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A New York Yankees blog by Chad Jennings and the staff of The Journal News


Five dates to keep in mind

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Jan 06, 2014 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Wednesday
Hall of Fame election results
Get ready for overwhelming Hall of Fame drama. Voters are only allowed to vote for 10 players, and this year’s ballot has well over 10 guys who are at least worth strong consideration. There’s a chance some viable candidates might not get enough votes to even stay on the ballot. Going to be extremely interesting.

January 15
Horowitz’s time is up
The window for Alex Rodriguez and Major League Baseball to file their final appeal hearing briefs was set to end on December 21, opening a 25-day window for Fredric Horowitz to make his decision. That puts the deadline at January 15 (or sometime around there, anyway, just in case I’m missing something). It’s been a strange process with a lot of waiting, but a decision should come soon.

January 17
Arbitration figures exchanged
Chances are, this deadline won’t mean much for the Yankees. They tend to avoid arbitration with most of their eligible players, but they do have a few key players involved. Brett Gardner, Dave Robertson, Ivan Nova, Francisco Cervelli and Shawn Kelley are each arbitration eligible. I doubt anyone involves wants to actually get to an arbitration hearing.

January 24
Masahiro Tanaka deadline
Clarity might come well before this date, but the 24th is the end of the 30-day negotiation window for Tanaka to work out a contract with a Major League team. It’s basically a one-man free agent market taking place in a defined period of time.

February 14
Pitchers and catchers
Yankees spring training opens on Valentine’s Day, with the first workout coming on February 15. That’s less than a month and a half away.

Comments

comments

 

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100 Responses to “Five dates to keep in mind”

  1. Ted Nelson January 6th, 2014 at 3:04 pm

    “If Zips are most likely scenario, you don’t think the Yankees need to add another good starter?”

    I don’t think that they *need* to, no. Certainly I think that it would benefit them to add a SP option who is better than what they have. I actually expect that they will do that. I think that they’ll sign Tanaka and I think that it will work out for them. My opinion on what they’ll do is not really what I’ve been discussing for the most part, though.

    Where this all started was just whether they have improved from 2013 in net terms. To do that I don’t think that they need to add another SP. I think they’ve already done that. This is what most of my arguments have been about. Do I think that they’ve a playoff team right now? I don’t know, but I do think that they’re right in the mix. I think that the Red Sox will be worse than last season, so I think that the AL East is more wide-open than most people probably do.

    Another thing I am just pointing out is that if they sign Santana/Jimenez/Garza it may just lead to having a rotation spot and $15+ million for 4, 5, 6 years locked up in below average performance like with Burnett/Pavano/Wright/Vazquez. Oliver’s projections actually have Jimenez as high as a 4.4 ERA for 2014, so while those guys are better bets than the current options they may not be better enough to justify locking up all that money, a long-term rotation spot, and in some cases a relatively high draft pick. At some point it’s better to go with fairly promising options and leave your options open for a trade or future FA acquisition than to overpay for a mediocre SP you don’t really want.

  2. mick January 6th, 2014 at 3:08 pm

    Full Squad 2/19.

  3. Wave Your Hat January 6th, 2014 at 3:11 pm

    “What are we talking about anymore?”

    A very long, pointless debate over 2 fWAR.

  4. blake January 6th, 2014 at 3:21 pm

    “What are we talking about anymore?”

    A very long, pointless debate over 2 fWAR.”

    Yes…that was it. I surrender

  5. bigdan22 January 6th, 2014 at 3:22 pm

    Re-post

    bigdan22 January 6th, 2014 at 3:20 pm
    blake January 6th, 2014 at 3:07 pm

    “If Tanakas fastball command and split at as good as advertised then he just needs an big league average breaking ball iMO to be really good…..if he came make it plus then he could be a 1.”

    ______

    Blake, look at that article I posted. And look at other scouting reports. Tanaka already has a plus slider to go with a plus split. The article indicates his four-seamer may have the best movement in the game. That’s 3 plus pitches. For most folks, that’s a No. 1.

  6. blake January 6th, 2014 at 3:23 pm

    Bigdan,
    Thanks for the link

  7. Hankflorida January 6th, 2014 at 3:24 pm

    Again, you don’t seem to understand what we are talking about. ZIPs are not the best case scenario. They are the most likely case scenario. At this point I am really begging of you that you understand what you’re arguing about. It’s really frustrating.

