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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


McCann press conference today; LoHud Yankees chat tomorrow

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Dec 05, 2013 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

I’m about to head over to Yankee Stadium for today’s Brian McCann press conference, which starts at 2 p.m. and will be carried live on YES Network. Brian Cashman and Joe Girardi are each going to be there, so I’m sure the questions will venture into topics beyond the McCann signing.

Speaking of which…

Plenty to talk about this week, and the Winter Meetings start next week, so let’s do a chat tomorrow at noon. Seems like a good opportunity to discuss McCann and Jacoby Ellsbury and Masahiro Tanaka and Robinson Cano and all of the other stuff that’s looming all around the Yankees these days.

Hope to see you then. Noon. Friday. Chat. Stop by if you can.

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208 Responses to “McCann press conference today; LoHud Yankees chat tomorrow”

  1. blake December 5th, 2013 at 11:57 am

    “He clearly wants to leave…? Or the team clearly wanted to post him when they thought they’d be getting a higher bid than Darvish? Because I dunno that we can assume what his motivations are with the information we have.”

    wouldn’t you? He could get a 100 million dollar contract in MLB

  2. joeman December 5th, 2013 at 12:00 pm

    joeman November 10th, 2013 at 9:29 am
    they can get a McCann and Choo or Ellsbury for the money they will spend on Cano and for lesser years

  3. joeman December 5th, 2013 at 12:01 pm

    blake November 10th, 2013 at 9:33 am
    joeman says:
    November 10, 2013 at 9:29 am
    they can get a McCann and Choo or Ellsbury for the money they will spend on Cano and for lesser years

    They could in total money but not in AAV.

    Cano will probbaly end up costing 25 million per year…..McCann and Choo will be at least 30 and probably closer to 35.

    Now you would get them for less years most likely…..but the problem is that without Cano….McCann +Choo would only marginally increase their offensive production …..and a marginal increase isn’t gonna put this team over the top.

    So you’d end up with basically the same quality team and no draft pick…..

    To really have a contender next year they need to have Cano plus other players….
    ————————
    Nice job

  4. MTU December 5th, 2013 at 12:02 pm

    Steve-

    189 = toast.

    Love your math.

    Please keep it up.

    :)

  5. Ys Guy December 5th, 2013 at 12:06 pm

    bill madden’s a pretty fishy source himself, so when he comes up with an anonymous source to back up his point, thats beyond fishy.

  6. DONNYBROOK December 5th, 2013 at 12:07 pm

    The voodoo math around here Never factors\mentions FULL seasons from Tex and Jeet, McCann’s numbers vs Stewart and comp. This is why the game is Not played on paper. The sum of the parts can\does exceed the whole.

  7. Tackelberry December 5th, 2013 at 12:08 pm

    Suddenly, a team like Seattle could be come a huge threat to Yanks landing Tanaka. They will no doubt make a huge offer, and a low key environment like in Seattle which has a good history of recruiting Japanese players might appeal more to a guy like Tanaka than a huge media markey like NY. Don’t know what kind of personality or how thick skinned he is.

  8. Ys Guy December 5th, 2013 at 12:08 pm

    personallly im not counting on too much from jeter.

  9. DONNYBROOK December 5th, 2013 at 12:09 pm

    The new posting process is basically, “Jacks or better to open”.

  10. RMS December 5th, 2013 at 12:09 pm

    Ellsbury is injury prone, his legs are his game. Contract is too many years, another old man at the end. They already have Gardner.

  11. MTU December 5th, 2013 at 12:10 pm

    Off to get some much needed exercise soon.

    When I come back Robbie better have signed or I’m pulling my 200Mil offer.

    I’ve waited on him long enough.

    Signed,

    False Hal

  12. MTU December 5th, 2013 at 12:11 pm

    DB-

    Actually it’s more like a pair of deuces to open.

    ;)

  13. DONNYBROOK December 5th, 2013 at 12:12 pm

    Yeah, $20 Mill ain’t what it used to be.

  14. blake December 5th, 2013 at 12:13 pm

    @Ken_Rosenthal: Source: Mujica, #RedSox in agreement, two years, $9.5M, pending physical. First reported: @JeffPassan.

  15. MTU December 5th, 2013 at 12:13 pm

    Or a 20 cent ante.

    ;)

  16. Tackelberry December 5th, 2013 at 12:14 pm

    RMS December 5th, 2013 at 12:09 pm
    Ellsbury is injury prone, his legs are his game. Contract is too many years, another old man at the end. They already have Gardner.

    ______________________________

    Gardner is a free agent after this year. NO guarrantee they resign him. Hopfully, one of Heathcott, Mason Williams or Tyler Austin emerges this year and is ready next year.

  17. Tackelberry December 5th, 2013 at 12:15 pm

    @Ken_Rosenthal: Source: Mujica, #RedSox in agreement, two years, $9.5M, pending physical. First reported: @JeffPassan.

    ____________________________________

    Solid addition to their already very good bullpen

  18. MTU December 5th, 2013 at 12:16 pm

    Did the Sux get Kemp yet ?

    :)

  19. DONNYBROOK December 5th, 2013 at 12:16 pm

    Gotta wait to see if the Yanks deal Gardner, and then add that player to the Ells addition. The groundwork could of been laid.

  20. joeman December 5th, 2013 at 12:16 pm

    joeman November 12th, 2013 at 3:42 pm
    don’t know if it will happen if Cano goes…..but I gave a shout out for Johnson here and once again got shot down by certain peeps here a usual

  21. blake December 5th, 2013 at 12:16 pm

    yup good pick up for socks

  22. blake December 5th, 2013 at 12:17 pm

    “Gardner is a free agent after this year. NO guarrantee they resign him. Hopfully, one of Heathcott, Mason Williams or Tyler Austin emerges this year and is ready next year.”

    one would hope

  23. Bronx Jeers December 5th, 2013 at 12:17 pm

    I hope the folks saying Ellsbury is injury prone realize how exactly he sustained his most serious injuries.

    Personally I’m looking at it as he’s a 30 year old with low mileage.

  24. Tackelberry December 5th, 2013 at 12:18 pm

    Wonder if Yanks will bring in a guy like Axford or Belisario

  25. MTU December 5th, 2013 at 12:18 pm

    “Gotta wait to see if the Yanks deal Gardner, and then add that player to the Ells addition. The groundwork could of been laid.”

    And then hatch like an egg.

    :)

  26. DONNYBROOK December 5th, 2013 at 12:18 pm

    I thought Oakland pulled a good trade with the addition of RP Gregerson.

  27. MTU December 5th, 2013 at 12:19 pm

    Wonder if the Yanks will bring guys like Balfour and O’Flaherty ?

  28. DONNYBROOK December 5th, 2013 at 12:20 pm

    I agree with the comment made yesterday about the problem being the “healing time” with Ells.

  29. MTU December 5th, 2013 at 12:20 pm

    Oakland didn’t really need BP help.

    Maybe they figure their starters will avg. 5 next season.

    ;)

  30. DONNYBROOK December 5th, 2013 at 12:22 pm

    If you can add a guy like Gregerson for Smith you immediately jump all over that. I was surprised that Oakland even entered discussions with the D Backs about Cespedes.

  31. MTU December 5th, 2013 at 12:23 pm

    So far the Yankees and Tigers have had the best OS’s.

    But I think we’ll beat them out in the end.

    ;)

  32. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 12:24 pm

    more from Politti:

    “…Is $200 million over eight years for Cano outrageous? It would be a better deal than Ellsbury at $153 over seven, but the Yankees have drawn the line. It’s not just that they’re inviting their best player to walk away. They’re daring him to. If he does, the richest team in professional sports will throw up its hands and fall back on the Cano-is-greedy refrain. Maybe some of their fans will buy it, too — at least in December.

    But come April, they’ll see that massive hole in the middle of the lineup…”
    ///

    Yes, a massive hole in the middle of the order, and a chasm at 2B. You don’t sign two “good” players to replace a great player/super MI and actually improve.

    Hal/Levine not only have contempt for the players, they apparently have it for the fans, as well. Most sports teams do; it’s the same old game whenever they’re trying to re-sign a player.

    Let’s vilify the player so that the fan, many of whom are envious of the player’s salary/lifestyle/celebrity, joins in to help build the artificial construct of a subhuman or demon, in order to disconnect from the player and shield himself/herself from disappointment in the event that the player leaves.

    The construct, no matter what actually happens, is that the player, if he walks, has “abandoned” the team out of self interest.

    Hopefully, Hal/Levine are at least smart enough to understand that such a Pyrrhic “W” here will turn into a bunch of “L”s in the short and long term.

