The LoHud Yankees Blog

A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


The easy target

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Nov 13, 2012 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Joe Girardi is not going to win Manager of the Year. We already know that. We knew it even before his name was left out of the three finalists announced last week. We knew it when the Orioles and A’s stunned the American League, and we knew it when the Yankees showed holes.

The Baseball Writers Association of America will announce its Manager of the Year winners tonight, and simply having the best record in the A.L. isn’t enough for a Yankees manager to win Manager of the Year.

But I still think Girardi had a pretty good year.

Having the best record in the American League is one thing, but it’s another to do it with the team’s closer, third baseman, first baseman, left fielder, No. 3 starter and No. 4 starter* all missing significant time with injuries. That’s to say nothing of the team’s ace going on the DL twice, a platoon DH having an unthinkably bad season, and the supposed-to-be somewhat-regular utility infielder being shipped to the minors because he couldn’t field a grounder.

Obviously a lot of things went right for this team — Derek Jeter’s resurgence, the bullpen rising to the occasion, Hiroki Kuroda pitching like an ace — but considering all that went wrong, 95 wins was no easy task. And surely Girardi deserves some credit for reaching that number.

So why is he second-guessed at best and despised at worst?

It’s partially because it comes with the territory. Second-guessing a baseball manager is easy, and it’s especially easy in a market full of opinions from so many radio hosts, TV personalities, local columnists, national columnists and every beat writer, fan and critic with a blog and a computer. Second-guessing a manager is part of what we do.

It’s partially because of Girardi’s personality. He’s loyal and patient in an arena that’s often aggressive and reactionary. For better and for worse, winning is the only thing that matters here. And when the Yankees lose — a game, a series or a season — it’s easy to come up with solutions that might have been better. Call-up a prospect. Change the lineup. Use the bullpen differently. Give a starting pitcher more rest (or less rest). It’s not vital that these alternatives be proven effective, it’s enough to think they might be effective.

This particular season, I happen to think Girardi was second-guessed and occasionally despised because he lacked options.

Andruw Jones kept playing despite terrible numbers. But until Ichiro Suzuki started hitting left-handers late in the year, there was no one on the roster who seemed to be a viable alternative. The late-inning relievers were overused. But the rest of the Yankees bullpen consisted of two specialists and a rotating cast of multi-inning relievers. Cory Wade helped out early and Joba Chamberlain helped late, but the only real constants were Rafael Soriano, Dave Robertson and Boone Logan. The Yankees didn’t hit in the postseason. But these were the same guys who played very well down the stretch, and when Girardi made a change, it was to insert hitless Eric Chavez and not-nearly-prepared-to-play-everyday Brett Gardner.

Look, there’s nothing fun in defending A manager. The fun part is ripping him, making up scenarios that might have worked and comparing those fantasies against his unproductive reality. But it’s not always a fair way to criticize.

Is Girardi a perfect manager? Absolutely not. I happen to like that he goes by the book — I appreciate that he’s able to explain every move, whether I agree with it or not — but I recognize that the binder mentality sometimes gets him into trouble, and Girardi has a secretive way about him that makes him evasive. But on the whole, I think he does a good job with the pieces in place. I think he’s a good man who is, at the very least, respected by the players in that clubhouse. I don’t think he’s the reason the Yankees lost to the Tigers.

Girardi doesn’t deserve to be Manager of the Year. But that doesn’t mean he had a bad year.

With that said, feel free to rip away…

* I’m guessing that, in a perfect world, Andy Pettitte and Michael Pineda would have been the Nos. 3 and 4 starters.

Associated Press photo

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191 Responses to “The easy target”

  1. blake November 13th, 2012 at 9:01 am

    I think the Yankees will sign Cano to a bad contract following 2013 and let Granderson walk…..and I think Arod sticks around for most of the rest of his contract.

    These aren’t the best things for the Yankees future obviously but they have yet to show the creative ability or will to do anything else…..until they show something different those are the most likely outcomes IMO

  2. blake November 13th, 2012 at 9:04 am

    I don’t see how anybody could be that upset with Girardi…..he won 95 games and made it to the ALCS with a roster that frankly wasn’t good enough to do that……best season as Yankee manager for Girardi IMO.

    Overall I think Joe is underrated as a manager….I don’t think he’s the best but he’s pretty good…..my issue with him is that I’m afraid he’s just a Yes man to the front office and Id love to know how much input he actually has and if he pushes back on things he doesn’t agree with…..maybe he does…..or maybe he really just agrees with them

  3. MTU November 13th, 2012 at 9:09 am

    Girardi has his strong point and weak points like any other Mgr.

    His strong points are his BP mgmt, loyalty,and patience.

    His weak points are his inflexibility, over-relaince on the Book, lack of creativity, propensity to overmanage, and poor in-game feel.

    That my take.

    Personally I think they could do better but Girardi isn’t terrible either.

  4. Cashmoney November 13th, 2012 at 9:09 am

    The easy target is Cashman and FO… chad.

  5. Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 9:11 am

    Chad-

    Since you know Joe Girardi better than anyone here, I’m resting on your opinions of him and am happy with the job he’s doing.

    However, there are two things I’d like to see. Let him get more animated in arguing with umps and get thrown out of more games. :)

    Play a NL style of baseball in close games late in the game. Can’t really blame Joe for that, as the Yankees don’t know how to lay down a succesful bunt and score a run from 3rd.

  6. MTU November 13th, 2012 at 9:11 am

    I apologize for butchering the spelling in my last post.

    Their are too many mistakes to bother even trying to correct them all.

    :(

  7. Cashmoney November 13th, 2012 at 9:13 am

    welcome to my world, MTU! :D

  8. brianlopez22 November 13th, 2012 at 9:15 am

    Girardi gave Hal a reason to believe his 189mm torture chamber may work.
    Girardi was able to finesse and maneuver his way to 95 wins with a team of aged,injured veterans.

    Had Girardi not given Hal this false sense of security, we would see how weak our farm system is and how badly cashman has managed the roster over the past 14 years.
    Yes, we won in 2009, but we all know Cashman needed to buy the top 3 free agents with the core 4 to make that happen.
    Now the Core 4 is down to 3 and 2 of them are over 40 years old.

    Girardi is not the target, Cashman is, and if it weren’t for Girardi, Cashman would not have his job.

  9. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 9:16 am

    To go back to last night, I’m not endorsing Romine as a good option.. but he’s a cheap one that will at least have an excuse to suck (unlike Martin) all season.

    If they are going to spend money somewhere, I’d rather it be in the OF than on sub-par catching.

  10. Cashmoney November 13th, 2012 at 9:19 am

    me like to see some Adams at 2b next year, well, 3b as well but his bat probably plays better at 2b in eventuality. lot has to do with Cano… other than that, i am sure there are those who follow much closer than I am, i see bunch of fringe hitting prospects in the upper tier of the farm. but nevertheless, the idea of seeing if Mustelier can be a nix type or the almontes can be your rh of against lh or 4th of can provide some mild interests.

  11. MTU November 13th, 2012 at 9:28 am

    Cash-

    When GB was here I could always fallback and point to his atrocious spelling and typing knowing I’d always look better by comparison.

    Now that he is not I am left to face the music on my own w/o excuses.

