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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Yankees let one get away in Baltimore

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Jun 28, 2013 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

CC Sabathia

Buck Showalter intended to use a left-handed starter to weaken the Yankees offense. What he seems to have done is weaken their defense just enough for a 4-3 Orioles win at Camden Yards. CC Sabathia was throwing a gem until David Adams — starting at first base in place of left-handed hitting Lyle Overbay — charged a slow roller instead of covering the bag. The miscue put two on with no outs, and Manny Machado doubled in both runs before scoring on another infield single to tie the game at 3. An inning later, Nate McLouth — who’d broken up Sabathia’s no hitter an inning earlier — homered to put the Orioles in front. Orioles spot starter T.J. McFarland allowed three runs through 2.2 innings, but an inexperienced first baseman cost the Yankees, and their offense couldn’t score against the Baltimore bullpen. Brett Gardner had two hits and Robinson Cano had three, but an early 3-0 lead vanished and the Yankees couldn’t get it back.

Associated Press photo

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172 Responses to “Yankees let one get away in Baltimore”

  1. sunny615 June 28th, 2013 at 9:56 pm

    And the ship keeps sinking. Totally pathetic.

  2. Locke June 28th, 2013 at 9:56 pm

    :( This isn’t fun.

  3. Captain Clutch June 28th, 2013 at 9:59 pm

    This is the 2nd worse loss of the year. Just behind Mo blowing the game to the Mets.

    CC should take full responsibility for losing the game. He should be able to win a game where he is leading 3-0 in the 6th inning. He has been terrible and makes way too many mistakes. I mean Nate freakin McLouth? The guy that was released and no one wanted him. You have to be kidding me that guy makes me sick.

  4. bruceb June 28th, 2013 at 10:00 pm

    It’s bad enough blowing a 3-0 lead but I have to pose the question…does this team even have any fight in it?

    We know they’re short on ability but once that tying run came in on the Jones’ dribbler, Vegas stopped taking bets on who was going to win the game.

    Amazing that this lineup managed 11 hits. Not so amazing they scored only three runs off them. I’ll be surprised if Yanks win a game in this series now.

  5. j9d June 28th, 2013 at 10:00 pm

    Not so upset yankees lost…we all know this is not going to be the year and it will be a bonus if good things happen. it was just tough to watch CC have his old dominance in first half of the game and just completely lose it.

  6. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:01 pm

    This a team sport. CC pitched well enough to win. The team and the manager deserve equal blame in the loss.

  7. Melk Man June 28th, 2013 at 10:01 pm

    At this point, is it even a question that they should be sellers at the deadline? Build for next year. A 2008 type season does nothing for us (and we won 89 games in 08, which is a longshot for this group).

    Sell off Hughes, Joba, Grandy, Kuroda, Ichiro and any other veteran

    They hung in there as long as they could, but we’re going to be under .500 by the trade deadline and with this roster, that is simply the truth

  8. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 10:03 pm

    Sounds like Chad has the orders from th Yanks to blame the loss solely on Adams.

  9. TheStraw June 28th, 2013 at 10:03 pm

    CC did not pitch well enough to win. The pitch to McLouth was inexcusable in that situation.

  10. Captain Clutch June 28th, 2013 at 10:03 pm

    Forget about Granderson, Jeter and Arod coming back. This team will be out of the race before they even come back. A lot of guys are hurt I get it but these guys don’t even look like they are trying hard for 27 outs everyday. As soon as CC gave up that homerun everyone knew the game was over. CC is absolutely killing them.

  11. Steve W. June 28th, 2013 at 10:04 pm

    We could be sellers at the deadline, but it doesn’t much matter. No matter what decisions Cashman makes, most of them are wrong. In general, his evaluation of talent stinks, his roster construction stinks.

  12. j9d June 28th, 2013 at 10:04 pm

    Wait now I see other posts disparaging CC. That’s not okay at all and not what my post meant. It’s just tough seeing CC struggle as he adjusts to the velocity issues.

  13. Steve W. June 28th, 2013 at 10:05 pm

    It’s safe to call Nate Uncouth a Yankees killer.

  14. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:05 pm

    You guys are a bunch of idiots. Chad called it the way it was. Blaming CC when he was pitching a gem and his defense let him down.

  15. J. Alfred Prufrock June 28th, 2013 at 10:06 pm

    Crap, I thought jmills might pull that game out.

  16. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:06 pm

    The hr didn’t kill them, they could have won if the defense held up in the 6th.

  17. Hassey June 28th, 2013 at 10:06 pm

    No matter what question you ask me, gonna tell you I don’t know

    All I do know iscthatvthis current squad is unwatchable, a broken window waiting to happen at any point in the game, a string of overmatched AAAA hitters and occasional but wasted hits. Cano has nt been great either but he must feel like he was left back to the third grade. I just can’t do it anymore….giving away games and letting other flawed teams feel like champs

  18. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:07 pm

    Or maybe TS Elliot.

  19. J. Alfred Prufrock June 28th, 2013 at 10:08 pm

    I did not see the defensive miscues (trying to hit a deadline) but C does not make excuses so you can forget that.

  20. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:08 pm

    Lets see if Girardi accepts some of the blame for this one…

  21. Captain Clutch June 28th, 2013 at 10:08 pm

    Too bad Cashman won’t get any blame for this and it will all be on the injuries. It seems like the baseball g-ds are getting Hal and Cashman back this year for not improving the offense the last 4 years. Even with the A lineup guys were getting older and it was never addressed. Well they are paying for it now and it probably won’t even be fixed in the off season because of the budget.

