Pirates reportedly willing to offer Martin three years
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Nov 29, 2012 
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The Pirates could be a serious challenger for Russell Martin.
Previous reports have linked Pittsburgh to the two-year Yankees catcher, and George King has offered details, writing that the Pirates recently increased their offer from two years up to three.
“They know they have pay a little more and go a little longer,” King’s source said.
If the Yankees are willing to go three years with Martin, it could be a real indication that they no longer believe Austin Romine can be a legitimate everyday catcher. Three years would basically bridge the gap until — if all goes well — Gary Sanchez will be ready for the big leagues.
Cashmoney says:
November 29, 2012 at 12:29 pm
It warms my heart to think of a potential reunion of AJ and Martin…. those soft and yet firm hands framing every hellacious offerings dealt by a grizzled AJ. Two veterans with bountiful playoff experience leading the charge for a young and exciting core group of junior bucs into territory unknown. The prospect of that is almost too good to even think too far… It’s a wonder story if it comes true.
—-
Yankees getting outbid by the Pirates. We’re through the looking-glass here, people.
Ugh, damn you Chad! (Just kidding, love you babe! MWAH!!) :*
Repost:
Shame Spencer November 29th, 2012 at 1:22 pm
Maine – Like others you miss the point of ‘being great’…
‘Being great’ is a state of mind. I don’t think Mariah Carey is actually great. But she believes she is.
It’s an easy mistake to make.
If Martin signs with the Pirates, he’ll probably get traded back to the Yankees at the deadline.
I hope the Yanks make Martin some kinda offer, even if it is a Hal Low Ball Special. Minus a Yankee offer of Any kind, Rusty would have No choice but to go elsewhere. Yanks have gotta make him walk away, rather than Force him to leave.
Like him or not, Martin has a lot of power, handles the pitchers well, and the Yankees need someone to play every day. If they let him slip, they’ll need to make a deal for someone else. I’d rather take a chance for 3 years with Martin.
I like Martin, and given the options out there he might be the best. However, there is no way I’d be willing to give him 3yr/25mm. I’d be fine with a Romine/Cervelli combo for this year.
3 years? Pass
Wonder when the Dodgers will offer Martin 9 years to come home
Mike in Harrisburg says:
November 29, 2012 at 1:22 pm
Yankees getting outbid by the Pirates. We’re through the looking-glass here, people.
Hey they already took a salary dump from the Yanks last year
I’m really not worried about losing Martin if that ends up being the case. I like Martin to an extent but that extent ends well before what the Pirates seem to want to give him, ANYWAYS.
repost:
Can Rihanna get any mention in the land of pop culture/MLB comparisons… I for one would like the Yankees to “Shine Bright Like a Diamond” this year.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8pmHntH7II
blake November 29th, 2012 at 1:33 pm
Wonder when the Dodgers will offer Martin 9 years to come home
———————
They will, so he can be their super-BUC/catching instructor. And then they’ll sign Napoli and AJ to tag-team the season.
The Dodgers are on a rampage!!!
It would be a good thing if the Pirates “steal” Martin for 3 years. I don’t want that dude anymore, he’s terrible
Hey they already took a salary dump from the Yanks last year.
Pirates are (indirectly perhaps) using the money the Yanks paid them to take Burnett to now outbid them on Martin. How ironic – and how stupid.
The Dodgers did Not even offer Martin arbitration back when he had hip surgery, which made signing Martin and Not losing a draft pick, attractive to the Yanks. I’m Not sure Martin would return to the Dodgers, even if they made a decent offer, after the way they treated him previously.
2011: .237/.324/.408
2012: .211/.311/.403
Why would anyone give this player a 3 year deal? He’s not good at all
As long as I never have to hear this guy being compared to Thurman Munson again don’t care where he goes.
And the Yankees def should have made the QO on Martin.
How interested would the Pirates be if they had to give up a draft pick?
Patrick says:
November 29, 2012 at 1:39 pm
It would be a good thing if the Pirates “steal” Martin for 3 years. I don’t want that dude anymore, he’s terrible
He’s not terrible…..he’s just not enough better than a back up to give him a multi yea deal with the budget so tight…..the old Yankees could over pay for marginally better players …the new Yankees cannot
LGY says:
November 29, 2012 at 1:45 pm
And the Yankees def should have made the QO on Martin.
Everyone said me and JF were nuts for suggesting this a month ago
Just start Cervelli at C, he’s probably less than a win worse than Martin. Spend the money elsewhere
I still say you’re nuts.
I guess looking back, we should have realized how weak the catching market would have been this off season…
Martin woulda taken the QO inna heart beat. That’s obvious, as he let’s the Only offer we hear about sit on the table.
Then again, this is the same group of people that was subjected to actually watching Martin play for a full year… I’d balk at the QO too.