  33. Doreen December 5th, 2013 at 12:24 pm

    yankeefemlnista -

    How do they know that the attendance wouldn’t have been LOWER had there not been Cano on the team last season???? How do they know that the people who DID show up didn’t come specifically to see Cano? They can’t know that.

    He may not get “extra” fannies in the seats (I mean there are usually many big-name players playing for them in each game, with Jeter, ARod, Tex, Mo and Cano, also Granderson and some Ichiro), but if he’s not signed, they well could LOSE some fannies.

    It’s really difficult to break something like that down, IMO. Plus, last year was a very off year for the Yankees from top to bottom; tough to put all that on one player.

  34. DONNYBROOK December 5th, 2013 at 12:24 pm

    Hal better Not duck that presser today. George was Always front and center.

  35. MTU December 5th, 2013 at 12:24 pm

    DB-

    Beane likes to trade.

    I don’t think he see many guys as permanent.

  36. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 12:26 pm

    Interesting article in BP on fastball spin and trackman spin rates. Not sure if you need a sub to read this one.

    http://www.baseballprospectus......leid=22362

  37. Ys Guy December 5th, 2013 at 12:28 pm

    according to cots, the dodgers 2014 payroll is already $209M, the angels are at $150M with 10 players to add to thier 25 man, the tigers are right around the same place with 11 players to add and the yannkees are at $136M with 10 players to add.

    so we can now stop with the line about the luxury tax only affecting the yankees. several of the big market teams are now either over it or up against it.

  38. MTU December 5th, 2013 at 12:29 pm

    See you all later.

    One last point.

    If Robbie goes Choo and Infante aren’t the only upgrades.

    You already have Ellsbury and McCann in the fold.

    And yeah they would better with all of that.

    Choo, JE, McCann, and Infante.

    Of course my hope is that the 2 sides get it together and find the right deal for both bringing back Cano.

    back later.

    Time to ditch some calories.

    :)

  39. Russell Munson December 5th, 2013 at 12:29 pm

    “I hope the folks saying Ellsbury is injury prone realize how exactly he sustained his most serious injuries.”

    He got them by not being able to stop from running into other players, right?

  40. Ys Guy December 5th, 2013 at 12:29 pm

    RS payroll at $145M with 7 players to add.

  41. Howler December 5th, 2013 at 12:30 pm

    Could you ditch some for me too MTU

  42. joeman December 5th, 2013 at 12:30 pm

    lets see Jeter won’t play much in 13…right
    Yankees will have 85 wins in 13..right
    Sox will win WS in 6 games..right
    189 is just a number..right
    Ellsbury will sign with the NYY..right
    189 is just a number…right
    Tanaka isn’t coming here..pending

  43. MTU December 5th, 2013 at 12:31 pm

    Howler-

    Your Mal should be able to help you w that I’d think.

    ;)

  44. Howler December 5th, 2013 at 12:31 pm

    I think all the stats for the last few years of attendance, and revenue declining doesn’t also take into account that the economy was tanking at the same time and people just didn’t have the funds to spend on things like a Derek Jeter jersey, or going to an extra game or two.

  45. Howler December 5th, 2013 at 12:32 pm

    I’m actually going out to take some eagle pics later today.

  46. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 12:32 pm

    Doreen,

    I am a person who occasionally attends games.

    Knock wood, Cano is virtually always healthy, but if I were considering a game on the schedule, and Cano was suddenly out of the lineup and would miss the game I had targeted, I would not go to that game; unless it was a playoff game or had some other momentous meaning restricted to that particular date.

  47. Ys Guy December 5th, 2013 at 12:33 pm

    so jap you read an anonymous quote from bill madden and you’re just gonna run with it as fact

    and now you’ve expanded it from hal hates the players to the whole FO hates the players.

  48. Bronx Jeers December 5th, 2013 at 12:35 pm

    Hal better Not duck that presser today.

    ——————

    Or what? Who cares as long as he keeps the vault open.

  49. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 12:35 pm

    Hankflorida December 5th, 2013 at 12:01 pm

    Joe DiMaggio was a quiet man who kept to himself, and yet fans came out to see him play because he could hit and get to balls in the outfield that most center fielders would not even get near. Cano can hit and make spectacular plays at 2nd, and if that does not draw fans, I do not know what will.
    ///

    Well, exactly. This is about baseball, right? :)

    Cano live is worth going out to the park to see, particularly if we have someone hitting behind him who they have to respect.

    Cano turning DPs and making plays live is way more dynamic than watching YES Network.

  50. DONNYBROOK December 5th, 2013 at 12:37 pm

    Overall, the 2013 attendance for MLB was Down roughly 1%. The Yankees were down roughly 9%. Forget the economy, that difference is Significant. Yankee home attendance has declined since the new joint opened.

  51. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 12:37 pm

    blake December 5th, 2013 at 11:57 am

    “He clearly wants to leave…? Or the team clearly wanted to post him when they thought they’d be getting a higher bid than Darvish? Because I dunno that we can assume what his motivations are with the information we have.”

    wouldn’t you? He could get a 100 million dollar contract in MLB

    ————-

    Sure, but I’m not locked into a contract already so it’s not as simple as what Tanaka wants. It’s about what the team wants.

    In the two options I outlined, which as far as I can tell are two totally plausible scenarios, there’s no way the team would let him go for $20 million this year when they could keep him for another year and get the same amount at that point.

    What reasons – besides wanting Tanaka on the Yankees – do we have for why Tanaka should be posted this year and not next year instead?

  52. Ys Guy December 5th, 2013 at 12:38 pm

    ‘if the fans dont want to pay to see a HOF 2nd baseman play, nobdody’s gonna stop ‘em!

  53. Bronx Jeers December 5th, 2013 at 12:38 pm

    He got them by not being able to stop from running into other players, right?

    ————————————

    Actually on both occasions he was on the ground (stopped) when he got injured.

  54. DONNYBROOK December 5th, 2013 at 12:38 pm

    I want to hear Hal field some tough questions regarding the $189.

  55. Mottsx December 5th, 2013 at 12:39 pm

    Does anyone know if the Press Conference today will be streamed somewhere online?

  56. Ys Guy December 5th, 2013 at 12:40 pm

    attendance may be trending down at NYS, but ballpark revenues are likely at historic levels.

  57. Howler December 5th, 2013 at 12:40 pm

    Well, the Yankees were stupid too and priced too many people out of that stadium.

  58. Chip December 5th, 2013 at 12:41 pm

    Two reasons why $189 might not be worth meeting:

    1. The Business Reason: The Yankees reportedly lost $50 million by missing the post season last year, not counting concessions and other revenue. Coupled with fan disinterest that would come with a second down year, it may be more cost effective to pay the luxury tax.

    2. The Emotional Reason: The Yankees likely look at this as Derek Jeter’s last season in pinstripes. He signed a 1 year deal earlier this offseason and will turn 40 this June. Mariano Rivera and Andy Pettitte did not get to enjoy playoff baseball in their last year, I don’t think the Yankees could handle the notion of not giving Jeter a solid chance at post season baseball. For Rivera there was a crutch to fall back on – the injuries. So many players missing so much time; making the playoffs was impossible. However, if the Yankees missed the playoffs in Jeter’s last year because they were trying to avoid paying a luxury tax, I think the public relations fallout would be massive.

    The Yankees don’t have to hit $189 this year to reset the luxury tax clock, they can do it at any time. It may be that for the two reasons above, as well as the fact that in a year or two their farm system will be in a better position to support a shift to low cost talent, that they are willing to go above $189 for now.

  59. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 12:42 pm

    YsGuy,

    Although I think Madden is largely a jerk, I’m assuming the quote in his story was not made up by the writer, but that some insider whom Madden spoke to actually made the observation.

    “As one of the sources put it, there’s no reason for Hal, Hank, Jessica, the GM of the family’s stable in Ocala, Fla., and Jennifer to hang on to the team other than the prestige of owning the New York Yankees.

    “Hal hates the players,” the source said, “and he hates the media.”

  60. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 12:43 pm

    And I don’t have the link, I just took that off SBNation.

    I cant’ find it, but feel free to look for it; I certainly didn’t make it up, and I have trouble believing that Madden would.

  61. DONNYBROOK December 5th, 2013 at 12:43 pm

    I agree about the, “pricing people out of the stadium”. These were Real fans. The reduced decibel level is testament to that.

  62. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 12:43 pm

    Doreen, Cano’s popularity or lack thereof is just a negotiating ploy by the Yankees. However, we all know Cano doesn’t likely have the drawing strength the way Jeter or Alex do, but I am sure people come out especially to see Cano play. But it isn’t easily quantifiable anyway; that is why the Yankees saying so isn’t backed up by any numbers unless they have done a sociological study and interviewed fans. That’s why I critiqued the Cano/lack of popularity theme in the reverse. I can’t tell you how many fans Cano draws and neither can the Yanks. But I do know that I would not go see the Yankees play in order to watch Hafner, Steward and Wells without Cano in the lineup, and I am someone who has attended huge numbers of games at Yankees Stadium.

