Rosenthal: Nationals land Haren
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Dec 04, 2012 
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The Nationals have added one of the market’s best risk-reward options.
According to Ken Rosenthal, the Nats have agreed to a one-year, $13-million deal with Dan Haren.
Coming off a down year, Haren was nearly traded before the Angels decided to decline his option for 2013. He’s only one year removed from a 3.17 ERA through 238.1 innings with the Angels, but there are some health concerns and his strikeout-to-walk ratio dipped considerably last season. Could be a terrific addition for the Nationals. Could be an expensive bust. I can’t help wondering if Haren might have been a fallback plan for the Yankees if they’d missed out on either Hiroki Kuroda or Andy Pettitte.
Chip December 4th, 2012 at 11:19 am
If I’m Phil’s agent and Cashman approached me my answer would be 5 years $60 – 65m. He’s younger and better than Guthrie who just got 3 years at just over 8/year.
To me the Haren signing makes me think that the Nats don’t think they’re going to bring back LaRoche. If they were bringing him back they would have filled their rotation spot by dealing Morse but they can’t deal Morse if LaRoche doesn’t re-sign.
Remember when the Yankees were trying to get Felix last off season?
… what happened to that money?
Athletics will meet today with agents for Japanese free-agent SS Hiroyuki Nakajima. Also considering trade for #Marlins’ Escobar, others.
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Yankees should look into this guy and give him a real offer not like last year…
Most players don’t live in NYC. Most live in Westchester, Conn or Jersey
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His most recent relapses took place in Tempe and Dallas, but I think you understand my point. The pressure that gets placed on stars in New York is significantly greater than anywhere in the country. I simply have doubts he has the makeup to tolerate it.
Remember when the Yankees were trying to get Felix last off season?
… what happened to that money?
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Kuroda raise, Pettitte big raise, need a 3B now, Granderson raise and on and on…
Yankees should look into this guy and give him a real offer not like last year…
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More reasons to make him a real offer than they had last year.
ac1 December 4th, 2012 at 11:23 am
Athletics will meet today with agents for Japanese free-agent SS Hiroyuki Nakajima. Also considering trade for #Marlins’ Escobar, others.
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Yankees should look into this guy and give him a real offer not like last year…
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I don’t think they’ll get a do-over
blake says:
December 4, 2012 at 11:25 am
JF,
If Arod just retired due to injury and the Yanks and he arranged a settlement where they paid him with insurances help the money he’s owed…..then does that get him off their books for the Luxury tax?
If A-rod retires, and by this I mean actually retires done from baseball retired, the Yankees will be off the hook for his salary. It essentially voids the player contract.
I don’t think that is likely, atleast for 2014. I think he will attempt to play 100% in 2013 and likely give 2014 his best shot. In which case I guess they’d be on the hook for a pro-rated portion of his contract if he ended up retiring in 2014. Then from 2015 on they’d be clear.
I love A-rod, but that would probably be the best for the Yankees.
@JimBowdenESPNxm: Dodgers fans quickly following suit of Laker fans with confidence that Robinson Cano will bring his talents to Hollywood for ’14 season @2B
Whether the team pays him with insurance money or not is irrelevant to the luxury tax. They can do whatever they want outside of baseball once A-rod retires, as long as MLB doesn’t sniff something out as being an attempt to circumvent the luxury tax (like the yankees forcing him to retire at gunpoint or something).
The Yankees would not be able to collect insurance on A-rod if he retired, because they’d no longer be obligated to pay his salary so they’d be getting back money they never spent. They can only collect insurance on players who are injured & still under contract. So every time a player misses significant time on the DL the team can potentially recoup money depending on the terms of the insurance.
JIM BOWDEN?@JimBowdenESPNxm
Dodgers fans quickly following suit of Laker fans with confidence that Robinson Cano will bring his talents to Hollywood for ’14 season @2B
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I think this too…
JF ,
I don’t think Alex would just walk away from 114 million bucks…. Which is why I was wondering if they could work out something where they paid him the money in lump sum or a portion of it to actually alllow him to retire…..and then still save the money towards the tax……
If 70% of his deal is insured then they’d only being paying 30% out of their pocket
I just can’t see Arod walking away from that much money…..
If they paid him it’d still count towards the luxury tax. If they pay him to get out of his contract, the original terms either remain the same (most likely) for luxury tax purposes which is no help or they are assuming the lump sump payment onto 2013 in which case the Steinbrenners pay a 172 million dollar lump sum which means they end up saving no money in the end even after all the rebates/luxury tax stuff because they’d be paying 50% luxury tax on the lump sum.
Cano will be gone next year as he will get $200M, likely from the Dodgers. But, we get a draft pick. How wonderful.
I have said AROD should retire with a wink, wink deal allowing him to buy a piece of the club in a year or two. The price would be $100M more favorable than one would expect.