    Ted, I do not think that anyone is not understanding that ZIPS are the most likely scenario based on statistics. How many times have we heard from the sports announcers that when a player starts out hitting way below his average, that things will even out for him and he will find his level. Who can dispute that “things are what they are not what they seem,” but what things could be if there is that certain chemistry are in the realm of reaching towards what you call the best case scenario; this is what you must understand when people on this blog tend to argue with each other, it is about the endless possibilities within the uncertaintity of tomorrow.

  8. kd January 6th, 2014 at 3:30 pm

    arod news after HOF announcement is a good thing for baseball, bad for the yankees.

  9. bigdan22 January 6th, 2014 at 3:32 pm

    Some may differ, but I think if the Yanks miss on Tanaka, I’d like the them to pass on Garza, Santana and Jimenez. I think they’d all be too expensive for the value provided. And as it has been pointed out, when you give big money to a pitcher like that, you can’t stick him on the bench. You have to pitch him and that could mean years of expensive below average performance from one spot in the rotation while simultaneously blocking a pitcher like Nuno or Phelps from emerging.

    If they miss on Tanaka, perhaps a flier on a cheap alternative. I wanted Colon or Hudson earlier this year. Maybe there someone like that still out there.

  10. GregD January 6th, 2014 at 3:34 pm

    On Saturday, thanks to the deep freeze, my pipes burst in the basement. Fortunately, I heard water running and was able to shut off the water main before any damage took place. However, I wasn’t able to get a plumber until today to come and fix the problem. So I have been living without water for more than two days………no fun…………….

  11. luis January 6th, 2014 at 3:37 pm

    Johan Santana would fill the profile BigDan…. I agree that any of those pitchers would be too expensive in relation to the production they would give…We have enough pieces capable of producing those numbers at a fraction of the cost of those guys… But they better not miss on Tanaka

  12. blake January 6th, 2014 at 3:38 pm

    Some may differ, but I think if the Yanks miss on Tanaka, I’d like the them to pass on Garza, Santana and Jimenez. ”

    I think I depends….if the Arod suspension is upheld and they can still get under 189 then I think you could make an argument for just passing on everyone else if they miss out on tanaka…..but if it’s blown already then go ahead and add a pitcher and go for it.

    Bottom line…..sign Tanaka

  13. blake January 6th, 2014 at 3:38 pm

    I’m for Tanaka and a minor league flyer on the Johan

  14. bigdan22 January 6th, 2014 at 3:44 pm

    luis January 6th, 2014 at 3:37 pm

    Johan Santana would fill the profile BigDan…. I agree that any of those pitchers would be too expensive in relation to the production they would give…We have enough pieces capable of producing those numbers at a fraction of the cost of those guys… But they better not miss on Tanaka

    ______

    Well he is left-handed :) I have an irrational affection for left-handers Luis. I’ve always been intrigued by Liriano. Even when he sucked I liked his change-up. A lefty can go far with fastball command and a good change-up.

  15. RadioKev January 6th, 2014 at 3:52 pm

    I think it’s worth noting again that the video is from 2009.

  16. joeman January 6th, 2014 at 3:57 pm

    there’s a need to bring a closer just to cover DRob ….he has little experience and to do on the job training is taking a big chance

  17. astrocityfan January 6th, 2014 at 3:57 pm

    I’m looking forward to the hof annoucements. Should be a big class. I want to state again for the record that all ballots should be made public and anyone not voting for greg maddux should have their privilages revoked.

  18. blake January 6th, 2014 at 4:00 pm

    Sounds like the expectation is that Maddux, Glavine, Thomas , and Biggio will get in…..

  19. joeman January 6th, 2014 at 4:02 pm

    HOF…Looking at four to get in Maddux..Bags..Thomas..Piazza

  20. blake January 6th, 2014 at 4:03 pm

    Piazza won’t get in….

  21. blake January 6th, 2014 at 4:06 pm

    I think Mussina was a better pitcher than Glavine…..Tom was really good but as a braves fan he REALLY benefitted from pre-quest tech umpiring ….some days he literally expanded the zone to 4 or 5 inches off the outside corner.