  22. bruceb June 28th, 2013 at 10:08 pm

    Have to agree about CC. No point in taking a no-hitter into the 6th if you then proceed to give up four runs on five hits in the next two.

  23. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:09 pm

    Maybe you need glasses TS.

  24. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:09 pm

    This would never happen, but I would love to see Hughes turned into middle relief, a la Ramiro Mendoza. I’d like to see him up any time a starter really looks to be losing it, and brought in immediately. Then I’d like to see him turn the ball over to whomever – Claiborne, Boone, etc. – (depending on the score). Remember the days when it was starter—>Mendoza—>Nelson/Stanton—>Mo. You talk about automatic.

    I don’t know if the Yanks would start to apply that kind of creativity with their pitching. But I bet it would work like a gem.

  25. TheStraw June 28th, 2013 at 10:10 pm

    I’m not disparaging him, but he is a different pitcher this year. I’m not convinced its because of the lack of velocity, either. But he’s got to put McLouth away there in a tie game with two outs.

    The fact is, the only starters giving the Yanks length right now are Kuroda and Phelps. The other three starters are wildly inconsistent. And I say that knowing that two of those three are borderline Hall of Famers.

  26. Captain Clutch June 28th, 2013 at 10:10 pm

    Is Wells playing 3rd base tomorrow?

  27. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:10 pm

    Would like to ask Girardi in the post game why he put Adams at first.

    Was it his bat or glove?

  28. Captain Clutch June 28th, 2013 at 10:11 pm

    Of course Girardi makes excuses for Adams instead of just saying he has never played 1st base before. He just said I don’t think a lot of 1st basemen make that play, oh please.

  29. J. Alfred Prufrock June 28th, 2013 at 10:11 pm

    RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:09 pm

    Maybe you need glasses TS.
    ////

    Are you talking to me?

  30. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:11 pm

    girardi talks a good game, but his face gives him away.

  31. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:12 pm

    I’m happy Phelps is starting tomorrow.

  32. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:12 pm

    Do you have Mohican?

  33. Captain Clutch June 28th, 2013 at 10:12 pm

    Was it his bat or glove?
    ————

    Both

  34. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 10:13 pm

    “I did not see the defensive miscues (trying to hit a deadline) but C does not make excuses so you can forget that.”

    Adams charged a ball hat he should have went back to the bag. Machado tagged up to 3B on a medium fly ball to Gardner. It looked like it took him by surprise.

    There was also two swinging bunts that inning. He didn’t pitch bad ( mistake 2b 2RBI to Machado) but it was just one those innings.

  35. TheStraw June 28th, 2013 at 10:15 pm

    No, he’s talking to me, Pruf. I didn’t have the benefit of seeing the first five innings tonight, but it sound like CC pitched well for those innings. But CC has given up way more HR this season than we are used to seeing. It is hurting them, whether anyone wants to admit it or not.

  36. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 10:15 pm

    Girardi is either clueless, or lying. Although I have suspicions regarding the former, my money is on the latter.

  37. Nick in SF June 28th, 2013 at 10:15 pm

    It was a trip to hell on gossamer wings.

  38. bruceb June 28th, 2013 at 10:15 pm

    “You have to put a complete start together and I don’t feel I’ve done that the whole year.”

    At least CC is as honest as ever. This team needed a shutout in the worst way tonight.

  39. austinmac June 28th, 2013 at 10:16 pm

    When a team scores three runs they usually lose. The pitchers never have a breather. It may well take it’s toll.

  40. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 10:17 pm

    CC – that’s funny

  41. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 10:17 pm

    “He just said I don’t think a lot of 1st basemen make that play, oh please.”

    I agree with this. I’ve seen Overbay not make it/ break the wrong way multiple times this year alone.

  42. Captain Clutch June 28th, 2013 at 10:18 pm

    You really have to wonder how long it’s going to take CC to adjust and if he will ever adjust to his lesser stuff. If not they are really in trouble. He really looks like a shell of himself. Even when he starts the game good he continues to make way too many mistakes over the plate.

  43. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:18 pm

    Can’t have a shut out when you play chitty d.

    I don’t care who is on the mound.

  44. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:18 pm

    No one asks Girardi why Adams was at 1st.
    Is this a police state?

  45. bruceb June 28th, 2013 at 10:19 pm

    Mets blow yet another “win” for Harvey. Both teams were up three runs. New York baseball sucks tonight.

  46. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:19 pm

    “It was a trip to hell on gossamer wings.”

    That made me laugh. As an aside, gossamer is one of my favorite words.

  47. TheStraw June 28th, 2013 at 10:19 pm

    Cash and Hal need to get off their asses and start to make some moves that will benefit this team in both the short and long term. No sense in holding on to prospects if you’re just going to use the scrap heap of the month club to try to get through the season.

  48. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:20 pm

    Tar if Overbay was on first that would have been an out.

    If Giambi the cigar store Indian was on first that would have been an out.

    Adams was out of position.

  49. J. Alfred Prufrock June 28th, 2013 at 10:21 pm

    Tar, thanks, I just saw the Adams play and then heard Adams’ mea culpas.