Neither Alex nor any other person is giving up $100 million.
blake December 4th, 2012 at 11:28 am
@JimBowdenESPNxm: Dodgers fans quickly following suit of Laker fans with confidence that Robinson Cano will bring his talents to Hollywood for ’14 season @2B
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This is gonna be a fun daily routine: F*ck the Dodgers.
According to the termination agreement, even if they pay A-rod a lump sum it counts in each year of the old salary as it would normally. There is no sneaky maneuver to get out of the luxury tax. The only way they can do it is if the player forfeits the contract.
I have said AROD should retire with a wink, wink deal allowing him to buy a piece of the club in a year or two. The price would be $100M more favorable than one would expect.
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This kind of deal makes no sense to me, why would the team get out of a minor obligation by giving up ownership stake which would cover the minor obligation & more? The value of a club stake is much greater than whatever A-rod’s contract is. A-rod’s contract doesn’t make money on its own, where as the ownership stake makes profits.
blake December 4th, 2012 at 11:28 am
@JimBowdenESPNxm: Dodgers fans quickly following suit of Laker fans with confidence that Robinson Cano will bring his talents to Hollywood for ’14 season @2B
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We have to hide this from Shame.
“According to the termination agreement, even if they pay A-rod a lump sum it counts in each year of the old salary as it would normally. There is no sneaky maneuver to get out of the luxury tax. The only way they can do it is if the player forfeits the contract.”
What big he retired from his baseball contract and they offered him an ownership percentage that would pay him?
http://riveraveblues.com/2012/.....era-80066/
Here’s a nugget from Paul Hoynes, Indians beat writer extraordinaire for The Cleveland Plain-Dealer…
“The going price on [shortstop Asdrubal Cabrera] is three to four players, preferably four. The Indians had the framework of a deal in place in which they would have received one big-league pitcher and two high-level prospects. When the Indians asked for a third prospect, the deal dissolved.”
The particular team the Indians were negotiating with planned to change Cabrera’s position, but right now he’s the top shortstop available this winter through free agency or trades.
Tell me that doesn’t have the Yankees written all over it. One big league pitcher? Take your pick of Phil Hughes, Ivan Nova, and David Phelps. Two high-level prospects? Pick two, though I’m not sure if “high-level” means top prospects or guys who played at Double-A and Triple-A. Asking Cabrera to change positions? Makes sense now that Alex Rodriguez will miss the start of next season. Could be a coincidence, but the glove sure does fit.
Jerkface December 4th, 2012 at 11:38 am
According to the termination agreement, even if they pay A-rod a lump sum it counts in each year of the old salary as it would normally. There is no sneaky maneuver to get out of the luxury tax. The only way they can do it is if the player forfeits the contract.
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If this is the case, I dont see Arod leaving that much money on the table. Nobody in their right minds would do that. Nor should he.
Damn too late lol
Klapisch has an article saying AROD is likely finished as a productive player. I am afraid that is true.
He also noted others are comparing this year to 1965. I believe I have been making the comparison for some time. If anyone dares, check out the record from 1965-1973,
Someone said the other day they will enjoy watching the games irrespective of the record. No, that’s not true. I know. When your team is awful, the fun is gone.
Where is Horace Clarke now?
Dan Plesac ?@Plesac19
From all I’m hearing in the hallways of the #WinterMeetings, looks like 2 horse race for Greinke… #dodgers and #Rangers. Tx very serious.
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Thanks Dan
I don’t see the benefit of giving A-rod an ownership stake. We’re talking about the Yankees doing all this to save 100 million over 3 years. Gotta get real.
JIM BOWDEN ?@JimBowdenESPNxm
Greinke market down to 1. Dodgers 2. Angels 3. Rangers in that order with possibility of mystery team Tor?Cws?Bos?.Nats out..Braves unlikely
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I love mystery teams
JF,
They could give AROD a piece of the team valued at his unpaid contract amount. That way they wouldn’t, if they got away with it, pay any luxury tax.
I have said AROD should retire with a wink, wink deal allowing him to buy a piece of the club in a year or two. The price would be $100M more favorable than one would expect.
*************************************************************************
Yeah, there’s no way anyone in MLB would catch on to that!
I don’t think it’s inconceivable that Alex would walk away, but I can’t see it happening until 2014. He won’t go thru the surgery and re-hab without giving himself a chance to be a quality MLB player again.
If the Yanks could sign Keppinger & Chavez for something in the $ 6 M range combined that’s probably as good as they can hope to do. Keppinger has been in a utility/platoon role most of his career and he can get some PT @ SS and DH too.
This a-rod news is going to drive me crazy with people misunderstanding the CBA/everything.