  22. Wave Your Hat January 6th, 2014 at 4:07 pm

    Soon the morality police will have fixed it so a team composed of players excluded from the HOF would beat a team of players in the HOF…

  23. blake January 6th, 2014 at 4:09 pm

    Wave Your Hat says:
    January 6, 2014 at 4:07 pm
    Soon the morality police will have fixed it so a team composed of players excluded from the HOF would beat a team of players in the HOF…

    Bonds, piazza, Clemens, Mac, Sosa, Arod, Palmero…..that’s a pretty good start to a club.

  24. joeman January 6th, 2014 at 4:11 pm

    Piazza beat Carter in every stat…explain to me why not

  25. blake January 6th, 2014 at 4:11 pm

    joeman says:
    January 6, 2014 at 4:11 pm
    Piazza beat Carter in every stat…explain to me why not

    Cause people think he took steroids…..he should have been first ballot

  26. blake January 6th, 2014 at 4:12 pm

    Only reason piazza didn’t get in last year was because some writers suspect he used….I doubt enough change their mind this year for him to get in

  27. joeman January 6th, 2014 at 4:12 pm

    blake January 6th, 2014 at 4:11 pm
    joeman says:
    January 6, 2014 at 4:11 pm
    Piazza beat Carter in every stat…explain to me why not

    Cause people think he took steroids…..he should have been first ballot
    ———————————
    has to get in

  28. tomingeorgia January 6th, 2014 at 4:14 pm

    blake,
    Mark McGwire wouldn’t be a bad addition, either.

  29. Cashmoney January 6th, 2014 at 4:16 pm

    Piazza said he took androstenedione and Ephedra before the substances landed on MLB’s banned list. He also said he took the anti-inflammatory drug Vioxx, stimulants commonly known as “greenies,” and the asthma med Dymetadrine, according to the New York Post. Piazza wrote of a time when he asked former Mets trainer Fred Hina about human growth hormone, not knowing it was banned substance, the New York Times reported.

  30. raymagnetic January 6th, 2014 at 4:16 pm

    “Against All Odds says:
    January 6, 2014 at 2:19 pm
    moving a SP to the pen is not the kiss of death

    —————–

    It is with this franchise.”

    Nova says high.

    In fact the only pitcher who was “ruined” by being put in the pen is Joba and if you ask me he ruined himself.

    Why hasn’t a Phelps been ruined yet when he’s been bounced around more times than a basketball.

    Some people gots the gots and some don’t.

    Joba was ruined because he’s just not that good. Same with Phil Hughes.

    If you people seriously think the a Yankees purposely ruin these pitchers cause of some bizarre desire to shore up their pen then you’re crazier than a bag of angel dust.

  31. Cashmoney January 6th, 2014 at 4:17 pm

    Bill Price of the New York Daily News wrote in a column Monday: “How did a guy who every team in baseball but the Dodgers passed on become the greatest hitting catcher of all time? Did all those teams miss something, or did Piazza have help? It’s a legitimate question, no matter what you believe.”

  32. Wave Your Hat January 6th, 2014 at 4:18 pm

    “Did all those teams miss something, or did Piazza have help? It’s a legitimate question, no matter what you believe.””

    Oh, he was better than we thought so it must be his fault…

  33. Wave Your Hat January 6th, 2014 at 4:20 pm

    blake-

    Don’t forget Rose, he was a pretty decent player too…

  34. tomingeorgia January 6th, 2014 at 4:25 pm

    Shoeless Joe.

  35. Cashmoney January 6th, 2014 at 4:30 pm

    Roy Hobbs.

  36. austinmac January 6th, 2014 at 4:34 pm

    I hate the suspicion equalling guilt on PEDs. Where is the evidence of Bagwell, Piazza etc.?

    Someone suggested the other day they should have a removal from the Hall option if certain criteria are met. That should remove the fears of later proof of cheating.

  37. Against All Odds January 6th, 2014 at 4:38 pm

    If you people seriously think the a Yankees purposely ruin these pitchers cause of some bizarre desire to shore up their pen then you’re crazier than a bag of angel dust.

    ———————————–

    Not purposely but I don’t think they have a good grasp on young starting pitchers. I rather them not experiment with their young flame throwers and let them pitch. A number of Joba’s problems are his own in terms of weight and even his attitude but the side show that were the Joba rules was a joke.

    Phelps hasn’t been ruined but he has been injured.

  38. tomingeorgia January 6th, 2014 at 4:42 pm

    austin,
    Who would be the judge? Jeez, what a can of worms that would open. Rose is in my Hall. So are Clemens, Bonds, Sosa and McGwire, as well as Palmiero., great ballplayers, even unamped.