    C said he hasn’t put together a complete start all year. Both stood in there and faced the music.

  50. J. Alfred Prufrock June 28th, 2013 at 10:21 pm

    Straw, got it.

  51. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:21 pm

    Unfortunate loss. What else to do with it?

    Turn the page and look toward tomorrow.

  52. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:21 pm

    Adams was out of position.
    =================
    Because he is not a 1st Baseman.
    But he hits righty against a lefty relief pitcher making his 1st start.

  53. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:22 pm

    Straw – I have a strong feeling you’re going to start to see some moves pretty quickly. No idea what, just moves.

    You saw it here first.

  54. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 10:23 pm

    Always though of the Giambino more as an Easter Island statue than a cigar store Indian.

  55. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:23 pm

    Let the professional hitters hit from here on out, Joe.
    Keep Hafner and Overbay in every lineup even if Koufax is pitching…

  56. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:24 pm

    mick,

    So you give away defense for offense and it come back to bite you.

  57. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:24 pm

    You saw it here first.
    ===============
    I’ve been saying it all week…

  58. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:25 pm

    mick,

    So you give away defense for offense and it come back to bite you.
    =================
    very un-girardi-like…
    he could be losing a bit off his fastball.

  59. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:25 pm

    First base is not a throw away position, good D at first wins ballgames.

  60. Steve W. June 28th, 2013 at 10:26 pm

    Is that prima Donna arod home right now?

  61. bruceb June 28th, 2013 at 10:26 pm

    Why the f was Adams playing first anyway tonight? You don’t sacrifice defense for a guy who’s hitting .186. Overbay should have started.

  62. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 10:27 pm

    RIB

    I think I know your position on the matter.

    Here’s mine: that’s a tough play for a 1B. He was holding the runner on and a full swinging bunt. He didn’t freeze he charged the ball. Watching on TV , Hindsight yeah, he should have stayed at the bag. But I agree with Joe G that’s a play not a lot of 1B make.

    There was also two swinging bunts,Gardner and a meatball to Machado and Mcclouth. As well as the usual no offense.

    Like I said kind of harsh to just blame Adams and or Giradi.

  63. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:27 pm

    Well. Joe learned something tonight. Lets just hope he doesn’t get stubborn and play no hit Adams at 1st again.
    He must feel like a hypocrite tonight.
    He doesn’t trust him at 3rd but plays him at 1st?

    Ludicrous.

  64. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:27 pm

    Not like Adams has been ripping the cover off the ball that should give up D at first to have him come to the plate 4 times.

    Over Overbay?? Joe blew it.

  65. J. Alfred Prufrock June 28th, 2013 at 10:28 pm

    Gausman gets the win. I couldn’t really focus because of a project, but Gausman is a nasty arm. Crap, Gausman and a rehabbed Bundy, Machado, Wieters, Jones.

  66. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:29 pm

    “I’ve been saying it all week…”

    Does it count that I never saw you say it? ;)

    “First base is not a throw away position, good D at first wins ballgames.”

    Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you! I got pilloried for suggesting the same thing when I posted on the NYTimes forum. One guy in particular always said that first wasn’t a particularly important position and that “anyone can play first.”

    Good D at first unequivocally wins ballgames!!!

  67. Steve W. June 28th, 2013 at 10:29 pm

    Adams isn’t a ML player.

  68. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 10:30 pm

    “Over Overbay?? Joe blew it.”

    That platoon went 2 for 3, it was a good move.

  69. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:30 pm

    “First base is not a throw away position, good D at first wins ballgames.”
    ======================================
    The question is:
    Why did Joe go against his principles?

  70. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 10:31 pm

    As much as folks hate on Tex for his hitting, you have to admit he’s saved a ton of runs.

  71. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:32 pm

    And I totally agree that nobody on this current roster should be playing first other than Overbey, unless he totally needs a rest. And then you bring up (who did we just get that can play all infield positions and even some outfield?)

  72. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:32 pm

    To say Overbay would have went after that ball is ludicrous.
    He is an experienced 1st baseman and Adams is a novice, if that.

  73. UnKnown June 28th, 2013 at 10:32 pm

    Mocking people who say the offense isn’t good looks dumb when you do it and they only score 3 runs.

    Epic Fail.

  74. I Am Winning June 28th, 2013 at 10:33 pm

    Steve W.,

    The Yankees don’t seem to have many ML players at this point in time. Adams, Romine, Gonzalez, and the most other guys that were signed or traded due to injury. Even our injured players aren’t sure fire defensive or offensive improvements.

    This team from top to bottom just doesn’t excite me. So many positions to fill with good players, and so little money to spend.

  75. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:33 pm

    Tar it was a good move? The 6th inning and that miscue was pivotal, got CC’s pitch count up, lost the lead and finally the game.

  76. austinmac June 28th, 2013 at 10:33 pm

    They have no alternatives to whom they are playing.

  77. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 10:34 pm

    Overbay is a platoon player. Joe needs offense, that platoon worked tonight.

    2 for 3 with a BB

  78. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:34 pm

    “As much as folks hate on Tex for his hitting, you have to admit he’s saved a ton of runs.”

    That’s why I remained totally in his corner when most people here were getting on him for his hitting. Once Overbey came and I saw how he was able to play first and hit the ball, it didn’t bother me that Tex was out.

