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State of the organization: Bullpen

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Jan 22, 2013 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Last May, the Yankees bullpen was forced to adjust. Mariano Rivera’s injury forced a premature glimpse into an inevitable future, and the Yankees filled the void with a veteran who’s since left for Washington. Now Rivera is back, but he’s brought only a sense of temporary security. Much like the rotation, the Yankees bullpen has been filled by a capable and potentially strong group of pitchers, but that group has left significant uncertainty for 2014 and beyond. There are young relievers on the rise, and the Yankees might have jobs for them in the not-so-distant future.    

Mariano Rivera, Joba Chamberlain, David Aardsma, Boone Logan (signed through 2013)
Dave Robertson (second year of arbitration)
The Yankees have five relievers who I believe are locked into big league jobs this season. Clay Rapada might be a sixth, but he’s certainly not as entrenched as the five listed above. You might have noticed that four of the five will be free agents at the end of the season. For the time being, this group offers solid depth with some undeniable risk. Rivera had knee surgery last year; Chamberlain and Aardsma each had Tommy John in 2011. The best-case scenario for those three is awfully good, but it’s hard to know how likely those best case scenarios might be. Logan became more of a workhorse than strict lefty specialist last season, and he could fill the same role this year if Rapada is back with the team. The key here just might be Robertson, whose walk rate dipped considerably last season and who no longer has Rafael Soriano as a safety net. The loser of the David Phelps/Ivan Nova rotation battle could find a spot in the bullpen, as could experienced, fairly young guys like Jim Miller and Cody Eppley. 

On the verge
Mark Montgomery has only one full season of pro ball on his resume, but he’s already put himself into the big league discussion. Maybe not out of camp, but certainly at some point during the season, Montgomery could most certainly become an option in the Bronx. His fastball/slider combination has generated 150 strikeouts with 35 walks through 92.2 minor league innings. He got to Double-A late last season and has drawn some comparisons to Robertson. Less flashy but slightly more advanced is Chase Whitley, a 2010 draftee who’s already logged 80.1 innings in Triple-A. He doesn’t have Montgomery’s massive strikeout totals, but Whitley gets groundballs and has routinely pitched two, three, even four innings at a time. He could get his first crack at the big leagues this season, but he’ll be fighting for an opportunity alongside fellow right-handers Eppley, Miller, Preston Claiborne and possibly Kelvin Perez. From the left side, last year’s Rule 5 pick Cesar Cabral could be an early summer option if his elbow has fully healed. Recent 40-man addition Francisco Rondon, waiver claim Josh Spence and returning Triple-A reliever Juan Cedeno add more immediate depth from the left side.

Deeper in the system
Used to be that a farm system’s real pitching talent was limited to the minor league rotations. A young pitcher who’d already been moved to the bullpen didn’t have much future, but that’s no longer the case. The Yankees system is actually pretty deep with bullpen arms. The 2010 draft gave the Yankees Tom Kahnle (72 strikeouts, 0.98 WHIP, 2.45 ERA) and 2011 gave them Branden Pinder (67 strikeouts, 1.46 ERA, 2.79 ERA), each of whom spent last year with High-A Tampa — each was promoted to Trenton at the very end of the year — and each of whom has legitimate bullpen potential. Last year’s sixth-round pick was LSU reliever Nick Goody, who pitched at three different levels last season and had 52 strikeouts, with nine walks and 20 hits through 32 innings. He’s already touched High-A and could move very quickly. Lefty Jeremy Bleich and righty Graham Stoneburner are former starters who have moved to the bullpen after injuries. Both have ability, but both need to prove themselves all over again. The jury is still out on whether Pat Venditte is a legitimate prospect or a switch-pitching oddity, but further evaluation will have to wait until mid-season while he recovers from injury. Just like with the rotation, it’s hard to mention all of the edge-of-the-radar, lower-level relievers in this space, but I’ll save a spot for Dan Burawa, who earned an early invitation to big league camp that was cut short by an oblique injury last season. Still a name worth knowing.

On the move
There are legitimate pitching prospects who are developed as relievers, but there are still plenty of minor league starters who eventually find their way into the bullpen. It has long been wondered whether Dellin Betances — with his big body and inconsistent results — might be better suited to a relief role (I contend that, if he can’t throw strikes, he won’t be suited for a role period). Basically, any young starting pitcher has the potential to move into the bullpen eventually, but the idea becomes especially intriguing with the hard-throwers like Betances or Jose Ramirez or Gabe Encinas. Makes sense to keep them in the rotation as long as possible, but if the need presents itself – or it becomes clear that they don’t have the secondary pitches or durability for the rotation — the bullpen can always become an option.

What to watch
Of course there will be immediate interest in Rivera’s return, but Aardsma is also worth some attention. He’s still a bit of a Yankees mystery, having hardly had time to prove anything last season. His past success could make him a major factor if he’s on top of his game. My guess, however, is that most of the bullpen anticipation will center on Montgomery, whose minor league dominance suggests a potent late-inning force. As with any season, it’s worth watching to see which minor league starters pitch their way into bullpen before the end of the year.

Associated Press photo; headshots of Chamberlain, Robertson, Montgomery, Whitley, Kahnle, Pinder and Betances

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272 Responses to “State of the organization: Bullpen”

  1. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:01 pm

    @EyeOnBaseball: This. RT @zacharylevine
    Sorry Domonic Brown. Maybe if you were worse at baseball, older, less healthy and a worse human being…

  2. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:01 pm

    @keithlaw: It sure seems that way. RT @tmengd: @keithlaw Dominic Browns days numbered in Phili, now that they have signed Delmon Young?

    I’ll take him

  3. Rich in NJ January 22nd, 2013 at 3:02 pm

    What would it cost to get him?

  4. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:03 pm

    Don’t see how they could ask that much when they chose Delmon Young over him

  5. Patrick January 22nd, 2013 at 3:04 pm

    I’d love to trade for Domonic Brown, depends what the Phillies want though.

  6. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:05 pm

    @jay_jaffe: Delmon Young has been worth -1.6 WARP over past 2 seasons while earning around $12 million.

  7. Patrick January 22nd, 2013 at 3:06 pm

    Jon Heyman ?@JonHeymanCBS
    delmon young obviously cost himself w/ terrible incident last yr. had over 1.000+ ops in alcs & WS, signs for under $1M

    Jon Heyman is a knucklehead. He signed for under $1 million because he’s a really bad player.