Sad news reading through the past few threads and learning of GB7′s passing.
RIP GB7.
http://riveraveblues.com/2012/.....aff-79732/
“I think 2012 was Girardi’s worst year as Yankees’ manager. Every manager makes questionable in-game moves during the season, but I felt Girardi made more this year than he had in any year since 2008…”
Opinions of how well Girardi did this year are all over the board. There doesn’t really seem to be a general consensus one way or the other. I’ve read many different takes so far.
Maybe the Yanks are trying to play their Yankee-angle.. like.. ‘dont you wanna play for a contendah, Russ?!’
Situation is this: Yankees have to take a risk that Romine can be an everyday catcher and produce or the team can take a risk on Martin. Signing him for 3 years and paying him all
that money.
There is no easy answer here folks.
Girardi wasn’t bad in 2012 at all… He doesn’t have great tools right now.
He’s does manage to get a lot out of what might normally be considered extra parts.. especially in the pen. Girardi only worries me when the team can’t hit and it forces him to be ‘strategic’.
Martin woulda taken the QO inna heart beat. That’s obvious, as he let’s the Only offer we hear about sit on the table
——–
Great. Then the Yankees would have the catching position set for 2013 and bought an extra year to evaluate Romine.
What I’d really like the Yankees to do is trade for Joe Mauer.. but we know they can’t afford that as absurd as it sounds.
I’d start Cervelli at C, sign a backup. Gives you another year to hope that Romine, Sanchez, Murphy, etc progress.
WTP – Do they have to take that risk, already? Why not tandem Stewie and Cervi and then call up Romine after giving him some time to establish himself again after a tough season last year. Either way you’re absolutely right.. neither option is ideal. Not even a little bit. But if Martin goes elsewhere, I dunno that it means Romine is our starting catcher on opening day.
Can we treat the catching position like we treat the bullpen lol??? Can Girardi gear up for us?!
Just how many teams are in need of a backstop??? There may be few free agent catchers, but there also Very few teams that really need one, and especially one with Martin’s resume. Hope some day this Blog can get together for a game of poker. I’ll supply the barrels to get you home.
$ 13.3 M for one year of Russell Martin would be an absurd overpay. There are plenty of guys out there who would take less than that for one year and be every bit as good/bad.
Pierzinski would probaby take that right now and would be a beter choice/fit since every Catcher in the organization is a RH hitter.
If the Pirates want to give him $ 25 M for three years let ‘em. right now a RF bat is the higher priority since great offense behind the plate is highly unlikely
Shame
The image of Cervelli/Stewie/Whiteside/ or anybody else in that mix getting AB’s during the regular season is frightening. Talk about an automatic out.
Martin for 3 years-I guess it could be worse. See my previous sentence.
I think 2 years ago the Yankees thought Romine was the catcher of the future and who could argue that? His injury in 2012 basically set him back one season and raised a lot of
question marks.
Joe Mauer ain’t worth a salary of $20 Mill +, and besides, he is No longer a full-time catcher.
LGY November 29th, 2012 at 1:53 pm
Martin woulda taken the QO inna heart beat. That’s obvious, as he let’s the Only offer we hear about sit on the table
——–
Great. Then the Yankees would have the catching position set for 2013 and bought an extra year to evaluate Romine.
—
Yeah, for what he should make for 2 years. The Yankees have a budget in 2013, paying Martin and extra 6-7 mil means 6-7 mil less to spend elsewhere. You seem to think that 2013 money doesn’t matter.
$ 13.3 M for one year of Russell Martin would be an absurd overpay
——-
Well yeah but that’s exactly how the Yankees should be operating.
Use their financial advantage to overpay on short term deals and exploit the market.
Joe Mauer ain’t worth a salary of $20 Mill +, and besides, he is No longer a full-time catcher.
—
He’s still a premium player. In the old days before this BS budget the Yanks would definitely be asking about him.
The Pirate offer is pretty much what the Yanks offered Martin a year ago. This should tell you guys something. “Hello, McFly”?
jacksquat says:
November 29, 2012 at 1:48 pm
I still say you’re nuts.
“$ 13.3 M for one year of Russell Martin would be an absurd overpay”
Not by the market….
The discussion is about Martin and filling the Yankee catcher spot. Mauer need Not apply.
Warning Track Power November 29th, 2012 at 1:59 pm
Shame
The image of Cervelli/Stewie/Whiteside/ or anybody else in that mix getting AB’s during the regular season is frightening. Talk about an automatic out.
—
Cervelli is not an automatic out. He has average about .270 avg .340 obp in the majors, he just doesn’t have much homerun power (he’d probably still hit 5-10 as a primary catcher). The only question with Cervelli is his defense. And that means Girardi won’t want him, he’d rather have a guy hit .140 as long as he threw out 30%.
Martin was aiming for 4/40 right?