  79. austinmac June 28th, 2013 at 10:34 pm

    Martinez is hitting at SWB. He was a prospect once.

  80. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:35 pm

    Tar, and a miscue because of it and a loss.

    CC pitched well enough to win.

  81. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:35 pm

    They have no alternatives to whom they are playing.
    ====================
    The point is they have one when it comes to where they play them.
    They need Hafner and Overbay in every game .

  82. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:35 pm

    “The question is:
    Why did Joe go against his principles?”

    mick, Kay said he was trying to shake up the offense.

  83. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 10:35 pm

    RIB

    What about the two swinging bunts? The meatball to Machado? Gardner’s play?

    Was that all Adams and Joe’s fault?

  84. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:37 pm

    “The point is they have one when it comes to where they play them.
    They need Hafner and Overbay in every game .”

    I agree with this.

  85. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:37 pm

    I agree Tricia, you have to have good D at first. Especially in YS anything up the line is at least a double.

    Tex has played great for us at first even if he didn’t hit his defense kept the other side from scoring.

    You just can’t stick an inexperienced glove in there and expect good defense.

  86. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 10:38 pm

    Then why keep Adams in after the O’s brought in a RHP?

  87. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:38 pm

    And they absolutely need someone to play the Ramiro Mendoza role, and they need to use that person continually.

  88. Rich in NJ June 28th, 2013 at 10:38 pm

    If you had a 1B who hit like a 1B, few people would care about 1B defense.

  89. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:38 pm

    mick, Kay said he was trying to shake up the offense.
    =================
    If I were Hafner, I would go to Joe and say I have to play everyday to stay sharp.
    On a team with an offense like this , this guy should be out there every day.
    Putting Wells up cleanup is whack.

  90. bruceb June 28th, 2013 at 10:38 pm

    And the Red Sox just keep on winning. Five games out…and counting. Going to be a long season I fear.

  91. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:40 pm

    Tar, when it counted because of his inexperience at first, Adams was hesitant on the play prolonging that inning for CC who up to that point had a low pitch count..

    I’m done good night.

  92. bruceb June 28th, 2013 at 10:40 pm

    And they absolutely need someone to play the Ramiro Mendoza role.

    Don’t we have enough players already batting below the Mendoza Line? :)

  93. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:40 pm

    Rhapsody, I’m not down on Adams at all. It’s just that I know the necessity of D at first. And I don’t care if you have the reincarnation of the Babe’s bat at first base, if you don’t have stellar D to go with it, you’re going to lose as many games as you win – if not more.

  94. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:41 pm

    If you had a 1B who hit like a 1B, few people would care about 1B defense.
    ==================
    If you want to play Adams play him at 3rd.
    Gonzales serves no purpose.
    If you dont trust his defense at 3rd how do you trust it at 3rd?
    He wanted all the RH bats he could get tonight against a 1st time starter????

  95. Chad Jennings June 28th, 2013 at 10:42 pm

    Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 10:03 pm e
    Sounds like Chad has the orders from th Yanks to blame the loss solely on Adams.

    It’s true. Randy Levine emailed me with two outs in the ninth inning. All the email said was “Adams.” I knew what that meant and followed his direction. This is the way baseball writers work.

  96. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:43 pm

    “If I were Hafner, I would go to Joe and say I have to play everyday to stay sharp.
    On a team with an offense like this , this guy should be out there every day.
    Putting Wells up cleanup is whack.”

    mick, I don’t disagree.

    If you really feel the need to bat Wells with a LH starting, bat him down in the order.

  97. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:43 pm

    This is the way baseball writers work.
    ===============
    Chad, really though…why didn’t anybody ask Joe why he played Adams at 1st?

  98. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:43 pm

    “It’s true. Randy Levine emailed me with two outs in the ninth inning. All the email said was “Adams.” I knew what that meant and followed his direction. This is the way baseball writers work.”

    :D

  99. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:44 pm

    Trisha, I’m not down on Adams either. I agree with you, you need good D at first, where Adams had no experience going into tonight’s game.

    Which we knew would be a tight game. My problem is with Girardi putting him there.

  100. bruceb June 28th, 2013 at 10:44 pm

    Way to go Chad…love this interactive blog. But don’t you have an obituary to write?

  101. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 10:44 pm

    “The point is they have one when it comes to where they play them.
    They need Hafner and Overbay in every game .”

    I agree with this.”

    What happened to deferring to Joe who knows best? He thought Adams was the right move at 1B tonight, even though he isn’t that experienced there.

    That’s what happens when your offense isn’t very good and you don’t have a back up 1B

    RIB

    He wasn’t “hesitant” at all, he charged the play aggressively.

  102. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:44 pm

    If you dont trust his defense at 3rd how do you trust it at 3rd?
    =========================
    meant to say:
    If you dont trust his defense at 3rd how do you trust it at 1st?

  103. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:47 pm

    Tar, that was the problem, he should have covered the bag. Inexperience.

  104. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 10:47 pm

    Apparently it is the way Yankee baseball writers work, because they never seem to ask the pertinent (and tough) questions. Too much fear of losing precious access to Joe and Cash?