Tell me that doesn’t have the Yankees written all over it. One big league pitcher? Take your pick of Phil Hughes, Ivan Nova, and David Phelps. Two high-level prospects? Pick two, though I’m not sure if “high-level” means top prospects or guys who played at Double-A and Triple-A. Asking Cabrera to change positions? Makes sense now that Alex Rodriguez will miss the start of next season. Could be a coincidence, but the glove sure does fit.
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Those could be Yankee fingerprints. However, could also be the Braves looking at using Cabrera at 3B and moving Prado back to LF.
Against All Odds December 4th, 2012 at 11:42 am
Damn too late lol
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I appreciate your concern! It was a worthy attempt.. but the Dodgers are trying to be great. Nothing can shield me from it!
JF,
Anything to make them spend money on the team again
They could give AROD a piece of the team valued at his unpaid contract amount. That way they wouldn’t, if they got away with it, pay any luxury tax.
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It would have to be under the table, or else they’d still pay luxury tax on the value they gave him, and again why would they do that? They are giving up their own stake in a business to save 100 dollars? Why do that when they can just keep paying A-rod, cut payroll, and save the same 100 million + get the profit from the stake they didn’t sell???
Think like a business guy, and not like a fan who is trying to desperately get out from A-rod’s albatross to avoid the luxury tax.
Tell me that doesn’t have the Yankees written all over it. One big league pitcher? Take your pick of Phil Hughes, Ivan Nova, and David Phelps. Two high-level prospects? Pick two, though I’m not sure if “high-level” means top prospects or guys who played at Double-A and Triple-A. Asking Cabrera to change positions? Makes sense now that Alex Rodriguez will miss the start of next season. Could be a coincidence, but the glove sure does fit.
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Is Cabrera worth all that?
“Those could be Yankee fingerprints. However, could also be the Braves looking at using Cabrera at 3B and moving Prado back to LF.”
Yea I think that paragraph has a good chance to have been about either the Yankees or braves
Is Cabrera worth all that?
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No, maybe for a team wanting to play him at SS but not to move him to third.
It would be very stupid to give A-rod a piece of ownership just to get him to retire.
Yankees are on Indians Cabrera’s limited “no trade” list.
I don’t see Arod retiring anytime soon anyway….. He’s gonna try to come back
how can the Dodgers add Cano what would there payroll be going forward ?? especially if adding Greinke
Tell me that doesn’t have the Yankees written all over it
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I agree. Especially in regards to what Lost wrote about being close to a deal and then something changes to make it fall apart. Someth9ing to that effect.
I’m glad they didn’t do that deal if they were that team. Cabrera is not a difference maker and he is not a very good defensive player
how can the Dodgers add Cano what would there payroll be going forward ?? especially if adding Greinke
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The Dodgers can have a payroll around 300 million per year and still make a profit, hope this helps, bye
no trade list means nothing, just a bargaining chip on players part
Like Anyone owning a piece of the Yankees wants to take on A-Rod as a partner??? Let’s get real here.
Shame Spencer December 4th, 2012 at 11:46 am
Against All Odds December 4th, 2012 at 11:42 am
Damn too late lol
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I appreciate your concern! It was a worthy attempt.. but the Dodgers are trying to be great. Nothing can shield me from it!
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True nothing wrong with that.
Yes I tried my best Darth Queen of Team Greedy *bows*
JIM BOWDEN ?@JimBowdenESPNxm
As we all search for the possible landing spot for Free Agent closer Rafael Soriano…don’t eliminate the Dodgers just yet as a possibility
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JF don’t think they make a profit of a team that has a payroll of 300 million……..sorry….bye
This a-rod news is going to drive me crazy with people misunderstanding the CBA/everything.
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In the end, I think it’s safe to say that, for luxury tax purposes, he’s on the books thru 2017 at $27.5M per barring some fairly extraordinary circumstances.
Dodgers said they dont care about payroll or the luxury tax.
Buster Olney ?@Buster_ESPN
Rival evaluator on Drew:”There’s no way he would sign with the Yankees to be a superutility guy, or part-time 3B. He wants an everyday job.”
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GOOD!!!!!!!!!
“He also noted others are comparing this year to 1965. I believe I have been making the comparison for some time. If anyone dares, check out the record from 1965-1973,”
Until it happens, I still go on the premise that the Yankees will enter each new season as a contender … I think being in the post season every season (sans 2008 – still won 89 games) affords them the benefit of the doubt.
Heading into 2011 after Pettitte “retired”, Lee chose Philly over NY, and we went into ST with Colon and Garcia as FA invitees for the starting rotation, people were saying it would be a long year for the Yankees … they ended up having the best record in AL.
So unless the Yankees pull a Jeffrey Loria and break down the team, they need to actually show they ARE an also-ran before being perceived as one before a single pitch has been thrown for the upcoming season.
