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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Pineda watch

Posted by: Brian Heyman - Posted in Misc on Nov 23, 2012 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Who knows what Michael Pineda is? He had one half of a good season with the Mariners and now he’s coming off shoulder surgery.

But he’s only going to be 24 in January and the 6-foot-7 righty did come with a price tag of Jesus Montero. It would be nice if he turned out to be something sooner or later in the Yankees’ rotation and lived up to the potential he originally showed.

Pineda went 9-10 with a 3.74 ERA in 2011, but he was just 1-4 with a 5.12 ERA after the All-Star break that year.  Then came the trade, the labrum tear and the operation May 1, forcing him to miss the entire season.

Here’s what we heard the other day about his comeback:

He came to town within the last two weeks for a routine follow-up with Dr. Chris Ahmad, the Yankees’ physician, and Dr. David Altchek, the Mets’ physician who operated on Pineda.  He threw at Yankee Stadium on flat ground, his program for about two months.

“He looked good,” Brian Cashman said. “He’s throwing on flat ground at 90 feet, so I don’t want to get  …

“All I can report is his arm was working very well, very healthy, very loose. He had zip on it. He’s in great physical shape in terms of body weight.

“He’s not going to be a choice in game action until probably sometime in May or June. Whether it’s majors or minors, who’s to say? We’ve got him to the side. … We certainly have high hopes for him, but in terms of planning and counting on him, it’s in everybody’s interest not to do that right now and just put together as deep and strong a staff as possible and be pleasantly surprised and appreciative if we can welcome him back to the fold at some point.

“But that’s all for another day. He’s got a lot more hurdles in the rehab process to clear.”

In other news, ESPN on Thursday had the Red Sox agreeing with Jonny Gomes on a deal for two years and $10 million, contingent on a physical. The outfielder hit .262 with 18 homers and 47 RBI for the A’s last season.

 

 
 

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135 Responses to “Pineda watch”

  1. tucker November 23rd, 2012 at 11:53 am

    Brian, good job with the updates in Chad’s absence.

    Pineda was electric for the first half of 2011. I hope he can regain that form, but I’d say it’s a low-percentage chance. He would be a key part of the rotation if the Yanks can’t sign Hughes: CC, Pineda, Nova, Phelps and Pitcher X.

  2. 86w183 November 23rd, 2012 at 11:55 am

    If the Yankees are going to succeed in the quest to get the payroll down to $ 189 M in 2014 AND remain competitive for the AL East they simply must get significant contributions from at least half of the following:

    Pineda, Nova, Banuelos, Phelps, Austin, Mesa, Mustelier, Romine, Sacnhez, Nunez and Adams

  3. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 11:57 am

    If the Yankees are going to succeed in the quest to get the payroll down to $ 189 M in 2014 AND remain competitive for the AL East they simply must get significant contributions from at least half of the following:

    Pineda, Nova, Banuelos, Phelps, Austin, Mesa, Mustelier, Romine, Sacnhez, Nunez and Adams

    ********

    Add Flores – - – -

  4. tucker November 23rd, 2012 at 12:05 pm

    Not all of those guys are going to pan out and some will likely be traded, but that group of names does need to contribute.

  5. tucker November 23rd, 2012 at 12:06 pm

    And I would add Heathcott to that list, too.

  6. kd November 23rd, 2012 at 12:08 pm

    hope everyone had a nice thanksgiving with loved ones

    pineda is going to be a project going forward. pitchers have have elbow problems, shoulders are more difficult. let’s hope he gets into peak physical condition to give himself the best chance to be successful

  7. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 12:11 pm

    I think the Yanks need to continue to go with a cheap bullpen – they will need contributors from Montgomery, Goody, Whitley, Rondon, Kahnle, Nuding, Pinder

  8. jacksquat November 23rd, 2012 at 12:14 pm

    Mason Williams could possibly be up sometime in 2014 as well if he plays well and they move him up.

  9. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2012 at 12:14 pm

    “Remain competitve”??? Nothing wrong with shooting for a World Championship. Mentally, you set goals atta low level, and before you know it, physically, your on Skid Row. We are talking about the New York Yankees. STOP lowering the bar.

  10. tucker November 23rd, 2012 at 12:27 pm

    For all the criticism of the Yanks’ development, they have used their system to provide inexpensive parts to fill the pen. Once Mo retires,mthey probably won’t spend big on a closer but will hope that Montgomery, Robertson or Joba can fill the role.

  11. 86w183 November 23rd, 2012 at 12:35 pm

    I’ll set the bar of my expectations wherever I damn well please.

    I have never bought into the psychotic mantra that anything shy of a World Series Championship is failure. That is and always has been ridiculous, ego-manical and counter productive.

    How did that mind set work for you from 1982-95?

    Would you rather have the Red Sawx last ten years w/ 2 W.S. wins or the Yanks’ with more consistency and more wins, but only one W.S. title??

  12. Run it Out November 23rd, 2012 at 12:37 pm

    DONNY….I don’t think you’re going to get that much for Hughes or Cano unless you include top prospects from the farm. Both Hughes and Cano are one year away from FA. Nova and Phelps are really unknown at this point and Nunnie is what he is. If you want to throw out proposals of return players then it’s a conversation but tojust say “trade these guys” is meaningless.

