primary catcher while McCann is rehabbing, probably due back early May.

  37. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:09 am

    What confuses me is why the only free agent the Yankees seem inclined to offer a multi year deal is Russ Martin.

    I get that they like him behind the plate and that he has shown power in his bat, but is he really someone you invest in for 3 years? I guess given the lack of catching around the league he is that good of an option.

    I’ve been trying to think about what the Yankees will do rather than what I think they should do. As a result I see them walking away from Kuroda if he wants more than 1 year. I don’t think they’ll sign Hunter or Ichiro, Hunter will want more than one year and the Yankees will want more power and right/left balance than a trio of Gardner, Granderson and Ichiro provides.

    I think they’ll bring back Ibanez on a 1 year deal and install him in RF and get a right handed compliment to him – Jonny Gomes or Scott Hairston maybe. Or they’ll count on Andruw Jones bouncing back because he’s cheap.

    They’ll retain Eric Chavez and maybe sign a guy to be the LH DH – Carlos Pena is someone I bet they look at long and hard.

  38. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 10:09 am

    Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:01 am
    jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 9:57 am

    Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 9:49 am
    Shame-

    Good morning. We talked about Cano this morning on the last thread. Couldn’t seem to find a trade for him, when the GM/Team, obtaining him is only guaranteed one year of Cano, when Boras usually takes his players to test the FA market.

    There is the Mark Teixeira trade as an example: Elvis Andrus, Neftali Feliz, Matt Harrison and Jarrod Saltalamacchia. That was for two months of Tex.
    ———–

    No it wasn’t. When the Braves traded for Tex he had another year on his contract. The Braves traded him to the Angels in his walk year and got Casey Kotchman and a minor leaguer (Steve Marek) who never made it.

    Ok, then 1 year and 2 months. The point remains about the same. You can get good prospects. Two of those guys were considered locks to be good major leaguers.

  39. Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 10:10 am

    Chip-

    I also found this about the 2 month Tex rental by the Angels.

    Initially, according to a source, the Braves asked for Kotchman, top pitching prospect Nick Adenhart and a third player in exchange for Teixeira. But the Angels told Atlanta that although they might be willing to talk about, essentially, a Kotchman-for-Teixeira swap even up, they were not willing to open a hole in their club for either 2008 or 2009.

  40. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 10:12 am

    Cano for Middlebrooks and Bogaerts. :D

  41. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:15 am

    Scouting the bargain bin:

    Here’s a list of position players who would come cheap and thus I wouldn’t be shocked by any of them in pinstripes:

    Placido Polanco
    Ty Wiggington
    Aubrey Huff
    Raul Ibanez
    Andruw Jones
    Eric Chavez
    Kelly Shoppach
    Rod Barajas
    Carlos Pena
    Travis Hafner
    Grady Sizemore
    Nate McLouth
    Carlos Lee
    Jason Giambi

  42. Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 10:15 am

    Anyway, that deal that John Shierholtz made with the Rangers was one of the most lopsided trades a GM ever made. It took years for the Braves to find a capable 1st baseman in Freddy Freeman. They still don’t have a good SS.

  43. AAA November 9th, 2012 at 10:17 am

    Ok, then 1 year and 2 months. The point remains about the same. You can get good prospects. Two of those guys were considered locks to be good major leaguers.

    =================================

    Wouldn’t count on it for a couple reasons. One, it was a bad trade for the Braves and we really haven’t seen one like it since. That’s probably not by accident. Secondly, there is now a premium on youth that wasn’t nearly as prevalent in 2007.

  44. Bronx Jeers November 9th, 2012 at 10:17 am

    Watching this movie “The Scout” on HBO about a young phenom pitcher with big time mental issues that gets signed by the Yanks….George Steinbrenner’s got a decent sized role and he’s not too bad… playing himself. :wink:

  45. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:18 am

    jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 10:09 am

    Ok, then 1 year and 2 months. The point remains about the same. You can get good prospects. Two of those guys were considered locks to be good major leaguers.
    ———–

    I’m in favor of trading Cano (and Granderson) but you’re not getting that kind of haul for them in their walk years.

    Look at what the Twins got for Santana.

    The Mets actually got a great deal for Beltran in part because Beltran’s contract demands were likely going to be palatable to the Giants if they wanted to retain him after the season. Yankees won’t have that luxury with Granderson or Cano who are both likely to seek deals in the range of over 6 years.

  46. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:19 am

    Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 10:15 am

    Anyway, that deal that John Shierholtz made with the Rangers was one of the most lopsided trades a GM ever made. It took years for the Braves to find a capable 1st baseman in Freddy Freeman. They still don’t have a good SS.
    ————-

    And, at the time, they were dealing guys who were blocked…Salty wasn’t playing over McCann and Andrus wasn’t playing over Escobar.

  47. yankeefeminista November 9th, 2012 at 10:22 am

    Yet, Ramirez sits 93-96, but can hit 99 out of pen. Still his. Alue is as a starter, he already has a plus> CU and his slider has really evolved. Austin is big but is smart and aggressive on base paths with good instincts, reads. So, he can definitely steal you some bases.

  48. AAA November 9th, 2012 at 10:23 am

    The Mets actually got a great deal for Beltran in part because Beltran’s contract demands were likely going to be palatable to the Giants if they wanted to retain him after the season.

    =========================

    Good call. Wheeler was a nice score for the Mets. I think that’s the ceiling though. You may be able to score ONE high end prospect (read: Top 20 to 30) for Cano. You almost certainly could not for Granderson.

  49. numbersguy November 9th, 2012 at 10:23 am

    I have a CRAZY idea:

    If Kuroda doesn’t accept the QO and his number goes out of control, Yankees should consider getting below the luxury tax threshold in 2013 rather than waiting for 2014.
    The 2013 threshold is $ 178 mill, so to get below that, they would have to trade Grandy for a cheaper option, and sign Pettitte and MO for 8 – 10 mill each. That would leave than enough money to fill out the roster with cheap 1-2 mill players for other remaining spots on the roster.

