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McCann still earning the trust of Yankees pitchers

Posted by: Chad Jennings - Posted in Misc on Apr 11, 2014 Print This Post Print This Post | Email This Post Email This Post

Brian McCann, David Phelps

It was a running storyline in spring training, and after last night’s win, it was brought up again: Exactly how much of the Yankees early pitching success is due to Brian McCann?

“He’s awesome when he’s behind the plate,” David Phelps said. “But one of the biggest things that I love about him is that (after) we finish the game, he comes in and he talks to me about, this is why I called this pitch, this is what we’re trying to do. That’s so big, especially for a young guy like myself. He’s caught so many good pitchers that have such good stuff, he knows what he wants to do and he knows what we need to be doing. It just makes it so much easier for me that I can just go out there and follow him and have faith in him.”

I believe I wrote it in spring training, and I’ll write it again: No one should expect a team’s pitching staff to openly throw its catcher under the bus. Things have to be pretty extreme for pitchers to openly say they distrust or dislike their catcher, so hearing a guy like Phelps say nice things about McCann isn’t surprising or unusual. But since February, the Yankees pitchers have generally gone out of their way to praise McCann’s efforts, and they usually have stories and examples to backup their claims.

Hiroki Kuroda, Brian McCann“I think it’s testimony to the work that he put in,” Joe Girardi said. “He put a lot of work in. As soon as he signed, he asked for video. We sent him video and he looked at our pitchers. You can get an idea from video, but really until you get back there, you don’t have a great idea. He went to work on the relationship part of it. He went to work on the type of stuff that they had. I know that he’s continuing to learn our staff, but he’s put a lot of work in.”

Phelps talked about McCann sitting on the floor in the spring clubhouse trying to get to know his pitchers. I can’t remember who said it in spring training, but I believe it was one of the pitchers who talked about McCann trying to spend time with guys away from the field as well. He seems prepared, and I don’t think I’ve ever heard a pitcher talk about his catcher making a point of explaining his pitch calling decisions after a game.

“That’s part of my job,” McCann said. “I’ve caught some games over the years. I know what works and what doesn’t work in certain situations, and if I can (I want to) pass that on to him. I got a chance to catch Tim Hudson and Kris Medlin, guys with similar stuff to (Phelps) that win 15 ballgames and he’s got that ability. He’s got that stuff.”

The impact of a catcher on a pitching staff is pretty hard to judge from a distance, but the Yankees have nine pitchers with an ERA of 4.15 or better so far this season. One of the few guys with an ERA higher is Phelps, who’s WHIP is just 1.00.

“To be honest with you, these are great pitchers,” McCann said. “I’m glad they say those nice words, but at the same time, the pitcher gets the outs and these guys have good stuff. Phelps came in tonight throwing everything he had, spotting all of it up. Pineda was awesome. I put my time in to learn these guys and every day is better.”

Associated Press photos

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213 Responses to “McCann still earning the trust of Yankees pitchers”

  1. blake April 11th, 2014 at 9:02 am

    If you were giving a game ball for last night then it goes to Pineda but Phelps was big time too……really big

  2. blake April 11th, 2014 at 9:06 am

    Pineda is willing to cheat to beat the Red Sox…..he’s a keeper

  3. Mike Ri April 11th, 2014 at 9:07 am

    Pineda is willing to cheat to beat the Red Sox…..he’s a keeper

    ——
    LOL

  4. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:11 am

    pat April 11th, 2014 at 9:10 am
    The Daily News I Team is all over this and is reporting that Alex gave Pineda the pinetar that he used. :wink:

    ———————-

    Ha!!

  5. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:11 am

    blake – But what’s on the game ball…??

  6. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:14 am

    BTW, for anyone wondering.. I think I’m going with getting a Slingbox and buying a WD TV box for myself.

    Modern technology is a helluva good time.

    Now I just gotta find a way to explain to my parents why I’m stealing their cable….

  7. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:15 am

    (I broke the rule!)

    Where’s randy been, btw?

    Are he and stuckey having a standoff?

  8. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:17 am

    Heh.. timely reporting here..

    ?@Ken_Rosenthal A change in culture: How #RedSox’s anger over Peralta’s participation in ALCS helped spark change in JDA. Story: http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/s.....ies-041014

  9. austinmac April 11th, 2014 at 9:19 am

    Randy has been depressed since Pineda showed his CU.

  10. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 9:23 am

    Alex
    Got that pine tar from
    A Stanford University laboratory I’ll have you know.

  11. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 9:24 am

    I realize they’ve only made two starts each – but what we’ve seen from Pineda and Tanaka is enough to let you dream about having two young, dominant starters at the top of the rotation for the next 6 years.

  12. The Fifth Core Foursman April 11th, 2014 at 9:24 am

    George Brett approves of Michael Pineda’s use of sweaty dirt.

  13. Tackelberry April 11th, 2014 at 9:25 am

    That performance had to be a real confidence booster for Phelps, who needed it badly after gettting roughed up in his last 2 appearances. Terririfc performance by Pineda, despite the little pine tar controversy. Sox didn’t hit him in the innings where his hand was clean so it is not a big deal. I’m sure Red Sox fans feel differently but should keep their mouths shut siince their team’s pitchers are known to do it too. Nice job also by Cabral too on a night when the bullpen was short. COngrat to Dean Anna on his first major league homer. All in all a good night. Need CC to keep it going tonight, since Yanks always have trouble with Lester. Seems they have him on the ropes quite a bit, but he almost always seems to escape with little damage.

  14. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 9:25 am

    Players don’t care about pitchers using stuff to get a better grip…it’s been said a lot over the last 10 hours, they would prefer a pitcher use pine tar to grip the ball than not and have a 96 mph fastball slip out of his hands.

  15. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:25 am

    Chip April 11th, 2014 at 9:24 am
    I realize they’ve only made two starts each – but what we’ve seen from Pineda and Tanaka is enough to let you dream about having two young, dominant starters at the top of the rotation for the next 6 years.

    ——————-

    Yeah it really does… if Manny can be what we think he can be… my goodness.

    And that’s not even considering Phelps, Nuno, Ramirez, etc.

  16. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 9:26 am

    Austinmac – I doubt randy is rooting against a Yankee pitcher.’he just likes
    To tweak people.
    And he’s banned and might have run out of variations on the apple.
    I think Randy being banned here is crazy considering what goes on here on a Daily basis but it’s not my blog.

  17. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 9:27 am

    All three pitchers did very well last night. Cabral gets lost in the shuffle but he was nasty up there too.

    Sometimes Girardi screws up by showing guys too much trust (Chris Stewart) and some times he’s rewarded for it like last night with Phelps. I will admit though I was screaming for him to bring in Thornton in the 9th to face Nava and Ortiz.

  18. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:28 am

    JAP – randy’s returned multiple times after.. if he’s not coming around lately it’s got nothing to do with Chad.

    The last time he was on here he was arguing with stuckey about self imposed exile lol.

  19. BIG AL April 11th, 2014 at 9:28 am

    The more we see results, like last night, from Pineda, the less I think of Montero.

    I still have hopes for Montero, and think he can turn his career around, providing he gets good coaching and support from his team.

    That being said, I still believe the Yankees got the better of that trade, and time should bear me out on this.

    Girardi needs to move McCann up in the order to give better protection, and keep teams from pitching around him, IMO. :)

  20. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:29 am

    I was a little worried about Cabral, but you’re right Chip he did really well.

  21. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 9:29 am

    Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:25 am

    Chip April 11th, 2014 at 9:24 am
    I realize they’ve only made two starts each – but what we’ve seen from Pineda and Tanaka is enough to let you dream about having two young, dominant starters at the top of the rotation for the next 6 years.

    ——————-

    Yeah it really does… if Manny can be what we think he can be… my goodness.

    And that’s not even considering Phelps, Nuno, Ramirez, etc.
    —————————-

    If you want to dream a little:

    2015 Yankee pitching staff:

    Tanaka
    CC
    Pineda
    Banuelos
    Nova

    with: Cabral, Warren, Betances, Burawa, Ramirez, Montgomery, Phelps in the pen.

  22. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 9:30 am

    Sorry – left Kelley off that list by accident

  23. 86w183 April 11th, 2014 at 9:30 am

    Morning all —-

    When it’s cold every pitcher uses something to improve the grip on the ball. Every hitter in baseball is glad that they do.

    This is much ado about nothing… as Tackelberry points out, the Red Sawx have multiple pitchers who have done similar things.

    The rule is vague… if it’s just to get a better grip it’s legal, but if it’s to gain an advantage it’s not…. how the hell do you measure that?

  24. 86w183 April 11th, 2014 at 9:31 am

    you left off David Robertson too

  25. BIG AL April 11th, 2014 at 9:32 am

    If the Yankees are going to make the PS, it’ll have as much to do with our rookies as the FA signings.

    I love seeing so many young players getting a chance to contribute.

  26. The Fifth Core Foursman April 11th, 2014 at 9:33 am

    Randy got banned? What for?

    Remember when he was lamenting over Pineda’s “violent” delivery and as proof he linked a video game clip? Classic Lohud.

  27. austinmac April 11th, 2014 at 9:34 am

    JAP,

    I’m just picking on Randy. I think any banning should be temporary. We all have moments.

    I was awfully impressed with his change. A bit too hard, but great movement resulting in some bad swings.

  28. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 9:34 am

    Montero and his .996 OPS as a Yankee contributed to a stretch drive and first-place finish.