I think the Dodgers will when in the red….in the end its a business
JF don’t think they make a profit of a team that has a payroll of 300 million……..sorry….bye
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Their media deal is going to pay them 250 million per year and only 80 mil of it will be open to revenue sharing. Which means they will pocket minimum 170 million. MLB also gives each team around 50 mil per year for national TV deals, this is not applicable to revenue sharing, so thats added on there, 220. Then after revenue sharing on the 80 million they keep 52.8 million. Thats 272.8 million.
This is not even counting gate tickets, merchandise, MLBAM, food, whatever.
So yea, they can.
Dr quoted in The Post said the hip surgery Might require cutting into the bone. This aint an ingrown toe nail being removed.
ok like I said we shall see
Oh and the dodgers only pay around 8% revenue sharing in the end, so after all the money is cut up and divvied out, they are only down 8% on revenues. So add 20.8 million back on there. 293.6 million without gate, MLBAM, merchandise, stadium.
I think he’s out longer than 4-6 months I say September… remember getting back into playing shape…..and his age
The Dodgers would definately turn a total profit with a 300 million dollar payroll…..so would the Yankees most likely.
The Dodgers are gonna sign Greinke and probably Soriano too and will likely take a 230ish million dollar payroll in to 2013
Dodgers said they dont care about payroll or the luxury tax.
=============================
Spoken like a team who has NEVER paid it.
Stu,
I am not saying 1965 has to happen or will happen. I say it can. Filling in C, RF, and 3B with short term players while Jeter, AROD, TEx age and Andy, Mo, Granderson and Cano leave after 2013, how do they field a competitive team?
Do they really expect to fill 10-15 holes next year? From where?
This team and it’s holes cannot be compared to any Yankee team for many years when they now apparently won’t spend to fill them.
JF look at the Yanks… do you think they make more than the Dodgers?? ok
OAA – I reward ALL the loyal subjects!
Maybe if we just start thinking about forgetting the luxury tax enough the Yankees will do it. Like if we all stared at a tree trying to set it on fire or something..
OFF TOPIC:………….Does anyone have Apple tv?!
More from that RAB article:
“Cabrera, 27, has hit a solid .272/.335/.443 (116 wRC+) with 41 homers over the last two seasons. He’s a switch-hitter with no platoon split (115 wRC+ vs. RHP and 117 wRC+ vs. LHP since 2011) and depending on your choice of defensive metric, he’s either a slightly-above-average (DRS and FRAA) or well-below-average defender (UZR) at short with minimal experience at the hot corner (four defensive outs in 2007). The Indians signed him to a short-term extension this past April, and he’s owned $6.5M next year and $10M the year after ($8.25M average annual value for luxury tax purposes) before qualifying for free agency. With A-Rod out and Nick Swisher‘s and Russell Martin‘s offense unlikely to be fully replaced, it’s easy to see why the Yankees would have pursued Cabrera to the point where they were on the verge of a deal.
Just to be clear, this is total speculation. Hoynes reported the Indians had a deal in place that fell through, and I’m just connecting the dots. ”
http://riveraveblues.com/2012/.....era-80066/
JIM BOWDEN ?@JimBowdenESPNxm
As we all search for the possible landing spot for Free Agent closer Rafael Soriano…don’t eliminate the Dodgers just yet as a possibility
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Why eliminate the Dodgers as a possibility for anyone?
At this point they can spend whatever they want.. winning one championship over there will carry them for a decade. (Not that they even need that to continue making money hand over fist.)
Angels Moreno is gonna have to figure out how to Blunt this Dodger Blitz. He’s getting blown outta the water in the SoCal Market.
SS I have apple TV
The Dodgers will get like 160 million more dollars per year in TV money than the Yankees….I doubt the other revenue streams cover that gap
Good. no Drew? Who then?
The Dodgers get about $200M/yr. from their local TV deal. They can easily afford to spend far more than they currently do. And yes, they have said the luxury tax is part of doing business.
I prefer that philosophy to we must be under the cap regardless of the consequences. That is, in reality, where the Yankees are today.
JF look at the Yanks… do you think they make more than the Dodgers??
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Yes, the Yankees could easily afford a 300 million payroll. I am not bullshtting here with these numbers. I am going off what is reported and how the finances of revenue sharing work. The Yankees own a stake in YES, own their concessions, get incredibly favorable stadium payments, are able to shelter 50+ million each year from revenue sharing thanks to the stadium. They are making tens of millions of dollars profit each year. Their stake in YES is the key, because they own 30% of it, it is a cash cow, and they have a very UNDER MARKET deal with the actual TEAM the Yankees for the media rights.
The Yankees get 80 million per year for their TV deal. The Dodgers will get 250 million per year. Look at these numbers. 250 million just from being on TV. Dodgers TV. Not even MLB national TV.
The Yankees just got a billion dollars for selling 10% stake in YES & agreeing to a 20 year TV deal. They are fluuuuuuuuuush with cash.