  39. vrsce January 6th, 2014 at 4:43 pm

    Roger threw the broken bat at Piazza in a fit of roid rage over which of them had the best “substance” connection.

  40. Cashmoney January 6th, 2014 at 4:46 pm

    Who would be the judge?
    —–
    BBWAA, in action and in reality.

  41. tomingeorgia January 6th, 2014 at 4:51 pm

    Any members of the baseball writers’ guild going to vote out Cobb for perceived sins?

  42. Jerkface January 6th, 2014 at 4:54 pm

    Nova says high.

    In fact the only pitcher who was “ruined” by being put in the pen is Joba and if you ask me he ruined himself.

    Why hasn’t a Phelps been ruined yet when he’s been bounced around more times than a basketball.

    Please explain how Nova was moved to the pen, tia. The way the Yankees have moved pitchers to the pen has not worked out. Phelps has been injured and has now thrown 100 IP or less for the last 3 seasons.

    Nova pitched in a double header out of the pen his first time being called up, but otherwise pitched 180 innings that year across the minors and majors. Joba pitched less than 100 IP, then was moved to the pen, then they tried to limit his innings with time in the pen.

    Hughes was arguably injured because of his pen stint -> full time starter.

    I’d like the Yankees to try just having their pitchers throw a lot of innings, then bring them to the big leagues to also throw lots of innings. In YE OLDEN TYMES of baseball most of the guys who started in the pen had thrown like 150-180 innings in the minors right prior to it.

  43. raymagnetic January 6th, 2014 at 4:55 pm

    The Joba Rules happened once. The only young flamethrower they’ve had was Chamberlain.

    Hughes was never a flamethrower and pitching out of the pen was the best thing that ever happened to him.

    So they’ve “ruined” one pitcher who really ruined himself.

    Pitchers get hurt all the time so there’s no way of knowing how or what caused Phelps injury last year.

    I just don’t see this fundamental neglect on the Yankees part.

  44. Hankflorida January 6th, 2014 at 4:57 pm

    Bigdan, I have also been intrigued by Lefthanded pitchers on the Yankees, and especially in the old Stadium, Lefty Gomez and Whitey Ford proved their worth keeping the balls away from the right field porch. That is why I feel that CC can become a Pettitte like pitcher and still win. I would like to see what Nuno has in his arsenal, and if not, Santana could have some mileage left for the price and the cap.

  45. raymagnetic January 6th, 2014 at 5:03 pm

    Jerkface,

    Prove to me that Hughes time in the pen caused his injury.

    Prove that it caused Phelps injury.

    “Please explain how Nova was moved to the pen, tia.” http://m.nydailynews.com/1.1354425

    I’m not arguing about how any innings they throw. It’s been said that the Yankees have ruined pitchers by making them pitch out of the pen. That’s what I was responding to.

  46. Chip January 6th, 2014 at 5:04 pm

    I still don’t believe that Alex Rodriguez will ever suit up for the Yankees again.

    I think that once his suspension is over, however many games that may be, he will be released. The only reason the Yankees haven’t done so already is because if they release him now they owe him all the money, if they release him after his suspension ends, then they don’t have to pay him for the games he’s suspended.

    I realize that Alex may still be a better player, when healthy, than Kelly Johnson at 3b, but he’s not such a great player that the team needs the headaches that come from having him around. Especially not after he has entered a lawsuit against the team’s doctor and has accused the team of conspiring against him in a very public way. Consider that part of the reason YES decided against re-signing the Francessa show was the fact that he gave Alex a forum and I think that’s all you need to know about the level of animosity between these two parties.

  47. Chip January 6th, 2014 at 5:05 pm

    Jerkface,

    Hughes was injury prone throughout his minor league time before the Yankees even considered moving him to the pen.

  48. Chip January 6th, 2014 at 5:06 pm

    Joba also had a significant injury history coming out of the draft which was one reason he slid into the supplemental round.

  49. Jerkface January 6th, 2014 at 5:06 pm

    All we know is that Hughes pitched in the pen, pitched a full year, then got injured. Since we cannot know if he would have been injured had he started in 2009 we cannot rule out that the lack of innings Hughes got resulted in his shoulder injury.