    Pineda looks great, but he’s made two starts in three years.

    I was at that game last night, and the offense isn’t any good.

    Pineda’s presence doesn’t solve that the offense isn’t going to be good enough, and the impressive young pitching that we have overall isn’t going to compensate for it.

    Cashman/Hal need to add players, unless you’re satisfied with oohing and ahhing over fastballs, sliders, curves and splitters in a vacuum.

  29. jmills April 11th, 2014 at 9:35 am

    http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UgincTSCkYQ#

    Couldn’t help myself, caught this # just now, and it had me breaking the HWY rules real fast :D

  30. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 9:36 am

    mac,

    He was brilliant. The Red Sox lineup isn’t all that much, but he dominated their “A” guys as well.

    They didn’t know what was coming and if they did they couldn’t do anything with it anyway.

  31. hardwired7 April 11th, 2014 at 9:37 am

    Scherzer would look good in that 2015 rotation.

    “Greed is good.” – Gordon Gekko

  32. austinmac April 11th, 2014 at 9:37 am

    JAP,

    I couldn’t agree more on the offense. They need a good bat, but I don’t see it happening.

  33. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:37 am

    If you want to dream a little:

    2015 Yankee pitching staff:

    Tanaka
    CC
    Pineda
    Banuelos
    Nova

    with: Cabral, Warren, Betances, Burawa, Ramirez, Montgomery, Phelps in the pen.

    —————–

    Yeah, that’d be something.. so many home grown arms. I’m with 86 though, I keep Robertson.

  34. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 9:37 am

    86w183 April 11th, 2014 at 9:31 am

    you left off David Robertson too
    —————————

    Been saying for a while that if the Yankees see enough out of Betances, Jose Ramirez and/or Danny Burawa they might opt to let Robertson walk rather than give him a new contract.

  35. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:39 am

    The development of Pineda’s change is huge for him.. I’m still concerned about this up and down velocity we’re seeing but developing that change was always a big key to his success.

  36. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 9:39 am

    J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 9:34 am

    Montero and his .996 OPS as a Yankee contributed to a stretch drive and first-place finish.

    Pineda looks great, but he’s made two starts in three years.

    I was at that game last night, and the offense isn’t any good.

    Pineda’s presence doesn’t solve that the offense isn’t going to be good enough, and the impressive young pitching that we have overall isn’t going to compensate for it.

    Cashman/Hal need to add players, unless you’re satisfied with oohing and ahhing over fastballs, sliders, curves and splitters in a vacuum.
    ————————

    Having a surplus of good young pitching means that you can trade for hitters. Hopefully ones that can play positions.

  37. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 9:42 am

    mac,

    Well then they don’t really care about winning.

    I’m not going to belabor it: but I was there last night, and when you see great pitching like that, and you look over at 2B, you just say, “Damn them.”

    Had they kept Mr. Robinson Cano, and added some of the guys they did, the Yankees would finally have a balance of bat and arm to give the rest of baseball the business in Derek Jeter’s final year.

    I’ll not forget how they spit on Mariano’s final season; no one should.

  38. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 9:43 am

    and Montero’s OPS as a Yankee came in 18 games as a late season call-up. Given a full season to play his OPS was .685, he was even worse last year and he’s currently not hitting in the hitter friendly PCL.

    I was just as big a fan of Montero as anyone, but the truth is that he looks more like another in the line of Jose Tabata’s, Ruben Rivera’s and Ricky Ledee’s.

  39. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:44 am

    Been saying for a while that if the Yankees see enough out of Betances, Jose Ramirez and/or Danny Burawa they might opt to let Robertson walk rather than give him a new contract.

    ——————

    I still think they should retain him for depth. It would just be a cost saving move and tbh, they could use a guy that’s been to the show before over a short term deal. Closers don’t usually command long term commitments and I think the longest Robertson gets is 3 years. That’s really not bad at all.

  40. The Fifth Core Foursman April 11th, 2014 at 9:45 am

    Montero and his .996 OPS as a Yankee contributed to a stretch drive and first-place finish.

    Pineda looks great, but he’s made two starts in three years.

    ——————————————————————————-

    A little bit of statistical “gerrymandering” no?

  41. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 9:46 am

    Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:44 am

    Been saying for a while that if the Yankees see enough out of Betances, Jose Ramirez and/or Danny Burawa they might opt to let Robertson walk rather than give him a new contract.

    ——————

    I still think they should retain him for depth. It would just be a cost saving move and tbh, they could use a guy that’s been to the show before over a short term deal. Closers don’t usually command long term commitments and I think the longest Robertson gets is 3 years. That’s really not bad at all.
    ——————–

    It’s the same decision the Yankees were forced to make after the 96 season when Wetteland (29) was a free agent and the Yankees thought highly enough of Rivera to give him the job.

    Clearly I’m not suggesting that Burawa, Betances or Ramirez will be as great as Rivera, just that in terms of allocation of resources they may prefer to take their chances with those three young guys and spend the money elsewhere.

  42. austinmac April 11th, 2014 at 9:46 am

    JAP,

    The Yankees have known their weaknesses for months, but Cashman has said the checkbook is closed. The ownership cares about fans’ perception of the team and resultant income.

  43. hardwired7 April 11th, 2014 at 9:47 am

    Interesting story on the fortuitous way the Yanks discovered Shane Greene:

    http://sbb.scout.com/2/1392598.html

  44. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 9:47 am

    The Fifth Core Foursman April 11th, 2014 at 9:45 am

    Montero and his .996 OPS as a Yankee contributed to a stretch drive and first-place finish.

    Pineda looks great, but he’s made two starts in three years.

    ——————————————————————————-

    A little bit of statistical “gerrymandering” no?
    —————————

    Agreed…Pineda’s success is a small sample size, Montero’s success in 18 games is not?

  45. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 9:48 am

    Having a surplus of good young pitching means that you can trade for hitters. Hopefully ones that can play positions.
    ///

    They’ve already flushed away three years by going with the wrong type of offenses – despite vehement protests on this board that the offense was “good enough” the last few years – by not giving younger players a chance. I don’t trust Cashman to even be able to identify good hitters, but they had better do something, and in the heat, because this offense, though they brought in three guys who can hit, isn’t a young nucleus and they’ll be facing the same brief window to maximize having added these guys that will disappear fast without upgrades.

    They need to do something to send Derek out the right way, and fool me once, twice….I’m not counting on that at all, but that’s what has to happen.

  46. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:49 am

    Clearly I’m not suggesting that Burawa, Betances or Ramirez will be as great as Rivera, just that in terms of allocation of resources they may prefer to take their chances with those three young guys and spend the money elsewhere.

    ————————-

    The other, cheaper arms could also be used as trade chips… We’ll see how things play out this year, but if they can sign Robertson to a 3/30 deal like blake suggested, I’d give it to him.

    That being said, if it’s a decision between buying an INF vs. keeping Robertson, I want a position player. I just hate that they feel they need to operate that way.

  47. DONNYBROOK April 11th, 2014 at 9:50 am

    - FRIDAY MORNING MUSINGS -

    (1) R/Sox currently in a world of hurt vs RH chuckers. Ortiz can be pitched around.

    (2) Though effective, both Cabral and Phelps pitched scared.

    (3) Girardi should have raised hell over the balk call. HP Ump was simply injecting himself into The Game. You notice Pierzynski wouldn’t give him the time of day, when the ump injured his hand when struck by a ball glancing off Pierzynski’s mitt? These guys know.

    (4) Why do runners on All teams across MLB, continue running into an out, while a runner is scoring? The game situation, and the closeness of the approaching play at the plate, should dictate this suicide mission on the bases. Jeet was going to score easily. We just gave away an out at 2B on that play.

    (5) This 25 Man squad has yet to achieve a “team” feel. A “walk off” or 2 would solve this.

    (6) League catching up to Solarte? Steven Drew Clock remains at Defcon 3.

  48. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 9:51 am

    Agreed…Pineda’s success is a small sample size, Montero’s success in 18 games is not?
    ///

    Well Montero can’t do much about his SSS in pinstripes, now can he.

    They’re both SSS, and the Yankees still have no young bats.

  49. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 9:53 am

    J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 9:51 am

    Agreed…Pineda’s success is a small sample size, Montero’s success in 18 games is not?
    ///

    Well Montero can’t do much about his SSS in pinstripes, now can he.

    They’re both SSS, and the Yankees still have no young bats.
    —————-

    Has Montero done anything to suggest that the Yankees were wrong?

  50. austinmac April 11th, 2014 at 9:53 am

    I see no reason to expect an all out effort to send Derek off as a winner. If that was the case, the checkbook wouldn’t have closed. I think Hal feels like he has spent enough. I think he has not.

  51. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 9:56 am

    Well Chip, as usual, we don’t agree on what a good hitter looks like, just like you continue to assert that Melky Cabrera has 4th OF talent with a bat.

    Bottom line: the Yankees’ offense isn’t good enough, despite getting Ellsbury/Beltran/McCann.

    It’s fine, if you don’t care about winning another World Championship.

  52. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:57 am

    Has Montero done anything to suggest that the Yankees were wrong?

    —————–

    Sadly no. If Montero finds his way back to the bigs and shows something this is a different conversation. But he’s really fallen off.

  53. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 10:00 am

    It would be really nice if CC can shut down what looks to me like less than a World beating Boston lineup tonight.

    And I know it will happen when hell freezes over, but could Betances actually make an appearance in a game that is winnable?

