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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Tex provides missing element

Posted by: Brian Heyman - Posted in Misc on Jun 05, 2013 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Kevin Youkilis, Mark TeixeiraMark Teixeira missed some things while he was sitting out the first two months of the regular season.

“You don’t play, you don’t miss making outs,” Teixeira said. “You don’t miss being the goat. You don’t miss losing four or five games in a row. But you miss hitting that big home run. You miss the energy in the dugout when you get back and the energy in the clubhouse when you get back.”

But Teixeira is experiencing that again. His homers have gone a long way in helping the Yankees win the last two games, his fourth and fifth games back from the DL.

In the 7-4 win over the Indians Monday night, he delivered a grand slam while hitting lefty. Then in Tuesday night’s 4-3 win, he cracked a three-run shot while hitting righty, and that provided to be the difference. He’s taking the power show as a positive in relation to his recovery from the partially torn tendon sheath in his right wrist suffered in early March.

“Seeing the power is important for me because I want to commit to my swing,” Teixeira said. “The first couple of games back, you’re kind of feeling for it. You don’t want to let it go and then (have to say), ‘Oh, that one hurt.’ But I haven’t had that yet. So just committing to the swing and hitting a home run left-handed and right-handed just kind of shows, ‘OK, just let it go.’ That’s what I’ve always done. I’ve never tried to just punch it to the opposite field or anything. So it’s definitely a good sign for the wrist.”

The Yankees have missed his kind of production and are glad to have it back.

“I think it’s kind of unfair to ask a guy that’s been down two months, didn’t have a normal spring training, to come in and be where other guys are at,” Joe Girardi said. “And you’ve got to remember, pitchers are further along now, too, than they were April 1 when they started. But it’s great to see him productive, productive from both sides.”

Here’s a link to my story today about the work of Teixeira and David Phelps in the latest victory as well as the reported coming suspension of Alex Rodriguez. There’s also a video link at the top of the article that I shot and edited of Girardi talking about Andy Pettitte and his desire not to cut back his between-starts work. And here’s a link to my story about the mostly wonderful work of the Yankees’ bullpen so far. I’ll be back later this morning with the lineup for today’s series finale.

Photo by The Associated Press.

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481 Responses to “Tex provides missing element”

  1. blake June 5th, 2013 at 7:38 am

    Yanks really need Tex to be good…..he looks more fit and athletic than he’s looked in years to me so maybe that’ll help him be a little more consistent offensively

  2. blake June 5th, 2013 at 7:40 am

    @JonHeymanCBS: here is #yankees real hope for a-rod, & it has nothing do with a possible 50/100 game ban. http://t.co/eu4cIDNag6

  3. Frankg June 5th, 2013 at 7:43 am

    Finally, someone is hitting HRs.

  4. blake June 5th, 2013 at 7:45 am

    Hey brain is saying that If Arod retired the yanks insurance policy would allow them to recover 80% of the remaining money on the contract…..ok assuming he’s talking about a perma DL type deal instead of straight retirement though because I thought if he just straight retired they were off the hook for everything

  5. MG June 5th, 2013 at 7:58 am

    blake June 5th, 2013 at 7:45 am
    Hey brain is saying that If Arod retired the yanks insurance policy would allow them to recover 80% of the remaining money on the contract…..ok assuming he’s talking about a perma DL type deal instead of straight retirement though because I thought if he just straight retired they were off the hook for everything
    —————
    blake, I was watching Teix pretty carefully from the left side last night and really didn’t see much of an uppercut, if any, in his swing.

    The grandslam on Monday just made the seats but it was a line drive.

    I thought that him cutting back on the number of swings he took in the cage would help him, it looks like he’s a little quicker to the ball from both sides of the plate-time will tell, of course.

  6. Yankee Trader June 5th, 2013 at 7:58 am

    ” So just committing to the swing and hitting a home run left-handed and right-handed just kind of shows, ‘OK, just let it go.’ That’s what I’ve always done. I’ve never tried to just punch it to the opposite field or anything. So it’s definitely a good sign for the wrist.”

    Blake-

    Regarding his last statement above, does trying to hit to the opposite field put more strain on the bottom wrist/hand on the bat? I know that Tex worked after the 2011 season, less with weights and more with hitting and soon after the season started, gave up trying to hit to the opposite field. He was happy with a 30 homer, 100 RBI.

  7. Doreen June 5th, 2013 at 7:59 am

    Blake,

    Interesting article.

    The whole situation is just a mess. I feel like I can’t intelligently comment on any of it so I won’t. And I’m not I to demonizing people. Human beings are faulty products.

    Nice to see Teixeira helping the Yankees win the past two nights. And nice to see Phelps back on track. The Indians are a tough team, and they worked him hard. Francona is a good manager.

    I thought that last night was the first time Joba went two nights in a row since coming off the DL, so I wasn’t surprised he had some difficulty. Still, a HR to Stubbs was not welcome at all! At least he didn’t cost them the game.

    I wonder what Girardi was talking about to DRob after the 8th? I guess we’ll never know be ause the reporters didn’t care much about the game…

  8. MG June 5th, 2013 at 8:03 am

    maybe Teix isn’t worth $20M+ a year but a guy who hits 30 HR, knocks in 100 RBI, and plays gold glove defense is worth more than Nick Swisher, who is making about $14-15M in his contract.

    So let’s say his fair value is in the $17-18M per year range right now. Is the Lohud Teix criticism based on him making $5M more per year than he’s worth?

    If so, given all the money thrown around in baseball on players that don’t live up to their contracts, that seems like a relatively small amount to generate all of this criticism and complaint, at least in my opinion.

  9. 86w183 June 5th, 2013 at 8:10 am

    Good morning gang —-

    I’m sure Girardi was reminding Robertson that throwing strikes is a good idea…. might also have been checking with him on availability for today.

    I have always been pretty supportive of A-rod and other PED users because I feel they have been infairly demonized by the hypocrites in the media who stood and cheered the Sosa/McGuire HR race in 1998.

    But if he did mess with this Regenesis guy and took HGH I’m done with him. this is post-testing and a far more egregious violation than anything he did prior to 2004.

    The Yanks’ best-case scenario is he just retires…. also the least likely.

    Second best would be a medically required retirement.

    Third best would be he misses all of this year with the injuries (earning some insurance $$$) and then gets hit with a 100 game suspension, saving another $ 16 Million.

  10. blake June 5th, 2013 at 8:10 am

    “Regarding his last statement above, does trying to hit to the opposite field put more strain on the bottom wrist/hand on the bat?”

    I think it just depends on the swing…..to hit a line drive to RF then you really need to keep that top hand on plane a long time….however if you think about hitting a fly ball the other way and the position your bottom wrist needs to be in to do that …sorta bent back…then yea I could see that.

  11. blake June 5th, 2013 at 8:12 am

    MG,

    Tex’s swing has always been long and kinda funky from the left side but when he was young and more athletic I think it was a bit more like throwing a cape and less of the collapse and lift and separate deal he had gotten in to the last couple of years. Maybe he’s made some adjustments in his time away that will actually help him……I certainly hope so cause there is probably nothing that could help this team more than for Tex to be good agin.

  12. 86w183 June 5th, 2013 at 8:12 am

    MG —-

    I never worry about what anyone is “worth” except when the debate is whether or not to sign player “X” for “Y” dollars. Once they are signed I would give a rat’s rump.

    Teixiera is a very good player. He’s more valuable than some players making more than he is and less valuable than some making less. C’est la’ vie’

  13. Yankee Trader June 5th, 2013 at 8:14 am

    Thanks for the article Blake.

    I’m not sure Heyman is accurate. If this is a disability insurance policy, I would think the monies flow from the insurance company directly to ARod. Depending on the wording in the policy, I would think that ARod would need physician statements that ARod could no longer perform in any capacity to play baseball at the major league level. The insurance company would do everything in it’s power to prove that ARod doesn’t have a career ending injury.

    Not an insurance agent, but questioning the article.

    Yes if he retires, as has been discussed on the blog before, the Yankees would be free from having to calculate his AAV for the remaining years of the contract, as it pertains to the LT.

    Thoughts?

  14. MG June 5th, 2013 at 8:14 am

    by the way, Adams is really struggling-pitchers started busting him inside and he was having trouble and now he’s chasing pitches away, probably trying to put a good swing on a pitch he can handle.

    The major leagues are tough, once the scouting report gets around they always find out the weaknesses. Then it’s up to the batter to adjust, hopefully Adams will make some adjustments and move forward.

  15. austinmac June 5th, 2013 at 8:15 am

    I wonder if the Yankees have been moving slowly with Cano’s contract until the Biogenisis facts are fully sorted out. It would make sense.

    To these reporters who suggest AROD will never return, we never hear how that will occur. It could only be from inability to physically play. He sure doesn’t strike me as a guy who walks away, and no team give up on $80M plus.

  16. joeman June 5th, 2013 at 8:15 am

    nothing against Tex he plays well thru the year and puts up nice #’s….Swisher is also a good player to have, two things I don’t like about Swisher are his act when he was here and not hitting in the playoffs…………….

    if Cervelli is suspended the NYY should cut him loose & I hope Arod is done with them….both are cheaters

  17. blake June 5th, 2013 at 8:15 am

    somebody give me a good summary of Phelps yesterday. I’m in the process of moving and have no TV or internet at home

  18. joeman June 5th, 2013 at 8:16 am

    blake June 5th, 2013 at 8:15 am
    somebody give me a good summary of Phelps yesterday. I’m in the process of moving and have no TV or internet at home

    —————————-
    yesterday he was good enough to pickup for my fantasy team….

  19. blake June 5th, 2013 at 8:17 am

    “maybe Teix isn’t worth $20M+ a year but a guy who hits 30 HR, knocks in 100 RBI, and plays gold glove defense is worth more than Nick Swisher, who is making about $14-15M in his contract.”

    Swisher has been a better hitter the last couple of years and can play 1B and RF…..so I don’t know. If Tex can get back to being a .900 OPS buy vs LHP and at least .800 vs RHP then yea I’d probably rather have Tex

  20. Rich in NJ June 5th, 2013 at 8:17 am

    I saw an uppercut from Tex from the left side, but at this point, the fact that he is a quality bat on a team that lacks them can obscure his shortcomings.