Highly doubt he takes the QO. It was well worth the risk especially since they need a catcher in 2013.
The discussion is about Martin and filling the Yankee catcher spot. Mauer need Not apply.
—
Mauer still catches 50% of the games his team plays.
He need not apply b/c the money owed him, not his position. Get a clue bro
Just how many full-time catchers are making better than $13 Mill per??? Come on now.
he image of Cervelli/Stewie/Whiteside/ or anybody else in that mix getting AB’s during the regular season is frightening. Talk about an automatic out.
——
Cervelli posted 359 and 324 OBP respectively in 10 and 11 in about a full season worth of catching… martin 324 and 311, whose the more automatic out?
13.3 million for one year and you have a catcher….vs the other options which are 3/30 for Martin or having no catcher at all
Cervelli posted 359 and 324 OBP respectively in 10 and 11 in about a full season worth of catching… martin 324 and 311, whose the more automatic out?
—
Martin. He’s really bad, let him go play for the Pirates
DONNYBROOK says:
November 29, 2012 at 2:06 pm
Just how many full-time catchers are making better than $13 Mill per??? Come on now.
That doesn’t matter….supply and demand….bunches of teams need a catcher and Martin is one of the few starting quality catchers in existence
or having no catcher at all
—-
you means vs what i think might a slight downgrade in the forms olivo, shoppach, soto or even barajas at a fraction of price? I don’t get martin or absolute bust theory.
It seems Romine’s ceiling quite similar to where Martin is at now. There is no sense in taking that risk. Martin has to be locked up.
“Cervelli posted 359 and 324 OBP respectively in 10 and 11 in about a full season worth of catching… martin 324 and 311, whose the more automatic out?”
Cervelli is a terrible defender….which is why he couldn’t even make the team as a back up
if the yanks really want to keep it down to 189 in 2014…then you can not have money tied up to guys like russell martin.
right now, the contracts of arod + tex are killing us. you can dole out 20 mil deals but only if they are the top players in the game. and neither guy is.
maybe cano will be worth it but for how long? 3-4 years?
I believe some of the Pro Martin posters are actually Cashman in disguise. That would be the Only explanation for this love-fest.
“you means vs what i think might a slight downgrade in the forms olivo, shoppach, soto or even barajas at a fraction of price? I don’t get martin or absolute bust theory.”
Id rather cobble something together than give Martin 3 years…..but Id rather over pay Martin for a year than to have a patchwork ? Behind the plate……which is why I was in favor of making him the QO
Doesn’t matter what Martin asked for, that’s just a bargaining position. The best offer on the table is reportedly 3/22. That’s 7 mil AAV. He would have snapped up 13.3 in a heartbeat.
“if the yanks really want to keep it down to 189 in 2014…then you can not have money tied up to guys like russell martin.
No you cannot
If Martin took the 13.3 million fine…..you have him for 1 year and you say buh bye after that……beats putting 7 -10 million on the 2014 books when they’ll have less money to spend
- BLAKE -
Your the guy that brought up “the market”. There is No market for catchers. NO team is beating the bushes for a catcher at $13.3 Mill
bdog375 November 29th, 2012 at 2:08 pm
It seems Romine’s ceiling quite similar to where Martin is at now. There is no sense in taking that risk. Martin has to be locked up.
———————————————–
Cashman is stuck between a rock and a hard place
“Your the guy that brought up “the market”. There is No market for catchers. NO team is beating the bushes for a catcher at $13.3 Mill”
Lots of teams need catching help….what are you talking about
Martin was not taking a one year offer.
Athletes prefer long term security.
blake November 29th, 2012 at 2:09 pm
“Cervelli posted 359 and 324 OBP respectively in 10 and 11 in about a full season worth of catching… martin 324 and 311, whose the more automatic out?”
Cervelli is a terrible defender….which is why he couldn’t even make the team as a back up
—
The only thing I would say is terrible is his 14% CS% for two years. He was better previous to that (43% in 2009) and he threw out 30% again in the minors this year (his avg down there is 34%). I don’t know what happened to him those two 14% years, but it might not be permanent.
The Yankees already offered Martin a 3 yr. deal.
And he rejected it.
I think they should let Martin go unless he will take a one year deal and then just get the best back up they can to go with Romine
Not sure about the rest of you, but can we all agree
that A.J. from the White Sox is also not the answer for the Yankees
1)He’s left handed
2)Bad rep won’t work in the Yankees clubhouse
russel martin is being offered 7 or 8 or more millions of dollars per year on a 3 year deal, how can you say there is no catcher’s market? that’s absurd.
“The only thing I would say is terrible is his 14% CS% for two years”
He’s all over the place back there….I would bet the pitchers don’t like throwing to him…..
And like blake said if he took it that’s fine!
