Risk-reward: Nunez leaves Yankees with a hard choice
Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Jan 17, 2013 
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If only Eduardo Nunez had made this easy for the Yankees, he might have been exactly the right player at exactly the right time. This would be a perfect moment for a young, offensive-minded utility infielder to fill a hole at third base and give Derek Jeter occasional rest at shortstop. Nunez could ease his way into steady playing time while the Yankees ease Jeter toward retirement.
If only he’d made it so easy.
Of course, there’s been nothing easy about Nunez. His current role is hard to define and his ultimate upside hard to imagine. Like Will wrote this morning, the Yankees still don’t know whether Nunez is a future shortstop, a utility infielder or a Triple-A standout. He might be nothing more than inevitable trade bait. Will thinks it’s time to find out — and I tend to agree — but isn’t that what the Yankees tried to do the past two years? The real question is whether the bumps along the way are going to be worth it.
This morning, Will brought up two shortstops for comparison, and although I’m not sure I buy the Alcides Escobar comparison — too good defensively, always considered a much bigger prospect than Nunez – the Ian Desmond comparison is interesting because it just might work as an extreme best-case scenario.
Both Nunez and Desmond had minor league careers dotted with 30-plus-error seasons. After Desmond made his major league debut with a handful of games in 2009, Baseball America wrote this: Desmond is capable of making spectacular plays, but he must improve his concentration to cut down on errors on routine plays. Doesn’t that sound familiar? Desmond made 34 errors as the Nationals regular shortstop in 2010, then 23 errors in 2011, then 15 in 2012. He was a career .262/.304/.387 hitter through 1,191 big league at-bats before he exploded at age 26 for 25 homers and an .845 OPS last year.
Can Nunez make the same improvements and take the same offensive leap forward? I have no idea. Neither do the Yankees. As I said earlier, Desmond seems to be an extreme best-case scenario. The extreme worst-case scenario has something to do with lost ballgames and Jay-Z filing a lawsuit after he’s hit in the head by a horrific throw into the seats.
If regular playing time will make Nunez consistent and productive, then the bumps along the way might be worth it. If not, the bumps will be nothing more than ugly opportunities to lose games. Nunez has never made this easy, and so the Yankees have to make their choice. Are you curious to find out what he can become, or are you ready to cut bait and let someone else take the risk?
Associated Press photo
http://t.co/srJxkKfs
I think this link is fitting for this thread
blake January 17th, 2013 at 2:37 pm
http://t.co/srJxkKfs
I think this link is fitting for this thread
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*sigh*
……………..
*adds gif to photobucket account for future use*
“I didn’t think the package the M’s offered was quite what we thought it would be though….. they may have put themselves in a position to have to take lesser value for him or just keep him.”
Some saw it as an overpay…..I saw it as pretty fair. The Mariners were giving nothing of great value off their big league roster and were giving a high upside pitching prospect who struggled in AA as the headliner…..
I actually remember that play and remember just busting out laughing….I was like….come on Nunie make the recovery……nice…..ohhhhh my
To say that Nunez could have made easy for them minimizes how poorly the Yankees have developed him for the role they apparently want for him. He has never received sufficient mL or ML PT at multiple positions so that he can be competent, and he always has to look over his shoulder in fear of being removed if he messes up. So it has become a vicious, unproductive cycle.
Yea Im not sure how the Yanks expected Nunez to just magically be able to play 4 positions when he had trouble playing 1…..
Towers always wants to compete now….what team can offer a player to replace Upton now better than Granderson and also supplement him with prospects? The question there though would be trading Granderson and prospects for Upton actually be wise? I guess it depends which prospects…..if rather keep Granderson and have then both or move him in a sepetate deal for other stuff they need
Brandon McCarthy?
In 2013 you can sit on a plane 30k feet in the sky and see an instant baseball replay. On earth we still can’t figure that out apparently.
Of course the Dbacks already have too many outfielders…..
Expanded replay on hold until 2014?
http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_.....e-baseball
pat says:
January 17, 2013 at 2:49 pm
Brandon McCarthy?