    This way, we don’t have to go through two years of cuts, just take the hit in one year. And go big in 2014.

  50. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 10:23 am

    You guys are making it sound like they couldn’t get a top 100 prospect for Cano… I think they could get a top guy from a team that covets him and is going for it in 2013. Or a somewhat more lateral trade for a Kemp or JUpton. If not, then just keep him. I would like the Yankees to at least try though, after offering him a reasonable contract of course.

  51. Yankee Trader November 9th, 2012 at 10:24 am

    Have to go. Always fun to interact with everyone.

    My predictions again for today, subject to change on a whim. :)

    Swisher ends up a Red Sox. They won’t lose their 1st pick.

    Soriano signs with the Marlins.

    Kuroda doesn’t accept the QO-takes time to consider all options and to see what direction the Yankees are going in.

    Nats go after Bourn or BJ Upton, a Virginia native and sign one of them

    Grienke stays in LA-either Angels or Dodgers

    Hamilton goes to the Orioles. Ouch!

    Hunter goes to the Rangers

    Ichiro resigns with the Yankees

    That’s all she wrote.

  52. yankeefeminista November 9th, 2012 at 10:24 am

    Should read YT, darn iPhone corrector and should read that J-Ram’s value is still as a SP.

  53. yankeefeminista November 9th, 2012 at 10:25 am

    Here’s hoping that the Orioles don’t get Hamilton. He’s the last player I want in our division.

  54. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:26 am

    AAA November 9th, 2012 at 10:23 am

    The Mets actually got a great deal for Beltran in part because Beltran’s contract demands were likely going to be palatable to the Giants if they wanted to retain him after the season.

    =========================

    Good call. Wheeler was a nice score for the Mets. I think that’s the ceiling though. You may be able to score ONE high end prospect (read: Top 20 to 30) for Cano. You almost certainly could not for Granderson.
    ——————-

    Yeah, in some ways Carlos Beltran at 35/36 was more attractive in trade than Robinson Cano would be this winter.

    Due to his age, he represented a player that many teams could have signed. The number of teams that can sign Cano and teams aren’t going to trade multiple good young assets for a player unless they at least believe they can sign him. So a team like the Royals that has tons of young assets isn’t going to be in the market for Robbie.

  55. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:28 am

    jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 10:23 am

    You guys are making it sound like they couldn’t get a top 100 prospect for Cano… I think they could get a top guy from a team that covets him and is going for it in 2013. Or a somewhat more lateral trade for a Kemp or JUpton. If not, then just keep him. I would like the Yankees to at least try though, after offering him a reasonable contract of course.
    —————

    Why are the Dodgers trading an MVP in Kemp that’s under their control for Cano who they would then have to re-sign?

    Why are the D’backs trading a 25 year old talented player like Upton who is under their control for Cano?

    Cano doesn’t have much trade value because of his likely contract demands.

  56. RadioKev November 9th, 2012 at 10:29 am

    I think trading Cano’s trade value is somewhere between Mark Teixeira’s Rangers/Braves trade, and Carlos Beltran’s Mets/Giants trade.

    Rangers obviously got a great package for a year and a half of Tex. Mets got a top prospect and one more for a half season of Beltran.

    Tex as your ceiling, Beltran as your floor.

  57. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 10:29 am

    I’m a little surprised that BA has Campos as high as #5. He was very impressive, but still a 19 year old that only made 5 starts in A ball before having to shut it down.

  58. MTU November 9th, 2012 at 10:30 am

    I agree with whoever said we shoould be willing to up our offer to Kuroda to as much as 15 mil or so on a 1 yr deal if he refuses the QO.

    He’s a perfect fit for us under the current circumstances.

    If he wants a multi-year deal he’s gone though.

    Secondary targets are Haren, Garza, or Greinke.

    We’ll need a # 2 who can eat innings. That makes Haren somewhat questionable.

    I hope we land Kuroda and soon.

    ;)

  59. AAA November 9th, 2012 at 10:31 am

    So a team like the Royals that has tons of young assets isn’t going to be in the market for Robbie.

    =================================

    Probably true of some contending teams as well. Take the Cardinals. They were THIS close to the World Series. You think there’s any chance they’d consider moving Oscar Taveras for Cano? I don’t either.

  60. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 10:31 am

    Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:28 am
    jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 10:23 am

    You guys are making it sound like they couldn’t get a top 100 prospect for Cano… I think they could get a top guy from a team that covets him and is going for it in 2013. Or a somewhat more lateral trade for a Kemp or JUpton. If not, then just keep him. I would like the Yankees to at least try though, after offering him a reasonable contract of course.
    —————

    Why are the Dodgers trading an MVP in Kemp that’s under their control for Cano who they would then have to re-sign?

    Why are the D’backs trading a 25 year old talented player like Upton who is under their control for Cano?

    Cano doesn’t have much trade value because of his likely contract demands.

    Yes, the Kemp deal would have to be contingent on the Dodgers and Cano working out a deal, probably the same for AZ. They both conceivably have the money to do it though.

  61. blake November 9th, 2012 at 10:31 am

    i’ll take Montero back if the M’s don’t want him.

  62. blake November 9th, 2012 at 10:33 am

    You’d have to shop Cano to a team that either really is in win now mode…..or a team that could afford to sign him to the type of contract he wants…..the Nats, the Tigers, the Dodgers etc fit those bills….

  63. MTU November 9th, 2012 at 10:34 am

    If you offer a negotiating window to a team who can afford to sign Cano then you get a very good haul for him.

    Does Cano have any no-trade protection ?

  64. blake November 9th, 2012 at 10:34 am

    Can’t see the Dodgers doing a Kemp for Cano deal….Kemp’s contract is good relative to his talent and he’s 2 years younger than Cano is.

  65. blake November 9th, 2012 at 10:35 am

    “Does Cano have any no-trade protection ?”

    don’t think so

  66. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:35 am

    How about Curtis Granderson for Kung Fu Panda?