    :(

  12. blake November 13th, 2012 at 9:29 am

    Hal is the target…..he pulls the strings

  13. blake November 13th, 2012 at 9:31 am

    @KenDavidoff: In this story, @DanMartin_Post reports #Yankees and Raul Ibanez have held preliminary discussions about re-upping. http://t.co/8S4eGwOi

  14. blake November 13th, 2012 at 9:34 am

    @mlbtraderumors: Braves Turned Down Simmons-For-Olt Trade http://t.co/NWmKHAwh #mlb

    Sounds like the braves could get Upton if they’d part with Simmons

  15. Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 9:37 am

    Blake-

    I can’t see where the math will work for 2014 if Cano stays and signs a lucrative let’s say 25M/8-10 year contract. The Yankees are already on the books for 75.125M for 4 players.

    Add 25M for Cano, Jeter takes the 3M buyout[factored in above], and opts out of the 8M, gets a QO, which lets say is now 15M and takes it.

    Now the math adds up to 75.125+25+15=115.25M for 5 players-Tex, CC, ARod, Jeter and Cano.

    Benefits for all 40 men on the roster count for LT purposes. Let’s say that’s 10M, but it’s probably slightly more.

    Add in 6M for inseason trades, and maybe 6M if ARod reaches a marketing milestone.

    Now we are at 137M rounded off.

    You have one penny less than $52M to pay for arbitration cases and field and pay for 35 more players, to get at 40 and pay no LT calculated at the end of the 2014 season, payable by 1/31/15.

    I can’t see therefore how they even consider extending Cano.

    Help me out here!

  16. MTU November 13th, 2012 at 9:37 am

    Blake-

    Andrus is better. Rangers don’t want to part with him.

    Towers should talk to the Cubs about Starlin.

    Of course the Cubs have no replacement just like the Braves.

    ;)

  17. The Return of Stoneburner November 13th, 2012 at 9:37 am

    Joe G is not winning manager of the year because of his attitude for running Montero out of town and his worship for all thing Martin. He orchestrated the trade of the best Yankees prospect since Mickey Mantle. At least this what I have learned from lohud.

    Simmons for Olt – who says teams do not discuss moving young positional players anymore- – - -

    Slade Heathcott for AZFL MVP!!!!

  18. Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 9:40 am

    Blake-

    That’s an average of 1.49M per man left on the 35 players.

  19. MTU November 13th, 2012 at 9:42 am

    YT-

    You must have liked Math as a kid.

    And trading baseball cards and marbles.

    :)

  20. MTU November 13th, 2012 at 9:44 am

    It’s a hike day and I have to go walk the dogs first.

    Later.

  21. Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 9:45 am

    MTU-

    Liked math. No marbles. Lost my entire collection of baseball cards in a flood. :(

  22. brianlopez22 November 13th, 2012 at 9:47 am

    Agreed, the only SS Arizona is gtting for Upton is Andrus.
    Texas is not going to part with their kid.

    The only way the Cubs part with Starlin is if they believe he will be a 3B, like ARod or Hanley, but can they really sell to their fan base that they traded 1 offensive young star for another and not gaining anything else?
    What was the net gain?

    Texas has a SS in waiting and would gain an offensive solution to possibly losing Hamilton.
    Andrus and Olt for JUpt seems like a even swap of needs.

  23. blake November 13th, 2012 at 9:49 am

    “Simmons for Olt – who says teams do not discuss moving young positional players anymore- – – -”

    The braves said no

  24. blake November 13th, 2012 at 9:50 am

    Trader,

    I just think they will…..I don’t think it’s a good idea and I do think it’ll limit them

  25. blake November 13th, 2012 at 9:51 am

    “Slade Heathcott for AZFL MVP!!!!”

    I’ve got the prospect bear hug on Slade

  26. Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 9:52 am

    Blake-

    Plus you have 3 free agents after this season-Hughes, Logan and Joba, and a number of players in their 1st, 2nd, or 3rd years of arbitration.

    Somebody tell me how we can resign Cano and then field a competitive team.

    https://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tpQLwiiQL4kzEzLhsUqVjLQ&output=html

  27. blake November 13th, 2012 at 9:53 am

    “Andrus and Olt for JUpt seems like a even swap of needs.”

    SSs and 3B are a lot harder to find than corner outfielders…..that the braves won even trade Simmons for Upton just speaks how hard it is to find a decent SS these days

  28. blake November 13th, 2012 at 9:54 am

    “Somebody tell me how we can resign Cano and then field a competitive team.”

    Well the young pitching and prospects have to pan out to offset all of that…..if that doesn’t happen I can’t see how they’ll be competitive long term anyway……

  29. Chip November 13th, 2012 at 9:55 am

    A few thoughts:

    1. Interesting that the Yankees are in on Napoli. I guess the brain trust has decided that if they’re willing to go 3 years and good money for Martin then going to those same lengths for Napoli makes sense. It would be a step back defensively, but offensively, no question it is an improvement.

    2. Good that Hunter is going to make a quick decision on his FA status. I don’t think the Yankees will get him, and now that Texas is coming to realize that they’re not going to get the young SS that will land them J-Ups I fully expect him to wind up there.

    3. Only two Angels to win the Rookie of the Year are Tim Salmon and Mike Trout – I find something fishy about that.

  30. longtimefan November 13th, 2012 at 9:55 am

    RE: Girardi, Agree not the best and not the worst, can be annoying at times but then again who is not.

  31. austinmac November 13th, 2012 at 9:56 am

    No one has criticized Girardi at all since the season has ended to my recollection. He is not being blamed for losing. Hal and Cashman are the ones deservingly getting the blame.

    I agree with YT that Cano cannot practically be retained and keep under the limit. Four guys can’t consume such a large part of the 40 man payroll.

    The Yankee solution will be to retain him, say he is too pricey and get another one of those valuable draft picks the Yankees have so successfully developed in the past.

  32. blake November 13th, 2012 at 9:59 am

    “I guess the brain trust has decided that if they’re willing to go 3 years and good money for Martin then going to those same lengths for Napoli makes sense”

    Not really….Napoli isn’t a full time catcher….he’s caught 80 games one time in his career and that was 4 years ago…..so unless they plan to play him significantly more games behind the plate than he ever has then youd either see a lot of Romjne or Steiwie to go with him and Napoli would tie up a lot of DH ABS…..I think they are just trying to drive up the price for Boston

  33. blake November 13th, 2012 at 10:00 am

    If the Yankees don’t want to sign Cano for 200 million then do they have the stones to trade him? Or will they just let him walk for a draft pick after 2013

  34. Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 10:05 am

    Only two Angels to win the Rookie of the Year are Tim Salmon and Mike Trout – I find something fishy about that.
    ————————-
    Good one Chip

    I’ll agree with Hunter going to the Rangers and top that with Martin signing a 3 year deal to go there also.

    If Napoli is getting 3 year offers, he won’t be a Yankee. Don’t need a 60-70 game catcher and another 70 games or more at 1B/FH.

    Just go get 37 yo AJ Pierzynski for 1-2 years and pay him big buckos if it’s a one year contract.

  35. Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 10:12 am

    Blake-

    Cano is taking a big chance if he waits another year for hopes at a big payday, and doesn’t ask Boras to inquire about extending him now.

    Who knows what could happen that would destroy his big payday by going to FA after this season. Another .239 BA vs lefties? An injury? A positive urine test?

  36. blake November 13th, 2012 at 10:12 am

    Wonder if Cashman could get the Indians involved in a 3 way deal to get Upton….theyve been shopping Cabrera…..

  37. blake November 13th, 2012 at 10:13 am

    “Cano is taking a big chance if he waits another year for hopes at a big payday, and doesn’t ask Boras to inquire about extending him now.”