  105. Pat M. June 28th, 2013 at 10:48 pm

    That play at first is an instinctive play that good first baseman usually makes. Texeria is a very good first baseman who has made that play a thousand times. Adams is being used as a utility infielder which is not in his toolbox. Giradi has a ballclub that has very little resources at the big league level. Sadly things are going to continue to sink slowly before we see any sunlight. Could be a few years unless a drastic decision I made upstairs and even then I think that window has closed significantly

  106. NYY fan in NH June 28th, 2013 at 10:49 pm

    Lucky if they win 80 games this year.. Pretty sad times to be a Yankee fan.

  107. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 10:50 pm

    This game is on

    No offense, some bad luck, not great D, a couple of really inopportune pitches by CC.

    Yet some want to harp on 1B D as being he sole cause.

  108. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:50 pm

    “Don’t we have enough players already batting below the Mendoza Line? :)

    :D

    bruce, think about it though, seriously. If our starters are having trouble getting through innings, then you have someone like a Hughes ready to come in. Save their bullets and save runs. I trust that Hughes could relieve 3 and 4 innings if he had to, preferably 3.

    Then you turn it over to the rest of the pen.

    Even if you just do something like that short run until some of the regulars come back – if they ever do – necessity is the mother of invention. If we have starters struggling a good deal of the time, give them 5 inning to win the game and then if in the 6th they look like they’re losing it, pull them and give it to Hughes and let him cover the next 2 innings – or even 3, again depending on the score. Then you get it to Claiborne, or Boone, or DRob, or Warren (is he still alive) and then hopefully to Mo.

    DO IT JOE! WE NEED YOU TO DO IT!

    God, the reason our starting arms were so potent for so long, when they were, was probably at least partly attributable to the way the Ys used Mendoza – until Torre ruined him.

  109. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 10:51 pm

    But they have continue to maintain 13 pitchers on the roster, just in case there’s an 18 inning game.

  110. RhapsodyInBlue June 28th, 2013 at 10:51 pm

    Tar

    Go Tarheels.

    Night.

  111. Chad Jennings June 28th, 2013 at 10:51 pm

    mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:43 pm e
    This is the way baseball writers work.
    ===============
    Chad, really though…why didn’t anybody ask Joe why he played Adams at 1st?

    Because we all know WHY he played Adams at first. It was brought up pregame. He wanted the right-handed bat and liked the idea of giving Overbay a day off in this stretch. It’s fair to wonder whether it was the right decision, but it’s easy to see why he did it.

    And by writing that Adams made a costly play, I’m not saying that everything hinges on him. It was just a key event in this game, a play that helped spark a rally and really transformed an otherwise very good start from Sabathia. In my mind, the offense — regardless of Sabathia throwing a horrible slider to McLouth and Adams making a play of inexperience — remains the overwhelming issue here.

  112. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 10:51 pm

    “That play at first is an instinctive play that good first baseman usually makes”

    I agree. Not every time and not every full time 1B makes it either.

  113. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 10:52 pm

    RIB

    :D

  114. Captain Clutch June 28th, 2013 at 10:52 pm

    Girardi has to play Hafner and Overbay everyday and whatever happens, happens. It’s absolutely ridiculous to sit them and play AAA guys because they bat right handed. He is really stubborn and when he believes in something there is no way to change his mind but this is insane. Gonzalez has no business being in a major league game unless Nix desperately needs a day off. Cashman has to tell him to cut the lefties can’t face lefties crap.

  115. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:53 pm

    By the way, Adams took full responsibility for what he did and refused to say it was because of inexperience at first. Then he said something about “these things happen.” I liked that. Players cannot afford to dwell on their mistakes, just improve upon them. Every dawn must be looked at as a new beginning.

    And so I say tomorrow is the day the Yanks start to get rocking and rolling.

  116. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 10:53 pm

    So who asked Joe G why he kept Adams in after the O’s switched pitchers?

  117. JobaTipsHisCap June 28th, 2013 at 10:53 pm

    clearly sux played well beyond expectation this season.
    in the end, will yanks be 10 games out?

  118. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:54 pm

    Chad, do you ever ask Girardi questions in those postgame interviews?

  119. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:56 pm

    “Yet some want to harp on 1B D as being he sole cause.”

    I know I haven’t done that and I hope nothing I have said has been interpreted that way.

    That said, EXEMPLARY D AT FIRST BASE IS CRITICAL.

  120. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 10:57 pm

    Exactly Chad.

    No offense and a host of other issues.

  121. bruceb June 28th, 2013 at 10:57 pm

    I have no problem putting Hughes back in the pen, Trisha, but if you can’t rely on CC to go deep in the game, then who can you rely on? It was his game to win and lose…unfortunately, he lost it and the defeat is magnified by the fact that the Yanks don’t have a 3-run lead in too many games these days.

  122. Steve W. June 28th, 2013 at 10:57 pm

    Joe had to get Overbay a day off. Days off here, days off there, days off everywhere. Cal Ripken wouldnt have played in 10 straight games with Girardi as his manager.

  123. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 10:58 pm

    Too many people on this team too often say “these things happen”. That’s an attitude of mediocrity.

  124. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 10:58 pm

    “What happened to deferring to Joe who knows best?”

    When I stop deferring to Joe, trust that I’m on to something.

    Those who question every move are the ones who are suspect.

  125. TheStraw June 28th, 2013 at 10:58 pm

    NYY Fan in NH-

    You really think they go 38-45 the rest of the way? I suppose it’s possible given the current stretch.