    I don’t think there is any 1 way to develop a pitcher, but the Yankees clearly have had the wrong approach.

  50. Jerkface January 6th, 2014 at 5:08 pm

    Nova pitched 3 games in the bullpen, so not really a good example.

  51. Jerkface January 6th, 2014 at 5:12 pm

    Pitching in the bullpen and getting innings are directly related. You need starters able to throw 180-200 innings in the majors and one way to ensure that isn’t possible is by throwing guys who already don’t have a lot of innings into the pen. Which is what happened with Joba, Hughes, Noesi, and Phelps.

  52. tomingeorgia January 6th, 2014 at 5:13 pm

    The temperature here has dropped from 58 at sunrise to 31 at sunset. Record cold for the date is 15, calling for 9 tonight, with 30 mph winds. Bless you Northern folks for sending this stuff our way. Wish you all well the next couple of days.

  53. Yankee Trader January 6th, 2014 at 5:19 pm

    “I think that once his suspension is over, however many games that may be, he will be released. The only reason the Yankees haven’t done so already is because if they release him now they owe him all the money, if they release him after his suspension ends, then they don’t have to pay him for the games he’s suspended.”

    Chip- I think it’s more likely that the Yankees aren’t going to pay him the enormous amount of money left on his contract to have him sit at home or on ESPN as an announcer. I think it’s more likely that he suits up again and spends time on the DL with further flare up of his hip/hips and subsequently has hip replacement or resurfacing surgery and then sits at home collecting a paycheck from the Yankees thru the end of his contract. Hopefully the Yankees will still have insurance to cover some of that contract.

  54. yankeefeminista January 6th, 2014 at 5:19 pm

    Chip, Hughes was not injury prone in the minors. He only got hurt in the majors.

  55. RhapsodyInBlue January 6th, 2014 at 5:20 pm

    Tom

    Here in NY state the governor’s office is shutting down part of the Thruway south of Buffalo this evening because of the extraordinary winter weather event that is forecast to include 36 inches of snow in the coming day and a half, lake-effect snows in some areas up to four inches per hour, wind gusts up to 40 mph and wind chill temperatures as low as 40 degrees below zero.

  56. Against All Odds January 6th, 2014 at 5:21 pm

    raymagnetic January 6th, 2014 at 4:55 pm
    The Joba Rules happened once. The only young flamethrower they’ve had was Chamberlain.

    Hughes was never a flamethrower and pitching out of the pen was the best thing that ever happened to him.

    So they’ve “ruined” one pitcher who really ruined himself.

    Pitchers get hurt all the time so there’s no way of knowing how or what caused Phelps injury last year.

    I just don’t see this fundamental neglect on the Yankees part.

    ——————————–

    Pitching ou tof the pen for Hughes turned him into a cutter happy pitcher who ran out of steam following the yr after he threw in the pen.

    Whether it’s neglect or not I would rather they not willing throw their pitchers out of the pen. It’s better to avoid the chaos.

  57. raymagnetic January 6th, 2014 at 5:21 pm

    Ok so there’s a limit to how much a pitcher can pitch out of the pen before they get injured? Alrighty then.

    Just cause you can’t rule something out doesn’t make it proof. C’mon now.

    Pitchers get hurt all the time.

  58. Against All Odds January 6th, 2014 at 5:23 pm

    Chip January 6th, 2014 at 5:06 pm
    Joba also had a significant injury history coming out of the draft which was one reason he slid into the supplemental round.

    ———————–

    He had issues coming out of college which is weird why they decided to play yo yo with their favorite new toy.

  59. Yankee Trader January 6th, 2014 at 5:24 pm

    Tom
    I’m further south than you and it’s 17 with a wind chill factor bringing it down to +1 degrees with a low expected tonight of 7 if no wind.

  60. yankeefeminista January 6th, 2014 at 5:26 pm

    Odds, that cutter was frightful and a frightfully bad idea.

    And Hughes was another Yanks pitching prospect limited by the Yanks minor league philosophy of 80 pitches or 5 innings, whichever came first. They did the same in Trenton with Betances and Banuelos… :roll:

  61. tomingeorgia January 6th, 2014 at 5:27 pm

    RIB,
    Stepdaughter went to school at RIT in Rochester, glad I’m not there tonight. I believe she’s on vacation in Hawaii this week. Good decision.