  54. Tackelberry April 11th, 2014 at 10:01 am

    Cabral and Phelps don’t pitch scared. Its just that neither has blow away stuff, so they have to rely on hitting their spots and command. Neither can afford to pitch near the middle of the plate since neither can throw the ball by hitters

  55. BIG AL April 11th, 2014 at 10:02 am

    JAP -

    Can you give me an idea of a “Good” bat we could obtain for what we have to offer?

  56. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 10:04 am

    J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 9:56 am

    Well Chip, as usual, we don’t agree on what a good hitter looks like, just like you continue to assert that Melky Cabrera has 4th OF talent with a bat.

    Bottom line: the Yankees’ offense isn’t good enough, despite getting Ellsbury/Beltran/McCann.

    It’s fine, if you don’t care about winning another World Championship.
    ——————-

    JAP -

    Montero looks like a good hitter, no doubt. But he just isn’t a good hitter. Much like Gabe Kapler looked the part of a good ball player but wasn’t.

    I will ask again though – what has Montero done to prove the Yankees wrong? The Mariners gave him every opportunity to prove he could catch; he couldn’t. They gave him every opportunity to prove he could hit at this level; he couldn’t.

    Now he’s in the minors trying to prove he can play 1b – which also isn’t going well.

    He has been so bad that the Mariners have essentially given up on him.

    I’m not trying to tell you what to think, but you’re clinging to 18 games like they’re gold…Montero had a tremendous September for the Yankees – so did Shane Spencer once.

  57. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 10:04 am

    I entirely disagree that Montero would not have been a boon to the lineup in 2012 and last year. Entirely disagree that being surrounded by Alex and Cano and playing in Yankee Stadium would not have helped him be the hitter he was in the minors and in his brief Yankee career.

    And had Girardi used his contact bat in 2011 ALDS, the Yankees might have been in the ALCS and then, who knows what could have happened.

    He also has looked good at 1B in Tacoma. I’d take him back in a heartbeat.

    The offense is not good enough, and that infield last night was spared because Pineda got flyouts and whiffs until later in the game.

  58. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 10:04 am

    If this is strictly a conversation about the offense.. I completely agree they need to upgrade at every position they can. I wish they would have kept Cano. He’s a guy that would’ve extended this line up and added the power/average we could really use.

    I’m looking through next year’s FA class and it’s gonna be hard to find this kinda talent on the market.

  59. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 10:05 am

    And I’m not saying that the Yankee offense has been good – but Montero, based on what we’ve seen of him as a professional, isn’t the answer.

  60. 86w183 April 11th, 2014 at 10:06 am

    I have a feeling people here will be debating the Montero/Pineda trade for another decade.

    AND they’ll be complaining about Cheapskate Hal and his minimal $ 300 M payroll in 2020

  61. CountryClub April 11th, 2014 at 10:07 am

    I haven’t dug through the comments, so this might have been mentioned already:

    The game was on the MLB channel last night and Smoltz and Costas pointed out (with pictures) that Buchholz had a glob of pine tar on his elbow. That’s why the Sox didn’t complain; they were both using it.

  62. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 10:07 am

    86w183 April 11th, 2014 at 10:06 am

    I have a feeling people here will be debating the Montero/Pineda trade for another decade.

    AND they’ll be complaining about Cheapskate Hal and his minimal $ 300 M payroll in 2020
    —————-

    Probably

  63. The Fifth Core Foursman April 11th, 2014 at 10:07 am

    Montero’s hitting talent was never a question. But his make-up and his catching ability were.

    Perhaps if he remained a Yankee things would have turned out differently. But as of right now he’s a chubby 1B in Tacoma

  64. BIG AL April 11th, 2014 at 10:08 am

    JAP -

    When Betances was given the shot in the late innings last time out, he could not find the plate.

    Yes, he has tremendous upside, but, he’s still too unpredicable, you never know who will show up, the guy that’s lights out, or the guy that can’t find the strike zone.

    You simply can’t say the younger players are not being given opportunities, but, they must earn their shot, and when given the chance, they have to be consistent.

  65. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 10:09 am

    JAP – I was talking to Chip yesterday about a prospect for prospect deal.. do you know if any other systems have any upper level INF talent we might want to check in on?

  66. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 10:10 am

    BIG AL April 11th, 2014 at 10:02 am

    JAP -

    Can you give me an idea of a “Good” bat we could obtain for what we have to offer?
    ///

    Good point! Teams are loathe to give up their young hitters in trades, and they don’t let those guys walk. Hence, we’re not getting Trout, hence, we’re not getting Harper. Hence, you have to grow your own.

    I’d give up a lot to get Makiel Franco off Philly, awesome RHB with batspeed to burn and projectable 3B-type power, but even though they’re going with Asche, I doubt we could pry him loose.

    That’s the kind of hitter I would like – not a Domonic Brown type.

    Maybe if the Yankees had listened to Texas, who were interested in actually giving us something for Robinson Cano – who walked away for NOTHING – we’d have a young bat or two.

    I didn’t want to trade Cano, but that’s because I wanted to re-sign him.

  67. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 10:11 am

    JAP

    3 things:

    1. How do you know how Montero has looked playing 1b in Tacoma? Seriously, this isn’t meant as a dig, but I didn’t realize that minor league games were televised that regularly outside of their local markets.

    2. You’re cherry-picking SSS again. Montero has looked good at 1b in a few games at Tacoma and that should be taken at face value, but Pineda’s success shouldn’t be because it’s come in a few games.

    3. You brush aside the fact that Pineda got a lot of strikeouts last night and that helped the infield defense, but Pineda is a strikeout pitcher – that he does it well is part of the reason he’s here.

  68. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 10:11 am

    Yeah, Shame, I want Franco :)

    Yeah, not happening.

  69. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 10:12 am

    How do I know?

    There’s this thing called milb.tv – I’ve watched him both last year and early this season. I’m a Montero fan, so I keep up ;)

  70. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 10:15 am

    J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 10:12 am

    How do I know?

    There’s this thing called milb.tv – I’ve watched him both last year and early this season. I’m a Montero fan, so I keep up
    —————–

    Thanks – didn’t know minor league baseball had it’s own web app like that.

    For what it’s worth – my guess is that the Yankees (or any other team) could have Montero if they wanted him.

    Maybe time will prove me wrong, but as I said earlier Montero appears to be another in the line of over-hyped prospects like Tabata, Jackson Melian, Ledee, Ruben Rivera, Wily Mo Pena.

  71. bbb51 April 11th, 2014 at 10:15 am

    I expect to see pine tar somewhere on CC tonight. He needs to take the reins and lead by example.

  72. Tackelberry April 11th, 2014 at 10:17 am

    Weather forecast not looking too promising tonight. Supposed to rain alter this afternoon into the early morning hours. Not sure they’ll play tonight. Wouldn’t be the worst thing as it would give the pen another night off and push Pineda to start the opener of the series in Tampa next Thursday. Also would keep Nova out of this series

  73. BIG AL April 11th, 2014 at 10:17 am

    JAP -

    “He also has looked good at 1B in Tacoma. I’d take him back in a heartbeat.

    The offense is not good enough, and that infield last night was spared because Pineda got flyouts and whiffs until later in the game.”

    ********************************************
    If Montero was here today, where would he play?

    C – No
    1B – No
    DH – No

    The Yankees realized they had no spot for him on the roster they were looking at going forward, and that, IMO, was a large part as to why he was traded.

    I watched Montero quite a bit in SWB, and he was a good hitter, but still had a great deal of trouble hitting off speed pitches, his attitude needed a severe adjustment, he was the only player on that AAA team that would not sign autographs, unless he was at an event getting paid to do so.

    I still liked Montero as a player, not so much as a person.

  74. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 10:17 am

    3. You brush aside the fact that Pineda got a lot of strikeouts last night and that helped the infield defense, but Pineda is a strikeout pitcher – that he does it well is part of the reason he’s here.
    ///

    Not at all.

    My argument before Cano wasn’t re-signed was that the pitching staff was going to be a predominant groundball/K combination that meant we needed a crisp infield.

    I reiterated that many times. Last night Pineda got flyouts until later in his outing. We are not going to be spared groundballs however with the staff we had. Those guys are going to have to make plays behind the pitchers.

  75. Hassey April 11th, 2014 at 10:25 am

    I guess we won The Trade

  76. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 10:26 am

    Big Al,

    Sanchez has trouble with offspeed away too. Young players do. Montero though has an approach and swing plane that I think will take care of that ultimately. He’s not Melky Mesa. He’s also 24 years old. Not quite down for the count.

  77. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 10:26 am

    Tackelberry April 11th, 2014 at 10:17 am
    Weather forecast not looking too promising tonight. Supposed to rain alter this afternoon into the early morning hours. Not sure they’ll play tonight. Wouldn’t be the worst thing as it would give the pen another night off and push Pineda to start the opener of the series in Tampa next Thursday. Also would keep Nova out of this series

    ——————–

    If the game were rained out I’d want to have a double header tomorrow or Sunday but they won’t do it because they all hate me.

  78. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 10:27 am

    The “no position” argument doesn’t work for me.

    Any way, you guys are the ones who love to talk about Jesus ;).

  79. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 10:35 am

    Jack Curry arguing with Fake Hank Stein on Twitter…. amazing.

  80. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 10:35 am

    Twitter is like the internet version of the subway… everyone’s gotta interact at some point, no matter how high or low you fall on the social totem pole.