“The Dodgers get about $200M/yr. from their local TV deal”
250….the Yankees get 90. The Angels actually get more than the Yanks also ….I think they get 130 annually in TV money
@JimBowdenESPNxm: Josh Hamilton realistic FA Market looks like Rangers or Red Sox with Yankees a dark horse…doubtful Hamilton goes to SEA even if best offer
The Yankees pay 1 dollar in rent on their stadium each year.
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs.....landscape/
Must read….goes over every teams TV deal
oak2455 December 4th, 2012 at 12:03 pm
SS I have apple TV
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You gotta use like Hulu and Netflix and all that stuff right? No live tv streaming stuff?
@blake thanks for posting that
if the Yanks get Josh….what would you guys think? ##JF I think we need the Yanks to renew their deal
Yankee’s looking into Hamilton, is a lot like when they signed Damon. Double whammy of improving the team, And weakening an opponent with 1 move.
Jerkface December 4th, 2012 at 12:08 pm
The Yankees pay 1 dollar in rent on their stadium each year.
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Must read….goes over every teams TV deal
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That article talks about what the Yanks make in rights fees. But it doesn’t mention what they make in advertising fees. Remember, that’s the reason why you set up your own network in the first place (ESPN, NFL Network, YES, etc…). You get money from 2 different avenues.
I think Philly is a more realistic dark horse for Hamilton.
The Braves essentially get no TV money until like forever……they are at a big disadvantage
I think we need the Yanks to renew their deal
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They already did, and its still incredibly under market. Though it has increasing payments so in 20 years they’ll be making what the Dodgers are now.
“The Yankees just got a billion dollars for selling 10% stake in YES & agreeing to a 20 year TV deal. They are fluuuuuuuuuush with cash.”
ok, let me get this straight.
are you telling me that the yankee owners aren’t part of the 47% ?
damn, the way they ‘ve been acting with building the team , i thought they’d be applying for food stamps soon.
“That article talks about what the Yanks make in rights fees. But it doesn’t mention what they make in advertising fees. Remember, that’s the reason why you set up your own network in the first place (ESPN, NFL Network, YES, etc…). You get money from 2 different avenues.”
That’s true I guess….hard to estimate how much they get for that
That article talks about what the Yanks make in rights fees. But it doesn’t mention what they make in advertising fees. Remember, that’s the reason why you set up your own network in the first place (ESPN, NFL Network, YES, etc…). You get money from 2 different avenues.
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Yea, thats just what the ‘team’ collects. The Steinbrenners and Yankees Global LLC or whatever it is make BANK and its not covered by revenue sharing because its outside of the ‘the team’. Thats why all this austerity stuff drives me up a wall.
Gammons on MLB Network talking about Escobar to the Yankees.
Hello Peter, old news and not going to happen. Get with it buddy.
“The Yankees pay 1 dollar in rent on their stadium each year.”
actually that’s fair because hal and hank never actually go there.
SS yes no live streaming…. you can get a blue-ray player( which I have, and works great) …..I have about 200 movies on Apple TV( Most my son’s movies)………do you have FIOS?? Because my friend just uploaded movies to their media center off his hard drive….works the same and its free
Bottom line…. The yanks have just as much revenue as the Dodgers and they are screwing around while LA goes after everybody
I think a lot of people here would be depressed if the Yanks signed Hamilton.
They’d have to eat all their anti-Hal Steinbenner nonsense about how cheap he and his family are.
They’d have to eat all their anti-Hal Steinbenner nonsense about how cheap he and his family are.
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I’ll gladly eat crow if the Yankees decided to get their swagger back.
“They’d have to eat all their anti-Hal Steinbenner nonsense about how cheap he and his family are.”
I’ll take it all back gladly
oak – I keep looking for ways to lower my cable bill and I have friends that work for Apple that suggested I get Apple tv instead of having cable at all… but ALL of Shame’s disposable income goes to paying the Yankees for something, so I need to keep my cable.
Ok I think a Josh signing would fill a lot of needs
Lol, the Yankees aren’t signing Hamilton..
I swear, people are still in that ‘phantom limb’ phase with this team.
Phantom Limb was a millionaire, he’d pay for a good team
http://fc07.deviantart.net/fs4.....C_5052.jpg
And yes, I’d love to have to eat my words. I’d LOVE it.
I’d love for our Yankees to go back to being Celine Dion.