    The contract should be yet one of many cautionary notes when the decide what to do with Cano.

  21. austinmac June 5th, 2013 at 8:18 am

    YT,

    I think you have analyzed the situation correctly. The insurance company will require strong medical evidence of inability to play in the MLB. Diminished ability is very likely not enough. He will need to show in testing he has lost too much strength, range of motion etc.

  22. blake June 5th, 2013 at 8:19 am

    I think Heyman is incorrect about Arod “retiring” If he retires conventionally then my understanding is that he forfeits the remainder of the contract and they are off the hook entirely unless some sort of buy out is done.

    If he retires in name only but it’s really like a perma-DL situation where he’s medically unable to play then that’s where I think the insurance comes in….problem with that is I believe he’d still count 27.5 million a year towards the luxury tax.

  23. austinmac June 5th, 2013 at 8:20 am

    Blake,

    Phelps was a little wild, but his arm had life. He was regularly hitting 92 and his breaking ball was sharp.

  24. blake June 5th, 2013 at 8:21 am

    excite for the draft tomorrrow.

  25. Rich in NJ June 5th, 2013 at 8:25 am

    A guy with A-Rod’s pride is not going to retire before he gives himself a very long chance to still be good enough.

  26. CountryClub June 5th, 2013 at 8:28 am

    Hey, the yanks are actually going to play a series vs the Mariners and they won’t have to face king Felix. A very rare occurrence for them.

  27. MTU June 5th, 2013 at 8:28 am

    Blake-

    6 innings or near no hit ball tells you all you need to know.

    His command was a little off IMO as he walked 3 or 4 guys.

    Everything was kept down in the zone with the usual nice action on his pitches.

    7K’s in 6.

    Next time out he just needs to concentrate on being more efficient.

    He bought himself some more starts.

    Good luck with your move.

    Hike day for me today.

    :)

  28. Yankee Trader June 5th, 2013 at 8:30 am

    Rich-

    I don’t know if it’s pride or “show me the money.” He definitely won’t retire, and either would anyone here, if it meant forfeiting the remainder of your contract.

  29. blake June 5th, 2013 at 8:33 am

    thanks mac….he’s a good pitcher…he’s gonna get hit sometimes if he’s off just because he doesn’t have premium velocity or stuff but he’s gonna be good most of the time

  30. pat June 5th, 2013 at 8:33 am

    craigcalcaterra
    Get ready for the resurrection of Anthony Bosch’s character http://hardballtalk.nbcsports......character/ … via @HardballTalk

  31. Against All Odds June 5th, 2013 at 8:34 am

    blake June 5th, 2013 at 8:21 am
    excite for the draft tomorrrow.

    ———————

    Yep hopefully things will be back to normal by then.

  32. blake June 5th, 2013 at 8:34 am

    Yea Alex isn’t going to retire….actually the best outcome for the Yankees would be for him to get healthy and produce at least something…..but I think the 2nd best outcome would be for him to get healthy and then them eat enough money to facilitate trading him.

  33. bigdan22 June 5th, 2013 at 8:35 am

    Heyman’s an idiot. If Arod retires the Yankees’ obligation as an employer with respect to salary and compensation would terminate so the insurance policy would be inapplicable.

    On a side note, what ever happened to editors? The guys who reviewed copy BEFORE it went to wire or was published. I’m listening to ESPN last night and they are interviewing Chris Singleton, another know-nothing, about Arod, this investigation and the likelihood of Arod’s return. I understand that this is the free-wheeling age of the internet but we’re talking major news outlets here, CBS, ESPN. Are there no standards anymore? Or doesn’t anybody care about getting the story right.

  34. Rich in NJ June 5th, 2013 at 8:36 am

    YT

    I can’t discount the role that money will play, but he wouldn’t have become this good, even with his outlier talent, if he wasn’t extremely driven. He could live more than 40 years. I doubt he wants to go out this way, especially if he knows that many players have escaped the attacks despite also having used.

  35. blake June 5th, 2013 at 8:36 am

    Joel Sherman ?@Joelsherman1 22m
    Column 2 http://bit.ly/15GsPUf Draft is tmrw and 1 reason #Yankees don’t hv yng stars is don’t hv high enough picks to take them

    where have you heard this before ;)

  36. blake June 5th, 2013 at 8:37 am

    “Are there no standards anymore? Or doesn’t anybody care about getting the story right.”

    not really

  37. joecembrale June 5th, 2013 at 8:37 am

    Yankee Trader June 5th, 2013 at 8:30 am
    Rich-

    I don’t know if it’s pride or “show me the money.” He definitely won’t retire, and either would anyone here, if it meant forfeiting the remainder of your contract.

    In arod’s case, given not only this but the accumulation of scandals, it may just be an absence of shame.

  38. Yankee Trader June 5th, 2013 at 8:38 am

    Blake-

    Phelps in the 5th. Walks first batter Reynolds. Girardi on phone to bullpen. Walks 2nd batter Giambi. Rothschild out to the mound. Aviles strikes out, Stubbs pops out, Bourn easy fly out.

    He was dominant when he had to be! :)

  39. Against All Odds June 5th, 2013 at 8:38 am

    where have you heard this before

    ———————–

    Sherman gets all of his ideas from us we know that :D

  40. joecembrale June 5th, 2013 at 8:40 am

    I thought was a little hard on himself when he said he struggles when he doesnt hit his spots and doesnt have the stuff to simply throw it by hitters. If last night was struggling, i will take that every time. Especially from a pitcher at his stage of development.

  41. pat June 5th, 2013 at 8:41 am

    “Are there no standards anymore? Or doesn’t anybody care about getting the story right.”

    Because of the 24 hours news cycle that the new media has given us, outlets now employ more columnists/writers who deal in opinion than reporters/journalists who deal in fact.

  42. joecembrale June 5th, 2013 at 8:41 am

    *i thought Phelps*

  43. Rich in NJ June 5th, 2013 at 8:41 am

    I hope the Yankees don’t draft players with health risks high.

  44. blake June 5th, 2013 at 8:44 am

    I think maybe Phelps is establishing himself as a rotation piece going forward…..even if it’s the 4th or 5th starter it’s just greatly helpful to have a quality and cheap guy in that role. Having a good back end starter steals you wins over the course of the year…..

  45. joecembrale June 5th, 2013 at 8:45 am

    Phelps also has the makeup of a guy you need in that role.

  46. Yankee Trader June 5th, 2013 at 8:49 am

    Heyman’s an idiot. If Arod retires the Yankees’ obligation as an employer with respect to salary and compensation would terminate so the insurance policy would be inapplicable.
    —————————
    BigDan-

    I read your good posts from last night. If this is a disability insurance policy, which is already being paid, if all medical tests and physician notes deem ARod will need , lets say for example, a total hip replacement due to arthritis or aseptic necrosis from lack blood flow to the hip, then wouldn’t the insurance policy between ARod and the company still be in effect, and monies then paid directly to him, if he retires?

  47. Rich in NJ June 5th, 2013 at 8:50 am

    Phelps’ role this year could be in jeopardy if Pineda comes back, as seems possible. Because he is more important to their future, I would keep Phelps in the rotation ahead of Hughes.

  48. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 8:50 am

    Random thoughts this morning:

    1) The Government couldnt prosecute Bonds or Clemens so I have a hard time believing baseball will be successful with their latest attempt.

    2) Is there a league anywhere that has as many leaks as MLB? They are never in control of the story. Ever. If I worked for their PR team, I’d be livid.

    3) MLB employs Mark McGuire… as a coach… of young hitters.

    4) Yankees: Glad we were able to win this series. We needed it badly. I’d love to see them sweep this team.

    5) I am still in complete shock that MLB is going to help shield Bosch from federal charges.

  49. MTU June 5th, 2013 at 8:50 am

    Two more items on Phelps :

    He has very respectable K rates

    He is very athletic on the mound. Take his pick off move as an example.

    Gotta hit the trail.

    Later.

  50. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 8:51 am

    McGwire. I always spell that wrong.

  51. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 8:52 am

    This will not be over by seasons end.. I can guarantee you that much.

  52. joecembrale June 5th, 2013 at 8:53 am

    Rich in NJ June 5th, 2013 at 8:50 am
    Phelps’ role this year could be in jeopardy if Pineda comes back, as seems possible. Because he is more important to their future, I would keep Phelps in the rotation ahead of Hughes.

    Yep. People will be desperate for pitching come close to the deadline. Hughes and even Joba will make nice rentals. Even Nova might fetch a diamond in the ruff. IF Pineda pans out.

  53. Yankee Trader June 5th, 2013 at 8:54 am

    MTU-

    One last thing on Phelps. He works fast.

    Have a great day.

  54. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 8:55 am

    Can we get a percentage of how often Phelps gives this team a chance to win? :D

  55. Rich in NJ June 5th, 2013 at 8:55 am

    5) I am still in complete shock that MLB is going to help shield Bosch from federal charges.
    -

    Bud is now more concerned with repairing flaws in his legacy than in building the brand for future growth. The NFL is leaving MLB in the dust in part because it is run better.

  56. Rich in NJ June 5th, 2013 at 8:55 am

    Later.

  57. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 8:56 am

    Ideally, Nova puts together some good numbers in AAA and they find a way to move him either at the deadline or in the off season.

  58. joecembrale June 5th, 2013 at 8:59 am

    The Nfl is run better. Baseball is a lot like Nixon in the years after his impeachment, the more you try to repair your reputation, you keep reminding people of what you did wrong. And it never goes away. The other problem for mlb is that the union is so strong, they are going to tie up this issue well beyond this year and the cloud will hang over the game. The football union does not have that power.

  59. bigdan22 June 5th, 2013 at 9:00 am

    It is my understanding YT, that is this type of insurance contract. the insured (the party paying the premiums and the party seeking protection from risk of loss) is the team not the player. Therefore, if the insured against event takes place, that is, Arod is unable to take the field, then the insurer pays the insured, the Yanks.