  81. Tackelberry April 11th, 2014 at 10:36 am

    Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 10:26 am

    If the game were rained out I’d want to have a double header tomorrow or Sunday but they won’t do it because they all hate me.

    _______________________________________

    Yeah. Jack Curry mentioned that on the post game last night.

  82. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 10:36 am

    JAP -

    As a fan you can keep dreaming on Montero, as a fan I still have high hopes that Christian Garcia finds health and emerges as a dominant relief pitcher; but you have to admit it doesn’t look good for him.

    The Mariners, who have more invested in his success than anyone, have essentially given up on him as a major leaguer.

    He’s 5th on their depth chart at both DH and 1b and not on it at all at C. I just looked at his numbers in Tacoma, he’s in a time share at 1b and being out hit by his platoon partner by a lot. His GM has proclaimed that whatever hopes they had for Montero are gone…at this point it seems like they’re keeping him in the organization just as depth rather than as someone who can contribute in any meaningful way.

  83. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 10:40 am

    Truthfully, the ex-Yankee I’m most upset that Seattle has is Abe Almonte. The Yankees really screwed the pooch on that one, deciding to keep Melky Mesa instead of Almonte.

  84. bruceb April 11th, 2014 at 10:42 am

    (2) Though effective, both Cabral and Phelps pitched scared.

    Completely disagree. They pitched “smart,” not “scared.”

    (4) Why do runners on All teams across MLB, continue running into an out, while a runner is scoring? The game situation, and the closeness of the approaching play at the plate, should dictate this suicide mission on the bases. Jeet was going to score easily. We just gave away an out at 2B on that play.

    Completely agree. I know that often they are trying to draw the throw to 2B rather than home but just how many runs are teams giving away? Not only are they surrendering a precious out but they’re giving the pitcher an easier inning.

  85. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 10:43 am

    86w183 April 11th, 2014 at 10:06 am

    I have a feeling people here will be debating the Montero/Pineda trade for another decade.

    AND they’ll be complaining about Cheapskate Hal and his minimal $ 300 M payroll in 2020
    ///

    You seem to have a very short fuse when it comes to fans’ disappointment with ownership/management.

    If you want to bow down to Hal’s “eat your gruel and like it” (GLove coinage) imperative, that’s your prerogative.

    But having sucked in 2012, with no real chance to do anything in the playoffs, didn’t sit well with me, nor did Hal thumbing his nose at Mariano’s final year in pinstripes, nor did getting nothing for Robinson Cano….

    It’s actually quite miraculous how little criticism the Yankees have received for letting their magnificent former 2B just walk away without recompense.

    Right now, the offense isn’t good. McCann will hit eventually I expect, but up and down the lineup, it’s not a deep group and it doesn’t really have a true middle order.

    It’s fun to watch big young arms dominate like Pineda did the Red Sox last night. There’s extra sizzle in those games, especially when you attend them.

    I hope Tanaka-Nova-Pineda-Kuroda-C I hope throw up zeroes all year – they’ll pretty much have to, the way things stand.

    But if the Yankees want to finish the job, they have more work to do, certainly for this season.

  86. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 10:49 am

    Chip,

    I don’t have to “admit” to something I don’t for a minute believe. Writing off a 24 year old who has struggled but who has natural ability up the wazoo isn’t even wise.

    Just like I didn’t have to “admit” that Sickels has any insight into Melky Cabrera’s hitting talent; I’ll trust my own judgment on both counts :)

  87. bruceb April 11th, 2014 at 10:49 am

    And as for the offense, it would look much more potent had we kept Cano, which I know was not possible. We’re missing that elite player in the middle of the order. Not sure even three stars = one superstar.

  88. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 10:52 am

    bruceb – you “know it was not possible”?

    Hal’s done a masterful con job on some of the fan base, I would say.

    And I agree, three stars don’t equal one superstar. Said so when the “Trade Cano” cries began here last year.

    Now – Cano for “three stars” would be welcome! (I know you’re talking FA signings rather than what they might have got for Cano in a trade – just sayin’)

  89. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 10:58 am

    Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 9:28 am

    JAP – randy’s returned multiple times after.. if he’s not coming around lately it’s got nothing to do with Chad.
    ///

    I realize that Shame, which is why I said he may be running out of variations on the apple :)

    He should apologize – not for calling out people here – but for making it personal with Chad.

    The blog isn’t the same without his irreverence and story-telling, IMO, but thems the breaks, I guess.

  90. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 11:03 am

    J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 10:49 am

    Chip,

    I don’t have to “admit” to something I don’t for a minute believe. Writing off a 24 year old who has struggled but who has natural ability up the wazoo isn’t even wise.

    Just like I didn’t have to “admit” that Sickels has any insight into Melky Cabrera’s hitting talent; I’ll trust my own judgment on both counts
    ————————

    Only one thing for it then – you’ll have to strike it rich, but a team and sign both Montero and Melky

  91. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:03 am

    He should apologize – not for calling out people here – but for making it personal with Chad.

    ———————

    He made it personal with a few people, sadly. He kinda carried it over onto Twitter to tell blake to shove it lmao. I don’t think anyone took it too personally, but randy can pop back in whenever he feels like it. Chad bans anyone that pulls that stuff. Our friends just keep returning in the same way.

  92. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 11:08 am

    Shame,

    He did go berserk, although I didn’t read the twitter stuff, just heard about it.

    Still think if he apologized, it would make a difference, although I can’t be sure.

    My point is, there’s an issue here generally IMO, starting with people using the place as their personal pulpit. But it is what it is.

  93. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 11:10 am

    The problem is that people take this nonsense way too seriously.

    They let it get personal for them when someone disagrees with their opinions and then they get rude. It’s dumb.

  94. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 11:10 am

    Haha, Chip, well Melky’s nearly 30, and I don’t envision coming into that kind of dough for the foreseeable future.

    Maybe in time for Montero to enter his prime, though :)

  95. mick April 11th, 2014 at 11:11 am

    Don’t sleep on the cagey RS, they will keep the Pineda thing in their back pocket till a really big game arises if for nothing else to try to rattle him.

  96. bruceb April 11th, 2014 at 11:12 am

    JAP

    Trust me, I know you were in the “keep Cano at all costs” camp so to speak. Had they kept him, I guess we would have signed McCann but not Ellsbury and Beltran.

  97. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:13 am

    Hey, thanks for all the jokes at my expense by the lohud heavy hitters!

    :D

    That said, cheating is cheating, and the “everyone is doing it excuse” is as weak as anyone willing to use it. So yes, I stick to my standards, and proud of it.

    Rules are rules. They’re not in place for people to pick and choose their favorite ones. If the managers and players were so against the pine tar rule, it occurs to me that they could lobby to have it removed.

    That also said, Pineda showed that once he washed his hand, he still could pitch effectively. So lah dee dah. I doubt he’ll be using pine tar again, and with the warmer weather it’s not going to matter at all.

    ***************

    And because enquiring mind still brings up the “will you accept him now that he’s cheated, ha ha” ridiculousness, it apparently can’t sink in that once is always grounds for accepting that someone made a mistake, and I’ve never varied from that.

    ***************

    Laugh at me all you want. I know this isn’t a court of law, but the “everyone does it” excuse wouldn’t get you past the court room door.

    I’d apologize for my “ridiculous” and “overblown” standards, but I’m afraid that I owe to my parents to live out their teachings. If something is wrong, you just don’t do it.

    :)

  98. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 11:14 am

    Watched the replay last night, but kept spacing out after the long night at the Stadium. In skimming through the blog and the Yankees/mlb news, I think it is ridiculous that people are being sidetracked by the pine tar thing instead of focusing on Pineda’s stellar outing. Drop the morality act.

    Shame, you said it is supposed to rain? Are you sitting out in the open? Man, I really want to go again tonight to see C. pitch.

    De Paula and Gallegos pitch for the Yankee kids tonight. Wish De Paula was on live stream.

  99. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 11:16 am

    bruceb,

    They could have signed Cano, McCann and Beltran too. Even if they didn’t sign Carrrrrrlos, but just the other two, they could have given Zoilo a shot at RF.

    Zoilo is ready for the next step. He’s not Carlos Beltran, but he’s also not 36 years old, and has both power and the ability to adjust to the situation. A good two-strike hitter who can go the other way or pull the ball out of the park. I think his RHB would come around, too and he’d be a decent SH.

  100. 86w183 April 11th, 2014 at 11:16 am

    JAP —-

    I don’t bow to anyone.. not Hal and not you.

    I have issues with STUPID criticism and the whole “Hal is Cheap” narrative is asinine. You claiming he thumbed his nose at Mariano’s last year is equally absurd. He spent more money last season than anyone in the history of baseball. You can criticize the wisdom of much of that spending as I have, but the “Cheap” argument is tired and completely false.

    You criticize letting Cano get away for nothing, but I would have been far more critical had they bailed on the season when they were never more than three games out of the post-season until the final week of the season.

    That said, I agree they need to add offense and hopefully it will come in part from Teixeira’s return.

  101. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:16 am

    Still think if he apologized, it would make a difference, although I can’t be sure.

    My point is, there’s an issue here generally IMO, starting with people using the place as their personal pulpit. But it is what it is.

    ————–

    I think Chad knows people can return at will (like Bret lol), so it was probably not necessary to apologize, though of course it would have perhaps been appreciated.

    The thing is, people can use the play as a bully pulpit and that’s not a ban-able offense based on the blog rules. I mostly just ignore posts that are sort of meant to illicit a response.