    That’s why the Yanks should try to get him at a discount this winter in years…..and if he won’t give them one then they have to wait …. You can’t give him a FA contract a year early….too much can happen

  38. Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 10:16 am

    Blake-

    I’d rather have Asdrubal Cabrera. I’ve asked this before, but no one wants to go there. Get a SS like Cabrera and would Jeter be able to play RF? Who knows what Jeter’s range will be at SS after repair of his ankle fx.

  39. blake November 13th, 2012 at 10:19 am

    “I’d rather have Asdrubal Cabrera. I’ve asked this before, but no one wants to go there. Get a SS like Cabrera and would Jeter be able to play RF? Who knows what Jeter’s range will be at SS after repair of his ankle fx.”

    How about get Upton and then sign Cabrera as a FA after 2014!

  40. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 10:24 am

    blake November 13th, 2012 at 9:59 am

    “I guess the brain trust has decided that if they’re willing to go 3 years and good money for Martin then going to those same lengths for Napoli makes sense”

    Not really….Napoli isn’t a full time catcher….he’s caught 80 games one time in his career and that was 4 years ago…
    ——————————

    Any chance they’re looking to get him time at 1B as well? Not sure what his splits are.

    I don’t really buy that they’re in on him in the first place, tbh. I think GLove had the right of it yesterday when he said he thinks the agents are just trying to up both Napoli and Martin’s value.

    I’d still rather them spend money on an OFer than a catcher at this point since there aren’t a lot of attractive options behind the plate.

  41. blake November 13th, 2012 at 10:26 am

    “Any chance they’re looking to get him time at 1B as well? Not sure what his splits are.”

    In general you want Tex out there vs lefties…..Id guess Napoli would catch about half the games as DH against LHP…..the problem would be who catches the other half of the games and how much he’d cost…..he makes more sense for Boston as they now have Ross who could split time behind the plate and Boston also could give Napoli time at 1B

  42. austinmac November 13th, 2012 at 10:27 am

    The Yankees are talking with Ibanez, next year’s right fielder. Then, they can platoon Melky Mesa with him. Add Romine to the starters, and presto, a much worse team. Two more magical money savers. Now, we can direct our focus to cheap Kuroda replacements.

  43. blake November 13th, 2012 at 10:29 am

    @mlbtraderumors: Jed Lowrie Drawing Interest http://t.co/rhaOkyN0 #mlb

    Get the stros involved with a 3 way

  44. Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 10:30 am

    Blake-

    Just found this article for you on Yankees FA spending the last 3 years plus other Random thoughts by Mike Axisa.

    “Since the CC Sabathia, A.J. Burnett, Mark Teixeira spending spree in December 2009, the Yankees have signed just four free agents to multi-year contracts. Mariano Rivera (two years) and Derek Jeter (three years) are two of ‘em and they were never really threats to sign elsewhere. The other two went to Pedro Feliciano (two years) and, on ownership’s orders, Rafael Soriano (three years).”

    http://riveraveblues.com/2012/.....ing-79121/

  45. blake November 13th, 2012 at 10:30 am

    The Astros might be willing to take players farther away since they stink so bad and Lowrie could interst Towers…..just a thought

  46. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 10:31 am

    Trader – IMO, it’s way more likely Cano has a better season this year (splits wise) and takes the Yankees to the bank.

    Can’t blame him, he gave them a very good deal the last time he signed.

    I can, however, blame the Yankees.

    Small comforts.

  47. blake November 13th, 2012 at 10:31 am

    Trader,

    Yea I read it…. The moral is the Yanks aren’t spending any money

  48. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 10:33 am

    blake – The only reason I asked is because losing Swish also hurts your roster if Tex goes down at any point. I’m not sad to see Swish go, exactly, but having him be serviceable at 1B made him even more valuable (which is why I still think he ends up in Boston, for the same reasons you stated Napoli might be a match for them lol).

  49. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 10:35 am

    blake November 13th, 2012 at 10:31 am

    Trader,

    Yea I read it…. The moral is the Yanks aren’t spending any money

    ———————

    Russell Martin is now rumored to be working his way out of our price range… RUSSELL MARTIN.

    What world is this?!

  50. brianlopez22 November 13th, 2012 at 10:36 am

    blake – actually Lowrie is interesting.
    You know how much the Sux brain trust love their own prospects.

  51. blake November 13th, 2012 at 10:37 am

    “What world is this?!”

    Hal’s new world order

  52. Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 10:37 am

    Why not trade for Corey Hart of the Brewers. Fits the new Yankees ‘profile” of having as many players who come off the books at the end of the coming season and makes 10M, i believe, in 2013.

  53. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 10:38 am

    @Buster_ESPN

    Other teams have expressed interest in Jed Lowrie, but Astros intent on keeping him unless they are completely overwhelmed.

    ——————

    Teams need to be overwhelmed for Jed Lowrie.

    Again, what world is this?!

    I may have liked it better when ALL the players were on steroids and actually good.

  54. JobaTipsHisCap November 13th, 2012 at 10:39 am

    Giants have great chance to lose 3 straight.

  55. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 10:39 am

    blake November 13th, 2012 at 10:37 am

    “What world is this?!”

    Hal’s new world order

    ——————–

    *Sigh*.. I preferred Kevin Nash’s version: http://www.obsessedwithwrestli.....nwo/71.jpg

  56. DONNYBROOK November 13th, 2012 at 10:39 am

    WOW. After that Gushing Tribute to Girardi above, we can Only expect the same jaded observations and opinions from Chad in the future. So much for objective journalism. And just what does being a “good man” have to do with evaluating a Mgr’s season? Girardi’s Failure to undress that 1B Ump on the blown call on TEX in Balt is a snap-shot of his fire. There is NONE, and the Yankees reflected this after Jeet went down in the Playoffs.

  57. 86w183 November 13th, 2012 at 10:41 am

    Boston has Saltalamacchia, Lavarnway and Ross. Why the hell would they be trying to sign another catcher…. is there a shortage on the horizon?

    Reminds me when the Yanks signed Don Baylor and Steve Kemp in the same off-season… two guys who should never wear a glove in public. Signing guys just to sign them never pays off.

  58. blake November 13th, 2012 at 10:41 am

    Dbacks get: Jed Lowre, Ivan nova , and Boone Logan
    Astros get: Tyler Austin and David Phelps
    yanks get : Justin Upton and a reliever from somebody

    Yanks do give up a lot…..but they get Upton and keep most of their very top prospects……I’m not sure a deal like that makes them better but I can’t see how they make a deal at all without it touching the big league roster.

  59. LGY November 13th, 2012 at 10:41 am

    NAPOLI

  60. Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 10:41 am

    Jed Lowrie hit .244 this season, .184 vs lefites. I’ll keep Nunez.

    Corey Hart, Shame, plays RF and 1B.

  61. blake November 13th, 2012 at 10:42 am

    “Boston has Saltalamacchia, Lavarnway and Ross. Why the hell would they be trying to sign another catcher…. is there a shortage on the horizon?”

    Cause they are trying to trade Salty

  62. 86w183 November 13th, 2012 at 10:43 am

    If the Yanks are going to go with a “shared catcher” situation they should try and find a LH hitter to be part of it.

    I’d be fine with Martin or Napoli/Jaso or something like that.

  63. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 10:44 am

    Corey Hart, Shame, plays RF and 1B.

    ——————–

    Decent OBP, multiple positions.. theoretically affordable…

    Okay, fine. Let’s get him then.