    It’s possible Arod could have his own disability policy, but unless he retires, the Yanks are paying his salary irrespective of whether he’s able to take the field.

  60. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 9:00 am

    Rich – I’m not sure the other leagues are better run, exactly… but I have a hard time wrapping my head around why any league would have this kind of info leak without having their ducks in a row.

  61. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 9:02 am

    The NFL suspended half a team for a something they had no proof of… and they still come out smelling like roses with the nonsense MLB is up to.

  62. Yankee Trader June 5th, 2013 at 9:06 am

    Ideally, Nova puts together some good numbers in AAA and they find a way to move him either at the deadline or in the off season.
    —————————

    Shame-
    Good morning.
    Ideally Nova finds consistency with his location, gets more ground balls and hits 94-96 on the radar gun with his fastball, that now has movement!

    Since we are speaking of an ideal world. :)

    Ideally Pineda comes back 100% with a 3rd pitch. Kuroda signs a one year extension before the TD. Phelps continues to shine and then you trade Hughes in a package to SD for Chase Headley.

    Starting rotation for next season:

    Kuroda
    Sabathia
    Nova
    Pineda
    Phelps

    :)

  63. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 9:06 am

    Also to add to my list of random thoughts:

    1) Any MLB player providing blood samples to anyone is an idiot.

    2) None of these guys watched The Wire. If you are buying drugs you do not have anyone associated with you do it for you. You layer like 5-6 other people between you and the purchase.

    3) If Biogenesis has blood samples of any player involved, how can it be proved there was no tampering involved? Is a link to Biogenesis enough? Would the argument simply be, ‘They denied any involvement but they have their blood’ or something of that nature?

    4) If I am Arod I will be taking all of my contract money, thankyouverymuch. No way, with my Hall of Fame entry in question and my ability to get a job with MLB in the future highly unlikely, will I give up the remainder of the money owed to me.

    5) Braun’s situation is even more interesting to me than Arod’s, as he’s someone that is in the thick of his career.

  64. blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:11 am

    “If this is a disability insurance policy, which is already being paid, if all medical tests and physician notes deem ARod will need , lets say for example, a total hip replacement due to arthritis or aseptic necrosis from lack blood flow to the hip, then wouldn’t the insurance policy between ARod and the company still be in effect, and monies then paid directly to him, if he retires?”

    I think so yes….but maybe the important thing for the Yankees is that he would still count on their luxury taxable payroll……they would get money back from the insurance but he’d still technically be on their payroll unless he retires officially…..

  65. blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:13 am

    “5) Braun’s situation is even more interesting to me than Arod’s, as he’s someone that is in the thick of his career.”

    I agree….Arod’s bed is pretty much already made in the court of public opinion….I’m not sure there is anything he can do to get his reputation back. Braun is teetering…..if this sticks he’s in the same boat.

  66. Hassey June 5th, 2013 at 9:13 am

    I’m also guessing Dan Uggla and Hanley Ramirez and any other muscle bound Miami players…possibly Stanton

  67. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 9:14 am

    Trader – I like your ideals!

  68. yankeefeminista June 5th, 2013 at 9:18 am

    Speaking of Nova, he isn’t even pitching yet at AAA? What is up with that?

    Another good article by Calcaterra on this MLB Biogenesis mess:

    Donnie Collins 21m
    A must-read for anyone who thinks union should step aside while MLB suspends Biogenesis suspects w/ out due process. http://hardballtalk.nbcsports......e/related/

  69. yankeefeminista June 5th, 2013 at 9:21 am

    Never mind. They finally put Nova’s start up; he is pitching tonight for SWB.

  70. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 9:21 am

    blake – I don’t think there are many people that believe Braun. I think anyone linked to this stuff is going to carry the stain forever. What we’ve seen, however, is a huge public ‘meh’ lately related to PEDs while MLB is sharpening their pitchforks. I think when Braun was caught initially, it was at first surprising and then people were just like ‘whatever, everyone is on that sh**’ and moved on quickly. This thing with MLB seems very personal…

  71. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 9:22 am

    fem – I was wondering the same! Thanks for the info.

  72. Tackelberry June 5th, 2013 at 9:22 am

    Scout.com’s Kiley McDaniel hears the Marlins are considering Rob Kamminsky at pick # 6. He has been projected as a late 1st rounder all this time, possibly to the Yankees. If Aaron Judge is there at pick#26, he should be the guy. Huge power bat with speed and power to all fields. Good outfielder too for his size

  73. 86w183 June 5th, 2013 at 9:24 am

    The money they might get back from insurance would/should be a credit on the luxury tax calculation just like the money they are getting back from the angels for the Vernon Wells contract.

    I don’t know that for certain but it only stands to reason. Just like they would get savings if he is suspended without pay. 100 games in 2014 would be roughly $ 16 M, which would reduce Alex’s cap figure from $ 27.5 M to $ 11.5 M.

    Teams pay to insure the contract and teams get any/all payouts from that insurance.

  74. 86w183 June 5th, 2013 at 9:25 am

    CC needs to be strong and efficient today. Likely Joba, D-Rob and Mo all unavailable.

  75. joeman June 5th, 2013 at 9:25 am

    I think Phelps is going to have his ups and downs, a full year of rotation work will set him up nice for next year

  76. yankeefeminista June 5th, 2013 at 9:26 am

    Shame, It’s curious. Nova’s hasn’t pitched since the 29th. Six days of rest between appearances…

  77. joeman June 5th, 2013 at 9:27 am

    Arod is a liar and a cheater….lawyer up and get this guy off the team

  78. ron June 5th, 2013 at 9:27 am

    If arod physically can’t play,he will be forced to retire,with the ins co covering a large part of the contract.I don’t think we are there yet,but if he comes back this year,i play him every day til he just can’t do it anymore,then he has to retire.

  79. yankeefeminista June 5th, 2013 at 9:27 am

    *Nova

  80. joeman June 5th, 2013 at 9:28 am

    86w183 June 5th, 2013 at 9:25 am
    CC needs to be strong and efficient today. Likely Joba, D-Rob and Mo all unavailable.

    ———————————-
    have no faith in joba anymore, he never seems to have a clean inning

  81. yankeefeminista June 5th, 2013 at 9:28 am

    MLB Trade Rumors mlbtraderumors 7m
    Yankees Release Clay Rapada http://bit.ly/181x9Sm #mlb

  82. joeman June 5th, 2013 at 9:30 am

    if Arod has admitted once and caught a 2nd time how could the NYY ever take him back…and really cut Cervelli loose

  83. 86w183 June 5th, 2013 at 9:30 am

    Aaron Judge and/or Austin Wilson could be nice, strong college bats they could choose in the range of 26-33.

    They also appear to like H.S. Outfielder Billy McKinney and Notre Dame 3B Eric Jagiello. Indiana State LHP Sean Manea would be a nice high ceiling grab too.

  84. blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:31 am

    “blake – I don’t think there are many people that believe Braun.”

    yea but he did skate by and there is at least some doubt there…..also because he wasn’t suspended the casual fan who doesn’t follow this stuff as closely may not even think twice about it.

  85. blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:32 am

    “The money they might get back from insurance would/should be a credit on the luxury tax calculation just like the money they are getting back from the angels for the Vernon Wells contract.”

    maybe it should be but I’m pretty sure it isn’t

  86. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 9:33 am

    A couple of things on the latest steroid news:

    1. From a purely baseball standpoint a suspension of Cervelli is worse for the Yankees than a suspension of Alex.

    2. Melky would also be in line for 100 games.

    3. For the people who are aghast that MLB is more interested in seeing Bosch’s clients punished than Bosch himself: That’s what they’re supposed to do. MLB is not a law enforcement agency; they’re a business. As such they have every right to be more concerned with the conduct of their employees than with the prosecution of a drug dealer. For example, if your company has a drug free policy and your boss has reason to suspect that you are using drugs and a dealer is willing to confirm that he sold you drugs, your boss’s obligation is not to turn the dealer over to the police but to fire you for a violation of company policy.

    4. I saw reference to McGwire being allowed to coach representing a double standard. It’s not and here’s why: If Alex is suspended for 100 games, MLB isn’t going to throw him out of baseball. They’re not going to say he can’t have anything to do with the game – he’ll even be eligible for the Hall of Fame. Once you do your time and serve your penalty that’s it. It’s over as far as MLB is concerned.

    5. The players are not victims here. The policies in place that the league is using to go after them were signed off on by the players’ union. It was collectively bargained. The majority of players don’t want guys like Alex or Braun or Melky or Cervelli or Cruz skating thanks to loopholes, they want to see their rights protected, but in the end they want the fans to know that the players who are dirty are being punished so we can hopefully do away with the widespread skepticism of player performance that has taken over the game.

    6. Go Tex.

  87. DONNYBROOK June 5th, 2013 at 9:33 am

    - WED AM MUSINGS -

    (1) Phelps was mediocre last night. Men on base, consistently behind in counts, Novaesque.

    (2) NO Cano. He continues to Shrink in situations where a “Face of the franchise” should Shine.

    (3) Someone needs to teach Stewart how to run-the-bases. We watched him pull a Bonehead move last week and get nailed at 3B, and he follows that up with last night’s Bonehead move at 2B. And this from a Vet?

    (4) Chamberlain continues to prove that MPH ain’t the end-all, be-all.

    (5) MLB cornered Pete Rose, and they will do likewise with A-Rod. It takes time, but they hire people that are methodically relentless.

  88. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 9:34 am

    blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:31 am

    “blake – I don’t think there are many people that believe Braun.”

    yea but he did skate by and there is at least some doubt there…..also because he wasn’t suspended the casual fan who doesn’t follow this stuff as closely may not even think twice about it.
    —————–

    Buster Olney this morning said that Braun is MLB’s Lance Armstrong.

  89. blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:34 am

    when a team takes on money in a trade they are actually taking on the money…..if Alex is deemed medically unable to play then the Yankees still have to pay him like normal…..the insurance just pays them back some of it. So it’s not exactly the same thing……and I’m almost positive that he’d still count 27.5 million towards the luxury tax just the same……JF or someone else will have to confirm that though.