  102. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:18 am

    Shame, you said it is supposed to rain? Are you sitting out in the open? Man, I really want to go again tonight to see C. pitch.

    —————-

    I[‘m a bleacher creature for life.

    I have a feeling this one won’t get played… WHY WON’T THEY GIVE ME A DOUBLE HEADER?! I could use some Saturday night or Sunday afternoon baseball!

  103. mick April 11th, 2014 at 11:19 am

    How was Mo abused last season?

  104. Stottlemyre68 April 11th, 2014 at 11:19 am

    McCann certainly looks good behind the plate. Very creative in pitch choice and location — like Russell Martin but with a more serious personality. One thing I saw that got my attention — Pineda got to 0-2 on one hitter and they wasted a couple and he ended up walking the batter. The next batter got 2 strikes and they may have wasted one pitch but they attacked the zone and got the out. In other words McCann tried to see if Pineda can waste 2 pitches from 0-2 to 2-2 and then bounce back, found out that that doesn’t work well with Pineda, and then went to Plan B. This is the sort of thing a really good catcher can do that the metrics folks simply can’t measure but that makes a huge difference with a pitching staff. It’s why I think Posada would have sat behind Berra, Howard, and Munson.

    Pineda-Montero is a fascinating trade. I think the GMs saw it as quality for quality but with huge risks on either side — so it seems to me to have been fair when made and we’ll see who makes out better in the long run. Maybe the Yanks knew things about Montero’s personality they didn’t like and that we don’t know and probably never will. The feeling I have is that Montero showed the ability to learn to hit for average at each level he played at after some initial struggles and then the power came. I thought he had the potential to be a huge bat that forces its way into the lineup somewhere and somehow — but I was skeptical about his staying at catcher. I have no idea what happened in Seattle — did he start swinging for the seats too much and then get more and more frustrated?

  105. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:20 am

    And yeah the weather is supposed to be more than just a little crappy tonight.. I remember a few years back there was a Sox/Yanks game that got started around 9-9:30pm after a long rain delay. I think I got home at 2am. They were making a comeback push in the late innings but Cano ended up making the final out.

  106. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:21 am

    And because enquiring mind still brings up the “will you accept him now that he’s cheated, ha ha” ridiculousness, it apparently can’t sink in that once is always grounds for accepting that someone made a mistake, and I’ve never varied from that.

    —————

    This is the second game in a row Pineda has used it.

  107. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:22 am

    “Drop the morality act.”

    Excuse me? Do you set the standards for what opinions people have? It’s about something in BASEBALL, and so I will discuss it and my feelings about it all that I want to. Stop telling people what they can talk about and what they can’t.

  108. 86w183 April 11th, 2014 at 11:22 am

    A lot of people thinking “cheating” during games is just gamesmanship, but cheating with the substances you inject/ingest is the worst act a player can perpetrate.

    As for me… I’m all for anyone trying anything they can to succeed and if they break the rules and get caught they pay the price. Competitive athletics isn’t the same as everyday life. The rewards for success are much greater and until the punishments for rule-breaking are dramatically increased the incentive to “push the envelope” so to speak won’t be diminished.

  109. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:23 am

    “This is the second game in a row Pineda has used it.”

    Not that I saw nor know about it.

  110. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 11:24 am

    You criticize letting Cano get away for nothing, but I would have been far more critical had they bailed on the season when they were never more than three games out of the post-season until the final week of the season.
    ////

    The bailed on last season by not upgrading the lineup. By dumpster diving. By having “Stewie” as their starting catcher.

    They had a slim chance of making the playoffs – that’s making the playoffs when Alex returned and he and Soriano went off, but it vaporized, quickly.

    The point is, they were never a contender last year and if they pretended – or worse, believed – that keeping Cano as opposed to trading them was the difference between a shot at a championship or not, then their lack of insight knows no bounds.

    Part of being competent is taking stock and recognizing that you’re nowhere near the summit. Especially with an organization that preaches “championship or bust” out of one side of their mouth, and then extols the virtues of “catcher defense” to try to sell you Chris Stewart as the starting Yankee catcher, out the other.

  111. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 11:24 am

    “I think Chad knows people can return at will (like Bret lol), so it was probably not necessary to apologize, though of course it would have perhaps been appreciated.”
    ____
    Shame, Yeah, well he didn’t only not apologize, he boasted about his little joke…

    “They let it get personal for them when someone disagrees with their opinions and then they get rude. It’s dumb.”

    Chip, it is indeed dumb, but some people take a personal swipe in every post, while others ignore ignore ignore to defuse the unpleasantness. However, sometimes by doing so the ones who get personal think they have carte blanche to continue their rude behavior. So, ignore vs. address (euphemism for confront.) It is the funny Lohud world in which we live, negotiating etiquette while we heatedly talk baseball. But the personal stuff so detracts from the blog, and diverts the conversation…

    As for Montero, he is coming off a suspension and surgery from last year, so hasn’t played a lot of baseball lately, and he is a notoriously slow starter. No way he won’t hit.

  112. willwill April 11th, 2014 at 11:24 am

    I hope it gets rained out so i can go to the tampa game on thursday and see pineda

  113. mick April 11th, 2014 at 11:26 am

    No way he won’t hit.
    ==============
    Has he lost that extra 40 ibs yet?

  114. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 11:26 am

    “trisha – true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:22 am
    “Drop the morality act.”

    Excuse me? Do you set the standards for what opinions people have? It’s about something in BASEBALL, and so I will discuss it and my feelings about it all that I want to. Stop telling people what they can talk about and what they can’t.”
    ___
    Trisha, reread my post. I wrote it before I even saw your current one. That response wasn’t for you personally.

  115. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:27 am

    “Competitive athletics isn’t the same as everyday life.”

    But it’s their everyday life, and we’re not robots. As long as people are going to comment that they see nothing wrong with it, I’ll continue to comment that I do.

    And I invite people not to read my posts if they don’t like my standards.

    Easy peasy.

  116. mick April 11th, 2014 at 11:27 am

    lbs that is

  117. Poetkiosk April 11th, 2014 at 11:27 am

    JAP -”I was at that game last night, and the offense isn’t any good.”

    Let’s hold off on such dire condemnation and get a bit more into the season.

    I disagree because I prefer an offense that is more capable of producing runs. Waiting for a homerun to save the day it pretty much the most boring baseball ever.

    I think once McCann gets going and Soriano has one of his hot streaks, this offense will seem electric.

  118. Mottsx April 11th, 2014 at 11:27 am

    Rain tonight… Ichiro will definitely be in CF/RF.

  119. mick April 11th, 2014 at 11:27 am

    Trisha, reread my post. I wrote it before I even saw your current one. That response wasn’t for you personally.
    ==========
    copout.

  120. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:28 am

    Shame, Yeah, well he didn’t only not apologize, he boasted about his little joke…

    —————–

    fem – I was referencing randy there, not Bret.

    Is Bret also I am Brett Godner, btw? Would be a bit of a turn around for him and his relationship with Gardner. I need the Lohud detectives on this.

  121. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:28 am

    “Trisha, reread my post. I wrote it before I even saw your current one. That response wasn’t for you personally.”

    YF thank you. I took a little slapping around for taking the stand I did so I’m a little sensitive to that stuff this morning.

    No harm done.

    :)

  122. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:28 am

    trisha – true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:23 am
    “This is the second game in a row Pineda has used it.”

    Not that I saw nor know about it.

    —————

    There are pictures. It’s been brought up already.

    So we’ll see if he hides it better going forward.

  123. Jerkface April 11th, 2014 at 11:28 am

    It has cutter movement is the point. So it can’t be categorized as a 4-seamer.

    This is kind of getting into the area of Pitch as intent vs Pitch as result. His cutters are 4-seamers. They are thrown with a 4 seam grip and happen to have cut fastball like movement. Sometimes they have sinker like movement. And sometimes they have 2-seam like movement. In the end though they are all thrown with a 4-seam grip. So I think they should be categorized as 4-seamers. If a pitcher throws a bad change up, the action on it is like a dead 85 mph fastball, but its still a bad change up. It doesn’t fall into the fastball bucket.

    I think these pitch systems work better when you can analyze the data on a bucket of pitches all thrown with the same grip, but of course we won’t get to that point until tiny nano robotic cameras are floating around video taping the pitchers grip as he throws.

  124. mick April 11th, 2014 at 11:28 am

    ”I was at that game last night,
    ==================
    Don’t you know that being at the game trumps all.

  125. mick April 11th, 2014 at 11:29 am

    How about that “religion” comment/slap from last night?

  126. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:30 am

    pete2 said there was talk about it on a Sox blog after the Jays game, too.

  127. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:31 am

    “There are pictures. It’s been brought up already.

    So we’ll see if he hides it better going forward.”

    Or doesn’t use it at all. That is an option you know. :)

  128. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 11:33 am

    mick, ???

  129. LordD99 April 11th, 2014 at 11:33 am

    Headline indicates a negative; the story indicates the opposite.

  130. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:34 am

    Or doesn’t use it at all. That is an option you know. :)

    —————

    Of course. I’m just pointing out this isn’t a case of a first offense. You can see it here:

    http://imgick.nj.com/home/njo-.....b26675.JPG

    So if you’re committed to saying a first time offense is forgivable that’s fine.. but you might need to find a little more forgiveness in your heart for Pineda.