    “Cano can hit and make spectacular plays at 2nd, and if that does not draw fans, I do not know what will.”

    HankinFla. We all know that winning is the biggest draw and that the TEAM is what matters, but those truisms don’t alter the facts. People do come out to see Robi play. As a STH, I can honestly say that Cano has often been one of the sole position players worth watching the past two years. Last season, at home I basically made sure I watched Robi’s AB’s and not many other players’ until we added Alex and Sori to the fold. And I am someone who normally watches every AB and every inning of every game every year for my entire life except when I attended school. But last season most of the time, I could just walk out of the room and hear the play by play b/c I didn’t care that I missed the other players’ in the lineups ABs. That dumpster dive of a team was unwatchable for most of the season. When I attend games, which I guess most people don’t do here, with travel etc., the entire day is wiped out, so are you really going to drive to the Bronx to watch Hafner, Wells, and Chris Stewart play? I don’t think so.

  63. Ys Guy December 5th, 2013 at 12:45 pm

    that source couldve been a stable boy employed by hank for all you know. im sure i could find a digruntled stewardess who would tell you that captain sully was a lousy pilot if you asked around (and needed just that quote to ‘make’ the point of your column)

    but my point was that you are now incorporating it into your posts as fact.

    and you expanded it to include the whole FO

  64. DONNYBROOK December 5th, 2013 at 12:46 pm

    The main thing that makes hitting the $189 worthwhile, is 2013. We Fans have Already paid the freight. The Yanks can hit that $189 and still be in the Playoffsin2014. Once in the playoffs, we all know it’s whatever team get’s Hot.

  65. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 12:48 pm

    “Cano live is worth going out to the park to see, particularly if we have someone hitting behind him who they have to respect.

    Cano turning DPs and making plays live is way more dynamic than watching YES Network.”

    Yep. Cano is worth going to the Stadium to see, and it is a world of difference watching him and the game live.

  66. Patrick December 5th, 2013 at 12:50 pm

    The Yanks can hit that $189 and still be in the Playoffsin2014.

    Highly doubtful

  67. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 12:50 pm

    Ys Guy December 5th, 2013 at 12:06 pm

    bill madden’s a pretty fishy source himself, so when he comes up with an anonymous source to back up his point, thats beyond fishy.
    ///

    Say, what?

    Journalism employs “anonymous sources” all the time???

    I was in the industry for 12 years, but even if I had not been:

    “an insider said…”,

    “a person privy to the process said…”,

    ???

    Ring a bell?

  68. Bronx Jeers December 5th, 2013 at 12:51 pm

    “There is always some kid who may be seeing me for the first or last time, I owe him my best.”

    No way that comes out of Robbie’s mouth.

  69. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 12:51 pm

    Ys Guy, every article you read that refers to an unnamed scout, player or just the word “anonymous source” means that there was a source for the quote or paraphrase that doesn’t want to attach the quote to their name.

  70. Captain Clutch December 5th, 2013 at 12:52 pm

    I want to hear Hal field some tough questions regarding the $189.
    ————

    He is going to say the same thing that they have said the whole off season. It will not stop us from fielding a championship caliber team.

  71. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 12:52 pm

    Jeers, you’re kidding, right? Do you know how many kids look up to Robinson Cano?

  72. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 12:55 pm

    “I want to hear Hal field some tough questions regarding the $189.”
    ___
    Who’s going ask them? Michael Kay? Meredith What’s’erName? :roll:

  73. Howler December 5th, 2013 at 12:55 pm

    I feel bad for some kid who goes to the stadium now and how quiet it is in comparison and thinks that’s how it should be…I remember when the place was literally rocking.

  74. Howler December 5th, 2013 at 12:56 pm

    All Hal would have to do is hold up a Mayo packet and Kay would run for the hills

  75. Russell Munson December 5th, 2013 at 12:58 pm

    “People are saying…”

  76. Captain Clutch December 5th, 2013 at 12:58 pm

    If the Yanks were planning to stay under $189 I really doubt that they would have given Ellsbury the contract that they did. The contract is one that you give when you are ALL in and money isn’t an issue. Otherwise it wouldn’t make any sense to give him that much.

  77. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 12:58 pm

    “INITIAL REPORT: In N.Y., O’Keeffe & Madden report rumors are flying in MLB and N.Y. banking circles that the Steinbrenner family “is exploring the possibility of selling the Yankees.” Multiple baseball and finance sources said that the Yankees “could be put on the block in the wake of the record sale price” of $2.175B the Dodgers went for in April. Sources said that the sale of the Dodgers is “just one reason why the Steinbrenner family may be looking to sell the team, which experts estimate could be worth up to” $3B. Another factor fueling the speculation is the fact that Hal Steinbrenner “doesn’t seem to share his father’s passion for baseball, and his brother, Hank, has virtually disappeared from the baseball landscape since he approved” a 10-year, $275M contract for 3B Alex Rodriguez before the ’08 season. Hal Steinbrenner “rarely attends games, and according to those who know him, abhors doling out the huge money long-term contracts such as the Rodriguez deal.” The source said, “Hal’s a smart businessman. And I’m just not sure that he considers baseball to be a smart business.” One source said that there is “no reason for Hal, Hank, Jessica, the GM of the family’s stable in Ocala, Fla., and Jennifer to hang on to the team other than the prestige” of owning the Yankees. The source said, “Hal hates the players, and he hates the media” (N.Y. DAILY NEWS, 5/24)”

    http://m.sportsbusinessdaily.c.....nkees.aspx

  78. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 12:59 pm

    “Howler December 5th, 2013 at 12:32 pm
    I’m actually going out to take some eagle pics later today.”

    I am only interested in one Eagle…

    Of the Rakuten Golden Eagle variety. ;)

    (But seriously, would love to see the pics if you care to share.)

  79. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 1:00 pm

    Bronx Jeers December 5th, 2013 at 12:51 pm

    “There is always some kid who may be seeing me for the first or last time, I owe him my best.”

    No way that comes out of Robbie’s mouth.
    ///

    Sure it does, only in Spanish ;)

  80. blake December 5th, 2013 at 1:00 pm

    What reasons – besides wanting Tanaka on the Yankees – do we have for why Tanaka should be posted this year and not next year instead?”

    What more reason do we need :)

  81. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:01 pm

    Howler December 5th, 2013 at 12:56 pm
    All Hal would have to do is hold up a Mayo packet and Kay would run for the hills
    ____

    :lol:

  82. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 1:01 pm

    Howler December 5th, 2013 at 12:56 pm

    All Hal would have to do is hold up a Mayo packet and Kay would run for the hills
    ///

    lol, shrilly shrieking while running away

  83. Howler December 5th, 2013 at 1:02 pm

    We’re getting into the time when the eagles do their wintering in my area…at times you’ll see about 100 in the trees…I have to set up a page for here…the outbreak for them hasn’t quite hit their peak yet, but I’m going to check it out today to see how things are going.

  84. Bronx Jeers December 5th, 2013 at 1:03 pm

    YF,

    No doubt but someone was making a DiMaggio comparison so I thought that famous quote was relevant because it does point out a flaw in Robbie’s game.

  85. Chip December 5th, 2013 at 1:04 pm

    Here’s the thing I come back to on Cano.

    Growing up my dad and I would sit down with the schedule and pick a few games that we wanted to go to: Invariably there would be games against Seattle, Oakland and Boston on the list. Later, once interleague started – that list included St. Louis, Texas, San Francisco, Chicago, Montreal and the Angels.

    Leaving Boston out of it – the reason I picked those other teams were the stars. I wanted to see Junior, Mac & Canceco, Bonds, Pujols, Sosa, Alex and Vlad because they were the players who could do the kinds of things that you wanted to be able to say to your friends and family “I was there to see when Vlad threw a ball from the RF corner to 3b and nailed a runner tagging from 2nd.” (Side note, I was at a game against the Angles when they had Vlad and Jose Guillen and the two of them were standing in front of the visiting dugout lobbing baseballs into the RF stands)

    Anyway, teams that weren’t on the list were the Orioles, White Sox or Braves because, while Ripken, Big Hurt and Chipper were fantastic players, there was nothing about them that screamed “must see.”

    I feel like Cano (and to an extent Jeter) falls into this category. You know he’s a tremendous player, likely one on a Hall of Fame track, but you’re not worried if you get up and go to the bathroom during an at bat, or miss the game entirely, that he’s going to do something you’ll never see again. That, I think, is what separates the $150 million dollar player from the $250 million dollar player.