  8. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:06 pm

    Maybe Warren for Brown ….

  9. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:07 pm

    @JimBowdenESPNxm: Delmon Young goes from a $6.75m contract in 2012 to $750,000 in 2013 because of off-the-field issues….lesson and message for all

    I guess these guys didnt watch Delmon play last year….he’s awful…he’s can hit LHP a little but he’s terrible at literally everything else

  10. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:10 pm

    How terrible Delmon is is just one reason the ALCS was just so unbearable…..not being able to hit at all and then watching Delmon Young kill you was just too much

  11. Chip January 22nd, 2013 at 3:10 pm

    blake January 22nd, 2013 at 2:59 pm

    Why would an NL team sign young
    ————

    It’s a much smaller field for him to cover and he’ll hit the ball quite far for them. Plus he cost them nothing.

  12. Shame Spencer January 22nd, 2013 at 3:10 pm

    @Buster_ESPN

    The Diamondbacks continue to weigh offers for Justin Upton and Jason Kubel, and they want to deal one of them sooner rather than later.
    ——————

    Define ‘sooner’….? :D

  13. Chip January 22nd, 2013 at 3:11 pm

    Keep in mind that you’re talking about a front office that employed Jim Thome as an actual first baseman last year.

    If nothing else, they’ll do the same thing with Young that they did with Thome and that’s dump him in June for some minor league depth.

  14. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:11 pm

    @JimBowdenESPNxm: Young should be 30 HomeRun bat playing half his games @ Citizens Bank Park and his right-handed bat will provide important balance to lineup

    Lol…good grief

  15. Rich in NJ January 22nd, 2013 at 3:11 pm

    Young has been the anti-Swisher lately. Good in playoffs, bad in the regular season.

  16. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:13 pm

    Id take either Dbacks but woukd much rarer have Upton

  17. Chip January 22nd, 2013 at 3:14 pm

    blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:13 pm

    Id take either Dbacks but woukd much rarer have Upton
    ————–

    Really? You’ve never said anything about Upton so this is a complete shock to me :-)

  18. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 3:14 pm

    Napoli’s contract incentives have been released. Bonuses for days on the active roster & plate appearances. Entire contract is guaranteed if he spends less than 20 days on the DL.

  19. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:15 pm

    “Really? You’ve never said anything about Upton so this is a complete shock to me ”

    I need to step it up then :)

  20. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:16 pm

    “Napoli’s contract incentives have been released. Bonuses for days on the active roster & plate appearances. Entire contract is guaranteed if he spends less than 20 days on the DL.”

    So how much would he get then?

  21. Rich in NJ January 22nd, 2013 at 3:17 pm

    “Napoli’s contract incentives have been released. Bonuses for days on the active roster & plate appearances. Entire contract is guaranteed if he spends less than 20 days on the DL.”

    That’s the way Youkilis’s contract should be have been structured.

  22. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:18 pm

    @CrawfordChrisV: The good news is, if Delmon Young tries to throw a battery back at a Philadelphia fan, they know it won’t reach them.

  23. Shame Spencer January 22nd, 2013 at 3:27 pm

    Rich in NJ January 22nd, 2013 at 3:17 pm

    “Napoli’s contract incentives have been released. Bonuses for days on the active roster & plate appearances. Entire contract is guaranteed if he spends less than 20 days on the DL.”

    That’s the way Youkilis’s contract should be have been structured.

    ——————–

    No, we’re the Yankees, we can just throw money at the problem……. sort of…. not really.

  24. Rich in NJ January 22nd, 2013 at 3:29 pm

    “No, we’re the Yankees, we can just throw money at the problem……. sort of…. not really.”

    They really do seem to have trouble making sensible distinctions about what and what not to spend money on at this point.

  25. Warning Track Power January 22nd, 2013 at 3:34 pm

    Mariano Rivera, Joba Chamberlain, David Aardsma, Boone Logan, Dave Robertson

    Let me tell you something, this bullpen makes me worry a lot

    Mo-Well for obvious reasons
    Joba-Can he be consistent for more than a week at a time
    Aardsma-Total mystery
    Robertson-Time for him to step up his game to another level, if possible
    Logan-Not sure if his arm has anything left after all the work he’s done

  26. randy l. January 22nd, 2013 at 3:35 pm

    “No, we’re the Yankees, we can just throw money at the problem……. sort of…. not really.”

    hank found a whole bunch of S&H green stamps in the ocala family stables so the yankee financial situation is looking up.

  27. Chip January 22nd, 2013 at 3:35 pm

    Kubel would be a good pick up.

    Give them Nunez, David Adams, Warren and Flores for Kubel, Chris Johnson and Cliff Pennington.

  28. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:37 pm

    “No, we’re the Yankees, we can just throw money at the problem……. sort of…. not really.”

    They have a sacred obligation to the fans to make sure they have all the Old guys they need

  29. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:39 pm

    Kubel would be ok as a DH/ OF but it’d be better if he hit righty….if they could trade for Kubel and sign Hairston then that’d be a good mix

  30. Shame Spencer January 22nd, 2013 at 3:42 pm

    blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:37 pm

    “No, we’re the Yankees, we can just throw money at the problem……. sort of…. not really.”

    They have a sacred obligation to the fans to make sure they have all the Old guys they need

    ———————-

    Yeah they need sexy names on their roster…. whoever though Youkilis was a sexy name needs to lose their job.

  31. Chip January 22nd, 2013 at 3:45 pm

    blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:39 pm

    Kubel would be ok as a DH/ OF but it’d be better if he hit righty….if they could trade for Kubel and sign Hairston then that’d be a good mix
    ——————–

    If you trade for both Kubel and Chris Johnson then you don’t need Hairston. Either he or Youk can DH for Kubel against LHP.

    Though again – to do any of this I think the Yankees are going to have to clear payroll – namely Granderson.

  32. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 3:49 pm

    It’s a much smaller field for him to cover and he’ll hit the ball quite far for them. Plus he cost them nothing.
    ///

    Yeah but he is not good getting off the ball. I don’t know how much you can fix that; I think “getting a good jump” is as inherent a talent as anything else. I guess he can improve on his angles and try to make better reads, but I’m just not sure how much. In left field, he is just dreadful moving toward the foul line. He seems to misjudge everything and for a guy that looks athletic and has a good arm, he doesn’t seem to possess great range.