  126. UnKnown June 28th, 2013 at 10:59 pm

    Well glass half full I will see CC’s 200th win next week at Target Field. That and Pettitte passing Whitey on the all time K’s list. Of course unless Nova bumps one of them from their start.

    I hope Nova goes on Thursday for Phelps. I think you have to keep Andy and CC on their regular turns and then you want to take advantage of the big ballpark and be sure to throw Hughes as well. SO that leaves Nova for DP on the 4th of July. Bottom line is they need to bring some offense. Preferable 4 or more runs. 4 at an absolute minimum.

  127. mick June 28th, 2013 at 10:59 pm

    No offense and a host of other issues.
    ==============
    Didn’t they have 11 hits to about 5 for Balt?

  128. Captain Clutch June 28th, 2013 at 11:00 pm

    The sad thing is the only reason that Nova is still on the roster is because they don’t have another position player to bring up. Everyone else in AAA is garbage and Musty and Boesch being hurt doesn’t help either.

  129. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 11:00 pm

    “Those who question every move are the ones who are suspect.”

    Yep. When you’re right you’re right.

    It’s kind of odd for me to be defending Joe and you going against him. :D

  130. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 11:01 pm

    bruceb – at this point it doesn’t matter. It’s not a matter of trust. It’s a matter of expediency. And if Girardi wants to keep Hughes in the rotation, then let Warren be the guy. I remember the year that the Chisox won the WS, their claim to fame was a rotating, nonstop bullpen. By the time the WS rolled around, he didn’t even have to go to many of them because he hadn’t overused his starters.

  131. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 11:02 pm

    “Didn’t they have 11 hits to about 5 for Balt?”

    What’s the ultimate goal of the offense?

    And good thing Joe’s platoon went 2 for 3 with a BB. :wink:

  132. mick June 28th, 2013 at 11:03 pm

    They are going with a 6 man rotation till the ASB.

  133. mick June 28th, 2013 at 11:05 pm

    Joe is a defense first maven and he went against his better judgment.
    You will not see Adams at 1st again, ever.

  134. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 11:06 pm

    “Didn’t they have 11 hits to about 5 for Balt?”

    Ayup.

    Tar – it isn’t so much that I’m going against Joe as I am thinking that Overbey should be at first permanently because he plays a great first AND he gets hits. Right now that combination I pretty important. If it were any other time and the Yanks were sailing right along and he tried Adams at first, even if it didn’t work out, really no harm done.

    I’m not down on Adams. He didn’t ask to play there. I’m sure he did his best.

    *************
    niblick – I actually like it when guys say “that’s baseball” – as long as it’s the last thing out of their mouths and not the first. When it has been preceded by adequate self-flagellation, as it was with Adams AND CC, then it’s good with me because what they don’t need to do is dwell on the obvious. They need to put it behind them, learn from it, and come back ready to fight.

  135. Jerkface June 28th, 2013 at 11:06 pm

    1B defense is not critical. It is a definite plus, and determines whether similar offensive players have an edge over one another. You want the bat at first.

    You do not want a defense first guy at first. Its a waste of the position.

  136. Jerkface June 28th, 2013 at 11:07 pm

    Overbey should be at first permanently because he plays a great first AND he gets hits

    Relative to Adams he gets hits, relative to 1B in baseball and he is near last in production.

  137. mick June 28th, 2013 at 11:08 pm

    Nighty night,
    Try not to fight.

  138. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 11:09 pm

    “Joe is a defense first maven and he went against his better judgment.
    You will not see Adams at 1st again, ever.”

    Overbay is not good vs LH pitching. And is he supposed to play everyday and every play?
    Unless you have some trade scenario in mind I don’t see it that way.

  139. mick June 28th, 2013 at 11:09 pm

    They have to make a trade. Have a good night.

  140. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 11:10 pm

    Trisha – I agree it’s important to put bad performaces behind you , but when I hear that kind of talk, I hear an excuse for a failure to perform. It’s real easy to blame fate or luck for your shortcomings.

  141. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 11:11 pm

    Mick – can’t make a trade if you don’t have anything anyone else wants.

  142. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 11:12 pm

    Jerkface – YOU want the bat at first. I want defense at first.

    Sometimes things are so common sense that seem to elude some of you that it really defies logic to me. You might really know your baseball, but then you seem to not be able to recognize the obvious.

    Every ball that gets by the 1B where it should be grabbed/caught by the 1B is a potential run. Who gives a crap if your 1B is a great hitter but lets balls go by him? The guy is the gatekeeper!

  143. Captain Clutch June 28th, 2013 at 11:15 pm

    Another reason why Hafner and Overbay have to play everyday is because Joey binder can’t bat Wells 4th anymore. It really has to stop. Wells should be off playing golf somewhere, being in the lineup is enough but batting 4th is really ridiculous.

  144. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 11:15 pm

    Trisha – it’s not even a question of offense v defense, if the offensive choice is hitting

  145. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 11:17 pm

    “Trisha – I agree it’s important to put bad performaces behind you , but when I hear that kind of talk, I hear an excuse for a failure to perform. It’s real easy to blame fate or luck for your shortcomings.”

    Seriously, Adams took full responsibility for not being on the bag and refused to write it off on inexperience at first. He really looked upset too. But at the end, I think Meredith said something about his feeling sorry or being sorry – I really didn’t catch exactly what she said – and he said something like “hey it happens”. And it does. But he definitely had the right attitude.