  86. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:06 pm

    blake December 5th, 2013 at 1:00 pm

    What reasons – besides wanting Tanaka on the Yankees – do we have for why Tanaka should be posted this year and not next year instead?”

    What more reason do we need :)

    ——–

    Well yeah, but right now if I’m the Yankees I’m on plan B regarding the rotation. Let Tanaka be icing if available, but start filling out the starters. They have an offer out there for Kuroda.. I’d check in on Colon’s cost for 1-2 years and see if adding depth via trade makes sense.

  87. Cashmoney December 5th, 2013 at 1:07 pm

    around GW bridge, I think Papi, Manny then Cano in that order, a lot DR peeps reveres Papi and Manny.

  88. Bronx Jeers December 5th, 2013 at 1:07 pm

    So Hal thinks baseball isn’t a “smart” business. Please…. The smartest business decision he’s ever made was to be born and to not die.

  89. blake December 5th, 2013 at 1:07 pm

    @BenBadler: Japanese media reports say Rakuten is mulling over the new rules and discussing whether to post Tanaka. My sources think they’ll post him.

  90. jackamir December 5th, 2013 at 1:08 pm

    Beltran is next…. 130 games in RF….Plus the Postseason, Gardner is a ” goner”……

  91. RhapsodyInBlue December 5th, 2013 at 1:09 pm

    jap

    That article is dated May 2012. It also claimed of rumors that the Yankees would be on the market.

  92. Mike Ri December 5th, 2013 at 1:09 pm

    I have a wierd feeling Beltran will be a Yankee soon …..

  93. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:10 pm

    If this off season goes as planned (spending on ALL the players) I’m working on a rendition of Miley Cyrus’ song Wrecking Ball that goes something like:

    Hank came in like a wreckkkkkking ball!!!!!

  94. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:10 pm

    Jeers, thus, the “where have you gone, Joe D.” line… I didn’t realize you were talk about Joe D. It was a different era then. At least you weren’t quoting Pedroia. ;)

  95. Cashmoney December 5th, 2013 at 1:10 pm

    I don’t what precisely draws people- charisma, personality, baseball skills probably all have something to do with it.

    Hr probably does, a Ruthian swatter who has the potential of hit anywhere in any given AB draws me.

  96. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 1:11 pm

    I feel like Cano (and to an extent Jeter) falls into this category. You know he’s a tremendous player, likely one on a Hall of Fame track, but you’re not worried if you get up and go to the bathroom during an at bat, or miss the game entirely, that he’s going to do something you’ll never see again.
    ///

    Well, that’s your experience.

    Mine is that Cano does things that I find myself reacting to in exactly that manner:

    “Other players can’t do that.”

  97. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:11 pm

    blake December 5th, 2013 at 1:07 pm

    @BenBadler: Japanese media reports say Rakuten is mulling over the new rules and discussing whether to post Tanaka. My sources think they’ll post him.

    —————

    Meh, they might but I don’t understand how it makes any sense for the club.

  98. Chip December 5th, 2013 at 1:11 pm

    I’m not inclined to believe any reports about the Yankees being sold until I hear that they’re in negotiations to be sold.

  99. AAA December 5th, 2013 at 1:12 pm

    so we can now stop with the line about the luxury tax only affecting the yankees. several of the big market teams are now either over it or up against it.

    ===============================

    Yeah, but a lot of those teams will hit it for the 1st or 2nd time when the %age of tax is reasonable. If Boston hits it this year, they pay a 17.5% rate. Depending on how far a team goes over the threshold, that difference between 50% and 17.5% can be significant.

  100. RhapsodyInBlue December 5th, 2013 at 1:12 pm

    I love Robbie but Pedroia 8 years @110 m.

    He is not worth 90 m more than Pedroia.

  101. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:12 pm

    I feel like Cano (and to an extent Jeter) falls into this category. You know he’s a tremendous player, likely one on a Hall of Fame track, but you’re not worried if you get up and go to the bathroom during an at bat, or miss the game entirely, that he’s going to do something you’ll never see again.

    ————————-

    Wait really…?? Last year, Cano’s were the only at-bats I wanted to watch.

  102. Chip December 5th, 2013 at 1:13 pm

    Mike Ri -

    At this point, I believe that Beltran would need to take a 2 year deal worth $14/year with a vesting option for a 3rd year at $15 for it to happen.

  103. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:13 pm

    Mike Ri, you mean at three years with a player 4th year option b/c we finally just had to have Beltran in the twilight of his career? Two years… maybe. Although I predicted long ago that we’d cave and sign Beltran for 3. But first things first, sign Cano.

  104. Howler December 5th, 2013 at 1:13 pm

    One of the things I loved about watching Cano is his long AB fouling off pitch after pitch when you knew at the end he usually was going to end up doing something. It’s also one of the reason Grandy frustrated the hell out of me…he’d get to a 3-2 count and I’d sit at home and say…okay, here comes the SO…and he usually wouldn’t prove me wrong.

  105. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 1:14 pm

    RhapsodyInBlue December 5th, 2013 at 1:09 pm

    jap

    That article is dated May 2012. It also claimed of rumors that the Yankees would be on the market.
    ///

    I’m not sure what that has to do with it?

    And how do we know they were not entertaining selling the team?

    The article also said he doesn’t attend games.

    And finally, why would Bill Madden invent a quote for someone claiming that Hal “hates the players”?

    I am assuming Madden had, you know, an actual source.

  106. UpState December 5th, 2013 at 1:14 pm

    Cano:

    7 for 182….26 per….alot of love there…absolutely, positively no insults with that haul.

    …but the die has already been cast…

    With his peoples’ bloated original ‘request’ – he’s now in a PR position that the Texas contract put A-Rod in.

    He won’t be a favorite throughout baseball.

    Beloved by NYY fans – but a target like young A-Rod was.

    The money makes it worth it, though.

  107. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:14 pm

    oops, should have added a ;) after that first sentence about 3 years and player’s option for 4th year.

  108. pkyankfan69 December 5th, 2013 at 1:15 pm

    CF – Ellsbury
    SS – Jeter
    2B – Cano
    RF – Beltran
    DH – Soriano
    C – McCann
    1B – Tex
    3B – Johnson
    LF – Gardner

    That would be a pretty sick lineup.. Only Johnson sucks but at least he’s got some pop.

  109. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 1:16 pm

    Bronx Jeers December 5th, 2013 at 1:07 pm

    So Hal thinks baseball isn’t a “smart” business. Please…. The smartest business decision he’s ever made was to be born and to not die.
    ///

    He has been very good at staying alive, hasn’t he?

  110. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:16 pm

    Upstate, RE: Cano, Yanks too bloated the Cano contract expectations by signing Ells to such a lucrative and long contract. Just compromise and get it done one way or another.

  111. Tackelberry December 5th, 2013 at 1:17 pm

    I think the Ellsbury signing took the Yanks out of the Beltran sweepstakes. Need to focus on the pitching and Cano

  112. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:17 pm

    Howler, where do you live that you get to see so many Eagles in one place?

  113. Russell Munson December 5th, 2013 at 1:18 pm

    If Pedroia chose to take far below market value when he wasn’t even going to be a free agent for two years it has no bearing on Cano’s value.

    Cano is worth what some team pays him. I hope it’s the Yankees. Pedroia’s contract is irrelevant.

  114. chicken little December 5th, 2013 at 1:18 pm

    Chip — your post on Cano is right on the money. I remember back in 1996, my dad insisted on dragging my mother to a game. My mother is totally disinterested in baseball, but came along (with the entire Sunday NY Times). She sat there and read the paper not picking her head up except for when Darryl Strawberry came to bat (he was on a HR tear then and always was one of the players you didn’t want to leave your seat for). Robinson Cano is a star player because of the numbers he puts up, but is not the type of player that most fans specifically show up to see. On the Yankees now, most fans do not want to leave their seats for are Jeter and A-Rod. The players whose jerseys you see being worn on the street mostly are Jeter, Rivera, etc … Not as much with Cano. is it fair? is it right? Who knows, but that is the case and that is what the Yankees will hang their hats on.

  115. Chip December 5th, 2013 at 1:19 pm

    Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:12 pm

    I feel like Cano (and to an extent Jeter) falls into this category. You know he’s a tremendous player, likely one on a Hall of Fame track, but you’re not worried if you get up and go to the bathroom during an at bat, or miss the game entirely, that he’s going to do something you’ll never see again.

