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Cashman: “I don’t feel that it’s all that different now”

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Dec 15, 2012 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

What’s going on with this free agent market? The Los Angeles teams have signed the biggest, most expensive players available, while the Yankees have gone after short-term contracts with older players, and the Red Sox have signed fairly big names without going after the best of the best. Has something in baseball’s economy shifted?

Brian Cashman was asked that question yesterday. This was his lengthy response.

“I can’t speak for Boston, but I just think it’s all cyclical. I don’t think anything is going on here that hasn’t before.

“We had massive commitments with Mike Mussina and Jason Giambi amongst others that prevented (the Yankees from being involved) when Carlos Beltran was a free agent and eventually signed with the Mets, when Delgado was a free agent and signed where he signed. I just remember there’s a number of players on the free agent market that I had to look at, and their year of free agency doesn’t match up with our current needs and our available payroll.

“We have more committed than anybody on a yearly basis, and have for quite some time, and that hasn’t changed. We’re still running a significant payroll that is or will be maybe second to the Dodgers this year. Every winter there is a rise and fall of teams that usually spend a lot and they have to gear down a little bit because it’s not like they can go out there spending with $100 million commitments or more on a yearly basis.

“People, I don’t think, pay attention to the real data of that. They (could) look back in time and say, when they made a commitment to Bernie, look at all those big center fielders that came down the line and went elsewhere. When they made the commitment to Jason Giambi over the number of years, and how many first base/DHs came and went? When they’ve had the pitching staffs that they’ve had, including Mussina and (others) prior to him, when we were re-signing Pettitte and Clemens, how many other starting pitchers would up signing somewhere else that we didn’t play on?

“We get aggressive when there’s a vacancy. We’re not aggressive when there’s not a vacancy. That’s the true story. Not the daily, ‘What The Boss would have done’ or ‘The Boss would have done that.’ Well, I was operating with The Boss under those previous circumstances, and I can tell you that that’s the way it was. I don’t feel that it’s all that different now either. I think we might be a little more methodical, but I think we’re aggressive when the timing is right and the circumstances are right.

“I don’t think we just do it just to do it. I know we might have done that in the 80s and stuff and years past, but I don’t think that’s been a part of our culture for quite a while.”

Associated Press photo

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173 Responses to “Cashman: “I don’t feel that it’s all that different now””

  1. RadioKev December 15th, 2012 at 9:01 am

    I’d still rather have Jeter than Reyes, and Reyes is the bigger injury risk. Encarnacion is coming off a very good season, but it’s definitely a career year. Outside his norm. Tex is still the safer bet to producer better.

    Lawrie obviously has the superstar potential, but it’s just that right now. Last year was a bit of a flop. I’d certainly rather have him than Youkilis, but he’s not for certain.

    And I’d take Kuroda before I take Johnson. Kuroda is the model of consistency. Johnson? Uh… not so much.

  2. blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:05 am

    blake says:
    December 15, 2012 at 9:00 am
    “They are treating 2013 as a “treading water” season by keeping the team competitive and the payroll relatively flat with a huge collection of expiring contracts.

    They will totally rebuild the roster in 2014, hoping that a significant number of spots will be taken by their best prospects being ready for prime time.”

    That’s a very unpredictable plan….it’s a plan that teams like the Royals had to do because of finances

  3. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:08 am

    We have a huge vacancy in right field. Hamilton would have matched up nicely. Things are not the same. Why does he tell us nothing has changed when they will be, for the first time since the sixties, massively reducing payroll?

    I agree that they are trying the Royals plan of hoping all your prospects pan out. It has worked great for them for the past 20 years.

  4. randy l. December 15th, 2012 at 9:08 am

    the yankees could win 95 again in 2013.

    but if they do, they won’y have hughes and granderson n 2014 and that’s when the real potential fall off happens.

    the yankees will need big years out of granderson and hughes to win 95. if they do well they’ll get huge free agent money.

    if they don’t do well in 2013, the yankees have a chance to sign them, but 2013 will have been the bad year.

    the yankees simply don’t have the number of potential star players that they once had. guys like hughes and granderson are no longer pluses if they come through but rather essentials.

    the yankees are also weaker in the bullpen without soriano. there is no telling how good or how many games mariano will be available for.

    old guys can be good, but not everyday. the yankees should try to get a rule passed that for every 40 year old a team has on the roster they can add another 40 year old extra.

    40 year olds should play a third to half as much depending on their positions. they will get overuse injuries faster and the injuries will take longer to heal.

    injuries will be a major theme of this team.it’s ideal for ichiro to be in a platoon. jeter should be in one too.obviously alex when he comes back.

    mariano should not pitch a whole season.

    so 95 wins?
    that’s a big roll of the dice. a lot of good things have to happen.

    probably a 25% chance of that happening. could happen. kind of like nate silver’s presidential odds.
    95wins or more could happen, but only once about every four times this scenario is run out there.

  5. Yankee Trader December 15th, 2012 at 9:11 am

    From a prior Sherman article in NY Post:

    George Steinbrenner and Brian Cashman were watching SportsCenter together in January, 2003 when it was reported the Red Sox had signed free agent David Ortiz.

    That should not have caused much of a stir. Ortiz was no star then and actually had been released five weeks earlier by the Twins. But nothing quite disturbed The Boss like Boston enlisting a player. He wanted a 50-man roster — 25 for his own and 25 to keep away from the Red Sox.

    To that point, Yankee officials never had seriously considered Ortiz. They had Nick Johnson at first base, Jason Giambi as their DH and seemingly no role for another lefty swinger with no ability to play elsewhere.

    David Ortiz, who was up for grabs in 2003, has become an all-time fan favorite at Fenway Park.As Ortiz became the game’s No. 1 Yankee killer, however, a mythology arose in which Steinbrenner always wanted Ortiz. The Boss — a relentless second-guesser — fueled that story by turning merciless toward his GM as Ortiz became Big Papi in Boston.
    ———————-

    Ortiz a Yankee in 2004. No doubt who would have advanced to the WS in 2004 and defeated the Cardinals in 4 straight.

  6. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:12 am

    Randy,

    Percentage chance for 85 wins or less? I believe at least 25%.

  7. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:13 am

    Cashman must have read “1984″ many times because he is a Master of “Double-speak”.

    He’s on a cruise going up the largest River in Egypt.

    What absolute pap.

    Must think Yankee fans are complete idiots.

    We all know it’s about 189 right now.

    Get real.

  8. blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:14 am

    There just has been a number of curious decisions by the Yankees this winter….opportunities either missed or ignored.

  9. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:14 am

    YT,

    The story I heard is George wanted Ortiz but was talked out of it.

    I wish we would acquire one player, any player, who was under 30 and had potential to improve. It is amazing this team has no such player.

  10. Cashmoney December 15th, 2012 at 9:15 am

    i

  11. pkyankfan69 December 15th, 2012 at 9:16 am

    “We get aggressive when there’s a vacancy. We’re not aggressive when there’s not a vacancy.”

    I guess Cervelli/Stewart/Romine isn’t considered a “vacancy”

    Empty words from Cash.

  12. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:16 am

    And I thought just Policiticans were full of crap.

    :)

  13. blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:16 am

    I think the Yankees could make the playoffs in 2013 as is……but I also think there is a very real chance they don’t if they don’t address some needs.

    There are a lot of questions that’d need to be answered yes for them to win the number of games they’ll need to …..

  14. raymagnetic December 15th, 2012 at 9:17 am

    They probably would have signed Hamilton if he wasn’t a drug addict with character issues.

  15. 86w183 December 15th, 2012 at 9:17 am

    “They are treating 2013 as a “treading water” season by keeping the team competitive and the payroll relatively flat with a huge collection of expiring contracts.

    They will totally rebuild the roster in 2014, hoping that a significant number of spots will be taken by their best prospects being ready for prime time.”

    That’s a very unpredictable plan….it’s a plan that teams like the Royals had to do because of finances

    *************************************************************************

    Of course counting on a bunch of kids is unpredictable, but its the only way to get to $ 189 as long as Jeter, CC, A-Rod and Tex are still breathing and tying up about half that money. If you have about $ 70 M to spend on 20 players you need as many $ 500 K guys as possible.

    It certainly wont look like any Yankees roster we’ve ever seen before. Even bad Yankees teams in past years were veteran squads.