    If he could put a monster OPS and limit his strikeouts, he could survive in RF I guess, but that’s about it.

    I’d take him if we were to give up mediocre talent.

  33. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 3:51 pm

    Nevermind, Chip, you’re talking about Young.

    I’m talking about Brown.

  34. Warning Track Power January 22nd, 2013 at 3:53 pm

    blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:39 pm
    Kubel would be ok as a DH/ OF but it’d be better if he hit righty….if they could trade for Kubel and sign Hairston then that’d be a good mix
    **********************************************************************
    Kubel? Is that who we are discussing today?
    The kid his from the left side. I think we have more than enough hitters from the left side.

  35. pat January 22nd, 2013 at 3:53 pm

    therealarieber
    Joba called youklis in winter and left a voicemail. Did youk call back? “No. He did not call back.”

  36. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 3:54 pm

    blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:06 pm

    Maybe Warren for Brown ….
    ///

    I’d do that; his upside in terms of being a high slug lefty could be worth the risk. But I doubt Philly would.

  37. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 3:54 pm

    “Napoli’s contract incentives have been released. Bonuses for days on the active roster & plate appearances. Entire contract is guaranteed if he spends less than 20 days on the DL.”

    So how much would he get then?

    13 million if he spends less than 20 days on the DL. Its 500k for the active roster days, and 500k for the first set of PA and 1 million for the 2nd set of PA.

  38. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:54 pm

    “Kubel? Is that who we are discussing today?
    The kid his from the left side. I think we have more than enough hitters from the left side.”

    Have no DH vs RHP currently

  39. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 3:54 pm

    I don’t see why Joba needs to slobber all over Youkilis. Get your fat head out of the way, dude.

  40. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:55 pm

    “I’d do that; his upside in terms of being a high slug lefty could be worth the risk. But I doubt Philly would.”

    Maybe not but they can’t think that much of him

  41. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:56 pm

    “13 million if he spends less than 20 days on the DL. Its 500k for the active roster days, and 500k for the first set of PA and 1 million for the 2nd set of PA.”

    In see….some shrewd negotiating by the Sox there

  42. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:59 pm

    @jcrasnick: Reliever Kyle Farnsworth is close to picking a team. He’s down to 2 choices. The #Rays are one of them, sources say.

  43. Patrick January 22nd, 2013 at 3:59 pm

    It’s kind of sad we are reduced to hoping that the Diamondbacks will give us their fourth outfielder. Was there anyone other than Chip hoping that the Yanks had signed Kubel last offseason? He’s not a very complete player, good power and that’s about it.

  44. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 3:59 pm

    blake, all I ever hear is that “he’s coming along”. I don’t know if that’s their “story” or they don’t want to be hasty with a guy with his potential.

  45. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 4:00 pm

    blake January 22nd, 2013 at 3:59 pm

    @jcrasnick: Reliever Kyle Farnsworth is close to picking a team. He’s down to 2 choices. The #Rays are one of them, sources say.
    ///

    um, good news for us :D

  46. randy l. January 22nd, 2013 at 4:01 pm

    ‘Joba called youklis in winter and left a voicemail. Did youk call back? “No. He did not call back.” ‘

    what? that’s not very nice. joba should drill him first pitch in live BP :)

  47. Warning Track Power January 22nd, 2013 at 4:01 pm

    Robertson>Farnsy

  48. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:03 pm

    Dom Brown was a top 5 prospect in baseball and hit .327 .391 .589 .980 between AA and AAA at age 22.

  49. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 4:05 pm

    what? that’s not very nice. joba should drill him first pitch in live BP :)
    ///

    Exactly, he blew his chance. Drill him and bring up Adams, or throw Diaz out there after signing him. Joba’s always been a team player :D

  50. Patrick January 22nd, 2013 at 4:06 pm

    Dom Brown was a top 5 prospect in baseball and hit .327 .391 .589 .980 between AA and AAA at age 22.

    And has less than 500 PA’s in the majors. The Phillies are pretty dumb. Hopefully Cashman is on the phone with RAJ right now, trade done by dinner.

  51. Chip January 22nd, 2013 at 4:06 pm

    Patrick -

    Given what Cashman has said he wants (big hairy mashers from the left side) Kubel would fit in nicely at DH and with a reasonable deal for next year it doesn’t seem like a bad fit.

    In the end I think the Yankees are going to go with a part time guy – maybe a guy like Pronk or Luke Scott or Kelly Johnson; with an eye towards Alex being the DH when he gets back from his surgery.

  52. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 4:08 pm

    Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:03 pm

    Dom Brown was a top 5 prospect in baseball and hit .327 .391 .589 .980 between AA and AAA at age 22.
    ///

    Sure, get him if you can do it without giving up anything of real note. ATM, he can’t field, and he gets fooled a lot.

    I enjoy watching him…get eaten alive by Betances :D

  53. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 4:09 pm

    I’ll trade Warren for him!:D

  54. Warning Track Power January 22nd, 2013 at 4:09 pm

    Chip
    I think the Yankees need to forget about the southpaws and find a player or two
    that can hit from the right side.
    Hoping this player(s) are found in ST.
    If not, you know a trade will be made in August to complete this team

  55. Patrick January 22nd, 2013 at 4:10 pm

    Chip,

    I’m not saying he’s a bad fit, just not the type of player I really like to watch. Ryan Braun, Matt Holliday, Justin Upton .. those are the types of RH outfielders I dream about playing for the Yankees. Jason Kubel, not so much.

    Also I don’t consider Kubel a “big hairy monster” because he’s not going to put up a great OBP. “Big hairy monsters” to me are guys like Matsui, Abreu, Sheffield, Giambi, A-rod, Teixeira, Posada. Big power, great OBP

  56. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 4:10 pm

    Warning Track Power January 22nd, 2013 at 4:01 pm

    Robertson>Farnsy
    ///

    um…punchline?

  57. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:11 pm

    JAP,

    Disappointed you’d be like that. He is essentially left handed Montero in the outfield.