    ————————-

    Wait really…?? Last year, Cano’s were the only at-bats I wanted to watch.
    —————–

    But did you ever find yourself thinking that Cano’s at bats were “must see TV” or feeling that you have to go to a game to watch Cano play?

  116. RhapsodyInBlue December 5th, 2013 at 1:20 pm

    “And finally, why would Bill Madden invent a quote for someone claiming that Hal “hates the players”?”

    Because he has a column to fill, I’m always skeptical of unnamed sources I don’t care who the author is..

    That same column dated May 2012 has the Steinbrenners putting the team up for sale, from the same reputable unnamed source?

  117. Howler December 5th, 2013 at 1:22 pm

    Washington State…when the Salmon runs come in the eagles start to party. I’ve had them fly within 15 feet of me and just park themselves in a tree. I’ve also had some perch in a tree right outside my window at times.

  118. Cashmoney December 5th, 2013 at 1:22 pm

    Straw was a national star, he hit homerun farther than any other human being are capable of, as a fledgling Yankee fan, i used to watch Mets game just to see Starw’s AB.

    Ruthian.

  119. Ys Guy December 5th, 2013 at 1:23 pm

    ok so that writer wrote that the yankees are selling the team and that hal hates long term contracts.

    a year and a half have passed. hal hasnt sold the team and he just signed a huge momey long term deal…

    great source, no surprise he or she wanted to remain anonymnous…

  120. Chip December 5th, 2013 at 1:23 pm

    chicken little December 5th, 2013 at 1:18 pm

    Chip — your post on Cano is right on the money. I remember back in 1996, my dad insisted on dragging my mother to a game. My mother is totally disinterested in baseball, but came along (with the entire Sunday NY Times). She sat there and read the paper not picking her head up except for when Darryl Strawberry came to bat (he was on a HR tear then and always was one of the players you didn’t want to leave your seat for). Robinson Cano is a star player because of the numbers he puts up, but is not the type of player that most fans specifically show up to see. On the Yankees now, most fans do not want to leave their seats for are Jeter and A-Rod. The players whose jerseys you see being worn on the street mostly are Jeter, Rivera, etc … Not as much with Cano. is it fair? is it right? Who knows, but that is the case and that is what the Yankees will hang their hats on.
    ——————-

    Right – Darryl’s another perfect example.

    When Straw was up you had to wait until the at bat was over because he was entirely capable of hitting a ball that made you say “oh good lord I feel bad for that pitcher’s mother.”

    I heard a story that at some point during that 96 season, someone handed Darryl and Cecil an aluminum bat for batting practice before a road game and the two of them were just destroying baseballs

  121. Ys Guy December 5th, 2013 at 1:23 pm

    steins havent sold the team not yankees havent sold the team…

  122. Cashmoney December 5th, 2013 at 1:26 pm

    Cano is not the same lvl as Darryl, I don’t mean statistical wise, it’s in the expectations.

  123. Howler December 5th, 2013 at 1:26 pm

    there are also bears and cougars in some of the places I go, but at this time of year you aren’t going to see as many bears…and a lot of people like to take pictures of the eagles, so the cougars aren’t an issue, but in the summers I like to go into the back woods areas of here and Canada. It sure is a hell of a lot different from where I grew up on LI.

  124. Cashmoney December 5th, 2013 at 1:27 pm

    when i look at Cano, i say to myself, heh he might win a batting title but probably not. that’s about it, that’s my expectation of Cano.

  125. Bronx Jeers December 5th, 2013 at 1:28 pm

    Robbie’s the best 2nd baseman in Yankee history no?

  126. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:28 pm

    “If Pedroia chose to take far below market value when he wasn’t even going to be a free agent for two years it has no bearing on Cano’s value.

    Cano is worth what some team pays him. I hope it’s the Yankees. Pedroia’s contract is irrelevant.”

    Yanks can blame themselves there b/c their policy in spite of most teams extending their best position players was not to do an extension when they could have. They were adamant and proudly stated over and over, our policy is that we don’t do extensions. Big mistake.

  127. RhapsodyInBlue December 5th, 2013 at 1:28 pm

    Howler

    But no Salmon run correct? Only in the spring.

    I’ve been on a few rivers up in Alaska to experience the same.

    I could watch Eagles all day.

  128. Chip December 5th, 2013 at 1:29 pm

    If the Yankees lose Cano because someone offers him 8-10 years at $26 or more per year, then so be it.

    I mentioned it yesterday, fans have complained about a myriad of things that the Yankees have done and not done over the last couple of years and this offseason they have reversed trend on every one of those issues.

    One thing I left out is “Bidding against themselves” We hated it when the Yankees bid against themselves for the privilege of retaining Alex though no one was close to offering him what the Yankees did. They aren’t doing that with Cano. They made a reasonable offer, Cano’s side is holding firm on their demand and there’s a gulf between the two.

    Thus far we’ve heard rumors that the Mariners might come closer to meeting Cano’s financial demands than the Yankees, but we’ve also heard reports that the teams more likely to offer Robinson a chance to make money and win aren’t involved in any negotiations with him.

    If the Mariners do come back with a big offer I would hope Cano gives the Yankees an opportunity to make a counter offer – if he doesn’t, if the Mariners say 8 years $200 and Cano says yes on the spot – then more power to him and I wish him well on his way.

  129. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:30 pm

    Chip, probably different if you live in NY metro and attend multiple games yearly. I feel blessed to have gotten to watch Cano live in his prime years.

  130. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:30 pm

    But did you ever find yourself thinking that Cano’s at bats were “must see TV” or feeling that you have to go to a game to watch Cano play?

    ——————

    Last year he and Mo were literally the only reason I watched… if they hadn’t been playing there would have been nothing worth watching on the field. So I guess my answer is yes. I’m a legit Cano fan and I know I’m not alone. I have a friend that texts me whenever Robbie makes a funny face during a game lol.

    I mean… for me ‘must see tv’ could consist of a lot of weird things that other people don’t really value lol, so maybe I’m not a great baseline. But what the hell were people watching a sub .500 team for last year?

  131. Cashmoney December 5th, 2013 at 1:31 pm

    Robbie’s the best 2nd baseman in Yankee history no?
    —-
    he probably is. if the competition is lazzeri and Gordon…

  132. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:32 pm

    Howler, that sounds amazing.

  133. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 1:33 pm

    Because he has a column to fill, I’m always skeptical of unnamed sources I don’t care who the author is..

    That same column dated May 2012 has the Steinbrenners putting the team up for sale, from the same reputable unnamed source?
    ///

    Great, be skeptical.

    But the idea that Madden made up his source and the quote is way more farfetched than entertaining the possibility Hal Steinbrenner doesn’t like the players.

    Could the source have an agenda? Of course, that is possible. That doesn’t necessarily mean, however, that the observation isn’t accurate.

  134. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:33 pm

    Cano actually came down to the area around where I work so he could play some stick ball outside of the MLB Fan Cave. It was done totally on the down low, but the crowd that ended up gathering was huge. I watch three grown women walk away giggling like school girls after they got a picture with him. It was hysterical.

    And I can’t speak for the younger generation too much, but my cousins are in high school and have come to regard Cano as they do Jeter. They think he’s one of the coolest players on the club. My cousin plays basketball and always picks Cano’s number. It’s that kinda thing for them.

  135. Chip December 5th, 2013 at 1:34 pm

    Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:30 pm

    But did you ever find yourself thinking that Cano’s at bats were “must see TV” or feeling that you have to go to a game to watch Cano play?

    ——————

    Last year he and Mo were literally the only reason I watched… if they hadn’t been playing there would have been nothing worth watching on the field. So I guess my answer is yes. I’m a legit Cano fan and I know I’m not alone. I have a friend that texts me whenever Robbie makes a funny face during a game lol.

    I mean… for me ‘must see tv’ could consist of a lot of weird things that other people don’t really value lol, so maybe I’m not a great baseline. But what the hell were people watching a sub .500 team for last year?
    ——————

    Let me put it this way – if you weren’t a Yankee fan. If you were a Twins fan or Mariners fan, do you think you would look at the schedule and say “Robinson Cano is coming to town, I should get tickets for this game?”

  136. Bronx Jeers December 5th, 2013 at 1:37 pm

    Months ago I thought the Yanks would have jumped on the chance to only give Robbie 8 years/200MM.

  137. kd December 5th, 2013 at 1:37 pm

    gardner and the ghost of ichiro for pablo sandoval

  138. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:37 pm

    I went to about 7-8 games last year.. any bathroom breaks or food runs were made when our bottom half of the order were up. Believe me when I tell you the ladies rooms were chaos when the bottom 3 were up lol. I know that’s not exactly a case for Cano any more than it is an indictment of how bad the team was… but what would have been ‘must see tv’ for the 2013 Yankees other than watching Mo close? Not a lot to choose from. I loved watching Andy and Kuroda start. Pickings were slim, though.