  16. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:17 am

    sp: politicians. sorry

  17. Shame Spencer December 15th, 2012 at 9:17 am

    I just don’t believe Cash when he says some teams won’t be able to keep spending.. at this point, the Dodgers are going to be pulling in a ton of revenue. I can’t say if it’s more than what the Yankees rake but it seems like it’s close… certainly seems like they’ll have a lot to work with on a yearly basis.

    I also find it totally laughable that they only go after players when there is a hole lol… remember when we signed Soriano to be our set up guy?? No? I mean, I get the overall point of what he’s saying but c’mon man..

  18. blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:18 am

    I think the Yankees will ultimately sign AJP or trade for a catcher….simply because they have to….otherwise they are just wasting all this money they’ve spent on these one year deals.

  19. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:19 am

    Cashmoney,

    You are usually more talkative than that. :)

    Without considering catcher since we have no clue there, Gardner is the only Yankee starter under 30, and he turns 30 in August.

    I wish we had someone like Lawrie or Rasmuss who might actually turn into something good.

  20. raymagnetic December 15th, 2012 at 9:19 am

    There are questions every year and every year people tend to want to answer these questions in the negative. Thats their preragotive of course. Doesn’t mean all the questions will turn out negative however.

  21. 86w183 December 15th, 2012 at 9:20 am

    For 2013 my hope would be that they add AJP and Ross…. an (almost) every day catcher with power and a versatile RH bat for the OF. I could even live with Demon Young though his best defensive position is nolo contendre

    THEN I would consider them favorites to win the division. Otherwise……

  22. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:20 am

    A-rod will retire ?

    He does have bad hips.

    Make him a high level scout. Let him be like a Reggie.

    ;)

  23. Shame Spencer December 15th, 2012 at 9:21 am

    The Yanks are gonna have a hard time getting the youngin’s ready for 2014 if they don’t get any playing time this year.

    I don’t see this team giving up on Youk at 3B, so that’s gonna be a hole in 2014. I don’t see them letting Ichiro sit so one of the Almontes can get in there (especially since we’ll probably add a Hariston-type 4th OFer). Cano isn’t going to be taking a game off so we can see if Joseph can man 2B if Robbie bolts.. The only place I can see the young guys getting a shot is in the rotation when Andy gets injured.

  24. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:21 am

    Ray,

    No, they wouldn’t have. They don’t want big or long contracts. How can that not be clear to you?

  25. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:21 am

    86-

    Ross is already gone.

    ;)

  26. blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:22 am

    “raymagnetic says:
    December 15, 2012 at 9:19 am
    There are questions every year and every year people tend to want to answer these questions in the negative. Thats their preragotive of course. Doesn’t mean all the questions will turn out negative however.”

    The more questions you have the more likely it is that enough of them will be answered negatively though to sink you….

    .that’s what’s happened with Boston the last couple of seasons……they have carried a ton of risk into opening day and predictably it all didnt work out.

    That’s the danger the Yanks are facing right now IMO…..

  27. Shame Spencer December 15th, 2012 at 9:24 am

    My hope is that the Yanks are trying to keep as much money off the books as possible beyond this year because they desperately want to keep Cano… but adding another huge deal like that leaves you with CF/LF, 2 Rotation spots, 3B, and possibly C and DH to fill with a chunk less money.

    If Arod comes back this year and they’re determined to make him the DH and share that spot with some big hairy 4th OFer, that’d be a decent approach. I guess you hope that someone steps up at C and for one of the rotation slots.. and sign an OFer.

  28. blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:24 am

    If the Yankees add AJP and then a RH bat to platoon with Ichiro ( preferably Morse or Ross) then they’ll compete in 2013 barring major Injuries.

    I really like their starting pitching depth and I think the pen will be strong …..

    The lineup is carrying a lot of risk though and they will likely have to pitch even better than last year to win the division ….

  29. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:24 am

    Martin’s offense, believe it or not, will be missed when we see the starting catcher with an OPS under .600.

    Nunez is a pretty decent hitter for a middle infielder, but now it is said he may be the primary DH, or at least the DH vs. lefties. I guess that is not a hole either.

  30. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:25 am

    Hal is only concerned with 1 thing right now.

    Being able to “limbo” under the 189 bar.

    Everything else is secondary.

    Of that I am certain.

  31. Shame Spencer December 15th, 2012 at 9:26 am

    raymagnetic December 15th, 2012 at 9:17 am

    They probably would have signed Hamilton if he wasn’t a drug addict with character issues.

    ——————-

    Hahahaha, yep just like when they signed Daryl Strawberry!

    They didn’t sign Hamilton because he cost too much, not because any of that other nonsense.

    Hell we signed guys like Lofton and Sheff.. character issues a’plenty on this team in the past.

  32. Yankee Trader December 15th, 2012 at 9:26 am

    Randy-

    For Curtis Granderson to earn a big payday in 2014 as a FA, he’s going to have to improve in almost every facet of his game.

    2011 doubles 26, triples 10, homers 41-about half on the road, 25 sb’s

    2012 doubles 18, triples 4, 43 homers-26 at home, 10 sb’s.

    BA down, strikeouts up, speed gone.

    Shift is killing his average and other teams are exploiting his weaknesses.

    Just my 3 cents.

  33. 86w183 December 15th, 2012 at 9:27 am

    Cody Ross signed? With whom?

  34. Shame Spencer December 15th, 2012 at 9:28 am

    We’re getting jabs thrown at us by the Mets beat guys??:

    “This transaction marks a brave new path for the Mets, one in which sound baseball operations trumps sentiment. This in the same week when the Yankees are giving 39-year-old Ichiro Suzuki, who clocked 10 mediocre weeks and two phenomenal ones in The Bronx, a two-year extension seemingly because fans adored his inability to hit home runs.”

    http://www.nypost.com/p/sports.....5u4yNhfcKP

  35. raymagnetic December 15th, 2012 at 9:28 am

    “Ray,

    No, they wouldn’t have. They don’t want big or long contracts. How can that not be clear to you?”

    Cashman says a lot of things that turn out not to be true. Could be they don’t want long or expensive contracts with the players that were available this year.

    “The more questions you have the more likely it is that enough of them will be answered negatively though to sink you….

    .that’s what’s happened with Boston the last couple of seasons……they have carried a ton of risk into opening day and predictably it all didnt work out.”

    Last year at this time the Yankees had Sabathia and pray for rain as their pitching staff. Hughes was coming off of a terrible season, Nova was coming into his second year, Koruda wasn’t on the team and Andy Pettitte was still retired. How’d that work out for them?

    Just saying, every year they have questions and people tend to answer all the questions in the negative.

    The team isn’t finished being assembled as of yet. Of course they have questions!!

  36. blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:29 am

    What’s done is done and Hamilton, Melky , etc are gone.

    So if I were Cashman what is be doing now is focusing on getting a catcher, and adding a RH bat…..also checking on Olt if they can get him.

    If the could sign AJP and the perhaps trade Nova or phelps for Morse then Granderson for Olt then that’d be good .

    Then try to sign Pelfrey for depth…..

    Jeter SS
    Ichiro LF
    Cano 2B
    Tex 1B
    Morse DH
    AJP C
    Youk 3B
    Olt RF
    Gardner CF

    Sabathia
    Kuroda
    Pettite
    Hughes
    Pelfrey

  37. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:30 am

    Cashman: “I don’t feel it’s any different.”

    Really ?

    Then you are either blind or you’re full of you-know-what.

    I think it’s that you are full of you-know-what.

    You’re standing right in a pile of it.

    Just don’t expect us to join you.

    ;)

  38. blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:31 am

    “The team isn’t finished being assembled as of yet. Of course they have questions!!”

    That’s what Im saying….they need to fill some holes before opening day if they want to win next year…..I have no idea what they’ll do beyond 2013 though

  39. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:32 am

    86-

    Sorry. a misunderstanding on my part.

    Been doing that a lot lately.

    I thought since we were talking about Catchers you wanted Dave not Cody.

    Yeah. I like Cody too but I don’t think he’s in the budget.

  40. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:33 am

    Ray,

    We are hoping they are not finished. I suspect, and of course I have no knowledge, the only other move will be a right handed hitting outfielder who will sign for one year. Such a player will not add much value.

  41. Shame Spencer December 15th, 2012 at 9:33 am

    I have no idea what they’ll do beyond 2013 though

    —————-

    They’ll let the kids play and act surprised that not having any MLB playing time was kind of a drawback…

    It’s either that or sign guys and go with a very, very young pitching staff.