  13. luis November 23rd, 2012 at 12:38 pm

    Good afternoon,

    Flores should be a factor by the end of this next season. He looks as ready as he can be. He is a very advanced hitter and deceivingly good.

  14. RhapsodyInBlue November 23rd, 2012 at 12:44 pm

    No DWI while Pineda was in town was a plus.

  15. Run it Out November 23rd, 2012 at 12:46 pm

    “No DWI while Pineda was in town was a plus.”

    Thank car service or cabs.

  16. tucker November 23rd, 2012 at 12:47 pm

    Cano would bring a nice haul. He is one of the ten best position players in the game at a premium position. Any team that is competitive could use a player like Cano to make them legit WS contenders.

    But with Kuroda back in the fold, might as well keep Cano and go for it in 2013 before the new reality of 189 sets in. I still would consider trading Hughes, though, if talks for an early extension prove fruitless. Or they may keep Hughes until they figure out what Pineda will offer. If Pineda is effective, Hughes could be a trade deadline move to a contending team.

  17. 86w183 November 23rd, 2012 at 12:54 pm

    It would be great if Flores and/or Tyler is ready for 2014.

    I would play both in Scranton every day in 2013.

    It wouldn’t bother be if they tried Dickerson/Mesa in one OF position in 2013. Dickerson can play RF… I have no idea if Mesa can. But I’d rather have them sign Josh Hamilton for one year @ $ 30 M…. but I’m not expecting that.

    Gotta go work…. seeya tomorrow…. or maybe tonight

  18. 86w183 November 23rd, 2012 at 12:54 pm

    Tyler Austin that is

  19. Run it Out November 23rd, 2012 at 12:59 pm

    tucker…Cano would bring a nice haul IF the receiving team was ready to go big bucks to retain him after 2013. Boras is licking his chops. You know that having only one year control of Cano would come up in every GM conversation.

  20. jacksquat November 23rd, 2012 at 1:01 pm

    Flores and Austin will likely both start at AA Trenton. They both got a very small taste there at the end of 2012. So likely Flores LF – Heathcott CF – Austin RF?

  21. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 1:21 pm

    @Jim_Duquette: more Gibby – “Melky brings energy every day, can really hit, and should hit at the top of the lineup” maybe #2 in front of Bautista

    No way…. Cash says he’s a 4th outfielder

  22. tucker November 23rd, 2012 at 1:25 pm

    Run it Out — two years of Cano control would bring more, no doubt. And Boras is going to take him to free agency regardless. But he is an elite enough player — a true difference maker on offense and defense — that he could return three blue chip, upper MILB prospects. Or a combination of a young position player and prospects.

    One year of Cano could make a decent team a true contender.

    But I doubt the Yanks shop Cano now that they have their rotation nearly set.

  23. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 1:35 pm

    “One year of Cano could make a decent team a true contender.”

    Could make the Yankees a non contender in 2013 too if they traded him…..

  24. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 1:40 pm

    I’m fine with them trading Cano if they don’t think they can sign him and they can get a good return…..but I think their lineup is borderline not good enough to make the playoffs now…..I think it definately isn’t without Cano.

    Now if they signed Hamilton to a 4 or 5 year deal and traded Cano for a big return……ok maybe.

  25. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 1:43 pm

    There are only a handful of teams that are both close enough to winning and have enough money to be willing to trade no for Cano…..the Nats, Dodgers, Tigers, Phillies, Angels…..Blue jays ….those are about the only clubs I can think of that could afford to keep him. I think Detroit would trade a lot for Cano…..they want to win now badly

  26. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 1:44 pm

    @SportsReelBOS: RT Can confirm Mike Napoli seeks four years from Boston, and yes he is visiting Seattle where he is likely to hit cleanup if he signs

    Maybe they’ll trade Montero back to us

  27. tucker November 23rd, 2012 at 1:45 pm

    The Kuroda resigning makes them a contender. Without Kuroda, they were third or fourth best in the division, IMO (without making another move to bring in a significant starter.)

    So with Kuroda, they should make one more pre-189 run for a championship. That means keeping Cano.

  28. tucker November 23rd, 2012 at 1:47 pm

    Could you imagine the Nats or Tigers with Cano? Dangerous.

  29. tucker November 23rd, 2012 at 1:48 pm

    I would not have great confidence with Cashman locking wits with Dombrowski over a Cano deal.

  30. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 1:53 pm

    tucker says:
    November 23, 2012 at 1:48 pm
    I would not have great confidence with Cashman locking wits with Dombrowski over a Cano deal.

    Me neither….. Id need to get Castellanos plus quite a bit more to do it

  31. jacksquat November 23rd, 2012 at 1:53 pm

    I wouldn’t trade Pineda for Montero now though.

  32. UnKnown November 23rd, 2012 at 2:25 pm

    I’m most interested in what the Bombers are going to do with the Catcher and RF positions…

  33. brianlopez22 November 23rd, 2012 at 2:31 pm

    The call to move kids up to AAA is useless.
    AAA is the land of misfit toys.

    Other organizations (not us) are willing to promote from AA because the competition is greater.

    The fact that we refuse to promote from AA is a testament to how bad Cashman is at managing the youth in the farm system.