  139. RhapsodyInBlue December 5th, 2013 at 1:37 pm

    jap

    If you want to believe cherry picked comments from an un-named source to support your beliefs who am I to tell you not to?

    Just don’t expect the rest of us to.

  140. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:39 pm

    Let me put it this way – if you weren’t a Yankee fan. If you were a Twins fan or Mariners fan, do you think you would look at the schedule and say “Robinson Cano is coming to town, I should get tickets for this game?”

    —————

    Well I’m not fans of either of those clubs, so I can’t answer that hypothetical. I do know the Yankees always do well on the road in terms of attendance and also know it’s hard to shake out why people are coming out. This year, it was all about seeing Mo. But the Yankees always carry a plethora of stars. Why split hairs over which one is a draw? It’s the collective.

    Yeah, Derek Jeter sells tickets. But Derek Jeter AND Alex Rodriguez sell more tickets. It’s always been that way.

  141. Howler December 5th, 2013 at 1:40 pm

    no the salmon run usually starts about a month ago…and ends middle of January at the place where the eagles congregate…so the eagles go crazy once the salmon have laid their eggs and died off…they just pluck them off the shore and out of the water..at times you’ll see 5 or 6 eagles fighting over one salmon…or one eagle fly in and knock over another for a fish..it’s really cool to watch.

  142. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:40 pm

    And I can’t stress this enough, but I really like Cano… he’s got some serious appeal for a large majority of female baseball fans. Hard to quantify the value of sexy.

  143. UpState December 5th, 2013 at 1:41 pm

    “… Robinson Cano is a star player because of the numbers he puts up, but is not the type of player that most fans specifically show up to see. On the Yankees now, most fans do not want to leave their seats for are Jeter and A-Rod. The players whose jerseys you see being worn on the street mostly are Jeter, Rivera, etc … Not as much with Cano. is it fair? is it right? Who knows…”
    ==========================

    Never, ever will be a Jeter.
    Jeter’s a model that kids want to be like…he won’t have the numbers as good as Cano’s if they hypothetically have the same number of career AB’s….but to compare Cano to Derek – it’s not fair.

    Kids want to be like Derek.
    Parents pray their kid is like Derek.

    Plays the right way.
    Interviews the right way.
    Has always been ‘clutch’ in the right way.

    Cano is no Jeter.

    If Ellsbury plays to his expectation – do not be shocked if he sells more shirts than Cano.

    Hated him as a RS; excited to have him here.

    Hate Pedroia even more; would want him as a NYY even more !

    (little bad-bearded P-I-A)

  144. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:42 pm

    I just don’t understand the point of downplaying Cano’s potential star power. He’s on a team with legends and still gets talked about…. a lot.

    Does that not mean anything…? If we’re measuring it in newspaper ink, I think the only Yankees that got more this year were Mo and Alex.

  145. RhapsodyInBlue December 5th, 2013 at 1:42 pm

    Howler

    Sounds fascinating, you’re very lucky, I wish I was there.

  146. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:43 pm

    If you get to watch Cano live over time, especially over a whole season/many seasons, you become deeply appreciative of his many talents, some perhaps that don’t jump out at you because he is so accomplished, smooth and consistent. He doesn’t have the flash of some, but he has substance. Watching him play D too, stabbing a ball and turning a DP is a thing of beauty, as is that gorgeous lefty swing. You keep your flash (not that I don’t appreciate that and Robi certainly also has power), I’ll keep subtle and underrated Robinson Cano.

  147. AAA December 5th, 2013 at 1:43 pm

    Yeah, Derek Jeter sells tickets. But Derek Jeter AND Alex Rodriguez sell more tickets. It’s always been that way.

    ================================

    Nobody has sold ‘em like Rodriguez has. Yankees never had 3.5 million fans in a season til he got here in 2004. That number climbed to 4M plus, and continued to stay high until they finally went under 3.5M last season. For all the grief he has caused them, he’s made the NYY a ton of money.

  148. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:43 pm

    Parents pray their kid is like Derek.

    ——————-

    I literally go to sleep every night hoping that my phantom sons will have the class to hand out gift baskets after bedding random women. This is what prayer is for, after all.

  149. Doreen December 5th, 2013 at 1:44 pm

    The bit on Hal may have been more true in May of 2012 than it is today. He’s got a bit more experience under his belt.

    Plus, I’ve always felt that particular quote was a little too nasty too believe.

    Would Hal have chosen this path? Probably not. But he also could have chosen to walk away at any point – or handed it over to a sister or to Hank.

    He’s certainly not a dynamic personality, and he truly seems to be feeling his way along at time, but so did George in the beginning. The difference is George’s imprint was to throw caution to the winds, while his son is more conservative.

    I remember George didn’t like the LT at all. But his answer to it was to say, the heck with all of you, I’m spending what I want and I’ll pay your da*n tax. But times were a bit different then. But I would be willing to bet that if an opportunity presented itself to get out of that tax as much as possible, George would have figured something out as well. He may have gone about it differently, or better (or maybe even worse) than Hal. We can’t know.

    The last thing, about Hal not liking the players, well, perhaps he doesn’t like dealing with the players? Which to me is a different thing altogether. And maybe he didn’t like dealing with the because he wasn’t yet comfortable doing so?

    Sometimes people have to grow into a job, and I sincerely hope that Hal is doing so. I don’t’ like everything about how the Yankees operate, because for me it is an emotional investment, not really a financial one. I wish it was one big happy family where everything ran perfectly, where all the decisions were either the right ones or at least worked out well. But it is n’t this way in the world. I suspect if we followed another team as closely, we’d see start to the see imperfections.

    The only hesitation I have is Hal didn’t really show his face all season long, and you do not see him at games (or at least, they don’t’ show him, and perhaps he’s requested that he not be on camera???), and for fans, I think it is important to see the owner of your franchise actually being engaged, even if it is for PR purposes (other than the scheduled press conferences).

    So to sum up, I have mixed feelings about Hal Steinbrenner, but I think it’s only fair to take that Madden thing with a grain of salt, plus to allow that situations and feelings are not stagnant, they can evolve.

  150. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:45 pm

    Nobody has sold ‘em like Rodriguez has. Yankees never had 3.5 million fans in a season til he got here in 2004. That number climbed to 4M plus, and continued to stay high until they finally went under 3.5M last season. For all the grief he has caused them, he’s made the NYY a ton of money.

    —————-

    Absolutely correct.

    Alex is a bigger draw than Jeter probably.

    So let’s put the value of this argument in it’s proper context.

  151. Doreen December 5th, 2013 at 1:45 pm

    Shame, you are so funny!

  152. RhapsodyInBlue December 5th, 2013 at 1:46 pm

    Shame,

    Nothing wrong with it as long as he includes an autographed ball.

    Could you imagine what one of those baskets would sell for on E-Bay?

  153. UpState December 5th, 2013 at 1:47 pm

    Somebody passed up a chance to get a basket ?

  154. blake December 5th, 2013 at 1:47 pm

    “Nobody has sold ‘em like Rodriguez has. Yankees never had 3.5 million fans in a season til he got here in 2004. That number climbed to 4M plus, and continued to stay high until they finally went under 3.5M last season. For all the grief he has caused them, he’s made the NYY a ton of money.”

    that’s why his contract was never as dumb as everyone made out…..no it’s not turned out good but in the fall of 2007 things were a bit different. Alex was a 10 WAR ticket selling machine then…..

  155. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:47 pm

    My cousins were born in the mid to late 90s. They missed most of the dynasty years. The team they know is the 2009 club. Jay Z singing on a float standing next to Cano. That’s the image an entire generation of Yankee fans is all over. There’s a whole group of young fans that really does already believe Cano is a rock star. Granted, those fans don’t have money to spend and are underrepresented in a setting like this, but I know they’re there.

  156. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:48 pm

    Except kids love Cano. And they wear his jersey. So, say want you want, but it isn’t based in reality. As for Jeter, like I said there is only one Derek Jeter, so the comparison is kind of worthless. And beyond Jeter’s personality appeal the team was winning 4WS in 5years at Jeter’s inception. The Yankees were the toast of the town.

  157. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:50 pm

    Shame, yep. If you are in the City or at the games, Robbie’s influence/love fest is clear. Also internationally he is a big draw. Look how crazy the Taiwanese were when he visited there.

  158. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:50 pm

    I think the sale of the team is probably an overblown thing.. I’ll worry about that when I think it’s a real option. Early on when the baby Steins took over, I thought they might but at this point it looks like they’re content to let Randy Levine run the team and still make oodles and oodles of money. Ownership sales are scary.. the devil you know vs. the devil you don’t and all that jazz.