  131. Doreen April 11th, 2014 at 11:34 am

    Shame,

    How do you know it was the second time he used? I don’t remember hearing anything about pine tar his first start. but i miss stuff…

  132. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:35 am

    LordD99 April 11th, 2014 at 11:33 am
    Headline indicates a negative; the story indicates the opposite.

    ——————-

    The old bait and switch.

  133. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 11:36 am

    Trisha, Pineda won’t not use the pine tar. They all do. It’s tacitly permitted as part of the game within the game.

  134. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:36 am

    @WFAN660 John Franco on pine tar: “If you go around the league, I would guarantee more than half the pitchers use it.” #Pineda http://cbsloc.al/1oTxBKV

    Ha.. timely. Can’t wait to see how Kay and Francesa discuss it today.

  135. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:37 am

    “Headline indicates a negative; the story indicates the opposite.”

    It’s up to MLB to do something to put this to bed, because it turns into a controversy every time it happens. If it’s an accepted practice – and from all the comments I’ve heard from commentators as well as ex-players it seems to be – then MLB has to wake up and get it removed from the rules book. The umpires said that if it was brought to their attention they would have to do something about it.

  136. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 11:38 am

    “Can’t wait to see how Kay and Francesa discuss it today.”

    I’ll pass on both.

  137. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:38 am

    Doreen – Seems like no one made a thing of it for that game, but pete2 brought up it was discussed on some fan blogs. I found the picture pretty easily.

  138. 86w183 April 11th, 2014 at 11:38 am

    Trisha —- nothing I wrote was directed at you…. I love your posts and have no problem with anyone’s right to his or her “standards”. I just have no issue with athletes who break rules in order to succeed… and I have no problem with significant punishment(s) if/when they get caught.

    Is acting like a pitch hit you when it didn’t “cheating”? Is pretending to catch a sinking liner when you know you short hopped it ? Is claiming the ball is lost in the Wrigley Field Ivy even though you can see it? Is using a scuffed up ball you know should be thrown out of play?

    There’s a lot of gray area and its up to the officials, not the players to adjudicate it.

    JAP — I will never support bailing on a season when the Yanks have a realistic chance at reaching the post-season and I don’t think most Yankees fans do. Besides, the fact that not one major deal took place at the deadline tells me no one was giving up prime young talent for a mid-season rental.

  139. Jerkface April 11th, 2014 at 11:39 am

    Good article on the cheating pitchers do:

    http://sports.yahoo.com/news/p.....59306.html

    Including a link to a gif of an astros reliever applying sun screen to both arms in the bullpen… in a dome

  140. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:39 am

    “So if you’re committed to saying a first time offense is forgivable that’s fine.. but you might need to find a little more forgiveness in your heart for Pineda.”

    I don’t see it there. So as far as I’m concerned, it’s the first time I’ve seen it and it’s been made into a controversy – despite what you’re saying.

    I’ll do it my way, thank you.

  141. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 11:39 am

    Much more fun to talk about Laptops’ multiple foreign substances. With all the goo on him, the guy looks like a nervous wreck who has been jonesing… :)

  142. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:40 am

    yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 11:38 am
    “Can’t wait to see how Kay and Francesa discuss it today.”

    I’ll pass on both.

    ————–

    I just wanna see if Francesa takes a hard stance on it cause YES booted him lol.

  143. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:41 am

    I don’t see it there. So as far as I’m concerned, it’s the first time I’ve seen it and it’s been made into a controversy – despite what you’re saying.

    I’ll do it my way, thank you.

    —————

    You don’t see that brown stuff on the base of his palm…?

  144. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 11:42 am

    I disagree because I prefer an offense that is more capable of producing runs. Waiting for a homerun to save the day it pretty much the most boring baseball ever.
    ///

    Well, yeah, I was pretty much preaching this during the 2011 ALDS, when Girardi kept Montero’s butt glued to the bench, refused to move Posada up in the lineup, etc., while letting Russell Martin wave at pitches with the bases loaded, and let Swisher swing from his shoes repeatedly, instead of using his bench or letting the guy who was hitting over .400 get more ABs.

    I also wanted Melky Cabrera NOT traded, because there’s a contact bat if there ever was one, that got away at age 25 for Javier Vasquez.

    The problem is, they let the best contact bat they had, and their best hitter, walk and now they have some better contact type hitters but the middle has been pulled out from a lineup that doesn’t have nearly enough to take advantage of the home ballpark or compensate for other teams taking advantage of it.

    I said I think McCann will come around, but I’m confident that what I’m seeing from the lineup accurately communicates that they need more to seriously contend.

  145. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:42 am

    I’ll blow it up for you and repost.

  146. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:42 am

    “Trisha —- nothing I wrote was directed at you…. I love your posts and have no problem with anyone’s right to his or her “standards”. I just have no issue with athletes who break rules in order to succeed… and I have no problem with significant punishment(s) if/when they get caught”

    Thanks for that. The world feels a little topsy turvy when you get made fun of for saying you don’t abide cheating.

    :)

  147. Doreen April 11th, 2014 at 11:43 am

    I wonder if he used it in Seattle, too? Pictures??

    But I’m sure no one would have cared….

  148. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 11:43 am

    *better contact hitters than they had overall last year, that is – not better contact hitters than Cano’s contact bat,

  149. JimK April 11th, 2014 at 11:45 am

    Just some random thoughts.
    Obviously I do not know how the Yankees will perform this year; I believe I projected 88 wins on Trish’s preseason prediction post. However, I find myself losing interest in the Yankees in general, and this is not based on the belief that the Yankees have a particularly poor team, but they now seem like a team without an identity.
    Seinfeld may have said “fans root for the laundry,” but for me this is not true. I find myself mainly interested in watching games that feature younger players with the hopes of watching them evolve; the current team does not have any young everyday players who I expect to be an integral part of future Yankee teams.
    It is also too early in the season to make a realistic assessment of their young(er) pitchers; Pineda has been exceptional, and Tanaka has shown some promise, but they both have pitched two games.
    Nova, who I originally believed was at best a 4 inning pitcher, has pitched brilliantly at times; not so well on other occasions. Instead of “King Felix,” he is more reminiscent of AJ Burnett; sometimes “lights out” and on other occasions a BP pitcher.

  150. Doreen April 11th, 2014 at 11:46 am

    Shame -

    I looked at the picture you linked of Pineda. Not really a slam dunk that there’s pine tar there. I looked really hard at it, and to me it’s a toss-up whether there was a substance, or whether it was a shadow. At first I saw nothing at all, in fact.

    Again, I would love to see pictures from Seattle.

    And I would love it if now we had closeup shots of every pitcher’s wrists, forearms, gloves, and caps. Let’s get a headcount of who uses pine tar, sunscreen, etc. ;)

  151. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:46 am

    http://i1075.photobucket.com/a.....abebf1.jpg

  152. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:46 am

    That’s the zoomed in version.

  153. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 11:47 am

    JAP — I will never support bailing on a season when the Yanks have a realistic chance at reaching the post-season and I don’t think most Yankees fans do. Besides, the fact that not one major deal took place at the deadline tells me no one was giving up prime young talent for a mid-season rental.
    ///

    Cano however was prohibitively the most game-changing mid-season rental out there, and Texas reportedly inquired about him.

    Just because the Yankees did nothing – while knowing they were not re-signing him – does not mean a deal wasn’t out there. Wonder what Texas was offering??

    As King Lear says, nothing will come of nothing.

    What’d we get for our superstar 2B?

    Nothing.

  154. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 11:48 am

    JF, yeah, I understand that it is a 4-seam grip with likely natural cut. Ditto, two seamers that have that movement in a 4-seam grip. So, I get the distinction. Still you have to differentiate between the two somehow. And it gets semantical with intent vs. involuntary. Maybe they can use asterisks to show intent vs. lack thereof. LOL. Still Pineda’s cutting fastballs are different than his non-cutting 4-seamers, so… And interesting to see how much speed he cut on those cutting FB late, more swings and misses? vs. the slower FB’s in 5th and 6th which I assume were the ones getting hit. I’d have to go to pitchfx and look.

  155. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:48 am

    “Much more fun to talk about Laptops’ multiple foreign substances. With all the goo on him, the guy looks like a nervous wreck who has been jonesing… :)

    Hey, I got all over him for that. And it drove me crazy that MLB didn’t make any kind of statement about it, despite it being all over the news and video shown everywhere. I went equally nuts when Lester used green goo in the postseason!

    Hypocrisy in my case would be me letting a Ys players slide for the same thing!

    Again, if it’s an accepted practice, then MLB needs to remove it from the rules book. If they don’t, then players need to stay away from it. Because it causes too much confusion, controversy, and craziness otherwise. If it’s outlived its usefulness as a rule, then it needs to go.

  156. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:48 am

    And I would love it if now we had closeup shots of every pitcher’s wrists, forearms, gloves, and caps. Let’s get a headcount of who uses pine tar, sunscreen, etc. ;)

    ————–

    Oh yeah, I’m sure we all would. I don’t really care either way, but you can see it in that picture. I’ve isolated his hand and blew it up to give everyone a closer look. Ya’ll can decide from there what you think but it looks pretty clear to me in that shot.

  157. Chip April 11th, 2014 at 11:50 am

    J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 11:47 am

    JAP — I will never support bailing on a season when the Yanks have a realistic chance at reaching the post-season and I don’t think most Yankees fans do. Besides, the fact that not one major deal took place at the deadline tells me no one was giving up prime young talent for a mid-season rental.
    ///

    Cano however was prohibitively the most game-changing mid-season rental out there, and Texas reportedly inquired about him.