  34. DONNYBROOK November 23rd, 2012 at 2:32 pm

    I have stated previously that I would go after J Upton and Headley. Upton is on-the-market, Headley was, but I do Not know if that currently is the case. Those players would be my primary targets. I believe Cano would garner interest and reap dividends for the Yanks. There are teams that are looking to win in 2013, and do Not want to hamstring themselves financially with Big multi-year contracts.

  35. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 2:33 pm

    blake November 23rd, 2012 at 1:21 pm
    @Jim_Duquette: more Gibby – “Melky brings energy every day, can really hit, and should hit at the top of the lineup” maybe #2 in front of Bautista

    No way…. Cash says he’s a 4th outfielder

    *****

    Yeah – b/c some scrub manager knows more than the Yankees. Welcome back John Gibbons to the AL East:

    Controversy with players

    On May 28, 2005, Gibbons chastised former Toronto starter Dave Bush in the dugout after the right-hander showed his displeasure on the mound about being removed from a game. The next day Bush was sent to the minor leagues.[7] After the season, Bush was traded to the Milwaukee Brewers.

    Gibbons was again involved in controversy in July 2006, after his feud with Shea Hillenbrand came to a head. After the former Blue Jays infielder and designated hitter wrote negative comments about the team on a display board in the Blue Jays clubhouse, Gibbons confronted him in a closed team meeting and allegedly challenged him to a fight.[citation needed] Hillenbrand was upset about his lack of playing time and that no one in the Blue Jays front office had made an attempt to congratulate him on recently adopting a child. Three days later the Blue Jays traded Hillenbrand, who was hitting .301 at the time, to the San Francisco Giants.[8]

    Gibbons was involved in more controversy on August 21, 2006, when he got into a confrontation with another of his players. Gibbons walked to the mound to remove Ted Lilly in the third inning of Toronto’s game against the Oakland Athletics. Visibly frustrated at his own performance (having given up 7 runs in that inning to erase an 8–0 lead), Lilly initially refused to surrender the ball to Gibbons. He ultimately left the mound and headed for the clubhouse.[9] When Gibbons returned to the dugout, he followed Lilly into the clubhouse tunnel where, according to eyewitnesses, Gibbons confronted the pitcher about his insubordination. The two exchanged shoves, and a number of players and Blue Jays staff rushed in from the dugout to break it up.[10]

    The final controversy occurred with Frank Thomas. At the beginning of the 2008 season, Gibbons benched Thomas, who had a batting average of .167 after the first 20 games of the season. Thomas, typically a slow starter, was livid over his lack of playing time. He claimed that the Blue Jays were giving him less playing time to prevent him from getting 364 at-bats in the season, which was the required amount for his $10 million 2009 option to become guaranteed. The Blue Jays responded the next day on April 20, 2008, by releasing Thomas. Blue Jays general manager J.P. Ricciardi met with Thomas and they agreed that the best thing for the team and for Thomas would be to let him go.[11]
    [edit]

  36. Jerkface November 23rd, 2012 at 2:36 pm

    Wow those controversies sound like Gibbons putting the boot down on some whiny players. Not a good argument against Gibbons.

  37. Jerkface November 23rd, 2012 at 2:39 pm

    That scrub manager won 80+ games in all 3 of his fullseasons in the AL east with a weak toronto team.

  38. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 2:53 pm

    Jerkface November 23rd, 2012 at 2:36 pm
    Wow those controversies sound like Gibbons putting the boot down on some whiny players. Not a good argument against Gibbons.

    Jerkface November 23rd, 2012 at 2:39 pm
    That scrub manager won 80+ games in all 3 of his fullseasons in the AL east with a weak toronto team.

    *****

    Exactly – scrub manager losing the clubhouse – and wait for it – finally losing his job to Cito Gaston. It is never a good thing when you are a manager involved with controversy and then you are let go after 3+ seasons. Good job Gibbons throwing out a HOF in Frank Thomas – nice job – if you do that – you had better have the cache of a WS ring on your hand – - – -

    Interesting 3 full seasons – could not complete his final season – they had to let him go for Cito Gaston.

    Nahh – it was not a weak Toronto team – they had added A.J. and B.J. Ryan – huge offseason signings – along with others – it was actually disappointing that he could not compete with Roy freackin Halladay:

    “Expectations were higher in 2006, after the Blue Jays acquired A.J. Burnett, Troy Glaus, Lyle Overbay, B. J. Ryan, and Bengie Molina. ”

    Oh – Bob Melvin and Buck Showalter – they do much more than what Gibbons

    Gibbons SHOULD have made the WC at least once – but alas – he was a scrub manager – who was in AA and/or a bench coach the past seasons.

  39. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 2:56 pm

    some whiny players

    ******

    LOL – yeah Frank Thomas – - – -nice one – - –

    Oh and this is probably why Gibbons does not like Thomas – and prefers Melky the cheat:

    Advocate for drug testing

    As early as 1995, Thomas was advocating drug testing for professional baseball players.[31] After hitting his 500th home run, Thomas stated, “It means a lot to me because I did it the right way,” alluding to Barry Bonds’s then-ongoing pursuit of Hank Aaron’s career home run record.[32] Thomas was, then, the only active baseball player to be interviewed during the preparation of the Mitchell Report. He did so voluntarily.

  40. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 2:58 pm

    Gibbons last won manager of the year in ___________.

  41. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 2:58 pm

    Gibbons last won a world series in __________.