  58. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:11 pm

    Long seems to do well with LH hitters with long swings….they should get Brown and see if they can fix him

  59. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:11 pm

    In fact I’d probably trade Betances for Brown.

  60. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:12 pm

    Blake,

    I don’t think Brown even needs ‘fixing’. He needs playing time.

  61. Warning Track Power January 22nd, 2013 at 4:12 pm

    Brown? Oh boy. How desperate are we today
    1st Kubel and now Brown

    I’m rolling my eyes in disgust!

  62. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:12 pm

    “Also I don’t consider Kubel a “big hairy monster” because he’s not going to put up a great OBP. ”

    Cashman called Ibanez a “big hairy monster”

  63. Chip January 22nd, 2013 at 4:13 pm

    WTP

    I don’t disagree with you – but the options from the right side are less attractive than the options from the left side.

    At this point the best RH hitters available are Carlos Lee and Juan Rivera.

  64. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:13 pm

    How desperate are we today

    Brown is a top prospect that is 25 with a team that is trying everything possible not to give him a shot, whats desperate about wanting to acquire him?

  65. Patrick January 22nd, 2013 at 4:13 pm

    Cashman called Ibanez a “big hairy monster”

    I know, and it makes no sense for him to do so.

  66. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:15 pm

    @BillShaikin: Source: #Dodgers tentative deal with Time Warner Cable worth between $7 billion and $8 billion to team.

    Somehow deal expanded by 2-3 billion :x

  67. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:15 pm

    @BillShaikin: Source: #Dodgers tentative deal with Time Warner Cable worth between $7 billion and $8 billion to team.

    Lol

  68. Patrick January 22nd, 2013 at 4:16 pm

    Holy crap

  69. Shame Spencer January 22nd, 2013 at 4:17 pm

    I’ve asked about Brown before.. I know he’s been discussed on here. Comes cheap in terms of what you’d give up, how much he actually costs, and has upside. If we’re only going to make one more move this off season I’d rather have a guy like Brown than a guy like Kubel.

  70. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:17 pm

    Jerkface says:
    January 22, 2013 at 4:12 pm
    Blake,

    I don’t think Brown even needs ‘fixing’. He needs playing time.

    I think that too….but last I saw him he was kinda long and that’s sorta K Longs specialty…..where woukd he play for the yanks though ? Would they DH him?

  71. Chip January 22nd, 2013 at 4:17 pm

    Patrick January 22nd, 2013 at 4:10 pm

    Chip,

    I’m not saying he’s a bad fit, just not the type of player I really like to watch. Ryan Braun, Matt Holliday, Justin Upton .. those are the types of RH outfielders I dream about playing for the Yankees. Jason Kubel, not so much.

    Also I don’t consider Kubel a “big hairy monster” because he’s not going to put up a great OBP. “Big hairy monsters” to me are guys like Matsui, Abreu, Sheffield, Giambi, A-rod, Teixeira, Posada. Big power, great OBP
    —————

    Patrick,

    I can understand how you wouldn’t like watching Kubel hit from the right side, what with him being left handed and all…

    As for the OBP stuff – look, I’m the guy who wants to dump Granderson so I don’t need convincing on that. But Kubel would hit here, he would put up better OBP numbers than three guys the Yankees had in their lineup last year (Granderson, Ibanez, Martin) and be a nice fit at DH. Plus, if getting Kubel means the Yankees add enough power to think about dumping Granderson (in my long standing deal to Texas for David Murphy, Gentry and a prospect) then even better.

  72. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:17 pm

    Jerkface says:
    January 22, 2013 at 4:11 pm
    In fact I’d probably trade Betances for Brown.

    For sure

  73. Patrick January 22nd, 2013 at 4:18 pm

    Chip,

    Whoa .. maybe I’m working too hard or something because I totally spaced out on Kubel. Sorry about that …

  74. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:18 pm

    And people don’t think the Dodgers are gonna offer Cano elenty billion dollars?

  75. Patrick January 22nd, 2013 at 4:19 pm

    Hey did anyone know there was a pitcher for the Reds in 1916 named Twink Twining? He pitched 2 innings in his career.

    http://www.fangraphs.com/stats.....position=P

  76. Shame Spencer January 22nd, 2013 at 4:20 pm

    blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:15 pm

    @BillShaikin: Source: #Dodgers tentative deal with Time Warner Cable worth between $7 billion and $8 billion to team.

    Lol

    ———————————–

    So goodbye Robbie Cano,
    You’re departure will make Yankee fans howl,
    We tried to lock you in a penthouse,
    But the Dodgers own Nasdaq and Dow

  77. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:20 pm

    @jcrasnick: Lots of people seem to be penciling in Dom Brown as #phillies regular right fielder. Maybe, but I’ll believe it when I see it

    They could platoon Brown and Ruf

  78. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 4:21 pm

    Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:11 pm

    JAP,

    Disappointed you’d be like that. He is essentially left handed Montero in the outfield.
    ///

    Comparing him to a hitter like Montero is a wildly superficial comparison. Montero is in a much better position to make contact and do damage, stays back better, keeps his bat in the zone longer, much, much better mechanics. Montero is better, period.

    If you mean he’s a guy who could be a high slug player with perceived questionable defense, then I would agree.

    As a hitter? Different world, sorry.

  79. Shame Spencer January 22nd, 2013 at 4:22 pm

    @Buster_ESPN

    One team viewed as a possible match for Jason Kubel by rival executives: The Baltimore Orioles.

  80. Patrick January 22nd, 2013 at 4:22 pm

    By the way, Chip, I think I was mixing up Kubel with Michael Cuddyer. Similar players, same team for most of their career, both are nondescript white dudes …

    But yeah Kubel would be ok on the Yanks. Trade Granderson and go with Kubel-Gardner-Ichiro left to right. Still, I wouldn’t be too excited to see the Yanks trade for Kubel.

  81. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:23 pm

    @keithlaw: And Dom Brown dies a little more inside. RT @ryanlawrence21: Amaro: Young will play RF.

  82. Shame Spencer January 22nd, 2013 at 4:23 pm

    I don’t have a problem taking on Brown’s defensive issues when we have a real solid defense in the OF already. They could rotate the four of them pretty well and after having Jones and Ibanez out there I don’t really care what routes the kid takes.