  90. Yankee Trader June 5th, 2013 at 9:34 am

    YF-

    Thanks for the article. In Braun’s case it was testosterone. Synthetic testosterone, from what I’ve read has a very short half-life, about an hour. Very difficult to test for, even if you are conducting unannounced random testing and easy to mask.

    MLB will be in for a big fight in trying to prove that Braun is using synthetic testosterone, or should I rephrase that-continuing to use synthetic testosterone! :)

  91. blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:35 am

    “Buster Olney this morning said that Braun is MLB’s Lance Armstrong.”

    strong statement without definitive proof or an admission…..more opinion than fact.

  92. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 9:35 am

    Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 8:50 am

    Random thoughts this morning:

    1) The Government couldnt prosecute Bonds or Clemens so I have a hard time believing baseball will be successful with their latest attempt.
    ————————-

    Burden of proof is a lot different for Baseball than it is for the Federal Government.

  93. blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:36 am

    Joba is going to be sliding down that depth chart…….

  94. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 9:36 am

    blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:35 am

    “Buster Olney this morning said that Braun is MLB’s Lance Armstrong.”

    strong statement without definitive proof or an admission…..more opinion than fact.
    ———————–

    He was referring to the fact that, when caught, not only did Braun deny use but he claimed a vast conspiracy, threw people under the bus, etc…

  95. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 9:37 am

    blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:36 am

    Joba is going to be sliding down that depth chart…….
    ——————

    Hopefully all the way out of pinstripes.

  96. ron June 5th, 2013 at 9:37 am

    Mlb said that they will try to get the biogenesis players on 2 counts of violations,setting up a 100 game suspention.
    One for lying,and another for the act itself.
    My question is,how many times before you can ban a player for good?
    Arod admitted to it once already,so if mlb gives him a 100 game suspention,that would mean a second offense,not including when arod admitted to using steroids.
    The Yankees can say that this is his 3rd offense,if mlb gets him with 2 offenses involving biogenesis???

  97. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 9:38 am

    ron,

    Alex admitted to steroid use before steroid use was a punishable offense in baseball – so that doesn’t count against him.

  98. joeman June 5th, 2013 at 9:40 am

    Chip June 5th, 2013 at 9:35 am
    Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 8:50 am

    Random thoughts this morning:

    1) The Government couldnt prosecute Bonds or Clemens so I have a hard time believing baseball will be successful with their latest attempt.
    ————————-

    Burden of proof is a lot different for Baseball than it is for the Federal Government.
    —————————–
    Arod did admit it ..those other two never did that

  99. Yankee Trader June 5th, 2013 at 9:41 am

    Mustelier’s BA now .303, second on the team to Neal, who’s at .333.

  100. Yankee Trader June 5th, 2013 at 9:44 am

    Time to go.

    Have a great day.

  101. Mike Ri June 5th, 2013 at 9:45 am

    Thanks for the article. In Braun?s case it was testosterone. Synthetic testosterone, from what I?ve read has a very short half-life, about an hour. Very difficult to test for, even if you are conducting unannounced random testing and easy to mask.

    ———-

    Respectfully not true … I use juice (sadly) . . >Test stays in your system 7 to 21 days depending on what kind of Testosterone

    Test C – 1 week
    Test Susp – 2 to 3 days
    Test E – 4 to 5 weeks

  102. CompassRosy June 5th, 2013 at 9:45 am

    CountryClub says:
    June 5, 2013 at 8:28 am
    Hey, the yanks are actually going to play a series vs the Mariners and they won’t have to face king Felix. A very rare occurrence for them.

    ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

    No such luck ;-)
    Felix pitches on Sunday (though he’s typically much tougher on the Yanks at YS than at SF)
    Too bad Kuma misses the series.

  103. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 9:46 am

    joeman June 5th, 2013 at 9:40 am

    Chip June 5th, 2013 at 9:35 am
    Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 8:50 am

    Random thoughts this morning:

    1) The Government couldnt prosecute Bonds or Clemens so I have a hard time believing baseball will be successful with their latest attempt.
    ————————-

    Burden of proof is a lot different for Baseball than it is for the Federal Government.
    —————————–
    Arod did admit it ..those other two never did that
    —————

    MLB is not (officially) going after Alex for what he did prior to 2009. They’re going after him for this Biogenesis stuff…what he admitted to doing prior to the current policy is irrelevant.

  104. Mike Ri June 5th, 2013 at 9:46 am

    2 to 3 weeks *

  105. yankeefeminista June 5th, 2013 at 9:46 am

    Good ole mlb, well said: “But then again, Major League Baseball has never seemed too interested in what actually went on with any of this in any thorough way. The Mitchell Report was certainly not meant to answer any questions. It was meant to stop them. To put a bookend on the p.r. disaster that Ken Caminiti and Jose Canseco uncorked in 2002. To put a bookend on the steroids era itself, really, and to allow fans, the press and the government to pretend that steroids use was limited to a certain unfortunate time and to certain unsavory group of people. Baseball is doing it again. It’s going to nip Biogenesis in the bud, hang a few big names out to dry and declare victory.

    If, in fact, it actually achieves victory….”

  106. blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:47 am

    “Respectfully not true … I use juice (sadly) . . >Test stays in your system 7 to 21 days depending on what kind of Testosterone”

    my biggest question on the whole thing was the actual level they tested him as having…..it was crazy high…..like so high that it didn’t seem realistic.

  107. yankeefeminista June 5th, 2013 at 9:47 am

    YT, you’re welcome. Have a good day!

  108. blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:48 am

    MLB wants fewer PEDS in baseball just like Salem wanted fewer witches in their town.

  109. yankeefeminista June 5th, 2013 at 9:49 am

    blake, great analogy. lol.

  110. Mike Ri June 5th, 2013 at 9:52 am

    Blake –

    From what I heard . .Brauns Testerone levels spiked 65 percent from a normal athlete of his size and stature

    Anyone familar with juice knows thats point blank steroids. He can blame the testing and a mix up in blood …. .. .Grant it …. the testing isn’t perfect .. and accidents do happen. . .But that big of spike sends red flags all over the place…

    MLB wanted Braun badly . . .and they Got him .

  111. ron June 5th, 2013 at 9:52 am

    Well,if mlb gets arod on 2 counts,and a 100 game suspention,then at the very least,the Yankees have to get him what,one more time before a permanent ban?

    Drop something into his Gatorade,and BY BY AROD……..

  112. 86w183 June 5th, 2013 at 9:52 am

    I thought Phelps was pretty good last night.

    I’ll take six shutout one-hit innings seven days a week. Yes he fell behind a good bit and walked some guys (4), but he struck out more (7) and got the big outs when he needed to and few if any balls were hit hard.

    I can forgive Stewart’s lousy base running. Hell, he doesn’t have much experience in that regard.

  113. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 9:53 am

    MLB is not a law enforcement agency; they’re a business.

    ———————

    Chip – Does it not strike you as crazy that a business can influence federal and state investigations…?? That’s ludicrous.

  114. ron June 5th, 2013 at 9:54 am

    Wit braun,it was determined that the testosterone had to have come from outside of his body.
    It was like a 30:1 ratio,when a 4:1 triggers a positive.

  115. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 9:54 am

    Random thoughts this morning:

    1) The Government couldnt prosecute Bonds or Clemens so I have a hard time believing baseball will be successful with their latest attempt.

    2) Is there a league anywhere that has as many leaks as MLB? They are never in control of the story. Ever. If I worked for their PR team, I’d be livid.

    3) MLB employs Mark McGuire… as a coach… of young hitters.

    4) Yankees: Glad we were able to win this series. We needed it badly. I’d love to see them sweep this team.

    5) I am still in complete shock that MLB is going to help shield Bosch from federal charges.
    _____________________

    MLB are a bunch of giant hypocrites. While I want steroids gone as much as anyone, I would rather someone other than the people who profited off of it with McGwire and Sosa start the fight.

    Also, making a deal with a drug dealer? Really MLB?

    This 100 game suspension for Braun and Alex is such BS and will go nowhere. There are suspension rules in place. Neither was actually suspended and in Alex’s case, didn’t fail a drug test during the testing era. Their lame attempt to suspend guys for being associated with the same drug dealer that they are now associated themselves with is just laughable. On top of that, the guy dealing drugs is the only witness? And will now be given a pass to say what MLB wants him to?

    Good luck Selig when the players SUE YOUR BUTTS!

  116. blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:55 am

    “From what I heard . .Brauns Testerone levels spiked 65 percent from a normal athlete of his size and stature”

    I think I read somewhere that it was 3x any level ever tested by MLB or something like that…..I don’t know the whole thing with Braun seemed fishy on both sides to me. If it turns out that he was involved in this biogenesis thing more than just a consultation on defense of the previous charge then yea I’d assume that’s too much smoke for there not to be some fire.

  117. blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:57 am

    my biggest issue really with MLB on their PED quest is how personal they seem to take some of the cases……it just depends on the player involved seems like to me and whether they like them or not how hard they push to bust them.

  118. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 9:57 am

    Chip – My only point in bringing up McGwire is that MLB does nothing to help itself ..ever. This is a guy that lied to Congress about PED usage and they welcomed him back to the game after some crocodile tear apology he handed out yearrrrrs later (only so he could get the job, mind you). Take a hard line stance or don’t. They want to play to the players they like and destroy the ones that they don’t. That’s how it seems to come across anyway.

  119. Mike Ri June 5th, 2013 at 9:58 am

    It was like a 30:1 ratio,when a 4:1 triggers a positive.


    LOL Damn thats insane . . .wow

  120. blake June 5th, 2013 at 9:58 am

    I don’t think we will see a rationale and objective protocol on this stuff until Selig is gone…..it’s personal to him and he has made it that way trying to repair his legacy

  121. Nick in SF June 5th, 2013 at 9:59 am

    Analogy Police have to step in here. Whatever you think about MLB’s motives, there are PEDs in baseball while there were no actual witches in Salem. So the analogy seems flawed. How does it work?