In 2013 you can sit on a plane 30k feet in the sky and see an instant baseball replay. On earth we still can’t figure that out apparently.
Oh we can see the replays fine….it’s getting bud to let the umpires look at them that’s the problem
Rich,
I couldn’t agree with you more. Nunez’s problem is he walks out on the diamond knowing if he throws away one to 1b Girardi will bench him. I think he actually plays with the most pressure of anyone on the team because his margin for error is so small. Granted, he caused that by being sloppy in the field, but the Yankees are complicit in this because they jerked him around from month to month.
Cashman declaring him a UTIF was utterly obnoxious. Less than a year ago, you banish the kid to the minors and claim he’ll only be a SS and since then he’s played nothing other than SS and now he’s back to UTIF status?
It’s laughable.
I’m a Nunez fan, although I would’ve traded him for Cliff Lee to Seattle way back when.
That said, the way the Yankees have treated him is wrong. He better get reps all over the field in the spring and they better be patient with him. He hasn’t been playing the other IF positions competitively at the major league level for more than a year now.
blake January 17th, 2013 at 2:48 pm
Towers always wants to compete now….what team can offer a player to replace Upton now better than Granderson and also supplement him with prospects?
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But what part of the M’s package would have helped them this year? I’m genuinely asking because I know nothing about their players and wasn’t sure what levels any of them were at.
but isn’t that what the Yankees tried to do the past two years?
No. He has never really gotten consistent play and has been bounced around between multiple positions. The Yankees have no patience with the errors.
Play him at SS vs lhp and get Jeter plenty of rest from bouncing around in the field. Then he justifies his place on the roster as part time SS and one side of the DH platoon.
Alexi Ramierez was a nightmare defensively when he first came up…. Nunez reminds me of him a little and I’ve said this before….but they just let him play and eventually he became acceptable.
Nunez isn’t a natural defender….the footwork just doesn’t seem to come naturally to him….Burke does have the speed and arm strength to make it work maybe if he was given enough time…..because of Jeter and just because they are the Yankees they are unlikely to do that and at 26 there may not be time left anyways…..
“But what part of the M’s package would have helped them this year? I’m genuinely asking because I know nothing about their players and wasn’t sure what levels any of them were at.”
The relievers….Franklin is close but both he and Walker need more minor league time …..that’s why I think he’d do a prospect deal….even if some of the pieces are a couple years away
WTF.. how do any of these guys have jobs. We’d make a better talk radio station, guys!
“I have not read the Deadspin story… I don’t read any stories on the Internet.” -@maddogunleashed, Chris Russo
I was thinking about last year when trisha did her poll on how many games we predicted the Yankees would win I said 102 and I wasn’t kidding.
Right now, with this team? I’m predicting 90 wins and that’s with a lot of good breaks coming their way. A big injury will decimate this team this year. There’s just no depth.
blake – Click this: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/.....lp00000003
Nunez has a career major league OPS of .701 and a career minor league OPS of .679.
He may be “offensive minded” but he hasn’t been particularly successful offensively, even for a utility fielder.
I agree the Yankees handling of Nunez has been baffling. Confidence is everything. Yet, they destroy it with every word and deed.
He has always reminded me of Alexei Ramirez on the White Sox. Give him a chance to play lots in the spring. Tell him he is a key part of the team. Let’s see what we have.
Yeah, I was at 97 last season. As of now, I am 89-91, similar to G. Love.
Blake,
I deny I stole your Ramirez thought. It was mine I tell you, all mine.
I think the Yanks are an 85-90 win team right now…..I honestly don’t know if 95 wins is there again even if things go perfect…..they’d really really have to pitch well and have some guys bounce back
@Ken_Rosenthal: Cody Ross in ’12: 22 HRs, 528 PAs, 113 OPS+. Scott Hairston: 20 HRs, 398 PAs, 117 OPS+. Ross: $26M. Hairston, also 32, isn’t worth $8M/2?
Last yea I had them at 98 wins, I think. I put them at 85-88 wins, and that is if Jeter and Mo return healthy. Absolutely, no depth on a team with such age.