    Just because the Yankees did nothing – while knowing they were not re-signing him – does not mean a deal wasn’t out there. Wonder what Texas was offering??
    ————————-

    I don’t think the Yankees had conceded by July a) that they weren’t making the playoffs and b) that they weren’t going to be able to keep Cano.

    They knew what Cano’s demands were and were probably optimistic that he would get onto the market and not find a team willing to go 10 years and then they would be back in play. They underestimated the desperation of the Mariners. Stuff happens.

  158. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 11:52 am

    And Trish, just a word to the wise, if I were responding to you, I would have no problem saying so. Like you, I am not shy about asserting myself.

    As for doing it your way. Do you prefer Frank or the Sid Vicious version? :)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDyb_alTkMQ

  159. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:52 am

    I haven’t read any of the headlines in any of the online papers, if there is coverage, and I don’t think I want to.

    I am just sitting here hoping to God that CC finds some magic tonight, especially because it seems that the Sux are his archilles heel. How wonderful would it be if he was able to kill two birds with one stone – pitch a great game so some who are doubting him would have more faith, and pitch a great game against the Sux. That would be the price of admission, even at the high prices the Yankees charge!

    :)

  160. RhapsodyInBlue April 11th, 2014 at 11:53 am

    What I don’t understand is where the supposed pine tar is located which is on Pineda’s wrist of his pitching hand.

    It would then have to be applied to his finger tips of the same hand in order for him to use it no?

    Would make more sense to me if the pine tar was on the wrist of his glove hand so he could go to it with his pitching hand.

    Or why isn’t it on the palm of his glove or his fore arm?

    But his pitching hand wrist?

  161. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 11:53 am

    mick April 11th, 2014 at 11:28 am

    ”I was at that game last night,
    ==================
    Don’t you know that being at the game trumps all.
    ///

    What do you mean, fella?

  162. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 11:53 am

    And I would love it if now we had closeup shots of every pitcher’s wrists, forearms, gloves, and caps. Let’s get a headcount of who uses pine tar, sunscreen, etc.
    ___
    A new coffee table photography book, just in time for Christmas.

  163. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:54 am

    “And Trish, just a word to the wise, if I were responding to you, I would have no problem saying so. Like you, I am not shy about asserting myself.

    As for doing it your way. Do you prefer Frank or the Sid Vicious version? :)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDyb_alTkMQ

    YF – cool. It’s all good then.

    And without even checking, it’s definitely Frank!

    :)

  164. RhapsodyInBlue April 11th, 2014 at 11:54 am

    How does he get it from the wrist to his finger tips?

    And if he was putting it on the ball itself it surely would seem to show up.

  165. Jerkface April 11th, 2014 at 11:55 am

    I wonder if he used it in Seattle, too? Pictures??

    But I’m sure no one would have cared….

    Clubs generally don’t challenge unless they think guys are loading up too much. If they did then their own guys would get called out.

  166. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:55 am

    Would make more sense to me if the pine tar was on the wrist of his glove hand so he could go to it with his pitching hand.

    ——————

    By positioning it at the base of his palm he can just close his fingers over his lower palm to get them sticky. You can try it yourself right now. Don’t make a fist and tuck your fingers in, just close your hand like you were holding something imaginary.

  167. trisha - true pinstriped blue April 11th, 2014 at 11:55 am

    Okay, I checked. Definitely Frank!

    :)

  168. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 11:55 am

    mick April 11th, 2014 at 11:28 am

    ”I was at that game last night,
    ==================
    Don’t you know that being at the game trumps all.

    ___
    Do people actually get trolled here for attending games now? I could see trolling them for not attending games… But um…

  169. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:56 am

    I hope my photo search efforts have not gone unappreciated.. I didn’t just waste my bosses time for nothing, ya know. ;)

  170. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 11:56 am

    Yeah, Sid Vicious’s version is an acquired taste, no doubt. :)

  171. Doreen April 11th, 2014 at 11:57 am

    Chip -

    That’s my view as well.

    The Yankees were really hanging in there last year, in spite of all the bad that happened. But September killed them, and Kuroda slowing down did as well.

    And I also agree, they did not think another team was going to go 10 years for Cano. Especially not after the Pujols disaster of a contract. I think they stuck to their original offer for the most part because no one else was bidding more until the Mariners came out with something that even the Yankees weren’t willing to beat. I think the Yankees were prepared to go higher, but not unless there was another competitive bid out there. For instance, if someone had offered 8 years, maybe they go there. There was no reason to do it without someone else offering it first. But 10 was just too much. I don’t think the Yankees didn’t want Cano. They just didn’t want Cano for 10 years.

    Shame -

    That’s what I did finally focus on, and the larger shot makes it look like something other than a shadow, I’d say. But I wonder why someone would put it somewhere that it can be easily detected if it’s something that potentially could get them in hot water? It has to be somewhat accepted, and somewhat rampant if a player is not worried about hiding it.

    But I’d say, he’s going to learn how to hide it, if he continues to need to use it.

  172. Jerkface April 11th, 2014 at 11:58 am

    And it gets semantical with intent vs. involuntary. Maybe they can use asterisks to show intent vs. lack thereof. LOL

    What gets crazy is that if it becomes a thing he repeats on purpose suddenly his intent changes and the whole thing is kerplunk. The reason I bring up intent vs result is that as you pointed out before, his ‘cutters’ in 2011 were the same or better velocity than his normal fastball bucket, because they were simply fastballs that moved hella good. The lower velocity he showed in ST/the end of this game could be mechanical in nature, or maybe he needs a really firm grip to get the rotation on his fastball. And when he doesn’t have the tight grip it slips out a bit too easily and we get the lower velo/cut action.

  173. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:58 am

    Shame -

    That’s what I did finally focus on, and the larger shot makes it look like something other than a shadow, I’d say. But I wonder why someone would put it somewhere that it can be easily detected if it’s something that potentially could get them in hot water? It has to be somewhat accepted, and somewhat rampant if a player is not worried about hiding it.

    —————-

    Well we’ve seen in the past even when the media does pick up on this stuff (like with Bucky) it doesn’t carry over into having managers challenge. Like JF said it put their guys under a microscope as well so it’s probably not worth drawing on-the-field attention to it.

  174. exiledintampa April 11th, 2014 at 11:58 am

    Shame – the Obama knock knock joke was appreciated. sorry for scanning your photo bucket.

  175. RhapsodyInBlue April 11th, 2014 at 11:59 am

    Looking at the pictures, you’re right Shame, the pine tar isn’t on his wrist but on his palm.

  176. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 11:59 am

    Do people actually get trolled here for attending games now? I could see trolling them for not attending games… But um…
    ///

    Regarding the game, the place was anything but full last night. So much for the claim that we “sell out” Red Sox games.

    That’s only for people who don’t get near Yankee Stadium to chew on.

  177. Doreen April 11th, 2014 at 12:00 pm

    Shame -

    I’m like two steps behind this morning. Just saw your post about folding your hand down, and sure enough, where the fingers end up is pretty much where the spot was on the wrist.

  178. Tackelberry April 11th, 2014 at 12:00 pm

    Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 11:40 am
    yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 11:38 am
    “Can’t wait to see how Kay and Francesa discuss it today.”

    I’ll pass on both.

    ————–

    I just wanna see if Francesa takes a hard stance on it cause YES booted him lol.

    ____________________________________________

    Never mind Kay or Francessa. I’m can only imagine Yankee hater Mad Dog Russo’s rabid rant about it.

  179. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 12:01 pm

    The lower velocity he showed in ST/the end of this game could be mechanical in nature, or maybe he needs a really firm grip to get the rotation on his fastball. And when he doesn’t have the tight grip it slips out a bit too easily and we get the lower velo/cut action.

    —————–

    That actually makes a lot of sense. We’ll have to keep watching him closely to spot if there are trends.

  180. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 12:01 pm

    And I saw the question about the Stadium only after the fact: it was pretty empty. I would say less than half full, but pretty vocal, considering.

    Lots of “Boston sucks” and a**hole chants, as usual, especially the latter at the (I assume) RS fan who caught Nava’s homer and didn’t throw it back. You must always throw back an opposing team’s homerun. No exceptions.

  181. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 12:01 pm

    exiledintampa April 11th, 2014 at 11:58 am
    Shame – the Obama knock knock joke was appreciated. sorry for scanning your photo bucket.

    ———————–

    Continues to be one of my favorite memes… mostly because of the eagle on his shoulder lmao.

  182. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 12:02 pm

    Doreen April 11th, 2014 at 12:00 pm
    Shame -

    I’m like two steps behind this morning. Just saw your post about folding your hand down, and sure enough, where the fingers end up is pretty much where the spot was on the wrist.

    —————–

    Yeah, I do think he might move it after it got more attention in this last game (like Bucky putting it on his elbow), but we’ll see.

  183. exiledintampa April 11th, 2014 at 12:03 pm

    Shame – it had me at weed. lol

  184. Tyler April 11th, 2014 at 12:03 pm

    Lots of “Boston sucks” and a**hole chants, as usual, especially the latter at the (I assume) RS fan who caught Nava’s homer and didn’t throw it back. You must always throw back an opposing team’s homerun. No exceptions.
    ———————————————————————–

    If I catch a homerun ball, I am not throwing it back. They can heckle me all they want.