  42. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 2:59 pm

    Gibbons last qualified his team as a wild card in __________.

  43. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 3:02 pm

    scrub
    A dude who act like a playa or like he sumthin but really got nothin.

    Oh and AA – please D’Arnaud is not worth Halladay – the Drabek situation needed to pan out for the Halladay trade to go down as nothing more than a disaster – - – -

  44. Jerkface November 23rd, 2012 at 3:07 pm

    Go look at 2006. AJ only pitched 135 innings because he got injured (surprise) and the rest of the rotation is guys with 5 ERAs. Even with that disaster rotation they managed to finish second in the AL East. Gibbons did not lose the clubhouse, you’re attributing the actions of malcontents to the entire clubhouse. Hillenbrand is a known douche. Frank THomas when he was getting sat was 40, was not hitting, and guess what? That was his final season because he was done! More to the point, his interactions with these players has nothing to do with his ability to recognize talent :)

    And even Showalter barely lasts 3 years in each of his managerial stints

  45. Jerkface November 23rd, 2012 at 3:14 pm

    Gibbons has been, by far, Torontos best manager by record and finishing position. Even Cito blew it in his 2nd stint.

  46. Jerkface November 23rd, 2012 at 3:19 pm

    And slamming AA on the Halladay trade? He got the 17th and 39th best prospects in baseball.

  47. Jerkface November 23rd, 2012 at 3:22 pm

    D’Arnaud is a catcher who is OPSing .900 and is expected to stick at catcher. How is that not worth 1 year of Halladay

  48. Against All Odds November 23rd, 2012 at 3:58 pm

    jacksquat November 23rd, 2012 at 1:53 pm

    I wouldn’t trade Pineda for Montero now though.

    —————

    Why not??

  49. jacksquat November 23rd, 2012 at 4:09 pm

    Against All Odds November 23rd, 2012 at 3:58 pm
    jacksquat November 23rd, 2012 at 1:53 pm

    I wouldn’t trade Pineda for Montero now though.

    —————

    Why not??

    Because we already lasted through the injury for the most part, and so far he is throwing and appears to be at least healthy. Montero has now been deemed not a starting catcher, at least not yet, by two orgs, not just the Yankees. He has big problems vs rhp. I’d rather take my chances with Pineda.

  50. Against All Odds November 23rd, 2012 at 4:15 pm

    You would rather take your chances with a guy coming back from a shoulder injury. Pineda still has a ways to go before he reaches what he did in 2011.

  51. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 4:26 pm

    November 23, 2012 at 1:53 pm
    I wouldn’t trade Pineda for Montero now though.

    Man I would .. I’ll take a healthy hitter who went through some growing pains in an extreme pitchers park over a pitcher with a labrum year every time

  52. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 4:34 pm

    Montero still has 5 years of control also….Pineda only has 4 left and one of those will probably be wasted for rehab next year unless the Yanks get creative and save the year by optioning him down (hopefully)

    Montero will still hit IMO….they are bringing the fences in at Safeco next year…..lets see how he does in his sophomore season.

    I hope Pineda comes back throwing darts and turns out to make it a good trade…..they really really need him to

  53. farcefarser November 23rd, 2012 at 4:56 pm

    The Yankees if I understand it correctly, did not do their due diligence when trading for Pineda. With a fall off that was that stunning in 2011, a contrast MRI was the safest most thorough way to check shoulder integrity, with respect to imaging. Even if a detailed clinical exam is negative the best images that could reveal small labrum or rotator cuff irregularities involve contrast . I believe the team ordered a non contrast MRI, something that may not have picked up what could well have been existing shoulder damage. I say this not to offer sour grapes, only to use going forward when evaluating joint health and high priced talent with warning signs like decreased performance evident, which should lead to increased scrutiny and more aggresive imaging.

  54. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 5:04 pm

    Contrast dye MRI’s are more invasive than standard MRI’s….my understanding is that the team can request one but it’s not really standard protocol and the player can say no…..

  55. Against All Odds November 23rd, 2012 at 5:12 pm

    I hope Pineda comes back throwing darts and turns out to make it a good trade…..they really really need him to

    —————-

    He’s so important to the present and future of the org.

  56. farcefarser November 23rd, 2012 at 5:14 pm

    Correct blake, however the morbidity and complication rates are usually low and the assurity the images give you, specifically when evaluating cartilagenous defects in high priced athletes make them close to essential IMO.

  57. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 5:15 pm

    Bowden said he always requested a contrast dye mRI when he traded for a pitcher…..but he said sometimes the player would decline

  58. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 5:19 pm

    “Correct blake, however the morbidity and complication rates are usually low and the assurity the images give you, specifically when evaluating cartilagenous defects in high priced athletes make them close to essential IMO.”

    True….but they also hurt and players don’t like to get dye shot in their arms…….I think a standard protocol to ask for one when trading for a pitcher is probably a good idea…..but you may not always get consent and then you have to decide if you still want to make the deal…..

    I agree though that when you’re trading for these guys it certainly would be nice to get one so there are fewer surprises….they probably should have asked….but again it’s not standard procedure for most teams (maybe it should be)

  59. Triple Short of a Cycle November 23rd, 2012 at 5:34 pm

    Because we already lasted through the injury for the most part, and so far he is throwing and appears to be at least healthy. Montero has now been deemed not a starting catcher, at least not yet, by two orgs, not just the Yankees. He has big problems vs rhp. I’d rather take my chances with Pineda.