    With Pagan and Melky gone the Giants need a CF. Panda’s not particularly good at 3b or 1b but for the Yankees could DH and play a little in the field. He would bring them a switch hitter that replaces Swisher’s bat. He’s due $6M this year and a little over $8 in 2014. It would lower this year’s payroll, Yankees could move Gardner to CF and sign a LF (Ichiro?)

  67. RadioKev November 9th, 2012 at 10:36 am

    Blake,

    I don’t know. I don’t think they’d have to be able to resign him. Plenty of on the bubble teams would take Cano’s rental bat.

  68. blake November 9th, 2012 at 10:36 am

    to do a deal with Arizona for Cano I think you’d have to expand the deal and include other players…..things KT could keep if he couldn’t sign Cano. Towers could also just turn around and flip Cano at the deadline….and he could potentially get a good return if the right team wanted him.;

  69. blake November 9th, 2012 at 10:37 am

    “I don’t know. I don’t think they’d have to be able to resign him. Plenty of on the bubble teams would take Cano’s rental bat.”

    yea but I’m talking to get the kind of return you’d need…..every team would want Cano for 2013…..but you have to create a situation where a team will actually pay you the right price for him.

  70. MTU November 9th, 2012 at 10:37 am

    Blake-

    Then the field is wide open.

    People should remember that Cano is considered a superstar by many and is in his prime.

    If you have the money you’ve got to love the opportunity to have him.

    That means a good haul.

    ;)

  71. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:40 am

    blake November 9th, 2012 at 10:33 am

    You’d have to shop Cano to a team that either really is in win now mode…..or a team that could afford to sign him to the type of contract he wants…..the Nats, the Tigers, the Dodgers etc fit those bills….
    ———————–

    Actually, a team that might fit would be the Marlins. Tino knows Cano, has worked with Cano and would probably speak highly of him. After last year’s debacle the Marlins might be looking for a do-over with fans and a middle infield of Cano and Reyes would certainly be exciting.

    What the Yankees could get back? I have no idea. Not Stanton. Maybe Jake Turner, Rob Brantley and Christian Yellich

  72. AAA November 9th, 2012 at 10:40 am

    to do a deal with Arizona for Cano I think you’d have to expand the deal and include other players…

    ==============================

    Also worth noting that Snakes have a pretty decent $5.5M solution at 2B right now.

  73. blake November 9th, 2012 at 10:41 am

    If the Yanks don’t address their offense this winter then they could be in a sell mode situation at the deadline and move Cano/Granderson then……I’m not saying that’ll happen…..I’m saying it could and we just saw how fast it can last year when the Phillies went from best record in baseball in 2011 to a seller at the deadline in 2012.

  74. MTU November 9th, 2012 at 10:42 am

    Cano is the kind of guy you can build a team around if you can afford the freight.

    GG, .300 + BA, 25 + dingers as 2B

    You’re looking at another 5 years or so of solid production and star power to pull the fans in.

    ;)

  75. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:42 am

    RadioKev November 9th, 2012 at 10:36 am

    Blake,

    I don’t know. I don’t think they’d have to be able to resign him. Plenty of on the bubble teams would take Cano’s rental bat.
    ————

    Teams will be interested in him, but they won’t give up equal value if they’re looking at him as a rental.

  76. RadioKev November 9th, 2012 at 10:43 am

    Eh, I dunno. If Cashman made it clear he was taking offers for Cano, at Cano’s 2013 price, I think the demand would be very strong. If demand can hand Zack Greinke the most valuable contract ever for a RHP (as some are speculating), then I think we’ll see something with Cano.

    Then again, I honestly can’t picture Cashman doing that.

  77. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 10:44 am

    blake November 9th, 2012 at 10:34 am
    Can’t see the Dodgers doing a Kemp for Cano deal….Kemp’s contract is good relative to his talent and he’s 2 years younger than Cano is.

    They could prefer to pay for 2B rather than CF(LF/RF?). They have outfield and pitching prospects. Just an idea, you never know what a team might want to do, especially those throwing around money like the Dodgers.

  78. blake November 9th, 2012 at 10:44 am

    “Also worth noting that Snakes have a pretty decent $5.5M solution at 2B right now.”

    sure….he’s no Cano though

  79. blake November 9th, 2012 at 10:45 am

    The Nats could afford to sign Cano and they have prospects

  80. MTU November 9th, 2012 at 10:45 am

    If Erin were still here she would kill each and every one of us.

    Catch you all later.

    :)

  81. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:46 am

    blake November 9th, 2012 at 10:41 am

    If the Yanks don’t address their offense this winter then they could be in a sell mode situation at the deadline and move Cano/Granderson then……I’m not saying that’ll happen…..I’m saying it could and we just saw how fast it can last year when the Phillies went from best record in baseball in 2011 to a seller at the deadline in 2012.
    —————

    The issue I see with that is the difference in the GMs. Amaro’s not a very good GM and made plenty of stupid moves, but one thing he isn’t is conservative. Cashman on the other hand doesn’t make major in-season trades. Never has. He’s too methodical for the rush of the deadline to be an environment he thrives under. If he’s going to move Cano and/or Granderson it would have to be during the winter.

    The other thing is what I’ve said before – I don’t think Brian’s creative enough to trade a star player. It goes against what he knows. He would, I think, rather play the string out and just let them walk as free agents instead of trading them and getting something back for them. He’ll lie to himself and believe that there’s a chance that one or both player will give him a discount or accept the qualifying offers or whatever.

  82. AAA November 9th, 2012 at 10:49 am

    Cano is the kind of guy you can build a team around if you can afford the freight.

    GG, .300 + BA, 25 + dingers as 2B

    You’re looking at another 5 years or so of solid production and star power to pull the fans in.

    =================================

    Which is why he’ll most likely stay a Yankee.