  64. DONNYBROOK November 13th, 2012 at 10:46 am

    Martin and Napoli are both, “all or nothing” sticks, and we just witnessed that horror show. PASS

  65. brianlopez22 November 13th, 2012 at 10:47 am

    “Again, what world is this?!”

    Welcome to the salary cap.
    Until salaries come back down, teams are going to favor a AA version of a perennial All-Star + an extra draft pick.
    Just like closers are pricing themselves out of jobs.
    Teams just realized that a generic closer is simply a failed starter who can handle pressure.
    Obviously, if you have a Mariano, you’re willing to pay a little more.

    But if you have anyone else, just bring up your big arm from the minors and let him get 3 outs.

    HOFers will make GMs pause but anyone who thinks they are bigger than the cap will be allowed to walk.
    So, I love Cano, and would argue that we should keep him.
    If Boras thinks Cano can get 25MM somewhere, then we might as well trade him.
    However, if Cano and the Yanks can agree on a 7 yr deal with an AAV of 18-20 mm, then they can start talking.

  66. DONNYBROOK November 13th, 2012 at 10:48 am

    Yanks have gotten into too many platoon situations, and the “shared catcher” adds to that. NIX

  67. austinmac November 13th, 2012 at 10:51 am

    The RAB article demonstrates how the Yankees have completely changed their business practices since winning in 2009. They believed and evidently still believe that that championship buys them fan support. The new CBA is now their justification for what they were already doing.

    Again, I have said and will say again, the Yankees are in the running with the least likely to spend in the present and the forseeable future. Maybe the Astros are less willing to spend. Maybe. The Rays will add Justin Upton despite his salary. The Brewers are considering Hamilton. And on and on. The Yankees are simply waiting until all the good chips have been played and will then try to get players from the unsigned and unwanted group.

    That is what is they refer to as the “process”.

  68. Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 10:51 am

    Boston would use Napoli also at 1st base and trade Salty.

  69. austinmac November 13th, 2012 at 10:53 am

    Hart was reported in the last week to be working on an extension with the Brewers. THEY can afford to do extend their players.

  70. MTU November 13th, 2012 at 10:54 am

    I was gonna say that Nunez is way better than Lowrie.

    If Lowrie would interest Towers then Nunez certainly should.

    ;)

  71. Against All Odds November 13th, 2012 at 10:54 am

    Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 10:39 am

    blake November 13th, 2012 at 10:37 am

    “What world is this?!”

    Hal’s new world order

    ——————–

    *Sigh*.. I preferred Kevin Nash’s version: http://www.obsessedwithwrestli…..nwo/71.jpg

    ——————

    The theme music is still in my head :)

  72. Chip November 13th, 2012 at 10:54 am

    austinmac November 13th, 2012 at 10:53 am

    Hart was reported in the last week to be working on an extension with the Brewers. THEY can afford to do extend their players.
    ————–

    They can afford to extend one of their players. Prince, Greinke, Marcum all gone.

  73. Chip November 13th, 2012 at 10:56 am

    Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 10:51 am

    Boston would use Napoli also at 1st base and trade Salty.
    ————–

    Boston should deal Ellsbury to the Giants for Timmy.

  74. austinmac November 13th, 2012 at 10:56 am

    Cano should and will demand eight plus years and $200+M. He can get it from someone. Boras is not taking less from the Yankees. The team won’t pay it.

    They will stick with leaving the engine in neutral while Cano plays his last year.

  75. MTU November 13th, 2012 at 10:57 am

    There’s a new financial reality in Yankeeland.

    Better get used to it. It’s here to stay for a while.

    Better hope that Farm produces.

    ;)

  76. Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 10:58 am

    Have to go. On the bright side I think Kuroda will be back with the Yankees for 15M. The Dodgers have enough starting pitching, and just signed the Korean pitcher,

    Hunter will sign with the Rangers if he insists on staying in AL. Otherwise, look at the Braves to make a strong push.

    Martin will get 3 years. If so, the Yankees are out and welcome to Arlington.

    Until later everyone.

  77. MTU November 13th, 2012 at 10:59 am

    Have a good one YT.

    I’ll be heading out real soon too.

  78. Chip November 13th, 2012 at 11:06 am

    I still think Russ winds up with the Pirates for more money.

  79. pat November 13th, 2012 at 11:07 am

    Too funny.

    http://shop.mlb.com/product/in.....91.1984702

  80. Yankee Trader November 13th, 2012 at 11:08 am

    Reposting this and adding:

    I can’t see where the math will work for 2014 if Cano stays and signs a lucrative let’s say 25M/8-10 year contract. The Yankees are already on the books for 75.125M for 4 players.

    Add 25M for Cano, Jeter takes the 3M buyout[factored in above], and opts out of the 8M, gets a QO, which lets say is now 15M and takes it.

    Now the math adds up to 75.125+25+15=115.25M for 5 players-Tex, CC, ARod, Jeter and Cano.

    Benefits for all 40 men on the roster count for LT purposes. Let’s say that’s 10M, but it’s probably slightly more.

    Add in 6M for inseason trades, and maybe 6M if ARod reaches a marketing milestone.

    Now we are at 137M rounded off.

    You have one penny less than $52M to pay for arbitration cases and field and pay for 35 more players, to get at 40 and pay no LT calculated at the end of the 2014 season, payable by 1/31/15.

    3 free agents after this season in Hughes, Joba, and Logan, plus multiple arbitration eligibles.

    52M if you sign Cano. That’s almost 1.49M per player for the rest of the 35 men on the 40 man roster.

    I can’t see therefore how they even consider extending Cano, “fuzzy” math or not!

    And again Cano should ask Boras to at least explore an extension. Big risk to wait until the end of next season. Just takes one key injury,one positive urine test and your value plummets.

  81. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 11:09 am

    AAO – Ever since I posted that I’ve been reading the NWO wikipedia page lol.. more fun than reading about the Yankees!

    I remember my brother and I used to refer to Scott Hall as Scot’all and beans (Italians have funny ways of pronouncing things like escarole lol, comes out sounding like ‘shcodol’).

  82. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 11:10 am

    @RobinsonCano

    Very proud day for me, I just became a US citizen, God bless America! http://say.ly/WIy4zC7
    ————–

    Learn to embrace capitalism, Robbie.

  83. NYY_Girl_Penny November 13th, 2012 at 11:15 am

    How you can write a piece on “the good job of Girardi” is worthy of Twilight Zone.

    This guys baseball acumen was equal to a snails. No, I don’t agree the players respect him as their manager, as a person sure but as a manger ? No way.

    You said, “The Yankees didn’t hit in the postseason. But these were the same guys who played very well down the stretch”

    C’mon man really ? We had a good run against the worst teams in baseball who had already given up that their season was over ? It’s no coincidence that every players BA went up and production jumped the way it did. When we faced the teams that mattered it was back to HR or nothing. Girardi is arguably one of least intuitive managers in the game. He has demonstrated time and time again that he has no feel for it. I just don’t get the point of this post at all. Was it to increase the number of user posts ?

  84. LGY November 13th, 2012 at 11:15 am

    Donnybrook

    Please don’t compare Russell Martin’s hitting ability to NAPOLI

  85. Patrick November 13th, 2012 at 11:16 am

    Learn to embrace capitalism, Robbie.

    There’s no doubt he will

  86. Patrick November 13th, 2012 at 11:18 am

    LGY,

    Trying the same technique you used to get Kuroda signed last year? If so, I approve!