    —————————–

    It wasn’t the surgery and recovery time it was the type of injury. If it was just TJ then no problem. Even the most ardent anti Montero folks on this board would do that trade to get him back

  60. farcefarser November 23rd, 2012 at 5:36 pm

    It is not standard for many exams and for some baseball players with no clinical presentation or history it should be unnecessary. However it is minimally invasive (butterfly needle intravenous) and in a case like Pineda, IMO the Yankee medical team should have insisted with his 2011 second half collapse. Brian Cashman’s response leads me to believe he may agree..

  61. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 5:39 pm

    I can’t argue with you there…..a trade of that magnitude they probably should have requested one and made them say no at the very least

  62. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 5:43 pm

    Pineda isn’t “mostly past” this injury….he’s had the surgery and his arm is still attached…..but until he gets on the mound and faces hitters we have no idea what he will be again……guys have made it all the way back from this injury before…. It’s ended some careers too…..it’s very important for the Yanks that its the former and hopefully it will be….but until it comes to pass we just don’t know

  63. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 5:47 pm

    Killed two black widows and found a dead mouse under the Cristmas tree bag while dragging it out from the storage building…..tis the season

  64. Triple Short of a Cycle November 23rd, 2012 at 5:48 pm

    It has ended more careers then have come back and by a pretty wide margin

  65. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 5:48 pm

    but until it comes to pass we just don’t know

    *****

    same with Montero – - – -

  66. Triple Short of a Cycle November 23rd, 2012 at 5:51 pm

    same with Montero – – – -

    ———————–

    Montero is hurt with an injury that the majority of players at his position fail to come back from?

  67. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 5:52 pm

    “same with Montero – – – -”

    Montero isn’t a pitcher with a torn labrum

  68. jacksquat November 23rd, 2012 at 6:03 pm

    Triple Short of a Cycle November 23rd, 2012 at 5:34 pm
    Because we already lasted through the injury for the most part, and so far he is throwing and appears to be at least healthy. Montero has now been deemed not a starting catcher, at least not yet, by two orgs, not just the Yankees. He has big problems vs rhp. I’d rather take my chances with Pineda.

    —————————–

    It wasn’t the surgery and recovery time it was the type of injury. If it was just TJ then no problem. Even the most ardent anti Montero folks on this board would do that trade to get him back

    I’m not anti Montero, I’d just rather have Pineda now.

    The damage to his shoulder wasn’t severe, and his surgery was arthroscopic, which means he will have a better chance. It’s still worse than TJ, but not as bad as in the past.

  69. Against All Odds November 23rd, 2012 at 6:13 pm

    blake November 23rd, 2012 at 5:47 pm

    Killed two black widows and found a dead mouse under the Cristmas tree bag while dragging it out from the storage building…..tis the season

    ——————

    Either that or jumanji

  70. Against All Odds November 23rd, 2012 at 6:16 pm

    Triple Short of a Cycle November 23rd, 2012 at 5:48 pm

    It has ended more careers then have come back and by a pretty wide margin

    ———

    Let’s hope he beats the odds.

    No pun intended

  71. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 6:42 pm

    If the Mariners win up with Napoli it’ll be interesting what they do with Montero….Napoli will have to DH a lot and Zunino is a stud and is coming fast…..will they move Montero to 1B or look to move him? I think personally it’s way to early to give up on his bat…..he’s gonna hit I still believe….how much depends on how he makes adjustments and how hard he works but the tools haven’t gone away…..

  72. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 7:10 pm

    blake November 23rd, 2012 at 5:52 pm
    “same with Montero – – – -”

    Montero isn’t a pitcher with a torn labrum

    *******

    Speculation is speculation – you wrote until it comes to pass – same with Montero – until he shows he can make adjustments – we do not know – same with Pineda – until we see how he comes back – we do not know – - – -

  73. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 7:10 pm

    blake November 23rd, 2012 at 6:42 pm
    If the Mariners win up with Napoli it’ll be interesting what they do with Montero….Napoli will have to DH a lot and Zunino is a stud and is coming fast…..

    ******

    Jaso says hi – - – - -

  74. kd November 23rd, 2012 at 7:12 pm

    my guess is that montero is sporting a 1b mitt this spring

  75. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 7:12 pm

    Triple Short of a Cycle November 23rd, 2012 at 5:51 pm
    same with Montero – – – -

    ———————–

    Montero is hurt with an injury that the majority of players at his position fail to come back from?

    *****

    No he just happens to hit and play in a professional league where most do not make it or pan out to be Mickey Mantle – as it was declared he was the best Yankees hitter developed since Mickey Mantle – - – - -

  76. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 7:15 pm

    “Jaso says hi – – – – -”

    About? Id guess Napoli and Jaso would split the catching duties until Zunino was ready and Montero would either play 1b/dH or be traded.

  77. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 7:16 pm

    If you can say here and guarantee Montero will live up to the Mickey Mantle praise from this site – than yes – you can hold to your stance and I salute – – - –

    If you can say here that it is guaranteed Pineda will not come back from his injury – than yes – you can hold to your stance and I salute you – - – -

    If you are not willing to guarantee either of the above – then everything right now on BOTH players is speculation, projection, and a bunch of guess work – - – -

  78. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 7:16 pm

    If they sign Napoli then Montero really has to 1B or be dealt….hard to see anything else working.