  83. blake November 9th, 2012 at 10:49 am

    “The other thing is what I’ve said before – I don’t think Brian’s creative enough to trade a star player. It goes against what he knows. He would, I think, rather play the string out and just let them walk as free agents instead of trading them and getting something back for them. ”

    I’ve said this before but the Yankees have never had to operate like this before…..they’ve never had to consider selling their star players to best manage a budget number…..do they know how? Can they make this work? I guess we’re going to find out……

  84. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:50 am

    And if the Yankees fall back in the first half they would still be more likely to add in an attempt to rebound for the second half than sell and look towards the future.

    Again, it’s the schizophrenic nature of the organization. They’re trying to operate in a win now mode while at the same time being concerned for the future. As a result they’re not willing to play prospects or trade productive players for prospects because it hurts the win now philosophy, but they’re also not willing to bring in high level players or make bold trades because they think they need those assets and salary room for the future.

  85. AAA November 9th, 2012 at 10:50 am

    sure….he’s no Cano though

    ========================

    Of course not, but he won’t cost $20M+ to keep around either.

  86. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 10:52 am

    blake November 9th, 2012 at 10:49 am

    “The other thing is what I’ve said before – I don’t think Brian’s creative enough to trade a star player. It goes against what he knows. He would, I think, rather play the string out and just let them walk as free agents instead of trading them and getting something back for them. ”

    I’ve said this before but the Yankees have never had to operate like this before…..they’ve never had to consider selling their star players to best manage a budget number…..do they know how? Can they make this work? I guess we’re going to find out……
    —————————-

    Which is why, as much as I respect Brian, I don’t think he’s the right person for this particular job. His only baseball experience has been with the Yankees. As such this is not something he would ever have gained experience with. They should bump him upstairs and bring in someone from an organization that has worked within long term budget constraints in the past and isn’t prejudiced by “the Yankee way”

  87. RadioKev November 9th, 2012 at 10:53 am

    I don’t think it has to do with lack of creativity (trading a superstar). I think it’s that they still think they have a chance to make the post season, and win the World Series next year. Why ruin those chances when we’re living in the now?

    Also there’s the media and fan backlash. Hell, people who knew of Jesus Montero for all of a month were complaining when we traded him. Imagine the sh!tstorm if they trade Cano.

    Personally, I’d ignore all that stuff, but in there shoes? I appreciate it.

  88. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 10:59 am

    It would be easy to justify trading Cano to the fans if you got the right player(s) back, and explained that they tried to keep him, he wanted crazy money, so they traded him instead of getting nothing but a compensatory draft pick.

  89. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 11:00 am

    All Yankee fans are seeing Arod and what paying a guy mega money into his late 30′s can look like.

  90. AAA November 9th, 2012 at 11:02 am

    and explained that they tried to keep him, he wanted crazy money, so they traded him instead of getting nothing but a compensatory draft pick

    ====================================

    You don’t think that potential trade partners are going to be aware that Cano wants crazy money?

  91. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 11:03 am

    RadioKev November 9th, 2012 at 10:53 am

    I don’t think it has to do with lack of creativity (trading a superstar). I think it’s that they still think they have a chance to make the post season, and win the World Series next year. Why ruin those chances when we’re living in the now?

    Also there’s the media and fan backlash. Hell, people who knew of Jesus Montero for all of a month were complaining when we traded him. Imagine the sh!tstorm if they trade Cano.

    Personally, I’d ignore all that stuff, but in there shoes? I appreciate it.
    ———————

    I agree – but like I said, you can’t have it both ways. Either you’re trying to win now or you’re building for the future, but you can’t do both. If you know that you can’t keep Cano and Granderson going forward and you have a team with age all over it, a lack of minor leaguers ready to contribute (or that you trust to contribute) and too much money tied up in the players still on the roster to be aggressive in a weak free agent market – then the smart move is to deal them.

  92. DONNYBROOK November 9th, 2012 at 11:03 am

    Kuroda has currently got Cashman on Hold, as to trading with Arizona, SD, etc. Cashman gets Kuroda and Pettitte, (Pettitte pretty much a given), in the fold, and he can then deal any 2 of Phelps, Nova, and Hughes. Coupled with Cano and Nunez, Cashman can then wheel-and-deal. Till the Kuroda question is answered, Cashman is just stringing paper clips to pass the time.

  93. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 11:04 am

    jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 11:00 am

    All Yankee fans are seeing Arod and what paying a guy mega money into his late 30?s can look like.
    —————-

    Agreed.

  94. blake November 9th, 2012 at 11:10 am

    “Of course not, but he won’t cost $20M+ to keep around either.”

    that’s why I said to deal Cano to Arizona you’d likely have to expand the deal to include other players Towers could keep beyond this year.

  95. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 11:11 am

    Interesting – the Rangers don’t plan to go more than 3 years for Josh Hamilton. They’re in a similar spot with him that the Yankees will be in with Cano next year.

    You have a contending team that is in danger of seeing their best player walk away.

    Both teams do have other offensive options.

    In the case of Hamilton, the issue is his personality and physical condition, in the case of the Yankees it will be payroll and a desire to stay away from a monster deal.

    In the end, I think the Yankees will make the mistake of doing what they’ve always done and give Cano a big money deal – because when you come right down to it, that’s what the Yankees do.

  96. blake November 9th, 2012 at 11:11 am

    Jon Heyman ?@JonHeymanCBS
    #mariners looking at swisher. gm jack zduriencik has connection to his dad steve. More important, they seek corner bats

    sounds like a good fit…..they won’t need him to hit in the playoffs :)

  97. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 11:12 am

    AAA, Pujols, Fielder? And they are only firstbasemen. Other teams might be willing to pay him. The Yankees are already overpaying Arod and Tex.

  98. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 11:16 am

    How about this:

    Twins get: Curtis Granderson, David Robertson

    Yankees get: Justin Morneau, Denard Span, Ryan Doumit

  99. Patrick November 9th, 2012 at 11:19 am

    Where does Morneau play? Why Doumit? Span is good but he’s basically a poor man’s Brett Gardner

  100. austinmac November 9th, 2012 at 11:20 am

    Yankee fans were upset with the Montero trade because the team has so very few potential young, impact players. If they traded Cano for young players with upside, I believe the fans would be much more understanding than if they let him walk for a draft pick.