  62. vrsce January 6th, 2014 at 5:28 pm

    It is useful to consider that ARod is such a controversial figure and burden to the Yankees, not because of his PED use ,which is on par with many others,but because of his monstrous contract. A contract which Hank, while negotiating solely against himself, signed.

    Hank is the real author of this mess,; I have never seen him called to account on this.

  63. Ys Guy January 6th, 2014 at 5:29 pm

    the idea that you can pin an injury to working a pitcher out of the bp or the rotation is BS.

    nobody can prove this, you’re just saying it happened to bolster your argument. i have seen no proof.

    plenty of pitchers (in fact almost all) who have never pitched out of the bullpen have been injured, yet you don’t argue that all those inning and long stints of work caused them to be injured.

    its unprovable bs.

  64. yankeefeminista January 6th, 2014 at 5:29 pm

    It was 55 degrees here in NJ at one point early this morning; it’s now 26 with the wind chill, and by midnight it is supposed to feel like -1. Crazy stuff.

  65. yankeefeminista January 6th, 2014 at 5:30 pm

    Hank gets all the blame, but Hal was the one who signed off on Alex’s contract.

  66. Ys Guy January 6th, 2014 at 5:32 pm

    “Hank is the real author of this mess,; I have never seen him called to account on this.”
    ——————————————-
    he’s probably getting loaded at the vip club at hialeah, you can probably just go there and “call him to account” yourself…

  67. yankeefeminista January 6th, 2014 at 5:32 pm

    Rays pitchers all pitch out of the pen, but they get their 500 innings before coming up. Yanks have babied their pitchers arms to an extreme both in the minors and majors.

  68. tomingeorgia January 6th, 2014 at 5:33 pm

    Your gas company thanks you all. Winter sucks.

  69. Yankee Trader January 6th, 2014 at 5:33 pm

    Fargo North Dakota at -32 colder than the South Pole!

  70. Jerkface January 6th, 2014 at 5:34 pm

    You can’t prove that pitchers were not messed up by pitching out of the pen though, and for the Yankees it clearly hasn’t worked. And the way that they have done it has shown CLEAR drawbacks related to their pitchers getting innings.

    Yea pitchers all over baseball get hurt all the time, thats part of the game with pitching, but you can’t just look at it fatalistically and say ‘we can do whatever we want with these guys because they’ll just get hurt eventually anyways’. Teams are still trying to figure out ways to stave off injury.

  71. vrsce January 6th, 2014 at 5:35 pm

    Ys Guy January 6th, 2014 at 5:32 pm
    “Hank is the real author of this mess,; I have never seen him called to account on this.”
    ——————————————-
    he’s probably getting loaded at the vip club at hialeah, you can probably just go there and “call him to account” yourself…
    ——————————————-
    Good idea, I could easily be admitted, whereas you would be parking my car.

  72. RhapsodyInBlue January 6th, 2014 at 5:35 pm

    Tom

    Freezing rain last night everything was ice covered then overnight the temp rose above freezing to 50 by 9 am this morning. Tonight back down close to zero.

    Fortunately the warm weather took all the ice and snow off the trees my roof and my driveway.

    This is going to be a wild winter I think.

  73. Ys Guy January 6th, 2014 at 5:35 pm

    i was outside in barre, vt one time when it was -30. (not the wind chill, the actual temp.)

  74. Ted Nelson January 6th, 2014 at 5:36 pm

    “Ted, I do not think that anyone is not understanding that ZIPS are the most likely scenario based on statistics.”

    Blake sure seemed to imply it. He told me to stop using ZIPs and then he talked about me projecting things out to the best case scenario. I was not projecting anything to the best case. I was citing ZIPs.

    “You morphed the discussion into something it wasn’t intended to be…..what’s are you talking about? I don’t disagree with what ZiPs is….I disagree with the reliability of it in some cAses”

    I didn’t morph the conversation into anything. I responded directly to your comments. You made a couple of comments that demonstrated a lack of understanding for what ZIPs is. It’s not a guess at anything. Then you said: “if you project everything out as best case scenario then it might make you feel better but chances are you will be disappointed.” ZIPs is not projecting anything out to the best case scenario.

    Can you please stop trying to prove that you are right about everything and just discuss things without assuming you already know everything in the world?