    And a guy having some struggles in his rookie year is a lot different than a pitching trying to come back from a very serious injury

  79. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 7:17 pm

    blake November 23rd, 2012 at 7:15 pm
    “Jaso says hi – – – – -”

    About? Id guess Napoli and Jaso would split the catching duties until Zunino was ready and Montero would either play 1b/dH or be traded.

    *****

    About being left off of your Napoli Zunino list

  80. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 7:18 pm

    ” as it was declared he was the best Yankees hitter developed since Mickey Mantle – – – – -”

    Not by everyone….and that really doesn’t have anything to do with the conversation

  81. austinmac November 23rd, 2012 at 7:18 pm

    I have said about Montero even before the trade, his success will depend on his ability to lay off breaking balls well off the plate. He hammers balls in the zone, but can go Alfonso Soriano on balls off the plate. I would say Soriano is his downside.

  82. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 7:19 pm

    blake November 23rd, 2012 at 7:16 pm
    If they sign Napoli then Montero really has to 1B or be dealt….hard to see anything else working.

    And a guy having some struggles in his rookie year is a lot different than a pitching trying to come back from a very serious injury

    ******

    Still speculation until it happens – same with Montero until it happens – - – -right now – a year later – we are still projecting and dreaming on Montero – as with most prospects – that is all – I am not saying one will succeed over the other – it is just both still have question marks – sure Pineda has a bigger question mark – but make no mistake – Montero STILL has a question mark himself – - – -

  83. Jerkface November 23rd, 2012 at 7:21 pm

    I’d rather have 5 years of Montero than 3 years of Pineda.

  84. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 7:21 pm

    blake November 23rd, 2012 at 7:18 pm
    ” as it was declared he was the best Yankees hitter developed since Mickey Mantle – – – – -”

    Not by everyone….and that really doesn’t have anything to do with the conversation

    *********

    Cannot separate the projection/hype of Montero from any conversation – for good or bad – he is stuck with it – it is lesser now b/c Seattle does not have the same media market and prospect follower craze that led to such Mickey Mantle expectations – some here on this site – - – -for good or bad – the hype/expectations are with Montero – - – -

  85. Jerkface November 23rd, 2012 at 7:22 pm

    Montero doesn’t have to do as much to pan out at this point than Pineda. He already is a good hitter on the road & against lefties. I’ll take that for 3 years of a pitcher that could wind up in the bullpen or out of baseball due to injury.

  86. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 7:22 pm

    Pineda has four years of control left I believe – assuming he is not optioned to the minors this year – - – -

  87. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 7:25 pm

    Actually the only time I’ve ready Monteto and mantle in the same sentence on this blog was that some old timers it’s said he hit balls to places they’d only seen mantle hit them…..

  88. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 7:26 pm

    Jerkface says:
    November 23, 2012 at 7:21 pm
    I’d rather have 5 years of Montero than 3 years of Pineda.

    Yea….especially when the guy with 5 years is healthy

  89. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 7:29 pm

    He already is a good hitter on the road

    *****

    With Montero – you have to go by OPS – he is a middle of the order guy – should not be a singles hitter – needed more doubles – OPS on the road is below .770 – he is not there yet – - -he also should have hit more homeruns than 9 on the road – and should have been in double digits for doubles – - – -plus he must improve his 99 K to 29 bb ratio – if he had played in more than 135 games – his K rate would have gone past the century mark.

    The fact that the Mariners are looking at Napoli – a similar type when it comes to position and defense options – speaks volumes – - – -

    Still dreaming and projecting on him at this point – there is no certitude – just a lot of this could happen or I think – - – -just opinions and speculation at this point – which was the original response – - – -

  90. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 7:31 pm

    I really hope Pineda makes the trade a win for the Yankees…..because they need him badly with the set backs to Banuelos…..with Betances pretty much a reliever….and with the budget

  91. The Return of Stoneburner November 23rd, 2012 at 7:33 pm

    blake November 23rd, 2012 at 7:25 pm
    Actually the only time I’ve ready Monteto and mantle in the same sentence on this blog was that some old timers it’s said he hit balls to places they’d only seen mantle hit them…..

    ********

    Actually, blake, this I find hard to believe – I am heading out for dinner and then watch the Knicks game – I do not want to be rude about this – but seriously – it’s best I just let the below speak for itself in response to your comments before I say anything – and this is just one of others:

    J. Alfred Prufrock January 13th, 2012 at 10:17 pm
    pat January 13th, 2012 at 10:12 pm
    JAP

    If you make a habit to speak to women like that, shame on you for doing it and them for allowing it.
    ///

    Gimme a break. You are the most passive aggressive poster here. You incessantly push the party line down everyone’s throat. You are the most insidious, arrogant, cutthroat person here. You make little digs that completely disrespect anyone who is even remotely thoughtful about the Yankees if it doesn’t flatter them.

    You earned that comment (and it’s not an anti-feminist remark, it’s a metaphor. I don’t give a damn what gender you are – you are consistently dishonorable in your snide slights at others).

    We’re talking about a Mickey Mantle type talent here, a generational bat that people were genuinely excited about. And all you bring is your self-absorbed, narcissistic snark. Get lost.