    *************

    Tar – didn’t we just pick up some utility player who can play all infield and some outfield positions? I forget who it was, but it was someone whom I thought at one point had a lot going for him. Maybe I’m dreaming this?

  146. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 11:19 pm

    “Trisha – it’s not even a question of offense v defense, if the offensive choice is hitting”

    Well Overbey has certainly gotten hits for the Yanks.

    I’m not sure if that’s exactly what you meant. And I’m not saying I want defense without hitting. But if I am forced to sacrifice one for the other, I sacrifice the offensive end.

  147. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 11:21 pm

    What I meant was that Adams isn’t providing any offense, so Overbay wins on both offense and defense.

  148. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 11:22 pm

    Clutch – you know I love Wells, and I love Girardi, but I can’t disagree with you. Again, Joe likes to experiment, and I don’t ever mind seeing that when we have some kind of cushion. But when you have better options and really are in a bind, that’s when I think you hunker down and go with your obvious choices.

    I’m thinking Girardi has to feel like he’s in some never-ending nightmare.

    Okay, he started Adams at first probably thinking that CC was going to be able to give him length and hold down the scoring.

    HE NEEDS TO GROOM A MIDDLE RELIEVER. JOE – PLEASE LISTEN TO ME!!!

  149. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 11:22 pm

    “What I meant was that Adams isn’t providing any offense, so Overbay wins on both offense and defense.”

    Okay, that’s what I thought you meant.

    And yes to that.

  150. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 11:23 pm

    If you screwed up something basic, and told your client “well, that happens”, you wouldn’t have too many clients would you?

  151. Jerkface June 28th, 2013 at 11:25 pm

    YOU want the bat at first. I want defense at first.

    Sometimes things are so common sense that seem to elude some of you that it really defies logic to me. You might really know your baseball, but then you seem to not be able to recognize the obvious.

    Every ball that gets by the 1B where it should be grabbed/caught by the 1B is a potential run. Who gives a crap if your 1B is a great hitter but lets balls go by him? The guy is the gatekeeper!

    Where are the teams in baseball that are sacrificing offense for defense at 1st? They don’t exist. You think its common sense that defense is more important than offense but you’re missing the common sense logic that would prove otherwise. On offense you are guaranteed a number of representations at the plate, minimum of 3 each game. On defense you are not guaranteed any plays at all.

    Every ball that gets by a player is a potential run? So I suppose you really dislike Derek Jeter’s defense then? Every PA wasted by an offensive zero is a potential run killed in the crib.

  152. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 11:26 pm

    Trish

    Lillbridge, but I don’t think he can hit either.

    JF will explain it better, but certain positions you look for offensive production from and 1B is high on that list. SS on the other hand is a position that you don’t worry so much about O.

    Heres an article it doesn’t really explain this issue too much, but it has a really cool chart that will show you how valuable a player like Cano or Cabrera is.

    http://www.vivaelbirdos.com/20.....e-position

  153. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 11:29 pm

    “If you screwed up something basic, and told your client “well, that happens”, you wouldn’t have too many clients would you?”

    I think you probably had to hear it to appreciate it. Believe me, it wasn’t cavalier. When IPK used to blow things off with that kind of attitude, I wanted to scream.

    If I screw up something basic, pretty much there’s no page to turn! I probably have a malpractice suit. :)

    But if they screw up something basic, unless it’s the last game of the season, there’s always another game.

    And truthfully, it is baseball. And again, Adams took full responsibility.

  154. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 11:34 pm

    Tar – that’s another thing we used to discuss on the NY Times forum. When they’d talk about looking for offense out of a certain position, I would say “says who?”

    If an outfielder wasn’t hitting for power some guys would talk about how that has to be a power-hitting position. And I would say, says who?

    And so I say, says who? That doesn’t mean I’m questioning what you’re saying! That means I’m questioning the notion that certain positions have to be known for offense. To me that’s craziness.

    And if I’m looking for strong D, I’m sure as hell wanting it in my 1B!

    But we know that my logic isn’t necessary “by the book”. However, I still think it’s superior logic in this case.

  155. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 11:34 pm

    “What I meant was that Adams isn’t providing any offense, so Overbay wins on both offense and defense.”

    Except this is not true vs LH pitching.

    Overbay
    .186 .216 .314 .531

    Adams
    .237 .275 .289 .564

    Both pretty bad but Adams has him beat. And will probably just get better.

  156. Jerkface June 28th, 2013 at 11:37 pm

    JF will explain it better, but certain positions you look for offensive production from and 1B is high on that list. SS on the other hand is a position that you don’t worry so much about O.

    Part of how teams look for offense is how easy it is to play a position. The defensive spectrum is like this:

    DH–>1B–>LF–>RF–>3B–>CF–>2B–>SS–>C*

    Most players in baseball started on the right side in HS. Most were SS’s or CFers in HS because they are the best athletes on the team. As you move up the levels you are pushed out by better athletes, as you grow and find you cannot handle a good defensive position at the upper levels.

    So 1B is the easiest position on the field physically. You don’t need great athletic talent to be a 1st baseman, it does not require foot speed. There are techniques that must be learned and practiced, but generally everyone with 2 legs is equipped to play 1st.