    What’s going to be hard is if both Kuroda and Andy have good seasons and want to play again..

  42. blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:34 am

    The Yankees shouldn’t play this half way….. Either go ALL in for 2013 or trade the guys you can’t keep beyond this year.

    They should trade Granderson if they can get good value for him…..Texas seems to be very open to dealing Olt and they need pitching and a LH hitting outfielder to replace Hamilton.

    Granderson and Nova for Olt and Perez may work for both sides?

    I doubt Texas and the Yanks would trade with each other though

  43. raymagnetic December 15th, 2012 at 9:34 am

    “Hahahaha, yep just like when they signed Daryl Strawberry!

    They didn’t sign Hamilton because he cost too much, not because any of that other nonsense.

    Hell we signed guys like Lofton and Sheff.. character issues a’plenty on this team in the past.”

    That was George and last I checked he’s dead, no?

  44. Yankee Trader December 15th, 2012 at 9:36 am

    austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:14 am
    YT,

    The story I heard is George wanted Ortiz but was talked out of it.
    —————————-
    By Cashman, who reminded him that Nick Johnson was their 1st baseman and Jason Giambi the DH.

    The Yankees playoff loss to the RS in 2004 had to be in the top 3 of the most depressing playoff defeats as a Yankee fan with the Rivera loss in Game 7 to the DBacks in 2001 and Bill Mazeroski’s homer to win game 7 in WS 1960.

  45. randy l. December 15th, 2012 at 9:36 am

    austin mac-

    yes, 85 wins or below is on the table because of the injury potential to an aging team.
    i’d say yeah, 20-25% chance of it.

    i was around a unique baseball experiment, the senior professional baseball league.

    the average age of our starting team was about 36. the catchers could be 32.most of the pitchers were younger than pettitte, rivera, and kuroda. the shortsop was younger than jeter ( ron washington),Joaquín Andújar was 37.

    my point is that for two seasons, as the bull pen catcher, half my time was spent with rehabbing pitchers and players. i was always the extra arm around to play catch with or long toss to get back to playing shape.

    older players who are good are better than young players who aren’t good as cashman said, however they can’t be good if they play everyday simply because they start to play with nagging chronic injuries that eventually blow out.

    that’s what happened with jeter last year. that’s what’s been happening with arod. old guys can’t play everyday even though they are wired to play everyday in their make up. that’s how they got to be stars, that inner drive to figure out a way.

    someone has to say no, you’re not playing today. it has to be done on a schedule and early so a player would peak for the playoffs. f the yankees accept the fact they are an aging team of all stars and use them accordingly, you know, like a senior league team, they just might win those 95 games.

  46. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:37 am

    As is usually the case, I approve of Blake’s plan. That team, without a bunch of injuries, could win the division. Only adding a poor outfielder, they have a poor chance, IMO.

  47. raymagnetic December 15th, 2012 at 9:37 am

    I love when people bring up something the team did 20 years ago as if it’s still valid today.

  48. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:38 am

    Randy-

    Yeah. But good young players are better than good old players.

    That’s the option I’m looking for.

    ;)

  49. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:39 am

    Kuroda, Pettitte and Mo will not return. There is no money for such high priced players. They will have to be on a budget at every position, particularly if they sign Cano.

  50. raymagnetic December 15th, 2012 at 9:40 am

    Daryl Strawberry made less than 1 million in 1998. That’s totally the same as paying Hamilton $125 mil or more. Totally.

  51. Shame Spencer December 15th, 2012 at 9:40 am

    That was George and last I checked he’s dead, no?
    ——————–

    Arod.

  52. Shame Spencer December 15th, 2012 at 9:40 am

    raymagnetic December 15th, 2012 at 9:40 am

    Daryl Strawberry made less than 1 million in 1998. That’s totally the same as paying Hamilton $125 mil or more. Totally.

    ————–

    I said it was about money. You were the one that said it was about character issues.

  53. blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:40 am

    austinmac says:
    December 15, 2012 at 9:37 am
    As is usually the case, I approve of Blake’s plan. That team, without a bunch of injuries, could win the division. Only adding a poor outfielder, they have a poor chance, IMO.

    Also solves 3B longterm and gives them a fairly cheap RH bat for 2014 in morse.

    That’s a lot of moving parts for a plan and no clue if they could do that because its dependent on other teams to trade ….but Cash should be exploring things like that

  54. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:42 am

    Ray,

    I agree. Just like folks who act as if the free spending Yankees are remotely in sight. Times have changed. They no longer are willing to exceed the cap. That is the principal and significant change.

  55. raymagnetic December 15th, 2012 at 9:42 am

    “Arod.”

    The stories about A-Rod came out after they resigned him.

    Try again.

  56. Shame Spencer December 15th, 2012 at 9:43 am

    blake – Cash said they didn’t explore any trades at 3B.

    I think Olt is another pipe dream.

  57. Yankee Trader December 15th, 2012 at 9:44 am

    Blake-

    I’m not convinced the Rangers or many other teams will trade a top prospect for Granderson in his walk year. The Rangers wthout Hamilton and Napoli are weaker, but they can use their $$$$ and just sign Swisher and Pierzynski and add LaRoche also and still have a manageable budget.

  58. blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:44 am

    The Yanks are kidding themselves if they think bringing back the same team ( a year older) minus Swisher and Martin with Jeter coming off surgery and Arod having surgery is going to be good enough……

  59. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:45 am

    I don’t know bout you Folks but I was never a fan of false dichotomies.

    For example: Good old player vs. young player.

    Isn’t there such a thing as “good” young player ?

    Yeah. I know. They are either too expensive, or unavailable.

    OK. I surrender. But I can dream, right ?

    ;)

  60. randy l. December 15th, 2012 at 9:45 am

    “Yeah. But good young players are better than good old players.

    That’s the option I’m looking for.”

    mtu-

    you have as much chance of finding a good young offensive player in the bottom of the grand canyon on a hike than you do finding one playing for the the 2013 new york yankees :)

  61. raymagnetic December 15th, 2012 at 9:45 am

    “Ray,

    I agree. Just like folks who act as if the free spending Yankees are remotely in sight. Times have changed. They no longer are willing to exceed the cap. That is the principal and significant change.”

    Good thing I’m not one of those folks.

  62. Shame Spencer December 15th, 2012 at 9:45 am

    raymagnetic December 15th, 2012 at 9:42 am

    “Arod.”

    The stories about A-Rod came out after they resigned him.

    Try again.

    —————-

    Are you serious?? Arod became an egomaniac only after the Yankees signed him??? Arod insulted our captain lol!

    Or do character issues = drug issues? Is that what you’re saying?? If that’s what your saying I would just stick with the drug thing.

  63. blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:46 am

    “I’m not convinced the Rangers or many other teams will trade a top prospect for Granderson in his walk year”

    It’s hard to say….the Indians essentially got Bauer for a Year of Choo…..and apparently the Blue jays are about to give up the best catching prospect in baseball for a year of rA dickey….you just have to find the right match

  64. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:46 am

    Randy-

    I can chosse where and when I choose to hike.

    The other……..

    :(

  65. Shame Spencer December 15th, 2012 at 9:47 am

    Remember when Andy blamed HIS DAD for obtaining HGH for him…? Did George’s ghost come back and resign him as well?

  66. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:47 am

    Sorry Randy. I butchered that one.

    But I think you still got the drift.

    ;)

  67. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:48 am

    Ray,

    Your point is what?

  68. Shame Spencer December 15th, 2012 at 9:49 am

    blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:44 am

    The Yanks are kidding themselves if they think bringing back the same team ( a year older) minus Swisher and Martin with Jeter coming off surgery and Arod having surgery is going to be good enough……

    ———————

    Cash said they usually make most of their moves in January.. my hope is it’s for a C, but if they make a big move for a younger, controlled MLB OFer that would be awesome.

  69. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:51 am

    Cashman said his unfinished work is to find an outfielder. One. Ichiro and Mesa as the platoon outfielder?

  70. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:52 am

    For all the Marines in our audience.

    ” I don’t know but I’ve been told.

    189 is where we go.

    Sound off. 189 !!! Sound off. 189 !!! ”

    Semper Fi. Boo Yah !