    Signing him to an 8-10 year contract would lead to another and potentially worse deal than AROD’s.

  101. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 11:22 am

    Patrick November 9th, 2012 at 11:19 am

    Where does Morneau play? – DH

    Why Doumit? – So you don’t sign Martin to a 3 year deal or you can play him in RF

    Span is good but he’s basically a poor man’s Brett Gardner – I think you mean Gardner is a poor man’s Denard Span but in any case, there’s no downside to having two good defensive outfielders in Yankee Stadium.

  102. Patrick November 9th, 2012 at 11:25 am

    Chip,

    Doumit is a really bad catcher and doesn’t hit enough to justify it. If you are willing to punt defense then just sign Napoli.

    Morneau at DH would be cool, I can get behind that.

    Span is most definitely a worse player than Gardner. Similar batting numbers but Gardner is much much better in the field and steals a LOT more bases. Gardner is significantly more valuable.

  103. AAA November 9th, 2012 at 11:25 am

    AAA, Pujols, Fielder? And they are only firstbasemen. Other teams might be willing to pay him. The Yankees are already overpaying Arod and Tex.

    =================================

    None of those teams in question had to trade significant young assets before paying the players in question the big money.

  104. austinmac November 9th, 2012 at 11:27 am

    Corey Hart had been mentioned as a possible replacement in right, but the Brewers are currently talking extension with him. Imagine the nerve of a team contracting all the way into 2014.

  105. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 11:28 am

    Patrick November 9th, 2012 at 11:25 am

    Chip,

    Doumit is a really bad catcher and doesn’t hit enough to justify it. If you are willing to punt defense then just sign Napoli.

    Morneau at DH would be cool, I can get behind that.

    Span is most definitely a worse player than Gardner. Similar batting numbers but Gardner is much much better in the field and steals a LOT more bases. Gardner is significantly more valuable.
    —————

    So play Doumit in RF instead of behind the plate. If the Yankees were willing to suffer Raul Ibanez in LF for most of the season then Doumit in RF wouldn’t be that much of a stretch.

    I don’t need Span to be a carbon copy of Gardner – but he can give the team probably what Ichiro did last year and maybe a little more pop than he showed with the Twinkies.

  106. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 11:29 am

    AAA November 9th, 2012 at 11:25 am
    AAA, Pujols, Fielder? And they are only firstbasemen. Other teams might be willing to pay him. The Yankees are already overpaying Arod and Tex.

    =================================

    None of those teams in question had to trade significant young assets before paying the players in question the big money.

    That’s changing the point. The subject was paying a mega contract. There might be teams willing to trade a prospect or two for the right to get Cano. In free agency you are bidding against everyone else.

    Don’t think that all other teams only make perfect deals and only the Yankees make mistakes.

  107. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 11:32 am

    After the trade:

    Assume still they re-sign Martin.

    Jeter – SS
    Span – LF
    Tex – 1b
    Cano – 2b
    Alex – 3b
    Morneau – DH
    Doumit – RF
    Martin – C
    Gardner – CF

    Nice lefty/righty mix – figure Justin, Ryan and Denard would have better offensive numbers going from Target Field to Yankee Stadium. Given his L/R splits you can still sit Justin against LHP and put Alex at DH those days.

  108. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 11:32 am

    Chip, no point trading Granderson for mediocre players. Either someone bites on Granderson’s 40+ HR + CF and gives up a good young player/prospect, or just keep him. Morneau’s salary is 14 mil in 2013 and he wasn’t all that good. The other two are not even worth considering.

    Not a good trade.

  109. AAA November 9th, 2012 at 11:33 am

    There might be teams willing to trade a prospect or two for the right to get Cano. In free agency you are bidding against everyone else

    ===============================

    It’s one year of Cano, and then you’re bidding against everyone else anyway.

  110. Patrick November 9th, 2012 at 11:33 am

    Chip,

    Doumit is bad at fielding RF as well… And it’s not like he’s a great hitter: .272/.331/.446 career numbers. Significant downgrade in RF defensively and offensively. Why not just sign Hunter or Ichiro instead?

    Span is a good player but he’s definitely not as good as Ichiro. Ichiro steals more, better defender, much higher average.

    Even Morneau isn’t really the same player he used to be. He’s very injury prone and last year only hit .267/.333/.440. And he can’t hit LHP worth a crap so he’s not your every day DH.

    You could definitely get a better package for Granderson and Robertson. And frankly I think they would offer more value if you just keep them. Not to mention, it’s not like the Yanks have a huge amount of depth in the bullpen, it would be a bad idea to trade Robertson.

  111. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 11:34 am

    Interestingly – Span was much much better at home than on the road offensively – my guess is that at home he was going gapping

  112. luis November 9th, 2012 at 11:36 am

    I don’t think Cashman will trade Granderson and Cano at the trade deadline. Their worth would be severely down, because the teams on the receiving end won’t get any comp draft picks if they don’t extend them. So the value we get in return won’t be worth trading them. You either trade them this winter or you keep them until their contracts are up. It’s very simple.

  113. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 11:37 am

    AAA November 9th, 2012 at 11:33 am
    There might be teams willing to trade a prospect or two for the right to get Cano. In free agency you are bidding against everyone else

    ===============================

    It’s one year of Cano, and then you’re bidding against everyone else anyway.

    Oy… not in a trade that is contingent upon Cano signing a contract. We’ve gone 360 here…

  114. AAA November 9th, 2012 at 11:39 am

    Oy… not in a trade that is contingent upon Cano signing a contract. We’ve gone 360 here…

    =============================

    Who’s Cano’s agent?