  122. Mike in Harrisburg June 5th, 2013 at 10:01 am

    I think this is going to blow up in Selig’s face. And to an extent I hope it does. I think he expects public sentiment to be on his side but I don’t think that is going to pan out. The MLBPA is ready to rumble and I think its’ going to become apparent the rules have less teeth than anyone thought. It’s one thing to suspend some minor league schlub for 50 games. Going after some of the top names in the game is another entirely.

  123. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:02 am

    Besides the s**tshow that is MLB’s quest to ‘demonize’ a few of the steroid users, they have proven extremely irresponsible. I am shocked the union hasn’t tried to sue them already for leaking player information against protocol and the process they agreed to. In the case of Robinson Cano, they have twice mentioned he is under investigation, even though the only tie to him was someone he knows who works at his charity.

    I am going to take a WILD GUESS and say Bosch works with people other than MLB players on steroids. I have to assume he probably works with regular people as well. Could be wrong, but I doubt I am.

  124. ron June 5th, 2013 at 10:03 am

    http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/ne.....eal_022312

  125. ron June 5th, 2013 at 10:06 am

    Bottom line is,if brauns sample was delivered on time,and fed x was not closed,braun is suspended,and he does not beat the test that showed synthetic testosterone,and a T/E ratio (testosterone to epitestosterone) was 30:1. A ratio of 4:1 triggers a positive test.

    He got off on a technicality,and maybe rightfully so.

  126. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:06 am

    congrats to the commissioner’s office on getting boesch’s cooperation. they’ve been working on this since the news broke about biogenesis.

    in the past they looked the other way and were rightly criticized for it.

    this time they deserve some credit. good work.

  127. Mike Ri June 5th, 2013 at 10:06 am

    Mike in Harrisburg-

    Its going to be a big time battle . .But i dont’ think MLB would have blown millions on this investigation if it wasn’t sure of a (court, suspension) victory.

  128. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:07 am

    I just wish MLB would handle this stuff in house until they’re ready to actually hand down suspensions.. they can’t seem to do anything on the DL. I imagine when they are doing investigations they have people dress like Sherlock Holmes.

    They’re always chasing the story. They’re never steering the ship.

    I don’t know if it’s sheer ineptitude but it seems incredible that something like negotiations between a key witness and the league would leak from DAY ONE. I mean, there wasn’t even time to wait for the other shoe to drop… that info came out immediately. What are you doing MLB?!

  129. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:09 am

    this time they deserve some credit. good work.
    _____

    Getting the cooperation of a steroid dealer.
    This is no different than Clemens v McNamee.
    Clemens was probably guilty as sin, but giving McNamee a pass was just crap. His credibility was zero. And the last time I checked, the drug DEALER is more of a catch than the DRUGGIE. So they idea that MLB can help Bosch in court if naive on the part of Bosch.

  130. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:09 am

    boeschs’ cooperation isnt going to be the end of this and they do have other evidence. and they are seeking more.

    alot of people making judgements on what mlb has before we know what they have beyind boesch.

    they seem to be going about this in the right way. we’ll see if it sticks, but they are getting alot more than they ever have in these situations in the past.

  131. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:10 am

    Give them credit for what…??? Offering protection to someone that has committed a felonies several times over in order to clean house? I don’t understand how this should be applauded. That’s like if my company decided tomorrow that they don’t like how much weed I smoke so they get my refer man to rat me out and get the feds to give him a free pass for the 10 pounds of northern lights he has in his trunk. What world is this?! This isn’t the way to do business. These guys weren’t that smart in how they dealt with Biogenesis it seems… there has to be a better way to investigate. I guess once they got c*ckblocked by the Miami New Times they decided their best bet was bribing a felon. This isn’t going to get them anywhere.

  132. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:11 am

    so ac, you advocate not going after boesch?

    its just one piece but it s a very critical piece.

    once the boss gives it up, anyone who worked there has no reason not to come clean.

    we’ll see where this goes but its not done at this point.

  133. pat June 5th, 2013 at 10:12 am

    EricFisherSBJ
    Turner adds @KeithOlbermann to studio for MLB playoffs coverage, signs long-term extension w Ron Darling, adds Cal Ripken Jr. to booth

    Not having to listen to Keith Olberman gives me a positive if the Yankees fail to make the postseason.

  134. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:12 am

    I think the players should be punished. Braun is so smug that he got a pass. If Alex is cheating again, he should go down.

    Hey Bud, if you want to make this seem sincere, you better add McGwire to your suspension list. You can’t let admitted users work for teams but not play for them.

  135. Irreverent Discourse June 5th, 2013 at 10:12 am

    Hi gang, just stopping by with all the fun going on :p

    There is basically zero new information in this new Biogenesis “leak” that you haven’t been able to dig up online for the past 5 months. It actually sounds more like this guy at ESPN just finally caught on to a story that has been dead in the water for months.

    There is no way MLB would risk a mass ban of players. If they suspend one player in that group that later proves innocent, it would be a total disaster. They have been digging at this for a long, long time and there are zero real first hand sources talking about it. They already got caught trying to illegally obtain information on players TWICE, so any players accused or suspended will have a laundry list of things to take MLB to court for.

    It’s the new age of “journalism”. Gone are the days where you needed 2 sources to confirm things before you could report them, now they don’t even bother with 1 source. All you need today is a Twitter account, and another “journalist” to “think” something. Then you can report that he thinks it.

    The XKCD web comic ironically refers to this phenomenon as Citogenesis http://xkcd.com/978/

    These hack writers/talking heads at ESPN have no problems smearing A-Rod and Braun because their past transgressions almost make them fair game. These are guys that are already guilty in the public eye, so no matter what the “facts” of the situation are or what gets reported or corrected at a later date they can safely be mocked today. ESPN gets the ratings bump it craves and the world turns.

    Until we hear something official from MLB, I’m totally ignoring the media flurry. Also, I’m still sticking by the original story a buddy working at MLB network leaked. Braun was on medication for HPV, they let him get off on the mishandling charge so he wouldn’t have to announce that publicly. I don’t even care if it’s true, it’s more entertaining than all of this nonsense.

  136. ron June 5th, 2013 at 10:13 am

    I do not like the idea of mlb,or the fbi,cia,etc…,getting into bed with criminals to secure convictions.
    It is shady,and somebody has to police the police.
    This is why there are rules,and tests.
    These players think that as long as they pass a test,they are fine.
    Not so.
    It is looking like mlb will do what it has to to get the results they wan’t,and that is shady.
    The biogenesis test results should not be allowed as evidence because who knows what happened with them,and it is not mlb who has handled them.

  137. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:14 am

    can one of you please explain how the commisioner’s office is supposed to go after ped cheats in this case another way?

    people complain constantly about them not going after ped’s during the steroid era. now you whine about them getting the cooperation of the guy who ran this clinic.

    please tell me what you would do if you were the commissioner in this case.

  138. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 10:14 am

    Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 9:53 am

    MLB is not a law enforcement agency; they’re a business.

    ———————

    Chip – Does it not strike you as crazy that a business can influence federal and state investigations…?? That’s ludicrous.
    ——————–

    You think baseball is the only industry that influences government agencies? Again, MLB has zero interest in Bosch beyond how he can help them clean up their own house. It’s akin to Internal Affairs saying to a mobster, “we’ll tell the DA you cooperated if you give us the names of all the cops on your payroll.”

  139. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:14 am

    so ac, you advocate not going after boesch?

    its just one piece but it s a very critical piece.

    once the boss gives it up, anyone who worked there has no reason not to come clean.

    we’ll see where this goes but its not done at this point.
    ____

    I advocate going after EVERYONE Ys. I think MLB is a fraud. They have no credibility and should be allowing an independent group handle this. That is my point. Bosch shouldnt get a pass while the witch hunt is on. They also need to produce actual proof and not the word of the steroid doctor.

    What i am saying is this is prime to get crushed by the players union and that is sad because they have a real chance to make a change.

  140. Mike Ri June 5th, 2013 at 10:15 am

    I think the players should be punished. Braun is so smug that he got a pass. If Alex is cheating again, he should go down.

    Hey Bud, if you want to make this seem sincere, you better add McGwire to your suspension list. You can?t let admitted users work for teams but not play for them.

    —-
    Nice post ac1 — i agree 100 percent

  141. ron June 5th, 2013 at 10:15 am

    Also,how was biogenesis allowed to stay open?

  142. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:16 am

    Ys – If they were going about this in the right way they’d have the evidence before it was released that they were seeking suspensions. They’re always chasing their tail.

  143. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:16 am

    a failed test is not the only way to be suspended. recieving ped’s also counts as a violation. this is where these players are vulnerable.

    if you’re hanging your hat on ‘no failed tests’ it is not likely to stand up in this case.

    i not saying this wins it for mlb , but there is alot of false info out there about how ped suspensions work.

  144. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:16 am

    Ys, I said. Independent investigation. That’s what I would do.
    I’d also use the Biogenesis stuff to learn the new drugs so we can better test.
    BUT. they are not going to win this case.
    The witness is not credible and baseball is overreaching with the suspension attempts, particularly on Alex and Braun.

  145. blake June 5th, 2013 at 10:16 am

    “Analogy Police have to step in here. Whatever you think about MLB’s motives, there are PEDs in baseball while there were no actual witches in Salem. So the analogy seems flawed. How does it work?”

    it was a play on the phrase “witch hunt” and how do you know there weren’t any real witches in salem ?

  146. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 10:17 am

    ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:12 am

    Hey Bud, if you want to make this seem sincere, you better add McGwire to your suspension list. You can’t let admitted users work for teams but not play for them.
    ————————————

    He does let admitted users play for teams: Colon, Melky, ManRam…there are plenty of players who have been caught, served their suspensions and then returned to baseball.

  147. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:17 am

    You think baseball is the only industry that influences government agencies?

    ———————-

    Not at all. But I disagree with businesses interfering with justice to serve their own agendas.

    Not everyone contributes to baseball the business… but everyone pays taxes lol.