Cashman would have probably wasted that extra money on a LOOGY or something and Hal should have been willing to expand the budget if they could get Martin for one year.
Your the guy that brought up “the market”. There is No market for catchers. NO team is beating the bushes for a catcher at $13.3 Mill
—
Yeah, this is wrong.
Joe Mauer makes $23 mill per year. Yadier Molina just signed a deal that pays him $15 mill per year (and it was a team friendly deal). Miguel Montero is making 12 million AAV and he is way underpaid.
The rest of the good catchers haven’t hit FA yet. Buster Posey will make >$20 mill per year when he hits FA. Ruiz will make >$13.3 mill in his next deal. Brian McCann is going to make mad bank when he hits FA.
There are only about 20 or so legit big league quality starting catchers alive on earth…..when there are 30 teams that makes a big market for them
13.3 million for one year and you have a catcher….vs the other options which are 3/30 for Martin or having no catcher at all
*************************************************************************
No, it’s between $ 13.3 M for Russell Martin and $ 500 K for Cervelli or Stewart. I would think there are plenty of options that would fall in between.
Even though $ 189 doesn’t kick in until 2014, there’s no indication the payroll is going to soar well beyond $ 210 this year so the one year $$$ still matters.
blake November 29th, 2012 at 2:18 pm
“The only thing I would say is terrible is his 14% CS% for two years”
He’s all over the place back there….I would bet the pitchers don’t like throwing to him…..
—
That can be fixed, quickly, if it’s true.
WTP-
No we can’t.
Sorry.
But it doesn’t matter anyway because he’s probably going back to the Sox.
Martin is being offered basically what the Yanks offered him a yr ago. That aint a market, that’s stagnation.
The catching position in MLB is extremely top heavy …..you have a handful of studs (posey, Mauer, Wieters) ….then a big drop off to a group of guys that are ok regulars…..then you have a smaller drop to all the back ups
We are all focused on the 2014 budget but as previous years have shown, Hal has a budget even without the cap issues. You cannot spend $13.3 million for 1 year of Martin when the next best option is $500k – 1 million and is less than a win difference.
Blake and LGY, 13.3 mil in 2013 is not fine, it means less money spent elsewhere. The Yankees still have a budget in 2013 even if it’s not as low as 189 yet.
If the Yankees thought Cervelli could play, he wouldn’t have spent all season in the minors, and, incidentally, not playing well. Romine didn’t hit well in the minorrs or the AFL.
Replace Martin cheaply. Replace them all cheaply. It only matters in wins and losses.
Count on AROD and Teixiera bouncing back. They have only declined the past four years. Too short a sample size.
The team’s solution for a RH bat will be Hairston, if he will take one year. Of course, he has had one good or semi-good year in his career as a backup.
So when Martin is one of the 3-4 best catchers in baseball he’ll be worth $ 13.3 M.
Call me when that happens.
What makes me sick is that this is the NYY and we are constantly talking about a mediocre Russell Martin. If the Yankees give this guy more than 2 years I am done with them and my entire family is die hard lifelong yankee fans.
I am sick of this BS with the yankees .. man how the mighty have fallen.
I’d much rather have a Cervelli platoon then deal with this delusional “I am a 1rst round pick” player. Please just let Pirates have him. Please please please! Anybody but Martin!
I have said and still believe the 2013 payroll will be a partial reduction aimed toward 2014 so it isn’t obvious they are cutting $40 million.
Mac-
I think the Steins are selling down the road.
They’ll do just enough to fatten the cow to make it look attractive to potential buyers.
No more. No less.
So when Martin is one of the 3-4 best catchers in baseball he’ll be worth $ 13.3 M.
—
There are 7 guys I’d feel somewhat comfortable paying $13.3 million or more on a long term deal. Posey, Molina, Ruiz, Mauer, Montero, Weiters and McCann.
Then there are a few that might be in that spot within 1-2 seasons: A.J. Ellis, Jonathan Lucroy, Carlos Santana. Salvador Perez and Grandal show some potential as well.
Then there are probably like a dozen more catchers that could start but I wouldn’t sign for more than 1-2 years and simply aren’t that good.
Count on AROD and Teixiera bouncing back. They have only declined the past four years. Too short a sample size.
—-
LOL – Arod has the mentality as a meager mouse and Tex has no idea what happened to his ability to hit .300 and aims to “hit 30hr and 100RBI” regardless of address.
It’s obvious too me that our multimillionaire men are so lost that the mental part of their game is next to nil. There the little train that could but never get to teh top — “i think i can, I think I can, I think i can – strike 3 your out” Doh gee boss they got me!
“That can be fixed, quickly, if it’s true.”
Not always
“Martin is being offered basically what the Yanks offered him a yr ago. That aint a market, that’s stagnation.”