    :)

  71. randy l. December 15th, 2012 at 9:53 am

    cashman seems to think the sweet spot in undervalued players is senior league guys like ibanez, kuroda,pettitte, ichiro, etc

    it’s kind of a new moneyball. instead of on base percentage, cashman seems mining the time between injuries that no one else wants to mess with.

    risky strategy fueled by lots of optimism at best, delusion at worst.

  72. blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:53 am

    “Cash said they usually make most of their moves in January.. my hope is it’s for a C, but if they make a big move for a younger, controlled MLB OFer that would be awesome.”

    It just depends on who they give up….Cashman scares me in trades a bit….if they are going to get under the gap and be competitive then that save of position players coming is essential…..unless they can get a proven big leaguer to replace those guys without giving up all of them then it may be counter productive.

    That’s why I just wanted them to sign Hamilton and keep those guys.

    Now if they could pull off an Upton deal while keeping Sanchez and one of Mason/Heathcott then ok…..but I doubt that’s possible.

  73. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:55 am

    Randy-

    It’s the best he seems able to do under the circumstances.

    Talk to Hal.

    ;)

  74. blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:56 am

    The new market inefficiency this winter was signing the guy who tested positive for steroids last year and was available for about 60 million less than he would have gotten…..Im surprised the Rays didnt jump on Melky but another very smart and aggressive GM did instead…..

  75. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 9:56 am

    Or better yet. Talk to Smellig.

    ;)

  76. Shame Spencer December 15th, 2012 at 9:56 am

    randy l. December 15th, 2012 at 9:53 am

    cashman seems to think the sweet spot in undervalued players is senior league guys like ibanez, kuroda,pettitte, ichiro, etc

    it’s kind of a new moneyball. instead of on base percentage, cashman seems mining the time between injuries that no one else wants to mess with.

    risky strategy fueled by lots of optimism at best, delusion at worst.

    ———————-

    Maybe that’s what they’ll do next year.. sign scrap heap guys to be the starters in all the holes and platoon all of them with a MiLB guy. Hope the young guys step up and steal those spots.

  77. Shame Spencer December 15th, 2012 at 9:57 am

    blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:56 am

    The new market inefficiency this winter was signing the guy who tested positive for steroids last year and was available for about 60 million less than he would have gotten…..Im surprised the Rays didnt jump on Melky but another very smart and aggressive GM did instead…..

    ————–

    Character issues.

    We don’t need that when we already have Arod and Andy on our team, two guys that are known cheats! / glib’d

  78. Migs December 15th, 2012 at 10:00 am

    Question…after 2013, will the yanks be willing to spend again?

    Personally, I don’t mind a basic floor/ceiling salary cap…and I am not in panic mode like many on here.

    ajp would be nice for 1yr at 13mill….hairston fits nicely as a RH bat on the bench.

    Other than that, and the usual bargain bin searching, I don’t see much else the Yanks could do in free agency. Wouldn’t sign a lot of these guys to these contracts. as far as the big FAs go, Hamilton at 5yrs may have been the most reasonable, but even then, he will be 32 and has already had issues staying healthy.

    I understand people being annoyed that we probably won’t be a top 5 team in baseball this season, but that happens…I understand the 189 deal, but in saying that, I do hope it changes after 2013.

    Although it would be nice for baseball to have a basic salary cap.

  79. yankee21 December 15th, 2012 at 10:01 am

    Cashman is the master at saying stuff that just doesn’t square with the reality many fans see. Remember his famous words with AJ a couple years back that despite his struggles, people “need to smoke the objective pipe”.

    A thought just sank into me thanks to Cashman, until a couple days ago I didn’t realize the calendar date and that the season didn’t start tomorrow. Wow, the light-bulb went on and I wonder if all of the other teams trying to improve have realized this too? Thank you Brian for your insight and your typical smug condescending rhetoric toward the fans out there, you are too much. You are my hero.

    At this point, NYY is a 87 win team by virtue of their solid SP, excellent RP and the Jeter factor. For them to make the PS in 2013 they need to ramp up the offense big time. Otherwise they will be on the outside looking in and waiting to tee up any useful injuries they can provide as cover for their performance.

    Chad request: please run a survey on this blog and ask contributors on a weekly basis how many wins NYY will have, should be interesting to follow.

  80. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 10:02 am

    Betting on the Farm to come thru in a big way is really betting the “farm”.

    It’s risky buisness. Might even be a bad bet.

    The MLB team will always need to be supplemented from w/o.

    Getting another crop like the “core 4″ ?

    Don’t hold your breath.

    Maybe 1 or 2. Maybe. If they are really lucky.

    ;)

  81. Yankee Trader December 15th, 2012 at 10:02 am

    Blake-

    Again, in a two team deal, what could the Yankees entice Kevin Towers with for Justin Upton with ready or near ready players?

    Another controlled starter?-Phelps?
    Bullpen arm? Robertson?

    The DBacks are now set at every offensive position.

    Yankees would need a 3rd team and would need to sign another FA starter first to be able to sacrifie pitching.

  82. Yankee Trader December 15th, 2012 at 10:06 am

    Have to go.

    Until later.

  83. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 10:06 am

    YT-

    Must be that JU is only one out there.

    :)

  84. jonnycat December 15th, 2012 at 10:07 am

    can someone remind me why is it is absolutely important that the yanks get below 189?

    This goal seems to be causing them to pass up on good talent that would help the team? I don’t understand….the yankees make the most money out of any sports franchise in the world and are being so tight with money.

    Is it that the focus with these guys is just the ‘bottom line’, rather than do anything to win a championship?

    Dont understand

    newbie.

  85. raymagnetic December 15th, 2012 at 10:08 am

    “Are you serious?? Arod became an egomaniac only after the Yankees signed him??? Arod insulted our captain lol!

    Or do character issues = drug issues? Is that what you’re saying?? If that’s what your saying I would just stick with the drug thing.”

    A-Rod never had any off field issues. And yeah, being a drug addict is a HUGE character issue.

  86. blake December 15th, 2012 at 10:08 am

    “Question…after 2013, will the yanks be willing to spend again?”

    No…they are looking to lop about 40 million off the payroll after this year

  87. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 10:09 am

    Houdini himself could not get out of the straightjacket Young Stein has put the Eunuch Cashman in.

    ;)

  88. blake December 15th, 2012 at 10:10 am

    “Again, in a two team deal, what could the Yankees entice Kevin Towers with for Justin Upton with ready or near ready players?”

    Well he has his SS now….

    Perhaps a Granderson/Gardner, Nova/Phelps/Hughes, Mason/Heathcott type deal could interest him…..I dunno

  89. blake December 15th, 2012 at 10:11 am

    “can someone remind me why is it is absolutely important that the yanks get below 189?”

    Cause Hal commands it….

  90. Against All Odds December 15th, 2012 at 10:14 am

    austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:08 am

    We have a huge vacancy in right field. Hamilton would have matched up nicely. Things are not the same. Why does he tell us nothing has changed when they will be, for the first time since the sixties, massively reducing payroll?

    I agree that they are trying the Royals plan of hoping all your prospects pan out. It has worked great for them for the past 20 years.

    ———————

    Do they even realize that banking on a bunch of kids in NY has the possibility of blowing up in their face. This the same place that couldn’t deal with generation trey making starts.

  91. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 10:14 am

    Why would the Yankees want JU anyway ?

    He is a 5 tool player rather than just a big, hairy monster.

    He doesn’t fit in.

    And he’s young also.

    That too.

    ;)

  92. Migs December 15th, 2012 at 10:16 am

    Blake,

    I meant after the 189 thing …I think I made a mistake with the yr since I guess 189 is for 2014…after avoiding that, will they go back to spending…that is what I meant….Michael Kay one day made it seem so.

  93. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 10:17 am

    JU is the only big Tuna in the entire baseball Ocean.

    You all should know that.

    And just how big a “net” are the Yankees using ?

    And just how many holes are in it ?

    Can’t trap a tuna with a minnow net.

    ;)

  94. Against All Odds December 15th, 2012 at 10:17 am

    I do hope it changes after 2013

    ———————–

    It might be worse after 13.

  95. ron December 15th, 2012 at 10:18 am

    If we signed jh,melky,we would not need ichiro,and would be stronger because of it.
    Also trading cano,and granderson could potentially fix our 3b,2b,c,o.f. problems.

    I just don’t get it.