  87. blake November 13th, 2012 at 11:21 am

    @jimcallisBA: Credit to his talent. System is fine. @yoursource123: is heathcott ranking 2nd a credit to him or a comment on how bad the #yankees…

  88. Against All Odds November 13th, 2012 at 11:21 am

    Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 11:09 am

    AAO – Ever since I posted that I’ve been reading the NWO wikipedia page lol.. more fun than reading about the Yankees!

    ———————–

    Definitely better than following the Yankees right now. Those days were classic. I used to do the Scott Hall walk when I was young ;)

  89. blake November 13th, 2012 at 11:22 am

    LGY had better use his technique on KURODA again

  90. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 11:23 am

    If the Yankees really want big hairy monsters they should give Kevin Nash, Scott Hall, and Buff Bagwell a call…

  91. jacksquat November 13th, 2012 at 11:23 am

    Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 10:31 am
    Trader – IMO, it’s way more likely Cano has a better season this year (splits wise) and takes the Yankees to the bank.

    Can’t blame him, he gave them a very good deal the last time he signed.

    Cano did not accept a good deal for the Yankees out of the goodness of his heart. He accepted security in place of possibly getting more going year to year (with more risk).

    I hate that players take these deals for security and then later feel that they were “underpaid”.

  92. pat November 13th, 2012 at 11:23 am

    @RobinsonCano
    Very proud day for me, I just became a US citizen, God bless America!

    Playing for US or DR in WBC? :wink:

  93. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 11:24 am

    Maybe The Giant…

  94. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 11:24 am

    @jonmorosi

    Sources: Free agent outfielder Torii Hunter is meeting with #Tigers officials in Detroit today. @MLBONFOX

  95. CountryClub November 13th, 2012 at 11:25 am

    Sweeny Murti had an article today where he said that the actual payroll number will need to be 170 mil in 2014 to stay under the 189 cap.

  96. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 11:26 am

    squat – No one said he accepted out of the goodness of his heart… he probably accepted because he didn’t have Boras as his agent at that time lol.

    I doubt he thinks he was underpaid, but that doesn’t negate the fact that it was a great deal, value wise, for the Yankees given Cano’s production (especially relative to the other contracts on the team).

  97. jacksquat November 13th, 2012 at 11:26 am

    MTU November 13th, 2012 at 10:54 am
    I was gonna say that Nunez is way better than Lowrie.

    If Lowrie would interest Towers then Nunez certainly should.

    He’s not, yet.

  98. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 11:27 am

    Playing for US or DR in WBC? :wink:

    ——————

    We could use him… the US team has been pretty crappy! But so has the whole tournament lol.

  99. blake November 13th, 2012 at 11:29 am

    @jonmorosi: Sources: Free agent outfielder Torii Hunter is meeting with #Tigers officials in Detroit today. @MLBONFOX

  100. blake November 13th, 2012 at 11:30 am

    Shame always beats me

  101. DONNYBROOK November 13th, 2012 at 11:30 am

    - PREDICTIONS FOR WWE PPV SUNDAY -

    (1) PUNK – Retains Title

    (2) “THE BIG WHITE” defeats “THE BIG SHOW” – Regains Title

    (3) ZIEGLER throws down “the case”, defeats “THE BIG WHITE” – New Champ

  102. Against All Odds November 13th, 2012 at 11:30 am

    Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 11:23 am

    If the Yankees really want big hairy monsters they should give Kevin Nash, Scott Hall, and Buff Bagwell a call…

    —————-

    And Hogan too

  103. jacksquat November 13th, 2012 at 11:31 am

    CountryClub November 13th, 2012 at 11:25 am
    Sweeny Murti had an article today where he said that the actual payroll number will need to be 170 mil in 2014 to stay under the 189 cap.

    189 – 11+ for player benefits, insurance, etc. – ? 6 mil for Arod.

    Arod would have to hit 67 home runs in the next 2 years to reach his 2nd 6 mil bonus (714). Likely not happening, that would be a big bounce back.

  104. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 11:31 am

    blake – I win.

    …..Diamond Dallas Page…?

  105. jacksquat November 13th, 2012 at 11:32 am

    blake November 13th, 2012 at 11:30 am
    Shame always beats me

    Maybe you deserve it. ;)

  106. Against All Odds November 13th, 2012 at 11:33 am

    CountryClub November 13th, 2012 at 11:25 am

    Sweeny Murti had an article today where he said that the actual payroll number will need to be 170 mil in 2014 to stay under the 189 cap.

    ———————

    It’s been brought up here before. I wonder if other writers will pick up on that.

  107. Chip November 13th, 2012 at 11:36 am

    LGY November 13th, 2012 at 11:15 am

    Donnybrook

    Please don’t compare Russell Martin’s hitting ability to NAPOLI
    ——————

    No doubt that Napoli is the better hitter; and the benefit to him is that if Romine, Murphy or Sanchez do emerge then you can move Napoli to DH and go from there – whereas with Martin you can’t really do that because he doesn’t hit enough to justify it.

    That said, Martin is a superior defensive catcher and Napoli is another big strike out guy.

  108. austinmac November 13th, 2012 at 11:38 am

    So, exactly how is going from $210M payroll to $170M a ten percent drop? That is about 20 percent.

    Which is the bigger lie to we fans:we will be competitive or it is a ten percent drop?

  109. jacksquat November 13th, 2012 at 11:38 am

    Maybe trade Granderson+ for Olt, throw Olt into the fire and play Alex mostly at DH. Alex can get days off or play 3B when Jeter needs to DH. Keep Nunez for SS, bring up Adams to back up 2B/3B. Olt also backs up 1B.

    ?

  110. austinmac November 13th, 2012 at 11:39 am

    Where is that Murti article?

  111. Against All Odds November 13th, 2012 at 11:40 am

    Which is the bigger lie to we fans:we will be competitive or it is a ten percent drop?

    —————————-

    hmmm probably it is a ten percent drop.

  112. CountryClub November 13th, 2012 at 11:41 am

    It’s been brought up here before. I wonder if other writers will pick up on that.

    ————-

    Oh, I know. But that’s even lower than most people on here have been guessing. Of course, he could be off by a mil or two.

  113. CountryClub November 13th, 2012 at 11:42 am

    “Of the nine players who received and rejected the $13.3 million tender offers from their teams, the one viewed within the sport as taking the greatest financial risk was Rafael Soriano.”

    http://m.nypost.com/f/mobile/s.....CQ6E2pG4RL

  114. CountryClub November 13th, 2012 at 11:44 am

    austinmac November 13th, 2012 at 11:39 am
    Where is that Murti article?

    —————

    http://newyork.cbslocal.com/20.....prospects/

  115. Patrick November 13th, 2012 at 11:44 am

    I would say that the Yanks should sign David Ross to back up Napoli but it looks like Boston just signed Ross. Would not be shocked to see them get Napoli as well

  116. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 11:46 am

    @Buster_ESPN

    The Mariners have expressed interest in Washington native Jeremy Bonderman, who has an offer from the Tigers in hand.

  117. Chip November 13th, 2012 at 11:48 am

    Patrick November 13th, 2012 at 11:44 am

    I would say that the Yanks should sign David Ross to back up Napoli but it looks like Boston just signed Ross. Would not be shocked to see them get Napoli as well
    ————–

    I agree with what someone said above – if the Red Sox sign Napoli I think it’s to play 1b and not catcher.

    I also think Boston’s going to be in on Stephen Drew.

  118. Patrick November 13th, 2012 at 11:49 am

    The Mariners have expressed interest in Washington native Jeremy Bonderman, who has an offer from the Tigers in hand.