Some claim we are pessimists. It is not that we are pessimistic after looking at last year’s optimistic forecasts. We are realistic. This team is worse than the team we saw at the end of last year.
When Hal says going all in, I now understand he means. It is going all in his pocket.
Logan, Robertson + minor league guys for Upton….???
Bacon lovers (I should not have singled out blake, so I apologize!): http://www.huffingtonpost.com/.....lp00000003
“austinmac says:
January 17, 2013 at 3:08 pm
Blake,
I deny I stole your Ramirez thought. It was mine I tell you, all mine. ”
Yea the similarities are obvious….kinda that wirey but awkward movement etc….
Rosenthal needs to look at all of Hairston’s preceding years of being a very marginal player. I don’t think he learned to play at 32. He had a career year.
Shame Spencer says:
January 17, 2013 at 3:14 pm
Logan, Robertson + minor league guys for Upton….???
I think it’ll take at least two of the (Mason, Sanchez, Heathcott, Austin) bunch….then a couple of big league pieces or guys that are close…..maybe a phelps/Nova or Montgomery or an Adams or Nunez etc…..it might even take more than that .
I think Ross was over paid too
I’d put them at 90-93… if the pitching stays healthy they have a shot. If Andy goes down for an extended period of time and Nova/Phelps fall apart, I dunno…
I know it’s a slow day, but you might wanna hold off on the Yankee W projections, until the holes get filled. Then again, some of you do like hangin’ out at the Waffle House.
Dear Hal,
Thank you for encouraging us and telling us that the team wasn’t done. We vaguely understand the season is not tomorrow, but it is approaching.
Please let Mr. Cashman have his phone privileges back(no personal calls allowed on company time), and tell him he is given permission to improve the team.
Austinmac
blake January 17th, 2013 at 3:16 pm
Shame Spencer says:
January 17, 2013 at 3:14 pm
Logan, Robertson + minor league guys for Upton….???
I think it’ll take at least two of the (Mason, Sanchez, Heathcott, Austin) bunch….then a couple of big league pieces or guys that are close…..maybe a phelps/Nova or Montgomery or an Adams or Nunez etc…..it might even take more than that .
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Seems like in that deal we’d be paying more than the M’s.. my ignorance of their system and those players effs up my chances of coming up with a similar package though.
Heathcott, Austin, Phelps/Nova, Montgomery, Robertson?
I won’t put Mason and Heathcott in the same deal.
“When Hal says going all in, I now understand he means. It is going all in his pocket.”
I am holding out hope that his wife will sway him at some point. If you saw the 2009 parade/City Hall ceremony, she looked absolutely enthralled to be on stage with the stars, swaying to the sounds of “Empire State of Mind.”
That won’t happen again any time soon if Hal wants to keep costs at or below the threshold while rejecting cost-controlling extensions (per RAB), even if they do start to develop and integrate major young talent on to the ML roster.
I have been waiting since October for the holes to be filled while all potential fillers sign elsewhere. I don’t think Juan Rivera is going to change the win total.
DONNYBROOK says:
January 17, 2013 at 3:20 pm
I know it’s a slow day, but you might wanna hold off on the Yankee W projections, until the holes get filled. Then again, some of you do like hangin’ out at the Waffle House.
Projecting what the team is right now Donny….obviously that could change if they do something
DONNYBROOK January 17th, 2013 at 3:20 pm
I know it’s a slow day, but you might wanna hold off on the Yankee W projections, until the holes get filled. Then again, some of you do like hangin’ out at the Waffle House.
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You’re Donnie Wahlberg. I’ve been calling this for a while: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUgRu8JgV9s
Players added could drive the W’s down.
“Seems like in that deal we’d be paying more than the M’s.. my ignorance of their system and those players effs up my chances of coming up with a similar package though.”