  92. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 7:39 pm

    One poster doesn’t really speak to the whole blog as you seem time to generalize all the time…..JAPAN posted an opinion….and it’s way to early to judge anyway

  93. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 7:40 pm

    JAP

  94. jmills November 23rd, 2012 at 7:44 pm

    Who knows, Jays might tank anyways – at least my off season is more amenable.I’ve given up projecting rotations.

    Black widows while uncovering the storage xmas tree?; another reason why I try to circumnavigate the whole affair. I don’t like snakes either and an Arkansas friend of mine says he brings a shotgun in the boat for the express purpose of poisonous water snakes – I can’t live there or Arizona for that matter where the reptiles and scorpions all come out at night necessitating knee high boots. The story goes you have snakes coming out of NYC toilets – if true, not worth all the Mark Rothkos in the world :)

    Thank little goddess for decimating cold.

  95. jmills November 23rd, 2012 at 7:51 pm

    JAP has always been kind unto me as have the rest of you ( I’m just trying to keep up ).

    Let’s evolve a wicked Friday.

  96. jmills November 23rd, 2012 at 8:14 pm

    Mickey Mantle is a special ” hitter “, No Doubt, Gwen.

    The Temptations is to kick Billy and the Mick ( not u blogger ) around. I think Thuran must have tried to temper all that, but the things remain, they are all important parts.

    I have not read anything misogynistic on this blog and if I did, I would say my unsightly peace.

  97. jmills November 23rd, 2012 at 8:20 pm

    Crap, ” Thurman.”

    Narcissistic Lohud I am a part of.

  98. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 8:22 pm

    @mlbtraderumors: Rangers Discussing Extension With Matt Harrison http://t.co/HcLhT5AN #mlb

    If they work out an extension with Harrison then itd be interesting to see what he gets as he’s about the same age as Hughes but has been probably a little better and is an additional year away from free agency……whatever Harrison gets….Hughes’s number should presumably be less if you’re looking at comps (of course it doesn’t always work that way)

  99. jmills November 23rd, 2012 at 8:25 pm

    Blake, when Cash leaves, I vote for you!

  100. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 8:44 pm

    jmills says:
    November 23, 2012 at 8:25 pm
    Blake, when Cash leaves, I vote for you!

    That’s because you’re a Blue Jays fan. :)

  101. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 8:49 pm

    The Red Sox have Nick Swisher “on their radar,” a source tells George A. King III of the New York Post. At least seven teams are known to be interested in Swisher, whose ability to switch-hit and play both first base and right field is a boon to many clubs. King hears from an industry source who believes Swisher could find a four-year, $60MM contract, though with that many teams and big markets in the running, it wouldn’t surprise me to see that number jump to between $65-$70MM in guaranteed money.
    Read more at http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/.....ytZQ9L3.99

    Kinda seems about right for Swish

  102. jmills November 23rd, 2012 at 8:49 pm

    Blake,haha, have a great night whilst it lasts! :)

  103. Jerkface November 23rd, 2012 at 9:20 pm

    The Yankees have 4 years of service time on Pineda but atleast half of the 4th year is going to be spent on rehab, maybe more.

  104. Jerkface November 23rd, 2012 at 9:22 pm

    Pineda will go on the 60 day DL, then take probably the full month of rehab. So a minimum of half the season is going to be lost. Now if they option him after that they can gain back a year, but they aren’t a team that really does that. They should, 100%, but I foresee them leaving him on the 60 day to save a 40 man spot and then put him in rehab when they are sure he can come up to the majors after it.

  105. jacksquat November 23rd, 2012 at 9:49 pm

    JF, what would the Pineda schedule have to be for the Yankees to get 4 more years of Pineda after 2013?

  106. blake November 23rd, 2012 at 10:13 pm

    @JeffPassan: Sources: Royals have shopped top prospect Wil Myers in attempts to trade for frontline starter. Story: http://t.co/VUYd16rQ

  107. fuster November 23rd, 2012 at 10:28 pm

    service time is rather secondary to getting a valuable contribution from Pineda in 2013 and 14.

  108. ron November 23rd, 2012 at 10:30 pm

    Option him to AAA after his injury,and i believe it becomes retro from las year.

  109. Jerkface November 23rd, 2012 at 11:42 pm

    Pineda will be on the 60 day dl for 2 months minimum. Then spend 30 days rehabbing. Then if by chance they option him he must stay in the minors for 20 days to gain a year.

  110. Jerkface November 23rd, 2012 at 11:43 pm

    Optioning is never retroactive or anything, mlbpa takes service time serious.

  111. jacksquat November 23rd, 2012 at 11:51 pm

    Wow, if it’s only 20 days in the minors to gain a year, they have to do it. If they don’t they are crazy.

  112. jacksquat November 23rd, 2012 at 11:53 pm

    But since Pineda is already on the 60-day and has been on it more than 60 days, he could come off at any time next year, right? Or does it “restart” at the beginning of the year?

  113. jacksquat November 24th, 2012 at 12:33 am

    After some reading, it seems all the DL stuff restarts at the beginning of the season. So Pineda wouldn’t come off the 60-day until day 61. It seems a rehab assignment can be up to 30 days. However, since Pineda has options, he could just be straight out optioned to the minors after coming off the DL?