  185. Tackelberry April 11th, 2014 at 12:03 pm

    Be curious to see how Pineda fares in his next start now with this controversy hanging over him. I’m sure he won’t have anything on his wrist or palm cause hewill be watched very closely on the mound. If he gets hit around, the speculation will be that he was effective becuase of the pine tar. If he shuts down his next opponent, the story will lose its legs

  186. Doreen April 11th, 2014 at 12:04 pm

    Again, I’m two steps behind. Yeah, if a manager challenges, and knows he’s got players who have done the same, he’s opening up a can of worms.

    Which is why I kind of felt sorry for Joe Girardi in the post-game interview. How do you answer that question? He needs to learn how to sidestep better, because he’s a guy that never looks comfortable when he’s avoiding a question. what could he say? He wasn’t going to say it was nothing; he wasn’t going to say what it probably was; and you know what, the reporters who asked those questions know that. KNow that he can’t throw his own player under the bus, and he can’t insinuate that other players out there do the same. I don’t know what they expected him to say.

  187. Jerkface April 11th, 2014 at 12:05 pm

    That actually makes a lot of sense. We’ll have to keep watching him closely to spot if there are trends.

    And taking this a step further. Pineda didn’t use pinetar in ST. It was florida, plenty sunny, so he made do with rosin/sun screen/whatever and was throwing 89-93. Now its the regular season, the games count, and he is going hardcore pinetar so the same effort from ST is now bumping his velo up 3 mph all around. Clubhouse guy who is watching video for replay notices NESN and YES are all talking about pinetar, they alert the dug out, and suddenly Pineda’s velocity in the 5th/6th/7th look a lot more like ST than Toronto or the 1st inning.

    This is where pitch FX data would be great if we had it for spring training. We could see how much rotation he is getting on his fastball now vs then.

  188. 86w183 April 11th, 2014 at 12:06 pm

    off to rejoin the real world…. seeya tomorrow cyber-world

  189. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 12:06 pm

    Girardi is one of these people that doesn’t wanna outright lie but has trouble being evasive lol. He said he didn’t see anything and that was a mistake because the media was able to press him on it, and he had to back off of that a little.

  190. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 12:08 pm

    I always wanna spell Farrell as ‘feral’ …heh.

    I crack me up.

  191. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 12:09 pm

    Pineda doesn’t need to buy into a manufactured “controversy” created by broadcasters.

    Doreen, Girardi did the right thing. He’s not the moral police, and he doesn’t have to issue mea culpas for his players. Torre did that at times and it was extremely irritating, IMO

  192. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 12:09 pm

    I’m trying to institute something called ‘Google Friday’ here at the office where everyone just spends their Friday Googling random stuff.

  193. exiledintampa April 11th, 2014 at 12:09 pm

    Girardi needs a press secretary to lie for him. He’s an honest guy and he does a really poor job of it.

  194. Doreen April 11th, 2014 at 12:10 pm

    Shame -

    Yeah. He probably could have said, the other part, about not being able to talk about it, or whatever his words were. But it did stretch credulity when he said he knew nothing about it at all. Surely someone showed him the video at some point? Or maybe they like to keep Joe in the dark about some things knowing he can’t really lie? ;)

  195. Jerkface April 11th, 2014 at 12:10 pm

    And unfortunately the website that I used to go to that could pull individual pitch data from pitchfx is gone so I can’t check innings. I can do it on Brooksbaseball but its not as easy to sort.

    Anyways just looking at Brooks his best fastballs had spin of 190+. His bad ones had spin of ~170 RPMs.

    He had way more 170s in the later innings. Less grip. Less spin.

  196. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 12:10 pm

    Shame,

    I like your brand of narcissism: out in the open, no hiding behind “causes” for you ;)

    I’m just kidding with you, of course.

  197. Doreen April 11th, 2014 at 12:11 pm

    J. Al,

    I like the way that Girardi doesn’t throw players under the bus.

  198. Poetkiosk April 11th, 2014 at 12:12 pm

    JAP – “What’d we get for our superstar 2B?”

    We got not giving out a stupid contract, where the back end of it would be terrible.

  199. Hankflorida April 11th, 2014 at 12:12 pm

    Alfred, no one can argue that last year was a year of “sound and fury signifying nothing” as the Yankees were transforming the team from the bombers to banjo hitters with more of a reliance on pitching. We spoke about playing Gardner and Ichiro together last year as there was a power outage at other positions, and this year with the loss of Cano, another table setter added to the mix as the team moved away from the long ball. We have no choice but to follow Cashman’s new blueprint and hope it works as I Jokingly call it “Back to the Future” to the dead ball era of pitching, speed and defense.”

  200. Jerkface April 11th, 2014 at 12:12 pm

    Of course I’m also looking at raw data and I am not an expert. So I’m just speculating.

  201. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 12:13 pm

    JF, could be just fatigue late in game on 4-seamer, but the history of higher velo on the cutting fastball is curious. I know that the cutter grip is normally a four-seam grip slightly off center, so is Pineda actually gripping the FB’s that cut off center or gripping them in the same way he grips his four-seamer? Love to see the grips up close.

  202. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 12:13 pm

    exiledintampa April 11th, 2014 at 12:09 pm

    Girardi needs a press secretary to lie for him. He’s an honest guy and he does a really poor job of it.
    ///

    This is one of the few things I like about Girardi. He doesn’t play the political game like Torre did.

    He does not have to feed some writer’s sidebar or even main story. He answered the question the way he wanted to.

  203. Jerkface April 11th, 2014 at 12:15 pm

    Love to see the grips up close.

    There really should be a grip cam or something. Baseball has all these interesting little things that could be displayed to the fans and would deepen their appreciation of the game. I love whenever they show grips and explain it on TV.

  204. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 12:15 pm

    Poetkiosk April 11th, 2014 at 12:12 pm

    JAP – “What’d we get for our superstar 2B?”

    We got not giving out a stupid contract, where the back end of it would be terrible.
    ///

    Yeah. Right.

  205. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 12:15 pm

    JF, just saw your 12:12 post. Ditto. But the discrepancy in velo with his own and most other pitchers’ cutters is really interesting. Then he is a big kid with a powerful arm and that natural movement might just be something he is blessed with.

  206. exiledintampa April 11th, 2014 at 12:17 pm

    So is that pinetar on Phelps two fingers in the picture up above?

  207. Jerkface April 11th, 2014 at 12:17 pm

    So is that pinetar on Phelps two fingers in the picture up above?

    Probably!

  208. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 12:18 pm

    Hank,

    I appreciate your appreciation of real Yankee baseball and of course, your references to the Bard :)

    The Stadium is going to bite the Yankees though. Rather than make it an ally, we’re allowing our foes to conspire with it, if they don’t fix this.

    We’ll hit some “Yankee Stadium” homers, but we just don’t have the glue in the middle that puts the lineup in the redemption category.

    It’s a sloppy, unfinished job, and the paint job won’t pass for the genuine article.

  209. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 12:18 pm

    I’d love a grip cam too. I am always straining to see the grip. Leiter and Cone sometimes show grips. If you find any photos, articles, please do share. I was glad that they put Cone on the broadcast the last few home games with Tanaka and Pineda pitching. The YES broadcasts were frustratingly bereft of analysis on those two when the Yanks were on the road to open. I couldn’t believe they had no pitching guru on that road trip with our shiny new pitching toys making their Yankee debuts. Grrr.

  210. Jerkface April 11th, 2014 at 12:22 pm

    I couldn’t believe they had no pitching guru on that road trip with our shiny new pitching toys making their Yankee debuts. Grrr.

    1 of Cone/Leiter should be in every game tbh. I know they can’t do a 3 man booth so often, but Flash is just so boring and Singleton only offers a hitting perspective.

  211. J. Alfred Prufrock April 11th, 2014 at 12:23 pm

    Doreen April 11th, 2014 at 12:11 pm

    J. Al,

    I like the way that Girardi doesn’t throw players under the bus.
    ///

    It may be the only thing I like about him, lol. That, and he’s a good person. Racing across a highway in the dead of night to help someone on the other side confirms that – after clinching the WS, no less. Any really good person would do it, and Joe is a good person.

    It’s tough for people like Joe, who lack social varnish to start faking it to get by. I think he’s stubborn and way too conservative, but he’s genuine. Because of that, he sometimes comes off as prickly. He clearly does not enjoy “playing the game.” I like that about him. I hate “the game” too.

    Girardi’s greatest moment, for me, in terms of media, is when he just flipped out after Alex got beaned. Yes, you are right, he won’t throw his players under the bus, and he defends them. Very admirable.

  212. yankeefeminista April 11th, 2014 at 12:25 pm

    Tyler April 11th, 2014 at 12:03 pm
    Lots of “Boston sucks” and a**hole chants, as usual, especially the latter at the (I assume) RS fan who caught Nava’s homer and didn’t throw it back. You must always throw back an opposing team’s homerun. No exceptions.
    ———————————————————————–

    If I catch a homerun ball, I am not throwing it back. They can heckle me all they want.
    ____
    Good luck with that. You will have hundreds of people standing, clapping and chanting “throw it back” and then yelling at you a**hole if you don’t. It is a sight to see. Lol. I love when the intimidated catcher of the HR throws the ball back and everyone cheers. You can’t mess with Yankee tradition, Tyler. You had better catch a Yankee HR ball instead.

  213. Shame Spencer April 11th, 2014 at 12:25 pm

    :arrow:

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