  115. DONNYBROOK November 9th, 2012 at 11:41 am

    Still believe the Yanks oughtta bite-the-bullet, pay over half of A-Rod’s contract, and deal him to Florida. Get Buck back in the deal. Sure, Buck’s hurtin’ defensively, but getting A-Rod off the books and the Yankee roster would be worth it. That Nut in Florida would do just about anything. taking Buck off his hands sweetens the deal.
    With Span Not running after the concussion, he’s a good 4th OF’er.

  116. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 11:42 am

    Patrick November 9th, 2012 at 11:33 am

    Chip,

    Doumit is bad at fielding RF as well… And it’s not like he’s a great hitter: .272/.331/.446 career numbers. Significant downgrade in RF defensively and offensively. Why not just sign Hunter or Ichiro instead?

    Span is a good player but he’s definitely not as good as Ichiro. Ichiro steals more, better defender, much higher average.

    Even Morneau isn’t really the same player he used to be. He’s very injury prone and last year only hit .267/.333/.440. And he can’t hit LHP worth a crap so he’s not your every day DH.

    You could definitely get a better package for Granderson and Robertson. And frankly I think they would offer more value if you just keep them. Not to mention, it’s not like the Yanks have a huge amount of depth in the bullpen, it would be a bad idea to trade Robertson.
    ————–

    I would be in favor of Hunter – but reports say that he’s looking for 2 years and the Yankees aren’t interested in going there at the money he’s going to want.

    As for Ichiro, I would also be in favor of that – hell I’m in favor of signing both of them. But again, the issue for the Yankees is years and money.

    Doumit and Span are both locked through 2014. Doumit gets $3.5m/year and Span gets $11.25 over those two years with an option at $9M ($500k buyout) for 2015.

    I don’t Morneau’s splits would be an issue for the Yankees. They could look at him as a guy they DH against RHP (the role Ibanez was signed for last year) and then against LHP use Alex at DH or some other platoon partner.

    Doumit’s a bad defensive player – I’m not denying that. But he wouldn’t be worse in RF than Ibanez or Jones were in LF.

    I think you’re vastly overstating the value Granderson would have on the market. In fact, the only reason that I think the Twins would be interested in the deal is because it shaves some money off their current payroll and clears a DH spot for Joe Mauer while still giving them a decent offensive player.

    As for bullpen depth, the Yankees will have Rivera and Phelps and Joba and Aardsma and Montgomery will likely be fast tracked given his strong performance last year.

  117. numbersguy November 9th, 2012 at 11:46 am

    Has anyone considered it makes more sance to get below the Luxury Tax threshold in 2013 than in 2014. While it’s $11 mill less in 2013, Hughes Joba Robertson and Logan are cost controlled in 2013, their salary bump in 2014 will be more than 11 mill. Also, we have Cano at $15 mill, reasonable for his play.
    If they let Martin and Kuroda walk, trade Grandy and sign Mo and Pettitte for $8 mill each. Yanks can get below the Luxury Tax threshold in 2013, even while paying $8.5 mill on AJ’s salary.
    Than Yanks can go big in 2014.

  118. DONNYBROOK November 9th, 2012 at 11:46 am

    Morneau and Bay just have Not been the same players since the concussions. Gotta be something to do with reaction time, vision, etc. Seeing “punch -drunk” fighters, makes me believe they are walking time bombs. There is a process underway that will manifest itself Prominently down the road.

  119. austinmac November 9th, 2012 at 11:46 am

    Luis,

    I agree any trade should occur now for the reason you expressed and a player has more value for a full year than 40% of one. That said I don’t think the Yankees have it in them to trade Cano. Maybe Granderson.

    Once Cashman gets his answers and money back on the QOs he will be on fire. He might even call an agent or two. Or wait until the other teams finish their shopping to see who is left.

  120. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 11:48 am

    Patrick

    As for why not just keep Granderson if that’s the best deal you can get for him? Simple math. I can use Granderson to fill two other spots. And by getting Span in the deal and moving Gardner over to CF I lose nothing in the field defensively. None of those guys are going to hit 40 HRs but two of them will probably give you around 25/30 and Span will get around 10.

  121. austinmac November 9th, 2012 at 11:48 am

    The Yankees will be hamstrung(on their own accord)until 2016 by the CBA. I do expect a significant payroll reduction this year as a half way step to 2014. They will gradually let the fans down and not want to do it in one swoop.

  122. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 11:49 am

    Justin’s power numbers dipped when the team moved to Target Field from the Metrodome. That could have played into it as well.

  123. DONNYBROOK November 9th, 2012 at 11:50 am

    An OF of Span and Granderson? AKA Punch-and-Judy. NOPE

  124. NYY_Girl_Penny November 9th, 2012 at 11:50 am

    Cano was telling teammates he is expecting a 10-year contract at the top of the market.

    I know he is arrogant but the guy is in lala land. If I were the Yanks I’d look at trading him now and getting as much value as you can. Knowing he’ll be off the books you can go after hamilton or other bigger better disciplined better attitude bats.

    Cano never carried the torch and look how he performs when the team depends on him. I don’t see it as a slump either. pitchers know you don’t have to throw him strikes and he’ll swing.

  125. DONNYBROOK November 9th, 2012 at 11:51 am

    Make that Span and Gardner.

  126. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 11:52 am

    DONNYBROOK November 9th, 2012 at 11:50 am

    An OF of Span and Granderson? AKA Punch-and-Judy. NOPE
    ———–

    Really wish you knew how to read.

    Granderson would be traded to the Twins for Span, Morneau and Doumit.

    OF would be:

    Span – LF
    Gardner – CF
    Doumit – RF

  127. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 11:53 am

    DONNYBROOK November 9th, 2012 at 11:51 am

    Make that Span and Gardner.
    ———–

    It would be the best defensive combination in baseball. A good thing if Doumit is the RF’er

  128. G. Love November 9th, 2012 at 11:53 am

    I don’t know, I’m kinda getting to the point that I hope Cashman & Hal stick to this plan to strip the Yankees due to bad contract decisions they made and turn the team into an also-ran.