It’s just a different package….the Yanks don’t have a prospect as good and as close as Walker that’s healthy….if Banuelos were healthy then maybe….but they don’t now. So instead of him I think you’d have to give two high upside guys that are maybe farther away…..it’s a different type package but I think the value is close unless Towers just really values Walker
Kevin towers loves mason williams the kids got a lot of potential but I’m not a fan of giving him and heathcott or him and Tyler austin I’ mean phelps Montgomery Williams and Nunez is just as comparable as the mariners package. Walker and hultzen and walker are top pitching prospects but still have that busy opportunity hence look at betances and banuelos Franklin is a short stop prospect Nunez is in majors already if they don’t want him give them Corbin Joseph or cito culver , Montgomery is money gonna b a stud out of the pen and mason williams towers loves to begin with
Mac,
Maybe Hal will let Cashman talk to Kotteras? He only makes 1 million
Nothing like a pre-emptive Waffle.
I do think Towers would want mason since he helped draft him and he’s the Yanks best prospect according to most publications
DONNYBROOK says:
January 17, 2013 at 3:28 pm
Nothing like a pre-emptive Waffle.
I see Donny slept in his hyperbolic chamber last night as usual
Can the Yankees meet the cap without a bunch of young players making it? Hal doesn’t think so, and neither do I. It is at least in part for that reason I don’t think the Yankees will trade their prospects. The plan cannot work without virtually all of the upside players making it. Fantasy? Yes, but it is Hal’s fantasy that Cashman gave him.
“Can the Yankees meet the cap without a bunch of young players making it? ”
Not and be any good they can’t
blake January 17th, 2013 at 3:28 pm
I do think Towers would want mason since he helped draft him and he’s the Yanks best prospect according to most publications
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If I put Mason in, he doesn’t get Austin or Heathcott… he can have Mesa or an Almonte or someone else.
But who am I kidding, the Yankees will probably trade half the roster and Cash will go, ‘oh well many people told me we were boring and they wanted Justin Upton. Now we’ve got him.’
“If I put Mason in, he doesn’t get Austin or Heathcott… he can have Mesa or an Almonte or someone else.”
Id give Mason and Austin….I wouldn’t give both Mason and Heathcott though cause they both can play CF….Upton can replace Austin in the future OF but they’ll need a CF
I will be surprised to hear the Yankees talking with Kottaras after making so making so many statements they are satisfied with the catching in-house. We shall see.
Mason, Austin, Phelps/ Nova, Adams/ Nunez is a nice and fair package…..something like that would be close to the limit Id give
There may be holes, but that still beats adding Schierholtz.
I might rather trade Robertson than Montgomery.
Despite the injury history, Heathcott is the one I would most hate to give up of the outfielders. he has more upside than the others since he has speed, an arm and power. That said, I would certainly trade him as his upside is likely lower than Upton’s past production.
ESPN is covering this Te’o thing like its the dang Penn State scandal…..
Rich in NJ says:
January 17, 2013 at 3:36 pm
I might rather trade Robertson than Montgomery.
That’s a tough call….6 years vs 2 years but Robertson has proven to be an elite reliever on the big leagues……also I don’t think Montgomery’s fastball will play in the bigs like dRobs does…..he doesn’t seem to get the same extension and his delivery isn’t as fluid. His slider is disgusting and his mL numbers are great…..but Id rather keep DRob I think
I think Towers might want Montglmery more though cause of the service time
Notre Dame is the New York Yankees of college football. Hence the ESPN dog pile.
blake
I think it’s time that the Yankees prioritize keeping the cheaper asset when there is a choice. Robertson may always have command issues that limit his ceiling. It’s a risk to move him, granted.
I think it is fairly common for young SS to make a lot of errors in their first few seasons. IIRC Jeter made more than 20 in each of his first 2 seasons with the NYY and he had one mL season where he made 50 or 60. If Nunez was put at SS and they just let him play I think he’d be pretty good, especially vs toady’s SS.
Not fair to compare him or anyone to the glory days of SS: Ripken ARod, Jeter, Nomar, Tejada. That was a different time.
blake January 17th, 2013 at 3:38 pm
ESPN is covering this Te’o thing like its the dang Penn State scandal…..
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Some reports are indicating ESPN has been sitting on this story for 10 days, hoping to already have an interview with Manti set up. The guy who wrote the article for Deadspin, I think, works for ESPN.