    So teams look to maximize offense there, because almost anyone can play it. Subsequently its difficult to maximize offense at SS or CF or 2B or C, which is why Posada, Jeter, and Cano are so great to have. The thing is, having bats at those positions isn’t supposed to mean punting 1st and 3rd and LF and RF. You’re supposed to have good bats there because they are easier to find and then the bonus bats you have the up the middle difficult positions are really making an impact.

  157. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 11:38 pm

    Strong D up the middle and power from your corners I the general rule Trish.

    One reason Derek is so great is because of all that he has accomplished offensively while playing SS, a defensive position.

  158. Ys Guy June 28th, 2013 at 11:39 pm

    props to coco crisp who almost gave himself a freakin concussion trying to preserve a no no for fat & juicy bartolo colon!

  159. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 11:39 pm

    Or what JF just posted. :D

  160. Niblick June 28th, 2013 at 11:40 pm

    Tar – with small sample sizes, that difference is probably not statistically significant (not that Looseleaf Joe would understand that). In any event, not big enough to play a guy with no experience at the position.

  161. Hankflorida June 28th, 2013 at 11:41 pm

    Captain Clutch June 28th, 2013 at 10:03 pm
    Forget about Granderson, Jeter and Arod coming back. This team will be out of the race before they even come back. A lot of guys are hurt I get it but these guys don’t even look like they are trying hard for 27 outs everyday. As soon as CC gave up that homerun everyone knew the game was over. CC is absolutely killing them.

    Astute observation! Before the All Star break, the Yankees have five more games with the O’s, seven with the Twins and four with the Royals. They have to win at least ten of these games in order to hold the fort before some of the injured played like Nunez and Musty get back to replace Adams and Gonzales and maybe make a deal for some right handed punch at first so they can continue to stay in the race till Jeter and Granderson come back. The way they are going now they may end up losing ten of the next sixteen games against these three teams who in previous years were money in the bank for wins and blow the season at the half way point. These sixteen games are at a critical point for this season, and the cavalry of replacements are no where in sight.

  162. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 11:41 pm

    Tar and Jerkface – Thank you for the explanations. I can see what you mean about the evolution of the game, etc.

    However I still disagree with the schematic. I think 1B should be a lot further toward the important D end.

    Maybe someday that will catch on.

  163. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 11:42 pm

    JF

    Did you take a look at that chart I posted a link to? Pretty cool but I don’t understand Trout not being dark red?

  164. Ys Guy June 28th, 2013 at 11:44 pm

    gerrit freaking cole just HAD to freakin go to college! like that damn degree is gonna make any damn difference!

  165. Jerkface June 28th, 2013 at 11:46 pm

    However I still disagree with the schematic. I think 1B should be a lot further toward the important D end.

    Maybe someday that will catch on.

    -

    Probably will never catch on, because 1B is not supposed to be going after balls. you need them at 1st to receive pitches, and again it is the easiest position to play. They do not see that many balls. The SS 2B and CF see the most balls in play in the field.

    You’re basically prioritizing something that simply doesn’t impact the game as much. Meanwhile, because nearly anyone can play it, you kind of have to have a good hitter there.

    Theres a reason Giambi got a big contract and Doug Mientkiewicz did not.

  166. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 11:48 pm

    “Tar – with small sample sizes, that difference is probably not statistically significant (not that Looseleaf Joe would understand that). In any event, not big enough to play a guy with no experience at the position.

    Absolutely agree with that. And I’m sure Rhapsody would also. And so would my friend Syzy from the NY Times forum who absolutely loved the way I thought, and he was a huge Yankee fans and extremely well versed in the game. However, he really liked creative thinking and so he’d oftentimes vibe onto my logic. Not that he agreed with everything I thought, of course.

    We had a great time on the Times forum and everyone shared their birthdays and I kept the birthday calendar and would always do a birthday countdown: In the Hole (two days before); On Deck (one day before); At Bat (Birthday day!) That’s when I discovered Syzy and I were the same birth sign. I’m not heavily into astrology but I did think it was kind of a cool thing!

  167. Jerkface June 28th, 2013 at 11:49 pm

    Tar,

    that chart doesnt go by player, so Trouts production is broken up over LF and CF. He has a 160 OPS+ he’d be practically black if he had his own square.

  168. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 11:49 pm

    “Probably will never catch on, because 1B is not supposed to be going after balls. you need them at 1st to receive pitches, and again it is the easiest position to play. They do not see that many balls. The SS 2B and CF see the most balls in play in the field.

    You’re basically prioritizing something that simply doesn’t impact the game as much. Meanwhile, because nearly anyone can play it, you kind of have to have a good hitter there.”

    I’ve seen too many games lost because of shoddy D at first to buy it.

    So that’s that.

  169. pat June 28th, 2013 at 11:49 pm

    TBTimes_Rays
    #Tigers Cabrera, on where Fielder homer would have gone if it didn’t hit Trop C-ring catwalk: “Miami”

    :smile:

  170. trisha - true pinstriped blue June 28th, 2013 at 11:52 pm

    And I saw Tex save a boatload of balls that were thrown poorly to him at first because of his great defense at first base.

    Nah, you need great D there. I just changed it from good to great.

    :)

    I’ll have Joe get right on that.

  171. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 11:55 pm

    Thanks JF.

    I didn’t realize he played LF that much. Ian Desmond was also a surprise, I knew he was good but not that good.

  172. Tar June 28th, 2013 at 11:56 pm

    Good night all.

    New thread

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