    Combine our own prospects with,what we got from trading cano,granderson,and free agency,and our financial might,we would be sitting on top of the world,while the dodgers are trading all their prospects,struggling with a 250 million payroll.

    We watched the cardinals,and giants win the last 3 ws,the giants 2 out of the last 3 years,with what looked like an ugly offensive team.

    The yankees have no vision when they just can’t spend their problems away.

    We see how almost every longterm contract for players that cross 35 years old turns out.
    We have to platoon every one of our players.
    At what point do we get a new hitting coach???

  96. yankee21 December 15th, 2012 at 10:19 am

    Getting to 189 is a Hal mandate. He cannot use the new CBA as cover because NY did not fight this clause in the CBA. They were a willing party to it. Allow that to sink in for a minute.

    Getting to 189 is a goal though and shouldn’t be a plan. Getting to 189 and competing for championships should be their plan.

    I don’t see them doing that but I really hope I am proven wrong.

  97. jacksquat December 15th, 2012 at 10:20 am

    austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 9:24 am
    Martin’s offense, believe it or not, will be missed when we see the starting catcher with an OPS under .600.

    Nunez is a pretty decent hitter for a middle infielder, but now it is said he may be the primary DH, or at least the DH vs. lefties. I guess that is not a hole either.

    Nunez career vs lhp: .298 .332 .436 .768

    Jones last year: .202 .294 .411 .705

  98. Against All Odds December 15th, 2012 at 10:20 am

    Migs December 15th, 2012 at 10:16 am

    Blake,

    I meant after the 189 thing …I think I made a mistake with the yr since I guess 189 is for 2014…after avoiding that, will they go back to spending…that is what I meant….Michael Kay one day made it seem so.

    ———————–

    Hal wants to field a team that is not expensive. He understands money will be spent on big name guys but his goal is to have a majority of the roster filled with players that don’t make much. whether it’s Generation Trey, the Bs, or the kids in A ball, every yr he mentions young players that will: help them compete on a budget

  99. blake December 15th, 2012 at 10:21 am

    “I meant after the 189 thing …I think I made a mistake with the yr since I guess 189 is for 2014…after avoiding that, will they go back to spending…that is what I meant….Michael Kay one day made it seem so.”

    It just resets their tax rate…..given that the majority of their savings is simply not spending as much Money though I just find it hard to believe they will take the payroll back to where it was.

    Honestly I think they will try to keep the payroll between 185-195 million from here on …..which will avoid taxes and also keep them leaner in case they want to sell

  100. blake December 15th, 2012 at 10:23 am

    What would be hilarious is if Cashman worked out a deal for Upton but Hal vetoed it because of his salary

  101. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 10:23 am

    It’s pretty obvious that for some Hal is an object of scorn and the butt of a lot of jokes.

    All kidding aside I see 2 possibilities :

    1) He is sincerely concerned about getting the Yankees on firm
    financial ground going forward, and intends to keep the team.

    Or

    2) He is just getting the cow fattened up for sale in the next few years
    or so and really has no interest in retaining the Team.

    An argument could be made on either side. Perhaps a good one.

    We all think we know but the real answers will come in a few years.

    Right now. I’m leaning #2 but I’m prepared to be wrong.

    :)

  102. blake December 15th, 2012 at 10:25 am

    “Getting to 189 is a Hal mandate. He cannot use the new CBA as cover because NY did not fight this clause in the CBA. They were a willing party to it. Allow that to sink in for a minute.”

    He’s using it as that though…..JF has shown that they aren’t saving as much money as everyone thinks on the taxes…..the majority of the money they are saving is simply by cutting payroll and they could have done that at any time…..

    .they just didnt have an excuse they could sell to the fans until now

  103. ron December 15th, 2012 at 10:26 am

    I wouldn’t care if we paid cano 30 million a year,but no more than 5 years,and there ns no way on earth we get him for that few imo.
    Cano is 30,and will be 31 after the 2013 season,32 after his first season under his new contract.He is still young,but we are going to miss the bus on the chance to cash in on him,granderson.

    Did we make a Qo to swisher??

    If not,it was a huge mistake.

  104. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 10:28 am

    Jacksquat,

    I hope better than Jones is not the goal. It is an achievable one, however.

  105. yankee21 December 15th, 2012 at 10:28 am

    I will not miss Martin’s offense.

    However, all of the internal candidates competing for a likely starting catcher slot; Romine, Cervelli, Stewart, and Wilson are worse options than Martin in terms of what they offer now offensively, defensively and durability as a package.

    That is why NYY should sign AJP. Instant fix and provides some stability until the transition to Romine, Murphy and Sanchez in the next couple of years hopefully.

  106. Against All Odds December 15th, 2012 at 10:28 am

    .they just didnt have an excuse they could sell to the fans until now

    ———————-

    And guys like Francesa just keep eating it up.

  107. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 10:29 am

    They did make a QO to Swisher.

  108. yankee21 December 15th, 2012 at 10:30 am

    ron, we did make a QO to Swisher, in addition to Soriano and Kuroda.

  109. DONNYBROOK December 15th, 2012 at 10:32 am

    Cashman’s mentioning, “what The Boss would have done”, in relation to the free agents that Hal has passed on, tells you all you need to know. There has been a change in course with the passing of The Boss, and even More importantly, the Yankee FO is sensitive to THIS issue, otherwise Cashman does Not even mention it. People around here feel that the comments expressed on this Blog or public sentiment in general, has No bearing on the Yankee FO. WRONG. The Yankee Hierarchy is Obviously already feeling the heat.
    Those of you that feel that Yankees could Not get much on the trade market for 1yr of Cano, I suggest you look at what Toronto has offered for 1yr of RA Dickey.

  110. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 10:34 am

    Anyone here at LoHud is welcome to join me in my Time Machine which is current set for 4/1/2015. Just have to hit the button.

    My name is Rod Taylor. No need to thank me.

    “Morloks” need not apply. “Eloy” only.

    HG Wells’ed

    :)

  111. yankee21 December 15th, 2012 at 10:34 am

    Cano will absolutely have NY over a barrel in 2013 if he puts up anything close to his typical production.

    I would give Cano 5/140, if he insists on anything more, then I tee him up all over the league as a instant playoff contending option for teams on the fence. He will be the recipient of a bidding war, better to get some players now then 1 draft choice a year from now. Then again that might be too complex for Cash to handle as it may be a distraction from him signing Raul for another hitch in 2013.

    And I can’t even blame Hal for that. Too bad!

  112. ron December 15th, 2012 at 10:36 am

    It works like this: for each year of the labor agreement, the top 15 clubs by market size are disqualified from receiving a growing percentage of net revenue-sharing proceeds they otherwise would have been entitled to. However (and here’s where the Yankees fit in), the CBA provides a clause by which these revenue-sharing funds are rebated for clubs that don’t break the luxury tax ceiling. The percentage of the revenue-sharing rebate that gets penalized if a team breaks the luxury tax ceiling escalates for each consecutive year: 25 percent for the first offense, then 50 percent, 75 percent, and eventually none of it comes back depending on how many years in a row the team blows through the luxury tax ceiling. It’s this escalating tax rate in two locations (the tax you get hit with for going over the luxury tax ceiling on top of the percentage of revenue-sharing held for being a top 15 market club) that can add extra pain to the Yankees’ wallet.

    http://6-4-2.blogspot.com/2012.....-must.html

  113. blake December 15th, 2012 at 10:41 am

    “And guys like Francesa just keep eating it up.”

    It’s worked to a large degree…. A lot of folks have bout it so far…..we will see what happens if they stop winning games

  114. Chip December 15th, 2012 at 10:44 am

    If the Mets are really getting d’Arnaud and Gose for RA then the Yankees HAVE to put Cano on the block – he would bring back a ton!

  115. blake December 15th, 2012 at 10:44 am

    “I would give Cano 5/140, if he insists on anything more, then I tee him up all over the league as a instant playoff contending option for teams on the fence”

    If he has a typical Cano season and stays healthy then he’s gonna get 200 million…..I can almost guarantee it….too many teams will be in play and his agent is simply too good with elite players.

    Boras may over play his hand at times with the 2nd tier guys….. But he ALWAYS gets his elite clients paid….and with both LA teams….the Yankees…. The Rangers, Tigers , Nats, Phillies…..all in play….he’s gonna get a fortune

  116. Against All Odds December 15th, 2012 at 10:45 am

    If they stop winning games then that’s when the real fun starts. I just wish a guy like JF could get a chance to explain the ins and outs on a larger scale. Maybe when Cashman has his breakfast thing with Mike this will be addressed more in depth.