  75. Jerkface January 6th, 2014 at 5:36 pm

    Basically the Yankees have sucked at developing pitching, so I would like for them to try something new, like perhaps letting their good pitchers throw a lot of innings the season before they come to the majors, and then when in the majors let them start and do not jerk them around.

  76. Jerkface January 6th, 2014 at 5:38 pm

    Rays pitchers all pitch out of the pen, but they get their 500 innings before coming up.

    Not all, and not like the Yankees have had their guys pitch out of the pen. Rays pitchers sometimes come up at the end of a season and throw some relief innings + a start or two but its on the tail end of a full minor league season. They don’t really throw them to the pen like Noesi, Joba, and Hughes were

  77. luis January 6th, 2014 at 5:39 pm

    Good evening guys,

    Bigdan,

    I like lefties too ;) …I just mentioned Johan Santana for that very reason and the fact that he would only take a very cheap and short term contract…But only if they miss on Tanaka…If they manage to get him, the 5th spot should be used for the internal options

  78. yankeefeminista January 6th, 2014 at 5:39 pm

    I was outside walking around in Moscow, Russia once and it was so cold that as my eyes teared, the tears would freeze on my face.

  79. Cashmoney January 6th, 2014 at 5:41 pm

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F30t-weDqko

    “The light that burns twice as bright burns half as long”

  80. Against All Odds January 6th, 2014 at 5:41 pm

    yankeefeminista January 6th, 2014 at 5:26 pm
    Odds, that cutter was frightful and a frightfully bad idea.

    And Hughes was another Yanks pitching prospect limited by the Yanks minor league philosophy of 80 pitches or 5 innings, whichever came first. They did the same in Trenton with Betances and Banuelos… :roll:

    ————————-

    The cutter fiasco was ridiculous. I think blake said it best about the cutter being a detriment to so many young pitchers. I think it has to the Rivera effect. Ppl have to understand just because he throws it doesn’t mean everyone should.

    I remember Francesa and Russo joking about how the Yankees were making another Jaret Wright smh.

  81. yankeefeminista January 6th, 2014 at 5:41 pm

    Does anyone not like lefties? And I think it is more rational than irrational…

  82. yankeefeminista January 6th, 2014 at 5:42 pm

    …especially as a Yankee fan because of our home park…

  83. Deal With It January 6th, 2014 at 5:42 pm

    Chip:

    Interesting perspective, I would like to see that play out. K. Johnson can give 25 & 80 given the AB’s which will be fine with decent D

    ============

    ‘Consider that part of the reason YES decided against re-signing the Francesa show was the fact that he gave Alex a forum and I think that’s all you need to know about the level of animosity between these two parties.’

    ————-

    Wasn’t aware of the Francesa (Fatscesa) / YES thing, curious where did you snag that info ?

  84. tomingeorgia January 6th, 2014 at 5:42 pm

    More nerdly, unhumorous comments, lots of noise signifying nothing, in way too many words.

    This weather sucks.

  85. Deal With It January 6th, 2014 at 5:44 pm

    Ys Guy:

    Arod pool = 162 games please

  86. yankeefeminista January 6th, 2014 at 5:46 pm

    tom, do you mean more matter with less art? Or too little art to matter?

  87. BoJo January 6th, 2014 at 5:46 pm

    Wave Your Hat says:
    January 6, 2014 at 4:07 pm
    Soon the morality police will have fixed it so a team composed of players excluded from the HOF would beat a team of players in the HOF…
    —————
    All HOF Banned Team (Players unlikely to get voted into HOF IMO)

    C–Ivan Rodriguez, Mike Piazza
    1B–Rafael Palmeiro
    2B–Pete Rose
    SS–Miguel Tejada
    3B–Alex Rodriguez
    LF–Barry Bonds
    CF–Joe Jackson
    RF–Sammy Sosa
    DH–Mark MacGwire
    SP–Roger Clemens
    SP–Bartolo Colon
    SP–Andy Pettitte?
    SP–Eddie cicotte
    SP–Lefty Williams
    RP–Eric Gagne
    RP–Ugueth Urbina
    Bench–Manny Ramirez, Jeff Bagwell, Jason Giambi

    Pretty good team indeed

  88. yankeefeminista January 6th, 2014 at 5:48 pm

    JF, yep, end of season for Rays, after they get their necessary innings. Like Price closing in 2008, with the understanding that he would go to the SP in 2009… ditto most of the others, and that was my point; most of them had the innings under them.