    There’s a smugness about Cashman I never liked and while it would kill me to see the Yankees run into the ground, I would be thrilled to see Cashman go down as the GM who destroyed the team and eventually run out of here sooner than later.

    The thing Hal Steinbrenner needs to remember is his siblings and himself wouldn’t have a fraction of what they do to play with if it were not for rabid fans worldwide who support the team at the park and demanded YES be part of their cable/satelite packages.

    Their fortune wasn’t built on being thrifty. It was built on being bold, smart, lucky and driven to succeed.

    They have more money than they know what to do with so it’s just numbers on a screen to them.

    But I do believe that Brian Cashman has a thing inside him where he wants to ruin the fun Yankees fans have had since 1994. I think he has a destructive side to him that would give him great pleasure to blow this up and walk away in shame.

    This offseason will be telling. Right now we’re looking at a team that is paying for mistakes the owners made financially. The fans didn’t sign Arod and Tex. The owners and GM did.

    Cashman was so wrong on Tex it’s not funny. He overpaid him by about 8 million a year, maybe more and Arod is all on the Stein’s.

    If nothing is done to improve this team it’s going to get ugly here fast. 95 wins don’t mean jack. That was a bad baseball team from the All Star break on that only won the division because of Raul Ibanez’s bat and the pitching staff.

    If the Yankees are intent on not improving and letting players walk for draft picks then we all might as well change our mindset to “give Jeter a good sendoff” and that’s that.

    If they don’t intend to sign Cano and then don’t explore a trade for him? It’s the definition of mis-management. Same with Grandy. Letting assets just walk away for draft picks which usually don’t pan out is about the stupidest strategy you can come up with.

  129. luis November 9th, 2012 at 11:56 am

    Mac,

    Agreed on your response… About Cano, I think they won´t trade him either… I just hope that they can either work a good deal for both parties involved ( 6 years or seven counting 2013)…But with Boras as Cano´s agent, I am not holding my breath that that will be the case… Which makes it imperative for the FO to find out what Cano´s intentions are this winter, so they can act accordingly… But this is just me dreaming

  130. Against All Odds November 9th, 2012 at 11:57 am

    Welcome to the New New York Yankees where the best player has to be traded because they can’t afford him wtf.

  131. Mike Ri November 9th, 2012 at 11:58 am

    Welcome to the New New York Yankees where the best player has to be traded because they can?t afford him wtf.

    ——

    Sign of the times my man !

  132. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 11:59 am

    Against All Odds November 9th, 2012 at 11:57 am

    Welcome to the New New York Yankees where the best player has to be traded because they can’t afford him wtf.
    —————

    Cano’s not going to be traded. He’s going to be signed to an insane contract at the expense of common sense because that’s what the Yankees do.

    They will sign Cano and be the Texas Rangers pre-Alex trade where they’re hamstrung by payroll and won’t be able to add around him as aging players (Alex, Jeter) continue to fade.

  133. The Return of Stoneburner November 9th, 2012 at 12:02 pm

    The Giants have been getting lots of calls on Brandon Belt, according to Heyman (via Twitter). Belt comes with solid upside and quality defense and is not yet arbitration-eligible.
    Read more at http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/#rQShiGBmOCLq2tXr.99

    ********

    Brandon Belt for RF? Played 1b last year – year before that he had 31 games in LF – - – -

  134. luis November 9th, 2012 at 12:03 pm

    If nothing is done to improve this team it’s going to get ugly here fast. 95 wins don’t mean jack. That was a bad baseball team from the All Star break on that only won the division because of Raul Ibanez’s bat and the pitching staff.

    ==============================

    Good post as usual G Love…. I just bring this part because aside from a six week period where they played out of their minds, this team was mediocre for the rest of the season…. If they don´t have those excellent six weeks, we don´t make the playoffs…. Add to that, that the division as a whole was relatively weak ( Jays: injuries, Boston: blew out the team to rebuild, Tampa: no offense, Orioles: good team, but in reality very pedestrian ) So anybody using the 95 wins argument, is not looking at the whole picture.

  135. DONNYBROOK November 9th, 2012 at 12:04 pm

    - WILL CANO BE -

    (A) TRADED ?

    (B) RE-SIGNED ?

    (C) WALK AT CONTRACTS END ?

    Cast your ballot NOW

  136. AAA November 9th, 2012 at 12:06 pm

    - WILL CANO BE -

    (A) TRADED ?

    (B) RE-SIGNED ?

    (C) WALK AT CONTRACTS END ?

    ===========================

    B

  137. luis November 9th, 2012 at 12:06 pm

    Against All Odds November 9th, 2012 at 11:57 am
    Welcome to the New New York Yankees where the best player has to be traded because they can’t afford him wtf.

    ==========================

    Odds!

    I don´t think he will be traded… I just hope they don´t go for ten years

  138. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 12:07 pm

    - WILL CANO BE -

    (A) TRADED ?

    (B) RE-SIGNED my guess 8 years $24/year

    (C) WALK AT CONTRACTS END ?

  139. luis November 9th, 2012 at 12:07 pm

    AAA,

    C

  140. DONNYBROOK November 9th, 2012 at 12:08 pm

    I strongly go A. Hal aint gonna shell out the coin, and he is gonna want More than a draft pick for Cano.

  141. G. Love November 9th, 2012 at 12:09 pm

    I think Cano is going to walk as a free agent with Granderson.

    I think the Yankees think we’ll be sensational in 2013 with both of them and a rejuvenated Arod!

    The 2014 Yankee team is going to give younger fans a chance to know what it was like to be there for the Henry Cotto, Dale Berra years.

    The only way that doesn’t happen is if someone pokes the Yankees with a flaming hot stick and wakes them up to remind them they are the Yankees.

  142. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 12:09 pm

    Against All Odds November 9th, 2012 at 11:57 am
    Welcome to the New New York Yankees where the best player has to be traded because they can’t afford him wtf.

    The best player does have to be traded if you don’t want to be paying a lot of money to old players. The Yankees need to make it clear that they are no longer a retirement home.