  114. Jerkface November 24th, 2012 at 1:18 am

    He could be but there is no way the yankees option him without rehab, the mlbpa would file a grievance.

  115. Nick in SF November 24th, 2012 at 1:39 am

    Another good reason for Andy to come back: to help keep this punk Pineda riding the rails for an extra 20 days.

  116. coney1 November 24th, 2012 at 2:12 am

    RIP J.R. Ewing

  117. blake November 24th, 2012 at 7:08 am

    @Buster_ESPN: Ichiro Suzuki is willing to wait for the Yankees before making his decision on where to play, says Tony Attanasio. http://t.co/e6hgQbEp

  118. blake November 24th, 2012 at 7:08 am

    @Buster_ESPN: Yankees President Randy Levine is blunt about marching orders for YES on-air talent in this Richard Sandomir piece. http://t.co/nqPFLn1Q

  119. blake November 24th, 2012 at 7:30 am

    Id love to bring Ichiro back….we will just have to wait and see…

  120. blake November 24th, 2012 at 7:37 am

    @Buster_ESPN: It’s apparent, in the midst of Mike Napoli’s free agency, that a lot of evaluators view him as a part-time catcher, not a 120-130 g. catcher

    Hard to evaluate him as that when he’s never caught 100 games

  121. jmills November 24th, 2012 at 7:50 am

    Hi blake, you’re up early too. I had temptations to start calling friends around here but I’m giving them a break.

    Let’s see how long Ichiro lasts in this league. Molitar and Winfield are yardsticks for me, man did those guys carried it on!

    I didn’t know Napoli was so inexperienced.

  122. jmills November 24th, 2012 at 7:54 am

    ” Carry it on ” – early morning blunder, mind you I’m given to it it any instant.

  123. jmills November 24th, 2012 at 7:55 am

    Double ” it ” …….I need coffee! :)

  124. 86w183 November 24th, 2012 at 8:59 am

    Morning all —–

    quiet here today.

    Nice to know Al-Yankzeera will maintain it’s editorial approach.

    This should be decision day for Pettitte and maybe Rivera too. Yanks don’t need to spend over $ 20 M on those two.

    Amazing how few players have done deals thus far this off-season.

  125. austinmac November 24th, 2012 at 9:14 am

    86w183,

    As slow here as the hot stove is cold. Next week, the Yankees need clarity with Pettitte and Rivera as the winter meetings approach. Ichiro is great as a 4th outfielder, but I hope they add some more pop in RF. Not counting on it.

  126. jmills November 24th, 2012 at 9:18 am

    Hi 86 – hard not to want Pettitte and Rivera back at it. I still want the Jays to add Marcum regardless of starts numbered. Romero is the only one who somewhat finised last season and I think he lost more consecutive decisions for Toronto than Underwood ( Pat or Tom I can’t remember but the one we had got traded to you I do think )in the late seventies. Fortunately for Ricky, a lot of people around these parts are out of touch.

    Chris Chambliss was a Jay for a day.

  127. jmills November 24th, 2012 at 9:20 am

    ” Finished ” – sorry folks, I’m going to make you ill over your morning eggs if I continue.

  128. blake November 24th, 2012 at 9:38 am

    An Ichiro/Ross platoon would be good….Ross could play some for Gardner and Granderson too and DH a lot….he’d play almost every day…..

    I wish they could do something bigger but if they can’t then that’d be pretty good…..

  129. MTU November 24th, 2012 at 9:47 am

    Happy post-Thanksgiving morning.

    Winter meetings coming.

    Better get on the stick Cashman.

  130. MTU November 24th, 2012 at 9:59 am

    Here’s a little rhyme :

    Take a peek of the coming week.

    Andy and Mo and away we go.

    :)

  131. MTU November 24th, 2012 at 10:00 am

    Apparently Mr. Suzuki really wants to play for the Yankees again.

  132. MTU November 24th, 2012 at 10:06 am

    OK. I know when I’m not wanted.

    Catch you all later.

    :)

  133. Tar November 24th, 2012 at 10:29 am

    Good Morning everyone.

    Curious what you guys think Andy should get for a 1yr deal? How about Mo?

  134. The Genius Maker November 24th, 2012 at 10:34 am

    Montero is a DH who did not hit…not too valuable. Of course we do expect him to have power and hit better, the bottom line is he did not have an OBP of even .300 or a slug above .400. That is weak.

    Kuroda signing was a great one for the Yankees; got him for one year at market value.

    the Yanks are making a mistake if the sign Ichiro; he is not a good player any more no matter how much people want to think he is. While with us he was decent/good, but I don’t think the 230 AB’s with us is an indicative of his playing ability as the prior 1800 AB’s, especially when you consider he will be 39 next year and his game was mostly predicated on speed. Ichiro walked only 5 times in all those AB’s with us…I don’t like that part of his game…in fact I hate it. the Yanks go well when they wear down pitchers and I don;t want guys who take away from that ability as a team to do it. First pitch outs kill a team.

    Ichiro had 2 straight years as the worst every day player in the majors…at 39 I am not expecting production so unless he is 2 mil a year I pass.

  135. Tar November 24th, 2012 at 10:55 am

    “Ichiro had 2 straight years as the worst every day player in the majors”

    I understand not wanting him going forward, but I feel this is an exaggeration. By what measurement was he the “worse every day player”?


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