  89. luis January 6th, 2014 at 5:49 pm

    The only pitcher that they have been successful is Nova…The only reason for that is that he went his way under the radar, so he built his innings in the minors…Also, he was never used extensively in the BP…JF hits in the head, it is one thing to put a SP in the pen at the end of the season and finish his innings buildup and another to give a full time BP job to an SP like they did with Joba, Phelps, Noesi and Hughes…This way they can’t build their innings workload and when they are needed to fill a spot in the rotation, you risk injury or a dead arm issue… As has been happening

    Also YF has it right…They need to stop pampering them in the minors…They need to let this pitchers grow

  90. BoJo January 6th, 2014 at 5:52 pm

    If the above list was just about PED users, I would be very tempted to add carl Yaztremski and try to build a case that he was one of the first to use PEDs. And introduced them to Rico Petrocelli and Hawk Harrelson.

    You could add Brian Downing to the list too IMO.

  91. luis January 6th, 2014 at 5:53 pm

    YF,

    Re: Lefties… Yes, especially with our park we should all like lefties!… ;)

  92. tomingeorgia January 6th, 2014 at 5:53 pm

    yankeefem,

    Just talking about Ted, is all.

  93. BoJo January 6th, 2014 at 5:56 pm

    Can we just ZIP the WARs so we don’t go to WAR over ZIP?

  94. luis January 6th, 2014 at 5:58 pm

    BoJo January 6th, 2014 at 5:56 pm
    Can we just ZIP the WARs so we don’t go to WAR over ZIP?

    ================================

    Zip it doo dah, zipped it day!…What a wonderful day! ;)

  95. yankeefeminista January 6th, 2014 at 6:00 pm

    luis, Nova already had a more than two pitches and had the time to develop them during his 517 IP in the minors. Joba had a mere 88 innings and Hughes under 250 IP when they were called up.

  96. yankeefeminista January 6th, 2014 at 6:01 pm

    had *more than two pitches, should read…

  97. BoJo January 6th, 2014 at 6:01 pm

    I wonder IF they ever did induct Pete rose into the HOF…if his acceptance speech would start off as: “HEY! I won my bet!”

  98. joeman January 6th, 2014 at 6:13 pm

    ARod = 65 games

  99. luis January 6th, 2014 at 6:15 pm

    yankeefeminista January 6th, 2014 at 6:00 pm
    luis, Nova already had a more than two pitches and had the time to develop them during his 517 IP in the minors. Joba had a mere 88 innings and Hughes under 250 IP when they were called up.

    ===============================

    No argument here…They were rushed, yanked them from one job to the other…Stemmed their innings built and at the same time their pitches development…And somehow the FO office is not at fault at this?

  100. pete2 January 6th, 2014 at 7:02 pm

    “Where this all started was just whether they have improved from 2013 in net terms. To do that I don’t think that they need to add another SP. I think they’ve already done that. ”

    Ted, is this really the case?

    First, the Yankees won 85 games last year, somehow, but were more like a 79-80 W team based on their pythag. Getting back Tex and Jeter presumably gets them back to 85 wins without the luck.

    Now for the additions and subtractions

    Rivera- inhouse replacement, Large Downgrade
    Pettitte-inhouse replacement, Large Downgrade
    Granderson- Ellsbury, Large Upgrade
    Ichiro to bench – Beltran, Large Upgrade
    Stewart -Mcann, Large Upgrade
    Cano-Roberts-Large Downgrade
    Logan-Thornton-Downgrade
    Collective 2013 3B-Johnson, Upgrade

    I have 4 upgrades, 4 downgrades, an equal amount of large upgrades as large downgrades

    I really have them treading water here. Overall, the teams a bit stronger than the 79-80 W team based on pythag due to the return of Jeter and Teixeira, and that presumes they return at 2012 form which is not certain.

    We also have to consider this is a pretty fragile team on the field. Between age and players recent injury history, injuries are certainly to be expected, and I can’t say I like the depth at most positions.

    As for the HOF, its irrelevant until they start voting in players like Clemens and Bonds.

    Chip, I agree with you that Arod will never play another game for the Yankees and then I think he gets blackballed by the rest of the league like Bonds was. After he serves his suspension he will only have 60 million or so left on his deal. My question is if they release him and the Yankees pay off in a lump sum will that get him off the books for 2015-2017? If so its a clear winner.

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