  148. blake June 5th, 2013 at 10:18 am

    “Turner adds @KeithOlbermann to studio for MLB playoffs coverage, signs long-term extension w Ron Darling, adds Cal Ripken Jr. to booth”

    Darling is good and Cal is good……Olbermann ? awful

  149. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:18 am

    ” Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:16 am

    Ys – If they were going about this in the right way they’d have the evidence before it was released that they were seeking suspensions. They’re always chasing their tail.”
    ====================================
    this is the theory that no crime should ever happen b ecause the cops should know about everything and prevent it. its absurd and not possible.

    please tell me how you would have prevented this from happening or how the commissioner’s office is supposed to know about what every player is doing at every minute.

  150. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 10:19 am

    Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:14 am

    can one of you please explain how the commisioner’s office is supposed to go after ped cheats in this case another way?

    people complain constantly about them not going after ped’s during the steroid era. now you whine about them getting the cooperation of the guy who ran this clinic.

    please tell me what you would do if you were the commissioner in this case.
    ——————–

    You’re 100% right. Like I said, MLB has to do what’s in the best interests of MLB – if that means working with Bosch like they worked with Radomski and MacNamee then that’s what they’ll do.

  151. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:19 am

    And again, Chip, I don’t see where Bosch offers any credibility in these circumstances. I suppose that will be up to a judge to decide. There’s going to be a ton of circumstantial evidence.

  152. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:20 am

    Ys, you are correct. And if they can get clear cut proof, besides the word of Bosch, then that is good. My point is, hanging on the word of him alone is a losing effort and the union will fight back AND win.

    I want MLB’s incompetence out of this, but I would like if they had something similar to the Mitchell report (only this time try to focus on teams outside of NYC).

  153. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:20 am

    mlb is never going to know everything that happened before anybody else does. its not possible

    when this came to light, t hey jumped on it and they are prosecuting it as hard as they can with no subpoena power and no law enforcement assistance, they are limited in how they can procure evidence and testimony.

    thats all they can do at this point.

  154. Mike in Harrisburg June 5th, 2013 at 10:21 am

    Technically by their own legal standards there were plenty of witches.

  155. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:21 am

    MLB could do actual covert investigations instead of trying to force the hands of journalists to hand over evidence. That’d be a start. Bosch has being doing his thing in Miami for a while. It’s still unclear if they jumped on this before or after the Miami New Times got on it.

  156. ron June 5th, 2013 at 10:21 am

    The language in mlb testing allows mlb to suspend players without a positive test,and this is where mlb is going with this.
    Manny got suspended,his first time,as a dodger,got suspended because of a paper trail.

  157. bruceb June 5th, 2013 at 10:21 am

    (1) Phelps was mediocre last night. Men on base, consistently behind in counts, Novaesque.

    One hit in six innings from a backup starter. If that’s mediocre, I guess we’d call a no-hitter average?

    1) The Government couldnt prosecute Bonds or Clemens so I have a hard time believing baseball will be successful with their latest attempt.

    2) Is there a league anywhere that has as many leaks as MLB? They are never in control of the story. Ever. If I worked for their PR team, I’d be livid.

    Right on the money, as usual, Shame. It seems that when it comes to drugs in baseball, the punishment is always discussed before the crime has been proven.

  158. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:22 am

    there are tons of reporters out there on the baseball beat and none of them go this info. some weekly non sports paper came up with it. there is no way for anyone, even the commissioner to find everything out by themselves.

    do you want them to ignore these stories when they are found out by third parties?

  159. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:22 am

    ac1 – I’m just curious what kind of proof could be offered. I think blood tests would be the best bet but then how would one prove they weren’t tampered with? What would the protocol be?

    They might have better luck with a paper trail. If these guys were dumb enough to be tied directly to their orders in any respect they deserve whatever they get for sheer stupidity.

  160. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 10:23 am

    Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:17 am

    You think baseball is the only industry that influences government agencies?

    ———————-

    Not at all. But I disagree with businesses interfering with justice to serve their own agendas.

    Not everyone contributes to baseball the business… but everyone pays taxes lol.
    —————

    Shame, you have every right to disagree with it but lobbyists do it every day on behalf of their industries.

  161. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:23 am

    You’re 100% right. Like I said, MLB has to do what’s in the best interests of MLB – if that means working with Bosch like they worked with Radomski and MacNamee then that’s what they’ll do.
    ___

    I guess we disagree on ‘best interest’. Giving a pass to the guys who brought the drugs to the players to me isn’t punishing the problem. Essentially it is them saying we dont mind you bringing the drugs, as long as you aren’t a big name we can use to go after and make ourselves look like we are solving the problem.

    And again i say MLB has little credibility here, letting McGwire work for them, and making millions off the homeruns in 10 years ago, while it was obvious what was happening.

    Mlb needs to step out of it and hire someone mildly independent.

  162. ron June 5th, 2013 at 10:23 am

    A paper trail is enough.

    http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/.....52922.html

  163. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:24 am

    Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:22 am

    there are tons of reporters out there on the baseball beat and none of them go this info. some weekly non sports paper came up with it. there is no way for anyone, even the commissioner to find everything out by themselves.

    do you want them to ignore these stories when they are found out by third parties?

    ————————-

    I don’t want them to ignore this stuff.. but get your ducks in a row before you let stuff be reported at the very least. Right now, we’re months from any action taking place, IMO. I don’t understand the lack of control over the story.

  164. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:25 am

    ac1 – I’m just curious what kind of proof could be offered. I think blood tests would be the best bet but then how would one prove they weren’t tampered with? What would the protocol be?

    They might have better luck with a paper trail. If these guys were dumb enough to be tied directly to their orders in any respect they deserve whatever they get for sheer stupidity.
    ___

    I assume bank statements etc. But even with the paper trail, MLB would have to get permission to view player’s bank records and stuff like that, and I don’t think they have the authority to do that.

    A note from Bosch showing half of the trail will not be enough.

    Without the police involved I dont see how MLB wins here.

  165. blake June 5th, 2013 at 10:25 am

    I guess you can be a witch without actually having any magical powers……it was against the law to be a witch I guess then just like it’s against the law now to do steroids. Whether or not either should have been against the law is another question.

  166. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:27 am

    Chip – It’s not a question of whether it is done all the time or not.. no matter the industry, there is no credibility. And MLB can’t expect people to believe they have any credibility under these circumstances. Whether you agree with what they’re doing or not, they have no credibility.

    If this was heroine or cocaine and not steroids I defy anyone to try and defend this type of approach.

  167. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 10:27 am

    Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:19 am

    And again, Chip, I don’t see where Bosch offers any credibility in these circumstances. I suppose that will be up to a judge to decide. There’s going to be a ton of circumstantial evidence.
    ———————–
    Again, you’re overstating the burden of proof that MLB has to live up to. This is not a criminal investigation, reasonable doubt is not enough to get Alex or Braun off here.

    The CBA doesn’t stipulate that you need to have failed a test or be caught on camera injecting yourself to be found in violation of the anti-doping policy. All MLB needs to do is establish a probability of use by these players. If they have a witness (Bosch) who says he provided drugs to Alex and Braun that, coupled with their names being in his records is all they need.

  168. Nick in SF June 5th, 2013 at 10:28 am

    “it was a play on the phrase “witch hunt” and how do you know there weren’t any real witches in salem ?”

    If the strength of the analogy rests on the possibility that there may have been real witches in Salem, we need to talk. ;)

    I understand the point of the analogy — PED investigation is phony, looking for scapegoats, etc. — but that doesn’t change the fact the PED usage in baseball is real whether or not it’s a problem and whether or not the governing body is hypocritical in its limited and targeted prosecutions.

    The analogy’s fatal flaw would have been overlooked until the analogy was cruelly overpraised as being “great”, triggering the Council For Better Analogies (CoFoBA) to summon the Analogy Police.

    Good day.

  169. jacksquat June 5th, 2013 at 10:28 am

    ake June 5th, 2013 at 7:40 am
    @JonHeymanCBS: here is #yankees real hope for a-rod, & it has nothing do with a possible 50/100 game ban. http://t.co/eu4cIDNag6

    Arod is not retiring and leaving all those millions on the table.

  170. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:29 am

    Chip – If they can make a case on a non-credible witness’ word along with a possible paper trail that may or may not exist, so be it. That doesn’t sound all that accurate to me, but we’ll see what the arbitrator makes of it.

  171. Jerkface June 5th, 2013 at 10:29 am

    The money they might get back from insurance would/should be a credit on the luxury tax calculation just like the money they are getting back from the angels for the Vernon Wells contract.

    I don’t know that for certain but it only stands to reason. Just like they would get savings if he is suspended without pay. 100 games in 2014 would be roughly $ 16 M, which would reduce Alex’s cap figure from $ 27.5 M to $ 11.5 M.

    Teams pay to insure the contract and teams get any/all payouts from that insurance.

    Insurance payments do not offset the luxury tax. if A-rod retires his contract is void and it doesn’t matter. The team would not receive any insurance because they aren’t paying anything. If A-rod sits on the DL for the next 5 years, they would get insurance, though I don’t see how A-rod (who seems to be doing ok in his rehab) would allow that.

    In the case of A-rod being suspended, his contract still counts against the luxury tax at full value. Only single season contracts could possibly be argued to be reduced, but its pretty clear in the wording in the CBA that multiyear deals count as what they count as regardless of circumstances.

  172. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:29 am

    “Giving a pass to the guys who brought the drugs to the players to me isn’t punishing the problem.”

    ——————————————————
    baseball has no jurisdiction whatsoever with these people and has nothing to do with prosecuting them. thats law enforcement and mlb has nothing to do with it.

    ” I don’t understand the lack of control over the story.”
    ———————————–
    the u.s. government can’t keep defense secrets. and there are probably more journalists covering baseball than national defense. what doesnt get leaked these days?

  173. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:30 am

    …and how do you know baseball didnt leak this to the press themselves? maybe the ARE in total control of the story.

  174. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:31 am

    ac1 – If these guys were really dumb enough to link their own bank information to Biogenesis than I’d love to see all of them take a hit. That type of stupidity should be punishable by law lol.

    But there’s no way the evidence will be so clear cut. This case will be based on mostly circumstantial evidence which may or may not be enough for them to be suspended. Anyone hoping they’re BANNED from baseball on what we’ve heard so far is dreaming, sadly. We’ll never get out from Arod’s contract.