  83. hardwired7 January 22nd, 2013 at 4:23 pm

    “worth between $7 billion and $8 billion to team”

    *insert Dr. Evil laugh*

  84. Triple Short of a Cycle January 22nd, 2013 at 4:24 pm

    Anyone have Tivo here?

  85. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:25 pm

    Shame Spencer says:
    January 22, 2013 at 4:22 pm
    @Buster_ESPN

    One team viewed as a possible match for Jason Kubel by rival executives: The Baltimore Orioles.

    I think Buster must have blocked me lol…..All I did was ask him when he was going to make his annual “the rays remind him of the 98 Yankees” proclamation

  86. yankeefeminista January 22nd, 2013 at 4:25 pm

    What were the results of Brown’s end of season knee MRI’s? Agree about Brown’s reads in the OF. Hard to miss. Brown is an abysmal fielder. That said I’d take a flyer on Brown, but Warren would not garner Brown. And Brown’s AAA 2012 OPS was @770.

    We should get to see some of the young BP arms including Montgomery’s but also Kahnle’s and Pinder’s (both got invites) in ST games. I think Montgomery’s FB will have a little more late life than it did at the end of the season.

  87. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 4:26 pm

    Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:11 pm

    In fact I’d probably trade Betances for Brown.
    ///

    Just don’t let him hit against him :D.

    Brown is young with a heavy left-handed bat and a real good arm. Sure, he may blossom with that kind of raw talent he’s got. But I wouldn’t burn any of our top spects for him.

    Betances has “risk” factors, too, but the upside is also there. I’d not trade Betances for him, needless to say.

    If the Phillies are truly down on him, it would make sense to kick the tires.

  88. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:26 pm

    Pre-2011

    Montero #3
    Dom Brown #4

    Prospect ranking. Both hit for a high average, both have power, Dom Brown has more patience. Struck out less than Montero too.

  89. joeman January 22nd, 2013 at 4:26 pm

    Yankees’ core value: D+. The Yankees have little (no?) impact talent on the right side of 30 on their big league roster beyond 27-year-old setup man David Robertson, and their top prospects are at least one year away from the show. That’s creates a rather grim picture for the immediate future. Add in ownership’s very public desire to get under the $189 million luxury tax threshold by 2014, and New York appears to have run into the perfect storm that, at some point in the next few years, could see them miss the playoffs in consecutive seasons for the first time in nearly two decades.
    ———————————
    yes he did nail this

  90. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:28 pm

    Brown is an outfielder with upside….Betances is most likely a reliever going forward….no brainer to make that swap IMO

  91. Shame Spencer January 22nd, 2013 at 4:31 pm

    blake – One thing I’ve learned about Twitter is how sensitive the writers are lol…. it’s pretty funny. Pete’s the only one that has blocked me…… so far.

  92. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:33 pm

    If Buster didnt say so many dumb things I wouldn’t have mocked him and he wouldn’t have blocked me….so it’s his fault

  93. Shame Spencer January 22nd, 2013 at 4:34 pm

    I dont even know why they have twitter if they can’t take abuse.. it’s like when people tweet political views, get criticized, and are like ‘hey, these are just my opinions!!’

    Yeah… opinions you shared online with a lot of people lol. Prepare for mockery.

  94. Chip January 22nd, 2013 at 4:35 pm

    Patrick January 22nd, 2013 at 4:22 pm

    By the way, Chip, I think I was mixing up Kubel with Michael Cuddyer. Similar players, same team for most of their career, both are nondescript white dudes …

    But yeah Kubel would be ok on the Yanks. Trade Granderson and go with Kubel-Gardner-Ichiro left to right. Still, I wouldn’t be too excited to see the Yanks trade for Kubel.
    —————

    Oh I loathe Cuddyer

    but I have Kubel at DH – OF of Murphy – Gardner – Ichiro

  95. joeman January 22nd, 2013 at 4:36 pm

    there’s no doubt Cano will be a Dodger in 14…..

    blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:28 pm
    Brown is an outfielder with upside….Betances is most likely a reliever going forward….no brainer to make that swap IMO

    ————————————————————
    where do you see upside

  96. Warning Track Power January 22nd, 2013 at 4:36 pm

    Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:13 pm
    How desperate are we today

    Brown is a top prospect that is 25 with a team that is trying everything possible not to give him a shot, whats desperate about wanting to acquire him?
    —————————————————————————————————-
    If Brown was as good as his hype, then he would already be an everyday player with the Phils or somewhere else.
    In 2011 and 2012, he played just 56 games
    He is a career .236 hitter with 433 AB’s
    .315 OBP
    .388 slg
    .703 OPS
    Fielding Percentage .977

  97. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:38 pm

    He was in his early 20s, coming back from wrist surgery. So what?

  98. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 4:38 pm

    blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:28 pm

    Brown is an outfielder with upside….Betances is most likely a reliever going forward….no brainer to make that swap IMO
    ///

    Brown has upside and Betances has no upside? Interesting. That’ll be news to nearly everyone, even those who think he can’t start.

  99. Chip January 22nd, 2013 at 4:39 pm

    Here’s the problem with trading for Dom Brown – the team that’s had him his entire professional career doesn’t think he’s good enough to play over Delmon Young so maybe we should take that as a cautionary tale.

  100. Shame Spencer January 22nd, 2013 at 4:39 pm

    It is possible the Yankees aren’t the only team that have trouble developing talent.

  101. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:39 pm

    ————————————————————
    “where do you see upside”

    Still young…was a top 5 prospect 2 years ago and has never been given a real chance

  102. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:39 pm

    That’ll be news to nearly everyone, even those who think he can’t start.

    If they think he can’t start then his upside is obviously reliever, which means trading him for a position player is a no brainer.

  103. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:39 pm

    Brown was compared to Daryl Strawberry only 2 years ago

  104. Patrick January 22nd, 2013 at 4:40 pm

    Here’s the problem with trading for Dom Brown – the team that’s had him his entire professional career doesn’t think he’s good enough to play over Delmon Young so maybe we should take that as a cautionary tale.

    That or the Phillies are making a mistake. We’ve seen them make many mistakes over the last several years, it’s not that absurd to think this is just another.

  105. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:40 pm

    Here’s the problem with trading for Dom Brown – the team that’s had him his entire professional career doesn’t think he’s good enough to play over Delmon Young so maybe we should take that as a cautionary tale.