==============================
i disagree with you alot donny but usually what you say make sense. this is garage.
jacksquat says:
November 29, 2012 at 2:23 pm
Blake and LGY, 13.3 mil in 2013 is not fine, it means less money spent elsewhere. The Yankees still have a budget in 2013 even if it’s not as low as 189 yet.
When you’re screaming at Stewie all summer I’ll remind you of this conversation.
There wasn’t a single player that took the qualifying offer this year…..Martin may have….but I think there is a good chance he would have passed to try for a long term deal (which he will probably get)
I would have over paid him for a year because catcher is an important position and you want to try to avoid garbage there if you can help it……but I wouldn’t go beyond one year for the marginally better production that Martin will bring
I don’t want Stewie (maybe as backup), I said Cervelli is not a terrible last resort option. He can hit ok, his defense is suspect. And he’s young and cheap!
Chad believes the Yankees will re-sign Cano. I don’t see how that can work. Add him to AROD, Tex and CC and it will be about $100M. That gives them a 3B/DH, a 2B, A SP and a 1B. They must add 36 more players for $70 million. A number of their players on the roster will either leave or significantly eat into the payroll, particularly Hughes.
Chad says they will still spend. Yes, but they could not spend for anyone who would eat up much of their remaining limit. Think small market spending. Very small market.
$70M is Kansas City’s payroll. That equalizes things except for those four players. Considering two of them are declining, that is not a pretty position.
Just think blake, if they went with Cervelli, they might be able to put HAMILTON in RF.
jacksquat says:
November 29, 2012 at 2:39 pm
Just think blake, if they went with Cervelli, they might be able to put HAMILTON in RF.
I would deal with Cervelli if I thought they’d use money elsewhere…..they’ll pocket it though
Most of the 40-man not on the 25 makes peanuts, so saying stuff like they would have only 70 mil for 36 players is deceptive.
I know this is a silly question but if a player like Big Hairy Monster XYZ for example was willing to take a salary like…
year 1 – 35 mil
year 2 – 1 mil
year 3 – 22 mil
etc…
Is that allowed or is there restrictions form doing that ? I am wondering if the yankees can still sign an expensive player that doesn’t screw up their tax goals in 2014 .. somebody that knows how contracts work please explain… please don’t tell me thats not going to happen either I am well aware it won’t. it is hypothetical, I am just wondering if its possible to do that.
MTU,
I do suspect they are selling and reducing liabilities for the new owner.
As far as Martin goes, replace him on the cheap, but use the savings to add a good player. I think they would pocket it as a starting point to 2014. They really can’t get a very good player if they won’t pay him in 2014.
for the luxury tax mlb uses the average annual salary of a contract not each year’s total. so you can pay a guy that way but you dont get any advantage from doing so.
didn’t some nhl team try to sign a guy to a 30 year contract at like $1M per year to get around the cap and the league nixed the deal?
Martin made 7.5 million last year. Paying a 6 milliom premium to have him for 1 year that doesn’t affect 2014 is fine.
They aren’t spending that money anywhere else anyways. Who are we going to bring in? Anyone who would affect the budget is going to want multiple years. Swisher & Soriano are off the books and they took up ~23 million. That money is getting eaten up by Kuroda & Pettitte’s raises, but there is enough left for Martin’s premium. And the rest isn’t being spent on anyone.
Mac-
If Martin is too pricey adios.
I prefer they trade for what they need because they do not want to spend.
They’re walking a tightrope. Trying to keep cost down while at the same time staying competitive.
Not sure they can pull it off. Tend to doubt it.
Martin costs too much ….let Hal keep the money and lets play Stewie!!!!
For whatever reason, the Yanks are down on Cervelli, so I do Not believe he should even be in the discussion about who catches in place of Martin. If it’s me, I get a journeyman and immediately make Romine his caddy. Short of that, I hit SD up about Grandal.
@mlbbowman: B.J. Upton said he and his brother Justin Upton have had a few conversations about possibility of playing together in Atlanta.
I think if the braves can get Justin then they should even if it meant parting with Simmons…..I like Simmkns and SSs are hard to find but I don’t really see him as an all star or anything….
..adding J Upton to Heyward and the rest would potentiallyake their offense so potent that they could play Jeff Blauser at SS and be fine
Count me in the Cervelli/Stewart and see what Romine does camp.
I think there are valid, strong economic arguments to be made for this, as well as the fact that I’d rather see Cervelli get another shot and see what Romine can produce.
Get Soto or somebody and just play Romjne…..if they are gonna punt catcher then do it with somebody that might get better
Blake-
“I like Simmkns and SSs are hard to find but I don’t really see him as an all star or anything….”
Then why would Towers give JU up for him ?
They might even be able to pry Andrus lose in return.
Much better.
Martin is a career .260 hitter.