  175. Jerkface June 5th, 2013 at 10:31 am

    I basically agree with this article: http://hardballtalk.nbcsports......he-future/

    Baseball does very little to get to the root of the “steroid problem”.

  176. Shame Spencer June 5th, 2013 at 10:32 am

    Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:30 am

    …and how do you know baseball didnt leak this to the press themselves? maybe the ARE in total control of the story.

    —————–

    IF they did, which is possible, why would they leak the negotiation tactics that took place with Bosch? How exactly does that help them? How does is cultivate public favor?

    They may be in control… but it doesn’t seem like this is information they would want out there when in the mist of building a case.

  177. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:33 am

    The CBA doesn’t stipulate that you need to have failed a test or be caught on camera injecting yourself to be found in violation of the anti-doping policy. All MLB needs to do is establish a probability of use by these players. If they have a witness (Bosch) who says he provided drugs to Alex and Braun that, coupled with their names being in his records is all they need.
    ____

    Maybe that’s all MLB thinks they need, but that will never hold up on an appeal. Someone’s word and a written doc that could easily be forged in order to save his own butt? Good luck in court Bud.

  178. pat June 5th, 2013 at 10:33 am

    “can one of you please explain how the commisioner’s office is supposed to go after ped cheats in this case another way?”

    It’s the job of the Commissioners office to negotiate with the MLBPA to set the rules and to enforce them. “Going after PED cheats” is making a business issue into a personal one.

    Also, MLB indemnifying Bosch crosses a line for me. Would you be okay with the players taking up a collection and paying Bosch to not assist MLB instead of MLB paying Bosch to assist them?

  179. Jerkface June 5th, 2013 at 10:33 am

    http://www.salon.com/2013/06/0.....vernments/

  180. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:34 am

    Baseball does very little to get to the root of the “steroid problem”
    ____

    Exactly!
    Constantly making deals with the dealers to go after players is hardly destroying the culture from within.

  181. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:34 am

    they had less on manny and he got suspended.

  182. GoldGlove9486 June 5th, 2013 at 10:35 am

    Embarrassing that Turner Sports is hiring Keith Olbermann. He’s a blow hard who can’t keep his political opinions to himself.

  183. blake June 5th, 2013 at 10:35 am

    “If the strength of the analogy rests on the possibility that there may have been real witches in Salem, we need to talk. ”

    again you can be a witch without having magical powers….

  184. 86w183 June 5th, 2013 at 10:35 am

    Remember it isn’t “guilt beyond a reasonable doubt” baseball needs in order to punish suspected users. Just enough evidence to convince the Commish.

    What I struggle with is baseball suing a private company to get information on its employees. It’s close to trying to get personal medical records and is not right.

    that said, I don’t care about pre-testing PED users, but want stronger penalties for post-testing rules violators.

    But if we dont start talking baseball soon I’m moving on….

  185. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:36 am

    Also, MLB indemnifying Bosch crosses a line for me. Would you be okay with the players taking up a collection and paying Bosch to not assist MLB instead of MLB paying Bosch to assist them?
    ___

    Their lawsuit was frivolous to begin with. He has no obligation to hand anything to MLB. They offered him assistance when the government comes calling and he bit, though MLB can do nothing to help him so I dont really get it.

  186. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:36 am

    they had less on manny and he got suspended.
    ___

    They had failed drug tests

  187. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:38 am

    Ys, again my argument is not to do nothing. It is to do it right. You can’t pick and choose who to punish and expect people to praise them. Do it the right way! Go after EVERYONE. Punish Selig the same way they will punish the players. Punish the guys bringing the drugs into the locker rooms. Don’t just go, well Alex and Braun are big names so we will leak this and get people on board.

  188. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:39 am

    “Also, MLB indemnifying Bosch crosses a line for me. Would you be okay with the players taking up a collection and paying Bosch to not assist MLB instead of MLB paying Bosch to ass”
    ———————————————————–
    in the absence of law enforcement forcing public testimony, mlb has no way to compel testimony.

    if the money is payment for someone to lie, it is reprehensible if not criminal. for either side.

    negotiating a deal for truthful testimony happens in every courtrooom in america every day. in this case since staying out of jail or reducing jail time is not a possibility, money, indemnity (which congress uses every day) and help in dealing with other judicial authority is the incentive to tell the truth.

    if mlb or a player approached someone with a payment to lie, that flat out wrong.

  189. Jerkface June 5th, 2013 at 10:39 am

    Just enough evidence to convince the Commish.

    Nah its just cause in the legal sense. The commish would just ban everyone. They need enough evidence to convince an appeals panel.

  190. ron June 5th, 2013 at 10:39 am

    the thing with arod is,how long before yankee doctors say,he just can’t play baseball like this,and force him to retire?
    I don’t know that this will happen,but arod has 2 bad hips.
    If i’m the Yankees,i play him every day til he breaks down,and force him to retire.
    When you are dl’ing a player every year because of hip problems,with both hips,for most of the year,at what point is it enough?

  191. blake June 5th, 2013 at 10:40 am

    Manny failed a drug test twice…..they had more on him and more that goes along with protocol in the CBA

  192. G. Love June 5th, 2013 at 10:41 am

    As long as Tex hits HR’s and we win those games, I have no beef with him. But let’s see how he does against a steady stream of RHP before we hold any parades.

    I know blake and luis have said this many times, but I wish he would bat RH all the time. His RH swing is almost Sheff-like with the way he attacks the ball.

    And I loved Phelps last night bearing down in the 5th.

    As for Arod, whatever. I’m over it. I’m seriously talked out on the subject. My only hope is somehow the Yankees get out of the financial obligation and have money to spend on the current team.

    I wish we could play the Indians all the time. They’re a good team, but we just have their number. It’s nuts.

  193. Jerkface June 5th, 2013 at 10:41 am

    @EdgeofSports

    Here’s a wacky idea: decriminalize & regulate PEDs for people over 21; set up clear guidelines for players & put it in the hands of doctors.

    :twisted:

  194. Mike Ri June 5th, 2013 at 10:42 am

    Baseball does very little to get to the root of the ?steroid problem?.

    ——
    Its easier said than done.

    1- (Steroid) dealers will always exsist
    2- Steroids will always exist
    3- The Punishment will never be severe enough (MLPA) to scare players.
    4- And for all the testing , they’re always going to be lab techs and juice junkies looking for a way to beat (mask) the system

    … the only way to “slow down” the use of PED’s in the game .. is to Increase the punishment to a point where its not worth it.

  195. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:42 am

    if mlb or a player approached someone with a payment to lie, that flat out wrong.
    ___

    You are right. However, maybe they actually want the honest truth and make the deal based on that, but Bosch tells them what they want to hear because that’s the understanding.

    He may have a lot of proof, but again, MLB is not the police. The same logic of making deals will not apply.

  196. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:42 am

    ac you want them to do it differently but you have offered no way of getting evidence other than the way its being done. as i said before, please explain what your strategy would be for prosecuting these violations other than what the commissioner’s office is doing here,

  197. blake June 5th, 2013 at 10:44 am

    “I know blake and luis have said this many times, but I wish he would bat RH all the time. His RH swing is almost Sheff-like with the way he attacks the ball.”

    Luis is for that but I’m against it…..his RH swing functionally is way better but I have reservations as to how he’d actually do facing RH pitching from that side……he hasn’t done it in forever and there would be an adjustment period of who knows how long.

    IMO he needs to focus on doing what he can do LH’d and thats hit homers and try to drive the ball…..if he does that from that side and just stays a good overall hitter RH’d then while he won’t be perfect he’ll be very productive for the Yanks.

  198. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:45 am

    … the only way to “slow down” the use of PED’s in the game .. is to Increase the punishment to a point where its not worth it.

    __

    This I agree with.
    If the union truly wanted clean players here is my suggestion.

    Punishment:

    1st violation: 1 year suspension and contract voided. 1 year probation where player can only sign 1 year deal at league minimum.

    2nd violation: 2 year suspension and player can ONLY sign 1 year contracts at league minimum for the remainder of his career.

    Take away the opp to profit and they will stop.

  199. blake June 5th, 2013 at 10:46 am

    MLB is doing a nice job of overshadowing their own draft tomorrow.

  200. ron June 5th, 2013 at 10:46 am

    “While investigating, MLB obtained documents that indicated Ramirez’s use of hCG, and it was those documents that formally were used to hand down the 50-game suspension. Baseball decided to suspend Ramirez for only hCG because, in the end, he would have been suspended for just the 50 games either way. There was a chance Ramirez could have proved that the testosterone did not come from a banned substance, the MLB source said”.

  201. Jerkface June 5th, 2013 at 10:48 am

    … the only way to “slow down” the use of PED’s in the game .. is to Increase the punishment to a point where its not worth it.

    But this will never work. In case it wasn’t obvious even with the increasing amounts of penalties players still use. In real life this is the case as well. You can cut off the heads of whomever you want but people will still do the crimes that necessitate that punishment. Life in jail, death sentence, 10 years, 15 years, 5 years, fines, penalties. It doesn’t stop crime.

    With privately run prisons there is little incentive to stop the root of crime (poverty for 1), but baseball doesn’t really have that kind of incentive. They make money off players who are good that hit home runs and are popular.

    They should stop spiting themselves.

  202. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:50 am

    ” blake June 5th, 2013 at 10:46 am

    MLB is doing a nice job of overshadowing their own draft tomorrow.
    ——————————-
    you mean espn has done a good job of overshadowing the mlb draft.

  203. blake June 5th, 2013 at 10:50 am

    PEDS will always be worth the risk to some players…..if you’re on the fringe of playing your way out of baseball anyways they hey why not chance it…. some players would feel that way anyways I’m sure.

  204. Jerkface June 5th, 2013 at 10:51 am

    Players can be suspended for smoking weed but are not suspended for driving drunk. MLB is wacky.

  205. blake June 5th, 2013 at 10:52 am

    “you mean espn has done a good job of overshadowing the mlb draft.”

    MLB is the one pushing it….ESPN is just reporting it in there usual insane way.