  143. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 12:10 pm

    DONNYBROOK November 9th, 2012 at 12:08 pm

    I strongly go A. Hal aint gonna shell out the coin, and he is gonna want More than a draft pick for Cano.
    ————

    Hal doesn’t care.

  144. luis November 9th, 2012 at 12:11 pm

    The best player does have to be traded if you don’t want to be paying a lot of money to old players. The Yankees need to make it clear that they are no longer a retirement home.

    =================================

    JS…..QFT…. We sure agree on this one

  145. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 12:11 pm

    DONNYBROOK November 9th, 2012 at 12:04 pm
    - WILL CANO BE -

    (A) TRADED ?

    (B) RE-SIGNED ?

    (C) WALK AT CONTRACTS END ?

    Cast your ballot NOW

    In order of likelihood: B, C, A. Unfortunately.

  146. luis November 9th, 2012 at 12:12 pm

    G. Love November 9th, 2012 at 12:09 pm
    I think Cano is going to walk as a free agent with Granderson.

    I think the Yankees think we’ll be sensational in 2013 with both of them and a rejuvenated Arod!

    The 2014 Yankee team is going to give younger fans a chance to know what it was like to be there for the Henry Cotto, Dale Berra years.

    The only way that doesn’t happen is if someone pokes the Yankees with a flaming hot stick and wakes them up to remind them they are the Yankees.

    =====================

    Welcome to team dreamer!!! ;)

  147. Benny Blanco November 9th, 2012 at 12:12 pm

    G love, you can’t put all of Tex’s short comings on cashman. I thought he would be -at the very least- a 275-280 hitter. No one here predicted that his batting average and Obp. Would drop so quickly as it has. I thought he able to provide a cushion for Alex’s decline. We were all sadly mistaken.

  148. DONNYBROOK November 9th, 2012 at 12:12 pm

    I’m sure Hal remembers the fans at Yankee Stadium cheering, when it was announced his Dad was suspended by The Commish. No way Hal allows the Yanks to degenerate back into the Cotto Years.

  149. Chip November 9th, 2012 at 12:13 pm

    G. Love November 9th, 2012 at 12:09 pm

    I think Cano is going to walk as a free agent with Granderson.

    I think the Yankees think we’ll be sensational in 2013 with both of them and a rejuvenated Arod!

    The 2014 Yankee team is going to give younger fans a chance to know what it was like to be there for the Henry Cotto, Dale Berra years.

    The only way that doesn’t happen is if someone pokes the Yankees with a flaming hot stick and wakes them up to remind them they are the Yankees.
    ——————-

    I think that the Yankees – especially Randy Levine – will end up making the call on this one. Consider Boras’s comments regarding Soriano’s contract – that he’s already talked with Levine about it, not Cashman, but Levine.

    I think at the end of the day Brian is happy to go to the $189 with some sort of a plan, but Randy Levine is the one telling Hal, “yes we’ll get there, we’ll cut here and save there but if we want to keep selling out the luxury suites we need to keep Cano.” So the Yankees will sign Robbie and be worse off for it.

  150. jacksquat November 9th, 2012 at 12:16 pm

    Tex was a good sign at the time of the trade. He was only signed through his age 36 season, which is exactly what should be done (not 38, 39, 40…). His dropoff stating at just age 30 was not expected by anyone.

  151. luis November 9th, 2012 at 12:16 pm

    Benny Blanco,

    Sure, you couldn´t predict Tex´s early decline… But his swing mechanics from the left side were so bad, that he must have known that the moment Tex loses a microsecond of bat speed, this was going to happen. In other words, this steep decline was predictable, not when it would happen

  152. DONNYBROOK November 9th, 2012 at 12:16 pm

    Winning Championships puts fannies in the seats. The empty Playoff seats With Cano on this team says-it-all. The Yanks have lost With Cano, they can do no less withOut him. Hal deals him.

  153. blake November 9th, 2012 at 12:18 pm

    (B) RE-SIGNED my guess 8 years $24/year

    yuck….that contract wouldn’t end pretty…..actually it would likely start being bad about 3 or 4 years in.

  154. DONNYBROOK November 9th, 2012 at 12:19 pm

    I love all these guys that NOW say the decline in TEX’s avg was obvious. Yea, and I predicted the Kennedy Assassination.

  155. Against All Odds November 9th, 2012 at 12:19 pm

    @ Mike if this is the New world I’m looking for another planet.

    @ Chip never say never. If he puts them in

  156. G. Love November 9th, 2012 at 12:21 pm

    Benny,

    You’re right. It’s not Cashman’s fault Tex has regressed into a lesser player so early into his deal.

    However, to use his contract and Arod’s contract as a defense for not improving the team going forward places blame on them.

    The team bought a nice little Hyundai at Ferrari prices. That’s hardly an acceptable excuse to not go out and make the team better. It’s the cost of doing business.

    If their prospects had stayed healthy, panned out, never were dealt maybe it would be different.

    But they operated like a team that seemed to be going for it all and now are backing away from the table hoping no one notices and nothing changes.

    You make bad deals and you live with them or move on. That’s part of the game. But to use bad deals as the reason why you can’t make new deals when you’re the team that makes the most money in the sport and charges a fortune to their fans is just wrong.

  157. NYY_Girl_Penny November 9th, 2012 at 12:25 pm

    Glove gets it! The voice of reason.

    New post

  158. Against All Odds November 9th, 2012 at 12:29 pm

    @ Mike if this is the New world I’m looking for another planet.

    @ Chip never say never. If he puts them in a corner they might not have a choice

    @ Luis ten yrs is extreme and even though I.would do eight I.see why many ppl wouldn’t do it. This could have been avoided two yrs ago before Boras came in the picture.

  159. luis November 9th, 2012 at 12:36 pm

    Odds,

    I wrote yesterday I think, that they should have given Cano a longer term deal when they extended him… Of course, it is easy to say it in hindsight…Like they did to Jeter in his first contract… This way the yankees had a better bargaining position

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