The problem is his average has dropped every year since 2007:
2007 .293
2008 .280
2009 .250
2010 .248
2011 .237
2012 .211
If you go by the stats, he’ll be a sub .200 hitter next year. Do we really want to commit $30 million over the next three years to a player like that? The market – or lack of it – is making a silk purse out of sow’s ear.
“Then why would Towers give JU up for him ?”
Cause he is pretty good…. He’s a young SS that should be at least a solid regular and Towers could control him a long time…..
I would just consider that deal if I were the braves because Upton and Heyward back to back could be unreal and also because the braves have Nick Ahmed coming who is a pretty good SS prospect also
No, it is not deceptive. The numbers are real. Add four starters at least, a SS, closer, the rest of the bullpen, CF, and RF. Yes, get them all cheaply.
I’d match a 3 year offer to Russell. Handling $60 million of pitching deserves a skilled hand.
Three years gives plenty time to see how much Romine’s back can handle, let him learn the staff, raise his deficiencies in throwing or hitting. Besides, good support there can mean well pitched games all week, every week; and getting beat up every day wears on ‘em.
“They might even be able to pry Andrus lose in return.”
If I were the Rangers I would keep Andrus….play Prodar at 2B and move Kinsler to the OF
IMO the Yankees should be concentrating more on their OF.
They have some possiblities for C w/o Martin.
Unless of course you think GGBG, Grandy, and Ichiro is good enough.
“..adding J Upton to Heyward and the rest would potentiallyake their offense so potent that they could play Jeff Blauser at SS and be fine”
——————————————————–
or justin and bj could play like last year and have blauser outhit both of them.
Blake-
Nunez can be a solid regular too if he’s given enough reps at SS.
Towers isn’t trading for him is he ?
“or justin and bj could play like last year and have blauser outhit both of them.”
BJ was almost a 30-30 guy and Blauser is probably 50 years old by now
Blake-
Can Kinsler play OF well ?
Again, a lotta people on this Blog overlook Nunez and his trade value.
Blauser was a decent hitter??? He’d be a top 5 short stop probably in this day and age.
If J Upton hits like last year the first 2 bits of his line look like: .280 .355 which is awesome. He was only missing some power due to his shoulder. He is a great guy to have.
Jerkface November 29th, 2012 at 2:50 pm
Martin made 7.5 million last year. Paying a 6 milliom premium to have him for 1 year that doesn’t affect 2014 is fine.
They aren’t spending that money anywhere else anyways
—
How do you know?
6-7 mil could pay for Soria. Overpay it to Martin, no Soria. It could mean a big difference in what they do in RF.
“Nunez can be a solid regular too if he’s given enough reps at SS.”
Much less likely to be than Simmons IMO
you have a handful of studs (posey, Mauer, Wieters)
*******
Yadier wants to fight you in the playground at 3:00 – be there – - – -
They do.
He’s fast. He can hit. And I think his fielding can improve signifcantly with sufficient reps.
Again, a lotta people on this Blog overlook Nunez and his trade value.
******
Unfortuntaley for the Yanks alotta people also includes a good chunck of baseball – - – -
austinmac November 29th, 2012 at 3:05 pm
No, it is not deceptive. The numbers are real. Add four starters at least, a SS, closer, the rest of the bullpen, CF, and RF. Yes, get them all cheaply.
—
It is deceptive. You make it sound like they will only have 2 mil players otherwise. 15 guys will make peanuts or close to it, several more on the 25 will make league min or close to it. You make it sound like they will have 4 good players and crap, which is not the case.
Blake-
Does Simmons have Nunez’s speed, and baserunning ability ?
Don’t think so.
November 29, 2012 at 3:08 pm
Again, a lotta people on this Blog overlook Nunez and his trade value.
There isn’t a great market for 25 year old SSs who can’t really play defense at a big league level
How do you know?
6-7 mil could pay for Soria. Overpay it to Martin, no Soria. It could mean a big difference in what they do in RF.
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Well if they don’t sign anyone good for RF we’ll know. Their mindset for 2014 is multi-year deal bad. It is their first priority. What good players are they going to acquire for RF in 2013 that beat that priority? I don’t think Martin would have accepted the QO, and if he did it wasn’t really a negative. It is the same reason I would have offered it to Soriano, and the Yankees managed to see that one right.
I don’t think they should sign Soria for 6 million for 1 year. If they are going to sign him they need to have some options for 2014 or later.
I don’t think Nunez has much trade value, although I do think he could be good if he got a chance to play more consistently.
Why sign Soria for 1 year when you can probably just sign Uehara for 1 year? Or Fujikawa for the same amount but for multiple years?
“Does Simmons have Nunez’s speed, and baserunning ability ?”
He hit .289 as a rookie and most importantly can play SS at a big league level …..that’s the huge difference
c’mon now guys, bowden’s joke about blauser wasnt serious in the first place so obviously neither was my tag-on joke.