    Wow seriously? He has been out of baseball for 2 years

  119. Patrick November 13th, 2012 at 11:51 am

    If Boston signs Napoli they would platoon him with Ross at catcher and probably also give Napoli a few starts at 1B. Napoli isn’t THAT bad behind the plate, it would be a waste of value to make him a straight 1B.

  120. blake November 13th, 2012 at 11:53 am

    Maybe trade Granderson+ for Olt, throw Olt into the fire and play Alex mostly at DH. Alex can get days off or play 3B when Jeter needs to DH. Keep Nunez for SS, bring up Adams to back up 2B/3B. Olt also backs up 1B.”

    That would be great if Texas would do it….butnindpubt they would

  121. blake November 13th, 2012 at 11:53 am

    Napoli is a good fit for Boston…..just wonder what they’ll do with Lavaraway….Salty will get traddd

  122. austinmac November 13th, 2012 at 11:55 am

    Bonderman would only want one year and has only been out of baseball for two years? Sign him up.

    Country Club, Thanks for the cite.

  123. DONNYBROOK November 13th, 2012 at 11:55 am

    Napoli at 1B, brings back memories of Steve Balboni. If the R\SOX wantta play Napoli there, GREAT. As for Napoli being signed by the Yanks ??? KIBOSH

  124. jacksquat November 13th, 2012 at 11:55 am

    Well the + in Granderson+ would have to be significant.

  125. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 11:56 am

    Trader – Did you get Hart yet? Or did he get extended by a club that could afford him lol? :P

  126. blake November 13th, 2012 at 11:57 am

    @BNightengale: The #Marlins are letting teams know that virtually everyone is available on trade market, and plenty of teams are calling.

    Trade everybody for Giancarlo!

  127. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 11:58 am

    It seems like the Rangers are shopping Olt hard…

  128. Chip November 13th, 2012 at 11:58 am

    Patrick November 13th, 2012 at 11:51 am

    If Boston signs Napoli they would platoon him with Ross at catcher and probably also give Napoli a few starts at 1B. Napoli isn’t THAT bad behind the plate, it would be a waste of value to make him a straight 1B.
    ————-

    Ross and Napoli are both RH so a platoon doesn’t really work.

    Just taking a quick look, I think Napoli is probably the best offensive option available at 1b. Unless they were to sign Swisher and put him there.

  129. Chip November 13th, 2012 at 11:59 am

    Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 11:58 am

    It seems like the Rangers are shopping Olt hard…
    ————-

    They’re trying to use him to get the chip that Arizona wants for Justin Upton.

  130. Patrick November 13th, 2012 at 11:59 am

    I’ll take Giancarlo and Josh Johnson please.

  131. Chip November 13th, 2012 at 12:03 pm

    Patrick November 13th, 2012 at 11:59 am

    I’ll take Giancarlo and Josh Johnson please.
    —————–

    I’m not greedy – give me Gerardo Parra and Jason Kubel.

  132. austinmac November 13th, 2012 at 12:04 pm

    Good luck with the Yankees getting involved in a good player from the Marlins. Too costly. Ibanez and a RH old guy for right. Romine and Stewie behind the plate. Liriano on the mound. I wonder why I wait for something else.

  133. jacksquat November 13th, 2012 at 12:07 pm

    Rob Brantly

  134. Against All Odds November 13th, 2012 at 12:07 pm

    The Marlins are a joke smh

  135. jacksquat November 13th, 2012 at 12:11 pm

    Olt is blocked on the Rangers, so they are willing to trade him to get what they need.

  136. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 12:18 pm

    Just to review:

    1) No one will trade with us because we’re the Yankees
    2) No one will give us discounts because we’re the Yankees
    3) No one will take our salary dumps because we’re the Yankees

    I want my Evil Empire back and I want it back now.

    Just call me Violet Beauregard.

  137. CountryClub November 13th, 2012 at 12:23 pm

    Olt is blocked on the Rangers, so they are willing to trade him to get what they need.

    —————–

    Except most talent guys think he’s better than Elvis. I think they only trade him in a legit blockbuster type of deal. Seems more likely that they trade Elvis instead.

  138. blake November 13th, 2012 at 12:24 pm

    “Except most talent guys think he’s better than Elvis. I think they only trade him in a legit blockbuster type of deal. Seems more likely that they trade Elvis instead.”

    That’s Profar…not olt

  139. Warning Track Power November 13th, 2012 at 12:25 pm

    Call me crazy, but I find it very interesting to see just how many Yankees grow a beard.
    I.E. Cano has a beard right now courtesy of his photo he shared while being sworn in.
    Joba grows facial hair.

    If you ask me, I kind of like the no facial hair team rule the Yankees have during the season.

  140. RadioKev November 13th, 2012 at 12:26 pm

    Loria is a pariah.

  141. Against All Odds November 13th, 2012 at 12:30 pm

    If you ask me, I kind of like the no facial hair team rule the Yankees have during the season.

    ——————

    I wouldn’t mind if they pulled back on the facial policy a bit. Not saying our players should look like the Red Sox but what Robbie has is an ok look.

  142. RadioKev November 13th, 2012 at 12:31 pm

    Great post Chad.

  143. CountryClub November 13th, 2012 at 12:32 pm

    That’s Profar…not olt

    ————-

    Oh crap, you’re right. Serves me right for trying to work and talk baseball at the same time.

  144. austinmac November 13th, 2012 at 12:33 pm

    Shame-correction

    No one will trade with us because we want the other team to pay all of the salaries.

    No one will trade with us because they don’t want our old, overpaid, players.

    No one will trade with us because our real MLB prospects are miles away from the bigs.

  145. Warning Track Power November 13th, 2012 at 12:35 pm

    AAO
    Nah. I prefer the facial hair team rule that is enforced during the season.
    I can’t forget about length of hair on the head. I think the Yankees have a rule about
    that as well.

    Some players like Cano, Joba, Andy probably look forward to growing a sweet beard after the season.
    Not sure why, but I find the entire situation interesting.

  146. J. Alfred Prufrock November 13th, 2012 at 12:35 pm

    austinmac November 13th, 2012 at 10:51 am

    The RAB article demonstrates how the Yankees have completely changed their business practices since winning in 2009. They believed and evidently still believe that that championship buys them fan support. The new CBA is now their justification for what they were already doing.
    ////

    They blew it regarding residual “fan support” from 2009. They should have viewed that championship as granting them a grace period to really be able to develop the next generation of arms and bats, something they could easily have sold the more rabid fanbase, especially since the team pulled out another ring with the Old Guard, and since the roster was still a couple of years younger than it is today.

    First mistake: trading Cabrera for Javy. Instead, they should have allowed Chamberlain to start in 2010 instead of running that kangaroo court of a “competition” in ST. That remains the biggest error that all mistakes seem to pivot on…. the search for the “illusive No. 2″ when they might have had him under their roof all along. Let’s see: Melky and Montero, were both still here, would have made the lineup young and dangerous. Instead, they peddled both to get arms in return: both damaged in different ways and no real response from the club since to shore up the lineup – their true bugaboo, rather than their mythical pitching “woes.”

    The private view and the one for public consumption should have been identical and sincere: we won another with Posada, Jeter, Andy and Mo, and now, we’re going to take some “risks” and allow our young arms and bats to grow into being the next core Yankees.

  147. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 12:36 pm

    Lol, thanks Mac, for clearing that up..