Jerkface December 4th, 2012 at 12:24 pm
Phantom Limb was a millionaire, he’d pay for a good team
http://fc07.deviantart.net/fs4…..C_5052.jpg
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Oh snap!
well I have Fios at 105 a month thats for everything( worked hard for that) so thats internet 50/25 speed unlimited phone and TV pretty much everything……also Optimum just came out with a new promo and DVR for a lower price
” Though it has increasing payments so in 20 years they’ll be making what the Dodgers are now.”
what’s the chance of a 2032 dollar equaling a 2012 dollar?
a 2032 dollar will probably be worth about half what a dollar worth now.
it may be worse than that.
a 2012 dollar is worth 40% less than a 1992 dollar
with all the dollars out in the system with the great recession, what’s the chance of inflation not being much higher in the next twenty years that it was the past twenty years.
this contract that looks bad on the surface fifteen- twenty years from now because of likely inflation, make me think the steinbrenners are probably thinking sell now. it looks like they are getting their ducks lined up in a row for cashing in sooner than later.
Bowden views the Rangers and Red Sox as the frontrunners for Josh Hamilton, with the Yankees as a dark horse. He doesn’t believe Hamilton would sign with the Mariners even if Seattle made the best offer.
Read more at http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/#mPuT8Mwo9vX33kyU.99
******
It is not as if Hamilton can pitch for the Red Sox – or can he – - – -
Interesting little winter league – formerly injured players making up time – Heathcott, Adams, Gumbs, Betances – or being showcased??
86w183,
I will also eat crow and admit to my foolhardiness if the Yankees were to spend money.
It is not the fans who say they are significantly cutting expenditures. It is the team. They are dropping $40M in payroll under the plan. They do so despite getting additional money form their own TV package and from the MLB TV agreement.
They clearly value profit over winning. How do I know that? They told us by saying the cap is mandatory. AROD’s absence doesn’t matter. Nothing does.
I believe it is you who doesn’t see the new reality.
I’ll probably have to call Optimum again and see if I can get anything less than what it’s costing me now. Problem is I already have the bare-bones, basic package.
A la carte channels please!
Hey, here’s a better question: When the Yankees don’t do anything.. who eats crow? No one? Everyone?
I feel like ALL the crows should have a chance to be eaten.
SS- lol is your contract up with optimum ? if so say your going elsewhere… like Verizon, and make a up an offer like 64.99 for 3 services ….say can you do better than that or come close…. say you love their service blah blah blah and would like to stay
Interesting little winter league – formerly injured players making up time – Heathcott, Adams, Gumbs, Betances – or being showcased??
==================================
Mostly the latter, I would think. Maybe just trying to see if there’s anything there anymore in the case of Bettances.
Shame Spencer December 4th, 2012 at 12:01 pm
OAA – I reward ALL the loyal subjects!
Maybe if we just start thinking about forgetting the luxury tax enough the Yankees will do it. Like if we all stared at a tree trying to set it on fire or something..
——————–
Thank you Queen
@Ken_Rosenthal: For A-Rod, the beginning of the end? Column: http://t.co/NfzxJj4M
Rosethal says that doctors can deem a player unable to perform and Arod would still get his money but insurance would cover 70% of it…..my question is does that count as retirement or just basically him being on the DL for 5 years?
It does not count as retirement, A-rod’s contract would still be on the books, it would still affect the luxury tax.
Get better Arod !
Jerkface says:
December 4, 2012 at 12:36 pm
It does not count as retirement, A-rod’s contract would still be on the books, it would still affect the luxury tax.
That’s stupid
With baseball player insurance, you are only getting insurance payments if the player is under contract. The Yankees would get 70% of A-rod’s contract back, but that would just be pure profit, its not helping them get under the luxury tax.
That’s stupid
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Baseball has guaranteed contracts, take it up with baseball. I don’t think its stupid. When signing big deals you risk injury.
Rosethal says that doctors can deem a player unable to perform and Arod would still get his money but insurance would cover 70% of it…..my question is does that count as retirement or just basically him being on the DL for 5 years?
*****
But in theory possibly – the savings on the 70% could equal or suprass any savings for being under 189 – so does ARod’s retirement act as a defacto savings enough for Hal to go above 189 then????
my question is does that count as retirement or just basically him being on the DL for 5 years?
================================
The latter. It’s guaranteed money. It’s going to count against the luxury tax for the full boat. Whether the insurance companies cover it or the Yankees do is immaterial for lux tax purposes.
But in theory possibly – the savings on the 70% could equal or suprass any savings for being under 189 – so does ARod’s retirement act as a defacto savings enough for Hal to go above 189 then????
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No its only 15 million per year.
But in theory possibly – the savings on the 70% could equal or suprass any savings for being under 189 – so does ARod’s retirement act as a defacto savings enough for Hal to go above 189 then????
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No its only 15 million per year.
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How much is the tax then they are trying to avoid?
“Baseball has guaranteed contracts, take it up with baseball. I don’t think its stupid. When signing big deals you risk injury.”
I agree there….what I think is somewhat unfair is that you have to count a player towards your payroll when the player is unable to play……not saying the player shouldn’t get paid with a guaranteed contract….just saying that only active players on the roster should count towards the luxury tax……
How much is the tax then they are trying to avoid?