    They also thought signing Ryan Howard to a huge extension was ok, as well as signing Raul Ibanez to play the outfield regularly in his late late 30s.

  106. Warning Track Power January 22nd, 2013 at 4:41 pm

    Chip
    You took the words right out of my mouth.
    If Brown was a good player, he would be an everyday player in Philly.

    Clearly there is something wrong with the kid today and since he’s another OF that
    hits from the left side, the Yankees don’t need him today.

  107. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 4:41 pm

    Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:38 pm

    He was in his early 20s, coming back from wrist surgery. So what?
    ///

    Yes, and he’s had other injuries and they reportedly messed with his swing and might have derailed him some, but his hit tool compared with Montero’s is prosaic.

    You never sniff at a young lefty hitter with great power potential, especially if you’re the Yankees. It would depend on what they would demand for him.

  108. joeman January 22nd, 2013 at 4:42 pm

    blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:39 pm
    ————————————————————
    “where do you see upside”

    Still young…was a top 5 prospect 2 years ago and has never been given a real chance

    —————————————————————-

    There aren’t any splits to speak of that would point to Brown either figuring something

  109. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:42 pm

    and since he’s another OF that
    hits from the left side, the Yankees don’t need him today.

    The Yankees need anyone young, good, and cost controlled.

  110. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:43 pm

    There aren’t any splits to speak of that would point to Brown either figuring something

    .327 .391 .589 .980

    .274 .395 .414 .809

    .310 .360 .473 .833

  111. joeman January 22nd, 2013 at 4:43 pm

    really how many prospects are the 2nd coming and never pan out…

  112. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:43 pm

    “Here’s the problem with trading for Dom Brown – the team that’s had him his entire professional career doesn’t think he’s good enough to play over Delmon Young so maybe we should take that as a cautionary tale.”

    Or perhaps he needs a change of scenery

  113. joeman January 22nd, 2013 at 4:44 pm

    Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:43 pm
    There aren’t any splits to speak of that would point to Brown either figuring something

    .327 .391 .589 .980

    .274 .395 .414 .809

    .310 .360 .473 .833
    —————————————————
    and where did you find them

  114. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:44 pm

    joeman says:
    January 22, 2013 at 4:43 pm
    really how many prospects are the 2nd coming and never pan out…

    Nobody is talking about trading Gary Sanchez for him …..

  115. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:45 pm

    @PeteAbe: Napoli says he is comfortable at first base and it should be easier on his body. He feels he can stay healthy all year

  116. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 4:46 pm

    Warning Track Power January 22nd, 2013 at 4:41 pm

    Chip
    You took the words right out of my mouth.
    If Brown was a good player, he would be an everyday player in Philly.
    ///

    There’s no way to know if his development suffered at the hands of the Phillies. Supposedly they fooled around with his swing mechanics and he didn’t feel as comfortable after that. He’s had injuries, and they also have not liked his defense, which is pretty bad.

    But you don’t just assume a player like that can’t improve. Still has great potential and is a LHB. No smart Yankee decision maker, if we have any, would just assume he never figures it out.

    I just would not give up anything with elite upside in our system for him.

  117. joeman January 22nd, 2013 at 4:47 pm

    blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:44 pm
    joeman says:
    January 22, 2013 at 4:43 pm
    really how many prospects are the 2nd coming and never pan out…

    Nobody is talking about trading Gary Sanchez for him …..
    ————————————————————-
    besides the B’s now Sanchez is the 2nd coming

  118. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 4:48 pm

    “Here’s the problem with trading for Dom Brown – the team that’s had him his entire professional career doesn’t think he’s good enough to play over Delmon Young so maybe we should take that as a cautionary tale.”
    ///

    That should be a leverage point though. His value is down, take advantage.

  119. joeman January 22nd, 2013 at 4:48 pm

    like to know where Brown is going to play

  120. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:48 pm

    and where did you find them

    Baseball reference

  121. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:49 pm

    “besides the B’s now Sanchez is the 2nd coming”

    Nice straw man you’re building there….but suggesting the Yanks try to take a flyer on Brown if he’s available and they can get him cheap isnt exactly calling anybody the 2nd coming

  122. Shame Spencer January 22nd, 2013 at 4:49 pm

    I just would not give up anything with elite upside in our system for him.

    ———————-

    Neither would I… the low cost is definitely what’s so attractive about this move. Kid could need a change of scenery/new set of eyes on him. Ironically, the same might be said about Betances.

  123. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:50 pm

    joeman says:
    January 22, 2013 at 4:48 pm
    like to know where Brown is going to play

    He’d have to be a DH/4th outfielder type with the Yanks for now

  124. Shame Spencer January 22nd, 2013 at 4:50 pm

    joeman January 22nd, 2013 at 4:48 pm

    like to know where Brown is going to play

    —————–

    The OF..?

    Ichiro/Gardner/Granderson/Brown would make a nice mix.. Grandy needs more time off this year.

  125. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:51 pm

    @PeteAbe: Napoli has Avascular necrosis. http://t.co/TRlGCdXU

  126. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:51 pm

    Thats a scary sounding thing.

  127. Warning Track Power January 22nd, 2013 at 4:52 pm

    joeman January 22nd, 2013 at 4:48 pm
    like to know where Brown is going to play
    ***********************************************
    AAA

    There is no room for him as another LH bat in
    the DH spot or 4th OF position in 2013
    Give the kid a solid year in the minors, perhaps call him up in Sept
    and go from there

  128. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:53 pm

    There is no room for him as another LH bat in
    the DH spot or 4th OF position in 2013

    There is plenty of room as a LH DH and 4th OFer. The idea being, that Granderson is going to walk so they should be getting him ready to take a full time spot in 2014.

  129. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 4:54 pm

    I’m saying these things because I’ve seen the guy a lot in AA and also in AAA – not because the Phillies think this or that about him. I don’t care what these various scouting bureaus say particularly, either, and I wouldn’t just assume, had I never laid eyes on him, that since he’s not playing on the ML roster that it wouldn’t be worth an inquiry, as a couple here seem to be doing. At 25, he’s still got his prime years in front of him. He’d be worth a shot as a project that might be salvaged, depending on the cost.