  117. Against All Odds December 15th, 2012 at 10:46 am

    Chip December 15th, 2012 at 10:44 am

    If the Mets are really getting d’Arnaud and Gose for RA then the Yankees HAVE to put Cano on the block – he would bring back a ton!

    ——————–

    If they are getting those two guys it probably means some guys are going along with RA

  118. ron December 15th, 2012 at 10:47 am

    The Collective Bargaining Agreement signed by the MLBPA & Ownership is what governs the interactions between players & management in Major League Baseball. Last offseason a new CBA was signed which introduced new wrinkles into the luxury tax agreement that has the Yankees attempting to get under the limit for the first time in a decade. Here are the basics:
    1.The luxury tax limit for 2013 is $178,000,000. For 2014-2016 it is $189,000,000.
    2.There is a new revenue sharing refund program which forces teams who are in the 15 largest markets to refund their revenue sharing if they were eligible in increasing proportions until they refund 100% in 2016. The Yankees pay around 27.5% of all revenue sharing each season, and would get some of that back thanks to the disqualification program. The teams who are going to pay back as of now are the Athletics, Braves, Nationals, and Blue Jays. They receive around 23% of all revenue sharing.
    3.The amount of refunded money the Yankees receives is based on how many consecutive years they have crossed the luxury tax threshold. 100% if they were not over the limit in the previous year. 75% if this year is the 2nd year they have gone over the limit. 50% if this year is the 3rd they have gone over the limit. 25% if this year is the 4th year they have gone over the limit. 0% if this year is the 5th (or more) year they have gone over the limit. If the Yankees did not go over the luxury tax for 2014-2016 they would receive 11.65% of their revenue sharing back in 2014, 17.47% in 2015, and 23.3% in 2016. This assumes the same teams above will continue to receive revenue sharing.
    4.The payroll value used to check against the luxury tax limit is not simply the sum of the team’s season contract values. Payroll figures like those found on ESPN or COTS MLB Contracts are not the number that is used to determine payroll. Payroll is the sum of: 1 year contract values of everyone on the 40 man roster, the annual average value of multi-year contracts including bonuses/player options/buy outs of non-player options, cash considerations from trades, single season salary escalators or bonuses (such as MVP bonuses/games played bonuses), any amount deductible or includible based on specific player events, and a 1/30th share of player benefits.
    5.Beginning in 2013, the amount of luxury tax a team pays will be changed to the following: 17.5% for first time offenders, 30% for second, 40% for third, 50% for fourth or more. A team which did not go over in the previous year will reset to the 17.5% amount if they go over again. This tax is only paid on the marginal overage, meaning if your payroll as calculated above is 190 you would pay tax on the $1 million not $190 million.
    6.The 1/30th share of player benefits is $10,799,590 for 2013, and will increase or stay the same for 2014.

    http://itsaboutthemoney.net/ar.....e-yankees/

  119. Doreen December 15th, 2012 at 10:52 am

    randy l -

    Girardi is pretty good with resting guys – ARod particularly, was on a rest schedule. But I agree that especially with Mr. Derek Jeter, Girardi just has to stand up to him at this point. You know its a fight every time.

    BTW – enjoyed your post yesterday, and would that I could run away sometimes and come back when things are better!

    You know last year, when CC was signed, I made some assumptions about what the Yankees would and would not do from that point forward. I even made an investment in that assumption with a certain Xmas gift for my daughter who was a fan of a particular young player. I was literally shocked at how the off-season developed. So, this year, I have no assumptions. Que sera, sera.

  120. jacksquat December 15th, 2012 at 10:54 am

    I would have Jeter DH vs lhp and have Nunez play SS those days.

  121. RadioKev December 15th, 2012 at 10:56 am

    blake December 15th, 2012 at 9:34 am
    The Yankees shouldn’t play this half way….. Either go ALL in for 2013 or trade the guys you can’t keep beyond this year.
    ——–

    You know Blake, I used to think the same. Either go all the way in competing or all the way in rebuilding. But then again, we’ve seen so many imperfect teams be successful. The last three World Series winners. The Orioles, the A’s, the Cardinals from last year. Teams are competing for the title with less than perfect rosters.

    The A’s and the Orioles, for example, got to the playoffs on the strength of their pitching. Can’t we still do the same next season?

  122. Doreen December 15th, 2012 at 10:57 am

    Oh, and earlier I had started a post and got distracted, so never submitted it, but basically, while it may look like the roster is not being constructed as a team playing to win, I offer to you that the players on the field have something to say about that. This team has some seasoned veteran players who are determined and want to win. Now, can will overcome whatever issues they may have? I think it did last year. Can it happen again? Don’t know. Just know that I can’t count the players on the field out.

    And perhaps they play will a chip on their shoulder. Sometimes it’s good to be counted so far out so early.

  123. RadioKev December 15th, 2012 at 10:59 am

    Man, those playoffs were frustrating. We had the pitching to go all the way. Really some of the best efforts I’ve ever seen from the organization. We also just saw the absolute worst case scenario with the bats.

  124. DONNYBROOK December 15th, 2012 at 10:59 am

    NO reason to put Jeet on some kinda AARP schedule. Once he’s cleared by the Doc, occasional rest should be sufficient to keep him hitting-on-all-8.

  125. blake December 15th, 2012 at 11:02 am

    Chip says:
    December 15, 2012 at 10:44 am
    If the Mets are really getting d’Arnaud and Gose for RA then the Yankees HAVE to put Cano on the block – he would bring back a ton!

    Should probably ask anyway…..they don’t have the stones

  126. jacksquat December 15th, 2012 at 11:03 am

    DONNYBROOK December 15th, 2012 at 10:59 am
    NO reason to put Jeet on some kinda AARP schedule. Once he’s cleared by the Doc, occasional rest should be sufficient to keep him hitting-on-all-8.

    Yeah, that worked out well in the end last year…

  127. Against All Odds December 15th, 2012 at 11:05 am

    We also just saw the absolute worst case scenario with the bats.

    ————————

    I don’t buy that at all. The offense had issues all yr.

  128. DONNYBROOK December 15th, 2012 at 11:06 am

    You get down to it, it’s hard to recall the last time the Yanks traded away 1 of their Starting 8. This goes to being Creative and having Balls. Guys like Cashman are stuck for an answer when someone says Hello.

  129. RadioKev December 15th, 2012 at 11:07 am

    blake December 15th, 2012 at 11:02 am
    Chip says:
    December 15, 2012 at 10:44 am
    If the Mets are really getting d’Arnaud and Gose for RA then the Yankees HAVE to put Cano on the block – he would bring back a ton!

    Should probably ask anyway…..they don’t have the stones
    ———

    Yeah :-/

  130. blake December 15th, 2012 at 11:08 am

    “The Orioles, the A’s, the Cardinals from last year. Teams are competing for the title with less than perfect rosters.”

    What’s the difference in those teams and the Yankees though? 1) age, those teams are young and are building towards something 2) expectations , they aren’t the Yankees.

    None of those teams are facing a closing window lien the Yankees are…..i

  131. DONNYBROOK December 15th, 2012 at 11:11 am

    You DH Jeet vs lefties, and your talkin’ roughly 50 games. That’s knee jerk.

  132. randy l. December 15th, 2012 at 11:12 am

    doreen -

    i think it’s more than juts a rest schedule within a 162 games season. i think jeter would be a much better player come playoff time if he played a 100 game season. dhing when not playing shortstop is really not a day off. same with alex.

    i wouldn’t even start mariano until middle of may. make it a short season.

    the players would hate it. they want to play. i remember running into jim palmer when he was making a comeback with the orioles and he was throwing well touching 90 supposedly. he was feeling great i had read. i knew this was the pattern of the
    old guys i had caught in the senior league.
    they’d feel great for a few weeks and then whammo , a hammy, or some groing pull, or rib cage strain.
    i told palmer that he was going too fast and should dial it back for a few weeks or he was going to get hurt. he looked at me kind of amused because he was was jim palmer and i was like a no name bullpen catcher. he was polite, but said thanks, that he knew what he was doing.
    a few days later he snapped an achilles or something and comeback over.

    injuries go hand in hand with older players. it’s like driving an old car. it might be a classic, but you’d better have a triple AAA card, because you’re gonna need towing.

    yankees could make a run with old players, but they better have a strategy for dealing with the injuries.