Here are some links, blake: http://www.thebiglead.com/inde.....itle-game/
blake January 17th, 2013 at 3:34 pm
Mason, Austin, Phelps/ Nova, Adams/ Nunez is a nice and fair package…..something like that would be close to the limit Id give
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And yeah, I’d do this.
The Te’o thing is interesting and somewhat amazing but I guess I just don’t see it as THAT big a deal……it was fun to poke fun at for a couple of hours but beyond that I really just don’t care that much
DONNYBROOK says:
January 17, 2013 at 3:43 pm
Notre Dame is the New York Yankees of college football. Hence the ESPN dog pile.
They are a figurehead…..the SEC is college football in 2013
@jonmorosi: Bogaerts, Simmons, Profar all expected to be named to Dutch roster for WBC. Intriguing team.
That’s what you call an upside infield
@WFANAudio
And there he is – the #MongoOfTheDay “Do you think Manti Te’o is the greatest homosexual linebacker of all time?”
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This is so outta control!! If you’re Manti, at this point you might find yourself pretending to be gay just to get out from under this mess without people thinking you’re insane.
blake – The big story isn’t Te’o, it’s the media. Right now they’re all scrambling to uncover every last detail since they did such an awful job of covering the news to begin with.
Shame Spencer says:
January 17, 2013 at 4:02 pm
blake – The big story isn’t Te’o, it’s the media. Right now they’re all scrambling to uncover every last detail since they did such an awful job of covering the news to begin with.
So the media is the story once again
Also gives the Mariners like 4 guys that should be DHing a lot and will force them to either catch Montero full time or rush Zunino…..unless morse will sign a cheap extension this trade makes very little sense for them
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That’s most likely the best aspect of the deal for the M’s.. They will now get an extended look @ Jesus @ C to really judge how good he is/can be heading into the future. They will most certainly get a much better offensive production from him as his splits shows and if he’s comfortable may prove to be they “generational ” middle of the order bat most ( including me of course) always felt he is.
But people are way overestimating the “value” of Jaso and his 3 yrs of control. He is a useful role player @ best who caught 40 games for the M’s last year. He’s not their starting catcher, nor the catcher of the future. Last year was by far his best year as a pro and Morse in 2/3 of a season coming off major injury hit as many homers as Jaso’s hit in his career.
If the M’s get the 2011 version of Morse then the trade for the M’s and Jack Z was a steal.
blake January 17th, 2013 at 4:03 pm
Shame Spencer says:
January 17, 2013 at 4:02 pm
blake – The big story isn’t Te’o, it’s the media. Right now they’re all scrambling to uncover every last detail since they did such an awful job of covering the news to begin with.
So the media is the story once again
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Basically, but when you don’t like the conversation (about improper reporting) you change it (to be about Manti).
On a higher level, one could make this a story about society as a whole
It’s not really enough to just work hard and be good at something.. everyone is a brand, everyone is trying to distinguish themselves, everyone builds their own narrative…
“If the M’s get the 2011 version of Morse then the trade for the M’s and Jack Z was a steal.”
And his defense in LF combined with Montero’s might cost them more runs than Morse adds with the bat…..plus they’ll finish in last place either way. The deal just doesn’t make much sense….if they were ready to contend and Zunino was ready then sure…..but neither of those things are really true
If Notre Dame had won the game i wonder if that woukd have changed anything with the story?
I completely forgot the M’s also have JD Drew…. so… Drew, Morse, and Ibanez…?????
Some reports are indicating ESPN has been sitting on this story for 10 days, hoping to already have an interview with Manti set up. The guy who wrote the article for Deadspin, I think, works for ES.
Amazing that it took some guy writing for Deadpsin to break the story…three weeks after it became fact.
Imagine just how many reporters were following Notre Dame around in the build up to the BCS Championship. One TV journalist discovered there was no obituary for “the girl” and no story/pix about the accident in her local newspaper. If that didn’t raise a red flag, what would?
blake January 17th, 2013 at 4:08 pm
If Notre Dame had won the game i wonder if that woukd have changed anything with the story?