    Considering making Violet Beauregard Team Greedy’s mascot, though maybe Darth Vader’s ship (which Google tells me is called ‘Executor’) would be most appropriate.

  148. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 12:38 pm

    Actually, they seemed a little looser with the facial hair rule this year… quite a few guys were rocking a 5 o’clock shadow…

  149. blake November 13th, 2012 at 12:40 pm

    Johnson is a guy that they could look at If Kuroda leaves but the price would be high and he’s very risky…..Kuroda leaving would really cause problems

  150. Warning Track Power November 13th, 2012 at 12:42 pm

    Blake
    The more I think about how valuable Kuroda was in 2012, the more I have to agree
    with you.
    If Kuroda leaves, that leaves a massive hole in the starting rotation.
    I’m not yet convinced Phelps can fill that hole. He has shown signs of being very good, I like his aggressiveness on the mound, but he’s still very young, raw and has a lot to learn.
    That being said, I have more faith in him compared to Adam Warren or DJ Mitchell or Betances.

  151. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 12:43 pm

    blake November 13th, 2012 at 12:40 pm

    Johnson is a guy that they could look at If Kuroda leaves but the price would be high and he’s very risky…..Kuroda leaving would really cause problems

    ———————

    Yes, we’re all very ‘oh no!’ about this for 2013…. now might not be a good time to mention it, but 2014 looks WAY worse.

  152. blake November 13th, 2012 at 12:44 pm

    “If Kuroda leaves, that leaves a massive hole in the starting rotation.”

    Not only that it would force them to address that first and put off the offense (if they were gonna do anything there anyway)

  153. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 12:44 pm

    The curious case of Phil Hughes continues…. if he is with us in spring training this season he better be signed to an extension already.

  154. Against All Odds November 13th, 2012 at 12:44 pm

    Warning Track Power November 13th, 2012 at 12:35 pm

    AAO
    Nah. I prefer the facial hair team rule that is enforced during the season.
    I can’t forget about length of hair on the head. I think the Yankees have a rule about
    that as well.

    Some players like Cano, Joba, Andy probably look forward to growing a sweet beard after the season.
    Not sure why, but I find the entire situation interesting.

    ———————————

    I’m sure they aren’t the only ones that look forward to it. Days after the season ends you see the facial have come back in full force.

  155. CountryClub November 13th, 2012 at 12:45 pm

    I want the Yanks to get Kuroda back too. But I can’t say I’m not worried about him bouncing back after last year’s workload.

  156. RadioKev November 13th, 2012 at 12:46 pm

    JAP,

    Give it up on the Melky thing. Who the heck knows where’d he’d be if he was never traded. Would he have stepped up and become a better player? Would he have cheated? Would he be returning next season? Who knows, and who cares. They traded him, he bottomed out, he rededicated himself, he cheated, and now he’s a question mark.

    Why are the Mariners so interested in another starting catcher if they already have Montero? If he were still on the Yankees, where would he play? DH with so many of our older players?

    You can’t just strip away context if you’re trying to make some rational criticism.

  157. Benny Blanco November 13th, 2012 at 12:46 pm

    ust to review:

    1) No one will trade with us because we’re the Yankees
    2) No one will give us discounts because we’re the Yankees
    3) No one will take our salary dumps because we’re the Yankees

    ======

    I concur

  158. Warning Track Power November 13th, 2012 at 12:47 pm

    Club
    Which is why I am very comfortable with re-signing him to a 1 yr deal for maybe $15M & not
    a multi-year deal.

  159. blake November 13th, 2012 at 12:47 pm

    CountryClub says:
    November 13, 2012 at 12:45 pm
    I want the Yanks to get Kuroda back too. But I can’t say I’m not worried about him bouncing back after last year’s workload.

    It is a worry….but there just really isn’t a better option….not one even close really

  160. Against All Odds November 13th, 2012 at 12:50 pm

    28 questions with Joe Girardi

    http://espn.go.com/new-york/ml.....oe-girardi

  161. blake November 13th, 2012 at 12:51 pm

    If Kuroda doesn’t re-sign then they have a few options but none of them are perfect and most will be expensive either in dollars or players.

    1) Greinke- gonna get a huge contract 100+ million
    2) garza- coming off injury and theo always asks the moon
    3) Johnson- made of glass and will cost a good bit in players most likely
    4) Haren- this may be the best option if he will do a one year deal….still risky cause of his back if you’re relying on him to fill Kuroda’s role.
    5) Freddy Garcia- yay! Winner winner

  162. blake November 13th, 2012 at 12:53 pm

    @jonmorosi: #Tigers are prepared to make Torii Hunter a multiyear contract offer, sources say. It is not clear if they have done so already.

  163. Chip November 13th, 2012 at 12:53 pm

    CountryClub November 13th, 2012 at 12:32 pm

    That’s Profar…not olt

    ————-

    Oh crap, you’re right. Serves me right for trying to work and talk baseball at the same time.
    —————-

    Indeed – stop working.

  164. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 12:53 pm

    Kev – Not sure if you noticed but we could use a catcher right now lol… and according to all reports and past performance, there is no prerequisite that it’d have to be a very good one, just a cheap one.

  165. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 12:54 pm

    Indeed – stop working.

    ————–

    Absolutely… pretty sure my boss’ last directive was to take the ball and slowly meander around with it..

  166. Shame Spencer November 13th, 2012 at 12:56 pm

    You guys know why Torii Hunter will help Detroit? Because they don’t need him lol. I remember when the Yankees used to do that stuff!

  167. blake November 13th, 2012 at 12:56 pm

    Wonder if the Tigers would trade Castellanos

  168. RadioKev November 13th, 2012 at 12:56 pm

    Blake,

    Josh Johnson actually did have a nice 2012. I can’t look up his splits right now on B-R because there’s a server issue, but he started rough and then pitched decent after that. It was especially encouraging after his injury shortened 2011.

    Problem is, it’s just one year, he still does have that injury history, and he’ll probably be costly.

  169. Warning Track Power November 13th, 2012 at 12:56 pm

    Shame
    I would prefer Martin catching compared to someone like Napoli
    Even if Martin does not hit, his defense is above average.

    Romine might be the better defensive catcher, but he’s young, needs more AB’s in the minors before he can become an everyday catcher.

    To me the choice is very clear.
    Re-Sign Martin and forget about Napoli

  170. blake November 13th, 2012 at 12:57 pm

    Johnson is good when he’s healthy….but he’s an injury risk….I mean if they could get him without giving too much it’d be great….he’s a true #1 when he’s right

  171. J. Alfred Prufrock November 13th, 2012 at 12:58 pm

    RadioKev November 13th, 2012 at 12:46 pm

    JAP,

    Give it up on the Melky thing. Who the heck knows where’d he’d be if he was never traded. Would he have stepped up and become a better player? Would he have cheated? Would he be returning next season? Who knows, and who cares. They traded him, he bottomed out, he rededicated himself, he cheated, and now he’s a question mark.

    Why are the Mariners so interested in another starting catcher if they already have Montero? If he were still on the Yankees, where would he play? DH with so many of our older players?

    You can’t just strip away context if you’re trying to make some rational criticism.
    ///

    I disagree with you fundamentally and on all counts.

    Cabrera was/is a good young hitter and they didn’t see it: they viewed him as a “fourth outfielder.” Right away, that tells me they don’t identify hitting talent very well, even though they signed the guy and had him in their system for several years. Your moral judgment of him as a “cheater” is really beside the point.