Blake-
Nunez’s problems are mostly footwork.
He sometimes rushes throws.
His arm is strong and he has great range.
It’s those very things that get him into trouble.
Better coaching might help.
The tools are there.
Sweeny Murti on Francesa now. Hope Mike manages to stay awake this time.
“Yadier wants to fight you in the playground at 3:00 – be there – – – -”
Those were just 3….didn’t mean the only 3
Soriano and Martin were not the same situations. Soria rep’d by Boras who definitely was going to think 3 to 4 years at 12-15 per. He was nearly a sure thing to reject the qual offer.
Martin was not going to get anywhere near 13 mil/year, and he knows it. He’s asking for 4/40, but so far the best, and only known offer is 3/22.
Those were just 3….didn’t mean the only 3
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Now that we have cleared up (use of etc. inserted) – - – -
Jerkface November 29th, 2012 at 3:13 pm
Why sign Soria for 1 year when you can probably just sign Uehara for 1 year? Or Fujikawa for the same amount but for multiple years?
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Soria was just an example, thought that was obvious. I like Uehara also.
Nunez Refused to bow-out vs Verlander in the 9th in the ALCS. He was the Yankee offense in that series. If you believe that was overlooked by MLB front offices, you probably also believe Martin woulda rejected the $13.3 Mill.
“Nunez’s problems are mostly footwork.”
I agree but a lot of it is natural….and he’s getting up their in age for a prospect….I agree he could possibly get better with regular playing time but teams aren’t going to give up a lot for a project…Towers wants a guy that can step in and play SS right now….not somebody that might could a year from now
Soria rep’d by Boras
*Soriano*
Knew I would screw that up eventually.
Yea, and those 3 catchers listed are not All making $13.3 per.
If you believe that was overlooked by MLB front offices
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If Nunez is a major league SS with offense – that gets you Uptonish type possibilities – I don’t see that yet – until then – then Nunez is something a little less – at least as a SS that the league is fawning over – - – like a Simmons – - – -
bj upton career ops: .758
jeff blauser career ops: .760
Blake-
Put Nunez out there on a regular basis with good coaching and I think he does well.
No need to wait. Just coach him at the ML level and giving more playing time.
He’s another guy who I think is being undervalued.
By the way, that does not mean I wouldn’t move him because I would.
We have other options.
im nunez’s value to the yankees is alot higher than what anyone would give them for him. hang on to him and use him.
I’m fine with no Martin, but it must be understood, he did provide far more offense than his successor will. Therefore, they must make it up somewhere along with Swisher’s. Giving up 45 homers gives up a large part of what the team tries to do. What is that, roughly 20% of the team’s total?
I’m sorry, but I just can’t get on board with the idea AROD and Tex will rebound significantly.
“Blauser was a decent hitter??? He’d be a top 5 short stop probably in this day and age.”
I meant Jeff Blauser right now! With an Upton, Upton, Heyward outfield and the rest of that team it wouldn’t matter
Blauser would definately be a top SS now….the position is so bad
Too many people buy into the Yankee clap trap about Nunez and his defense. Saying Nunez issa “project” is a gross exagerration. He’s a young player that the Yanks jerked around. MLB teams realize this, and come Monday, they are gonna inquire as to his status.
Yea, what’s the SS Market currently. $15 Mill per???
DONNYBROOK says:
November 29, 2012 at 3:19 pm
Yea, and those 3 catchers listed are not All making $13.3 per.
Posey would get 25 if he was a FA
“Too many people buy into the Yankee clap trap about Nunez and his defense. Saying Nunez issa “project” is a gross exagerration”
Have you watched him the last two years at all?
“Put Nunez out there on a regular basis with good coaching and I think he does well.”
Maybe….but when you’re talking about trade value….you’re not getting a lot back for a maybe….I think he’d have some value….but not as a key piece for Justin Upton…..if he could be then he’s already be on his way to Arizona by now
Save the shoulda, woulda, coulda. We were talking about the supposed Catching Market, and whether Martin’s $13.3 offer reflected that. Obviously, based on what the top catchers are currently being paid, $13.3 for Martin is ridiculous.
Soriano may be repped by Boras, but Martin has an inflated sense of ego about himself. I’d see him declining a QO. He is the guy that thinks he is a first round pick type of talent.
Blake-
Who said anything about Nunez being a “key” piece ?
Part of a package is more like it.
And who said it has to be the Snakes ?
You feeling me ?
Obviously, based on what the top catchers are currently being paid, $13.3 for Martin is ridiculous.
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Mauer 23 aav, Molina 15 AAV, Montero 12 AAV. Wieters & Posey aren’t free agents yet. Martin vs these guys is probably an 8 or 9 or 10 AAV catcher. That is why you are paying a premium to keep the deal to 1 year.