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Well they pay 50% on amounts over 178 this year. 189 next 3 years. They can get rebates totaling 50 million if they are under the tax all 3 years, or the first 2 years. Then factor in whatever other savings you want for simply not spending money/not paying luxury tax.
blake says:
December 4, 2012 at 12:34 pm
@Ken_Rosenthal: For A-Rod, the beginning of the end? Column: http://t.co/NfzxJj4M
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Now is the beginning of the end? Which ARod was he watching?
The one I watch began his end 4 seasons ago.
The rule should be that the player is still paid….but only players on the active 40 man roster count towards the luxury tax….
what I think is somewhat unfair is that you have to count a player towards your payroll when the player is unable to play
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That’s life in professional sports and CBAs. Reggie Lewis counted against the Boston Celtics salary cap for 3 years after he was dead.
@mlbtraderumors: Cardinals, Yankees Eyeing Marco Scutaro http://t.co/hzeHSs7Z #mlb
Scutero would be great cause he can play SS too
The Return of Stoneburner December 4th, 2012 at 11:10 am
Jerkface December 4th, 2012 at 11:07 am
Is Tyler Austin hitting wise Mike Olt 2012?
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I think Austin in 2013 can become the Olt of 2012 yes. May end with him traded, as these kind of mid tier top 100 prospects tend to be. Getting Olt and possibly being able to fill 3rd/1B/RF with a combination of Olt/Austin in 2014 could help them get under 189
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What is your view of the Texas and PCL leagues? Just curious – – -
Go look at the top hitting numbers in the TL compared to the PCL. TL might be a hitter’s league, but it’s like Yankee Stadium compared to Coors Field. PCL is ridiculous. You always have to be wary of hitter’s coming from the PCL. Some of them literally crush it in the PCL and suck in the majors.
That said, Olt lead the entire TL in OPS and HR. It’s AA though, not AAA.
“That’s life in professional sports and CBAs. Reggie Lewis counted against the Boston Celtics salary cap for 3 years after he was dead.”
Maybe so….but doesn’t seem very fair
Go look at the top hitting numbers in the TL compared to the PCL. TL might be a hitter’s league, but it’s like Yankee Stadium compared to Coors Field. PCL is ridiculous. You always have to be wary of hitter’s coming from the PCL. Some of them literally crush it in the PCL and suck in the majors.
That said, Olt lead the entire TL in OPS and HR. It’s AA though, not AAA.
****
Thanks.
@nickcafardo: Red Sox didn’t like what they saw on Dan Haren’s medicals on his hip.
blake December 4th, 2012 at 12:34 pm
@Ken_Rosenthal: For A-Rod, the beginning of the end? Column: http://t.co/NfzxJj4M
Rosethal says that doctors can deem a player unable to perform and Arod would still get his money but insurance would cover 70% of it…..my question is does that count as retirement or just basically him being on the DL for 5 years?
Jerkface December 4th, 2012 at 12:36 pm
It does not count as retirement, A-rod’s contract would still be on the books, it would still affect the luxury tax.
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Which means the Yankees save a bunch of money but don’t have to spend to replace him because hey, that money is still counting against the CBT limit. Hal’s dream situation.
So basically there is no way Arod would ever retire when he could just have a dr deem him unable to play and he’d still he paid……and that doesn’t help the Yankees at all other than giving Hal the insurance for his money bin
Maybe so….but doesn’t seem very fair
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Yeah. I bet teams like the Celtics and Yankees going to their respective leagues and saying “this isn’t fair” really resonates.
“Which means the Yankees save a bunch of money but don’t have to spend to replace him because hey, that money is still counting against the CBT limit. Hal’s dream situation.”
Yes
Yes, the fans only win in 2 scenarios: A-rod comes back healthy and can play, A-rod retires forfeiting over 100 million dollars
The least likely scenarios!
“Yeah. I bet teams like the Celtics and Yankees going to their respective leagues and saying “this isn’t fair” really resonates.”
There is a difference between two organizations creating their own good fortunes…..and an unfair rule
“Jerkface says:
December 4, 2012 at 12:54 pm
Yes, the fans only win in 2 scenarios: A-rod comes back healthy and can play, A-rod retires forfeiting over 100 million dollars
The least likely scenarios!”
Okay, what if Arod retires and then the Yankees leave a suitcase full of lottery tickets in his cabana? One of those tickets hits and BOOM! there’s his $100 million. Problem solved. Take that, silly CBA.
A-rod comes back healthy, is good
A-rod comes back healthy, is bad
A-rod is not healthy, and good in what playing time he gets
A-rod is not healthy, and bad
A-rod is not healthy, and cannot even play
A-rod is not healthy, and retires
These are the scenarios in descending order of health for the fans.
@jcrasnick: Momentum is building in Shane Victorino talks. A deal could get done in Nashville.