  133. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 11:14 am

    Cashman was right about one thing.

    Many things, if not all, run in cycles.

    Trouble is I don’t think of the Yankees in the same way I do my “Whirlpool”. It’s easily replaced.

    ;)

  134. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 11:16 am

    Randy-

    Geritol and ace bandages.

    :)

  135. blake December 15th, 2012 at 11:16 am

    For Cano….if they could get

    Nats: Rendon , Espinosa , Morse , etc
    Tigers: Castellanos , Romdon, Porcello etc
    Mariners: Zunino, Ackely et

    Then they should think about it…..but as I said…. They don’t have the stones to deal Cano….it’d be a public admission that they won’t pay him and are punting 2013

  136. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 11:17 am

    Yes, surprise teams can win in the playoffs. My first concern is getting there, and I prefer increasing ones chances.

  137. jacksquat December 15th, 2012 at 11:18 am

    I think it’s very likely they are going to try to sign Cano next year no matter how much the Dodgers or others run the price up. Without Cano you are left with a Tex/Arod middle of the order. I don’t see any free agent bats for 2014 that would be a suitable #3 Yankee hitter. Trading for a #3 hitter seems pretty unlikely. Prepare yourselves for 8/200.

  138. RMS December 15th, 2012 at 11:18 am

    Cano is the best player on the Yankees. Don’t think they will trade him.

  139. 4 NYY December 15th, 2012 at 11:19 am

    Don’t forget folks, we’ve got Bobby Wilson now !!! BUC’s galore !!! It’s over now !!!

  140. randy l. December 15th, 2012 at 11:21 am

    the weird thing is the yankees had to know this new CBA thing was coming , and yet they traded away their young cost controlled players like melky, austin jackson,montero,ian kennedy, etc.

    hal is the bad guy right now, but wtf was cashman thinking knowing this austerity crap was coming. what kind of a moron trades for a granderson when he knows he can’t sign him. that trade only made sense if granderson signed another yankee contract.

    cashman has screwed up royally by playing his cards the way he did.

    this is on cashman as much as hal.

  141. 4 NYY December 15th, 2012 at 11:21 am

    RMS December 15th, 2012 at 11:18 am
    Cano is the best player on the Yankees. Don’t think they will trade him.

    —————————————-

    Agent will be asking for the moon. Would you trade him or just lose him ?

  142. ron December 15th, 2012 at 11:21 am

    “Then they should think about it…..but as I said…. They don’t have the stones to deal Cano….it’d be a public admission that they won’t pay him and are punting 2013

    This is why signing a hamilton,and melky would eliminate those fears,and they’d get back a pretty haul.

    It would potentially fix every positional problem we have.

    3b,2b,o.f.,c,and maybe even a pitcher,if we threw granderson,and maybe hughes on the block.
    It might of even allowed us to persue anibal sanchez,or another pitcher.

  143. jacksquat December 15th, 2012 at 11:21 am

    DONNYBROOK December 15th, 2012 at 11:11 am
    You DH Jeet vs lefties, and your talkin’ roughly 50 games. That’s knee jerk.

    No, that’s 39 year old ankle broken.

  144. Against All Odds December 15th, 2012 at 11:23 am

    4NYY December 15th, 2012 at 11:21 am

    RMS December 15th, 2012 at 11:18 am
    Cano is the best player on the Yankees. Don’t think they will trade him.

    —————————————-

    Agent will be asking for the moon. Would you trade him or just lose him ?

    ——————————

    I’d rather sign him and keep spending because we all know they have more than enough money to do it.

  145. 4 NYY December 15th, 2012 at 11:23 am

    Without the money to spend, Cash is not king !

  146. RadioKev December 15th, 2012 at 11:24 am

    What’s the difference in those teams and the Yankees though? 1) age, those teams are young and are building towards something 2) expectations , they aren’t the Yankees.

    None of those teams are facing a closing window lien the Yankees are…..i
    ————-

    Well, that is the difference, but that doesn’t change the Yankees chances of competing this season, does it? Those teams are also in transition, and they might get to their prime faster than the Yankees will, mostly because they’ve been in transition longer. Not really an enviable position.

    If everything goes right for the Yankees we could see a new core running at around 2015. That’s really not a bad position to be in. Especially if we CAN compete in these next two years.

  147. DONNYBROOK December 15th, 2012 at 11:24 am

    With the $189 Mill goal, NO WAY the Yanks sign Cano. “Book ‘em, Dano”.

  148. 4 NYY December 15th, 2012 at 11:25 am

    Against All Odds December 15th, 2012 at 11:23 am
    4NYY December 15th, 2012 at 11:21 am

    RMS December 15th, 2012 at 11:18 am
    Cano is the best player on the Yankees. Don’t think they will trade him.

    —————————————-

    Agent will be asking for the moon. Would you trade him or just lose him ?

    ——————————

    I’d rather sign him and keep spending because we all know they have more than enough money to do it.
    ———————————————————-

    True, but they ain’t doin’ that .

  149. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 11:26 am

    Maybe some of it Randy.

    Either way Cashman has been publically neutered at this point.

    He has been turned into a Gelding. Not much respect given there.

    So Hal might agree with you.

    Trouble is no one knows for sure what young Stein’s future intentions are either.

    He has not given Cashman any latitiude to proceed.

    Just chump change. Guess he thinks that’s appropriate for Cashman.

    Personally, I don’t think he’s that bad, and in a few more years Hal might turn out to be the villian.

    Guess we’ll see.

    ;)

  150. 4 NYY December 15th, 2012 at 11:26 am

    DONNYBROOK December 15th, 2012 at 11:24 am
    With the $189 Mill goal, NO WAY the Yanks sign Cano. “Book ‘em, Dano”.

    =====================

    Booked

  151. jacksquat December 15th, 2012 at 11:27 am

    randy l. December 15th, 2012 at 11:12 am
    doreen -

    i think it’s more than juts a rest schedule within a 162 games season. i think jeter would be a much better player come playoff time if he played a 100 game season. dhing when not playing shortstop is really not a day off. same with alex.

    It’s not a full day off, but DH’ing is much less stress than bouncing around at SS or 3B, accelerating, stopping, pivoting, pushing off, fielding bunts, jumping over sliding runners, chasing pop flys, etc.

  152. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 11:27 am

    sp: villain

  153. ron December 15th, 2012 at 11:27 am

    Trade your great players before they drain your resources,keep your good prospects,get top prospects in return,sign the right free agents.
    Imagine if the rays could spend 189 million.

    If mason williams turns into a great cf,i’d run him through the arbitration system,get the best years out of him,then trade him for a haul.
    This is what the rays do.
    They know the perfect time to trade a player,and maximize the return,keeping in mind that because they no longer draft at number one,they side step that by trading the right players at the right time.
    What value will cano have making 25 million a year for the next 7 years?

  154. RadioKev December 15th, 2012 at 11:32 am

    This is what the rays do.
    They know the perfect time to trade a player,and maximize the return,keeping in mind that because they no longer draft at number one,they side step that by trading the right players at the right time.
    ———–

    The Rays likely knocked themselves out of AL East competition this season when they could have kept pushing for a title. That’s the drawback.

  155. blake December 15th, 2012 at 11:33 am

    “Well, that is the difference, but that doesn’t change the Yankees chances of competing this season, does it? ”

    No….the Yanks can compete this year but they need to pick a lane….either be 100% all in this year ( get a catcher , try to get a legit RH bat) …..or start positioning themselves for the future so they can open a new window faster.

    IMO just keeping the status quo and seeing what happens is he worse option…..

  156. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 11:37 am

    SJ no longer comes around here.

    And he could be very reactive, and call you out in a heartbeat.

    But one thing I never doubted about him was his knowledge of the buisness side of the game.

    He had an insiders perspective.

    His nephew Tony, a promising player in his own right was, ascending rapidly through the Pirates MiLB system reinforcing his knowledge even further.

    I was very grateful to him for sharing that knowledge and experience.

    One thing that was seared into to my memory from speaking with SJ was the Parent club’s view of prospects, and how “they” tended to see them as opposed to the Fan.

    It was very different. Most prospects are thought of as trade chips and nothing more.

    The odds of making the Majors and becoming a valuable player.

    Very small.