  206. Against All Odds June 5th, 2013 at 10:53 am

    Rich in NJ June 5th, 2013 at 8:55 am
    5) I am still in complete shock that MLB is going to help shield Bosch from federal charges.
    -

    Bud is now more concerned with repairing flaws in his legacy than in building the brand for future growth. The NFL is leaving MLB in the dust in part because it is run better.

    ———————————–

    And the brand is dying by the second….with more children focusing their attention on MLB and NFL. Based on the attention Lebron attracts and guys like Durant, Curry, Rose, etc could we see the NBA pass MLB someday?

  207. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:53 am

    wait, so you’re saying that mlb should not have entered the agreement this week because it might interfere with the mlb draft?

    …seriously?

  208. ron June 5th, 2013 at 10:54 am

    Mlb has to just make these tests realistic.
    unannounced testing,year round,with a few blood tests per year.
    That is all they can do.
    Try to stay ahead of the street drugs with the best testing possible.
    Making drugs legal so every player is even,is not going to happen.

    Do weekly testing,or daily testing.
    Whatever it takes.

  209. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 10:56 am

    ” Jerkface June 5th, 2013 at 10:51 am

    Players can be suspended for smoking weed but are not suspended for driving drunk. MLB is wacky.”

    ============================================
    Americans can be arrested for smoking pot but not for drinking alcohol? america is wacky…

  210. blake June 5th, 2013 at 11:00 am

    “wait, so you’re saying that mlb should not have entered the agreement this week because it might interfere with the mlb draft?”

    what agreement? Im saying that they are helping keep this biogenesis mess on the front burner of the news world rather than play on the field and their draft…….

  211. Jerkface June 5th, 2013 at 11:02 am

    Americans can be arrested for smoking pot but not for drinking alcohol? america is wacky…

    Yes. It is!

  212. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 11:03 am

    Again, there are too many people who watch Law & Order and are confusing MLB with the US Government.

    The players can appeal a suspension, but they’ll lose because MLB will have met the burden of proof that they are required to meet to hand out a suspension. If this was a criminal case where someone was trying to prosecute Ryan Braun for using illegal drugs – that would be something else entirely. But it isn’t.

    Braun won his appeal last time because the testing procedure agreed to by MLB and the Union was violated by the facility.

    This time the arbiter will ask “Does Major League Baseball have reasonable proof that Braun, Alex, etc…used performance enhancing drugs?”

    MLB will present a witness who will say he provided them with drugs and paperwork that corroborates that. Bosch will probably provide details (he’s already saying that he injected Alex himself). This isn’t a case where MLB needs to prove “beyond a reasonable doubt” that the players used. They just have provide evidence that the players “probably” used.

    As for Bosch’s credibility, there aren’t very many credible drug dealers out there – however if he can provide some paperwork to back up his claims of a link with these players, that’s it, game’s over.

  213. Jerkface June 5th, 2013 at 11:03 am

    But of course americans are arrested and severely punished for driving drunk, which was my original point. :)

  214. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 11:04 am

    “what agreement? Im saying that they are helping keep this biogenesis mess on the front burner of the news world rather than play on the field and their draft…….”
    ————————————–
    the agreement with boesch. what the news that is supposedlly interfering with tomorrow’s draft that you complained about.

    the news is that baseball has gotten boesch’s cooperation and as a result will attempt to suspend players.

    baseball didnt announce this, they just entered in to the agreement with boesch. espn reported it.

    espn’s report is what’s interfering with coverage of the draft according to your suggestion.

    so my question is, did you want them to delay entering into that agreement until after the draft so as not to ‘interfere with it’ or do you think they just shouldnt be pursuing biogenics or peds at all?

  215. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 11:05 am

    Jerkface June 5th, 2013 at 10:51 am

    Players can be suspended for smoking weed but are not suspended for driving drunk. MLB is wacky.
    —————————-

    I would like to see the next CBA have something about drunk driving in it too – but I don’t see why we attack MLB for punishing players who violate rules that they agreed to follow.

  216. Jerkface June 5th, 2013 at 11:06 am

    I would like to see the next CBA have something about drunk driving in it too – but I don’t see why we attack MLB for punishing players who violate rules that they agreed to follow.

    The rules are stupid. There are plenty of stupid laws in the US which I would similarly attack.

  217. pat June 5th, 2013 at 11:11 am

    From MLBPA

    “The Players Association has been in regular contact with the Commissioner’s Office regarding the Biogenesis investigation. They are in the process of interviewing players, and every player has been or will be represented by an attorney from the Players Association. The Commissioner’s Office has assured us that no decisions regarding discipline have been made or will be made until those interviews are completed. It would be unfortunate if anyone prejudged those investigations.

    “The Players Association has every interest in both defending the rights of players and in defending the integrity of our joint program. We trust that the Commissioner’s Office shares these interests.”

  218. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 11:12 am

    ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 10:34 am

    Baseball does very little to get to the root of the “steroid problem”
    ____

    Exactly!
    Constantly making deals with the dealers to go after players is hardly destroying the culture from within.
    ——————-

    Going after the players isn’t the problem. The problem is that a player like Melky can salvage his career by using steroids and then get a $12 mil contract the next year. As long as there’s that kind of financial incentive players will use.

    Teams should be able to void the contracts of players on long term deals that are caught using for the first time (for example the Brewers could delete Ryan Bruan’s deal but the Jays are stuck with Melky) and the player is banned for one year. At which time he’s allowed to return to the game but any salary he makes over the league minimum for 5 years is donated to the Taylor Hooten Foundation (or another anti-doping or drug awareness foundation)

  219. blake June 5th, 2013 at 11:12 am

    “so my question is, did you want them to delay entering into that agreement until after the draft so as not to ‘interfere with it’ or do you think they just shouldnt be pursuing biogenics or peds at all?”

    do you think the NFL’s focus would be on this in the wake of their draft? not a chance…..honestly I think the Biogenesis stuff is all based on a very sketchy witness and MLB is trying their best to squeeze a case and story out of it.

    My point was with regards to why MLB is pushing this so hard instead of the baseball on the field and their draft…..the MLB draft is never going to be like the NFL’s or even the NBAs…..it’s just not. People don’t know the players as well…..but it’s never going to be bigger than it is if they keep throwing in on the back burner to chase down this stuff.

  220. blake June 5th, 2013 at 11:13 am

    Joel Sherman ?@Joelsherman1 3m
    Overbay starts in RF again, no Ichiro in starting lineup #Yankees

  221. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 11:13 am

    Going after the players isn’t the problem. The problem is that a player like Melky can salvage his career by using steroids and then get a $12 mil contract the next year. As long as there’s that kind of financial incentive players will use.
    ___

    Chip see my comment above on what i believe the punishments should be.
    Here it is:

    Punishment:

    1st violation: 1 year suspension and contract voided. 1 year probation where player can only sign 1 year deal at league minimum.

    2nd violation: 2 year suspension and player can ONLY sign 1 year contracts at league minimum for the remainder of his career.

    Take away the opp to profit and they will stop.

  222. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 11:13 am

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  224. Chip June 5th, 2013 at 11:15 am

    Jerkface June 5th, 2013 at 11:06 am

    I would like to see the next CBA have something about drunk driving in it too – but I don’t see why we attack MLB for punishing players who violate rules that they agreed to follow.

    The rules are stupid. There are plenty of stupid laws in the US which I would similarly attack.
    ————–

    Yeah but the difference between the laws in the US and the rules in baseball is that the baseball players collectively bargained for the rules that they have to follow.

    It’s more akin to if you take a job somewhere that doesn’t allow you to wear jeans to work and yet you show up consistently wearing jeans, they fire you for it and then you complain that the rule sucks. Whether it sucks or not is irrelevant. If you didn’t want to follow the rule then you shouldn’t have taken the job.

  225. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 11:16 am

    “do you think the NFL’s focus would be on this in the wake of their draft? not a chance…..honestly I think the Biogenesis stuff is all based on a very sketchy witness and MLB is trying their best to squeeze a case and story out of it.

    My point was with regards to why MLB is pushing this so hard instead of the baseball on the field and their draft”
    ———————————————–
    yes the nfl would not be going after ped cheating, never has, probably never will. and nobody cares.

    baseball fans and the public in general has constantly demeaned baseball over ped’s and the commissioner’s office not going after cheats.

    your response indicates that you dont think they should even be bothering with biogenesis. if you ever knocked the commissioner for looking the other way during the steroid era, then you are being totally inconstent. if you advocate ped usage and legalizing peds’ then you are consistent.

    just wondering which it is.

  226. ac1 June 5th, 2013 at 11:19 am

    your response indicates that you dont think they should even be bothering with biogenesis. if you ever knocked the commissioner for looking the other way during the steroid era, then you are being totally inconstent. if you advocate ped usage and legalizing peds’ then you are consistent.
    ___

    Point is Selig should go!

    I did knock him for turning the other way and because he did that, he is a giant hypocrite now. Get someone else to lead MLB out of the situation Bud allowed and profited from.

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    Yeah but the difference between the laws in the US and the rules in baseball is that the baseball players collectively bargained for the rules that they have to follow.

    It’s more akin to if you take a job somewhere that doesn’t allow you to wear jeans to work and yet you show up consistently wearing jeans, they fire you for it and then you complain that the rule sucks. Whether it sucks or not is irrelevant. If you didn’t want to follow the rule then you shouldn’t have taken the job.

    I dunno, Chip, the laws of the united states are supposed to be collectively bargained by the people and the government between the representatives of the people and those of the government. So like I’m fine with thinking that rules can be stupid even if you have agree to them.

    Technically by continuing to live in the united states I agree to many of their stupid rules and policies. I’ll just keep breaking the law. And if I get caught I will complain vociferously about how stupid the rules are. Maybe eventually they will be changed.

    The law is not immutable. Nor should it be in baseball.

  228. Jerkface June 5th, 2013 at 11:26 am

    And Chip, I doubt your company’s policy on jeans was collectively bargained. Most corporations/businesses are not comprised of fully unionized work forces.

  229. Ys Guy June 5th, 2013 at 12:09 pm

    “I did knock him for turning the other way and because he did that, he is a giant hypocrite now.”
    —————————————————
    but then, you are also being just as much of a hypocrite.

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