@jcrasnick: The Pagan & Bourn deals appear to be helping Victorino’s market. He’s now looking at a 3- or 4-year contract.
How in the world is a 3-4 year deal for Victorino a good idea for Cleveland?
There is a difference between two organizations creating their own good fortunes…..and an unfair rule
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Suppose, but the rule is the rule. No sense beefing about it. Not going to be addressed before the next CBA.
does that mean the Yanks are in on Shane
“A-rod is not healthy, and retires”
Is rank this as #2….but it seems the changes of that are less than zero
blake December 4th, 2012 at 12:47 pm
The rule should be that the player is still paid….but only players on the active 40 man roster count towards the luxury tax….
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It’s too easy of a loophole, blake.
The teams need to have some penalty for giving out bad deals… paying them and having it count is the penalty. Which seems wholly fair. The alternative is being like the NFL which allows teams to drive players physically into the ground and then not pay them at all.
@mlbtraderumors: The Mets continue to push for Wil Myers in trade talks with the Royals, according to ESPNNY. http://t.co/Eg0cC55H
please go sign Josh call it a day Ca$$$hman
Shame Victorino could be my dad’s handle if he ever decides to start posting here..
“It’s too easy of a loophole, blake.”
You’d have to state that sufficient medical evidence has to be supplied to prove that the players career is over…..Im not talking about DL stints….Im talking about career ending injuries
if KC gives up Wil for Dickey , KC should just shutdown the business
How in the world is a 3-4 year deal for Victorino a good idea for Cleveland?
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Can’t see how it’s a good idea for anyone.
Also, what Bourn deal? Wasn’t aware he signed anywhere.
blake December 4th, 2012 at 1:02 pm
@mlbtraderumors: The Mets continue to push for Wil Myers in trade talks with the Royals, according to ESPNNY. http://t.co/Eg0cC55H
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I do really like Sandy. He’s a good baseball guy.
The Yanks (I hope) aren’t giving Shane 3 years
Ha, someone set up a fake SJ account on twitter.
@RealJoeCasale16
JIM BOWDEN ?@JimBowdenESPNxm
The negotiations are presently at a standstill between R. A. Dickey and the New York Mets increasing expectations that Dickey will traded
Retweeted by Adam Rubin
I think we should automatically sign Scutaro just so Mo doesn’t have to face him in what could be his final season.
“Also, what Bourn deal? Wasn’t aware he signed anywhere”
I guess they are just talking about his market
@jcrasnick: Pardon me: I meant Upton and Pagan deals have helped Victorino. Not Bourn, obviously.
There ya go
Jerry Crasnick ?@jcrasnick
#Indians have emerged as a prime suitor for Victorino. Terry Francona reached out to him personally earlier in offseason.
good enjoy the midgs( or whatever)
@FollowThePadres: The #Padres have no interest in trading 3B Chase Headley. GM Josh Byrnes not ruling out extension: http://t.co/Ko6cvu4T
blake December 4th, 2012 at 1:04 pm
“It’s too easy of a loophole, blake.”
You’d have to state that sufficient medical evidence has to be supplied to prove that the players career is over…..Im not talking about DL stints….Im talking about career ending injuries
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Still.. it’s the risk you take when handing out long term pacts to any player. I mean, the Dodgers could give Cano $200 million and have him snap his knee so badly he can never play again. I don’t think they should be off the hook for it in terms of team salary because they got a bad break.
I get what you’re saying but the focus has to go back to the Yankees and not Arod. Arod’s deal doesn’t hurt the team if they don’t let it. They gave him the deal knowing the rules and possible consequences.
Yes a rebuilding team signing a 31 year old declining player to a multi year deal seems smart
Probably meant Upton
UnKnown December 4th, 2012 at 1:04 pm
Ha, someone set up a fake SJ account on twitter.
@RealJoeCasale16
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LOL!
Let’s take our drama over here
“Still.. it’s the risk you take when handing out long term pacts to any player. I mean, the Dodgers could give Cano $200 million and have him snap his knee so badly he can never play again. I don’t think they should be off the hook for it in terms of team salary because they got a bad break.”
They aren’t off the hook…. Still would have to pay him….I just don’t think it should count towards the taxable payroll because it prevents you going and replacing a player that will never play again
Mike Olt:
.288 .398 .579 .977, AA
Texas League
Ronnier Mustelier:
.353 .412 .598 1.010 AA, Eastern League
.303 .359 .455 .815 AAA, International League
.314 .371 .488 .859 combined AA+AAA
Make the league adjustment, are they that different? (aside from Olt being 4 years younger, but this isn’t about prospect status)
jacksquat –
Olt is a better defender at 3B than Tyler Austin and Ronnier.
That said, I agree that if the price is too high, I’d rather have Ronnier get a chance.
We all saw Olt struggle in the bigs last year.