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They probably would have found a chick and killed her just to make sure this never surfaced lol.. but in all seriousness, it sounds like they already had this story in their hands prior to the bowl game. There have been a couple of reports claiming this popped up on or before January 6th. Some go back to December 27th.
Sandy Alderson on the FAN. Could not come out and say it, but was talking about alternatives to Scott Hairston (because of playing time, Mets cannot commit to his playing time if other things happen), he put the Mets odds of something via trade being 50/50. I can only assume this means Upton.
I hope Cashman is on this as well.
This Manti Te’o story would have become epic IF he had won the Heisman.
You follow the money. Te’o is on record stating he sent flowers to the funderal. If he paid by credit card, there is a record of that. The store that he used should also have a record of this.
Now if nick Saban had a fake Internet girlfriend then THAT would be a story
Do you mean OSaban Bin Lyin?
Maybe Cashman can throw in Te’o's girlfriends phone number in a trade for Upton?
Sign of the times for a Yankees fan: So glad it was not Alex Rodriguez with the fake girlfriend.
Question on a Thursday afternoon: What is more real, Manti Te’o's girlfriend or Hal Steinbrenner’s commitment to winning over saving pocket change?
@jonmorosi: Jair Jurrjens on Dutch roster.
Should be a chance to show if he’s healthy….if he is then Id take a minor league flyer for sure
Alex doesn’t need fake girlfriends. He has enough real women chasing him (although some parts of their anatomy may well be fake). Surprising someone as high-profile as Te’o needs an internet date.
There Will Never Be Another Mo says:
January 17, 2013 at 4:26 pm
Question on a Thursday afternoon: What is more real, Manti Te’o’s girlfriend or Hal Steinbrenner’s commitment to winning over saving pocket change?
Equally nonexistent
Te’o's girlfriend. At least he thought about it.
It may not be just one year for Morse in Seattle. He played there earlier in his career and apparently he is very fond of the area. I could see them signing him to some type of extension or being the favorites to re-signing him in FA. M’s obviously have some money to spend, seemed like they were serious about Hamilton. Of course, now you are talking about extra $$ to keep Morse around, not just Jaso. But still, Morse may end up sticking around in Seattle after 2013. He’ll likely be a productive player for the next few seasons assuming good health. And even if it is just one year, sure Jaso is a nice player, but I’d rather give him up than a good prospect. They have two more years of control over him yeah, he gets on base a lot, but he’s not a good defensive catcher. I understand the move from the M’s point of view.
Would also like the Yankees to take a look at George Kotteras. I know he’s not a great defensive catcher, so they might pass, but he has some pop. Could hit a few HR’s to the short porch. And considering the underwhelming lot of catchers they have currently it couldn’t hurt.
i see team usa is a bunch of ‘nobodies’ again…
Question on a Thursday afternoon: What is more real, Manti Te’o’s girlfriend or Hal Steinbrenner’s commitment to winning over saving pocket change?
__
This requires more thought than it should.
DONNYBROOK January 17th, 2013 at 3:43 pm
Notre Dame is the New York Yankees of college football. Hence the ESPN dog pile.
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So you’re not so self righteous when a scandal involves your beloved Golden Domers as you are with ballplayers who have allegedly used PEDs?
Not exactly the dynasty you were predicting a couple of weeks ago before ND was exposed as a fraud in the national championship game and the face of the program now exposed as a fraud as well.
This probably won’t happen, but I still believe Nunez is the answer to the RH bat for OF….
I shake my head at Cashman’s stubbornness to consider Nunez in OF (like Danny Tartabull) and Joba as starter…and Jesus as DH/1B. I would have already lost faith in Cashman’s ability to develop prospects into stars, but to be fair, he has to get some credit for DRob, Cano, Gardner, Hughes, as well as the scrap heap pick-ups he has made.
Rich in NJ January 17th, 2013 at 4:36 pm
Question on a Thursday afternoon: What is more real, Manti Te’o’s girlfriend or Hal Steinbrenner’s commitment to winning over saving pocket change?
__
This requires more thought than it should.
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Apparently both the “girlfriend” and Hal have a lot in common…such as j**king off anyone who believes in them.