  130. yankeefeminista January 22nd, 2013 at 4:54 pm

    Betances doesn’t need a change of scenery. He just needs to keep pitching, whereas the Phillies don’t want to give Dominic a shot. Then again, he cannot field, so you’d have to play him at DH. Further, I do wonder if he is a damaged goods. He had MRIs on the knees in March, and then again at the end of the season. What is up with that?

  131. joeman January 22nd, 2013 at 4:56 pm

    Shame Spencer January 22nd, 2013 at 4:50 pm
    joeman January 22nd, 2013 at 4:48 pm

    like to know where Brown is going to play

    —————–

    The OF..?

    Ichiro/Gardner/Granderson/Brown would make a nice mix.. Grandy needs more time off this year
    ————————————
    not for nothing but shouldn’t a nice 4th outfielder be righthanded

  132. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:57 pm

    I can certainly see why the Sox wanted to shorten the term on Napoli….that’s not a condition that figures to go away and could get progressively worse

  133. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:57 pm

    not for nothing but shouldn’t a nice 4th outfielder be righthanded

    No time to be picky, and at this point when you’re begging for scraps I’d take a very good prospect with the potential to help 2014+ over a RH guy like scott hairston that just going to suck up payroll

  134. Warning Track Power January 22nd, 2013 at 4:57 pm

    Joe
    Yes. The answer is yes.

    Brown can be traded for and sent to the minors
    for development.

  135. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 4:58 pm

    “not for nothing but shouldn’t a nice 4th outfielder be righthanded”

    Ideally yea but they could also put him at AAA and currently they have no DH vs RHP

  136. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 4:59 pm

    Neither would I… the low cost is definitely what’s so attractive about this move. Kid could need a change of scenery/new set of eyes on him. Ironically, the same might be said about Betances.
    ///

    Betances was a risk from go. Having seen them both, I wouldn’t trade Betances for him. I’ve seen Betances dominate too much to not be extremely reluctant to give up on him. I also think his 2012 was more nightmare than waking reality, for reasons already stated in here. Betances’ value, right now, is low, anyway.

  137. joeman January 22nd, 2013 at 4:59 pm

    Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:57 pm
    not for nothing but shouldn’t a nice 4th outfielder be righthanded

    No time to be picky, and at this point when you’re begging for scraps
    ——————————————–
    who ever thought it would come to this raise their hand

  138. Shame Spencer January 22nd, 2013 at 5:00 pm

    yankeefeminista January 22nd, 2013 at 4:54 pm

    Betances doesn’t need a change of scenery. He just needs to keep pitching, whereas the Phillies don’t want to give Dominic a shot. Then again, he cannot field, so you’d have to play him at DH. Further, I do wonder if he is a damaged goods. He had MRIs on the knees in March, and then again at the end of the season. What is up with that?

    ————————

    I think Betances and Brown are as comparable as it gets when it comes to position players vs. pitchers.

    Both guys have good raw tools, both have been jerked around on some level by their organization, and both aren’t fulfilling their on-paper potential.

    I’m not saying it’s 100% apples to apples, but the more we discuss these two, the more interesting the similarities look.

  139. yankeefeminista January 22nd, 2013 at 5:00 pm

    So, FWIW, it is the right knee that is Brown’s problem knee, and sounds like it might be chronic; he broke the right ankle in high school and so biomechanically he may be a little off, which may result occasional problems with that knee.

  140. yankeefeminista January 22nd, 2013 at 5:01 pm

    result *in

  141. yankeefeminista January 22nd, 2013 at 5:02 pm

    I get what you are saying, but I don’t think you can compare a pitcher to a position player.

  142. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 5:03 pm

    @PeteAbe: Agent Brian Grieper said Napoli’s condition is in both hips

    Yikes

  143. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 5:14 pm

    Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 4:39 pm

    That’ll be news to nearly everyone, even those who think he can’t start.

    If they think he can’t start then his upside is obviously reliever, which means trading him for a position player is a no brainer.
    //

    It’s always been “high ceiling, low floor” with him. The “upside” has never been in doubt, and no one ever called his ceiling or “upside” relief work.

    Making him a reliever is a last resort, and a profoundly disappointing one.

    That said, I have no idea if the Yankees want to see another year of him starting or what their plans are. His value right now is extremely low.

  144. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 5:17 pm

    Both guys have good raw tools
    ///

    Betances isn’t really “raw” though. He’s got a great change to go with his FB/CB. He’s tall, not raw.

  145. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 5:17 pm

    “Brown has upside and Betances has no upside? Interesting. That’ll be news to nearly everyone, even those who think he can’t start.”

    Different kinds of upside….I think Betances is a reliever as I’ve said so that limits his quite a bit

  146. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 5:17 pm

    Betances is make or break essentially, he is running out of options

  147. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 5:20 pm

    I just don’t think they have much more time with Betances to make him a starter…..they’ve been at it for a long time now. Maybe give it one more go early in 2013 but it’s not happening then I think they’ll move him to the pen and that they probably should…..this isn’t Joba Chamberlain where they literally have up after 1 year…..Betances has been in the system for like 7 years now

  148. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 5:29 pm

    Chamberlain isn’t 6-8.

    Betances lost a year because of ligament replacement so it’s actually five years.

  149. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 5:29 pm

    @daynperry: Even Delmon Young base-runner would run on Delmon Young right fielder.

  150. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 5:31 pm

    And there is no advantage to making him a reliever.

    His value has decreased, so he’s not going to get back the value of what he potentially becomes should he put it all together this year.

    The only thing that makes any sense is to wait it out and see what happens this year with him as a starter.

  151. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 5:32 pm

    “And there is no advantage to making him a reliever.”

    Sure there is….if they can get value out of him some way then they need to

  152. theREALkevin January 22nd, 2013 at 5:35 pm

    1 yr, 750k would have been a good move for delmon young by an AL team asking him to DH and hit mostly against lefties. I think some of those teams missed the boat. Maybe scared off by personality. Doesn’t make much sense for the phillies to me

  153. yankeefeminista January 22nd, 2013 at 5:36 pm

    Maybe the Phillies plan to platoon Delmon and Brown, and as an added bonus, both can field badly for them.