  159. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:50 pm

    Alex sold tickets THIS year. Not just in 2007.

  160. Yankee Trader December 5th, 2013 at 1:51 pm

    Shame
    Keep your sons away from my daughters! :)

    From SB Nation-a suggestion

    Enter Jeff Baker. Baker is just a career .267/.321/.440 hitter with a 96 wRC+ in over 1600 plate appearances. However, he does hit lefties very well; he’s a career .298/.353/.522, 128 wRC+ hitter in 827 plate appearances against southpaws. Last season with the Rangers, Baker demolished lefties to the tune of a 183 wRC+ in over 100 PA’s. And, in the last three years, Baker is a 124 wRC+ hitter against them.

    As an added bonus, Baker provides versatility. In his career, Baker has seen time at the corner outfield spots, first, second, and third base. This doesn’t come without any caveats, however, as he grades out as at least a below-average defender according to the respective advanced defensive metrics. At the same time, Mark Reynolds, who most want the Yankees to re-sign, is a complete disaster at third base and can’t at least fake it in the outfield like Baker can.

  161. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:51 pm

    Could you imagine what one of those baskets would sell for on E-Bay?

    ——————

    That would be amazing!! I always wonder what else might be in there… body wash, perhaps?

    :lol:

  162. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 1:52 pm

    RhapsodyInBlue December 5th, 2013 at 1:37 pm

    jap

    If you want to believe cherry picked comments from an un-named source to support your beliefs who am I to tell you not to?

    Just don’t expect the rest of us to.
    ///

    I don’t have much investment in what you believe, RIB.

    The quote isn’t my invention, but it’s probably yours that the writer made it up.

  163. Howler December 5th, 2013 at 1:52 pm

    Derek’s personal scent…so you can take his memory of him wherever you go…

  164. AAA December 5th, 2013 at 1:52 pm

    Alex sold tickets THIS year. Not just in 2007.

    =======================

    He actually did. Also, YES saw an increase in ratings, albeit not a massive one, when Rodriguez returned.

  165. blake December 5th, 2013 at 1:53 pm

    I’ve heard Billy Butler makes great BBQ….he’d also look great hitting behind Cano

  166. RhapsodyInBlue December 5th, 2013 at 1:53 pm

    Next item..a Jeter booty basket.

  167. blake December 5th, 2013 at 1:53 pm

    “He actually did. Also, YES saw an increase in ratings, albeit not a massive one, when Rodriguez returned.”

    True but this year was more like to watch the train wreck….I think the shock value won’t last there.

  168. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:54 pm

    yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:50 pm

    Shame, yep. If you are in the City or at the games, Robbie’s influence/love fest is clear. Also internationally he is a big draw. Look how crazy the Taiwanese were when he visited there.

    ——————–

    There’s a whole generation of fans that identify Robbie as one of those elusive ‘true Yankees’ we talk so much about. I don’t think people get how much he’s loved by kids. Robbie has a swagger in the way he plays.. he and CC are probably the two most popular Yankees amongst the youngest generation of fans.

  169. chicken little December 5th, 2013 at 1:54 pm

    To me re fan appeal (on a national level, but even also a bit on a local NY level), Cano’s problem is that he never was the guy marketed by the Yankees or MLB as the player to see on the Yankees. It was always Jeter, A-Rod, Mariano but not Cano. this past year, with all the big name Yankee hitters down, Cano was thrust into a spotlight he never was marketed for. Quite frankly, I was stunned that Jay-Z didn’t have Cano pop up all over the place this year to give him bigger exposure.

    If Cano re-signs, he (along with Ellsbury, McCann, and who knows who else) will probably become more of the focal point of Yankee marketing. But until that happens, there is no way to predict his “appeal” level on a national level.

  170. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:54 pm

    Shame, lol. Some role model, eh? ;)

    “Nobody has sold ‘em like Rodriguez has. Yankees never had 3.5 million fans in a season til he got here in 2004″

    Not out of love, more like curiousity, controversy and often a twisted dislike. Guy makes too much money; let’s go boo his ass.

  171. UpState December 5th, 2013 at 1:55 pm

    blake December 5th, 2013 at 1:53 pm
    I’ve heard Billy Butler makes great BBQ….he’d also look great hitting behind Cano
    ===================================

    Really would hate to see Cano go to KC for a few extra dollars.

  172. Yankee Trader December 5th, 2013 at 1:55 pm

    I’m reading that despite the Rakuten Golden Eagles signing of on the 20M posting fee, they still might not post Tanaka. MLB Trade rumours

  173. RhapsodyInBlue December 5th, 2013 at 1:55 pm

    “I don’t have much investment in what you believe, RIB.

    The quote isn’t my invention, but it’s probably yours that the writer made it up.”

    A ham sandwich told Bill Madden that Hal Steinbrenner disliked his players.

  174. Chip December 5th, 2013 at 1:55 pm

    Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:39 pm

    Let me put it this way – if you weren’t a Yankee fan. If you were a Twins fan or Mariners fan, do you think you would look at the schedule and say “Robinson Cano is coming to town, I should get tickets for this game?”

    —————

    Well I’m not fans of either of those clubs, so I can’t answer that hypothetical. I do know the Yankees always do well on the road in terms of attendance and also know it’s hard to shake out why people are coming out. This year, it was all about seeing Mo. But the Yankees always carry a plethora of stars. Why split hairs over which one is a draw? It’s the collective.

    Yeah, Derek Jeter sells tickets. But Derek Jeter AND Alex Rodriguez sell more tickets. It’s always been that way.
    ————————-

    Because you have to split hairs when you’re talking about whether or not a guy is worth the kind of money Cano wants.

    When you give a player a contract like that it’s not about being a great baseball player anymore, it’s about being a guy who puts fans in the stands and drives ratings on television. It’s a business investment. The Yankees gave Alex the contract they did because they thought people were going to turn out in record numbers to watch him break Bonds’ records and become “the clean home run king.”

  175. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 1:55 pm

    Doreen, that’s all very nice, and it’s possible, but it’s quite an epic piece of conjecture.

    I could craft a different storyline where Hal “hates” the players because his father doted on the Yankees, and not on him…. :)

  176. AAA December 5th, 2013 at 1:55 pm

    I’ve heard Billy Butler makes great BBQ….he’d also look great hitting behind Cano

    ==================================

    Wouldn’t shock me if the Royals moved him for pitching and continued to push for Beltran. Don’t think the Yankees have a pitcher good enough to get him though

  177. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 1:55 pm

    blake December 5th, 2013 at 1:53 pm

    “He actually did. Also, YES saw an increase in ratings, albeit not a massive one, when Rodriguez returned.”

    True but this year was more like to watch the train wreck….I think the shock value won’t last there.

    —————–

    Maybe, but the overall point is that you can’t evaluate the total package of signing a player based on something as fickle as fan interest – which has varying motivations/factors.

    Fans like winning. Das it.

    Fans like awesome. Robbie is awesome.

    Fans like Robbie.

  178. Bronx Jeers December 5th, 2013 at 1:56 pm

    “Nobody has sold ‘em like Rodriguez has. Yankees never had 3.5 million fans in a season til he got here in 2004. That number climbed to 4M plus, and continued to stay high until they finally went under 3.5M last season. For all the grief he has caused them, he’s made the NYY a ton of money.”

    —————————————-

    YES network revenues as well. But there was also supposed to be a big-time HR record chase.

  179. blake December 5th, 2013 at 1:57 pm

    “Wouldn’t shock me if the Royals moved him for pitching and continued to push for Beltran. Don’t think the Yankees have a pitcher good enough to get him though”

    Me neither…..I wouldn’t trade Nova for him and I don’t think Phelps and other stuff would be enough.

  180. AAA December 5th, 2013 at 1:57 pm

    When you give a player a contract like that it’s not about being a great baseball player anymore, it’s about being a guy who puts fans in the stands and drives ratings on television.

    ================================

    Doesn’t really explain Ellsbury though, does it?

  181. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 1:58 pm

    chicken, Cano probably needed to sleep in. Too tired to promote himself. Guy rarely gets a DH day and instead needed the rest. Also probably Cano was too “hispanic” to sell earlier, but his English has greatly improved. Still he is a kind of low key easy going guy, so even YES Network rarely goes to him for interviews vs. the more hyper native speaking types.

  182. blake December 5th, 2013 at 1:58 pm

    I’ll continue to say that at the time they were signed…..Arod’s 10/275 made more sense than Ellsbury’s 7/153. Arod was A LOT better player then than Ellsbury is now.