    Montero caught this past season and could have caught and DH’d as a Yankee. Again “saving” the DH, a true position, for older, flawed platoon bats is a ridiculous stance, especially when you had an elite talent who would have crushed in this park for years to come.

    The point was and is: both Cabrera and Montero are the kind of bats they DON’T have: bat speed, contact ability, YOUNG.

    They traded BOTH away for pitching, when they needed hitting. It demonstrates how flawed their thinking is and how bad they are at even self-scouting. Nothing “irrational” about that criticism.

  172. RadioKev November 13th, 2012 at 1:00 pm

    Shame,

    Montero just might not be a catcher (period)

    I haven’t seen scouts changing their mind, but it looks like the Mariners are.

    I don’t hate the guy. I don’t think I’m suffering from sour grapes. Our roster construction didn’t leave room for him, making him a trade chip. It happens. He also wasn’t very good last season with the bat. Even A-Rod had a more productive year. That could certainly change, but we didn’t miss him last season and I’d venture to guess we won’t sorely miss him this season.

  173. RadioKev November 13th, 2012 at 1:01 pm

    Yeah, OK JAP. My “moral judgement” that he’s a cheater. Right. I’m blinded by my bias, clearly.

  174. G. Love November 13th, 2012 at 1:02 pm

    blake,

    If Kuroda doesn’t sign, I would seriously look at a guy like Jeremy Guthrie. I think he’d be motivated by the stage he’d be on and he has a mean streak to him as we know on the mound. He was nails with KC after being liberated from the Rockies.

    If we’re talking low cost-ish free agent signings without trading, I’d also try to bring back Ichiro & see if we can get a guy like Ryan Ludwick to put in the OF mix.

    I also think if Keppinger is an upgrade over Nix, which I believe he is, he should be pursued.

    At catcher, I have no ideas. The Yankees stopped treating C as a real position in my eyes when Girardi took the helm. He’s thrilled with catch and throw guys who can’t hit and I think the team shares the sentiment.

    I don’t buy the Napoli talk at all.

    I’m fine with bringing Martin back provided that Girardi doesn’t block Gary Sanchez because of loyalty to Martin and Romine or whatever new C that has popped up here he identifies with. Cashman will overpay Martin before all is said & done and I’m pretty sure Martin coming back means Kuroda returns.

  175. UnKnown November 13th, 2012 at 1:06 pm

    Ha, I was at that game in Detroit where the picture above is taking with Joe’s hands in the air. Man was he hot.

  176. J. Alfred Prufrock November 13th, 2012 at 1:06 pm

    RadioKev November 13th, 2012 at 1:01 pm

    Yeah, OK JAP. My “moral judgement” that he’s a cheater. Right. I’m blinded by my bias, clearly.
    ///

    You’re missing the point, which you accuse me of doing.

    Don’t you understand? The two guys from their system who could have lifted the lineup are both gone – and that is WHY they are looking for bats TODAY. They had the young hitters and they traded them because they were too impatient to give Chamberlain more than a cup of coffee as a starter.

    It began the whole self-imposed “search for pitching.” It’s laughable, that they so confounded a team that potentially had all the pieces to be what now eludes them and what puts, again, their top prospects in peril.

  177. blake November 13th, 2012 at 1:07 pm

    “If Kuroda doesn’t sign, I would seriously look at a guy like Jeremy Guthrie. I think he’d be motivated by the stage he’d be on and he has a mean streak to him as we know on the mound. He was nails with KC after being liberated from the Rockies.”

    I’m sad that we have to take about Jeremy Guthrie

  178. RadioKev November 13th, 2012 at 1:10 pm

    And my point is, who knows what Melky would have been on the Yankees. You assume he would have been successful, cheating or no cheating, and I think it’s unclear. I thought it was unclear when he was in Kansas, and I definitely think it’s unclear after his suspension. That’s just the difference.

    At the time the Yankees needed starting pitching more, and they still do now! We don’t even have a 5 man rotation!

  179. J. Alfred Prufrock November 13th, 2012 at 1:10 pm

    …and if they are really in on Napoli, well just SMFH.

    Pineda threw 98 for half a season. HALF of a rookie season. He was pretty much where Chamberlain was when they cut bait on him. They are naive and ridiculous, thinking Pineda was going to just be a stud without any hitch or growing pains – meanwhile, they had no patience with Joba Chamberlain.

  180. Chip November 13th, 2012 at 1:13 pm

    blake November 13th, 2012 at 12:51 pm

    If Kuroda doesn’t re-sign then they have a few options but none of them are perfect and most will be expensive either in dollars or players.

    1) Greinke- gonna get a huge contract 100+ million
    2) garza- coming off injury and theo always asks the moon
    3) Johnson- made of glass and will cost a good bit in players most likely
    4) Haren- this may be the best option if he will do a one year deal….still risky cause of his back if you’re relying on him to fill Kuroda’s role.
    5) Freddy Garcia- yay! Winner winner
    ——————–

    Looking at the FA list available it’s not a great bunch of options out there. My great fear is that they sign Carl Pavano to a 1 year deal. Remember, Brian tried to orchestrate a sign and trade with the Twins to get Pavano back last time he was a FA.

  181. J. Alfred Prufrock November 13th, 2012 at 1:15 pm

    RadioKev November 13th, 2012 at 1:10 pm

    And my point is, who knows what Melky would have been on the Yankees. You assume he would have been successful, cheating or no cheating, and I think it’s unclear. I thought it was unclear when he was in Kansas, and I definitely think it’s unclear after his suspension. That’s just the difference.
    ///

    Sorry, I don’t share your sense of mystery on what he would have been. Anyone could see off 2009 he was beginning to hit from both sides of the plate, developing more line drive power, etc. What am I supposed to do? Pretend I didn’t anticipate that, or call that? I’m not alone – others recognized a nascent but genuine hitting ability that was going to eventually come. Switch hitters take longer to develop. The point is, the Yankees didn’t see it.

  182. J. Alfred Prufrock November 13th, 2012 at 1:18 pm

    At the time the Yankees needed starting pitching more, and they still do now! We don’t even have a 5 man rotation!
    ///

    They did?? How’d they pitch so well without Pineda?? They signed two FAs who solidified their staff and pitched lights out most of the year and in the playoffs, underscoring that they didn’t need to give up their best young hitting prospect for pitching!

  183. J. Alfred Prufrock November 13th, 2012 at 1:19 pm

    …and THEY COULDN’T HIT A LICK!!!

    so much for their, and your, premise :(

  184. ron November 13th, 2012 at 1:24 pm

    You are judged on results.
    Simple as that,and montero could of been traded for a real good bat.
    Instead we have a very badly injured pitcher that is gone for 1 1/2 years,at the minimum,and we did not get maximum value from melky,regardless of not knowing how he would turn out.

  185. austinmac November 13th, 2012 at 2:29 pm

    To the question asked earlier about why the Tigers would want Hunter, they are trying to improve and win. I understand why we Yankee fans would be confused.

    The Tigers want another bat. They are already getting Victor Martinez back. Add Hunter and they have significantly improved from the team that mopped the floor with our team.

    Yet, we get worse. But, Brian has his process of waiting and hoping a player will think it is 1960 when only one year contracts are given.

  186. West Coast Yankee November 13th, 2012 at 7:18 pm

    Girardi’s not a terrible manager, but he’s not an especially good one either. He’s good at bullpen management. But he’s not dynamic, not creative, doesn’t keep anyone guessing, and is ridiculously formulaic.

    I think the team could use an injection of dynamism and modernity. Exciting baseball is good for the fans and the players.

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