  154. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 5:36 pm

    They can’t just keep Betances on the 40 man forever hoping he will figure it out as a starter….at some point they need to get value out of him or move him off

  155. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 5:37 pm

    If he’s throwing strikes, he can start. If he’s not, he can’t do either.

    A Betances who’s throwing strikes is entirely wasted in the bullpen.

  156. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 5:38 pm

    Phillies say they are gonna play Delmon in RF and platoon Brown and Ruf in LF

  157. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 5:39 pm

    They still have a year left with him. They should stay the course.

  158. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 5:39 pm

    Betances lost a year because of ligament replacement so it’s actually five years.

    That was Brackman, Betances wasn’t on the 40 man so he didn’t lose a year.

  159. Rich in NJ January 22nd, 2013 at 5:40 pm

    I have no idea what the Phillies will do, but they have to say that, no matter what.

  160. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 5:40 pm

    J. Alfred Prufrock says:
    January 22, 2013 at 5:37 pm
    If he’s throwing strikes, he can start. If he’s not, he can’t do either.

    He might can throw strikes for shorter periods of time more consistently with that 6’8 frame

  161. blake January 22nd, 2013 at 5:41 pm

    Rich in NJ says:
    January 22, 2013 at 5:40 pm
    I have no idea what the Phillies will do, but they have to say that, no matter what.

    Yea

  162. yankeefeminista January 22nd, 2013 at 5:50 pm

    For his sake, hopefully Brown is healthy but he’s had a ton of hand and knee injuries, swing tweaks etc. And his power hasn’t been what it once was. He’s arb eligible in 2014, and they wanted to trade him for Soriano. I can’t imagine the Phillies allowing him to stick around much longer, but we’ll see.

  163. Chip January 22nd, 2013 at 5:50 pm

    Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 5:39 pm

    Betances lost a year because of ligament replacement so it’s actually five years.

    That was Brackman, Betances wasn’t on the 40 man so he didn’t lose a year.
    ————–

    Correct – Betances lost a year by being awful.

  164. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 5:51 pm

    That was Brackman, Betances wasn’t on the 40 man so he didn’t lose a year.
    ///

    He lost a year pitching. He missed 2009.

  165. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 5:53 pm

    Correct – Betances lost a year by being awful.

    He lost a year pitching. He missed 2009.

    No, he wasn’t added to the 40 man until Dec 2010 so he has not lost any time. He has 1 option left is all.

  166. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 5:54 pm

    To be clear, the Yankees have 6 years of control on Betances should they call him up. He has 1 option remaining, as he used 2 for 2011 & 2012.

  167. Chip January 22nd, 2013 at 5:54 pm

    Betances for Dom Brown would be an overpay.

    If you deal Betances then he’s going to wind up looking like Chris Garica – a shut down reliever (something the Yankees could use with Mo retiring and Joba hitting FA after this year).

    In return you’re getting a guy who might be no better than what the Yankees already have in Melky Mesa or Zoilo Almonte.

  168. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 5:56 pm

    In return you’re getting a guy who might be no better than what the Yankees already have in Melky Mesa or Zoilo Almonte.

    Or Betances is Brackman and Dom Brown is a major league outfielder and then oh no! Brown could atleast play in the majors next year. Betances has to get his walk rate into single digits.

  169. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 5:57 pm

    No, he wasn’t added to the 40 man until Dec 2010 so he has not lost any time. He has 1 option left is all.
    ///

    He has not been pitching here for seven years, but for five. That is my point.

  170. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 5:59 pm

    Ah I see, thought you were talking about service time.

  171. yankeefeminista January 22nd, 2013 at 5:59 pm

    I think Pruf meant that Betances lost a year of development not control.

    Betances still has one option, and with 3 solid pitches, you don’t want to relegate him to the bullpen unless you have to. We have a boatload of bp arms.

  172. Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 6:00 pm

    Betances basically has 1 year + spring training to become a starter. At the end of next spring, he will need to stick on the active roster and if he can’t start its going to be a pen transition or trade or DFA

  173. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 6:01 pm

    No, not service time.
    ///

    I wonder if he starts at AA or goes straight to SWB.

  174. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 6:04 pm

    YF, I see no virtue in it. The AFL outings sound encouraging.

  175. yankeefeminista January 22nd, 2013 at 6:05 pm

    I think SWB.

  176. austinmac January 22nd, 2013 at 6:05 pm

    Joeman,

    Most prospects don’t make it. Of course, the exceptions are all of the Yankee prospects who must make it by 2014.

  177. austinmac January 22nd, 2013 at 6:08 pm

    My point of view on Brown vs. Betances is Brown had the higher value at one point, but now both are long on projection and short on production. Maybe each needs a change of scenery. I would probably do that trade, but I doubt the Phil’s would. Someone would pay more.

  178. J. Alfred Prufrock January 22nd, 2013 at 6:11 pm

    Betances’ BB/K rates will be fine but he’s always going to BB some. That’s why relief work is not suited to him.

    He’ll not be the most efficient of starters, but one who is always a groundball away from erasing baserunners he’s walked and a K away from getting out of dodge. With his stuff, that will be just fine.

  179. yankeefeminista January 22nd, 2013 at 6:13 pm

    blake January 22nd, 2013 at 5:38 pm
    Phillies say they are gonna play Delmon in RF and platoon Brown and Ruf in LF
    ____
    Ruf was impressive at LHV. Monster power. But he is another wonky outfielder. Ben Revere has his work cut out for him with those COF’s flanking him.

  180. austinmac January 22nd, 2013 at 6:13 pm

    I appreciate the Betances support, but this is the year he has to prove himself. He is out of options, and the Yankees would likely lose him. Let’s hope Patterson helps him rather than having another Garcia situation.

  181. Chip January 22nd, 2013 at 6:15 pm

    Jerkface January 22nd, 2013 at 5:53 pm

    Correct – Betances lost a year by being awful.

    He lost a year pitching. He missed 2009.

    No, he wasn’t added to the 40 man until Dec 2010 so he has not lost any time. He has 1 option left is all.
    ————–

    He lost all of last season.

  182. yankeefeminista January 22nd, 2013 at 6:19 pm

    “The AFL outings sound encouraging.”

    Yep, AAA was the outlier actually, plus he had the shoulder strain. AFL = 11.25 K/9 3.00 BB/9 3.75 K/BB

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