  183. AAA December 5th, 2013 at 1:59 pm

    Me neither…..I wouldn’t trade Nova for him and I don’t think Phelps and other stuff would be enough.

    ==========================

    Doubt the Royals would accept Nova for him. I’m certain Phelps and other stuff wouldn’t be enough.

  184. blake December 5th, 2013 at 2:00 pm

    “Doubt the Royals would accept Nova for him. I’m certain Phelps and other stuff wouldn’t be enough.”

    well it depends on who else was bidding and how motivated they were to move him…..I think that’s fair though as Nova is pretty good….pretty cheap….and still has upside.

    Butler’s market is basically only AL teams and only contenders…..not sure how high teams would go..

  185. Mordot11 December 5th, 2013 at 2:00 pm

    If the Elsbury signing precludes them from Cano, it’s probably a big mistake. He’s definitely an upgrade, but not close to the magnitude of upgrade Cano is compared to any other available second baseman.

  186. Yankee Trader December 5th, 2013 at 2:01 pm

    Jeter schmoozes with opposing teams fans. I was sitting behind fans at a Braves, Yankees WS game when he was talking to Brave fan behind home plate, just to the left of the netting, who told him that he might want to stand a little further away since Mark Wohlers was pitching.

  187. blake December 5th, 2013 at 2:01 pm

    River Ave. Blues ?@RiverAveBlues 4m
    Did you buy an authentic A.J. Burnett jersey? Sorry for your wallet, but break that baby outta the closet. @FeinsandNYDN says McCann gets 34

  188. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 2:02 pm

    Because you have to split hairs when you’re talking about whether or not a guy is worth the kind of money Cano wants.

    When you give a player a contract like that it’s not about being a great baseball player anymore, it’s about being a guy who puts fans in the stands and drives ratings on television. It’s a business investment. The Yankees gave Alex the contract they did because they thought people were going to turn out in record numbers to watch him break Bonds’ records and become “the clean home run king.”

    ———————–

    My stance is simple: If a team goes to 8/180-200 I expect the Yankees to match it.

    If they don’t they are dumb.

    Cano has a lot more value than you’re giving him credit for. He’s like two seasons away from breaking into the top ten Yankees of all time in terms of hits.

    I just don’t think anyone here has proven he doesn’t sell tickets or create fan interest. I’ve spent the last two years talking about his pending FA, so in terms of this fan’s interest, he’s got it.

  189. blake December 5th, 2013 at 2:02 pm

    maybe McCann can clear up his stance on latino players at this presser.

  190. blake December 5th, 2013 at 2:04 pm

    I want the Yankees to sign Cano for the least amount of money they can…..so sure they should be playing hardball…..but ultimately I want them to sign him.

  191. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 2:04 pm

    And when you talk about splitting hairs over what type of draw Cano is, the elephant in the room is Jacoby’s deal.

    I can’t avoid comparing them at this point.. they need to keep Cano.

  192. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 2:06 pm

    blake December 5th, 2013 at 2:04 pm

    I want the Yankees to sign Cano for the least amount of money they can…..so sure they should be playing hardball…..but ultimately I want them to sign him.

    —————-

    Yeah this exactly.. I don’t think anyone is advocating asking him to sign a $250 million deal right now just to get it done. Let the process play out, see what he can get from other clubs, and be willing to match or at least come close.

    This is all I want.

  193. blake December 5th, 2013 at 2:06 pm

    “I can’t avoid comparing them at this point.. they need to keep Cano.”

    I can’t either……folks can say they are unrelated all they want but tell me how Cashman is supposed to look him and his representation in the face without laughing and tell them that they value him at 170 after just giving Ellsbury 153? Cano is their own and he’s a significantly better player than Ellsbury……

  194. Bret The Hitman December 5th, 2013 at 2:09 pm

    Beltran can’t be the next contract because that eliminates Choo and Choo is the backup plan to Cano.

    As long as Boras holds Choo, Cano can’t gain extra leverage.

  195. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 2:10 pm

    Randy Levine = perpetually rosy-faced.

  196. Shame Spencer December 5th, 2013 at 2:10 pm

    :arrow:

  197. slim December 5th, 2013 at 2:10 pm

    Few Tanaka questions if anyone would be kind enough to chime in that may know:

    This is a real mess now, with a new rule that doesn’t seem to be very thought out going into immediate affect.

    With a $20 Million Max and still no penalty to the winning team if you don’t reach a contract, why wouldn’t every single team bid $20 million if you want him or not?
    If for no other reason you could block him from coming to the MLB for a year that way.

    In the past whoever won the posting had sole negoiating rights so contract terms were no discussed in advance. I see no where that this aspect has changed, so the player picks a team basically and then starts contract negoitations right? And then if doesn’t reach contract with said team goes back to Japan.
    I see posts saying he would be a free agent but unless above has changed, he really wouldn’t and would have to blindly select a team to talk numbers to.

    Lastly, why would his current team even post him this year. If $20 mil is the max he would still command $20 mil next year barring major injury. He is a free agent in 2 years.
    So why wouldn’t his team keep him for one more year, post him next year to get the $20 mil before he reaches free agency and can leave without compensation.
    Makes really no sense for them not to use him and use him hard next year to try and repeat and then post in 12 months since the payout is the same.
    In the old system after his amazing year and his one year less old makes him more valuable, this new system he is worth $20 mil now or in the 12 months.

  198. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 2:10 pm

    For whomever asked, presser is being streamed on yankees.com

    blake, maybe McCann can say a few words in Spanish for the Spanish media to show he is a good sport. ;)

  199. yankeefeminista December 5th, 2013 at 2:11 pm

    Heeeeeres, Cash!

  200. J. Alfred Prufrock December 5th, 2013 at 2:11 pm

    chicken little December 5th, 2013 at 1:54 pm

    To me re fan appeal (on a national level, but even also a bit on a local NY level), Cano’s problem is that he never was the guy marketed by the Yankees or MLB as the player to see on the Yankees. It was always Jeter, A-Rod, Mariano but not Cano. this past year, with all the big name Yankee hitters down, Cano was thrust into a spotlight he never was marketed for. Quite frankly, I was stunned that Jay-Z didn’t have Cano pop up all over the place this year to give him bigger exposure.
    ///

    Well this is a very good point, I would say, but it also is media-driven.

    Cano is often passed over for other players by reporters in the clubhouse.

    He himself expressed consternation over it: he said he’d stand at his locker waiting patiently to be interviewed (after, I would imagine, he had clearly been a key contributor in a game just played) and he said “Nobody wants to talk to me.”

    Cano’s first language is not english, although he has really improved in that regard. Even though he attended high school in Newark, I’m sure his family and cousins (he had lots of relatives who also lived there, apparently) and his friends all spoke in Spanish.

    Cano tries to give the boilerplate type quote, but sometimes there is a language disconnect and he doesn’t advance the interview because of it; I think that may be why he gets passed over, and also because reporters have their “go-to” guys and that’s who they go to, on deadline.

    If there were more bilingual reporters, Cano would have a greater public profile, which makes sense because, as Randy pointed out by linking Arangure’s piece, the game is now crawling with talented, highly identifiable Latino players, and if you go to the Bronx, there is Latino representation in the stands at every game.

    What hasn’t adjusted is who covers the game and speaks for it.

    Cano himself

  201. 86w183 December 5th, 2013 at 2:12 pm

    There are so many factors that go into what contract someone gets and it’s pointless to play the comparison game. Cano will get as much as he can get from whomever he elects to sign with, period. Ellsbury’s contract is irrelevant. McCann’s contract is irrelevant. A-rod’s contract is irrelevant. the fact that Mike Trout will only make $ 600 K this year is irrelevant.

  202. slim December 5th, 2013 at 2:21 pm

    “There are so many factors that go into what contract someone gets and it’s pointless to play the comparison game. Cano will get as much as he can get from whomever he elects to sign with, period. Ellsbury’s contract is irrelevant. McCann’s contract is irrelevant. A-rod’s contract is irrelevant. the fact that Mike Trout will only make $ 600 K this year is irrelevant.”

    Yes and no.
    Yes with Trout or with any extension but the current crop of FA surely sets the market and prices adjust to current market conditions.
    Such like real estate the agents for these ballplayers and GM’s use comparables all of the time.

  203. 86w183 December 5th, 2013 at 2:43 pm

    slim —-

    That’s true, but I don’t agree that you can compare a 2B with a RF, a SS to a DH or a Catcher to a CF.

    The Yanks made Ellsbury one of the highest paid CF in history…. by all indications they’ve offered Cano significantly more $$$ and would make him the highest paid 2B ever. How his contract compares to Ellsbury’s is meaningless as far as I’m concerned.

    It must be nice to consider $ 17 M a laughable amount of money.

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