1 year deal = best for the Yankees right now, best for the kind of player Martin is, and potentially saves you money down the road. You can throw away 8 million 3 years from now on a guy that stinks or you can pay 3-6 million premium to have the guy for 1 year and wash your hands of him.
And of course Montero & Molina were extensions, not free agent market prices. Add a couple mil on there for that.
What do you think Nova or Phelps, D-Rob, Nunez, and Austin would get you ?
I think plenty. That’s some significant talent and some serious upside.
Mauer is NOT a full-time catcher.
New one —>
Mauer is NOT a full-time catcher.
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Doesn’t matter, he got paid 23 mil as a primary catcher.
nunez really screwed up last year. had he been solid defensively he would have played more games at 3b than arod and the lineup would have been better all season. it was a good plan to use him as the b/u to both jeter and arod but he just couldnt do it. its too bad.
manny machado played about 200 minor league games all at ss and then they put him at 3b for 2 games before sending him up to baltimore at 19 to start at third base in the middle of the pennant race and he did fine
I just saw the news about GB7′s passing.
Though I was most of a reader than a writer on this blog, he seemed like a genuine nice guy, and he definitely loved the Yankees. RIP GB7
Give Martin 3 years. He may surprise, knowing he’s got one more semi-lengthy contract opportunity left, [after a 3 year one] in his career, basically. If Romine can become a #1 catcher in 1-2 years, trade Martin if he is not doing so well. Martin’s ‘window’ is to prove he can hit in the next 1-2 seasons, and Romine’s ‘window’ is to stay healthy and prove he’s a #1 MLB catcher in 1-2 years. To sign Martin seems obvious to me, at this time, even considering the ‘budget’ Yankees of the future. Good teams are built ‘up the middle’, and catcher is one of those positions. I am not comfortable watching Cervelli, Stewart, and Whiteside taking cuts like a pitcher in clutch situations. At least Martin has power potential. I mean, who would you, as a manager, pick to pinch hit, runner on first, two outs, down one, bottom 10th at home, against a lefty? Martin, Stewart, Cervelli, or Whiteside? Come on!
Martin is a ‘gamer’, in my opinion. The Yankees need gamers, all teams do. So how many do we have now? Not enough….
P.S. The Yankees should NEVER give out no trade contracts again. That should become their new policy. If they had none now, we could move some dead wood much easier. We are hamstrung with no trade clauses.
manny machado played about 200 minor league games all at ss and then they put him at 3b for 2 games before sending him up to baltimore at 19 to start at third base in the middle of the pennant race and he did fine
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That is because Machado is a better defender than Nunez. At this point Nunez is what he is, a mediocre SS or nothing at all. If he plays 100% at short I think he can probably be a major league regular, but that isn’t gonna happen with the Yankees.
What is the plan for Nunez? Does he stick around to see if Jeter can play? He is too good a player to languish in AAA again. He is a guy who can hit good pitching and seem unintimidated at the plate. Unfortunately, he seems scared on the defensive side of the ball. Too much thinking.
It will be desperate and insane for the Yankees to offer Martin 3/30mm. He is slightly above average defensively and a poor average hitter. Inflated salaries and age are the current problem,with no minor leaguers ready for the show. If your going to waste money do it for AJ,two years with an team option for the third and overpay for the two. As for Sanchez,like Montero he may never be a solid defender.
Cashman and the Tampa lames are the responsible parties for the lack of prospects. And now that other teams are spending bushels of dough as well,the organization must do a better job in both the draft and International market.
Cashman and the Tampa boys should be on notice this year. Add his trades to the mix with Swisher being the only good one and why his feet are not being put to the fire escapes me.
Where is the head scratching over the ridiculous contract given to Pettitte?
Does anyone believe a 4-3 record and a soon to be 41 year old coming off an injury could get half as much from another team?
This is but another example of the desperation and failure of the organization to develop it’s prospects. As if 12mm. were not enough,they give him “incentives to earn even more!
I guess last years paycheck wasn’t motivation enough. Forget about last year,I deserve a raise!
Next we’ll have Mo getting 15mm. for his efforts. Then we’ll have three pitchers with a combined age of 120 years making 42mm! Isn’t America a great place for some seniors!
i’ve never seen a player coming of such an abysmal year be revered by fans as is Martin. If the guy was under contract for 5 more years at a reasonable salary i wouldn’t want him back. What part of “terrible player” when describing Martin can’t people understand? Guy had one of the worst full seasons a Yankee has had in a very long time. Last years performance was nothing to write home about either. Are Yankee fans taking a cue from the front office and running scared when it comes to giving young guys a shot? I’d be willing to bet if you put Cervelli in there as a full time catcher by mid season people around here wouldn’t even remember who Martin was. I’ve never seen such an awfully performing player being so valued by fans for doing so little.
Screw it. Let’s bring back Posada. Core 4 reunion tour!