    That insight, provided by SJ, has stayed with me and still colors how I see prospects.

    Most are designated to be traded for other needs.

    Very few are true “keepers”, or “untouchables”.

    It’s up to the Yankees to know which ones are. It’s essential.

    My apologies for the long post.

  157. ron December 15th, 2012 at 11:39 am

    We don’t know if the rays are worse,or better.

    “The jewel of the deal for Tampa Bay is undoubtedly Myers, who turned 22 on Monday.

    The power-hitting outfielder batted .314 with 37 homers and 109 RBIs in 134 games at Northwest Arkansas and Triple-A Omaha, and eventually could help provide some protection in the batting order for Rays star Evan Longoria. Myers showed what he could do during the All-Star Futures Game hosted by Kansas City in July, when he had a pair of hits and drove in three runs at Kauffman Stadium.

    He’ll finally get a chance to prove it at the major league level at Tropicana Field.

    “I think it’s very possible that Wil Myers and Jake Odorizzi will help us win games in 2013, and Mike Montgomery as well,” Friedman said.

    Odorizzi will also have an opportunity to make a splash in the big leagues after going 15-5 with a 3.03 ERA for Northwest Arkansas and Omaha. He made two late-season starts for Kansas City, going 0-1 with a 4.91 ERA in 7 1/3 innings.

    Montgomery was once considered one of the Royals’ top prospects, but his stock has slid considerably the past couple of years. He was just 5-13 with a 6.07 ERA last season, when he was demoted from Omaha to Northwest Arkansas.

    Leonard hit .251 with 14 homers and 46 RBIs in 62 games for short-season Burlington”

    The rays got a nice haul,and meyers could be a very big bat in the middle of their lineup..

  158. randy l. December 15th, 2012 at 11:39 am

    “It’s not a full day off, but DH’ing is much less stress than bouncing around at SS or 3B, accelerating, stopping, pivoting, pushing off, fielding bunts, jumping over sliding runners, chasing pop flys, etc.”

    you’d think so , but an aging athlete doesn’t warm up that fast after a certain point. often they are going into an at bat without being that loose. it’s easy to strain something.

    when you hit a certain point in age once you get warmed up you’d better play when you can because once you cool down you’re toast.

  159. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 11:40 am

    So I say.

    “keep the best. trade the rest.”

    ;)

  160. RMS December 15th, 2012 at 11:41 am

    Agent will be asking for the moon. Would you trade him or just lose him ?

    ——————————————————————————————————-
    Mo, Andy, Kuroda, Grandy will be off the books. They need to sign Cano, their best player.

  161. DONNYBROOK December 15th, 2012 at 11:44 am

    How many Championships have The Rays won??? Let’s Not get carried away.

  162. randy l. December 15th, 2012 at 11:49 am

    “The Rays likely knocked themselves out of AL East competition this season when they could have kept pushing for a title. ”

    i don’t see that at all. they planned on getting rid of shields a year ago. the kid archer is ready.

    the rays unlike the yankees seem to make a plan and stick to it.

    what a concept to actually getting a pitcher mlb ready at the minor league level to replace a high price veteran and getting impressive cost controlled young offensive players back.

  163. ron December 15th, 2012 at 11:50 am

    Imo,baseball prospects will start to blossom earlier now,and going forward like the nfl,nba,nhl.
    We seen it with trout,stratsburg,harper,etc…

    Mlb has just so many more levels of complexity than any other sport,but i think younger players are a priceless commodity.
    Remember,pujols,arod,mays,ruth,mantle,and the list goes on forever,were all prospects at one time,and when drafting it is very hard to find that gem.

    I think the yankees should spend whatever is needed on scouts to find the best players in the world,then development is right there with drafting.
    Then knowing when,and how to say goodbye to the cano’s,etc…

    Right now,and moreso a few weeks ago,the yankees had,or have a great opportunity to trade for some real prospects,fixing a lot of holes,while still competing,wich is a fear that is going to hurt them deeply.
    The fear of not competing the next few years in paralizing them.

  164. blake December 15th, 2012 at 11:52 am

    “Mo, Andy, Kuroda, Grandy will be off the books. They need to sign Cano, their best player.”

    Ok….so assuming they must stick to the luxury tax budget.

    They have about 100 million on the books for 2014 now when you add up everything…..Cano would put them at about 125 for tax purposes for 5 players…..

    Can they fill out the entire rest of the roster with like 60 million bucks? Sure they can…..but remember that Gardner and Robertson and Nova and some of these guys will be making real money in arbitration by then and they will have a ton of roster spots to fill…..

    Cano is going to get 200 million if he stays healthy…..so the question is should they sign him to a huge deal (most of which will be part his prime) or should they plan on trading him or letting him gnand spreading that money around ?

  165. 86w183 December 15th, 2012 at 11:52 am

    The Yanks can get to $ 189 AND sign Cano.

    Cano + Adams/Joseph in 2014 is cheaper than Cano + Youkilis in 2013.

    They have to cut roughly $ 40 M and that’s basically when Pettitte + Kuroda + Rivera will cost. So they key to $ 189 is Getting Phelps, Pineda and Montomgery to fill those roles.

    See! Wasn’t that easy?

    If I were Cashman I’d call my old pal in Seattle and see if he had an interest in Granderson. They desperately need bats and it’s hard for them to entice free agents. If there was any chance to get my hands on Mike Zunino I’d do it.

  166. MTU December 15th, 2012 at 11:53 am

    The current financial climate creates a disincentive for many teams to spend over the 189 mil.

    Most, but not all, are on the bandwagon to avoid going over.

    That means spending less and spending wiser.

    It goes w/o saying that in years past that would not have mattered to the Yankees.

    But it does now.

    The Yankees have tried to compensate by rebuilding the Farm, shortening the length of contracts, and letting some expensive players walk.

    The Team is in transition whether openly stated or not. We all know that.

    Problem is that the Yankee are not used to being a team that operates in that fashion.

    They are learning to be a development team but they can never fully embrace becoming one for various reasons.

    What that means is do not ever expect the Yankees to become the Rays, or the Twins.

    It is not happening.

    Mistakes are, and will continue to be , made in transition.

    I think the Yankees will right themselves eventually.

    After all, they are greatest sports franchise in the World.

    We know that too !

    I apologize again for the length.

    I have to run.

    See ya all later.

    :)

  167. blake December 15th, 2012 at 11:56 am

    “The Yanks can get to $ 189 AND sign Cano.”

    Sure they can….they question is should they

  168. blake December 15th, 2012 at 11:57 am

    The only chance they could get Zunino would be if they traded Cano

  169. randy l. December 15th, 2012 at 11:58 am

    “If I were Cashman I’d call my old pal in Seattle and see if he had an interest in Granderson. They desperately need bats and it’s hard for them to entice free agents. If there was any chance to get my hands on Mike Zunino I’d do it.”

    yeah, cashman usually fleeces seattle on deals. let’s try another one. good idea.

    your best chance getting your hands on zunino is going to spring training in arizona next spring and when he’s leaning up against some chain link fence waiting to hit tap him on the shoulder.

  170. blake December 15th, 2012 at 11:58 am

    @JimBowdenESPNxm: Sandy Alderson’s deals with Carlos Beltran and now RA Dickey are the absolute maximum possible returns PERIOD!!

    True if this deal goes through

  171. blake December 15th, 2012 at 11:59 am

    Cano for Zunino, Ackley , and MONTERO!

  172. Against All Odds December 15th, 2012 at 12:01 pm

    4 NYY December 15th, 2012 at 11:25 am

    Against All Odds December 15th, 2012 at 11:23 am
    4NYY December 15th, 2012 at 11:21 am

    RMS December 15th, 2012 at 11:18 am
    Cano is the best player on the Yankees. Don’t think they will trade him.

    —————————————-

    Agent will be asking for the moon. Would you trade him or just lose him ?

    ——————————

    I’d rather sign him and keep spending because we all know they have more than enough money to do it.
    ———————————————————-

    True, but they ain’t doin’ that .

    ————–

    No they ain’t

  173. austinmac December 15th, 2012 at 12:25 pm

    86w183,

    The Yankees need to cut $40 million. Signing Cano and having Adams at third doesn’t reduce the payroll. They would be at or over $100 million on four players, leaving $70 million for the rest including Jeter.

    They had to know at least a year before the CBA was signed something similar was happening. Yet, they did not take a single step,that I can see to deal with it.

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